Printer-friendly copy Email this topic to a friend
Lobby Pass The Popcorn Pass The Popcorn Archives topic #105153

Subject: "Black folks - On: Racial Cheerleading in the Arts" This topic is locked.
Previous topic | Next topic
k_orr
Charter member
80197 posts
Sun Jun-24-07 07:41 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy listClick to send message via AOL IM
"Black folks - On: Racial Cheerleading in the Arts"


  

          

"Ooh, A black person's involved, I gotta support".

For most regular black people, as opposed to okp's, this is how they operate.

Dancing with the Stars
Bad Summer Movies, hell movies in general
Black people in an extreme sport.
Music that isn't hip hop/R&B (Tvotr, Bloc Party, Living Colour BAd Brains)
The Lion King on Broadway

To cheerlead is the default for the black mass.

For the elites (or outkasts, depending on how you look at it) they often have to walk a tight rope between, not cheering for wack shit, and not looking like a sell out (or feeling weird cause erebody got the new tyler perry/r.kelly/zane and is loving it) Most of the time they end up on some bathroom dread locks steez talkin bout how they don't eat pork and watch Soul Plane, but are up on every episode of Sex and the City.

And then you've got the anti-elite elites, who have an ironic/pathological embrace of black culture, but appreciate it at a "different" level, despite despising a lot of material that they feel insults their intelligence, or promotes the same traditional wisdom that has got us in this mess in the 1st place. They find themselves @ a cross roads when they watch a series like the Wire, and find out it's mostly a white writing staff.

Is there a 3rd way?

What do you see as the 3rd way?

one
k. orr

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top


Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
Don't know, but I'm the second one, no fronting.
Jun 24th 2007
1
If it's good, it's good. If it's bad, it's bad. Period.
Jun 24th 2007
2
i like this
Jun 25th 2007
30
      i'd rather just not support crap in general.
Jun 25th 2007
31
      and thats the bottom line
Jun 26th 2007
67
      supporting crap is supporting crap, regardless of color.
Jun 25th 2007
33
money...this isn't fucking art. it's business.
Jun 25th 2007
3
RE: money...this isn't fucking art. it's business.
Jun 25th 2007
7
so the masses of black movie goers LIKED rushmore?
Jun 25th 2007
8
      What masses of white movie goers LIKED rushmore?
Jun 26th 2007
84
Do you REALLY "support" all black films?
Jun 26th 2007
83
      And why not?
Jun 27th 2007
87
      buy a ticket and go see something else...it's that simple
Jun 27th 2007
91
           RE: buy a ticket and go see something else...it's that simple
Jun 27th 2007
101
I came in here to mention TVOTR and Bloc Party
Jun 25th 2007
4
TVOTR is a perfect example.
Jun 25th 2007
28
*and* I was riding for JUMP TOMORROW
Jun 25th 2007
34
      didn't *love* Jump Tomorrow but 'Jorge' was great!
Jun 25th 2007
35
      it was one, though, that I thougth deserved cheerleading
Jun 25th 2007
41
      i love JUMP TOMORROW
Jun 25th 2007
44
I liked Bloc Party before I knew what their racial makeup was.
Jun 25th 2007
60
is there room in this discussion for Tyler Perry?
Jun 25th 2007
5
ha... basically, that's what it's ALL about.
Jun 25th 2007
6
      yup...that's what it's all about for me...black folk gettin MONEY
Jun 25th 2007
9
           do you also buy every CD made by Black people?
Jun 25th 2007
10
                black musicians experiencing some kinda drought?
Jun 25th 2007
11
                     is it anyone's fault that some of these moves are SO bad
Jun 25th 2007
12
                     you failed the moment you assumed that i do this:
Jun 25th 2007
13
                          RE: you failed the moment you assumed that i do this:
Jun 25th 2007
14
                               again... you make a lot of wrong assumptions here.
Jun 25th 2007
17
                                    in lieu of going in circles, i'll just say: i own cowboy troy's CD
Jun 25th 2007
20
                                         great.
Jun 25th 2007
21
                                              yeah, i bought that bullshit
Jun 25th 2007
22
third way = man up, like what you like, fuck the next man...
Jun 25th 2007
15
as for tyler perry, bsags got it...
Jun 25th 2007
16
and that makes them 'progressive'? LOL
Jun 25th 2007
18
      progressive = judging art on their own merits, not the next man's...
Jun 27th 2007
95
           this romantication of 'ghetto' Blacks is so bizarre.
Jun 27th 2007
96
RIGHT!!!
Jun 25th 2007
19
      because *you* make it a race thing
Jun 25th 2007
36
      No, *HE* isn't
Jun 25th 2007
38
      this is what I am referring to:
Jun 25th 2007
50
           Your "we are the world" act is tiresome, wrong, and sad.
Jun 25th 2007
55
      you don't care about white folk except to watch their shitty movies
Jun 25th 2007
45
           you and OE make this mistake all the time.
Jun 25th 2007
51
                You aren't actually making a point, like, at all.
Jun 25th 2007
53
                     it's a simple rebuttal, Mr. Strawman.
Jun 25th 2007
57
                     Exactly, what, is your point?
Jun 25th 2007
58
                          haha, okay then.
Jun 25th 2007
59
                     other ethnic whites do this?
Jun 28th 2007
106
                          Sorta. Kind complicated.
Jun 28th 2007
107
                               I dunno. like, you mentioned Irish & Italians mostly as the others
Jun 28th 2007
108
                                    That's exactly what I meant by sorta complicated.
Jun 28th 2007
109
                                         RE: That's exactly what I meant by sorta complicated.
Jun 29th 2007
111
      you didn't like Undercover Brother?
Jun 26th 2007
77
The key word Bags used was "equality."
Jun 25th 2007
23
very good point...a lot of white people enjoy "black" humor
Jun 25th 2007
24
for the record, Will Ferrel kinda embarrasses me
Jun 25th 2007
32
Speaking on behalf of all whites :)
Jun 25th 2007
25
I agree and that's what I was trying to say.
Jun 25th 2007
26
quick sidenote: Hav Plenty wasn't very good n/m
Jun 26th 2007
64
but is it the white "Tenenbaums" crowd...
Jun 26th 2007
68
Couldn't you call "Friday" the black "Clerks"
Jun 26th 2007
85
I agree with Bags + This post is sorta retarded.
Jun 25th 2007
27
these niggas is slave heads, man
Jun 25th 2007
29
this is just way off base.
Jun 25th 2007
37
      WRONG!!!!!! BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!
Jun 25th 2007
42
      RE: WRONG!!!!!! BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!
Jun 25th 2007
56
      here's the thing about about good, effective racism
Jun 26th 2007
65
      ^^^^^the truth
Jun 26th 2007
66
      ^^^SENSE
Jun 27th 2007
92
      Can't you support these films and admit their flaws?
Jun 27th 2007
94
           this is why i fucks with the soulhonkey....'tegrity & common ass sense
Jun 27th 2007
98
           ^^^COMBUSTIBLE
Jun 27th 2007
100
      As a sidenote ...
Jun 26th 2007
69
      No matter how many times you say it, they won't listen.
Jun 25th 2007
46
           it's besides the point...
Jun 25th 2007
47
           LMAO !!!! Resorting to STRAWMEN = Powerful L-dom.
Jun 25th 2007
49
lol at hip hop/r&b. in 2007 they are damn near the same thing.
Jun 25th 2007
39
I don't know if this is a third way, but
Jun 25th 2007
40
This is a good & important topic but it's already a shouting match n/m
Jun 25th 2007
43
Pretty much. *sigh* n/m
Jun 25th 2007
61
you heard that Fitzgerald quote?
Jun 26th 2007
82
be an individual
Jun 25th 2007
48
all this sexual tension is really getting me excited.
Jun 25th 2007
52
all u do is ask rhetorical questions...
Jun 25th 2007
54
This is on a tangent but..I like artists.
Jun 26th 2007
62
Why can't I just like something?
Jun 26th 2007
63
interesting side question(s): restaurants
Jun 26th 2007
70
shitty analogies aren't gonna solve anything...support black films
Jun 26th 2007
71
      DeNiro has a track record of quality.
Jun 26th 2007
72
      *sigh* playing right into his hands. nm
Jun 26th 2007
74
      i love how spike's history been rewritten in the last 5-7 years
Jun 26th 2007
75
      ha ha
Jun 26th 2007
73
These PTP pundits need to MAKE SOMETHING.
Jun 26th 2007
76
do you really think that OK Artists aren't dropping as much material
Jun 26th 2007
78
Alright, I see your point on the marketing.
Jun 26th 2007
80
      did they all really take breaks or did they have other issues
Jun 27th 2007
90
           The average rapper comes back the next year or so.
Jun 27th 2007
97
                Yeah, the ball was dropped...
Jun 27th 2007
103
I've done work. Others here have too.
Jun 26th 2007
79
      RE: I've done work. Others here have too.
Jun 26th 2007
81
           RE: I've done work. Others here have too.
Jun 27th 2007
86
                RE: I've done work. Others here have too.
Jun 27th 2007
99
                Late Edit....
Jun 27th 2007
104
                     RE: Late Edit....
Jun 29th 2007
110
I just came in to say I agree with OE & Basaglia...good night
Jun 27th 2007
88
bottom line: its entertainment.
Jun 27th 2007
89
But black people aren't allowed to entertain.
Jun 27th 2007
93
No to the music thing
Jun 27th 2007
102
RE: Black folks - On: Racial Cheerleading in the Arts
Jun 27th 2007
105

ActWon
Member since May 01st 2007
3290 posts
Sun Jun-24-07 08:09 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
1. "Don't know, but I'm the second one, no fronting."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

bignick
Charter member
24054 posts
Sun Jun-24-07 08:42 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
2. "If it's good, it's good. If it's bad, it's bad. Period."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

And the sooner black folks let go of that bullshit theory that they have to support crap just because said crap was manufactured by someone of color, the sooner the art can actually progress.

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
UncleClimax
Charter member
13786 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 12:29 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
30. "i like this"
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

>And the sooner black folks let go of that bullshit theory
>that they have to support crap just because said crap was
>manufactured by someone of color, the sooner the art can
>actually progress.

on point. however, i think that if u have white crap and black crap, u should sooner support the black crap..but yeah.

__________________
http://twitter.com/theloniousfunk
http://havetravelled.blogspot.com
http://instagram.com/arsonwelles

“Be uncomfortable; be sand, not oil, to the machinery of the world.”
- Gunter Eich

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

        
Orfeo_Negro
Member since Oct 24th 2004
20923 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 12:34 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
31. "i'd rather just not support crap in general."
In response to Reply # 30


  

          


>on point. however, i think that if u have white crap and
>black crap, u should sooner support the black crap..but yeah.

but i feel you.

________________

"Do you know what a nerd is? A nerd is a human being without enough Africa in him or her." © Brian Eno, "A Year With Swollen Appendices"

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

            
JAESCOTT777
Member since Feb 18th 2006
28484 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 12:51 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
67. "and thats the bottom line"
In response to Reply # 31


  

          

no one else makes (*insert ethnic group*) movies

they just make movies
and what ever their affiliation was
its just what it was

we are some of the only ones who are on that steez



  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

        
disco dj
Charter member
84260 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 01:21 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
33. "supporting crap is supporting crap, regardless of color."
In response to Reply # 30


  

          

.

______________



http://www.windimoto.com


http://ten2one.wordpress.com/ <-FEB

http://wallpapershi.net/wallpapers/2012/01/boba-fett-star-wars-star-wars-boba-fett-movie-anime-1080x1920.jpg

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49462 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 05:47 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
3. "money...this isn't fucking art. it's business."
In response to Reply # 0
Mon Jun-25-07 05:50 AM by Basaglia

  

          


all i care about is that black filmmakers keep getting opportunities. and if the shit that sells starts tanking, these niggas who wanna see "quirky" black movies are outta their fucking minds if they think those kinds of movies will start getting greenlighted more often. all these black folks, in front and behind the camera, gonna lose jobs...and for what? 'cause some smarty art niggas didn't like "white girls" or "madea"? fucking niggas, man...FUCKIN NIGGAS!!! always holding each other back with the stupidest fuckin shit!!!

is it that painful to admit that the masses of black people don't fucking like rushmore and don't care to see a black version of rushmore?

