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Subject: "What will banning Assault Weapons achieve if the Culture doesn't change?" Previous topic | Next topic
Case_One
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Tue Jun-21-16 09:52 AM

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"What will banning Assault Weapons achieve if the Culture doesn't change?"
Tue Jun-21-16 09:59 AM by Case_One

          

And when I say Culture, I'm talking about the promotion of Gun Violence in all forms of entertainment - especially in movies and video games? What will banning any weapon do if the country is obsessed with using and promoting guns (all types) as the primary source / solution for winning or stopping a threat? If the gun is considered the only equalizer then what will change?

Also, more people die from handguns than assault weapons. It's just the magnitude of one single event (mass shooting by one person) that captures the real horror the gun crazed culture.


ADDED: If the culture glorifies violence, then people will seek out violent means to solve problems or achieve goals of any kind. To that point, if a person is bent on causing mass destruction then banning the assault weapons will not mitigate that goal. People that want to cause mass destruction don value human life and that's what our entertainment culture promotes - the marginalization and devaluing of human life. And until our culture puts a premium on human life then nothing will really change long-term. IMO.


If the government bans Assault Weapons and does not ban the use of these weapons in entertainment then, in my opinion, the ban is a fake solution that's being promoted a means to appease the masses reaction to horrible events.


I say all forms of guns in movies except for historical material like war movies or movies based on true events in conjunction with banning assault weapons.

Just my opinion. How do you feel?

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
HEY ITS THE BOY FROM AFRICA (c) Coming To America....
Jun 21st 2016
1
Nah, Somebody locked me out of my account
Jun 21st 2016
8
This response shoulda got more laughs
Jun 23rd 2016
94
Also, more people die from car accidents than all guns
Jun 21st 2016
2
Most people need a car to go to work...
Jun 21st 2016
6
I'm just pointing out the selective outrage that people have
Jun 21st 2016
28
actually, it's not selective at all
Jun 21st 2016
34
      Man, STFU.
Jun 21st 2016
50
           you meant my *facts.
Jun 21st 2016
79
i think a more applicable analogy
Jun 21st 2016
33
      that's definitely closer
Jun 21st 2016
46
           yup
Jun 23rd 2016
95
Smh
Jun 21st 2016
10
Yaknow folks are going to clown you, but you're not off base
Jun 21st 2016
12
And Cars are highly regulated. I wish guns were as regulated as cars.
Jun 21st 2016
20
And bullets too. You should need a license to but limited ammunition.
Jun 21st 2016
22
Do you even need to pass a test to own a gun in the US?
Jun 22nd 2016
85
You've gotta put the numbers in perspective though
Jun 21st 2016
25
      TBH, I didn't intend to make an A:B comparison
Jun 21st 2016
31
           Please tell me you aren't actually this dumb
Jun 21st 2016
75
           But as it's already pointed out.....
Jun 22nd 2016
82
If the Orlando, San Bernardino and Aurora Shooters only had hand guns
Jun 21st 2016
3
That's True. But if dude -
Jun 21st 2016
11
Building bombs to do that much damage isn't that easy. Shit you
Jun 21st 2016
32
      it was a densely closed space. And fire would have been a factor too.
Jun 21st 2016
37
If a ban was in place back then
Jun 21st 2016
18
      Perhaps, but then they would've been breaking the law...
Jun 21st 2016
23
           BANG
Jun 21st 2016
59
           RE: Perhaps, but then they would've been breaking the law...
Jun 21st 2016
70
           RE: Perhaps, but then they would've been breaking the law...
Jun 21st 2016
74
I really hate this line of logic...
Jun 21st 2016
4
I think you're missing my point
Jun 21st 2016
7
      No. You're wrong...
Jun 21st 2016
13
      So you don't think that our Culture of promoting gun Violence -
Jun 21st 2016
14
           Yes and no...
Jun 21st 2016
16
           US Culture and China's culture is totally different.
Jun 21st 2016
19
           I think Japanese culture is way more violent, but they have no gun viole...
Jun 21st 2016
24
                Shame is also a factor in their culture too.
Jun 21st 2016
26
                     They also date pillows that look like women. Soo I think they need more
Jun 21st 2016
57
                          You get 10 points for that
Jun 21st 2016
68
      The tools matter though.
Jun 21st 2016
29
           The tool is a tool. The Goal is the issue. But I understand ya point too...
Jun 21st 2016
35
we can't change the world unless we change ourselves
Jun 21st 2016
5
Absolutely!
Jun 21st 2016
9
      I think he was facetious because of the emptiness of that statement.
Jun 21st 2016
21
49 will remain the record nm.
Jun 21st 2016
15
Most likely not. Sadly. As long as people want to cause mass murder
Jun 21st 2016
17
It's not the record.
Jun 21st 2016
44
What will changing school segregation achieve if the culture doesn't cha...
Jun 21st 2016
27
It's always the wrong culture that gets blamed
Jun 21st 2016
30
Exactly. We have the same movies and games here but not the same gun pro...
Jun 21st 2016
45
ticketmaster out here trying to send me to
Jun 21st 2016
51
Gaaawd, if you're listenin..... HEEEELP!!!!
Jun 21st 2016
36
More Than 500 People Were Shot In America During the Week After Orlando
Jun 21st 2016
38
all because of movies
Jun 21st 2016
48
      I'm going to let you figure it out..
Jun 21st 2016
53
           yup movies and video games caused the Orlando incident
Jun 21st 2016
60
                I've learned to love you man.
Jun 21st 2016
66
                     you're saying gun violence is due to movies and video games
Jun 21st 2016
76
                          I said the love of guns / and gun cultureis responsible for the violence...
Jun 22nd 2016
91
                               I'm no social scientist
Jun 23rd 2016
93
The problem is that the Consitution probably intended to protect...
Jun 21st 2016
39
You are echoing very good points.
Jun 21st 2016
40
the constitution argues for a well regulated militia
Jun 21st 2016
41
      Preach!
Jun 21st 2016
42
      I don't disagree with what you said and it dovetails with what I said.
Jun 21st 2016
56
           not really. we should go back to the 1939 supreme court ruling
Jun 21st 2016
58
It will show that politicians are trying *anything.*
Jun 21st 2016
43
Hey, I say try it all, but until the LOVE A GUN culture changes ...
Jun 21st 2016
64
Thank you
Jun 23rd 2016
92
nah, let's just pray for the killing to end
Jun 21st 2016
47
Absolutely. Now ya learning.
Jun 21st 2016
54
      yup. Im learning. pray for homophobic massacres to end
Jun 21st 2016
61
           Man you are trying too hard to be a troll. You lack the skill. Stop
Jun 21st 2016
69
                nah let's just pray and blame movies/video games
Jun 21st 2016
77
"Since we can't do everything, let's do nothing." - you.
Jun 21st 2016
49
wouldn't the assumption be the two are related
Jun 21st 2016
52
RE: wouldn't the assumption be the two are related
Jun 21st 2016
67
      If you think I'm scapegoating Movies and Games then you've missed it
Jun 21st 2016
78
           You play whatever if games you need to make yourself feel superior
Jun 22nd 2016
84
Isn't the idea behind banning gay marriage that it will
Jun 21st 2016
55
Culture is just a reflection of people. It's not the problem but a symp...
Jun 21st 2016
62
The People create the culture and the culture shapes the people.
Jun 21st 2016
63
Assault rifles have been illegal in America for 3o years now
Jun 21st 2016
65
Tell us what an AR-15 is?
Jun 21st 2016
71
      AR=Armalite Rifle
Jun 21st 2016
73
this actually argues for increasing regulation
Jun 21st 2016
72
Great Dialog in here. Glad that some people are thinking
Jun 21st 2016
80
Assault Weapons is a misnomer. All weapons are for the assault
Jun 21st 2016
81
Very simple answer:
Jun 22nd 2016
83
Culture will follow. Take it from experience.
Jun 22nd 2016
86
Scottish culture has far less anti-black anti-native ideology if any.
Jun 22nd 2016
87
House Democrats are having a sit-in for gun legislation
Jun 22nd 2016
88
Good stuff.
Jun 22nd 2016
89
They'd have to fill the room with their constituents to stand a chance
Jun 22nd 2016
90

