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topic #81098

Subject: "Oh Lawd....now Grant Hill is going to write an editorial about the Fab 5"

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TheRealBillyOcean
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38224 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 09:11 AM

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"Oh Lawd....now Grant Hill is going to write an editorial about the Fab 5"

I never knew an 18 yr old's comments would cause such a firestorm. Just let it go Grant. You're better than this.

http://www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/PaulCoro/122240

Grant Hill writes back
Phoenix Suns update:

Suns forward Grant Hill has written an editorial that will appear in this Sunday's New York Times in response to the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary on Michigan's Fab Five.

The Fab Five was a college contemporary of Hill's time at Duke and the documentary, for which Jalen Rose was executive producer, has created controversy with statements Rose made about Duke recruiting, including an "Uncle Tom" reference. He and Michigan teammate Jimmy King made specific statements about Hill.

"For me, Duke was a person," Rose said on the documentary. "I hated Duke and I hated everything Duke stood for. Schools like Duke don't recruit players like me. I felt like they only recruited Black players that were Uncle Toms.

"I was jealous of Grant Hill. He came from a great Black family. Congratulations, your mom went to college and was roommates with Hillary Clinton. And your dad played in the NFL - a very well-spoken and successful man. I was upset and bitter my mom had to bust her hump for 20 years. I was bitter that I had a professional athlete that was my dad that I didn't know. I resented that more than I resented him."

Hill's piece is expected to be posted at www.nytimes.com Wednesday.

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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Topic Outline

Subject	Author	Message Date	ID
hahahaha >>> influence that Da U... BE MAD!	LegacyNS	Mar 16th 2011	1
damn grant lol	illegal	Mar 16th 2011	2
I imagine that the editorial will be classy, magnanimous and all of that...	Dr Claw	Mar 16th 2011	3
What's he possibly gonna say? 'I'm good. I'm black. I'm sooo...	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 16th 2011	6
I bet it'll say it's ok for black men to go to a school like Duke.	Frank Longo	Mar 16th 2011	7
But that's not what they said.	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 16th 2011	8
Let me rephrase it then.	Frank Longo	Mar 16th 2011	9
But they didn't say that either	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 16th 2011	11
Did you watch Jalen and Jimmy on ESPN yesterday?	Frank Longo	Mar 16th 2011	15
I didn't see that. But if that's the angle Grant takes, cool.	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 16th 2011	20
I don't think they equated it. They phrased it carefully.	Frank Longo	Mar 16th 2011	22
basically equated it	analog2digital	Mar 16th 2011	28
Not true	nahymsa	Mar 18th 2011	363
pretty much	veritas	Mar 16th 2011	38
Yes & its true Duke requires conformity	nahymsa	Mar 18th 2011	362
LOL, Because you can't POINT to ANYTHING	analog2digital	Mar 19th 2011	419
Duke is a place	nahymsa	Mar 23rd 2011	470
No, they didn't	analog2digital	Mar 16th 2011	13
Nah, Jalen was saying that's how he felt then.	Frank Longo	Mar 16th 2011	16
I don't care how he felt then	analog2digital	Mar 16th 2011	21
agreed. (even though yall the enemy)	BrooklynWHAT	Mar 16th 2011	41
Dangerous how..	nahymsa	Mar 18th 2011	366
Define it	analog2digital	Mar 19th 2011	416
don't you know? no tats! no facial hair! no bald heads! no bad grammar!	Basaglia	Mar 19th 2011	418
At the time of the Fab 5 time	nahymsa	Mar 23rd 2011	466
RE: Define it	nahymsa	Mar 23rd 2011	468
lolsmhlol nm	d.	Mar 16th 2011	4
"cmon, mayne" (c) miller high life delivery truck dude	ChuckFoPrez	Mar 16th 2011	5
GOOD!	analog2digital	Mar 16th 2011	10
It's not from archival footage but it's from his memory.	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 16th 2011	14
Does it need to be addressed or not?	analog2digital	Mar 16th 2011	18
PLEASE STOP TYPING NOW	Rjcc	Mar 16th 2011	26
kill yourself, because you're a non reading stupid fuck	Rjcc	Mar 16th 2011	17
LOST	Amritsar	Mar 16th 2011	30
I thought the key phrase was "FELT"	HeadNodda	Mar 16th 2011	12
1) Isn't it Jalen's documentary?	analog2digital	Mar 16th 2011	24
If he responds to this shit like Jalen said he fells that way now	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	19
Word up. What she said. Like I heard Jason Osbourne...	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 16th 2011	23
J. O. is actually playing overseas....so no.	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	25
Across the Mississippi = Not Overseas	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 16th 2011	27
You stupid cole. lol	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	91
stop bullshitting. They still feel that way.	Expertise	Mar 16th 2011	31
Would you go on to your Tea Party meeting already. lmao	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	93
At duke they only offer	cereffusion	Mar 16th 2011	35
Reston, VA what what	josephmurf2384	Mar 16th 2011	29
Good. He needs to respond.	Expertise	Mar 16th 2011	32
it leaked: http://i52.tinypic.com/2dkwt4n.jpg	FortifiedLive	Mar 16th 2011	33
LOL	40thStreetBlack	Mar 16th 2011	85
lol@ 'an 18 year olds comments' as if Jalen didnt say the same this week	Bombastic	Mar 16th 2011	34
basically.	Expertise	Mar 16th 2011	36
EXACTLY	BrooklynWHAT	Mar 16th 2011	83
What did he say that wasn't true?	nahymsa	Mar 18th 2011	367
i'm going to continue to not care about this stupid controversy	bshelly	Mar 16th 2011	37
fuck duke and fuck coach k.	Guinness	Mar 16th 2011	39
its out!	PROMO	Mar 16th 2011	40
wrong spot	CherNic	Mar 16th 2011	42
LOL GRANT LOL	CherNic	Mar 16th 2011	43
Ether nm	El_essence	Mar 16th 2011	44
damn thats some well written ether	BrooklynWHAT	Mar 16th 2011	45
Nothing wrong with this response.	Frank Longo	Mar 16th 2011	46
Grant sounds hurt...soft ass nigga shoulda said what's real	avionix	Mar 16th 2011	47
he felt that way cause he was ignorant and shortsighted.	BrooklynWHAT	Mar 16th 2011	50
lol right?	V3rb	Mar 16th 2011	52
but who's said that and ONLY that without throwin more darts?	avionix	Mar 16th 2011	55
He felt that way because the Fab 5 were treated like thugs & criminals	nahymsa	Mar 18th 2011	369
From an outsider, I agree with you. However, if I'm Grant, I'm not	El_essence	Mar 16th 2011	53
that's the thing, grant seems smart enough to separate the idea	avionix	Mar 16th 2011	57
fair enough.	El_essence	Mar 16th 2011	86
Who lives without Chaucer?	Walleye	Mar 16th 2011	48
That was a typo. He meant Chauncey	jigga	Mar 16th 2011	133
^^^^^	selppataei	Mar 16th 2011	138
Eloquent.	V3rb	Mar 16th 2011	49
They both one. Fuck picking sides.	muzuabo	Mar 20th 2011	442
God....damn. ETHER.	Ryan M	Mar 16th 2011	51
The last sentence alone	Numba_33	Mar 16th 2011	54
I'm guessing that Jalen is preppin for Sportscenter shruggin his shoulde...	Beezo	Mar 16th 2011	56
write_serengeti's reply #19 smh @ Grant Hill	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 16th 2011	58
nods	bshelly	Mar 16th 2011	63
This read exactly like I knew it would.	Dr Claw	Mar 16th 2011	59
RE: This read exactly like I knew it would.	nipsey	Mar 16th 2011	62
yup	bshelly	Mar 16th 2011	66
sounds like a butthurt bear. jalen has a right to his opinion.	PROMO	Mar 16th 2011	61
why's Jalen have a 'right to his opinion' but Grant doesn't have a righ...	Bombastic	Mar 16th 2011	69
amazing isn't it? apparently only ppl they agree with have that right	LegacyNS	Mar 16th 2011	94
sign. he played himself.	bshelly	Mar 16th 2011	65
No. It reads like an articulate Black man taking issue with ignorance	bignick	Mar 16th 2011	71
ignorance which everyone involved already admitted was ignorant	bshelly	Mar 16th 2011	74
when did you and O_E switch places?	40thStreetBlack	Mar 16th 2011	84
how on earth is it a dead issue while its been repeated by a 38-year-old	Bombastic	Mar 16th 2011	110
^^^^^	El_essence	Mar 16th 2011	132
it's being repeated because the media latched onto it	40thStreetBlack	Mar 17th 2011	242
lol @ 'latched onto it',they made it a key theme of a film they produced	Bombastic	Mar 17th 2011	262
they made financial exploitation of college athletes key theme of it too	40thStreetBlack	Mar 17th 2011	279
What freaking more does Grant Hill need?	nahymsa	Mar 18th 2011	370
lulz.	Guinness	Mar 16th 2011	80
exactly....thanks for the tongue lashing Grant	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 16th 2011	72
applause	universally_speaking	Mar 16th 2011	67
Grant's taking this personally	nipsey	Mar 16th 2011	68
RE: Grant's taking this personally	SirLau	Mar 16th 2011	105
I like Hill, but this sounded a lot more bitter than it needed to be	mrhood75	Mar 16th 2011	70
Perfect.	bignick	Mar 16th 2011	73
He WOULD post it on the NY Times. Shoulda gone to Slam Online.	haj20	Mar 16th 2011	76
clueless and unsympathetic.	Guinness	Mar 16th 2011	77
how i read it was...	builtfromwax	Mar 16th 2011	78
lol.	jane eyre	Mar 16th 2011	79
It's really tough to argue against this response	ZooTown74	Mar 16th 2011	81
I think it's funny how folks are acting as if he shouldn't feel some	El_essence	Mar 16th 2011	101
very little clarification? He explained exactly why he felt that way.	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	113
They ain't really been clear about it post doc though. I'm looking at it	El_essence	Mar 16th 2011	130
If it's UNCLEAR then get on the phone like a grown ass man	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	140
RE: If it's UNCLEAR then get on the phone like a grown ass man	BLACK_ADAM	Mar 16th 2011	143
nah jalen shouldve called first	MfDash	Mar 16th 2011	161
What? lol Anyway, Wilbon said he talked to Grant and Grant	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	163
RE: What? lol Anyway, Wilbon said he talked to Grant and Grant	MfDash	Mar 16th 2011	165
Because the whole argument is about WHETHER he still feels	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	168
noo the thread is about hills response	MfDash	Mar 16th 2011	178
Thanks. lol	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	182
This is so ridiculous.	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	88
What's worse is that Jalen pre-emptively apologized...	BLACK_ADAM	Mar 16th 2011	92
Fuck a pre-emptive apology	JungleSouljah	Mar 17th 2011	276
Or Jalen saw how the comments were taken out of context..	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 17th 2011	280
RE: Or Jalen saw how the comments were taken out of context..	BLACK_ADAM	Mar 21st 2011	445
Maize and Blue til I die but Grant Hill is spot on....	LegacyNS	Mar 16th 2011	95
Right. I ain't even mad at Rose. I feel him. But the fact that Grant	El_essence	Mar 16th 2011	103
shit.	Guinness	Mar 16th 2011	117
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^	BLACK_ADAM	Mar 16th 2011	119
Traits of a WINNER	T Reynolds	Mar 16th 2011	121
or it could be him feeling disrespected and not focusing on that. I	El_essence	Mar 16th 2011	123
it's an open letter in the nytimes, not a tweet.	Guinness	Mar 16th 2011	139
^^^^^and AGAIN^^^^^^^^^^^^^^	BLACK_ADAM	Mar 16th 2011	141
lol @ '18' & 'adolescent' continuing to be tossed out there	Bombastic	Mar 16th 2011	144
i disagree.	Guinness	Mar 16th 2011	153
RE: i disagree.	El_essence	Mar 16th 2011	158
no one asked grant to say anything.	Guinness	Mar 16th 2011	170
RE: i disagree.	Bombastic	Mar 16th 2011	183
I would agree with you if Jalen and King were more thoughtful in how	El_essence	Mar 16th 2011	146
That actually reaffirmed how I feel about this situation thus	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	149
they CONTINUE to misrepresent duke's recruiting philosophy	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	166
lol@you using two niggas whose daddies went to college and	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	176
too bad jalen and jimmy made a blanket statement. TWO is not ALL	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	189
I didn't even get what I said, but okay. lol	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	192
can't really blame him i guess, but grant could've been bigger than this	40thStreetBlack	Mar 16th 2011	120
Good stuff but I still hate seeing brothas "fight" in public	Solaam	Mar 16th 2011	126
He's so well spoken!	jigga	Mar 16th 2011	136
So basically Grant proved Jalen was right	Kira	Mar 16th 2011	147
Very well done.	Challenger	Mar 16th 2011	152
A bitch	Notalent	Mar 16th 2011	60
dope avy, even if the coneys look disgusting.	guru0509	Mar 16th 2011	64
Lafayette Coney downtown	Notalent	Mar 16th 2011	75
C'mon American Better	nipsey	Mar 16th 2011	82
damn. Fatlock done went in too (swipe)	BrooklynWHAT	Mar 16th 2011	87
Ewing went to Cambridge Rindge & Latin...	BLACK_ADAM	Mar 16th 2011	98
You should e-mail Whitlock and/or his editor	Numba_33	Mar 16th 2011	100
LOL! I know I won't get a response!!!!	BLACK_ADAM	Mar 16th 2011	118
He was an intern in my dad's office	Walleye	Mar 16th 2011	107
Your father worked with/for Senator Bill Bradley?	Numba_33	Mar 16th 2011	114
Ewing was an intern with the Senate Finance Committee	Walleye	Mar 16th 2011	128
Whitlock doesnt even know what PE song name-drops Elvis, whatchu expect?	Bombastic	Mar 16th 2011	108
takes a real incompetent coach to reach 3 NC games in 5 years	cgonz00cc	Mar 16th 2011	99
FUCK THAT FAT FUCK.	Dr Claw	Mar 16th 2011	111
This is a whooooole 'nother post	nipsey	Mar 16th 2011	112
RE: self-awareness and common sense are our most rare commodities.	veritas	Mar 16th 2011	216
beautiful column.	Expertise	Mar 16th 2011	223
and it would have been more idiotic than this one	cgonz00cc	Mar 17th 2011	270
I want Shane Battier to do a diss track.	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 16th 2011	89
Black guys hating Duke: The manifestation of self-hate	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	90
grant's article barely talks about race at all	bshelly	Mar 16th 2011	96
then you should cease passing judgment on grant's article	El_essence	Mar 16th 2011	106
u were better off 'skipping this controversy' as u originally planned	Bombastic	Mar 16th 2011	116
misplaced channeling of rage at Phillies injuries	B9	Mar 16th 2011	129
fuck it, I'm cosigning.	Dr Claw	Mar 16th 2011	125
Nobody attacked his family	nahymsa	Mar 18th 2011	385
but, it does. he hits squarely on views of race and identity among black...	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	154
delete	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	164
uhhh, what?	kayru99	Mar 17th 2011	245
and it has nothing to do with winning...and beating "black" teams a lot	Basaglia	Mar 17th 2011	246
man, in the 80s and 90s, duke was a lily white team	kayru99	Mar 18th 2011	342
Jalen wasn't speaking in the present tense and anyone	Warren Coolidge	Mar 17th 2011	267
grant u didnt have to hit him w/ the ether like that dog	Binlahab	Mar 16th 2011	97
Yeah that was OD. He declensioned on dat azz	T Reynolds	Mar 16th 2011	102
Grant needs to be careful about looking really foolish with this...	Warren Coolidge	Mar 16th 2011	104
just read the article.... Grant missed the point big time....	Warren Coolidge	Mar 16th 2011	109
RE: just read the article.... Grant missed the point big time....	nipsey	Mar 16th 2011	115
Ok, I currently live in NC and Duke's perception	Torez the Judge	Mar 16th 2011	124
John Chaney was a leader of men as well.	guru0509	Mar 16th 2011	134
indeed he was/is n/m	Bombastic	Mar 16th 2011	145
word word (c) tip	Torez the Judge	Mar 16th 2011	156
thinking that a program is elitist...and the dellusion and denial of	Warren Coolidge	Mar 16th 2011	148
i agree....	Torez the Judge	Mar 16th 2011	157
The funny part about this whole thing is Coach K (intentionally	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	122
^^^^	Torez the Judge	Mar 16th 2011	127
See I don't see it as molding already "good" black men....it's	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	135
I think we are saying the same thing	Torez the Judge	Mar 16th 2011	155
No, no, no...the good coaches KNOW they have to be a daddy	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	171
So is Coach K not a good coach because he's recruiting people	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	172
but i've already run of a rack of names that didn't have daddies	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	179
lol@you knowin if all those dudes daddies are active in their....	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	181
you making my point for me. how "black" do their families have to be?	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	190
lol...and the funny part is you're serious with this reply.	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	193
What's scary is HE associated blackness w/ crack babies	nahymsa	Mar 19th 2011	409
Rashad Carruth, Jason Parker, Desmond Allison...	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 16th 2011	142
i was jealous of motherfuckers with fathers when i was a teenager, too.	Jesse Badgreen	Mar 16th 2011	131
So he IS a bitch? Good to know.	FireBrand	Mar 16th 2011	137
Exactly	nahymsa	Mar 18th 2011	375
Grant wrote a very profound and well thought out response but...	vee-lover	Mar 16th 2011	150
True Story: Saw Grant on campus his freshman year	Challenger	Mar 16th 2011	151
damn, jada been fucking with THATBEIGE for a minute...	Torez the Judge	Mar 16th 2011	159
RE: damn, jada been fucking with THATBEIGE for a minute...	CanUooooFeeLiT	Mar 16th 2011	180
RE: True Story: Saw Grant on campus his freshman year	SirLau	Mar 16th 2011	160
it was a black basketball player driving a range ...	Challenger	Mar 16th 2011	162
Iverson was driving a Benz his Freshman year....soooooooo.....	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	169
sooooooooo think people thought his mom bought it for him?	Challenger	Mar 16th 2011	185
and you make my point EXACTLY...	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	186
Fuck you talking about Lucy?	Challenger	Mar 16th 2011	194
They don't want to talk about perception on here. lol	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	196
jalen wasn't talking about perception, he stated it as FACT...	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	198
if you insist, let's go to the tape ... (Jalen quote)	Challenger	Mar 16th 2011	199
NIGGA. they talking about TODAY's recruiting philosophy!	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	200
^^^ people ignore what Rose said this week, lol.	Frank Longo	Mar 17th 2011	248
wow I just watched this...	LegacyNS	Mar 18th 2011	344
I defended Jalen when this first started, but he and Jimmy are wrong	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	167
Ummm no but now ya'll about to become even more	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	174
lol	ChuckFoPrez	Mar 16th 2011	177
slow down son, you killin 'em	analog2digital	Mar 16th 2011	184
Grant Hill is an oreo, and writes like an uppity nigga.	LittleX	Mar 16th 2011	173
Now the post has jumped the Blue Devil. smh	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	175
LOL!	nipsey	Mar 16th 2011	188
Stop being a such an Internet Troll, LittleX.	Dr Claw	Mar 16th 2011	204
BTW, the letter is the perfect "Tebow speech" for Duke	B9	Mar 16th 2011	187
maybe i'm too young but i never even heard this Duke player == Uncle Tom	southphillyman	Mar 16th 2011	191
I never thought that either, but I think in recruiting circles some	write_serengeti	Mar 16th 2011	195
yup there is a difference between being a corny nigga like boozer	southphillyman	Mar 16th 2011	197
LOOK AT WHAT THE FUCK THEY SAYING STARTING AT 2:45	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	201
is it possible (in your mind) that they were wrong AND GH could have	avionix	Mar 16th 2011	202
no, no, no...let's just leave it at THEY WERE/ARE WRONG!	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	206
elton got the fuck out cuz he wasn't feeling that elitist shit	s_dot_miles	Mar 16th 2011	203
elton got the fuck because he was going #1, you dumb fuck	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	205
K been at duke for 31 years and how many inner city kids have been	s_dot_miles	Mar 16th 2011	210
RE: K been at duke for 31 years and how many inner city kids have been	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	213
Roshown McCloed was a transfer dumbass	s_dot_miles	Mar 16th 2011	217
so was jones, you dumb bitch...as if that changes ANYTHING	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	220
aka, not a typical recruit. nice try though.	s_dot_miles	Mar 16th 2011	225
you are way too mad right now.	Expertise	Mar 16th 2011	209
that's not a response...and yes, i'm mad. because people are lying	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	214
wrong...	builtfromwax	Mar 16th 2011	224
RE: wrong...	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	227
you reachin'...	builtfromwax	Mar 16th 2011	238
Duke students were on that BS when Elton left (swipe)	Kira	Mar 16th 2011	207
annnnnnnd that has nothing to do with duke's recruiting philosophy	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	208
actually it shows why an 18year old jalen and so many others	s_dot_miles	Mar 16th 2011	211
local kids like...john wall? rodney purvis? HE DID, YOU DUMB FUCK!	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	215
thanks for proving my point. where john wall go to school?	s_dot_miles	Mar 16th 2011	218
they were recruited by duke...don't matter where they went.	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	219
hahaha so K feigning interest is what you call recruiting now?	s_dot_miles	Mar 16th 2011	221
feigning interest...you don't offer scholarships for fun, ya dumb fuck	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	222
^^^^^^wearing a Universal Madness sweatshirt and lanyard keychain	s_dot_miles	Mar 16th 2011	226
i disproved every bit of bullshit y'all threw out...	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	228
NIGGA YOU NAMED DAMN NEAR EVERY BLACK PLAYER DUKE HAS	s_dot_miles	Mar 16th 2011	229
actually, i didn't come close. that just crystallizes your ignorance	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	230
you prolly feel this whole issue is an indictment against your own black...	s_dot_miles	Mar 16th 2011	233
no, no...being "cute" doesn't mean shit here. you're wrong. they wrong	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	234
Maybe they didn't choose Duke because they wanted to play in the NBA	Warren Coolidge	Mar 18th 2011	335
LOUISVILLE. :)	write_serengeti	Mar 17th 2011	298
LOL Brand got real with her.	Expertise	Mar 16th 2011	212
legit question.... has duke ever had a black starting 5?	s_dot_miles	Mar 16th 2011	231
RE: legit question.... has duke ever had a black starting 5?	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	232
thanks. i just knew there had to be at least 1 team out of 31 K years	s_dot_miles	Mar 16th 2011	235
RE: thanks. i just knew there had to be at least 1 team out of 31 K year...	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	236
you're doing great. keep up the good work basa!	s_dot_miles	Mar 16th 2011	237
"i've been proven wrong beyond repair...time to be cute!"	Basaglia	Mar 16th 2011	239
you sure dunleavy didnt start some of those games?	s_dot_miles	Mar 17th 2011	240
RE: legit question.... has duke ever had a black starting 5?	SirLau	Mar 17th 2011	253
The fuck you mean count? They black. I dont even like Duke...	ChuckNeal	Mar 17th 2011	257
the fact that in 2011 people of mixed race are still considered Black	s_dot_miles	Mar 17th 2011	258
The fact that we still HAVE race in 2011 should be your first concern	ChuckNeal	Mar 17th 2011	286
let's get to the bottom of what it is	Nodima	Mar 18th 2011	404
RE: http://i367.photobucket.com/albums/oo115/Mr-Monday/umad-2.jpg	40thStreetBlack	Mar 20th 2011	443
trajan and battier are not Black. neither is Obama.	s_dot_miles	Mar 20th 2011	444
word? Frederick Douglass and Bob Marley too?	40thStreetBlack	Mar 21st 2011	446
what he identifies with doesnt change who he actually is	s_dot_miles	Mar 21st 2011	448
sure it does...you mad	Basaglia	Mar 21st 2011	450
nigga your whole style on this board is played out. get a new fucking gi...	s_dot_miles	Mar 21st 2011	451
a new gigli? your subject line got cut, you dumb mad bitch	Basaglia	Mar 21st 2011	453
gimmick. but i couldnt give less of a fuck. you mad and terrified	s_dot_miles	Mar 22nd 2011	454
"let them live w/o creating your own narrative for their lives."	40thStreetBlack	Mar 22nd 2011	455
meanwhile in reality land, you cant pick who your parents are	s_dot_miles	Mar 22nd 2011	457
and he didn't. he chose how HE would live his own life.	40thStreetBlack	Mar 23rd 2011	458
i'm talking biological facts and you talking dumb shit.	s_dot_miles	Mar 23rd 2011	462
LOL- biological fact is Black Americans have on average~30% European DNA	40thStreetBlack	Mar 23rd 2011	464
smart dumb people are funny. do the math on Obama and see	s_dot_miles	Mar 23rd 2011	467
just plain dumb people are funnier. and you're a riot.	40thStreetBlack	Mar 24th 2011	477
Oh give me a break	nahymsa	Mar 18th 2011	379
lol damn. good for grant. basa is killing y'all btw.	dula dos pistolas	Mar 17th 2011	241
And trying way too hard.	SpookyElectric	Mar 17th 2011	243
basa took the burner to some of these niggas.	BrooklynWHAT	Mar 17th 2011	244
That photo and caption combo is fking amazing	JungleSouljah	Mar 17th 2011	281
being loud and wrong is not killing anything.	s_dot_miles	Mar 17th 2011	249
actually, he absolutely destroyed every bad point u made specifically	Bombastic	Mar 17th 2011	264
I think he's on the precipice, fam...	Dr Claw	Mar 17th 2011	259
He's STILL insinuating K thinks kids aren't "Good" enough to go to Duke	analog2digital	Mar 17th 2011	265
And? He could have said the same about UNC or Wake, or OSU...	Dr Claw	Mar 17th 2011	271
I just don't accept that anything was "wrong" with Jalen Rose	analog2digital	Mar 17th 2011	278
I don't think there was, either.... but	Dr Claw	Mar 17th 2011	283
Fair enough...but he certainly SOUNDS Butthurt	analog2digital	Mar 17th 2011	285
not jalen specifically - he said when has K recruited anyone in Detroit?	40thStreetBlack	Mar 18th 2011	364
So?!?! Its true	nahymsa	Mar 18th 2011	373
RE: So?!?! Its true	analog2digital	Mar 19th 2011	415
people who don't think critically, but speak on emotion? they're stupid	Basaglia	Mar 19th 2011	417
Actually he is not. lmao	write_serengeti	Mar 18th 2011	354
Lol....this bullshit is still going on.	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 17th 2011	247
Still going ... Basa, come out and playyyyyy. Coach K speaks (SWIPE)	Challenger	Mar 17th 2011	250
"But you still have to be careful to recruit the right ones."	s_dot_miles	Mar 17th 2011	251
I don't really understand the confusion.	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 17th 2011	252
the confusion is in the "bitch" and "Uncle Tom" comments	El_essence	Mar 17th 2011	260
Then they should get in a time machine and 19 yr old Grant Hill should..	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 17th 2011	261
or when asked directly whether he thinks Black players at Duke	El_essence	Mar 17th 2011	263
the conversaition is happening NOW, what don't y'all get about that?	Bombastic	Mar 17th 2011	266
Reply #255	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 17th 2011	269
a) brought up multiple times this week, b) First & 10	Bombastic	Mar 17th 2011	272
It's Jalen clarifying his comments today	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 17th 2011	273
I get that, it's also after a week of this talk & Grant's letter	Bombastic	Mar 17th 2011	275
But to me his initial comment was already clear enough..	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 17th 2011	277
obviously it did since he couldnt clarify himself until todays backtrack	Bombastic	Mar 17th 2011	282
It was obvious what was meant...no need for clarification	nahymsa	Mar 18th 2011	380
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDlfp4ADJRE&feature=player_detailpage#t=1...	El_essence	Mar 17th 2011	274
RE: "But you still have to be careful to recruit the right ones."	Basaglia	Mar 17th 2011	288
did K ever actually meet with Wall? i heard some reporter say K	southphillyman	Mar 18th 2011	387
yes, he did. and he offered him a scholarship	Basaglia	Mar 19th 2011	410
I LOVE DISMANTLING DUKE-HATERS!!!!	Basaglia	Mar 17th 2011	289
andddd, not 1of the people u named were playing in 91, 92 or	Challenger	Mar 18th 2011	349
so, johnny dawkins wasn't rocking niggerish gold ropes in durham 84?	Basaglia	Mar 18th 2011	391
Blue devil, I beseech your belligerent ass.	Challenger	Mar 18th 2011	393
you're unable to argue your position. live with it	Basaglia	Mar 18th 2011	394
Jimmy King Responds to Hill 3-17 (podcast)	LegacyNS	Mar 17th 2011	254
cough	ZooTown74	Mar 17th 2011	255
Good thing he clarified which was clearly OBVIOUS	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 17th 2011	256
lol...told y'all so...	Warren Coolidge	Mar 17th 2011	268
If it was so clear why did Jalen apologize to Grant	JungleSouljah	Mar 17th 2011	284
Maybe Grant aint know Jalen thought he was a bitch before?	ChuckNeal	Mar 17th 2011	287
Because Jalen has more class in his pinky than Grant does in his entire ...	nahymsa	Mar 18th 2011	374
He apologized because before it even premiered people were talking	Melanism	Mar 18th 2011	386
iono man Basa might have a point regarding their First Take appearance	LegacyNS	Mar 18th 2011	345
like i said....the internal debate...grant a beast...y'all MAD!	Basaglia	Mar 17th 2011	290
tamia cheating...grant a cuckold. cry about it.	s_dot_miles	Mar 17th 2011	291
Jimmy King is just being dumb now (twitter)	smooth va	Mar 17th 2011	292
I think Grant went from being a bitch to not being a bitch to being	write_serengeti	Mar 17th 2011	296
so, everytime G proves he's better than them, they think he's a bitch	Basaglia	Mar 17th 2011	299
At the end of the day none of the shit is going to matter. You	write_serengeti	Mar 17th 2011	301
he can think G a bitch all he wants and K can not offer dumbasses	Basaglia	Mar 17th 2011	304
LOL@you adding some new shit to it. YOU know as well as I DO	write_serengeti	Mar 17th 2011	309
can you understand that i DON'T know what they meant?	Basaglia	Mar 17th 2011	312
Yes you did....you just want to argue....that's what YOU do.	write_serengeti	Mar 17th 2011	313
so now Duke went after Taylor King and not Kevin Love	Warren Coolidge	Mar 18th 2011	334
no because he and his father were a headache	Basaglia	Mar 18th 2011	339
he's acting like exactly what he is...i'll leave it at that	Basaglia	Mar 17th 2011	297
I agree. the more jalen and jimmy speak, the dumber they sound	smooth va	Mar 17th 2011	310
Y'all still going? I'm all debated out so hopefully one of you will	write_serengeti	Mar 17th 2011	293
where the hell is the basketball in your avy?	smooth va	Mar 17th 2011	294
In the stands. That was a pic of Siva blocking a shot.	write_serengeti	Mar 17th 2011	295
Say something funny?	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 17th 2011	300
topic ain't been explored enough...they can't argue their position	Basaglia	Mar 17th 2011	302
You're not changing anybody's mind because you are	write_serengeti	Mar 17th 2011	306
there are no DEGREES of it being TRUE. it's just NOT TRUE	Basaglia	Mar 17th 2011	311
And they were real high on the degrees of truthiness. HIGH.	write_serengeti	Mar 17th 2011	314
the degree to which it's true at duke is the same at most elite programs...	Basaglia	Mar 17th 2011	316
You know what they said IS the truth that's why you talking	write_serengeti	Mar 17th 2011	318
again: it's true at MOST of the elite programs	Basaglia	Mar 17th 2011	322
Elite in terms of academics...not sports world elite.	write_serengeti	Mar 17th 2011	324
Fam.... no one is checking for Jimmy King says on tv 3 days after the do...	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 17th 2011	308
throws tomatoes as you	write_serengeti	Mar 17th 2011	307
mgoblog agrees with Jimmy King (link ) /	cgonz00cc	Mar 17th 2011	303
all that hiding behind the "that how they felt at 18" shit is DONE...	Basaglia	Mar 17th 2011	305
thats not true, but who cares anyway?	cgonz00cc	Mar 17th 2011	315
except it's true. your glib aside is a classic polemical eject button	Basaglia	Mar 17th 2011	317
if you're referring to the 5:27 mark, let it go. seriously.	cgonz00cc	Mar 18th 2011	327
so, i'm supposed to skip where they specifically contradicted that?	Basaglia	Mar 18th 2011	329
when jimmy king defined what he thought selling out was?	cgonz00cc	Mar 18th 2011	331
again...i defend the 20 years ago shit...stop derailing	Basaglia	Mar 18th 2011	338
He knows Jalen and nem were speaking truth. Trust me.	write_serengeti	Mar 17th 2011	321
so is anybody gonna note that Duke is an elite university?	smooth va	Mar 17th 2011	319
Yeah...same goes for Notre Dame, Stanford....but coaches	write_serengeti	Mar 17th 2011	323
exactly. Duke seems to want to top academic performers	smooth va	Mar 18th 2011	325
Which proves Jalen's point.	write_serengeti	Mar 18th 2011	326
No. jalen seems to think this is specific to Duke and black players	smooth va	Mar 18th 2011	350
lol.....no you proved his point with exactly what you said.	write_serengeti	Mar 18th 2011	352
completely separate issue....	Basaglia	Mar 18th 2011	328
Africa. NOPE! Africa.	Orbit_Established	Mar 17th 2011	320
Africa Far(c)T-Boz	Bombastic	Mar 18th 2011	330
oh, you in the motherland, my nigg?	dula dos pistolas	Mar 18th 2011	332
broussard spitting fiya:	dula dos pistolas	Mar 18th 2011	333
Instead of questioning who Duke recruits and who they don't	Warren Coolidge	Mar 18th 2011	336
forgoes derailment attempt	Basaglia	Mar 18th 2011	337
APPLAUSE!!!	nahymsa	Mar 18th 2011	384
quinn cook, prepare to be told how not black you are, son	Basaglia	Mar 18th 2011	340
I can't deal with you lmao	CherNic	Mar 18th 2011	341
tre kelley blacker, he a Dunbar grad...	builtfromwax	Mar 18th 2011	346
So many unsurprising things in this post.	Frank Longo	Mar 18th 2011	343
Just watched the First Take vid and they absolutely still feel that way	LegacyNS	Mar 18th 2011	347
ok, this is fair	bshelly	Mar 18th 2011	348
lol	write_serengeti	Mar 18th 2011	355
I'm sayin the shit been posted multiple times	El_essence	Mar 18th 2011	356
So..Michigan is now a local community college?	gmltheone	Mar 18th 2011	351
Are people even thinking? lol	write_serengeti	Mar 18th 2011	353
Michigan is a public school with a history of recruiting Detroit PSL	cgonz00cc	Mar 18th 2011	358
Its not about the school, its about the attitude	nahymsa	Mar 18th 2011	382
....oops	write_serengeti	Mar 18th 2011	357
Jalen and Jimmy King's espn interview	Warren Coolidge	Mar 18th 2011	359
Oh look! Warren posting about Duke! What a surprise!	Frank Longo	Mar 18th 2011	360
you've been caught in an obvious lie frank...	Warren Coolidge	Mar 18th 2011	361
Is this true? I can't click on the link now, and haven't clicked...	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 18th 2011	365
lol @ cold pizza	cgonz00cc	Mar 18th 2011	368
*frowns at the Duke contingent*	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 18th 2011	372
yall? ive been a michigan fan since 11/18/82	cgonz00cc	Mar 18th 2011	378
Warren and y'all are acting like I give a fuck about ANY of this, lol.	Frank Longo	Mar 21st 2011	452
They stand by the fact the Duke DID and DOES recruit	write_serengeti	Mar 18th 2011	371
RE: They stand by the fact the Duke DID and DOES recruit	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 18th 2011	376
after that poorly written vaginal cramp of a letter	cgonz00cc	Mar 18th 2011	377
Thank you!	nahymsa	Mar 18th 2011	381
i don't think grant was ever a bitch	jahlove7	Mar 18th 2011	399
they have absolutely been lying....	Warren Coolidge	Mar 18th 2011	383
so, you let kani customer MERGE me and longo into one person?	Basaglia	Mar 18th 2011	390
I think there was a hang up over Jalen's comment	Dr Claw	Mar 18th 2011	396
if you need to think jimmy king was speaking in a "kid" contex...	Basaglia	Mar 18th 2011	397
If Duke has a history of recruiting in the inner city..	Warren Coolidge	Mar 18th 2011	408
RE: If Duke has a history of recruiting in the inner city..	Basaglia	Mar 19th 2011	413
^^^^ RUBBISH.	Dr Claw	Mar 20th 2011	440
if the perception has no basis in reality, why perpetuate it?	Basaglia	Mar 21st 2011	449
I have no idea, really. People need a reason to justify their hate.	Dr Claw	Mar 22nd 2011	456
btw Bomani Jones absolutely ethered Grant Hill (and Duke) over	southphillyman	Mar 18th 2011	388
^^^ Yup!	nipsey	Mar 18th 2011	389
except that he's intellectually dishonest and a duke-hater	Basaglia	Mar 18th 2011	392
You so wrong and you know it. I really thought you were better	write_serengeti	Mar 18th 2011	395
and I thought Bomani was better than being a Duke-hating fraud	Basaglia	Mar 20th 2011	439
jones isn't saying whether Hill is an uncle Tom or not. none of us can	southphillyman	Mar 18th 2011	401
define K's suspect recruiting methods. please...i dare you.	Basaglia	Mar 18th 2011	402
OMG	nahymsa	Mar 19th 2011	412
RE: OMG	Basaglia	Mar 19th 2011	414
RE: OMG	nahymsa	Mar 23rd 2011	465
We reaching & making shit up now to deflect one's own failed argument?	TheRealBillyOcean	Mar 19th 2011	424
whatever...you mad. don't matter what i say once i shit on UK	Basaglia	Mar 19th 2011	426
i don't think grant's editorial was so much about jalen...	jahlove7	Mar 18th 2011	398
bojangling how? did they tap dance? or just smile in duke unis?	Basaglia	Mar 18th 2011	400
dude, did you just start watching duke? seriously...	jahlove7	Mar 20th 2011	441
hearsay don't do me any good.	Basaglia	Mar 23rd 2011	460
those cats would be on nccu's campus acting like they in the hood...	jahlove7	Mar 23rd 2011	472
and there it is again	Basaglia	Mar 23rd 2011	473
LMFAO @ Billy King	Dr Claw	Mar 21st 2011	447
also why is everybody acting like being an uncle tom is a class thing......	southphillyman	Mar 18th 2011	403
cough cough	ZooTown74	Mar 18th 2011	405
that's wonderful...	Basaglia	Mar 18th 2011	406
you spend a lot of energy on this board	Warren Coolidge	Mar 18th 2011	407
you are a well-known moron, so you don't warrant a response	Basaglia	Mar 19th 2011	411
here's where you are full of shit...	Warren Coolidge	Mar 19th 2011	422
do you understand you're asking a question only recruits can answer?	Basaglia	Mar 19th 2011	427
I'm asking for your analysis on why they don't	Warren Coolidge	Mar 19th 2011	432
FINALLY! MY BLACKNESS IS QUESTIONED! THANK YOU, KANI!	Basaglia	Mar 19th 2011	435
you question your own blackness by rooting for Duke	Warren Coolidge	Mar 24th 2011	474
let it go man, emotions are running too high for truthiness	cgonz00cc	Mar 19th 2011	420
and if you wanna be mad that duke wins a lot, i'mma let you be mad	Basaglia	Mar 19th 2011	421
and when you and the 4 other Black Duke fans in America	Warren Coolidge	Mar 19th 2011	423
and that has nothing to do with the issue...	Basaglia	Mar 19th 2011	425
Nukka you sound punch drunk ...	Challenger	Mar 19th 2011	428
i already stripped your intellect nekkid. lemme deal with kani customer	Basaglia	Mar 19th 2011	429
You spent too much time on this boards "Beggin for Brothers"	Warren Coolidge	Mar 19th 2011	430
i sure did...i was beggin for certain TYPES of brothas, was i?	Basaglia	Mar 19th 2011	431
how does more athletic = more urban/poor/whatever metric y'all usin?	analog2digital	Mar 19th 2011	433
know why you can make the distinction? because you like seeing duke win	Basaglia	Mar 19th 2011	434
Even Duke's Nolan Smith recognizes those WERE Jalen's feelings 20 yrs ...	nipsey	Mar 19th 2011	436
From the mouth of Louisville babes. :)	write_serengeti	Mar 19th 2011	437
great, because that stopped mattering after the First Take appearence	Basaglia	Mar 19th 2011	438
dave zirin on point as usual, ethers hill and whitlock.	Guinness	Mar 23rd 2011	459
none of this has anything to do with duke's recruiting philosophy	Basaglia	Mar 23rd 2011	461
lol give it a rest buddy, you are literally the only one that cares	cgonz00cc	Mar 23rd 2011	463
he's right, though	Orbit_Established	Mar 23rd 2011	469
orbasa estabiglia	s_dot_miles	Mar 23rd 2011	471
no one thinks there is anything wrong with the way duke recruits	cgonz00cc	Mar 24th 2011	475
DING.	Dr Claw	Mar 24th 2011	476
and as you can see.....recruit some REAL NIG-roes....	Warren Coolidge	Mar 24th 2011	478

LegacyNS
Member since Jan 16th 2004
38095 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 09:15 AM

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1. "hahahaha >>> influence that Da U... BE MAD!"
In response to Reply # 0

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<---- 5....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlgiritpmfo

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illegal
Charter member
78381 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 09:16 AM

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2. "damn grant lol"
In response to Reply # 0

***
when I come around, they frown
then wanna dap me down
but when I leave?

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
132214 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 09:19 AM

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3. "I imagine that the editorial will be classy, magnanimous and all of that..."
In response to Reply # 0

...but lol (people who thought Grant wouldn't say shit) lol.