^^^nobody...cares...nigga. black folk don't wanna see it!!!

these dudes talk all this shit and don't see akeelah and the bee. i can't get over it. talking about it was heavyhanded...LIKE ALL RON HOWARD'S SHIT AIN'T HEAVYHANDED, WITH HIS STUPID ASS "CRY NOW" MUSIC!!!

what's kills me is that black folks who like tyler perry shit and the wayans brothers ain't fucking with nobody...they pay to have a good time. if they like it...SO? you MAD because they like it? you can hate all you want, but don't sit there and look down on them for liking what they like, because they don't give a shit if you like borat, which MOST black people find fucking stupid.

as far as i'm concerned, none of these niggas can say shit to me because i support ALL black films...ALL OF THEM! because there should be a place of good and bad black filmmakers, just as there is a place for good and bad white ones. BECAUSE THAT'S FUCKING EQUALITY!!! that's the way it SHOULD be!!!

i'll tell you what: when the next akeelah or the visit comes out and y'all naysaying ass niggas don't go see it, we gonna talk about it.

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
Brother_Afron
Member since Jul 06th 2003
3812 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 07:28 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
7. "RE: money...this isn't fucking art. it's business."
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

>
> all these black folks,
>in front and behind the camera, gonna lose jobs...and for
>what? 'cause some smarty art niggas didn't like "white girls"
>or "madea"? fucking niggas, man...FUCKIN NIGGAS!!! always
>holding each other back with the stupidest fuckin shit!!!
>>>>>

I was hoping that this was sarcasm. Really.


>is it that painful to admit that the masses of black people
>don't fucking like rushmore and don't care to see a black
>version of rushmore?
>
>^^^nobody...cares...nigga. black folk don't wanna see it!!!
>

Imus?

Fun is the new gritty

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

        
Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49462 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 07:49 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
8. "so the masses of black movie goers LIKED rushmore?"
In response to Reply # 7


  

          

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

            
SoulHonky
Member since Jan 21st 2003
25919 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 11:47 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
84. "What masses of white movie goers LIKED rushmore?"
In response to Reply # 8


          

Wes Anderson is a niche director. The Life Aquatic made 24 million. It's not like people in Middle America are loving his films.

----
NBA MOCK DRAFT #1 - https://thecourierclass.com/whole-shebang/2017/5/18/2017-nba-mock-draft-1-just-lotto-and-lotta-trades

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
professor
Member since Dec 30th 2003
645 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 11:35 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
83. "Do you REALLY "support" all black films?"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

So you paid to go see Soul Plane...and Akila and the Bee?

If so, I'm impressed, because that would mean your tastes are way more diverse than mine, for sure. But you do know how Hollywood works when it comes to producing movies, right?

If a 'Soul Plane-type' movie sells tickets, the studios green light more soul planes. On the other handl, if Akila and the Bee sells tickets, they will green light more Akila and the Bees. Which means that since you support EVERY black movie, your "votes" don't help determine what types of black movies will get green lit in the future because they cancel one another out. But for real...

No one can like both Madea's Family Reunion AND Malcolm X. With that said, I guess you can force yourself to sit through every black movie ever made to express your "race consciousness." This is America.

Even in the moments when we are most dissatisfied, we are living someone's idea of heaven.

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

        
KCPlayer21
Charter member
30076 posts
Wed Jun-27-07 12:37 AM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
87. "And why not?"
In response to Reply # 83


  

          

>No one can like both Madea's Family Reunion AND Malcolm X.

I actually own both flicks on DVD and enjoyed them very much.....




I finally joined the crowd: http://www.myspace.com/kc2atl - Add me, I need some friends.....

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

        
Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49462 posts
Wed Jun-27-07 09:06 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
91. "buy a ticket and go see something else...it's that simple"
In response to Reply # 83


  

          

however, i saw soul plane. awful.

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

            
professor
Member since Dec 30th 2003
645 posts
Wed Jun-27-07 03:42 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
101. "RE: buy a ticket and go see something else...it's that simple"
In response to Reply # 91


  

          

Now I am with this, and have done it on rare occasion. Don't know why I don't do it more. Oh wait a minute, yes I do - since I bought my movie projector 2 years ago I don't go to the movies very often.

I buy a lot of dvds now, though.

Even in the moments when we are most dissatisfied, we are living someone's idea of heaven.

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

Science_Fiction
Charter member
42096 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 06:20 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
4. "I came in here to mention TVOTR and Bloc Party"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

though in fairness a lot of people genuinely like them.
but i tend to look at kids who wouldnt ordinarily fuck with indie froth at the mouth over them, with skepticism.

*****************
With all due respect...
ask around.

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
bignick
Charter member
24054 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 11:56 AM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
28. "TVOTR is a perfect example."
In response to Reply # 4


  

          

They're just a great fucking band. I ride for them just like I ride for Radiohead, Mars Volta or My Morning Jacket.

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

        
REDeye
Charter member
6598 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 01:46 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
34. "*and* I was riding for JUMP TOMORROW"
In response to Reply # 28


          

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0273300/

*pulls up "Ambulance" on the mp3 player*

RED
http://arrena.blogspot.com

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

            
Orfeo_Negro
Member since Oct 24th 2004
20923 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 01:51 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
35. "didn't *love* Jump Tomorrow but 'Jorge' was great!"
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

________________

"Do you know what a nerd is? A nerd is a human being without enough Africa in him or her." © Brian Eno, "A Year With Swollen Appendices"

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                
REDeye
Charter member
6598 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 02:40 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
41. "it was one, though, that I thougth deserved cheerleading"
In response to Reply # 35


          

Because most people didn't know it existed.

I never told anyone it was the greatest movie ever, but it was very charming. The overall tone of the movie left me with a nice, warm feeling.

RED
http://arrena.blogspot.com

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

            
Nettrice
Charter member
61747 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 03:00 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
44. "i love JUMP TOMORROW"
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

.

<--- Blame this lady for Nutty.

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
kurlyswirl
Member since Jul 13th 2002
16693 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 11:09 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy listClick to send message via AOL IM
60. "I liked Bloc Party before I knew what their racial makeup was."
In response to Reply # 4


  

          

So there. lol

~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~


kurly's Super-Duper Awesome DVD Collection:
http://kurlyswirl.dvdaf.com/owned

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

Science_Fiction
Charter member
42096 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 06:21 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
5. "is there room in this discussion for Tyler Perry?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

ie - lauding mediocrity(at best) because a "Black Man is Getting Money and Doing His Thing".

*****************
With all due respect...
ask around.

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
Orfeo_Negro
Member since Oct 24th 2004
20923 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 07:07 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
6. "ha... basically, that's what it's ALL about."
In response to Reply # 5


  

          

see: Basaglia's foaming-at-the-mouth reply above

________________

"Do you know what a nerd is? A nerd is a human being without enough Africa in him or her." © Brian Eno, "A Year With Swollen Appendices"

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

        
Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49462 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 07:50 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
9. "yup...that's what it's all about for me...black folk gettin MONEY"
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

            
Orfeo_Negro
Member since Oct 24th 2004
20923 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 07:55 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
10. "do you also buy every CD made by Black people?"
In response to Reply # 9
Mon Jun-25-07 07:58 AM by Orfeo_Negro

  

          

.

________________

"Do you know what a nerd is? A nerd is a human being without enough Africa in him or her." © Brian Eno, "A Year With Swollen Appendices"

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                
Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49462 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 08:01 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
11. "black musicians experiencing some kinda drought?"
In response to Reply # 10


  

          


every avenue you try to take to rationalize why you will GO FIND OUT how bad a "white" movie is, while dismissing a "black" one during the trailer, will fucking fail.

you have no excuse.

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                    
Science_Fiction
Charter member
42096 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 08:06 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
12. "is it anyone's fault that some of these moves are SO bad"
In response to Reply # 11
Mon Jun-25-07 08:06 AM by Science_Fiction

  

          

that they make you shrink in your seat when the trailer comes on?
i dont need to go to rottentomatos.com when i can see one in front of me.

*****************
With all due respect...
ask around.

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                    
Orfeo_Negro
Member since Oct 24th 2004
20923 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 08:08 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
13. "you failed the moment you assumed that i do this:"
In response to Reply # 11


  

          

>every avenue you try to take to rationalize why you will GO
>FIND OUT how bad a "white" movie is, while dismissing a
>"black" one during the trailer, will fucking fail.

i DON'T waste good money to "find out" how bad a white movie is... i dismiss them the same way i dismiss bad Black movies.

and i find that i'm rarely wrong about it, too.

as for your comment about a drought of Blacks in the music industry... it just shows how naive you are, really.

the fact that there's a million niggas making CDs doesn't mean that Blacks are *really* "making money," which is supposedly your primo concern. it just means that there's a lot of niggas putting out bullshit that a lot of people support, for some reason.

if you were *really* as 'bout it as you claim to be, you would go out of your way to support Black indie artists, Black-owned labels, and (dare i say) Jay-Z!

________________

"Do you know what a nerd is? A nerd is a human being without enough Africa in him or her." © Brian Eno, "A Year With Swollen Appendices"

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                        
Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49462 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 08:22 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
14. "RE: you failed the moment you assumed that i do this:"
In response to Reply # 13


  

          

>>every avenue you try to take to rationalize why you will GO
>>FIND OUT how bad a "white" movie is, while dismissing a
>>"black" one during the trailer, will fucking fail.
>
>i DON'T waste good money to "find out" how bad a white movie
>is... i dismiss them the same way i dismiss bad Black movies.
>
>and i find that i'm rarely wrong about it, too.

suffice it to say, you've seen more bad white movies in the last, say, five years than black bad ones...even relative to the amount produced during that span. so, don't say "well, they make more white films" fuck outta here...i KNOW you go see bullshit movies, because MOST movies are bullshit...and nigga, you got to the fuckin moves.

>as for your comment about a drought of Blacks in the music
>industry... it just shows how naive you are, really.
>
>the fact that there's a million niggas making CDs doesn't mean
>that Blacks are *really* "making money," which is supposedly
>your primo concern. it just means that there's a lot of niggas
>putting out bullshit that a lot of people support, for some
>reason.

"for some reason" = they like it. get over it. neither of us like tyler perry, but the difference is you seem determined for hustle to STOP. you actually want people to stop seeing his shit...and for you to try to be a fucking weasel and put his shit on par with wack ass rappers who ain't bout shit and sell bullshit that white folks dance to is disgusting. tyler shit might be corny and "embarrassing" for you, but it's not degrading black women ya weasely fucker.

>if you were *really* as 'bout it as you claim to be, you would
>go out of your way to support Black indie artists, Black-owned
>labels, and (dare i say) Jay-Z!

you're a moron. i own every jay-z album...most of which i BOUGHT. not my fault he went at the general and lost.

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                            
Orfeo_Negro
Member since Oct 24th 2004
20923 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 08:32 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
17. "again... you make a lot of wrong assumptions here."
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

>suffice it to say, you've seen more bad white movies in the
>last, say, five years than black bad ones...even relative to
>the amount produced during that span. so, don't say "well,
>they make more white films" fuck outta here...i KNOW you go
>see bullshit movies, because MOST movies are bullshit...and
>nigga, you got to the fuckin moves.

first of all: i don't go to the movies THAT much these days.

almost 90% of my movie-watching is done on DVD.

and i'd say that over the past 5 years i've watched more bad Black movies than white because i used to think like you... i'm more likely to end up watching a bad Black movie because while i dismiss a white joint for being bullshit right off the top, i could wind up watching the Black flick because it got some chicks with fat asses in it or some shit.

but bullshit is stil bullshit, and a few fat asses are not worth my loot.


>"for some reason" = they like it. get over it. neither of us
>like tyler perry, but the difference is you seem determined
>for hustle to STOP. you actually want people to stop seeing
>his shit...

again, another stupid assumption on your part.

i've NEVER said that i want people not to watch Tyler Perry's shit. in fact, i've said may times on this board that i admire his hustle.

but if you ask me if i think he is a good filmmaker, am i supposed to LIE about it?


and for you to try to be a fucking weasel and put
>his shit on par with wack ass rappers who ain't bout shit and
>sell bullshit that white folks dance to is disgusting. tyler
>shit might be corny and "embarrassing" for you, but it's not
>degrading black women ya weasely fucker.

