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Subject: "Philosophical Mind F*ck about the universe." Previous topic | Next topic
initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
2420 posts
Mon Feb-02-15 12:53 PM

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"Philosophical Mind F*ck about the universe."


          

Don't read this post if you do not want to be challenged. Leave now.

So, I had a bit of an existential mind riot this weekend. It dawned on me that most things that matter only come in two's. I've never really noticed that before. Let me illustrate what I mean. I can't possibly list them all.

Human abstractions and profundities:

Life & Death
Good & Bad
War & Peace
Rich & Poor
Materialist & Spiritualist
Atheist & Non Atheist

Physical:

Two eyes, two ears, two hands, two legs, two nostrils, two lips, two lungs, two testicles, two kidneys, two lungs.
Male & Female

Scientific:

Binary code (On and Off - Foundation for computing.)
Wave's (Crest and Trough)
Two poles, two halves (Equator)
DNA (Double Helix)
Quantum theory (Atoms vanish and reappear.)

I could go on but I will stop there.

Why does our universe have so many profound instances of two's, or dualism? If you analyse every instance, the two halves, or two parts always compose a single unity or concept that cannot exist with only 1 part. You cannot have war without peace, life without death, existence without non existence.

I know that there are many examples where there are more than 2 parts, however, my point is that the most profound, and life affecting concepts or abstractions, only come in two.

WHY?!!

Is it possible that we live in a parallel universe model? and that our universe is interacting with one other universe?

Is it possible one of these universe is female and another is male? Is possible that life could only occur when our universe collided with the other?

Could the dualism of Life and Death, the Double Helix, Light & Darkness, Existence and Non Existence be reflected and rooted in two universes which are colliding? Is it possible that dark matter and dark energy is the impact of the second universe which is directly on top of ours? is it possible that all unexplained phenomenon is the interplay between these two universes?

Is it possible that the reason our most profound realities come in two is simply because there are two roots for everything?

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
because your brain understands things in clusters.
Feb 02nd 2015
1
My brain of *two* hemisphere's is from this universe.
Feb 02nd 2015
2
bullshit.
Feb 02nd 2015
6
No.
Feb 02nd 2015
11
I can't believe I missed this dumb shit...
Feb 02nd 2015
49
that's some good shit ain't it...
Feb 02nd 2015
7
      bless his heart.
Feb 02nd 2015
12
           For some reason, I make you insecure, and
Feb 02nd 2015
14
                maybe you're projecting.
Feb 02nd 2015
15
                ^^^ this
Feb 02nd 2015
20
                     So it isnt just me then
Feb 02nd 2015
29
                          Definitely not just you
Feb 02nd 2015
35
                Dawg, shit was a joke. If you can't figure that out, log off of life.
Feb 02nd 2015
18
                I wasn't speaking to you.
Feb 02nd 2015
21
                nah Joe shut your simple minded shit down
Feb 02nd 2015
36
Someone was thinking about this before
Feb 02nd 2015
3
Exactly. I was hoping this symbol would come up.
Feb 02nd 2015
4
      it's a cool symbol.
Feb 02nd 2015
8
      there is a field of study that somewhat disagrees here
Feb 02nd 2015
24
that's the dialectic method
Feb 02nd 2015
5
these are all earth things you're listing. the 'universe' doesn't
Feb 02nd 2015
9
Of course it does, is the Earth not part of the universe??
Feb 02nd 2015
13
      A couple of your points here are invalid...
Feb 02nd 2015
28
So, I had a bit of an existential mind riot this weekend i.e.
Feb 02nd 2015
10
pairs is one thing. duality, antithesis, reciprocal/binary states is ano...
Feb 02nd 2015
16
One cannot exist without the other.
Feb 02nd 2015
17
      as a concept to understand, yes. but as a state of being
Feb 02nd 2015
22
           In a state of being or concept, they cannot be separated.
Feb 02nd 2015
25
Postjack: The idea of death is becoming more real
Feb 02nd 2015
19
lol gotta love shrooms
Feb 02nd 2015
23
What does the obvious dualism that exists in our universe have to do
Feb 02nd 2015
26
Hey Jaden, take this shit back to twitter
Feb 02nd 2015
27
HIGHLY UNDERRATED
Feb 03rd 2015
65
lmfao
Feb 03rd 2015
66
I can see now that this is the wrong forum for me.
Feb 02nd 2015
30
i did think about the question. and the observation still sucks.
Feb 02nd 2015
31
You posted about a revelatory ‘mind fuck’…
Feb 02nd 2015
32
Well there's more internet over there -->
Feb 02nd 2015
37
Yes it is the wrong forum for you
Feb 02nd 2015
55
#70
Feb 03rd 2015
75
That Katey Perry halftime had me tripping too, glad it wasn't just me
Feb 02nd 2015
33
best reply
Feb 02nd 2015
40
lol
Feb 02nd 2015
34
he's 33 years old
Feb 02nd 2015
41
      thats the same age jesus died at.
Feb 02nd 2015
45
           Jesus trained in the far east under Hindus and Buddhists
Feb 02nd 2015
50
           this is why our ppl fail-- please be joking
Feb 02nd 2015
52
                I am being an asshole.
Feb 02nd 2015
56
                it was great snark and U and PopGeorge came in here
Feb 02nd 2015
58
                     aye... I was sleepy as shit and in an extra pissy mood
Feb 02nd 2015
60
Atoms disappear and reappear?
Feb 02nd 2015
38
he's got ZERO grip on quantum theory/mechanics/computing
Feb 02nd 2015
39
no nm
Feb 02nd 2015
44
      Yes they do.
Feb 03rd 2015
72
           You're thinking of subatomic particles, not atoms.
Feb 03rd 2015
91
           Thanks.
Feb 03rd 2015
110
           Whole atoms? HIGHLY unlikely.
Feb 03rd 2015
93
Bah I think you guys are being a bit too hard on the original poster
Feb 02nd 2015
42
it would be different if this was the first time...
Feb 02nd 2015
46
“Don't read this post if you do not want to be challenged”
Feb 02nd 2015
51
      especially when the content is remedial at best
Feb 02nd 2015
53
bilateral symmetry in biology was an adaptation to directional movement
Feb 02nd 2015
43
I got this in my facebook feed this week:
Feb 02nd 2015
47
which drugs?
Feb 02nd 2015
48
LMAO this is like a jimmy Kimmel bit where
Feb 02nd 2015
54
Science education is important n/m
Feb 02nd 2015
57
lol
Feb 02nd 2015
59
LOL
Feb 02nd 2015
61
If the weedman had Yelp, this would be an amazing review.
Feb 02nd 2015
62
PING
Feb 03rd 2015
64
Okay, that's funny.
Feb 03rd 2015
73
You seem to have discovered the concept of opposite.
Feb 03rd 2015
63
I do not believe "opposites" are possible.
Feb 03rd 2015
71
      RE: I do not believe "opposites" are possible.
Feb 03rd 2015
76
           That's not what I mean.
Feb 03rd 2015
77
                RE: That's not what I mean.
Feb 03rd 2015
80
                     I simply do not see it that way.
Feb 03rd 2015
85
                          Hmm. I'll try for a little longer.
Feb 03rd 2015
88
                               I was using your word to illustrate an idea.
Feb 03rd 2015
89
                                    Life and Death exist on the same scale, yes.
Feb 03rd 2015
90
                                         It's just 1 coin. That's my point.
Feb 03rd 2015
92
                                              Correct.
Feb 03rd 2015
97
                                                   Are you serious or being facetious?
Feb 03rd 2015
98
                                                        I'm serious.
Feb 03rd 2015
99
                                                             Okay cool.
Feb 03rd 2015
102
                                                                  RE: Okay cool.
Feb 03rd 2015
106
                                                                       RE: Okay cool.
Feb 03rd 2015
107
                                                                            Gotcha, still cherry picking. I tried to engage you.
Feb 03rd 2015
108
                                                                                 How is it out of context? lol
Feb 03rd 2015
109
Your choice of "two's" is mad arbitrary and cherry picked at the same ti...
Feb 03rd 2015
67
But.. He EATS, and also SHITS!! He DRINKS and PISSES!! GET IT??!!
Feb 03rd 2015
82
You're right some of those were incorrect.
Feb 03rd 2015
87
not to add to the dogpile here but I really wish you'd refrain from--
Feb 03rd 2015
68
Explain.
Feb 03rd 2015
74
spare me. please nm
Feb 03rd 2015
69
Let's try this again.
Feb 03rd 2015
70
Let's not. There's absolutely nothing to what you're saying
Feb 03rd 2015
78
      I will say this to you only once.
Feb 03rd 2015
79
           he's telling the truth
Feb 03rd 2015
81
           Truth is relative.
Feb 03rd 2015
86
                You began the entire post with rudeness
Feb 03rd 2015
96
                     I apologize if that offended you.
Feb 03rd 2015
100
                          Coloring outside the lines doesn't make one creative
Feb 03rd 2015
104
           lol, who the fuck is Mark?
Feb 03rd 2015
83
                he does that when someone calls him Bartek
Feb 03rd 2015
84
Two mind-blowing words: one heart
Feb 03rd 2015
94
You tell that to Doctor Who.
Feb 03rd 2015
95
but, but - there are FOUR quadrants!
Feb 03rd 2015
105
I have a genuine question. What were you expecting to happen here?
Feb 03rd 2015
101
To be honest, I didn't think anyone would read it.
Feb 03rd 2015
103

Joe Corn Mo
Member since Aug 29th 2010
15139 posts
Mon Feb-02-15 01:06 PM

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1. "because your brain understands things in clusters. "
In response to Reply # 0
Mon Feb-02-15 01:15 PM by Joe Corn Mo

  

          

it's an evolutionary throwback.
humans that took too much time figuring out
exactly how many sabertooths were attacking them got eaten by sabertooths.

humans don't examine things closely.
they group the ideas into chunks that are easy to remember.



that why we group things together in twos (or threes).
day and night
made good metaphors for good and evil,
Life and death, etc.
so that worked its way into our mythology.


humans also tend to cling to patterns,
so we tend to read more significance into these paterns than necessary.

the reoccurring theme of the number 2 is not a glimpse
into an unseen universe... it's an example of your
human brain trying to read order into a mostly chaotic universe
and focusing on the number 2 because it's round and easy to remember.

ppl also do this with the number 3, 5, and 7, and occasionally 12 or 13,
which is coincidentally about the same number of things the human brain
can comfortably keep track of at the same time.
(humans can remember 5 plus or minus 3 things in short or long term memory. that's why phone numbers are broken into 3 and 4 digit chunks
to help us remember a 10 digit number.)

which is what I suspect you are doing right now.
I can recognize it because I used to do the same thing.




btw, birth is opposite of death.
life has no opposite.




  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
2420 posts
Mon Feb-02-15 01:12 PM

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2. "My brain of *two* hemisphere's is from this universe."
In response to Reply # 1
Mon Feb-02-15 01:24 PM by initiationofplato

          

I am not separate to the universe, nor is my brain.

There are also only two sexes. Some animals possess the power of both, but there is only two. We cannot even conceive of a sex that does not fit into the Male & Female duality.

