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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
8480 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 09:10 AM

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"Pro Black Music vs. Cointelpro and Uncle Tom Niggaz"
Thu Mar-01-07 09:15 AM by AquamansWrath

  

          

If you afraid nigga say you afraid.

from Curtis Mayfield to Bob Marley to PE to Boots to ... living colour to bad brains... black people have always made problack music.

You see blues was nothing more than conscious problack music.
Gospel is nothing more than conscious problack music.
Jazz greats would explain that during their era of censorship, Jim Crow, and white supremecy, that Jazz was problack music speaking on the troubles of people of color.
In other words... black people have ALWAYS made problack music.
It's fairly sensible considering you would have to have an alternate view of your people or agenda to support or to make music that would counter your own neighborhoods, families, and support systems.

Jimi Hendrix has a wonderful piece called Black Gold...where he clearly explains that people of color are the fathers of this earth... and the barers of light, wonderfully creative people caught up in turmoil.

If you were a sucker for any movement and you weren’t sincere to it… then that’s your natural order.
You might be
The cat who had on timbs and a tissue up your nose when redman was hot..
That nigga with a gun and skullcap when NWA was out…
I maintain… anyone who was concered about consciousness that was serious in 89… will be serious in 09…
Anyone who shifted gears in 93 probably shifted gears in 03.
you might be that cat right now with a Blazer and a Fitted on...
thinking your fresh...

That was arguably the most potent period in hiphop as there was an agenda to the music. That climate during that period challenged younger writers and producers to not only think outside the box... but write music with content, substance, and demanding that you address the ills of our era. In a era that had no black leadership... it was hiphop that stepped up and played King, X,
In the words of the great Joe Strummer
“Today’s Revolution Music, is tomorrow’s pop”.

However… you have to have pop people to want pop music.
Nations of Millions to Hold Us Back and Fear of a Black Planet are two timeless gems that addressed the climate of this country during the late 80’s. I have always maintained that after the success of these albums there was a feverish attempt to counter it with work from Dre and Eazy. The fact that Eazy had the same lawyers as the lawyers who represented the cops who beat Rodney King, the fact that Eazy was in the Source defending the cops “if you look at the tape they were telling him to stay down, but the nigga wouldn’t listen”. The fact that Eazy was invited to the White House to have dinner with the Seth Lord himself… George Bush Sr. even taking a pic with him.
You see Jerry Heller who was the owner of Ruthless Records had a huge history in music.
He’s the man responsible for bringing Pink Floyd to the US for the very first time and as well as Elton John.
He was Marvin Gaye’s Manager from 1967-1972.
several things about Heller you don't know...

Is a teacher at UCLA for Entertainment Studies and Performing Arts. . . .

He is the first non-lawyer ever admitted to lecture at the Practicing Law Institute. . .???

Was manager to Ike and Tina Turner.

He was invited to the White House by two different presidents… Nixon and George Bush Sr.

Read that part again... Nixon and Bush... both worked closely with Kissinger. Now if you know anything about neutralizing and the operations of the CIA, then you know what this means.
I invite you to review the Heroine drug case of Jimi Hendrix in Toronto Canada...

Both of whom viewed popular music, rock music, and black music in general as national security threats.
Was this the downfall of ProBlack music? Who knows. Eazy was friends with Freeway Rick, the most notorious drug dealer out of Compton in the late 80’s and notably the man responsible for bringing CRACK to the black community thru the CIA.
Freeway Rick has explained how this work on many occasions.
Let’s discuss.

Assassination Politics of the Vietnam War period.

Former CIA Richard Ober, director of OPERATION CHAOS...
the most expansive domestic surveillance and covert ops net-work in America'shistory.
The intelligence sectors response to the anti-war and civil rights movements, ran covert
assassinations programs as well.
The Nixon administration rose on a foundation of political murder.
The C.I.A.had assembled a thick concordia of lethal methods.
The project began with an anonymous , undated memo on assassination by "natural cause."
Knock off key people the heavily censored document specified, " how to knock off key guys,
natural causes, a declassified memo..
1 Bodies left with no hope if the cause of death being determined by the most complete
autopsy and chemical examinations,
2 Bodies left in such circumstances as to simulate accidental death
3 Bodies left in such circumstances as to simulate accidental suicide
4 Bodies left with residue that simulate those caused by natural diseases.

CHAPTER 1 A Killing Field For The Heat

In 1967 a subversive form of music melded with politics in San Francisco.Thus,
destabilization tactics were summarized in a leaked memo, excerpt:
"show them as depraved" call attention to their habits, and every possible
embarrassment. Send articles to the newspaper showing their depravity. Use misinformation
to confuse and corrupt. Provoke target groups into rivalries that might result in death."

For the first time since it's creation the warfare state erected by the Dulles brothers,
Hoover, MacArthur, Kissinger, Nixon, etc. was threatened by an increasingly militant
segment of society.The FBI rose to the challenge.
On July 30, 1994, Intelligence files on Leonard Bernstein reveal the bureau spent
countless hours examining his links with associations deemed communist to subversive.

FBI agent Jane Moore said the FBI saw the strength and power of the idea of socialism,
realized it represented a very real danger to our profit-motivated corporate state andhad
declared total covert war against not only the denim clad revolutionaries but all
progressive forces
The bureaus tactic was to cut them down or burn them out before they realized their
potential.

At the federal level, the CIA. was already pursuing similar objectives under code name
Operation Chaos.

Targets of Chaos
Blank Panther Movement (Geronimo Pratt, jailed for 27 yrs. for murders he did not
commit. He was also a target of COINTELPRO, the FBI "counter-surveillance program"
Politically active hippies were also targets.Many underground papers were put out of
business when they were abandoned by advertisers who had been pressured by the FBI From
1967 to 1972 the operation compiled 13,000 files, which concerned 300,000 individuals and
organizations. The CIA directorate of operations created an index of 7 million names.

CHAPTER 2 The Machine Cia And Mob Influences On The Rock Industry

The mafia was to be enlisted for the covert war against the counter-culture. In the
mid-60's CHAOS officials and the mob both eyed the rise of political rock music. The CIA
saw them as long haired communists screaming for revolution and the end to the Vietnam
War. The mafia wanted more constrictive financial control over the recording industry. Top
40, the reigning broadcast format in America owes its very existence to the CIA and mafia
combo. Drugs would enter the equation, plus youth and LSD with the politics of heroin and
LSD drugs wereonly onecontribution the agency has made to the American culture.
The National Security Council was patterned after Hitler's security council , and its
jurisdiction was to oversee the CIA by dictate of the NSA of 1947.

CHAPTER 3 Parapolitical Stars In The Dope Show

Books were burned, book stores closed down, offices and social centers were broken into,
artists, writers, musicians and countless hippies got dragged into court., to answer
trumped up charges of corruption, obscenity, drug-abuse, and anything that might silence
their voices.LSD appeared on the streets, as if on cue to destroy student descent. More
potent drugs used in federally sponsored behavior modification studies (translates
mind-control) also found their way to society at large. STP created by Dow-Chemical Co. in
1964 was considered incapacitating agent by the CIA Emergency wards was choked in San
Francisco with freaking bohemians. PCP an animal tranquilizer, also fed to the hippies by
the CIA. The Mob opened mass production labs and a meticulously organized network of
traffickers to move black marketdrugs.
A CIA agent who claims to have infiltrated the covert LSD network, provided a clue when
he referred to Height-Asbury as a human guinea pig farm.A dozen years earlier in the same
city, George Hunter White and hisCIA colleagues had set up a "safe house" and began
testing hallucinogenic drugs on unwitting citizens. Now suddenly there was a neighborhood
packed with young people who were ready and willing to gobble experimental
chemicals.Charles Manson and Timothy Leary arrived in San Francisco and each had a keen
interest in mind-control.

Dulles mentioned in his memo that the agency was testing drugs on groups of people. CIA
personnel mingled with the drug dealers.. Monitoring stations were set up, among them was
Louis J West, Jack Ruby's shrink, West oversawDr Jose Delgado, author of Physical Control
of the Mind and Ross Addey, a veteran of operation Paperclip (Nazi's entry into CIA and
NASA and else where), Dr. Margaret Singer of the CIA created False Memory Syndrome. All
participated in the study of LSD as a politically destabilizing weapon. One CIA memo named
the drug as a potential new agent for unconscious warfare. In 1967 as CHAOS was launched
by CIA White House. Timothy Leary, tossed out of the army for erratic behavior, left
experimenting with LSD on prisoners in N.Y. for the CIA, and donned the robes of the
designated LSD media prelate. He later admitted to knowing at the time that some powerful
people in Washington have sponsored this drug research. Leary was constantly surrounded by
ops of intelligent agents.

CHAPTER 4 The death of Cass Elliot (of the Mamas and the Papas)and other restless youth

According to Mae Brussell, researcher, in 1968 orders went out to proceed to neutralize
segments of society. including those restless youth. By 1969 the SSS (Special Services
Section of the FBI), combined with the Justice department and with the CIA operation
Chaos.
Thus. Manson Murders, etc. Manson joined the Process church, a Satanist church, who also
worshipped Lucifer and Jehovah. It was (is) big in Hollywood at the time.(Manson clearly a
mind-controlled dupe).

One FBI report on Cass Elliot marked urgent states she attended a fund raiser in
Hollywood , for Peace and Justice. Cass had political ambitions and wanted to be a
senator, maybe, in 20 yrs or so. An underground paper called The Realist suggested Cass
was the target of political foul play. The editorPaul Krassner said, "I believe she might
have been killed. She knew a lot about the incredible criminal links between Hollywood and
Washington and Las Vegas.

CHAPTER 5 The Murder In The House Of Pooh, Brian Jones Of The Rolling Stones

. The fusion of music and politics made the stones an enemy of the state.There were
infiltrators and drug set-ups and busts thus, Jagger said " This is a protest against the
system, war stems from power-mad politicians and patriots, we must end all these mindless
men from seats of power, and replace them with real people, people of compassion." The
stones were stalked harassed and getting paranoid.
An odd construction crew came to restore the house of Brian Jones, the former cottage of
AA Milne, author of Pooh books. They muscled their way into hisprivate life, and had a
weird hold over Brian. One worker, Thorogood, made a death bed confession, that he had
drowned Wilson The tell-tale signs of cover-up by authorities are unmistakable. He was
off drugs at the time. his death was not caused by a life of abuse as was claimed, he was
murdered.

CHAPTER 6 The End Of Rock Festivals

Five Months later, a music festival happened near San Francisco, and became murderous.
The band would be forever tainted by the surreal violence..
Editor of Rolling Stone, Jan Wenner, put the Rolling Stones Band in touch with Melvin
Belli, attorney of California well-heeled conservative base, whose eulogy at his funeral
was, "a man of law against the CHAOS of life, a man ofCHAOS against the law of life." He
was one of CIA's most trusted court room wonders.Belli chose the Altamount for the Stones
concert. It had all the charm of a grave yard, and not fitto draw 300,000 people.! Ralph
Sonny Barger of the Hells Angels was hired to keep the peace, (an informant hit-man, who
was hired by feds to kill labor activist Cesar Chavez, but was arrested instead on an old
charge.)Hells Angels are represented in 18 countries now, largest crime family export. Who
in 1969 suspected the Hells Angels was a death squad in employ of the political agencies?
(a refreshing break from the status quo?)

At the Stone's concert the Hells Angels beat up on the youth to excited to seeJagger and
Leary arrive, an 18 year old girl was stabbed to death for allegedly having a gun, by the
Hells Angels. There ended up 3 dead and many wounded.. A Cancer Was Planted And Growing In
The Counter-Culture

CHAPTER 7 Jimi Hendrix Political Harassment And Murder

He didn't die from a drug overdose, he was not an out of control dope fiend. He was not
a junkie.
FBI COUNTELPRO was out to do more than prevent a communist menace, from overtaking the
U.S.! (or to control black power movement). It was out to obliterate its opposition and
ruin the representatives of the people involved in the anti-war movement, Civil Rights
Movement, and the rock revolution.

Hendrix manager, Mike Jeffery, by his own admission was an intelligence agent. He
frequently boasted he had powerful underworld connections.There were many mafia managed
"acts". The CIA/Mafia connection had exercised considerable influence in the music
industry for decades.Hendrix wanted out of the contract. He felt he was under surveillance
and felt more and more unsafe in New York, his former safe haven. His manager, thus, might
have created a Toronto arrest, to silence Jimi. He preferred him to be isolated. He had
always been a trusting and open person before, and now he didn't know who to trust.

He was getting 10 grand for a 50 grand concert.Hendrix friends said Jeffrey's would get
more money from a dead Hendrix than a living one. There was also a possiblemillion dollar
insurance policy in Jeffrey's name.

Was Hendrix murdered? The official cause of death was asphyxiation caused by vomit? The
pathologist report left the cause of death open. Monica Danneman (investigator), had long
insisted Hendrix was murdered. At the time of her own death, she had brought media
attention to the case in a letter and highly publicized court battle.Monica's body was
found in a fume-filled car near her home, in south England. It was called a suicide.

She had a lot of death threats, and people who knew her said "she didn't believe in the
concept of suicide"

CHAPTER 8 Death Of Jim Morrison, Lead Singer Of The Doors

Two years after the death of Brian Jones, Jim Morrison's body was found in a bath-tub in
his flat in Paris. Death was attributed to natural causes, possibly heart failure.Morrison
's political outbursts attractedthe FBI. He had said, " I like the idea about the breaking
away or over-throw of the established order." In another interview Manzerek (of the Doors)
considered possible motives for the elimination of the AnarchisticLizard King " they were
going to stop all rock and roll by stopping the Doors. He was considered the most
dangerous because he was saying . "We want the world and we want it NOW."
FBI harassment rendered Morrison so anxiety ridden that he had an ulcer by mid-twenties.
Paranoia struck deep and it was thought he was a marked man.Bob Seymore wrote a book re:
Jim called The End and conceded" you could say the CIA and the other intelligence agencies
may have had a hand in the deaths of Hendrix, Joplin and Morrison etc., simply because
they were the leaders of the generation of the 60's.

A book " The Bank of America in Louisiana" appeared in 1975, after his death, supposedly
written by Morrison. Some say he survived Paris and lived a life free from celebrity and
the FBI.A James Douglas Morrison, claimed to beoperating as an intelligence agent for a
number of groups including the CIA and Interpol, and also had connections with various
occult groups.ThisJM2 also claims to be the dead rock star. There are stacks of official
looking document, and letters between the agencies, CNN, NBC, and JM2. This claim was made
by researcher Thomas Lyttle who claims to have seen what looks like authentic documents.
There seems to be hundredsif not thousands of miscellaneous files under the name.No
autopsy was performed after his death, a probable violationof French law.Pamela Courson,
who was with him at the time, died later of an overdose that some said was a "Hot Shot" or
poisoned opiate.

CHAPTER 9 Joan Baez Phil Ochs

Joan Baez survived the Operation Chaos backlash, she fully understood that political assassination
could be her reward for openly castigating military-industrial masters of war. Her close
friend Martin Luther King Jr., the worlds most honored civil rights leader told her and a
group of activists before delivering his famed speech how the police had dumped him in the
hole and it was black and he couldn't see. They shoved food in the room but he wouldn't eat
it for fear it was poisoned , hungry and afraid he got on his knees and prayed and when he
got up he said it didn't matter anymore.
Kings entourage hid their pain when they knew what he meant." We knew he was going to
die, and he was ready to die, and he was ready to make a commitment to Vietnam etc"
He said, "I have been to the mountaintop and I have seen the Promised Land and it doesn't matter anymore."

Joan Baez wrote a memoir," And a Voice to Sing With", (1987) of her childhood and her
father as a bright young Stanford scientist "Albert Baez recognized the danger of the
unleashed atom even in the early days" He took a job at Cornell University in Ithica, New
York (Cornell is the base of CIA Mind Control experiments and Joan is a survivor of ritual
abuse and mind control experimentation, according to letters she has written to
researchers and other survivors) Many universities are common cover for trauma-based-mind-control programmi She has a song about it:.........

"I am paying for protection, Smoking out the truth...chasing recollections...nailing
down the roof"

Baez entertained no illusions about the CIA, and promoted State of Siege, film she saw
as exposing the corrupt element of AID (Agency for International Development, overseas),
which funded the teaching of techniques of torture tactics in Latin America. We solicited
signatures against the use of torture. Torture was made more prevalent than it had been
since the Middle Ages, thus the danger was its common use as government policy. The hands
of the US government were far from clean.

Joan did years of intensive therapy to confront her inner demons ,fears, insomnia, panic
attacks, phobias, anxieties, etc. Therapists kept Joan glued together, "to get me to the
next gig", she said.

Joan's father was invited to become the head of Operations at Cornell, which would bring
him in contact with CIA Human Ecology Foundation, (re: Academic Mind Control Studies)
that are behind the fences of the Ivy League campuses across the country. Joan said it was classified.. She was not buried by Chaos, but she lived under its intolerant eye and
it could silence her. An example is a mistranslation in Japanese re: her comments on Vietnam and Nagasaki.
The interpreter was threatened and complied....A year later sale of her records
were banned from all Army PXs and when she denounced the draft on the Smother's Brothers Hour,she was censored by CBS, her comments cut, and CBS cancelled the Brothers soon after.
The same year, her then husband, David Harris ,was sentenced to three years for draft evasion.

Civil rights activists were falsely linked to Communist organizations. A common smear
tactic.


Joan Baez And Bob Dylan Mimi Farina And Richard Farina.....................................

In 1961 Joan Baez met Bob Dylan. Whose songs had such stark political flavor. Bob
nearly died in 1966 after a motorcycle accident. Joan's brother-in-law Richard Farina did
die few months later in a motorcycle accident. It was suspicious and happened on his wife Mimi Farina's birthday He was on his way back from a promotional party for his book :
"Been Down So Long It Looks Like Up". Before his death he had been producing an album to be performed by Joan, it got shelved.


(Mimi Farina, sister of Joan, is an equally talented singer and politically active woman
who sings in prisons and goes out" hands on "to the poor people, last I heard, and I
think Joan's heart is also with the poor folk. Ms.Farina has organized groups to carry out these endeavours..).. (My Note)

After Dylan's accident he went thru a political change . He dropped the broadside lyrics
grating on the nerves of the establishment. Mark Edmundson wrote: "He wasn't ruined by
drugs. His work combines art and politics and the harshest truth about the world. He is a
visionary skeptic ,he loves the promise of America and yet is disgusted by much of its
reality."

His songs tell about the cane murder of black servant Hattie Carroll, the death of boxer
Davie Moore, the unbroken chains of injustice. They go to the heart of the decades most
recurring preoccupation ,that in a time of irreversible technical progress , moral
civilization has pathetically faltered, that no matter how much international attention is
focused on the macro-cosmic affairs, the plight of the individual must be considered.

Five years after the accident he wrote "George Jackson", a fiercely driven ballad about
the Black Panther leader " "George Jackson" who was murdered by a prison
guard.

Phil Ochs (The Out Law And His Brain) Mind Contro And MPD

"U.S. agents were able to destroy any persons reputation by inducing hysteria or
excessive emotional responses, temporary or permanent insanity, suggest or encourage
suicide , erase memory , invent double or triple personalities, inside ones
mind." ---quote by the late Mae Brussells, Operation Chaos investigator etc.
Ochs was a close chum of Bob Dylan, and thought Bob was the greatest poet ever.
Together with others they dragged folk music away from the migration camps and union halls and
into direct confrontation with the Eisenhower's looming military-industrial complex. Ochs
denounced the American politics in the "Cops of the world". song

" and when we've butchered your sons boys, have a stick of gum boys, we own half the
world...."OH CAN YOU SEE"? AND THE NAME OF OUR PROFITS IS DEMOCRACY.
He was the ultimate dissident song

" the comic and the beauty queen are dancing on the stage .The raw recruits are lining
up like coffins in a cage. Oh we are fighting in a war we lost before the war began"
Not long before he died, one night after too many drinks, he drew down the CIA Director
Wm. Colby, director of the murderous Phoenix Project in Vietnam. He claimed he put a
contract out on his life for 100,000 dollars. "I told Colby he's got a half of year to
live or get out of Vietnam or he is dead. They can kill me but he is dead" he said.( He as
well was certain that Gloria Steinem, editor of Ms. magazine and famous feminist is a CIA
agent) Ochs was founder of the Yippee party, sang with protesters, and appeared as a
witness for the trail of the Chicago Seven. His lyrics were considered so inflammatory
that he was banned from the air-waves. The FBI did not refrain form amassing a huge file
on him, and the feeling that he was never alone unnerved him. He wrote " take everything I
own, take the tap from my phone, and leave my life alone, My life alone! He was tarred as
a communist and a threat to national security. His friends said Ochs was convinced he
would be assassinated. He was driven to drink by the radio black-listing his music and the
ongoing surveillance and harassments and his nerve gave out. He lived in a perpetual state
of paranoia His vocal cords were crushed by thugs.

He developed a right wing pseudo personality called John Train who he wrote about

( Beth's note: Who created John Train? Was he like his good friend Joan Baez, a
mind-controlled MPD(DID), from abuse and experimentation? On the first day of summer
,1975," Phil Ochs "was murdered in the Chelsea Hotel by John Train, Ochs said in a taped
interview. "for the good of societies public and "secret," he needed to be gotten rid of."
He also made reference to his Pseudo personality in song fragments in an album never
recorded re: "Phil Ochs checked into the Chelse a Hotel, there was blood on his clothes,
Train Train Train, the outlaw and his brain. (my note: I have read accounts of cloning
since the 50's. Lots of hi-tech knowledge kept secret, including in Jim Keith's book
"Secret and Suppressed").

Ochs actually now believed he was working for the CIA., writes biographer Marc
Elliot.( Ochs also referred to N.Y. Cornell Hospital in mysterious lists) "Train hinted
that if Ochs had been a commercial success "they"(CIA) would have killed his host
personality.. " Colby and Co. would have been more than happy to put a slug thru his head
at that point, "said Train, the alternate personality. Ochs committed suicide on April 9,
1976, by hanging. This was the same year of the book " the Control of Candy Jones" by
Donald Bain., ( a study of CIA mind control experimentation, Candy was also an MPD,
created personalities, who carried out covert assignments , a marionette with an inner
Nazi personality. She worked without her knowledge as a CIA op. for 12 years. Her final
post-hypnotic command was suicide, which was intervened by her husband, talk show host
John Nebel. ( the book is out of print, I have a copy) It is very probable that "John
Train" was programmed to kill Philip Ochs the host personality.

Another musician with repressed memory of child-hood trauma was Peter Townsend ("Who"
guitarist). In 1999 it occurred to him that certain phrases from rock opera "TOMMY" were
not fiction but his life. He filled in the blanks from his childhood amnesia.

CHAPTER 10 Who Killed The Kennedys And Sal Mineo (Rebel Without A Cause)

Actor Sal Mineo was stabbed to death in a parking lot after signing on to play Sirhan
Sirhan in an upcoming movie regarding JFK. (CIA assassination and post-hypnotic
programming were the major themes of the movie.) Elliot Mintz talk show host for ABC,
later Bob Dylan and the Lennon's publicist was buried in research with Mineo, regarding
JFK killing. They became convinced Sirhan was innocent. The movie production disagreed and
Mineo pulled out of the picture. After he was killed the media revealed in his secret life
of bi-sexuality, and the murder was taken as homophobia. Gay Bars were closing in fear,
and Hollywood stars took refuge behind locked doors.
Michael Ruppert a former LAPD officer left the department to expose his CIA trained
colleagues. He claims "Sirhan was hypno-programmed using hypnosis, drugs and torture by
Rev. Jerry Owen and CIA Mind-Control Specialist Wm. Bryan at the stable where he worked
months before the shooting. The LAPD concealed evidence implicating the CIA in shooting.
The channels of the intelligence world swarmed with crooks and killers.

Conservative Evangelist Billy Graham was Presidents Nixon's celebrated "spiritual
advisor". Then there was LA's gangster corrupt public servant and wealthy gambling czar
Mickey Cohen.(who "claimed "to be a friend of Sal Mineo) The former hit-man Cohen
contacted the press after Mineos death t o boost that he was his pal. Cohen was also
chummy with Nixon, and his entourage. In 1968, Cohen was coined the godfather of the West
Coast Mafia gambling ops. When Cohen was close to death he opened up to investigative
reporter Chuck Ashman, and he said, "Mickey Cohen told me the tale of his being paid off
to fake a conversion and dose of Christianity for Billy Grahams N.Y. crusade. Two of
Graham's staff had passed more than 10,000 dollars to Mickey and his family." We found the
dates and the amounts and even the checks" Cashmon said.

Cohen was the first bridge linking the killers of Robert Kennedy and Sal Mineo. He was
on friendly terms with Carlos Marcellos, mob boss, who ran with David Ferrie, CIA corrupt
ops., who was investigated by Jim Garrison in the connection of killing of JFK. Cohen was
also a chum with Jack Ruby. Cohen was also a friend of Melvin Belli, Jack Ruby's defense
attorney. He also controlled the Santa Anita race-track where Sirhan was employed. Mickey
Cohen's circle of friends and his appearance in the limelight after the Mineo killing begs
question on Hollywood power brokers. Sirhan and Cohen were close to Desi Arnez, (Producer)
of I Love Lucy .Arnez was an anti Castro Cuban exile leader. In 1966 Sirhan wrote in his
notebook that he landed a job at the stables Corona Breeding Farm co-owned by Desi Arnez,
Buddy Ebsen, Dale Robertson, ultra conservatives, and TV personalities were well
acquainted with Sirhan. Sirhan was known as a fervent anti-communist. Attorney, Russell
Parsons, Sirhan's attorney, showed no effort to make known that Sirhan was in the wrong
position to kill senator Kennedy, he was shot from behind and Sirhan stood in front of
Kennedy.

CHAPTER 11 Project Walrus: John Lennon

Mark-David Chapman chose to plead not guilty due to following the direction of his
voices.. His attorney J. .Marks, punctuated the plea "by reason of insanity". Chapman
testified "I can hear their thoughts, I can hear them talking, but not from the outside,
from the inside" Not one of the three psychiatrists at the trial explored the possibility
of Mind-Control. In 1977 Chapman lost his fundamentalist religion and became a Satanist..
At 19, 1n 1975,Chapman signed onto the YMCA,(international camp counselor program) and
was sent to Beirut where he allegedly received instructions in lethal arts at the CIA
training camp school of terror. (there was a known "experiment in Mind Control unit" for
the army in Lebanon.). In 1980 he surfaced in New York, and mailed a letter to an Italian
address. The Dakota (residence of the Lennon's) was given as a return address. There was a
reference to his" mission " in N.Y.. It was returned to New York, the address not found in
Italy, where it sat for three years in the dead letter bin, and finally delivered to the
Dakota. Yoko Ono glanced at the letter and dropped it in her deranged file. In 1983, head
of security, Mahoney, found the letter. This was evidence of premeditated murder and
conspiracy. The letter vanished and reappeared slightly altered, the post-date now was
1981. The "mission" statement was missing...

Elliot Mintz, friend of Sal Mineo ,was instrumental in exposing "Project Walrus" as a
conspiracy regarding Lennon. He had been Lennon's chum too and publicist since 1971 Mintz
recalls that some of Yoko body guards were at the time New York Police officers.. It is
very difficult for a private citizen to legally possess a weapon in New York. The people
who can are off duty officers. It is thus, a common celebrity arrangement. There were many
files with missing contents at Yoko's apt. after Lennon was killed. Listening devices were
planted at the Dakota and once swept clean would reappear. There had been numerous
attempts on Yoko's life. One man was arrested at airport who had made a call that he was
coming to finish the job and kill Yoko and Sean. There were also calls made to tell her
body guards were going to kill her. Sean Lennon said, "I grew up afraid my mother and I
were going to be killed".

After John's murder the first promoting of Project Walrus was the ruining of his
reputation. John had known he was wire-tapped and was paranoid. After Watergate he filed a
lawsuit for wiretap and surveillance and made some progress. Justice Dept. never would
admit it actually carried out the wiretap and blamed it on other possibilities. After he
got his green card he gave up the litigation. Lennon overcame his fear of federal
harassment and gave public statements that were anti-republican.

Killing Lennon was only the first step. All that he signified must be defaced. That was
the principle objective of Walrus. His diaries were stolen and returned later with extra
entries and some entries altered. Fred Seaman wrote a defamatory book on Lennon. Seaman
was to be executive of Lennon's archives, and much was feigned regarding their bond. He
told friends he was going to discredit Ono at all costs. The goal was to drive her to a
nervous breakdown and discredit her attempt to set straight the public record. The walrus
crew anticipated immense profits. Dead Lennon's money's The events at the Dakota began to
sound like the Movie "Gaslight"..( in which a husband tries to drive his wife crazy by
reality distortion) Yoko began sleeping badly. One of Yoko's assistants, wracked by stress
began packing a gun at all times. He said " you do not know how big this is. The people
doing this are too big to fight." To discredit Lennon and Yoko and the Peace movement was
a major part of Operation Walrus. (but it didn't and IT WILL NOT)

CHAPTER 12 What Cha Gonna Do? The Deaths Of Marley And Tosh

"Vampires do not come out to bite your neck anymore, instead they cause something
destructive to happen that will spill blood., and those invisible vampires will get their
meal " Peter Tosh.
Peter Tosh , like Marley was a widely influential civil rights agitator, and like other
black activists before him he was gunned down. He died in 1987 at age 43. He was upset
with the treatment of his people. Tosh went to Trench Town to live with an uncle after the
aunt he was living with died. It was there he met the young Bob Marley, and taught him to
play guitar. They got together with Bunny Wailer and the trio called themselves the Wailin
Wailers. They were drastically underpaid. Record producers are notorious for pocketing
money. (dem pirates and dem thieves). Peter Tosh always let his feelings be known. He
cared more about principles and morals than popularity and fame. He said "they know I do
not support POLITRICKS and games, my duty is to unify the people." He and Marlew had some
wrangling and he left the group, and went on his own. Destabalsation tactics were
employed, and political violence and sabotage etc. from the CIA with pernicious attempts
to wreck the economy of their country.. The new weapon and the new menace was
destabilization..

Bob Marley held onto the Wailer name and took on new members. The peoples National Party
asked them to play at Smile Jamaica concert. He agreed.

In Nov. a death squad came to Marley's home and started shooting. They shot bullets into
his manager, and one in his wife's' Rita's head , as she tried to get their 5 children out
of the house. They survived. The last bullet creased Marley's breast below his heart and
drilled deep into his arm. Marley would sing "Ambush in the night, all guns aiming at me."
This did not stop them performing at the Smile Jamaica concert.. ("War") "Until the
ignoble and unhappy regimes that now hold our brothers, in Angola, in Mozambique, in
subhuman bondage, have been toppled utterly destroyed...everywhere is war.

Carl Colby, son of CIA head Wm. Colby, came to the concert and posed as crew and got
back stage where he gave a gift to Marley, a pair of boots. Former black Panther Lee
Lew-Lee was close to Marley and he thinks Marley's cancer started with the boots He claims
there was a link of copper wire attached to the boots, which hurt his foot when he tried
them on and had to be removed..(it might have been treated chemically with a carcinogenic
toxin. Marley later broke his toe and found out it was cancerous, it spread. He did not
trust main-stream medicine and continued to perform. He knew by 1977 he was dying and
compressed a lifetime of music into a few years

Something of a Caribbean CIA POGROM was underway via Kissinger and Co. There was
emphasis on psychological Ops. which became arson, banking assassination disruption of the
now Manley's democratic socialist rule. Political violence was stoked and arsenal of
weapons supplied. This was all mostly financed by Hard Drugs, which disrupted the Rasta
movement and marijuana. They wanted it legalized. Their chosen weapon in the Rasta
Movement was free expression and they were crucified for it. Tosh was busted and beaten
almost to death and it made his music more vengeful.. Secret Police and the CIA tailed him
thru it all. Grotesque human rights violations were commonplace. Marley found out he had a
brain tumor. He sang " these songs of freedom is all I ever had, emancipate yourself from
MENTAL SLAVERY. "He was observed rubbing his forehead and grimacing while performing. One
woman explained "Hidden lasers were fixed to spotlights above the stage and burned out his
brain" Fellow
Rasta's heard about an alternative doctor in Jamaica, who advised Marley to talk to a
Doctor Josef Issels, a holistic immuno therapist in a Bavarian village. He went. The Dr.
said "I hear you are one of the most dangerous black men in the world." Issels medical
career did not hold up under scrutiny, during WW2 he had worked hand in hand with Dr.
Mengele (angel of death) in research in Poland, at the Auschwitz camp. The Wailers found
this out after his death.