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TheRealBillyOcean
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38224 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 09:25 AM

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6. "What's he possibly gonna say? 'I'm good. I'm black. I'm sooo..."
In response to Reply # 3

down. I help the innercity youth. I was in Katrina with mom and Tamia cleaning off basketball courts and libraries. Where were you?'

I mean is it gonna be a whole black contest?

Nothing good can come of this.

Especially when they said those comments when they were kids.

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
86672 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 09:38 AM

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7. "I bet it'll say it's ok for black men to go to a school like Duke."
In response to Reply # 6

A very popular documentary came out re-affirming the stereotype that if you go to Duke or schools like it, you're "less black". I bet he'll address that subject, not anything about his team in particular or anything spiteful about the Fab 5.

My movies: http://russellhainline.com
My movie reviews: https://letterboxd.com/RussellHFilm/
My beer TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@thebeertravelguide

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TheRealBillyOcean
Charter member
38224 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 09:40 AM

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8. "But that's not what they said."
In response to Reply # 7

>A very popular documentary came out re-affirming the
>stereotype that if you go to Duke or schools like it, you're
>"less black".

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
86672 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 09:48 AM

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9. "Let me rephrase it then."
In response to Reply # 8

>>A very popular documentary came out re-affirming the
>>stereotype that if you go to Duke or schools like it, you're
>>"subservient to white people."

Better?

My movies: http://russellhainline.com
My movie reviews: https://letterboxd.com/RussellHFilm/
My beer TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@thebeertravelguide

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TheRealBillyOcean
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38224 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:02 AM

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11. "But they didn't say that either"
In response to Reply # 9

And they didn't promote anything. They simply stated how they felt about Duke when they were young and in college. They didn't defame the institution in any way. If anything more racially derogatory sentiments were positioned toward the University of Michigan.

And Jalen also logically reasoned and tied his feelings toward bitterness of not being recruited by Duke and being jealous of Duke players upbringings. And that he felt he was just as good as them even if he didn't have those social advantages.

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
86672 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:08 AM

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15. "Did you watch Jalen and Jimmy on ESPN yesterday?"
In response to Reply # 11

They still feel that way. They said they understand why Duke does it now, and they don't begrudge them, but that schools like Duke, Notre Dame, Indiana, etc. only recruit black men from elite private school settings. They said there's a logical reason why they felt that black folks who went to Duke were Uncle Toms.

And I bet Grant is going to respond to that.

I had no problem with Jalen saying what he said, and I still don't. He was 17 and hated Duke for completely understandable reasons. But since the doc was so popular, I'm certain a black figure from Duke wants to step out and say that going to Duke doesn't make you an Uncle Tom, again, for very understandable reasons.

My movies: http://russellhainline.com
My movie reviews: https://letterboxd.com/RussellHFilm/
My beer TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@thebeertravelguide

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TheRealBillyOcean
Charter member
38224 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:25 AM

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20. "I didn't see that. But if that's the angle Grant takes, cool. "
In response to Reply # 15

If I had a scholly from Michigan or Duke. I'm going to Duke.

Michigan or Stanford. Going to Stanford.

But it's true Duke recruits a certain type of player. I didn't hear how Jimmy and Jalen rationalized it. But if they equate intelligence and respectability with Uncle Toms, then of course they're incorrect.

From what I've read, Grant talks about how him and Jimmy were friends. And how he wanted Jimmy not to cut from the Pistons.

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
86672 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:30 AM

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22. "I don't think they equated it. They phrased it carefully."
In response to Reply # 20

>But it's true Duke recruits a certain type of player. I didn't
>hear how Jimmy and Jalen rationalized it. But if they equate
>intelligence and respectability with Uncle Toms, then of
>course they're incorrect.

But they were also very careful to not back down from what they said. It left some room for some to misunderstand.

I think the whole thing is foolishness in general. I think Jalen should have been able to say his statement without the hubbub. But then there was a hubbub. So I think Grant should be able to respond.

My movies: http://russellhainline.com
My movie reviews: https://letterboxd.com/RussellHFilm/
My beer TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@thebeertravelguide

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analog2digital
Charter member
3597 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:58 AM

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28. "basically equated it"
In response to Reply # 22

>But they were also very careful to not back down from what
>they said. It left some room for some to misunderstand.
>

And he didn't leave that room with anything else.

1) "We thought Duke was some bitches"

Cleanup:

"They were the better team"

2) "We thought Laettner was a scrub"

Cleanup:

"Until we got out on the floor with him."

3) "We thought Duke recruited Uncle Toms, i.e., kids from two parent, multiple degree households."

Cleanup:

...... still waiting.

Is he saying Janet Hill shuffled her way onto corporate boards? Has Grant had an Uncle Ruckus moment that I missed?

Or is she a sellout merely by virtue of having attended Wellesly and knowing HRC?

We don't know because of all that room Jalen left.

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nahymsa
Charter member
1734 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 01:46 PM

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363. "Not true "
In response to Reply # 28

This is what Jalen said:

"I was jealous of Grant Hill. He came from a great black family. Congratulations. Your mom went to college and was roommates with Hilary Clinton. Your dad played in the NFL, is a well-spoken and successful man. I was upset and bitter that my mom had to bust her hump for twenty-plus years. I was bitter that I had a professional athlete that was my father that I didn't know. I resented that, more so than I resented him. I looked at it as 'they are who the world accepts and we are who the world hates."

The last sentence is the most important and the reality that is being ignored. Grant Hill WAS held up like some kind of model minority in comparison to the Fab 5. Those guys were being judged for things that had nothing to do with basketball - even by their own alumni & school. Duke can have a standard, even brag about that standard but when its pointed out that its a standard that is inherently biased against certain types of people, no matter how talented and that people felt & still feel a certain way about the school for that reason then its wrong? Please.

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veritas
Member since Sep 16th 2002
37201 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:50 AM

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38. "pretty much"
In response to Reply # 22

I think
>Jalen should have been able to say his statement without the
>hubbub. But then there was a hubbub. So I think Grant should
>be able to respond.

i still blame hip-hop.

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nahymsa
Charter member
1734 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 01:40 PM

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362. "Yes & its true Duke requires conformity"
In response to Reply # 15

That's their shit they've always been praised for it, brag about it. They're standard doesn't allow for cats like Jalen & those black men who go there cant display anything like the Fab 5's temperment or demenaor or they can't go there.

Grant Hill knew how he was positioned & how the players are Michigan were treated as thugs & lowlives just for being themselves when they were actually good kids who just did things different. Grant Hill knows he was held up like some type of model minority from a school and the media that had a low tolerance for certain types of black people regardless of the talent because of aesthetics that have nothing to do with the game.

Why is it wrong to think that's not cool? And why is it wrong to point out how rigid & conformist Duke's philosophy to recruiting has always been?

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analog2digital
Charter member
3597 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 08:53 AM

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419. "LOL, Because you can't POINT to ANYTHING"
In response to Reply # 362

>That's their shit they've always been praised for it, brag
>about it. They're standard doesn't allow for cats like Jalen &
>those black men who go there cant display anything like the
>Fab 5's temperment or demenaor or they can't go there.

Temperment or demeanor?

You mean like Christian stomping on chests and barking on cats? (See: Webber, Chris)

Like JJ mean-mugging them away crowds with the viciousness? (See: Rose, Jalen and Webber, Chris)

Like Maggette doing pull ups on the rim just to prove a point?

Or are you talking about Hill and Davis smiling/crying?

What demeanor did the Fab 5 display that Duke didn't/doesn't?

I'll wait.

>
>Grant Hill knew how he was positioned & how the players are
>Michigan were treated as thugs & lowlives just for being
>themselves when they were actually good kids who just did
>things different. Grant Hill knows he was held up like some
>type of model minority from a school and the media that had a
>low tolerance for certain types of black people regardless of
>the talent because of aesthetics that have nothing to do with
>the game.

None of which has ANYTHING to do with how K actually recruits. This is not Texas, K/Duke does not have its own media channel (yet). You can't blame Duke for how Duke is covered. You can't conflate media perception with how K runs his program, recruits his players.

>
>Why is it wrong to think that's not cool?

It's not cool. It wasn't cool the media did it to the Fab 5. And it's not cool that you're doing it to Duke.

And why is it wrong
>to point out how rigid & conformist Duke's philosophy to
>recruiting has always been?

You haven't pointed to ONE. SINGLE. THING. about Duke's recruiting philosophy.

You have identified no trends.

You have pointed to no recgonizable "type."

Nothing of statistical significance.

Nothing but your hate and madness.

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nahymsa
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470. "Duke is a place"
In response to Reply # 419

Those were kids and if you can't see the difference between suggesting that those kids were CRIMINALS which promoted tons of racist hate mail & threats against their lives and the suggestion that Duke was/is an institution of conformity & rigidity then there is something wrong.

Again the issue is perception and the perception that Duke has was fostered by Duke and the media.

Everything the Fab 5 did that I watched seemed like normal bball playing to me. Nothing violent, hurtful, rude or foul imo. Both sides came to the court to play with passion and nobody was a thug or criminal or threatening which definitely was how the Fab 5 were perceived.

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analog2digital
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13. "No, they didn't"
In response to Reply # 6

>Especially when they said those comments when they were kids.
>

That was recent footage and somebody should have known better. I didn't mind "bitches" as much as "Uncle Tom."

Jalen messed up on that one. He gave Duke credit, and has admitted that Duke (unlike UNC) was just a better team. But he needs to clean this up.

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
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Wed Mar-16-11 10:09 AM

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16. "Nah, Jalen was saying that's how he felt then."
In response to Reply # 13

He didn't say he feels like that now, he just doesn't regret thinking it and believes he thought it for understandable reasons. Both of which are true. He was a 17 year old sleeping in sweatshirts cuz there was no heat with a father who wasn't around looking at Hill's wealthy parents and Cosby sweaters. I don't blame him for saying it, nor do I blame Grant for writing an op-ed saying black men who go to Duke aren't Uncle Toms.

My movies: http://russellhainline.com
My movie reviews: https://letterboxd.com/RussellHFilm/
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analog2digital
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21. "I don't care how he felt then"
In response to Reply # 16

I understand it and that's nice, but what was missing from the documentary is how he, as a black man, feels now--about his "Uncle Tom" comment in particular.

And as a black man who went to Duke, the notion that playing for or attending Duke (or any school like it) equates to being an Uncle Tom is dangerous and needs to be addressed.

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BrooklynWHAT
Member since Jun 15th 2007
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Wed Mar-16-11 12:41 PM

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41. "agreed. (even though yall the enemy)"
In response to Reply # 21

<--- Big Baller World Order

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nahymsa
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366. "Dangerous how.."
In response to Reply # 21

The idea of being a Tom is not about going to Duke or any college, its about needing to conform to the Duke way or any other way that implies that there's something inherently wrong with a group of people who don't.

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analog2digital
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416. "Define it"
In response to Reply # 366

What is the "Duke Way"?

What Kool-Aid is K serving?

What is he trying to get these kids to conform to and how?

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
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Sat Mar-19-11 08:19 AM

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418. "don't you know? no tats! no facial hair! no bald heads! no bad grammar!"
In response to Reply # 416

no jewelry!

no leaving early!

all of which are easily disprovable. does it matter to them? nope.

so, curse these dumb fucks out and keep it moving, dogg.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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nahymsa
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466. "At the time of the Fab 5 time "
In response to Reply # 418

not tats, no bald heads, no ghetto aesthetics, no leaving early, seeming to conform certainly was the image being promoted by the media & Duke.

That perception still persists - right or wrong. It was based on a reality and the perception remains.

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nahymsa
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468. "RE: Define it"
In response to Reply # 416

>What is the "Duke Way"?

The perceived Duke way is understood to be only recruiting players who are Grant Hill esque in demeanor...ie not "hood" or what may be perceived as aesthetically "black" outside of complexion.

Are you saying that during the Duke vs Fab 5 year that the media did not promote Duke as the epitome of refinement, morality, class, & conformity & tradition which read pretty much as white? That is why the Fab 5 received tons of racist hate & Michigan received hate mail not just for outsiders but from freaking alumni? That it wasn't suggested that Duke would win & did win because their players weren't nigger hoodlums trashing the institution of college basketball with their rebellious appearance & thuggish demeanor?

Are you saying that Duke does not have this perception as a legacy - 100% accurate or not? Much like Boston (for example) still has a legacy of being a racist place even though I'm sure its decreased some since its racist heyday.

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d.
Member since Dec 13th 2009
4132 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 09:20 AM

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4. "lolsmhlol nm"
In response to Reply # 0

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ChuckFoPrez
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5. ""cmon, mayne" (c) miller high life delivery truck dude"
In response to Reply # 0

https://twitter.com/chuck4prez

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analog2digital
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10. "GOOD!"
In response to Reply # 0

It needs to be addressed and probably better from him than K.

I completely get where Jalen was coming from but the "Uncle Tom" comment was not from archival footage of an 18-year old. That was recent and needs to be checked.

After seeing Webber's clumsy blog post about the documentary yesterday (which actually made it worse), we need somebody with some sense to finish this.

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TheRealBillyOcean
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14. "It's not from archival footage but it's from his memory."
In response to Reply # 10

"Hey analog, how'd you feel about 7th grade social studies?"
"I hated it."

See. Past tense.

Jalen: "I felt they were Uncle Toms. I was jealous of Grant Hill."

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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analog2digital
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18. "Does it need to be addressed or not?"
In response to Reply # 14
Wed Mar-16-11 10:19 AM by analog2digital

You can't just throw the term "Uncle Tom" out there and think it's gonna ride.

It's an epithet. Moreover, it's one not based on any sort of reality.

There are plenty of non-athletes who attend Duke from very poor, unstable circumstances.

And I know for a FACT that the lives of several prominent players were no crystal stair. Not that that should be some kind of rallying cry.

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Rjcc
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26. "PLEASE STOP TYPING NOW"
In response to Reply # 18

http://card.mygamercard.net/lastgame/rjcc.png

www.engadgethd.com - the other stuff i'm looking at

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Rjcc
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17. "kill yourself, because you're a non reading stupid fuck"
In response to Reply # 10

which is much worse than any uncle tom aspersions.

http://card.mygamercard.net/lastgame/rjcc.png

www.engadgethd.com - the other stuff i'm looking at

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Amritsar
Member since Jan 18th 2008
32093 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:22 AM

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30. "LOST"
In response to Reply # 10

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HeadNodda
Member since Dec 02nd 2004
2016 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:03 AM

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12. "I thought the key phrase was "FELT" "
In response to Reply # 0

In a documentary your gonna take soundbites, but Jalen spoke in the past tense, he did not say Duke currently recruits "Uncle Toms"...

---------------------------------
<----DAMN!
Straddling the Line Between Genius and Insanity

https://soundcloud.com/headnoddaproductions

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analog2digital
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Wed Mar-16-11 10:35 AM

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24. "1) Isn't it Jalen's documentary? "
In response to Reply # 12

I mean, he produced it, right?

2)Isn't the issue why Jalen EVER thought that black kids Duke recruited WERE Uncle Toms, not whether he is saying Duke "still" recruits kids who are Uncle Toms today?

I mean, I get that 17-year olds say and think immature things.

But does 38 year-old Jalen think that kids from stable households are "Uncle Toms"?

I was willing to give him the benefit of the doubt but his post-documentary comments haven't exactly answered the question for me.

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:22 AM

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19. "If he responds to this shit like Jalen said he fells that way now"
In response to Reply # 0

I'm going to know that now ALL athletes at every college, even Ivy-like colleges, major in basket weaving or "Criminal Justice".

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TheRealBillyOcean
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23. "Word up. What she said. Like I heard Jason Osbourne..."
In response to Reply # 19

say he felt like when he was working at Macy's in the store room, that the he thought the sales associates were Uncle Tom's, but then when he got promoted to cologne counter he didn't feel that way anymore.

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:38 AM

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25. "J. O. is actually playing overseas....so no."
In response to Reply # 23

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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TheRealBillyOcean
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27. "Across the Mississippi = Not Overseas"
In response to Reply # 25

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 02:23 PM

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91. "You stupid cole. lol"
In response to Reply # 27

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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Expertise
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Wed Mar-16-11 11:24 AM

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31. "stop bullshitting. They still feel that way."
In response to Reply # 19

They may not say that shit outright, but they're doing a lot of plea copping and "clarifying" for people that have changed their opinions on something.

And I damn sure know Jimmy King and Ray Jackson haven't.
_________________________
http://expertise.blogdrive.com
http://twitter.com/KMBReferee
http://www.formspring.me/KMBReferee

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 02:29 PM

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93. "Would you go on to your Tea Party meeting already. lmao"
In response to Reply # 31

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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cereffusion
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35. "At duke they only offer"
In response to Reply # 19

'Advanced Basketweaving' as a major. I've heard its tough.

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josephmurf2384
Member since Nov 21st 2005
5289 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:17 AM

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29. "Reston, VA what what"
In response to Reply # 0

I like Grant Hill, and he will most likely take the opportunity to open it up to a broader dialogue than directly respond to Jalen.

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Expertise
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32. "Good. He needs to respond."
In response to Reply # 0

_________________________
http://expertise.blogdrive.com
http://twitter.com/KMBReferee
http://www.formspring.me/KMBReferee

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FortifiedLive
Member since Dec 26th 2006
9984 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:27 AM

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33. "it leaked: http://i52.tinypic.com/2dkwt4n.jpg"
In response to Reply # 0

http://i52.tinypic.com/2dkwt4n.jpg

_______________________________________

<<progressions.

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40thStreetBlack
Charter member
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Wed Mar-16-11 02:17 PM

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85. "LOL"
In response to Reply # 33

___________________

Mar-A-Lago delenda est

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Bombastic
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34. "lol@ 'an 18 year olds comments' as if Jalen didnt say the same this week"
In response to Reply # 0

at 38.

Grant is perfectly within his rights to say whatever he wants in response, same way Jalen's free to speak his perspective to get the dialogue started twenty years later in the first place.

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Expertise
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Wed Mar-16-11 11:42 AM

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36. "basically."
In response to Reply # 34

.
_________________________
http://expertise.blogdrive.com
http://twitter.com/KMBReferee
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BrooklynWHAT
Member since Jun 15th 2007
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83. "EXACTLY"
In response to Reply # 34

niggas is poohpoohing Jalen's comments like he dont still believe that in the moment.

<--- Big Baller World Order

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nahymsa
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367. "What did he say that wasn't true?"
In response to Reply # 34

He said he felt at the time that they were Toms.

He felt that way because Duke only recruits certain types players and EVERYBODY knows what type of players those are.

Duke itself prides itself on conformity, rigidity, and the idea that the players are just cogs in a well orchestrated machine.

Jalen, Jimmy, etc can still feel like Duke's recruiting standards are foul and imply that there's something inherently wrong with people that come from Jalen's background WHILE being grown enough to know that Duke can do what it wants and that that doesn't necessarily make the players Toms.

That being said, its a flat out lie for Grant to say that Jalen insulted his family when its anybody with ears or who can read knows that he did just the opposite. Grant is an insecure bougie negro and it has nothing to do with Jalen.

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bshelly
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Wed Mar-16-11 11:46 AM

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37. "i'm going to continue to not care about this stupid controversy"
In response to Reply # 0

glad to see grant get a chance to shine, though.

----
bshelly

"You (Fisher) could get fired, Les Snead could get fired, Kevin Demoff could get fired, but I will always be Eric Dickerson.” (c) The God

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Guinness
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Wed Mar-16-11 11:52 AM

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39. "fuck duke and fuck coach k."
In response to Reply # 0

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PROMO
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40. "its out!"
In response to Reply # 0

http://thequad.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/03/16/grant-hills-response-to-jalen-rose/

I am a fan, friend and longtime competitor of the Fab Five. I have competed against Jalen Rose and Chris Webber since the age of 13. At Michigan, the Fab Five represented a cultural phenomenon that impacted the country in a permanent and positive way. The very idea of the Fab Five elicited pride and promise in much the same way the Georgetown teams did in the mid-1980s when I was in high school and idolized them. Their journey from youthful icons to successful men today is a road map for so many young, black men (and women) who saw their journey through the powerful documentary, �The Fab Five.�

It was a sad and somewhat pathetic turn of events, therefore, to see friends narrating this interesting documentary about their moment in time and calling me a bitch and worse, calling all black players at Duke �Uncle Toms� and, to some degree, disparaging my parents for their education, work ethic and commitment to each other and to me. I should have guessed there was something regrettable in the documentary when I received a Twitter apology from Jalen before its premiere. I am aware Jalen has gone to some length to explain his remarks about my family in numerous interviews, so I believe he has some admiration for them.

In his garbled but sweeping comment that Duke recruits only �black players that were �Uncle Toms,� � Jalen seems to change the usual meaning of those very vitriolic words into his own meaning, i.e., blacks from two-parent, middle-class families. He leaves us all guessing exactly what he believes today.

I am beyond fortunate to have two parents who are still working well into their 60s. They received great educations and use them every day. My parents taught me a personal ethic I try to live by and pass on to my children.

I come from a strong legacy of black Americans. My namesake, Henry Hill, my father�s father, was a day laborer in Baltimore. He could not read or write until he was taught to do so by my grandmother. His first present to my dad was a set of encyclopedias, which I now have. He wanted his only child, my father, to have a good education, so he made numerous sacrifices to see that he got an education, including attending Yale.

This is part of our great tradition as black Americans. We aspire for the best or better for our children and work hard to make that happen for them. Jalen�s mother is part of our great black tradition and made the same sacrifices for him.

My teammates at Duke � all of them, black and white � were a band of brothers who came together to play at the highest level for the best coach in basketball. I know most of the black players who preceded and followed me at Duke. They all contribute to our tradition of excellence on the court.

It is insulting and ignorant to suggest that men like Johnny Dawkins (coach at Stanford), Tommy Amaker (coach at Harvard), Billy King (general manager of the Nets), Tony Lang (coach of the Mitsubishi Diamond Dolphins in Japan), Thomas Hill (small-business owner in Texas), Jeff Capel (former coach at Oklahoma and Virginia Commonwealth), Kenny Blakeney (assistant coach at Harvard), Jay Williams (ESPN analyst), Shane Battier (Memphis Grizzlies) and Chris Duhon (Orlando Magic) ever sold out their race.

To hint that those who grew up in a household with a mother and father are somehow less black than those who did not is beyond ridiculous. All of us are extremely proud of the current Duke team, especially Nolan Smith. He was raised by his mother, plays in memory of his late father and carries himself with the pride and confidence that they instilled in him.

The sacrifice, the effort, the education and the friendships I experienced in my four years are cherished. The many Duke graduates I have met around the world are also my �family,� and they are a special group of people. A good education is a privilege.

Just as Jalen has founded a charter school in Michigan, we are expected to use our education to help others, to improve life for those who need our assistance and to use the excellent education we have received to better the world.

A highlight of my time at Duke was getting to know the great John Hope Franklin, John B. Duke Professor of History and the leading scholar of the last century on the total history of African-Americans in this country. His insights and perspectives contributed significantly to my overall development and helped me understand myself, my forefathers and my place in the world.

Ad ingenium faciendum, toward the building of character, is a phrase I recently heard. To me, it is the essence of an educational experience. Struggling, succeeding, trying again and having fun within a nurturing but competitive environment built character in all of us, including every black graduate of Duke.

My mother always says, �You can live without Chaucer and you can live without calculus, but you cannot make it in the wide, wide world without common sense.� As we get older, we understand the importance of these words. Adulthood is nothing but a series of choices: you can say yes or no, but you cannot avoid saying one or the other. In the end, those who are successful are those who adjust and adapt to the decisions they have made and make the best of them.

I caution my fabulous five friends to avoid stereotyping me and others they do not know in much the same way so many people stereotyped them back then for their appearance and swagger. I wish for you the restoration of the bond that made you friends, brothers and icons.

I am proud of my family. I am proud of my Duke championships and all my Duke teammates. And, I am proud I never lost a game against the Fab Five.

Grant Henry Hill
Phoenix Suns
Duke �94

.

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CherNic
Member since Aug 18th 2005
37156 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 12:45 PM

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42. "wrong spot"
In response to Reply # 40
Wed Mar-16-11 12:46 PM by CherNic

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CherNic
Member since Aug 18th 2005
37156 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 12:45 PM

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43. "LOL GRANT LOL "
In response to Reply # 40

>>I am proud of my Duke championships and all my Duke teammates. And, I am proud I never lost a game against the Fab Five.

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El_essence
Charter member
24899 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 12:57 PM

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44. "Ether nm"
In response to Reply # 40

.

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BrooklynWHAT
Member since Jun 15th 2007
85077 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 12:57 PM

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45. "damn thats some well written ether"
In response to Reply # 40

<--- Big Baller World Order

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
86672 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 12:59 PM

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46. "Nothing wrong with this response."
In response to Reply # 40
Wed Mar-16-11 12:59 PM by Frank Longo

nm

My movies: http://russellhainline.com
My movie reviews: https://letterboxd.com/RussellHFilm/
My beer TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@thebeertravelguide

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avionix
Member since Sep 24th 2007
498 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 01:00 PM

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47. "Grant sounds hurt...soft ass nigga shoulda said what's real"
In response to Reply # 40

the real sad shit is the fact that Jalen actually "felt" that way as a 17yo. I mean, these folks done spunt up an "issue" without even discussing why that sentiment exists.

That, to me, is the only thing worth discussing from Jalen's quote.

#mistycopeland

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BrooklynWHAT
Member since Jun 15th 2007
85077 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 01:04 PM

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50. "he felt that way cause he was ignorant and shortsighted."
In response to Reply # 47

<--- Big Baller World Order

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V3rb
Member since Jul 20th 2008
7675 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 01:09 PM

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52. "lol right? "
In response to Reply # 50

http://hypevercab.bandcamp.com

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avionix
Member since Sep 24th 2007
498 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 01:14 PM

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55. "but who's said that and ONLY that without throwin more darts?"
In response to Reply # 50

i hoped Grant would just say, "I heard what the brother was saying. He felt like that when he was young and ignorant. I can't speak on what he thinks now, you'd have to ask him. I have nothing but respect for the Fab Five and all their accomplishments. But they never beat me." ---> that, to me, is the smart response.

Seems like none of the principal minds in all of this (starting from the clowny ass reporter who blew this shit up from the beginning) thought it was interesting enough to discuss the dichotomy of "proud black" vs "sellout" mentalities.

I would have LOVED that conversation to be opened up with the entire sports media watching. Could have really done a lot to contradict the "dumb jock" stereotype.

#mistycopeland

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nahymsa
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Fri Mar-18-11 02:04 PM

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369. "He felt that way because the Fab 5 were treated like thugs & criminals "
In response to Reply # 50

Just because they wore baggy shorts & black socks while Grant Hill was put on a pedastol just for being the type of black man who wore that corny ass flat top.

The Fab 5 was perceived as threatening just for being kids who dressed a little different and played ball like they do around the way in a college setting. The entire country acted like it was the end of damn civilization as we know it and to pretend otherwise really is some tom as shit.

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El_essence
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53. "From an outsider, I agree with you. However, if I'm Grant, I'm not"
In response to Reply # 47

satisfied with his explanation and how he feels today. Couple that with Jimmy King showing his ass on ESPN, he deserves the right to go in.

The sad thing is, if Rose and King are asked specifically what they feel about Duke and Grant Hill as adults, they wouldn't have the same opinions. But they haven't really.

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avionix
Member since Sep 24th 2007
498 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 01:16 PM

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57. "that's the thing, grant seems smart enough to separate the idea"
In response to Reply # 53

from the mind, ya dig?

If these simple niggas can't man up and discuss what was really on their bird, then he doesn't need to "go in". Why be combative with the personification of a problem and never attack the cause of that man's frustration?

I think I just expect too much thought and leadership from my brothers

#mistycopeland

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El_essence
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86. "fair enough."
In response to Reply # 57

.

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Walleye
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48. "Who lives without Chaucer?"
In response to Reply # 40

The rest of us are trying to have a civilization here. Stop fucking it up.

______________________________

"Walleye, a lot of things are going to go wrong in your life that technically aren't your fault. Always remember that this doesn't make you any less of an idiot"

--Walleye's Dad

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jigga
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Wed Mar-16-11 03:37 PM

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133. "That was a typo. He meant Chauncey"
In response to Reply # 48

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selppataei
Charter member
2012 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:42 PM

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138. "^^^^^"
In response to Reply # 48

____________________________________________________________
http://proc.bandcamp.com
http://twitter.com/grandproc

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V3rb
Member since Jul 20th 2008
7675 posts

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49. "Eloquent. "
In response to Reply # 40
Wed Mar-16-11 01:07 PM by V3rb

grant won.

http://hypevercab.bandcamp.com

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muzuabo
Member since Dec 03rd 2009
2064 posts

Sun Mar-20-11 01:33 PM

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442. "They both one. Fuck picking sides."
In response to Reply # 49

______________________________
PSN ID - muzuabo
http://www.flickr.com/photos/muz_e/

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Ryan M
Member since Oct 21st 2002
43745 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 01:07 PM

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51. "God....damn. ETHER."
In response to Reply # 40

------------------------------

17x NBA Champions

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Numba_33
Charter member
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54. "The last sentence alone"
In response to Reply # 40

is laser guided heat seeking magma. And I'm not even that much of a a follower of college basketball. Pretty sad that Grant Hill was that hurt to have to write this though.

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Beezo
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56. "I'm guessing that Jalen is preppin for Sportscenter shruggin his shoulde..."
In response to Reply # 40
Wed Mar-16-11 01:16 PM by Beezo

.

<---
Fuck a sig, my presence is enough.

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TheRealBillyOcean
Charter member
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58. "write_serengeti's reply #19 smh @ Grant Hill"
In response to Reply # 40

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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bshelly
Charter member
71730 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 01:25 PM

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63. "nods"
In response to Reply # 58

----
bshelly

"You (Fisher) could get fired, Les Snead could get fired, Kevin Demoff could get fired, but I will always be Eric Dickerson.” (c) The God

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
132214 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 01:19 PM

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59. "This read exactly like I knew it would."
In response to Reply # 40

Duke fans all over the nation just collapsed in a collective, orgasmic faint.

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nipsey
Charter member
9924 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 01:23 PM

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62. "RE: This read exactly like I knew it would."
In response to Reply # 59

Basically.

>Duke fans all over the nation just collapsed in a collective,
>orgasmic faint.

____________________________________
Twitter: nipsey
A Friend's Blog: http://trayrific.wordpress.com/
http://nipsey.yelp.com

XBOX Live Gamertag: slballer

Last 3 things I watched:

The Town: B+
Legacy: C+
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bshelly
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Wed Mar-16-11 01:28 PM

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66. "yup"
In response to Reply # 59

----
bshelly

"You (Fisher) could get fired, Les Snead could get fired, Kevin Demoff could get fired, but I will always be Eric Dickerson.” (c) The God

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PROMO
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Wed Mar-16-11 01:22 PM

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61. "sounds like a butthurt bear. jalen has a right to his opinion."
In response to Reply # 40

that was his feelings. he's allowed to have them.

plus, i would say a majority of folks if you took a poll do think of black players at duke as a little "tom"-ish.

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Bombastic
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Wed Mar-16-11 01:32 PM

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69. "why's Jalen have a 'right to his opinion' but Grant doesn't have a righ..."
In response to Reply # 61

y'all are funny with that shit.

And spare me the '18 year-old' thought shit, Jalen & his teammates have rehashed this whole line of thought all week plugging their documentary plus speaking at length afterwards.

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LegacyNS
Member since Jan 16th 2004
38095 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 02:29 PM

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94. "amazing isn't it? apparently only ppl they agree with have that right"
In response to Reply # 69
Wed Mar-16-11 02:29 PM by LegacyNS

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<---- 5....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlgiritpmfo

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bshelly
Charter member
71730 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 01:27 PM

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65. "sign. he played himself."
In response to Reply # 40

this is exactly the reply that white duke fans wanted him to write. it reads exactly like an older, straight A brother yelling at his younger brother for playing his NWA records too loud and disturbing mom and dad.

----
bshelly

"You (Fisher) could get fired, Les Snead could get fired, Kevin Demoff could get fired, but I will always be Eric Dickerson.” (c) The God

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bignick
Charter member
24054 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 01:35 PM

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71. "No. It reads like an articulate Black man taking issue with ignorance"
In response to Reply # 65

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bshelly
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74. "ignorance which everyone involved already admitted was ignorant"
In response to Reply # 71

so now grant's turning something that should be a dead issue of dumb 18 yos saying dumb 18 yo shit and making it into something current about the Fab Five and, to the NYT audience, the people they, uhm, "represent."

----
bshelly

"You (Fisher) could get fired, Les Snead could get fired, Kevin Demoff could get fired, but I will always be Eric Dickerson.” (c) The God

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40thStreetBlack
Charter member
27116 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 02:17 PM

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84. "when did you and O_E switch places?"
In response to Reply # 74
Wed Mar-16-11 02:19 PM by 40thStreetBlack

LOL

(agree with your points btw)

___________________

Mar-A-Lago delenda est

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Bombastic
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88874 posts

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110. "how on earth is it a dead issue while its been repeated by a 38-year-old"
In response to Reply # 74

>so now grant's turning something that should be a dead issue
>of dumb 18 yos saying dumb 18 yo shit and making it into
>something current about the Fab Five and, to the NYT audience,
>the people they, uhm, "represent."

multiple times *this week* & the only reason we're talking about it is because said man is the guy producing a nationally-televised documentary for the company he works for espousing that belief?

And I don't even have a problem with Jalen speaking on what his perception of the situation was, even if like many things he's done on the air he handles it kinda clumsily like he did on 1st and 10.

But to act like Grant Hill isn't allowed to discuss it from his side as a result or that Grant should just *understand* & keep it moving is fucking stupid.

He has as much right to speak on this shit as Jalen & you're actually being condescending to Jalen/Jimmy/whoever if you don't think he does.

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El_essence
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24899 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:37 PM

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132. "^^^^^"
In response to Reply # 110

.