>it's an evolutionary throwback.

It's not *just* that.

>
>that why we group things together in twos (or threes).

You will find profound realities, which exist here, outside of our "human" understanding in two's, not three's. However, we are still from this universe, so the fact that our brain see's so many dual relationships is a completely natural, and organic observation. Our DNA is a double helix, electrons have positive and negative charges, most of our organs and senses which allow life to procreate only come in two as well. These things exist beyond "human" definition or pattern recognition, or pattern invention. How many arms do you have? How many legs? how many eyes? Just think about it. These are innate realities.


>Life and death, etc.

Life and death is not a human invention or metaphor. It is a reality.


>which is what I suspect you are doing right now.
>I can recognize it because I used to do the same thing.
>

You are not seeing my point yet, but you will. The question I am asking is: "Why is dualism the underlying foundation for our experience of living and dying and everything that we understand or observe about the universe?"

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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Joe Corn Mo
Member since Aug 29th 2010
15139 posts
Mon Feb-02-15 01:31 PM

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6. "bullshit. "
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

>I am not separate to the universe, nor is my brain.
>

great. neither is mine.
where does that get us?

that we are all connected and I am a part of you
and we are only seperated by illusionary social constructs?
fine. but you still can't move my arm... or read my thoughts,
so for all intents and purposes, we are seperate.

your brain is not a magical portal
that holds all the secrets to the universe.
not really.

you won't find your answers this way.
you will go on and on in meaningless circles.




>There are also only two sexes. Some animals possess the power
>of both, but there is only two. We cannot even conceive of a
>sex that does not fit into the Male & Female duality.
>

You're still stuck on the idea that there are 2 biological human sexes,
but there are more than 2 genders. the world is bigger than your brain.
in fact, our society pushes against the idea of multiple genders
because their human brain keeps trying to cram everything
into neat, bianary systems.

which is another reason this mystical shit played out for me.
it's just another box and the world doesn't fit neatly in it.


>>it's an evolutionary throwback.
>
>It's not *just* that.
>
>>
>>that why we group things together in twos (or threes).
>
>You will find profound realities, which exist here, outside of
>our "human" understanding in two's, not three's. However, we
>are still from this universe, so the fact that our brain see's
>so many dual relationships is a completely natural, and
>organic observation. Our DNA is a double helix, electrons have
>positive and negative charges, most of our organs and senses
>which allow life to procreate only come in two as well. These
>things exist beyond "human" definition or pattern recognition,
>or pattern invention. How many arms do you have? How many
>legs? how many eyes? Just think about it. These are innate
>realities.
>
>
>>Life and death, etc.
>
>Life and death is not a human invention or metaphor. It is a
>reality.
>
>
>>which is what I suspect you are doing right now.
>>I can recognize it because I used to do the same thing.
>>
>
>You are not seeing my point yet, but you will. The question I
>am asking is: "Why is dualism the underlying foundation for
>our experience of living and dying and everything that we
>understand or observe about the universe?"
>
>



I see your point perfectly fine.
I answered it years ago.

You ASSUME dualism is the underlying foundation for your experience
of living and dying because your brain fixates on things in pairs.

there's nothing more to it than that.

you will not stumble upon the universal theory of relativity
if you keep looking for these round numbers.

chaos theory already proved
that the universe doesn't care about round numbers as much as humans do.


this post would be better if you shifted your fixation
to the occurrance of irrational numbers in some of our models for the universe.

that's more interesting than this pseudoscience
from the overly romanticized mystery schools of
greece/ egypt.


  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
2420 posts
Mon Feb-02-15 01:36 PM

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11. "No."
In response to Reply # 6


          

>>I am not separate to the universe, nor is my brain.
>>
>
>great. neither is mine.
>where does that get us?
>

It asserts the reality that we are not separate to this universe. Most people whom enter this conversation will say something like: "That is a *human* idea." You have to remind them, that to be human, is to be this universe.

>that we are all connected and I am a part of you
>and we are only seperated by illusionary social constructs?
>fine. but you still can't move my arm... or read my thoughts,
>so for all intents and purposes, we are seperate.

You are off topic.

>
>your brain is not a magical portal
>that holds all the secrets to the universe.
>not really.
>

This is your own personal contention and has no ground in reality or truth.

>you won't find your answers this way.
>you will go on and on in meaningless circles.
>
>

Maybe you will, but you should not impose your perception on to the universe.


>You're still stuck on the idea that there are 2 biological
>human sexes,
>but there are more than 2 genders. the world is bigger than
>your brain.

There are only 2 physical sexes.

>in fact, our society pushes against the idea of multiple
>genders
>because their human brain keeps trying to cram everything
>into neat, bianary systems.
>

Male & Female. Count them, let me know what number you arrive at.

>which is another reason this mystical shit played out for me.
>

You are not seeking to understand, you are seeking to prove me wrong, which is ironic, because you do not understand what I am trying to say yet.

>
>I see your point perfectly fine.
>I answered it years ago.
>

You answered nothing.

>You ASSUME dualism is the underlying foundation for your
>experience
>of living and dying because your brain fixates on things in
>pairs.
>
>there's nothing more to it than that.
>

Incorrect.

>you will not stumble upon the universal theory of relativity
>if you keep looking for these round numbers.
>
>chaos theory already proved
>that the universe doesn't care about round numbers as much as
>humans do.
>
>
>this post would be better if you shifted your fixation
>to the occurrance of irrational numbers in some of our models
>for the universe.
>
>that's more interesting than this pseudoscience
>from the overly romanticized mystery schools of
>greece/ egypt.


Feel free to make your own post about that if you wish.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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PoppaGeorge
Member since Nov 07th 2004
10384 posts
Mon Feb-02-15 04:57 PM

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49. "I can't believe I missed this dumb shit..."
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

> electrons have positive and negative charges


It's apparent you failed all manner of science and physics in high school and college (if you even went).

An electron has a charge of -1.
A POSITRON has a charge of +1. It is the antimatter equivalent of an electron.

and electron will never have a +1 charge, always -1.

---------------------------

forcing myself to actually respond to you is like bathing in ebola virus. - Binlahab

Like there is stupid, and then there is you, and then there is dead. - VAsBestBBW

R.I.P. Disco D

  

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PoppaGeorge
Member since Nov 07th 2004
10384 posts
Mon Feb-02-15 01:31 PM

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7. "that's some good shit ain't it... "
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

https://38.media.tumblr.com/8a8d4883f0e0d12a14466435e0412083/tumblr_muhh4oo8AZ1svefdfo1_400.gif

---------------------------

forcing myself to actually respond to you is like bathing in ebola virus. - Binlahab

Like there is stupid, and then there is you, and then there is dead. - VAsBestBBW

R.I.P. Disco D

  

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Joe Corn Mo
Member since Aug 29th 2010
15139 posts
Mon Feb-02-15 01:38 PM

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12. "bless his heart. "
In response to Reply # 7


  

          

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
2420 posts
Mon Feb-02-15 01:40 PM

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14. "For some reason, I make you insecure, and"
In response to Reply # 12


          

you feel the need to condescend.

I will ignore you from now on.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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Joe Corn Mo
Member since Aug 29th 2010
15139 posts
Mon Feb-02-15 01:47 PM

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15. "maybe you're projecting. "
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

>you feel the need to condescend.
>
>I will ignore you from now on.

  

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PoppaGeorge
Member since Nov 07th 2004
10384 posts
Mon Feb-02-15 01:56 PM

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20. "^^^ this"
In response to Reply # 15


  

          

Dude comes off as very "I know something you don't know"-ish in pretty much every post I've ever seen. Like... "I'm enlightened and you all are unwashed plebeians."


---------------------------

forcing myself to actually respond to you is like bathing in ebola virus. - Binlahab

Like there is stupid, and then there is you, and then there is dead. - VAsBestBBW

R.I.P. Disco D

  

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DaHeathenOne76
Member since May 11th 2003
29357 posts
Mon Feb-02-15 02:25 PM

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29. "So it isnt just me then"
In response to Reply # 20


          

This person also comes off as first year in college smoking weed in the basement of the residence hall and philosophizing until 3 am because no one has Friday classes.

  

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PoppaGeorge
Member since Nov 07th 2004
10384 posts
Mon Feb-02-15 03:22 PM

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35. "Definitely not just you"
In response to Reply # 29


  

          

coming in here like Oswald Bates from In Living Color

www.youtube.com/watch?v=HebReKH82kE


---------------------------

forcing myself to actually respond to you is like bathing in ebola virus. - Binlahab

Like there is stupid, and then there is you, and then there is dead. - VAsBestBBW

R.I.P. Disco D

  

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PoppaGeorge
Member since Nov 07th 2004
10384 posts
Mon Feb-02-15 01:53 PM

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18. "Dawg, shit was a joke. If you can't figure that out, log off of life. "
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

ctrl-alt-delete yourself for not being to take a lil humor.


---------------------------

forcing myself to actually respond to you is like bathing in ebola virus. - Binlahab

Like there is stupid, and then there is you, and then there is dead. - VAsBestBBW

R.I.P. Disco D

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
2420 posts
Mon Feb-02-15 01:58 PM

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21. "I wasn't speaking to you. "
In response to Reply # 18


          

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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astralblak
Member since Apr 05th 2007
20029 posts
Mon Feb-02-15 03:41 PM

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36. "nah Joe shut your simple minded shit down "
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

and you again want to throw a passive-aggressive tantrum because another person has shown you how NOT deep you are

  

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ShawndmeSlanted
Member since Oct 30th 2004
42601 posts
Mon Feb-02-15 01:19 PM

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3. "Someone was thinking about this before"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/17/Yin_yang.svg/1024px-Yin_yang.svg.png

---
"though time has passed, im still the future" (c) black thought

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
2420 posts
Mon Feb-02-15 01:24 PM

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4. "Exactly. I was hoping this symbol would come up."
In response to Reply # 3
Mon Feb-02-15 01:25 PM by initiationofplato

          

To give life, two sexes have to come together.
We cannot experience reality without life and death.
There cannot experience without existence and non existence.

There are so many profound examples which point to a strict duality. Why the two?!

Zen Buddhism states that there is no separation or difference in duality. That everything we see as dual is one energy, simply because you cannot have the foreground without the background. We even have two hemispheres in our brain which we produce one stream of consciousness with.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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Joe Corn Mo
Member since Aug 29th 2010
15139 posts
Mon Feb-02-15 01:33 PM

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8. "it's a cool symbol. "
In response to Reply # 4


  

          

it's romantic to think about the light side and good side of the force.
you can pull some interesting philosophical concepts from the model.

but it's just a model, and it's not that deep.

let it go.


>To give life, two sexes have to come together.
>We cannot experience reality without life and death.
>There cannot experience without existence and non existence.
>
>There are so many profound examples which point to a strict
>duality. Why the two?!
>
>Zen Buddhism states that there is no separation or difference
>in duality. That everything we see as dual is one energy,
>simply because you cannot have the foreground without the
>background. We even have two hemispheres in our brain which we
>produce one stream of consciousness with.

