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Subject: "Since processed meats are bad, what is safe to eat at Subway?" Previous topic | Next topic
Starks dunked on Bulls
Member since Dec 07th 2011
12028 posts
Wed Jul-01-15 07:38 PM

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"Since processed meats are bad, what is safe to eat at Subway?"


  

          

Subway seems like my only option for lunch during my work days.

What's good on their menu? I had Tuna today but I don't think I can eat tuna everyday (due to mercury).

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
i'm only eating tuna or their pizzas
Jul 01st 2015
1
I only eat chicken.
Jul 01st 2015
2
their chicken is super processed
Jul 01st 2015
4
:(
Jul 01st 2015
6
man, just look at that shit.
Jul 01st 2015
8
I didn't know that. Whatever the case, chicken is the only meat
Jul 01st 2015
7
Their chicken is good?
Jul 01st 2015
5
      Hell nah. Subway chicken is like 39% rubber.
Jul 01st 2015
13
           lmaoooooooo
Jul 01st 2015
15
i like their veggie max (fake meat) or just plain veggie
Jul 01st 2015
3
lotsa fiber in their napkins.
Jul 01st 2015
9
RE: lotsa fiber in their napkins.
Jul 01st 2015
10
'safe' to eat at a fast food restaurant?
Jul 01st 2015
11
LOL
Jul 01st 2015
12
well, according to jrocc and stravinskian, they are just fine.
Jul 01st 2015
14
still waiting on that evidence to the contrary
Jul 02nd 2015
19
right? who cares about facts and "data"
Jul 02nd 2015
24
      conjecture
Jul 02nd 2015
27
      lol k.
Jul 02nd 2015
28
      You have no facts, you have no data,
Jul 03rd 2015
35
      I love when you try to talk politics, too.
Jul 03rd 2015
46
      And regarding your "facts."
Jul 03rd 2015
37
           https://youtu.be/QM0dbwDc2FE
Jul 03rd 2015
38
           How so?
Jul 03rd 2015
39
                nature doesnt have an optimal level beyond reproduction
Jul 03rd 2015
42
                So good health is a myth?
Jul 04th 2015
47
                     myth is your word, not mine
Jul 04th 2015
48
                          Are you talking about the reproductive system or the entire body?
Jul 04th 2015
56
                               im talking about all life. stravinskian had the right of it when he sai...
Jul 04th 2015
59
                                    Ok thanks for saying that...
Jul 04th 2015
60
                                         Vex claimed to be talking about what the body is "designed" to do.
Jul 06th 2015
99
                                              Yes - we should totally listen to the guy who thinks processed meats
Jul 07th 2015
109
                                                   And here's that strange fascination with my career again.
Jul 08th 2015
113
                ya this needs to be flushed out.
Jul 03rd 2015
43
                Of course, it's about far more than just athletic performance.
Jul 03rd 2015
44
                     did you just call the field of biochemistry "alchemy" ? lmao
Jul 04th 2015
53
                          thankfully, we have you here to enlighten us.
Jul 04th 2015
54
                               agreed
Jul 04th 2015
55
                Strav gonna strav.
Jul 03rd 2015
45
                     so now you are calling him a troll for knowing more than you?
Jul 04th 2015
49
                     Wait.
Jul 04th 2015
50
                     he has a phd in physics. that makes him a scientist
Jul 04th 2015
61
                     What does physics have to do with nutrition?
Jul 05th 2015
77
                          RE: What does physics have to do with nutrition?
Jul 05th 2015
78
                          point out the nutritionists in this post
Jul 06th 2015
82
                          There are none. That was the central theme to my post.
Jul 06th 2015
88
                          See also - malpractice insurance coverage limits.
Jul 06th 2015
97
                               Nah, i've been to him and been told i just had dry eye...
Jul 06th 2015
100
                                    naw.
Jul 06th 2015
102
                     lmfao
Jul 04th 2015
63
                     You fail even with Orwellian reversals.
Jul 06th 2015
98
                          yea that's deep.
Jul 06th 2015
105
I was barely even in that thread. You must really dislike me.
Jul 02nd 2015
22
Cooking for yourself isn't an option brah?
Jul 01st 2015
16
edit
Jul 03rd 2015
40
nothing. cook at home or buy food elsewhere.
Jul 02nd 2015
17
of course, you'll be fine if you eat there.
Jul 02nd 2015
18
they get *the people's eyebrow* when they try to front on the
Jul 02nd 2015
23
if you don't want processed food then don't eat at Subway
Jul 02nd 2015
20
supplement
Jul 02nd 2015
21
^^
Jul 02nd 2015
25
it's really all safe to eat...
Jul 02nd 2015
26
Compared to other fast food it's the best alternative no?
Jul 02nd 2015
29
      People are incredibly silly about this kind of stuff.
Jul 03rd 2015
34
           hmmmm
Jul 03rd 2015
36
           there are all kinds of studies on how processed meat
Jul 04th 2015
51
                But according to them, mortality rates don't indicate health...
Jul 04th 2015
64
                     From what i can see......
Jul 04th 2015
66
                          RE: From what i can see......
Jul 04th 2015
                          RE: From what i can see......
Jul 04th 2015
67
           ^^^^^ thanks for this
Jul 04th 2015
57
           I agree with "most" of what you said, but just want to point out that
Jul 05th 2015
69
           Reasonable points, especially in regard to trans fats.
Jul 06th 2015
93
           All the scientists say
Jul 05th 2015
75
                ^^^ not a scientist
Jul 06th 2015
83
                ^^^^ not literate or logical
Jul 06th 2015
89
                     lol
Jul 06th 2015
90
                          this post is high comedy
Jul 06th 2015
95
                Easy there, I never said all food is equally "good for you."
Jul 06th 2015
96
                     I'm just replying to this idea which is false.
Jul 06th 2015
101
                          My students often feel the same way.
Jul 06th 2015
103
Being from Philly, I can't eat that crap
Jul 03rd 2015
30
safe. it's special occasion food
Jul 03rd 2015
31
land of the free
Jul 03rd 2015
32
Since processed meats are bad, which processed meat should I choose
Jul 03rd 2015
33
I might actually try this Blue Apron thing
Jul 03rd 2015
41
good idea
Jul 06th 2015
85
RE: Since processed meats are bad, what is safe to eat at Subway?
Jul 04th 2015
52
Here's how they make it...
Jul 04th 2015
58
LMAO!
Jul 04th 2015
62
eat fresh!!
Jul 05th 2015
68
this is foolish. That's just fine for the body.
Jul 05th 2015
70
RE: Since processed meats are bad, what is safe to eat at Subway?
Jul 04th 2015
65
subway is trash
Jul 05th 2015
71
there are two subways in kenya
Jul 05th 2015
72
I call it 'dietary imperalism', lol
Jul 05th 2015
73
More misconception.
Jul 05th 2015
76
      ehh, I see you in some respects. However, why would obesity rates
Jul 05th 2015
80
           the nutritional dual-burden
Jul 06th 2015
84
I saw a knock-off KFC while in Nairobi. I wept.
Jul 05th 2015
74
      kenchick has always been there
Jul 06th 2015
81
           yup! that was it.
Jul 06th 2015
104
Subway is not edible
Jul 05th 2015
79
not sure myself
Jul 06th 2015
86
Yeah, I would gladly spend the extra $2-3
Jul 06th 2015
91
      i used to skip Subway and get a banh-mi
Jul 06th 2015
92
           banh-mi sounds yummy
Jul 06th 2015
106
i chew it and swallow it.
Jul 06th 2015
87
Not edible, huh?
Jul 06th 2015
94
i find this idea to be prominent in people from the northeast
Jul 07th 2015
108
The bread tastes like it was made from urea-formaldehyde insulation
Jul 07th 2015
107
In other news: Home of Subway Spokesman "Jared" searched for child porn
Jul 07th 2015
110
PLZ TELL ME U WASH YO PROCESSED MEETZ!!!!
Jul 08th 2015
111
Lmfao. Gotta wash them nitrates off, fam
Jul 08th 2015
112

Kwesi
Member since Jan 11th 2004
7370 posts
Wed Jul-01-15 07:42 PM

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1. "i'm only eating tuna or their pizzas "
In response to Reply # 0


          

  

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Shaun Tha Don
Member since Nov 19th 2005
18289 posts
Wed Jul-01-15 10:03 PM

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2. "I only eat chicken. "
In response to Reply # 0


          

Rest In Peace, Bad News Brown

  

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NikaMandela
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Wed Jul-01-15 10:21 PM

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4. "their chicken is super processed"
In response to Reply # 2


          

  

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Starks dunked on Bulls
Member since Dec 07th 2011
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Wed Jul-01-15 10:23 PM

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6. ":("
In response to Reply # 4


  

          

>

  

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NikaMandela
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Wed Jul-01-15 10:30 PM

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8. "man, just look at that shit."
In response to Reply # 6


          

thats not how chicken looks!