Issels told Bob he could cure him and did sadistic procedures that left him in agony.
After visits the Wailor's said "he is killing Bob" He also cut off his dreadlocks. He was
in the hands of the doctor who had been the accomplice of Mengele in horrific Medical
experiments against what they considered "sub humans". His mother said " he was starving
and wasting away , and he would fall into fits of shaking, etc" Marley weighed 82 pounds
on the day of his death. May 11, 1980.(HIS MUSIC LIVES ON)

Peter Tosh found the bloodshed and hypocrisy of death squad justice in the Third World
unbearable He was obsessed with the hidden evil. By 1987 the year of Tosh murder Jamaica
musicians were censored by the prevailing politics. Witnesses and friends insist his
murder was a political hit. They were convinced Tosh was killed for his statements on
Human Rights , Black liberation and the legalization of Marijuana. Tosh was throwing a
small party at home when Mike Robertson, a local radio host answered the door. Leppo
Leppan, an old buddy from Trenchtown days stepped in. Behind him were two clean-cut
looking strangers, professional hit-men, they insisted on talking to Tosh at gun-point.
Shots were fired and three people were dead.

Shortly afterward the N.Y. City apartment of Tosh was entered and burglarized, (such as
the aftermath of Hendrix death). Two out of three of the Tosh killers remain at large.
One hit-man was said to be a policeman, (of course Leppan was convicted.)

CHAPTER 13 Gang War Sons Of Chaos

Rap artist Tupac Shakur was gunned down at a stop-light in Las Vegas in 1996. It will be
evident re: the police strategy of disinformation, ignoring of witnesses, and the presence
of undercover agents from L.A. and N.Y at the murder of rapper Notorious B.I.G.
This suggests that both rappers were murdered by hit squads under the sanction of
federal officers. Tupac's father said "It was clear to me form day one that the Las Vegas
police never had any interest in solving the case of my sons murder," it was said " we
dealt extensively with COINTELPRO (FBI) issues. We worked around a lot of political
prisoners and the black liberation movement over the years. This shaped Tupac into the
person he was. The family operated the "Center for Black Survival." They had a youth group
called "The New African Panthers" and Tupac became the chairperson for it."

The agony of the Rap industry was exacerbated in March 1997 by killing 24 yr. old
Brooklyn rap artist Notorious B.I.G. in L.A. This happened after he had attended the
annual 'Soul Train' Music awards, by an unidentified gun-man. Tupac's father said in a
letter excerpt:

"we do know that Brother Biggie was a part of an industry that has been under attack
from the highest form of government officials. They have targeted Tupac, Sister Souljah,
IceT, and Ice Cube, just to name a few. This is reportedly due to the content of the
lyrics. "IF" this was the case why would devil-worshippers (music-artists) not be hounded
out also? (They openly worship the devil in a so-called God fearing country.) Their lyrics
preach mayhem, destruction. death to parents, and even government; whereas our rapper
love-ones wanted to explain their pain and identify from where they came, with hopes for a
better tomorrow; if all things were fair.
We believe that history has demonstrated that the murders of black people(young and
old) who can have a profound impact, those who refuse to bow down, have been targeted by
government at its highest level.

What we must understand is that our warriors are needed when it has been proven beyond
contradiction that the C.I.A. were principal importers of Crack Cocaine and Cocaine into
the 'HOOD', with blatantly racist drug laws, to set into motion tactics of genocide to
destroy or lock away our brothers and sisters or the rest of their lives.

Pay attention to the game that is being played on/against us! Search for TRUTH! Don't
look at who shot them, but why? Don't be fooled by the media, that has never shown real
concern for our welfare." Dr. Mutulu Shakur

Mutulu Shakur's conviction that SECRET POLICE killed his stepson and Notorious B.I.G.
proves to be increasingly feasible.

CHAPTER 14 False God Syndrome

Death Of Michael Hutchene
1997, M. Hutchence was found tethered by his neck to a door frame. He too was an
activist, who willed the lion share of his fortune to Amnesty International and the Green
Party. He was found at the Ritz-Carleton in Sydney Australia. The media concocted scenes
of SM but he was found with a broken hand and lacerations and had taken a bad beaten. His
friends said he was not depressed and he was against suicide. There were rumors of the
"MOB" involved in his investments possibly unknown to him. He died penniless due to
investments and trusts and his family had to fight for his money.

He knew Gianni Versace, famous designer who was gunned down, and was also said to be
possibly mafia involved, although he denied it angrily (A dead mourning bird was found by
the Versace body, a symbol of a hit-man).

The funeral of Versace was attended by Diana Spencer, the Princess of Wales, and a month
before her own death. As it happened another friend of Hutchence was Dodi Fayed , someone
said to have mob links. Dodi's uncle was arms dealer Adnan Khashoggi of the Iran-Contra
Fame.

Dodi and Diana were killed in a car accident four months before Hutchence died.

The Deep Politiics Of Music

Roger Bunn director of the Music Industry, Human Rights Association (MIHRA), in the U.K.
lives in the eye of the corporate music beast. These are excerpts from letters form Bunn:

"Re: M.Hutchene "so that's it, huh? Death due to hanging? Sort of unusual that, even for
the music industry. Those wonderful featured artist really light up the sky every now and
then. Maybe we should consider making the poor darlings an endangered species? When they
reach their peak it probably means worth more to the conglomerates dead than live. Think
about that next time you go out to by your conglomerate primitive/folk music, or a
well-known movie. Yyou add strength to the cartel Monopoly. The music industry turns over
120 billion dollars a year. In the music industry there is no such thing as "Real
Competition".

"Music Industry Is The Richest Industry On The Planet, by providing the public with a
marketing of False God Syndrome

When an artists "usefulness" to a conglomerate is over things can get a little sticky."

Beth's Notes and Comments
This Project Of Summarizing This Book Has Been One Close To My Heart, Since I Have Loved
Many Musicians (And World Of Fame People) Up Close And From Afar. I Have Seen How The
World Of Fame Works And I Think It Is Something The Public Should Know. They Are People
First And Foremost And Have All The Same Trials And Tribulations That We Have, As Can Be
Seen By Alex Constantine's Book.
MY GRATITUDE TO YOU ALEX.

what the "POWERS-THAT-BE" have done to MUSICIANS for decades and not all of them have
survived it. This includes mind-control and surveillance and murder by the alleged CIA and
FBI and other forces of destruction, on civil rights activists and others AWAKE people in
the WORLD OF MUSIC


COINTEL PRO AND RAP MUSIC
Last week we raised the possibility that an organized attempt had been and still is being made to destabilize the Hip-Hop industry and thus the community. We briefly looked at the murder of the Notorious B.I.G. and raised some unanswered questions surrounding his death; introduced some important background information regarding the FBI’s COINTELPRO which was dedicated to destabilizing Black and progressive organizations, especially in the 1960s and 70s; and posed a challenge to Black intellectuals to apply their knowledge of the tactics used by the U.S. government to oppose Black leaders, to Biggie’s murder in particular, and to the Hip-Hop Industry/Community in general. We also pointed you to a Brill’s Content article that shows how the L.A. Times has been involved in disseminating false information regarding Biggie’s murder. We also took pains to mention that it was this story and one prior to it that brought Suge Knight’s name into the mix as allegedly involved in Biggie’s death. We openly questioned that if the L.A. Times article is misinformation wouldn’t that point to Mr. Knight’s innocence and we asked who was the original source in the FBI/LAPD that fingered Suge Knight? What was their motive for doing this, through the media? I hope that some of you, in your study of COINTELPRO and other programs, are familiar with the manner in which the FBI and CIA used reporters and media outlets, print and TV, to plant stories, have articles written and spread malicious lies – much of which was directed at getting groups that otherwise could have worked together to fight one another.

Last week, I also openly stated that it was my opinion that the image and rumors of an East Coast – West Coast Hip-Hop “war” were a fabrication of the media and perpetuated by local and federal police departments prior to and during the investigations into Tupac and Biggie’s murders, in large part via information fed to reporters in various media outlets. We will conclude this series next week on this crucial point of the role of the media, in particular its role in COINTELPRO of yesterday and its possible continuation today. This week we take a very brief look at a more recent situation in Hip-Hop that again raises the possibility that the Federal Government has ill- intentions for the Hip-Hop Community.

A few weeks ago, the Village Voice published an article alleging that over the last year a white government informant was in some capacity representing members of the multi-platinum group, Wu-Tang Clan, while the group was under criminal investigation. After reading the article, it is readily apparent that it was a sensationalized story designed to reflect negatively upon Wu-Tang. The story also appeared to be crafted in great part because while the headlines emphasized the supposed connection between this white individual and Wu-Tang, the article deals more substantively with the individual’s alleged real connection to white organized crime figures in New York and Miami. The individual is reportedly a government informant in a case involving Mob figures in New York and Miami. So while real evidence allegedly links the individual to Mob figures, the Village Voice cover and headlines and subtitles focused on a very unclear connection between the “informant’ and the Hip-Hop group. Most of the information on that front is anecdotal in nature that informs the reader of little.

The real story is this individual’s relationship with white underworld figures and the feds yet the Village Voice markets the piece, which was picked up by news services all over the world, as quality reporting that somehow connects this individual’s relationship with the U.S. Government with his relationship with Wu-Tang. The piece doesn’t live up to that billing. It never connects the dots but to an unsuspecting and innocent reader, it does open the Clan up to suspicion not only in terms of a link to the feds but also in terms of criminal activity. I found that to be peculiar and yes, the deliberate intention of the Village Voice. In the weeks that have followed the piece, many people have spread more rumors, gossip and innuendo regarding the Clan over the Internet and many people seem to have only read the sensational headlines but have not analyzed the story or the motive behind it with a critical mind.

To me, the aim of the Village Voice and/or whoever may have helped them craft the story, was to discredit the Clan inside of the unforgiving world of the New York Hip-Hop community and to discredit them among their core group of fans. It also attempted to portray the group as unintelligent but it definitely did not seek to prove that the individual was really working on behalf of the government specifically against the Clan, though the article and headlines imply otherwise. This is one of the factors that makes me believe that someone bigger than just the Village Voice may have been behind the story – how else could the government come off clean and the Clan looking rather uncomplimentary. Remember, the story is supposed to be about feds, Wu and this informant but it ends up really only being about the informant and Wu. What happened to the feds?

The reason why I stress that point is because I believe the writer(s) could have proved or disproved whether the informant was working against the Clan if they so desired and from reading the piece, I believe that the writer(s) has discussed the government’s surveillance of Wu-Tang with enough people in the know, to be able to determine whether or not this government informant is directly working against Wu-Tang or if he is only with the group strictly for business purposes as he gives evidence on the alleged Miami/New York crime figures. The writer(s) simply asks why the informant was working with Wu-Tang in any capacity and spends the majority of the article lampooning and mocking the group. And again, he leaves the feds unscathed.

The Village Voice sought to harm the group’s reputation by negative implication and innuendo. The story, to me, seemed designed to destroy the Clan’s street credibility not prove any thing about this informant working for the feds against the Clan. If they had done that (proved the informant was working against the Clan) the Village Voice would have proved the existence of COINTELPRO. No, the informant angle is the hook that draws you in to read garbage about the Clan. And I found it very interesting that no one in the community that prides itself on its “consciousness” came to the defense of the Clan, even to intelligently alert the public to the possibility that the Village Voice article may point to something bigger than Wu-Tang.

This could have helped others even those who I know do not like Wu-Tang personally or what they represent in music or ideology. If you are in the Hip-Hop community, personal dislike of the Clan won’t cut it on this one. The Hip-Hop community owes it to itself to defend itself from what many people, more than just myself, know to be a deliberate attempt to destabilize and destroy the real and potential cultural, economic and political impact of Hip-Hop. From my limited vantage point, everyone seemed caught up in the sensational aspects of the story and not the potential threat it posed to the entire community. This is another aspect of the indolence of the Hip-Hop community that I referred to last week.

I personally served as management to Wu-Tang a couple of years ago. I no longer do so. To the best of my knowledge, which I think is pretty good, the Clan was never involved in any of the criminal activities that they were or are currently under investigation for. I do not and never have, for one moment believed that they are guilty. Of course, I did not see everything that everyone was doing but I am confident that I was certainly in a position to know whether or not a gun-running operation was being organized and ran by the group. I am not afraid to go on public record in defense of the group or the truth of what I know.

But the Federal Government wants to pin these charges on the Clan. What I can tell you that the Village Voice did not tell you, is that several individuals who have been arrested and/or charged with crimes in New York City and who have never had any affiliation with the group, have been offered reduced sentences or no time at all in exchange for either saying that they were connected with Wu-Tang when they committed their alleged crimes or in exchange for directly infiltrating the music group. This is a fact. A fact that the Village Voice should know about with all of its connections in the entertainment community and law-enforcement. And these individuals being approached are young Black males not an alleged white informant who is linked to some white mobsters in New York or Miami. That is the real story if the Village Voice is so interested.

The goal of the Federal Government, the FBI included, is to lie and link Wu-Tang and others to a supposed Hip-Hop industry- wide crime network. I know that as early as 1995, several young Black music executives, other than Wu-Tang, and their actual places of business were under surveillance and “investigation” by the Federal Government allegedly for committing various crimes. Not only have individuals under the supervision of the criminal justice system been approached in an effort to make cases against high-profile individuals in the industry but so have white lawyers and white music executives who deal with these individuals. This is common knowledge inside of a few circles in the music industry; even marketing plans of certain artists have been taken by federal investigators. We also know that the IRS has been and is unfairly targeting several Hip-Hop artists and their business enterprises for audits. One day, this will all come out.

For those who persist in wanting to see all crime-fighting efforts as above reproach and legitimate, I can tell you that for whatever illegal activities that may or may not have been perpetrated by various individuals in the music business, the Federal Government has gone above and beyond what is fair in their investigation of the Clan. Asking individuals to straight up lie and say that they are connected to crimes that never occurred and to make up affiliations and even to ask suspects to infiltrate Wu-Tang is not legitimate crime fighting. I also do not see it as simply a case of a “few bad cops”. I see it as a deliberate attempt to destabilize and discredit not only an influential group but also an entire industry and cultural force. To me, it is certainly reminiscent of COINTELPRO where the goal was not to arrest guilty individuals but to arrest a cultural and political movement. For those who have studied COINTELPRO, it is interesting to learn of all of the Black celebrities and entertainers who have/had government files. I hope everyone in the Hip-Hop community will become much more alert and those who have first-hand knowledge of what I am talking about will begin to compare notes with one another. This isn’t a game or fantasy although some will persist in doubting to the very end. Next week at http://blackelectorate.com/ we will look at some historical evidence that shows that the FBI and CIA used reporters to spread pieces of misinformation to the public and actually helped journalists write false stories. Could this be happening today?

Cedric Muhammad


PEOPLE, STOP LETTING THESE CONFUSED NIGGAZ GUIDE YOU.
IT'S RIDICULOUS.

AllHiphop.com
3121.com
Wardolphin.com
Afropunk.com
Bling47.com
Fader.com



Who's fucking wit B More right now?

"Freedom is a Lie" - the animals

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
its so hard to read shit like this over the internet
Mar 01st 2007
1
Deprogramming. Here... CIA and the Murder of John Lennon.
Mar 01st 2007
3
      its really all about money, power, & control
Mar 07th 2007
346
look what you trying to start
Mar 01st 2007
2
i so wanna be in this conversation
Mar 01st 2007
4
THEN KILL THE NIGGA IN U & BRING THE BLACKMAN OUT
Mar 01st 2007
5
i'm a black woman but yea
Mar 01st 2007
8
What you FOCUS on you will FIND
Mar 01st 2007
47
i don't know what that means
Mar 01st 2007
59
      keep skimmin & shimmyin
Mar 01st 2007
72
           hahaha... step n fetch it...
Mar 01st 2007
115
What you FOCUS on you will FIND
Mar 01st 2007
48
HEY, i'll never the formally known as blackman so...
Mar 01st 2007
6
      where's that chapter break down from?
Mar 01st 2007
9
           not my problem.
Mar 01st 2007
10
                okay but where is the chapter breakdown from?
Mar 01st 2007
11
                lol not your problem but you want people to have the info right?
Mar 01st 2007
62
C-O-N-spiracy.
Mar 01st 2007
7
CIA and Bob Marley
Mar 01st 2007
12
where afkap @?
Mar 01st 2007
13
somewhere embarrassed by it all
Mar 01st 2007
15
*waits*
Mar 01st 2007
18
i was thinkin the same shit, guess he's too embarrassed to read this
Mar 01st 2007
87
      and not wise enough to live it...
Mar 01st 2007
91
           pretty much...
Mar 01st 2007
103
           right.. .same here... a grown ass black man...
Mar 01st 2007
121
                Yeah Afkap is certfied bitchmade...
Mar 02nd 2007
181
                     hands him certificate... lol...
Mar 02nd 2007
182
           WORD.
Mar 02nd 2007
246
and the funny thing is
Mar 01st 2007
14
bingo... the music or the niggas who support it... are shallow
Mar 01st 2007
24
Exactly!
Mar 01st 2007
51
basic
Mar 01st 2007
34
true
Mar 01st 2007
43
I'm generally in favor of posts mentioning Phil Ochs
Mar 01st 2007
16
if you wake up everymorning and you wish to live...
Mar 01st 2007
17
      That has nothing to do with music.
Mar 01st 2007
21
      this has everything to do with music...
Mar 01st 2007
23
           So... outta curiosity: what's 'conscious' about Milk Cow Calf Blues?
Mar 01st 2007
25
                and? Louie Louie was written around the same time as the
Mar 01st 2007
28
                lmao
Mar 01st 2007
33
                     Were niggaz strugglin in 1955? Yes.
Mar 01st 2007
35
                          lmao. well played.
Mar 01st 2007
38
                               It's truth. Lol.
Mar 01st 2007
40
                                    Yeah, but it's got nothing to do with an answer to my question.
Mar 01st 2007
52
                                         Your question is weak and baseless.
Mar 01st 2007
54
                                              And your post is a mess, but I've tried to adress it respectfully.
Mar 01st 2007
161
                                                   All these brothers agree with me... you couldn't do NOTHING.
Mar 05th 2007
254
                                                        My man, it saddens me that you think I'm trying to 'validate'
Mar 05th 2007
266
                nah, black roots music in america was powerful cuz
Mar 01st 2007
30
                     bingo
Mar 01st 2007
31
                     Absolutely. But that's not what he said.
Mar 01st 2007
37
                          so three songs constitute all of Blues? Keep this in mind...
Mar 01st 2007
39
                          Well, you're wrong about that too.
Mar 01st 2007
49
                               How's that Secret Life of Plants album? Hmm...
Mar 01st 2007
53
                                    Just so show you... Paul Robeson and the CIA
Mar 01st 2007
60
                                    hmmmmm
Mar 01st 2007
61
                                         Excellent... now... don't run...
Mar 01st 2007
63
                                              and these
Mar 01st 2007
64
                                              Memphis Jug Band - Cocaine Blues
Mar 01st 2007
67
                                                   Yup, I have the CD... actually, I have a link of it up right now
Mar 01st 2007
159
                                                        right cause Cocaine must mean Church where your from...
Mar 02nd 2007
189
                                                             *smh*
Mar 02nd 2007
197
                                                                  I don't have to listen... I know the people... see this is a class for m...
Mar 08th 2007
349
                                                                       Okay.
Mar 08th 2007
360
                                                                            RE: Okay.
Mar 08th 2007
364
                                                                            RE: Okay.
Mar 08th 2007
368
                                              You're an idiot!
Mar 01st 2007
69
                                                   Here they come...... LMAO!
Mar 01st 2007
73
                                                   Hmm.. actually he/she didn't... Hence.. Cocaine Blues
Mar 01st 2007
83
                          so we goin offa one person's definition of pro-black?
Mar 01st 2007
41
                               Exactly.
Mar 01st 2007
42
                               Which is why I was addressing him, not you.
Mar 01st 2007
50
                                    and I have more than answered you... you just don't like it...
Mar 01st 2007
55
      GOOD POST
Mar 01st 2007
22
they didn't Invite Eazy-E to the white house. They invited Eric Wright.
Mar 01st 2007
19
so it's cool to shake the hands with the man pumping crack into
Mar 01st 2007
20
CIA and Crack...
Mar 01st 2007
26
freeway rick
Mar 01st 2007
27
Place holder
Mar 02nd 2007
170
      exactly, well said.
Mar 05th 2007
253
EAZY E SOLD CRACK TOO, YOU DUMBFUCK...
Mar 01st 2007
65
      But did Eazy actually fly the plane
Mar 01st 2007
107
           and I said the CIA brought it here... Not Easy E
Mar 01st 2007
117
Knee jerk shit? analytical thinking?
Mar 02nd 2007
247
      I have actually worked with Mr. Hellar...
Mar 05th 2007
299
i started reading, but i'll be back to finish, so far great stuff
Mar 01st 2007
29
MC 5 and the White Panther Party
Mar 01st 2007
32
      The Last Poets
Mar 01st 2007
36
           The Great Frank Zappa "Aids is a CIA Plot"
Mar 01st 2007
44
Cointelpro: NOW THAT'S FASCIST!
Mar 01st 2007
45
lol...
Mar 01st 2007
46
in a way it kinda reminds me of
Mar 01st 2007
58
      RE: in a way it kinda reminds me of
Mar 01st 2007
84
           Bingo again... War on Terror/ War on Drugs...
Mar 01st 2007
85
           Which all falls under The Dialectic
Mar 01st 2007
137
           I AM SOOOOOOOOOOOO GLAD
Mar 01st 2007
139
                haha..
Mar 01st 2007
154
say it again.
Mar 01st 2007
56
      namean.
Mar 01st 2007
57
Asskap thinks "pro-black" music is akin to facism
Mar 01st 2007
66
Scared niggaz snitched on Harriet Tubman too...
Mar 01st 2007
68
basically.
Mar 01st 2007
79
LMAO! @ Asskap
Mar 01st 2007
70
      lol!
Mar 01st 2007
78
this looks like a GREAT post...
Mar 01st 2007
71
it is... I'm tryin to get work done and isht LMAO!
Mar 01st 2007
74
this is good stuff
Mar 01st 2007
75
Bingo
Mar 01st 2007
77
Awesome post
Mar 01st 2007
76
My nigga! (c) alonzo
Mar 01st 2007
80
You forgot about BPP vs US shift to Crips vs Bloods
Mar 01st 2007
81
How about... YOU explain... let's get down then...
Mar 01st 2007
82
there's actually a great doc on bpp vs us into crips vs bloods
Mar 01st 2007
88
he don't wanna explain, he just said that cuz he feels that slave...
Mar 01st 2007
92
i just started...
Mar 01st 2007
96
the chronic and gubment weed
Mar 01st 2007
94
Excellent... yes continue...
Mar 01st 2007
97
forget everything you've heard pac was killed because...
Mar 01st 2007
99
      there are a few reasons why...
Mar 01st 2007
104
           reason why he changed his persona
Mar 01st 2007
108
                Hmmm... yeah...
Mar 01st 2007
110
We been discussing that isht
Mar 01st 2007
86
hahaha...
Mar 01st 2007
89
ahhhh.... now i get it
Mar 01st 2007
90
shhhhhhhhhh!
Mar 01st 2007
93
LMAO!
Mar 02nd 2007
201
      yo... that cat...
Mar 02nd 2007
202
i agree with you, but the point is to digset the info and discuss it
Mar 01st 2007
102
anytime your embaressed of being Pro Black...
Mar 01st 2007
105
      i had a couple of posts deleted a year ago
Mar 01st 2007
111
      now is your time to reverse that.. break it down...
Mar 01st 2007
113
      RE: anytime your embaressed of being Pro Black...
Mar 01st 2007
112
where can i get info on the part about 4/4 music?
Mar 02nd 2007
240
i've been sayin this for a while, the gov't kilt hip hop
Mar 01st 2007
95
They killed JFK on TV.. .His brother... X and King...
Mar 01st 2007
98
      on jfk... pharoahe actually exposed that shit in guns drawn video
Mar 01st 2007
100
           haven't seen it yet...
Mar 01st 2007
101
                watch jackie
Mar 01st 2007
123
*smh*
Mar 01st 2007
106
niggers there sellout Joe? Or niggaz?
Mar 01st 2007
109
      funny thing is yall would be allies if it weren't for semantics
Mar 01st 2007
114
      imcvspl... i could NEVER be allies with the enemies of logic.
Mar 01st 2007
118
           Hmm... The Four Tops are better than the Temps is logic?
Mar 01st 2007
120
           no... it's an opinion.
Mar 01st 2007
122
                THe US Gov. Vs. John Lennon....
Mar 01st 2007
124
                *pssst* hey Kingfish... lemme pull your coat to something!
Mar 01st 2007
129
                     Right... thanks KAP... again... you have had your chance...
Mar 01st 2007
130
                          speak all you want, brother...
Mar 01st 2007
135
                               Right..... thanks for your input...
Mar 01st 2007
136
                                    *goes*
Mar 01st 2007
138
                                         ascend my brother... ascend...
Mar 01st 2007
140
                                         yay!
Mar 01st 2007
142
                                         Bingo... now let's review....
Mar 01st 2007
147
                                              Black americans created jazz and this fucker wants to ask
Mar 01st 2007
150
                                                   I would love to hear a OKP ask Miles or Coltrane that same shit
Mar 01st 2007
153
                                                        Im reading "Myself When I Am Real" a bio of Mingus
Mar 01st 2007
156
                                                             Heart * He* art
Mar 01st 2007
158
                                         HOOORAY!!!!!
Mar 02nd 2007
184
                                              hahaha...
Mar 02nd 2007
190
                *gasp*
Mar 01st 2007
169
                nah the gasp is you hitting my inbox asking for my music...
Mar 02nd 2007
171
                     I'm still curious about your music, but if you don't want to share,
Mar 02nd 2007
186
                          Uh no sir, I don't think you know Aqua, I speak for SELF...
Mar 02nd 2007
188
                               I'm not private about my real world info.
Mar 02nd 2007
195
                                    if you are truly encouraging music... no your not...
Mar 02nd 2007
196
                                         I recognize the genius of the MC5. I just don't like them much.
Mar 02nd 2007
199
                                              Why the mid 80's? Was that your rock moment? I understand that
Mar 02nd 2007
200
                                                   I grew up a classic rock fiend
Mar 02nd 2007
235
                                                        of course you have no clue what I mean... exactly...
Mar 02nd 2007
239
                                                             ah, 'it' was meaning the blues, I thought you were still talking MC5.
Mar 02nd 2007
241
                                                                  exactly
Mar 03rd 2007
249
                                                                  Um... I never said that.
Mar 05th 2007
255
                You sir are NO Booker T.
Mar 02nd 2007
183
                     I know right... that was arrogant as HELL... as if being a OKP
Mar 02nd 2007
192
           Yay !
Mar 01st 2007
131
      there's a difference?
Mar 01st 2007
116
           just like Revolutionaries (me) and Uncle Toms...
Mar 01st 2007
119
                oh, i AM embarrassed by people who believe conspiracy theories
Mar 01st 2007
125
                     RIght... we know your embaressed about alot...
Mar 01st 2007
127
                     and this is my issue...
Mar 01st 2007
132
                          No one is my enemy....
Mar 01st 2007
134
I have a picture for you:
Mar 01st 2007
126
right thanks.
Mar 01st 2007
128
      Information on the US Gov. VS. John Lennon
Mar 01st 2007
133
      in a min, it aint gonna be just limited to black folks
Mar 01st 2007
141
sorry to bother you 'street niggaz' again, but before i REALLY leave
Mar 01st 2007
143
I lost 30 years
Mar 01st 2007
144
*smh*
Mar 01st 2007
145
Um.. your the cat who would have snitched on Malcolm
Mar 01st 2007
146
I am assuming he would feel the same way about
Mar 01st 2007
148
      Bingo... here Tupac...
Mar 01st 2007
149
           Tupac Pt. 2
Mar 01st 2007
152
                I'm sure most folks have seen Resurrection
Mar 01st 2007
155
                     people have no idea what was really going on...
Mar 01st 2007
157
                          ,,,
Mar 01st 2007
162
you are a fuckin idiot
Mar 01st 2007
151
i think malcolm was talking about following elijah muhammed
Mar 01st 2007
160
^^^^Commendable^^^^
Mar 01st 2007
163
ASSKAP ETHER JUICE
Mar 01st 2007
167
Exactly... and be cautious of anyone who supports us
Mar 02nd 2007
173
applauds...
Mar 02nd 2007
172
you left out his whole haj realization that it aint about color
Mar 02nd 2007
176
but have you read his speeches
Mar 02nd 2007
177
      he called it human rights
Mar 02nd 2007
244
           lol called what human rights?
Mar 08th 2007
354
                nah he did say that he was shifting gears from courtrooms and
Mar 08th 2007
355
                     thats what i was eluding to
Mar 08th 2007
359
notice that he said 'all Muslims' were hypnotized zombies, though
Mar 02nd 2007
203
      Sure... cause all that information I posted is just rambling right?
Mar 02nd 2007
204
      he was talking about the nation of islam
Mar 02nd 2007
208
      No need to explain it to him... cause if he don't know
Mar 02nd 2007
209
      and this point here is key
Mar 02nd 2007
211
           ridiculous.
Mar 02nd 2007
212
           um... seriously, though: how exactly does that translate to saving face?
Mar 02nd 2007
216
                KAP this post isn't about you bruah... so your Dr Phil moment
Mar 02nd 2007
217
                and your a liar... you got way more than that... trust...
Mar 02nd 2007
218
                i never said i came to 'school' anybody
Mar 02nd 2007
220
                     I said leave or other OKPs? Can't speak for them.
Mar 02nd 2007
222
                     I wasn't even here yesterday...
Mar 02nd 2007
224
                          Yup, we all have, hence the post itself.
Mar 02nd 2007
225
                This bitchmade response was brought to you by...ASSKAP
Mar 02nd 2007
219
                     ...and i rest my case.
Mar 02nd 2007
221
                          His Bitch... to your Conspiracy... call it what
Mar 02nd 2007
223
           :(
Mar 02nd 2007
215
      ASSKAP, It's time for another lesson hiatus *throws you a deuce*
Mar 02nd 2007
213
           and after a few trips to wherever REAL black folks are...
Mar 02nd 2007
214
                Co sign
Mar 02nd 2007
227
                     haha! thanks.
Mar 02nd 2007
232
                          exactly... or high life for that matter...
Mar 02nd 2007
238
                               oh shit! this nigga actually questioned my knowledge of highlife???
Mar 05th 2007
279
                                    Actually I was in Ghana for months... and other parts of AFrica...
Mar 08th 2007
351
AHH' Fuck Yo statement nigga just leave *points to the door*
Mar 02nd 2007
187
Exactly... it amazes me how staning up for whats right will get
Mar 02nd 2007
191
ASSKAP = Trend Whore...
Mar 02nd 2007
193
      haahaha... and I'm sayin.. most of the real niggas aint online...
Mar 02nd 2007
194
to add on...
Mar 01st 2007
164
RE: to add on...
Mar 01st 2007
165
Bingo
Mar 02nd 2007
174
Do you agreee with everything you just posted?
Mar 01st 2007
166
now THIS is what i'm talking about
Mar 01st 2007
168
Exactly.
Mar 02nd 2007
175
      .
Mar 02nd 2007
185
^^^ actin' pro-black, but named after a whiteman in tights ^^^
Mar 02nd 2007
178
LOL, this guy
Mar 02nd 2007
179
      the minds of children.
Mar 02nd 2007
180
           THE CIA vs. ROCK MUSIC... more info
Mar 02nd 2007
198
to arrest a cultural and political movement.
Mar 02nd 2007
205
Exactly.
Mar 02nd 2007
206
      Sun RA
Mar 02nd 2007
207
           To live outside the Law You Must Be Honest.
Mar 02nd 2007
210
we talked about bob and peter tosh
Mar 02nd 2007
226
No a great ramble tho'... Buju and I hung out a few times...
Mar 02nd 2007
228
      The HipHop Police... since these nigga call is conspiracy...
Mar 02nd 2007
229
      RE: No a great ramble tho'... Buju and I hung out a few times...
Mar 02nd 2007
230
           Well James was and still is perhaps the funkiest man to ever visit
Mar 02nd 2007
231
                RE: Well James was and still is perhaps the funkiest man to ever visit
Mar 02nd 2007
233
                a minor point on James ...
Mar 02nd 2007
242
are Street Corner Crack Dealers Uncle Toms?
Mar 02nd 2007
234
the question is what are YOU wrestling with?
Mar 02nd 2007
236
usually they don't know any better, so they ain't toms, they just ignant
Mar 02nd 2007
237
i'v said they are for awhile now
Mar 02nd 2007
243
yeah I have sat back on it for a while myself...
Mar 05th 2007
251
RE: are Street Corner Crack Dealers Uncle Toms?
Mar 05th 2007
260
*bookmarks*
Mar 02nd 2007
245
all this is very ineteresting..
Mar 02nd 2007
248
oh shit.... reason^^^^
Mar 03rd 2007
250
This is why I NOMINATE WARREN COOLIDGE FOR PRESIDENT
Mar 05th 2007
252
thanks for the kind words sir.....I commend the
Mar 05th 2007
257
LOL
Mar 05th 2007
258
      what about the arrogant part?
Mar 05th 2007
270
           depends on what you mean by 'arrogant'...
Mar 05th 2007
273
                its funny you wont answer my question about jazz...
Mar 05th 2007
289
                     well...
Mar 05th 2007
292
                          ok
Mar 05th 2007
295
                               explizit you summed it all up right here homie...
Mar 05th 2007
297
                               just as an aside before i continue: isn't this nice, explizit?
Mar 05th 2007
301
                                    first.. .explizit isn't new... just on point... second...
Mar 05th 2007
302
                                    jazz was a black american invention homie.
Mar 05th 2007
305
                                         and there you have it again folks... scienced out...
Mar 05th 2007
307
                                         first of all, i apologize to you
Mar 05th 2007
310
                                              ok.
Mar 05th 2007
313
                                              explizit is the man... man... stay around...
Mar 05th 2007
316
                                              explizit... you are missing the point.
Mar 05th 2007
317
                                                   eh....you're still not really making a good argument.
Mar 05th 2007
328
                                                        *sigh* okay... i can see that i'm wasting my time here.
Mar 06th 2007
336
                                                             AQUA'S RESPONSES ARE ALL CAPS...
Mar 06th 2007
337
                                                             okay, Aqua. first of all: i was not talking to you.
Mar 06th 2007
338
                                                                  I will respond later.. but KAP .. show me ONE FACT FROM U...
Mar 06th 2007
340
                                                                       ONE fact in this entire post, Aqua?
Mar 07th 2007
344
                                                             you're guilty of everything you've accused me of.
Mar 06th 2007
339
                                                                  actually... i'm not.
Mar 06th 2007
341
                                                                       wow, you actually got specific for a minute!! wow!
Mar 06th 2007
342
                                                                            Bingo...
Mar 08th 2007
352
                                                                                 no problem. dude oversimplifies everything
Mar 08th 2007
356
                                              now there you go... good response KAP...
Mar 05th 2007
314
                                                   man... i ain't saying nothing i wasn't saying before.
Mar 05th 2007
318
                                                        Negroe please... you should be happy we even approaching you
Mar 08th 2007
353
.........
Mar 05th 2007
256
and what facts are YOU dealing in here?
Mar 05th 2007
261
      desperate.
Mar 05th 2007
263
      LOL i'm not the desperate one.
Mar 05th 2007
264
           right, aren't you the same nigga who was ashamed?
Mar 05th 2007
268
                yes, i AM ashamed that so many Black cosign BS like this
Mar 05th 2007
271
      RE: and what facts are YOU dealing in here?
Mar 05th 2007
265
      LMAO! sha... i fucking love you!
Mar 05th 2007
267
      we will agree to disagree
Mar 05th 2007
272
      i don't know exactly what your opinion is, sha...
Mar 05th 2007
274
           RE: i don't know exactly what your opinion is, sha...
Mar 05th 2007
277
                like i said: i don't know exactly what your view is.
Mar 05th 2007
280
                     have you heard the new show yo?
Mar 05th 2007
281
                          LOL
Mar 05th 2007
284
                               lol no doubt
Mar 05th 2007
286
      nobody brought up Yacub but YOU!!!!
Mar 05th 2007
304
           exactly... that's what I'm saying...
Mar 05th 2007
309
      Exactly. Well said Sha.
Mar 05th 2007
269
           nigga, when you was rocking Africa medallions i was LIVING in Africa.
Mar 05th 2007
275
                Um.. you do know Africans sold Africans into Slavery too right?
Mar 05th 2007
278
                     of course... AND?
Mar 05th 2007
282
                          two weeks? haha... so assumptive and arrogant...
Mar 05th 2007
283
                               oh, sorry... it was a *month*. MY BAD!
Mar 05th 2007
287
                                    that was one time idiot... hahaha...
Mar 05th 2007
288
                                         *pot calling kettle desperate*
Mar 05th 2007
290
                                              what happened to not wanting to even speak to us 'such' niggaz?
Mar 05th 2007
291
                                                   oh okay... so you really DO want me to leave.
Mar 05th 2007
293
                                                   sell out niggaz... aint they something...
Mar 05th 2007
294
                                                        forgive me for posting again when i said i'd leave
Mar 05th 2007
296
                                                             show me where anyone mentioned Yakub?
Mar 05th 2007
298
                                                                  exactly... LIES >>>> BitchTalk
Mar 05th 2007
300
      RE: and what facts are YOU dealing in here?
Mar 05th 2007
303
           and there you have it folks... scienced out...
Mar 05th 2007
306
           okay... let's be level-headed here.
Mar 05th 2007
315
                this statement is true... but it simplifies the entire process...
Mar 05th 2007
322
                okay... when you bring the CIA into it
Mar 05th 2007
325
                     RE: okay... when you bring the CIA into it
Mar 06th 2007
332
                RE: okay... let's be level-headed here.
Mar 05th 2007
329
                     Warren Coolidge is Aquaman's HERO...
Mar 06th 2007
333
                     i'm really trying to be nice here...
Mar 06th 2007
334
                          can't have it both ways man..
Mar 06th 2007
343
                               Warren, i just want to confirm that i read your post.
Mar 07th 2007
345
                               well said Warren... I love the clarity and on point as always....
Mar 08th 2007
350
                               Eh....Warren
Mar 08th 2007
358
                                    Eh Jam... PROVE IT.
Mar 08th 2007
361
                                    RE: Eh Jam... PROVE IT.
Mar 08th 2007
362
                                         Let me explain to you why this is bullshit...
Mar 08th 2007
363
                                              Calm down.
Mar 08th 2007
365
                                                   Brother please.. everyone knows he was Angry at Elijah however
Mar 08th 2007
366
                                                        Did I not say give me a minute, brother? Here it is...
Mar 08th 2007
367
                                    come on man..
Mar 09th 2007
369
RE: Pro Black Music vs. Cointelpro and Uncle Tom Niggaz
Mar 05th 2007
259
take your time.. .
Mar 05th 2007
262
-prints off and hands in for university thesis-
Mar 05th 2007
276
hahaha....
Mar 05th 2007
285
      and AFKAP... for the record...
Mar 05th 2007
308
           as far as being disrespectful to people goes
Mar 05th 2007
311
                please money... I defended you and told them... kaps a good brother
Mar 05th 2007
312
                     okay... granted, you DID say KAP's a good brother
Mar 05th 2007
319
                          See here's where you fucked up...
Mar 05th 2007
320
                               fair enough...
Mar 05th 2007
321
                                    PRove it...
Mar 05th 2007
323
                                         and for the record... how can you seperate the struggle from
Mar 05th 2007
324
                                         who separated the struggle from the people?
Mar 05th 2007
327
                                         okay... will do.
Mar 05th 2007
326
Have you forgotten........
Mar 05th 2007
330
Exactly... ANY REVOLUTION THEY WILL SHUT DOWN...ANY
Mar 06th 2007
331
      You are being trivial.
Mar 06th 2007
335
it's really all about money, power, and control
Mar 07th 2007
347
it's not about white vs black at all...
Mar 08th 2007
348
^^^^Definately IN THE KNOW!^^^^^
Mar 08th 2007
357