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40thStreetBlack
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Thu Mar-17-11 01:48 AM

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242. "it's being repeated because the media latched onto it"
In response to Reply # 110

and jalen handled it pretty well on 1st and 10 (jimmy king kinda fumbled on there though), especially his point about K only recruiting detroit-area players from a private school in the suburbs and not from inner-city detroit.

of course grant is allowed to respond and discuss it from his side. but his response, while very well-written and clearly heartfelt to his personal feelings on the matter, is pretty tone deaf to where jalen was coming from.

___________________

Mar-A-Lago delenda est

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Bombastic
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262. "lol @ 'latched onto it',they made it a key theme of a film they produced"
In response to Reply # 242

>and jalen handled it pretty well on 1st and 10 (jimmy king
>kinda fumbled on there though), especially his point about K
>only recruiting detroit-area players from a private school in
>the suburbs and not from inner-city detroit.
>
I have no problem with him saying his piece but let's stop acting like it was the musings of an 18-year-old when he's still basically saying the same thing now when called upon it & the only reason we're hearing it is because of a movie he made.

>of course grant is allowed to respond and discuss it from his
>side. but his response, while very well-written and clearly
>heartfelt to his personal feelings on the matter, is pretty
>tone deaf to where jalen was coming from.
>
so they can both be 'tone deaf', that's fine, let's not act like Jalen tried to get into things from Grant's 'perspective' either.

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40thStreetBlack
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Thu Mar-17-11 02:12 PM

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279. "they made financial exploitation of college athletes key theme of it too"
In response to Reply # 262

but I don't see that or any other key themes of the doc being repeated all over the place this week, because all they keep talking about in the media are the uncle tom comments. lol @ you thinking that's not the case.

>I have no problem with him saying his piece but let's stop
>acting like it was the musings of an 18-year-old when he's
>still basically saying the same thing now when called upon it
>& the only reason we're hearing it is because of a movie he
>made.

and while we're at it let's stop acting like jalen's comments are nothing more than his personal biased "perception" and have no basis when like he pointed out yesterday the only detroit area players K has recruited were from a private school in the suburbs and not from inner-city detroit public schools, so fact is duke does generally recruit a certain type of player and kids who like jalen felt excluded by it naturally feel resentment at that.

>>of course grant is allowed to respond and discuss it from
>his
>>side. but his response, while very well-written and clearly
>>heartfelt to his personal feelings on the matter, is pretty
>>tone deaf to where jalen was coming from.
>>
>so they can both be 'tone deaf', that's fine, let's not act
>like Jalen tried to get into things from Grant's 'perspective'
>either.

I don't. but let's not act like grant's response was anything more than a defensive reaction to the specific words that were spoken (which is understandable as they're hurtful words) and didn't completely miss why jalen felt the way he did, which jalen explicitly stated in the documentary & which incidentally is also the way the majority of black ppl feel/felt about it too.

___________________

Mar-A-Lago delenda est

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nahymsa
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1734 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 02:10 PM

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370. "What freaking more does Grant Hill need?"
In response to Reply # 262

Its not enough that Jalen Rose flat out said they got beat by a BETTER team. Its not enough that Jalen admitted being resentful of the fact that Hill's father was there. Its not enough that Jalen said that Grant came from a great family?

Basically what's being said is that Jalen can't have said all those things yet think it foul that Duke thinks kids who were raised like Jalen was don't deserve a shot no matter how talented UNLESS they totally strip themselves of any remnants of their upbringing?

Grant Hill needs for Jalen to say that Grant Hill's entire life is inherently better in order for Grant Hill to feel okay for being the model negro.

Instead of writing a piece about how he wished they could've known each other & the things that made them similar Hill choose to lash out about shit that wasn't even said & make it all about his hurt feelings because apparently he's not overprivileged enough.

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Guinness
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Wed Mar-16-11 02:05 PM

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80. "lulz."
In response to Reply # 71

it read like a letter from a clueless, unsympathetic cunt who couldn't even bring himself to acknowledge that duke was disliked not only by jalen, but by the majority of young black kids in america. by refusing to address why duke was emblematic of privilege or why a kid from a broken home could resent his gilded upbringing, hill reinforces everything we hate about the school and its douchebag athletes. just in time for the tournament.

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TheRealBillyOcean
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72. "exactly....thanks for the tongue lashing Grant"
In response to Reply # 65

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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universally_speaking
Member since Jan 09th 2005
3586 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 01:29 PM

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67. "*applause*"
In response to Reply # 40

____________________________
Bringin it to you live in stere-ere-o.

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nipsey
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Wed Mar-16-11 01:31 PM

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68. "Grant's taking this personally"
In response to Reply # 40

All respect to Grant, but that was a perception people had about Duke and many STILL do. Grant's taking it personally. But as Jalen said on ESPN on Tuesday. His comments are nothing new. With their trash talk, they told those Duke players the same things 20 years ago when they played.

Rather than attack Jalen for his feelings as an 18 year old child, maybe others, including Grant, should explore why Duke has this perception of recruiting Uncle Toms.

____________________________________
Twitter: nipsey
A Friend's Blog: http://trayrific.wordpress.com/
http://nipsey.yelp.com

XBOX Live Gamertag: slballer

Last 3 things I watched:

The Town: B+
Legacy: C+
Damages Season 2: C+

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SirLau
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Wed Mar-16-11 02:56 PM

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105. "RE: Grant's taking this personally"
In response to Reply # 68

>
>Rather than attack Jalen for his feelings as an 18 year old
>child, maybe others, including Grant, should explore why Duke
>has this perception of recruiting Uncle Toms.

Right, while Grant's response was incredibly well written, I think folks are missing the point of what Jalen said. He said that he and some of the other Fab Five guys wereen't recruited by Duke and they didnt understand why. Thats what I got from their comments. They were 18 year old kids who were thinking, "Duke doesn't think I'm good enough to play for them?". Anyone who feels that way about a person or institution is going to have some kind of negative feelings toward that person or institution. I would love for someone to ask Coach K if this is true and if so why would he not be recruting 5 Top 100 recruits that every other schools were fighting over.

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mrhood75
Member since Dec 06th 2004
44720 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 01:34 PM

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70. "I like Hill, but this sounded a lot more bitter than it needed to be"
In response to Reply # 40

Taking the high road was the best course of action here. Hill didn't do that.

-----------------

www.albumism.com

Checkin' Our Style, Return To Zero:

https://www.mixcloud.com/returntozero/

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bignick
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Wed Mar-16-11 01:37 PM

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73. "Perfect. "
In response to Reply # 40

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haj20
Member since Nov 21st 2002
16195 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 01:51 PM

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76. "He WOULD post it on the NY Times. Shoulda gone to Slam Online."
In response to Reply # 40

_________________________

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Guinness
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Wed Mar-16-11 01:51 PM

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77. "clueless and unsympathetic."
In response to Reply # 40

what a dick.

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builtfromwax
Member since May 01st 2007
1879 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 01:51 PM

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78. "how i read it was..."
In response to Reply # 40

>I am a fan, friend and longtime competitor of the Fab Five. I
>have competed against Jalen Rose and Chris Webber since the
>age of 13. At Michigan, the Fab Five represented a cultural
>phenomenon that impacted the country in a permanent and
>positive way. The very idea of the Fab Five elicited pride and
>promise in much the same way the Georgetown teams did in the
>mid-1980s when I was in high school and idolized them. Their
>journey from youthful icons to successful men today is a road
>map for so many young, black men (and women) who saw their
>journey through the powerful documentary, �The Fab Five.�

translation: yeah, they was cool. i was sort of corny in my adolescent stages. but they wasn't like Big John and Georgetown. Big John ain't think i was black enough, poor enough either to play for him.

>It was a sad and somewhat pathetic turn of events, therefore,
>to see friends narrating this interesting documentary about
>their moment in time and calling me a bitch and worse, calling
>all black players at Duke �Uncle Toms� and, to some degree,
>disparaging my parents for their education, work ethic and
>commitment to each other and to me. I should have guessed
>there was something regrettable in the documentary when I
>received a Twitter apology from Jalen before its premiere. I
>am aware Jalen has gone to some length to explain his remarks
>about my family in numerous interviews, so I believe he has
>some admiration for them.

translation: them n*ggas CRAZY talkin' sideways and shit about me and my fam! they know damn well if i invited 'em to the crib they woulda used up all the hand soap in the bathroom and left my mama's towels dirty as shit! then woulda tried to go in the fridge and get a CapriSun, cuz we ain't have no f*ckin' Kool-Aid in my house...n*gga!

>In his garbled but sweeping comment that Duke recruits only
>�black players that were �Uncle Toms,� � Jalen seems to change
>the usual meaning of those very vitriolic words into his own
>meaning, i.e., blacks from two-parent, middle-class families.
>He leaves us all guessing exactly what he believes today.

translation: see, that's what a Michigan education does for you. n*gga don't even know how to properly use "Uncle Tom" in an analogy...dumb ass n*gga still!

>I am beyond fortunate to have two parents who are still
>working well into their 60s. They received great educations
>and use them every day. My parents taught me a personal ethic
>I try to live by and pass on to my children.

translation: we stay paid B!TCH!!! my kids gon' hire your kids to rotate their tires and change their oil!

>I come from a strong legacy of black Americans. My namesake,
>Henry Hill, my father�s father, was a day laborer in
>Baltimore. He could not read or write until he was taught to
>do so by my grandmother. His first present to my dad was a set
>of encyclopedias, which I now have. He wanted his only child,
>my father, to have a good education, so he made numerous
>sacrifices to see that he got an education, including
>attending Yale.

translation: we ain't come from much, but n*gga we got Duke and Yale plaques hangin' above our f*ckin' fireplaces! i got Reggie Love on speed dial n*gga!

>This is part of our great tradition as black Americans. We
>aspire for the best or better for our children and work hard
>to make that happen for them. Jalen�s mother is part of our
>great black tradition and made the same sacrifices for him.

translation: you mama tried to teach you some f*ckin' manners. she cool. ya pops? that n*gga went to Providence. he wasn't shit and i woulda gave him 60 in the early mornin' YMCA league.

>My teammates at Duke � all of them, black and white � were a
>band of brothers who came together to play at the highest
>level for the best coach in basketball. I know most of the
>black players who preceded and followed me at Duke. They all
>contribute to our tradition of excellence on the court.

translation: we got 4 championships and workin' on a fifth...now that's what the fuck i call a Fab 5!!!

>It is insulting and ignorant to suggest that men like Johnny
>Dawkins (coach at Stanford), Tommy Amaker (coach at Harvard),
>Billy King (general manager of the Nets), Tony Lang (coach of
>the Mitsubishi Diamond Dolphins in Japan), Thomas Hill
>(small-business owner in Texas), Jeff Capel (former coach at
>Oklahoma and Virginia Commonwealth), Kenny Blakeney (assistant
>coach at Harvard), Jay Williams (ESPN analyst), Shane Battier
>(Memphis Grizzlies) and Chris Duhon (Orlando Magic) ever sold
>out their race.

translation: where the fuck is Glen Rice? Rumeal Robinson? Terry Mills? Lois Bullock? Tractor Traylor? i ain't gon' do Bernard Robinson like that...he from the urrea. in my haste to make deadline i failed to shout out William Avery, Cory Maggette and Elton Brand. nah, f'real tho'...f*ck them n*ggas. i stayed 4 years, the could have too.

>To hint that those who grew up in a household with a mother
>and father are somehow less black than those who did not is
>beyond ridiculous. All of us are extremely proud of the
>current Duke team, especially Nolan Smith. He was raised by
>his mother, plays in memory of his late father and carries
>himself with the pride and confidence that they instilled in
>him.

translation: n*gga we are the black family! Nolan Smith from the urrea too! his pops -- god bless the dead -- coached two of your bitch ass Fab 5 members when they was with the Bullets! he passed that national championship pedigree on to his son...some shit y'all wouldn't know about.

>The sacrifice, the effort, the education and the friendships I
>experienced in my four years are cherished. The many Duke
>graduates I have met around the world are also my �family,�
>and they are a special group of people. A good education is a
>privilege.

translation: u mad?

>Just as Jalen has founded a charter school in Michigan, we are
>expected to use our education to help others, to improve life
>for those who need our assistance and to use the excellent
>education we have received to better the world.

translation: yeah, you got a lil' school. that's cool. but you STILL dumb...n*gga!

>A highlight of my time at Duke was getting to know the great
>John Hope Franklin, John B. Duke Professor of History and the
>leading scholar of the last century on the total history of
>African-Americans in this country. His insights and
>perspectives contributed significantly to my overall
>development and helped me understand myself, my forefathers
>and my place in the world.

translation: n*gga i'm well schooled in blackness! i studied from a n*gga that wrote black history!

>Ad ingenium faciendum, toward the building of character, is a
>phrase I recently heard. To me, it is the essence of an
>educational experience. Struggling, succeeding, trying again
>and having fun within a nurturing but competitive environment
>built character in all of us, including every black graduate
>of Duke.

translation: n*gga, we graduate at Duke!

>My mother always says, �You can live without Chaucer and you
>can live without calculus, but you cannot make it in the wide,
>wide world without common sense.� As we get older, we
>understand the importance of these words. Adulthood is nothing
>but a series of choices: you can say yes or no, but you cannot
>avoid saying one or the other. In the end, those who are
>successful are those who adjust and adapt to the decisions
>they have made and make the best of them.

translation: n*gga the older you get, you still ignant than motherf*cker!!! u got a lil' mo learnin' to do.

>I caution my fabulous five friends to avoid stereotyping me
>and others they do not know in much the same way so many
>people stereotyped them back then for their appearance and
>swagger. I wish for you the restoration of the bond that made
>you friends, brothers and icons.

translation: ain't this the pot callin' the motherf*ckin' kettle BLACK! that's right n*gga...i'm BLACK!!!

>I am proud of my family. I am proud of my Duke championships
>and all my Duke teammates. And, I am proud I never lost a game
>against the Fab Five.

translation: i still own u B!TCHES!!! 3-0!!!

>Grant Henry Hill
>Phoenix Suns
>Duke �94

"Rock music is deplorable. It is tribal. And it is from America. It follows ragtime, blues, jazz, hot cha-cha and the boogie-woogie, which surely originated in the jungle. We sometimes wonder whether this is the negro's revenge." Sept. 1956, The Daily Mai

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jane eyre
Member since Jan 16th 2007
715 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 01:54 PM

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79. "lol."
In response to Reply # 40
Wed Mar-16-11 01:55 PM by jane eyre

i haven't been a sports fan for a while.

when i was crazy and hardcore about sports (especially basketball), it was around the unlv-duke and fab 5-duke time period.

it's been a long long time since i've felt the kind of special disdain i once had for coach k and duke university. heaven knows that i hated duke with every fiber of my being.

when i read this sentence:

>>And, I am proud I never lost a game against the Fab Five.<<

for a brief moment, it all came back to me.

anyhow. other than that--

as some have stated, who knows what jalen rose thinks now. and sure, hill makes some valid points. but if i were hill, i wouldn't have even responded. at least not publicly. but it's not like i think hill's response is horrible or out of pocket or something.

i keep thinking, though...the hurt/anger that a 17 y.o. jalen rose might feel about guys his same age that appeared to have a life that he never had but wanted, is legitimate. it's not like it's rare to find college athletes who are disadvantaged, fatherless, young, and black. in the context of this debacle, it's not like that's anybody's fault. definitely not grant hill's.

BUT

it would be nice, generally speaking, if more people at least acknowledged that young black males who come from a particular kind of experience might feel pain. acknowledge that it might majorly blow to not have the sorts of things that rose felt resentful about. it's not like an apology is needed. but just some empathy, maybe, and not so much a defense about how blacks have all kinds of experiences or how "having" doesn't mean selling out.

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ZooTown74
Member since May 29th 2002
43582 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 02:06 PM

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81. "It's really tough to argue against this response"
In response to Reply # 40

It's so well-spoken and articulate

Kidding

Anyway, people are telling on themselves in here...

_________________________________________________________________________
The New Shit

twitter.com/LetsStay2Gether

also on Facebook

I WILL NOT LET YOU FORGET IT

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El_essence
Charter member
24899 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 02:50 PM

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101. "I think it's funny how folks are acting as if he shouldn't feel some "
In response to Reply # 81

kinda way about being called a bitch in front of millions of viewers with very little clarification from Rose.

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:11 PM

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113. "very little clarification? He explained exactly why he felt that way."
In response to Reply # 101
Wed Mar-16-11 03:28 PM by write_serengeti

Dude said he was jealous....what more was he expected to say? Broke down what he knew about Grant and then went on to explain where he came from thus showing they came from two different places and he was jealous behind that.

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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El_essence
Charter member
24899 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:35 PM

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130. "They ain't really been clear about it post doc though. I'm looking at it"
In response to Reply # 113

from Grant's point of you. *I* feel Jalen probably doesn't feel the same way. With that said, if I'm Grant and the first time I'm hearing this shit is in a documentary, I'ma need a phone call before hand or after the fact with some specific understanding of how you feel now. Saying you're jealous is different than saying specifically, "I don't feel the same way now".

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:50 PM

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140. "If it's UNCLEAR then get on the phone like a grown ass man"
In response to Reply # 130
Wed Mar-16-11 03:55 PM by write_serengeti

and call Jalen. That nigga is in the same world as you are, so you call him. Grant writing this article was about not standing firmly on who he KNOWS he is and...IT WAS ABOUT his ego. It made him look like a bitch. And what's so funny is Grant knows this isn't about what Jalen said about his family....it's about being called a bitch. The male EGO got his dick on all over this.

Who was he trying to explain this to in the first place? Did he think people agreed with Jalen? Apparently so....and if people DO agree with Jalen, writing this article was not going to change nary a nigga's mind.

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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BLACK_ADAM
Member since Mar 21st 2006
4791 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:57 PM

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143. "RE: If it's UNCLEAR then get on the phone like a grown ass man"
In response to Reply # 140

>and call Jalen. That nigga is in the same world as you are,
>so you call him. Grant writing this article was about not
>standing firmly on who he KNOWS he is and...IT WAS ABOUT his
>ego. It made him look like a bitch. And what's so funny is
>Grant knows this isn't about what Jalen said about his
>family....it's about being called a bitch. The male EGO got
>his dick on all over this.
>
>Who was he trying to explain this to in the first place? Did
>he think people agreed with Jalen? Apparently so....and if
>people DO agree with Jalen, writing this article was not going
>to change nary a nigga's mind.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ALL 'LIS^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

"Inspectah Deck, he's like...he's like that dude thatta sit back and watch you play yourself and all that right? And see you sit there and know you lyin; and he'll take you to court after that, cuz he the Inspectah."

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MfDash
Member since May 10th 2008
549 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 05:35 PM

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161. "nah jalen shouldve called first"
In response to Reply # 140

but no he tweeted grant hill.. nah you aint hear or see he tweeted the man.. like hes 16 or some shit.. you can say what you want about intentions or how he felt but you cant be serious saying after they called grant and the rest of black dukies (sic) uncle tom's and bitches and then continued on tv like that for grant to then call him and find out whats up.. thats on jalen and he clearly didnt do the grown man and express this to grant before explaining in a doc he had full control over and final say on.. no misunderstanding or anything else.. smh.. btw shits disgusting people could feel any kind of way about grant's response.. dude was called an uncle tom on television and all types of names and was supposed to not feel some kind of way.. and even past that was made to sound as if he was less black because of shit he cant control.. say you have an issue with K or any other coach that didnt recruit but a player? and to even push that agenda in a documentary.. Grant handled it better than black men of past generations who understood what uncle tom meant and how disrespectful it is.. but carry on..

and when i can im gonna build a castle that touches the clouds,
not to get closer to god but to get further from y'all

- Slug

www.myspace.com/d_ash
www.twitter.com/mfdash

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 05:46 PM

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163. "What? lol Anyway, Wilbon said he talked to Grant and Grant "
In response to Reply # 161

himself said he's friend with Jalen and KNOWS he didn't feel that way now which makes his response even more ridiculous because wasn't about what he said, but because other people saw it....IE His ego was hurt.

He didn't have to really explain shit to Grant and I'm talking just off the doc alone because I feel like he clarified how he felt thoroughly and why, but yeah carry on.

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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MfDash
Member since May 10th 2008
549 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 05:50 PM

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165. "RE: What? lol Anyway, Wilbon said he talked to Grant and Grant "
In response to Reply # 163

What does Wilbon have to do with it.. You said Grant shouldve called Jalen.. Being they are friends it furthers my point of Jalen shouldve called Grant prior.. If thats his friend he would have.. there is a level of respect especially knowing how those comments would be received in a culture that lives off these types of comments.. Grant may not be all that upset but to think he shouldve called him first is crazy talk..

and when i can im gonna build a castle that touches the clouds,
not to get closer to god but to get further from y'all

- Slug

www.myspace.com/d_ash
www.twitter.com/mfdash

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 05:55 PM

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168. "Because the whole argument is about WHETHER he still feels"
In response to Reply # 165
Wed Mar-16-11 06:00 PM by write_serengeti

like that now....well at least that is what WE (the people *I* was talking to in THIS thread) was saying.

But for arguments sake...let's say he still wasn't sure especially AFTER Jalen and Jimmy were on 1st Take....HE SHOULD have called...now if you think he shouldn't have okay...I don't....end of story.

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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MfDash
Member since May 10th 2008
549 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 06:34 PM

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178. "noo the thread is about hills response"
In response to Reply # 168

but nevermind i dont want to interrupt your private conversation on a message board..

and when i can im gonna build a castle that touches the clouds,
not to get closer to god but to get further from y'all

- Slug

www.myspace.com/d_ash
www.twitter.com/mfdash

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 06:48 PM

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182. "Thanks. lol"
In response to Reply # 178

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 02:21 PM

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88. "This is so ridiculous. "
In response to Reply # 40

LMAO!

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BLACK_ADAM
Member since Mar 21st 2006
4791 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 02:25 PM

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92. "What's worse is that Jalen pre-emptively apologized..."
In response to Reply # 40

...I would imagine, in hopes of Grant and his ilk seeing his comments for what they were...

...a (then)kid expressing frustration at not being considered as a top prospect and having suspicions that his upbringing was being judged as crippling to his character...and as an unworthy castoff..

Last I heard....some athletes play better with a chip on their shoulder. Jalen clearly explained his hatred of Duke...particularly as a Wolverine player, as irrational (and necessary for his psyche at the time...)

...I mean isn't that a pervasive problem for most kids growing up in a single parent household???!?!? Feelings of inadequacy?!? Chip on shoulder? Scrappy?!? Overcompensating????

...especially a single parent household where he didn't even know who/where his father was??!??!?

Jalen already *ADMITTED* he was jealous and expressed his feelings of inadequacy...

Grant's response is classless at best and a pile on... "I had a Daddy!!! Nanny-Nanny Boo Boo!!!"

"Good Grammar-ed Bitchassness" at it finest! Way to go Grant!!!

"Inspectah Deck, he's like...he's like that dude thatta sit back and watch you play yourself and all that right? And see you sit there and know you lyin; and he'll take you to court after that, cuz he the Inspectah."

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JungleSouljah
Member since Sep 24th 2002
14987 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 01:24 PM

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276. "Fuck a pre-emptive apology"
In response to Reply # 92

That just proves Jalen knew that shit was wrong and did it anyway because he's hoping for any little extra controversey to hype his documentary. If he really was apologetic he could have chosen to EDIT IT. Since he was the producer and the director.

Fuck outta here with an apology. If he wants to make his comments that's fine, but then people who the comments were directed at have the freedom to respond how they see fit.

______________________________
PSN: RuptureMD
http://hospitalstories.wordpress.com/

The 4th Annual Residency Encampment: Where do we go from here?

All you see is crime in the source code.

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TheRealBillyOcean
Charter member
38224 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 02:18 PM

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280. "Or Jalen saw how the comments were taken out of context.."
In response to Reply # 276

and all of the attention it garnered after it was edited and screened. Thus, he wanted to apologize to Hill for it.

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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BLACK_ADAM
Member since Mar 21st 2006
4791 posts

Mon Mar-21-11 08:33 AM

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445. "RE: Or Jalen saw how the comments were taken out of context.."
In response to Reply # 280

>and all of the attention it garnered after it was edited and
>screened. Thus, he wanted to apologize to Hill for it.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^yup^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I mean...the man has to apologize for being an immature 17-18 year old now????

The documentary was meant to "capture" *THAT* moment in time...*PAST* sentiments...

Cats in here wildin'

"Inspectah Deck, he's like...he's like that dude thatta sit back and watch you play yourself and all that right? And see you sit there and know you lyin; and he'll take you to court after that, cuz he the Inspectah."

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LegacyNS
Member since Jan 16th 2004
38095 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 02:31 PM

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95. "Maize and Blue til I die but Grant Hill is spot on...."
In response to Reply # 40

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<---- 5....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlgiritpmfo

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El_essence
Charter member
24899 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 02:52 PM

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103. "Right. I ain't even mad at Rose. I feel him. But the fact that Grant"
In response to Reply # 95

shouldn't be irritated by what was said is silly.

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Guinness
Charter member
26270 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:15 PM

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117. "shit."
In response to Reply # 103
Wed Mar-16-11 03:16 PM by Guinness

i don't have a problem with grant responding or being annoyed. he can say what he wants and feel however he wants.

but his refusal to acknowledge why a kid from a fucked up environment might resent duke (the embodiment of whiteness in college hoops) and the middle-class players who went there is coldhearted and elitist.

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BLACK_ADAM
Member since Mar 21st 2006
4791 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:16 PM

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119. "^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^"
In response to Reply # 117

>i don't have a problem with grant responding or being
>annoyed. he can say what we wants and feel however he wants.
>
>but his refusal to acknowledge why a kid from a fucked up
>environment might resent duke (the embodiment of whiteness in
>college hoops) and the middle-class players who went there is
>coldhearted and elitist.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
"Inspectah Deck, he's like...he's like that dude thatta sit back and watch you play yourself and all that right? And see you sit there and know you lyin; and he'll take you to court after that, cuz he the Inspectah."

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T Reynolds
Member since Apr 16th 2007
42760 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:22 PM

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121. "Traits of a WINNER"
In response to Reply # 117

>coldhearted and elitist.

cry.

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El_essence
Charter member
24899 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:24 PM

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123. "or it could be him feeling disrespected and not focusing on that. I"
In response to Reply # 117

don't understand how Grant is expected to either a) not say shit or b) make the perfect all encompassing retort when Rose was at best was mealy mouthed with his feelings and King was basically doubling down.

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Guinness
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26270 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:43 PM

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139. "it's an open letter in the nytimes, not a tweet."
In response to Reply # 123
Wed Mar-16-11 03:44 PM by Guinness

a thoughtful response isn't too much to ask. but his refusal to empathize whatsoever with rose's adolescent grudges indicate hill is exactly who duke-haters assumed him to be: a pompous, privileged dickface.

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BLACK_ADAM
Member since Mar 21st 2006
4791 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:51 PM

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141. "^^^^^and AGAIN^^^^^^^^^^^^^^"
In response to Reply # 139

>a thoughtful response isn't too much to ask. but his refusal
>to empathize whatsoever with rose's adolescent grudges
>indicate hill is exactly who duke-haters assumed him to be: a
>pompous, privileged dickface.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^all 'lis^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

"Inspectah Deck, he's like...he's like that dude thatta sit back and watch you play yourself and all that right? And see you sit there and know you lyin; and he'll take you to court after that, cuz he the Inspectah."

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Bombastic
Charter member
88874 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:57 PM

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144. "lol @ '18' & 'adolescent' continuing to be tossed out there "
In response to Reply # 139

this shit is even a conversation right now because of what these men approaching 40 have been saying *this week* on special funded by the network that employs Jalen Rose.

Why is one man's oft-repeated-this-week perspective allowed so much leeway for gray area he left out there while another is supposed to either be quiet or write a soliquy worthy of MLK at the Lincoln Memorial.

That double-standard y'all are granting (no pun intended) is more insulting/condescending than anything in Hill's response.

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Guinness
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26270 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 05:16 PM

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153. "i disagree."
In response to Reply # 144

first off, speaking on a camera is entirely different from composing a letter (with or without the help of a publicist and the duke alumni association). so, yeah, i hold hill to a different standard of clarity. but besides that, i thought rose articulated clearly why he hated duke: he believed they didn't want players with his background, he thought their players were privileged, and, by the "uncle tom" comment, he felt that black players who went there were playing for a program that was opposed to urban values.

i'm not sure why you're harping on the fact that rose, king and jackson said these statements recently. It was clear the questions were about how they felt as a teenager.

as for hill, his unwillingness to broach why duke--then and now, the most hated program in the country--was disliked by kids from the hood is mind-boggling. asking him to acknowledge a commonly-known fact that plays a looming part in this discussion isn't asking for the "letter from birmingham jail." he's just another a self-satisfied, indignant duke prick.

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El_essence
Charter member
24899 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 05:26 PM

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158. "RE: i disagree."
In response to Reply # 153

>i'm not sure why you're harping on the fact that rose, king
>and jackson said these statements recently. It was clear the
>questions were about how they felt as a teenager.

Because neither king or rose would back off of the Uncle Tom comments when asked directly.

>as for hill, his unwillingness to broach why duke--then and
>now, the most hated program in the country--was disliked by
>kids from the hood is mind-boggling.

Because he wasn't asked.

asking him to acknowledge
>a commonly-known fact that plays a looming part in this
>discussion isn't asking for the "letter from birmingham jail."
>he's just another a self-satisfied, indignant duke prick.

Who's asked him?

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Guinness
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26270 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 05:57 PM

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170. "no one asked grant to say anything."
In response to Reply # 158
Wed Mar-16-11 05:58 PM by Guinness

he came out and made a statement on his own - and avoided any meaningful discussion of the crux of the issue.

i don't care if king/jackson still think hill is an uncle tom. that's not my place to decide, but i think anyone who goes to duke is generally a cornball.

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Bombastic
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88874 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 06:49 PM

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183. "RE: i disagree."
In response to Reply # 153

>first off, speaking on a camera is entirely different from
>composing a letter (with or without the help of a publicist
>and the duke alumni association). so, yeah, i hold hill to a
>different standard of clarity. but besides that, i thought
>rose articulated clearly why he hated duke: he believed they
>didn't want players with his background, he thought their
>players were privileged, and, by the "uncle tom" comment, he
>felt that black players who went there were playing for a
>program that was opposed to urban values.
>
>i'm not sure why you're harping on the fact that rose, king
>and jackson said these statements recently. It was clear the
>questions were about how they felt as a teenager.
>
because he's saying it today & continuing to ride with those thoughts, check First & Ten for further evidence, not to mention we're only talking about it because they decided to put this out there again this week all over.

Let's stop with the 'what he thought as a teenager' defense to hide from the fact that he & many *still* feel this way & we know this.

I don't have a problem with someone feeling that way either but don't bullshit a bullshitter and also don't act like someone on the other side of that discussion doesn't have the right to say something in his own defense or in defense of the school he comes from.

>as for hill, his unwillingness to broach why duke--then and
>now, the most hated program in the country--was disliked by
>kids from the hood is mind-boggling. asking him to acknowledge
>a commonly-known fact that plays a looming part in this
>discussion isn't asking for the "letter from birmingham jail."
>he's just another a self-satisfied, indignant duke prick.

I'm not even getting into Duke fandom or whatever, it's just stupid to me that he's the asshole for not carving out a response brilliant enough to both fully understand Jalen's perspective while articulating his own while the guy that just made the movie & the news with all this twenty years later somehow isn't held to that standard.

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El_essence
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Wed Mar-16-11 04:03 PM

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146. "I would agree with you if Jalen and King were more thoughtful in how"
In response to Reply # 139

they articulated their disdain for duke and Grant as kids. Saying "I thought he was a bitch" or talking about Grant's family in a snarky tone ("congratulations") deserves some explanation of how you feel about him today if you're not expecting someone to feel some way about it.

>a thoughtful response isn't too much to ask. but his refusal
>to empathize whatsoever with rose's adolescent grudges
>indicate hill is exactly who duke-haters assumed him to be: a
>pompous, privileged dickface.

yeah looking at Rose and King now in this interview http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=6224395

They're not backing off the Uncle Tom shit.

I'm sorry, I'm not even a Duke fan. I even felt like Rose did about black players at Duke back then. But if I'm Grant, I'm not going to spend time trying to feel where dude is coming from if he's still talking this Uncle Tom shit.

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 04:25 PM

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149. "That actually reaffirmed how I feel about this situation thus"
In response to Reply # 146

coming down to perception because I know you wouldn't be debating with me to just be bullshitting.

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 05:53 PM

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166. "they CONTINUE to misrepresent duke's recruiting philosophy"
In response to Reply # 117

they needed to be checked.

>but his refusal to acknowledge why a kid from a fucked up
>environment might resent duke (the embodiment of whiteness in
>college hoops)

And that's where you fucked up. Duke's only the embodiment of whiteness to dumb fucks. Let's just ignore Nolan's black ass face. Or the entire piss-colored but black Curry family...Kyrie..Dawkins, Tyler, Josh.

and the middle-class players who went there is
>coldhearted and elitist.

Middle class black players go EVERYWHERE. They made up the majority of the Fab 5.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 06:15 PM

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176. "lol@you using two niggas whose daddies went to college and"
In response to Reply # 166

are/where are a very huge part of their lives.
>
>>but his refusal to acknowledge why a kid from a fucked up
>>environment might resent duke (the embodiment of whiteness
>in
>>college hoops)
>
>And that's where you fucked up. Duke's only the embodiment of
>whiteness to dumb fucks. Let's just ignore Nolan's black ass
>face. Or the entire piss-colored but black Curry
>family...Kyrie..Dawkins, Tyler, Josh.
>
> and the middle-class players who went there is
>>coldhearted and elitist.

>Middle class black players go EVERYWHERE. They made up the
>majority of the Fab 5.

Now you're just mincing words....WE know what he means by elite. Maybe it's a not a good use of the word, but this reminds me of an episode of Good Times when that little gang member was all surprised when Michael told him that his father and mother were married and lived with him. Nigga was hella surprised and probably thought it was elite. LMAO!

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 07:54 PM

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189. "too bad jalen and jimmy made a blanket statement. TWO is not ALL"
In response to Reply # 176

>Now you're just mincing words....WE know what he means by
>elite.

he means a FEW black Duke players (Hill, Henderson, Battier), not MOST and certainly not ALL black dukies came from elite families. we not talking about due university being elite...we talking about what jalen and jimmy said about the type of family black dukies have...ELITE and WELL-TO-DO...that's what they said.

we can't just laugh the shit off and give them space to fudge exactly what they were tryna convey. not when "uncle tom" has been lobbed out there. oh, fuck no.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
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Wed Mar-16-11 08:17 PM

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192. "I didn't even get what I said, but okay. lol"
In response to Reply # 189

>
>>Now you're just mincing words....WE know what he means by
>>elite.
>
>he means a FEW black Duke players (Hill, Henderson, Battier),
>not MOST and certainly not ALL black dukies came from elite
>families. we not talking about due university being elite...we
>talking about what jalen and jimmy said about the type of
>family black dukies have...ELITE and WELL-TO-DO...that's what
>they said.
>
>we can't just laugh the shit off and give them space to fudge
>exactly what they were tryna convey. not when "uncle tom" has
>been lobbed out there. oh, fuck no.
>

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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40thStreetBlack
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Wed Mar-16-11 03:19 PM

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120. "can't really blame him i guess, but grant could've been bigger than this"
In response to Reply # 40

jalen didn't say that blacks from two-parent, middle-class families are all uncle toms (e.g. chris webber's family). and he didn't disparage grant's parents, what he said is that he was jealous of grant coming from a successful black family and that his resentment stemmed from his bitterness over his father abandoning him and his mother struggling to raise a family by herself in detroit, not from any personal animosity towards grant himself.

guess it's hard not to take it personal when you hear the words uncle tom and bitch directed towards you though, so guess I can't blame him for that. but a little disappointing he was so defensive about it and either didn't get or didn't acknowledge why jalen felt the way he did.

can't front though, that last line was straight fiya.

___________________

Mar-A-Lago delenda est

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Solaam
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Wed Mar-16-11 03:29 PM

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126. "Good stuff but I still hate seeing brothas "fight" in public"
In response to Reply # 40

PS3/Xbox ID: BackDo Do
Wii: Solaam

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jigga
Charter member
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Wed Mar-16-11 03:40 PM

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136. "He's so well spoken!"
In response to Reply # 40

All jokes aside this was a good retort with a dash of ether sprinkled on the end

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Kira
Member since Nov 14th 2004
28848 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 04:09 PM

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147. "So basically Grant proved Jalen was right"
In response to Reply # 40

He did a nice job of deflecting from Rose's actual point. He ignored Rose's statement about his feelings at 18.

I'd love to know why Duke doesn't recruit basketball players from the hood.

No empathy for white misery (c) BDot

"root for everybody black haters say that's crazy, wow..."

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Challenger
Member since Dec 21st 2004
4193 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 04:43 PM

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152. "Very well done."
In response to Reply # 40

Reads as smooth as his game.

Challenger-

************************************************************************************
M. Ali - the Greatest - https://youtube.com/watch?v=jkhpZoPOfZI

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Notalent
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Wed Mar-16-11 01:21 PM

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60. "A bitch"
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Mar-16-11 01:23 PM by Notalent

I actually met him all around cool dude before he bolted from the Pistons <---still hurts when breathe

______________________________________

www.twitter.com/muhfuckinthomas

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guru0509
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45358 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 01:26 PM

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64. "dope avy, even if the coneys look disgusting."
In response to Reply # 60

_______________________________

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Notalent
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12439 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 01:49 PM

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75. "Lafayette Coney downtown"
In response to Reply # 64

______________________________________

www.twitter.com/muhfuckinthomas

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nipsey
Charter member
9924 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 02:11 PM

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82. "C'mon American Better"
In response to Reply # 75

____________________________________
Twitter: nipsey
A Friend's Blog: http://trayrific.wordpress.com/
http://nipsey.yelp.com

XBOX Live Gamertag: slballer

Last 3 things I watched:

The Town: B+
Legacy: C+
Damages Season 2: C+

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BrooklynWHAT
Member since Jun 15th 2007
85077 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 02:20 PM

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87. "damn. Fatlock done went in too (swipe)"
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Mar-16-11 02:20 PM by BrooklynWHAT

this whole situation is just comical

aside from that though, I want to see a John Thompson documentary.

http://msn.foxsports.com/collegebasketball/story/ESPN-The-Fab-Five-documentary-Jalen-Rose-Chris-Webber-Juwan-Howard-Jimmy-King-Ray-Jackson-031511

It was my intention to ignore ESPN�s �The Fab Five� documentary.