  

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Shaun Tha Don
Member since Nov 19th 2005
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Wed Jul-01-15 10:23 PM

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7. "I didn't know that. Whatever the case, chicken is the only meat"
In response to Reply # 4


          

I really care to eat.

Rest In Peace, Bad News Brown

  

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Starks dunked on Bulls
Member since Dec 07th 2011
12028 posts
Wed Jul-01-15 10:23 PM

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5. "Their chicken is good? "
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

>

Is it premium real chicken? or is it the same quality as 99cent chicken patties?

  

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Hitokiri
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Wed Jul-01-15 10:45 PM

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13. "Hell nah. Subway chicken is like 39% rubber."
In response to Reply # 5


  

          

legit.

--

"You can't beat white people. You can only knock them out."

  

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Boogie Stimuli
Member since Sep 24th 2010
14027 posts
Wed Jul-01-15 11:09 PM

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15. "lmaoooooooo"
In response to Reply # 13


          

~
~
~
~
~
Days like this I miss Sha Mecca

  

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NikaMandela
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3. "i like their veggie max (fake meat) or just plain veggie"
In response to Reply # 0


          

you can turn a veggie sub into something of a cheese pizza with by having them add some marinara sauce.

the veggie max is processed too but at least its not meat.

  

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SoWhat
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Wed Jul-01-15 10:33 PM

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9. "lotsa fiber in their napkins."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

fuck you.

  

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neuro_OSX
Member since Oct 29th 2004
1157 posts
Wed Jul-01-15 10:39 PM

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10. "RE: lotsa fiber in their napkins."
In response to Reply # 9


  

          

Cellulose does a body good

- said by a cow (probably) hahah

"You used to be so cool, but now, you know you're so cold"

  

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hardware
Member since May 22nd 2007
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Wed Jul-01-15 10:39 PM

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11. "'safe' to eat at a fast food restaurant?"
In response to Reply # 0


          

  

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Shaun Tha Don
Member since Nov 19th 2005
18289 posts
Wed Jul-01-15 10:44 PM

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12. "LOL"
In response to Reply # 11


          

Rest In Peace, Bad News Brown

  

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Vex_id
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Wed Jul-01-15 10:57 PM

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14. "well, according to jrocc and stravinskian, they are just fine."
In response to Reply # 0


          

so eat all the italian B.M.T. your heart desires.

-->

  

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jrocc
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Thu Jul-02-15 09:56 AM

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19. "still waiting on that evidence to the contrary"
In response to Reply # 14


          

take your time

  

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Vex_id
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Thu Jul-02-15 06:36 PM

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24. "right? who cares about facts and "data" "
In response to Reply # 19
Thu Jul-02-15 06:38 PM by Vex_id

          

http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2015/06/gut-bacteria-on-the-brain/395918/

I used to eat at Subway fairly often in my early 20's - I didn't die. In fact, the food didn't seem to affect me then, and I'm sure plenty of people eat Subway now and are "just fine."

The problem is, when there's an accumulative habit of consuming these foods - matched with an aging body that doesn't perform basic building blocks of good health, habits like eating processed foods at Subway every day catch up to you and can greatly impede your performance and quality of life as you age.

If you eat processed foods for decades and absorb considerable mileage on your body from age/environmental factors...*and* you don't a.) exercise; b.) hydrate properly and c.) consume nutrients mindfully - you're not giving yourself a chance to perform at a high level, which is what this is all about. What's interesting to explore is the evidence pointing to a causal link between attitude and mind-state with microbial activity in the gut.

These are just facts:

Processed meats/artificial foods are not going to create the kind of thriving gut-flora environment in the body that is necessary to be neurologically and physiologically whole. Gut bacteria can generate neuroactive chemicals that correspond to advanced levels of mental and physical health. Microbes in the gut can activate the vagus nerve, the main line of communication between the gut and the brain. In addition, the microbiome is intertwined with the immune system, which itself influences mood and behavior. We should be practicing lifestyle habits that activate this type of activity within the body.

The body was designed to generate optimum health, not to be transformed by invading microorganisms that seek to unseat the body's natural neuro-physiological balance. What we're discovering more widely now is that, there's actually microbial activity in the body that can greatly alter your mood and catalyze depression, anxiety, and a variety of other imbalances.

However, the mind will *still* convince you that there's actually nothing wrong with the yellow-9 additive. The cloned, processed cow that was tortured and slaughtered, festering with disease and pumped full of hormones and antibiotics? nah! those are good too. My grandfather ate those and he lived to be 89!

That's great. I see a lot of old, beat up 1980's caravans on the road too. They are functional and still operable, "alive" - but are they performing at optimum levels?

Most people take more care into fueling their luxury cars than they do their own bodies. That's where the #InnerWar is waged.




-->

  

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jrocc
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27. "conjecture"
In response to Reply # 24


          

you haven't actually provided any facts or data to support what you're saying. you've taken this article (which is pretty interesting mind you) and you've added your own ideas and formed your own conclusion. while i feel that you truly believe what you're saying, that doesn't make it fact. you seem to skip over the key points in the article because you want to believe what you want to believe. so even though it clearly states that the connection isn't even known yet YOU seem to have made the connection all on your own. you must be some kind of genius!

  

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Vex_id
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28. "lol k. "
In response to Reply # 27


          




-->

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Fri Jul-03-15 04:28 PM

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35. "You have no facts, you have no data, "
In response to Reply # 24


          


you don't know anything about how this works. You have an ideology that happens to be aligned with the fads of the day. You found a news story that has nothing whatsoever to do with your assertions, but you've either convinced yourself that it does, or you just hope people won't actually think about it too hard. You're working directly out of the Republican science denier playbook.

  

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Vex_id
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46. "I love when you try to talk politics, too."
In response to Reply # 35


          

gifts upon gifts.


-->

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Fri Jul-03-15 05:10 PM

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37. "And regarding your "facts.""
In response to Reply # 24


          

Colbert would maybe call it "factiness."

>These are just facts:
>
>Processed meats/artificial foods are not going to create the
>kind of thriving gut-flora environment in the body that is
>necessary to be neurologically and physiologically whole.

Why? You've just made that claim, without any justification whatsoever. What does processing have to do with gut flora?

>Gut
>bacteria can generate neuroactive chemicals that correspond to
>advanced levels of mental and physical health. Microbes in
>the gut can activate the vagus nerve, the main line of
>communication between the gut and the brain. In addition, the
>microbiome is intertwined with the immune system, which itself
>influences mood and behavior. We should be practicing
>lifestyle habits that activate this type of activity within
>the body.

Yeah, the microbiome is interesting, isn't it? Shame it has nothing whatsoever to do with the topic of discussion.

>The body was designed to generate optimum health,

First, the body was not "designed," for anything other than to be an efficient transmitter of its own genes. Second, the phrase "optimum health" doesn't mean anything.

> not to be
>transformed by invading microorganisms that seek to unseat the
>body's natural neuro-physiological balance.

Nature loves it when invading organisms, micro or otherwise, "unseat the body's natural balance." Nature makes lice that eat away the tongues of fish, and then take the place of those tongues to steal some fraction of the fish's food. If you eat unprocessed food from contaminated soil, a roundworm might just eat away your entire optic nerve, this is a statistically-significant cause of blindness in humans. A student right out of AP biology could go on and on and on.

Even this microbiome that you love so much, symbiotic as it is, is an example of foreign organisms introducting themselves into your body and upsetting your "natural neuro-physiological balance." Those critters aren't there to make you healthier or happier. They're there to reproduce, period.