LOL again... please, try to see through your menstrual hysteria and stick to things that I ACTUALLY HAVE SAID.

m'kay?

>>if you were *really* as 'bout it as you claim to be, you
>would
>>go out of your way to support Black indie artists,
>Black-owned
>>labels, and (dare i say) Jay-Z!
>
>you're a moron. i own every jay-z album...most of which i
>BOUGHT. not my fault he went at the general and lost.

well... i hope you bought that nigga Cowboy Troy's CD, too... there's a drought of Black people in country music, so we've got to support the few that we got in there!

________________

"Do you know what a nerd is? A nerd is a human being without enough Africa in him or her." © Brian Eno, "A Year With Swollen Appendices"

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                                
Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49462 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 08:39 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
20. "in lieu of going in circles, i'll just say: i own cowboy troy's CD"
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                                    
Orfeo_Negro
Member since Oct 24th 2004
20923 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 08:40 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
21. "great."
In response to Reply # 20


  

          

at least i gotta give you props for being dedicated, even if i don't agree with the principle behind that dedication.

you did BUY the CD, right? you didn't get it as a promo?

________________

"Do you know what a nerd is? A nerd is a human being without enough Africa in him or her." © Brian Eno, "A Year With Swollen Appendices"

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                                        
Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49462 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 08:44 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
22. "yeah, i bought that bullshit"
In response to Reply # 21


  

          

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

Torez
Charter member
19262 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 08:24 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy listClick to send message via AOL IM
15. "third way = man up, like what you like, fuck the next man..."
In response to Reply # 0
Mon Jun-25-07 08:32 AM by Torez

  

          

and take race out of the criteria.

i really don't think this becomes
a problem until people try to
prostelytize what they like...

i watched buffy and angel for years,
but knew full well that was not no
shit to go blow up the barbershop
with. (and that was cool with me)

the problem only comes when the
naive black person is INFURIATED
that folks don't like what they
look, because they wanna 'share
the experience'

like what you like, and k.i.m.

(shit, i thought lucky louie
was wild funny, but i don't judge
black folks who dont...)

WWW.TYPEILLYPRESS.COM <-- buy product
http://blog.myspace.com/mtorez <--- recent exploits

<--- SOUTHSIDE NEFERTITI # 3
art by PENCILISM (ye'en ready!)

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
Torez
Charter member
19262 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 08:31 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy listClick to send message via AOL IM
16. "as for tyler perry, bsags got it..."
In response to Reply # 15


  

          

and it dovetails nicely
into my point, which is
that the THIRD WAY is
for folkst to stop viewing
art relative to 'other'
black folks, and just watch
what they like and k.i.m.

in that way, 'ghetto' black
people are actually much more
progressive than art elitists,
cause they are supporting the
stuff they like and spend no
time at all overtly hating on
the stuff art elites like.

as bsags said, mugs around the
way don't give a cripple crab
fuck about who liked TO SLEEP
WTIH ANGER. They went to see
PHATGIRLZ and kept it moving.

The only time they have a problem
is when art elites come hotting
the spot up, basically telling
them they are stupid because
of what they like, or that
they are too slow to 'get'
DAUGHTERS OF THE DUST.

the third way = like what you like, fuck the next man.
WWW.TYPEILLYPRESS.COM <-- buy product
http://blog.myspace.com/mtorez <--- recent exploits

<--- SOUTHSIDE NEFERTITI # 3
art by PENCILISM (ye'en ready!)

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

        
Orfeo_Negro
Member since Oct 24th 2004
20923 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 08:34 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
18. "and that makes them 'progressive'? LOL"
In response to Reply # 16


  

          

you're always flinging that argument around here.... and it STILL rings false to me.

________________

"Do you know what a nerd is? A nerd is a human being without enough Africa in him or her." © Brian Eno, "A Year With Swollen Appendices"

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

            
Torez
Charter member
19262 posts
Wed Jun-27-07 02:22 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy listClick to send message via AOL IM
95. "progressive = judging art on their own merits, not the next man's..."
In response to Reply # 18


  

          

not progressive = fucking with something YOU
like, and then judging another large subset
of a population because they don't.

and then calling them less intelligent
because of it.

WWW.TYPEILLYPRESS.COM <-- buy product
http://blog.myspace.com/mtorez <--- recent exploits

<--- SOUTHSIDE NEFERTITI # 3
art by PENCILISM (ye'en ready!)

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                
Orfeo_Negro
Member since Oct 24th 2004
20923 posts
Wed Jun-27-07 02:47 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
96. "this romantication of 'ghetto' Blacks is so bizarre."
In response to Reply # 95


  

          

whenever these discussions pop up, we always end up with this exquisitely rendered characterization of "ghetto" or "regala" Black people as being serene, progressive people who would never EVER dream of dissing things they don't like.

"they just deal with the shit they like and leave everything else alone."

riiiiiiiiight.

________________

"Do you know what a nerd is? A nerd is a human being without enough Africa in him or her." © Brian Eno, "A Year With Swollen Appendices"

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49462 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 08:36 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
19. "RIGHT!!!"
In response to Reply # 15
Mon Jun-25-07 08:45 AM by Basaglia

  

          

these niggas keep coming with this "i just don't like it" shit...THAT'S FINE!!! but, save the "black folks can do better" BULLSHIT!!! why *YOU* bitchmade niggas gotta make it a race thing?

not liking it is one thing, but shitting on the collective taste of black movie goers is some bullshit.

i say again: black folk don't wanna see a black version of that wes anderson shit. accept that shit and move the fuck on, bitches. it wasn't a good feeling when i took my ex to see igby goes down, and she fucking hated it, but SHE BLACK!!! i understand her disdain. not my fault she fucked wit undercover brother either...like MOST black folk.

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

        
REDeye
Charter member
6598 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 01:54 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
36. "because *you* make it a race thing"
In response to Reply # 19


          

>these niggas keep coming with this "i just don't like it"
>shit...THAT'S FINE!!! but, save the "black folks can do
>better" BULLSHIT!!! why *YOU* bitchmade niggas gotta make it a
>race thing?

White folks could do better, too. But I don't care about them.

>not liking it is one thing, but shitting on the collective
>taste of black movie goers is some bullshit.

I shit on the collective tastes of all audiences, but I don't care if whites support crap. I'm worrying about my people first.

RED
http://arrena.blogspot.com

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

            
Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52927 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 02:20 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
38. "No, *HE* isn't"
In response to Reply # 36


  

          


He is actually arguing that black people don't have
a copyright on bad taste.

That, in fact, there is very little different about the races
in this regard.


Same way black and white people both kill and massacre.


Same way some of us(both) are ignorant and superficial.


The reason it *IS* about race is that me(and I'm willing to bet,
Bags) have been fucked with on BEHALF of the fact that someone
WHITE(or Tom-ish) BELIEVED THE STEREOTYPE.


The anatomy of the "Blacks like dumb movies" theory is
similar to the anatomy of any negative stereotype of blacks:


Its comprised of an awkward ability for every black
individual to pay the piper for negative things committed
by every other black.


White people don't have that burden, which is why being
white kicks ass, small dick and all.


Blacks allegedly have bad movie taste because of some bad,
ignorant black movies that are somewhat successful.


Whites don't, even though Hollywood is in shambles largely
because of white people.


*shrugs*


No, it doesn't make sense, and yes, its unfair.









>>these niggas keep coming with this "i just don't like it"
>>shit...THAT'S FINE!!! but, save the "black folks can do
>>better" BULLSHIT!!! why *YOU* bitchmade niggas gotta make it
>a
>>race thing?
>
>White folks could do better, too. But I don't care about
>them.
>
>>not liking it is one thing, but shitting on the collective
>>taste of black movie goers is some bullshit.
>
>I shit on the collective tastes of all audiences, but I don't
>care if whites support crap. I'm worrying about my people
>first.
>
>RED
>http://arrena.blogspot.com


----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                
REDeye
Charter member
6598 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 04:12 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
50. "this is what I am referring to:"
In response to Reply # 38


          

From a post above:

"as far as i'm concerned, none of these niggas can say shit to me because i support ALL black films...ALL OF THEM! because there should be a place of good and bad black filmmakers, just as there is a place for good and bad white ones. BECAUSE THAT'S FUCKING EQUALITY!!! that's the way it SHOULD be!!!"

He supports black films BECAUSE they are black.

RED
http://arrena.blogspot.com

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                    
Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52927 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 04:44 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
55. "Your "we are the world" act is tiresome, wrong, and sad."
In response to Reply # 50


  

          

>He supports black films BECAUSE they are black.

Because blacks, as of now, don't have the SAME opportunity.

Your whole "we are the world" act is not going to cure racism
in Hollywood.

Going out of your way to address what's wrong with Hollywood, and
people going out of their way to support actors/actresses and films
where under-represented groups are staring/prominent, IS how we're
going to fix the race problem in Hollywood.


----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

            
Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49462 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 03:01 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
45. "you don't care about white folk except to watch their shitty movies"
In response to Reply # 36


  

          

>>these niggas keep coming with this "i just don't like it"
>>shit...THAT'S FINE!!! but, save the "black folks can do
>>better" BULLSHIT!!! why *YOU* bitchmade niggas gotta make it
>a
>>race thing?
>
>White folks could do better, too. But I don't care about
>them.
>
>>not liking it is one thing, but shitting on the collective
>>taste of black movie goers is some bullshit.
>
>I shit on the collective tastes of all audiences, but I don't
>care if whites support crap. I'm worrying about my people
>first.
>
>RED
>http://arrena.blogspot.com

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                
REDeye
Charter member
6598 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 04:13 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
51. "you and OE make this mistake all the time."
In response to Reply # 45


          

I don't watch shitty white movies either.

RED
http://arrena.blogspot.com

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                    
Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52927 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 04:42 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
53. "You aren't actually making a point, like, at all."
In response to Reply # 51


  

          


>I don't watch shitty white movies either.

I'm not exactly sure who and what you're arguing for, or against,
actually.

You are saying....what?

That we shouldn't let the race of the cast and writers dictate
what we support?


Is that it?


I'm not going to respond again until you are CLEAR because
up until now, you're just advancing arguments and them retreating
to a "we are the world" perspective.


Unless you're just hitting us with the naive "We shouldn't focus on
race in order to fix racism" which is sorry, naive, and wrong.


If Hollywood is racist, and doesn't permit persons of certain
backgrounds to have the SAME chance of success, than Basaglia is
correct:

We have to GO OUT OF OUR WAY to support filmmakers and
films where these groups are represented.

Like I said:

Its the same shit the Jews and other ethnic whites do.









  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                        
REDeye
Charter member
6598 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 05:19 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
57. "it's a simple rebuttal, Mr. Strawman."
In response to Reply # 53


          

>
>>I don't watch shitty white movies either.
>
>I'm not exactly sure who and what you're arguing for, or
>against,
>actually.

You and Bags say I support bad white movies. I'm saying I don't. Why is that not clear? Does it interfere with your ability to lump everyone in the same group? Remember, I'm also the one who doesn't like Tarantino.

>
>You are saying....what?
>
>That we shouldn't let the race of the cast and writers
>dictate
>what we support?
>
>
>Is that it?
>
>
>I'm not going to respond again until you are CLEAR because
>up until now, you're just advancing arguments and them
>retreating
>to a "we are the world" perspective.

I was very clear in my post down near the bottom, directly replying to the original post. If I think a movie is bad, I don't support it no matter who made it or who is in it. But if it is a black movie that I think is good, I go out of my way to champion it and tell everyone to support it.

I don't think supporting movies I think are bad helps anyone.

Is that clear enough?

RED
http://arrena.blogspot.com

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                            
Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52927 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 05:46 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
58. "Exactly, what, is your point?"
In response to Reply # 57


  

          


Other than saying:

"O_E and Bags, you know I'm not one of the people that
you're talking about"

What, really, are you contributing to my life?

Really?