  

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Riot
Member since May 25th 2005
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Mon Feb-02-15 02:07 PM

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24. "there is a field of study that somewhat disagrees here"
In response to Reply # 4


  

          

bc one hemisphere is tasked with verbalization

the thought is that it does the talking for what its desires are
and your other hemisphere is essentially a gagged prisoner

look up some of the research on folk with collapsed corpus callosum
where the hemispheres do not have to form a "mutual" decision and info can be shown to one hemisphere of the brain and hid from the other

We even have two hemispheres in our brain which we
>produce one stream of consciousness with.



)))--####---###--(((

bunda
<-.-> ^_^ \^0^/
get busy living, or get busy dying.

  

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Benji
Member since Jun 11th 2014
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Mon Feb-02-15 01:26 PM

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5. "that's the dialectic method"
In response to Reply # 0


          

  

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Deadzombie
Member since Aug 21st 2008
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Mon Feb-02-15 01:34 PM

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9. "these are all earth things you're listing. the 'universe' doesn't"
In response to Reply # 0


          

really support this.

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
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Mon Feb-02-15 01:39 PM

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13. "Of course it does, is the Earth not part of the universe??"
In response to Reply # 9
Mon Feb-02-15 01:49 PM by initiationofplato

          

The Big Bang model suggests that our Universe is constantly EXPANDING, even though Gravity is CONTRACTING. They invented Dark energy and dark matter to support this theory.

Expansion Vs. Contraction in the universe. Two, duality!

How many profound instances of 2 can you find on your own body?

Our brain has two hemispheres. I did not invent the brain. I did not invent all the pairs which compose your body.

How about breathing, INHALE, EXHALE. Two. With two lungs!

How about seeing, two eyes (Light and Dark), hearing, two ears (Bass and Treble)

How bout concepts concerning our reality.

Conscious Vs. Subconscious. Two.

Waking Vs Sleeping. Two.

Something Vs. Nothing. (Find me a 3rd if you can.)

Life Vs. Death. (Find me a 3rd if you can.)

Existence Vs. Non Existence.(Find me a 3rd if you can.)

Male Vs. Female (Find me a 3rd if you can.)

Truly examine and think about it, you will find a resounding amount of TWO's, and only TWO's which are at the root of all our thinking.

The question is, WHY two?!

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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PoppaGeorge
Member since Nov 07th 2004
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Mon Feb-02-15 02:23 PM

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28. "A couple of your points here are invalid..."
In response to Reply # 13


  

          

>The Big Bang model suggests that our Universe is constantly
>EXPANDING, even though Gravity is CONTRACTING. They invented
>Dark energy and dark matter to support this theory.

You really don't know how this works and I don't have the time or space to expound on this (get it??? No??? I thought not...)

>
>Expansion Vs. Contraction in the universe. Two, duality!
>
>How many profound instances of 2 can you find on your own
>body?
>
>Our brain has two hemispheres. I did not invent the brain. I
>did not invent all the pairs which compose your body.
>
>How about breathing, INHALE, EXHALE. Two. With two lungs!
>
>How about seeing, two eyes (Light and Dark), hearing, two ears
>(Bass and Treble)

bass and treble??? The average human ear can hear from 20Hz to 20KHz, some (like mine) can extend beyond this but for the most part this is it.

Within that span of frequencies lies bass, midbass, low/mid/high midrage, and low/mid/high "treble" if you want to call it that.
>
>How bout concepts concerning our reality.
>
>Conscious Vs. Subconscious. Two.

There is also Super conscious.

>
>Waking Vs Sleeping. Two.

There is a state between the two where you are partially awake and partially dreaming. Sleep paralysis falls into that area.

>
>Something Vs. Nothing. (Find me a 3rd if you can.)
>
>Life Vs. Death. (Find me a 3rd if you can.)

some would argue for a spiritual existence after death.
>
>Existence Vs. Non Existence.(Find me a 3rd if you can.)

>
>Male Vs. Female (Find me a 3rd if you can.)

There are organisms on this planet that reproduce asexually, thus rendering them neither male or female.


>Truly examine and think about it, you will find a resounding
>amount of TWO's, and only TWO's which are at the root of all
>our thinking.
>
>The question is, WHY two?!
>


---------------------------

forcing myself to actually respond to you is like bathing in ebola virus. - Binlahab

Like there is stupid, and then there is you, and then there is dead. - VAsBestBBW

R.I.P. Disco D

  

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Atillah Moor
Member since Sep 05th 2013
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10. "So, I had a bit of an existential mind riot this weekend i.e. "
In response to Reply # 0
Mon Feb-02-15 01:38 PM by Atillah Moor

  

          

shroomed it up at a concert with a wicked bad light show.

______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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Riot
Member since May 25th 2005
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Mon Feb-02-15 01:49 PM

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16. "pairs is one thing. duality, antithesis, reciprocal/binary states is ano..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

there are things, and there is the absence of that thing


light and dark are not really a pair, dark is the absence of light
poor is the absence of wealth
cold is the absence of heat
stillness is the absence of movement
homeless is the absence of a home

that in itself doesnt lend to the idea that there should be 2 homes, or a pair of universes



)))--####---###--(((

bunda
<-.-> ^_^ \^0^/
get busy living, or get busy dying.

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
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Mon Feb-02-15 01:51 PM

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17. "One cannot exist without the other."
In response to Reply # 16
Mon Feb-02-15 01:57 PM by initiationofplato

          

>there are things, and there is the absence of that thing
>
>
>light and dark are not really a pair, dark is the absence of
>light

You cannot have dark on its own without light to illuminate that it was dark. You cannot have light without dark to illuminate that it is light.

>poor is the absence of wealth

Cannot have wealth without poverty to illuminate wealth.

>cold is the absence of heat

Cannot have heat without cold to identify what cold or heat is. They are tied together at the hip. They are the same thing!

>stillness is the absence of movement

You know what I'm going to say.

>homeless is the absence of a home
>
>that in itself doesnt lend to the idea that there should be 2
>homes, or a pair of universes
>

Think about it again. You cannot have the foreground without the background.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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Riot
Member since May 25th 2005
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22. "as a concept to understand, yes. but as a state of being"
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

of course u can have cold without heat

and none of the binary situations exist at the same time

u are poor, or not poor


so still doesnt make the argument here for 2 simultaneous universe



)))--####---###--(((

bunda
<-.-> ^_^ \^0^/
get busy living, or get busy dying.

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
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25. "In a state of being or concept, they cannot be separated."
In response to Reply # 22
Mon Feb-02-15 02:15 PM by initiationofplato

          

>of course u can have cold without heat
>

How would you understand what cold is without heat? How would you measure cold if there was no heat? How would you account for its state of being if it had no background to measure against? If there was no heat, and there was only cold, it would not be called cold anymore.

The temperature is either High or Sub Zero (Duality.)

>and none of the binary situations exist at the same time

Binary, 1 and 0, On and Off. The computer I am using right now is going ON and OFF quadrillion times per second as I type these words. The coming together of these two things at the same time creates something, an experience, a reality, a machine, etc.

Your heart expands and contracts. Duality. On and Off.

>
>so still doesnt make the argument here for 2 simultaneous
>universe

I am just musing, I am not suggesting it is so as fact.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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ShawndmeSlanted
Member since Oct 30th 2004
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19. "Postjack: The idea of death is becoming more real"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I didnt think twice about it til I had kids, but now I get these times -- I dont know if I consider them anxiety attacks, where I start thinking about how life is finite and every second I'm getting closer to it.


I wanna be around for as much of my kids' shit as I can....

Also not sure how much sense this makes (it makes sense in my head)
But then I also love living and being me -- if that makes any sense. I love my consciousness and the way I navigate this world. Like damn, is that shit just gonna stop one day? Then what?

This is my one life its amazing that Im here, but its gonna stop one day.

Then I get sad.

---
"though time has passed, im still the future" (c) black thought

  

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MiracleRic
Member since Oct 21st 2002
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Mon Feb-02-15 02:05 PM

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23. "lol gotta love shrooms"
In response to Reply # 0
Mon Feb-02-15 02:07 PM by MiracleRic

  

          

good form debunking this pseudo-epiphany that most children have learned to resist the urge to give too much credence to

Let me sport my Air Hyperbole 2010s in peace. (c) ansomble

Building repetoires (c) spm since 1983

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
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Mon Feb-02-15 02:15 PM

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26. "What does the obvious dualism that exists in our universe have to do"
In response to Reply # 23


          

with shrooms?

That is such a narrow and unfounded point of view. You made no effort to seek understanding at all.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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Cold Truth
Member since Jan 28th 2004
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27. "Hey Jaden, take this shit back to twitter"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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TheAlbionist
Member since Jul 04th 2011
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Tue Feb-03-15 08:44 AM

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65. "HIGHLY UNDERRATED"
In response to Reply # 27


  

          

>

_______________________________

))<>((
forever.

  

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MiracleRic
Member since Oct 21st 2002
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66. "lmfao"
In response to Reply # 27


  

          

Let me sport my Air Hyperbole 2010s in peace. (c) ansomble

Building repetoires (c) spm since 1983

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
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Mon Feb-02-15 02:35 PM

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30. "I can see now that this is the wrong forum for me."
In response to Reply # 0


          

No hard feelings, but, many of you are so eager to attack, put down, condescend, "snark", etc. before you make a single effort to understand. I don't think I have ever come across such a potent level of closed mindedness before, and such a deep desire to protect the status quo. Do any of you listen to any of the OkayArtists? how did you end up here? LOL.

This forum has a knee jerk "I'm going to put this person down before I try to understand them" complex. Why does this community breed so much anger and hatred? What is to be gained?

Be wary of what type of personality and person you allow yourself to be. If you find yourself putting down everyone for ideas that are unconventional, you should probably take some time to reflect. What will you say to your children in the future when they have questions?

Are you going to snark them too because they haven't indoctrinated themselves with the status quo that you find comfortable yet?

This place lacks heart and love, exploration, and curiosity. Take care y'all. Wishing everyone of you love and happiness.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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Deadzombie
Member since Aug 21st 2008
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Mon Feb-02-15 02:42 PM

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31. "i did think about the question. and the observation still sucks."
In response to Reply # 30


          

it always stop short somewhere.

you're way focused on the 'two!', but that's not really what's going on.

male + female is astonishing.

yes, two hands, two feet, two eyes.

but that's all contextual.

if the animals isn't bipedal, there are way more feet.

some animals have way more than two eyes.

what about one head?

what about one sun.

five fingers.

five toes.

yeah. the pair thing is interesting but it stops very short, very soon.

you acting like you discovered some brand new prime number or some shit.

i think the golden mean e is more interesting to ponder.

but that goes far beyond the number two.

  

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Cold Truth
Member since Jan 28th 2004
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32. "You posted about a revelatory ‘mind fuck’…"
In response to Reply # 30
Mon Feb-02-15 03:04 PM by Cold Truth

  

          

…then proceeded to post about how everything comes in twos.

Two hands! Two feet! Two brains! Binary Code! Double Helix(double=two!)! War/Peace! Good/Bad! YIN AND YANG!!

Which, ok, I mean… alright. Hey, let’s see where he ‘s going with it…

… and then you posit an entirely baseless question: “Is it possible that we live in a parallel universe model? and that our universe is interacting with one other universe?”