>What we're
>discovering more widely now is that, there's actually
>microbial activity in the body that can greatly alter your
>mood and catalyze depression, anxiety, and a variety of other
>imbalances.

Yes, and this has nothing whatsoever to do with processed food, at least in any way you've shown us.

>However, the mind will *still* convince you that there's
>actually nothing wrong with the yellow-9 additive.

Well, the mind, and data. The two work best when used together.

>The
>cloned, processed cow that was tortured and slaughtered,
>festering with disease and pumped full of hormones and
>antibiotics?

See, hyperbolic rants don't constitute facts, or data.

>nah! those are good too. My grandfather ate
>those and he lived to be 89!
>
>That's great. I see a lot of old, beat up 1980's caravans on
>the road too. They are functional and still operable, "alive"
>- but are they performing at optimum levels?

Again, "performing at optimum levels" doesn't mean anything.

  

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cgonz00cc
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Fri Jul-03-15 05:27 PM

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38. "https://youtu.be/QM0dbwDc2FE"
In response to Reply # 37


  

          

https://youtu.be/QM0dbwDc2FE

WHAT A TIME TO BE ALIVE

  

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Boogie Stimuli
Member since Sep 24th 2010
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Fri Jul-03-15 06:19 PM

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39. "How so?"
In response to Reply # 37


          

> the phrase "optimum health" doesn't mean anything.
>

He's talking about a body performing the best it can perform.
Maybe you're being unnecessarily literal to the point where it's stopping you from
understanding shit that's hella easy to understand, but yes, performance at an optimal level does mean something.
People don't change the oil in their cars for nothing.
Athletes don't train for nothing.
This isn't even debatable.

~
~
~
~
~
Days like this I miss Sha Mecca

  

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cgonz00cc
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Fri Jul-03-15 07:37 PM

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42. "nature doesnt have an optimal level beyond reproduction"
In response to Reply # 39


  

          

Anything else is an external and/or artificial criterion

WHAT A TIME TO BE ALIVE

  

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Boogie Stimuli
Member since Sep 24th 2010
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Sat Jul-04-15 04:13 AM

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47. "So good health is a myth?"
In response to Reply # 42


          

~
~
~
~
~
Days like this I miss Sha Mecca

  

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cgonz00cc
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Sat Jul-04-15 08:27 AM

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48. "myth is your word, not mine"
In response to Reply # 47


  

          

I said that in nature, the only applicable criterion is reproduction

WHAT A TIME TO BE ALIVE

  

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Boogie Stimuli
Member since Sep 24th 2010
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Sat Jul-04-15 02:22 PM

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56. "Are you talking about the reproductive system or the entire body?"
In response to Reply # 48


          


~
~
~
~
~
Days like this I miss Sha Mecca

  

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cgonz00cc
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Sat Jul-04-15 04:52 PM

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59. "im talking about all life. stravinskian had the right of it when he sai..."
In response to Reply # 56


  

          

Bodies are vehicles for genetic propagation

Successful life produces viable offspring

Unsuccessful life does not

In nature thats all that matters. However humanity has constructed a number of ways to measure individual strength, speed, etc. For a given criterion, like World's Strongest Man, the optimum is big and powerful. For a marathoner, the optimum is high blood oxygenation and powerful slow twitch muscles. None of that actually really matters to nature.

WHAT A TIME TO BE ALIVE

  

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Boogie Stimuli
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Sat Jul-04-15 05:21 PM

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60. "Ok thanks for saying that..."
In response to Reply # 59
Sat Jul-04-15 05:22 PM by Boogie Stimuli

          

because I don't think Vex is simply talking about genetic propagation.
If you have kidney stones, I don't think any of us would consider that "optimum health".
Sluggishness and fatigue don't exactly constitute optimum health either, but you can
reproduce feeling that way.
This is about personal comfort, efficiency and happiness as much as (if not more)
than genetic propagation.
To simply focus on genetic propagation is to eliminate a very large part of what good health (and especially optimum health)
means to most human beings.


~
~
~
~
~
Days like this I miss Sha Mecca

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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99. "Vex claimed to be talking about what the body is "designed" to do."
In response to Reply # 60


          


The body is not designed to do anything other than transmit its genes.

It certainly wasn't designed to run marathons, lift 1000 pounds, leap tall buildings in a single bound, or do many of the other (mutually incompatible) things that people associate with good health.

That's not to say these abilities wouldn't be desirable under certain circumstances. The main point was that Vex was trying to sound like a sage, while he was spouting gobbledygook. He has a habit of that.

  

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Vex_id
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109. "Yes - we should totally listen to the guy who thinks processed meats"
In response to Reply # 99


          

are "just fine" for the body.

Thanks for that, Teacher's Assistant.

-->

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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113. "And here's that strange fascination with my career again."
In response to Reply # 109


          

Yes, I know some things about how science works. I don't think anyone sees how that should count against me in this discussion. I honestly don't see why you'd keep bringing it up, apart from a self-conscious need to defuse a factor that *you* think is important.

If you're really that interested, I'm a tenure-track professor, but thanks for implying that I seem younger than that.

The job title isn't why I know more Biology than you, though. I knew more Biology than you do when I was a postdoc, when I was a grad student (and a TA), when I was an undergrad, when I was in high school. To be honest I think a reasonably engaged middle schooler would be able to out-argue you on the facts here. The issue is not that I'm a huge font of knowledge on biochemistry (I'm not), the issue is that you have no interest in the facts, or in any kind of understanding, whatsoever.

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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Fri Jul-03-15 08:34 PM

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43. "ya this needs to be flushed out."
In response to Reply # 39
Fri Jul-03-15 08:35 PM by denny

          

The athletic example is a good way of illustrating our misconceptions. Oftentimes, an athlete that trains their body to perform a specific task is actually doing damage. You don't need to jump 6 feet high in order to reproduce or hunt/gather food. And you could possibly do damage to your body by training it do this useless, arbitrary task. So it's not 'optimal' to jump 6 feet high. Ballet dancers and young girls in gymnastics literally destroy their bodies in order to achieve optimal performance. But they might be decreasing their life expectancy in the process. Bodybuilders often shorten their life expectancy too.

We're not robots and life does not provide us with a specific motivation for how our bodies should be. So any talk of 'optimal performance' is based on arbitrary criteria that we construct for ourselves.

  

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Vex_id
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44. "Of course, it's about far more than just athletic performance. "
In response to Reply # 43
Fri Jul-03-15 10:25 PM by Vex_id

          

So any talk of
>'optimal performance' is based on arbitrary criteria that we
>construct for ourselves.

Here, when we speak about 'optimal performance' we're not talking about how fast one can run, or high one can jump. We're talking more about the efficiency of the organs, circulatory system, and neurological function. Some can run fast and jump high while eating junk food every day, as genetics are able to overcome even the most egregious abuse to the body....for a while.

The body is the real alchemist, converting junk into energy - but learning how best to perform that inner alchemy to yield more dynamic results is a field of study that is cutting edge right now, and the aforementioned article (which featured a wealth of facts that the pseudo-scientists in this thread conveniently gloss over because it doesn't fit their cynical, nihilist world-view) is a wonderful precursor to how mainstream this way of thinking will become as people begin to have an evidentiary basis upon which to more intelligently customize their lifestyle habits towards more dynamic health attainment.




-->

  

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cgonz00cc
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53. "did you just call the field of biochemistry "alchemy" ? lmao"
In response to Reply # 44


  

          

Jesus christ

I hope its obvious to everyone reading this that you are not qualified to speak on cellular biology. Even ONE intro class at the university level would quadruple your authority to speak on things like this.

WHAT A TIME TO BE ALIVE

  

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Vex_id
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54. "thankfully, we have you here to enlighten us. "
In response to Reply # 53


          


-->

  

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cgonz00cc
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55. "agreed"
In response to Reply # 54


  

          

WHAT A TIME TO BE ALIVE

  

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Vex_id
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45. "Strav gonna strav."
In response to Reply # 39
Fri Jul-03-15 10:23 PM by Vex_id

          

I'll go back and forth w/ him/her once she/he actually has some original scientific work to contribute to this community - which he/she's never done, despite claiming to b a "scientist." What he/she does extraordinarily well is troll, which I suppose is a sort of science in itself.


