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Case_One
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Wed Jan-14-15 08:54 AM

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"Poll question: Wash/Post Columnist says "Blacks’ political muscle has gone soft."T/F?"
Wed Jan-14-15 09:15 AM by Case_One

  

          

Blacks’ political muscle has gone soft
By Courtland Milloy Columnist January 13 at 8:07 PM

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/2015/01/13/4ef41c56-9b73-11e4-96cc-e858eba91ced_story.html


What if African Americans were as politically unified as our racial attitudes make us appear to be? Suppose, for instance, we did more than believe that racial discrimination exists but actually used our political and economic muscle to remedy race-specific problems?

There are 42 million African Americans in this country with a combined purchasing power expected to hit $1.1 trillion this year. If Black America were an actual nation state instead of just a shaky state of mind, it would have a population slightly less than Spain’s and rank as the 46th-richest nation in the world, according to a statistical profile published in the Atlantic last year.

And yet, African Americans spent much of 2014 on bended knee — pleading for justice, crying for jobs, begging for equal treatment, with President Obama declaring that “a country’s conscience has to be sometimes triggered” to bring awareness to the killings of unarmed black men and boys by police.

Stand up, Black America.

Leading up to the 2014 midterm elections, President Obama urged his base of support not to sit this one out. Too much was at stake. Black people needed to be as fired up as elderly white Republicans. Yet a poll by the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee leading up to the elections found that 67 percent of Obama’s base didn’t even know that an election was being held.

No point in complaining about Republicans in Congress now.

An Associated Press survey two years ago found that 56 percent of Americans have explicit “anti-black attitudes” — and the rest don’t love you all that much, either. Harvard University professor Michael I. Norton found last year that many whites now believe anti-white racism is a bigger problem than anti-black bias — the latter having been all but eliminated, they say.

On the most important issues, an NBC News/Marist College poll found last month that 52 percent of whites have a “great deal” of confidence that police officers in their community treat blacks and whites the same, compared with only 12 percent of blacks.

So whose “conscience,” exactly, are black people trying to prick?

The answer ought to be our own. Black people have serious problems, to be sure — extraordinarily high incarceration and homicide rates, for starters. But the resources at our disposal are enormous, if not always used most effectively.

“African Americans make more shopping trips than the average consumer,” reports Target Market News, an authority on black consumer habits. “They are more likely than average to buy beauty and ethnic products, children’s cologne, toiletries for both men and women, frozen meats, and fresh vegetables and grains.”

We have sweet-smelling kids but no major black-owned publishing companies that can reflect their sweet little faces in children’s books.

There are fewer than 30 black-owned banks in the country, according to the Federal Reserve, compared with about 130 such institutions at the turn of the 20th century. You’d think black people would be seeking more community-oriented banks as alternatives to the big Wall Street firms that ripped them off during the Great Recession.

Black-owned businesses are the second largest employer of black people, next to the federal government. But only 7 percent of small businesses are owned by blacks. How unfortunate that the president must go hat in hand to Corporate America, asking for $200 million to help black men and boys stay in school and get jobs.

The program is called “My Brother’s Keeper.” Better we start more businesses and hire these black men and boys. Let the brothers keep themselves.

“As shoppers, African Americans are influencers and trendsetters whose purchasing habits affect others,” Target Market News said. “They set trends in their purchase of apparel, autos and food and in their use of social media.”

Surely we can influence more than that.

The Atlantic article cited a speech by the black scholar W.E.B. Du Bois, given more than 80 years ago, titled “A Negro Nation Within a Nation.” In it, he declared:

“The peculiar position of Negroes in America offers an opportunity. . . . With the use of their political power, their power as consumers, and their brainpower . . . Negroes can develop in the United States an economic nation within a nation . . . ”

At the very least, we could stop expecting people who hate us to save us.