Big Kuntry
Member since May 09th 2010
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Tue Jun-21-16 09:56 AM

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1. "HEY ITS THE BOY FROM AFRICA (c) Coming To America...."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I thought you had left for good, bruh

  

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Case_One
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Tue Jun-21-16 10:08 AM

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8. "Nah, Somebody locked me out of my account"
In response to Reply # 1


          

I get censored a lot around here. Eh Oh well.
.
.
.

  

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DavidHasselhoff
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Thu Jun-23-16 04:07 PM

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94. "This response shoulda got more laughs"
In response to Reply # 1


          

  

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flipnile
Member since Nov 05th 2003
12959 posts
Tue Jun-21-16 10:02 AM

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2. "Also, more people die from car accidents than all guns"
In response to Reply # 0
Tue Jun-21-16 10:03 AM by flipnile

          

>Also, more people die from handguns than assault weapons.

By nearly THREE times. 2013 stats:

Firearm-related deaths: 11,208
Auto-related deaths: 32,719


Funny how folks get selective outrage tho. Probably a lot of people that text, drink and fuck around behind the wheel while driving are the same people that scream for gun control and act live everyone that doesn't see things their way is crazy.

  

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CRichMonkey
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Tue Jun-21-16 10:06 AM

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6. "Most people need a car to go to work... "
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

Can you say that for guns?

I mean, if you want to compare guns and cars, I'm willing to have that debate, but please know that you're setting up a pretty shitty thesis.


my avy: Deep in your heart, you know he's right: http://coreyrichardsonneedsajob.com/
my hustle: http://SupaSoulSounds.com

*RIP: John T. "220v" Richardson, Blessing Benson, and Dilla*

  

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flipnile
Member since Nov 05th 2003
12959 posts
Tue Jun-21-16 10:48 AM

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28. "I'm just pointing out the selective outrage that people have"
In response to Reply # 6
Tue Jun-21-16 10:49 AM by flipnile

          

Folks get mad emotional when it comes to guns, but are all "meh" when it comes to something that takes 3x as many lives per year.

Case's post was about culture, and I wanted to point out how adamant people are about particular causes, while completely ignoring other legit causes and concerns because it doesn't meet *their* (often poorly thought through) agendas.

Look at violent rap music. Shit basically GLORIFIES the same violence and the same assualt rifles that people are having heart attacks over now, yet they won't let the negative music go. Generations of people grew up listening to this shit, but many anti-gun folks STILL won't acknowledge the negative conditioning that this causes.

Instead of trying to get to the root of why Americans are shooting each other, they just jump to the same old knee-jerk "ban guns," and "throw them in jail" solutions that have been proven over time (decades, actually) to simply not work at preventing future shootings.

  

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Rjcc
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Tue Jun-21-16 11:04 AM

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34. "actually, it's not selective at all"
In response to Reply # 28


          

you're just too dumb to know how numbers work.

hundreds of millions of people drive every year.

if people died from driving at the same rate they die from being shot, you'd have something of a point, but you don't.

www.engadgethd.com - the other stuff i'm looking at

  

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flipnile
Member since Nov 05th 2003
12959 posts
Tue Jun-21-16 01:00 PM

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50. "Man, STFU."
In response to Reply # 34
Tue Jun-21-16 01:04 PM by flipnile

          

Your opinion is meaningless to me.

Fucking loser.

  

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Rjcc
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Tue Jun-21-16 10:57 PM

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79. "you meant my *facts."
In response to Reply # 50


          

I know you don't like them. It's ok.

www.engadgethd.com - the other stuff i'm looking at

  

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GriftyMcgrift
Member since May 22nd 2002
20414 posts
Tue Jun-21-16 10:59 AM

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33. "i think a more applicable analogy"
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

if we are going to use cars is

why do we need cars that can over over 60 70 or 80 mph?

  

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Rjcc
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Tue Jun-21-16 12:26 PM

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46. "that's definitely closer"
In response to Reply # 33


          

there's a ton separating it, but just OH PEOPLE DIE IN CAR ACCIDENTS isn't really applicable.

www.engadgethd.com - the other stuff i'm looking at

  

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GriftyMcgrift
Member since May 22nd 2002
20414 posts
Thu Jun-23-16 04:49 PM

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95. "yup"
In response to Reply # 46


  

          

and i love guns! and a texan!

but i also am realistic and have common sense

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
69222 posts
Tue Jun-21-16 10:11 AM

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10. "Smh"
In response to Reply # 2


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Case_One
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Tue Jun-21-16 10:14 AM

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12. "Yaknow folks are going to clown you, but you're not off base"
In response to Reply # 2


          

If the government was not tied to the auto industry and all businesses that support it to include the oil industry, we would have safer more advanced forms of individual and mass transportation.

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.
.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Tue Jun-21-16 10:33 AM

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20. "And Cars are highly regulated. I wish guns were as regulated as cars. "
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

>>Also, more people die from handguns than assault weapons.
>
>By nearly THREE times. 2013 stats:
>
>Firearm-related deaths: 11,208
>Auto-related deaths: 32,719
>
>
>Funny how folks get selective outrage tho. Probably a lot of
>people that text, drink and fuck around behind the wheel while
>driving are the same people that scream for gun control and
>act live everyone that doesn't see things their way is crazy.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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Case_One
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Tue Jun-21-16 10:35 AM

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22. "And bullets too. You should need a license to but limited ammunition. "
In response to Reply # 20


          

Quantity, frequency and kind.