It’s the sort of pondering that sounds incredibly deep and provocative when you’re 13 years old, but laughably shallow and simple-minded to most people no later than age 17.

But again… let’s see where you go with it. Turns out, not very far.

Well, yeah, sure. It’s possible. I guess it’s also possible that we’re all in a massive shared dream and don’t actually exist. We can ask a gazillion open-ended questions about things that are “possible” and never be wrong because there’s no definitive, concrete proof that it’s wrong. In this case, there’s no definitive, concrete wrong answer to your question but that doesn’t make it any less absurd. There’s nothing about so-called “duality” that even remotely suggests a parallel universe model. While string theory presents interesting notions of multiple universes, your “eureka!!” moment regarding “duality”presents absolutely zero basis for your question. It just comes across like you’re a 14 year old stoner who just got a better grade bag than usual.

So yeah, if you think this was some sort of groundbreaking, earth shattering, perspective altering ‘mind fuck’? Then yeah, this is the wrong place for you. Fortunately for you, Myspace has made a comeback and youtube is still going strong.

  

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Atillah Moor
Member since Sep 05th 2013
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37. "Well there's more internet over there -->"
In response to Reply # 30
Mon Feb-02-15 04:27 PM by Atillah Moor

  

          

don't take it so seriously and also consider the fact that what you're saying may no be as profound as you think.

For real it does read like someone's first peyote experience at Burning Man. Maybe the universe brought you here to help you not take yourself so seriously. Did you ever think of that?

And if you're catching feelings from a forum I feel bad for you son

______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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DaHeathenOne76
Member since May 11th 2003
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Mon Feb-02-15 05:41 PM

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55. "Yes it is the wrong forum for you"
In response to Reply # 30


          

You displayed hubris by assuming that your ideas were profound and ground breaking when they lack both.

Try again

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
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75. "#70"
In response to Reply # 30


          

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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Cocobrotha2
Charter member
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Mon Feb-02-15 03:18 PM

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33. "That Katey Perry halftime had me tripping too, glad it wasn't just me"
In response to Reply # 0


          

<-><-><-><-><-><-><-><-><->
<-><-><-><-><-><-><-><-><->

  

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astralblak
Member since Apr 05th 2007
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40. "best reply"
In response to Reply # 33


  

          

.

  

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infin8
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34. "lol"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

y'all cold.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OvmvxAcT_Yc

IG: amadu_me

"...Whateva, man..." (c) Redman

  

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astralblak
Member since Apr 05th 2007
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41. "he's 33 years old"
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

.

  

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Joe Corn Mo
Member since Aug 29th 2010
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45. "thats the same age jesus died at. "
In response to Reply # 41


  

          

and here we are crucifying the man for bringing
the same ancient wisom that we rejected years ago.

you all can't see the connections.

jesus trained at the same mystery schools as plato,
who got ancient wisdom from kemet,
and they spoke of the inner wisdom of the duality that surrounds us.

the fact that this BLACK message board can't see that is amazing.
but not surprising.

this is why our ppl fail.


smh.

  

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PoppaGeorge
Member since Nov 07th 2004
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Mon Feb-02-15 05:01 PM

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50. "Jesus trained in the far east under Hindus and Buddhists"
In response to Reply # 45
Mon Feb-02-15 05:04 PM by PoppaGeorge

  

          

Plato, Socrates, and their ilk had African ghostwriters.

True some of what he's saying is old, and I really doubt any of it is foreign to the averag OKP, but it's the manner that he's going about "spreading" it that's irritating the shit out of everyone.

(dammit... I can't spell for shit today...)

---------------------------

forcing myself to actually respond to you is like bathing in ebola virus. - Binlahab

Like there is stupid, and then there is you, and then there is dead. - VAsBestBBW

R.I.P. Disco D

  

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Atillah Moor
Member since Sep 05th 2013
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Mon Feb-02-15 05:12 PM

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52. "this is why our ppl fail-- please be joking"
In response to Reply # 45


  

          

______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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Joe Corn Mo
Member since Aug 29th 2010
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56. "I am being an asshole. "
In response to Reply # 52


  

          

I'll stop.

  

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astralblak
Member since Apr 05th 2007
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Mon Feb-02-15 08:55 PM

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58. "it was great snark and U and PopGeorge came in here"
In response to Reply # 52


  

          

and ruined it

LOL

  

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PoppaGeorge
Member since Nov 07th 2004
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60. "aye... I was sleepy as shit and in an extra pissy mood"
In response to Reply # 58


  

          

I had next to no sense of humor earlier.


... Still don't, but it's bedtime soon.
---------------------------

forcing myself to actually respond to you is like bathing in ebola virus. - Binlahab

Like there is stupid, and then there is you, and then there is dead. - VAsBestBBW

R.I.P. Disco D

  

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Starks dunked on Bulls
Member since Dec 07th 2011
12028 posts
Mon Feb-02-15 04:07 PM

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38. "Atoms disappear and reappear?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I didn't know that.

  

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PoppaGeorge
Member since Nov 07th 2004
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39. "he's got ZERO grip on quantum theory/mechanics/computing"
In response to Reply # 38


  

          

which is how he arrives at this juvenile description.


---------------------------

forcing myself to actually respond to you is like bathing in ebola virus. - Binlahab

Like there is stupid, and then there is you, and then there is dead. - VAsBestBBW

R.I.P. Disco D

  

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cgonz00cc
Member since Aug 01st 2002
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Mon Feb-02-15 04:26 PM

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44. "no nm"
In response to Reply # 38


  

          

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
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Tue Feb-03-15 10:06 AM

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72. "Yes they do."
In response to Reply # 44


          

"At the quantum scale, space is a writhing, frantic, ever-changing foam, with particles popping into existence and disappearing in the wink of an eye. This is not just a theoretical idea—it's confirmed. How can this bizarre idea be true?"

http://www.fnal.gov/pub/today/archive/archive_2013/today13-02-01_NutshellReadmore.html

I have heard this mentioned countless times in scientific documentaries.

Quantum computing is built on this idea, where an atom can be at two places at once and thus produce a more powerful computing machine.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Tue Feb-03-15 11:05 AM

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91. "You're thinking of subatomic particles, not atoms."
In response to Reply # 72


          


In principle it can happen with entire atoms, but the probability is minuscule, compared to more basic particles.

The bigger problem is that you know nothing of what this all means. Quantum computing has nothing to do with pair production and annihilation. You seem to be mixing it up with entanglement, an entirely different effect from an entirely different field of physics.

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
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110. "Thanks."
In response to Reply # 91


          

>
>In principle it can happen with entire atoms, but the
>probability is minuscule, compared to more basic particles.
>
>The bigger problem is that you know nothing of what this all
>means. Quantum computing has nothing to do with pair
>production and annihilation. You seem to be mixing it up with
>entanglement, an entirely different effect from an entirely
>different field of physics.
>

If you have some time, I'd love to hear you elaborate on quantum computing more.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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TheAlbionist
Member since Jul 04th 2011
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93. "Whole atoms? HIGHLY unlikely."
In response to Reply # 72


  

          

By it's very definition, the bigger and hotter an object gets, the less improbable its position. Once you get past quantum particles into atoms, the probabilities of them seemingly "appearing from nowhere" becomes absolutely miniscule.

Atoms were fused from quantum particles (in turn created from raw energy) in the conditions following the Big Bang; they do not randomly pop into existence.

Energy, sure. Sub-atomic particles, likely. Atoms? You're stretching it A LOT.

Try not to collapse every idea into every other one. Quantum Mechanics is amazing, but most Quantum Physicists spend their lives starting sentences "Nice thought, but it's not quite that simple..."

>At the quantum scale, space is a writhing, frantic,
>ever-changing foam, with particles popping into existence and
>disappearing in the wink of an eye. This is not just a
>theoretical idea—it's confirmed. How can this bizarre idea
>be true?"
>
>http://www.fnal.gov/pub/today/archive/archive_2013/today13-02-01_NutshellReadmore.html
>
>I have heard this mentioned countless times in scientific
>documentaries.
>
>Quantum computing is built on this idea, where an atom can be
>at two places at once and thus produce a more powerful
>computing machine.

_______________________________

))<>((
forever.

  

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ShinobiShaw
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42. "Bah I think you guys are being a bit too hard on the original poster"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Well maybe if he wasn't a douche that would help but he is attempting to post about something other than the usual suspects.

http://soundcloud.com/djshinobishaw
http://www.rareformnyc.com
http://twitter.com/DJShinobiShaw
https://twitter.com/RareFormNYC
PSN: ShinobiShaw

"Arm Leg Leg Arm How you doin?" (c)T510

  

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PoppaGeorge
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46. "it would be different if this was the first time..."
In response to Reply # 42


  

          

but after making a number of threads with undercooked ideas, you would think the OP would figure out how to post.


---------------------------

forcing myself to actually respond to you is like bathing in ebola virus. - Binlahab

Like there is stupid, and then there is you, and then there is dead. - VAsBestBBW

R.I.P. Disco D

  

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Cold Truth
Member since Jan 28th 2004
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51. "“Don't read this post if you do not want to be challenged”"
In response to Reply # 42


  

          

You lead off with that condescending bullshit, talking like you’re on some higher plain of understanding/knowledge/what have you, you’re going to get shit for it.

  

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PoppaGeorge
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53. "especially when the content is remedial at best"
In response to Reply # 51


  

          

and cringe-worthy at worst.


---------------------------

forcing myself to actually respond to you is like bathing in ebola virus. - Binlahab

Like there is stupid, and then there is you, and then there is dead. - VAsBestBBW

R.I.P. Disco D

  

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cgonz00cc
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43. "bilateral symmetry in biology was an adaptation to directional movement"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Lower evolutionary life is symmetrical radially, like a starfish

But when an organism moves in one direction relative to its body ie forward, sensory organs need to be on the end that encounters the environment first, and the structures that allow for locomotion need to be balanced on both sides of the sagittal plane. Basically you have 2 legs so that you dont walk in circles.

2 eyes are necessary for stereoscopic vision, and 2 ears are necessary for balanced audio levels in the brain.

  

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Ted Gee Seal
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47. "I got this in my facebook feed this week:"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

"Atheism will be the next world religion. And the internet is its bible."

Just IMO though.