I assumed their �legacy� would be framed inaccurately by the doc�s executive producer Jalen Rose, the leader of the Fab Five.

Earning $125 million in the NBA and transitioning into a TV talking head produces little self-awareness and even fewer qualifications as a documentarian.

Give Rose credit. He talked a major television network and an alleged news organization into allowing him to write his own 90-minute history. We should all be so lucky.

With the help of the Worldwide Leader, Rose took baggy shorts, black socks, bald heads and trash talk and created the illusion the Fab Five were some sort of transcendent, revolutionary freedom fighters cut from the same cloth as Jackie Robinson, Jim Brown, Arthur Ashe and Muhammad Ali.

It�s laughably untrue.

The legacy of the Fab Five is that they were on the cutting edge of America�s unashamed embrace of style over substance.

When Rose ended the documentary waxing about how no one knows the names of the starters on North Carolina�s 1993 national championship team and everyone remembers Rose, Webber, Howard, King and Jackson, it dawned on me the Fab Five were the original Charlie Sheen.

Let me make this clear: I do not dislike the Fab Five. I made my bones as a journalist covering the Fab Five for the Ann Arbor News. I have a strong affinity for Rose, Juwan Howard and Ray Jackson. I have a great deal of respect for Chris Webber, particularly the way he handled the aftermath of the �timeout� and his work as an NBA broadcaster. I never developed any kind of connection with Jimmy King.

But the celebration of this documentary annoys me.

The Fab Five are taking credit for the real accomplishments of John Thompson�s and Patrick Ewing�s Georgetown Hoyas.

It was Thompson�s all-black, Ewing-led teams a decade before the Fab Five that shook the foundation of college basketball, changed the complexion of starting lineups across the country, opened coaching doors that had previously been closed to blacks and paved the way for black sportswriters at major newspapers.

It�s easy to forgive Rose for his lack of self-awareness. It�s America. In this country, self-awareness and common sense are our most rare commodities.

What�s not easy to excuse is the clueless robbery of what Thompson, Ewing, Bill Martin, Reggie Williams, Horace Broadnax and David Wingate accomplished.

They won championships � conference and national. They scared and intimidated the establishment. They were the inner-city black kids who left a legacy of jobs and playing opportunities for other impoverished minorities that exposes the lack of substance in the fads popularized by the Fab Five.

�Hoya Paranoia� is the story that deserves celebration and should serve as a teaching tool. Fab Five is a safe, harmless story celebrating black kids for choosing style over substance.

Rather than participate in the documentary, Public Enemy�s Chuck D should�ve remade �Don�t Believe the Hype� and replaced Elvis with Jalen Rose.

Five super-talented black kids enrolled at a prestigious, white university to play for an inexperienced, piss-poor-at-the-time white coach and, 20 years later, had the audacity to embark on a media tour preaching about black Duke players being Uncle Toms.

Are you kidding me?

Are we really this lost as a people?

Let�s end the facade that Rose�s words about the Duke players are being taken out of context. On Monday, Jimmy King was on ESPN spewing this nonsense.

Last week Webber published this bit of nonsense on his blog.

The Fab Five clearly believe Coach K and Duke didn�t and don�t recruit inner-city black kids, and they believe race/racism/elitism are the driving forces behind the philosophy.

Let�s go back to the Fab Five era and Duke�s philosophy then. Coach K recruited kids who had every intention of staying in school for four years. He recruited kids who had a good chance of competing academically at Duke and could meet the standardized test score qualifications for entrance.

The Fab Five stated it was their intention to win a national championship and turn pro as a group after their sophomore season. Webber, who was recruited by Duke, left Michigan after two years. Rose and Howard left as juniors. Impoverished inner-city kids have good reason to turn pro early. I�m not knocking Webber, Howard and Rose for their decisions. They didn�t fit the Duke profile at the time.

Furthermore, unlike Steve Fisher at the time, Coach K did more than roll the ball on the court. He coached.

The ideal in college basketball is to lead four-year student-athletes to conference and national championships. That�s the goal.

During the three-year run of the Fab Five (one season without Webber), Duke beat Michigan all four times the schools met while winning two ACC titles and one NCAA title. During the same span, Michigan won zero conference or national titles. In addition, Webber�s interactions with booster Ed Martin put the program on probation and caused Michigan to forfeit all its games.

I think Coach K recruited and recruits the right kids for Duke.

It�s ridiculous for Webber to insinuate that Coach K feared the Fab Five were �thugs and killers.�

Coach K probably thought the same thing I thought watching the Fab Five play: They�re immature, arrogant, interested in playing for a coach they could ignore and incapable of putting together the consistent focus and effort necessary to win a conference championship.

Two teams consistently beat the Fab Five � Duke (4-0) and Indiana (4-2).

Let me translate that for you: Structured, disciplined, well-coached teams beat Michigan.

While making money for their white university and allowing their incompetent, white coach to learn on the job, the Fab Five were not man enough to harness the courage and focus to outduel � in their minds � inferior, racist teams.

Now tell me who the sellouts were?

It wasn�t John Thompson, Patrick Ewing or Grant Hill.

<--- Big Baller World Order

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BLACK_ADAM
Member since Mar 21st 2006
4791 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 02:39 PM

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98. "Ewing went to Cambridge Rindge & Latin..."
In response to Reply # 87

LIBERAL ASSED, LILY WHITE/BLACK CAMBRIDGE MASSACHUSETTS

hardly inner city black youth environment there....

Whitlock needs to check his fucking facts!

"Inspectah Deck, he's like...he's like that dude thatta sit back and watch you play yourself and all that right? And see you sit there and know you lyin; and he'll take you to court after that, cuz he the Inspectah."

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Numba_33
Charter member
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Wed Mar-16-11 02:48 PM

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100. "You should e-mail Whitlock and/or his editor"
In response to Reply # 98

and see if you get a response.

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BLACK_ADAM
Member since Mar 21st 2006
4791 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:15 PM

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118. "LOL! I know I won't get a response!!!!"
In response to Reply # 100

I know cats that went to that HS when Patrick was there!!!!

Not to mention that Matt Damon and Ben Affleck are graduates....

...^^^should put some perspective on this^^^...

I like Whitlock...he does have some journalistic courage...and he's even spot on sometimes...just not today....

...and the big deal about the Fab Five is that it was a an *ALL FROSH* squad beasting through the ranks to get to the Championship Game....TWICE...

If anything...it is somewhat MORE of an accomplishment since he believes they weren't coached well...AND the fact that what killed them both times was maturity...not skill or ability....

How many squads of upperclassmen fell or even made the tournament???

Whitlock needs his hour of Daylight Savings back...
"Inspectah Deck, he's like...he's like that dude thatta sit back and watch you play yourself and all that right? And see you sit there and know you lyin; and he'll take you to court after that, cuz he the Inspectah."

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Walleye
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15523 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:00 PM

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107. "He was an intern in my dad's office"
In response to Reply # 98

Or rather, the office my dad worked in. He was apparently so diligent and serious in this opportunity that my father has literally no interesting stories except that it was weird seeing Patrick Ewing around the office.

______________________________

"Walleye, a lot of things are going to go wrong in your life that technically aren't your fault. Always remember that this doesn't make you any less of an idiot"

--Walleye's Dad

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Numba_33
Charter member
19335 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:12 PM

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114. "Your father worked with/for Senator Bill Bradley?"
In response to Reply # 107

Remember reading off the back of basketball cards and such when I was a teen that Ewing interned for Bill Bradley. Mightly humble of you not to drop that name there.

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Walleye
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15523 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:32 PM

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128. "Ewing was an intern with the Senate Finance Committee"
In response to Reply # 114

My dad worked for a different senator on the committee. I think Bradley was on that committee at that time, too, though I'm willing to be corrected on that.

______________________________

"Walleye, a lot of things are going to go wrong in your life that technically aren't your fault. Always remember that this doesn't make you any less of an idiot"

--Walleye's Dad

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Bombastic
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88874 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:00 PM

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108. "Whitlock doesnt even know what PE song name-drops Elvis, whatchu expect?"
In response to Reply # 98

>LIBERAL ASSED, LILY WHITE/BLACK CAMBRIDGE MASSACHUSETTS
>
>
>hardly inner city black youth environment there....
>
>
>Whitlock needs to check his fucking facts!
>
>
>
>"Inspectah Deck, he's like...he's like that dude thatta sit
>back and watch you play yourself and all that right? And see
>you sit there and know you lyin; and he'll take you to court
>after that, cuz he the Inspectah."

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cgonz00cc
Member since Aug 01st 2002
35271 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 02:41 PM

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99. "takes a real incompetent coach to reach 3 NC games in 5 years"
In response to Reply # 87

FOH

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
132214 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:07 PM

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111. "FUCK THAT FAT FUCK."
In response to Reply # 87

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nipsey
Charter member
9924 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:08 PM

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112. "This is a whooooole 'nother post"
In response to Reply # 87

Whitlock got something to say now? Eff that cheeseburger eatin', self hatin', opportunistic, disingenuous, UNCLE TOM.
____________________________________
Twitter: nipsey
A Friend's Blog: http://trayrific.wordpress.com/
http://nipsey.yelp.com

XBOX Live Gamertag: slballer

Last 3 things I watched:

The Town: B+
Legacy: C+
Damages Season 2: C+

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veritas
Member since Sep 16th 2002
37201 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:48 PM

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216. "RE: self-awareness and common sense are our most rare commodities."
In response to Reply # 87

SELF ETHERING SELF WHAT DO I DOOOOOO?

i still blame hip-hop.

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Expertise
Charter member
37848 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:00 PM

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223. "beautiful column."
In response to Reply # 87

I would have taken it deeper tho, and said the Fab 5 documentary was nothing more than about plea cops, excuses, losses, and scandal.
_________________________
http://expertise.blogdrive.com
http://twitter.com/KMBReferee
http://www.formspring.me/KMBReferee

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cgonz00cc
Member since Aug 01st 2002
35271 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 12:47 PM

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270. "and it would have been more idiotic than this one"
In response to Reply # 223

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TheRealBillyOcean
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Wed Mar-16-11 02:22 PM

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89. "I want Shane Battier to do a diss track."
In response to Reply # 0

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 02:22 PM

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90. "Black guys hating Duke: The manifestation of self-hate"
In response to Reply # 0

Grant fucked y'all bitch.

And y'all bitch is your distorted view of black manhood that you have readily accepted for decades and cling to because you have no real sense of identity. You threatened by black men wit good sense who listen to a white man that fuckin loves the shit outta them and makes them behave as MEN should...not black men...MEN!! If you wanna shuck and jive and cheer on undisciplined playground squads coached by slimeballs because they more authentically black...go right ahead witcho dumb ass.

Grant used Jalen's stupidity -- and not clarifying what he feels TODAY is stupid -- as an opportunity to makes reference to that larger problem.

I watched giggle like idiots all weekend about how funny it was that people USED to think that way about Duke. Fuck outta here. What board we been on all these years. Most of you that are mad STILL feel that way. When a kid picks Duke you think he's a bitchmade dude. Let's just cut the shit. Stop lying and acting indignant like dumb fucking niggers in the movie theater that been cuttin' up and then get mad when someone with good sense checks the fuck outta you.

Ain't no more giggling on First Take about this shit. Jalen was speaking in the perfect-present about the kinds of black players Duke recruits TODAY. While he didn't use Uncle Tom in that same breath, it could reasonably be characterized as SUBTEXT. Them dudes need to defend their position, which none of them could ever do on the court, so I ain't really expecting much from them intellectually.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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bshelly
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71730 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 02:33 PM

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96. "grant's article barely talks about race at all"
In response to Reply # 90

it barely addresses that issues at all and reads like an insecure investment banker listing the career achievements of himself and his golf team, with some random and out-of-place asides about two parent families fit in. i didn't see the doc yet, so i have no idea if jalen made that part of the image he was talking about, but it feels like the king of all strong men.

grant shouldn't have done anything about this. if he is going to write the article, he had a chance to really talk about how the image was harmful and how it's encouraging that a guy like jalen could realize that later in life.

instead, he just sounds like every asshole duke grad, white AND black, who are insecure about their dick size and need to remind you about every good thing they've ever done, even if it has nothing to do with the topic at hand. i know that trick. i've had way too many dinner parties with jackass ivy leaguers to know that trick.

i'm not saying what grant talks about isn't relevant to the issue, just that he didn't write it well enough to make those connections and that he looks like a pompous bougie jackass as a result. dude actually used latin, for god's sake.

----
bshelly

"You (Fisher) could get fired, Les Snead could get fired, Kevin Demoff could get fired, but I will always be Eric Dickerson.” (c) The God

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El_essence
Charter member
24899 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 02:58 PM

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106. "then you should cease passing judgment on grant's article"
In response to Reply # 96

>i didn't see the doc
>yet, so i have no idea if jalen made that part of the image he
>was talking about,

because when Jalen referenced Grant Hill, he was speaking specifically to his family.

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Bombastic
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88874 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:14 PM

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116. "u were better off 'skipping this controversy' as u originally planned"
In response to Reply # 96

.

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B9
Charter member
43124 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:33 PM

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129. "misplaced channeling of rage at Phillies injuries"
In response to Reply # 116

Shells: YOUR BREATHING! Remeber your breathing...

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
132214 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:27 PM

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125. "fuck it, I'm cosigning."
In response to Reply # 96

I don't blame Hill Smith for defending himself and his family, but while the "Uncle Tom" perception of Duke MAY persist in the present day, that shit about Grant's family and such was EXPRESSLY confined to the younger Jalen, who envied Grant's situation as much as he seemed to resent it (and he explictly said it as such).

I'm actually kind of disappointed that Grant took the easy route to saying essentially, "Duke won".

well, he could have said as quite a few Duke defenders do, HOW they "won". How they "win" with Black students, how they don't recruit "Uncle Toms", something, ANYTHING that spells out why that perception is BS.

Instead it's like, "yeah, I might be a lil Carlton more than Will, but you niggas still lost. GOOD!" Rubbish.

if Basa can defend the integrity of Puke U, so can someone who is essentially seen as the greatest class act to ever come out of Duke.

Also, there's no reason for the whole disparaging niggas who like other niggas who act like "niggas" thing either. Except for Chris Webber (the proto-Studio Thug), the rest of those dudes basically were a bunch of clean cut dudes who liked rap music and other young kid stuff.

It's essentially the same gay-ass shit people do w/Mike Vick, and did with him before he got nabbed for interstate gambling. Rubbish.

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nahymsa
Charter member
1734 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 03:11 PM

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385. "Nobody attacked his family "
In response to Reply # 125

That's what's crazy.

Jalen Rose said that Grant Hill came from a great family and that he was "jealous".

The real issue is Grant's bougie black insecurities..his lack of confidence & his snobbery is all through his article including the implication that his upbringing was inherently better.

Nobody ever suggested it was bad that Hill's mom went to college or that his dad was present in his life.

What is being rejected & has always been rejected is the idea that this makes Grant Hill an inherently superior person because of his background. Or that other talented players who don't come from his background can't get the opportunity to play for a Duke. That the Duke's players inherently "better kids" or more moral.

That's always been the issue.

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 05:20 PM

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154. "but, it does. he hits squarely on views of race and identity among black..."
In response to Reply # 96

and you being white...

>insecure investment banker listing the career achievements of
>himself and his golf team

...have no frame of reference

>instead, he just sounds like every asshole duke grad, white
>AND black,

...for the internal debate he's touching on

>who are insecure about their dick size and need to
>remind you about every good thing they've ever done, even if
>it has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

...that has been at the heart of black guys hating duke.

>i know that
>trick. i've had way too many dinner parties with jackass ivy
>leaguers to know that trick.

but, you commented anyway...

>he looks like a pompous bougie jackass as

...with your white liberal bullshit.

>dude actually used latin, for god's sake.

and only made a fucking fool of yourself.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 05:47 PM

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164. "delete"
In response to Reply # 154
Wed Mar-16-11 05:55 PM by Basaglia

nm

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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kayru99
Member since Jan 26th 2004
16105 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 04:24 AM

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245. "uhhh, what?"
In response to Reply # 90

hating duke is a tradition

if you are black and old enough, hating duke has a lot to do with overhyped white mediocrity, or at least hating how the media often used duke's lily-whiteness as a positive point in comparison to other schools.

FOH with that self-hating bullshit

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 06:33 AM

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246. "and it has nothing to do with winning...and beating "black" teams a lot"
In response to Reply # 245

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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kayru99
Member since Jan 26th 2004
16105 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 07:56 AM

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342. "man, in the 80s and 90s, duke was a lily white team"
In response to Reply # 246

that couldn't get over the hump UNTIL they got grant hill. If you are in your mid 30s, you old enough to remember that Duke didn't win SHIT till they beat UNLV (in a game that most people recognize as being HIGHLY suspect)

And people hated duke before that. The bball team was insanely overhyped back then. And, like everything else in the 80's and early 90's, the "all-american" team was often put in direct contrast with the "other" teams. Like dude said the other day...Duke, Notre Dame, Indiana - always discussed as playing "the right way"

I got sick of that shit in middle school when Duke was losin, cuz.

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Warren Coolidge
Charter member
41998 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 12:26 PM

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267. "Jalen wasn't speaking in the present tense and anyone "
In response to Reply # 90

with half a brain can see that. He was talking about something that happened during the fab 5 era, which is the past not the present.

People dislike Duke because they have overrated and overhyped players who do nothing in the NBA yet their dellusional fans still thing Laetner and Deng just came out of school or something..

THAT was the past.... Duke's present tense is overhyped goobers who y'all think are Hurley and Laetner worthy...

they are not...

so to avoid speaking on that reality, now everyone is a self hater who doesn't like Duke and you use the recounting of a 19 year old kid 20 years ago to support your claim??? lolol..

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Binlahab
Charter member
182954 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 02:39 PM

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97. "grant u didnt have to hit him w/ the ether like that dog"
In response to Reply # 0

Ad ingenium faciendum?

OUCH.

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T Reynolds
Member since Apr 16th 2007
42760 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 02:50 PM

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102. "Yeah that was OD. He declensioned on dat azz"
In response to Reply # 97

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Warren Coolidge
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41998 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 02:55 PM

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104. "Grant needs to be careful about looking really foolish with this..."
In response to Reply # 0

because I get the feeling that Jalen's comments will be taken out of context.....they've actually already been taken out of context.

Jalen wasn't saying that those dudes were uncle toms.....He was saying that's how he perceived them to be when he was 18, 19 years old because of the bitterness of the poverty he came from and the lack of a father in the home.

His perception as a poor Black kid looking at Duke was that those were eltist type of Blacks that played their....

and placed in the context of Jalen's social condition, and his age.... it was an understandable perception. One that Duke itself promotes with the type of players they recruit vs. the type they don't...

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Warren Coolidge
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41998 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:04 PM

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109. "just read the article.... Grant missed the point big time...."
In response to Reply # 104

and I hope that his upbringing didn't cheat him out of contextual thinking as it has for many other Black people..

Grant needs to realize that Jalen Rose the grown man wasn't call him an Uncle Tom.... Jalen was speaking on what a 19 year old Jalen Rose from poverty and estrangement perceived about Grant at that time...

it's unfortunate that Grant Hill didn't take the time to put it in it's proper context.

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nipsey
Charter member
9924 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:13 PM

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115. "RE: just read the article.... Grant missed the point big time...."
In response to Reply # 109

Apparently noone has. Irrespective of Jalen's 18 year old feelings, people STILL feel that way about Duke. Why is that? Why don't people try to address why there's this perception of Duke (real or otherwise) amongst the Black community?

>it's unfortunate that Grant Hill didn't take the time to put
>it in it's proper context.

____________________________________
Twitter: nipsey
A Friend's Blog: http://trayrific.wordpress.com/
http://nipsey.yelp.com

XBOX Live Gamertag: slballer

Last 3 things I watched:

The Town: B+
Legacy: C+
Damages Season 2: C+

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Torez the Judge
Member since Mar 13th 2007
3957 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:26 PM

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124. "Ok, I currently live in NC and Duke's perception"
In response to Reply # 115

extends WAAAAAYYYY beyond the black community. Mad white folks in this state don't like Duke for similar reasons. Duke is perceived throughout the state as being elitist, snobby and 'better than.'

Also, I don't buy the 'Duke is a great molder of black men' narrative. Duke recruits black kids that were going to be have solid, productive lives regardless, and just gives them a higher platform to start their post college years. The praise given to Coach K for 'hooking up black boys' really only belongs to JOHN THOMPSON (and maybe NOLAN RICHARDSON.)

When Coach K fucks with an Allen Iverson, or gets a D.C. drug dealer to steer clear of one of his star players, then he'll deserve the credit people want to lavish on him for 'shaping the lives of black men.'

Until then, he is just a great college coach who knows which type of players fit into his system.

The past is my foundation, not my preoccupation.

http://www.typeillypress.com
http://www.twitter.com/mtorez

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guru0509
Charter member
45358 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:38 PM

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134. "John Chaney was a leader of men as well."
In response to Reply # 124

The praise
>given to Coach K for 'hooking up black boys' really only
>belongs to JOHN THOMPSON (and maybe NOLAN RICHARDSON.)

and of course the General.

_______________________________

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Bombastic
Charter member
88874 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:59 PM

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145. "indeed he was/is n/m"
In response to Reply # 134

.

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Torez the Judge
Member since Mar 13th 2007
3957 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 05:23 PM

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156. "word word (c) tip"
In response to Reply # 134

The past is my foundation, not my preoccupation.

http://www.typeillypress.com
http://www.twitter.com/mtorez

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Warren Coolidge
Charter member
41998 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 04:12 PM

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148. "thinking that a program is elitist...and the dellusion and denial of"
In response to Reply # 115

the fan base with Duke doesn't mean that people think the black players there are uncle toms..

it's apples and oranges..

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Torez the Judge
Member since Mar 13th 2007
3957 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 05:26 PM

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157. "i agree...."
In response to Reply # 148

if anything, me and mine are TORN behind duke, cause they keep a black dude on the team we wanna root for (g.hill, tommy amaker) amidst over-rated white cats that we hate (reddick, laetner, parks)

They are the New England Patriots of college football.

The past is my foundation, not my preoccupation.

http://www.typeillypress.com
http://www.twitter.com/mtorez

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:23 PM

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122. "The funny part about this whole thing is Coach K (intentionally"
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Mar-16-11 03:57 PM by write_serengeti

or not) going after players in "better" household environments is something, I venture to say, a lot of coaches do, did or doing because THEIR jobs are at stake behind it. The coaches are being held accountable for how players conduct themselves on and off the court.

Look at Ron English, football coach at Eastern Michigan, he (who is black) got blasted because he said he'd rather recruit kids that come from two-parent homes. However, if we start talking about the root of this shit people will have to start realizing that ain't shit changed AND Lord forbid we start talking about the truth around here.

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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Torez the Judge
Member since Mar 13th 2007
3957 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:30 PM

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127. "^^^^"
In response to Reply # 122

Going after kids from two family homes is not BAD. But mugs act like COACH K is tbhe white Booker T. Washington out this camp.

Grant Hill was going to be a successful black man, no matter where he went to school. Coach K is smart enough to know who works best in his system and who can help him win. That makes him a great coach. It does not - in my book - mean he deserves 'extra props' for 'molding the lives of black men.'

The fact that folks give Coach K so much 'credit' for simply doing what is best for his program is another reason I don't fuck with Duke.

The past is my foundation, not my preoccupation.

http://www.typeillypress.com
http://www.twitter.com/mtorez

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:39 PM

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135. "See I don't see it as molding already "good" black men....it's"
In response to Reply # 127

because he's not trying to be somebody's DADDY. He JUST wants to coach. He's thinking fuck all that other shit. It makes his job easier. Most white people don't live by the "it takes a village" doctrine.

Then you take somebody like John Thompson or black men who KNOW what a broken home can do and they don't mind doing that extra because a lot of kids need it.

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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Torez the Judge
Member since Mar 13th 2007
3957 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 05:22 PM

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155. "I think we are saying the same thing"
In response to Reply # 135

I agree with your assessment of dude's motives.

Which is why I don't like the reverence he gets.

Is he a great coach? Yes.

Does he (or his school) deserve any love for what they do for 'black men?' No, but bammas stay comparing the 'black men of Duke' with 'black men of _______' <-- janky SEC school with shitty graduation rate

It's a false comparison. Coach K isn't doing charity work. He's trying to win within the elite system Duke has established.

The past is my foundation, not my preoccupation.

http://www.typeillypress.com
http://www.twitter.com/mtorez

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 06:00 PM

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171. "No, no, no...the good coaches KNOW they have to be a daddy"
In response to Reply # 135

>Most white people don't live by the "it takes a
>village" doctrine.

most people don't.

>Then you take somebody like John Thompson or black men who
>KNOW what a broken home can do and they don't mind doing that
>extra because a lot of kids need it.

coach was more willing to give opportunities to rough ass kids, but he ain't have no problem bouncing dudes, zero tolerance...ask john turner.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 06:03 PM

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172. "So is Coach K not a good coach because he's recruiting people"
In response to Reply # 171

that already have daddies.

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 06:38 PM

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179. "but i've already run of a rack of names that didn't have daddies"
In response to Reply # 172

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 06:48 PM

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181. "lol@you knowin if all those dudes daddies are active in their...."
In response to Reply # 179

no dad at the house does not mean NO daddy at all. But you do your Basaglia thing up in here...lol And again like I've said a few times there is a perception involved in this as well.

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 08:08 PM

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190. "you making my point for me. how "black" do their families have to be?"
In response to Reply # 181

so K needs to be recruiting crack babies to disprove the blatant lie that duke only recruits blacks from "elite" families and went to "private schools?"

that's what jalen and jimmy said: "ELITE" and "WELL-TO-DO" ain't no pussy-footing around and getting all into what they meant to say and all that. they done had a week and clear shit up and it keeps getting worse. like i said, i defend him on the uncle tom statement, because i knew from jump that was within the context of the films. but, they KEEP talking about the recruiting philosophy of duke and they are flat out wrong.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 08:19 PM

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193. "lol...and the funny part is you're serious with this reply."
In response to Reply # 190

We just are not listening to the argument the same...so we have to agree to disagree. lol

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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nahymsa
Charter member
1734 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 06:19 AM

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409. "What's scary is HE associated blackness w/ crack babies"
In response to Reply # 193

on so many levels he exemplifies what the problem is.

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TheRealBillyOcean
Charter member
38224 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:52 PM

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142. "Rashad Carruth, Jason Parker, Desmond Allison..."
In response to Reply # 122

I can go on about guys that fucked Tubby over before he stopped pandering to recruiting top 100's

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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Jesse Badgreen
Member since Sep 30th 2003
7816 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:36 PM

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131. "i was jealous of motherfuckers with fathers when i was a teenager, too."
In response to Reply # 0

and i've overreacted to being called a bitch before. this reads like a pissy wasted opportunity, though.

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FireBrand
Charter member
145739 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 03:41 PM

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137. "So he IS a bitch? Good to know."
In response to Reply # 0

"Slaves got options...cowards aint got shit." --PS
"Once upon a time, little need existed for making the distinction between a nigga and a black�at least not in this country, the place where niggas were invented" -- Donnell A

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nahymsa
Charter member
1734 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 02:25 PM

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375. "Exactly"
In response to Reply # 137

>

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vee-lover
Member since Jul 30th 2007
20388 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 04:27 PM

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150. "Grant wrote a very profound and well thought out response but..."
In response to Reply # 0

I can't believe he addressed this as if this is the sentiments of Jalen and other Fab 5 members NOW.

And lets be honest here for a minute, ain't that exactly why the majority of blk ppl (I know) HATE Duke? Whether it's inaccurate or misplaced anger towards blk Duke players is another issue.

And for the record, he didn't call Grant a "bitch" as I keep hearing ppl on here saying and Jalen didn't say anything disparaging abt Grant's parents. In fact, he really gave the utmost respect to Grant's dad by saying "he's a well spoken and successful man."

Shit, it's no different than when I was 18 and referring to MLK as a "sellout" because I thought the ideologies of someone like Malcolm x and the Blk Panthers represented what I thought was authentic blkness.

I'm sure now that Jalen is an older and more mature man and has worldly experience, he no longer thinks of blk players that attend Duke as "Uncle Toms."

But this problem of categorizing "blackness" is symptomatic of a larger problem in the black community. A lot of (uninformed) blk ppl, mostly younger, would think of players like Jalen and the other Fab 5 as more "blk" because they seem more hip where as Duke blk players to a lesser informed person would say Duke players are too clean cut, too upright which are codewords for acting "white." This is a twicetold tale.

It's the very reason why someone like Webber, whose background is more closer to Grant's than Jalen's, went out of his way to act hard and tough, characteristics that are associated with being blk, pariticularly blk ppl in the inner city.

grassrootsphilosopher

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Challenger
Member since Dec 21st 2004
4193 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 04:39 PM

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151. "True Story: Saw Grant on campus his freshman year"
In response to Reply # 0

driving a flucking Range Rover. His girlfriend at the time was Jada Pinkett though no-one was checking for her ... pause ... more in shock that a freshman was pushing a Range ... not that having a Range feeds into Jalen's 18yr old perspective, just that it does.

That is all.

Challenger-

************************************************************************************
M. Ali - the Greatest - https://youtube.com/watch?v=jkhpZoPOfZI

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Torez the Judge
Member since Mar 13th 2007
3957 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 05:27 PM

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159. "damn, jada been fucking with THATBEIGE for a minute..."
In response to Reply # 151

The past is my foundation, not my preoccupation.

http://www.typeillypress.com
http://www.twitter.com/mtorez

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CanUooooFeeLiT
Member since May 11th 2005
2178 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 06:41 PM

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180. "RE: damn, jada been fucking with THATBEIGE for a minute..."
In response to Reply # 159

SHEBEIGE!!!!

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SirLau
Charter member
5517 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 05:32 PM

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160. "RE: True Story: Saw Grant on campus his freshman year"
In response to Reply # 151

>driving a flucking Range Rover. His girlfriend at the time
>was Jada Pinkett though no-one was checking for her ... pause
>... more in shock that a freshman was pushing a Range ... not
>that having a Range feeds into Jalen's 18yr old perspective,
>just that it does.

Is a freshman driving a Range all that uncommon at a school like Duke? Or was it that he was a black dude driving a range.

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Challenger
Member since Dec 21st 2004
4193 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 05:38 PM

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162. "it was a black basketball player driving a range ..."
In response to Reply # 160

At a lot of schools people would assume a 'booster' was behind it ... at Duke, the perception is likely that they come from money.

Challenger-

************************************************************************************
M. Ali - the Greatest - https://youtube.com/watch?v=jkhpZoPOfZI

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 05:57 PM

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169. "Iverson was driving a Benz his Freshman year....soooooooo....."
In response to Reply # 151

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Challenger
Member since Dec 21st 2004
4193 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 07:34 PM

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185. "sooooooooo think people thought his mom bought it for him?"
In response to Reply # 169

as most did with Grant?

Challenger-

************************************************************************************
M. Ali - the Greatest - https://youtube.com/watch?v=jkhpZoPOfZI

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 07:37 PM

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186. "and you make my point EXACTLY..."
In response to Reply # 185
Wed Mar-16-11 07:41 PM by Basaglia

black people view hill's range rover through a negative lense (oh, he uppity...got rich parents who got the nerve to be well-educated) while we KNOW iverson driving some shit he ain't supposed to have and it's AUTHENTIC BLACKNESS (YEAH, AI!!! you BALLING).

nigga shit.

bait taken...now fuck off

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Challenger
Member since Dec 21st 2004
4193 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 08:21 PM

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194. "Fuck you talking about Lucy? "
In response to Reply # 186

He was speaking from perspective, not fact. Calm yo sensitive ass down, as if Duke doesn't have the rep Jalen was speaking of ... its true in the corporate space as well, shitstain.

Challenger-

************************************************************************************
M. Ali - the Greatest - https://youtube.com/watch?v=jkhpZoPOfZI

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 08:23 PM

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196. "They don't want to talk about perception on here. lol"
In response to Reply # 194

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 08:35 PM

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198. "jalen wasn't talking about perception, he stated it as FACT..."
In response to Reply # 194

that ALL duke's black players were pursued because they came from well-to-do fams.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Challenger
Member since Dec 21st 2004
4193 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 08:52 PM

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199. "if you insist, let's go to the tape ... (Jalen quote)"
In response to Reply # 198

�For me, Duke was personal,� Rose said. �I hated Duke. And I hated everything I felt Duke stood for. Schools like Duke didn�t recruit players like me. I felt like they only recruited black players that were Uncle Toms.�

Misremember much?

I.FELT.LIKE = perception. Let it go ...

Challenger-

************************************************************************************
M. Ali - the Greatest - https://youtube.com/watch?v=jkhpZoPOfZI

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 09:17 PM

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200. "NIGGA. they talking about TODAY's recruiting philosophy!"
In response to Reply # 199

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=6224395

"they do recruit a certain type of player"

"they only go after affluent kids"

"3 or 4 players, you're feeding my point over 35 years"

"you can only pick 3 or 4...maybe"

"it holds true that duke goes after a certain player...it speaks for itself when you watch them"

THIS IS CURRENT, MUHFUCKA!

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
86672 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 08:27 AM

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248. "^^^ people ignore what Rose said this week, lol."
In response to Reply # 200

They only watched the doc and are riding solely on that. So there's no arguing with people who've made up their minds already.

My movies: http://russellhainline.com
My movie reviews: https://letterboxd.com/RussellHFilm/
My beer TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@thebeertravelguide

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LegacyNS
Member since Jan 16th 2004
38095 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 08:10 AM

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344. "wow I just watched this..."
In response to Reply # 200

http://search.espn.go.com/s/overlay/video?searchString=first%20take&id=6219766&dims=6&start=0

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<---- 5....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlgiritpmfo

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 05:55 PM

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167. "I defended Jalen when this first started, but he and Jimmy are wrong"
In response to Reply # 0

and are intentionally perpetuating easily disprovable shit about K and the Duke program.

sean dockery
kenny blakeney
johnny dawkins
nate james
dave henderson
will avery
mike chappelle
dahntay jones
ricky price
shelden williams
billy king
chris duhon
chris carrawell
casey sanders
phil henderson
robert brickey
brian davis
daniel ewing
elton brand
corey maggette
tony moore
carmen wallace

Jalen and Jimmy said TODAY that you can't name more than 3 or 4 Duke players in the last 35 years that haven't come from "well-to-do" or "elite" families...well, I just did. And don't try to weasle out of it and say they said "stable"...FUCK OUTTA HERE...that could mean anything and is a catch-all to avoid being WRONG. They said "ELITE" and "WELL-TO-DO." They will ignore it. And you idiots will ignore it. Because that title is fresh, Kyrie back, y'all scared of a repeat and y'all just flat out mad.

Them niggas made a blanket statement about the recruiting philosophy of the program based on the notable black Duke players they faced then (Grant Hill) and the more recent guys in the Internet age (Battier, Hendo, Austin, Kyrie, Nolan)

And not only are they proven WRONG by the guys who suited up for Duke, what about all the guys that were HEAVILY recruited by Duke, but decided to go elsewhere, like...

greg monroe
pat patterson
james white
john wall
greg echenique
kenny boynton
tyler adams (remember the great laugh we all had about him...great post, Kani customer)

Let's just stop there, because I don't wanna relive all that.

Are they Duke guys? Now, be careful, because I know the bitch in you wants to take the opening and offer "Obviously, they ain't go to gay ass Duke." but you'd be missing the fucking point. DUKE RECRUITED THEM AND OFFERED THEM! THAT'S THE FUCKING POINT!

This shit has turned into such a pathetic display of Duke-hate. Like I said, Black people just cannot think straight when Duke basketball comes up. Like, y'all actually refuse to THINK.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 06:06 PM

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174. "Ummm no but now ya'll about to become even more "
In response to Reply # 167

ridiculous about this subject so I'mma just flat iron my hair. smh

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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ChuckFoPrez
Charter member
47859 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 06:20 PM

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177. "lol"
In response to Reply # 174

https://twitter.com/chuck4prez

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analog2digital
Charter member
3597 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 06:49 PM

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184. "slow down son, you killin 'em"
In response to Reply # 167

n/m

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LittleX
Member since Sep 17th 2007
3487 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 06:06 PM

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173. "Grant Hill is an oreo, and writes like an uppity nigga."
In response to Reply # 0

His response was lame, I expected better from a uncle tom that went to Duke.

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 06:08 PM

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175. "Now the post has jumped the Blue Devil. smh"
In response to Reply # 173

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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nipsey
Charter member
9924 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 07:46 PM

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188. "LOL!"
In response to Reply # 175

____________________________________
Twitter: nipsey
A Friend's Blog: http://trayrific.wordpress.com/
http://nipsey.yelp.com

XBOX Live Gamertag: slballer

Last 3 things I watched:

The Town: B+
Legacy: C+
Damages Season 2: C+

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
132214 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:14 PM

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204. "Stop being a such an Internet Troll, LittleX."
In response to Reply # 173

you were lickin' Duke booty in that other post

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B9
Charter member
43124 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 07:42 PM

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187. "BTW, the letter is the perfect "Tebow speech" for Duke"
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Mar-16-11 07:51 PM by B9

I'm trying to think of a physical manifestation of this speech, on a plaque, somewhere on Duke's campus, and I'm failing to place it.

Got it: it should be on a 1/16th bronze statue of Grant Hill in full Marty McFly pose next to a Delorian with spinners.