Poll result (8 votes)
True - Tell us why (5 votes)Vote
False - Explain why (0 votes)Vote
I'm White (3 votes)Vote

  

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
Hmmm.
Jan 14th 2015
1
he's right. starts with the grass roots.
Jan 14th 2015
2
But did you vote in the poll tho?
Jan 14th 2015
3
LMAOOOOOOOO
Jan 14th 2015
5
      yep. on my phone so I can't link do your googles nm
Jan 14th 2015
6
           interesting, well at least something is cohesive
Jan 14th 2015
41
                its all cohesive and logical. its the future.
Jan 14th 2015
42
RE: Wash/Post Columnist says "Blacks’ political muscle has gone soft."...
Jan 14th 2015
4
that was pretty pointless *edit*
Jan 14th 2015
7
So you can't see it huh?
Jan 14th 2015
8
      yeah i'm a complete idiot
Jan 14th 2015
9
           I'm glad to see it. Now do better
Jan 14th 2015
10
                your reading comprehension sucks
Jan 14th 2015
11
                     And you're a self-proclaimed Idiot.
Jan 14th 2015
12
                          Oh yes, I'm the one keeping blacks focused on being consumers
Jan 14th 2015
14
                               You really love living within the margins of exaggerations huh?
Jan 14th 2015
18
                                    do you know what 'margin' and 'exaggeration' mean?
Jan 14th 2015
20
                                         Yes.
Jan 14th 2015
22
                                              but teacher, you didn't answer my initial questions
Jan 14th 2015
25
                                                   Your only question was " "do you know what 'margin' and 'exaggeration' m...
Jan 14th 2015
30
                                                        A lot of space in this post
Jan 14th 2015
33
                                                        A lot of unnecessary space in this post
Jan 14th 2015
36
                                                        let's just be clear on that space
Jan 14th 2015
45
                                                             Dude, you said the article was pointless. I asked you a question
Jan 15th 2015
49
                                                        I'm speaking gibberish, by asking questions from your definition
Jan 14th 2015
43
                                                             Homes, you asked ONE Question and I answered it.
Jan 15th 2015
47
                                                                  questions (sentences with ? at the end) from above
Jan 15th 2015
51
                                                                       In summary,
Jan 15th 2015
52
True,
Jan 14th 2015
13
Would any of this actually happen?
Jan 14th 2015
15
stop being an idiot and publish a black children's book
Jan 14th 2015
16
It's foolish to expect non-blacks to positively cater to blacks
Jan 14th 2015
17
      more foolish to think this is the crux of our issues n/m
Jan 14th 2015
19
      not the crux, but we have to be responsible for our image
Jan 14th 2015
21
      No one ever said it was the crux of our issues n/m
Jan 14th 2015
23
           but it is the crux of this article n/m
Jan 14th 2015
27
                The article is only addressing on issue. This is not a Doctoral Disserta...
Jan 15th 2015
50
      and it isn't neccesary in this example.
Jan 14th 2015
24
           Every ghetto has the potential to turn empty lots and buildings
Jan 14th 2015
26
                sure once they become communities and not ghettos n/m
Jan 14th 2015
28
                     That's how you turn them into communities
Jan 14th 2015
29
                          whilst work can be an organising factor in peoples lives
Jan 14th 2015
31
                               won't disagree but can't agree until it's actually attempted
Jan 14th 2015
32
                                    gotta try before we say it won't work
Jan 14th 2015
35
Does he talk about how redistricting has had a role in this?
Jan 14th 2015
34
Maybe because redistricting is cause by the elected officials.
Jan 14th 2015
37
      An elected official would not vote to redistrict themselves out
Jan 14th 2015
38
           RE: An elected official would not vote to redistrict themselves out
Jan 14th 2015
39
                true.
Jan 14th 2015
40
Its true
Jan 14th 2015
44
no excuses your president is Black.
Jan 15th 2015
48
Black folks are comfortable with White Ppl solving their problmes
Jan 15th 2015
46
And we are the only ones that believe in this nonsense.
Jan 15th 2015
53
Yes, we are the only ones
Jan 15th 2015
56
what kinda problems ?
Jan 15th 2015
54
      Schools, Health, Relationships
Jan 15th 2015
58
foh at putting democrats election collapse on blk ppl
Jan 15th 2015
55
there was a lot of truth minus fact and fact minus truth
Jan 15th 2015
57

ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71175 posts
Wed Jan-14-15 09:13 AM

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1. "Hmmm. "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

>There are 42 million African Americans in this country with a
>combined purchasing power expected to hit $1.1 trillion this
>year. If Black America were an actual nation state instead of
>just a shaky state of mind, it would have a population
>slightly less than Spain’s and rank as the 46th-richest
>nation in the world, according to a statistical profile
>published in the Atlantic last year.

I hate stats like this. Black America is not a "nation" and if we were to take sub-populations as "nations," it would make for a longer list where they'd place lower. Even taking the statement at face value, we are talking about their economy being the size of Portugal, Pakistan, the Czech Republic and Kazakhstan. Do these countries have political unity, no social problems and serious international pull? Spain, the country they compare in terms of size, is in the top 15 economies (ranked by GDP) in the world. This is just a wholly unconvincing paragraph, and here it is WAY up high in the story.

>And yet, African Americans spent much of 2014 on bended knee
>— pleading for justice, crying for jobs, begging for equal
>treatment, with President Obama declaring that “a
>country’s conscience has to be sometimes triggered” to
>bring awareness to the killings of unarmed black men and boys
>by police.

I don't think "bended knee" is a fair categorization and I am tired of this and other brands of isolationist politics. I think people of all races who believe that understanding and action in concert is necessary on the right track and this kind of stuff disrupts that progress.

>Stand up, Black America.

Short paragraphs like this in columns are a pet peeve of mine.

>Leading up to the 2014 midterm elections, President Obama
>urged his base of support not to sit this one out. Too much
>was at stake. Black people needed to be as fired up as elderly
>white Republicans. Yet a poll by the Democratic Congressional
>Campaign Committee leading up to the elections found that 67
>percent of Obama’s base didn’t even know that an election
>was being held.

Ouch, right? Wrong. I suspect his "base" is being defined in some specious way (likely by age) because BLACK VOTER TURNOUT WAS HIGHER THAN WHITE VOTER TURNOUT in 2012. In 2014, it failed to match 2012 (true of voter turnout as a whole) but in many key races it was higher than it was in the last mid-term election in 2010. Again, this guy is presenting nuanced realities as being cut-and-dried.

>No point in complaining about Republicans in Congress now.
>
>An Associated Press survey two years ago found that 56 percent
>of Americans have explicit “anti-black attitudes” — and
>the rest don’t love you all that much, either. Harvard
>University professor Michael I. Norton found last year that
>many whites now believe anti-white racism is a bigger problem
>than anti-black bias — the latter having been all but
>eliminated, they say.

How many is "many?" Obviously not a majority. But yes, racism exists, attitudes suck and there is work to be done that will extend past any of our lifetimes.

>On the most important issues, an NBC News/Marist College poll
>found last month that 52 percent of whites have a “great
>deal” of confidence that police officers in their community
>treat blacks and whites the same, compared with only 12
>percent of blacks.
>
>So whose “conscience,” exactly, are black people trying to
>prick?

Everyone's, no?

>The answer ought to be our own. Black people have serious
>problems, to be sure — extraordinarily high incarceration
>and homicide rates, for starters. But the resources at our
>disposal are enormous, if not always used most effectively.
>
>“African Americans make more shopping trips than the average
>consumer,” reports Target Market News, an authority on black
>consumer habits. “They are more likely than average to buy
>beauty and ethnic products, children’s cologne, toiletries
>for both men and women, frozen meats, and fresh vegetables and
>grains.”
>
>We have sweet-smelling kids but no major black-owned
>publishing companies that can reflect their sweet little faces
>in children’s books.

So much for "whites shower more than ethnics!"

>There are fewer than 30 black-owned banks in the country,
>according to the Federal Reserve, compared with about 130 such
>institutions at the turn of the 20th century. You’d think
>black people would be seeking more community-oriented banks as
>alternatives to the big Wall Street firms that ripped them off
>during the Great Recession.