  

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Allah
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48. "which drugs?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

_______________________
"Arm Leg Leg Arm Hate." c/o desus
_______________________
Divine Ruler
http://www.facebook.com/divineruler
__gigs__
__stuff__

  

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IceburgSmurf
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54. "LMAO this is like a jimmy Kimmel bit where"
In response to Reply # 48


  

          

they ask kids at a festival about made up bands. Pure bullshitting nonsense from most of this posts participants lol

  

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Sarah_Bellum
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57. "Science education is important n/m"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


___________________________________________________________


DJTB YOMM

  

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cgonz00cc
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59. "lol"
In response to Reply # 57


  

          

  

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Starks dunked on Bulls
Member since Dec 07th 2011
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61. "LOL"
In response to Reply # 57


  

          

>
>___________________________________________________________
>
>
>DJTB YOMM

  

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CRichMonkey
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62. "If the weedman had Yelp, this would be an amazing review. "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


my avy: Deep in your heart, you know he's right: http://coreyrichardsonneedsajob.com/
my hustle: http://SupaSoulSounds.com

*RIP: John T. "220v" Richardson, Blessing Benson, and Dilla*

  

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Allah
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64. "PING"
In response to Reply # 62


  

          

_______________________
"Arm Leg Leg Arm Hate." c/o desus
_______________________
Divine Ruler
http://www.facebook.com/divineruler
__gigs__
__stuff__

  

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initiationofplato
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Tue Feb-03-15 10:06 AM

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73. "Okay, that's funny."
In response to Reply # 62


          

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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TheAlbionist
Member since Jul 04th 2011
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63. "You seem to have discovered the concept of opposite."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Opposites come in pairs. That's how they work.

>Life & Death
>Good & Bad
>War & Peace
>Rich & Poor
>Materialist & Spiritualist
>Atheist & Non Atheist

_______________________________

))<>((
forever.

  

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initiationofplato
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Tue Feb-03-15 10:01 AM

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71. "I do not believe "opposites" are possible."
In response to Reply # 63


          

Nothing that is deemed as an opposite can exist independently of the other.

>Opposites come in pairs. That's how they work.
>
>>Life & Death

The relationship between life and death is inseparable. You cannot have Life without Death, and you cannot have Death without Life. They are the same process expressing itself differently. *They cannot exist independently to one another.

>>Good & Bad
>>War & Peace
>>Rich & Poor
>>Materialist & Spiritualist
>>Atheist & Non Atheist
>

In every case, 1 is dependent on the other to exist, so how can they be opposites?

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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TheAlbionist
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Tue Feb-03-15 10:10 AM

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76. "RE: I do not believe "opposites" are possible."
In response to Reply # 71
Tue Feb-03-15 10:12 AM by TheAlbionist

  

          

>Nothing that is deemed as an opposite can exist independently
>of the other.

This is just a failure to understand what an opposite is, surely? The same being can't be both alive and dead, *obviously*, but clearly both states exist in the world. There are living people and corpses. And their bodies are in exactly opposite states from each other.

Clearly white (and I'm talking colours, not skin tones!) is opposite to black. One has all the colour. One has none of the colour. They're opposites. Obviously. Black's not very common, but it exists. White exists all over the place.

Is Yes not the opposite of No? Seriously, what's hard to understand about opposites? I'm obviously missing something.

>>Opposites come in pairs. That's how they work.
>>
>>>Life & Death
>
>The relationship between life and death is inseparable. You
>cannot have Life without Death, and you cannot have Death
>without Life.

Tell that to an immortal jellyfish.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turritopsis_dohrnii

_______________________________

))<>((
forever.

  

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initiationofplato
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77. "That's not what I mean."
In response to Reply # 76


          

>>Nothing that is deemed as an opposite can exist
>independently
>>of the other.
>
>This is just a failure to understand what an opposite is. The
>same being can't be both alive and dead, *obviously*, but
>clearly both states exist in the world. There are living
>people and corpses. And their bodies are in exactly opposite
>states from each other.
>

Death cannot exist independently on it's own. Life cannot exist independently on it's own. The presence of life points to the absence of it. They are in a relationship that cannot be separated into two parts. You cannot have the foreground without the background. Pointing to a corpse and pointing to a living body is identifying the same process at varied states of itself.

We would be unable to identify anything as dead if there was no life to contrast it.

>>>Opposites come in pairs. That's how they work.
>>>
>>>>Life & Death
>>
>>The relationship between life and death is inseparable. You
>>cannot have Life without Death, and you cannot have Death
>>without Life.
>
>Tell that to an immortal jellyfish.
>
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turritopsis_dohrnii
>


"Biological immortality refers to a stable or decreasing rate of mortality from cellular senescence as a function of chronological age. Various unicellular and multicellular species may achieve this state either throughout their existence or after living long enough. A biologically immortal living being can still die from means other than senescence, such as through injury or disease."

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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TheAlbionist
Member since Jul 04th 2011
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Tue Feb-03-15 10:28 AM

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80. "RE: That's not what I mean."
In response to Reply # 77


  

          

>Death cannot exist independently on it's own.

OK.

>Life cannot exist independently on it's own. The presence of life >points to the absence of it.

As the jellyfish shows, if you can continually renew yourself this needn't be the case, but I wasn't being terribly serious with that. Obviously the jellyfish can still be killed.

>They are in a relationship that cannot
>be separated into two parts. You cannot have the foreground
>without the background. Pointing to a corpse and pointing to a
>living body is identifying the same process at varied states
>of itself.

You're correct that an "opposite" situation can't exist without two counterparts. "Opposite" by definition requires two values at either end of a scale.

>
>We would be unable to identify anything as dead if there was
>no life to contrast it.

Obviously.

Again, opposites are opposites. They can't exist without each other. It doesn't stop them being opposites. You're intentionally misconstruing a very simple concept to try and make yourself feel like you've made a discovery.


>"Biological immortality refers to a stable or decreasing rate
>of mortality from cellular senescence as a function of
>chronological age. Various unicellular and multicellular
>species may achieve this state either throughout their
>existence or after living long enough. A biologically immortal
>living being can still die from means other than senescence,
>such as through injury or disease."
>

Invoking the jellyfish was just me having a joke, you don't need to get too hung up on those bits, son.

I think your main problem is in separating individual units with the overall. If you look at the whole universe then obviously life and death both exist because my state of being has no impact on yours. If you look at an *individual*, the only measure of life that matters, obviously only one state can exist at a time.

Because they're opposites.

_______________________________

))<>((
forever.

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
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Tue Feb-03-15 10:37 AM

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85. "I simply do not see it that way."
In response to Reply # 80


          


>>They are in a relationship that cannot
>>be separated into two parts. You cannot have the foreground
>>without the background. Pointing to a corpse and pointing to
>a
>>living body is identifying the same process at varied states
>>of itself.
>
>You're correct that an "opposite" situation can't exist
>without two counterparts. "Opposite" by definition requires
>two values at either end of a scale.
>

Stick with this thought. You said "at two ends of a scale".

The point I am making is that there is only one state, one "Scale" and we observe varying states of it, but ultimately, it is the same and one thing, that is inseparable.

>
>Again, opposites are opposites. They can't exist without each
>other. It doesn't stop them being opposites. You're
>intentionally misconstruing a very simple concept to try and
>make yourself feel like you've made a discovery.

Ugh. Please stop with the psycho analysis. I have spared you from that torment and I treat you with a level of respect not to do that. If I did that, I could insult you as well. It's a primitive form of communication, I will not lower myself to that level.

I am interested in ideas and exploring them. I have no personal interest in exercising the ego. I had a thought which I think is interesting and I wanted to share out of sheer excitement. The fact that out think I did it in order to support a discovery is more telling of how you view yourself and the world, not me.

Look how much time we are wasting just working through the ego. Let's stick with the ideas and leave the personal stuff out of it please. If you are incapable of that, I can simply ignore you because I will not engage in primitive forms of communication.


>
>Invoking the jellyfish was just me having a joke, you don't
>need to get too hung up on those bits, son.
>

I am not your son.

>I think your main problem is in separating individual units
>with the overall. If you look at the whole universe then
>obviously life and death both exist because my state of being
>has no impact on yours. If you look at an *individual*, the
>only measure of life that matters, obviously only one state
>can exist at a time.
>
>Because they're opposites.

I don't have a problem. I am communicating an idea to expand my horizons. Personally, I do not see opposites, it's fine with me that you do. All I wanted to illustrate is that it's the same thing expressing itself at various states of itself.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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TheAlbionist
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Tue Feb-03-15 10:48 AM

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88. "Hmm. I'll try for a little longer."
In response to Reply # 85


  

          

>Stick with this thought. You said "at two ends of a scale".
>
>The point I am making is that there is only one state, one
>"Scale" and we observe varying states of it, but ultimately,
>it is the same and one thing, that is inseparable.
>

A scale isn't a state. It's a scale. A state isn't a scale. It's a state. One is a value, one is a range.

A scale is a hypothetical construct containing all possible values of a property. A state is the value that an *individual* takes on that scale.

They aren't one and the same thing any more than a touchdown and a football pitch are the same or water's boiling point and a thermometer are the same.

_______________________________

))<>((
forever.

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
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Tue Feb-03-15 10:51 AM

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89. "I was using your word to illustrate an idea."
In response to Reply # 88


          

You put Life an Death on the same "scale". You can define "scale" in any way you like. The point is Life & Death are one and the same thing at various states, just like being asleep or awake. You as a human being are capable of being awake, and asleep and you are one and the same thing expressing varied states of the same thing.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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TheAlbionist
Member since Jul 04th 2011
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Tue Feb-03-15 10:59 AM

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90. "Life and Death exist on the same scale, yes."
In response to Reply # 89
Tue Feb-03-15 11:00 AM by TheAlbionist

  

          

At exactly opposite ends of it... making them.... wait for it.... opposites.

>You put Life an Death on the same "scale"

I don't have to put them there, but ok.


> You can define
>"scale" in any way you like.

I'm trying to stick to the standard "English" definition. If we both try and speak the same language, it makes conversation a lot more efficient.

"A graduated range of values forming a standard system for measuring or grading something."

>The point is Life & Death are one
>and the same thing at various states, just like being asleep
>or awake. You as a human being are capable of being awake, and
>asleep and you are one and the same thing expressing varied
>states of the same thing.
>

Well, yes, again, obviously I can be alive or dead or awake or asleep, but I can't be alive and dead or awake and asleep. Because they're opposites. The coin in my pocket has a head side and a tails side, but if I flip it, it can only be one of them.

You still haven't fucked anyone's mind but your own, I'm afraid.

_______________________________

))<>((
forever.

  

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initiationofplato
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Tue Feb-03-15 11:07 AM

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92. "It's just 1 coin. That's my point."
In response to Reply # 90
Tue Feb-03-15 11:18 AM by initiationofplato

          

>
>Well, yes, again, obviously I can be alive or dead or awake or
>asleep, but I can't be alive and dead or awake and asleep.
>Because they're opposites. The coin in my pocket has a head
>side and a tails side, but if I flip it, it can only be one of
>them.

It's just 1 coin.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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TheAlbionist
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Tue Feb-03-15 11:30 AM

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97. "Correct."
In response to Reply # 92


  

          

Can you try and explain your "point" in different words? I couldn't find one in the words you wrote.

_______________________________

))<>((
forever.

  

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initiationofplato
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Tue Feb-03-15 11:31 AM

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98. "Are you serious or being facetious?"
In response to Reply # 97


          

Once again, I don't engage in ego, so I just want to make sure you are being sincere.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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TheAlbionist
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Tue Feb-03-15 11:33 AM

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99. "I'm serious."
In response to Reply # 98


  

          

You've written a lot of words, but you haven't really said... anything... why is this a mindfuck for you?

_______________________________

))<>((
forever.

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
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Tue Feb-03-15 11:39 AM

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102. "Okay cool."
In response to Reply # 99


          

>You've written a lot of words, but you haven't really said...
>anything... why is this a mindfuck for you?