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southphillyman
Member since Oct 22nd 2003
90059 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 08:09 PM

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191. "maybe i'm too young but i never even heard this Duke player == Uncle Tom"
In response to Reply # 0

shit until recently
i grew up rooting for Duke
at one point i thought hurley was the best player in bball, not college bball...basketball PERIOD lol
read grant hills autobiography and did a presentation on that shit and everything
had the Duke starter jacket wit the big ass D on the back wit the devil on the chest plate
when ppl asked my bol sampson what he wanted to go to school for, his answer was duke basketball (he never made it)
growing up we had no understanding of gpa requirements and kids having records and all that bullshit
we liked winners so we rode wit duke
fuck the bullshit

imo college basketball is basically void of individual personalities
so iono how anyone could say for certain that nolan smith is an uncle tom or not
except for a few outliers like renardo sidney it's not like there are a bunch of kids out there thugging it on the court
and the duke offense might be constrained by K's system but really if the shit hits the fan a player like nolan has the green light to gun anyway so whatever on that aspect

~~~~~~

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 08:21 PM

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195. "I never thought that either, but I think in recruiting circles some"
In response to Reply # 191

may have thought that. I just thought most them niggas was corny except Johnny Dawkins.

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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southphillyman
Member since Oct 22nd 2003
90059 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 08:33 PM

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197. "yup there is a difference between being a corny nigga like boozer"
In response to Reply # 195

and being an uncle tom
i need to watch the doc tho so see where jalen was coming from
might watch it tonight

~~~~~~

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 09:24 PM

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201. "LOOK AT WHAT THE FUCK THEY SAYING STARTING AT 2:45"
In response to Reply # 0

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=6224395

JIMMY'S SHIT SPEAKS FOR ITSELF!

he said if you go there, knowing you're recruited by them because you fit duke's "system," then you ARE selling out.

RESPOND, YOU DUMB FUCKS! WE GETTIN TO THE BOTTOM OF THIS!

y'all not gon keep tryna obscure the debate by talking about that wack uncle tom said that was said within the doc...we talking about TODAY!!!

i defending them initially and now i say fuck 'em. they need to stop answering questions because they repeating the same misinformed nigga shit i been hearing since forever. i wish phil henderson and elton would come outta nowhere and steal the shit outta them niggas, so they can feel the power of a SINGLE-PARENT INNER-CITY DUKIE PUNCH!

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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avionix
Member since Sep 24th 2007
498 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:08 PM

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202. "is it possible (in your mind) that they were wrong AND GH could have"
In response to Reply # 201

opened up a more thoughtful dialogue about the comments?

is there any middle ground to your thinking or is it just

I'M RIGHT. GOOD!

I'm not defending the Fab 5 at all...but this seemed like a great chance for these men to discuss something that most (if not all) of OKS acknowledge as truth: black kids from single-parent homes carry inferiority complexes into adulthood.

You seem hellbent on someone being right or wrong. I think Jalen and them were ignorant then. And if they think the same now, they're still ignorant. And G. Hill is ignorant now of the opportunity he just squandered to have an intelligent discourse on a subject he can actually bring some thoughtful perspective on. He got defensive and lost.

And, in the tourney, Duke won.

See? Smiles and cries, Basa. Embrace the dichotomy. Your sanity will thank you.

#mistycopeland

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:17 PM

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206. "no, no, no...let's just leave it at THEY WERE/ARE WRONG!"
In response to Reply # 202

grant hill could have not responded and i'd still be fuckin pissed about their comments about duke's recruitment of "certain" blacks.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:10 PM

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203. "elton got the fuck out cuz he wasn't feeling that elitist shit"
In response to Reply # 201

jimmy ignorant for saying they sellouts, but you lying to yourself if you think K don't recruit "system" players.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:15 PM

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205. "elton got the fuck because he was going #1, you dumb fuck"
In response to Reply # 203
Wed Mar-16-11 10:32 PM by Basaglia

we not talking about the UNIVERSITY...we talking about the DUKE MEN'S BASKETBALL PROGRAM. jimmy king dumb ass could even make that distinction.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:31 PM

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210. "K been at duke for 31 years and how many inner city kids have been"
In response to Reply # 205
Wed Mar-16-11 10:31 PM by s_dot_miles

on his roster??

you love being a loud, wrong, bama. where you see me talk about the university? and lol at you for holding elton brand of all people up like he a inner city reclamation project that k took under his wing and made a man. i knew people that went to hs with him and he def wasn't on no iverson shit.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:40 PM

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213. "RE: K been at duke for 31 years and how many inner city kids have been"
In response to Reply # 210

chris carrawell
brian davis
sean dockery
phil henderson
TYLER THORNTON
elton brand
will avery
JOHNNY DAWKINS
tony moore
Ro McCloed
dahntay jones

carrawell had a rougher living situation than ALL of the fab 5. you are a dumb bitch that knows nothing of duke basketball and don't know shit about where all these recruits come from year after year.

how many inner-city players been on maryland's roster...or UNC's...or CUSE...over the same period?

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:50 PM

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217. "Roshown McCloed was a transfer dumbass"
In response to Reply # 213

and don't act like you grew up with all these kids and know their family history. the fact of the matter is k recruits more white kids each year than almost any other d1 program, and the few black kids he does go after are 95% of the time not like jalen rose or kids that grew up like him. thats the whole point.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:56 PM

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220. "so was jones, you dumb bitch...as if that changes ANYTHING"
In response to Reply # 217

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:08 PM

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225. "aka, not a typical recruit. nice try though."
In response to Reply # 220

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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Expertise
Charter member
37848 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:29 PM

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209. "you are way too mad right now."
In response to Reply # 201

Go drink some camomile tea or something. Settle your nerves.
_________________________
http://expertise.blogdrive.com
http://twitter.com/KMBReferee
http://www.formspring.me/KMBReferee

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:42 PM

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214. "that's not a response...and yes, i'm mad. because people are lying"
In response to Reply # 209

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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builtfromwax
Member since May 01st 2007
1879 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:02 PM

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224. "wrong..."
In response to Reply # 201

...Peekskill ain't no inner city. it's f*ckin' Westchester County! that's like goin' to school in...Reston. besides, Elton said he don't care about Duke: http://www.aseaofblue.com/story/2007/6/7/102426/5876

shit...Phil Henderson tried to transfer!

find better/different players to make your point. but it's hard for Duke to shake the perception that they only recruit "certain" types of players. is it factual? probably not, but the perception looms larger that what hard core facts can present.

but the facts are: Coach K graduated as an Army officer from the U.S Military Academy. u really think he gon' recruit players that give him the impression -- whether accurate or not -- that they lack discipline or require more coddling than he's willing to offer?

he just want to coach. he not runnin' a social experiment or a charity. he want kids that have skills who are prepared. which means...he ain't gettin' n*ggas from DC or PG County public schools. but he'll go to DeMatha all day. he'll peek in Fairfax County at a South Lakes or a W.T. Woodson tho'.

it's his program. he can do as he wishes. i don't believe he gives a f*ck one way or the other. but that PERCEPTION strong tho'.

"Rock music is deplorable. It is tribal. And it is from America. It follows ragtime, blues, jazz, hot cha-cha and the boogie-woogie, which surely originated in the jungle. We sometimes wonder whether this is the negro's revenge." Sept. 1956, The Daily Mai

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:15 PM

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227. "RE: wrong..."
In response to Reply # 224
Wed Mar-16-11 11:16 PM by Basaglia

>...Peekskill ain't no inner city. it's f*ckin' Westchester
>County! that's like goin' to school in...Reston.

but, he was raised a by a single mother, who worked hard as fuck. how black do you need him to be. should they have been in queens and should she have been a crackhead? it's not enough that he was friends with ron artest, but he actually need to have his life to prove he black? and peekskill is not nearly like reston.

besides,
>Elton said he don't care about Duke:
>http://www.aseaofblue.com/story/2007/6/7/102426/5876

DERAILMENT ALERT!

>shit...Phil Henderson tried to transfer!

but he didn't. you made a completely pointless comment here. he was recruited by a program that allegedy had no interest in players like him. argue the ISSUE, not your predisposition, bitch.

>find better/different players to make your point. but it's
>hard for Duke to shake the perception that they only recruit
>"certain" types of players. is it factual? probably not

probably not as in NOT.

but
>the perception looms larger that what hard core facts can
>present.

core facts seems to be what you will accept. motherfucker, you actually said henderson tried to transfer as if it meant a fuckin thing.

>but the facts are: Coach K graduated as an Army officer from
>the U.S Military Academy. u really think he gon' recruit
>players that give him the impression -- whether accurate or
>not -- that they lack discipline or require more coddling than
>he's willing to offer?

and what does that have to do with inner-city vs. not? it's about whether they are being raised right REGARDLESS! and most coaches recruit the same way.

he ain't gettin' n*ggas from DC or PG County public
>schools. but he'll go to DeMatha all day.

nigga, when's the last time a kid from DC PUBLIC SCHOOLS been good enough BASKETBALL-WISE to elicit a duke offer? niggas not even as good as dave fuckin mcclure. it's been a while since public schools been putting out top 50 talent, which is duke's target territory. MOST top 50 recruits, no matter what family status, go to good schools, public or private. you throwing out absolute bullshit, tryna jump on the grenade for those two fuckin idiots.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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builtfromwax
Member since May 01st 2007
1879 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:50 PM

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238. "you reachin'..."
In response to Reply # 227

>but, he was raised a by a single mother, who worked hard as
>fuck. how black do you need him to be. should they have been
>in queens and should she have been a crackhead? it's not
>enough that he was friends with ron artest, but he actually
>need to have his life to prove he black? and peekskill is not
>nearly like reston.

you said Brand should give a INNER CITY PUNCH...that n*gga didn't go to a f*ckin' inner city school! all that shit u sayin' don't change the fact that he went to school in...WESTCHESTER COUNTY!!! i ain't shit about the n*gga blackness. we talkin' location. get a map, read it and get a sense of direction...n*gga.

> besides,
>>Elton said he don't care about Duke:
>>http://www.aseaofblue.com/story/2007/6/7/102426/5876
>
>DERAILMENT ALERT!
>
>>shit...Phil Henderson tried to transfer!
>
>but he didn't. you made a completely pointless comment here.
>he was recruited by a program that allegedy had no interest in
>players like him. argue the ISSUE, not your predisposition,
>bitch.

you made the inference that Elton and Phil should come and rep the inner city portion of the Duke alumni brigade and punch n*ggas square in the motherf*ckin' face. fact is...they don't/didn't give a fuck about the school. so i doubt they comin' to the rescue for all that's Blue and Devilish. lol. make a better point with better players who actually gave a f*ck, BITCH!!! lol.

>>find better/different players to make your point. but it's
>>hard for Duke to shake the perception that they only recruit
>>"certain" types of players. is it factual? probably not
>
>probably not as in NOT.
>
> but
>>the perception looms larger that what hard core facts can
>>present.
>
>core facts seems to be what you will accept. motherfucker, you
>actually said henderson tried to transfer as if it meant a
>fuckin thing.

its means that he wasn't bleedin' true blue enough back then to probably wanna punch n*ggas in the face in 2011.

>>but the facts are: Coach K graduated as an Army officer from
>>the U.S Military Academy. u really think he gon' recruit
>>players that give him the impression -- whether accurate or
>>not -- that they lack discipline or require more coddling
>than
>>he's willing to offer?
>
>and what does that have to do with inner-city vs. not? it's
>about whether they are being raised right REGARDLESS! and most
>coaches recruit the same way.

dumb ass...its what the f*ck Jimmy and Jalen are talkin' about. it's what everybody keeps asking them about, "do you believe that today!" yes. they do. and as u just said, most coaches recruit that way! YOU proved their point. Duke only recruits a certain type of player. but Jimmy and Jalen take it a step further by saying, "Duke don't even look in certain areas for players..." i.e. inner-city public schools.

real quick...cuz i know u know. who's the last black player(s) from an inner-city public school went to Duke and played ball on full scholarship? i can only think of ONE. and if YOU can't think of any other ones, then that's f*ckin' proving Jalen's point. "Coach K been at Duke for 30 years, he doesn't recruit people like me..." i'm paraphrasing, but u seem to understand shit on occasion. so even if it's only 10 players out of the hundreds he's recruited, he's established a pattern of where he recruits from...and an inner-city public school ain't fertile ground for Duke basketball.

>he ain't gettin' n*ggas from DC or PG County public
>>schools. but he'll go to DeMatha all day.
>
>nigga, when's the last time a kid from DC PUBLIC SCHOOLS been
>good enough BASKETBALL-WISE to elicit a duke offer? niggas not
>even as good as dave fuckin mcclure. it's been a while since
>public schools been putting out top 50 talent, which is duke's
>target territory. MOST top 50 recruits, no matter what family
>status, go to good schools, public or private. you throwing
>out absolute bullshit, tryna jump on the grenade for those two
>fuckin idiots.

it ain't bullshit doggie, YOU stepped out their with silly ass soldiers like Elton and Phil thinkin' they repped to the fullest, but...they don't. when the point Jalen and Jimmy are making is a valid one and they haven't backed away from it. so it's on unless y'all n*ggas combing thru them old ass media guides and present factual shit, people gon' listen and BELIEVE that shit Jalen and Jimmy sayin' cuz they bein' honest about their observations.

now, i will say Jimmy wrong for sayin' u a sell out if you black and go to Duke...but all that other shit they sayin' ain't far from the mark at all.

"Rock music is deplorable. It is tribal. And it is from America. It follows ragtime, blues, jazz, hot cha-cha and the boogie-woogie, which surely originated in the jungle. We sometimes wonder whether this is the negro's revenge." Sept. 1956, The Daily Mai

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Kira
Member since Nov 14th 2004
28848 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:22 PM

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207. "Duke students were on that BS when Elton left (swipe)"
In response to Reply # 0

http://www.aseaofblue.com/story/2007/6/7/102426/5876

Oh, with all this hatred and schedenfreude for ole Florida, we almost forgot about our old pals at Duke University, where the "mystique" is thick as the cheerleader's love handles.

And before you call me classless for writing that, I call you stupid for not realizing already how small, petty and classless I am!

To keep it brief, a famous e-mail exchange from a then-departing Elton Brand to a haughty Duke student enraged at his deciding to forgoe the "Duke Experience" for the "I Can Buy Your Mom's House And Burn It Down If I Want To Experience."

According to Scoop Jackson, probably the only time I'll ever quote him, Brand has admitted to this response, which is a smart thing to do, because his Q Rating just went through the roof!

Enjoy!

From: Taylor, Jennifer
Sent: Friday, April 16, 1999 2:55 PM
To: Brand, Elton
Subject: Leaving Duke

I graduated from Duke last May and just wanted to express my disgust for your decision to leave the Duke program after only two years. As an alum, not only do I hold the school in high regard, but the basketball program as well, especially since both have deservedly garnered such a great deal of respect for their accomplishments.

As part of our basketball program, you represent Duke as a whole. We are first and foremost an academic school, you clearly did not belong at Duke in the first place if this was the extent of your commitment to Duke and a college education in general. You have not only insulted the current students who are putting in four years at a school they love, but also the thousands of alumni who have realized the value of a Duke education and what an honor and privilege it was to be there for four years.

If you do not realize the opportunity you has infront of you to play for Coach K and at the same time attain a Duke diploma, then that is certainly your loss. I just wish that you has spared us the notion that you were continuing in the tradition of being a Duke student-athlete, in emphasizing excellence in both academics and athletics. You will not be considered part of the Duke family, in my mind as well as many others. You have by no means proved yourself worthy of that title.

Sincerely,
Jennifer Taylor

From: Elton Tyron Brand
Sent: Sunday, April 25, 1999 8:05 PM
To: Taylor, Jennifer
Subject: Re: Leaving Duke

Thank you very much, for reminding me of the reason why I left Duke. People like you can not and will not ever understand my situation. I'm sure daddy worked very hard to send your rich self to college. While real people struggle. I would also like to extend an invitation for you not to waste your or my time ever agin. Never being considered a part of your posh group of yuppies really hurts me to the heart. Yeah, right. Because I don't care about you or your alumni.

Sincerely,
Elton Brand #42 NBA

No empathy for white misery (c) BDot

"root for everybody black haters say that's crazy, wow..."

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:25 PM

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208. "annnnnnnd that has nothing to do with duke's recruiting philosophy"
In response to Reply # 207

ANNNNNNNNNNNNNNND a lotta white people at g-town turn up their noses at the b-ball players because they don't job with the school's academic status.

aaaaaannnnnnd that letter is 12 years old and only intends to derail the issues here in this thread.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:36 PM

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211. "actually it shows why an 18year old jalen and so many others"
In response to Reply # 208

feel/felt the way they do about duke. most people who are actually from nc cant fucking stand duke and their basketball program because k doesnt really recruit the local kids.

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:43 PM

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215. "local kids like...john wall? rodney purvis? HE DID, YOU DUMB FUCK!"
In response to Reply # 211

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:53 PM

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218. "thanks for proving my point. where john wall go to school?"
In response to Reply # 215

where purvis going?

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:55 PM

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219. "they were recruited by duke...don't matter where they went. "
In response to Reply # 218

you are a moron

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:57 PM

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221. "hahaha so K feigning interest is what you call recruiting now?"
In response to Reply # 219

imma leave you to your madness. goodnight bamma nigga.

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:59 PM

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222. "feigning interest...you don't offer scholarships for fun, ya dumb fuck"
In response to Reply # 221

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:12 PM

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226. "^^^^^^wearing a Universal Madness sweatshirt and lanyard keychain"
In response to Reply # 222

its obvious your mad as shit and its distorting your ability to reason. take another stab at it tomorrow.

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:20 PM

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228. "i disproved every bit of bullshit y'all threw out..."
In response to Reply # 226

you can't name as many black duke players from "elite" and "well-to-do" families as i named the ones that AREN'T. that's the issue. anything outside of that issue--elton's letter, geography, etc--is fuckin bullshit

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:23 PM

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229. "NIGGA YOU NAMED DAMN NEAR EVERY BLACK PLAYER DUKE HAS"
In response to Reply # 228
Wed Mar-16-11 11:24 PM by s_dot_miles

HAD OVER THE PAST 31 YEARS!!! THATS THE FUCKING POINT. K DOESNT GET MANY BLACK PLAYERS PERIOD.

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:26 PM

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230. "actually, i didn't come close. that just crystallizes your ignorance"
In response to Reply # 229
Wed Mar-16-11 11:30 PM by Basaglia

i could name lots more...you'd just have reasons why they less than black, which is hill's entire point

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:34 PM

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233. "you prolly feel this whole issue is an indictment against your own black..."
In response to Reply # 230

being a duke fan so you feel like you have to go extra hard and be extra mad, but just remember that you're just some internet bamma. nobody gives a shit.

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:36 PM

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234. "no, no...being "cute" doesn't mean shit here. you're wrong. they wrong"
In response to Reply # 233

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Warren Coolidge
Charter member
41998 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 12:58 AM

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335. "Maybe they didn't choose Duke because they wanted to play in the NBA"
In response to Reply # 219

.

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 10:38 PM

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298. "LOUISVILLE. :)"
In response to Reply # 218

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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Expertise
Charter member
37848 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 10:40 PM

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212. "*LOL* Brand got real with her."
In response to Reply # 207

_________________________
http://expertise.blogdrive.com
http://twitter.com/KMBReferee
http://www.formspring.me/KMBReferee

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:27 PM

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231. "legit question.... has duke ever had a black starting 5?"
In response to Reply # 0

im trying to think and i'm honestly not sure. i feel like they might have in the mid 90's but i dunno.

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:31 PM

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232. "RE: legit question.... has duke ever had a black starting 5?"
In response to Reply # 231

will avery
trajan
carrawell
battier
elton

now, commence to explain how NOT BLACK they are.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:37 PM

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235. "thanks. i just knew there had to be at least 1 team out of 31 K years"
In response to Reply # 232

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:40 PM

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236. "RE: thanks. i just knew there had to be at least 1 team out of 31 K year..."
In response to Reply # 235
Wed Mar-16-11 11:41 PM by Basaglia

jwill
nate james
carrawell
boozer
battier

keep talkin though

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:48 PM

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237. "you're doing great. keep up the good work basa!"
In response to Reply # 236

battier = nat turner
trajan = dred scott
basa = sojourner truth

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-16-11 11:59 PM

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239. ""i've been proven wrong beyond repair...time to be cute!""
In response to Reply # 237

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 12:10 AM

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240. "you sure dunleavy didnt start some of those games?"
In response to Reply # 239

you're the expert though.

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SirLau
Charter member
5517 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 10:24 AM

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253. "RE: legit question.... has duke ever had a black starting 5?"
In response to Reply # 232
Thu Mar-17-11 10:25 AM by SirLau

>will avery
>trajan
>carrawell
>battier
>elton
>
>now, commence to explain how NOT BLACK they are.

You count Battier really and Trajan? I think these are excatly the types of dudes Jalen was talking about. Don't know if I would call them Uncle Toms, but they both seemed to be on that "Tiger Woods" steez.

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ChuckNeal
Member since Feb 03rd 2004
5458 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:01 AM

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257. "The fuck you mean count? They black. I dont even like Duke..."
In response to Reply # 253

But yall sayin some dumb shit. Making Bags look good is bad for business so stop it.

>>will avery
>>trajan
>>carrawell
>>battier
>>elton
>>
>>now, commence to explain how NOT BLACK they are.
>
>You count Battier really and Trajan? I think these are
>excatly the types of dudes Jalen was talking about. Don't
>know if I would call them Uncle Toms, but they both seemed to
>be on that "Tiger Woods" steez.

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:18 AM

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258. "the fact that in 2011 people of mixed race are still considered Black"
In response to Reply # 257

is beyond ridiculous to me. this has nothing to do with this post though, so carry on.

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ChuckNeal
Member since Feb 03rd 2004
5458 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 03:51 PM

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286. "The fact that we still HAVE race in 2011 should be your first concern"
In response to Reply # 258

if you really wanna talk about it.

>is beyond ridiculous to me. this has nothing to do with this
>post though, so carry on.

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Nodima
Member since Jul 30th 2008
15313 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 11:11 PM

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404. "let's get to the bottom of what it is"
In response to Reply # 286

~~~~~~~~~
I don't check my inbox.

http://rateyourmusic.com/list/Nodima/run_that_shit__nodimas_hip_hop_handbook

http://www.last.fm/user/NodimaChee

http://www.potholesinmyblog.com

http://www.popmatters.com/pm/archive/contributor/517

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40thStreetBlack
Charter member
27116 posts

Sun Mar-20-11 04:17 PM

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443. "RE: http://i367.photobucket.com/albums/oo115/Mr-Monday/umad-2.jpg"
In response to Reply # 258

>is beyond ridiculous to me. this has nothing to do with this
>post though, so carry on.

___________________

Mar-A-Lago delenda est

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Sun Mar-20-11 05:45 PM

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444. "trajan and battier are not Black. neither is Obama."
In response to Reply # 443

You mad?

its insulting to them as individuals and to their families by basically saying the race of their mother, or father whatever the case may be, doesnt exist or is somehow voided by the Blackness of their spouse. they are mixed race people, let them live w/o creating your own narrative for their lives.

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40thStreetBlack
Charter member
27116 posts

Mon Mar-21-11 12:17 PM

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446. "word? Frederick Douglass and Bob Marley too?"
In response to Reply # 444

I was really just joking around. but you seem rather mad about this though.

at any rate it's not about saying the race of the mother/father doesn't exist or whatever you're talking about. and Obama identifies as Black, so you're actually the one creating your own narrative for his life.

___________________

Mar-A-Lago delenda est

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Mon Mar-21-11 09:11 PM

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448. "what he identifies with doesnt change who he actually is"
In response to Reply # 446

>I was really just joking around. but you seem rather mad
>about this though.
>
>at any rate it's not about saying the race of the
>mother/father doesn't exist or whatever you're talking about.
>and Obama identifies as Black, so you're actually the one
>creating your own narrative for his life.
>
>
>

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Mon Mar-21-11 09:23 PM

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450. "sure it does...you mad"
In response to Reply # 448

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Mon Mar-21-11 09:27 PM

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451. "nigga your whole style on this board is played out. get a new fucking gi..."
In response to Reply # 450

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Mon Mar-21-11 11:32 PM

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453. "a new gigli? your subject line got cut, you dumb mad bitch "
In response to Reply # 451

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Tue Mar-22-11 08:09 AM

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454. "gimmick. but i couldnt give less of a fuck. you mad and terrified"
In response to Reply # 453

that this post just exposed you for how wack you really are. shit is really sad.

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40thStreetBlack
Charter member
27116 posts

Tue Mar-22-11 11:41 AM

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455. ""let them live w/o creating your own narrative for their lives.""
In response to Reply # 448

meanwhile obama lives as a black man and here you go creating your own narrative for his life.

___________________

Mar-A-Lago delenda est

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Tue Mar-22-11 08:42 PM

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457. "meanwhile in reality land, you cant pick who your parents are"
In response to Reply # 455

Obama can self identify with whatever race he chooses, but it doesnt change the fact that his mother is white.

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40thStreetBlack
Charter member
27116 posts

Wed Mar-23-11 02:10 AM

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458. "and he didn't. he chose how HE would live his own life."
In response to Reply # 457

the hypocrisy of you admonishing ppl to "let them live w/o creating your own narrative for their lives" while that is exactly what you are doing here is rather glaring.

>Obama can self identify with whatever race he chooses, but it
>doesnt change the fact that his mother is white.

meanwhile in you just mad land, nobody said it did.

___________________

Mar-A-Lago delenda est

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Wed Mar-23-11 08:03 AM

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462. "i'm talking biological facts and you talking dumb shit."
In response to Reply # 458

now who is the mad one again?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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40thStreetBlack
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Wed Mar-23-11 01:55 PM

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464. "LOL- biological fact is Black Americans have on average~30% European DNA"
In response to Reply # 462

so no you're actually not talking "biological facts", you just talking dumb shit about the oppressed white parents of mixed race ppl & being a hypocrite about creating your own narrative for their lives.

>now who is the mad one again?

http://i54.tinypic.com/28k62iw.jpg

___________________

Mar-A-Lago delenda est

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Wed Mar-23-11 03:34 PM

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467. "smart dumb people are funny. do the math on Obama and see"
In response to Reply # 464
Wed Mar-23-11 04:04 PM by s_dot_miles

what you come up with.

and please tell me what narrative i have created other than you being a dumbass and basa being a bigger dumbass? all i said was that Obama, Trajan, and Battier are all mixed race people. If they want to self identify as black men, then more power to them, but it doesnt change the fact that they are 50% white.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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40thStreetBlack
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Thu Mar-24-11 09:49 PM

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477. "just plain dumb people are funnier. and you're a riot."
In response to Reply # 467

>and please tell me what narrative i have created other than
>you being a dumbass and basa being a bigger dumbass?

you've created the narrative of being a dense fucking moron cuz I already told you that twice.

all i
>said was that Obama, Trajan, and Battier are all mixed race
>people.

no that's not all you said, you said that they're not black.

so you're a liar as well as a hypocrite.

If they want to self identify as black men, then more
>power to them, but it doesnt change the fact that they are 50%
>white.

and it doesn't change the fact that you are 100% mad.

___________________

Mar-A-Lago delenda est

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nahymsa
Charter member
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Fri Mar-18-11 02:34 PM

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379. "Oh give me a break"
In response to Reply # 232

When did anybody ever say those kids weren't black?

By definition to be an uncle tom you must be black.

its not a question of being black, its what type of black.

And that's the point.

Again, in 91 was not Duke presented as being saviors to college basketball holding it down against the unworthy low class n*gg*s that had invaded the game some kind of way and didn't deserve the attention or accolades they were getting?

Are we really going to pretend that was not the attitude and that there's a certain part of that mentality that still exists today.

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
3295 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 01:04 AM

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241. "lol damn. good for grant. basa is killing y'all btw."
In response to Reply # 0

___

low end crazy, eastside crazy, wild hunnids crazy, englewood crazy.

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SpookyElectric
Charter member
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Thu Mar-17-11 02:15 AM

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243. "And trying way too hard."
In response to Reply # 241

"Everyone knows Republicans love this country, they just hate half the people in it"!!! (c) Jon Stewart

"I will NOT be getting my anchovy on"!!! (c)Black Thought

X-Box Live: SixSeven83

PSN: SixSeven83

Twitter: http://twitter.com/Jay6Seven83

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BrooklynWHAT
Member since Jun 15th 2007
85077 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 02:37 AM

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244. "basa took the burner to some of these niggas."
In response to Reply # 241

basa came in like this
http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/6012/mytrapcard.jpg

<--- Big Baller World Order

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JungleSouljah
Member since Sep 24th 2002
14987 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 02:25 PM

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281. "That photo and caption combo is fking amazing"
In response to Reply # 244

______________________________
PSN: RuptureMD
http://hospitalstories.wordpress.com/

The 4th Annual Residency Encampment: Where do we go from here?

All you see is crime in the source code.

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 08:29 AM

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249. "being loud and wrong is not killing anything."
In response to Reply # 241

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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Bombastic
Charter member
88874 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 12:13 PM

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264. "actually, he absolutely destroyed every bad point u made specifically"
In response to Reply # 249

I almost woulda felt bad for you but at some point in the dialogue you turned into the dude who just wouldn't stay down & kept getting up to get knocked down again so my sympathy eroded.

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
132214 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:25 AM

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259. "I think he's on the precipice, fam..."
In response to Reply # 241

them dudes were NOT calling dudes who go to Duke "Uncle Toms" in 2011

Jalen's comments were more of the "I get Duke now" type.
and no where in what he said did he say it was BAD what Duke does, or that Duke is the ONLY school that does it. They have a reputation and they do their best to adhere to it, that's all.

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analog2digital
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Thu Mar-17-11 12:16 PM

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265. "He's STILL insinuating K thinks kids aren't "Good" enough to go to Duke"
In response to Reply # 259
Thu Mar-17-11 12:20 PM by analog2digital

See Jalen's "three or four over 35 years" comment.

Which is kinda slanderous.

Jalen believes that K thought he wasn't "good" enough, or of the requisite moral character to play at Duke.

He's pointed to nothing to support this other than the way he "felt" that K/Duke "felt" about people "like" him.

There's nothing else here. No smoking gun. No meat. Nothing.

K didn't sit him down and say, "Son, you're just not a good fit for the program" leaving Jalen to infer what he has.

And to my knowledge, Jalen never had major problems in high school (academically or otherwise), that could have arguably moved him off K's radar. So this is basically Jalen speculating that K didn't recruit him because he was too....poor?

Again, based on NOTHING.

If we've established that every black guy who played at Duke doesn't have freshman year Range Rover money, then what are we even talking about?

Jalen just mad.

He apparently has had a chip about not being recruited by Duke which only grew larger after Duke whooped them repeatedly.

He can't let it go. He's still using it as motivation, even though he arguably WON, looking at his NBA career versus some of the guys on those Duke teams.

Still shadowboxing at 38. It's sad, really.

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
132214 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 12:53 PM

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271. "And? He could have said the same about UNC or Wake, or OSU..."
In response to Reply # 265

...but they were talking about Duke, so he kept his comments confined to that school. Shit, he could have said the same about Michigan, but...they obviously recruited him and he accepted (so he wouldn't be saying that).

I mean, why bring other schools into it?

I think it's a whole lot about nothing. People are focusing too much on the "Uncle Tom", shit.

Still, I don't think it's a "bad" thing necessarily to not be "good enough" for a school. Why doesn't anyone take say... Harvard or Princeton to task for the same? Duke has a similar rep among college ballers (and their fans).

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analog2digital
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278. "I just don't accept that anything was "wrong" with Jalen Rose"
In response to Reply # 271
Thu Mar-17-11 02:17 PM by analog2digital

This is really about class, Doc.

Jalen being poor had nothing to do with why he wasn't recruited by Duke.

Jalen, then and now, seems like an all-around nice kid. Although he does love to hear himself talk.

So maybe K just didn't like the way he ran point?

Maybe K didn't think such a highly touted kid would take to playing behind Hurley?

There's all types of ways to measure "fit" for a program and coaches have all sorts of preferences.

But Jalen's saying that being a "fit" for Duke had nothing to do with basketball and was totally based on his race/class/love for Chuck D.

If you look at K's history, there's just nothing supporting that.

Jalen's implications about "fit" and "type" have no basis in reality at Duke.

If he has some verifiable evidence for his theories, perhaps focused on other schools, then I'd like to hear them. He's certainly better off not having gone to those schools.

And the same would be true if he could prove any of what he's saying about Duke/K.

But he can't, he's going completely off his hurt feeling about the .05% of D1 programs that didn't kiss the ring.

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
132214 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 02:31 PM

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283. "I don't think there was, either.... but "
In response to Reply # 278

I don't think Jalen still thinks that about himself/Duke. That's the problem...

>So maybe K just didn't like the way he ran point?
>
>Maybe K didn't think such a highly touted kid would take to
>playing behind Hurley?
>
>
>There's all types of ways to measure "fit" for a program and
>coaches have all sorts of preferences.
>
>But Jalen's saying that being a "fit" for Duke had nothing to
>do with basketball and was totally based on his
>race/class/love for Chuck D.
>
>If you look at K's history, there's just nothing supporting
>that.
>
>Jalen's implications about "fit" and "type" have no basis in
>reality at Duke.
>
>If he has some verifiable evidence for his theories, perhaps
>focused on other schools, then I'd like to hear them. He's
>certainly better off not having gone to those schools.
>
>And the same would be true if he could prove any of what he's
>saying about Duke/K.
>
>But he can't, he's going completely off his hurt feeling about
>the .05% of D1 programs that didn't kiss the ring.

I think that Jalen is more inclined to believe what you say up there now than he did back in '90 or so. He was being very vague about what Duke does recruit and how they recruit, so it's hard to get a precise reading of his slant/inference... but at 18, I don't think that dude thought that deeply about WHY someone recruits them.

All he knew was how the media/his boys/people in general perceived Duke, and generally, if all you know is the silly "rivalry-based" stuff, that's all you're gonna know.

After time (and reading his commentary further down in the post), I have no reason to believe he's really salty about that Duke stuff today.

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analog2digital
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285. "Fair enough...but he certainly SOUNDS Butthurt "
In response to Reply # 283
Thu Mar-17-11 03:04 PM by analog2digital

Jalen's notoriously cocky. That's what I like about him (except in this instance).

I don't think he EVER felt he wasn't "good" enough, but apparently convinced himself that K felt that way.

Which, in the end, still says more about Jalen's state of mind as a kid than K's preferences.

But the fact he still believes these things about K is just bizarre.

I mean, at this point he's probably just stirring the pot for ratings and future film production gigs. Smart.

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40thStreetBlack
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Fri Mar-18-11 01:47 PM

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364. "not jalen specifically - he said when has K recruited anyone in Detroit?"
In response to Reply # 278

jalen wasn't just talking about himself, he said he's never seen K recruit any players from Detroit city schools (which is a pretty damn good talent pool), which speaks to the overall point he was making about duke's recruiting practices. I'm not aware of any kids K's recruited there either, don't know if I'm missing any, but I imagine jalen would know more about it than I do.

so no it's not about jalen being hurt that duke didn't recruit him personally. and you can't say his point has no basis in reality at duke.

___________________

Mar-A-Lago delenda est

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nahymsa
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Fri Mar-18-11 02:19 PM

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373. "So?!?! Its true"
In response to Reply # 265

Its always been their reputation.

>Which is kinda slanderous.

not if its true.
>
>Jalen believes that K thought he wasn't "good" enough

Are we going to pretend that that was not the narrative of 91? That the Fab 5 were ghetto thugs (which actually they all weren't see Chris Webber who was lumped into that narrative too) that didn't know how to act. And that Michigan losing was a win for decency in college sports culture. Are you kidding me?

>And to my knowledge, Jalen never had major problems in high
>school (academically or otherwise), that could have arguably
>moved him off K's radar. So this is basically Jalen
>speculating that K didn't recruit him because he was
>too....poor? Again, based on NOTHING.

Says who, you? Do we need a memo to see what's obvious.
>
>Jalen just mad. Admittedly so.

>He apparently has had a chip about not being recruited by Duke
>which only grew larger after Duke whooped them repeatedly.

A person who has a chip on their shoulder doesn't say that Michigan got beat by Duke who was a better team. Please

Apparently Jalen is being criticized for saying that he thought & still thinks that Duke has a bias against players who come from poor background and aren't willing to shed that aesthetic.

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analog2digital
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415. "RE: So?!?! Its true"
In response to Reply # 373
Sat Mar-19-11 08:09 AM by analog2digital

>Its always been their reputation.
>

Doesn't make it true.

>>
>>Jalen believes that K thought he wasn't "good" enough
>
>Are we going to pretend that that was not the narrative of 91?
>That the Fab 5 were ghetto thugs (which actually they all
>weren't see Chris Webber who was lumped into that narrative
>too) that didn't know how to act. And that Michigan losing was
>a win for decency in college sports culture. Are you kidding
>me?

I like how you just shifted the argument from speculation on K's thoughts about Jalen AS A RECRUIT to the media's perception of Duke and Michigan? Y'all are disgusting.

I like Duke. Everything the media said/says about Duke players isn't true. Every player doesn't come from money. There was nothing clean cut about Laettner stomping on Timberlake's chest. Funny though.

For the record, I also liked the Fab 5. And guess what I recognize and acknowledge? THE MEDIA LIED ABOUT THEM TOO! All talented young brothers with good heads on their shoulders. I don't like that they were portrayed as evil black-socked bald blackity black demons.

But while you recognize the lie about Michigan you completely turn OFF your critical faculties when it comes to Duke, when you have been presented ALL THROUGH THIS POST, with examples that destroy the notion of any Duke "type"

And that's not because you're stupid. You're not.

But it is because you're mad.

>>And to my knowledge, Jalen never had major problems in high
>>school (academically or otherwise), that could have arguably
>>moved him off K's radar. So this is basically Jalen
>>speculating that K didn't recruit him because he was
>>too....poor? Again, based on NOTHING.
>
>Says who, you? Do we need a memo to see what's obvious.

Yes, give me a memo. Itemize for me K's alleged bias against poor/non-rich recruits. Prove to me that K doesn't recruit poor/non-rich players after BASA SHOWED YOU A LIST OF PLAYERS FROM THROUGHOUT K'S TENURE PROVING THE EXACT OPPOSITE.

>A person who has a chip on their shoulder doesn't say that
>Michigan got beat by Duke who was a better team. Please.

I'm not saying Jalen carries it around with him every day. But his notions about how K recruits players has not changed ONE IOTA since he was 17. He even said it in the video. They would recruit his son TODAY. But they would not recruit Jalen Rose TODAY.

>Apparently Jalen is being criticized for saying that he
>thought & still thinks that Duke has a bias against players
>who come from poor background and aren't willing to shed that
>aesthetic.

Just the "still thinks" part. 17 year-olds are a peculiar lot. But I have no patience for 38 year-olds who should know better.

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 08:15 AM

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417. "people who don't think critically, but speak on emotion? they're stupid"
In response to Reply # 415

fuck him. you don't have to be diplomatic with these fucking idiots. i curse these muhfuckas out because it's all they understand.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 10:22 AM

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354. "Actually he is not. lmao"
In response to Reply # 241

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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TheRealBillyOcean
Charter member
38224 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 07:20 AM

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247. "Lol....this bullshit is still going on."
In response to Reply # 0

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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Challenger
Member since Dec 21st 2004
4193 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 08:35 AM

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250. "Still going ... Basa, come out and playyyyyy. Coach K speaks (SWIPE)"
In response to Reply # 0

via 2008 interview ... recruited a certain type of player ...

Nukka, you know what the fuck Jalen's point was on this issue. Certain type of player, no visible tats, no baldies, no cornrows, no facial hair, equal focus on education as NBA, no interest in leaving school early ... <--- THAT type of player.

http://www.pantagraph.com/sports/college/article_fe6ad09d-ea5a-5832-9f01-84065f453d47.html

***"Back when USA guard Kobe Bryant was taking pop princess Brandy to the prom, the rules allowed the future Los Angeles Laker to go straight to the NBA in 1996.

Duke's recruiting philosophy - leave them alone - reflected that. Then the rules changed, forcing high schoolers to spend a year in college, and Duke's rules changed, too.

Though Krzyzewski includes former Duke stars Grant Hill and Jason Williams in the same talent category as U.S. team members Carmelo Anthony and Dwight Howard, he said there was a time Duke avoided guys with the NBA in their eyes.

"Because they didn't want to go to college," he said. "Now that pool has to be recruited. But you still have to be careful to recruit the right ones."

Bryant never visited Duke before being taken with the 13th overall pick in 1996, though he was recruited by other college coaches. USA point guard Jason Kidd had some interest in Duke but never really acted on it.

Duke never recruited LeBron James or Howard, who were chosen first in 2003 and 2004, respectively. Krzyzewski saw Howard play once and only once.

"I thought, 'That ain't happening. I better go back home and play with my grandkids because any trip back to Atlanta is going to be a waste of time,"' he said.****

Elton felt the heat, Avery felt the wrath, Maggette is still not forgiven for leaving early.

btw, the very idea of you using Pac in a Duke jersey in your avy is the exact reason it is appealing ... we both know if he had game Coach K likely wouldn't have recruited him.

Challenger-

************************************************************************************
M. Ali - the Greatest - https://youtube.com/watch?v=jkhpZoPOfZI

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 09:56 AM

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251. ""But you still have to be careful to recruit the right ones.""
In response to Reply # 250

so K knows he has to recruit 1 and done players now but only wants a certain type and will not go after the best. he is basically proving jalen's point. K is handpicking these kids based not on basketball ability but on "other" factors.

the duke apologists will spin this into "we want team players, system players"...."we want players that care about education first"..."we want overrated guys that we can humble into staying more than a year or two (nolan)" etc etc

if this wasnt such a big deal at duke basa wouldnt make a post everytime they get a black recruit. he thinks we forgot about all those posts he made about how wack duke recruiting is. about dawkins being able to get kids that wojo and collins can't, and now having nate do the job dawkins was doing. basa is a fucking hypocrite, but i'm sure he will spin all of this into some ALL CAPS BUTANE BLIMINAL FAGGOT DUMB FUCK BLAH BLAH BLAH!!!!! that will hype up his followers on here.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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TheRealBillyOcean
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Thu Mar-17-11 10:20 AM

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252. "I don't really understand the confusion."
In response to Reply # 251

Jalen felt he wasn't recruited because of factors outside of basketball. And Duke follows this practice.

And Coach K has the right to run his program and recruit whoever he wants.

Soooo... it is what it is. If Grant had a problem with Jalen's old comments. Holla at Jalen. Don't grandstand.

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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El_essence
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24899 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:39 AM

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260. "the confusion is in the "bitch" and "Uncle Tom" comments "
In response to Reply # 252

that weren't really clarified. And to be honest most folks don't have an issue with Rose as much as they do with the idea that Grant shouldn't feel some sort of way about what Rose said without a solid denouncement.

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TheRealBillyOcean
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Thu Mar-17-11 11:43 AM

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261. "Then they should get in a time machine and 19 yr old Grant Hill should.."
In response to Reply # 260

have a convo or fight with 18 yr old Jalen Rose.

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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El_essence
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24899 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 12:13 PM

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263. "or when asked directly whether he thinks Black players at Duke"
In response to Reply # 261

are Uncle Toms now. He didn't do that when he was with King and on ESPN and Skip asked him directly. I don't believe he thinks that. But he wasn't clear about it after the doc.

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Bombastic
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Thu Mar-17-11 12:17 PM

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266. "the conversaition is happening NOW, what don't y'all get about that?"
In response to Reply # 261

Jalen can say what he wants, Grant's still well within rights to a rebuttal.

Stop hiding behind this '18 year-old' bullshit.

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TheRealBillyOcean
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Thu Mar-17-11 12:36 PM

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269. "Reply #255"
In response to Reply # 266

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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Bombastic
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Thu Mar-17-11 12:54 PM

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272. "a) brought up multiple times this week, b) First & 10"
In response to Reply # 269

.

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TheRealBillyOcean
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Thu Mar-17-11 01:02 PM

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273. "It's Jalen clarifying his comments today"
In response to Reply # 272

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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Bombastic
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Thu Mar-17-11 01:07 PM

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275. "I get that, it's also after a week of this talk & Grant's letter"
In response to Reply # 273

.

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TheRealBillyOcean
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Thu Mar-17-11 01:38 PM

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277. "But to me his initial comment was already clear enough.."
In response to Reply # 275

and didn't need the clarification.

And I would think most people who have even a basic grasp of the English language would not need a clarification either.

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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Bombastic
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Thu Mar-17-11 02:26 PM

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282. "obviously it did since he couldnt clarify himself until todays backtrack"
In response to Reply # 277
Thu Mar-17-11 02:27 PM by Bombastic

>and didn't need the clarification.
>
which was only put out there after GHill fired back yesterday.

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nahymsa
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Fri Mar-18-11 02:35 PM

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380. "It was obvious what was meant...no need for clarification "
In response to Reply # 282

until Grant hill's bitch ass made it an issue.

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El_essence
Charter member
24899 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 01:04 PM

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274. "http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDlfp4ADJRE&feature=player_detailpage#t=1..."
In response to Reply # 269

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDlfp4ADJRE&feature=player_detailpage#t=124s

The point I'm making is Rose isn't being clear. And to be surprised that Grant Hill a) would even respond to the lack of clarity with his feelings and b) would not go out of his way to address the overarching issues in his response is silly.

It's actually a smack in the face to Rose and King to hold Hill to higher standards than them. Had they been clearer or shit even told Grant specifically what he felt before the shit went down, Grant probably wouldn't have responded.

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 05:40 PM

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288. "RE: "But you still have to be careful to recruit the right ones.""
In response to Reply # 251

>so K knows he has to recruit 1 and done players now but only
>wants a certain type and will not go after the best.

like john wall? greg monroe, who was supposed to be one and done and stayed 3 at G-town

he is
>basically proving jalen's point. K is handpicking these kids
>based not on basketball ability but on "other" factors.

nope.

>the duke apologists will spin this into "we want team players,
>system players"...."we want players that care about education
>first"..."we want overrated guys that we can humble into
>staying more than a year or two (nolan)" etc etc

nolan is a 6-2 natural SG that has developed PG skills after 4 years. bad example. what, you want him to be the next dexter strickland?

>if this wasnt such a big deal at duke basa wouldnt make a post
>everytime they get a black recruit.

i make fun of you bitches. that's why i make those posts. you say duke don't recruit blackies, i'm throwing it down your throat everytime and laughing at it.

he thinks we forgot about
>all those posts he made about how wack duke recruiting is.
>about dawkins being able to get kids that wojo and collins
>can't, and now having nate do the job dawkins was doing.

nate is doing the job dawk was...and excelling at it.

basa
>is a fucking hypocrite, but i'm sure he will spin all of this
>into some ALL CAPS BUTANE BLIMINAL FAGGOT DUMB FUCK BLAH BLAH
>BLAH!!!!! that will hype up his followers on here.

you mad

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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southphillyman
Member since Oct 22nd 2003
90059 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 05:55 PM

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387. "did K ever actually meet with Wall? i heard some reporter say K"
In response to Reply # 288

didn't really try to recruit wall hard enough (given the talent and his proximity to Duke)
i found this which kinda supports that
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/163590-coach-k-drawing-unwaranted-criticism