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.
.

  

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TheAlbionist
Member since Jul 04th 2011
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Wed Jun-22-16 09:41 AM

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85. "Do you even need to pass a test to own a gun in the US?"
In response to Reply # 20


  

          

Last time I checked you needed to go through a fair few hours of practical training, an eye test, a practical test and in most places a theory test before anyone will let you drive a car in public.

Perhaps that would be a half decent first step.

_______________________________

))<>((
forever.

  

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Cocobrotha2
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Tue Jun-21-16 10:37 AM

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25. "You've gotta put the numbers in perspective though"
In response to Reply # 2


          

>>Also, more people die from handguns than assault weapons.
>
>By nearly THREE times. 2013 stats:
>
>Firearm-related deaths: 11,208
>Auto-related deaths: 32,719
>
>
>Funny how folks get selective outrage tho. Probably a lot of
>people that text, drink and fuck around behind the wheel while
>driving are the same people that scream for gun control and
>act live everyone that doesn't see things their way is crazy.

90% of american households have cars, while (if you believe the numbers) around 35% of American households have guns.

So maybe 3 times as many households have cars than guns... which is roughly the same multiple of auto-related deaths to firearm related deaths.

But it goes deeper... vast majority of households that own cars, use their cars EVERY SINGLE DAY while most gun owners likely don't. While some people carry every day due to their jobs, the vast majority maybe use their guns a couple times a month (if that) to target practice or hunt).

So if you look at how often cars or guns are used and compare it to the number of people that die, there's a huge disparity. Owning a car is relatively MUCH safe than owning a gun because 1)owning a car is highly regulated and 2) a car is primarily used for transportation and deaths are accidental while guns are often used TO kill.

<-><-><-><-><-><-><-><-><->
<-><-><-><-><-><-><-><-><->

  

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flipnile
Member since Nov 05th 2003
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Tue Jun-21-16 10:58 AM

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31. "TBH, I didn't intend to make an A:B comparison"
In response to Reply # 25
Tue Jun-21-16 10:59 AM by flipnile

          

Cars vs. Guns aren't even close to being in the same category, except for one stat: fatalities.


>Owning a car is relatively MUCH safe than owning a gun because

According to the 2013 stats I used above, 10.3 per 100k die in car accidents in the us, while 3.5 per 100k die in firearms-related incidents. The average citizen is 3x more likely to die in a car accident than a shooting. I'm not trying to compare the two AT ALL except for this one stat. In terms of risk, there's a much greater one from autos than guns.

Knowing this, I do wonder why people get so worked up over guns, yet text away while operating a vehicle and act like it's no big deal. And it makes me question whether they truly care about making this country safer, or if they are motivated more by what they *feel* personally.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_motor_vehicle_deaths_in_U.S._by_year
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_violence_in_the_United_States

  

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Anonymous
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Tue Jun-21-16 07:46 PM

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75. "Please tell me you aren't actually this dumb"
In response to Reply # 31


  

          

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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Wed Jun-22-16 12:09 AM

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82. "But as it's already pointed out....."
In response to Reply # 31
Wed Jun-22-16 12:10 AM by denny

          

Cars provide a benefit for which the cost (in terms of deaths) can be balanced against the value they provide. So we'd be reasonable in saying that we'll accept car fatalities in order to receive the benefits they provide.

Guns really don't offer the same benefit to society that cars do. So lives lost because of guns are avoidable and not off-set by a greater benefit.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Tue Jun-21-16 10:03 AM

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3. "If the Orlando, San Bernardino and Aurora Shooters only had hand guns"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

A lot more people would be alive.

If you balance that negative with the positive of such personal use of such weapons (what is it again?), then you have to conclude it's an easy decision to either ban their use or greatly restrict who can own such a weapon.

I don't think you absolutely have to ban them, we just have to stop allowing any tom, dick or hank from being able to so easily purchase them.




>And when I say Culture, I'm talking about the promotion of
>Gun Violence in all forms of entertainment - especially in
>movies and video games? What will banning any weapon do if the
>country is obsessed with using and promoting guns (all types)
>as the primary source / solution for winning or stopping a
>threat? If the gun is considered the only equalizer then what
>will change?
>
>Also, more people die from handguns than assault weapons. It's
>just the magnitude of one single event (mass shooting by one
>person) that captures the real horror the gun crazed culture.
>
>If the government bans Assault Weapons and does not ban the
>use of these weapons in entertainment then, in my opinion, the
>ban is a fake solution that's being promoted a means to
>appease the masses reaction to horrible events.
>
>
>I say all forms of guns in movies except for historical
>material like war movies or movies based on true events in
>conjunction with banning assault weapons.
>
>Just my opinion. How do you feel?
>
>.
>.
>.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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Case_One
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Tue Jun-21-16 10:11 AM

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11. "That's True. But if dude - "
In response to Reply # 3


          

was bent on causing a mas killing he would have used a Bomb or some other means to murder all of those people.

My point is that we live in a culture that promotes violence like a sickness and then wonder why people are sick.

.
.
.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Tue Jun-21-16 10:59 AM

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32. "Building bombs to do that much damage isn't that easy. Shit you"
In response to Reply # 11


  

          

have to have a license to buy certain fertilizers (often used to make bombs).


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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Case_One
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Tue Jun-21-16 11:11 AM

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37. "it was a densely closed space. And fire would have been a factor too."
In response to Reply # 32


          

I'm just saying.
.
.
.

  

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Innocent Criminal
Member since May 03rd 2003
14480 posts
Tue Jun-21-16 10:28 AM

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18. "If a ban was in place back then"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

You don't think they couldn't have gotten assault rifles if they really wanted? If someone has a plan to do some really evil shit like that I don't think they'd let a gun ban stop them from acquiring what they wanted.

________________________________
There are dozens of us! Dozens!

  

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CRichMonkey
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Tue Jun-21-16 10:36 AM

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23. "Perhaps, but then they would've been breaking the law... "
In response to Reply # 18


  

          

And perhaps they would have been arrested before they committed their crimes.

The whole, "THEY BOUGHT THEIR GUNS LEGALLY" argument is shitty circular logic. If the guns weren't legal, they would've been harder to get and perhaps exposed them to law enforcement while they were contemplating their crimes rather than after they committed them.

It's not like they'd be illegal and no one would be looking to enforce the law, right?


my avy: Deep in your heart, you know he's right: http://coreyrichardsonneedsajob.com/
my hustle: http://SupaSoulSounds.com

*RIP: John T. "220v" Richardson, Blessing Benson, and Dilla*

  

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ThaAnthology
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59. "BANG"
In response to Reply # 23


  

          

www.anthologyfmn.com

Enter the Written World of Fahim Malik Nassar

The House of Caine (available)

Melancholoy Funk (available)

Tha Anthology (Words 2001-2003) Poetry inspired by OKP and Wash, DC
(available)

The Spook who sat by the Radio Poetry (av

  

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ILLwiLL132
Member since Jul 14th 2011
217 posts
Tue Jun-21-16 04:21 PM

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70. "RE: Perhaps, but then they would've been breaking the law... "
In response to Reply # 23
Tue Jun-21-16 04:47 PM by ILLwiLL132

          

>And perhaps they would have been arrested before they
>committed their crimes.
>

LOL like the same way that they arrest gang bangers before they go out and commit a drive by with an illegal assault weapon. SMH come on man...