- The Human biology is oddly governed by pairs and sets of two. As I already stated, we have 2 arms, 2 legs, 2 hands, etc.
- Also, our organs function in a relationship of On and Off. Which is another duality. 2 lungs Inhale, and then Exhale. All muscles contract, and expand.

There is an ancient philosophical axiom which states: "As above, so below." and it simply means that the universe as observed in the heavens, is identical as the universe that we experience and interact with on a daily basis, more specifically, the human body.

Ancient mystics believed that the human body is representative of the universe and it's patterns.

- I find it compelling and interesting that our thinking is also governed by dualism: Good & Evil, Light & Dark, Friendly & Unfriendly, Right & Wrong.

- ***What I am curious about is why we are governed by dualism in our thinking.***

- Do our ideas reflect the dualism we have in our biology and are they a direct result of it? In other words, does our biology produce our dual thinking?

If the human body inhales, and exhales, and if our muscles, contract, and expand, is that why we arrived at certain cosmological theories which imply the same relationships in the body of the universe? ie. The universe is expanding, and gravity is contracting. = Dualism.

- Or does it mean that the universe itself is governed by dualism?

- I want to try and understand why we see so many examples of dualism, and why our thinking is governed by it.

- Think about other profound examples: Life & Death, Love & Hate, Heaven & Hell. In almost any relevant instant you will find a relationship governed with a pair.

- Think about all computing. It is also based on an On and Off paradigm: Binary code.

- Our traffic is based on "Stop and Go".

- I want to understand why as I find it incredibly telling.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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TheAlbionist
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Tue Feb-03-15 12:02 PM

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106. "RE: Okay cool."
In response to Reply # 102
Tue Feb-03-15 12:04 PM by TheAlbionist

  

          

>>You've written a lot of words, but you haven't really
>said...
>>anything... why is this a mindfuck for you?
>
>- The Human biology is oddly governed by pairs and sets of
>two. As I already stated, we have 2 arms, 2 legs, 2 hands,
>etc.

1 brain
1 heart
1 liver
1 spleen
1 pancreas
1 penis
1 vagina
1 mouth
1 tongue
1 small intestine
1 large intestine
1 stomach
1 colon
1 pharynx
1 esophagus

Shall I continue or are we just ignoring all the ridiculously important stuff that comes in 1s or other numbers? Just blinkering ourselves to the twos?

>- Also, our organs function in a relationship of On and Off.
>Which is another duality. 2 lungs Inhale, and then Exhale. All
>muscles contract, and expand.

How else could either of those systems work then? Apply Occam's Razor. How else can you get the oxygen from air and lose the carbon dioxide without putting it somewhere, processing it and then spitting out the waste?

We breathe in and out because that's the only way breathing makes sense. If we didn't breathe in we couldn't strip the air of its oxygen. If we didn't breathe out, we'd explode after a few minutes. It's obvious, isn't it?

>
>There is an ancient philosophical axiom which states: "As
>above, so below." and it simply means that the universe as
>observed in the heavens, is identical as the universe that we
>experience and interact with on a daily basis, more
>specifically, the human body.
>
>Ancient mystics believed that the human body is representative
>of the universe and it's patterns.

Ancient mystics believed the world was flat and the stars were gods too. Ancient mystics aren't often the best people to consult in 2015, especially when you're going to try and invoke quantum mechanics.

>
>- I find it compelling and interesting that our thinking is
>also governed by dualism: Good & Evil, Light & Dark, Friendly
>& Unfriendly, Right & Wrong.

Binary choices are easy to deal with. Our brain likes to be reductive in order to increase efficiency and Yes/No 0/1 Good/Bad choices are the easiest to make. Most things have a conceivable opposite and the diametrically opposed nature of them makes deciding much easier than picking our favourite shade of grey.

There's plenty of non binary choices in human life though. Cherry picking the binary ones isn't really terribly fair. Are the most important jobs we do every day binary? Choosing something to eat from a planet full of choice? Picking a mate from 3.5Bn candidates? Choosing an occupation? A favourite subject? A forum to post your musings to? Favourite colour? Your name?


>- ***What I am curious about is why we are governed by dualism
>in our thinking.***

We're not; it's just a particularly common form of thinking.


>
>- Do our ideas reflect the dualism we have in our biology and
>are they a direct result of it? In other words, does our
>biology produce our dual thinking?

A little bit. Our brains are highly evolved to provide us with the simplest view of the world so that we can process such huge amounts of sensory data in such short times. Reducing our choices in some areas to the minimum (you can't have less than two choices) on the more "black and white" issues allows us to spend more time on the choices that exist on "greyer" scales.


>If the human body inhales, and exhales, and if our muscles,
>contract, and expand, is that why we arrived at certain
>cosmological theories which imply the same relationships in
>the body of the universe? ie. The universe is expanding, and
>gravity is contracting. = Dualism.

No. We found those rules by devising experiments and looking at the results. We know the Universe is expanding because of Red Shift... it's not something we dreamed up, it's something we found out. The same cannot be said of your "ancient mystics".


>
>- Or does it mean that the universe itself is governed by
>dualism?

No. In fact, one of the most basic properties of elemental particles (of which something like 17 types exist), their "spin" is anything but binary.


>
>- I want to try and understand why we see so many examples of
>dualism, and why our thinking is governed by it.

It's not, but it can be if you blinker yourself to only thinking about binary choices.

>
>- Think about other profound examples: Life & Death, Love &
>Hate, Heaven & Hell. In almost any relevant instant you will
>find a relationship governed with a pair.

Especially if you are only looking for things that fit this mould. Life and Death is easy. How about "Health"? There's not just "Healthy" and "Unhealthy" is there? It's an almost infinitely complex scale for anyone, isn't it? Lots of our qualities are like that.

_______________________________

))<>((
forever.

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
2420 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 12:39 PM

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107. "RE: Okay cool."
In response to Reply # 106
Tue Feb-03-15 12:57 PM by initiationofplato

          

There are many pairs on the human body, I did not say it was the only thing on the human body, however, you will still find sets of 2 within those organs. I'll list a few instances where this is the case.

>1 brain

-The brains of all species are composed primarily of two broad classes of cells: neurons and glial cells.

-The two neurotransmitters that are used most widely in the vertebrate brain are glutamate, which almost always exerts excitatory effects on target neurons, and gamma-aminobutyric acid (GABA), which is almost always inhibitory.

-There are two types of sleep: REM sleep (with dreaming) and NREM (non-REM, usually without dreaming) sleep, which repeat in slightly varying patterns throughout a sleep episode.

-2 Hemispheres. Brains without 2 hemispheres have been found but they are extremely rare. The consensus is that we have 2.

>1 heart

-1 heart which contracts and expands. The way it works is completely governed by duality.

-The heart has four chambers, two upper atria, the receiving chambers, and two lower ventricle

-Between the left atrium and left ventricle is the mitral valve, also known as the bicuspid valve due to its having two cusps, an anterior and a posterior medial cusp. These cusps are also attached via chordae tendinae to two papillary muscles projecting from the ventricular wall.



>1 liver

-Gross anatomy traditionally divided the liver into two – a right and a left lobe, as viewed from the front (diaphragmatic) surface; but the underside (the visceral surface) shows it to be divided into four lobes and includes the caudate and quadrate lobes.

-Other anatomical landmarks exist, such as the ligamentum venosum and the round ligament of the liver (ligamentum teres) that further divide the left side of the liver in two sections.


>1 pancreas

-The pancreas is a secretory structure with a internal hormonal role (endocrine) and an external digestive role (exocrine). It has two main ducts, the main pancreatic duct, and the accessory pancreatic duct.

>1 penis

-2 testicles. Source of life.


I'll stop here. As you can see, there are many pairs embedded into the anatomy. You can go on and research them yourself. It all depends on how you choose to look at it. You can take it at surface level and all it just a "liver", but on deeper inspection, there are actually 2 lobes, etc.

>
>Shall I continue or are we just ignoring all the ridiculously
>important stuff that comes in 1s or other numbers? Just
>blinkering ourselves to the twos?

I think you should look at those organs in more detail and also look into fractals.

>
>>- Also, our organs function in a relationship of On and Off.
>>Which is another duality. 2 lungs Inhale, and then Exhale.
>All
>>muscles contract, and expand.
>
>How else could either of those systems work then? Apply
>Occam's Razor. How else can you get the oxygen from air and
>lose the carbon dioxide without putting it somewhere,
>processing it and then spitting out the waste?
>
>We breathe in and out because that's the only way breathing
>makes sense. If we didn't breathe in we couldn't strip the air
>of its oxygen. If we didn't breathe out, we'd explode after a
>few minutes. It's obvious, isn't it?

There are other ways to breathe. Certain organisms do not need a mouth or lungs to breathe. There are also 2 lungs in the human body which do the breathing.

The point I am trying to illustrate is, that pairs come up a lot in the human anatomy, and this is reflected in our thinking as well.




>Ancient mystics believed the world was flat and the stars were
>gods too. Ancient mystics aren't often the best people to
>consult in 2015, especially when you're going to try and
>invoke quantum mechanics.

Ugh. Not at all. This is Strawman. You would need to study theology and history in great depth in order to grasp the level of detail and knowledge the ancients had. None of them believed the stars were gods. Gods were allegorical symbols for the super physical forces of nature. That is why you had a god of summer, spring, winter, water, death, etc. You are completely misrepresenting the argument to make it easier to attack, based on completely personal and anecdotal assumptions which have no ground in the actual data.

>
>>
>>- I find it compelling and interesting that our thinking is
>>also governed by dualism: Good & Evil, Light & Dark,
>Friendly
>>& Unfriendly, Right & Wrong.
>
>Binary choices are easy to deal with. Our brain likes to be
>reductive in order to increase efficiency and Yes/No 0/1
>Good/Bad choices are the easiest to make. Most things have a
>conceivable opposite and the diametrically opposed nature of
>them makes deciding much easier than picking our favourite
>shade of grey.
>

So you are an expert on how our brain works? Also, my point is that our thinking is based on dualism. Why it happens neurologically is not what I am investing, I am trying to figure out why we limit ourselves to two choices.

>There's plenty of non binary choices in human life though.
>Cherry picking the binary ones isn't really terribly fair. Are
>the most important jobs we do every day binary? Choosing
>something to eat from a planet full of choice? Picking a mate
>from 3.5Bn candidates? Choosing an occupation? A favourite
>subject? A forum to post your musings to? Favourite colour?
>Your name?

The most profound theories/ideas/realities which govern our lives are built only on pairs.

Life/Death
Freedom/Not Freedom
War/Peace
Expansion/Contraction (Big Bang model: Universe Expands, Gravity Contracts)
etc etc.


>
>We're not; it's just a particularly common form of thinking.
>

We are. You are breathing in, and breathing out. You are considering right and wrong choices, you are considering existence and non existence, you are awake, or asleep. All sets of two!