~~~~~~

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 06:20 AM

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410. "yes, he did. and he offered him a scholarship"
In response to Reply # 387

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 05:51 PM

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289. "I LOVE DISMANTLING DUKE-HATERS!!!!"
In response to Reply # 250
Thu Mar-17-11 05:52 PM by Basaglia

>Nukka, you know what the fuck Jalen's point was on this issue.
>Certain type of player, no visible tats

http://assets.nydailynews.com/img/2010/04/04/420x316-amd_nolan_smith.jpg

nolan tatted arms to chest

http://scottalleman.files.wordpress.com/2010/11/boozer-duke.jpg?w=168&h=300

booz...arms to chest

http://thegooley.com/image/thumb/250-250/1000670.jpg

dan ewing...tatted

jay-will...dockery...kyrie (arms and chest)....you just wrong...and you know what's sad? you don't care. you really think you get to just say this wrong shit because it's duke and you know ignorant niggas gonna back you off GP.

>no baldies

well, that's not true for black or white players at duke...booz, avery, batty (sadly), newton and more all rocked bald heads at some point while at duke. a bald head is not "black"

>cornrows,

GOOD...it's for fucking niggers...and roy williams, gary, self...NONE of them allow it either. so shut the fuck up.

>no facial hair

zoubeard...WRONG!

>equal focus on education as NBA, no
>interest in leaving school early ... <--- THAT type of player.

well, GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOD FORBID!!! you ignorant fuckin n-word! CHRIST!

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Challenger
Member since Dec 21st 2004
4193 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 09:24 AM

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349. "andddd, not 1of the people u named were playing in 91, 92 or"
In response to Reply # 289

prior. The relevant years that shaped Jalen's perception. In short, your examples are misplaced, not unlike Grant's response. Must be a Duke 'thing.'

Basa, sometimes it is better to admit defeat than to get stomped out. A good run is better than a bad stand. You're barely recognizable now. So caught up in deflecting the jabs, you didn't block the overhand right.

Elephant in the post, Coach K comments. You may try to divert attention from them, as you should, since it doesn't help your argument. The comments that co-sign the perception Jalen held and many shared ... still there, in print. Not going away.

Then again maybe I'd divert attention too, if my bluff were called. NOT! Pride is both a gift and a curse. Good luck working through that, Stacey.

Challenger-

************************************************************************************
M. Ali - the Greatest - https://youtube.com/watch?v=jkhpZoPOfZI

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 07:04 PM

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391. "so, johnny dawkins wasn't rocking niggerish gold ropes in durham 84?"
In response to Reply # 349

that 91/92 shit is perhaps the most meaningless shit stated so far in this thread

>Elephant in the post, Coach K comments.

"you have to recruit the right ones"? that one? what about it? the ones that will actually go to class? those? like kyrie irving? a top 3 player that will actually go to class, as opposed to josh selby, who self has fucking benched because that kid can't even pretend to give a fuck about school or the team?

your point--which depending entirely on the nefarious inference that could that could be made from a white man stating that you have to choose "the right ones" from a talent pool comprised mostly of black kids--has been easily dismantled with a case study of K's recruiting philosphy. and it wasn't easy because i'm smart; it was easy because you're a fucking moron.

now, go get smarter if you want to have a real fuckin debate.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Challenger
Member since Dec 21st 2004
4193 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 07:21 PM

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393. "Blue devil, I beseech your belligerent ass."
In response to Reply # 391

You shrink with every letter typed. Better off debating your shadow, only way you make sense. Go somewhere, I'm busy.

Fucking lilliputian.

Challenger-

************************************************************************************
M. Ali - the Greatest - https://youtube.com/watch?v=jkhpZoPOfZI

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 07:26 PM

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394. "you're unable to argue your position. live with it"
In response to Reply # 393

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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LegacyNS
Member since Jan 16th 2004
38095 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 10:24 AM

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254. "Jimmy King Responds to Hill 3-17 (podcast)"
In response to Reply # 0

Jimmy King Responds to Hill 3-17
Thu, 17 Mar 2011 09:21:37 -0400
King calls Shep to respond to Grant Hill's feelings on the Fab Five documenta

http://www.wdfn.com/cc-common/podcast/single_podcast.html?podcast=ShepAndSharp.xml
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<---- 5....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlgiritpmfo

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ZooTown74
Member since May 29th 2002
43582 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 10:34 AM

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255. "*cough*"
In response to Reply # 0

usatoday.com:

>Mar 17, 2011

Fab Five's Jalen Rose clarifies comments about Duke
10:13 AM

By Michael McCarthy, USA TODAY

ESPN's Jalen Rose says he was speaking as a high school basketball player, not a 38-year-old man, when he said Duke preferred to recruit "Uncle Tom" African-Americans.

The comments were the most recent salvo in a war of words between the Michigan Fab Five alumnus and former Duke players, including Grant Hill and Bobby Hurley, coming out of Rose's ESPN Films documentary, The Fab Five.

Rose -- an ESPN basketball analyst -- was supposed to do a phone interview from Bristol, Conn., with Game On!s Michael McCarthy Wednesday about the documentary, which became ESPN Films highest-rated ever beating all of the 30 for 30 films.

Rose, who played on with the Fab Five from 1991-1993 after growing up in Detroit, missed the interview.

But he left a long voicemail Wednesday night in which he clarified his comments from the documentary and responded to Hill's Wednesday column in the New York Times in which the Phoenix Suns star fired back at Rose and Fab Five teammate Jimmy King for calling him a "bi---."

First, says Rose, his comments about Duke preferring to recruit "Uncle Tom' African-American athletes were said from his former perspective as a high school athlete; not as a 38-year old man. He's irritated that one comment is overshadowing the rest of the documentary.

"I know a lot of people are trying to circumvent a great documentary that was two hours of quality content and paraphrase a statement that I made and look at the headline but not read the story. That's basically when I talked about my recruiting as a high school student as it related to Duke. I just want to make sure I verify how I felt about that. I was clearly talking about a framework from 1991-1993, not about 2011."

Now, as an adult, Rose says he has "great respect and appreciation for Duke, its players and all they've achieved. The comments I made during the Fab Five documentary were clearly reflecting my thoughts as a teenager. I'm proud of the documentary and its success, our accomplishments at the University of Michigan as well as the work I'm currently doing to support the city of Detroit in the community"

On Friday, Rose is scheduled to break ground on his new Jalen Rose Leadership Academy in Detroit, a college prep charter high school for grades 9-12.

Previously, Hurley, a former Duke point guard and Hill teammate told Dan Patrick that Rose would have been a benchwarmer at Duke. Both Hill and Hurley tweaked Rose by reminding him that their Blue Devils team, which won repeat titles in 1991-1992, was 3-0 against the Fab Five.

_______________________________________________________________________
The New Shit

twitter.com/LetsStay2Gether

also on Facebook

I WILL NOT LET YOU FORGET IT

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TheRealBillyOcean
Charter member
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Thu Mar-17-11 10:54 AM

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256. "Good thing he clarified which was clearly OBVIOUS"
In response to Reply # 255

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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Warren Coolidge
Charter member
41998 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 12:28 PM

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268. "lol...told y'all so..."
In response to Reply # 255
Thu Mar-17-11 12:29 PM by Warren Coolidge

Jalen really didn't need to clarify anything but I'm glad he did since there were so many people...like Grant Hill...who didn't have the sense to put what he said in it's appropriate context.

Grant should give Jalen a public apology...

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JungleSouljah
Member since Sep 24th 2002
14987 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 02:31 PM

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284. "If it was so clear why did Jalen apologize to Grant"
In response to Reply # 268

via twitter before the doc premiered?

I don't know how you do, but I don't apologize for shit in advance. That's on some: "I mean this in the best way possible, but your sister's a whore"

______________________________
PSN: RuptureMD
http://hospitalstories.wordpress.com/

The 4th Annual Residency Encampment: Where do we go from here?

All you see is crime in the source code.

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ChuckNeal
Member since Feb 03rd 2004
5458 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 03:53 PM

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287. "Maybe Grant aint know Jalen thought he was a bitch before?"
In response to Reply # 284

>via twitter before the doc premiered?
>
>I don't know how you do, but I don't apologize for shit in
>advance. That's on some: "I mean this in the best way
>possible, but your sister's a whore"

who knows son

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nahymsa
Charter member
1734 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 02:22 PM

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374. "Because Jalen has more class in his pinky than Grant does in his entire ..."
In response to Reply # 284

Besides, I heard it was viewed & being talked about before the premiere.

Notice how we've glossed over the fact that the school was getting hate mail from the alumni for having a hard working winning team.

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Melanism
Charter member
20451 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 04:45 PM

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386. "He apologized because before it even premiered people were talking"
In response to Reply # 284

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LegacyNS
Member since Jan 16th 2004
38095 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 08:12 AM

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345. "iono man Basa might have a point regarding their First Take appearance"
In response to Reply # 255

http://search.espn.go.com/s/overlay/video?searchString=first%20take&id=6219766&dims=6&start=0

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<---- 5....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlgiritpmfo

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 06:06 PM

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290. "like i said....the internal debate...grant a beast...y'all MAD!"
In response to Reply # 0

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/commentary/news/story?id=6227464

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 06:57 PM

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291. "tamia cheating...grant a cuckold. cry about it."
In response to Reply # 290

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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smooth va
Member since May 02nd 2005
6059 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 09:46 PM

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292. "Jimmy King is just being dumb now (twitter)"
In response to Reply # 0

http://twitter.com/jimmyking24/status/48084439384862720

"This is dedicated to whom it may concern."-Donny Hathaway

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 10:27 PM

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296. "I think Grant went from being a bitch to not being a bitch to being"
In response to Reply # 292

a bitch in his mind. Because this really got blown outta proportion.

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 10:41 PM

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299. "so, everytime G proves he's better than them, they think he's a bitch"
In response to Reply # 296
Thu Mar-17-11 10:42 PM by Basaglia

seems that way

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 10:48 PM

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301. "At the end of the day none of the shit is going to matter. You"
In response to Reply # 299
Thu Mar-17-11 10:52 PM by write_serengeti

getting all up in arms about some silliness. Nobody thought Grant was a horrible player...no one said they didn't respect his game. So Jimmy thinks he's bitch again...He thinks he's a bitch and believe he's a great player with a great career...now what. We talking about him being a bitch....NOT HIS GAME. NOT HIM GAME. Grant ain't gone fight the nigga, so why you in here just running us in circles?

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 10:56 PM

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304. "he can think G a bitch all he wants and K can not offer dumbasses"
In response to Reply # 301

whether it be kevin love and his overbearing father or demarcus cousins ignant ass.

but to say he don't recruit niggas that fit ALL these random criterias of "blackness" (tats, inner-city, cornrows, bad grammar, police records, etc.) is lazy and dangerous.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:05 PM

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309. "LOL@you adding some new shit to it. YOU know as well as I DO"
In response to Reply # 304

>whether it be kevin love and his overbearing father or
>demarcus cousins ignant ass.
>
>but to say he don't recruit niggas that fit ALL these random
>criterias of "blackness" (tats, inner-city, cornrows, bad
>grammar, police records, etc.) is lazy and dangerous.

what they meant and that it rings with more truth than not.

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:23 PM

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312. "can you understand that i DON'T know what they meant?"
In response to Reply # 309

obviously, i don't view duke like most black sports fans. they said something i don't agree with, because i know it's not true. and it can be disproven DOZENS of times over and not just 3 or 4 like they stated. simple as that. and duke haters are so committed to their wrong-headedness that they will imply thata nigga like elton brand was on easy street coming up.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:26 PM

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313. "Yes you did....you just want to argue....that's what YOU do."
In response to Reply # 312

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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Warren Coolidge
Charter member
41998 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 12:57 AM

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334. "so now Duke went after Taylor King and not Kevin Love "
In response to Reply # 304

because Love was a dumbass???

lolololol...

amazing...

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 06:16 AM

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339. "no because he and his father were a headache"
In response to Reply # 334

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 10:34 PM

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297. "he's acting like exactly what he is...i'll leave it at that"
In response to Reply # 292

i bought that 18 vs 38 shit at first, but it's clear now that they feel niggas that go to duke are less "black"...especially him.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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smooth va
Member since May 02nd 2005
6059 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:08 PM

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310. "I agree. the more jalen and jimmy speak, the dumber they sound"
In response to Reply # 297

"This is dedicated to whom it may concern."-Donny Hathaway

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 09:50 PM

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293. "Y'all still going? I'm all debated out so hopefully one of you will"
In response to Reply # 0

say something funny in this bitch to cheer me up. Bags done fucked around and got mad and shit.

I still feel the same way about this.
<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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smooth va
Member since May 02nd 2005
6059 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 09:55 PM

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294. "where the hell is the basketball in your avy?"
In response to Reply # 293

"This is dedicated to whom it may concern."-Donny Hathaway

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 09:57 PM

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295. "In the stands. That was a pic of Siva blocking a shot."
In response to Reply # 294

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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TheRealBillyOcean
Charter member
38224 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 10:46 PM

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300. "Say something funny?"
In response to Reply # 293

>say something funny in this bitch to cheer me up.

Karrine Steffans graduated from Morehead State

No seriously this topic is beyond repair. And the fact that it's gone on this long and been in the news this long is ridiculous.

How bad does Chuck want to go home right now. He probably gonna yell at his agent on his way back to the hotel.

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 10:49 PM

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302. "topic ain't been explored enough...they can't argue their position"
In response to Reply # 300

jimmy king said that if black players go to duke, knowing they're being recruited because they fit the duke ideal or "system" (his exact word), then, YES, they are selling out. he ain't say that shit in no doc, giving the perspective of his 18 year-old self. he was talking about right now. and he's wrong. and he's a fucked up teeth ignorant ass nigga who got checked and reminded that he's even less of a man in comparison to g. hill than he already thought he was. fuck him.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:01 PM

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306. "You're not changing anybody's mind because you are "
In response to Reply # 302

using their generalizations and loose word use against them when deep down you know a large percentage of it is TRUE.

Does elite mean every nigga that ever played at Duke came from rich families? No

Do the niggas come from stablER backgrounds yes...INCLUDING the ones they recruited who went else where. IE John Wall and Rodney Purvis. That young nigga is fabulous by the way.

So don't keep trying to lie to us...we not blind or dumb. I've watch Duke as long as you have and YOU know what's up.

You just want to argue...but you know I ain't buying that shit Bags. lol

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:16 PM

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311. " there are no DEGREES of it being TRUE. it's just NOT TRUE"
In response to Reply # 306
Thu Mar-17-11 11:17 PM by Basaglia

>using their generalizations and loose word use against them
>when deep down you know a large percentage of it is TRUE.

why wouldn't i use their loose words and generalizations against them? the fuck? you can't use be WRONG with an absolute statement and then reframe the debate to focus on the few cases where you may have a point. that would be like me saying UNC only recruits shooting guards that are fucking headcases and i keep pointing to forte and mccants and strickland.

>Does elite mean every nigga that ever played at Duke came from
>rich families? No

great, because the VAST MAJORITY didn't. and that goes for the white players, too.

>Do the niggas come from stablER backgrounds yes...INCLUDING
>the ones they recruited who went else where. IE John Wall and
>Rodney Purvis. That young nigga is fabulous by the way.

what does stabler even mean? like i already asked: how "black" does a recruit's situation have to be to disprove this bullshit? how black and poor and single-mama'd did will avery have to be? or carrawell? or j. dawkins? i don't understand shit y'all saying. i can throw out dozens of name and y'all will just go back to grant hill and battier and trajan in y'all heads...that's BLACK DUKE PLAYERS to y'all. meanwhile, rocbert brickey ain't have SHIT coming up.

>So don't keep trying to lie to us...we not blind or dumb. I've
>watch Duke as long as you have and YOU know what's up.

i don't think you do. at all.

>You just want to argue...but you know I ain't buying that
>shit Bags. lol

nah, i'm being pretty real right now. this ain't even about duke. it's about black people. it's about what jimmy king said. i still cannot believe he said it when given the chance to clarify their statements. and jalen backed that shit like an idiot.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:27 PM

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314. "And they were real high on the degrees of truthiness. HIGH."
In response to Reply # 311
Thu Mar-17-11 11:29 PM by write_serengeti

And just like I'm not going to change you mind from arguing this point(even though you know the real)you're not going to change mine.

I believe what THEY (Jalen and nem) is way TRUER than not. Damn near 100% fact.

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:37 PM

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316. "the degree to which it's true at duke is the same at most elite programs..."
In response to Reply # 314
Thu Mar-17-11 11:45 PM by Basaglia

so when kansas stops making niggas like josh selby cut their fucking hair, you can holla back at me with how bad duke is at stifling displays of "blackness"...or not even recruiting players who will display dat AUTHENTIC blackness y'all love so much.

as far as i'm concerned, LOSING and talking shit is AUTHENTIC blackness.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:47 PM

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318. "You know what they said IS the truth that's why you talking "
In response to Reply # 316

semantics up in here.

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:54 PM

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322. "again: it's true at MOST of the elite programs"
In response to Reply # 318
Thu Mar-17-11 11:54 PM by Basaglia

they singled duke out, because that is the prevailing view of duke, if only because duke's black kids are lined up next to white kids and kicking the asses of other teams full of black kids. that part of this shit i'm aware of, the idea that niggas at duke are helping the white man win. that's super-ignorant, because none of these niggas are at howard or hampton.

speaking of hampton, i hope them plumaryans dunk all over them niggas and make dudes more incensed about duke.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:59 PM

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324. "Elite in terms of academics...not sports world elite."
In response to Reply # 322
Fri Mar-18-11 12:02 AM by write_serengeti

Which points back to the fact that Coach K and Duke University do exactly what Jalen and nem said they do.

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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TheRealBillyOcean
Charter member
38224 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:03 PM

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308. "Fam.... no one is checking for Jimmy King says on tv 3 days after the do..."
In response to Reply # 302

This is the first time someone has checked for him in 15 years. That nigga is just happy to be on tv. The fact this whole controversy exists is even giving him life.

And the fact is he probably holds a lot of resentment for A LOT of shit in his life. So of course he'll keep showing his ass on tv. He might show up on Duke's campus with his own hired tv crew dressed like Carlton in whiteface on some undercover expos� shit.

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:02 PM

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307. "*throws tomatoes as you*"
In response to Reply # 300

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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cgonz00cc
Member since Aug 01st 2002
35271 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 10:50 PM

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303. "mgoblog agrees with Jimmy King (link ) / "
In response to Reply # 0

http://mgoblog.com/content/unverified-voracity-sees-grant-hill-effect

seriously, why is this such a big deal? anyone who actually was a Michigan fan in those years could have told you that Michigan's players (including subs like Michael Talley and Eric Riley) thought that Duke's players were bitches.

are people just mad that they said it on TV? because all that did was confirm that they felt a way i always knew they felt.

did everyone stop watching before they gave credit to Duke? they all admit they lost to a better team, and called them the best team they'd ever played.

also im pretty sure this answers the "U v. Fab 5" question. the whole sports world has been fixated on the fab five for a week because of a basic cable documentary

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 10:59 PM

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305. "all that hiding behind the "that how they felt at 18" shit is DONE..."
In response to Reply # 303

i defended them last week on that shit. but, they fucked up on first take when they spoke of duke's image TODAY, saying that black players that go there are selling out...i an't making shit up. i done posted the video. they said it. that's why all these duke players are pissed.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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cgonz00cc
Member since Aug 01st 2002
35271 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:36 PM

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315. "thats not true, but who cares anyway?"
In response to Reply # 305

yall won the games, be happy

seems like the Duke basketball community is mad that they arent getting enough attention

at this point im waiting for thomas hill to record a diss track and upload it to youtube

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:42 PM

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317. "except it's true. your glib aside is a classic polemical eject button"
In response to Reply # 315
Thu Mar-17-11 11:44 PM by Basaglia

i will post the video AGAIN...

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=6224395

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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cgonz00cc
Member since Aug 01st 2002
35271 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 12:13 AM

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327. "if you're referring to the 5:27 mark, let it go. seriously."
In response to Reply # 317

they were asked point blank if they thought Duke's players were doing a disservice to their race and they flat out said "No".

this is much ado about nothing, and i still think this is all about the fact that the story about the 2nd place team is more interesting, relevant, and basically cooler than the story of the first place team.

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 12:23 AM

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329. "so, i'm supposed to skip where they specifically contradicted that?"
In response to Reply # 327

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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cgonz00cc
Member since Aug 01st 2002
35271 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 12:34 AM

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331. "when jimmy king defined what he thought selling out was?"
In response to Reply # 329

because thats all he was doing. when asked if he thought today that black players at duke were doing that, he said no.

what more do you want? jalen rose even admitted that his own jealousy played a huge role in how he felt about grant hill at the time.

seriously, this is such a non-issue that its ridiculous. you're getting really emotional about the way some kids felt about duke 20 years ago

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 06:15 AM

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338. "again...i defend the 20 years ago shit...stop derailing"
In response to Reply # 331
Fri Mar-18-11 06:15 AM by Basaglia

>because thats all he was doing.

that's not all he was doing. he's speaking SPECIFICALLY ABOUT DUKE HERE:

JIMMY KING: "it's not about academics, it's about that program and the kids they go after that fit their system. THAT TO US IS SELLING OUT TO WHERE IF YOU GO THERE."

CHICK ANCHOR: "system and image, maybe?"

JIMMY: "system and image, yes. you're gonna go there as this type of player, you're gonna be viewed as that. i didn't grow up with anybody in my family, in the neighborhood that even mentioned duke, so that is my reality and how i view duke"

all that came in the last 3 minutes. they spilled their true feelings and jalen said that duke only goes after the ELITE, which is just factually incorrect.

now, you can act stupid and hide behind that "they were 18 shit" but this is a separate issue. i don't care what they said in that doc. i care what they are saying right now.

when asked if he thought
>today that black players at duke were doing that, he said no.
>
>what more do you want? jalen rose even admitted that his own
>jealousy played a huge role in how he felt about grant hill at
>the time.
>
>seriously, this is such a non-issue that its ridiculous.
>you're getting really emotional about the way some kids felt
>about duke 20 years ago

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:49 PM

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321. "He knows Jalen and nem were speaking truth. Trust me."
In response to Reply # 315

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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smooth va
Member since May 02nd 2005
6059 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:47 PM

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319. "so is anybody gonna note that Duke is an elite university?"
In response to Reply # 0
Thu Mar-17-11 11:49 PM by smooth va

and perhaps their recruiting has to do with that?

P.S. Yes, I know Michigan is also an elite, well-endowed university.

edit: elite in academics, you know as in school?

"This is dedicated to whom it may concern."-Donny Hathaway

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:57 PM

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323. "Yeah...same goes for Notre Dame, Stanford....but coaches"
In response to Reply # 319
Thu Mar-17-11 11:58 PM by write_serengeti

can choose to take a chance (some do and MOST don't) because a lot of these guys are smart and not their environment. A large % of these coaches think exactly what Paul Hornung said on the subject.

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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smooth va
Member since May 02nd 2005
6059 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 12:04 AM

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325. "exactly. Duke seems to want to top academic performers"
In response to Reply # 323

And in terms of athletes, they seem to want those who are at least academically inclined or interested.

Unfortunately, due to a variety of factors, most top academic performers don't come from "broken" families, and aren't street-wise.

At the end of the day, these are universities who have a variety of perceptions to uphold, most notably, the perception of academic excellence.

"This is dedicated to whom it may concern."-Donny Hathaway

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 12:07 AM

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326. "Which proves Jalen's point. "
In response to Reply # 325

>And in terms of athletes, they seem to want those who are at
>least academically inclined or interested.
>
>Unfortunately, due to a variety of factors, most top academic
>performers don't come from "broken" families, and aren't
>street-wise.
>
>At the end of the day, these are universities who have a
>variety of perceptions to uphold, most notably, the perception
>of academic excellence.
>

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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smooth va
Member since May 02nd 2005
6059 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 09:43 AM

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350. "No. jalen seems to think this is specific to Duke and black players"
In response to Reply # 326

All universities have standards of some sort.
Jalen TODAY overlooks that point as it relates to who
plays on a university's basketball team.

"This is dedicated to whom it may concern."-Donny Hathaway

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 10:16 AM

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352. "lol.....no you proved his point with exactly what you said."
In response to Reply # 350

>All universities have standards of some sort.
>Jalen TODAY overlooks that point as it relates to who
>plays on a university's basketball team.

And of course all schools have some sort of standard, but if you are a coach you can choose to take a chance or not. Duke 9.99 times out of 10 will NOT take that chance. WHICH like I said proves his point. And it goes for early 90s and TODAY.

Same goes for Notre Dame, but they talked about it only in terms of football, but of course it shows on their basketball team. Again Jalen was talking about Duke.

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 12:21 AM

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328. "completely separate issue...."
In response to Reply # 325

they said that players who choose duke, knowing WHY they are being pursued by duke, are sellouts.

that's why i'm pissed.

now, the TYPE of player duke recruits, which THEY SAID (outside of 3 or 4 examples) come from private schools, elite, well-to-do families, etc....that shit is another issue which they are WRONG about.

i'm less pissed about that, because that's just regular misinformed duke-hate

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52934 posts

Thu Mar-17-11 11:47 PM

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320. "Africa. NOPE! Africa."
In response to Reply # 0
Thu Mar-17-11 11:48 PM by Orbit_Established

I'll be back soon, thanks for the inboxes

And even on this here dial up compuserve speed Internet I can see Basa splashing diarrhea on niggas' spirits

----------------------------

Young Broadway Star Urgently Needs a Bone Marrow Donor. Is it you? http://MatchShannon.com/

O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"

"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "

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Bombastic
Charter member
88874 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 12:28 AM

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330. "Africa Far(c)T-Boz"
In response to Reply # 320

enjoy your trip.

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
3295 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 12:42 AM

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332. "oh, you in the motherland, my nigg?"
In response to Reply # 320

that's what's up.

bring me back a spear, yo.

___

low end crazy, eastside crazy, wild hunnids crazy, englewood crazy.

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
3295 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 12:44 AM

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333. "broussard spitting fiya:"
In response to Reply # 0

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=6227827

___

low end crazy, eastside crazy, wild hunnids crazy, englewood crazy.

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Warren Coolidge
Charter member
41998 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 01:17 AM

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336. "Instead of questioning who Duke recruits and who they don't"
In response to Reply # 0

we need to look at why the more urban inner-city school that even may be recruited by Duke...are choosing not to go to Duke...

Why???

maybe it's because those players want to be successful in the NBA .... and see that Duke seems to be more likely to produce over-rated and over-hyped Opie types....

Duke does recruit a certain type of players...they recruit more White players than most big time College b-ball programs do currently. That goes without question...

So a lot of the perception of Duke has been earned by their recruiting strategy.... Part of the so-called Duke hate is that people see how overboard the media and their fans go over these guys...it reminds me of the energy the old celtic fans and the media had during the Larry Bird era...it was like "see we can beat you with white boys"

people see that...basketball fans see that...high school players see that....and thus for the most part a Black urban inner city type of kid will probably not go there....

all this conspiracy theory bullshit is just crazy..

this debate hit a nerve because everyone see's duke's recruiting strategy and their fans are super defensive..especially the 5 Black Duke fans in America.... You see them White Boys....you seem them win some..then you see them flop in the Big Leagues or never make it....

These kids don't need Jalen Rose or anyone else to tell them what they thought of Duke 20 years ago..... They can look at Duke RIGHT TODAY and if they want a chance to make it in the NBA...they will probably go elsewhere...

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 05:43 AM

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337. "*forgoes derailment attempt*"
In response to Reply # 336

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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nahymsa
Charter member
1734 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 02:54 PM

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384. "APPLAUSE!!!"
In response to Reply # 336

>we need to look at why the more urban inner-city school that
>even may be recruited by Duke...are choosing not to go to
>Duke...
>
>Why???
>
>
>maybe it's because those players want to be successful in the
>NBA .... and see that Duke seems to be more likely to produce
>over-rated and over-hyped Opie types....
>
>
>Duke does recruit a certain type of players...they recruit
>more White players than most big time College b-ball programs
>do currently. That goes without question...
>
>So a lot of the perception of Duke has been earned by their
>recruiting strategy.... Part of the so-called Duke hate is
>that people see how overboard the media and their fans go over
>these guys...it reminds me of the energy the old celtic fans
>and the media had during the Larry Bird era...it was like "see
>we can beat you with white boys"
>
>people see that...basketball fans see that...high school
>players see that....and thus for the most part a Black urban
>inner city type of kid will probably not go there....
>
>all this conspiracy theory bullshit is just crazy..
>
>this debate hit a nerve because everyone see's duke's
>recruiting strategy and their fans are super
>defensive..especially the 5 Black Duke fans in America....
>You see them White Boys....you seem them win some..then you
>see them flop in the Big Leagues or never make it....
>
>These kids don't need Jalen Rose or anyone else to tell them
>what they thought of Duke 20 years ago..... They can look at
>Duke RIGHT TODAY and if they want a chance to make it in the
>NBA...they will probably go elsewhere...
>
>

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 06:41 AM

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340. "quinn cook, prepare to be told how not black you are, son"
In response to Reply # 0

no matter how hard you rep the DMV.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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CherNic
Member since Aug 18th 2005
37156 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 07:39 AM

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341. "I can't deal with you lmao"
In response to Reply # 340

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builtfromwax
Member since May 01st 2007
1879 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 08:19 AM

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346. "tre kelley blacker, he a Dunbar grad..."
In response to Reply # 340

...inner-city, public school, named after a black man. one of the 1st high schools for black people in america. yeah...BLACKER!