>You and Bags say I support bad white movies.

Uh. O_E didn't say anything of the sort, thank you
very much.

I'm saying that a lot of white people support bad movies
and their repeated support is never charged to their RACE.

Such is not the case for black people.

I mean, seriously, STFU.

>I'm saying I
>don't. Why is that not clear? Does it interfere with your
>ability to lump everyone in the same group? Remember, I'm also
>the one who doesn't like Tarantino.

Uh.

Not every single white person on earth needs to carry
out the act of being unfair in how they label films for
me or Bags' points to hold

I mean, please: Stop thinking like a child.




>I was very clear in my post down near the bottom, directly
>replying to the original post. If I think a movie is bad, I
>don't support it no matter who made it or who is in it. But if
>it is a black movie that I think is good, I go out of my way
>to champion it and tell everyone to support it.

That isn't very far from what I said, in which case I don't
understand why you ever responded to me at all.


>I don't think supporting movies I think are bad helps anyone.

But you *DO* support black movies that are good both
because of the goodness AND blackness.

That makes you a lot more like Basaglia than you think.


And makes you a lot like me.





----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                                
REDeye
Charter member
6598 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 06:29 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
59. "haha, okay then."
In response to Reply # 58


          

>But you *DO* support black movies that are good both
>because of the goodness AND blackness.
>
>That makes you a lot more like Basaglia than you think.

Which is what I said in post #37. You responded to that post, but somehow missed that.


>And makes you a lot like me.

Which I freely admit. We want the same thing, just differ on how to get there.

RED
http://arrena.blogspot.com

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                        
40thStreetBlack
Charter member
26666 posts
Thu Jun-28-07 12:52 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
106. "other ethnic whites do this?"
In response to Reply # 53


  

          

>We have to GO OUT OF OUR WAY to support filmmakers and
>films where these groups are represented.
>
>Like I said:
>
>Its the same shit the Jews and other ethnic whites do.

Jews maybe. I dunno about the rest.


<----- Long Live The King

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                            
Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52927 posts
Thu Jun-28-07 01:09 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
107. "Sorta. Kind complicated."
In response to Reply # 106


  

          


I could say lots about it, but mostly Jews
do it in film.

Other ethnic whites do support the hell out of
each other in many areas, entertainment being one
area.









  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                                
40thStreetBlack
Charter member
26666 posts
Thu Jun-28-07 01:31 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
108. "I dunno. like, you mentioned Irish & Italians mostly as the others"
In response to Reply # 107
Thu Jun-28-07 01:38 PM by 40thStreetBlack

  

          

as far as films go, Irish Americans don't seem to really even support GOOD Irish films like that, let alone bad ones.

with Italians it's a little different; Scorcese, Coppola, Pacino & De Niro (who ironically is acually of as much Irish descent as Italian) are *American* icons, not just Italian ones, so it kindof skews that a bit. And I don't know how to judge how much Italians support bad Italian stuff. but I recall there were a bunch of Italian American organizations that were protesting the Sopranos saying it portrayed negative stereotypes of Italians, so they have that internal backlash element too (I guess if Bags was Italian he would be calling them hanky-head goombas - LOL)


so as far as films/TV go, I dunno. but in general terms of them supporting their own in many areas, yeah of course.


<----- Long Live The King

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                                    
Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52927 posts
Thu Jun-28-07 06:18 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
109. "That's exactly what I meant by sorta complicated."
In response to Reply # 108


  

          


>as far as films go, Irish Americans don't seem to really
>even support GOOD Irish films like that, let alone bad ones.

Yep.

>with Italians it's a little different; Scorcese, Coppola,
>Pacino & De Niro (who ironically is acually of as much Irish
>descent as Italian) are *American* icons, not just Italian
>ones, so it kindof skews that a bit.

Sure, but I actually worked at a movie theatre when 'Bronx Tale'
came out and every single Italian person from the Bronx came
to see that movie. Every single American person didn't.

I mean, again, its sort of complicated because there are lots
of confounding factors there and a direct parallel can't
quite be drawn. I could sketch out each element, but the
payoff wouldn't be big enough, given that none of my
arguments hinges on that little detail.

I'm willing to just say I should have been clearer or not
said it.

And I don't know how to
>judge how much Italians support bad Italian stuff. but I
>recall there were a bunch of Italian American organizations
>that were protesting the Sopranos saying it portrayed negative
>stereotypes of Italians, so they have that internal backlash
>element too (I guess if Bags was Italian he would be calling
>them hanky-head goombas - LOL)

Yep! They sure do. Funny thing is, their internal backlash
contingency is faaaaaaar less visible than "ours."

Our absolutely most educated, and wealthiest are the ones
who author the backlashes.

Much of the Italian community's backlashers do so for
Catholic reasons and stuff(not to say there aren't some
parallels...its just sorta complicated).



>so as far as films/TV go, I dunno. but in general terms of
>them supporting their own in many areas, yeah of course.


Yeah, that's sort of what I meant. The post was about "the arts."

I was extrapolating it to entertainment as a whole. Everyone
ethnically cheerleads in some way, shape, or form.

It isn't any worse when black people do it. Thats all I'm saying.

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                                        
40thStreetBlack
Charter member
26666 posts
Fri Jun-29-07 02:19 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
111. "RE: That's exactly what I meant by sorta complicated."
In response to Reply # 109


  

          

>>as far as films go, Irish Americans don't seem to really
>>even support GOOD Irish films like that, let alone bad ones.
>
>Yep.

yeah I don't get that.

... actually I do: most Irish-Americans today are fully integrated and assimilated into mainstream middle-class America; shit, the majority of them are Republicans now (*vomits*) So outside of singing Danny Boy and eating corned beef & cabbage on St. Patty's day, most don't really have an 'ethnic' identity in any meaningful sense anymore and have just become... average white-bread Americans (*sheds single tear*)



>Sure, but I actually worked at a movie theatre when 'Bronx
>Tale'
>came out and every single Italian person from the Bronx came
>to see that movie. Every single American person didn't.

of course, that was a story about their specific neighborhood by a guy from the neighborhood. but Italians nationwide didn't come out to see it like that, and the movie lost money even though it was a very good film. but generally speaking, with the Godfather, Goodfellas, Casino, etc. movies, Americans all across the board go to see them. so yeah it is hard to draw direct parallels here.



>I mean, again, its sort of complicated because there are lots
>of confounding factors there and a direct parallel can't
>quite be drawn. I could sketch out each element, but the
>payoff wouldn't be big enough, given that none of my
>arguments hinges on that little detail.
>
>I'm willing to just say I should have been clearer or not
>said it.

oh I mean in general terms yeah I know what you are saying and agree. in terms of films though, yeah it is sort of complicated, for the above reasons and others.


>Yep! They sure do. Funny thing is, their internal backlash
>contingency is faaaaaaar less visible than "ours."
>
>Our absolutely most educated, and wealthiest are the ones
>who author the backlashes.
>
>Much of the Italian community's backlashers do so for
>Catholic reasons and stuff(not to say there aren't some
>parallels...its just sorta complicated).

yeah it's mostly those Knights of Columbus type organizations.

it was funny, they even addressed this issue in the Sopranos one time, Dr. Melfi and her family were discussing it over dinner & her ex-husband was like "you don't see the Scots-Irish complaining that they were portrayed as violent gunfighters and cattle rustlers in old Westerns, so why should it bother us?" Layers upon layers of parallels - LOL.

>>so as far as films/TV go, I dunno. but in general terms of
>>them supporting their own in many areas, yeah of course.
>
>
>Yeah, that's sort of what I meant. The post was about "the
>arts."
>
>I was extrapolating it to entertainment as a whole. Everyone
>ethnically cheerleads in some way, shape, or form.
>
>It isn't any worse when black people do it. Thats all I'm
>saying.

yeah I know & I agree with that. the specific issue here though is about cheerleading for wack shit that you know is wack just because it's your people. where I think the parallels don't match up with other groups is that they have more opportunities to produce a wider variety of material, so when they support their stuff they aren't pigeonholed for just cheering the low-brow stuff. But because the studios disproportionately greenlight & produce that type of fare wrt black movies, when black folks go out and support black movies they do get pigeonholed for it.

so yeah it's not any worse when black people do it, but that unfairly becomes the perception. as for what the solution to that is, I don't know. there really aren't any easy answers I don't think.


<----- Long Live The King

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

        
40thStreetBlack
Charter member
26666 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 06:59 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
77. "you didn't like Undercover Brother?"
In response to Reply # 19


  

          

>understand her disdain. not my fault she fucked wit undercover
>brother either...like MOST black folk.

that shit was funny man.


<----- Long Live The King

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

Gemini_Two_One
Charter member
11542 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 10:04 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
23. "The key word Bags used was "equality.""
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I don't think most black people that criticized Tyler Perry hate him as much as they hate the fact that his movies get green lighted while movies like Hav Plenty are few and far between. Most people regardless of race like simple, entertaining, movies. Most quirky white movies have a small audience, but since they are the majority in this country their small audience still brings in more money. Now, the question I have is this...white people people will watch "Big Momma's House", but I doubt they would see a Black version of "The Royal Tenenbaums".....why is that? I know plenty of black people who support quirky, independent films. I bet the same white people who love "Clerks" would not watch a similar movie with a black cast.


!sig!
www.myspace.com/gemini2one

When a White kills a Black, it's Riot time.
When a Black kills a White, it's execution time.
When a Black kills a Black, it's Miller time!
- Good Old Jesse Jackson

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49462 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 10:34 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
24. "very good point...a lot of white people enjoy "black" humor"
In response to Reply # 23
Mon Jun-25-07 10:36 AM by Basaglia

  

          

same as a lot of black folk like dry ass slice of life white comedies.

i just dunno why grown ass black folk still gettin "embarrassed" or "cringe" when they see a trailer for a black movie.

your big grown ass sitting there scared to smile because some niggas smiling on that screen and groovin to a frankie beverly track...AS IF black folk don't fuckin smile when frankie dogg come on dat stereo.

do white people cringe when white comic actors sing fucking neil diamond while smiling, you piece of shit? spade and ferrell didn't embarrass no white folk. slave head ass niggas.

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

        
tappenzee
Member since Sep 28th 2002
19839 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 12:52 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
32. "for the record, Will Ferrel kinda embarrasses me"
In response to Reply # 24


  

          

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
PolarbearToenails
Charter member
11197 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 11:24 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy listClick to send message via AOL IM
25. "Speaking on behalf of all whites :)"
In response to Reply # 23


  

          

I dunno if I buy that line of reasoning.

I would say if 75% of the population of this country is white, and 10% or 15% is black, that means that there are five times as many white people. So if you make a film for a niche within that white audience, you have five times as much potential audience as if you made it for the same niche in the black audience. It's a numbers game.

-
Bullseye with Jesse Thorn
A public radio show about things that are awesome.
http://www.maximumfun.org
"This is the kind of show people listen to in a more perfect world." - McSweeney's

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

        
Gemini_Two_One
Charter member
11542 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 11:35 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
26. "I agree and that's what I was trying to say."
In response to Reply # 25


  

          

when I said, "Most quirky white movies have a small audience, but since they are the majority in this country their small audience still brings in more money."


!sig!
www.myspace.com/gemini2one

When a White kills a Black, it's Riot time.
When a Black kills a White, it's execution time.
When a Black kills a Black, it's Miller time!
- Good Old Jesse Jackson

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
Bombastic
Charter member
88863 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 01:45 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
64. "quick sidenote: Hav Plenty wasn't very good n/m"
In response to Reply # 23


  

          

.

www.somethinginthewudder.com

https://twitter.com/nostrabombus

https://www.facebook.com/matt.koelling.96

https://www.instagram.com/something_in_the_wudder/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/matt-koelling-438a803?trk=hp-identity-name

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
Mynoriti
Charter member
37576 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 02:14 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
68. "but is it the white "Tenenbaums" crowd..."
In response to Reply # 23


  

          

...who are running out to see Big Momma's House, or is it everyone else? aka the majority who already like shitty movies.

>I know plenty of black
>people who support quirky, independent films. I bet the same
>white people who love "Clerks" would not watch a similar movie
>with a black cast..