>
>>If the human body inhales, and exhales, and if our muscles,
>>contract, and expand, is that why we arrived at certain
>>cosmological theories which imply the same relationships in
>>the body of the universe? ie. The universe is expanding, and
>>gravity is contracting. = Dualism.
>
>No. We found those rules by devising experiments and looking
>at the results. We know the Universe is expanding because of
>Red Shift... it's not something we dreamed up, it's something
>we found out. The same cannot be said of your "ancient
>mystics".
>

Once again, the big bang theory was predicted, not found. We have been seeking to prove it ever since, without much conclusive result.


>>- Think about other profound examples: Life & Death, Love &
>>Hate, Heaven & Hell. In almost any relevant instant you will
>>find a relationship governed with a pair.
>
>Especially if you are only looking for things that fit this
>mould. Life and Death is easy. How about "Health"? There's not
>just "Healthy" and "Unhealthy" is there? It's an almost
>infinitely complex scale for anyone, isn't it? Lots of our
>qualities are like that.

Healthy vs. Unhealthy exists.

Either you are healthy or you are not. Simple. I forgot to add. Male & Female. Need I say more? How about X chromosomes, Y chromosomes.

2's, 2's everywhere! Dualism is real. Why.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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TheAlbionist
Member since Jul 04th 2011
3306 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 01:02 PM

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108. "Gotcha, still cherry picking. I tried to engage you."
In response to Reply # 107


  

          

Wildly out of context copy and pastes and nindlessness (healthy or Unhealthy = binary? REALLY? You want to stand by that?!) don't convey personal understanding... you've got so much out of context in that post I can't even decide where to star... if only you'd keep yourself to two idiotic ideas per post my dualist brain might be able to decide.

Out of interest, why are you discussing this on a hiphop forum and not a philosophy one? Having discussed life and existence at length with a father and brother with phds in the subject, a best friend with a PhD in physics and an ex-girlfriend with one in Neuroscience, I'd just love to see how THAT goes. Normally I'm the idiot in these situations, it's nice to be on the other side of the net occasionally, I suppose.

>There many pairs on the human body, I did not say it was
>the only thing on the human body, however, you will still find
>sets of 2 within those organs. I'll list a few instances where
>this is the case.
>
>>1 brain
>
>-The brains of all species are composed primarily of two broad
>classes of cells: neurons and glial cells

>
>-The two neurotransmitters that are used most widely in the
>vertebrate brain are glutamate, which almost always exerts
>excitatory effects on target neurons, and gamma-aminobutyric
>acid (GABA), which is almost always inhibitory.
>
>-There are two types of sleep: REM sleep (with dreaming) and
>NREM (non-REM, usually without dreaming) sleep, which repeat
>in slightly varying patterns throughout a sleep episode.
>
>-2 Hemispheres. Brains without 2 hemispheres have been found
>but they are extremely rare. The consensus is that we have 2.
>
>>1 heart
>
>-1 heart which contracts and expands. The way it works is
>completely governed by duality.
>
>-The heart has four chambers, two upper atria, the receiving
>chambers, and two lower ventricle
>
>-Between the left atrium and left ventricle is the mitral
>valve, also known as the bicuspid valve due to its having two
>cusps, an anterior and a posterior medial cusp. These cusps
>are also attached via chordae tendinae to two papillary
>muscles projecting from the ventricular wall.
>
>
>
>>1 liver
>
>-Gross anatomy traditionally divided the liver into two – a
>right and a left lobe, as viewed from the front
>(diaphragmatic) surface; but the underside (the visceral
>surface) shows it to be divided into four lobes and includes
>the caudate and quadrate lobes.
>
>-Other anatomical landmarks exist, such as the ligamentum
>venosum and the round ligament of the liver (ligamentum teres)
>that further divide the left side of the liver in two
>sections.
>
>
>>1 pancreas
>
>-The pancreas is a secretory structure with a internal
>hormonal role (endocrine) and an external digestive role
>(exocrine). It has two main ducts, the main pancreatic duct,
>and the accessory pancreatic duct.
>
>>1 penis
>
>-2 testicles. Source of life.
>
>
>I'll stop here. As you can see, there are many pairs embedded
>into the anatomy. You can go on and research them yourself. It
>all depends on how you choose to look at it. You can take it
>at surface level and all it just a "liver", but on deeper
>inspection, there are actually 2 lobes, etc.
>
>>
>>Shall I continue or are we just ignoring all the
>ridiculously
>>important stuff that comes in 1s or other numbers? Just
>>blinkering ourselves to the twos?
>
>I think you should look at those organs in more detail and
>also look into fractals.
>
>>
>>>- Also, our organs function in a relationship of On and
>Off.
>>>Which is another duality. 2 lungs Inhale, and then Exhale.
>>All
>>>muscles contract, and expand.
>>
>>How else could either of those systems work then? Apply
>>Occam's Razor. How else can you get the oxygen from air and
>>lose the carbon dioxide without putting it somewhere,
>>processing it and then spitting out the waste?
>>
>>We breathe in and out because that's the only way breathing
>>makes sense. If we didn't breathe in we couldn't strip the
>air
>>of its oxygen. If we didn't breathe out, we'd explode after
>a
>>few minutes. It's obvious, isn't it?
>
>There are other ways to breathe. Certain organisms do not need
>a mouth or lungs to breathe. There are also 2 lungs in the
>human body which do the breathing.
>
>The point I am trying to illustrate is, that pairs come up a
>lot in the human anatomy, and this is reflected in our
>thinking as well.
>
>
>
>
>>Ancient mystics believed the world was flat and the stars
>were
>>gods too. Ancient mystics aren't often the best people to
>>consult in 2015, especially when you're going to try and
>>invoke quantum mechanics.
>
>Ugh. Not at all. This is Strawman. You would need to study
>theology and history in great depth in order to grasp the
>level of detail and knowledge the ancients had. None of them
>believed the stars were gods. Gods were allegorical symbols
>for the super physical forces of nature. That is why you had a
>god of summer, spring, winter, water, death, etc. You are
>completely misrepresenting the argument to make it easier to
>attack, based on completely personal and anecdotal assumptions
>which have no ground in the actual data.
>
>>
>>>
>>>- I find it compelling and interesting that our thinking is
>>>also governed by dualism: Good & Evil, Light & Dark,
>>Friendly
>>>& Unfriendly, Right & Wrong.
>>
>>Binary choices are easy to deal with. Our brain likes to be
>>reductive in order to increase efficiency and Yes/No 0/1
>>Good/Bad choices are the easiest to make. Most things have a
>>conceivable opposite and the diametrically opposed nature of
>>them makes deciding much easier than picking our favourite
>>shade of grey.
>>
>
>So you are an expert on how our brain works? Also, my point is
>that our thinking is based on dualism. Why it happens
>neurologically is not what I am investing, I am trying to
>figure out why we limit ourselves to two choices.
>
>>There's plenty of non binary choices in human life though.
>>Cherry picking the binary ones isn't really terribly fair.
>Are
>>the most important jobs we do every day binary? Choosing
>>something to eat from a planet full of choice? Picking a
>mate
>>from 3.5Bn candidates? Choosing an occupation? A favourite
>>subject? A forum to post your musings to? Favourite colour?
>>Your name?
>
>The most profound theories/ideas/realities which govern our
>lives are built only on pairs.
>
>Life/Death
>Freedom/Not Freedom
>War/Peace
>Expansion/Contraction (Big Bang model: Universe Expands,
>Gravity Contracts)
>etc etc.
>
>
>>
>>We're not; it's just a particularly common form of thinking.
>
>>
>
>We are. You are breathing in, and breathing out. You are
>considering right and wrong choices, you are considering
>existence and non existence, you are awake, or asleep. All
>sets of two!
>
>
>>
>>>If the human body inhales, and exhales, and if our muscles,
>>>contract, and expand, is that why we arrived at certain
>>>cosmological theories which imply the same relationships in
>>>the body of the universe? ie. The universe is expanding,
>and
>>>gravity is contracting. = Dualism.
>>
>>No. We found those rules by devising experiments and looking
>>at the results. We know the Universe is expanding because of
>>Red Shift... it's not something we dreamed up, it's
>something
>>we found out. The same cannot be said of your "ancient
>>mystics".
>>
>
>Once again, the big bang theory was predicted, not found. We
>have been seeking to prove it ever since, without much
>conclusive result.
>
>
>>>- Think about other profound examples: Life & Death, Love &
>>>Hate, Heaven & Hell. In almost any relevant instant you
>will
>>>find a relationship governed with a pair.
>>
>>Especially if you are only looking for things that fit this
>>mould. Life and Death is easy. How about "Health"? There's
>not
>>just "Healthy" and "Unhealthy" is there? It's an almost
>>infinitely complex scale for anyone, isn't it? Lots of our
>>qualities are like that.
>
>Healthy vs. Unhealthy exists.
>
>Either you are healthy or you are not. Simple.
>

_______________________________

))<>((
forever.

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
2420 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 01:11 PM

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109. "How is it out of context? lol"
In response to Reply # 108


          

You said: "1 liver". I showed you that it is made of "2 parts".

How is that out of context? The human anatomy is full of pairs. I did not invent it, I am only observing it.

>Wildly out of context copy and pastes and nindlessness
>(healthy or Unhealthy = binary? REALLY? You want to stand by
>that?!) don't convey personal understanding... you've got so
>much out of context in that post I can't even decide where to
>star... if only you'd keep yourself to two idiotic ideas per
>post my dualist brain might be able to decide.
>

Yes, I will stand by Healthy vs. Unhealthy. There is a level of "unhealthy" that allows us to continue living, because the body is resilient, but it is compromised, and decaying faster as a result, therefore, it is unhealthy.

If you had something to show anything I said was out of context, you would have. You gave up.

"Idiotic?"

If this is too much for you, you don't have to engage. I have never insulted you and will not do that, you don't seem to be capable of the same level of respect. Shrug.

>Out of interest, why are you discussing this on a hiphop forum
>and not a philosophy one? Having discussed life and existence
>at length with a father and brother with phds in the subject,
>a best friend with a PhD in physics and an ex-girlfriend with
>one in Neuroscience, I'd just love to see how THAT goes.
>Normally I'm the idiot in these situations, it's nice to be on
>the other side of the net occasionally, I suppose.

At this point I will choose not to speak with you anymore. Your ego controls your mouth and therefore, you are not capable of respect and love when met with an idea you don't agree with.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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kwez
Member since Aug 10th 2003
11539 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 09:09 AM

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67. "Your choice of "two's" is mad arbitrary and cherry picked at the same ti..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

There are an infinite number of things in the universe that occur in other multiples too.

You chose two hands, two eyes, yet we have one penis. Earth has one moon, our solar system has one sun, multiple planets. Dogs have four legs etc

You're over thinking something that is quite random.

  

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Cold Truth
Member since Jan 28th 2004
41320 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 10:34 AM

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82. "But.. He EATS, and also SHITS!! He DRINKS and PISSES!! GET IT??!!"
In response to Reply # 67


  

          

He sleeps, but can also be awake!!!
His eyes are open, then they're closed!!!
We have DOGS and CATS!!
XBOX and PLAYSTATION!!!
PEPSI AND COKE!!!
HAM AND CHEESE!!
BEANS AND RICE!
WHITE CHICKS AND BLACK DICKS!!