"Rock music is deplorable. It is tribal. And it is from America. It follows ragtime, blues, jazz, hot cha-cha and the boogie-woogie, which surely originated in the jungle. We sometimes wonder whether this is the negro's revenge." Sept. 1956, The Daily Mai

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
86672 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 08:05 AM

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343. "So many unsurprising things in this post."
In response to Reply # 0

1. A solid number of logical posters, which include fervent Duke haters.
2. Basa droppin' logic bombs.
3. Posters who didn't follow Jalen and Jimmy's media tour after the doc replying with zero context about how Jalen and Jimmy don't think that way anymore, when they obviously do.
4. Warren Coolidge rambling incoherently about Duke.

My movies: http://russellhainline.com
My movie reviews: https://letterboxd.com/RussellHFilm/
My beer TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@thebeertravelguide

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LegacyNS
Member since Jan 16th 2004
38095 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 08:48 AM

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347. "Just watched the First Take vid and they absolutely still feel that way"
In response to Reply # 343
Fri Mar-18-11 08:48 AM by LegacyNS

http://search.espn.go.com/s/overlay/video?searchString=first%20take&id=6219766&dims=6&start=0
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<---- 5....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlgiritpmfo

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bshelly
Charter member
71730 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 09:02 AM

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348. "ok, this is fair"
In response to Reply # 343

>3. Posters who didn't follow Jalen and Jimmy's media tour
>after the doc replying with zero context about how Jalen and
>Jimmy don't think that way anymore, when they obviously do.

i haven't followed the promo tour. i'll watch the laink Legacy posted up.

----
bshelly

"You (Fisher) could get fired, Les Snead could get fired, Kevin Demoff could get fired, but I will always be Eric Dickerson.” (c) The God

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 10:26 AM

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355. "lol"
In response to Reply # 343

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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El_essence
Charter member
24899 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 10:31 AM

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356. "I'm sayin the shit been posted multiple times"
In response to Reply # 343

>3. Posters who didn't follow Jalen and Jimmy's media tour
>after the doc replying with zero context about how Jalen and
>Jimmy don't think that way anymore, when they obviously do.

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gmltheone
Member since Jun 11th 2003
8564 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 09:50 AM

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351. "So..Michigan is now a local community college?"
In response to Reply # 0

When did it stop being an elite university academically and athletically?

From the tone of all this rhetoric one would assume the fab five went to a Div III school or a HBCU. No they went to one of the top schools in the country.

Sellouts and Uncle Toms? That shit is so tired and inflammatory. 2011 and we're still having that house slave vs field slave argument. Damn shame.

----------------------------
Same as it ever was!

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 10:20 AM

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353. "Are people even thinking? lol"
In response to Reply # 351

>When did it stop being an elite university academically and
>athletically?
>
>From the tone of all this rhetoric one would assume the fab
>five went to a Div III school or a HBCU. No they went to one
>of the top schools in the country.
>
>Sellouts and Uncle Toms? That shit is so tired and
>inflammatory. 2011 and we're still having that house slave vs
>field slave argument. Damn shame.
>
>
>----------------------------
>Same as it ever was!

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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cgonz00cc
Member since Aug 01st 2002
35271 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 11:41 AM

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358. "Michigan is a public school with a history of recruiting Detroit PSL"
In response to Reply # 351

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nahymsa
Charter member
1734 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 02:48 PM

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382. "Its not about the school, its about the attitude"
In response to Reply # 351

Its very simple in 91:

Michigan recruited 5 black freshman players - good kids, some honor studends - that were from a variety of backgrounds and did something unusal in allowing them all to not only start but giving them flexibility in terms of self expression which included a decidedly urban working class black aesthetic.

Duke proudly recruited players with the requirement that they sacrifice any semblance of self to be part of a machine that valued tradition, authority, & not rocking the boat.

The dichotomy has always been obvious.

Michigan was treated by the media and even many of their school alumni like scary thugs & criminals who didn't work hard & lucked up on wins due to natural ability.

Duke was treated like darlings & golden children who exemplified hard work & who's wins came from hard work & practice.

Michigan was treated as if they were ruining the sanctity of college basketball

Duke was treated like they were saving the dignity of college basketball.

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 10:48 AM

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357. "....oops"
In response to Reply # 0
Fri Mar-18-11 10:50 AM by write_serengeti

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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Warren Coolidge
Charter member
41998 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 12:41 PM

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359. "Jalen and Jimmy King's espn interview"
In response to Reply # 0
Fri Mar-18-11 12:45 PM by Warren Coolidge

http://search.espn.go.com/s/overlay/video?searchString=first%20take&id=6219766&dims=6&start=0

Here's what Frank Longo said:

"3. Posters who didn't follow Jalen and Jimmy's media tour after the doc replying with zero context about how Jalen and Jimmy don't think that way anymore, when they obviously do."

anyone who watches the above link can see and hear Jalen Rose constantly placing his "uncle tom" comments in the context of a 17 year old kid.

frank...basa...are simply lying here on this board and trying to mislead people into thinking that Jalen is being anything but 100% honest.

the claim that Jalen is not placing his comments in the context of his age at that time is simply not true...he did so in writing..and he did so in the interview above...

the fact of the matter is that Duke does recruit a certain type of player, and because of the internal guilt that people like basa and frank have for supporting a program that does recruit players of that certain ilk, they are now lying and making up conspiracy theories to avoid the real issue at hand..

otherwise...why it such a big deal when Duke does recruit out of that mold.... Why do we see comments on here like "Duke is recruting a long armed Black" and things of that nature...the reason is because its out of the norm.... and everyone knows it..

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
86672 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 12:55 PM

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360. "Oh look! Warren posting about Duke! What a surprise!"
In response to Reply # 359

My movies: http://russellhainline.com
My movie reviews: https://letterboxd.com/RussellHFilm/
My beer TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@thebeertravelguide

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Warren Coolidge
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Fri Mar-18-11 01:14 PM

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361. "you've been caught in an obvious lie frank..."
In response to Reply # 360

you claimed that Jalen Rose made no reference to the context of his comments being from a 17 year old kid....

"3. Posters who didn't follow Jalen and Jimmy's media tour after the doc replying with zero context about how Jalen and Jimmy don't think that way anymore, when they obviously do."

the video shows he made reference to that at least 6 different times....in fact he started and ended the interview making reference to it..

love Duke all you want...but your insecurity about that is causing you to make claims that simply lack a verifiably factual foundation..

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TheRealBillyOcean
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Fri Mar-18-11 01:54 PM

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365. "Is this true? I can't click on the link now, and haven't clicked..."
In response to Reply # 359

on any of the post document interviews on Cold Pizza, Sports Nation, First Take none of that.

But is this true?

Y'all cats been lying?

Man.

I hope it's not, cuz I take Frank and Basa at their word.

That shit ain't cool. Y'all can't be making up shit just to argue.

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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cgonz00cc
Member since Aug 01st 2002
35271 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 02:03 PM

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368. "lol @ cold pizza"
In response to Reply # 365

and yeah. they were asked point blank if black dukies were doing a disservice to their race and they said absolutely not.

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TheRealBillyOcean
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Fri Mar-18-11 02:14 PM

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372. "***frowns at the Duke contingent***"
In response to Reply # 368

I fucks with y'all. And I agree cats do hate Duke unnecessarily at times. But this ain't one of them times.

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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cgonz00cc
Member since Aug 01st 2002
35271 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 02:33 PM

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378. "yall? ive been a michigan fan since 11/18/82"
In response to Reply # 372

and i cant fucking wait for sunday

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
86672 posts

Mon Mar-21-11 09:33 PM

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452. "Warren and y'all are acting like I give a fuck about ANY of this, lol."
In response to Reply # 368

Basa's arguing in here, not me.

I didn't give a fuck about Jalen's comments. I had no problem with it.

He went on Cold Pizza with very carefully worded responses so that as he clarified that he didn't think Grant Hill was an Uncle Tom today, that the same methods of recruiting that led a 17-year-old to call them all Uncle Toms then are still happening. This ruffled my feathers, as it basically gives an excuse for 17-year-olds today to equate the two opinions, which I stated above, and I believe is what Basa is heated about.

I also didn't give a fuck about Grant's comments. I had no problem with those either.

As someone who is not black, I don't really have anything to add to this discussion, which is why I left. I can say that pigeonholing Duke's recruiting tactics seems unfair, and I can say that giving young people any reason to be ashamed to hope to go to a school like Duke is disgusting in that it encourages folks to avoid attempting to get the best education possible.

Issues of blackness or its effects on black people and their perception on the comments? Debate til your fingers bleed, cuz I'm out, lol.

I maintain that I haven't lied about what Jalen and Jimmy try to accomplish in those comments. It's classic PR stuff-- clarify that you've grown up since you made those comments, but also carefully state that there was a legit reason why those comments were made without getting as inflammatory as you did when you were 17. If you're not seeing that, you're not hearing what they want you to get out of it and I don't know what to tell you.

My movies: http://russellhainline.com
My movie reviews: https://letterboxd.com/RussellHFilm/
My beer TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@thebeertravelguide

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 02:11 PM

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371. "They stand by the fact the Duke DID and DOES recruit"
In response to Reply # 365
Fri Mar-18-11 02:17 PM by write_serengeti

a certain type of player.

Everybody KNOWS Duke DOES. If you've been watching basketball as long as I assume we all have...YOU know they do.

Do they think black Duke players are Uncle Tom's TODAY? No.

Is Grant a bitch?

He was.
Then he wasn't.
I think Jimmy is back to Grant being a bitch again.
Jalen didn't make the comment so we can not say he thinks Grant's a bitch.

In terms of the word use of Uncle Tom...I think it's kinda missplaced and the use of the word elite is LOOSE(but I understand it)....HOWEVER, the GENERAL notion behind all of what they said is TRUE.

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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TheRealBillyOcean
Charter member
38224 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 02:30 PM

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376. "RE: They stand by the fact the Duke DID and DOES recruit"
In response to Reply # 371

>a certain type of player.
>
>Everybody KNOWS Duke DOES. If you've been watching basketball
>as long as I assume we all have...they do.
>

All coaches recruit within their comfort zone of player (Bob Knight, Bob Huggins, Calipari, John Chaney). So this is common sense. Didn't Grants mom preach common sense? Coach K wouldn't go anywhere near some cats. And good for him or bad for him...who cares.

>Do they think black Duke players are Uncle Tom's TODAY? No.
>
>Is Grant a bitch?
>
>He was.
>Then he wasn't.
>I think Jimmy is back to Grant being a bitch again.
>Jalen didn't make the comment so we can not say he thinks
>Grant's a bitch.
>

He's acting kinda like a bitch now though. Like he felt that strong holla at Jalen. On Twitter, Skype, phone, pre game, post game, any of that.

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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cgonz00cc
Member since Aug 01st 2002
35271 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 02:31 PM

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377. "after that poorly written vaginal cramp of a letter"
In response to Reply # 371
Fri Mar-18-11 02:32 PM by cgonz00cc

EVERYONE thinks grant hill is a bitch now

EDIT: even christian laettner

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nahymsa
Charter member
1734 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 02:39 PM

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381. "Thank you!"
In response to Reply # 377

>EVERYONE thinks grant hill is a bitch now
>
>EDIT: even christian laettner

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jahlove7
Charter member
10743 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 10:28 PM

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399. "i don't think grant was ever a bitch"
In response to Reply # 371

he's one of the top five players duke ever had, and one of the best players in acc and college basketball history.

were there some duke players that were bitches? oh hell yeah.

but grant was not one of them while he was there.

now brian davis, he was a bitch...

inaugural member - okayplayer sports hall of fame.

what i'm digging right now:

chocolate butterfly - self-titled
laura jane - welcome to my planet boo
me & this japanese guy - waiting for the miracle
wade3 - dreams
tracey amos - who are we really?

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Warren Coolidge
Charter member
41998 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 02:50 PM

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383. "they have absolutely been lying...."
In response to Reply # 365

throughout this post...

the video speaks for itself. Frank stated that Jalen made "zero" reference to his statements being made in the context of a 17 year old kid....yet the video shows Jalen is consistenly mentioning that throughout the interview...

Notice the lack of response to Jalen's actual words in this post : http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=8&topic_id=1711366&mesg_id=1711366&page=#1712359

then watch this video... http://search.espn.go.com/s/overlay/video?searchString=first%20take&id=6219766&dims=6&start=0

read those words and watch the video..then look at all the effort that is going in to portray Jalen's words in a completely different context than they were intended..

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 06:54 PM

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390. "so, you let kani customer MERGE me and longo into one person?"
In response to Reply # 365

i have repeated over and over in this thread that i intially defended 18 year-old jalen's right to believe that black dukies were uncle toms. that's fine.

HOWEVER...

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=6224395

Standing By Comments About Duke? <----click that video

When Jimmy King SPECIFICALLY says that if you go to Duke, knowing that you are being recruited because you fit their "system" or "image", then you are selling out and you deserve to be viewed that way.

now, the fact that you let a fuckin moronic, unreasonable duke-hater derail what i have repeated over and over and over and over and over in this thread, leads me to believe that you don't give a fuck about the truth.

and the truth is...

you can have facial hair at duke, black or white, but most players choose not to rock a fucking beard.

http://thehoopbuzz.files.wordpress.com/2010/11/josh-hairston.jpg?w=357&h=480

put josh hairston in another jersey and niggas would view him as a "nigga"...but, still a "good kid", just like jalen and them were viewed by the black community.

you have rock big ass diamonds in your ear at duke and chest and arm tate, like nolan smith does, but somehow people will have you believe that since he's at duke he's some kind of exception to a rule...WHAT FUCKING RULE? that's y'all problem. you're assuming things about the "type" of player duke recruits based on your admittedly biased perceptions and then you even have the nerve to cry like idiots when whites do the reverse with schools like g-town, when i know for a fact the g-town recruited whites under big john and continue to do so under his son...there is no RULE, so i get equally pissed at whites who act like nate lubick is an exception.

you people are poor fucking thinkers. that's really all i have left to say about this.

so because K ain't been in inner-city detroit that negates the fact that he's gone into inner-city DC and chicago to pluck up recruits? you all are fucking idiots.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
132214 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 08:43 PM

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396. "I think there was a hang up over Jalen's comment"
In response to Reply # 359

about when word got out about his "Uncle Tom" comment, people blew up his Twitter with examples of I'm guessing other Dukies that THEY felt fit the role.

That really wasn't Jalen agreeing as an adult that Duke recruits "a certain" type of person/player, that was him pointing out that DUKE has a perception (from both sides of the fence) that may have little to do with reality, BUT it persists today.

When asked about whether he believes Grant Hill, Elton Brand and other blacks did a disservice to their race, he clearly said they do not. He went on to say that Duke wants the best players they can get so they don't disgrace the program. Jalen's comments were mostly in an "I understand Duke now" context. Even Jimmy King's comments starting at 5:27 were in a "kid" context -- "I didn't grow up, none of the people in my neighborhood grew up mentioning Duke". Jalen even acknowledged that Chris Webber was the ONLY one of the bunch to be pursued by Duke.

Also, this bullshit about how it was just something DUKE did is one hundred percent bullshit: Jalen SPECIFICALLY mentioned Notre Dame and Indiana as schools that were considered to be just like Duke when they were younger. He then gave examples of "The U" (football program), UNLV and Michigan as examples of schools that were not perceived like Duke was when they were younger.

Look at who's defending Duke in this thread. Outside of the Duke fans? You got Ex-Pac up there. Like me, a UNC fan, but UN-like me, someone who constantly deflects accusations of being called an "Uncle Tom" and other like terms (at least, on this site). A noted "social conservative". Someone who often trumpets his position being grounded in a certain sort of pride instilled in him through family, much like Grant Hill had said about his own family in his rebuttal to Jalen's commentary.

Now I'm not saying it's rubbish outright but I'm saying the point is being missed. It's a simple one: DUKE was hated because they are seen not to be "of the people". Duke was hated because they are seen as "America's Team", the team that does things the right way.

When I was a kid, I felt the same way about the Boston Celtics as Jalen Rose did Duke. That any Black players on that team (absent Bill Russell, probably because of having seen him outside of a basketball context on TV over the years) were "Uncle Toms". That the team represented 'CISM and were heavily favored in an increasingly "Blackening" league because they did things "the right way". Shit, I used to think that same way about the Red Sox (and in some cases, even the Yankees) ... which played a role in me rooting for the Blue Jays.

Now? I just know they were a good ass team. And Lance Parrish, Dennis Johnson and them weren't necessarily Decepticons. Bird might have been an annoying ass KF from French Lick (I've been there... I can't even imagine motherfuckers even hooping in a town like that nowadays, but times were different back then), and a Bad Dad, but that dude is one of the GOATs. And well, the Celtics of now are a FAR cry from what they used to be. Hell, they're actually ... cool, in a way. That old perception of the Celtics is gone (for a number of reasons). If you ask people why they dislike the Celtics -- younger fans? It'll probably because 1) they're a fan of the Lakers 2) they're a fan of some other team in the division 3) they just hate Boston and what it stands for (in their minds)

and #3 is the same rationale behind this Duke "hate", behind numerous peoples' Duke hate, and why Jalen and the rest of them thought that shit back in the day.

At the end of the day, we're getting fired up over the KNOWN FACT that random people see Duke (and other schools like it) as a haven for the elite, and that causes resentment within many fans of college athletics.

I'm sure that UF may one day produce a QB worth a shit. And that someone graduating from FSU may actually indeed have a GPA over 2.0. Even though perception may not be based in reality, the fact that perception exists is reality.

If I gotta hear it from asshole Cowboy fans about how my team's fans throw batteries at Santa and are gay and in the building regarding some of their players, then shit, Duke fans... y'all gotta eat this POO POO as well.

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 09:17 PM

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397. "if you need to think jimmy king was speaking in a "kid" contex..."
In response to Reply # 396
Fri Mar-18-11 09:20 PM by Basaglia

Even Jimmy King's comments starting at 5:27 were in a
>"kid" context

they were NOT, dude.

>-- "I didn't grow up, none of the people in my
>neighborhood grew up mentioning Duke".

and let me back up, before i dismantle this bullshit. jalen explicitly said "they do recruit a certain type of player"...and he assigned labels to that "TYPE" of player..."affluent" "well-to-do"...when i can run off DOZENS of players that contradict that statement, that means it's fucking wrong. there's not "three or four" to disprove his premise...there are DOZENS. he's wrong. he's wrong NOW. not at 18.

as far as what jimmy said, i cannot believe i have to repeat myself again in this thread. he was speaking about TODAY. he said if you go to duke, knowing why you're being recruited by that program ('cause you fit the "image"),then you ARE selling out. as far as what his people were saying in the hood when he was a kid, he was talking about the schools that were recruiting him...none of them even mentioned duke as an option, because he would never go there.

grant hill was absolutely correct when he said "he leaves us guessing exactly what he feels today." jalen cannot defend his opinion and continues to hide behind the assertion that he was 18 and didn't know any better. he and jimmy DIRECTLY contradict themselves on first take and think that euphemisms for "uncle tom" lessen what they're saying. if you think kids are "selling out" by going to duke, you are calling them uncle toms. there's no difference. and that's what they said. you can say they said they don't think elton and grant are uncle toms all you want, but when they directly contradict themselves within the same interview, they need to be destroyed intellectually and sadly that hasn't happened. people do not have the intellectual honesty to follow their premise (duke ONLY recruits a certain TYPE of black player) to its natural conclusion (sean dockery and trajan langdon are the same TYPE...carrawell and shane? nate and austin? even the kids they recruited (read: OFFERED SCHOLARSHIPS) and didn't go...kenny boynton the same type of black person as dave mclure? REALLY? and i can give example after example and you will ignore because you don't wanna be wrong. that's what's sickening.

>Look at who's defending Duke in this thread. Outside of the
>Duke fans?

and look who's ignoring the shit they said on first take...

You got Ex-Pac up there. Like me, a UNC fan, but
>UN-like me, someone who constantly deflects accusations of
>being called an "Uncle Tom" and other like terms (at least, on
>this site). A noted "social conservative".

this means nothing...i'm skipping it. argue the issue, not the person.

>At the end of the day, we're getting fired up over the KNOWN
>FACT that random people see Duke (and other schools like it)
>as a haven for the elite, and that causes resentment within
>many fans of college athletics.

what you did here was package duke university with duke basketball, which never happens with other schools, because if it did generations of dumb niggas wouldn't still think g-town was an HBCU.

>I'm sure that UF may one day produce a QB worth a shit. And
>that someone graduating from FSU may actually indeed have a
>GPA over 2.0. Even though perception may not be based in
>reality, the fact that perception exists is reality.

exept duke has and continues to recruit black kids in the inner-cities of america...continues to offer kids with tats and diamond studs...continue offer kids that rock full beards...continue to offer kids that might be one and done...continue to offer kids with single-moms...continue to offer kids who barely pass the fuckin ACT/SAT, but are given the opportunity to prove it in the classroom. Doc, we cool, but you're wrong. there haven't been exceptions to the perceived rule at duke. all there has been is a self-sustaining narrative constructed by duke-haters all because they beat those dumb apes in the unlv unis and those clownish monkeys in the michigan uniform.

my first organized game was at mackin HS, johnny dawkins alma mater. johnny was the man in DC when i was very young and the grown ass men in DC that hate duke NOW cheered for duke and johnny in 1986 when he was going for the title. this "perception" comes from hurt that has been built up over the years of watchin duke become a fucking machine. i have seen it from the inside. duke was not always PERCEIVED the way it is now. that is a lie. all this shit happened AFTER THE WINNING.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Warren Coolidge
Charter member
41998 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 11:55 PM

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408. "If Duke has a history of recruiting in the inner city.."
In response to Reply # 397

and they are presently recruiting the inner-city...

2 questions..

Why do you go so far out of your way to make a big deal when they either go hard after, or actually get ANY damn Black player??? If it's the norm, then why do you make it like it's such an out of the norm event???

2nd question....

If again they are all up in the urban inner city.....then why aren't those recruits choosing Duke?? Why are they going elsewhere if Duke is such a prestigious program, and such a solid school. Why are they not flocking to Duke???

2 simple questions.

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 07:02 AM

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413. "RE: If Duke has a history of recruiting in the inner city.."
In response to Reply # 408

>2 questions..
>
>Why do you go so far out of your way to make a big deal when
>they either go hard after, or actually get ANY damn Black
>player??? If it's the norm, then why do you make it like it's
>such an out of the norm event???

because i'm antagonizing duke-hater on this board. that's what the fuck i do, warren. i make people mad. are you new? *i* know duke's recruiting track record, but haters don't. haters think they can just say what the fuck they want about duke is just a bunch a white boys, like nolan's black ass ain't RIGHT THERE, like tyler thornton don't exist, like kyrie ain't black, like seth's whole black famly ain't on TV...so, yeah, i'mma point out every black recruit duke secures. you mad?

>2nd question....
>
>If again they are all up in the urban inner city.....then why
>aren't those recruits choosing Duke?? Why are they going
>elsewhere if Duke is such a prestigious program, and such a
>solid school. Why are they not flocking to Duke???

ask those kids and their parents. that has nothing to do with duke's recruting strategy. that's the kinda question someone with little interest in the truth would ask. it obscures the current issue--DOES DUKE ONLY RECRUIT A CERTAIN *TYPE* OF *BLACK* PLAYER?--and introduces a new issue--why don't certain BLACK kids accept scholarship offers from duke? do you understand? did i make it clear enough for you? can you follow, warren?

now, while i was happy to fuck up your derail attempt, i will actually offer an answer from MY PERSPECTIVE. again, speaking for me, not duke basketball. black kids that don't go to duke after being offered go for all kids of reasons: playing time. no interest going to class and they know that ain't happening at duke. and my favorit--and the one i think you wanna discuss--because they don't wanna be perceived as SELLOUTS, which is what jimmy king so graciously lobbed out there for public analysis on first take. too bad i seem to be the only one who is actually analyzing what he said. patrick patterson all but admitted that he didn't go to duke because he felt duke was corny, wack, whatever. now, he was highly pursued and OFFERED...K flew to see him AGAIN two days before he decided..kissed his ass and his fam's ass. now, why would i explore K's recruiting tactics, when it was pat patterson's reluctance to be associated with what many in the black community perceive as CORNY, SOFT and WACK? just like many black kids percive honor roll students as CORNY, SOFT and ACTING WHITE. that is the mentality that i believe a lot of recruits have regarding duke.

and i'm happy this episode has sparked that debate. it's been needed for YEARS. and in the end, it will HELP duke's recruiting efforts even MORE, as if they need it. GOOD!

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
132214 posts

Sun Mar-20-11 12:58 PM

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440. "^^^^ RUBBISH."
In response to Reply # 397

>and look who's ignoring the shit they said on first take...

Only a few ignored it, and when they did actually see it, they came to the same conclusion. Jimmy King did not articulate his point well, but his mental exclusion of Duke was something clearly he felt when he was younger, and if it persisted, it wouldn't be for similar reasons. Jalen clearly distanced himself from the negative connotations of Duke.

NOPE. That wasn't ignored, and even if it was by some, it should have been, because the initial mention of those things were 100% in the context of 10 000 years ago. Shouldn't have been an issue except from butthurt Duke fans who are afraid that their school is looked at as a Quintesson boot-licker factory, BULLSHIT.

>this means nothing...i'm skipping it. argue the issue, not the
>person.

bullshit, it doesn't. Because like Grant, like YOU -- you get hung up on what kind of "people" are being said to be recruited by Duke, a statement that was made as a kid, clearly stated as a position of jealousy and hate for what he didn't understand... and blew it up to these proportions. RUBBISH. That wasn't the initial issue, isn't an issue now, and yet, what are we arguing. Bullshit.

>what you did here was package duke university with duke
>basketball, which never happens with other schools, because if
>it did generations of dumb niggas wouldn't still think g-town
>was an HBCU.

What?!

They didn't make the distinction between Duke University and Duke Basketball, and I don't generally do that anyway. Duke U = Duke Basketball same way UNC Athletics = UNC, same way OSU Athletics (football) = OSU....

>exept duke has and continues to recruit black kids in the
>inner-cities of america...continues to offer kids with tats
>and diamond studs...continue offer kids that rock full
>beards...continue to offer kids that might be one and
>done...continue to offer kids with single-moms...continue to
>offer kids who barely pass the fuckin ACT/SAT, but are given
>the opportunity to prove it in the classroom. Doc, we cool,
>but you're wrong. there haven't been exceptions to the
>perceived rule at duke. all there has been is a
>self-sustaining narrative constructed by duke-haters all
>because they beat those dumb apes in the unlv unis and those
>clownish monkeys in the michigan uniform.

and that doesn't really have much to do with the perception. It isn't based on reality. I really think THAT, if you really want a Duke-centric take on this thing, is the lesson in all of this. This whole BS is not based on reality. I'm pretty sure Penn State actually recruits people that don't marry cousins in their family. Doesn't stop me from thinking that Happy Valley is the incest capital of the Big 10. This perception of Duke came WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY before UNLV and Michigan and it'll be there long after (you've seen it, because people needlessly went after Nolan Smith over some bullshit). It doesn't have to be REAL. Exceptions to the rule? Well, I thought it might have been Grant Hill, until this needless controversy came up. Now that it has, you might be right about "no exceptions".

>my first organized game was at mackin HS, johnny dawkins alma
>mater. johnny was the man in DC when i was very young and the
>grown ass men in DC that hate duke NOW cheered for duke and
>johnny in 1986 when he was going for the title. this
>"perception" comes from hurt that has been built up over the
>years of watchin duke become a fucking machine. i have seen it
>from the inside. duke was not always PERCEIVED the way it is
>now. that is a lie. all this shit happened AFTER THE WINNING.

Maybe elsewhere. But in North Carolina, Duke was hated for YEARS off the "image". It's like any other college rivalry in-state. The hate was mild and really confined to those who only saw them compete on a regular basis. Now I will admit, when they started winning (and the media started hanging off their nuts because of WHO they beat), it may have become widespread (for me it was when they beat Michigan, personally, as said in the documentary).

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Mon Mar-21-11 09:18 PM

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449. "if the perception has no basis in reality, why perpetuate it?"
In response to Reply # 440

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
132214 posts

Tue Mar-22-11 02:32 PM

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456. "I have no idea, really. People need a reason to justify their hate."
In response to Reply # 449

it's sports. this happens all the time.
It's not really going to change Duke from getting the people they want to play basketball for their team (it certainly hasn't over the years), or any other school really.

I really think people saw "Uncle Tom" in the comments and went wild with the sensationalism. Now we have this.

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southphillyman
Member since Oct 22nd 2003
90059 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 06:00 PM

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388. "btw Bomani Jones absolutely ethered Grant Hill (and Duke) over"
In response to Reply # 0

the last couple days
check out his podcast
that shit he spitting basically makes everything grant said irrelevant

~~~~~~

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nipsey
Charter member
9924 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 06:46 PM

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389. "^^^ Yup!"
In response to Reply # 388

Didn't listen to him today, but the first hour yesterday was him breaking down this whole Uncle Tom thing. People need to get on that and listen up.

>the last couple days
>check out his podcast
>that shit he spitting basically makes everything grant said
>irrelevant

____________________________________
A Proud Michigan Man

XBOX Live Gamertag: slballer
Twitter: nipsey

Last 3 things I watched:

The Town: B+
Legacy: C+
Damages Season 2: C+

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 07:16 PM

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392. "except that he's intellectually dishonest and a duke-hater"
In response to Reply # 388

never liked him. way before this episode. typical media-hustler bullshit type dude. if he had any intellectual integrity, he'd take this as an opportunity to speak on the internal debate among blacks and the scourge of black self-hate that makes one black man applaud another black man calling an educated black man a "bitch", which is something that chris rock has broached--also obama, cosby and now hill.

twitter has made me sad the past two days because all i see if young black men and women calling duke players uncles toms and bitches off GP because of this back and forth. that's EXACTLY why hill should have said something. this mentality has to be challenged. authentic blackness does not exist, no matter how much self-hating blacks continue building their impossible stupid paradigms of black masculinity based on the behavior of self-hating rappers and athletes and the drug dealers, pimps and general criminals that they mimic.

bomani is a fucking moron.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 08:04 PM

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395. "You so wrong and you know it. I really thought you were better "
In response to Reply # 392
Fri Mar-18-11 08:05 PM by write_serengeti

than this, but shit this is the internet. I need to take my expectation back to the real world. *twitches nose like Bewitched*

lol

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Sun Mar-20-11 08:11 AM

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439. "and I thought Bomani was better than being a Duke-hating fraud"
In response to Reply # 395
Sun Mar-20-11 08:17 AM by Basaglia

I listened to his whole show on the issue and he sounded like he's been waiting a long ass time to say something negative about Grant Hill, as were a lot of people.

He even lied and said Elliot Williams left Duke because he didn't "fit in." Elliot Williams left Duke because his Moms was extremely ill and it looked like she was going to die. That's why K had no problem with him leaving and that's why the NCAA gave him a special waiver to transfer without missing a year. Elliot was heartbroken for having to leave Duke, so for Bomani to use him an as a case study to bolster a false narrative just confirmed my suspicions: he's a fraud ass nigga who can't think straight when it comes to Duke. And if you listened to that show you know I'm not lying. I'm being real here. If I thought he had a point, I'd say so. The nigga wrong. Dudes who think like him are wrong.

Nigga even lied and said K publicly stated that he prefers recruiting kids from two-parent households. K ain't never said that shit, so why do you think it's okay for Bomani just to perpetuate fucking lies? Oh, because "We all know what Duke does" or some completely meaningless variation thereof? No, I DON'T know what Duke does. Not when I KNOW Tyler Thornton's fam and I KNOW he ain't "affluent" and I KNOW he ain't a sellout.

I hope we take this shit again so bad now. I was jive cool with getting the joint last year and chillin' for a few years. Now, I'm gonna be a complete dick and shit on everybody for real.

I ain't mad at you or whatever. I just get tired of this same ol' debate about Duke. I never impune the recruiting strategies of any other teams, so I find it distasteful when people suggest that K is basically engaging in social engineering and that all these niggas that went to Duke and that are going to Duke are aware of it and are cool with it.

It's bullshit and I expect better of a LOT of people who believe that shit...like, close friends and family even. Shit is wack and born outta anger, which I don't discount because sports makes people angry as fuck.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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southphillyman
Member since Oct 22nd 2003
90059 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 10:35 PM

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401. "jones isn't saying whether Hill is an uncle Tom or not. none of us can"
In response to Reply # 392

even speak on that, and before last week none of us cared

fact of the matter is Uncle Toms do exist
Grant Hill wasted an opportunity to drive discussion on why Duke has/had a certain perception and instead was defensive as shit
and coach K has suspect recruiting methods
that's all bomani really been speaking on
the fact he spun that shit ALL on duke is duke hate , lol. but he still made some valid points

~~~~~~

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 10:46 PM

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402. "define K's suspect recruiting methods. please...i dare you. "
In response to Reply # 401

>fact of the matter is Uncle Toms do exist

of course they do. they're drug dealers, pimps and thugs. and most rappers, as they are subservient to the white record execs who make them put out garbage to black kids.

>Grant Hill wasted an opportunity to drive discussion on why
>Duke has/had a certain perception and instead was defensive as
>shit

grant hill doesn't have to clear up a certain perception. idiots who have that perception have to FACTUALLY SUPPORT IT.

>and coach K has suspect recruiting methods

this is amorphous drivel. it means nothing. calipari has suspect "recruiting methods." he pays the shit outta players and doesn't give a fuck if they bother going to class for the one year they're in school.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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nahymsa
Charter member
1734 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 06:42 AM

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412. "OMG"
In response to Reply # 402

>
>>fact of the matter is Uncle Toms do exist
>
>of course they do. they're drug dealers, pimps and thugs. and
>most rappers, as they are subservient to the white record
>execs who make them put out garbage to black kids.

Maybe but their also the Clarence Thomas', upper middle class executives who help their white peers & business owners rape the poor, black middle management who throw away resumes of people with a "ghetto" name like Latifah, corp & middle class drug users & sellers...

We can go on & on. The ills & problems of black america and all of America don't fall on one particular socio-economic group. There are tons of problems from a social consciousness perspective with all facets of black america.
>

>grant hill doesn't have to clear up a certain perception.
>idiots who have that perception have to FACTUALLY SUPPORT IT.
>
>
Again, there was nothing to clean up. The documentary was clearing speaking in the past tense. Rose had clearly stated Duke at the end was a better team, he expanded on his hostility by honestly admitting he was jealous of Grant's involved dad. What more needed to be said?

>this is amorphous drivel. it means nothing. calipari has
>suspect "recruiting methods." he pays the shit outta players
>and doesn't give a fuck if they bother going to class for the
>one year they're in school.

They weren't talking about Calipari. They were talking about the Duke/Michigan dynamic. And why they didn't (and apparently still don't) care for Duke's style of recruiting. Nobody said it was illegal, they don't LIKE it. They are entitled not to.

Are you actually arguing that Jalen Rose should RESPECT Duke even though he feels that Duke didn't attempt to recruit him because wasn't a private school student in an elite school and wasn't tutored enough in boogie aesthetics for their taste? Are you suggesting that Jalen should be okay with that?

It seems your argument is that Jalen's perception of Michigan is wrong, that their is no argument or side to his perception, therefore he shouldn't have & still can't feel how he feels. Are you honestly saying that Duke then & now did not have the perception of recruiting a "certain type of player" which was the white american standard of a clean cut kid.

Here's a question, Chris Webber & Grant Hill had somewhat similar backgrounds. Why was Webber (in 91) labeled a thuggish, lazy, style over substance, while Hill was not? Jalen Rose was the clean cut kid of his community, what made him more scary than Hill?

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 07:33 AM

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414. "RE: OMG"
In response to Reply # 412

>Maybe but their also the Clarence Thomas'

sure...and what's all that have to do with black players at duke?

>We can go on & on. The ills & problems of black america and
>all of America don't fall on one particular socio-economic
>group. There are tons of problems from a social consciousness
>perspective with all facets of black america.

nothing to do with duke. nothing to do with what we're debating...duke's recruiting practices.

>>grant hill doesn't have to clear up a certain perception.
>>idiots who have that perception have to FACTUALLY SUPPORT
>IT.
>>
>>
>Again, there was nothing to clean up. The documentary was
>clearing speaking in the past tense.

on FIRST TAKE, they were not speaking in past tense. they were speakin on duke's recruiting practice TODAY and its track record over 30+ years under Coach K.

Rose had clearly stated
>Duke at the end was a better team, he expanded on his
>hostility by honestly admitting he was jealous of Grant's
>involved dad. What more needed to be said?

oh, i don't give a fuck. sorry. that ain't the issue i been arguing in this thread. i am only interested in why the believe duke ONLY recruits a certain TYPE of BLACK player. that's all i care about.

