http://america.aljazeera.com/watch/shows/live-news/2015/6/african-american-women-struggle-to-find-marry.html


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0MBD4uuksxg


whats the stance again? propaganda/stacked argument?


I hear the argument but then I kinda roll my eyes

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https://soundcloud.com/swageyph/yph-die-with-me

At least, they don't want to marry any of their available options. Personally, I think that "Husband Store" joke best describes what happens.

Edit: I didn't watch that video. I'm guessing it says that most black men are in jail, not interesting in women romantically, don't have jobs, have mad baby momma, etc. The stereotypical stuff.

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https://soundcloud.com/swageyph/yph-die-with-me

>

Do you seriously feel like this type of discussion is a personal attack? From what I've seen in my lifetime, I feel like I can find a suitable mate easier than an African American woman of comparable attributes and educational level.

Let my love slide in and never slip out

It depends on who the guy is, but as a whole, it tends to lead to typical gender wars. "Y'ALL men aren't focused enough" "Y'all men don't want to settle down" "Maybe if y'all wanted to date Black women instead of only wanting a White or Asian girl" "Y'all don't even make it to college" "Y'all get locked up."

And of course, that turns into us being defensive in some way, and if we tell them that we don't represent those types, it's "well y'all need to be helping your fellow Black men because they are still lost, even if you aren't."

It's also a major shot to the Black men who never got play from Black women, and many of them even have a Mike Jones attitude about it all. "Y'all used to chase thugs and all the wrong guys, but now you're older and single, and blaming us, when you could have had us before." I've met plenty guys who fit this bill...some got zero play growing up or even in college because they didn't have the personality, style, or anything to attract women...and now, they have a great career, and seem to still have something against (Black) women.

Additionally, most men tend to know women who are single for reasons that aren't just due to statistics, yet we feel the stats may be a copout for SOME of the women. I know some women who are so focused career-wise, that they don't seem to entertain any men who are out there. Or, those women who actually attract great men, but they seem to find a problem with literally every man who is into them. Of course, they shouldn't just be into a guy because he wants them...but when EVERY, every every single guy who tries seems to have something wrong in their eyes? It's just harder for us to feel sympathy or believe it's truly about statistics.

I can go on and on, but yeah. For me, personally? I feel that it's a mixture of everything, but the root cause isn't the fault of Black men OR women. It's a much deeper argument and issue, but the fact that Black men aren't as educated or focused isn't because we're naturally born to be lazy or shiftless.

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Your dating options won't change regardless of whether you watch the video or not. Neither should your dating outlook. People with major dating hang-ups & reservations generally expose themselves rather quickly. I do understand there's some justification behind their statements (which is why I don't get mad or defensive), but ultimately complainers are undesirable. I wouldn't even entertain any of these women telling ME what I need to do to fix THEIR dating problems. Those just aren't the type of people that I'd enjoy spending time around, maybe your social circle is different, I dunno. In my life, gender wars have only really existed in sibling relationships, in rap music, and online. I make it a habit not to deal with people who are subject to a lot of peer influence.


Let my love slide in and never slip out

Being that I'm 30, Black, single, and have so many interconnected circles of like minded men and women...these debates and discussions come up all the time. Even when I'm dating a woman, it comes up in regards to why they're single, or why their friends/cousins are single.

It's not about my personal options, but just about the topic itself whenever it comes up.

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>Being that I'm 30, Black, single, and have so many
>interconnected circles of like minded men and women...these
>debates and discussions come up all the time. Even when I'm
>dating a woman, it comes up in regards to why they're single,
>or why their friends/cousins are single.
>
>It's not about my personal options, but just about the topic
>itself whenever it comes up.

alot. Male or female, justifiable or not. It's just not healthy for me, but again to each their own. And do you really ask women "why are you single?". Seems like a really awkward question.
I guess I'll just chalk it up to different social circles then. I guess I've never had an all Black with a capital B social circle, there were always Latins, Caribbeans & Africans in the mix. And people who don't have much in common with me might find me difficult to get along with, maybe that has helped me in some ways.