sha mecca
Member since Oct 21st 2004
64667 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 09:17 AM

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1. "its so hard to read shit like this over the internet"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

i get headaches...maybe i'll print it out

www.mybabystayfresh.com

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
8480 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 09:19 AM

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3. "Deprogramming. Here... CIA and the Murder of John Lennon."
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

Why Bush & the CIA Had John Lennon Killed -- The Beatles, the Montauk Project, the Tavistock Institute and Mass Social Control

© 1999 John Quinn/NewsHawk® inc.

All Rights Reserved

Today is the birthday of Beatle John Lennon.

In honor of the man and his wonderful music NewsHawk Inc. has decided to take a look at what was going on "behind the scenes" of the 1960's "countercultural revolution"; to explore a bit how the world's most popular and undeniably talented rock band was without ANY doubt "used" by New World Order social manipulators (as were MANY other pop music groups) in an ongoing project designed to control the development of human society in the most fundamental ways.

There are direct links which tie these activities to certain covert scientific projects of an extremely advanced, esoteric nature which were exploring the realms of (manipulation of) consciousness, time, thought and indeed "reality" itself, which were being conducted during the same period of time on Long Island, N.Y.: activities which were part of the Phoenix/Montauk Project.

In fact we are talking about two sides of the same coin here. On one side, the covert, subtle manipulation and control of not only thought and human consciousness but of the most fundamental, subatomic, electromagnetic matrix of (perceived) reality itself, using newly-developed electromagnetic/radio frequency technologies of extraordinary, unheard-of power and potential. On the other side, directly and overtly shifting the paradigm, changing the basic concepts, widening the parameters--the envelope, changing the playing field and all the rules of play by which society defines itself within an exceptionally short period of time.

Factor in what was happening on more political levels such as the civil rights and anti-war movements, stir briskly while at full boil, and STAND BACK!

What's rather amazing in fact is that society did NOT disintegrate/implode/explode in the way the social manipulators had apparently hoped. The higher qualities of human nature seemed to consistently float to the surface--with some notable exceptions--and certainly began to acquire a significant, if not nearly irresistible momentum of it's own; pulling in larger and larger segments, of "straight"', conventional, "moral majority" type elements of society. obviously, the big plan was backfiring severely and something "needed to be done."

The Beatles were also part of the mass experimentation that contemporary society was being subjected to by the CIA, Britain's MI6 and the Tavistock Institute utilizing extraordinarily powerful mind-altering psychedelic/psychotropic drugs.

More than most of the other boys in the band, John Lennon became increasingly aware not only of the extent of corruption, co-opting and infiltration of the counterculture -- most CERTAINLY including the rock music scene -- by these same covert government intelligence elements.

Lennon was also aware than one of the "big guns" in the CIA/Tavistock/MI6 arsenal, LSD, had been having effect upon the population groups to which it had been funneled so extensively that was most unexpected on the part of the social manipulators--and to a large extent the effect was rather positive and beneficial.

Shortly before Lennon's death at the hands of what beyond the faintest glimmer of a shadow a doubt was a mind-controlled, "Manchurian Candidate" type assassin deployed by Tavistock/CIA/MI6, Mark Chapman to terminate a "loose cannon", Lennon had the audacity to massively and blatantly "out" the aforementioned consortium in a Playboy interview -- in which he made note of LSD's completely unforeseen liberating impact upon human society and civilization--pretty much thumbing his nose at the whole bunch and their whole trip; AND indicating as well that he was aware of the extent to which he and other pop musicians had been set up--to be used as dupes in massive social manipulation schemes.

Shortly afterward, New World Order head honcho and Satanist, globalist, CIA chief and Tavistock underling vice-president George Bush had Lennon slaughtered on the streets of new York; where he died in the arms of someone that a number of sources claim was the monarch agent deployed by MI6/CIA to keep the exceptionally intelligent Lennon constantly gravitating toward the social fringe; thereby keeping his potential influence at least minimized -- Yoko Ono. That's NOT to say that even IF this last supposition is true, that genuine love and a fulfilling relationship did not exist between the two and that Yoko's "programming", just like John's, broke up and fell apart.

And what about those Beatles, anyway? Anyone who has heard the Beatles' live tapes recorded in 1961 and 1962 on the "Reeperbahn" in Hamburg, Germany realizes that this was an incredibly talented and energetic bunch of rockers who no matter what would have undoubtedly had a significant impact upon popular music and thus upon society itself, regardless of things which occurred subsequently in their saga.

And without any doubt being given access to state-of-the art audio and recording technologies and facilities stimulated their creativity quite a bit--for the benefit of all; "MR. KITE" included.

Personally I think the Beatles were definitely "the greatest"--or damn close to it.

STOP LETTING THIS CONFUSED NIGGAZ GUIDE YOU.
IT'S RIDICULOUS.

AllHiphop.com
3121.com
Wardolphin.com
Afropunk.com
Bling47.com
Fader.com



Who's fucking wit B More right now?

"Freedom is a Lie" - the animals

  

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FuriousStyles3000
Member since Jan 18th 2007
860 posts
Wed Mar-07-07 12:28 PM

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346. "its really all about money, power, & control"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

racism is the greatest tool created to confuse the masses and keep their eye off of the ball. the focus should be on rich vs poor. mlk knew this.

throughout history, different cultures, people, nations, etc. conquered other nations and subjected their people to atrocities foul and inhumane. all races perpetuated this sickness. the moors did it to spain and italy. the egyptians (pre-ptolemy) did it to the nubians. the japanese did it to the chinese. the driving force behind the 99% of wars is money, power, and control.

whites in general are not devils. blacks are not criminals. there is bad and good in every race... greedy people too. greedy people willing to sacrifice anything or anyone to maintain & increase their influence.

greed is what influenced the genocide of my people during colonial-times slavery. greed is why slaves were enslaved for 400 years. greed is why our leaders were killed. greed is why drugs were placed in our communities. racism is a product of this greed.

there is an obsession w/ labeling and categorizing. everything from music, to race, to food must be labeled correctly according to some asanine standard. this obsession prevents growth and promotes stagnation. only by thinking and functioning "outside of the box" can progress be made.

i am about solutions. not problems. if what has been said in this topic is true, i ask what is the solution?

the greedy money-hungry, power-hungry, control-hoarding folks are the ones who should receive our wrath, not whites. as long as we are divided, they will continue conquering.

_________________
When you control a man's thinking, you don't have to worry about his actions.
-Carter G. Woodson

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
41971 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 09:18 AM

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2. "look what you trying to start"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

i'll try to be back.

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." © Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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sha mecca
Member since Oct 21st 2004
64667 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 09:20 AM

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4. "i so wanna be in this conversation"
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

but like the nigger in me really doesn't want to read all that shit
at the price of a headache.

www.mybabystayfresh.com

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
8480 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 09:22 AM

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5. "THEN KILL THE NIGGA IN U & BRING THE BLACKMAN OUT"
In response to Reply # 4


  

          

-+- The CIA and Mind Control -+-

In April 1950, the CIA began work on PROJECT BLUEBIRD, the
agency's fledgling attempt at mind control. "Within two years
this had progressed into the substantially enlarged PROJECT
ARTICHOKE. According to a later CIA internal memorandum, PROJECT
ARTICHOKE was intended to 'exploit operational lines, scientific
methods and knowledge that can be utilized in altering the
attitudes, beliefs, thought processes and behaviour patterns of
agent personnel. This will include the application of tested
psychiatric and psychological techniques including the use of
hypnosis in conjunction with drugs.' In turn, only one year
later, in April 1953, PROJECT ARTICHOKE became MKULTRA, the
generic name for a series of on-going investigations by the
agency's Technical Services Staff."

Some might object that pre-programming a subject to be a "killer
on command" violates the common wisdom that one cannot be
hypnotised to do something that is contray to one's individual
morals. Yet not all "experts" are in agreement on this. For
example Milton Kline, a New York psychologist and former
president of the American Society for Clinical and Experimental
Hypnosis believes it is *not* impossible to create a "Manchurian
Candidate." According to Kline, "It cannot be done by everyone.
It cannot be done consistently, but it can be done."

"There seems little doubt that sophisticated techniques have now
reached the stage where, if murder is desired, a killer, once
programmed and 'on hold', can be triggered into action."

-+- Sirhan Sirhan -+-

Bresler suggests that Sirhan Sirhan, the supposed lone assassin
of Robert F. Kennedy, was a pre-programmed killer. Seven years
after the RFK assassination, Sirhan was interviewed by
psychiatrists. These recorded interviews were analyzed with the
help of a Psychological Stress Evaluator (PSE), a device which
measures micro-tremors in the voice. Based on the PSE, former
high-ranking intelligence officer Charles McQuiston stated: "I'm
convinced that Sirhan wasn't aware of what he was doing. He was
in a hypnotic trance when he pulled the trigger... Everything in
the PSE charts tells me that someone else was involved in the
assassination -- and that Sirhan was programmed through hypnosis
to kill RFK. What we have here is a real live 'Manchurian
Candidate.'"

After examining Sirhan's PSE charts, Dr. John W. Heisse, Jr.,
president of the International Society of Stress Analysis, agreed
with McQuiston: "Sirhan kept repeating certain phrases. This
clearly revealed he had been programmed to put himself into a
trance."


STOP LETTING THIS CONFUSED NIGGAZ GUIDE YOU.
IT'S RIDICULOUS.
SENSATIONALISM ONLY WORKS IF YOU LIKE SHINY OBJECTS.
LOL.

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"Freedom is a Lie" - the animals

  

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sha mecca
Member since Oct 21st 2004
64667 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 09:28 AM

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8. "i'm a black woman but yea"
In response to Reply # 5


  

          

thanks for the inspiration

but

posting more shit is making it worse lol

www.mybabystayfresh.com

  

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Earl Flynn
Member since Dec 08th 2005
28751 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 11:19 AM

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47. "What you FOCUS on you will FIND"
In response to Reply # 4


  

          

-

Each progressive spirit is opposed by a thousand mediocre minds appointed to guard the past. ~
Maurice Maeterlinck

  

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sha mecca
Member since Oct 21st 2004
64667 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 11:28 AM

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59. "i don't know what that means"
In response to Reply # 47


  

          

but i'm skimmin hard lol

www.mybabystayfresh.com

  

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Earl Flynn
Member since Dec 08th 2005
28751 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 12:30 PM

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72. "keep skimmin & shimmyin"
In response to Reply # 59


  

          

LOL!

Each progressive spirit is opposed by a thousand mediocre minds appointed to guard the past. ~
Maurice Maeterlinck

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
8480 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 02:01 PM

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115. "hahaha... step n fetch it..."
In response to Reply # 72


  

          

lol

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Who's fucking wit B More right now?

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Earl Flynn
Member since Dec 08th 2005
28751 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 11:19 AM

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48. "What you FOCUS on you will FIND"
In response to Reply # 4


  

          

-

Each progressive spirit is opposed by a thousand mediocre minds appointed to guard the past. ~
Maurice Maeterlinck

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 09:23 AM

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6. "HEY, i'll never the formally known as blackman so..."
In response to Reply # 2
Thu Mar-01-07 09:23 AM by AquamansWrath

  

          

it's my duty.
especially when you don't know what the fuck your talking about.

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
41971 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 09:36 AM

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9. "where's that chapter break down from?"
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

Honestly I wish you had put this all out there slowly.... Like Sha pointed out it becomes overwhelming to look at and deters people from getting into it. But it's worth getting into. It's really worth getting into.

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." © Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
8480 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 09:40 AM

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10. "not my problem."
In response to Reply # 9
Thu Mar-01-07 09:40 AM by AquamansWrath

  

          

no offense.
haven't even started. Wait til I get to Bob and Tosh.

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Who's fucking wit B More right now?

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
41971 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 09:44 AM

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11. "okay but where is the chapter breakdown from?"
In response to Reply # 10


  

          

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." © Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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sha mecca
Member since Oct 21st 2004
64667 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 11:29 AM

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62. "lol not your problem but you want people to have the info right?"
In response to Reply # 10


  

          

*smh* i'm with dude where's the info coming from
maybe where you got it from there's an easier format on the eyes

www.mybabystayfresh.com

  

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Backpacker Bevin
Member since Nov 08th 2005
107 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 09:28 AM

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7. "C-O-N-spiracy."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

its about time, a good post.
they trying to destroy real hip-hop man.
they only promoting that faggot bullshit like,
"just bought a cadillac". foh!
fuck I need cadillac for, god?
with my mind, i can travel anywhere I want to go.
muthafuckers ain't understanding that shit.
back in '89, we had that essence to the music, b.
the gubment take away hip-hop
and they kept giving us that stale ass cheese.
fuck that wack shit on the radio,

i represent da real hip-hop (c) das efx.

~


"Fuck being hard, Posdnous is complicated" - Pos

Top 5 MC's:

1. Ras Kass
2. Aceyalone
3. Talib Kweli
4. MF DOOM
5. Phonte

GOAT Album: Ras Kass' "Soul on Ice"

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
8480 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 09:45 AM

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12. "CIA and Bob Marley"
In response to Reply # 7


  

          

"Bob Marley: Blunt Questions" By: I. Jabulani Tafari

“Rasta don’t work for no CIA”

Did the CIA really kill Bob Marley? How’s that for a Blunt Question? This is only one of many Blunt Questions that remain unanswered nearly 22 years after Bob Marley’s translation from this world into another dimension.

When the newz broke in Jamaica on May 11, 1981, that Bob Marley had passed on from this world at the Cedars of Lebanon Hospital in Miami, the immediate and initial response by politically savvy Rastafarians in Jamaica was that the Reggae Maestro had been murdered, or more correctly, assassinated! At the time, the Rastas didn’t know exactly who, when, where or how, but they knew enough to suspect foul play with extreme prejudice. Of course, anyone who heard that reasoning, scoffed at it. After all, everyone knows that cancer is a fatal disease, and Bob had it and died from it and that’s a great pity… but murdered? How ridiculous! Maybe, or maybe not. Not when you stop and really think about it. Who would want to? Who would be able to and how could it be done so skillfully without suspicion?

It’s almost like the classic scenario that Detective Lieutenant Columbo of TV fame, would stumble and fumble his bumbling way into. Only to find that the seemingly straight forward ‘death by natural causes’, was really the ‘perfect murder’ in disguise. After all, who ever would even suspect the possibility of something as bizarre as that occurring? So for the past 20 years, music lovers around the world have been mourning the ‘untimely’ passing of Bob Marley, accepting that the Reggae Legend died of ‘natural causes’ (really unnatural, because what’s ‘natural’ about cancer?) Thus, as we move swiftly into a new millennium and an impending New World Order, a mounting body of information is seriously suggesting that Bob Marley was the victim of an elaborate assassination scheme that resulted him being literally ‘taken out’ –right there in broad daylight on center stage before the eyes of the whole world.

Since the late 1970’s and on into the early 1980’s, the New York City and Houston, Texas, Police Departments have led the way in compiling official reports on the Rastafari Movement. The NYPD in particular, not only described Rastafarians as dangerous, gun-shooting, drug-dealing, criminal Jamaican Posse members, but actually profiled and described dreadlocked Rastas as “terrorists”. The largest police operation in the history of Washington DC, ‘Operation Caribbean Cruise’ back in the late 1980’s, was designed to prove once and for all the drug-dealing, gun-running connection between Rastafarians and the Jamaican criminal posses that were said to be even more ruthless and trigger happy than the Italian Mafia and Organized Crime. “Operation Caribbean Cruise’ never made the nightly news outside of DC, because the police dragnet came up empty…. But for about five guns (not the high powered automatic weapons anticipated) and a minimal amount of drugs.

Despite these failed attempts to tarnish and taint the reputation of the Rastafari Kulcha, Bob Marley and Peter Tosh continued leading the way for a world wide revolution in thinking and thought. Their militant brand of hardcore Rootz Reggae was revolutionary in its impact. The Word Sound & Power of their Muzik, inspired political, economic, social and religious changes all over the globe. The anti-apartheid movement in South Africa drew inspiration from Marley Muzik; the Zimbabwean freedom fighters engaged in a guerrilla struggle against Ian Smith’s colonial Rhodesian settler regime, drew inspiration from Marley Muzik; even young, rich White kids in America from name-brand families were starting to hang out at Wailers concerts, were starting to dig the message in Marley’s muzik and were becoming inspired to work for social change and to “Chant Down Babylon” That was motive enough for Marley’s murder.

Marley was succeeding in a rhythmic revolution that utilized music as a more efficient tool than guns and bombs. Bob Marley, his mere personae, his instantly and internationally recognized image and look, his use and promotion of the “Wisdom Weed’, his verbal and material support of global Pan-African Liberation, and the fact that Bob Marley had become a millionaire –a Black Jamaican-born, pro-African, independent-thinking millionaire Rastaman- who could now put his own money where his mouth was and finance whatever project he wanted to… All of these factors made Bob Marley a very serious threat to the North American status quo and to the hidden power brokers trying to implement their plan for a New World Order.

By 1980, Bob Marley was the most popular ‘Third World’ muzik star on the planet and his immense influence was growing geometrically. The final straw that prompted clandestine covert operations against Marley was probably when Bob put the immortal words of HIM Emperor Haile Selassie I to muzik in the brilliant composition entitled “War”. When they heard: “Until the color of a man’s skin makes no more significance than the color of his eyes, there will be war… Until there are no first or second class citizens of any nation - war… Until the ignoble and unhappy regimes that hold our brothers in Angola, Mozambique, South Africa, have been toppled and utterly destroyed - War. And until bigotry, prejudice and malicious and inhuman self interest have been replaced by tolerance, understanding and good will… everywhere is war.” When the CIA types heard that song, they brought in the heavyweights and the battle went to another dimension. Unfortunately, Bob Marley never really knew that he had already been “Marked For Death”. And as Del Jones chronicles inhis “Culture Bandits” series of books, Bob was soon eradicated as a revolutionary 3rd World Icon and replaced in the early 1980’s by an androgynous (blurred gender), surgically altered, cosmetically bleached Michael Jackson.

O.K., so now you agree that they had a reason and a motive to kill Marley, but now you’re wondering, how could they give him cancer? According to the popular version of events, Bob is supposed to have contracted cancer after bruising his toe and losing a toe-nail while playing soccer in France in 1977. In his revealing book, “Marley And Me”, former Wailers manager Don Taylor notes that an unknown doctor came and gave Bob a still unknown injection in his toe right after the ball game was interrupted Malignant cancer, originating in the same toe, was diagnosed some time after. But the origin of the melanoma (the most virulent and deadly kind of cancer found in Humans) that took Bob’s life, may be concealed in little known events that took place at an even earlier time.

In a very interesting cover article published in the February 2002 issue of High Times magazine, the authors disclose that in 1976, Carl Colby, son of ex-CIA Director William Colby, visited the Hope Road home of Marley and gave the Reggae Star a gift in the form of a pair of boots. The High Times article quotes eyewitnesses as saying that Bob cried out “Ow!” when he stuck a foot in one of the boots. Something had jucked (stuck) him in the toe(s). Talk about being aware or beware of “Greeks baring gifts”. Subsequent investigation of the boot by hand, retrieved a piece of copper wire that had been sticking up inside the footwear. Entitled, “Chanting Down Babylon: The CIA and the Death of Bob Marley”, the High Times article went on to pose another Blunt Question: had the copper wire found in Bob’s new boot been chemically treated with a carcinogenic toxin? There is no doubting that with today’s technology, carcinogenic (that is cancer-causing) substances can be introduced into the human body very easily by a variety of means. By food, drink, smoke, sex, a pin/wire prick, or with the spike of an umbrella.

As the High Times article also observed, 1976 was a time when Jamaica, under the leadership of the Democratic Socialist and pro-Castro Prime Minister Michael Manley, was known to be under direct destabilization efforts by the CIA. According to High Times, Marley and Tosh as Reggae musicians, were targeted in particular because they were using their music to alert the Jamaican people to the dangers of the ongoing CIA covert operations. The visit to Marley by Carl Colby, who was supposedly posing as a member of a foreign film crew, took place a week after the “Ambush In the Night” during which Bob and Rita Marley and Don Taylor were all shot and wounded during the first upfront assassination attempt. Most people took that attack as involving only local partisan politics, with the opposition JLP not wanting Marley & the Wailers to perform at the PNP-Government sponsored and free Smile Jamaica concert days before a hotly contested General Election in Jamaica in December 1976. Marley appeared and performed for a mostly inner-city, urban audience on the Smile Jamaica Concert in the National Heroes Circle, in spite of the gun attack.

At the other, final end of this melodrama, we find Dr. Josef Issels, the supposedly holistic immuno-therapist who treated Bob in Germany after his collapse in Central Park, New York, in late 1980. Information is coming to light that Issels is an ex-Nazi doctor who may be implicated in some of the more nefarious practices associated with German medical studies and practices from the Hitler era. This may explain the painful, starvation-diet based treatment program inflicted on Bob by Dr. Issels. So we want to know: Who exactly is this Dr. Josef Issels? Does he indeed have a Nazi past? And what precisely did his ‘unorthodox’ cancer treatment entail? These Blunt Questions also need Blunt Answers.

At the end of the day and at the end of this article, we’re basically at the same place we were when we started. Just like the following truism indicates: “There are more questions than answers”. Nevertheless, muzik fans and people of good will owe it to themselves and to Bob Marley, to continue asking these Blunt Questions, and should demand that answers be given by the powers that be and those in the know. In the meantime, the final Blunt Question for all of you reading this, is: Bob Marley was willing to get up and pay the price for Standing Up for his Rights and for seeking Liberation from political and mental slavery for his people. Are you?

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fire
Charter member
111364 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 09:48 AM

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13. "where afkap @?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

________________________________________
who gonna check me boo?!

www.twitter.com/firefire100
http://instagram.com/firefire100
www.philadelphiaeagles.com

  

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kayru99
Member since Jan 26th 2004
15231 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 09:53 AM

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15. "somewhere embarrassed by it all"
In response to Reply # 13


  

          

  

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themn
Member since Apr 21st 2005
5667 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 09:57 AM

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18. "*waits*"
In response to Reply # 13


          


"I fuckin' know you"

  

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Ill Jux
Member since Jan 19th 2007
14664 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 01:27 PM

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87. "i was thinkin the same shit, guess he's too embarrassed to read this"
In response to Reply # 13


  

          

______

in the memory of NYC upt JUX�

<--- don't front, you'd smash

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
8480 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 01:29 PM

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91. "and not wise enough to live it..."
In response to Reply # 87
Thu Mar-01-07 01:40 PM by AquamansWrath

  

          

I like money..
he's just not on point about damn near anything.


all that post showed me was the answer to one question...

"how many houseniggaz can you get on one message board?"

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Russ
Member since Jul 26th 2003
2035 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 01:48 PM

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103. "pretty much..."
In response to Reply # 91


  

          

>I like money..
> he's just not on point about damn near anything.
>
>
>all that post showed me was the answer to one question...
>
>"how many houseniggaz can you get on one message board?"
>

I was completely embarassed by the whole thing. Haha.

-----
http://www.waxpoetics.com

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
8480 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 02:05 PM

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121. "right.. .same here... a grown ass black man..."
In response to Reply # 103


  

          

saying some punk shit like that.
It's time for all bitch niggaz to get off the mic.

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Who's fucking wit B More right now?

"Freedom is a Lie" - the animals

  

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Zap Furer
Member since Dec 11th 2003
1528 posts
Fri Mar-02-07 09:30 AM

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181. "Yeah Afkap is certfied bitchmade..."
In response to Reply # 121


  

          

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The murder rate is dropping (I see you gangsta rap)
Meth is the hottest narcotic amongst the impoverished (coke rap stand up!)
Hip Hop "L"ost!

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
8480 posts
Fri Mar-02-07 09:36 AM

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182. "hands him certificate... lol..."
In response to Reply # 181


  

          

you know... i tried to tell em before..
see I'm from Bmore.. we don't make those make and models out here...
namean...
word.

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thebadnegro
Member since Nov 13th 2006
4028 posts
Fri Mar-02-07 08:52 PM

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246. "WORD."
In response to Reply # 91


          

  

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kayru99
Member since Jan 26th 2004
15231 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 09:52 AM

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14. "and the funny thing is"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

you ain't even gotta get THAT deep with the modern era.

A handful of companies owns both the radio stations and the record labels.

If you aren't an artist that falls within that axis of influence, you get NO burn.

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
8480 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 10:20 AM

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24. "bingo... the music or the niggas who support it... are shallow"
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

as hell.
Embaressed? Please. I'm a man.

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Who's fucking wit B More right now?