>Are you actually arguing that Jalen Rose should RESPECT Duke
>even though he feels that Duke didn't attempt to recruit him
>because wasn't a private school student in an elite school

maybe duke didn't recruit jalen because they'd just recruited grant hill and thomas lang at his position and bobby hurley was only a sophomore and marty clark was only a soph. kenny blakeney was a soph. duke had TWO FRESHMAN from jalen's HS class and you wana know what positions they played? CENTER, you dumb fuck! it's not like they recruited someone INSTEAD of jalen. they didn't recruit that position (G/WF) very much AT ALL that year, because that would have meant recruiting over guys. that's why chris webber was the only fab 5 guys offered by duke. he was a big man and he fit a NEED, not a PROFILE. PLEASE DO NOT IGNORE THIS FUCKING POINT, BECAUSE YOU DON'T GET TO JUST SAY STUFF AND THEN IGNORE A FUCKING FACT-BASED REBUTTAL!

and
>wasn't tutored enough in boogie aesthetics for their taste?
>Are you suggesting that Jalen should be okay with that?

all you're doing is appealing to the angry nigger in us

>It seems your argument is that Jalen's perception of Michigan
>is wrong, that their is no argument or side to his perception,
>therefore he shouldn't have & still can't feel how he feels.

no. i'm saying he can have his perception, but when PROOF to the contrary is offered, don't just play it off and lie about there only being 3 or 4 examples or said PROOF. which leads me to my other point in all this, he and jimmy seemed to imply that there is a magic number for PROOF? 3 or 4 not good enough. what about DOZENS?

>Are you honestly saying that Duke then & now did not have the
>perception of recruiting a "certain type of player" which was
>the white american standard of a clean cut kid.

no, no, no...we have been debating the BLACK american clean cut kid. i will not let you obscure this debate with bullshit variations on a specific issue.

>Here's a question, Chris Webber & Grant Hill had somewhat
>similar backgrounds. Why was Webber (in 91) labeled a
>thuggish, lazy, style over substance, while Hill was not?

what the fuck does that have to do with DUKE RECRUITING PRACTICES?!?! that is an issue of media and race, not coach K's mindset as it relates to recruiting.

>Jalen Rose was the clean cut kid of his community, what made
>him more scary than Hill?

*shrug*...i don't care

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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nahymsa
Charter member
1734 posts

Wed Mar-23-11 03:22 PM

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465. "RE: OMG"
In response to Reply # 414

>sure...and what's all that have to do with black players at
>duke?

I never said it did, I was responding to a point made about poor & working class problems as if that was part of the conversation Jalen had on the documentary - when it wasn't.
>
>nothing to do with duke. nothing to do with what we're
>debating...duke's recruiting practices.

Do not disagree...
>
>>>grant hill doesn't have to clear up a certain perception.
>>>idiots who have that perception have to FACTUALLY SUPPORT
>>IT.

>on FIRST TAKE, they were not speaking in past tense. they were
>speakin on duke's recruiting practice TODAY and its track
>record over 30+ years under Coach K.

And so what? They are entitled to their opinions & perceptions. Just because you don't see it that way doesn't mean they are wrong.

>Rose had clearly stated
>>Duke at the end was a better team, he expanded on his
>>hostility by honestly admitting he was jealous of Grant's
>>involved dad. What more needed to be said?
>
>oh, i don't give a fuck. sorry. that ain't the issue i been
>arguing in this thread. i am only interested in why the
>believe duke ONLY recruits a certain TYPE of BLACK player.
>that's all i care about.

Apparently Grant Hill did give a fuck though because his commentary was not actually suggesting that Jalen was wrong about his perceptions of Duke's recruiting practices BUT that Jalen shouldn't have called him an uncle Tom for having a mom that read Chaucer...seriously that's what he said and parents with morals. And since Jalen didn't call him an uncle tom for having parents with morals or a mom that read Chaucer, I'm still not quite sure what Grant's issue was in the first place.

>...you dumb fuck!

Fuck you too bitch..now what asshole.

>PLEASE DO NOT IGNORE THIS FUCKING POINT, BECAUSE YOU DON'T GET
>TO JUST SAY STUFF AND THEN IGNORE A FUCKING FACT-BASED
>REBUTTAL!

I'm not ignoring a thing, like I said Jalen & Jimmy can have their perceptions. The fact that there are other reasons which could provide alternatives to their perceptions doesn't exactly prove that they are wrong either.

I can't say anything about the personalities that were on Duke, regardless of their background. But I will say that Duke as an instituion and the mainstream media at that time & to this day have always promoted the perception that Duke selects certain types of players and that their success is due to them being the opposite of teams like the Fab 5 - NOT in terms of skill set - but in terms of socioeconomic aesthetics.

This is not perception, this is fact. Unless we're going to deny that the Fab 5 was contrasted as thugs in comparison to model negro Grant Hill.

>>wasn't tutored enough in bougie aesthetics for their taste?
>>Are you suggesting that Jalen should be okay with that?
>
>all you're doing is appealing to the angry nigger in us

I don't have nigger in me...

That said,
>>Are you honestly saying that Duke then & now did not have
>the
>>perception of recruiting a "certain type of player" which
>was
>>the white american standard of a clean cut kid.
>
>no, no, no...we have been debating the BLACK american clean
>cut kid. i will not let you obscure this debate with bullshit
>variations on a specific issue.

WHAT?

>
>>Here's a question, Chris Webber & Grant Hill had somewhat
>>similar backgrounds. Why was Webber (in 91) labeled a
>>thuggish, lazy, style over substance, while Hill was not?
>
>what the fuck does that have to do with DUKE RECRUITING
>PRACTICES?!?! that is an issue of media and race, not coach
>K's mindset as it relates to recruiting.

Nothing but it has everything to do with the perception that Duke recruits certain types of players and that Grant Hill was representative of something different than Chris Webber, Jalen Rose, and all the other blacks on the Fab 5 - not in skill - but in morality, decency, intelligence and class. This was before any scandal.

>>Jalen Rose was the clean cut kid of his community, what made
>>him more scary than Hill?
>
>*shrug*...i don't care

Maybe but I do. And so did a whole lot of black people.
>

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TheRealBillyOcean
Charter member
38224 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 01:29 PM

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424. "We reaching & making shit up now to deflect one's own failed argument? "
In response to Reply # 402

>calipari has suspect "recruiting methods." he pays the shit outta >players and doesn't give a fuck if they bother going to class for the
>one year they're in school.
>

This shit is going down in flames.

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 01:34 PM

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426. "whatever...you mad. don't matter what i say once i shit on UK"
In response to Reply # 424

>>calipari has suspect "recruiting methods." he pays the shit
>outta >players and doesn't give a fuck if they bother going to
>class for the
>>one year they're in school.
>>
>
>
>
>This shit is going down in flames.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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jahlove7
Charter member
10743 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 10:19 PM

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398. "i don't think grant's editorial was so much about jalen..."
In response to Reply # 0

as much as he's heard this for most of his duke career.

people like wilbon and whitlock are making revisionist history. a good number of black people felt like the dookies were a bunch of bitches, and a lot of the black players were sambos. and a few of them were. (billy king and brian davis in particular were some bojangling mofos if ever there was any)

i think grant is just tired of having to justify his duke career, and jalen's point of view (on national tv at that) was the perfect storm for his editorial.

clearly jalen was expressing how he felt when he was 18 years old. and he did reach out to grant to tell him about the documentary before it came on and apologized beforehand.

i just think grant got fed up, and he decided to speak out on it.

inaugural member - okayplayer sports hall of fame.

what i'm digging right now:

chocolate butterfly - self-titled
laura jane - welcome to my planet boo
me & this japanese guy - waiting for the miracle
wade3 - dreams
tracey amos - who are we really?

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 10:30 PM

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400. "bojangling how? did they tap dance? or just smile in duke unis?"
In response to Reply # 398

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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jahlove7
Charter member
10743 posts

Sun Mar-20-11 01:08 PM

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441. "dude, did you just start watching duke? seriously..."
In response to Reply # 400

anyone that was ever on duke's campus doing the years billy king was there, (like i was) would tell you king would go out of his way to please white folks to the point of disgracing himself. the same for brian davis. and it translated to the court.

that's kinda common knowledge...except maybe for a duke lover like yourself.

inaugural member - okayplayer sports hall of fame.

what i'm digging right now:

chocolate butterfly - self-titled
laura jane - welcome to my planet boo
me & this japanese guy - waiting for the miracle
wade3 - dreams
tracey amos - who are we really?

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-23-11 05:28 AM

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460. "hearsay don't do me any good. "
In response to Reply # 441

i'm really tired of the "c'mon...you know it's true" defense.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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jahlove7
Charter member
10743 posts

Wed Mar-23-11 10:23 PM

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472. "those cats would be on nccu's campus acting like they in the hood..."
In response to Reply # 460

like someone was gonna rob them, or some shit. cats like king and davis were shook on an hbcu campus.

you could always tell the brothas on duke's team. most dated sistas from black colleges in the area (nccu, shaw, st. aug's), because, you know, the black college sistas were usually the finest. that especially holds true when you compare the black women at duke to those at nc central.

negro players like billy king and brian davis used to act like they were in a scene from a different world or boyz in the hood at nc central.

and like i said, it translated to the court. you could easily see once you saw those guys off the court.

and that ain't hearsay, that's observation that the majority of nccu students saw.

inaugural member - okayplayer sports hall of fame.

what i'm digging right now:

chocolate butterfly - self-titled
laura jane - welcome to my planet boo
me & this japanese guy - waiting for the miracle
wade3 - dreams
tracey amos - who are we really?

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-23-11 10:37 PM

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473. "and there it is again"
In response to Reply # 472

cats like
>king and davis were shook on an hbcu campus.

right...because they grew up around very few black people

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
132214 posts

Mon Mar-21-11 12:22 PM

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447. "LMFAO @ Billy King"
In response to Reply # 398

>people like wilbon and whitlock are making revisionist
>history. a good number of black people felt like the dookies
>were a bunch of bitches, and a lot of the black players were
>sambos. and a few of them were. (billy king and brian davis
>in particular were some bojangling mofos if ever there was
>any)

I'm sorry, I didn't see Megane out there in a Duke uniform, but I'm trying to imagine this mugfucker "Bojangling" in a basketball context

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southphillyman
Member since Oct 22nd 2003
90059 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 10:47 PM

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403. "also why is everybody acting like being an uncle tom is a class thing......"
In response to Reply # 0

wasn't uncle tom .....a slave
a dude in the projects can be an uncle tom if he stepping fetching for them white folks
the main defense for duke players so far has been that they all haven't been rich
that ain't got shit to do wit being an uncle tom
not saying duke players are uncle toms
but iono how this became a class thing
they thought bron was an uncle tom in high school cause he "sold out" and he was still living in a studio apt. wit a crackhead mom

~~~~~~

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ZooTown74
Member since May 29th 2002
43582 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 11:13 PM

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405. "*cough* *cough*"
In response to Reply # 0

>Last Updated: March 18. 2011 5:37PM

Fab Five fallout

Jalen Rose aims to smooth things over with Grant Hill
Terry Foster / The Detroit News

Detroit� Jalen Rose said he wants to give Grant Hill a hug, talk things over and continue a good relationship with the former Duke star. Rose also said the media and the public sensationalized him calling Hill "an Uncle Tom" during the ESPN Fab Five documentary he produced.

"Way too much was made of that," Rose said moments before dedicating the Jalen Rose Leadership Academy on Detroit's west side.

Rose leaned forward and pointed a finger.

"Please stress I was discussing what I said or thought as a high school recruit," Rose said. "People say that I am a racist. Well the last time I checked I am black and he (Hill) was black. If anything, it was a social economic issue. I was an urban youth and I said I was jealous of that. I was motivated by that.

"Now at the point I am in life, I want that for my family. The way his family raised him is the way I am trying to raise my kids. So for people to fast forward saying that what I believed as a kid is the same I believe as an adult is ignorant."

Duke and Michigan's Fab Five enjoyed a heated two-year rivalry during which the Blue Devils won all three meetings, including the NCAA title game.

Rose said he respects Hill and does not consider him an Uncle Tom. He also said his relationship with Chris Webber, who did not participate in the documentary, remains strong.

"We still have a great relationship," Rose said. "A lot of people believe because he did not participate in the doc that we have a problem. We've been home boys since we were 12 years old. That was an adult decision. He felt for whatever reason that at this time he did not want to participate or give testimony to what happened during those years. That did not take away from the story. The story was about what happened 20 years ago, not about 2011."

From The Detroit News: http://detnews.com/article/20110318/SPORTS0201/103180424/Jalen-Rose-aims-to-smooth-things-over-with-Grant-Hill#ixzz1H16BYam8

________________________________________________________________________
The New Shit

twitter.com/LetsStay2Gether

also on Facebook

I WILL NOT LET YOU FORGET IT

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 11:18 PM

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406. "that's wonderful..."
In response to Reply # 405
Fri Mar-18-11 11:18 PM by Basaglia

but he cannot define the "type" of black player K recruits outside of ones that come from "affluent" or "elite" or "well-to-do" families, which are not the norm among black recruits at duke.

when i get someone explain to me how scoop jardine or derrick williams or whoever else are any different from andre dawkins, then i'll drop this.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Warren Coolidge
Charter member
41998 posts

Fri Mar-18-11 11:44 PM

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407. "you spend a lot of energy on this board"
In response to Reply # 406

getting excited when Duke is recruiting players that don't fit that "type" of player Duke is known to recruit...YOU talk about how Black and atheletic they are..... because you know when they are recruting outside of the mold of player that they usually recruit..

yet now when someone else pretty much just points out what YOU yourself point out...in terms that are more blunt....YOU are acting all butt hurt about it..

can't have it both ways playboy...

just becuase Tupac wore a Duke jersey don't mean that they go after tough urban inner-city kids....you sensative about that fact, and Jalen Rose pulling that card publicly got you running your usual conspiracy theories, diversions and flat out lies to cover it up..

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 06:36 AM

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411. "you are a well-known moron, so you don't warrant a response"
In response to Reply # 407

but i will anyway...

>getting excited when Duke is recruiting players that don't
>fit that "type" of player Duke is known to recruit...YOU talk
>about how Black and atheletic they are.....

what "type" of BLACK player, not white, is duke KNOWN to recruit? i'm saying there is no ONE "type" and all of you are saying there is without giving me the characteristics of that "type"

when i was pissed about duke's recruiting a few years back, it wasn't about the "type" of black player they were recruiting--which IS what we are debating here--i was pissed that they weren't recruiting enough GOOD players, black or white. i even said that they are recruiting too many WHITE players. since nate james and c-well have joined the staff, they have been able to secure more GOOD black players as well as white ones.

because you know
>when they are recruting outside of the mold of player that
>they usually recruit..

rasheed sulaimon is not outside the mold of what duke usually recruits. neither is mike gbinije. neither was tyler adams. neither was greg echenique. neither was james white. neither is shabazz muhammad. sorry. you are a moron.

>yet now when someone else pretty much just points out what YOU
>yourself point out...in terms that are more blunt....YOU are
>acting all butt hurt about it..

*i* am making fun of the perception of duke basketball that most you haters have on this board.

>just becuase Tupac wore a Duke jersey don't mean that they go
>after tough urban inner-city kids...

except when they do. when they do and an inner-city kid actually goes to duke (dawkins, carrawell, dockery, thornton, etc.) , it doesn't disprove anything, right? it actually PROVES jalen's point, right? if that ain't the most backward ass logic i've ever heard from a duke-hater, then jalen's vaneers actually look natural.

you sensative about that
>fact, and Jalen Rose pulling that card publicly got you
>running your usual conspiracy theories, diversions and flat
>out lies to cover it up..

actually, i'm glad it's been brought out publicly, because it's been insinuated far too long because no one had the balls to say it into a mic like they used to so freely when big john's hoya teams. i'd really like coach k to speak on this shit and destroy all haters. but, he prolly won't because that shit is beneath him and he know y'all just mad.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Warren Coolidge
Charter member
41998 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 01:02 PM

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422. "here's where you are full of shit..."
In response to Reply # 411

>but i will anyway...
>
>>getting excited when Duke is recruiting players that don't
>>fit that "type" of player Duke is known to recruit...YOU
>talk
>>about how Black and atheletic they are.....
>
>what "type" of BLACK player, not white, is duke KNOWN to
>recruit? i'm saying there is no ONE "type" and all of you are
>saying there is without giving me the characteristics of that
>"type"
>
>when i was pissed about duke's recruiting a few years back, it
>wasn't about the "type" of black player they were
>recruiting--which IS what we are debating here--i was pissed
>that they weren't recruiting enough GOOD players, black or
>white. i even said that they are recruiting too many WHITE
>players. since nate james and c-well have joined the staff,
>they have been able to secure more GOOD black players as well
>as white ones.

at the same time you are saying you were critical of Duke for not recruiting enough GOOD players....you are at the same time admitting to saying they were recruiting too many White players. Then now that this issue is a public debate, you're acting like putting Duke recruiting in a racial context is out of bounds....yet YOU did that your damn self...

>
> because you know
>>when they are recruting outside of the mold of player that
>>they usually recruit..
>
>rasheed sulaimon is not outside the mold of what duke usually
>recruits. neither is mike gbinije. neither was tyler adams.
>neither was greg echenique. neither was james white. neither
>is shabazz muhammad. sorry. you are a moron.

the recruiting of those small handful of players does not change the reality that there was/is a perception as to the type of player that Duke recruited....a perception again that even YOU put in a racial context. Now that it's public you back off, and act like everyone else who is pointing out something that YOU saw, and spoke on is wrong...

I will again come back to the question...I know that Duke does recruit some in the urban inner city...maybe not as much as other schools ..but I'll accept that they do recruit there...

WHY AREN'T MORE OF THOSE PLAYERS CHOOSING DUKE????

that is the question that you will still not answer....

Jalen Rose sees it....

You saw it....(even though you don't have to balls to stand by what you said when Duke was exiting the tourny in the 2nd round)

everyone else sees it....

but you refuse to admit that those recruits in the inner city, and their families see it too....and THAT is why they will likely go elsewhere....

Those urban kids have hoop dreams...they want to play in the NBA.... they don't view Duke as their best road to that goal.

add to that the "perception" about Duke's priorities (ie too many white players, and softer black ones) .....

>>yet now when someone else pretty much just points out what
>YOU
>>yourself point out...in terms that are more blunt....YOU are
>>acting all butt hurt about it..
>
>*i* am making fun of the perception of duke basketball that
>most you haters have on this board.

so when you were saying that Duke needed to recruit more Black players....you were just joking?? You were making fun of the perception?? maybe you had pre-screened this fab 5 Documentary even before it was made soyour jacking off on your computer keyboard every time it was rumored Duke might get a Black urban player...all that was just jokes???

right..lol.

>
>>just becuase Tupac wore a Duke jersey don't mean that they
>go
>>after tough urban inner-city kids...
>
>except when they do. when they do and an inner-city kid
>actually goes to duke (dawkins, carrawell, dockery, thornton,
>etc.) , it doesn't disprove anything, right? it actually
>PROVES jalen's point, right? if that ain't the most backward
>ass logic i've ever heard from a duke-hater, then jalen's
>vaneers actually look natural.

So when they do recruit urban kids.....and let's say they all up in the ghetto......Coach K is drinkin Hen with Wacka Flacka and shit..... Let's say all that...

So when those kids don't go to Duke....WHY AREN'T THEY GOING THERE????

>
>you sensative about that
>>fact, and Jalen Rose pulling that card publicly got you
>>running your usual conspiracy theories, diversions and flat
>>out lies to cover it up..
>
>actually, i'm glad it's been brought out publicly, because
>it's been insinuated far too long because no one had the balls
>to say it into a mic like they used to so freely when big
>john's hoya teams. i'd really like coach k to speak on this
>shit and destroy all haters. but, he prolly won't because that
>shit is beneath him and he know y'all just mad.

So if Coach K says "we recruit them ghetto niggas" ..... the question still remains....

Why are they not on your team?

>

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 01:40 PM

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427. "do you understand you're asking a question only recruits can answer?"
In response to Reply # 422

and that it is a COMPLETELY different issue from whether or not duke recruits those players?

i'm not going to let you CONCEDE my point regarding duke's recruiting practices and then create a NEW ISSUE, which is: why don't player's like john wall go to Duke when offered?

i honestly cannot answer that. and i don't care.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Warren Coolidge
Charter member
41998 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 03:00 PM

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432. "I'm asking for your analysis on why they don't"
In response to Reply # 427

>and that it is a COMPLETELY different issue from whether or
>not duke recruits those players?

and no it's not a separte issue. If the kids aren't coming then why should Duke recruit them to the same degree as other kids? It would be a waste of time.

>i'm not going to let you CONCEDE my point regarding duke's
>recruiting practices and then create a NEW ISSUE, which is:
>why don't player's like john wall go to Duke when offered?
>
>i honestly cannot answer that. and i don't care.

It's not a new issue. Your list ..(small list at that) of the urban inner-city who Duke has recruited actually proves nothing at all. It's completely meaningless. Because of those kids aren't coming there, what difference does it make that they were "recruited". Did they simply send him letter? How hard did they recruit them? Who knows?

but what we do know is that they do not come there much if at all.

Why??

This is completely related to this issue...in fact it's at the crux of the issue.

I have my opinions, and I've stated them on this board for years.

and let us not forget how you've insulted kids that have gone to other schools by saying they had difficult parents, or questioned their intelligence..

Do you believe those urban kids don't go to Duke because they are dumb? Or they lack intellect? Maybe those coloreds are too stupid to realize what a great opportunity Duke is for them?

Is that the type of Negro you are? You think that those Black kids who are being recruited by Duke are just to stupid??

speak on it...

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 03:09 PM

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435. "FINALLY! MY BLACKNESS IS QUESTIONED! THANK YOU, KANI!"
In response to Reply # 432

>Do you believe those urban kids don't go to Duke because they
>are dumb? Or they lack intellect? Maybe those coloreds are
>too stupid to realize what a great opportunity Duke is for
>them?

this is a pink herring...and it's pink because you're a fag, warren.

>Is that the type of Negro you are? You think that those Black
>kids who are being recruited by Duke are just to stupid??
>
>speak on it...

no...i don't know the reasons behind the decision made by each individual kid who's offered by duke but ultimately decides not to go. i can't answer. to try would be intellectually irresponsible.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Warren Coolidge
Charter member
41998 posts

Thu Mar-24-11 10:04 AM

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474. "you question your own blackness by rooting for Duke"
In response to Reply # 435

Barry Manilow ain't Public Enemy son...

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cgonz00cc
Member since Aug 01st 2002
35271 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 09:55 AM

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420. "let it go man, emotions are running too high for truthiness"
In response to Reply # 405

if they want to be mad, let em

i bet you $20 that Darius, Disco Stu, and the boys are watching that shit again tonight

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 12:30 PM

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421. "and if you wanna be mad that duke wins a lot, i'mma let you be mad"
In response to Reply # 420

but i'm not gonna let you suggest duke recruits a one "type" of black player without checking the fuck outta you.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Warren Coolidge
Charter member
41998 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 01:04 PM

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423. "and when you and the 4 other Black Duke fans in America"
In response to Reply # 421

where watching early round tournment exits...and no Dukies drafted in the NBA..

you were yelling "Go get us some Niggas"

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 01:32 PM

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425. "and that has nothing to do with the issue..."
In response to Reply # 423

the ISSUE is the false assertion that duke recruits a TYPE of black player--affluent, two-parent, elite--not whether duke was recruiting too many damn white boys under wojo and collins, which they WERE. and that has been remedied and you are and every other duke hater is mad about it and tryna create a new narrative that will scare off future recruits and their parents. it has been tried before. and it failed.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Challenger
Member since Dec 21st 2004
4193 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 01:52 PM

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428. "Nukka you sound punch drunk ..."
In response to Reply # 425

Continue to try and change the focus of this thread all you want but the debate is over. You were knocked out, it happens. Logic left you long ago. Maybe a new topic or new thread will allow you to redeem yourself. Til then, get some rest ...

http://splicd.com/_GF6pcGymow/25/45

"Dont ever play with matches"

Challenger-

************************************************************************************
M. Ali - the Greatest - https://youtube.com/watch?v=jkhpZoPOfZI

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 01:59 PM

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429. "i already stripped your intellect nekkid. lemme deal with kani customer"
In response to Reply # 428

>Continue to try and change the focus of this thread all you
>want but the debate is over. You were knocked out, it happens.
>Logic left you long ago. Maybe a new topic or new thread will
>allow you to redeem yourself. Til then, get some rest ...
>
>http://splicd.com/_GF6pcGymow/25/45
>
>"Dont ever play with matches"
>
>Challenger-

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Warren Coolidge
Charter member
41998 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 02:43 PM

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430. "You spent too much time on this boards "Beggin for Brothers" "
In response to Reply # 429
Sat Mar-19-11 02:46 PM by Warren Coolidge

to go to Duke over the years..

YOUR credibility on this issue is shot. YOU were saying what Jalen Rose said..just from the perspective of a Duke fan...Now you trying to act all brand new about it..

your card been pulled.

and let me add this.... Coach K is a great coach...I've never doubted that at all. But when Duke was coming up short....a lot of the blame was HIS because of the type of player he was recruiting....He was applying an old formula to a new day and it won't work. Looks like he's figured that out recently, but still..there was a time when he was not recruiting well at all, and the lack of players being drafted or being successful in the NBA is a sign of that.

But if Coach K can't take these urban ghetto kids into his program and turn them INTO a Grant Hill from a character standpoint, that's on HIM....Seems to me that their program takes that easier safer route by not trying to "save" those kids, because they have an culturated belief that it's not a winning propostion.....

The coach that can take those ghetto kids and win and make them upstanding citizens is a more relevent coach today than one who doesn't have or take the opportunity to do that.

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 02:59 PM

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431. "i sure did...i was beggin for certain TYPES of brothas, was i?"
In response to Reply # 430

>to go to Duke over the years..
>
>
>
>YOUR credibility on this issue is shot. YOU were saying what
>Jalen Rose said

jimmy said that players who go to duke are sellouts and jalen nodded in agreement. i do not agree with them. jalen said duke recruits black kids only from a particular socio-econoic background...not true.

how do i agree with jalen? how were we saying the same thing. you think jalen wanted duke to recruit to black kids when we were losing like fuck without 'em? what duke hater wanted us to land nolan and watch him completely change the direction of this program with his big nigga nose and DC URREA swag? not jalen, NIGGA! you mad as fuck, doggie.

>and let me add this.... Coach K is a great coach...I've never
>doubted that at all. But when Duke was coming up short....a
>lot of the blame was HIS because of the type of player he was
>recruiting...

yeah, shitty athletes. black and white SHITTY athletes. and the ones that weren't shitty athletes had wack b-ball IQs (DEMARCUS NELSON).

>But if Coach K can't take these urban ghetto kids into his
>program and turn them INTO a Grant Hill from a character
>standpoint, that's on HIM...

no, it's not. not if they decide to not come to duke. if he offers and they don't come, that's on them.

Seems to me that their program
>takes that easier safer route by not trying to "save" those
>kids,

which coaches try to SAVE "those kids" in SIGNIFICANT numbers, kani customer? it's not enough to "save" johnny dawkins, carrawell, dockery? i'm uncomfortable with the idea that he's SAVING kids in the ghetto. they're good kids with talent. no one needs to "save" them.

<because they have an culturated belief that it's not a
>winning propostion.....
>
>The coach that can take those ghetto kids and win and make
>them upstanding citizens is a more relevent coach today than
>one who doesn't have or take the opportunity to do that.

yeah, man, i admire john thompson more than all these muhfuckas. too bad he's not coaching today, when most of the elite coaches are not taking chances on ghetto ass kids.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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analog2digital
Charter member
3597 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 03:00 PM

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433. "how does more athletic = more urban/poor/whatever metric y'all usin?"
In response to Reply # 430
Sat Mar-19-11 03:03 PM by analog2digital

I don't ever remember anybody wishing on a star that K would grab some more thuggish/urban/morally compromised players.

I specifically remember getting hyped about getting more PHYSICAL and ATHLETIC players, black or white.

I remember wishing for Greg Monroe. Not a thug.

I remember getting crushed by John Wall. Also not a thug or from a broken home.

I remember Harrison tripping on us at the end. NOBODY'S definition of thug. Might even out Grant Hill Grant Hill on the character scale.

I remember being happy as HAIL when Kyrie signed. Super solid family and character.

We had some NEAR misses, but it was only for BETTER players. Not this nonsense about "type" y'all are babbling about.

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 03:02 PM

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434. "know why you can make the distinction? because you like seeing duke win"
In response to Reply # 433
Sat Mar-19-11 03:03 PM by Basaglia

when you hate seeing duke win...young, your mind straight up stops working.

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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nipsey
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Sat Mar-19-11 09:45 PM

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436. "Even Duke's Nolan Smith recognizes those *WERE* Jalen's feelings 20 yrs ..."
In response to Reply # 0

So Y are Duke fans still arguing the point that Jalen didn't do enough to prove that's not how he feels now.

http://www.detnews.com/article/20110319/OPINION03/103190403/Michigan-gets-chance-to-rekindle-Duke-rivalry

"I don't even know what an Uncle Tom is, somebody give me the definition," Duke guard Nolan Smith said. "I don't pay attention to that. I watched the documentary and I enjoyed it. But that's definitely separate, and it's how (Rose) felt about Duke then. He didn't mention my name or Kyrie's name. This is gonna be a tough game. When Duke and Michigan go head to head, it's a battle."

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write_serengeti
Member since Aug 22nd 2002
17244 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 10:05 PM

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437. "From the mouth of Louisville babes. :)"
In response to Reply # 436

<-- UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP!

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Sat Mar-19-11 10:07 PM

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438. "great, because that stopped mattering after the First Take appearence"
In response to Reply # 436

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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Guinness
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Wed Mar-23-11 02:38 AM

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459. "dave zirin on point as usual, ethers hill and whitlock."
In response to Reply # 0

http://www.thenation.com/blog/159391/skipping-class-blind-side-duke-michigan-uncle-tom-debate

Skipping Class: The Blind Side of the Duke-Michigan 'Uncle Tom' Debate

Dave Zirin | March 22, 2011
As college basketball�s March Madness overwhelms the sports landscape, a war of words has escalated between the early 1990s alums of Michigan and Duke. In an ESPN documentary about the Fabulous Five Michigan freshmen who led the Wolverines to two title games, their point guard Jalen Rose invoked the phrase �Uncle Toms� to describe the Blue Devil�s African-American players of that era. One of those players, Duke All-American and current Phoenix Sun Grant Hill, went public with a stiletto-sharp response in the New York Times. Hill called upon his own family�s history, weaving black pride and Duke pride together calling Rose �pathetic� and writing, �My teammates at Duke�all of them, black and white�were a band of brothers who came together to play at the highest level for the best coach in basketball. I know most of the black players who preceded and followed me at Duke. They all contribute to our tradition of excellence.�

In the subsequent uproar, Rose has tried to explain that his statements reflect how he felt twenty years ago. He said it was born out of the envy he felt for the familial and financial security held by many of the Duke players and his resentment that Duke didn�t recruit him because he came from an impoverished single-parent home. That hasn�t been nearly enough to chill the rage of many commentators.

That rage and Hill�s scathing response miss the primary tension between the Fab Five and their Duke counterparts. It�s not race, it�s class. When Rose said that �schools like Duke didn�t recruit players like me,� he was talking about African-American kids who were also poor. This is partially, as Rose asserts, about the recruitment strategy of Head Coach Mike Kryzyewski. It�s also very much about the culture of Duke�a walled university of wealth, privilege and arrogance ensconced in North Carolina�s poorest city, Durham. The University of Michigan is hardly a trade school, but Duke�in pedigree and in attitude�is really in a �class� all its own.

When Duke star Elton Brand became the first Blue Devil player to leave school early for the NBA draft, he received a note from a Duke alum that read, �I graduated from Duke last May and just wanted to express my disgust for your decision to leave the Duke program after only two years.� We are first and foremost an academic school, and you clearly did not belong at Duke in the first place if this was the extent of your commitment to Duke and a college education in general.�

Brand�s response focused on this question of class writing, �Thank you for reminding me of the reason why I left Duke.� I�m sure daddy worked very hard to send your rich self to college. While real people struggle. I would also like to extend an invitation for you not to waste your or my time ever again. Never being considered a part of your posh group of yuppies really hurts me to the heart. Yeah, right�. I don�t care about you or your alumni.�

This was a much-reported exchange, but Hill doesn�t address it. He does, however, use his piece to make a staunch defense of the family values that he believes Rose is trying to disparage, saying, �I am beyond fortunate to have two parents who are still working well into their 60s. They received great educations and use them every day. My parents taught me a personal ethic I try to live by and pass on to my children.� With that line, Hill was sending the equivalent of the bat signal up in the air to the self-appointed guardian of African-American family values, sportswriter and Fox Sports scold, Jason Whitlock.

Anytime someone takes a shot at single mothers or unruly, young black men, Jason Whitlock leaps into the fray. In a series of pieces devoted to crushing Michigan�s Fab Five, Whitlock describes Rose as someone consumed by �bitterness, envy and hatred� because he never knew his father.

But that�s just the preamble for a broader critique of black America. He writes, �Bitterness inspired by fatherlessness is one of the primary reasons there are more young black men incarcerated than in college.�

Wow. A slam of single mothers and a lecture on family values by someone who calls himself �big sexy� and is prone to regaling audiences with his adventures in strip clubs. Aside from the hypocrisy, his argument also represents the worst kind of scapegoating. Whitlock is certainly on the mark about prison rates. In Washington, DC, where I live, over the last thirty years we�ve seen the ratio go from three African-American men in college for every one in prison to one in college for every three in prison. But it�s not �bitterness� that got us to this point.

The United States has the highest prison rates on earth for rather different reasons. There is a massive for-profit prison industry with its own lobbying wing. There are laws that target our youth for nonviolent offenses and hand down mandatory minimum sentences to slake the thirst of Prisons, Inc. There is the historic drug sentencing disparities between African-Americans and whites. There are the deep budget cuts to public schools, after-school programs and Boys and Girls clubs. And then there�s the stubborn fact that there are no damn jobs. Unemployment among black men has reached �great depression proportions ,� and it�s a little hard to pull yourself up by the bootstraps when the bank has repossessed your boots and the strap.

People like Whitlock who think that today�s poor kids are just a good spanking away from success are cloistered from the daily, humiliating reality of joblessness that affects almost a fifth of this country.

But, as always, his tired routine is wrapped in a false patina of black pride. This is seen when he tries to bury Rose by invoking the legendary hip-hop group Public Enemy. Whitlock writes, �Public Enemy�s Chuck D should�ve remade �Don�t Believe the Hype� and replaced Elvis with Jalen Rose.�

Slow down there, MC Trickle Down. You don�t need to be Davey D to know that the �Elvis� reference is in �Fight the Power,� not �Don�t Believe the Hype.� It�s not even the right album. But, alas, there is no Public Enemy in the champagne room.

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts

Wed Mar-23-11 05:31 AM

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461. "none of this has anything to do with duke's recruiting philosophy"
In response to Reply # 459

____________________________________________________

Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

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cgonz00cc
Member since Aug 01st 2002
35271 posts

Wed Mar-23-11 09:59 AM

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463. "lol give it a rest buddy, you are literally the only one that cares"
In response to Reply # 461
Wed Mar-23-11 10:00 AM by cgonz00cc

at this point

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
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Wed Mar-23-11 03:49 PM

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469. "he's right, though"
In response to Reply # 463
Wed Mar-23-11 03:49 PM by Orbit_Established

>at this point

Everyone is using this situation to pop off some profound social
commentary. That's cute and all, but the central question has
been ignored:

Is there anything wrong with the way Duke recruits?

The only answer to this question is "fuck no," and
the fact that Duke wins makes it even more etherous .

Everything else is irrelevant.

----------------------------

Young Broadway Star Urgently Needs a Bone Marrow Donor. Is it you? http://MatchShannon.com/

O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"

"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "

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s_dot_miles
Member since Dec 26th 2003
3714 posts

Wed Mar-23-11 04:39 PM

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471. "orbasa estabiglia"
In response to Reply # 469

when discussing elite level one and done players, why would K say that "you have to recruit the right ones."

take the obvious racial context out that jumps into peoples mind from a statement like that. and take out the fact that duke is an top tier academic school, not just bball team, so obviously the kids need the grades also.

now try to understand what he could possible mean when he is talking about recruiting the right ones out of a pool of players who are nba ready and have no aspirations to go to school for 4 years. to me it sounds like he is talking about players from a certain socio-economic and educational background that he feels are going to fit into his system. there is certainly nothing wrong with that, but i think thats the issue many people have with the way duke recruits and the resentment people have towards the program because if it is just about basketball and winning and molding young kids into men, then duke would most likely go after a different group of players than they do. to many people duke is trying to create an elitist culture at their school and on their bball team which obviously rubs many people the wrong way.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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cgonz00cc
Member since Aug 01st 2002
35271 posts

Thu Mar-24-11 11:48 AM

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475. "no one thinks there is anything wrong with the way duke recruits"
In response to Reply # 469

thats probably the *reason* no one cares

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
132214 posts

Thu Mar-24-11 12:11 PM

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476. "DING."
In response to Reply # 475

>thats probably the *reason* no one cares

and that's all there is. I honestly don't know what they're getting mad at, the observation, or what people extrapolate from it.

No one really cares how Duke recruits. Or rather, WHO they recruit, unless they snap up someone that the offended wanted on THEIR teams.
Again, nothing about the comments made by Jalen in present day indicate that he thinks that there is something WRONG about how Duke recruits.

Looking at s_dot_miles's reply above, it's really how it may or may not feed into its perception as an "elite" institute of athletics and education.

People extrapolate all kinds of shit from it, including Duke hate. I think one of the biggest thing that drives Duke hate, as O_E said was the WINNING, but it wasn't the winning alone.

People (namely the media) start adding little narratives to the winning that just grates on people's nerves. That's where the perception comes from...it doesn't have to be true, but it is "real".

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Warren Coolidge
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41998 posts

Thu Mar-24-11 10:20 PM

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478. "and as you can see.....recruit some REAL NIG-roes...."
In response to Reply # 0

that Dunk...and play with energy and passion..

it's 2011.....

White Boys will get you some Rah-Rah....they'll win you some games... (all bs aside, Plumlee ain't bad)..

but I don't give a fukk.....

Duke won it last year because they were fortunate enough NOT to play an athletic team of Brothers..

now they are..

and they are going the fukk home...

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