Let my love slide in and never slip out

but you all up in here telling people who have ties to them to not talk about it?

okay

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TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

>but you all up in here telling people who have ties to them
>to not talk about it?
>
>okay

with groups of women telling you how to fix their dating problems? Let me know bruh.
You saw where I said "all Black". You should now what "all" means at this point in your life. C'mon.

Let my love slide in and never slip out

You listed off every other group but Black women being in your social circle.

I'm not going to argue with you on this tho..

you got it all figured out.

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TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

>You listed off every other group but Black women being in
>your social circle.
>
>I'm not going to argue with you on this tho..
>
>you got it all figured out.

Here's is the quote that you seem to be having a whole lotta trouble with
"I guess I've never had an all Black with a capital B social circle, there were always Latins, Caribbeans & Africans in the mix"

I don't see how this reads as "My social circle had everything but Af-Ams". I just said it wasn't ALL "Af-Am"/"Black", and I named the backgrounds of the people who were in my social circles that weren't "Af-Am".

I never asked if it was an ALL Black circle bruh...

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TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

And hell naw, I'll never ask someone why they're single.

I get it now, if you don't have the types of circles I have, you'd never get it. Hell, you don't even have to have "all-Black" circles, but just knowing a few and being open with them, it's a pretty common topic. Most of them aren't bitching or complaining at that level, either.

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being the only way this discussion could go down.

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TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

>being the only way this discussion could go down.

mixed company. That's why I said what I said. I asked you if YOU had to deal with these conversations often in your everyday life, and I got no response. So you probably don't and just want to bicker....

And you had such a hard time understanding the fact that I answered your question from #22 in #23. There's just too much that you are missing, you shouldn't even bother trying figure me out, or jump into a back and forth that you weren't involved in.

there is the point that I cant possibly belittle the struggle of people but I do feel slighted because it feels like yet another voice about why I am not shit, why black men are not shit.....and for the record Im talking about the people I grew up with that overcame despite the obstacles

so when I hear this argument that has been said forever and ever I'm like....


yeah.

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https://soundcloud.com/swageyph/yph-die-with-me

>there is the point that I cant possibly belittle the struggle
>of people but I do feel slighted because it feels like yet
>another voice about why I am not shit, why black men are not
>shit.....and for the record Im talking about the people I grew
>up with that overcame despite the obstacles
>
>so when I hear this argument that has been said forever and
>ever I'm like....
>
>
>yeah.

I still don't understand why you guys feel defensive. Do you think the woman that you make happy everyday is going to constantly bring up the plight of her single friends? Do you have women in your social circle constantly taking you to task about this? lol c'mon....
And as many Black single mothers as there are out there doing the most to keep their sons happy (sometimes overdoing it), how can you truly believe, that they believe we ain't shit?

Let my love slide in and never slip out

but i have several friends and fam who are wonderful women, successful and are single..hell my sister is a beautiful girl who has her own nice ass townhouse, car and phd but she says dudes are reluctant to approach her because they assume shes involved...or when they see she is independent and doesnt "need" them for anything outside of companionship etc they have trouble processing that. my best female friend who ive known since high school is in the same boat...got a nice house, car, job, etc but alot of black men seem to have trouble dealing with that for some reason... sad state of affairs.

>but i have several friends and fam who are wonderful women,
>successful and are single..hell my sister is a beautiful girl
>who has her own nice ass townhouse, car and phd but she says
>dudes are reluctant to approach her because they assume shes
>involved...or when they see she is independent and doesnt
>"need" them for anything outside of companionship etc they
>have trouble processing that. my best female friend who ive
>known since high school is in the same boat...got a nice
>house, car, job, etc but alot of black men seem to have
>trouble dealing with that for some reason... sad state of
>affairs.