-->

  

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cgonz00cc
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49. "so now you are calling him a troll for knowing more than you?"
In response to Reply # 45


  

          

How dare he??

Lmao

WHAT A TIME TO BE ALIVE

  

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soulpsychodelicyde
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50. "Wait."
In response to Reply # 45


          

I'm very confused by this. You're questioning whether Strav is a scientist because he hasn't presented any original/primary research so that YOU believe him? I'd actually like to see your primary work on this subject as well since you are so aggressively and condescendingly questioning his credibility. Where's yours? Show YOUR work.

  

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akon
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61. "he has a phd in physics. that makes him a scientist"
In response to Reply # 45


  

          

no quotes necessary

.
http://perspectivesudans.blogspot.com/
i myself would never want to be god,or even like god.Because god got all these human beings on this planet and i most certainly would not want to be responsible for them, or even have the disgrace that i made them.

  

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ndibs
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77. "What does physics have to do with nutrition? "
In response to Reply # 61
Sun Jul-05-15 09:57 PM by ndibs

          

>no quotes necessary

?

Like all scientists are created equal.

My surgeon who operates on the back of the eye won't even comment on anything to do with the front of the eye.

It's ludicrous that anyone in here thinks they're an expert on this topic when the experts in the article are saying it's all theory and hypothesis at this point.

While the science hasn't finalized, I would love to see what team #eatcrap looks like.

This is about the guy brain connection, but I really don't care. Leaving it here.

  

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denny
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78. "RE: What does physics have to do with nutrition? "
In response to Reply # 77


          

Well, scientists know the scientific method. So I tend to give value to what a doctor might have to say about a global warming paper because the basic tenets that govern hypothesis, observation and conclusion are common amongst all the sciences. I'm not saying we should all cede to whatever Strav thinks....and I'm sure there are scientists who specialize in this field that disagree with some of the things he said. I wouldn't call him an all-out authority....but I do think that his profession equips him with a greater ability to point out flaws in these conclusions.

In anycase, he isn't pulling the 'I am a scientist' card. And his perspective seems pretty rational to me regardless of his background.

  

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akon
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82. "point out the nutritionists in this post"
In response to Reply # 77
Mon Jul-06-15 04:57 AM by akon

  

          

and actually, i'd trust a scientists opinion with regards to interpreting scientific data
because this post is actually not about nutrition, its about microbiology and biochemistry and the interaction with neuroscience
these are fields that are usually required for someone pursuing science degree
certainly was when i was working on my chemistry degree in undergrad
and anyone studying food science is going to take up some chemistry and biology
newsflash: the science doesnt change across fields

but i was mainly reacting to the 'scientist' quotation as used vis a vis strav
no quotes necessary. he is a scientist.
in fact, id wager physics is the first science, followed by chemistry and biology being the third cousin
so we need to accord him his due respect as a phd, even when we disagree with what he is saying
its not coming from a place of 'trolling'

.
http://perspectivesudans.blogspot.com/
i myself would never want to be god,or even like god.Because god got all these human beings on this planet and i most certainly would not want to be responsible for them, or even have the disgrace that i made them.

  

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ndibs
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88. "There are none. That was the central theme to my post. "
In response to Reply # 82


          

There's no data to interpret. We're not discussing data.

  

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SoWhat
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97. "See also - malpractice insurance coverage limits."
In response to Reply # 77


  

          


>My surgeon who operates on the back of the eye won't even
>comment on anything to do with the front of the eye.

that doesn't necessarily mean your doc doesn't know much about the rest of your eye. She could have many other reasons to avoid commenting.

fuck you.

  

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ndibs
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100. "Nah, i've been to him and been told i just had dry eye..."
In response to Reply # 97
Mon Jul-06-15 06:44 PM by ndibs

          

and gotten basic drops and then went to a regular opthamologist and was diagnosed with eye allergies shortly after and given a new $200 eye drop. The knowledge isn't there. He's not keeping up with the latest and greatest in season allergy eye drops and it's not because he's at any greater risk for being sued for prescribing those eye drops vs not prescribing those eye drops as an opthamologist. He just does what he does and that's the back of the eye and he understands his limits.

  

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SoWhat
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102. "naw."
In response to Reply # 100


  

          

it doesn't have to be that at all. it could be that you're right but that's not necessarily the case.

fuck you.

  

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Boogie Stimuli
Member since Sep 24th 2010
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63. "lmfao"
In response to Reply # 45


          

>What he/she does extraordinarily well is troll, which I suppose is a sort of science in itself.
>

~
~
~
~
~
Days like this I miss Sha Mecca

  

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stravinskian
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98. "You fail even with Orwellian reversals."
In response to Reply # 45


          


You got me, I'm not a biochemist. Also, in case you're unaware, neither are you.

I never brought up my scientific training (or credentials, or career). So thanks for mentioning all that. Nor did I ever bring up your, uh, lack of any scientific or technical background whatsoever.

(And as much as I'm tempted to mention it every time I interact with you, I've held off until now mentioning the company you linked to in your sig, which sold potions for thousands of dollars, claiming to heal you thanks to "quantum nonlocality." Was that really a real thing?)

No, I don't know as much biochemistry (or biology, or chemistry, or neuroscience, or any number of other sciences) as someone actively doing research in the field, and I never claimed to. In most fields, all I aspire to is to be familiar enough with a field to understand its most basic logic, to keep in mind how much I don't know (and how much more the real practitioners do know), and to be able to separate fads from reality, most of the time. These are not the requirements for working in the field, they are the requirements for being an informed citizen. It would be nice, for all of us, if more people tried to meet them, including yourself.


  

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Vex_id
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105. "yea that's deep."
In response to Reply # 98


          


-->

  

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stravinskian
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22. "I was barely even in that thread. You must really dislike me."
In response to Reply # 14


          


But yes, jrocc was fighting the good fight.

Matter of fact, I'm gonna go get some dead plasma for lunch. Shame nobody sells it cloned.

  

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Amritsar
Member since Jan 18th 2008
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Wed Jul-01-15 11:40 PM

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16. "Cooking for yourself isn't an option brah? "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Cld easily make your own sandwich and bring it in

Or holla at that Blue Apron. I usually have enough left to bring in for lunch next day

  

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Starks dunked on Bulls
Member since Dec 07th 2011
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Fri Jul-03-15 06:29 PM

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40. "edit"
In response to Reply # 16
Fri Jul-03-15 06:29 PM by Starks dunked on Bul

  

          

....

  

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b.Touch
Member since Jun 28th 2011
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Thu Jul-02-15 02:47 AM

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17. "nothing. cook at home or buy food elsewhere."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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SoWhat
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18. "of course, you'll be fine if you eat there."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

i get one of their sammiches once per week or so and i'm not dead yet. i also haven't grown an extra limb. and i usually get the spicy italian - nothing but cold cuts. but i avoid cheese, mayo, salt and oil. i have them put all of the veggies on there - they get stingy w/the spinach but i'm working on them.

fuck you.

  

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poetx
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23. "they get *the people's eyebrow* when they try to front on the "
In response to Reply # 18


  

          

spinach.

mfer, that's what i came in here for.

subway should be irrelevant to the discussion, anyway, b/c by the time i pile on all the veggies, i just have a slightly meat flavored salad sandwich anyway.

it's painful watching them titrate out the meat, like i ordered a footlong truffle and gold flake sub an shit.

but, at the same time, jersey mike's give you hella meat, and then be tryna charge you extra for the veggies.


peace & blessings,

x.

www.twitter.com/poetx

=========================================
I'm an advocate for working smarter, not harder. If you just
focus on working hard you end up making someone else rich and
not having much to show for it. (c) mad

  

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jrocc
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20. "if you don't want processed food then don't eat at Subway"
In response to Reply # 0


          

since, ya know, every item they have is pretty much processed.

as far as what's safe, your boy Jared literally ate there twice a day for like a year. i think we can all agree he's doing pretty well. if anyone would have gotten sick from eating subway it would have been him.