>The whole, "THEY BOUGHT THEIR GUNS LEGALLY" argument is shitty
>circular logic. If the guns weren't legal, they would've been
>harder to get and perhaps exposed them to law enforcement
>while they were contemplating their crimes rather than after
>they committed them.

There are a lot of snitches out there so there is a chance that they would get told on if expressing their intention. But then again what criminal minded individual goes around buying illegal guns telling others what they're about to do with them?

>It's not like they'd be illegal and no one would be looking to
>enforce the law, right?
>

Just cause the police are looking to enforce the law on illegal guns doesn't mean they will find those who possess them. That sounds good to someone who actually believes police are really out here looking to protect them.

>my avy: Deep in your heart, you know he's right:
>http://coreyrichardsonneedsajob.com/
>my hustle: http://SupaSoulSounds.com
>
>*RIP: John T. "220v" Richardson, Blessing Benson, and Dilla*

I'm for truth no matter who tells it. I'm for justice no matter who it's for or against. - el Hajj Malik el Shabazz

  

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Innocent Criminal
Member since May 03rd 2003
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Tue Jun-21-16 05:03 PM

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74. "RE: Perhaps, but then they would've been breaking the law... "
In response to Reply # 23


  

          

>And perhaps they would have been arrested before they
>committed their crimes.
>
>The whole, "THEY BOUGHT THEIR GUNS LEGALLY" argument is shitty
>circular logic. If the guns weren't legal, they would've been
>harder to get and perhaps exposed them to law enforcement
>while they were contemplating their crimes rather than after
>they committed them.
>


The FBI interviewed the Orlando shooter 3 times and followed him for weeks. He even purchased firearms under their supposed surveillance, I have zero confidence in law enforcement stopping someone because they bought an illegal firearm.

________________________________
There are dozens of us! Dozens!

  

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CRichMonkey
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4. "I really hate this line of logic... "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Because it presupposes that any change that comes from regulation has to be immediate to be efficacious. That's far from the truth.

Banning assault weapons isn't about stopping a mass shooting next week. It's about slowing the ebb of mass shootings and creating a new "normal" when it comes to what constitutes reasonable gun ownership. Just like prohibition didn't stop people from drinking, it did change the culture around drinking from being something you did all fucking day to being something you did in certain places on nights and weekends.

We can't stop mass shootings until we reign in the tools that are used to commit the crimes and we can't/won't do that if we insist that their regulation and prohibition somehow show an immediate impact rather than treat them like any other policy that is proven right or wrong over time.



my avy: Deep in your heart, you know he's right: http://coreyrichardsonneedsajob.com/
my hustle: http://SupaSoulSounds.com

*RIP: John T. "220v" Richardson, Blessing Benson, and Dilla*

  

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Case_One
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Tue Jun-21-16 10:07 AM

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7. "I think you're missing my point"
In response to Reply # 4


          

If the heart and mind of the culture is sick then the tool doesn't matter. Unhealthy people will always find a tool to cause mass pain and death
.
.
.

  

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CRichMonkey
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13. "No. You're wrong... "
In response to Reply # 7


  

          

You're operating from the assumption that something is wrong with society, I disagree. Humans are humans and to question their "nature" as a means of debating policy relies of certain normative assumptions of ethics and morality that you're not qualified to posit.

That said, I don't know about changing hearts and minds as much as I know about influencing sentiment and opinion and there have been plenty of public shifts when it comes to prevailing issues when presented with sensible regulation.

There was a time when we didn't bat an eye at children working. Then we passed laws that said that wasn't cool, and now if you see an 8 year-old too close to the stove you get nervous.

There was a time when you could and did smoke cigarettes just about everywhere. I remember my grandfather smoking in the hospital. Then we realized the health risks associated with cigarettes and regulated the shit outta them. Now, if you see someone smoking too close to the door of a bar you look at them funny.

You can change public opinion, and it's very reasonable to assume it can be done with guns. There just has to be the collective will legislatively to try.



my avy: Deep in your heart, you know he's right: http://coreyrichardsonneedsajob.com/
my hustle: http://SupaSoulSounds.com

*RIP: John T. "220v" Richardson, Blessing Benson, and Dilla*

  

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Case_One
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Tue Jun-21-16 10:19 AM

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14. "So you don't think that our Culture of promoting gun Violence - "
In response to Reply # 13
Tue Jun-21-16 10:22 AM by Case_One

          

has any affect on the love of guns and the use of guns in our society?






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CRichMonkey
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16. "Yes and no... "
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

I mean, there are always going to be those that exist at the extremes, but that's like saying that China's love for Kung Fu would predispose them to giant karate fights in the streets and we don't see that happening.

The issue is that we've started to normalize and internalize a bastardized culture of weapons porn and our legislators act like mass shootings are an aberration rather than a direct result of their policy choices.

There have been crazy and violent people for eons, it's only when you have those people AND unfettered access to weapons where you find us where we are now.


my avy: Deep in your heart, you know he's right: http://coreyrichardsonneedsajob.com/
my hustle: http://SupaSoulSounds.com

*RIP: John T. "220v" Richardson, Blessing Benson, and Dilla*

  

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Case_One
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Tue Jun-21-16 10:29 AM

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19. "US Culture and China's culture is totally different. "
In response to Reply # 16


          

We see the same problem - mass murders. We just see the solutions differently. I'm cool with that.


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Buddy_Gilapagos
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24. "I think Japanese culture is way more violent, but they have no gun viole..."
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

>has any affect on the love of guns and the use of guns in our
>society?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>.
>.
>.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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Case_One
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26. "Shame is also a factor in their culture too."
In response to Reply # 24


          


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Buddy_Gilapagos
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57. "They also date pillows that look like women. Soo I think they need more "
In response to Reply # 26


  

          

Shame.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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Case_One
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68. "You get 10 points for that"
In response to Reply # 57


          


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Cocobrotha2
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Tue Jun-21-16 10:48 AM

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29. "The tools matter though. "
In response to Reply # 7


          

>If the heart and mind of the culture is sick then the tool
>doesn't matter. Unhealthy people will always find a tool to
>cause mass pain and death


Even if we say there will always be people that will want to do mass amounts of damage, it still makes sense to minimize their potential impactt by limiting the availability of powerful weapons.