Deep down, these guys probably know that and act accordingly. She has a PHD... the odds of her respecting a man with a bachelor's (or less) is probably very low. How long before the "I need a man on my level" thoughts begin? How long before she feels "stifled" by his lack of intellectual conversation? Or feeling bad that he can't afford to buy things that she can?

is finding a man that she can relate to...my friend didnt finish college but did complete alot of course work...she just had a great job. but my sis wouldnt have a prob dating a guy with a BA for sure

talking about how men need to accept that there's ALWAYS women who are out of their league. They literally said that except for the President, EVERY man has thousands of women who are out of their league, and that they need to act accordingly.

They said "men feel entitled to think they can holler at ANY woman, as if they are qualified enough for them." One even said "a guy who paints the White House will say 'damn Michelle, you think you too good just because you live in there, huh?'"

When I challenged them, and basically said that it reeks of low self esteem for a man to assume a woman is better than him, they didn't agree at all. They wouldn't specify what makes a woman out of a man's league, but said it's a combo of culture, education, career, and several other things.

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connected in the academic community in our area which is pretty strong...we have several hbcus and top notch pwis in the area.. as a result, she attends alot of high profile type functions and events...some are dress up affairs etc. im sure at a minimum she would want a guy who could mix with that type of crowd and feel comfortable mingling and networking etc. i dont think its an unreasonable request nor a bad reflection on her if her desire of having a man that can roll in those types of environments happens to exclude some ppl

>talking about how men need to accept that there's ALWAYS
>women who are out of their league. They literally said that
>except for the President, EVERY man has thousands of women who
>are out of their league, and that they need to act
>accordingly.
>
>They said "men feel entitled to think they can holler at ANY
>woman, as if they are qualified enough for them." One even
>said "a guy who paints the White House will say 'damn
>Michelle, you think you too good just because you live in
>there, huh?'"
>
>When I challenged them, and basically said that it reeks of
>low self esteem for a man to assume a woman is better than
>him, they didn't agree at all. They wouldn't specify what
>makes a woman out of a man's league, but said it's a combo of
>culture, education, career, and several other things.

>connected in the academic community in our area which is
>pretty strong...we have several hbcus and top notch pwis in
>the area.. as a result, she attends alot of high profile type
>functions and events...some are dress up affairs etc. im sure
>at a minimum she would want a guy who could mix with that type
>of crowd and feel comfortable mingling and networking etc. i
>dont think its an unreasonable request nor a bad reflection on
>her if her desire of having a man that can roll in those types
>of environments happens to exclude some ppl

I think she's all good and will be good soon, even if it takes a while to find a match.

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>They wouldn't specify what
>makes a woman out of a man's league, but said it's a combo of
>culture, education, career, and several other things.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0MBD4uuksxg

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And yes propaganda. I feel like there is an effort or message to force black people into assimilating via supporting white supremacy e.g. adopting a "bootstraps" mentality or some other such frame of thinking that in turn pits those who assimilate vs those who cannot or will not. All the while both sides remain prey for the system of white supremacy.

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Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

>And yes propaganda. I feel like there is an effort or message
>to force black people into assimilating via supporting white
>supremacy e.g. adopting a "bootstraps" mentality or some other
>such frame of thinking that in turn pits those who assimilate
>vs those who cannot or will not. All the while both sides
>remain prey for the system of white supremacy.

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https://soundcloud.com/swageyph/yph-die-with-me

assimilate as in good job, works for white company???

and gotdamn that white supremacy

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TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

Irish, Italians, Germans, various Eastern European groups, certain Central and South American, etc. It appears that the process of identifying as white means the sacrifice of whatever one's original cultural identity is.

The Irish for example are culturally very different from Americans of European descent, but in coming to the US and ultimately being accepted into white society the vast majority of their cultural distinctions over a relatively short amount of time became non-existent. In other words in order to claim whiteness they had to let go of being Irish, French, German, Polish, etc. to some degree (and to a large one with perhaps the exception of Italians).

