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Subject: "I think it's near impossible *and* we should do it anyhow" Previous topic | Next topic
Walleye
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15523 posts
Tue Apr-28-20 02:38 PM

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29. "I think it's near impossible *and* we should do it anyhow"
In response to In response to 27
Tue Apr-28-20 02:42 PM by Walleye

          

I don't really disagree with you by much. It just seems like a matter of framing to me.

>It is damn near impossible to say "this happened solely
>because that"

History is story-telling. We're working with the same set of facts, and even though I disagree with how you've strung those together, I don't think you've said anything factually incorrect, much less dishonest. So even if the project of saying that "this thing led to that thing" is really complicated, the process of moving toward a clearer understanding seems really important. Especially when we're run by an honest-to-god fascist with no desire to play by the rules of historical story-telling.

To me, the way it should work is you analyze some uncontested facts and tell your story. I get viciously angry and tell you that you're wrong, based on the same uncontested facts and/or additional ones, from reframing the scope of the story we're telling by geography or year or perspective. And then some third sucker comes in and explains that we're BOTH incredibly misguided, offering another new story. And then you and I both turn on that dumb-dumb, in spite of mostly disagreeing before their presence.

Storytelling and arguing. I've got a class full of incredibly dedicated women right now that I'm trying to teach 20th century history (this isn't my typical area of interest and my background in it is VERY limited) and this is the chaotic, messy process that I'm trying to teach them.

______________________________

"Walleye, a lot of things are going to go wrong in your life that technically aren't your fault. Always remember that this doesn't make you any less of an idiot"

--Walleye's Dad

  

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It's the 75th anniversary of Mussolini's death [View all] , Walleye, Tue Apr-28-20 08:23 AM
 
Subject Author Message Date ID
i got some down time, i'll bite. Why should any of us on OKP care
Apr 28th 2020
1
what an odd stance. the poster is presenting history. an observation
Apr 28th 2020
2
Yeah, the photos are something else
Apr 28th 2020
7
stance? not a stance. a question. please settle down.
Apr 28th 2020
15
      asking someone: 'feed me a position!'. is odd to me.
Apr 28th 2020
18
      stop being weird fam. this is where I spend my down time.....
Apr 28th 2020
21
           i can be 'weird' if i want. the fuck?
Apr 28th 2020
22
           Why you poasting like it's 2008? It's 2020, this ain't that kinda party ...
Apr 28th 2020
24
                way to silly it up by stating the year in which i joined.
Apr 28th 2020
26
           I didn't really think it was an odd question
May 01st 2020
41
      also, stance doesn't mean 'up in arms'. it's simply a position.
Apr 28th 2020
19
It's more than fine not to care
Apr 28th 2020
3
      Thank you for the very thorough response!
Apr 28th 2020
4
      I'm always intrigued by US, ahistorial, views about the war anod "who" w...
Apr 28th 2020
5
      And folks will pretend your first point somehow doesn't count
Apr 28th 2020
8
           Don't wanna derail, but it seems like you're romanticizing USSR's motiva...
Apr 28th 2020
20
                But we don't do that same de-coupling in the United States
Apr 28th 2020
23
                     You write very well
Apr 28th 2020
27
                    
                     wrestling coaches almost always have reactionary political instincts
Apr 28th 2020
30
                     Well said. It's extremely complicated.
Apr 28th 2020
28
                          And the complexity is the fun part
Apr 28th 2020
32
                               Ha yep. Fun/interesting, and endlessly frustrating too.
Apr 28th 2020
33
      *fire emojis*
Apr 28th 2020
14
Got a song out of it at least
Apr 28th 2020
6
I got a good beginners introduction to Mussolini with this Podcast
Apr 28th 2020
9
Shit, this looks good
Apr 28th 2020
11
Checked the Ivan The Terrible pod yesterday. Real life Game of Thrones.....
Apr 29th 2020
38
I was incredibly into Russian History when I was sixteen
Apr 29th 2020
39
Just started listening to this - thanks.
Apr 29th 2020
40
I wonder how popular it would be to hang criminal bodies in public in th...
Apr 28th 2020
10
That's a big part of why I think this is important
Apr 28th 2020
12
      Our system has diffused responsibility so much and made everything legal
Apr 29th 2020
36
           Exactly
Apr 29th 2020
37
Just became familiar with this through Celtic vs. Lazio
Apr 28th 2020
13
That's extremely good
Apr 28th 2020
16
      Nothing from florida could ever be Maoist. From rednecks
Apr 28th 2020
17
           Good call - plus, I forgot about the Packers
Apr 28th 2020
25
                ah what a waste of a specialty
Apr 28th 2020
31
is there a decent movie on this?
Apr 28th 2020
34
That's a really good question!
Apr 28th 2020
35

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