  

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lfresh
Member since Jun 18th 2002
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Thu Jul-02-15 10:36 AM

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21. "supplement"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

bring carrots and humus
apples and cheese or grapes
celery
mix yogurt and green onion

and still get the sandwich but its not the only thing you are depending on



btw my coworker pulled out an apple peeler/corer just yesterday on me
and i was like...dont like the skin?
he was like pesticides even o organic
and it marinates in the core
!


my point everything will kill you
try and supplement
=)

and no i'm not consistent
*eats bag of doritos*
~~~~
When you are born, you cry, and the world rejoices. Live so that when you die, you rejoice, and the world cries.
~~~~
You cannot hate people for their own good.

  

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Vex_id
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25. "^^"
In response to Reply # 21


          

>bring carrots and humus
>apples and cheese or grapes
>celery
>mix yogurt and green onion
>
>and still get the sandwich but its not the only thing you are
>depending on

preach. Not really sensible to assume that you can have a Subway sandwich
at 1 p.m. and expect that to power your day at optimal levels.

If you gotta have that double cheesteak sub, at least eat quinoa-oatmeal with blueberries for breakfast or *something* that can balance the gut activity. At least drink a glass of water w/ the sub.


-->

  

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ndibs
Member since Aug 06th 2012
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26. "it's really all safe to eat..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

just not routinely or to have your diet revolve around these things.

  

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denny
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29. "Compared to other fast food it's the best alternative no?"
In response to Reply # 26


          

I don't eat it often....but I figure it's better than pizza or burgers/fries.

I presumed that Subway was the healthiest of all the fast food chains. Is that wrong?

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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34. "People are incredibly silly about this kind of stuff."
In response to Reply # 29


          

It's bread, it's meat, it's veggies, it's dressing, it's not that complicated.

The bread obviously has a lot of carbs, as bread does. It also supposedly has quite a lot of salt, even compared to other bread. But it's bread.

Go easy on the cheese, because it's cheese. Go easy on the dressing, because it's mostly oil and other fats.

But this stuff is obvious, and it's no different from any other sandwich shop in the universe.



Ooh, but is it GMO?! No more than most food is. But we shouldn't care about that anyway. Genetically-modified organisms are just organisms, the only difference is that someone happens to have bred them in this very precise way, a way that's actually *safer* than old-fashioned breeding, because it targets the production only of single, individual proteins.

Ooh, but is it cloned?! No, as jrocc has so clearly argued here and elsewhere. There is no economic reason for anyone to turn cloned animals into meat. But anyway, we also shouldn't care about this! Biochemically, there is no way to tell the difference between meat from a cloned animal and meat from a "non-cloned" animal, any more than there's a way to tell if a piece of meat comes from an animal that happens to have been born with an identical twin (that's essentially what cloning is, by the way). If there's no way to tell the difference, even in principle, then there is no difference.

(Now, when confronted with this simple argument, people will start to babble about genetic diversity and ecology. These concerns are also often way overblown, but at least there's undoubtedly an issue there. Still, these questions don't have anything whatsoever to do with whether the food is safe for an individual to eat, either one time or every day.)

Ooh, but is it processed? Everything is processed. Cooking is processing. Slicing is processing. *Cleaning* is processing. Anything can be called processing, as long as there's a process involved somewhere. The question is whether the processing presents any risk. The goal of food processing is not to make foods unhealthy. It's often the opposite (consider nixtamalization, for example). But the kind of processing people generally talk about is usually meant to improve shelf life. There is no reason that such processing would tend to make foods less healthy, but in some cases, they might (and in some cases, they might make them more healthy; it's just as likely to go either way). Anyway, we have a whole federal agency dedicated to judging these questions. And if you don't want to trust them, we have entire fields of science, and the communities of scientists who work in those fields, who would gladly break the scandalous news if a common food processing technique posed any risk.

  

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denny
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36. "hmmmm"
In response to Reply # 34
Fri Jul-03-15 05:01 PM by denny

          

yah. I'm not well-versed on these issues. But it all looks like a product of our notion of 'nature'. And the romantic caveman analogies. The skepticism of anything 'man-made'. Which, at base, takes for granted that we HAVE to interact with our environment in order to survive.

I saw N Degrasse-Tyson say something about this. That the modern orange is not 'natural' in the way people think. It's the product of cultivation.....genetic modification through selection. Without human interference....the orange would barely be edible. All seeds.

And then there's the fact that with population growth we may have no choice but to invest in more GMO development. And also the potential of GMO's to feed the poor.

  

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ndibs
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51. "there are all kinds of studies on how processed meat"
In response to Reply # 36


          

will shorten your life and increase cancer risk. this is tiny amounts a day of processed meat.

when scientist study cultures that eat vegetarian diets or diets low in meat (seventh day adventist/japanses) they live longer. but that is any meat processed or unprocessed.

paleo diets are based on a lot of inference from different studies. there are no long term studies on the overall longevity or health of practitioners of paleo diets. there is solid science for it being good for weight loss and obesiy is more dangerous to your health than just about anything.

  

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Boogie Stimuli
Member since Sep 24th 2010
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Sat Jul-04-15 06:38 PM

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64. "But according to them, mortality rates don't indicate health..."
In response to Reply # 51


          

and all that matters is that people can reproduce lol.

"Optimum health means nothing" and so forth.

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Days like this I miss Sha Mecca

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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66. "From what i can see......"
In response to Reply # 64
Sat Jul-04-15 11:07 PM by denny

          

there is a significant portion of the 'healthy living' movement that is not being scientific. They are straddling over into the new-age spiritual realm. Which has a habit of using scientific terminology for concepts that are not scientific in any way.

Spiritualists and new-agers are replacing religion imo. I hesitate to listen to anything they have to say about food.

It's not common for religious people to say 'studies show that prayer leads to a more fulfilling life'. Though that's exactly what new-agers do nowadays. 'Studies show that meditation/yoga result in fulfillness'. A study can't 'show' something like that. They are bastardizing the scientific method. The term 'optimum health' is similar to 'fulfillness'. There isn't an objective criteria to determine what it is.

  

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Boogie Stimuli
Member since Sep 24th 2010
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Sat Jul-04-15 11:30 PM

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"RE: From what i can see......"


          

>there is a significant portion of the 'healthy living'
>movement that is not being scientific.
>They are straddling
>over into the new-age spiritual realm. Which has a habit of
>using scientific terminology for concepts that are not
>scientific in any way.
>
>Spiritualists and new-agers are replacing religion imo. I
>hesitate to listen to anything they have to say about food.


Ok, disagreeing with a "significant portion" of a group of people isn't reason to
write them all off whether we're talking about vegans, scientists, Asians or what have you. This is an especially weird way to judge people concerned with healthy living,
as this is a subject approached by spiritualists, doctors, and scientists alike.
So this term "healthy living movement" kinda warrants a side-eye honestly.



>It's not common for religious people to say 'studies show that
>prayer leads to a more fulfilling life'. Though that's
>exactly what new-agers do nowadays. 'Studies show that
>meditation/yoga result in fulfillness'. A study can't 'show'
>something like that. They are bastardizing the scientific
>method. The term 'optimum health' is similar to
>'fulfillness'. There isn't an objective criteria to determine
>what it is.


Ok this isn't the same as determining when a liver is functioning optimally.



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Days like this I miss Sha Mecca

  

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Boogie Stimuli
Member since Sep 24th 2010
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Sat Jul-04-15 11:30 PM

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67. "RE: From what i can see......"
In response to Reply # 66
Sat Jul-04-15 11:30 PM by Boogie Stimuli

          

>there is a significant portion of the 'healthy living'
>movement that is not being scientific.
>They are straddling
>over into the new-age spiritual realm. Which has a habit of
>using scientific terminology for concepts that are not
>scientific in any way.
>
>Spiritualists and new-agers are replacing religion imo. I
>hesitate to listen to anything they have to say about food.


Ok, disagreeing with a "significant portion" of a group of people isn't reason to
write them all off whether we're talking about vegans, scientists, Asians or what
have you. This is an especially weird way to judge people concerned with healthy living,
as this is a subject approached by spiritualists, doctors, and scientists alike.
So this term "healthy living movement" kinda warrants a side-eye honestly.