"Freedom is a Lie" - the animals

  

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Earl Flynn
Member since Dec 08th 2005
28751 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 11:22 AM

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51. "Exactly!"
In response to Reply # 24


  

          

Cats be lookin at me funny and shit when I say, "I don't listen to WJLB"

Each progressive spirit is opposed by a thousand mediocre minds appointed to guard the past. ~
Maurice Maeterlinck

  

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sha mecca
Member since Oct 21st 2004
64667 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 10:54 AM

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34. "basic"
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

www.mybabystayfresh.com

  

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Ill Jux
Member since Jan 19th 2007
14664 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 11:15 AM

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43. "true"
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

______

in the memory of NYC upt JUX�

<--- don't front, you'd smash

  

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lonesome_d
Charter member
30298 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 09:54 AM

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16. "I'm generally in favor of posts mentioning Phil Ochs"
In response to Reply # 0


          

but this one is a bit bewildering in terms of scope, focus, and some content.

btw, what is your definition of 'pro-Black music'?

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
8480 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 09:55 AM

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17. "if you wake up everymorning and you wish to live..."
In response to Reply # 16


  

          

if you wish to see your children live...
your community... your families...
if you wish good intentions for you and yours.

what's yours?

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lonesome_d
Charter member
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Thu Mar-01-07 10:12 AM

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21. "That has nothing to do with music."
In response to Reply # 17


          

It's also a philosophy I don't necessarily see in a lot of Black music (though I generally do see it in music that I would consider 'pro-Black.')

It's a great philosophy for life, though.

  

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AquamansWrath
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Thu Mar-01-07 10:19 AM

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23. "this has everything to do with music..."
In response to Reply # 21


  

          

everything. You may view music as a commodity..
and there in lies your problem.

Yes, it's a great philosophy for life...
if you are a sincere person in life... so is your music..
the reflection of it... therefore.

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lonesome_d
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Thu Mar-01-07 10:30 AM

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25. "So... outta curiosity: what's 'conscious' about Milk Cow Calf Blues?"
In response to Reply # 23


          

Cocaine Habit Blues?

Bed Spring Blues?

44-20 Blues?

Frankie & Johnny?

Stagger Lee?

I don't know if links are still active, but I did a 'Black roots music' post last month that had a fair amount of fun stuff that was about nothing more than getting high and getting laid, with occasional pepperings of misogyny, domestic violence, self-loathing, marital infidelity, and homicide.

Sure, people can make the argument that it's party music that is uplifting precisely because it is about relieving the stress of the day to day existence. But to me, that's like saying 'Gin And Juice' is about striving for social equality and promoting a healthy diet.

A lot of blues stuff is pretty much the opposite side of the coin from songs like Parchman Farm Blues, or even ballads like John Henry, which ARE about personal upliftment and fulfillment.

*shrug*

  

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AquamansWrath
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Thu Mar-01-07 10:35 AM

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28. "and? Louie Louie was written around the same time as the"
In response to Reply # 25


  

          

last poets
your point?

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lonesome_d
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33. "lmao"
In response to Reply # 28


          

you do know Richard Berry wrote Louie, Louie in 1955?

  

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AquamansWrath
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Thu Mar-01-07 10:56 AM

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35. "Were niggaz strugglin in 1955? Yes."
In response to Reply # 33


  

          

So...

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lonesome_d
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38. "lmao. well played."
In response to Reply # 35


          

sort of.

  

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AquamansWrath
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40. "It's truth. Lol."
In response to Reply # 38


  

          

period.

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lonesome_d
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:23 AM

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52. "Yeah, but it's got nothing to do with an answer to my question."
In response to Reply # 40


          

  

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AquamansWrath
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:24 AM

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54. "Your question is weak and baseless."
In response to Reply # 52


  

          

We are not discussing the authoring of Louie Louie, pay attention and learn something.

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lonesome_d
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161. "And your post is a mess, but I've tried to adress it respectfully."
In response to Reply # 54


          

>We are not discussing the authoring of Louie Louie, pay
>attention and learn something.
>

Hold up... who brought up Louie, Louie?

  

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AquamansWrath
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254. "All these brothers agree with me... you couldn't do NOTHING."
In response to Reply # 161


  

          

on any level.
We know wassup and we don't need some white boy to validate.
So... enjoy the music?
Peace.

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lonesome_d
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266. "My man, it saddens me that you think I'm trying to 'validate'"
In response to Reply # 254


          

or 'invalidate' anyone's opinion.

All I wanted was for you to explain your stance more clearly, and it doesn't make sense to me that you have refused to do so while asserting that you have already done so.

If you just don't like me, or don't deem me worthy, that's cool. But say that instead of speaking in half-shades. It genuinely confuses me that you seem so salty and dismissive.


As far as the Louie Louie bullshit goes: you (confusingly) brought it up, and you got your information wrong. Then you criticise me for correcting you and straying off-topic? That's just weird.



>So... enjoy the music?

I always do.

  

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kayru99
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Thu Mar-01-07 10:40 AM

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30. "nah, black roots music in america was powerful cuz"
In response to Reply # 25


  

          

it showed autonomy.

It spoke to a reality and lifestyle that was outside of the control of white folks, in a way, which made (and makes) it powerful as hell.

Black people simply living thier lives indepently is sometimes a revolutionary act in this culture.

  

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AquamansWrath
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Thu Mar-01-07 10:41 AM

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31. "bingo"
In response to Reply # 30


  

          

exactly.

bob says it best...
"he who feels it
knows it"

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lonesome_d
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37. "Absolutely. But that's not what he said."
In response to Reply # 30


          

to quote: "You see, blues was nothing more than conscious pro-black music."

I asked specifically what was "conscious" and "pro-black" about specific songs which are clearly a significant part of blues tradition, several of which I'm sure he knows.

"Stagger Lee shot Billy, he shot that boy so bad, that the bullet went through Billy and broker the bartender's glass." (said fight was overe a card game and a Stetson hat.)

"Frankie went down to the hotel. She didn't go there for fun; underneath her red kimono she carried a 44 gun, to shoot her man if he was doing her wrong." (he was, and she did.)

"Well, I love my whiskey and I love my gin, but the way I love my coke is an awful sin - hey, hey, honey take a whiff on me!"

There's nothing in these songs that to me says

"if you wake up in the morning and you wish to live...
if you wish to see your children live...
your community... your families...
if you wish good intentions for you and yours."

  

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AquamansWrath
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:04 AM

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39. "so three songs constitute all of Blues? Keep this in mind..."
In response to Reply # 37
Thu Mar-01-07 11:04 AM by AquamansWrath

  

          

blues was the only voice we had at the time...
if your expecting them to give you a public enemy rant..
keep expecting it...
bottom line is black people didn't own their masters or the studios they recorded in and had to code their music...

besides...
that's one sentence out of all this information..
and you choose to harp on that?
What does that say of your agenda?
Just curious.

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lonesome_d
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:19 AM

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49. "Well, you're wrong about that too."
In response to Reply # 39


          

>blues was the only voice we had at the time...

blues
jug band music
country & old-time music
jazz
pop
shit, Paul Robeson was singing opera at the time
minstrelsy, even, was being recorded by black artists and sold to a black audience

>if your expecting them to give you a public enemy rant..
>keep expecting it...

All I asked was: what is 'pro-black' about those songs?

>bottom line is black people didn't own their masters or the
>studios they recorded in and had to code their music...

Okay. So what is the code in those songs? I mean, 'Follow the Drinking Gourd' I get, but not the kind of stuff I've asked about.

and as is clear, I pointed out that there are indeed plenty of uplifting songs within the blues tradition. I don't have a one-dimensional view of the genre or form either way.

> that's one sentence out of all this information..
>and you choose to harp on that?
>What does that say of your agenda?
>Just curious.

I chose to discuss blues because that's the area you addressed in which I'm best versed. I'm not sure what you're trying to imply about my agenda.

Frankly, the conspiracy theory stuff which is the main body of your post doesn't interest me all that much. Of course that doesn't mean there isn't any merit in it.

  

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AquamansWrath
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:23 AM

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53. "How's that Secret Life of Plants album? Hmm..."
In response to Reply # 49
Thu Mar-01-07 11:27 AM by AquamansWrath

  

          

first off... paul Robeson... a man of dignity, multiple languages a trained actor... had to play SAMBO, complete with a loin cloth... to be exposed.

second.
I said the only VOICE we had.
Jazz... had no voice... that's what I pointed out earlier...
they chose to fight the system thru their music.

"blues
jug band music
country & old-time music
jazz
pop"

You must be kidding.
Jub band music?
Name one.
Country and Old time music?
Name one.
Pop?
Name one.

You do realize this is before Little Richard and Chuck Berry broke the popular music sound barrier.

I really question your intentions.

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AquamansWrath
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:28 AM

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60. "Just so show you... Paul Robeson and the CIA"
In response to Reply # 53


  

          

Did the CIA Poison Paul Robeson?







Paul Robeson, the black actor, singer, and political radical, may have been a victim of CIA chemist Sidney Gottlieb's MK-ULTRA program. We have previously noted Gottlieb's death and outlined his career of infamy. In the spring of 1961, Robeson planned to visit Havana, Cuba to meet with Fidel Castro and Che Guevara. The trip never came off because Robeson fell ill in Moscow, where he had gone to give several lectures and concerts. At the time, it was reported that Robeson had suffered a heart attack. But in fact Robeson had slashed his wrists in a suicide attempt after suffering hallucinations and severe depression. The symptoms came on following a surprise party thrown for him at his Moscow hotel.

Robeson's son, Paul Robeson, Jr., has investigated his father's illness for more than 30 years. He believes that his father was slipped a synthetic hallucinogen called BZ by U.S. intelligence operatives at the party in Moscow. The party was hosted by anti-Soviet dissidents funded by the CIA.

Robeson Jr. visited his father in the hospital the day after the suicide attempt. Robeson told his son that he felt extreme paranoia and thought that the walls of the room were moving. He said he had locked himself in his bedroom and was overcome by a powerful sense of emptiness and depression before he tried to take his own life.

Robeson left Moscow for London, where he was admitted to Priory Hospital. There he was turned over to psychiatrists who forced him to endure 54 electro-shock treatments. At the time, electro-shock, in combination with psycho-active drugs, was a favored technique of CIA behavior modification. It turned out that the doctors treating Robeson in London and, later, in New York were CIA contractors. The timing of Robeson's trip to Cuba was certainly a crucial factor. Three weeks after the Moscow party, the CIA launched its disastrous invasion of Cuba at the Bay of Pigs. It's impossible to underestimate Robeson's threat, as he was perceived by the U.S. government as the most famous black radical in the world. Through the 1950s Robeson commanded worldwide attention and esteem. He was the Nelson Mandela and Mohammed Ali of his time. He spoke more than twenty languages, including Russian, Chinese, and several African languages. Robeson was also on close terms with Nehru, Jomo Kenyatta, and other Third World leaders. His embrace of Castro in Havana would have seriously undermined U.S. efforts to overthrow the new Cuban government.

Another pressing concern for the U.S. government at the time was Robeson's announced intentions to return to the United States and assume a leading role in the emerging civil rights movement. Like the family of Martin Luther King, Robeson had been under official surveillance for decades. As early as 1935, British intelligence had been looking at Robeson's activities. In 1943, the Office of Strategic Services, World War II predecessor to the CIA, opened a file on him. In 1947, Robeson was nearly killed in a car crash. It later turned out that the left wheel of the car had been monkey-wrenched. In the 1950s, Robeson was targeted by Senator Joseph McCarthy's anti-communist hearings. The campaign effectively sabotaged his acting and singing career in the states.

Robeson never recovered from the drugging and the follow-up treatments from CIA-linked doctors and shrinks. He died in 1977. Robeson, Jr. has been pushing the U.S. to release classified documents regarding his father. He has already unearthed some damning stuff, including an FBI "status of health" report on Robeson created in April of 1961. "The fact that such a file was opened at all is sinister in itself," Robeson recently told the London Sunday Times. "It indicates a degree of prior knowledge that something was about to happen to him."

Robeson's case has chilling parallels to the fate of another black man who was slipped CIA-concocted hallucinogens, Sgt. James Thornwell. Thornwell was a U.S. Army sergeant working in a NATO office in Orleans, France, in 1961 (the same year Robeson was drugged), when he came under suspicion of having stolen documents. Thornwell, who maintained his innocence, was interrogated, hypnotized and harassed by U.S. intelligence officers. When he persisted in proclaiming his innocence, Thornwell was secretly given LSD for several days by his interrogators, during which time he was forced to undergo aggressive questioning, replete with racial slurs and threats. At one point, the CIA men threatened "to extend the state indefinitely, even to a point of permanent insanity." The agents apparently consummated their promise. Thornwell experienced an irreversible mental crisis. He eventually committed suicide at his Maryland home. There was never any evidence that he had anything to do with the missing NATO papers.


--Jeffrey St. Clair and Alexander Cockburn

NOW AGAIN, SIT BACK AND LEARN SOMETHING.

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lonesome_d
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:29 AM

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61. "hmmmmm"
In response to Reply # 53


          

.
>
>second.
>I said the only VOICE we had.
>Jazz... had no voice... that's what I pointed out earlier...
>they chose to fight the system thru their music.

Jazz had no vocals? Is that what you're suggesting?

>"blues
>jug band music
>country & old-time music
>jazz
>pop"
>
>You must be kidding.
>Jub band music?
>Name one.

Jug bands:
Memphis Jug Band
Cannon's Jug Stompers
Jack Kelly & the South Memphis Jug Band
Earl MacDonald's Original Louisville Jug Band
Whistler & His Jug Band
King David Jug Band
Stovepipe No. 1 & Mississippi Sarah


>Country and Old time music?
>Name one.

Mississippi Mud Steppers
Mississippi Shieks
Jim Booker, fiddler for Taylor's Kentucky Boys
Jimmie Strothers

and plenty of guys I have field recordings of

gotta run, sorry...

  

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AquamansWrath
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:39 AM

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63. "Excellent... now... don't run..."
In response to Reply # 61


  

          

Mississippi Mud Steppers
so this wasn't conscious music explaining the poverty of what was happening in the hills?
songs like 'the return of the northern starvers'? isn't conscious music?
haha...


Mississippi Shieks
songs like "Sales Tax" albums like "Stop and Listen"?

Jim Bookes version of People Get Ready isn't conscious music?

Jug bands:
didnt' explain the poverty and climate of racism in the south?
Sure they did..
and much of it was disguised... not to mention they were not ALLOWED the chance to voice there opinions.

Also... you do realize that AlB.Sure existed during the PE era don't you? So again...

Oh and nice job evading Paul Robeson.
I question your intentions.

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AquamansWrath
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:42 AM

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64. "and these"
In response to Reply # 63


  

          

Crazy Blues ... Perry Bradford, Traditional Mamie Smith (3:20)
I've Got Salvation in My Heart ... Sam Jones (3:06)
Lonesome John ... Sam Jones (3:19)
Fisher's Hornpipe ... Sam Jones (3:12)
Court Street Blues ... Sam Jones (3:19)
A Woman Gets Tires of the Same Man All the Time ... Sam Jones (3:14)
A Chicken Can Waltz the Gravy Around ... Sam Jones (3:09)
Bed Slats ... Sam Jones (3:08)
Cincinnati Southern Blues ... Charles "Cow Cow" Davenport, Ivy Smith (2:40)
Sixth Street Moan ... Kid Cole (3:00)
Hey Hey Mama Blues ... Kid Cole (3:05)
Hard Hearted Mama Blues ... Kid Cole (2:49)
Niagra Fall Blues ... Kid Cole (2:57)
Newport Blues ... Bob Coleman Cincinnati Jug Band (3:00)
George Street Stomp ... Cincinnati Jug Band (2:48)
Tear It Down ... Bobby Coleman (2:48)
Cincinnati Underworld Woman ... Bobby Coleman (2:58)
Sing Song Blues ... Bobby Coleman (3:06)
Mandd Blues ... Bobby Coleman (3:07)
Have You Ever Been Worried in Mind?, Pt. 1 ... Sweet Papa Tadpole (3:11)
Have You Ever Been Worried in Mind?, Pt. 2 ... Sweet Papa Tadpole (3:06)
Your Baby Can't Get Enough ... Sweet Papa Tadpole (3:12)
Keep Your Yes Ma'am Clean ... Sweet Papa Tadpole (2:40)
Black Spider Blues ... Sweet Papa Tadpole (2:50)
Weep and Moan When I'm Gone ... Sweet Papa Tadpole (2:45)


CD 2

Track Title iTunes Composers Performers Time
I Had to Smake That Thing ... Francis Wallace (2:25)
Can't Get Enough ... Clara Burston (2:37)
Mama Keep Your Yes Ma'am Clean ... Walter Cole (2:40)
Everybody Got Something ... Walter Cole (2:45)
What's That Tastes Like Gravy? ... King David's Jug Band (3:07)
Rising Sun Blues ... Traditional King David's Jug Band (3:02)
Sweet Potato Blues ... King David's Jug Band (3:21)
Tear It Down ... King David's Jug Band (3:04)
I Can Deal Worry ... King David's Jug Band (3:12)
Georgia Bo Bo ... King David's Jug Band (2:51)
Clair and Pearley Blues ... (2:55)
Tricks Ain't Walkin' No More ... (3:23)
Freight Train Blues ... (3:02)
War Dreams Blues ... (2:55)
George Street Blues ... Leroy Carr (3:07)
I'm Going to Cincinnati ... Walter Coleman (2:45)
Greyhound Blues ... Walter Coleman (2:55)
Mama Let Me Lay It on You ... Walter Coleman (3:02)
Smack That Thing ... Walter Coleman (3:04)
Carry Your Good Stuff Home ... Walter Coleman, Jesse James (2:46)
Mama Let Me Lay It on You ... Walter Coleman, Jesse James (3:01)
Sweet Patuni ... Jesse James (3:02)
Southern Casey Jones ... Jesse James (3:01)
Lonesome Day Blues ... Jesse James (3:07)
Highway 61 ... Jesse James (3:10

War Dream Blues
Hardluck Blues... so none of these explain...

poverty, racial climate, black man in America problems, and love?
Yeah right.
One of the reasons they made music was to express themselves...
there was no other voice to do that.
Black people didn't even have a voice to rep them until the 60's...
outside of cats like Marcus Garvey and WEB Dubois...

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:49 AM

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67. "Memphis Jug Band - Cocaine Blues"
In response to Reply # 64
Thu Mar-01-07 11:51 AM by AquamansWrath

  

          

1. Low Down Blues - Whistler's Jug Band
2. Giving It Away - Birmingham Jug Band
3. Cocaine Habit Blues - Memphis Jug Band
4. Try And Treat Her Right - Ben Ferguson
5. Glad And Sorry Blues - John Harris
6. What's That Taste Like Gravy - King David's Jug Band
7. Newport Blues - Cincinnati Jug Band
8. Big Railroad Blues - Cannon's Jug Stompers
9. Fourth Street Mess Around - Memphis Jug Band
10. Banjoreno - The Dixieland Jug Blowers
11. Tear It Down - King David's Jug Band
12. Ticket Agent Blues - Noah Lewis's Jug Band
13. You Ought To Move Out Of Town - Jed Davenport & His Beale Street Jug Band
14. Cold Iron Bed - Jack Kelly & His South Memphis Jug Band
15. Bill Wilson - Birmingham Jug Band
16. Cash Money Blues - Kaiser Clifton
17. Minglewood Blues - Cannon's Jug Stompers
18. That's My Rabbit, My Dog Caught It - The Walter Family
19. Spider's Nest Blues - Memphis Jug Band
20. She's In The Graveyard Now - Earl McMonald's Original Louisville Jug Band
21. Please Don't Holler, Mama - Ben Ferguson
22. Vamps Of "28" - Whistler's Jug Band
23. Ruckus Juice And Chittlin' - Memphis Jug Band

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lonesome_d
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Thu Mar-01-07 04:13 PM

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159. "Yup, I have the CD... actually, I have a link of it up right now"
In response to Reply # 67


          

if you want to hear it:

vol. 1 - http://www.sendspace.com/file/mcpkft

vol. 2 - http://www.sendspace.com/file/mix004

but I'm not sure what you're trying to achieve by posting up a bunch of song titles, as though that's indicative of what you were talking about before.

  

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AquamansWrath
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Fri Mar-02-07 09:52 AM

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189. "right cause Cocaine must mean Church where your from..."
In response to Reply # 159


  

          

haha...
and it doesn't matter... if it's from the hands of black folks...
then it's from our similar experiences... regardless of how white people try to divide it up.

Bottom line..
when did you hear a jugband talking about killing each other?
Promoting pimping each other?
Exactl. Conscious music.
Uplifting music.

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lonesome_d
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197. "*smh*"
In response to Reply # 189


          

download that jug band compilation I posted the links to. Or go to the other post I linked up.

Or don't, and keep trying to make points about music you've never listened to.

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-08-07 10:53 AM

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349. "I don't have to listen... I know the people... see this is a class for m..."
In response to Reply # 197
Thu Mar-08-07 10:53 AM by AquamansWrath

  

          

this is your window of opporunity into our shit..
not the other way around.
White people are not complex. Bottom line poor people anywhere, any color have the same issues. Perhaps you should LIVE with the people you study... when I want to know how to play a jug, I'll holla.

Cause no matter how hard you try, you'll never have the power to seperate the struggle from the people..
whether a jug band, 2live crew, PE, or Living Colour... this is white america. PERIOD.

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lonesome_d
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360. "Okay."
In response to Reply # 349
Thu Mar-08-07 12:03 PM by lonesome_d

          

>this is your window of opporunity into our shit..
>not the other way around.

By 'this' I'm assuming you mean 'blues' as opposed to 'this thread on OKP.'

I may be wrong about that.

But yes, blues and old/traditional music in general is a window to history, both good and bad, and that is part of the appeal.

>White people are not complex.

Depends on the white person.

>Bottom line poor people
>anywhere, any color have the same issues.

Sure.

>Perhaps you should
>LIVE with the people you study...

Well, considering that the type of blues I enjoy the most is not really practiced anywhere as a living musical culture, that would be difficult in this case.

On a musically unrelated note, I did spend 4 years in Japan while I was learning taiko. Just mentioning that as a way of saying the concept is far from alien to me.

>when I want to know how to
>play a jug, I'll holla.

I'll be glad to help.

>Cause no matter how hard you try, you'll never have the power
>to seperate the struggle from the people..

Once again, I've no intention of trying such a thing.

>whether a jug band, 2live crew, PE, or Living Colour... this
>is white america. PERIOD.

Which is why I said below that IF your thinking on hip hop is consistent on your thinking with blues, then you would argue that all hip hop is also pro-Black conscious music.

Apparently you missed the conditional since you responded below that you hadn't said that.

But now you pretty much have.


Overall, even though I disagree with it I can work with you feeling like you're better versed to judge music because you're a musician (though we have nothing to go on for that except your word; I'm a trusting sort.) I can work with you discounting my opinion off the bat because I'm white.

But I can't work with you feeling as though you're entitled to comment on music you have never listened to. Considering various statements you've made ('blues was our only voice;' questioning why the CIA wasn't mentioned in 'Cocaine Habit Blues,' questioning the actual existence of non-blues/jazz forms of Black expression in the 1920s and 1930s) etc., it's pretty clear that you're not familiar with music of this era (outside of Robert Johnson), and that you don't feel that you need to be in order to voice any opinions on it.

And aside from how it afects the discussion, I think it's a shame because the music is great.

So I've said about all I can say. Thanks for the convo.

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-08-07 03:46 PM

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364. "RE: Okay."
In response to Reply # 360


  

          

(Overall, even though I disagree with it I can work with you feeling like you're better versed to judge music because you're a musician (though we have nothing to go on for that except your word; I'm a trusting sort.) I can work with you discounting my opinion off the bat because I'm white. )

I didn't say I'm better versed... I never said that... what I said was to be clear... is that my insight counts...
and if your talking about driving a bus...
who do you speak to... a cab driver or a bus driver?
it's pretty simple homie.

(But I can't work with you feeling as though you're entitled to comment on music you have never listened to.)

Huge ASSumption don't you think?

( Considering various statements you've made ('blues was our only voice;' questioning why the CIA wasn't mentioned in 'Cocaine Habit Blues,' questioning the actual existence of non-blues/jazz forms of Black expression in the 1920s and 1930s) etc., it's pretty clear that you're not familiar with music of this era (outside of Robert Johnson))))

Actually that's not what I said... I listed various forms of black music... from jazz to blues...
you harped on one sentence cause that's all you had. And then you brought up Jug music... which depending on how you classify it...
haha... either way... My statement still stands.
Cause again, whether jug music or jazz... it was a reflection of the people who made it was it not? Are you telling me there was no racism or poverty in the south?

(, and that you don't feel that you need to be in order to voice any opinions on it.)

ASSumptions again?

(And aside from how it afects the discussion, I think it's a shame because the music is great.)

That's great. We are all glad to hear it.

(So I've said about all I can say. Thanks for the convo.)

Which honestly wasn't much.
Thanks.
LOL.

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lonesome_d
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Thu Mar-08-07 10:15 PM

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368. "RE: Okay."
In response to Reply # 364


          


>I didn't say I'm better versed... I never said that... what I
>said was to be clear... is that my insight counts...
>and if your talking about driving a bus...
>who do you speak to... a cab driver or a bus driver?
>it's pretty simple homie.

Yes, but you don't have to be a race car driver to enjoy a NASCAR race.

Your analogy would at least make sense if you only brought up the fact that you play (again, without providing any evidence of this) when discussing technique, ability, performance, etc. But you frequently use it to justify your own opinions on music appreciation, which is a different beast altogether, and as proof of the extent of your knowledge, which it has squat to do with.

>(But I can't work with you feeling as though you're entitled
>to comment on music you have never listened to.)
>
>Huge ASSumption don't you think?

#61: me: "Jim Booker, fiddler for Taylor's Kentucky Boys"

#63, you: "Jim Booke's version of People Get Ready isn't conscious music?"

You didn't even get the right era, let alone the right guy.

>Actually that's not what I said... I listed various forms of
>black music... from jazz to blues...

#39: "Keep in mind... blues was the only voice we had at the time..."

When I mentioned other genres besides the obligatory jazz and gospel, you replied in #53: "You must be kidding."

>you harped on one sentence cause that's all you had.

As I said earlier, the concept of that one sentence was what caught my eye, and the only thing I found partiuclarly interesting in the initial post. If you didn't want to discuss that part of your thesis, you should have said so. Or not replied to me at all.

>And then
>you brought up Jug music... which depending on how you
>classify it...

Jug bands belnded all kinds of styles together. Sometimes they're classified as blues, sometimes as jazz, sometimes they played country.

>haha... either way... My statement still stands.
>Cause again, whether jug music or jazz... it was a reflection
>of the people who made it was it not? Are you telling me
>there was no racism or poverty in the south?

Why would I tell you that?

Of course it was a reflection of the people who made it... who frequently, like any other Americans at any time, ESPECIALLY poor ones, indulged in violence, drug and alcohol abuse, and infidelity, and this showed up in SOME OF the music. To me, those elements are neither "pro-Black" nor "conscious," so I wouldn't consider the songs they appear in to be so either.

>(, and that you don't feel that you need to be in order to
>voice any opinions on it.)
>
>ASSumptions again?

#349: "I don't have to listen..."



  

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IIIIIIIIIIIII
Member since Jan 10th 2007
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:58 AM

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69. "You're an idiot!"
In response to Reply # 63


          

He/she never said those bands weren't "conscious". YOU were the moron that said blues was black people's only voice and he/she proved you wrong by simply pointing out other black musical styles of the time. Whether they were "conscious" or not is irrelevant!

  

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Earl Flynn
Member since Dec 08th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 12:31 PM

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73. "Here they come...... LMAO!"
In response to Reply # 69


  

          

-

Each progressive spirit is opposed by a thousand mediocre minds appointed to guard the past. ~
Maurice Maeterlinck

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:23 PM

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83. "Hmm.. actually he/she didn't... Hence.. Cocaine Blues"
In response to Reply # 69


  

          

amoungst other stuff...
either way.
I win.
lol.

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kayru99
Member since Jan 26th 2004
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:09 AM

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41. "so we goin offa one person's definition of pro-black?"
In response to Reply # 37


  

          

autonomy is about as pro-LIFE as one can get. If black folk write and perform songs about their lives in an era that pretty much makes it illegal or improbable to learn how to read or write, let alone learn how to play an instrument, how much of a stronger argument for "pro-black conciousness" does one need?

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:12 AM

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42. "Exactly."
In response to Reply # 41


  

          

Here is a read I recommend for everyone.
Especially confused niggaz.

The CIA's Cover War Against Rock

Table Of Contents

Acknowledgements xi
Foreword xii
Prelude Assassination Politics of the Vietnam War Period: Fascism, American-Style and the Rise of Richard Nixon 1 (8)
A (Killing) Field Day for the Heat
9 (10)
Time Machine: The Birth of Top 40 Radio and Alan Freed's Near-Death Experience (Early Cia and Mob Influences on the Rock Music Industry)
19 (5)
Parapolitical Stars in the Dope Show
24 (11)
The Death of Cass Elliot and other ``Restless Youth''
35 (7)
A Murder in the House of Pooh
42 (11)
Brian Jones

Portraits in Carnage: The End of the Rock Festivals
53 (7)
I Don't Live Today: The Jimi Hendrix Political Harassment, Kidnap and Murder Experience
60 (16)
When You're a Stranger: Fragrance de Chaos---Investigative Findings on the Death of Jim Morrison
76 (11)
Like Coffins in a Cage: The Baez Contras and the Death of Phil Ochs
87 (13)
Who Killed the Kennedys? (And Sal Mineo?)
100 (17)
``Project Walrus'' and Holden Caulfield's Warm Gun
117 (14)
What'Cha Gonna Do? ... The Deaths of Bob Marley and Peter Tosh
131 (18)
Gang War: Sons of Chaos vs. Thugs a Tupac Shakur and Notorious B.I.G. Assassination Digest
149 (16)
Dancing on the Jetty: The Death of Michael Hutchence, et al
165


Synopsis
Since the sixties, musicians have been outspoken and powerful proponents for social change, making them a threat to those eager to maintain the status quo. Typically fond of drugs, they also make easy targets for investigation and exploitation. In this comprehensive look at more than a dozen suspect rock star deaths, conspiracy researcher Alex Constantine delves into the secrets that the record industry, organized crime, and even the FBI and CIA don't want uncovered.
Unearthing recent -- and successful -- assassination plots against Tupac Shakur and The Notorious B.I.G. as well as new information on the tragic deaths of Jimi Hendrix, Jim Morrison, and John Lennon, this long-overdue report offers disturbing evidence that there may be more behind these deaths than accident, psychosis, and indulgence.

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lonesome_d
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:22 AM

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50. "Which is why I was addressing him, not you."
In response to Reply # 41


          

  

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AquamansWrath
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:25 AM

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55. "and I have more than answered you... you just don't like it..."
In response to Reply # 50


  

          

and that's fine.
However it's either you..

or I run with
Bob Marley
Peter Tosh
Frank Zappa
Prince
Chuck D
teh Last Poets...
I think I'll run with them thanks.

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JAESCOTT777
Member since Feb 18th 2006
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Thu Mar-01-07 10:18 AM

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22. "GOOD POST"
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

give me some book titles on this.

  

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disco dj
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Thu Mar-01-07 09:58 AM

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19. "they didn't Invite Eazy-E to the white house. They invited Eric Wright."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

they looked at the stat sheet and saw that some Southern California cat named Eric Wright was worth a whole lotta fuckin' money. THAT'S how Eazy wound up there.

That shit happens everyday. and FURTHERMORE I would've gone too. Just to show those assholes that there's successful BLACK folks too. You KNOW a Republican function needed some color in there ( JC Watts doesn't count).

Him simply *going* to the White House didn't make him a sellout, but all that shit he was pumping to Black youth to build his fortune? THAT's what people should've been criticizing.

Stop with the Knee-jerk shit and do some analytical thinking, people..

______________



http://www.windimoto.com


http://ten2one.wordpress.com/ <-FEB

http://wallpapershi.net/wallpapers/2012/01/boba-fett-star-wars-star-wars-boba-fett-movie-anime-1080x1920.jpg

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 10:04 AM

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20. "so it's cool to shake the hands with the man pumping crack into"
In response to Reply # 19
Thu Mar-01-07 10:06 AM by AquamansWrath

  

          

black neighborhoods?
Put down your records and pick up a cause.
A mixtape aint never save anybody.


oh and as far as they didn't invite Eazy...
what regular nigga do you know getting invites to the white house?
you ever gete one for your groundbreaking dj skills?
exactly.
Stop confusing niggaz.

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Who's fucking wit B More right now?