This is where you're on point. reminds me of what David Simon said regarding the The Wire, and white america's discomfort with getting into a show with a predominantly black cast. Something along the lines of how most well meaning americans are comfortable with *some* diversity in their neighborhoods, and white americans being comfortable with them being up to around 7% black... but once they start passing 10%, discomfort sets in and for sale signs pop up. Putting aside the way The Wire is structured, white folks simply find it "too black".

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
SoulHonky
Member since Jan 21st 2003
25919 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 11:53 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
85. "Couldn't you call "Friday" the black "Clerks""
In response to Reply # 23


          

People hanging out all day with nothing to do? I think a lot of the Clerks crowd loved that movie.

----
NBA MOCK DRAFT #1 - https://thecourierclass.com/whole-shebang/2017/5/18/2017-nba-mock-draft-1-just-lotto-and-lotta-trades

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52927 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 11:43 AM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
27. "I agree with Bags + This post is sorta retarded."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


From what I'm reading, this is nothing more than a
classic double standard(but what the fuck else
is new):

When blacks support comedies that are *allegedly* unfunny,
that support sticks to the race, as if there is something
specific about blackness, and its culture, that facilitates
the support of the unfunny comedy. In this situation the
suggested solution is a cultural one, that is, black people need to
stop supporting unfunny, or "coonish" comedy.

White people, however, are immune to such cultural
"stickiness" -- When legions of white people like
dumbshit(as they do all the fucking time) its written off as random,
not "stuck" to their whiteness specifically, and so no pundit
is around to talk about how white people need to improve
their taste in movies(when, again, they like just as much dumbass
shit as anyone else).


Black pundits(like BigNick in PTP), on the other hand,
endlessly bitch and moan about black people's propensity to
support substandard nonsense. These people are idiots,
of course, because black people aren't any more close-minded,
actually, than white people.

Lest you don't believe that, tell me how successful the black
version of '300' was(hypothetical, of course).

Lol. It was never made. The white '300', however, was a smashing
box office success.


This despite the fact that it was a horrid, expensive movie with no
redeeming value of any kind other than the guts and fights(and the
fights still weren't any better choreographed than the fights in all them
other epic movies).

That, and the film had nothing to do with black people(except for the
persian african nigga with the light eyes who got kilt).

Even better, its success had nothing to do with black people.

White people funded, and saw, that horrific nonsense.


Upon its great success, I saw no punditry about white people's
lack of appreciation for good scripts and stories.


Its quite odd then how I saw dozens of criticisms of black taste in
films when 'Hustle and Flow' became somewhat of a commercial
success("Why do we worship pimps??!!!!!")



Not to mention that conversations like these tend to be hegemonic
in terms of defining what is artistic or funny versus what isn't -- I thought
'Sideways' was the biggest bunch of horeshit in the universe. I found
none of it funny, or relevant, or interesting, at all. I'd rather see 'Little
Man' three times than have to see half of that movie again.


Now, I wish a motherfucker would say I have a bad taste in films
because of it.

And I dare someone call the writers of 'Sideways' more "artistic"
than the Wayans brothers.


What would be the justification of such?


Lol.


Because the 'Sideways' writers know about wine?



Fuck outta here, really.



In the end, Bags is right because its all about opportunity.

Black people are no worse for ethnic self-promotion than
ethnic whites(Italians, and Irish mostly) and Jews are.

The latter three do the shit faaaar more than black people in
general, and that ethnic self-promotion is directly responsible
for their success in various fields(including entertainment).


That being the case, yes, O_E does support black, latino,
and asian films and filmmakers, and will continue to do
so, in large part because of the lack of equal opportunity.


I also support minority films and fillmakers because the
PROBABILITY that their comedy is something I can *dig* or
relate to is often quite high, that is, assuming the film is
made fairly well.


I thought 'American Beauty' and 'Sideways' were D+ fims at best,
and yes, the white maleness of both of those films likely had something
to do with the fact that I couldn't relate. Now, certainly there are blacks
who did relate to both. Good for them.

I didn't.

I'm very educated, so you can't pull that card(for people who simply
say that only intelligent people *got* Sideways).

I just happen to be very black, and raised very
lower-middle class/poor, and am in love with every
second of it.


That being the case, there is comedy that by PROBABILITY might
relate to my demographic more than some.

Its not absolute.

I think a lot of black films are retarded.

I also think some white films are retarded.

It becomes interesting when the world(i.e.. Golden Globe people,
Academy people, internet film crowd) has tastes far different than
mine.

Instead of feeling inferior for being different, I've decided to strike
back and ask why *THEY* thought that 'Feeling Minnesota' was a good
movie. I can't, for the life of me, think of why.


Instead of chastizing BLACK people for liking "bad" or "non artistic"
or "substandard" films, we need to ask why WHITE people have
established such a hegemony over what is artisitc and considered
"sophisticated".

I still can't get any of you to tell me what was great about
'Sideways', for example.


Your reasons are as arbitrary, and baseless, as my reasons for
liking 'Little Man'.



And I'm smart enough to defend my stance, probably better than
you can defend yours.



Mang.





----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49462 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 12:28 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
29. "these niggas is slave heads, man"
In response to Reply # 27


  

          

these niggas supposed to be so enlightened and progressive, but can't see that they have a problem when they place limitations on what black can do to provoke laughter, while laughing their heads off at two white men putting their fucking dicks in each others faces for laughs.

if "borat" were same fuckin movie but had egdoubki botoobi from fuckin gabon, these fake high-brow niggas would just fuckin die of shock when the trailer came on in front of their white friends.

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
REDeye
Charter member
6598 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 02:18 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
37. "this is just way off base."
In response to Reply # 27


          

This is all nullified because some seriously off-base assumptions and flat-out errors.

The "pundits" around here are constantly saying that ALL audiences need to start supporting better movies.

The question, of course, comes down to a disagreement of what is a better movie.

Perhaps you missed all the critics, white and otherwise, in the press all last year bitching and moaning about the quality of movies. Perhaps you missed them this year bitching about the crappy summer movies. Perhaps you miss them constantly complaining about the irrelevance of the film critic because no matter how bad the reviews are, audiences are still going to see these bad movies. They aren't talking just about White Girls and Tyler Perry movies (which, in case you haven't noticed, have been getting better and better reviews).

You'll have a hard time proving that the "pundits" around here are criticizing bad black movies while supporting bad white movies -- because it's not true. People like Bignick and I have said time and time again that ALL audiences need to stop supporting ALL bad movies.

You just disagree with us about what is a bad movie. But, really, we don't disagree that much. We all want better for black people, specifically in regards to entertainment industry. We just have different ideas about how to go about it.

RED
http://arrena.blogspot.com

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

        
Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52927 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 02:41 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
42. "WRONG!!!!!! BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!"
In response to Reply # 37


  

          



>The "pundits" around here are constantly saying that ALL
>audiences need to start supporting better movies.

Right, but never, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, do I hear
anyone, ever, talk about the bad movie tastes of WHITE
audiences specifically. I hear black pundits foaming at the
mouth in this regard all the time.

Read on...

>Perhaps you missed all the critics, white and otherwise, in
>the press all last year bitching and moaning about the quality
>of movies. Perhaps you missed them this year bitching about
>the crappy summer movies. Perhaps you miss them constantly
>complaining about the irrelevance of the film critic because
>no matter how bad the reviews are, audiences are still going
>to see these bad movies. They aren't talking just about White
>Girls and Tyler Perry movies (which, in case you haven't
>noticed, have been getting better and better reviews).

Thanks for the strawman, but Tyler Perry flicks needn't be
the only films getting bad reviews for my stance to hold:


White people, or white culture, is never CHARGED with having
bad taste on account of there being unsuccessful, bad, terrible
white movies.


Black people, as a culture, ARE charged.


Just ask BigNick. He's CONSTANTLY complaining about the
poor taste of blacks based on what he believes to be bad
movies about, and starring, black people.

I'm saying this is WRONG for TWO reasons:

a) Using the (white)consensus standards for what good movies
are(which is the one we generally all use, black or white, conservative
or liberal), that black people liked WHITE GIRLS is no more telling for
the state of the RACE than white people liking '300'.


b)Why use the (white)consensus standards for good movies at all?

American Beauty?

Sideways?


Lol.

Those movies fucking SUCK, in my very non-white consensus view.

Belly?

White Girls?


Brilliant. Both of them.

Neither received a lot of critical acclaim.

The latter was called "coonish" by snobby
blacks.




I'm right.


>You'll have a hard time proving that the "pundits" around here
>are criticizing bad black movies while supporting bad white
>movies -- because it's not true. People like Bignick and I
>have said time and time again that ALL audiences need to stop
>supporting ALL bad movies.

Well then give yourself a goddamn medal, Ghandi.

Problem is:

a)I never actually said that the world, and the boards, are full of
evil crackers and uncle toms who laud 'Freddy Got Fingered' and
chastice 'White Girls'


b)That phantom argument doesn't have to the case for me(and Bags')
central argument to hold:

Do you *EVER* hear *ANYONE* talk about the poor movie tastes
of *WHITE* people S-P-E-C-I-F-I-C-A-L-L-Y???







Of course you don't.








Well,


People do the shit about BLACK MOVIE TASTES
S-P-E-C-I-F-I-C-A-L-L-Y all the time.



BigNIck and LOTS of others do it. There's a generation of black
artists who are generally just player haters, but also are
self-proclaimed vanguards who feel oppressed and sling
bad things at black people. This brand of black artist
is increasing in frequency and popularity. Stanley Crouch
is sort of their Ronald Regan. White people absolutely
love them, because they are black and chastize black art
and tastes with veracity.



One of Bags points was that these dickheads are
no more PROFOUND than the "ignorant" black who supports
Wayans films. This is because self-proclaimed vanguard black man
simply BOUGHT the consensus white view for what is good/funny,
without putting his/her very viewpoints under the microscope.


I mean, I read Stanley Crouch's review of 'Pulp Fiction'.


I'm smarter than he is, and can say that was the biggest
bunch of horseshit I've ever read in my life. I laughed my
ass off. It was perhaps the most wordy and nonsensical
review of the film ever.

I respect people who say "Hey O_E, I liked Pulp Fiction
because the shit was entertaining."


Crouch was writing all this shit about racial commentary,
and how brilliant was. Of course, he did that solely to
please white people. This is the crowd me and Bags are
referring to.


>You just disagree with us about what is a bad movie. But,
>really, we don't disagree that much. We all want better for
>black people, specifically in regards to entertainment
>industry. We just have different ideas about how to go about
>it.

Now, how is that?


How can we get better films for black people?


How can we get more oppotunities for black people?


How?


Black women STILL get no fucking roles and have to do
porn to get oscars.

Denzel and Will are STILL the only two black actors who get scripts
that aren't necessarily written for blacks.



I mean, Hollywood is really, really, really, really a fucked up + racist
place, man.




It really is.




Now, I'm saying that we need to do something OTHER THAN
blame BLACK movie-going tastes to fix it.




WHITE people need to be held responsible for that shit TOO.




And if WHITE people can make a hit movie with two dudes
putting each others assholes in each others faces, than black
people should be able to do the same. Not only that, we should
able to do it, and get the same box office purse, and critical acclaim.

(one of the oddities is how everyone *got* the social commentary in
'Borat' but didn't get it in 'White Girls' when the commentary in 'White
Girls' was perhaps, more profound. The Wayans Bros, of course, were
getting yts back for the minstrel tradition. Borat, on the other hand,
told us how ignorant white people are. I think the former is at least
as thoughtful as the latter).