>It's not common for religious people to say 'studies show that
>prayer leads to a more fulfilling life'. Though that's
>exactly what new-agers do nowadays. 'Studies show that
>meditation/yoga result in fulfillness'. A study can't 'show'
>something like that. They are bastardizing the scientific
>method. The term 'optimum health' is similar to
>'fulfillness'. There isn't an objective criteria to determine
>what it is.


Ok this isn't the same as determining when a liver is functioning optimally.



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Days like this I miss Sha Mecca

  

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akon
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57. "^^^^^ thanks for this"
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

.
http://perspectivesudans.blogspot.com/
i myself would never want to be god,or even like god.Because god got all these human beings on this planet and i most certainly would not want to be responsible for them, or even have the disgrace that i made them.

  

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kfine
Member since Jan 11th 2009
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Sun Jul-05-15 11:25 AM

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69. " I agree with "most" of what you said, but just want to point out that"
In response to Reply # 34


          

food processing techniques do, in fact, differ substantially in their risk to human health. Certainly traditional practices like cooking, slicing, nixtamalization, nutrient fortification etc. are safe and have been done since humans determined how. But as food production and distribution industrialized, the majority of practices have been introduced to prioritize producers' bottom line (extend shelf life, cut manufacturing costs, etc.).

Yes there is robust regulatory infrastructure in place to monitor and evaluate food safety, but the USDA and FDA have their own set of operational problems (problematic resource allocation, understaffing, misaligned priorities, poor coordination, etc.), which hinders effectiveness. Plus, scientific research almost never effectuates immediate changes in food policy. The food and beverage industry devotes such substantial resources to its lobbies and the government tends to be overly sympathetic out of, what appears to be, fear of drastic market effects (which makes some sense, considering there are so many stakeholders involved throughout the food production to food consumption continuum).

A good example of food policy lag is the recent FDA ruling on trans fats/partially hydrogenated oils. Trans fats were introduced into food products because selectively hydrogenating fatty acid chains, creating stereochemical variants of naturally occurring unsaturated fats, delays oxidative degradation (rancidity) thus extending shelf life (sure you're familar). However research has been piling for decades indicating a strong association between trans fats and cardiovascular disease and the fact that these compounds are not metabolized effectively in humans, essentially circulating homelessly in the bloodstream and turning it into a viscous, LDL cholesterol-laden, fluid landfill so toxic that it triggers an inflammatory response in cardiovascular epithelia. We're in 2015 and the FDA has only NOW ordered the removal of trans fats from all food items. And even with that, companies have been given a 3 year grace period to comply with the new regulation. 3 YEARS to remove a compound with a widely accepted mechanism of catalyzing the leading cause of death in the United States.

So the 'lag' creates a valid space for moderate public concern, imo. In this discussion, when people say "processing" I think the main targets of concern are synthetic additives and processes for which there has been some scientific indication of a risk to human health. Not cooking, slicing, etc.



>
>Ooh, but is it processed? Everything is processed. Cooking is
>processing. Slicing is processing. *Cleaning* is processing.
>Anything can be called processing, as long as there's a
>process involved somewhere. The question is whether the
>processing presents any risk. The goal of food processing is
>not to make foods unhealthy. It's often the opposite (consider
>nixtamalization, for example). But the kind of processing
>people generally talk about is usually meant to improve shelf
>life. There is no reason that such processing would tend to
>make foods less healthy, but in some cases, they might (and in
>some cases, they might make them more healthy; it's just as
>likely to go either way). Anyway, we have a whole federal
>agency dedicated to judging these questions. And if you don't
>want to trust them, we have entire fields of science, and the
>communities of scientists who work in those fields, who would
>gladly break the scandalous news if a common food processing
>technique posed any risk.
>

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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93. "Reasonable points, especially in regard to trans fats."
In response to Reply # 69


          

I'm not trying to say that all food is safe, under all conditions, obviously some (many) foods can reasonably be considered unhealthy or even unsafe, and no amount of government regulation will catch all examples immediately.

My comment about scientific consensus was basically only meant to deal with the fact that this board is brimming with conspiracy theorists who assume that being skeptical of fads means "taking the government's word for it." Apart from that, I'm really just arguing that we have regulatory infrastructure in place.

Indeed this infrastructure is imperfect, especially in the modern budget-cutting, corporations-are-more-trustworthy-than-regulators age. I'd be the first to say that our regulations need more teeth.

My main point, though, was simply that processing food to lower cost, or to increase shelf-life (the two main goals of the large-scale food industry), would not be expected to correlate with safety or nutrition. Safety and nutrition are determined by a completely different set of biochemical characteristics than shelf-life and cost. This does not imply that all such processing will be nutrition-neutral, merely that they would be on average (and, perhaps paradoxically, would be just as likely to improve nutrition than to worsen it).

Trans fats are a clear example where processing to improve shelf life ended up creating a product that's less healthy (one could even say unsafe, but the distinction is subtle in cases like this).

Of course, it should be noted that trans fats were not originally introduced to improve shelf life or to lower cost. What made trans fats commonplace was the fact that the public thought they were more nutritious! In the public conception in the early to mid 20th century, lard was seen as dirty, sinful, disgusting. Crisco gave the same great flavor but was produced entirely from plants, so therefore must be healthier. (Of course a massive marketing campaign helped this specious viewpoint gain traction, but the fact that our nutritional perceptions are so susceptible to marketing and fashion is precisely the problem!)

  

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ndibs
Member since Aug 06th 2012
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Sun Jul-05-15 08:01 PM

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75. " All the scientists say"
In response to Reply # 34


          


>agency dedicated to judging these questions. And if you don't
>want to trust them, we have entire fields of science, and the
>communities of scientists who work in those fields, who would
>gladly break the scandalous news if a common food processing
>technique posed any risk.

carbs processed to remove fiber
Refined sugar
Processed meat with preservatives
Trans fats
Red meat


Are all associated with various negative health consequences (including increase stroke risk, shortening of life expectancy, tooth decay, increased cancer risk) etc.

Why are you acting like these studies don't exist or this isn't common knowledge?

  

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akon
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83. "^^^ not a scientist"
In response to Reply # 75


  

          

.
http://perspectivesudans.blogspot.com/
i myself would never want to be god,or even like god.Because god got all these human beings on this planet and i most certainly would not want to be responsible for them, or even have the disgrace that i made them.

  

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ndibs
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89. "^^^^ not literate or logical"
In response to Reply # 83


          

  

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akon
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90. "lol"
In response to Reply # 89


  

          

.
http://perspectivesudans.blogspot.com/
i myself would never want to be god,or even like god.Because god got all these human beings on this planet and i most certainly would not want to be responsible for them, or even have the disgrace that i made them.

  

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40thStreetBlack
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95. "this post is high comedy"
In response to Reply # 90


          

i have been thoroughly entertained.

___________________

Mar-A-Lago delenda est

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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96. "Easy there, I never said all food is equally "good for you.""
In response to Reply # 75


          

>carbs processed to remove fiber

... have been around for thousands of years and have been widely understood to be less healthy for much of that time. But the issue is not that the food was "processed", the issue is that the fiber was removed, because it doesn't taste as good. If you want, a mill can process your flour to *increase* its fiber content. (In fact, they often do.)

>Refined sugar

^ and the same here, though the phrase "refined sugar" is annoyingly vague. All sugars are unhealthy in the quantities that we take them. You're just as likely to get diabetes from overconsumption of natural honey than you are from overconsumption of high fructose corn syrup.

And as I noted above, when you process your food specifically to increase its sugar content, the problem is not that you "processed" the food, the problem is that you increased its sugar content.

>Processed meat with preservatives

Mneh. Again, "preservatives" can mean a thousand different things. Some are more harmless than others, of course. But you're not gonna find data to support the public's simplistic and universal "preservatives are bad" viewpoint.

>Trans fats

Granted, though as I just noted in another post: trans fats became popular because the public (driven by fads, not by data, and thinking they were being driven by data) thought they were more healthy!

>Red meat

Now you're really breaking news. Yes, light meat is better for you than red meat. And by the way, it's just as natural.

  

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ndibs
Member since Aug 06th 2012
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101. "I'm just replying to this idea which is false."
In response to Reply # 96


          

Anyway, we have a whole federal agency dedicated to judging these questions. And if you don't want to trust them, we have entire fields of science, and the communities of scientists who work in those fields, who would gladly break the scandalous news if a common food processing technique posed any risk.


plenty of these approved processes pose risk.

i didn't need you to check my work.