With a certain percentage of successful black people you seem to hear more of the "bootstraps, pant's up, respect yourself, speak properly" type of mentality. All of it seeming to say that in order to "make it" i.e. live like most whites-- you must give up these certain things that are often common within areas of the black experience and or culture. This to me looks like support for white supremacy (because as we know white people who behave in similar fashion need not give up much if any aspect of their cultural experience in order to be successful) masked as a type of self bias or self criticism.

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Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

but maybe it's because I grew up in Pittsburgh where they have Polish Hill, Irish, Jews, Germans, Italians who all have strong ties to their culture.

I think those groups didn't assimilate, they just passed the hate along to us... but maybe that is assimilating to a certain extent?

ionno... but these groups still hold onto their culture in certain communities



I think as long as you have someone black in the room... you become "white"

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TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

>but maybe it's because I grew up in Pittsburgh where they
>have Polish Hill, Irish, Jews, Germans, Italians who all have
>strong ties to their culture.

They could be outliers though. Like the Amish communities, but I see your point. I mean they can still claim white, but are they really about that European culture? Are the German folks doing anything more than Oktoberfest? Are the Irish observing more than just St. Patrick's? If they're really holding to the cultural norms and all then I would think they're more likely to identify as Polish, German, or whatever first before white. Did you find that to be the case?


>I think those groups didn't assimilate, they just passed the
>hate along to us... but maybe that is assimilating to a
>certain extent?

They very well may have not, but it sounds like your describing enclaves almost like Native American's on reservations who still observe their traditional ways.

>ionno... but these groups still hold onto their culture in
>certain communities

Certainly, but do they practice traditional dances and certain rites of passage or festivals?

>
>I think as long as you have someone black in the room... you
>become "white"

Yes and no. What if you're a north African who only identifies as white in skin tone? But ass far as white supremacy is concerned sure.

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Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

we had something called Nationality Days where they blocked of the road for a week and everyone set up good tents with their food and each night was dedicated to a different nationality and had dances, speeches, costumes, etc.

In Charlotte there is a Greek Festival that is huge every year.

I think you missed on this one.

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TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

245,918,582 people as of 2013 classify as white. A Greek festival here and there or a Polish day in a handful of major cities simply can't take a large enough number out of that total to make an impact.

I'd agree that there are these areas with pockets of preserved culture which perhaps newly arrived emigrants help in keeping the culture alive, but I'd say there are just as many that come and end up quickly assimilating. The Tsaranev brothers are a good example in support of your claim, but I'd wager had the younger of the two finished school and tasted success in Boston he'd quickly drop that muslim business and start filling in white on his applications.

Even if you're 100% correct about there being whites who still function as culturally this or that (and I'd say that would include regular observance of customs, traditions, and language not just a day or week to celebrate here and there) they are a minority. And 38% of that number classified as white/hispanic/latino e.g. Louis CK types. So that leaves about 198,127,454 people of which I wouldn't even say 1/3rd are "keeping it real" so to speak

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Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

That's a very interesting and profound characterization. I totally see that....and haven't really thought about it in that way. Good post

Here's a random observation I've had that speaks to that. During the world cup alot of 'white' people cheer for the country of their heritage. So they'll have irish flags on the car windows. Or French, Dutch, English, etc. There is ALWAYS an eventual backlash. I will have at least 3 or 4 rants on my facebook feed about people neglecting their Canadian identity. 'If you like Germany so much than move back there'....that type of thing. It's like they're threatened in some way by people celebrating their heritage. It's like clockwork every four years with the exact same rants from the same people. I've always wondered what motivates that....it totally fits your characterization though. It's basically a way of putting people back in line.

In so many words....'You're white now. You're not French anymore. Don't take that heritage shit too far lest we revoke the privilege inherited in your new white Canadian identity. Fall in line'.