----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

            
REDeye
Charter member
6598 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 05:09 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
56. "RE: WRONG!!!!!! BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!"
In response to Reply # 42


          

>
>
>>The "pundits" around here are constantly saying that ALL
>>audiences need to start supporting better movies.
>
>Right, but never, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, do I
>hear
>anyone, ever, talk about the bad movie tastes of WHITE
>audiences specifically. I hear black pundits foaming at the
>mouth in this regard all the time.
>
>Read on...
>
>>Perhaps you missed all the critics, white and otherwise, in
>>the press all last year bitching and moaning about the
>quality
>>of movies. Perhaps you missed them this year bitching about
>>the crappy summer movies. Perhaps you miss them constantly
>>complaining about the irrelevance of the film critic because
>>no matter how bad the reviews are, audiences are still going
>>to see these bad movies. They aren't talking just about
>White
>>Girls and Tyler Perry movies (which, in case you haven't
>>noticed, have been getting better and better reviews).
>
>Thanks for the strawman, but Tyler Perry flicks needn't be
>the only films getting bad reviews for my stance to hold:

I take this to mean that by "pundits" and "punditry" you are referring only to people posting in this forum. Fair enough. My comments are still relevant to the discussion, because I have criticized white movies on these board. Bignick has as well. Plenty of people have, and not just you. So I don't see how it's a strawman.


>White people, or white culture, is never CHARGED with having
>bad taste on account of there being unsuccessful, bad,
>terrible
>white movies.

Again, yes they are. Perhaps you just missed...

In any event, the reason you see us criticizing blacks' taste in movies is, as I have said, because I am concerned with black people. I am not really concerned about white people as a group or a culture, so if they want to have bad taste, that's on them.

>Belly?
>
>White Girls?
>
>
>Brilliant. Both of them.
>
>Neither received a lot of critical acclaim.

Because they aren't good.

>The latter was called "coonish" by snobby
>blacks.

I don't think people call Belly coonish.



>I'm right.
>
>
>>You'll have a hard time proving that the "pundits" around
>here
>>are criticizing bad black movies while supporting bad white
>>movies -- because it's not true. People like Bignick and I
>>have said time and time again that ALL audiences need to
>stop
>>supporting ALL bad movies.
>
>Well then give yourself a goddamn medal, Ghandi.
>
>Problem is:
>
>a)I never actually said that the world, and the boards, are
>full of
>evil crackers and uncle toms who laud 'Freddy Got Fingered'
>and
>chastice 'White Girls'

And I never said you said that. So, huh?


>
>b)That phantom argument doesn't have to the case for me(and
>Bags')
>central argument to hold:
>
>Do you *EVER* hear *ANYONE* talk about the poor movie tastes
>of *WHITE* people S-P-E-C-I-F-I-C-A-L-L-Y???


And that doesn't matter either, for reasons I have stated already, but will repeat: I don't give a fuck about white people's taste.

>Well,
>
>People do the shit about BLACK MOVIE TASTES
>S-P-E-C-I-F-I-C-A-L-L-Y all the time.

Because we are black.

If I were Indian, I might be concerned about the quality of Bollywood movies. But I'm not, so you don't see me talking shit about the taste of Indian moviegoers. If I was French, I might be complaining about the state of the French movie industry.

But I'm black, so I talk about black people.

>BigNIck and LOTS of others do it. There's a generation of
>black
>artists who are generally just player haters, but also are
>self-proclaimed vanguards who feel oppressed and sling
>bad things at black people. This brand of black artist
>is increasing in frequency and popularity. Stanley Crouch
>is sort of their Ronald Regan. White people absolutely
>love them, because they are black and chastize black art
>and tastes with veracity.

Wow. Talk about shit that's irrelevant to the discussion.


>Crouch was writing all this shit about racial commentary,
>and how brilliant was. Of course, he did that solely to
>please white people. This is the crowd me and Bags are
>referring to.

Nice to know you aren't referring to me. I don't like Pulp Fiction.

>>You just disagree with us about what is a bad movie. But,
>>really, we don't disagree that much. We all want better for
>>black people, specifically in regards to entertainment
>>industry. We just have different ideas about how to go about
>>it.
>
>Now, how is that?
>
>
>How can we get better films for black people?
>
>
>How can we get more oppotunities for black people?
>
>
>How?

By supporting the good product when it comes out and hollywood will try to duplicate that success.

One good reason to use the "white standards" of success is that hollywood is still a white place. Wayan's brothers do fairly large numbers, but most of the other successful black stuff, even Tyler Perry movies, do niche numbers. They are profitable, and a few might try to duplicate that on a similarly niche level. The major studios aren't really trying to fuck around on that level.

I'm talking about trying to acheive the success that comes with $100+ box office on the regular. The type of success that allows the studios to think about greenlighting a budget of $100 million.

Frankly, I don't think Tyler Perry-size movies will get us to that point. In fact, I think they have the opposite effect, to a certain degree, giving theestudios justification for thinking of black products solely as niche. They have known for a while that if you spend less than $10mil you stand a good chance at making your money back. But if studios only made movies on that level, they would go out of business because even if the movies were profitable they wouldn't cover studio overhead.

Anyway, I could go on, but I'm sure you'll disagree and say it's all irrelevant. Suffice it to say, that I don't think having more of these bad movies actually does much to raise employment levels for blacks in front of or behind the camera. Yeah, people are working on these movies. But there aren't any greater number of these projects. So we're still talking about the same number of people, no increase. For every Tyler Perry movie made, that's one less other black movie made. It's not then two movies made. And if the movie comes out and sucks and doesn't make money, even with Bags rushing out to see it, then next time that *will* be one less black movie made.

To a certain degree, I understand saying that once the movie is made, it should be supported, because if it bombs it's going to hurt the cause of black movies. But a truly bad movie will bomb regardless. And a movie that most people think sucks except for a niche audience of black people will cause the people putting up the money for these things to have no interest in improving the product. They will think that there's no point in trying to improve the movie because blacks will go see it regardless. And then the quality of the product goes down even further.

I'm sure you disagree. But I'm jsut stating my position.

>Now, I'm saying that we need to do something OTHER THAN
>blame BLACK movie-going tastes to fix it.

You're right. "Other than" as in "in addition to." Because even if you are one who sees every black movie, good or bad, I'm sure you would appreciate it if there were less bad ones.



>And if WHITE people can make a hit movie with two dudes
>putting each others assholes in each others faces, than black
>people should be able to do the same. Not only that, we
>should
>able to do it, and get the same box office purse, and critical
>acclaim.

How about... if neither one received any acclaim? That's what I'm looking for.

I hated Borat.

RED
http://arrena.blogspot.com

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

            
kayru99
Member since Jan 26th 2004
16017 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 12:18 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
65. "here's the thing about about good, effective racism"
In response to Reply # 42


          

it's all about gettin the black folk to feel like they gotta prove they're not subhuman, instead of getting the racist to prove they ain't fucked up.

Ain't nobody gonna question the racial dynamics of how or why ron howard is considered a good director, or why russell crowe and tom hanks and jack nicholson can play the same guy over and over again, or martin scorsese can essentially make the same movie 4 or 5 times in a row.

They white, so all of their "art" is more valid. Especially if other white critics say its dope.

The funny thing, a good chunk of "smart" black folk will shit on black movies that DARE to actually be about something of substance, saying its "heavy-handed", or "preachy" or some other easy complaint.

Gotta love double standards, lol

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                
Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49462 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 12:31 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
66. "^^^^^the truth"
In response to Reply # 65


  

          

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                
Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52927 posts
Wed Jun-27-07 12:27 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
92. "^^^SENSE"
In response to Reply # 65


  

          

>it's all about gettin the black folk to feel like they gotta
>prove they're not subhuman, instead of getting the racist to
>prove they ain't fucked up.
>
>Ain't nobody gonna question the racial dynamics of how or why
>ron howard is considered a good director, or why russell crowe
>and tom hanks and jack nicholson can play the same guy over
>and over again, or martin scorsese can essentially make the
>same movie 4 or 5 times in a row.
>
>They white, so all of their "art" is more valid. Especially
>if other white critics say its dope.
>
>The funny thing, a good chunk of "smart" black folk will shit
>on black movies that DARE to actually be about something of
>substance, saying its "heavy-handed", or "preachy" or some
>other easy complaint.
>
>Gotta love double standards, lol
>
>


----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                
SoulHonky
Member since Jan 21st 2003
25919 posts
Wed Jun-27-07 12:49 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
94. "Can't you support these films and admit their flaws?"
In response to Reply # 65


          

A lot of people who bash Akeelah and the Bee also bash Ron Howard. I think Bags has a point though when he says the key difference is that people will go see the Howard flick but then dismiss Akeelah immediately. That seems to be the issue.

Who cares if people walk out of the theater and come here to say that Akeelah was heavy handed as long as they walked into the theater to support the predominantly black cast. Further defending the direction/writing seems pointless, especially because the film was written and directed by a white guy. It would make more sense to hype up Castlevania, which is going to be helmed by the director of Stomp the Yard.

Which in the end, is the point. Support Stomp the Yard and that director will get more opportunities, which he hopefully will then use to open up the doors for more black filmmakers. Bash it and don't see it and nothing good happens.


----
NBA MOCK DRAFT #1 - https://thecourierclass.com/whole-shebang/2017/5/18/2017-nba-mock-draft-1-just-lotto-and-lotta-trades

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                    
Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49462 posts
Wed Jun-27-07 03:03 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
98. "this is why i fucks with the soulhonkey....'tegrity & common ass sense"
In response to Reply # 94


  

          

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                    
Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52927 posts
Wed Jun-27-07 03:22 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
100. "^^^COMBUSTIBLE"
In response to Reply # 94


  

          


YIKES!!!!

>Which in the end, is the point. Support Stomp the Yard and
>that director will get more opportunities, which he hopefully
>will then use to open up the doors for more black filmmakers.
>Bash it and don't see it and nothing good happens.


OUCH!!!!

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

            
Mosaic
Charter member
16408 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 02:17 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
69. "As a sidenote ..."
In response to Reply # 42


          

>Do you *EVER* hear *ANYONE* talk about the poor movie tastes
>of *WHITE* people S-P-E-C-I-F-I-C-A-L-L-Y???

>Do you *EVER* hear *ANYONE* talk about the poor movie tastes
>of *WHITE* people S-P-E-C-I-F-I-C-A-L-L-Y???
>Of course you don't.

Does that include movies or tv shows coming out of the Blue Collar Comedy camp?

While those products are intended toward a specific segment of white audiences, they are pretty universally panned, both as products and as representations of a certain type of humor (that's usually cast as base and unsophisticated).

How does that relate to this discussion?

I think part of the problem is that whereas white folks have the freedom to have a diverse palette of strains and segments and the like within that broader umbrella of "white folks," black folks are still seen as being a monolithic culture in which every black person's taste is the same as the next black person's.

This is a problem and fucked up when it comes to how Hollywood regards black folks because it ends up subsidizing the kind of dreck that for whatever reason is considered lesser than (white films, "important" black films, merely good filmmaking, etc. - just take your pick) for the sake of trying to reach (and profit from) what they think is a monolithic black audience.

This is also a problem because it seems to push people to support films based primarily on involvement from black actors and producers, because A) it supports folks trying to make it in an already cutthroat industry before you even add the (often unfair) challenges unique to black filmmakers and B) the support is seen as crucial to getting future opportunities for black filmmmakers and their movies and projects.

While Hollywood often sees black folks as one monolithic mass of people, I think black folks, to a certain degree, tend to see black folks as monolithic as well. That seems to lead to folks establishing limits to what people can and can't enjoy as art and/or entertainment either because it's outside of what's considered enjoyable within black culture ("You like this? It's "too white" for me!") or because it might reflect poorly on the tastes of black folks ("You like that? It's an embarassment to our race!")

I don't know ... there are a billion issues wrapped up in this dicussion - art vs. commerce, art and entertainment, black business within white/mainstream industry & society, issues in black culture, etc. Luckily, namecalling, condescension, and grandstanding on an internet message board will give us the single, silver bullet answer we need!

Also for the record, when white people are enjoying "Malibu's Most Wanted," they say "hee hee" and slap their knees, while black people say "ha ha" and convulse back into their seats when they're enjoying "I Got the Hook Up!"

(Also, getting back to the original question quoted above - I'd say occasionally that happens but often is in looking back that that's done more so than in the moment and it's cast as the bad taste & stupidity of the mainstream, rather than that of only white people, and is even looked at in an oddly fond way. Just look at "I Love (Whichever decade it's cool to snarkily mock).")