I've seen people on my news feed post repeatedly about an incident in China 5 years ago where 4 fanatics killed 30 people and injured another 150 people when they went on a stabbing free. The logic goes "SEE?!?! Even if you ban guns there could still be events like this!"

1 man in Orlando killed 49 people and injured another 50. If he had only had knives, or even just a regular handgun, there certainly would've been fewer. On the other hand, if there were 2 other shooters as armed as he was, there might have been 200 dead.

The tools matter and part of the reason folks want to restrict everyone's access to certain tools (like we already do for fully automatic firearms) is because we can't effectively screen for obviously sick minds, let alone usually sane folks who go off the deep end during periods of high stress and pressure and lash out at anyone nearby.

<-><-><-><-><-><-><-><-><->
<-><-><-><-><-><-><-><-><->

  

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Case_One
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35. "The tool is a tool. The Goal is the issue. But I understand ya point too..."
In response to Reply # 29


          

>>If the heart and mind of the culture is sick then the tool
>>doesn't matter. Unhealthy people will always find a tool to
>>cause mass pain and death
>
>
>Even if we say there will always be people that will want to
>do mass amounts of damage, it still makes sense to minimize
>their potential impactt by limiting the availability of
>powerful weapons.
>
>I've seen people on my news feed post repeatedly about an
>incident in China 5 years ago where 4 fanatics killed 30
>people and injured another 150 people when they went on a
>stabbing free. The logic goes "SEE?!?! Even if you ban guns
>there could still be events like this!"
>
>1 man in Orlando killed 49 people and injured another 50. If
>he had only had knives, or even just a regular handgun, there
>certainly would've been fewer. On the other hand, if there
>were 2 other shooters as armed as he was, there might have
>been 200 dead.
>
>The tools matter and part of the reason folks want to restrict
>everyone's access to certain tools (like we already do for
>fully automatic firearms) is because we can't effectively
>screen for obviously sick minds, let alone usually sane folks
>who go off the deep end during periods of high stress and
>pressure and lash out at anyone nearby.


.
.
.

  

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SooperEgo
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Tue Jun-21-16 10:05 AM

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5. "we can't change the world unless we change ourselves"
In response to Reply # 0


          

(c) some shit biggie prolly NEVER said

  

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Case_One
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Tue Jun-21-16 10:09 AM

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9. "Absolutely!"
In response to Reply # 5


          


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.
.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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21. "I think he was facetious because of the emptiness of that statement. "
In response to Reply # 9


  

          


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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RaFromQueens
Member since Apr 18th 2006
19528 posts
Tue Jun-21-16 10:20 AM

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15. "49 will remain the record nm."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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Case_One
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Tue Jun-21-16 10:27 AM

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17. "Most likely not. Sadly. As long as people want to cause mass murder "
In response to Reply # 15


          

the death toll will always have the opportunity to rise.
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.
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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
42170 posts
Tue Jun-21-16 12:08 PM

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44. "It's not the record."
In response to Reply # 15


  

          


█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." � Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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double negative
Member since Dec 14th 2007
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Tue Jun-21-16 10:40 AM

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27. "What will changing school segregation achieve if the culture doesn't cha..."
In response to Reply # 0
Tue Jun-21-16 10:40 AM by double negative

  

          

#justsayin

***********************************************************
https://soundcloud.com/swageyph/yph-die-with-me

  

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BigReg
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30. "It's always the wrong culture that gets blamed"
In response to Reply # 0
Tue Jun-21-16 11:02 AM by BigReg

  

          

So we ban guns, but we don't ban guns in movies? While there are differences the same violent movies/games/movies that we consume are consumed WORLDWIDE. And if you combine the gun deaths in all the other first world countries you have a number that basically just equals Camden, NJ, lol.

America's got a might makes right gene right down to it's very core; I don't think it will ever fix it's gun violence problem because its a nation that was built on gun violence.

Gun violence to commit genocide for land.
Gun violence to keep man enslaved.
Gun violence to spread its sphere of influence.

Can't fix that in schools because that history's been re-written to make the above all positives. Can't fix that in church because if there's anything that pushes the us vs them narrative it's organized religion (men of various faiths being pro-death penalty and 'tough on crime'). Can't fix it in the workforce because as opposed to fair wages/benefits/ etc for all we just care about OUR bonuses and salary, fuck yours.

Basically, we've had it coming for awhile. Its easy to look at the surface issue of it and say guns or gun related entertainment should be banned instead of looking in the mirror and realizing yes, WE ARE THE BADGUYS.

*kanye shrug*

  

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Ted Gee Seal
Member since Apr 18th 2007
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Tue Jun-21-16 12:17 PM

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45. "Exactly. We have the same movies and games here but not the same gun pro..."
In response to Reply # 30


  

          

It's actually not that hard to get a gun here if you want one, just takes time and money. That discourages the crazies though.

I think John Oliver nailed it. People who want guns are more committed than those who want to ban them. They mobilise for every piece of legislation in a way that gun control supporters don't.

It's a big reason for Sanders looking like a mirage to me. Making progress on issues is a grind. Look at how the GOP is wearing down Roe v Wade. Democrats don't have the same single mindedness on their issues.

Just IMO though.

  

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akon
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51. "ticketmaster out here trying to send me to"
In response to Reply # 30


  

          

> Camden, NJ,

ugh

.
http://perspectivesudans.blogspot.com/
i myself would never want to be god,or even like god.Because god got all these human beings on this planet and i most certainly would not want to be responsible for them, or even have the disgrace that i made them.

  

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Cold Truth
Member since Jan 28th 2004
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Tue Jun-21-16 11:10 AM

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36. "Gaaawd, if you're listenin..... HEEEELP!!!! "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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Case_One
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Tue Jun-21-16 11:14 AM

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38. "More Than 500 People Were Shot In America During the Week After Orlando"
In response to Reply # 0


          

https://www.thetrace.org/2016/06/everyday-gun-violence-orlando-pulse-nightclub-shooting/


More Than 500 People Were Shot In America During the Week After Orlando
The massacre at Pulse nightclub was the beginning of a typically bloody week in the U.S.

BY JENNIFER MASCIA· @JENNIFERMASCIA·June 20, 2016
In the early morning of Sunday, June 12, shortly after the Pulse nightclub gunman was killed by police, Camarillo Pedro Lara, 48, was found shot to death in the passenger seat of a car in Little Rock, Arkansas.

Around the time that Orlando Mayor Buddy Dyer broke the news that the massacre at the venue had claimed 49 lives, making it the deadliest mass shooting on American soil in modern history, a woman in Fountain, Colorado, found a note tacked to her neighbor’s fence: “Call 911 killed Val and myself,” it read. Inside the home, police found 60-year-old Merwin Rowe dead of a self-inflicted shotgun blast. The body of Valerie Hills, 56, lay beside him.

On Sunday night, shortly before the names of victims began trickling out from news outlets, 24-year-old Perez Villa Rufino was unintentionally shot and killed by a friend while they were play-fighting with a rifle in Queens, New York.