  

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stravinskian
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103. "My students often feel the same way."
In response to Reply # 101


          


>i didn't need you to check my work.

  

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afrogirl_lost
Member since May 22nd 2012
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Fri Jul-03-15 02:45 PM

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30. "Being from Philly, I can't eat that crap"
In response to Reply # 0


          

I'd eat a hoagie from the Papi store before I'd eat at subway. At least I know the Amoroso's roll is real food. Can't say the same for Subway's bread.

  

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MizClayton
Member since Feb 22nd 2003
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31. "safe. it's special occasion food "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

problem with Americans is we eat special occasion food every damn day

  

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makaveli
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32. "land of the free"
In response to Reply # 31


  

          

😄

“So back we go to these questions — friendship, character… ethics.”

  

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Boogie Stimuli
Member since Sep 24th 2010
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Fri Jul-03-15 04:21 PM

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33. "Since processed meats are bad, which processed meat should I choose"
In response to Reply # 0


          

That's how the subject line reads.

>Subway seems like my only option for lunch during my work
>days.
>

How is this possible? No refrigeration at work? Can't store food at home?

~
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Days like this I miss Sha Mecca

  

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Starks dunked on Bulls
Member since Dec 07th 2011
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Fri Jul-03-15 06:49 PM

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41. "I might actually try this Blue Apron thing"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I was under the impression that it was just a recipe site. But they actually send you the food and you just cook it (following the recipes). Looking at these Blue Apron youtubes got me thinking.

  

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lfresh
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85. "good idea"
In response to Reply # 41


  

          


~~~~
When you are born, you cry, and the world rejoices. Live so that when you die, you rejoice, and the world cries.
~~~~
You cannot hate people for their own good.

  

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Tiggerific
Member since May 24th 2007
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Sat Jul-04-15 11:28 AM

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52. "RE: Since processed meats are bad, what is safe to eat at Subway?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Salad. Maybe.

"We don't make mistakes, we just have happy little accidents" - Bob Ross

"I'm wearing a MSU Tshirt because I went to MSU, you are wearing a UM Tshirt because you went to Walmart!" -unknown.

http://bjsquirrelchronicles.blogspot.com

  

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Sarah_Bellum
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58. "Here's how they make it..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Ufbb6YjEaGo
___________________________________________________________


DJTB YOMM

  

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Starks dunked on Bulls
Member since Dec 07th 2011
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62. "LMAO!"
In response to Reply # 58


  

          

>
>https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Ufbb6YjEaGo
>___________________________________________________________
>
>
>DJTB YOMM

  

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SooperEgo
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68. "eat fresh!!"
In response to Reply # 58


          

  

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Vex_id
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70. "this is foolish. That's just fine for the body."
In response to Reply # 58


          


-->

  

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stead21
Member since Oct 21st 2004
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65. "RE: Since processed meats are bad, what is safe to eat at Subway?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

No fast food us safe due to gmo and pesticides in the fruits and veggies. You gotta make your own food.

  

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SHAstayhighalways
Member since Sep 03rd 2014
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71. "subway is trash"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

i mean i eat all kinds of worse trash but subway is trash
either make your own food or just resign yourself to the fact youre eating trash

www.royallegacy.org

For Real (Official Video):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hBRoCPO8esE

  

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akon
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72. "there are two subways in kenya"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

im somewhat disappointed
there was only one when i left in december
(and i went in to get a veggie patty - and they didnt have any because
get this- they were waiting on a shipment from the u.s.a
wtf?)
now there are two

geez us, globalization

did i also mention there is a kfc?
ugh

.
http://perspectivesudans.blogspot.com/
i myself would never want to be god,or even like god.Because god got all these human beings on this planet and i most certainly would not want to be responsible for them, or even have the disgrace that i made them.

  

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kfine
Member since Jan 11th 2009
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73. "I call it 'dietary imperalism', lol"
In response to Reply # 72


          



If you look at the countries with the highest rates of diabetes or obesity in the world, it's not even countries that you would expect to eat a 'Western' diet

The sad part is that in many cases, indigenous foods, diets and customs are so much healthier.

But Western style products/lifestyle is viewed with this warped sense of higher status and so crappy food imports and McDs, KFCs, etc. are welcomed with open arms as if they won't start an obesity/chronic disease epidemic in less than a generation

Was it Japan? That implemented a national weight limit, enforced by employers and local governments. If you were over and did not lose within a set time period you had to pay a financial penalty.

A little on the draconian side, to put it lightly lol. But at least they peeped game

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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76. "More misconception."
In response to Reply # 73
Sun Jul-05-15 09:53 PM by denny

          

I researched this from a thread here a few months back:

http://i100.independent.co.uk/article/these-are-the-most-obese-countries-in-the-world--gyEoNT9Esx

The Top 10 most obese countries barely even have western fast food. The obesity that exists there isn't because of 'food imperialism'. In some cases...there are cultural issues that place value on obesity (Samoa especially).

I was kinda shocked by the data. Someone had joked around saying Croatians weren't fat like Americans because they hadn't been influenced by our processed food culture. Nope. Croats have a huge problem with obesity despite eating less processed food.

This is why I think some of this thinking has shades of 'first world problems' to it. The fact is....we perceive obesity to be a problem because we're largely detached from the more severe health problems of poorer countries like Chronic Persistent Hunger, access to clean water, etc. Some of this rhetoric starts to sound a little silly in the grand scheme of things. And I worry that if we lose perspective....we end up making policy decisions that don't address the REAL problems of other nations because we're projecting our privileged problems onto the rest of the world. Subway sandwiches are certainly better than eating nothing.

And I don't have enough info to make a real argument on this. But the insistence on organically farmed food smells elitist to me. Can we really feed everyone with organic farming? Or is it just for the privileged? The fact is.....GMO research and development is bound to experience growing pains and mistakes. I'm not saying GMO food is great. Though I would suggest that the potential end-game is the ability to feed the poorest people on the planet efficiently. As population exponentially increases....it may be our only way to survive in hundreds of years from now. Imagine that? We'll all look pretty stupid when it's Montesanto's technological innovation that saves us all. Bill Nye spent a week with the Montesanto R and D department and changed his mind about the ethics of their intentions. For the scientific layman in me....that certainly perked my ears. Of course, people claimed he was 'bought'....only adding to the irrational conspiratorial tone of their position.

Edit: I think there may have been a typo in your post. If so, then I think we're agreeing more than not. Traditional diets in many cultures are often NOT healthier and I'm thinking that's what you meant to say. Again....this goes to what I call the notion of 'nature' that people have. Old customs are unjustifiably romanticized. Anything new is seen as 'unnatural'.

  

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kfine
Member since Jan 11th 2009
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Sun Jul-05-15 11:11 PM

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80. "ehh, I see you in some respects. However, why would obesity rates "
In response to Reply # 76


          

'increase' in these countries in recent years/decades? If the primary driver of obesity in these countries is cultural, than we would expect to see consistent obesity prevalence over time. So I'll actually take responsibility for using unclear language, because the association really seems to be between increased availability of processed foods and increased obesity 'incidence'.

For example, this epidemiologist at Brown studies the obesity in Am Samoa specifically. Excerpt:

https://news.brown.edu/articles/2014/02/samoa

"Certainly, with or without a definitive biological underpinning, the timing of the island’s obesity pandemic coincided with a change in diet and lifestyle. Where Samoans once engaged in subsistence fishing, Westernization has brought fast food, labor-saving devices, and other conveniences.

McGarvey co-authored and led a study in 2012 showing that the available food energy in Samoa rose an average of 900 calories per person between 1961 and 2007 and that most of those new calories came from dietary fat. Meanwhile, McGarvey said, the islands were ill-prepared for the ramifications of this sweeping change in diet. Health education and awareness efforts on the island are still catching up to the changes."