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 10:31 AM

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26. "CIA and Crack..."
In response to Reply # 20


  

          

The CIA's Role in the Crack Epidemic
CIA and Cocaine: Truth and Disinformation Part 4
Revolutionary Worker #886, December 15, 1996
Journalist Gary Webb performed a useful service: Last summer, in a series of articles in the San Jose Mercury News, he documented that a ring of CIA-linked contra mercenaries had created a pipeline of cheap Colombian cocaine. They introduced tons of cocaine into the Black communities of South Central L.A. and Compton during the early 1980s, just as the "crack epidemic" was taking off. Webb documented that the two right-wing Nicaraguans running this cocaine ring, Oscar Danilo Blandón and Norwin Meneses, were recruited by the leading CIA agent within the contra movement. Webb also documented how their operation was protected from police investigation for years. (See RW #873.)

Many people have heard (and believed) that the U.S. government was behind the so-called "crack epidemic." But at the same time, the story of CIA drug trafficking has been suppressed, denied and ridiculed in the media and courts. Instead, the rulers of this country have pointed their finger at the ghettos and barrios. They accuse the people of causing the drug traffic. They have packed their prisons with thousands of youth--who were just trying to make a living in devastated communities.

And then, last summer, it was suddenly documented in the pages of a mainstream daily newspaper that the CIA-organized mercenaries had financed themselves by selling cocaine in Black communities. At last, there was hard evidence that the U.S. government itself was deeply involved in creating the "crack explosion"!

Gary Webb has come under sharp attack. This has been the merciless, unjust, but predictable counterattack of a system that is determined to defend the CIA and the government from this devastating scandal. Virtually every part of Webb's series is being picked apart and challenged by the system's major newspapers: New York Times, Los Angeles Times and Washington Post. His personal journalistic integrity has been questioned.

Most mainstream reports now insist that Webb's reporting has been "discredited" and "refuted." And it is said that there is still no credible evidence that the CIA was involved in cocaine trafficking or that their contras were funded by drug sales. And, the mainstream media claims, the Meneses-Blandón ring was just small fry. Blandón, they now claim, never gave more than $60,000 to the contras, and his South Central and Compton sales supposedly didn't play much role in the crack epidemic anyway.

Earlier in this RW series, we have documented that the CIA and its agents were deeply involved in cocaine trafficking--especially during 1981-1988, the years of their dirty contra war against Nicaragua. We documented that the CIA and other U.S. government agencies organized networks of airplanes to smuggle guns to the contras in Honduras and Costa Rica, and that these planes often flew back to U.S. airports and air bases loaded with drugs. We have documented that the CIA gave protection to major Latin American and U.S. drug traffickers--arranging to have charges against them dropped and to have their operations protected from investigations by the U.S. Customs and Drug Enforcement Agency (DEA). And we have documented that this trafficking was known and protected from high places within the CIA and the U.S. government, including Reagan's White House.

In this final installment of our series, we will assess what the CIA's role was in helping to create the so-called "crack epidemic," and we will show that large sums of money were created through the drug trade for financing the contra war.

It's No Coincidence--
It's an M.O. for Covert War
You don't really need secret documents or the testimony of drug smugglers to find evidence of CIA drug trafficking. You just have to compare the history of CIA covert actions and the history of drugs in the U.S. For 40 years, major waves of drug trafficking have coincided with secret CIA wars waged in the Third World.

During the 1960s there was the so-called "heroin epidemic." Cheap heroin flooded oppressed communities. Later it was documented that the CIA brought this heroin into the U.S. from the opium-growing regions of Southeast Asia's Gold Triangle.

The CIA was waging a secret mercenary war in northern Laos and Thailand--and was financing that war using heroin trafficking. CIA agents flew planeloads of opium out of the Gold Triangle on its cargo airline Air America. Once the opium was processed into heroin, it was sold to many different distribution networks, some operating within the U.S. military. One recently documented operation involved sewing large packages of heroin inside the bodies of U.S. soldiers killed in the Vietnam War, and then removing the drugs when the bodies arrived at air force bases within the U.S.

Twenty years later, during the 1980s, there was a new drug "epidemic" in the U.S.--this time involving cocaine. Cocaine had been available before the 1980s, but only at sky-high prices of $5,200 an ounce. It had been a prestige item among the wealthy. The L.A. Times estimates that in 1980 there were 400,000 cocaine users in the U.S., and only 10 percent of them were smoking cocaine.

Suddenly, after 1981, the price of cocaine started to drop. Within a couple of years it had been cut in half. A kilo of cocaine that cost $60,000 in 1981, soon cost $30,000, or even $20,000. The drop in price was caused by a rise in supply. One estimate is that supplies of cocaine within the U.S. rose to over 200 tons a year.

By 1983 cocaine was plentiful enough and cheap enough within the U.S. to become a common "street drug." The sale of cocaine shifted from upper-class enclaves to the ghetto. A new cheap, crystallized, and highly addictive form of cocaine appeared--crack.

This new trade in cocaine drew people in at the street level in the poor neighborhoods, because it provided income to pay rent, buy food, clothes and cars for people who had no other economic options. At the same time, it brought much bitterness to the people: young people often ended up dead or disabled. Capitalist competition over markets intensified deadly conflicts among the people.

The number of estimated cocaine users rose to over six million--with over two million using it at least every couple of days. Many thousands of new addicts lived and died in abandoned buildings, driven to desperate acts to feed their pipes. The L.A. Times reports that the number of crack-related medical emergencies in L.A. jumped from 40 in 1983 to 2,453 in 1989.

What fueled this "rise of crack" during the 1980s?

During those same years (surprise, surprise!), the CIA was waging a new secret war--this time in Central America. The staging areas of that war, in Honduras and Costa Rica, were halfway between the U.S. border and the major cocaine processing points in Colombia. The CIA was hiring mercenary pilots and airlines, flying secret flights to deserted airstrips, and trying to create a "self-financed" military operation--so that the war atrocities of the contras would be harder to blame on the U.S. government.

Once that contra war started to cool down after 1986, the use of cocaine started to decline in the U.S. But this did not mean that the U.S. government's attacks on the people also declined. In 1988, after years of promoting and protecting cocaine trafficking, the U.S. government announced a "war on drugs" that would take on the "demand side"--which meant targeting and punishing "street level" dealers and users. Since then, federal and local governments have used the drug economy as a justification to occupy whole neighborhoods with their police--harassing, accusing, brutalizing and imprisoning more and more people each year.

Protecting Drug Transport Was Key
"The Washington Post concluded that the CIA did not launch or play a major role in promoting the crack plague that swept America's largely black inner cities in the 1980s--but that the agency's support of the Contra rebels may have contributed to the drug influx. Available data from arrest records, hospitals, drug treatment centers and drug user surveys point to the rise of crack as a broad-based phenomenon driven in numerous places by players of different nationalities, races and ethnic groups."

From the Washington Post's
Internet website

"The force of the Mercury News account appears to have relatively little to do with the quality of the evidence that it marshals to its case...court documents, past investigations and interviews with more than current and former rebels, C.I.A. officials and narcotics agents, as well as other law-enforcement officials and experts on the drug trade, all indicate that there is scant proof to support the paper's contention that Nicaraguan rebel officials linked to the C.I.A. played a central role in spreading crack through Los Angeles and other cities."

The New York Times

These arguments dodge the key issue here: No one is claiming that CIA agents and contra officials personally went out on every street corner and peddled vials of crack. The CIA's role was not concentrated at the distribution end of the cocaine trade. The CIA agents opened key new channels for smuggling large volumes of cocaine. They granted protection for fleets of airplanes loaded with cocaine, including large cargo planes, to fly across the U.S. border and land at U.S. airports.

In some cases, the street-level cocaine distribution organizations were tied to the CIA's contra armies directly--certainly that seems to have been the case with the L.A.-based Blandón ring that Gary Webb exposed. In many cases, the mid-level networks distributing cocaine out of Miami to other cities were built by organizations of right-wing Cuban exiles--who had their own extensive ties to the CIA. But, overall, the flood of cheap cocaine hit the streets through many different street organizations--including the Crips and Bloods in Los Angeles.

In other words, the fact that many organizations were involved in the distribution of cocaine in the 1980s is hardly proof that the CIA didn't play a key role in sparking the crack epidemic.

In the 1970s, the transportation of cocaine from Latin America into the U.S. was a major bottleneck of the cocaine trade. According to available analyses, the "cartels" that emerged in Colombia developed their control over 70 percent of the cocaine trade by pioneering new ways of smuggling cocaine--but still had trouble moving the drugs in large volume. Before the 1980s cocaine had been brought in by a "mule system" (where individual couriers strapped packets of cocaine on their body) or by light planes air-dropping duffel bags of drugs.

Then, in the 1980s, the methods of cocaine smuggling took a major leap: Cocaine started arriving in the U.S. in planeloads and cargo containers--shipments as large as half a ton, a ton, or even larger. The cocaine trade started using larger aircraft--and for that they needed airstrips where the planes could land and unload without U.S. Customs interference.

As we documented in Part 1 of this series--this is exactly what the CIA offered major drug smugglers, in exchange for their help in laundering money and transporting weapons for the contras. There were undoubtedly smuggling operations that operated outside CIA channels--no one argues that all the cocaine entering the U.S. during the 1980s was under CIA protection. However, the available evidence indicates that large shipments and the networks of several big-time drug smugglers were under the protection of the U.S. government.

The CIA Alliance with the Largest Cocaine Traffickers
How much cocaine did the CIA sell directly? How much of the larger cocaine flow did they protect? It is hard to find any reliable figures to quantify this. Most of what is known comes from the testimony of drug traffickers in U.S. courts and congressional hearings. CIA officials insist that their accounts are lies.

Here is the overall picture of the CIA's involvement in the cocaine traffic--based on evidence gathered in the first three parts of this series:

At the start of the 1980s, there were two key centers for cocaine trafficking to the U.S. One was the alliance between the so-called Colombian "cartels" and Panama's military dictator Manuel Noriega. The other was the alliance between the Honduran military and the Honduran druglord Juan Matta Ballesteros.

Both of those operations developed extremely close ties to the CIA-contra supply operations. General Noriega was a life-long CIA agent. And the Honduran generals were U.S.-trained lackeys whose semi-colonial army had always crudely served the interests of U.S. companies like United Fruit. The CIA relied on these Honduran generals for setting up the main contra bases along the Honduras-Nicaragua border.

Inside U.S. borders, much of the early distribution of the cocaine was carried out by right-wing Cuban exiles based in Miami--many of whom had worked for the CIA in the Agency's many secret raids and invasion plots against Cuba.

CIA Alliances with the
Major Cocaine Operations
As the CIA war on Nicaragua grew, ever larger amounts of drugs and money were funneled through the Panamanian and Honduran operations.

In 1988, Ramón Milian Rodríguez, a leading money launderer for the Colombian cocaine operations, testified before the U.S. Senate Foreign Relations subcommittee that he had moved about $11 billion in drug profits from the United States, through Miami to Panama--on behalf of the Medellín cartel. Most of these funds were not directly controlled by the CIA. Instead the CIA levied a kind of tax on these large drug operations. The cartel could protect their shipments from seizure and their apparatus from arrest by funneling money to the contras.

In April 1987 the Boston Globe reported that between 50 and 100 flights "arranged by the CIA took off from or landed at U.S. airports during the past two years without undergoing inspection" by the U.S. Customs.

"Narcotics proceeds were used to shore up contra efforts," Milian Rodríguez testified. "I have laundered money for that network. I made it possible to transfer funds." Asked by Senator Kerry how the money was moved to the contras, Milian Rodríguez said: "I had a liaison with the U.S. intelligence--let's not call him `U.S. intelligence.' Let's call him `whoever was running the resupply.' " That man was CIA agent Félix Rodríguez. Milian Rodríguez testified, "Félix would call me with instructions on where to send the money." Milian said he personally laundered $10 million from the Medellín cartel to the contras--using about a dozen Miami companies. For one of the companies, Ocean Hunter, he moved about $200,000 a month in cash by courier.

Carlos Lehder, one of the "pioneers" of the Colombian Medellín cocaine cartels, gave the same figure during testimony in a U.S. courtroom--saying that the Colombian cartel had donated about $10 million to the contras between 1982 and 1985. In exchange for these payoffs, the cartel got valuable contra air bases, fuel, transit points for their smuggling operations, information on radar surveillance, and "a little friendship" from the CIA.

Carlos Lehder described how he had developed the island of Norman's Key in the Bahamas as a base for large-scale smuggling between 1979 and 1982--before the contra war got started. Once he was in contact with the CIA, the U.S. government rented his island facilities for their smuggling operations and, in exchange, gave protection to the larger drug-smuggling operations he was running.

Meanwhile, General Noriega was making his direct financial contributions to the contras. Noriega also provided pilots and aircraft for CIA-contra drug-smuggling operations and set up his own ring, through pilot Floyd Carlton. The Noriega operation reportedly flew at least four tons of cocaine through CIA bases in Costa Rica in nine months. A Costa Rican legislative commission concluded in 1989 that Noriega helped install in that country at least seven pilots who ran drugs to North America as part of contra supply operations.

At the same time, the billion-dollar organization of Juan Matta Ballesteros in Honduras was hired--first by the CIA and then in 1984 by the State Department--to be the main supply airline of the contras. In 1985, Newsweek estimated that his organization supplied "perhaps one-third of all the cocaine consumed in the United States."

It is not clear exactly how much of Matta's organization was protected by the CIA--but Matta's alliance with the U.S. government appears to have played a major role in his emergence as one of the largest cocaine traffickers in the world. In 1983, just as Matta's contra supply operation was taking off, the DEA's office in Honduras was shut down. Matta remained protected from U.S. prosecution until 1988, right after the contra war finally stopped.

To discredit Gary Webb's articles, the mainstream press has been arguing that most cocaine entering the U.S. after the mid-1980s came through Mexico. What they neglect to explain is that the growing Mexican cocaine operations of the so-called "Guadalajara cartel" were themselves an outgrowth of Matta's organization and relied heavily on protection from both the Mexican federal police (the Dirección Federal de Seguridad--DFS) and the U.S.'s CIA.

Smaller Operations
In addition to these major CIA-drug alliances, the contra supply operations also provided an umbrella for many smaller smuggling rings. These operations became especially important during 1984-1986, when the CIA-contra operations was cut off from direct U.S. funding and was ordered to become "self-financing."

During that period, the CIA arranged for Miami-based smuggler George Morales to supply and finance the Costa Rican-based contra group headed by Eden Pastora--by flying guns and drugs from the CIA airstrip on land owned by John Hull in Costa Rica. Morales testified that he passed $5 million to the contras in 1984 and 1985. In exchange, legal charges he was facing in the U.S. were dropped and his operations were protected. Colombian pilot Ernesto Carrasco testified that he personally saw Morales pay more than $1 million to contra leader Adolfo "Popo" Chamorro in a Florida restaurant in 1985.

It was also reported that right-wing Cuban smuggler Frank Castro was giving the Pastora contra operation $200,000 a month.

Colombian smuggler Carlos Lehder estimated, in an ABC News interview, that Hull's operations were "pumping about 30 tons of cocaine into the United States" every year--that would mean an average of one or two half-ton shipments each week. Costa Rican authorities claimed that they had evidence of at least two tons of cocaine passing through the Hull ranch. One pilot, Fabiano Carrasco, testified in 1990 that he alone flew in at least a ton of cocaine for Morales between 1983 and 1986--with CIA protection.

One notation written by Reagan aide Lt. Col. Oliver North, gives a revealing picture of the role of drug profits. In Honduras, an operation run by Ronald Martin and James McCoy had accumulated between $15 million and $20 million in weapons for the Honduran-based contras headed by CIA agent Adolfo Calero. In North's diary, he wrote that $14 million of the money used to finance Martin and McCoy "came from drugs."

The Changing Story
of Danilo Blandón
Gary Webb's series documented how one contra drug dealer, Danilo Blandón, sold cocaine in Los Angeles to raise money for the FDN contra organization headed by Adolfo Calero. In 1994, Blandón testified before a federal grand jury that he sold between 200 and 300 kilos of cocaine for contra fundraiser Norwin Meneses. And in later court testimony, he said that all profits from those sales went to the FDN. He testified he was selling the cocaine for $60,000 per kilo--which means that the gross receipts for these operations were between $12 and $18 million.

Recently, Senator Arlen Spector, chairman of a Senate subcommittee, said that Blandón told the committee that he only passed between $60,000 to $65,000 to the contras. Blandón also denied having any contact with the CIA, and said the contras did not know about drug deals he was making. Blandón now claims that he was only working with Meneses for a few months, and that by 1982 or 1983, when his cocaine operation started to grow, he was totally independent of any contra ties.

In short, Blandón (who is now on the DEA's payroll!) has conveniently changed his story. Meanwhile, Meneses has told the L.A. Times that his contra contributions were often little more than $20 or $30 at a time. And the mainstream media has seized on this to claim that the Blandón-Meneses operations were not really selling drugs to fund the contras.

However, contra leader Eden Pastora contradicted Blandón's new story. Pastora recently testified before the same Senate subcommittee that Blandón gave Pastora's contras money after 1984. Pastora said he even lived in a house that Blandón owned in Costa Rica.

Let's Get Real
The U.S. government has responded to the reports of CIA drug smuggling with outraged protests. They say it is inconceivable for the U.S. government to allow, or profit from, drug sales. Who are they kidding!? This country was founded on profits from trade in drugs and stimulants--and the trade in slaves who were forced to grow those drugs and stimulants. The origins of New England's merchant capitalism are deep in the "triangle trade" where tobacco, coffee and rum from American colonies were delivered to Europe. The ships then went south to kidnap African people for the return trip. In England, the arrival of cheap, distilled alcohol had terrible effects on the masses of people. The profits from those deals financed the early wars that took land from the Indians of New England--killing many and selling the rest into slavery.

The Founding Fathers? Many of them were the early merchant capitalists and plantation owners who grew fat from this "triangle trade."

Two hundred years later, in 1996, oppressed people do not possess the planes, banks, airports and high-level contacts needed to conduct today's international drug trade. These operations have always been carried out in close alliance with governments--not just the corrupt pro-U.S. governments of countries like Bolivia and Peru, but the most powerful government of all--headquartered in Washington, D.C.

How much cocaine entered the U.S. under CIA protection? This much is known: Large amounts of cocaine--many, many tons--were passing through CIA-protected channels during the early 1980s. Tons of cocaine were being loaded and unloaded on CIA airstrips, by pilots working with CIA operations, sometimes onto the CIA's Southern Air Transport cargo shops, often under the direct supervision of CIA agents. Tons were sold in Los Angeles by the Blandón-Meneses cocaine ring, operating closely with the CIA agents Bermúdez and Calero. And this ring deliberately and specifically targeted the Black communities of Compton and South Central L.A. for their operations.

And beyond those direct CIA operations, the major Colombian cartels were themselves receiving various kinds of aid and protection during this period from CIA agents--starting with General Manuel Noriega in Panama, John Hull in Costa Rica, Félix Rodríguez in El Salvador, and ending with special CIA protection to drug shipments landing in U.S. airports and U.S. military bases. This protection of cocaine "pipelines" was carried out by the joint cooperation of the CIA, the Reagan White House, the Justice Department, the DEA, and U.S. Customs.

The CIA and the mainstream media are trying to shove these facts back under cover. They call people paranoid and gullible. They act like the only real shocker here is that people believe the stories of CIA drug-trafficking. But the secret is out, and these facts will not go away.

Did the CIA play a key role in triggering the so-called "crack epidemic" of the 1980s? After a close look at the available evidence, the answer is: YES!

Now we have some other questions: When do the people get justice!? When will they get the boot of police occupation off their necks? And what about all the brothers and sisters railroaded into prison during this "war on drugs"--When do they get their lives back? When do the cell doors open for the people? When do those doors slam shut to imprison our oppressors? When do the people of the world get freedom from the murdering hand of the CIA?

*****

"Everybody's talkin bout crime. Tell me, who are the criminals?"

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 10:34 AM

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27. "freeway rick"
In response to Reply # 26


  

          


Cocaine was first extracted from coca in the 19th cent. and was at first hailed as a miracle drug. By the 1880s in the United States it was freely prescribed by physicians for exhaustion, depression, and morphine addiction and was available in many patent medicines. After users and physicians began to realize its dangers and various regulations were enacted, its use decreased, and by the 1920s the epidemic had abated.

Another epidemic began in the United States in the 1970s and peaked in the mid-1980s; again the drug was at first considered harmless. With the latter epidemic and its accompanying crack epidemic (beginning in 1985 and peaking in 1988) violence in crack-infested neighborhoods increased dramatically. Young people with few other opportunities were lured by the power and money of being crack dealers; most carried guns and many were murdered in drug-gang wars that ensued. By the late 1990s the cocaine and crack epidemic had subsided as heroin regained popularity among illicit drug users.

Crack appeared in late 1984 and 1985 primarily in impoverished African-American and Latino inner-city neighborhoods in New York, Los Angeles, and Miami. Crack is smokeable cocaine. It gained its named from the "crackling" sound it makes when heated. It is easily produced in a pot on a kitchen stove by "cooking down" a mixture of powder cocaine, water, and baking soda. Crack is typically sold in tiny vials or envelopes that cost between $5 and $20. Crack was not a new drug; its active ingredient is entirely cocaine. Nor was it a new way of using cocaine; smoking cocaine freebase had been practiced since the 1970s.

Crack was a marketing innovation. It was a way of packaging a relatively expensive and upscale commodity (powder cocaine) in small, inexpensive units. So packaged, this form of smokeable cocaine (crack) was then sold, usually on the street by young African-Americans and Latinos, to a whole new class of customers: residents of impoverished inner-city neighborhoods. The marketing innovation was successful for at least two reasons. First, there was a huge workforce of unemployed young people ready to take jobs in the new, neighborhood-based business of crack preparation and sales. Working in the crack business offered these people better jobs, working conditions, and pay than any "straight" job they could get (and better than other entry-level criminal jobs like burglary or stealing car radios). Second, the marketing innovation succeeded because turning powder cocaine into smokeable "crack" changed the way cocaine was consumed and thereby dramatically strengthened the character of cocaine intoxication. Smoking crack offered a very brief but very intense intoxication. This inexpensive and dramatic "high" was much better suited to the finances and interest in immediate escape of the inner-city poor than the more subtle and expensive effects of powder cocaine.

Cocaine in any form is a stimulant, much like amphetamine or even caffeine. When powder cocaine is sniffed in small doses (as it usually is), it makes the user moderately alert and energized. Thus, the typical psychoactive effects of sniffing powder cocaine are subtle. Users report having to learn to recognize it. In the 1930s, songwriter Cole Porter wrote that he'd "get no kick" from cocaine about powder cocaine.

INFORMATION:

Cocaine is either snorted (sniffed), swallowed, injected, or smoked. Habitual snorting can result in serious damage to the nasal mucous membranes; shared needles put the user at increased risk of HIV infection. The street drug comes in the form of a white powder, cocaine hydrochloride. The hydrochloride salt and the cutting agents are removed to create the pure base product "freebase." Freebase is smoked and reaches the brain in seconds. "Crack" cocaine, also called "rock," is a form of freebase that comes in small lumps and makes a crackling sound when heated. It is relatively inexpensive, but must be repeated often.

Crack cocaine magnifies the effects of cocaine and is considered to be more highly and more quickly addictive than snorted cocaine. It causes a very abrupt increase in heart rate and blood pressure that can lead to heart attack and stroke even in young people with no history of vascular disease, sometimes the first time the drug is used. It also crosses the placental barrier; babies born to crack-addicted mothers go through withdrawal and are at a higher risk of stroke, cerebral palsy, and other birth defects.

STREET NAMES:

Big C, blow, "C", chick, coke, corine, dust, flake, girl, happy, dust, nieve, nose candy, nose stuff, snow, toot, uptown, white, white girl, roca, rock, crack, Roxane, and white pipe.


Now a little low end theory history on the invention of crack. Crack was started by a Los Angles legend named, "Freeway Rick" Ross. He was an illiterate ex-tennis champ, and got his first bag of yayo on Christmas Day in 1979. He started out selling white to wealthy Black clients. As he took on more users and expanded his coverage, he got his product cheaper. He started to make his competition work for him because he was offering them great prices on powder. They traded in what they were selling and then got up with Rick. He was even training L.A. Crips to do sales for him. Back then Freebase was the "upper class" way to use cocaine. It was only really done by the wealthy and upper class users. Ricks customers knew about freebase, but they were afraid of Richard Pryors lil experiment gone wrong. So Rick then learned how to make a simpler method of cooking cocaine, cutting it with baking soda and heating it to make "Ready Rock". With Ready Rock, the rocks were a lot more potent then powder and a lot more economically viable. By the end of 1982 Rick stopped selling powder, and just hustled rocks. Rock offered a much larger market, and was doubling the profits of powder cocaine. Which took on the masses. Anyone could afford a nick rock of crack compared to a gram of coke that would run upwards $50 to $100. And the addiction to crack made it the greatest product for a dealer to sling, cause one hit was all it took most of the time to have a customer on lock. After this, the shit hit the fan. Whole communities were devastated and destroyed. Families and friends turned into zombies. Fiends were robbing anyone and everything they could for pocket change to cop rocks with. It was a real fucked up period. This also left room for mad entrepenaur that could make $100,000 a week on the corner, compared to a 9 to 5 paying $150 a week. Kids saw dealers rolling around in expensive cars with expensive clothes with wads of cash. These dealers became there idols, and showed them that if u want some real money, sell crack. Cause the legit job cant touch the profits that hustlers were making. Fuck being a fireman or an astronaut when u could be a millionaire slanging rocks. This also brought on mad violence such as turf wars, police intervention, rivalries, and claimed thousands of lives. In the 90's these dealers transferred there illicit business into the rap game. Easy E was one of the first cats that turned his hustle biz into a record label. Cats saw that you could make more money slanging music, but still keep the mentality and ethics of the crack game. Tons of artists, from Biggie to Jay-Z to Snoop Dog to Masta P, all were hustlers at one time serving fiends on the corner. Some still are, such as Irv Gotti, most recently. A lot of rappers glorify crack and promote the selling of crack because of how lucrative it is. There is also the songs that discuss the down sides and the evils of the biz. But they are some what out numbered by the tracks that are in favor of the pure white and praise the virtues of selling rocks, such as status, assets, and just being a gangster. Crack has somewhat died down in the last couple of years, just due to fiends dying and people shifting more into heroin. But the impact crack made on society and even music, will be felt for decades. And with that, im going to show all the different angles of cocaine/crack within hip hop music.

1. Peruvian Cocaine - Immortal Technique
This tracks is a narrative about where the cocaine originates and the channels it comes from. Immortal Technique and pals each take turns with roles from the cat picking the leaf, to the political influences, to the cat slanging in the projects, and then even the law enforcement end of it. Its basically shows who is involved and how yayo travels.

2. Ghetto D - Masta P
This is how u make crack and hit the block. This song pretty much tells u how to cook up some crack and get your ass some work. Pretty much biting Eric B and Rakim's classic, Make Em Clap To This, Master P and pals spit the crack rock recipe. This song shows how to make the rocks and how to get your own crack business blooming.

3. Ten Crack Commandents - Biggie Smalls
Ah the classic crack track. This track deals with the crack dealers etiquette. A how to guide on successful crack dealings. Biggie lays down the rule book for slanging rocks on this joint. On a side note, its funny how Chuck D went after Primo for using his voice on this song without authorization for its negative content. What a dick.

4. Hardcore Hip Hop - Rawcoticks (Primo Remix)
This is a soldiers point of view on slanging rocks. A rugged primo track with the cats from Rawcotiks spitting about the everyday hustle. The cat on the second verse really gets into it and details his daily crack slanging biz.

5. Raw And Uncut - Beanie Sigel ft. Jay-Z
This song parallels crack and rap. Beanie goes over his street life, and how he got down on the block. The chorus pretty much sums it all up.

6. White Lines - Grandmaster Flash and the Furious Five
This is the old school anti drug track. They rock over Liquid Liquid's Cavern break beat and talks about cocaine and how you got to stay away. The good ol' hip hop PSA.

7. P Is Still Free - KRS One
Damn another Primo track. Primo is the don dadda of this crack rap shit. This song is about skeezy crack hoes. This is basically a follow up to the old BDP classic, The P is Free. This song talks about the sleezy crack chasing hoes, that will do whatever for some rocks.

8. Jane Stop This Crazy Thing - M.C. Shan
Ah this classic talks more about a skeezy crackhoe named Jane. Jane is a base head that is all fucked up and Shan breaks down how wack she got from the glass dick.



Wise Intelligence of Poor Righteous Teachers got some hot, brand new music!
By Toure Muhammad

When Poor Righteous Teachers hit the national scene in 1990 with the release of their first album, it was clear they would become Hip Hop legends.

Now, of course they can boast respectable record sales and a loyal following, and they didn’t have record-breaking CD sales, but that has NEVER been the criterion for REAL Hip Hop. If that were the case, then MC Hammer, with 10 million copies, Please Hammer, Don’t Hurt ‘Em sold, would be THE best rapper of all-time. And even Oaktown’s 357 know that’s not the case.

Yeah, what PRT represents is the BEST of the Hip Hop rap genre: lyrical excellence, powerful, thought provoking content, and some straight up head nodding beats. This trio put together a flavor that makes brothers like me proud of what hip hop means and can do when we have knowledge and love of self and knowledge of our enemy.

PRT’s music exposed the pain, poverty and destruction in the black community and always shed light on the hidden hands that fostered those conditions. They inspired me.

And now, the front man for PRT, Wise Intelligence is releasing a solo CD, Wise Intelligent is…The Talented Timothy Taylor. He recently gave an exclusive interview to Bean Soup Times. I told him the news of his new release was like water in the desert. Can you believe we haven’t heard from PRT since 1996 with the release of New World Order?

And After listening to A Genocide, it’s no doubt; the people are in for a cool and refreshing treat.

With this solo project, Wise is ready to stand once again, with the best Hip Hop has to offer. He knows how to put it together. "It’s about music, message, and flow all being up to a par," said Wise Intelligent. Wise brings it with "A Genocide" which has the melodic lyrical flow and head-nodding beat with some serious content, as he talks about the "birth" of the modern dope game in the black community.

In the rap, Wise talks about Freeway Rick and the whole CIA, Contra, Black community drug triangle that was exposed via the reporting of former San Jose Mercury News reporter Gary Webb.

Webb was crediting with breaking the story and doing lot’s and lot’s of legwork in Central America to corroborate the story initially told to him by Freeway Rick which was that he was provided drugs by the Contras with the CIA’s knowledge. Since then, Webb reported committed suicide by putting TWO holes in his own head with a shotgun. Makes you go hhhmmm.

Wise wants to make a point with A Genocide. "I want black youth to know, they’re not the cause of the problem. When it was over, Freeway Rick felt like a strawberry. He wasn’t the king pin, he was a runner," said Wise.

"Lotta innocent lives are lost, black communities paid the cost…
All the drugs and guns we bought we financed CIA dirty wars…
I’m just a young boy born down in a ghet-to…
Hanging out on corners cooling with my fel-la’s…"
--A Genocide

To get a sample of A Genocide go to http://www.myspace.com/wiseintelligent.

Many Hip Hop historians will talk about how conscious rap took a fall in the early 90s as record labels moved to promote gangsta rap. "I’m a ghetto political MC," said Wise who witnessed the attack on political hip hop artist like X-Clan, Public Enemy, Brand Nubian, KRS One and others in the early 90s.

Record labels began very deliberately taking money from the promotion of conscious rap to gangsta rap. "I witnessed it happening," said Wise. "They cut the money for promotion of PRT to spend more money promoting people like DJ Quick."

"Did you know that Easy E was the FIRST rapper to be invited to the White House?" Wise added.

Word? Imagine that.

One goal Wise has in mind with this latest project is that, "these rhymes were about change and getting a brother to see himself in that brother he’s pointing the gun at," he said. As always, Wise is about self-love, respect and unity.

Citing the huge void in lyrical content, outside of current rappers Talib Kweli, Mos Def, and Dead Pres, the "best thing about hip hop today is that poor kids from the hood are finally making some money," explained Wise.

Another must listen to cut on his myspace.com page is the classic Conscious Style featuring Boogie Down Productions’ KRS One. Both MCs remind you of what hardcore conscious rap should be.

Speaking on current events, Wise explained why black folks on roofs crying for help might be the best thing to happen in recent history. "When I saw it, I was like, hell yeah! That’s what needs to happen. Maybe we’ll begin to rely on self now! If nothing else, Hurricane Katrina will teach black folks to do for self."

This brother is deep. After you check out his new music on myspace.com, read his blog that gives and extensive list of books to read. It’s more than 100 books so before the interview concluded, I asked him which five would he recommend to Bean Soup Times readers.