The week wore on. Investigators sought clues, senators filibustered, lobbyists angled. And as during quieter times, shootings claimed dozens more lives every day.

On Monday, John Cloud, 81, was shot and killed by 80-year-old Edward Acquisto at a cemetery in Tiverton, Rhode Island. On Tuesday, Regginna Jefferies, 17, was killed in a shooting that wounded three others outside a vigil for teenaged drowning victims in Oakland, California. On Wednesday, Dr. Robert Sowers, 46, was shot and killed by the husband of his receptionist, who then killed himself, inside a chiropractic office in McKenna, Washington. On Thursday, Michael Wayne Jensen, 30, a clerk at a Shell station, was shot and killed during an armed robbery in George West, Texas. On Friday afternoon, a 4-year-old boy fatally shot himself in the head while visiting the home of his mother’s friend in Elgin, Iowa. From Friday evening to Sunday morning, another 10 people were killed by shootings in Chicago alone.

During the seven days between the end of the siege at Pulse and the following Sunday at the same time, at least 228 people were fatally shot across the country, according to the Gun Violence Archive, a nonprofit research collective which tallies gun deaths and injuries. As weekend reports trickle in, that tally will likely rise.

As at Pulse, where another 53 people were injured, the full toll that gun violence wreaked between 6 a.m. June 12 and the same time on June 19 encompassed another 536 who were shot but survived. That tally includes includes Lynn Herriott, shot six times by her ex-fiancé, a former police officer, as she got off work in Jacksonville, Florida. A 12-year-old and three teenagers — ages 13, 15, and 16 — were struck by bullets when someone opened fire as they played tag in Wilmington, Delaware. And the three people were hit by gunfire during a large gathering in a Buffalo, New York, parking lot early Saturday.

As much as mass shootings like Orlando devastate, they account for less than 2 percent of all deaths due to firearms. Annually, over the past five years, total gun deaths have ranged from 31,672 to 33,599, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), for an average of 32,964 annually.

Whether it’s a result of neighborhood conflict, domestic arguments, or suicide, Americans are killed by guns at a rate unparalleled in other advanced nations.

America records about 30 gun homicides a day — but the deaths hit one population much harder than others

Nearly a million people have seen the Facebook Live video of Antonio Perkins’s murder on Tuesday night.

“It’s hot. Hot. Mom, I’m hot,” the 28-year-old father of three murmurs into his cell phone as he livestreams a steamy late-spring evening with friends and family in the North Lawndale neighborhood of Chicago. Thirty-four minutes later, shots ring out, the phone falls to the ground, and Perkins is dead.

According an analysis of CDC statistics by FiveThirtyEight.com last June, black Americans are killed at 12 times the rate of people in other developed countries.

The firearm homicide rate among black men ages 15 to 34 is 68 per 100,000 residents, which is six times the national average, and is a large reason why homicide is the leading cause of death for their cohort. For white and Hispanic men in the same age group, the firearm homicide rate is 3 percent and 13 percent, respectively.

Most gun homicide victims know their killers — and many are killed by people they love

According to an analysis by the Violence Policy Center, 1,001 women were murdered in 2013 by men they were married to or dating, the most recent year such statistics were available.

Intimate partner homicide is largely an American phenomenon: The lion’s share of women killed by guns in high-income countries — 90 percent — are from the United States. An American woman is shot and killed by a current or former romantic partner every 16 hours, according to a February analysis of crime data.

The fatal combination of guns and domestic violence can sometimes ensnare other family members too. Michael Ratliff, 44, fatally shot his 44-year-old wife and their 15-year-old daughter at their south Houston, Texas, home early Thursday.

The biggest source of gun deaths is the least discussed and most often discounted

Any contemporaneous tally of gun deaths and injuries, such as the one provided here, is inevitably incomplete. The gap comes from the fact that 60 percent of all gun deaths are suicides, many of which are not recorded by the media reports and law enforcement sources from which the Gun Violence Archive culls its rolling totals. And no government agency tracks them in anything close to real-time.

When a suicide does get covered in the media, it’s usually because it’s a murder-suicide, or foul play is initially suspected. Early Tuesday morning in Oxford, Maine, 41-year-old Daniel Pulkkinen shot and killed himself during a domestic dispute with his wife. He’d barricaded himself in their mobile home and ended his life before police arrived. At least twice this week, someone committed suicide during a police pursuit.

According to the CDC, 21,334 Americans shot themselves to death in 2014, a 28 percent jump from 15 years earlier. Because guns are responsible for half of all American suicides, these victims of gun violence form a forgotten majority, and some pro-gun advocates don’t believe that their deaths should be considered in statistics on gun violence. Even well-intentioned debates about America’s epidemic of shooting violence — like last week’s 15-hour Senate filibuster — don’t include suicide victims. That blind spot can be attributed in part to the mistaken belief that someone intent on taking their own life can’t be stopped.

But suicide is an impulse that’s often fleeting, and most people who survive rarely go on to re-attempt. “If you look at studies of people who’ve attempted suicide, only about 10 percent go on to die by suicide,” Catherine Barber, who directs the Means Matter Campaign at the Harvard School of Public Health’s Injury Control Research Center, told The Trace last month. “For those making quick decisions, it really matters what’s available to them.”

And the means by which people attempt suicide do, in fact, matter — 85 percent of all suicide attempts by firearm are successful, while overdosing and wrist-cutting, two of the most common methods, have a success rate of just 3 percent.

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atruhead
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48. "all because of movies"
In response to Reply # 38


  

          

  

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Case_One
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53. "I'm going to let you figure it out.. "
In response to Reply # 48


          

Maybe you will catch hold to it one day.
.
.
.

  

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atruhead
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Tue Jun-21-16 03:37 PM

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60. "yup movies and video games caused the Orlando incident"
In response to Reply # 53


  

          

  

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Case_One
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66. "I've learned to love you man."
In response to Reply # 60


          

But if that's all you got out of what i said and that's your conclusion then I'm just gonna have to accept you for what you are.
.
.
.

  

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atruhead
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76. "you're saying gun violence is due to movies and video games"
In response to Reply # 66


  

          

this is the same argument racists make about Hip Hop music

  

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Case_One
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91. "I said the love of guns / and gun cultureis responsible for the violence..."
In response to Reply # 76


          

And the Entertainment industry is a key influence in the gun culture and the culture of violence.


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atruhead
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93. "I'm no social scientist"
In response to Reply # 91


  

          

but I'm sure movies and video games have almost no influence on anyone who wasnt already mentally prepared to commit homicide

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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39. "The problem is that the Consitution probably intended to protect..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Assault Rifles more than hand guns.

Folks don't really talk about it but the purpose of the second amendment is to fight invading armies or even our own army. Not to provide for personal safety.