^And this is actually consistent with what was shared in a lecture I attended given by a (native) Samoan diabetes researcher. He placed heavy emphasis on the proliferation of processed foods on the island. (Also, apparently preserved/fried turkey tails are the most popular snack in Samoa. I never knew that)


>This is why I think some of this thinking has shades of 'first
>world problems' to it. The fact is....we perceive obesity to
>be a problem because we're largely detached from the more
>severe health problems of poorer countries like Chronic
>Persistent Hunger, access to clean water, etc. Some of this
>rhetoric starts to sound a little silly in the grand scheme of
>things. And I worry that if we lose perspective....we end up
>making policy decisions that don't address the REAL problems
>of other nations because we're projecting our privileged
>problems onto the rest of the world.

The thing is conditions like obesity and diabetes are still on the rise in low and middle income countries.. just in the wealthier and/or urbanized segments of the populations. For example, urban-rural disparities found in cross-sectional data from several Sub-Saharan countries in Africa:

http://www.biomedcentral.com/1471-2458/11/564

"Prevalence in the general population of T2DM recorded in these studies ranged from 0.6% in rural Uganda to 12% in urban Kenya. A low to medium prevalence (0-7%) was recorded in Cameroon, Ghana, Guinea, Kenya, Nigeria, South Africa and Uganda and a very high prevalence (> 10%) was recorded in Zimbabwe (table 1). Variation in prevalence recorded within countries was common. Prevalence estimates varied considerably between different studies for some countries, with estimates for rural South Africa ranging from 3.9% to 8.8%. Variation between urban and rural populations was frequently observed, with a higher prevalence recorded in urban populations . Prevalence recorded in Christensen's Kenyan survey ranged from 2% in rural areas to 12% in urban areas ."

And none of this talk is rhetoric. Obesity may not sound as provocative as HIV/AIDS, Ebola, Hunger, etc. but believe me, having a large segment of the population become obese is the absolute last thing any LMIC needs. Comorbidities make obesity extremely expensive and it severely impacts productivity. For example, being obese accounts for something like 80% of the probability one will develop Type 2 Diabetes.. A lot of LMICs would not be managing their HIV populations without foreign aid assistance, so if you added a diabetes epidemic to the mix?? Forget the fact that weaker health systems mean the majority of diabetes cases would be likely be poorly controlled (glucose monitoring, insulin, medication = $$$). Poorly controlled diabetes progresses to lower extremity circulation issues/clots ($$$), retinopathy/blindness ($$$), and of course the most fatal and expensive outcome of all kidney failure (dialysis = $$$). Not to mention the implications for mothers with respect to gestational diabetes and how that would impact perinatal care needs ($$$) and c-section deliveries ($$$$).


>I'm not saying GMO food is great. Though I would
>suggest that the potential end-game is the ability to feed the
>poorest people on the planet efficiently. As population
>exponentially increases....it may be our only way to survive
>in hundreds of years from now. Imagine that? We'll all look
>pretty stupid when it's Montesanto's technological innovation
>that saves us all.

^lol you might actually have a point here though. If it comes to this, I hope it is after my time. And my children's

  

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akon
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84. "the nutritional dual-burden"
In response to Reply # 80


  

          

it gives one much pause for thought
countries in which under-weight and over-weight occurs concurrently
a good example is south africa - i see kenya listed in your post
(although walking around nairobi- people here are really small.
i often wonder where the 12% is - i'd assume it would be a more visible population)
certainly when i was in cape-town, obesity was very much more visible
mexico also has an obesity problem - part of it might also be physical size.

but.. this shit is real
the question is how does one even effectively handle this?
also... one would assume that overweight would mainly affect the wealthier, urban classes
but apparently this is not (always) the case

.
http://perspectivesudans.blogspot.com/
i myself would never want to be god,or even like god.Because god got all these human beings on this planet and i most certainly would not want to be responsible for them, or even have the disgrace that i made them.

  

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Vex_id
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74. "I saw a knock-off KFC while in Nairobi. I wept."
In response to Reply # 72


          




-->

  

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akon
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81. "kenchick has always been there"
In response to Reply # 74


  

          

but over the past couple of years we see a lot of
restaurant chains from overseas
started with nandos and other south african chains
now it looks like we are on some american shit
im surprised mcdonalds isnt here yet (its been rumoured for years)
we seem to be good at copying from others

do better, nairobi

.
http://perspectivesudans.blogspot.com/
i myself would never want to be god,or even like god.Because god got all these human beings on this planet and i most certainly would not want to be responsible for them, or even have the disgrace that i made them.

  

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Vex_id
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104. "yup! that was it."
In response to Reply # 81


          

I did have some amazing restaurant experiences in Nairobi outside of the Java House / Carnivore touristy spots.

I had some of the best Italian food I've ever had just outside of Nairobi (forget the name) - and some of the East African / Indian fusion spots I went to were absolutely incredible, particularly in Lamu.

but yea, the Americanized fast-food spots really made me cringe.


-->

  

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luminous
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79. "Subway is not edible"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

how do you guys eat that stuff? their sandwiches taste like sawdust

--
Sometimes you have to look reality in the face and say 'No!'
-Ben (Reaper)

If you need any help, don't. Hesitate to ask.

  

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lfresh
Member since Jun 18th 2002
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Mon Jul-06-15 11:16 AM

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86. "not sure myself"
In response to Reply # 79


  

          

but we have delis in NY


folks go for the prices i believe
i still prefer not to
i prefer my nitrates fresher
0_o
*cheese*
~~~~
When you are born, you cry, and the world rejoices. Live so that when you die, you rejoice, and the world cries.
~~~~
You cannot hate people for their own good.

  

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luminous
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91. "Yeah, I would gladly spend the extra $2-3"
In response to Reply # 86


  

          

For a decent sandwich... I like my bread crispy like a baguette and not tasting like playdough...

--
Sometimes you have to look reality in the face and say 'No!'
-Ben (Reaper)

If you need any help, don't. Hesitate to ask.

  

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SoWhat
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92. "i used to skip Subway and get a banh-mi"
In response to Reply # 91


  

          

back when my favorite banh-mi joint sold sammiches for about $5 when Subway was running its $5 Footlong deal. the shops were about 2 blocks apart. i miss that banh-mi spot.

but now when it comes to lunch options at the office i have McDonald's, a terrible local taqueria, a bar that serves bland bar food, an absolutely awful hot dog stand, a Chinese food place that i wouldn't let feed my cat and Subway as the only options w/in walking distance.

so yeah, i eat Subway once per week and McDonald's once per week - usually on days when i can't convince a coworker to drive out to Chipotle. lol

fuck you.

  

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luminous
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106. "banh-mi sounds yummy"
In response to Reply # 92


  

          

i'm sorry you have to suffer with such a lack of choice.

--
Sometimes you have to look reality in the face and say 'No!'
-Ben (Reaper)

If you need any help, don't. Hesitate to ask.

  

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SoWhat
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87. "i chew it and swallow it."
In response to Reply # 79


  

          

fuck you.

  

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Boogie Stimuli
Member since Sep 24th 2010
14027 posts
Mon Jul-06-15 05:44 PM

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94. "Not edible, huh?"
In response to Reply # 79


          

~
~
~
~
~
Days like this I miss Sha Mecca

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
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Tue Jul-07-15 08:51 AM

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108. "i find this idea to be prominent in people from the northeast"
In response to Reply # 79


  

          

who always get at delis and bodegas. Subway is really for the southern and the midwest people. it's not great but it comes through when you want a quick (moderately healthy) lunch.

  

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stattic
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Tue Jul-07-15 08:38 AM

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107. "The bread tastes like it was made from urea-formaldehyde insulation"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


which is to say that Subway is gross and it's cheaper to make a sandwich that will also taste better than that swill. If you frequent this establishment, trust that your self-hatred is completely justified.

  

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Vex_id
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110. "In other news: Home of Subway Spokesman "Jared" searched for child porn "
In response to Reply # 0


          

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/cops-raid-home-subway-spokesman-jared-fogle-n387926


-->

  

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mtbatol
Member since May 22nd 2002
19788 posts
Wed Jul-08-15 12:09 AM

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111. "PLZ TELL ME U WASH YO PROCESSED MEETZ!!!!"
In response to Reply # 0


          

  

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Boogie Stimuli
Member since Sep 24th 2010
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Wed Jul-08-15 12:49 AM

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112. "Lmfao. Gotta wash them nitrates off, fam"
In response to Reply # 111


          

~
~
~
~
~
Days like this I miss Sha Mecca

  

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