"First, I’d recommend "A People’s History of The United States" by Howard Zinn

"Countering the Conspiracy to Destroy Black Boys," Volumes 1, 2 and 3 by Jawanza Kunjufu," said Wise. "OK, that’s three (laughs). And the last one, this may surprise people, but the last one would be "No More Prisons" by William Upski, because in that book he tells you how to organize."

"The last thing I want to say is get knowledge, get wisdom but in all of your getting, get the understanding." Yes sir, brother Wise. Yes, sir.

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Adwhizz
Member since Nov 12th 2003
39410 posts
Fri Mar-02-07 05:48 AM

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170. "Place holder"
In response to Reply # 26


  

          

I'll be back

R.I.P. Loud But Wrong Guy
Dec 29th 2009 - Dec 17th 2017

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
8480 posts
Mon Mar-05-07 09:07 AM

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253. "exactly, well said."
In response to Reply # 170


  

          

true.

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disco dj
Charter member
84260 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 11:46 AM

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65. "EAZY E SOLD CRACK TOO, YOU DUMBFUCK..."
In response to Reply # 20


  

          

what I'm saying is Political fundraisers ( in BOTH parties ) invite people based on INCOME. They were probably just as shocked as WE were when Eazy showed up. Like I said, The invite was extended to Eric Wright...Eazy E showed up.



Quit trying to incite riots with these half-baked theories and READ something for a change.


______________



http://www.windimoto.com


http://ten2one.wordpress.com/ <-FEB

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Earl Flynn
Member since Dec 08th 2005
28751 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 01:56 PM

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107. "But did Eazy actually fly the plane"
In response to Reply # 65
Thu Mar-01-07 02:00 PM by Earl Flynn

  

          

that brought Crack into the US? circa late 1970?

That is what Aqua is saying.



Any person with half a brain will tell you that Black people didn't invent crack....

Do you know about the history of "legal" pharmaceutical drug companies?


Did you know that Xtacsy goes as far back as World War I

Did you now that Xtacsy is a drug that was manufactured by MERCK, during this same period (WWI)

http://www.merck.com/





Each progressive spirit is opposed by a thousand mediocre minds appointed to guard the past. ~
Maurice Maeterlinck

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 02:02 PM

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117. "and I said the CIA brought it here... Not Easy E"
In response to Reply # 107


  

          

the CIA under Bush and the southeast asia programs
Heroin
Crack
and used cats like Freeway Rick in LA to distribute
and Easy E to provide the soundtrack.

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thebadnegro
Member since Nov 13th 2006
4028 posts
Fri Mar-02-07 09:07 PM

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247. "Knee jerk shit? analytical thinking?"
In response to Reply # 19


          

I guess you chose not to analyze the background info dude provided on Jerry Hellar.

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Mon Mar-05-07 01:05 PM

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299. " I have actually worked with Mr. Hellar..."
In response to Reply # 247


  

          

so...

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Ill Jux
Member since Jan 19th 2007
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Thu Mar-01-07 10:35 AM

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29. "i started reading, but i'll be back to finish, so far great stuff"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

i will be printing this, i'll respond later on cuz i'm pretty sure this will be up for a while

______

in the memory of NYC upt JUX�

<--- don't front, you'd smash

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 10:48 AM

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32. "MC 5 and the White Panther Party"
In response to Reply # 29


  

          

"MC5 and the White Panther Party"




See most of you only know of Detroits rock legendary band as drugged out hippies during the movement. However most of you wouldn't know what being sincere about a movement is anyway...
MC5 is that group. Originally taking on the role of creating America's first White Panther Party during the height of the Black Panther Party movement. Putting thier neck on the line and risking it all despite a successful career was their agenda. I invite you to heavily familiarize yourself with their work.

From their album liner notes:
Original uncensored text from inside gate-fold of first album:
The MC-5 is a whole thing. There is no way to get at the music without taking in the whole context of the music too- there is no separation. We say the MC-5 is the solution to the problem of separation, because they are so together. The MC-5 is totally committed to the revolution, as the revolution is totally committed to driving people out of their separate shells and into each other's arms.

I'm talking about unity, brothers and sisters, because we have to get it together. We are the solution to the problem, if we will just be that. If we can feel it, LeRoi Jones said, "feeling predicts intelligence." The MC-5 will make you feel it, or leave the room. The MC-5 will drive you crazy out of your head into your body. The MC-5 is rock and roll. Rock and roll is the music of our bodies, of our whole lives- the resensifier (sic), Rob Tyner calls it. We have to come together, people, "build to a gathering," or else. Or else you are dead, and gone.

The MC-5 bring you back to your senses from wherever you have been taken to hide. They are bad. Their whole lives are totally given to this music. They are a whole thing. they are a working model of the new paleo-cybernetic culture in action. There is no separation. They live together to work together, they eat together, fuck together, get high together, walk down the street and through the world together. There is no separation. Just as the music will bring you together like that, if you hear it. If you will live it. And we will make sure you hear it, because we know you need it as bad as we do. We have to have it.

The music is the source and the effect of our spirit flesh. The MC-5 is the source and effect of the music, just as you are. Just as I am. Just to hear the music and have it be ourselves, is what we want. What we need. We are a lonely desperate people, pulled apart by the killer forces of capitalism and competition, and we need the music to hold us together. Separation is doom. We are free men, and we demand a free music, a free high energy source that will drive us wild into the streets of America yelling and screaming and tearing down everything that would keep people slaves.

The MC-5 is that source. The MC-5 is the revolution, in all its applications. There is no separation. Everything is everything. There is no thing to fear. The music will make you strong, as it is strong, and there is now way it can be stopped now. All power to the people! The MC-5 is here now for you to hear and see and feel now! Give it up- come together- get down, brothers and sisters, it's time to testify, and what you have in your hands is a living testimonial to the absolute power and strength of these men. Go wild! The world is yours! Take it now and be one with it! Kick out the jams, motherfucker! And stay alive with the MC-5!

more:

The White Panther Party (WPP) of Detroit and Ann Arbor, Michigan was a radical counterculture group which became a major target for the FBI's counter-intelligence (or "COINTELPRO") program between 1968 and 1971. 1 For a more detailed history of the White Panthers, as well as the Nixon Administration's focus on the group as part of a complex legal strategy to obtain expanded "national security" wiretapping authority, see the author's Ph.D. dissertation: Wiretapping and National Security: Nixon, the Mitchell Doctrine, and the White Panthers, (Ann Arbor, MI: University Microfilms,Incorporated, 1995) . In October of 1970, the FBI referred to the White Panthers as "potentially the largest and most dangerous of revolutionary organizations in the United States." 2 FBI Memorandum, R.L. Shackelford to C.D. Brennan, October 8, 1970, 62-112678- 125. However, just three years earlier, the group's leaders hosted a "Love-In" on Detroit's Belle Isle, presided over by John Sinclair, whom the Detroit News proclaimed "High Priest of the Detroit hippies." 3 Detroit News, May 2, 1967, 18-A. In recounting the story of how and why the White Panther collective evolved from primarily cultural, avantgardist beginnings into one of the Midwest's influential "political" extremist groups, this essay will address an important (and largely unresolved) historiographical issue: why some segments of the counterculture progressed from strictly non-political ideologies to positions of radical extremism. A case study exemplifying this development, it is hoped, will contribute to an historiographical reassessment of the counterculture, documenting its diversity and complexity.

The White Panther Party grew to become a professedly political organization that was dedicated to the confrontational strategy of "a total assault on the culture by any means necessary." Its formation during the fall of 1968 owed much to both local and national influences. On the local front, Detroit and Michigan State Police surveillance, harassment, and intimidation of left-wing activists reached unprecedented levels in the wake of the Detroit Riots of 1967, as well as in reaction to the popular success of the WPP's "house band," the "MC-5." National influences, especially the allure of the Black Panthers and the Yippies, also played an important role in the politicization of the group. The dynamics of, and interplay between, these (and other) influences are of critical importance because the existing historiography of the 1960s, still dominated by former participants in the various struggles, offers no useful model for explaining the White Panthers' progression toward radical extremism. To cite just one example, former SDS leader Todd Gitlin explains the New Left's step-by-step evolution from "protest" to "resistance" and ultimately "Revolution" as emanating largely from the Movement's impatience and frustration with the continuing Vietnam War. 4 Todd Gitlin, The Sixties: Years of Hope, Days of Rage, (New York: Bantam Books, 1987), 229, 380-82. In dramatic contrast, the Vietnam issue was inconsequential to the evolution of the White Panthers; the forces and motivations underlying the group's "radicalization" are to be found elsewhere, as we shall see.

The White Panther story is, in many respects, synonymous with the life of John Alexander Sinclair, one of the Midwest's most influential sixties counterculture leaders. 5 The information concerning John and Leni Sinclair's early lives through the Artists' Workshop period comes primarily from the following sources: John Sinclair, Guitar Army: Street Writings/Prison Writings, (New York; Douglas Book Corporation, 1972), 7-9, 56-58, and 188- 200; The John and Leni Sinclair Papers, Michigan Historical Collections, Bentley Historical Library, University of Michigan ; Leni Sinclair personal interview, July 21 and 23, 1992, Detroit, Michigan; Bret Eynon, "John Sinclair: Hipster," unpublished biography, November, 21, 1977, Hunter College, American Social History Project, 9-18, located at the Michigan Historical Collections, Bentley Historical Library, University of Michigan, "Contemporary History Project Papers : John Sinclair," box 1, topical file: John Sinclair ; and John Sinclair Interview with Bret Eynon, 1977, ASHP Interviews, box 239-J . Bret Eynon's work with the American Social History Project in Ann Arbor during the late seventies resulted in extremely thorough oral history documentation of the White Panthers (and other Movement participants). I am grateful to him for allowing access to these documents. He was born on October 2, 1941, in the town of Flint, Michigan, the birthplace of General Motors. His father was a career employee at the local Buick plant, starting on the assembly line in 1928 and eventually advancing to a mid-level management position; Elise, his mother, was a homemaker. John, his brother David, and sister Kathy enjoyed a comfortable middle-class upbringing in Davison, a small town located a few miles from Flint. The closest thing to radicalism that John experienced growing up was drinking beer on Friday nights, listening to rock and roll on a "black" Detroit radio station, and occasionally "crashing" all-black rhythm and blues shows in Flint with his friends. He graduated from Davison High with good grades, and attended Albion College, a small Methodist institution in southern Michigan. It was at Albion that he first came into contact with the beatnik culture that would later define his life. Befriending the college's lone hipster, Sinclair became an instant and obsessed devotee of avant-garde jazz (a la John Coltrane) and beatnik poetry (Allen Ginsberg, Lawrence Ferlinghetti, Gregory Corso, etc.). He also discovered marijuana, which had been part of the black urban jazz scene in America since the twenties, before the beatniks introduced it to white culture. Sinclair believed that "weed" heightened his awareness of the world around him, promoted togetherness, and expanded his creativity. It is a credo from which he has never wavered. 6 Sinclair, Guitar Army, 185; ASHP-Sinclair Interview, 44; John Sinclair, "Musical Memoirs," 1991.

After two years at Albion College, Sinclair dropped out and moved back to Flint, where he continued his exploration of black culture in the jazz and blues clubs located in the town's North Side ghetto. Like his beatnik predecessors, Sinclair saw the expressive and communalist culture of urban African Americans as an appealing alternative to the individualistic dominant culture of the post-war United States. Some years later, reflecting upon Norman Mailer's book The White Negro, Sinclair asserted "I was a White Negro in a purer sense. By the time that came out, I was on the streets, I was hangin' in the barbershops, in the pool rooms . . . doing it." 7 ASHP-Sinclair Interview, 18; Norman Mailer, The White Negro, (San Francisco, CA: City Lights, 1957).



After completing a bachelor's degree at the Flint branch of the University of Michigan in spring 1964, Sinclair moved to Detroit, enrolling in the graduate school of Wayne State University (WSU). His drug connections in Flint, as well as his bohemian sensibilities, led to rapid acceptance in the city's small and exclusive "hipster" community, located near the WSU campus. Here, at beatnik hangouts like the "Red Door Gallery," John first came into contact with jazz musician Charles Moore, poets George Tysh and Allen Van Newkirk, and other hipsters. And through these new connections, Sinclair also met his future wife, Magdalene "Leni" Arndt, a gifted artist/photographer from East Germany who had emigrated to Detroit in 1959 and was also attending WSU.

During that fall, John and Leni and their friends and acquaintances began discussing the possibility of starting an organization of area poets, musicians, and other artists, with the immediate goal of providing a meeting place outside of the WSU campus. A "document of self- determination" was drawn up, which among other things preached the virtues of not succumbing to the dominant "square" culture. Soon afterward, the "Artists' Workshop" was established on the ground floor of a two-story house on the corner of John Lodge and Warren Avenue. Every Sunday, the Workshop held an open house, with poetry readings, jazz performances, exhibitions of photographs and original art, and screenings of avant-garde films. Sinclair and Charles Moore performed together in an experimental jazz quartet, known as the "DC-4," and Leni began experimenting with photography and film-making. 8 Leni Sinclair's enormous collection of photographs documents the evolution of Detroit's beatnik and counterculture community during the sixties. These materials are available for research and commercial use. Leni can be contacted as follows: P.O. Box 32929, Detroit, MI 48232; lenisinclair@hotmail.com.

Over the next two years, the Artists' Workshop flourished. The organizational skills of the group's leadership were immediately evident. The Artists' Workshop Press developed into an alternative publishing house, eventually producing first books by John Sinclair, George Tysh, Bill Hutton, J.D. Whitney, Ron Caplan, and John Kay. 9 Internationally-known author and National Public Radio commentator Andre Codrescu frequented the Artists' Workshop as a student at WSU in the mid-sixties. Members of the collective also published some of the first underground newspapers in the Midwest, including Guerrilla, a journal whose masthead read "A Newspaper of Cultural Revolution." Sinclair's activities were the most prolific of all; in addition to attending graduate school, he managed several area houses (sub-letting rooms to artists and micro-entrepreneurs), wrote jazz reviews for Downbeat, JAZZ, and other national music magazines, and wrote and published three books of poems: This is Our Music; Fire Music: A Record; and Meditations: A Suite for John Coltrane. 10 Sinclair, Guitar Army, 56-58, 188-91; Leni Sinclair personal interview, July 21, 1992, Detroit, Michigan.

The ideology of the Detroit hip community reflected a voluntary isolation from, and utter contempt for, the outside society. As John recalls: "Jazz, it's all we did. We used to sit around and smoke dope . . .You didn't want to go out too much, because, you know, people were a drag.

They might see you. . You weren't a pleasant sight to them. There weren't too many places you wanted to go . . . . Besides, this was what was happening." In its commitment to creating a totally new cultural existence, the Artists' Workshop exhibited elitist tendencies; flyers advertising their events were distributed only to those who "looked hip." 11 ASHP-Sinclair Interview, 6-7. The idea of turning on the masses of American youth to a cultural revolt -- the White Panther credo -- was antithetical to the group's analysis.

While isolating itself from the dominant culture in Detroit, the Artists' Workshop interacted regularly with other bohemian/hip communities on the two coasts. Attending the Berkeley Poetry Conference in 1965, Sinclair met Allen Ginsberg, Ed Sanders, Charles Olson, and others -- an experience which led him to conclude that the Artists' Workshop was as hip as many of the other beatnik "scenes" in the country. And, by hosting numerous poets and avant-garde performers who toured the Midwest, the Artists' Workshop acquired hip credentials. 12 Leni Sinclair personal interview, July 21, 1992, Detroit, Michigan; Sinclair, Guitar Army, 191-92.

The spectacle of increasing numbers of beatniks congregating near WSU soon caught the attention of Detroit's police, who had a long history of aversion to nonconformity. 13 In a city that was 35 percent black, only 5 percent of police were African-American. Two-thirds of the police were from blue-collar families. Training in the handling of modern urban problems was lacking, and the end result was very poor police-community relations. See the following: Dan Georgakas and Marvin Surkin, Detroit: I Do Mind Dying: A Study in Urban Revolution, (New York: St. Martins Press, 1975), 105, 186-87; Peter K. Eisinger, The Politics of Displacement: Racial and Ethnic Transition in Three American Cities, (New York: Academic Press, 1980) 57; James A. Geschwender, Class, Race, and Worker Insurgency: The League of Revolutionary Black Workers, (Cambridge, UK: Cambridge University Press, 1977), 18, 25, 58- 64; and Sidney Fine, Violence in the Model City: The Cavanagh Administration, Race Relations, and the Detroit Riot of 1967, (Ann Arbor, MI: Univ. Of Michigan Press, 1989), 95. Frank Donner finds that, from the thirties onward, Detroit had one of the nation's most repressive police forces. The Detroit "Red Squad," or "Special Investigative Bureau" (SIB), was created in 1930, ostensibly to "work on the Bolshevik and Communistic activities in the city." This special unit quickly evolved into an abusive surveillance machine, monitoring all shades of political activity under the guise of hunting "radicals." A long-term ally for the SIB appeared in 1950, with the establishment of the "Security Investigation Squad" (SIS), a Michigan State Police counter- subversive unit, whose primary objective was discouraging employers from hiring suspected radicals. The two Red Squads established a close collaborative relationship, characterized by unprecedented information sharing and joint intelligence operations. 14 Frank Donner, Protectors of Privilege: Red Squads and Police Repression in Urban America, (Berkeley, CA: University of California Press, 1990), 53-58, 290-95. By the mid-1970s, when the full scope of their activities was first made public in a landmark Michigan court case, the Red Squads had amassed dossiers on more than 1.5 million citizens. 15 Benkert, et. al. v. Michigan State Police et. al., No. 74-023-934-AZ (Wayne County Circuit Court, Michigan). The John and Leni Sinclair "Red Squad Files" , obtained via the case's "disbursement program" (and graciously made available to the author), contain hundreds of pages of documents spanning the years 1964 through 1974. See Detroit Free Press Magazine, November 4, 1990, 8-10, 16-21; and Detroit Free Press, September 14, 1990, 20.

In light of the Detroit police force's historical role as praetorian defender of the status quo, it is not surprising that it utilized many of the same surveillance and intimidation tactics against the Artists' Workshop (and its successor, "Trans-Love Energies") which it had successfully employed against suspected "subversives," since the turn of the century. A favored tactic employed against artists, beatniks, and leftist utopians was Michigan's draconian marijuana statutes, which listed possession of even trace amounts as a felony offense. John Sinclair's first marijuana arrest occurred on October 7, 1964, when he and two friends were "set up" in a Detroit Police sting operation. Given two years probation and a $250 fine, Sinclair continued his work with the Artists' Workshop, refusing to give the incident much thought. However, the bust was an important harbinger of future events: Detroit's Red Squad immediately opened files on him and his associates, and began to take special interest in the beatnik community. 16 Sinclair Red Squad Files. The Detroit Police "set up" involved a friend of Sinclair's from Jackson, Michigan, who had been arrested on drug dealing charges. In return for a reduced prison sentence, the friend-turned-informer arranged to purchase marijuana from Sinclair and a friend, in a sting operation orchestrated by the Detroit Police. See also Sinclair, Guitar Army, 189-90. The following summer, Detective Vahan Kapagian of the Detroit Police Narcotics Bureau infiltrated the Artists' Workshop, an assignment that was facilitated by the group's open invitations to the public for Sunday poetry readings. Dressing in street clothes and calling himself "Eddie," Kapagian repeatedly pestered Sinclair with requests for assistance in locating marijuana. On August 16, 1965, Sinclair finally relented, driving Kapagian to a friend's house for a "score." Upon returning to the Artists' Workshop, a detail of twenty-five officers from the Narcotics Bureau raided the house at 4825 John Lodge, arresting seven people, including John and Leni Sinclair. John was convicted of second offense marijuana possession on February 22, 1966, and later sentenced to six months in the Detroit House of Corrections ("DEHOCO"). Detroit's newspapers portrayed Sinclair as the leader of a WSU campus dope ring. 17 ASHP-Sinclair Interview, 19-20; Detroit Free Press, August 18, 1965, 3.

In addition to Sinclair's six month incarceration, the events of 1966 brought considerable change to the Artists' Workshop. The Detroit scene underwent a radical transformation, as a number of core members moved away from the city for a variety of reasons, including fear of the police and a desire to experience San Francisco's emerging hip community. Writing from inside DEHOCO, John advised them against abandoning Detroit: "You have it in your power now to create a vital living situation here in Detroit -- if you have the will and commitment to such a situation . . . we are all going to have to start working with each other and take advantage of what our local possibilities . 18 ASHP-Sinclair Interview, 18-19. Upon his release from DEHOCO on August 6, Sinclair immediately began acting on his commitment to local organizing. The fruit of these labors was the eventual creation of "Trans-Love Energies" (TLE), an attempted union of counterculture, student, and other alternative groups in Detroit, named after a line in a song by folk-rock artist Donovan, urging listeners to "Fly Translove Airways, get you there on time" (the song was later popularized in "live" performances by the San Francisco rock troupe The Jefferson Airplane). 19 Donovan's original studio version of "The Fat Angel" appeared on his 1966 album Sunshine Superman (Epic BN-26217). Subsequent "live" cover versions of the song have appeared on Jefferson Airplane compilations, including the 1987 release 2400 Fulton Street (RCA C-214830).

The creation of Trans-Love Energies during the first half of 1967 20 The Artists' Workshop existed for a time within the larger TLE collective. However, by late 1967 the Artists' Workshop closed and the group's energies focused almost exclusively on the TLE organization. owed much to two simultaneously occurring phenomena: the arrival of LSD and the flower children. A sea change had occurred in the WSU community during the six months of Sinclair's imprisonment, as large numbers of "Baby Boom" progeny, now coming of age, congregated in and around the campus.

Many became regulars at the Artists' Workshop. Facilitating the union between older beatniks and younger hippies was LSD-25, which had just arrived in Detroit. For both groups, "acid" ended pessimism concerning the possibility that American society would ever break out of its state of cultural stagnation. As Sinclair explained: "When beatniks started taking acid, it brought us out of the basement . . . . the fringes of society -- and just blew us apart. From being cynical and wanting to isolate yourself forever from the squares . . . . one was suddenly filled with a messianic feeling of love and brotherhood . . . . LSD made you realize that you had ties with the rest of humanity." 21 Ibid., 19-20. Beatnik elitism quickly disappeared, and a plethora of alternative organizations and micro-enterprises sprang up -- essentially creating a new alternative culture, with its own economy outside of mainstream Detroit society.

TLE tried to unify a diverse student/hip community into an umbrella organization, or "tribal council." Co-founders Sinclair and artist Gary Grimshaw attempted to get representatives from all of the area's hip organizations to meet on a regular basis, for the purpose of discussing how better to utilize their talents and services for the benefit of the hundreds of young people converging on the area. Some of the support services provided included free housing, job information services, concerts, transportation in and around Detroit, and a cooperative booking agency for performers and organizations. Although TLE never became the unified model of inter- organizational cooperation originally envisioned, "Trans-Love Energies, Unlimited," the central business unit, became quite successful, organizing local cultural events and hooking up with other hip enclaves across America to bring in well-known artists and performers such as Allen Ginsberg, the Grateful Dead, and the Ed Sanders' "Fugs."

The Trans-Love organization, like most other counterculture collectives, paid much lip service to the egalitarian "no leaders" concept. In theory, the organization was comprised of numerous avant garde and alternative groups, all possessing equal status on the tribal council; each individual was therefore encouraged to be his or her own leader. In reality, the core group within the Artists' Workshop was the driving force behind the TLE collective, due to its energy, organizational abilities, and commitment to making the experiment work. By the same token, Trans-Love Energies' embrace of hierarchical organization and charismatic leadership (namely Sinclair) contrasted dramatically with other elements of the evolving counterculture, such as San Francisco's Digger collective. These differences, viewed by many (then and now) as contradictions, would continue to characterize Sinclair's group through the White Panther period.

They underscore both the diversity of counterculture forms which emerged during the latter half of the 1960s and the continuing danger of stereotyping historical movements too narrowly.

As TLE underwent expansion, its core membership changed. John's brother David signed on, having passed up a full football scholarship at Dartmouth. Two additional 1967 arrivals who would later assume leadership positions in the White Panthers were "Pun" Plamondon and Genie Parker. Lawrence Robert "Pun" Plamondon was born in Traverse City, Michigan, the illegitimate son of a "half-breed Ottawa and a long-distance operator." He was adopted as an infant by upper middle-class foster parents, who were well respected in Traverse City. Despite his comfortable upbringing and excellent academic potential, Pun exhibited a rebellious streak from an early age. At sixteen he ran away from home, hitchhiking across the country, and eventually working with migrant farm workers in California. He moved to Detroit in 1967, was introduced to the Artists' Workshop/TLE, befriended Sinclair, and joined the group just in time to take his first LSD trip at the "Love-In" on April 30th (discussed below). With TLE he found an appropriate outlet for his enormous energy and increasing social consciousness. He and Sinclair soon became close friends; eventually Pun assumed a leadership position in the organization. 22 Kathleen Stocking, "A Personal Remembrance: Ann Arbor's Famous Radicals, Then and Now," Monthly Detroit, vol. 5, (February, 1992), 78 . Genie Parker, the daughter of an Army colonel with Vietnam combat experience, arrived at the TLE house shortly after the "Love-in." An "army brat" who had been raised in Texas, Georgia, and New Jersey, her attraction to the Sinclairs was immediate, and she moved in with the group her first day in Detroit. Within a few months, she and Pun became inseparable, and the two of them gradually became well known in radical circles throughout the country. 23 Genie Parker Interview with Bret Eynon, 1977, ASHP Interviews, box 239-J .

Two of Trans-Love Energies' most significant modes of cultural expression were the underground press and the rock band "MC-5." By early 1967, Sinclair was writing regular columns for the Fifth Estate, while also contributing to the sporadically-published Warren-Forest Sun, the "official" TLE newspaper. He and Fifth Estate editor Peter Werbe participated in a dialogue with alternative press editors from across the country, which would eventually spawn the "Underground Press Syndicate," a national system of alternative news acquisition and distribution, run primarily by college-age people. As a result of these connections, the Fifth Estate's coverage of the emerging New Left, Black Power, and counterculture movements became extensive.



The union of the MC-5 and Trans-Love Energies in mid-1967 contributed to major changes for the collective, including the rapid acquisition of mass youth appeal. Sinclair's association with MC-5 members Rob Tyner, Fred Smith, Wayne Kramer, Dennis Thompson, and Michael Davis began in 1966, when the band first utilized a TLE house for free rehearsal space.

At the time, only Tyner and Davis were out of high school. Over the next two years, the quintet would develop and perfect a unique, hard-driving rock and roll sound, widely credited with influencing (some say pioneering) later "punk" and "heavy metal" rock genres. 24 Goldmine, April 17, 1992, 16-22; Rolling Stone, no. 25, January 4, 1969, 7; see also no. 632, June 11, 1992, 35-36.

The MC-5 began as a collaboration between Kramer and Smith, two junior high school students from the blue-collar Detroit suburb of Lincoln Park. Things began to happen for the guitarists after Kramer hooked up with vocalist Rob Tyner, two years his senior. A devotee of avant-garde jazz and beat culture, Tyner had only recently "discovered" the potentialities of rock and roll. After adding drummer Dennis Thompson (who was the newspaper delivery boy in Kramer's neighborhood) and bass player Michael Davis (Tyner's friend) to their line-up, the group settled upon the name "MC-5," which Tyner, its author, believed sounded like an industrial serial number for a race car engine; only later did he realize the name could also stand for the "Motor City 5." Playing at local clubs and high school dances, the group gradually created a high energy electric sound, which reflected the combination of rock, R & B, and experimental jazz influences. One unique feature of their sound, its deafening loudness, was made possible by the acquisition of a $3000, state-of-the-art, Vox public address and amplification system. The group's experimentation with the new system resulted in the regular use of "feedback" in their performances, as well as several trademark Tyner stage antics, such as plunging a microphone into a loud-speaker for effect. By mid-1967, the MC-5 had built a substantial local following and cut its first 45 RPM single. 25 Wayne Kramer Interview, published in the online magazine Addicted To Noise (ATN), Issue 1.02, Parts I-IV, February, 1995, URL address: http://www.addict.com/issues/1.02; ; Goldmine, April 17, 1992, 16-22.

The marriage between the MC-5 and Trans-Love Energies was rooted in the many social and cultural changes occurring in Detroit, circa 1967. A strict jazz aficionado only a year before, Sinclair rediscovered rock music via the younger hip crowd, and rapidly recognized its potential for attracting youth to the TLE banner. The MC-5 saw in him an older, experienced artist with undisputable hip credentials. Thus, when Sinclair offered to manage the group, they accepted immediately. An additional contributing factor to the band's rapid acceptance was the opening of the "Grande Ballroom," a large Detroit rock club modeled after the Fillmore West in San Francisco. Russ Gibb, the club's "hip capitalist" owner, hired the MC-5 as the "house band," which guaranteed the group weekly exposure headlining for the top British and American touring acts of the day. Soon, the entire TLE commune became part of the act, providing psychedelic light shows, outstanding psychedelic concert posters and handbills by Gary Grimshaw, and even master of ceremonies duties from "Brother" J.C. Crawford. From this platform, Trans-Love Energies would recruit hundreds -- perhaps thousands -- of followers. 26 Kramer ATN Interview.

The peak of this optimistic period for Sinclair and his group came on April 30, 1967, when they staged a "Love-in" at the large metropolitan park on Belle Isle, on the Detroit River. Influenced by San Francisco's "Human Be-In" the previous January, as well as the trend of similar counterculture celebrations happening in hip enclaves across the country, Trans-Love Energies promoted the event as a gathering of "peace and love," where hippies and straights could come together to celebrate a new vision of society. The Detroit News and Detroit Free Press gave the Love-In significant coverage, and on the day of the event several thousand "freeks" were in attendance, smoking marijuana, dropping LSD, singing, chanting, and enjoying themselves with minimal disturbances. Although the police were out in significant numbers, they kept a low profile until dusk, when the arrest of a motorcyclist encouraged taunting and rock-throwing. The result was a full-scale riot, with numerous arrests, ostensibly for "damaging police vehicles." The resulting press coverage was almost unanimously on the side of the police, portraying Sinclair and TLE as mindless hedonists, more interested in picking a fight with police than with "peace and love." 27 Detroit News, May 1, 1967, A-1; see also May 2, 1967, 18-A.

The Belle Isle experience had a profound impact upon the later development of Trans-Love Energies. The hippie philosophy of getting high, creating alternative institutions, and waiting for the capitalist machine to rust away was proving to be an inadequate analysis. Sinclair later admitted: " a simplistic picture of what the 'revolution' was all about . . . . we said that all you had to do was 'tune in, turn on, and drop out,' as if that would solve all the problems of humankind . . . and what we didn't understand, spaced out as we were behind all that acid, was that the machine was determined to keep things the way they were . . . by this time there was a full-scale suppression campaign underway." 28 Sinclair, Guitar Army, 25-27. Sinclair struggled with the realization that the localpolice were responding to cultural revolt with political repression. Gradually, over the course of the next year, he came to the conclusion that the counterculture forms espoused and lived by Trans-Love Energies were actually political statements. In response, TLE's activities focused on educating youth regarding both the positive, liberating aspects of the new cultural forms, and also their potential risks. Sinclair began appearing at area colleges, high schools, and other youth gatherings, urging people to join in a "total assault on the culture" -- a William S. Burroughs phrase from the early sixties, popularized by New York poet/artist (and future Yippie) Ed Sanders. 29 Ed Sanders Telephone Interview with Author, May 10, 1998. The collective also stepped up distribution of its newspapers and other propaganda at MC-5 concerts, warning of police surveillance and hassles. Still another initiative involved assisting high school students with publishing alternative newspapers, activity which again earned Sinclair a hostile press response. 30 Detroit News, April 27, 1967, 17-C.

Although TLE was still a long way from advocating militant action against police and "the state," the group nonetheless delighted in taunting police and other symbols of authority with anti- establishment (often tongue-in-cheek) writing in its newspapers, "street theater" actions in public, and inflammatory rhetoric at MC-5 concerts. And in a city like Detroit, where racial tensions were always high and police rarely appreciated humor perpetuated by hippies at their expense, Trans-Love Energies' actions heightened police interest in the group. The end result was increasingly severe reprisals.