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

        
bignick
Charter member
24054 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 03:06 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
46. "No matter how many times you say it, they won't listen."
In response to Reply # 37


  

          


>You'll have a hard time proving that the "pundits" around here
>are criticizing bad black movies while supporting bad white
>movies -- because it's not true. People like Bignick and I
>have said time and time again that ALL audiences need to stop
>supporting ALL bad movies.

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

            
Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49462 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 03:21 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
47. "it's besides the point..."
In response to Reply # 46
Mon Jun-25-07 03:22 PM by Basaglia

  

          

nm

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

            
Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52927 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 03:32 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
49. "LMAO !!!! Resorting to STRAWMEN = Powerful L-dom."
In response to Reply # 46


  

          


>>You'll have a hard time proving that the "pundits" around
>here
>>are criticizing bad black movies while supporting bad white
>>movies -- because it's not true. People like Bignick and I
>>have said time and time again that ALL audiences need to
>stop
>>supporting ALL bad movies.

a)That isn't what anyone said.

b)That isn't necessary for the central argument...hell...
that isn't necessary for any of the peripheral arguments..
...its just overall bad and retarded.





----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

Doc Maestro
Member since May 12th 2005
10391 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 02:20 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
39. "lol at hip hop/r&b. in 2007 they are damn near the same thing."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

ima buy you a draaank.

sheeeeit

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

REDeye
Charter member
6598 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 02:22 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
40. "I don't know if this is a third way, but"
In response to Reply # 0


          

>"Ooh, A black person's involved, I gotta support".

I don't support anything I think is bad, no matter who made it. But if it something good involving black people, I will do extra cheerleading.

Most white good stuff I don't bother to cheerlead for because I figure people will hear about it on their own. But I try to get the word out on good black stuff that I feel might get overlook or squeezed out of the marketplace.

RED
http://arrena.blogspot.com

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

Marbles
Member since Oct 19th 2004
22027 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 02:56 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
43. "This is a good & important topic but it's already a shouting match n/m"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


Peace,

*** MARBLES ***

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
kurlyswirl
Member since Jul 13th 2002
16693 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 11:11 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy listClick to send message via AOL IM
61. "Pretty much. *sigh* n/m"
In response to Reply # 43


  

          


~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~


kurly's Super-Duper Awesome DVD Collection:
http://kurlyswirl.dvdaf.com/owned

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
k_orr
Charter member
80197 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 09:55 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy listClick to send message via AOL IM
82. "you heard that Fitzgerald quote?"
In response to Reply # 43


  

          

the mark of a first rate mind is the ability to hold two contradictory ideas...

There's a couple gems in here, but mostly noise.

I tried to inoculate, but you can lead a horse to water....

one
k. orr

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

manythoughts
Charter member
839 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 03:26 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
48. "be an individual"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

used to be called being a man. Like what you like. Support what you suppoprt, and fuck anybody who doesn't like it. They don't live your life.

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

buckshot defunct
Member since May 02nd 2003
26345 posts
Mon Jun-25-07 04:23 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
52. "all this sexual tension is really getting me excited."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

.

-----------------------------
http://talestosuffice.com/
@kennykeil

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

dan_ackryte
Charter member
posts
Mon Jun-25-07 04:43 PM

54. "all u do is ask rhetorical questions..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

Leamas
Member since Dec 25th 2004
1851 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 12:32 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy listClick to send message via AOL IM
62. "This is on a tangent but..I like artists."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

But one any of those bands do what Bad Brains have done, please let me know.

Bad Brains did it all. Please dont lump them together. Maybe some people like what they think they are supposed to like. That's is not about being black,that just makes you a poser.

When The Bad Brains were really doing it, kids were getting beat up for liking that, and going to shows slugging it out with skinheads. So I dont think they really apply. There was no " hipster factor" in liking the Bad Brains.

I know where this convo is going. ( I think) Some people are posers and some arent.

IMO: Gnarls Barkley: Catchy single. Brilliant: no.
J'davey: Interesting concept, great look. Black Eurythmics? C'mon. Did the person who wrote that ever hear one Eurythmics song? I know they didn't.

I like artists who look at themselves as artists. That doesnt always mean I love the art. I love what Cody Chessnutt did. I didn't love all the music, but I loved that fact that he is an artist who is doing what he wants.

People dont wanna feel like they missed the boat on something, so they co-sign all types of shit they dont really support. But fuck that support Black Art. Sometimes you wont like it, but you should support the spirit of creating it.

I'm still waiting for Prince to make a heavy guitar record. I didnt like this 3121 shit. I still support him as an artist. ( That record had moments, but overall it was lost me.)

I'm sure I in no way answered the question, but I wanted to put that out there.


--------------------------------------------
It must be the Kung Pau chicken. George likes his chicken spicy.

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

rorschach
Member since Nov 10th 2004
7723 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 01:12 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
63. "Why can't I just like something?"
In response to Reply # 0
Tue Jun-26-07 01:13 AM by rorschach

  

          

The problem isn't that I'm cheerleading for or against anything. The problem comes when people feel that they need to correct you because they find your favorite stuff inferior.

If you ask me whether or not I like Daddy's Little Girls, The Wire or TV on the Radio and I say yes, you don't need to give me a long speech about why you don't like it. I could care less about what standard YOU have.

And as far as race is concerned, I AM cheerleading. What do you want me to do? Hate?



"Being the bigger man is overrated." -- Huey (The Boondocks)

"But today's black leaders, I'm afraid, have become leading blacks. And don't ever confuse leading blacks with black leaders." --Dr. Julia Hare.



http://www.myspace.com/dozingoff

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

REDeye
Charter member
6598 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 03:52 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
70. "interesting side question(s): restaurants"
In response to Reply # 0


          

If a black person opens a new restaurant, do you cheerlead for it? Do you make a point of eating there on the regular, tell your friends about it, write positive reviews for it on food websites, any/all of the above?

What if it's not a food you normally like? Like it's a health food joint, and you don't eat tofu and the like. Or they specialize in pork and you don't get down on the hog?

What if you get a sample of the food and don't like it? Do you still tell your friends to go there and spend their money? Do *you* still go there, just because you think it's important to support a black restaurant?

What if the food tastes good but you feel it is unhealthy? Perhaps you are vegan, or just like to eat healthy, and the restaurant is all about deep-fried, homestyle Southern cooking with all the fat and cholesterol that implies? Do you give them your money? Do you encourage your friends to eat there even though you believe this type of food is a major source of obesity, hypertension and other health problems for black people?

RED
http://arrena.blogspot.com

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49462 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 04:08 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
71. "shitty analogies aren't gonna solve anything...support black films"
In response to Reply # 70


  

          

and save these dumb ass excuses.

"damn, that new deniro joint just wasn't good...oh well, maybe i'll like his next one with rob schneider as his sidekick"

"tyler perry? no. just no"

^^^this is unmistakably the mentality some of you folks have.

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

        
Monkey Genius
Member since Mar 04th 2005
8074 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 04:24 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
72. "DeNiro has a track record of quality."
In response to Reply # 71


  

          

Put Spike Lee in your sentence and watch it work.

----------------------------------
I have a webcomic: www.watchthecomic.com

My webcomic has a page: www.facebook.com/watchyourheadcomic

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

            
REDeye
Charter member
6598 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 04:26 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
74. "*sigh* playing right into his hands. nm"
In response to Reply # 72


          


RED
http://arrena.blogspot.com

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

            
Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49462 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 05:27 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
75. "i love how spike's history been rewritten in the last 5-7 years"
In response to Reply # 72


  

          

spike starts using high profile white folks and ALL OF A SUDDEN...the lil jokes about how amatuerish his films look just kinda stop.

love it

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

        
REDeye
Charter member
6598 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 04:25 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
73. "ha ha"
In response to Reply # 71


          

>and save these dumb ass excuses.

I didn't offer it as an analogy, and it certainly isn't an excuse. It's a question, or rather, a series of questions.

But your ability to see it as an analogy means it's not as dumb as you want to want folks to believe.

>^^^this is unmistakably the mentality some of you folks have.

But not me.


RED
http://arrena.blogspot.com

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

rorschach
Member since Nov 10th 2004
7723 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 06:46 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
76. "These PTP pundits need to MAKE SOMETHING."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

They're on the same shit Jesse Jackson was on back in the 70s when Blaxploitation was taking off.

However, the fact still remains: when are you gonna put your money where your mouth is. These "inferior" writers are getting on in almost every aspect of entertainment off work ethic alone.

You could fall back and say "That's irrelevant" but it really isn't. If the intellectual blacks don't come out and actually try to make something that OTHER black folks can get behind then you'll never get what you want.

I don't see Larry Leon Hamlin encouraging black churches to come see his plays the way Tyler Perry does. I don't see some of the OKArtists putting out constant material like Young Jeezy does. This is why there's bullshit on our radios and movie screens--the artists with the most incentives to gain from working hard aren't bringing it nearly as much as they need to.

Don't get mad at the average black man for going to see Tyler Perry's play. Tyler Perry made sure that guy knew he had a play out. Long story short, the criticism is extra because everyone knows you won't do anything. Shut up and do something.

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
Nukkapedia
Member since Apr 16th 2006
35461 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 07:47 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
78. "do you really think that OK Artists aren't dropping as much material"
In response to Reply # 76


  

          

as Young Jeezy because they're not "working hard enough"?

I'd say it's the other way around: Jeezy probably spends less time working and more time promoting. What you should be saying is that these artists need better marketing teams/agents/promoters and not branding the lot of them as lazy.

and as for PTPers making something, some of us ARE involved in entertainment/creative fields. But then again, some of us are just film and music fans with other careers. If someone complains about their city having a sorry basketball team, you don't expect that person to start running drills and show up at the tryouts, do you?

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

        
rorschach
Member since Nov 10th 2004
7723 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 08:04 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
80. "Alright, I see your point on the marketing."
In response to Reply # 78


  

          

but that doesn't excuse these artists. They don't market themselves well at all. And that IS a major part of their problem.

When they had the spotlight from 1999 to 2000, they all took a break. A great deal of them dropped their best material in those years and then disappeared. You can't get mad that people moved on.


"Being the bigger man is overrated." -- Huey (The Boondocks)

"But today's black leaders, I'm afraid, have become leading blacks. And don't ever confuse leading blacks with black leaders." --Dr. Julia Hare.



http://www.myspace.com/dozingoff

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

            
Nukkapedia
Member since Apr 16th 2006
35461 posts
Wed Jun-27-07 08:56 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
90. "did they all really take breaks or did they have other issues"
In response to Reply # 80


  

          

to attend to?

D'Angelo took a break of sorts. Him aside, most of the rest of the OkayArtists stayed reasonably active in some capacity.

It seems that they're not the type of performers to stay in the studio and then go out on abbreviated promo tours for a few months - they tour constantly to build up a following. I could be wrong though.

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                
rorschach
Member since Nov 10th 2004
7723 posts
Wed Jun-27-07 03:00 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
97. "The average rapper comes back the next year or so."
In response to Reply # 90


  

          

You can see the length of time between albums:

Common: Like Water for Chocolate-2000, Electric Circus-2002
The Roots: Things Fall Apart-1999, Phrenology-2002
Mos Def: Black on Both Sides-1999, The New Danger-2004
Talib Kweli: Train of Thought-2000, Quality-2002
Erykah Badu: Mama's Gun-2000, Worldwide Underground-2003
D'Angelo: Voodoo-2000, ??????

Get where I'm going with this? If you're what's hot at moment, you gotta come back with something with the quickness. That's partly why the South is hot right now. I can count on a lot of those artists to come out with something regularly. And even if they're not coming out for a minute, they still get on mixtapes and other tracks so you don't forget them.

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                    
Brother Grifter
Member since Apr 07th 2003
2118 posts
Wed Jun-27-07 03:59 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
103. "Yeah, the ball was dropped..."
In response to Reply # 97


          

But it SEEMS like, there was a lot of pressure on them...folks counting on them to save Black music, lead us to the promised land, and take care of the hole in the ozone layer...and not to drink, smoke, or make commercials for multi-national corporations.

Truth be told, if they came out with some VooDoo by the numbers or something, folks would've revolted. So you had some who tried to get some mainstream appeal, some who tried to go WAY out with the music and influences, and some who were expected to make the next musical/social/religious masterpiece that it broke them down we're still waiting for them....