You don't see the dualities at work?

XB

Bro

You're totally missing it

A TV can be off...or on. Except for sleep mode.

Cups are full, or empty. Except when it's not full but there's still something in the cup.




  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
2420 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 10:45 AM

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87. "You're right some of those were incorrect."
In response to Reply # 67
Tue Feb-03-15 10:46 AM by initiationofplato

          

I admitted that I should not have applied duality to all living things, that is obviously erroneous and incorrect. Think of these examples:

Life/Death
Wake/Sleep
Friend/Foe
Exhale/Inhale
Contract/Expand
Existence/Non Existence

Our existence as human beings is governed by duality. Why is what I am wondering.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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Somnus
Member since Jun 25th 2012
3360 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 09:15 AM

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68. "not to add to the dogpile here but I really wish you'd refrain from--"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

mentioning Zen Buddhism so much...

you're giving the practice a bad rap.

________________________________________________

The ULTIMATE negation of everything.

The space between despair and orgasm is hard to fill ~ Maron

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
2420 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 10:07 AM

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74. "Explain."
In response to Reply # 68


          

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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Binlahab
Charter member
182564 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 09:18 AM

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69. "spare me. please nm"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


does it really matter?

Look at that motherfucker, Binlahab! damn i wish I was him - Corey
http://i.imgur.com/phECCMp.jpg

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
2420 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 09:55 AM

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70. "Let's try this again."
In response to Reply # 0


          

1. I am not used to this place. It seems Anger and Insults are the first thing people reach for. Someone let me know that it's just the "nature" of this place and not to take it to heart. I felt overwhelmed by the level of negativity thrown at me yesterday and I took a time out because I do not believe in using anger, as I see it as a mental disease.

2. I am not a person that enjoys insulting others so when it's directed at me, I generally shy away and refuse to engage. Some of you are just impossible to speak to and the only comment I'd like to make is, that your anger will consume you and noone else. Anger is a killer. Be weary of how often you use it.

3. I have read all your responses and there are clearly logical errors in some of the things I said. Especially applying dualism to the biology of all living things which is clearly wrong.

I get excited about ideas and speaking with people about them. I see everything as a learning process, not a competition. I prefer to talk to people who are not experts as they are not quite as shut in and locked to their theories. Most experts are incredibly close minded. Non experts are generally more open to unconventional ideas and I feel a lot more interesting thoughts are produced as a result.

10 years ago, if you told someone the speed of light varies they would have laughed you off the island. More data is emerging which suggests that it does. This is why I don't like sticking to "facts" derived by science, because more often than not, they are not facts, but a phase in the evolution of the idea itself.

http://www.livescience.com/29111-speed-of-light-not-constant.html


About my post. Let me rephrase it.

- The Human biology is oddly governed by pairs and sets of two. As I already stated, we have 2 arms, 2 legs, 2 hands, etc.
- Also, our organs function in a relationship of On and Off. Which is another duality. 2 lungs Inhale, and then Exhale. All muscles contract, and expand.

There is an ancient philosophical axiom which states: "As above, so below." and it simply means that the universe as observed in the heavens, is identical as the universe that we experience and interact with on a daily basis, more specifically, the human body.

Ancient mystics believed that the human body is representative of the universe and it's patterns.

- I find it compelling and interesting that our thinking is also governed by dualism: Good & Evil, Light & Dark, Friendly & Unfriendly, Right & Wrong.

- ***What I am curious about is why we are governed by dualism in our thinking.***

- Do our ideas reflect the dualism we have in our biology and are they a direct result of it? In other words, does our biology produce our dual thinking?

If the human body inhales, and exhales, and if our muscles, contract, and expand, is that why we arrived at certain cosmological theories which imply the same relationships in the body of the universe? ie. The universe is expanding, and gravity is contracting. = Dualism.

- Or does it mean that the universe itself is governed by dualism?

- I want to try and understand why we see so many examples of dualism, and why our thinking is governed by it.

- Think about other profound examples: Life & Death, Love & Hate, Heaven & Hell. In almost any relevant instant you will find a relationship governed with a pair.

- Think about all computing. It is also based on an On and Off paradigm: Binary code.

- Our traffic is based on "Stop and Go".

- I want to, scratch that, need to understand why as I find it incredibly telling.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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Cold Truth
Member since Jan 28th 2004
41320 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 10:23 AM

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78. "Let's not. There's absolutely nothing to what you're saying"
In response to Reply # 70
Tue Feb-03-15 10:26 AM by Cold Truth

  

          

It's not because we're mean.
It's not because we're closed minded.

Further, you're not being insulted out of anger or spite. Actually, that's the clearest indication of your delusion, because nobody is mad at you at all. People are laughing, not screaming.

It's because your premise is laughably simple-minded. You really think this is some deep thinking and that's half the issue. You're delusional, BarTek.

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
2420 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 10:27 AM

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79. "I will say this to you only once."
In response to Reply # 78


          

I do not wish to have any communication with you at all Mark, and after this message, do not waste your time writing to me, as I will never respond again.

I have read some of your other posts and I see how frequently and often you say things to others which speak of a deep and concerning mental issue. ie. Telling people to "kill themselves", etc.

I think you need to seek mental help.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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MiracleRic
Member since Oct 21st 2002
45200 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 10:32 AM

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81. "he's telling the truth"
In response to Reply # 79


  

          

nobody is angry over what you are saying

unless of course simple-minded thoughts expressed as wisdom really grinds their gears...

and anger is still the wrong emotion...annoyance, sure...disdain, absolutely

the message is laughable...easily disproved...and a thought that occurs to your average (pre)teen and is later disregarded bc well...u learn things that prove it to be gibberish

nothing worth anger...annoyance at the fact that you really think you've discovered something mindfucking like the world is flat in the 21st century

Let me sport my Air Hyperbole 2010s in peace. (c) ansomble

Building repetoires (c) spm since 1983

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
2420 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 10:42 AM

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86. "Truth is relative."
In response to Reply # 81


          

>nobody is angry over what you are saying
>

Negativity and insults are products of anger and insecurity.


>unless of course simple-minded thoughts expressed as wisdom
>really grinds their gears...

Think of me as a kid in a play pen with building blocks. I am humble enough to be thought of as inferior because it does not matter to me. I am not interested in my ego or exercising it. I simply want you to play blocks with me.

Healthy debate is sharing ideas which conflict with one another and working through them to learn something. There is absolutely no need to be mean to someone if they say something you don't agree with.

Furthermore, my ideas are mind f*ckery to me whether or not you like it. I have a right o be mind f*cked by anything I want. You are not my thought police and you shouldn't try to act as it. It's just rude.

>
>the message is laughable...easily disproved...and a thought
>that occurs to your average (pre)teen and is later disregarded
>bc well...u learn things that prove it to be gibberish
>

It's definitely not laughable if you open your mind. Dualism is a real thing and I want to understand why it exists. Why are we governed by dualism? Why do all our best ideas built on dualism? Think about it. It is profound to think that in a universe with no limits, our best ideas and concepts are built on simple duality. Is that not a mind f*ck to you?

Life/Death
Wake/Sleep
Friend/Foe
Exhale/Inhale
Contract/Expand
Existence/Non Existence

All profound examples of duality which govern all our lives. Why just duality?

>nothing worth anger...annoyance at the fact that you really
>think you've discovered something mindfucking like the world
>is flat in the 21st century

That is your ego speaking friend.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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DaHeathenOne76
Member since May 11th 2003
29357 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 11:29 AM

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96. "You began the entire post with rudeness"
In response to Reply # 86


          

"Don't read this post if you do not want to be challenged. Leave now."

But you will only perceive this as negative and insulting.
*****************************************
huh

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
2420 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 11:35 AM

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100. "I apologize if that offended you."
In response to Reply # 96


          

>"Don't read this post if you do not want to be challenged.
>Leave now."

I thought it was a cheeky disclaimer, perhaps too cheeky.I like to think outside of the box as often as possible. I don't mind if I am wrong, the point is the exercise to share ideas and have fun.

I do not think I am better/smarter than anyone else, nor am I seeking validation for something so boring. I believe in unity, in one energy. I believe you and I are the same thing expressing itself differently and I just want to share ideas and the excitement it gives me.

I have a feeling this forum is used to a lot of hostility and argument/fighting.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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Cold Truth
Member since Jan 28th 2004
41320 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 11:51 AM

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104. "Coloring outside the lines doesn't make one creative"
In response to Reply # 100


  

          

more often than not, people seem to 'color outside the lines/think outside the box/go against the grain/etc' just to do it, as though merely being different is a virtue.

Said people are often so bullish in their outside-the-box-ness that they challenge conventional thinking just because it's conventional thinking.
Frankly, ost people who think they’re esoteric are really just people trying to stand out. Often enough, this is nothing more than overcompensating by people who never fit in to begin with. The best way to deal with rejection from the mainstream is to become the alternative, and absolutely everything about what you’re doing reflects that. Further, you presented a half baked idea if there ever was one.

Seriously, your entire premise can be summed up this way:

ISN’T IT CRAZY THAT A LOT OF SHIT COMES IN TWOS? I MEAN, COME ON, THINK ABOUT IT!

  

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Cold Truth
Member since Jan 28th 2004
41320 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 10:35 AM

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83. "lol, who the fuck is Mark?"
In response to Reply # 79
Tue Feb-03-15 10:39 AM by Cold Truth

  

          

Oh, and I love how you cherry picked the kill yourself shit like that's something I say to *people* and not just one guy who wouldn't leave me alone.....A situation that has since been squashed, by the way.

So.....yeah.

  

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MiracleRic
Member since Oct 21st 2002
45200 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 10:37 AM

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84. "he does that when someone calls him Bartek"
In response to Reply # 83


  

          

i dunno if that's bartek being brilliant or if this guy doesn't realize that we've already had a character play this part

Let me sport my Air Hyperbole 2010s in peace. (c) ansomble

Building repetoires (c) spm since 1983

  

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Boogie Stimuli
Member since Sep 24th 2010
13089 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 11:16 AM

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94. "Two mind-blowing words: one heart"
In response to Reply # 0


          

~
~
~
~
~
"Until you get outta my way, I don't wanna hear what you say aye aye"

  

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TheAlbionist
Member since Jul 04th 2011
3306 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 11:26 AM

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95. "You tell that to Doctor Who."
In response to Reply # 94


  

          

>

_______________________________

))<>((
forever.

  

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Deadzombie
Member since Aug 21st 2008
13358 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 11:53 AM

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105. "but, but - there are FOUR quadrants!"
In response to Reply # 94


          

  

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Case_One
Charter member
54575 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 11:36 AM

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101. "I have a genuine question. What were you expecting to happen here?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Seriously. You've been here a while and based on the time and experience, what did you expect to happen in this post?

.
.
.
"Today is your day to have a better life -- it's your right."

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
2420 posts
Tue Feb-03-15 11:40 AM

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103. "To be honest, I didn't think anyone would read it."
In response to Reply # 101


          

I have not been here for too long. I only really started posting this year. I was not a daily reader prior to that.

I did not expect the hostility.

~Experience is the currency of the soul.

  

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