John Sinclair's third marijuana arrest occurred on January 24, 1967, when a force of thirty-four law enforcement officers, representing local, state, and federal agencies, raided the group's commune (still officially known as the Artists' Workshop), arresting fifty-six persons. The raid was the culmination of a four-month-long sting operation, once again facilitated by the wily (and newly bearded) Detective Vahan Kapagian, who infiltrated the organization posing as "Louie" the hip candle maker. Assisting him was fellow Narcotics Detective Jane Mumford, who faithfully wore mini-skirts in her portrayal of "Peg" the counterculture "chick." As helpful and friendly as "Louie" and "Peg" were, they remained unable to purchase any marijuana for several months. The police were ultimately forced to move with little hard evidence: two minor pot purchases from WSU students only peripherally associated with the Artists' Workshop and Sinclair's "gift" of two marijuana "joints" to officer Mumford shortly before Christmas, 1966. 31 Sinclair Red Squad Files, Detroit Police Department, Detective Division, Narcotics Bureau, Arrest Report, January 27, 1967; Leni Sinclair personal interview with author, July 23, 1992, Detroit, Michigan.

The impact of Sinclair's third arrest would be delayed for two and a half years, as his attorneys, Sheldon Otis and Justin "Chuck" Ravitz, skillfully fought the constitutionality of the state's marijuana statutes. Sinclair remained free to lead Trans-Love Energies through the most turbulent years of the 1960s. 32 It was also during this period that John and Leni, who had lived together since 1965, decided to get married. At the time, Leni was pregnant with Sunny, their first child.

A significant turning point in the history of Detroit was the bloody rioting of July 24-31, 1967, the worst in America's history. Following the riots, the attitudes of Detroit police moved farther to the right, reflecting the growing siege mentality prevalent among many of the city's whites. During the winter and spring of 1968, the situation became unbearable for Trans-Love Energies. Sinclair summarized his feelings during the period: "Nothing was happening but the police. They had everything covered, and if you moved after dark you were snatched up and taken to jail without bail. If you stayed inside they came in after you, kicking down the doors and ransacking everything in sight . . . . Detroit was Police City, baby, and you never forgot it -- not for a minute." 33 ASHP-Sinclair Biography, 48. The last straw came in response to the assassination of Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. on April 4, when Detroit's police, fearing another major riot, established a "protective curfew" in the city after dark. Since Sinclair's group earned most of its operating funds producing MC-5 concerts and related events, which usually took place during the evenings, the curfew threatened their very livelihood. Therefore, in May, 1968, TLE relocated some forty-five miles to the west, to the college town of Ann Arbor.

The new Trans-Love Energies commune consisted of twenty-eight people, including three children and the MC-5 members. 34 Eve Silberman, "The Hill Street Radicals," Ann Arbor Observer, May, 1991, 45-53. Together they occupied two old houses at 1510 and 1520 Hill Street, on the outskirts of the University of Michigan (UM) campus. Two new members of note were 19 year-old Ken Kelley, a UM student from Ypsilanti, Michigan, and Milton "Skip" Taube, a Detroit native who first attended UM in 1965 and had since become closely associated with SDS. Kelley edited one of the campus' first underground newspapers, the Argus, and immediately recognized in Sinclair a kindred spirit. Taube had recently become disillusioned with the split in the local SDS organization. Two of his closest friends, Bill Ayers and Diana Oughton, led the new SDS splinter group "Jesse James Gang," which would later evolve into the Weather Underground. 35 Ken Kelley Interview with Bret Eynon, 1977, Hunter College, NY, American Social History Project, 3, located at the Michigan Historical Collections, Bentley Historical Library, University of Michigan, ASHP Interviews, box 239-J; Milton "Skip" Taube Interview with Bret Eynon, 1977, Hunter College, NY, American Social History Project, 14, located at the Michigan Historical Collections, Bentley Historical Library, University of Michigan, ASHP Interviews, box 239-J.

Trans-Love Energies' immediate focus was music, which had recently become a local source of conflict. During the winter of 1968, the Ann Arbor City Council had passed an ordinance banning amplified music from city parks. When Sinclair decided to hold an MC-5 concert in defiance of the law, the small Ann Arbor Police force threatened to arrest all involved.

Sinclair did not back down. Thanks to press coverage from the Michigan Daily, the campus community got involved. Two weeks later the City Council relented, granting TLE permission to hold a series of free concerts at Gallup Park, on the outskirts of town. 36 ASHP-Sinclair Biography, 48-49. This was a big turning point for the group. Trans-Love Energies had stood up to the police and other "authority figures" and won. In Sinclair's view, the incident demonstrated conclusively the potential power of organized youth revolt. Henceforth, TLE's members pursued a recruitment strategy characterized by arrogant, militant posturing toward authority figures and flaunting (in print and on stage) the fact that they were "getting away with it."

Freed from the stifling, repressive atmosphere of urban Detroit and fortified by its success in the Ann Arbor free concert struggle, Trans-Love Energies initiated a "total assault on the culture" throughout the summer. The spearhead of its attack was the MC-5, which, thanks to Sinclair's managerial prowess, became a regionally-successful touring group. Each MC-5 concert was a multi-media event, with psychedelic lights, rear-screen projection, plus the spiritual rantings of "Brother" J.C. Crawford. The supercharged electric music of the MC-5 was punctuated by Sinclair's radical speeches, urging youth to pursue personal freedom to the utmost extremes. The MC-5's shows successfully fused two very new countercultural forms: alternative, electric rock and roll music and a rhetoric of youth culture liberation. Ken Kelley's recollections of his first MC-5 concert provide insight into the energy and excitement surrounding the band:

I'll never forget the first time I saw the MC5 perform that hot June night in 1968 at the Grande Ballroom . . . . The ozone scent of anticipation quickened my pulse as Rob Tyner jumped to center stage and shouted 'Kick out the jams, motherfuckers!,' the opening rant into The 5's anthemic underground hit song. As Tyner squirmed and sang, behind him were two sparkle-sequined guitarists who traded-off lead in a fervid fusillade of fiery notes . . . . When Fred played solo on his trademark-tune, 'Rocket Reducer No. 62', you knew why he got his name 'Sonic' -- the only word that packed enough 'G-force' . . . . He leaped up and down . . . in swirling orgiastic gyrations of musical frenzy . . . . When Fred played, sex itself exploded on stage. 37 Ken Kelley Interview, published in the online magazine Addicted To Noise (ATN), Issue 1.02, Page 2, February, 1995, URL address: http://www.addict.com/issues/1.02/Features/MC5/Kick_Out_The_Jams/index.html



Stephen Stills' anti-establishment lyrics from the previous year -- "There's something happening here; What it is ain't exactly clear" 38 Buffalo Springfield's "For What It's Worth" (a hit single), appeared on their 1967 debut album: Buffalo Springfield (Atco SD-33-200-A). -- seem equally appropriate for the unprecedented countercultural amalgamation which Trans-Love Energies and the MC-5 were forging in America's heartland during the year of the barricades.

TLE's political economy was far removed from that of most other hippie collectives. Earnings from MC-5 shows financed the entire Trans-Love operation, including two communes, several dozen core members, and a very active propaganda machine. This uniqueness reflected the history and evolution of the group; from the first days of the Artists' Workshop, Sinclair had juggled such seemingly contradictory tasks as organizing free "Love-Ins" and being responsible for collecting rent from tenants in several buildings he managed. And in much the same manner, the Trans-Love commune in Ann Arbor booked most MC-5 "gigs" for pay, while also playing many free concerts and benefits. Sinclair defended the group's political economy by asserting that the MC-5 was a true "people's band," which played as many benefits and free shows as possible. He added that the funds acquired from paid shows were used primarily "to spread the word that there was another way of doing things . . . to bring the new world order into being." 39 Sinclair, Guitar Army, 307-308.

The MC-5's growing popularity did not escape the attention of the local Ann Arbor Police, the Washtenaw County Sheriff's Office, or the Michigan State Police. Throughout the summer, an increasing number of what Sinclair called "creep scenes" occurred, in which police presence at MC-5 shows led to arrests, near-arrests, and an intimidating "cat and mouse" surveillance and evasion game. Sinclair's biweekly Fifth Estate articles, titled "Rock and Roll Dope," chronicled both the MC-5's growing popularity and what Sinclair believed to be an escalating counterattack from the forces of the conservative establishment. The police response included marijuana busts in the parking lots, pressure on club owners (in response to the MC-5's desecration of American flags and frequent use of profanity on-stage), and a steadily increasing presence. On several occasions, the police turned off the electricity at clubs to prevent the band from playing; in one bizarre incident, the MC-5 was issued a ticket for being "a noisy band." In June, TLE leaders Gary Grimshaw and "Pun" Plamondon were charged by Traverse City Police with marijuana possession and sale in their community the previous March, an incident which sent Grimshaw fleeing to another state and resulted in the imprisonment of Plamondon (a $20,000 bond, far in excess of the group's resources, kept him in jail for three months awaiting trial). The unpredictability and insanity of the summer of 1968 peaked on July 23, when Sinclair and MC-5 guitarist Fred "Sonic" Smith were arrested by Oakland County Sheriffs in Leonard, Michigan and charged with "assault and battery on a police officer." While in prison, the Oakland County authorities cut off most of Sinclair's long hair. Three days later, the MC 5 were arrested by Ann Arbor Police, and charged with "disturbing the peace" for playing at a free concert in West Park. 40 ASHP-Sinclair Biography, 50-51; Sinclair, Guitar Army, 73-95.

The harassment by law enforcement officials was undoubtedly motivated by several factors, including their repulsion at the sight of long-haired hippies using drugs, mutilating the nation's flag in public, and in the process influencing other young people to imitate their counterculture lifestyle. As had been the case in Detroit, police in the hinterlands of Michigan were ill prepared to face resistance and blatant anti-police hatred from rebellious, white, middle- class youth. However, the police overreaction was also influenced by TLE's provocations on stage and in the pages of the Fifth Estate and the Sun. Seeking to (in the terminology of the times) "expose the repressive nature of the mother-country system," Sinclair and MC-5 lead vocalist Rob Tyner regularly informed crowds of hyped-up youth about the various police (and club owner) hassles they were facing. Audience reaction often bordered on riot. In addition, Sinclair baited the police in article after article of the Fifth Estate. He realized that the newspaper was now required reading for many local police officers, as part of their intelligence gathering. The following passage is typical of Sinclair's invective that summer:

We matched our magic against the pigs' brute tactics and it worked -- any respect any of the people there might have had for 'law and order' as represented by the Ann Arbor police just disappeared, and their futile tricks were exposed to the light. All this bullshit was totally unnecessary -- we just wanted to do our thing and let the people do their thing with us, but the police just won't let that happen without trying to stomp us out one way or the other . . . . People are getting hip to all of the old people's lies and perversions, and they aren't going to stand for it much longer. We sure aren't. 41 Ibid., 86.

The defiantly "political" tone of Sinclair's writing was intentional, and demonstrated the continuing evolution of his ideology. He theorized that "our culture itself represented a political threat to the established order, and that any action which has a political consequence is finally a political action." 42 Ibid., 74. However, Sinclair also recognized that the typical MC-5 fan was largely uneducated as to the nuances of political versus cultural revolt, and generally despised "politics" of the conventional and/or New Left variety. Therefore, TLE began using its growing popularity to educate young people regarding the politics of their new culture and movement.

National events, such as the expansion and convergence of the New Left, Black Power, anti-war, and counterculture revolts into a single "Movement" for radical social change, also played a role in the increasing politicization of Trans-Love Energies. By virtue of their national underground newspaper connections, as well as their extensive touring with the MC-5, Sinclair and his cadre were better informed than more isolated counterculture groups about the Movement's increasing resistance to the establishment. Detroit's Fifth Estate, along with the Ann Arbor-based TLE papers Sun and Argus, gave extensive coverage to Black Panther shoot-outs with police, campus revolts, and the increasing numbers of street battles between police and "freeks" which were happening across the country. The importance of this process cannot be overstated, as members of Detroit's hip community would now begin relating the events in their lives (such as drug usage/acceptance, alternative institution building, and deteriorating police relations) with similar developments in other hip communities across the U.S. The national "underground" media network, a first-of-its-kind phenomenon, would become a catalyst for the future merging of radical movements.

Trans-Love Energies' previous interaction with counterculture enclaves on the east and west coasts also provided a platform for increasing national awareness. By 1968, Sinclair had befriended fellow avant-garde artist/poets Ed Sanders and Allen Ginsberg, and through them had met Youth International Party ("Yippie") activists Jerry Rubin and Abbie Hoffman. The "street theatre" antics of the New York Yippies had much in common with the MC-5's shocking stage antics. Therefore, when Ed Sanders invited Sinclair and the MC-5 to perform at the Yippies' "Festival of Life" in Chicago in late August, they accepted without hesitation. Sinclair recalled the band's Sunday, August 25th performance -- and the disturbance it provoked:

As it turned out, we were the only ones in the country who showed up to play . . . The Fugs wouldn't even come . . . . They were terrified! . . . didn't have a stage. They didn't have a permit. They didn't have power . . . . So we set up on the grass. We plugged into a hot dog stand. . . . We played one set on the grass, just like in Ann Arbor at the free concerts . . . Abbie Hoffman decides that this is the time to start the shit. He had this big flat bed wagon that was going to be used for the stage, but they wouldn't let him bring it in. So he decides, 'Fuck it, I'm going to bring it in.' He knows that this is going to provoke a confrontation . . . . He started to bring this wagon through and that attracted thousands of people. Then he comes up and takes the mike between sets and starts ranting and raving. . . . The police were already starting to advance on the park . . . . So I just got my equipment men and started to take down the equipment and pack it in the van . . . . The police were getting closer and closer . . . . When we pulled out, the police were swarming all over the area, and that's when the shit really started. We just drove straight back . 43 ASHP-Sinclair Interview, 41-42.

Sinclair came away from the Chicago debacle convinced of two things. First, the police responded vastly out of proportion to any real threat posed by the gathering of "freeks," New Leftists, anti-war activists, Black Power supporters, and others. For Sinclair, this meant that the Movement -- including the counterculture -- would have to get politically organized for self- defense purposes or face repression by law enforcement agencies. Secondly, after experiencing the Yippies' less than prolific organizational skills, Sinclair became convinced that Trans-Love Energies possessed the requisite organization, experience, and popular following to present a viable model for politicizing the youth culture on a national scale. The creation of the "White Panther Party" as the political wing of TLE, formally announced on November 1, 1968, represented the culmination of these "lessons."

The selection of the name "White Panthers," which demonstrated a close identification with the Black Panthers, might appear as something of a contradiction, considering TLE's mostly white membership and sparse record of attention to black causes in Detroit. However, Sinclair never strayed from his close identification with black culture (especially its music), and the Artists' Workshop had been a multi-racial organization. Most TLE members envied and respected the Black Panthers' armed self-defense strategy and disciplined organizational model. Yet, the most influential Black Panther advocate within the collective was Pun Plamondon, who spent the summer in a jail cell in Traverse City reading works by or about Black Panther leaders Huey Newton and Eldridge Cleaver. At this time, the Black Panthers were actively seeking alliances with "white mother country radicals" in the New Left, counterculture, and peace movements. For Plamondon, the Black Panthers' call for white allies, essentially white Black Panthers, was a revelation. Upon his return to Ann Arbor in September, he lobbied Sinclair to form a white support group for the Black Panthers. 44 Sinclair had also been deeply moved by a 1968 Huey Newton interview, in which the Black Panther leader mentioned that whites should support the BPP by organizing their own revolutionary cadres. Genie Plamondon recalls that, on John's recommendation, she took this newspaper article to Pun in prison. See ASHP-Genie Plamondon Interview, 9; and ASHP- Sinclair Biography, 57. The timing of Plamondon's request, just after Sinclair had returned from the "stomp scene" in Chicago, was crucial: the Black Panthers appeared to have just the sort of national model of political organization which TLE was seeking. In addition, the title "White Panthers" gave the group instant radical credentials and, they hoped, credibility as a "vanguard" white revolutionary organization.

At first, the WPP was little more than a paper construct. The organization's "Ten Point Program" displayed a Yippie-esque mixture of counterculture themes and "fantasy politics." The platform included such things as: full endorsement of the Black Panther Party's 10-point program and platform; a "total assault on the culture by any means necessary, including rock and roll, dope, and fucking in the streets"; free food, clothes, housing, drugs, music, bodies, and medical care; and freedom from "phony 'leaders' -- everyone must be a leader -- freedom means free every one." 45 Sinclair, Guitar Army, 105. The tongue-in-cheek nature of the early White Panther slogans is something that few people outside the Movement, most importantly the police and FBI, realized. In fact, the WPP was originally conceived as "an arm of the Youth International Party." The naming of a "Central Committee" demonstrated Sinclair's penchant for Yippie-inspired theatrics, with positions such as "Minister of Religion" and "Minister of Demolition." 46 Ibid., 101.



Another feature of the early WPP which paralleled the Yippie model was its attempt to co-opt the straight (commercial) media. Just as the Yippies had attracted international press coverage for the Chicago Festival of Life, so too did Sinclair hope to recruit America's youth with both conventional and alternative media coverage of the WPP, generated by its own propaganda machine. "We can work within those old forms, infusing them with our new content and using them to carry out our work," he asserted. 47 Ibid., 116. Sinclair had also learned from the Yippies that there was a direct relationship between the level of sensationalism in the press/media message and the degree of coverage. Early White Panther press releases and propaganda were intentionally overstated: "If you make it outrageous enough," Plamondon later recalled, "the networks will pick it up." 48 Quoted in Silberman, "The Hill Street Radicals," 49.

All propaganda and wishful thinking aside, the White Panthers did possess one potential "ticket" to national visibility that fall: the MC-5. On September 26, 1968, Elektra Records signed the band to record a "live" album at the Grande Ballroom in Detroit. Elektra's young publicity director, Danny Fields, apparently recognized the potential commercial value of youth in revolt. The MC-5's debut album, "Kick Out The Jams," as well as a 45-rpm single (same title, with B-side "The Motor City is Burning") were released in early 1969, and immediately entered the Billboard Hot 100. The album went to number 20 on the Billboard charts; the single to number 82. 49 Joel Whitburn, Top Pop Artists and Singles, 1955-1978, (Menomonee Falls, WI: Record Research, Inc., 1979), 277; Goldmine, April 17, 1992, 16-22. Rolling Stone put lead vocalist Rob Tyner on its January 4, 1969, cover. Few at the time realized the significance of radical counterculture musical expressionism achieving popular acceptance.

For Sinclair, a national recording contract with Elektra, complete with $50,000 advance, represented neither a "sell out," nor a surrender to capitalist commodification of "the people's music." In his 1972 book Guitar Army, he provided an ideological justification for the action, focusing upon two key aspects of Trans-Love's "total assault on the culture" thesis. First Sinclair stressed that successful revolutions require the participation of the masses. He hypothesized that in order to reach the maximum number of pre-revolutionary youth the WPP should use as many of the "old establishment forms" as possible, including the media, radio stations, and of course record companies. Secondly, Sinclair believed that by disguising itself as a "simple economic force" like a rock band, the MC-5 could work parasitically from within the capitalist recording industry to challenge its dominance of national music distribution; he added " .

. . we're determined to change the structure of . . . the pop music scene -- and the people whose lives it shapes, as we pass through it on our way to building a whole new structure on our own." 50 Sinclair, Guitar Army, 125. Finally, Sinclair predicted that once the MC-5's record was released and gained national acceptance, the WPP, working with other radical groups and "people's bands" across the country, could establish an alternative recording and distribution system to rival, and eventually replace, the existing capitalist structure.

The details surrounding the MC-5's contract with Elektra would seem to support Sinclair's position that the WPP was in fact "putting something over on the old people," rather than selling out. The most obvious evidence for this are Sinclair's liner notes on the album, which boldly state: "The MC-5 is the revolution . . . . The music will make you strong . . . and there is no way it can be stopped now . . . Kick out the jams, motherfucker!" Equally significant, Elektra allowed the album to originally be released with an uncensored version of "Kick Out The Jams," complete with Tyner's use of profanity. Thus, while Elektra's primary motivation was undoubtedly record sales, i.e. an attempted commodification of the new counterculture music, by conceding to Sinclair's demands that the White Panthers' core philosophies be included in the record, the company became a willing accomplice in disseminating the WPP gospel to a national audience. And when one considers that the precise parameters of the relationship between record companies and hip rock bands were not yet established in 1968, it is therefore not unreasonable to ask "who commodified who?"

The first year of the WPP coincided with Richard Nixon's election to the presidency and an increasing atmosphere of confrontation nationwide. The FBI initiated a COINTELPRO (nationwide secret counter-intelligence initiative) specifically designed to disrupt and destroy the New Left and affiliated groups. In 1969, came the fragmentation of SDS and the first incident of National Guardsmen shooting unarmed hippies and students during the "People's Park" riots at the University of California, Berkeley. Other campus confrontations paralyzed universities across the country. Beat poet Allen Ginsberg, a favored speaker on the college circuit, claimed that the police and National Guard were gassing and beating so many students "its like they're manufacturing violent radicals by the milliard." 51 Michael Schumacher, Dharma Lion: A Critical Biography of Allen Ginsberg, (New York: St. Martin's Press, 1992), 541. Todd Gitlin accurately summed up the atmosphere of mounting social disorder:

In the year after August 1968, it was as if both official power and movement counterpower, equally and passionately, were committed to stoking up 'two, three, many Chicagos,' each believing that the final showdown of good and evil, order and chaos, was looming . . . . The once-solid core of American life -- the cement of loyalty that people tender to institutions, certifying that the current order is going to last and deserves to -- this loyalty, in select sectors, was decomposing . . . underneath grew a sublime faith that the old sturdy-seeming ways might be paper-mache and that the right trumpet blast -- the correct analysis, the current line, the correct tactics -- might bring them crashing down. 52 Gitlin, The Sixties, 342-45.

Nixon did not disguise his intent to utilize the full force of the nation's police, military, and intelligence establishments to smash all shades of dissent, including the counterculture. What is more, his Administration's willingness to define the enemy with ever-wider strokes of the brush empowered and emboldened the praetorian forces of authority. In this environment, the mere act of advocating "revolution" was looked upon by police and the FBI as tantamount to committing a violent, treasonous act.

The worsening relationship between police and the Movement in southeast Michigan paralleled the national trends. The cops might have acted with greater restraint if radical rhetoric and posturing had been all they were up against. However, memories of the riots of 1967 lingered and, in fall 1968, a wave of bombings took place, targeting unmanned police cars and other symbols of the establishment, including a clandestine CIA recruiting office in Ann Arbor. The individual responsible for much of the destruction was "hippie-turned-mad bomber" David Valler, whose philosophy had evolved from LSD to TNT over the course of a few months. 53 For press coverage of the Valler bombings in 1968, see Detroit News, September 2, 1- A; September 10, 1-A; September 12, 17-A; September 20, 1-A; September 30, 1-A; October 15, 3-A; November 12, 1-A and 18-A; November 20, 2-A; November 22, 4-A; November 24, 2-A; and November 27, 3-B. Not surprisingly, the Valler bombings influenced many local police and FBI to begin looking at all hippies as potentially violent.

In this atmosphere of mounting tensions the White Panthers presented their analysis of a pending revolution in increasingly militant terms. Plamondon emerged as the most radical of the group, issuing statements like: " . . . get a gun brother, learn how to use it. You'll need it, pretty soon. Pretty soon. You're a White Panther, act like one." 54 Fifth Estate, October 31 - November 13, 1968. For his part, Sinclair presented a "youth colony" thesis, which asserted that the hip youth of America were in fact a persecuted "colony," with similarities to both urban blacks and Third World anti-imperialist movements, such as the VietCong (National Liberation Front) in South Vietnam. "Our culture is a revolutionary culture," he stated, adding "we have to realize that the long-haired dope-smoking rock and roll street-fucking culture is a whole thing, a revolutionary international cultural movement which is absolutely legitimate and absolutely valid." Opposing the youth colony, Sinclair saw a "pig power structure," reflecting the "low-energy death culture" of American capitalist society, which he believed would even resort to "kill us if they can get away with it." 55 Sinclair, Guitar Army, 147-53.

The culmination of this increasingly militant posturing was the creation of a "White Panther Myth," by which the group portrayed themselves as genuine revolutionaries who would not hesitate to take the struggle to the next level -- violence against the state. The White Panther Myth contained both offensive and defensive components. Rhetorically, Sinclair and Plamondon promised to "attack" and "assault" the capitalist power structure; they boasted of their creation of "high-energy rock and roll bands," for the purpose of "infiltrating the popular culture." 56 Ibid., 48. Yet their propaganda also spoke of being "dragged into t

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AquamansWrath
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36. "The Last Poets"
In response to Reply # 32


  

          

LAST POETS BIOGRAPHY

Last Poets were rappers of the civil rights era. Along with the changing domestic landscape came the New York City-hip group called The Last Poets, who used obstreperous verse to chide a nation whose inclination was to maintain the colonial yoke around the neck of the disenfranchised.

Shortly after the death of Martin Luther King, The Last Poets were born. David Nelson, Gylan Kain, and Abiodun Oyewole, were born on the anniversary of Malcolm X's birthday May 19, 1968 in Marcus Garvey Park. They grew from three poets and a drummer to seven young black and Hispanic artists: David Nelson, Gylan Kain, Abiodun Oyewole, Felipe Luciano, Umar Bin Hassan, Jalal Nurridin, and Suliamn El Hadi (Gil Scott Heron was never a member of the group). They took their name from a poem by South African poet Willie Kgositsile, who posited the necessity of putting aside poetry in the face of looming revolution.

"When the moment hatches in time's womb there will be no art talk," he wrote. "The only poem you will hear will be the spearpoint pivoted in the punctured marrow of the villain....Therefore we are the last poets of the world."

The Last Poets has brought together music and the word. Like Haki Madhubuti (Don L. Lee), they are/were modern day griots expressing the nation- building fervor of the Black Panthers in poems written for black people. As the great poet Amiri Baraka (LeRoi Jones) says, "The Last Poets are the prototype Rappers... the kina nigger you don never wanna meet!" They teach what America does to its Black men, what Black men do to themselves, and WHY!

Novelist/essayist Darius James, in his book "That's Blaxploitation!" (St. Martin's Griffin, 1995) recalled the impact of the Poets at their birth.

In 1970 the Last Poets released their first album and dropped a bomb on black Amerikkka's turntables. Muthafuckas ran f'cover.

Nobody was ready.

Had em scared o' revolution. Scared o' the whyte man's god complex. Scared o' subways. Scared o' each other. Scared o' themselves. And scared o' that totem of onanistic worship -- the eagle-clawed Amerikkkan greenback! The rhetoric made you mad. The drums made you pop your fingers. And the poetry made you sail on the cushions of a fine hashish high.

Most importantly, they made you think and kept you "correct" on a revolutionary level.

We all connected. 'Cause it was a Black communal thing. Like the good vibes and paper plate of red-peppered potato salad at a neighborhood barbecue. The words and the rhythms were relevant. We joined together around the peace pipe and the drum. And when it came to the rhythms of the drums, the drums said, "Check your tired-ass ideology at the door."

With withering attacks on everything from racists to government to the bourgeoisie, their spoken word albums preceded politically laced R&B projects such as Marvin Gaye's What's Going On and foreshadowed the work of hard-hitting rap groups such as Public Enemy. Their classic poems Niggers are scared of Revolution, This is Madness, When the Revolution Comes (not to be confused with Oyewole's modern version linked above), and Gashman were released on their two record albums Last Poets (1970) and This Is Madnesss (1971). I, the maker of this webpage, learned the poems of both albums from the lyrics on the back.

During their late 60s and early 70s they connected with the violent factions of the SNCC (Student Non-Violent Coordinating Committee), the SDS (Students for a Democratic Society), and the Black Panther party. They went through confrontations with the FBI and police, and went arrests for robbing the Ku Klux Klan and various other ventures with Revolution in mind. Abiodun Oyewole received a 12-to-20-year jail sentence, but served less than four years.

Like Oyewole, Umar Bin Hassan was able to overcome the urban social maladies of a broken home, child abuse, a musician-father doing jail time, the dog-eat-dog world of public housing in Akron Ohio, and his own crack addiction. Hassan dispenses with the eloquence of classic English verse, for the gritty, in-your-face cadence of the 'hood.

They also fought each other and split into two groups. One, including Jalal Nuriddin, who wrote Wake Up Niggers, and Suleiman el-Hadi, was known as "The Last Poets" and the other, including Abiodun Oyewole and Umar Bin Hassan, while also original members, was billed as "Formerly of the Last Poets." It was a legal dispute, fundamentally, and for years there was talk of reconcilation. Nuriddin and el-Hadi also were active, though mostly in the UK (Nuriddin has been based in London for some years). In an early 90's Paris where Umar Bin Hassan was preparing for a Last Poet concert, Jalal mysteriously appeared and stabbed Hassan in the throat. Attempting to learn their own lessons, at present only Oyewole and Hassan (shown at the top of this page) remain of the original Last Poets in the group, and have the right to call themselves that title.



The Last Poets made four albums. Oyewole, at times with Hassan, at time without, made a number of others. On the albums, there are many special guests. Bill Laswell has appeared with the group during much of the 90s. They participated in the 1994 Lollapalooza tour; performed in John Singleton's "Poetic Justice" film and Holy Terror has Senegalese drummer Aiyb Dieng and his longtime collaborator, former Coltrane protege Pharoah Sanders to add some fireworks on sax. Hassan has the CD Be Bop or Be Dead. Anyway, a mid 90s performance of Oyewole and Hassan can be heard on the Stolen Moments: Red Hot and Blue compilation, which also ran on PBS as a video. On the fourth album since 1993,Time Has Come, Chuck D, co-founder of Public Enemy appears.

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:16 AM

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44. "The Great Frank Zappa "Aids is a CIA Plot""
In response to Reply # 36


  

          

he Duke of Prunes Frank Zappa 1940-1993
Monday, Dec. 20, 1993 By MICHAEL WALSH
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Frank Zappa surely would have appreciated -- indeed, relished -- the irony ! that his death last week was, as the old show-biz line has it, a shrewd career move. The musical iconoclast, best known for his work with the seminal 1960s rock band the Mothers of Invention, was in many ways the prisoner of his own raffish image: hirsute hippie freak; countercultural sire of prototypical Valley Girl Moon Unit Zappa and her siblings Dweezil, Ahmet and Diva; opinionated crank ("AIDS is a CIA plot"); and First Amendment scourge of Tipper Gore. With his death from prostate cancer, a few days short of his 53rd birthday, it may now be easier to appreciate an often overlooked fact about Francis Vincent Zappa: he was the most protean and adventurous American composer of his generation.
Yes, composer. "The only reason I went into rock 'n' roll," he explained, "is because I couldn't get anybody to play the classical music that I wrote." During a career that spanned three decades, Zappa never pretended or wanted to be anything else. On the first Mothers' album, 1966's Freak Out!, he quoted the maxim of his hero, the '20s avant-gardist Edgard Varese: "The present-day composer refuses to die." They were words he lived by.
In addition to his 12 albums with the Mothers and his numerous other rock recordings, Zappa collaborated with the likes of composer Pierre Boulez and conductor Zubin Mehta on such pieces as The Perfect Stranger, a collection of chamber music, and 200 Motels, an "opera for television." The self-taught Zappa was as prickly and puckish about his "serious" music as he was about rock. "I write," he declared, "because I am personally amused by what I do, and if other people are amused by it, then it's fine. If they're not, then that's also fine."
Born in Baltimore, Zappa was the son of a Sicilian-born meteorologist and metallurgist who worked for a poison-gas manufacturer -- the inspiration, perhaps, for his later Prelude to the Afternoon of a Sexually Aroused Gas Mask. The family moved to California when he was 10, and young Frank grew up in Lancaster, north of Los Angeles. "I developed an affinity to creeps," he recalled, "and I've surrounded myself with them ever since." At 15 he read a magazine article that referred to Varese's audacious compositions as "the ugliest music in the world," and he knew he had to hear them; for a birthday present, he cajoled his parents into letting him telephone the old man, then 72 and living in New York City.