But back to the subject

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
REDeye
Charter member
6598 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 07:56 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
79. "I've done work. Others here have too."
In response to Reply # 76


          

>Don't get mad at the average black man for going to see Tyler
>Perry's play. Tyler Perry made sure that guy knew he had a
>play out. Long story short, the criticism is extra because
>everyone knows you won't do anything. Shut up and do
>something.

So take that "You ain't in the NBA so you can't call someone garbage" type shit elsewhere.

Fact is, I speak on this mess is because I have experience.

RED
http://arrena.blogspot.com

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

        
rorschach
Member since Nov 10th 2004
7723 posts
Tue Jun-26-07 08:12 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
81. "RE: I've done work. Others here have too."
In response to Reply # 79


  

          

>So take that "You ain't in the NBA so you can't call someone
>garbage" type shit elsewhere.
>
>Fact is, I speak on this mess is because I have experience.
>

Really...what have you done? And I don't mind you guys calling someone like Tyler Perry garbage. The problem is that you really don't support your opinion well because you probably didn't even see what you're talking about. A good example was Bignick's rant on Daddy's Little Girls. He DIDN'T see the movie. How can rant on something you haven't seen.

When I say I hate a movie, I point out specific things about THAT movie that I don't like. I don't say Tyler Perry's wack so Daddy's Little Girls has to be wack. That's stupid. I can agree that Tyler Perry isn't a good writer/director. But the fact still remains that that particular movie was decent and not bad.

The real problem is that you guys don't judge black movies individually. You have to factor in that director's whole catalog like that really changes anything about THAT movie.



"Being the bigger man is overrated." -- Huey (The Boondocks)

"But today's black leaders, I'm afraid, have become leading blacks. And don't ever confuse leading blacks with black leaders." --Dr. Julia Hare.



http://www.myspace.com/dozingoff

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

            
REDeye
Charter member
6598 posts
Wed Jun-27-07 12:37 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
86. "RE: I've done work. Others here have too."
In response to Reply # 81


          

>Really...what have you done?

What do I have to say to satisfy your requirements of having done something? I am a produced screenwriter. I have been a development executive in the past. I work in DVD distribution right now at a company that is the biggest distributor of independent black cinema in terms of market share. But what, I can't speak on the state of black cinema because I don't have Tyler Perry type success?

And I don't mind you guys
>calling someone like Tyler Perry garbage. The problem is that
>you really don't support your opinion well because you
>probably didn't even see what you're talking about.

Stop making assumptions.

A good
>example was Bignick's rant on Daddy's Little Girls. He DIDN'T
>see the movie. How can rant on something you haven't seen.

This is slightly off topic, but I firmly believe that, save for the the rarest of exceptions, I have more than enough experience as a moviegoer to be able to tell from the marketing material whether I will like a movie or not. I think anyone should be able to do this. And it is the job of the marketing folks to ensure this. So I am always puzzled when people say stuff like this. But that is neither here nor there. I have seen enough of Tyler Perry's work to know he has made nothing that interests me. Maybe he will one day, but I doubt it.


>The real problem is that you guys don't judge black movies
>individually.

Stop making assumptions.


RED
http://arrena.blogspot.com

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                
rorschach
Member since Nov 10th 2004
7723 posts
Wed Jun-27-07 03:17 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
99. "RE: I've done work. Others here have too."
In response to Reply # 86


  

          

>>Really...what have you done?
>
>What do I have to say to satisfy your requirements of having
>done something? I am a produced screenwriter. I have been a
>development executive in the past. I work in DVD distribution
>right now at a company that is the biggest distributor of
>independent black cinema in terms of market share. But what, I
>can't speak on the state of black cinema because I don't have
>Tyler Perry type success?
>
>And I don't mind you guys
>>calling someone like Tyler Perry garbage. The problem is
>that
>>you really don't support your opinion well because you
>>probably didn't even see what you're talking about.
>
>Stop making assumptions.
>
>A good
>>example was Bignick's rant on Daddy's Little Girls. He
>DIDN'T
>>see the movie. How can rant on something you haven't seen.
>
>This is slightly off topic, but I firmly believe that, save
>for the the rarest of exceptions, I have more than enough
>experience as a moviegoer to be able to tell from the
>marketing material whether I will like a movie or not. I think
>anyone should be able to do this. And it is the job of the
>marketing folks to ensure this. So I am always puzzled when
>people say stuff like this. But that is neither here nor
>there. I have seen enough of Tyler Perry's work to know he has
>made nothing that interests me. Maybe he will one day, but I
>doubt it.
>
>
>>The real problem is that you guys don't judge black movies
>>individually.
>
>Stop making assumptions.
>

First off, I'm not making assumptions. If you go back and look at some of those old threads, you'll see that there is a lot of blind criticism going on. I'm not making that up. And you can't say that you and Bignick judge black movies individually because you both said in those posts that you don't actually watch all of those movies. I'm saying that you really can't criticize something you haven't seen. Sure you may be right some of time about movies when you watch the trailer and say "That looks like shit". But you really can't truthfully say it's shit until you've seen the movie.

My point is: if you're gonna comment on whether a film's good or bad, at least see the movie you're talking about. And if someone says they like ...., you really don't need to try be condescending about it. I'm not saying you did that (that one was Bignick) but there's a lot of conscending attitude floating around some of these posts.



"Being the bigger man is overrated." -- Huey (The Boondocks)

"But today's black leaders, I'm afraid, have become leading blacks. And don't ever confuse leading blacks with black leaders." --Dr. Julia Hare.



http://www.myspace.com/dozingoff

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                
rorschach
Member since Nov 10th 2004
7723 posts
Wed Jun-27-07 04:38 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
104. "Late Edit...."
In response to Reply # 86


  

          

BTW, I'm not trying to play you when I ask what you've actually done. I genuinely wanted to know because a lot of PTPers don't really mention what they do.

But...I'm like this, if you have talent and the time, and you know people, WHY NOT make something that you think is better and push it? Every day it's getting easier to actually make a project and actually get it released.



"Being the bigger man is overrated." -- Huey (The Boondocks)

"But today's black leaders, I'm afraid, have become leading blacks. And don't ever confuse leading blacks with black leaders." --Dr. Julia Hare.



http://www.myspace.com/dozingoff

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                    
DarkStar
Charter member
20015 posts
Fri Jun-29-07 10:07 AM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
110. "RE: Late Edit...."
In response to Reply # 104


  

          

>BTW, I'm not trying to play you when I ask what you've
>actually done. I genuinely wanted to know because a lot of
>PTPers don't really mention what they do.

And this entire post is the reason why.

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

MikeLove
Charter member
13221 posts
Wed Jun-27-07 01:46 AM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
88. "I just came in to say I agree with OE & Basaglia...good night"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

<----- The reason your team's players jump into the stands after a TD

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

Binlahab
Charter member
182910 posts
Wed Jun-27-07 07:56 AM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
89. "bottom line: its entertainment."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

i'd love for mass Black media to be on the level of a do the right thing...but i appreciate mama i wanna sing style gospel plays for what they are, fluffy mass consumption puff pieces. thats cool.

the end

i aint reading all that up there


<---- im getting 2 of these

http://i15.tinypic.com/62hl79t.jpg

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

    
Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52927 posts
Wed Jun-27-07 12:37 PM

Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
93. "But black people aren't allowed to entertain."
In response to Reply # 89


  

          


(I agree with you, btw)

*EVERYTHING* we make is to be charged to our "culture
account(my term)", and if its ignorant, than our entire culture is
charged with ignorance.

White people don't have that burden.

They can continue to support absolute horseshit,
over, and over, and over, and over, and they'll never
receive a backlash from someone suggesting that WHITE
people need to watch better films, or someone who
condescendingly chides white movie goings tastes.


Its just a double standard.

White people can be ignorant and entertain, no one
says shit. No one accused white people of "Racial
cheerleeding" when they all went to see 'Borat'.
White people went because they thought it was entertaining.

I see no reason why we need a grand explanation as to why
I went to see 'Little Man'. Shit was entertaining.


I feel you.


>i'd love for mass Black media to be on the level of a do the
>right thing...but i appreciate mama i wanna sing style gospel
>plays for what they are, fluffy mass consumption puff pieces.
>thats cool.

>i aint reading all that up there
>
>
><---- im getting 2 of these
>
>http://i15.tinypic.com/62hl79t.jpg


----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

Rockscissorspaper
Charter member
2042 posts
Wed Jun-27-07 03:55 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
102. "No to the music thing"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

>"Ooh, A black person's involved, I gotta support".
>
>For most regular black people, as opposed to okp's, this is
>how they operate.
>
.
>Music that isn't hip hop/R&B (Tvotr, Bloc Party, Living Colour
>BAd Brains)

You're average black person doesn't support music that isn't hip-hop/r&b that's made by blacks...

-----------------------------

HEY KIDS, (BUY MY) COMICS!! https://www.mythworldemedia.com/store

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

jane eyre
Member since Jan 16th 2007
715 posts
Wed Jun-27-07 08:29 PM

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this authorClick to view this author's profileClick to add this author to your buddy list
105. "RE: Black folks - On: Racial Cheerleading in the Arts"
In response to Reply # 0


          

elites and anti-elites have something in common. they're trying to negotiate a relationship to black culture that makes sense to them. in that sense, they grapple with the same kinds of questions. i hesitate to use the word identity, it's too cheesy, too expected, and it puts people under the glare of a social-political spotlight. if that isn't enough, psychology is usually lurking in the shadows. for whatever it's worth, and i mean it as simply as possible-- people are people before they're clinical specimens or an abstract part of a social struggle.

what's another word for identity that doesn't have such a heavy-handed we-already-know-it meaning? it's probably idealistic, but i wonder what people would see if they figured out a way to come to terms (?) with....well...whatever it is that makes this a push button topic.

i'm not sure what it means that elites and anti-elites end up facing discrepancies about who they are and how that relates to what they know as black culture. it's not like there's a book or a place to go that can tell anybody the answers to that stuff. but sometimes the answers sound so...perfect. so safe. so in denial.

whatever tension elites and anti-elites put up with, the way they solve it makes it a human issue. my point: the arts "talk" about human issues ad infinitum. the arts are the perfect place to go to find some insight about the human condition.

is there a third way? sure. how about using the arts as a guide for feeling out a third way? the arts are great for offering answers for this kind of situ. sometimes it depends on whether or not people are receptive to mulling over the answers and possibilities that the arts, however they're created, offer about the things they're working to resolve (or not)....for instance your ex: white writers and the wire.

two, maybe three steps back:

maybe it's helpful to view art as more than a personal expression. it is that, yes. but there's more. loosely speaking, just so i can keep moving and not start a convo about what art is, art says something about whatever or whoever it's addressing. that can happen in a lot of different ways. maybe an artist has a bigger picture frame of reference. maybe not. criticism functions like a second conversation about the bigger picture. differing views, some positive, some negative, come with the schtick. some critics are right, some are wrong. a black critic giving a black artist a bad review isn't necessarily a smoking gun that proves that the critic has a hard on for being pretentious ass who doesn't support the black community. or whatever else.

the role of the critic/reviewer gets washed out these days. i blame a generally sarcastic spirit, a tendency to boil matters of truth down to bite-sized phrases, and the daily show. and maybe blogs. hee. anyway. criticism, good or bad, but particularly the bad, is not hate. racial cheerleading for or against critics irks me unless it's warranted.

sure, there are bitter wanna-be critics with an axe to grind. yes, there are instances when they get personal and nasty. there are instances when a critic has a bias or prejudice and ends up making an unfair criticism.

not all criticism falls into the racially motivated-race editorial category. racial cheerleading sometimes walks the fine line of not making the distinction by assuming too quickly that it does. by too quickly i mean: before the merits of artistic expression are given fair consideration. and nuh....that doesn't have to be a pinky up process. it can be as simple as: i dig this/i don't like this and here's how come.

i wish that some connontations of the word hate and hater would pack up and go home.

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

Lobby Pass The Popcorn Pass The Popcorn Archives topic #105153 Previous topic | Next topic
Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.25
Copyright © DCScripts.com