Another way I've noticed it. I grew up with this guy John who was greek. When we were kids....he didn't really care about his heritage. He was absorbing the anglo-saxon culture around him....hockey, kraft dinner, etc. But when he turned 13 he had a bit of a cultural awakening. He started hanging out with more Greek people....started listening to Greek music....spoke Greek outside the house. This was met with alot of resistance from his friends. "What's with John....since when did he become 'Mr Greek' about everything? What a poser." It's like they resented him for exploring his heritage....and you can sense that they feel threatened by it somehow. Underneath their resistance...you can see how they're basically saying 'John, you're white. Cut it out with that Greek stuff'.

...I can see how that would be the case..I have seen where some 'white' folks that have some type of ethinic heritage sort of downplay it at times, and other times wave the flag..(mostly when they are around other ethinicities like us, on some well you know I'm not "WHITE white, Im irish or italian..ect).

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“I love these bitches, man. I really do.”
- Andre 3000

eh Atilla.....did you study sociology or something like that? Is there a particular idealogical theory or book that you've culled these views from? I'd like to read more about the frameworks/philosophies that you mention on here.

My outlook is largely formed from the overall historic record of US Emigration, combined with my experiences with and observations of White culture.

The PBS documentary on prohibition I think gives a good amount of insight into how in the beginning those arriving from Europe were barely accepted at all by the majority of American Whites and touches on a facet of how they became accepted, however the race aspect is not really given much attention but the ethnic conflict is.

Any historic reference on the Irish who came to America during the potato famine and found themselves initially working alongside than competing against blacks for jobs-- which in and of itself is an overarching theme when it comes to black and newly immigrant interaction. Any book on that is as good a place as any to start, but I can't think of any one resource in regard to that though.

There is a book I've been meaning to read myself but have discussed with those who have read it which is:

How Jews Became White Folks and What That Says About Race in
by Karen Brodkin

I grew up around a good amount of Jewish culture though so I thought I pretty much knew the gist of it, but I do plan to read it.

*Did you know tap dance is the product of Irish and African American interaction? I learned that from a white dance major who specialized in Irish dance. It makes a lot of sense when you think about it.

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Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

What is the solution you say?

Marry whoever the hell you want, fuck everybody else.

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all the reasons are valid and true.

but i also agree with the point made that a lot of black men get married much later.

in general, black men aren't as relationship/family/marriage-oriented as other men. not because "they aint shit," but because most of us grow up in broken families. we dont have many models of solid 2-parent homes growing up.

i also think a lot of black woman who remain single are too fixated on the idea of marrying "someone on my level or better." i think that a lot of black men either marry "up" or "out."

people get married sooner because they have stronger support systems going in.

I hear young white people that get married always talk about "mom AND dad" paying for everything, the wedding, major appliances or furniture for their new house, the down payment on the house, or living in their parents house or rental property for cheap or free, a new car, no student loans, just a ton of different things that give them a head start out of the gate.

Conversely a lot of black folks go in debt from the wedding alone before you get to any of the other stuff.

For that reason, a lot of black people look to get married later. Black men in particular tend to wait until their more "established". A lot of black women want the finished product and sometimes won't give a brother a chance when he is working his way up. But once the brother is established he has a LOT more options and women in his age range often get passed over for younger women and even other races.

I always say a woman over 35 that is still single is single for a reason.

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"Take the surprise out your voice Shaq."-The REAL CP3
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2H5K-BUMS0

>I always say a woman over 35 that is still single is single
>for a reason.

what might those reasons be?

especially if she is fine. I know it sounds messed up but dudes think something HAS to be off for her to be by herself.

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TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

aint nothing wrong with me.

ppl need to stop repeating this nonsense.

and i take extreme offense to the notion that there's something wrong with ME because i've not yet wed/am single

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TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

________________________________________
"Take the surprise out your voice Shaq."-The REAL CP3
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2H5K-BUMS0