Throughout his life, Zappa's music was both eclectic and uneven. At his worst he could be amateurish, as in the early Return of the Son of Monster Magnet. On guitar Zappa was no Eric Clapton, and as a band the Mothers were no match for Lou Reed's raw Velvet Underground, with whom they shared an in-your- face aesthetic that guaranteed zero radio play. At his best, however, Zappa fused two seemingly irreconcilable 20th century musical strains; his masterpiece, Absolutely Free (1967), is a dazzling merger of Stravinsky and Varese with rock and rhythm and blues. Who else would have thought to counterpoint the Berceuse from Stravinsky's Firebird with the doo-wop of Duke of Earl on a song called The Duke of Prunes? To quote The Rite of Spring and Petrouchka as a prelude to some of the hardest-charging, straight-ahead rock of the era? To use Varese's musique concrete, which alters conventionally produced sounds to create an electronic effect, in a paean to rock-groupie archetype Suzy Creamcheese?
His post-Mothers work, including Lumpy Gravy (1967), which Zappa called a "curiously inconsistent piece which started out to be a ballet but probably didn't make it," never quite reached the same freewheeling, free- associating level, although it became more ambitious and technically accomplished. In such works as The Yellow Shark, a 90-minute program of his instrumental music performed last year in Europe, his natural predilections for spiky, dissonant sonorities and unusual sound effects were fully in evidence, exemplifying his Cage-like motto of AAAFNRAA -- "Anything anytime anyplace for no reason at all."
By the end of his life, Zappa had all but abandoned rock; the '60s icon who had posed sitting naked on a toilet for a poster called Phi Zappa Krappa was instead encouraging young audiences to register to vote and battling censorship of rock lyrics. After cancer was diagnosed in 1990, he worked 14 hours a day in his home studio in the Hollywood Hills, composing a musical called Thing-Fish and contemplating an opera. With Suzy Creamcheese finally grown up, Zappa dropped the entertainer's mask, revealing the face of the artist beneath. "My music," he said, "makes the mind think."

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Who's fucking wit B More right now?

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Earl Flynn
Member since Dec 08th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:17 AM

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45. "Cointelpro: NOW THAT'S FASCIST!"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

-

Each progressive spirit is opposed by a thousand mediocre minds appointed to guard the past. ~
Maurice Maeterlinck

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:18 AM

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46. "lol..."
In response to Reply # 45


  

          

right.

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Earl Flynn
Member since Dec 08th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:27 AM

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58. "in a way it kinda reminds me of"
In response to Reply # 46


  

          

what Arabs are going thru today here in America with the Patriot Act, amongst other things.

They used the same type of propoganda on "us" that they are using on the Arab population today.

Each progressive spirit is opposed by a thousand mediocre minds appointed to guard the past. ~
Maurice Maeterlinck

  

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Ill Jux
Member since Jan 19th 2007
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:23 PM

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84. "RE: in a way it kinda reminds me of"
In response to Reply # 58


  

          

They used the same type of propoganda on "us" that they are using on the Arab population today<<<<<<<<<<<<

i've moticed this since 9/11, it's almost like a script reread.

______

in the memory of NYC upt JUX�

<--- don't front, you'd smash

  

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AquamansWrath
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:25 PM

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85. "Bingo again... War on Terror/ War on Drugs..."
In response to Reply # 84


  

          

and all the connecting dots in between...

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Who's fucking wit B More right now?

"Freedom is a Lie" - the animals

  

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Earl Flynn
Member since Dec 08th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 02:34 PM

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137. "Which all falls under The Dialectic"
In response to Reply # 85


  

          

and history repeating itself.

Each progressive spirit is opposed by a thousand mediocre minds appointed to guard the past. ~
Maurice Maeterlinck

  

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Earl Flynn
Member since Dec 08th 2005
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139. "I AM SOOOOOOOOOOOO GLAD"
In response to Reply # 84


  

          

someone else on OKP noticed this (besides Aqua)

Each progressive spirit is opposed by a thousand mediocre minds appointed to guard the past. ~
Maurice Maeterlinck

  

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AquamansWrath
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Thu Mar-01-07 03:39 PM

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154. "haha.."
In response to Reply # 139


  

          

and these dudes have no idea why hiphop is so powerful... none.
or Malcolm for that matter.

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sha mecca
Member since Oct 21st 2004
64667 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 11:25 AM

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56. "say it again."
In response to Reply # 45


  

          

www.mybabystayfresh.com

  

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AquamansWrath
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57. "namean."
In response to Reply # 56


  

          

I'm waiting for all the Toms to show up.
One is here...
I'm sure the rest are being informed.

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"Freedom is a Lie" - the animals

  

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explizit
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:48 AM

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66. "Asskap thinks "pro-black" music is akin to facism"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://myspace.com/bambumusic

www.individualsole.com

http://www.individualsole.com/?p=5256

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGH3OuP9Sek

  

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AquamansWrath
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Thu Mar-01-07 11:52 AM

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68. "Scared niggaz snitched on Harriet Tubman too..."
In response to Reply # 66


  

          

and chose to pick cotton as oppossed to fighting for thier lives.

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"Freedom is a Lie" - the animals

  

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explizit
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79. "basically."
In response to Reply # 68


  

          

this whole contrarian movement is hilarious. all of a sudden "Art" is bad. being smart is bad. being ignant and dumb is whats in..if you dont at least act like youre dumb and ignant people will label you an elitist for just simply using your brain. oh heavens! oh no, dont use your brain, thats so not in.

http://myspace.com/bambumusic

www.individualsole.com

http://www.individualsole.com/?p=5256

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGH3OuP9Sek

  

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Earl Flynn
Member since Dec 08th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 12:06 PM

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70. "LMAO! @ Asskap"
In response to Reply # 66


  

          

I'm an ASCAP member....

Each progressive spirit is opposed by a thousand mediocre minds appointed to guard the past. ~
Maurice Maeterlinck

  

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explizit
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78. "lol!"
In response to Reply # 70


  

          

http://myspace.com/bambumusic

www.individualsole.com

http://www.individualsole.com/?p=5256

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGH3OuP9Sek

  

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estipi
Member since Oct 24th 2005
2009 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 12:11 PM

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71. "this looks like a GREAT post..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

i'm tagging this so i can read later

very interesting, cause i just caught "Bastards of the Party" last night and this clearly relates to the overall issue

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
those who make peaceful revolution impossible only make violent revolution inevitable-MLK

  

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Earl Flynn
Member since Dec 08th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 12:33 PM

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74. "it is... I'm tryin to get work done and isht LMAO!"
In response to Reply # 71


  

          

It's hard though....

Each progressive spirit is opposed by a thousand mediocre minds appointed to guard the past. ~
Maurice Maeterlinck

  

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FuriousStyles3000
Member since Jan 18th 2007
860 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 12:50 PM

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75. "this is good stuff"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

this post brings to mind my fav quote- "when you control a man's thinking, you don't have to worry about his actions" Carter G. Woodson

some of this i am up on and some i am not. i will print some of this out and read it later.

i posted not too long ago about nwa being the yin to public enemy's yang. they helped father all the crap in the game now.

i never put anything past the govt. they are the biggest gangsters around.

_________________
When you control a man's thinking, you don't have to worry about his actions.
-Carter G. Woodson

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 12:59 PM

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77. "Bingo"
In response to Reply # 75


  

          

yes they did... Dr. Dre has sold nothing but DEATH.
Hence Death Row.

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Musa
Member since Mar 08th 2006
14948 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 12:56 PM

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76. "Awesome post"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

.

<----

Soundcloud.com/aquil84

(HIP HOP)
http://aquil.bandcamp.com

  

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realityrap
Member since Sep 21st 2005
8379 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 01:13 PM

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80. "My nigga! (c) alonzo"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:20 PM

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81. "You forgot about BPP vs US shift to Crips vs Bloods"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I mean if you want to talk about this shit for real lets talk about it man.

What about the fact that Suge Knight is a fed?

Pac & Big?

The Chronic as cointelpro?

4/4 as mind control?

Government weed?

While this may be new to some, I've seen all of this shit before. What I haven't seen is people ready to discuss the implications and then get into solutions. Let's talk bout that. Other wise what's the point.

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." © Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:22 PM

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82. "How about... YOU explain... let's get down then..."
In response to Reply # 81


  

          

I'm all eyes.

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:28 PM

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88. "there's actually a great doc on bpp vs us into crips vs bloods"
In response to Reply # 82


  

          

but who knows if it'll ever see the light of day.

the long and short of it is that the govt fueled money into us (United Slaves) for weapons and such to create a conflict between them and the bpp which while they may have had guns would not have been considered a militant group. us ended up killing a bunch of bpp, cats went to jail. other cointel opperations on bpp helped pull it a part, but in its wake rose the color gangs which interestingly enough were broken out the same way that us bpp was. all done to ensure that there was no unity in the community around upliftment.

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." © Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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Ill Jux
Member since Jan 19th 2007
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:31 PM

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92. "he don't wanna explain, he just said that cuz he feels that slave..."
In response to Reply # 82
Thu Mar-01-07 01:40 PM by Ill Jux

  

          

blood burnin in him cuz this post is filled with too much truth. negroes have been conditioned to fear rebellion.

______

in the memory of NYC upt JUX�

<--- don't front, you'd smash

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:38 PM

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96. "i just started..."
In response to Reply # 92


  

          

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." © Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:35 PM

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94. "the chronic and gubment weed"
In response to Reply # 82


  

          

remember the plot of half baked. gubment making that potent potent shit. chappelle goes to steal and start selling it. hollywood fiction right. well the solitary nigga stealing and selling is cause you know somebody been making a profit.

60's 70's 80's were all about experimentation. which drugs could be best used for population control. acid.... nah. too unpredictable. heroine.... nah. too deadly. cocaine.... nah, we like it too much. crack cocaine.... well to a degree, but only in the tear apart the community regard. what about the keep them niggas in check regard. weed. well that's a good one if it only could be better controled. in its natural state the effects aren't really controllable. but if we could genetically modify a more potent variety there may be potential. few years in the lab and tadow. yeah this shit is potent. now all we need is a way to promote it.

pretty much every grade of marijuana today unless it is organicly grown outdoors, is a government strain or has cross polinated with a government strain.

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." © Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
8480 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 01:42 PM

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97. "Excellent... yes continue..."
In response to Reply # 94


  

          

I know your right, hence Bush, Freeway Rick... remember Bush ran the CIA southeast Asia programs and was responsible for Heroin flooding out streets again in the 70's...
but these also needs to come out of the mouth of someone else...
otherwise it will just look like aqua, aqua, aqua..
I know you know...
knowledge them...

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:44 PM

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99. "forget everything you've heard pac was killed because..."
In response to Reply # 82


  

          

the minute he said "aight my niggas, fuck all the bullshit, let's start the revolution" he had an army of over 5 million soilders behind him. before he got killed him and big were probably months from reconcilliation.

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." © Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:48 PM

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104. "there are a few reasons why..."
In response to Reply # 99


  

          

also the PHD version of the Thug code as put to Sunny Carson, his stepfather Shakur and a few serious cats out of the D, LA, ATL, and Miami... it was some serious shit..

they dicuss this on a DVD called Cocaine City, his stepfather breaks it all down..
days after their meeting he caught the rape charge
then the next day he got gunned down in Quad studios...

there are more dynamics at play...
did the same thing to Malcolm...

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:57 PM

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108. "reason why he changed his persona"
In response to Reply # 104


  

          

may have bought him a few years on his life. but at the end of the day...

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." © Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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110. "Hmmm... yeah..."
In response to Reply # 108


  

          

crazy right...

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Who's fucking wit B More right now?

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Earl Flynn
Member since Dec 08th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:26 PM

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86. "We been discussing that isht"
In response to Reply # 81


  

          

That's why we're invading THE LESSON

Each progressive spirit is opposed by a thousand mediocre minds appointed to guard the past. ~
Maurice Maeterlinck

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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89. "hahaha..."
In response to Reply # 86


  

          

invasion - Nas

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:28 PM

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90. "ahhhh.... now i get it"
In response to Reply # 86


  

          

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." © Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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Officer Tackleberry
Member since Nov 21st 2005
72 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 01:35 PM

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93. "shhhhhhhhhh!"
In response to Reply # 81


  

          

>What about the fact that Suge Knight is a fed?

Rats are a pig's best friend!

  

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Earl Flynn
Member since Dec 08th 2005
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Fri Mar-02-07 10:38 AM

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201. "LMAO!"
In response to Reply # 93


  

          

there he is.....

Each progressive spirit is opposed by a thousand mediocre minds appointed to guard the past. ~
Maurice Maeterlinck

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Fri Mar-02-07 10:43 AM

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202. "yo... that cat..."
In response to Reply # 201


  

          

unfucking real.

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Ill Jux
Member since Jan 19th 2007
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:47 PM

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102. "i agree with you, but the point is to digset the info and discuss it"
In response to Reply # 81


  

          

>>>>>>>While this may be new to some, I've seen all of this shit before. What I haven't seen is people ready to discuss the implications and then get into solutions. Let's talk bout that. Other wise what's the point. <<<<<<<<<<<


nigguhz have a habbit of doin that a lot, for what reason i don't know. yeah we need solutions and ways to counter the bullshit, but damm let's at least digest this info fully. who's to say a solution may already be found in one of the responses.

anyway, i've actually been thinking suge has been cia for the last 5 or so years. just by the his actions and the what he represents, he is the perfect cia op.

______

in the memory of NYC upt JUX�

<--- don't front, you'd smash

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:50 PM

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105. "anytime your embaressed of being Pro Black..."
In response to Reply # 102
Thu Mar-01-07 01:50 PM by AquamansWrath

  

          

obviously mad niggaz don't know and thought that shit was no different than say a pair of Karl Kani jeans...
put em on while their hot..
take em off when their not...

so it's best to lay it out first...
then we offer solutions..
however the solution to these problems should be obvious as hell.

Not to mention if niggaz was up on this..
how come it was never posted before?

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:58 PM

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111. "i had a couple of posts deleted a year ago"
In response to Reply # 105


  

          

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." © Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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113. "now is your time to reverse that.. break it down..."
In response to Reply # 111


  

          

'explain it to them' - older brother from Wierd Science

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Ill Jux
Member since Jan 19th 2007
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Thu Mar-01-07 02:00 PM

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112. "RE: anytime your embaressed of being Pro Black..."
In response to Reply # 105
Thu Mar-01-07 02:02 PM by Ill Jux

  

          

so it's best to lay it out first...
then we offer solutions..
however the solution to these problems should be obvious as hell


^^^ i agree with everything stated above, i said that in response to implvc dude.

oh, i saw this article on blackelectorate too, but decided not to read it, my bad.

______

in the memory of NYC upt JUX�

<--- don't front, you'd smash

  

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mr_graff
Member since Jan 25th 2006
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Fri Mar-02-07 04:16 PM

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240. "where can i get info on the part about 4/4 music?"
In response to Reply # 81


          


  

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Ill Jux
Member since Jan 19th 2007
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95. "i've been sayin this for a while, the gov't kilt hip hop"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

every time i allude to this negroes look at me like i' just sayin some ole next shit. the record labels have been destroying all substance in hip hop as a whole for years, and i've always thought the gov has been behind this.

______

in the memory of NYC upt JUX�

<--- don't front, you'd smash

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:42 PM

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98. "They killed JFK on TV.. .His brother... X and King..."
In response to Reply # 95


  

          

of course a couple or rap niggaz aint nothing.

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:45 PM

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100. "on jfk... pharoahe actually exposed that shit in guns drawn video"
In response to Reply # 98


  

          

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." © Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:46 PM

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101. "haven't seen it yet..."
In response to Reply # 100


  

          

but I heard it's a must see...
government issues heroin is a problem.

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Who's fucking wit B More right now?

"Freedom is a Lie" - the animals

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 02:14 PM

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123. "watch jackie"
In response to Reply # 101


  

          

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZ6-FYAngvc

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." © Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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AFKAP_of_Darkness
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106. "*smh*"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

can't believe i just wasted like an hour reading this whole post.

some niggers sure love conspiracy theories, don't they?

_____________________

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The man who thinks at 50 the same way he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life - Muhammed Ali

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 01:57 PM

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109. "niggers there sellout Joe? Or niggaz?"
In response to Reply # 106
Thu Mar-01-07 01:59 PM by AquamansWrath

  

          

and if your saying

John Lennon
Sun Ra
Fela
Bob MArley
Peter Tosh
Frank Zappa
Chuck D
Saul Williams
versus... an okayplayer who's embaressed of his Previous BLACKNESS and consciousness... then yeah.

Keep picking that cotton, it'll bring you back to Darkness.

OH and it's NIGGA.. .not NIGGER like you typed.

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Who's fucking wit B More right now?

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 02:01 PM

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114. "funny thing is yall would be allies if it weren't for semantics"
In response to Reply # 109


  

          

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." © Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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AFKAP_of_Darkness
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Thu Mar-01-07 02:03 PM

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118. "imcvspl... i could NEVER be allies with the enemies of logic."
In response to Reply # 114


  

          

_____________________

http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2010/287/6/c/the_wire_lineup__huge_download_by_dennisculver-d30s7vl.jpg
The man who thinks at 50 the same way he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life - Muhammed Ali

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 02:04 PM

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120. "Hmm... The Four Tops are better than the Temps is logic?"
In response to Reply # 118


  

          

Lol.
Try harder.

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AFKAP_of_Darkness
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Thu Mar-01-07 02:11 PM

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122. "no... it's an opinion."
In response to Reply # 120


  

          

just like: in my OPINION, you are full of shit.

now... on the other hand, if i were to say that you have a tendency to make posts that are full of lies and half-truths and then push them through with an aggressive, bullying style of posting... that would not be an opinion: it would be a FACT.

some of you negroes are just silly to me, for real... you have very little grasp of your own history. rather than studying up about your heritage, you go and "Stolen Legacy" or "Afrocentricity" and other tracts of extremely dubious scholarship.

i mean, shit... Aqua, aren't you the guy who tried to argue that fucking SOUTH AFRICA was in some way connected musically to Nigeria and Ghana... in the middle of APARTHEID?? hell, even now that South Africa is "free," it's still barely connected to the rest of Africa culturally.

but nope... couldn't nobody tell you nothing. no matter how many facts are presented, Aqua would rather hold fast to his own ridiculous beliefs.

i mean, lonesome_d - a WHITE GUY - just schooled you about the roots of American Negro music in this very post. but will you listen?

*shrug*

i'm not gonna argue with you funny-style negrroes no more.

i really don't care if you call me an Uncle Tom... shit, they called Booker T. Washington a Tom too, so i'm in good company.

keep on feeding your conspiracies there, Huey.

LOL

_____________________

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The man who thinks at 50 the same way he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life - Muhammed Ali

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 02:15 PM

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124. "THe US Gov. Vs. John Lennon...."
In response to Reply # 122
Thu Mar-01-07 02:19 PM by AquamansWrath

  

          

and there you have it.
WE have heard your opinion... you bitched up...
trust... we know all we need to know about your shook, stepnfetch it, afraid if your image, ass...

thanks... now it's time for the MEN to speak.
PEACE.


Yawn.. as far as Lonesome D... he doesn't understand why we coded our songs... hence songs by those same groups he mentioned like
Memphis blues

Cocaine Blues are not going to mention the CIA..
just the ills of economics, race...etc.
Ask ANY veteran blues player or jazz cat who LIVED it... he will agree with what I say... trust me on that.
Watch the documentary on Chuck Berry, he eloquently breaks this down to Jerry Lee Lewis..
just like I broke it down to YOU and the OTHER white boy.
Peace.

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AFKAP_of_Darkness
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Thu Mar-01-07 02:24 PM

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129. "*pssst* hey Kingfish... lemme pull your coat to something!"
In response to Reply # 124


  

          

>Cocaine Blues are not going to mention the CIA..
>just the ills of economics, race...etc.

"Cocaine Blues" ain't gonna mention the CIA because the CIA didn't exist when the song was written.

LEARN YOUR HISTORY

shit... didn't we just come outta February?

it's a fucking shame, yo... i'm not even being facetious here. it breaks my fucking heart that this kind of Black ignorance can be flaunted so liberally. in 2007!

>Ask ANY veteran blues player or jazz cat who LIVED it... he
>will agree with what I say... trust me on that.
>Watch the documentary on Chuck Berry, he eloquently breaks
>this down to Jerry Lee Lewis..

Chuck Berry also filmed women going to the toilet. AND---???

_____________________

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The man who thinks at 50 the same way he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life - Muhammed Ali

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 02:26 PM

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130. "Right... thanks KAP... again... you have had your chance..."
In response to Reply # 129


  

          

and you chose to lift your skirt up.. .
for those of who ARE NOT EMBARESSED by the Problack movement...it's our turn to speak... thanks.


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AFKAP_of_Darkness
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Thu Mar-01-07 02:32 PM

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135. "speak all you want, brother..."
In response to Reply # 130


  

          

i ain't stoppin' you or studyin' you

babble on in your Babylon


MOST of the shit you're saying in this post can be discredited quite easily, through the most rudimentary research (mind you, SOME of what you IS in fact true... SOME of it) but if it makes you feel better to believe in this massive conspiracy theory keeping the Black man down... be my guest.

some Negroes really NEED to have fairy tales like this in order to wrap themselves in the comforting salve of perpetual victimhood.

other Negroes are just interested in ascending.

_____________________

http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2010/287/6/c/the_wire_lineup__huge_download_by_dennisculver-d30s7vl.jpg
The man who thinks at 50 the same way he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life - Muhammed Ali

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 02:34 PM

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136. "Right..... thanks for your input..."
In response to Reply # 135


  

          

you are free to go.

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Who's fucking wit B More right now?

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AFKAP_of_Darkness
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Thu Mar-01-07 02:34 PM

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138. "*goes*"
In response to Reply # 136


  

          

_____________________

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The man who thinks at 50 the same way he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life - Muhammed Ali

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 02:35 PM

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140. "ascend my brother... ascend..."
In response to Reply # 138


  

          

:)

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explizit
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9990 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 02:52 PM

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142. "yay!"
In response to Reply # 138


  

          

http://myspace.com/bambumusic

www.individualsole.com

http://www.individualsole.com/?p=5256

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGH3OuP9Sek

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
8480 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 03:26 PM

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147. "Bingo... now let's review...."
In response to Reply # 142


  

          

a certain someone said

he's embaressed about the PROBLACK period in hiphop..
the same nigga who said

when did black music become artsy...

yeah I have a problem with ANYONE
who continuously sees the same problems...
the same patterns
from the same people
against the same people
and defend it by saying I'm crazy... right...

I listen to Sun Ra, I read Miles, I read the words of Malcolm, I read the words of Sonny Carson, the Last Poets... I know what we are dealing with...
if you choose Jeezy... Choose Jeezy... that nigga looks and acts like Idi Amin... if that's you... do you...
but never tell me I'm crazy.
Cause there were thousands of niggaz on their roofs in New Orleans who will show you what crazy was...

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explizit
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9990 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 03:33 PM

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150. "Black americans created jazz and this fucker wants to ask"
In response to Reply # 147


  

          

"where art came into it"? wtf? I swear dude is braindead.

http://myspace.com/bambumusic

www.individualsole.com

http://www.individualsole.com/?p=5256

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGH3OuP9Sek

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Thu Mar-01-07 03:38 PM

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153. "I would love to hear a OKP ask Miles or Coltrane that same shit"
In response to Reply # 150


  

          

clowns man... I swear...
when we drink water we are art.... these niggaz.

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explizit
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Thu Mar-01-07 03:45 PM

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156. "Im reading "Myself When I Am Real" a bio of Mingus"
In response to Reply # 153


  

          

its fucking amazing. I've always loved dudes music. I have that doc. where hes in his workshop as they're evicting him and hes talking, playing music, has his daughter around. Dude was so ahead of his time. Took art, jazz to another level. And we got fools like asskap on these boards saying black people dont create art? man.

http://myspace.com/bambumusic

www.individualsole.com

http://www.individualsole.com/?p=5256

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGH3OuP9Sek

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
8480 posts
Thu Mar-01-07 03:48 PM

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158. "Heart * He* art"
In response to Reply # 156
Thu Mar-01-07 03:50 PM by AquamansWrath

  

          

Exactly... the very idea of God is art... hence creation.
Mingus would slap that nigga silly.
Not only did he completely understand art..
he and his woman worked to retain ownership during a time most niggaz couldn't see driving thier own cab.
he was a bad motherfucker. A real man, who regretted nothing.

My head hurts from reading these bitch niggaz go on and on about shit that aint real...
gossiping about shit that aint real...
and never ONCE dealing with the real issues.

Any man that tries to seperate black people from their art or being artistic... is a devil. PERIOD.

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Zap Furer
Member since Dec 11th 2003
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Fri Mar-02-07 09:42 AM

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184. "HOOORAY!!!!!"
In response to Reply # 138


  

          

The bitchmade nigga is dead

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The murder rate is dropping (I see you gangsta rap)
Meth is the hottest narcotic amongst the impoverished (coke rap stand up!)
Hip Hop "L"ost!

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Fri Mar-02-07 09:55 AM

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190. "hahaha..."
In response to Reply # 184


  

          

hahaha... now that was funny as hell.

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lonesome_d
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169. "*gasp*"
In response to Reply # 122


          

>i mean, lonesome_d - a WHITE GUY -

classified info!

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Fri Mar-02-07 08:46 AM

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171. "nah the gasp is you hitting my inbox asking for my music..."
In response to Reply # 169


  

          

thinking you were slick. Lol.

First off, this post isn't about Jubmusic... but the one thing I don't expect you to get is understanding why thier music was primarily uplifting, major key music.
That music came out of poverty...
racism...
and just the climate of the day. That is conscious music. Anytime you can deal with White America in thier foulest form and turn around and make music to uplift your spirit and those around you... nothing is more conscious.

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Who's fucking wit B More right now?

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lonesome_d
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186. "I'm still curious about your music, but if you don't want to share,"
In response to Reply # 171


          

that's cool.

And now that you've rephrased your argument to be more along the lines of Kayru's, I don't have any beef with it - even if songs that begin with "I wouldn't marry a Black woman, tell you the reason why..." ('A Black Woman Is Like A Black Snake') or "I got a girl and her name is Eve, ev'ry time I hit her she holler 'Police!" (Tear It Down) are hard to envision as being pro-Black or 'conscious' in any way.

They do jam, though. You should really listen to some of that stuff. My other post is still on the boards at

http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=5&topic_id=1091430&mesg_id=1091430&listing_type=search

  

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AquamansWrath
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Fri Mar-02-07 09:50 AM

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188. "Uh no sir, I don't think you know Aqua, I speak for SELF..."
In response to Reply # 186


  

          

and if you look at my reply's from yesterday I was saying the same thing...
I don't expect white people to get it cause they never do for the most part... with exceptions...
and because segregation divided people so that..
the poor lived in thier world
the non poor in theirs... all you would see are niggaz smiling.
and would think... 'wow, those niggaz sure are happy'.

Nah, I'm not sharing, who are you?

You having a problem with anything I say don't mean shit.
I don't need your validation. At all. By you or your peoples.
In fact you don't have that power. Ever.
Lol.
Arrogant ass people.
All that shit I posted about MC5, Frank Zappa, Marley, you find one sentence and try to exploit it? haha... typical.

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lonesome_d
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195. "I'm not private about my real world info."
In response to Reply # 188


          


>Nah, I'm not sharing, who are you?

But what does it matter who I am? You say you're a musician; I asked politely to hear some of your music.

>You having a problem with anything I say don't mean shit.
>I don't need your validation. At all. By you or your
>peoples.
>In fact you don't have that power. Ever.
>Lol.
>Arrogant ass people.
>All that shit I posted about MC5, Frank Zappa, Marley, you
>find one sentence and try to exploit it? haha... typical.

*sigh* As I said, I don't particularly care about them, and have read conspiracy theories on them in the past. I did read the White Panther stuff you posted over in Activist, and it's pretty interesting. I just don't like their music all that much.

I do, however, like blues. Very much. And I've gone waaaaaaaaay out of my way on these boards to encourage people to listen to historic blues recordings and draw their own conclusions about the music. But because I disagree with you, I'm arrogant?



  

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AquamansWrath
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Fri Mar-02-07 10:12 AM

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196. "if you are truly encouraging music... no your not..."
In response to Reply # 195


  

          

however...
when you trivialize... yes you are.
however... I question anyone who doesn't see the genius of MC5. Are you buggin? Maybe I should hip you to their documentary/performance for more understanding.
They were and are the truth.

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lonesome_d
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Fri Mar-02-07 10:16 AM

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199. "I recognize the genius of the MC5. I just don't like them much."
In response to Reply # 196


          

I've had Kick Out the Jams for 7 or 8 years. I don't listen to much rock overall anymore though, so tey're not exceptional in that regard... I probably would have loved them if I'd heard them in the mid-80s.

  

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AquamansWrath
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Fri Mar-02-07 10:22 AM

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200. "Why the mid 80's? Was that your rock moment? I understand that"
In response to Reply # 199


  

          

Being a musician I see the genius in them all day...
and then to know they risked it all for truth and righteousness just made me love them more.
I mean... I love Joy Divison too... completely different species and they toggle with unclarity as their purpose... even tho' Ian Curtis was a genius in my eyes. One of the few to come out of that scene actually. However...
there are serious blues elements with MC5 as that's how their guitarists learned to play. Mind you... I love electric blues... all day... have played with some of the best... and I love to get down...
so I understand that.
All I'm saying is... I also understand the element that produced it cause I was there.

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lonesome_d
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Fri Mar-02-07 03:33 PM

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235. "I grew up a classic rock fiend"
In response to Reply # 200


          

but by the late 1980s I was fine tuning my tastes away from rock and toward roots music. I've since taken a few divergences, but mostly my tastes are firmly rooted in my love of traditional music of all kinds.

>Being a musician I see the genius in them all day...

And being a musician I acknowledge their innovation and influence, but prefer not to listen to it.

>and then to know they risked it all for truth and
>righteousness just made me love them more.

Yes, but by many accounts their version of truth and righteousness also included misogyny, drug abuse, and a cult-like environmnet, all of which contribute to the diminishment of their overall ideals in my eye.


>All I'm saying is... I also understand the element that
>produced it cause I was there.

You were in Trans-Love Enterprises? If not, I have no clue what you mean.

  

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AquamansWrath
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Fri Mar-02-07 03:41 PM

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239. "of course you have no clue what I mean... exactly..."
In response to Reply # 235
Fri Mar-02-07 03:47 PM by AquamansWrath

  

          

that's my point...
i bet you the other cats on here know exactly what I mean.

It's one thing to play music..
it's quite another to live it.

As far as your love for our music, and music in general that's great...
you do realize the same climate that produced blues...
is now producing hiphop and things of the like right?

That not much has changed at all actually...
I mean I love blues too... no question... however have you ever looked past the record, the sensational aspects and realized the poltical/social climate behind the people making the music... not the record per se... but the music?

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lonesome_d
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Fri Mar-02-07 04:52 PM

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241. "ah, 'it' was meaning the blues, I thought you were still talking MC5."
In response to Reply # 239


          

yes, of course I try to look at the social context of music, whatever music I'm learning about. Have you checked out the post I referenced? I would hope if you'd read it and/or listened to the music I linked up in it, you'd recognize this.

The parallells between blues in the '20s and '30s and hip hop in the '80s and '90s are multitude. But if your thinking on hip hop is consistent with your thinking on blues, then you'd say all hip hop is positive, 'conscious' music, regardless of the actual subject matter, and I (along with many posters) can't get with that either.

  

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GumDrops
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Sat Mar-03-07 10:46 AM

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249. "exactly"
In response to Reply # 241


  

          

>The parallells between blues in the '20s and '30s and hip hop
>in the '80s and '90s are multitude. But if your thinking on
>hip hop is consistent with your thinking on blues, then you'd
>say all hip hop is positive, 'conscious' music, regardless of
>the actual subject matter, and I (along with many posters)
>can't get with that either.

but the conditions that surrounded/created blues back in the 20s are still quite different to the ones that hip hop came out of in the 80s and 90s, despite the commonalities

  

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AquamansWrath
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Mon Mar-05-07 09:10 AM

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255. "Um... I never said that."
In response to Reply # 241


  

          

And the same people, facing the same problems, as oppressed by the same white power structure... trust... WE understand this more than you ever could... so again, I'm not looking for your validation... cause you couldn't validate our experience if you tried...
you own the record
we own the skin.
there is a HUGE fucking difference.

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Who's fucking wit B More right now?

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Zap Furer
Member since Dec 11th 2003
1528 posts
Fri Mar-02-07 09:39 AM

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183. "You sir are NO Booker T."
In response to Reply # 122


  

          

keep it movin'

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The murder rate is dropping (I see you gangsta rap)
Meth is the hottest narcotic amongst the impoverished (coke rap stand up!)
Hip Hop "L"ost!

  

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AquamansWrath
Member since Apr 12th 2005
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Fri Mar-02-07 09:58 AM

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192. "I know right... that was arrogant as HELL... as if being a OKP"
In response to Reply # 183


  

          

makes this nigga on par with Booker T.

His infamous
Pharell is better than Dilla posts.
or
The FourTops are better than the Temps.
Equates him to Booker T? See... when you expect less from your people... you provide less.

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Who's fucking wit B More right now?

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