In that context their is a better constitutional argument to protect assault rifles more than hand guns.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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Case_One
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40. "You are echoing very good points. "
In response to Reply # 39


          


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akon
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41. "the constitution argues for a well regulated militia"
In response to Reply # 39
Tue Jun-21-16 11:27 AM by akon

  

          

yes, at the state level
in case the national (federal) govt over-extends itself
... thats not the right for every single individual to bear arms
its individuals who are part of a regulated militia
(in today's day and age that would be the state's national guard)
what y'all are arguing is the re-interpretation of the second amendment by the supreme court
and very recent too

so, no.

perhaps we need to go back to the letter of the law

.
http://perspectivesudans.blogspot.com/
i myself would never want to be god,or even like god.Because god got all these human beings on this planet and i most certainly would not want to be responsible for them, or even have the disgrace that i made them.

  

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Case_One
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42. "Preach!"
In response to Reply # 41


          


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Buddy_Gilapagos
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56. "I don't disagree with what you said and it dovetails with what I said. "
In response to Reply # 41


  

          

I don't think the second amendment intended for PEOPLE to carry around weapons for personal safety.

In fact, when the second amendment was written people didn't keep arms in their home. They kept them at militia depots.

So I think it is clear though that it intends for people (the 2nd amendment references PEOPLE not STATES) to have access to arms in order to fight the national government or foreign government but what type of weapons do you need to best fight governments? At least guns as powerful as the government have, assault weapons.

In fact, I think a good argument can be made that the 2nd amendment did intend for us to have access to RPGs and other serious weaponry because that's what would be needed to fight off the government, just that we don't have the right to walk around carrying them for personal protection.




>yes, at the state level
>in case the national (federal) govt over-extends itself
>... thats not the right for every single individual to bear
>arms
>its individuals who are part of a regulated militia
>(in today's day and age that would be the state's national
>guard)
>what y'all are arguing is the re-interpretation of the second
>amendment by the supreme court
>and very recent too
>
>so, no.
>
>perhaps we need to go back to the letter of the law


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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akon
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58. "not really. we should go back to the 1939 supreme court ruling"
In response to Reply # 56


  

          


which i think is closer to what the 2nd amendment intended
the people, yes but only the people who are part of a well-regulated militia

the recent ruling is based on arguing what the comma means
i.e. it disengages the first part of that sentence (being part of a well regulated militia)
from the latter part (the people's right)
thats a failure of english

.
http://perspectivesudans.blogspot.com/
i myself would never want to be god,or even like god.Because god got all these human beings on this planet and i most certainly would not want to be responsible for them, or even have the disgrace that i made them.

  

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
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43. "It will show that politicians are trying *anything.*"
In response to Reply # 0
Tue Jun-21-16 11:36 AM by Frank Longo

  

          

If banning assault rifles doesn't change the numbers, or if the deaths continue to climb instead of decrease, they can always *un-ban* them.

There's no surefire way to stop violence. The only thing politicians can do is try something. Right now, they're trying nothing, because the NRA uses fear-mongering to fight any attempt to add any regulation whatsoever. So nothing gets done. At all.

Just try things. See how they work. If they do, great. Keep them in place. If they don't, cool. Future elected officials can always propose going back to the old laws if the new ones make things worse.

Just try ANYTHING. Allow ANYTHING to get done.

For beer lovers: http://thebeertravelguide.com
For movie lovers: http://russellhainline.com

  

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Case_One
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64. "Hey, I say try it all, but until the LOVE A GUN culture changes ..."
In response to Reply # 43


          

and this promotion of violence stops then we will always have this kind of sick and twisted crap going on.
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Eric B Is Prez
Member since Nov 08th 2005
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92. "Thank you"
In response to Reply # 43


  

          

I'm so tired of the bullshit arguments

"gun control won't stop every single mass shooting"
"bad guys will still find a way to get guns"
"we need to focus on treating mental health problems"

All of these statements are true. But they're also totally inane in this context.

As if treating mental health problems and gun control are mutually exclusive. We can do both. We should do both.

And of course you can never eradicate mental illness or crime, but at the very least we can make it a LITTLE more difficult for dangerous people to have guns. Why not try that?

It's as if a partial solution isn't still progress. Fuck, it'll be progress if in the next mass shooting only 25 people die instead of 49. I know that sounds morbid, but it's true.

They have to do SOMETHING. Demanding a perfect solution is basically just procrastination. We have perfectly reasonable solutions available, and we can't even get Congress to vote on them.

_______________________________________________________________________________________

  

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atruhead
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47. "nah, let's just pray for the killing to end"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

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Case_One
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54. "Absolutely. Now ya learning. "
In response to Reply # 47


          


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atruhead
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61. "yup. Im learning. pray for homophobic massacres to end"
In response to Reply # 54


  

          

me praying can totally change the lives of killers who dont know I exist

  

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Case_One
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69. "Man you are trying too hard to be a troll. You lack the skill. Stop"
In response to Reply # 61


          


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atruhead
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77. "nah let's just pray and blame movies/video games"
In response to Reply # 69


  

          

surefire solutions to gun violence

  

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magilla vanilla
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49. ""Since we can't do everything, let's do nothing." - you."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

---------------------------------
Photo zine(some images NSFW): http://bit.ly/USaSPhoto

"This (and every, actually) conversation needs more Chesterton and less Mike Francesa." - Walleye

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
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52. "wouldn't the assumption be the two are related"
In response to Reply # 0
Tue Jun-21-16 01:17 PM by bentagain

  

          

that is

crazy + access = mass shootings

you can't cure crazy...that I know of

least we could do is make it harder for crazies to get WMDs, IMO.

I haven't heard the rationale for selling these AR-15s/AK-47 high capacity multi round kill as many people as you can as quickly as you can, etc...

I haven't heard the rationale for citizens to have access to these types of weapons

are we suppose to believe people are buying them for something other than mass shootings?

I could see some of the analogies if I was able to go into Walmart and buy rocket launchers, bombs, nuclear weapons, etc...

but as far as I know, those weapons are illegal, for what I will assume are the same reasons these automatic assault weapons should be illegal

I'm sayin, what's a well regulated militia without fighter jets

I want a tank, why can't I own a tank

etc...

anyway, IRT regulation

we regulate everything else

take 911 for example (I heard this analogy in a panel)

crazies decided to turn airplanes into WMDs

and we responded with increased regulations

air marshalls, reinforced cockpit doors, enhanced security screenings, etc...

the gun debate is the only one I can think of where people are so inclined to just throw up their hands, shrug, and say there's nothing we can do about it

???

oh, and Australia.

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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Ted Gee Seal
Member since Apr 18th 2007
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67. "RE: wouldn't the assumption be the two are related"
In response to Reply # 52


  

          

>that is
>
>crazy + access = mass shootings
>
>you can't cure crazy...that I know of
>
>least we could do is make it harder for crazies to get WMDs,
>IMO.
>
>I haven't heard the rationale for selling these AR-15s/AK-47
>high capacity multi round kill as many people as you can as
>quickly as you can, etc...
>
>I haven't heard the rationale for citizens to have access to
>these types of weapons
>
>are we suppose to believe people are buying them for something
>other than mass shootings?
>
>I could see some of the analogies if I was able to go into
>Walmart and buy rocket launchers, bombs, nuclear weapons,
>etc...
>
>but as far as I know, those weapons are illegal, for what I
>will assume are the same reasons these automatic assault
>weapons should be illegal
>
>I'm sayin, what's a well regulated militia without fighter
>jets
>
>I want a tank, why can't I own a tank
>
>etc...
>
>anyway, IRT regulation
>
>we regulate everything else
>
>take 911 for example (I heard this analogy in a panel)
>
>crazies decided to turn airplanes into WMDs
>
>and we responded with increased regulations
>
>air marshalls, reinforced cockpit doors, enhanced security
>screenings, etc...
>
>the gun debate is the only one I can think of where people are
>so inclined to just throw up their hands, shrug, and say
>there's nothing we can do about it
>
>???
>
>oh, and Australia.

Yep. Sensible stuff. Lots of common sense steps and perspectives that can be entertained before trying to scapegoat movies or games.

Just IMO though.

  

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Case_One
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78. "If you think I'm scapegoating Movies and Games then you've missed it"
In response to Reply # 67


          


>
>Yep. Sensible stuff. Lots of common sense steps and
>perspectives that can be entertained before trying to
>scapegoat movies or games.
>


^^ SMH.


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Ted Gee Seal
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84. "You play whatever if games you need to make yourself feel superior "
In response to Reply # 78


  

          

Feel better little buddy?

Just IMO though.

  

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Mr. ManC
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55. "Isn't the idea behind banning gay marriage that it will"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

somehow effect the culture?

Like, if you still think gay people will want to be together, then what is the energy behind banning gay marriage?

An assault weapons ban will effect the culture. For someone to not have access to the weapon stops short the fantasy of carrying out the rampage they would otherwise only be able to carry out in video games. It is the same principle behind the death penalty, and that the threat of capital punishment is enough to help dissuade people from breaking the law to that extent of that verdict levied against them.

damn, but the more I am typing, the more I'm making your argument.....gay marriage shouldn't be banned, the death penalty should be outlawed....hmm....and assault weapons shouldn't be in the hands of civilians.

I guess it is because one is an attempt to legislate something innate to a person, and the other is gunz at WalMart. Yeah, let's ban commodities, not non-heteronormative oddities.

________________________________________________

SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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62. "Culture is just a reflection of people. It's not the problem but a symp..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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Case_One
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63. "The People create the culture and the culture shapes the people. "
In response to Reply # 62


          


.
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Garhart Poppwell
Member since Nov 28th 2008
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65. "Assault rifles have been illegal in America for 3o years now"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

The AR-15 isn't an assault rifle.

__________________________________________
CHOP-THESE-BITCHES!!!!
------------------------------------
Garhart Ivanhoe Poppwell
Un-OK'd moderator for The Lesson and Make The Music (yes, I do's work up in here, and in your asscrease if you run foul of this

  

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Case_One
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71. "Tell us what an AR-15 is?"
In response to Reply # 65


          


.
.
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Garhart Poppwell
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73. "AR=Armalite Rifle"
In response to Reply # 71


  

          

An assault rifle is fully automatic. ARs are semi automatic like any other rifle you only have to cock once.

__________________________________________
CHOP-THESE-BITCHES!!!!
------------------------------------
Garhart Ivanhoe Poppwell
Un-OK'd moderator for The Lesson and Make The Music (yes, I do's work up in here, and in your asscrease if you run foul of this

  

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akon
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72. "this actually argues for increasing regulation"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

because what we have seen to date, and in numerous instances, is that by increasing regulation
then we change the culture surrounding what is being regulated
so the culture follows the laws in place (and really, not the other way round)
this may not be true in *all* instances - we are increasingly seeing instances where
the cultural attitudes have changed, and the laws have then had to follow (e.g gay marriage)
but with regards instances where we have been forward thinking enough to institute forward thinking laws
we have been able to then influence/shift cultural attitudes
the same is true of gun control legislation
although even in this instance, the majority of americans believe access to guns should be regulated
its the laws that are failing to catch up (and we know why)

.
http://perspectivesudans.blogspot.com/
i myself would never want to be god,or even like god.Because god got all these human beings on this planet and i most certainly would not want to be responsible for them, or even have the disgrace that i made them.

  

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Case_One
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80. "Great Dialog in here. Glad that some people are thinking"
In response to Reply # 0


          

of ways to look at the problem of gun violence in this nation.
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.
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Atillah Moor
Member since Sep 05th 2013
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Tue Jun-21-16 11:21 PM

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81. "Assault Weapons is a misnomer. All weapons are for the assault "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

of other creatures and nothing changes if the culture doesn't change. The culture that would require change would be that of ignorance, intolerance, and possibly greed across a broad spectrum of society i.e. schools, homes, churches, political offices, etc.

Only a catastrophic or otherwise unprecedented event could even have a chance of getting that to happen.

______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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Wed Jun-22-16 02:25 AM

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83. "Very simple answer:"
In response to Reply # 0


          

Less people will die.

  

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TheAlbionist
Member since Jul 04th 2011
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86. "Culture will follow. Take it from experience."
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Jun-22-16 10:01 AM by TheAlbionist

  

          

Although we've never been as attached to our guns as you, when we banned handguns in the 90s following ONE school shooting (Dunblane) there were headlines and whinge stories from all over the country about how we're destroying a hobby, even that we're making it harder for our Olympians to compete and that we were endangering the age-old tradition of shooting intruders in the face multiple times.

20 years later and nobody ever even mentions it. I remember Dunblane vividly and Turns out we missed handguns for about 2 weeks and then everyone realised only sad excuses for people needed to go around carrying lethal force next to their shriveled genitals.

_______________________________

))<>((
forever.

  

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Atillah Moor
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87. "Scottish culture has far less anti-black anti-native ideology if any."
In response to Reply # 86


  

          

gun worship/culture in America is underpinned by the aforementioned as well as fear of government oppression and "Mexicans".

Were the country mostly white like Scotland then your example would be more apples to apples.

______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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atruhead
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88. "House Democrats are having a sit-in for gun legislation"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

not praying, not trying to get rid of guns in movies and video games
working towards a solution

  

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denny
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89. "Good stuff."
In response to Reply # 88


          

  

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Atillah Moor
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90. "They'd have to fill the room with their constituents to stand a chance"
In response to Reply # 88


  

          

Hate to say it, but a handful of aarp members sitting on a hard floor for hours won't last very long.

______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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