That is an interesting figure but I'd like to see it evaluated within the context of the consolidation of ownership in the industry as a whole.

>Black-owned businesses are the second largest employer of
>black people, next to the federal government. But only 7
>percent of small businesses are owned by blacks. How
>unfortunate that the president must go hat in hand to
>Corporate America, asking for $200 million to help black men
>and boys stay in school and get jobs.
>
>The program is called “My Brother’s Keeper.” Better we
>start more businesses and hire these black men and boys. Let
>the brothers keep themselves.

Why can't it be both things? The idea is to get a push in the right direction and then keeping moving it in on your own, not to create dependency or a perpetual state of pity. I get this author's frustration but I don't see it as being productive.

>“As shoppers, African Americans are influencers and
>trendsetters whose purchasing habits affect others,” Target
>Market News said. “They set trends in their purchase of
>apparel, autos and food and in their use of social media.”
>
>Surely we can influence more than that.

>The Atlantic article cited a speech by the black scholar
>W.E.B. Du Bois, given more than 80 years ago, titled “A
>Negro Nation Within a Nation.” In it, he declared:
>
>“The peculiar position of Negroes in America offers an
>opportunity. . . . With the use of their political power,
>their power as consumers, and their brainpower . . .
>Negroes can develop in the United States an economic nation
>within a nation . . . ”
>
>At the very least, we could stop expecting people who hate us
>to save us.

I still think in a position where you're a minority, albeit a significant one, getting people to stop hating you is a worthwhile goal. I mean, it *kind of* fetters your effort to *live*.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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Binlahab
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182541 posts
Wed Jan-14-15 09:17 AM

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2. "he's right. starts with the grass roots."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Reparations is the cause and the green party is the future


does it really matter?

for all my fans who keep my name in their mouth: http://i.imgur.com/v2xNOpS.jpg

  

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Case_One
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54304 posts
Wed Jan-14-15 09:19 AM

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3. "But did you vote in the poll tho?"
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

See what I'm tawn bout Bin...LOL Old Non Voting Butt. LOL

.
.
.
"America, stop turning our Court Houses of Justice into Dens for Justified Murderers."

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71175 posts
Wed Jan-14-15 09:27 AM

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5. "LMAOOOOOOOO"
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

i replied fast to beat you to being the first.

has anyone in the green party made a statement about reparations?

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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Binlahab
Charter member
182541 posts
Wed Jan-14-15 09:32 AM

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6. "yep. on my phone so I can't link do your googles nm"
In response to Reply # 5


  

          


does it really matter?

for all my fans who keep my name in their mouth: http://i.imgur.com/v2xNOpS.jpg

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71175 posts
Wed Jan-14-15 04:36 PM

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41. "interesting, well at least something is cohesive"
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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Binlahab
Charter member
182541 posts
Wed Jan-14-15 04:56 PM

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42. "its all cohesive and logical. its the future. "
In response to Reply # 41


  

          

As it slowly comes to fruition you'll be able to say damn that fool on okp was doing that shit...weird

  

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Case_One
Charter member
54304 posts
Wed Jan-14-15 09:23 AM

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4. "RE: Wash/Post Columnist says "Blacks’ political muscle has gone soft."..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Economics is Key. Choosing to spend out money on maters that benefit our greater social, political, educational, needs will trickle down to our recreational and legacy needs.


>There are fewer than 30 black-owned banks in the country,
>according to the Federal Reserve, compared with about 130 such
>institutions at the turn of the 20th century. You’d think
>black people would be seeking more community-oriented banks as
>alternatives to the big Wall Street firms that ripped them off
>during the Great Recession.
>
>Black-owned businesses are the second largest employer of
>black people, next to the federal government. But only 7
>percent of small businesses are owned by blacks. How
>unfortunate that the president must go hat in hand to
>Corporate America, asking for $200 million to help black men
>and boys stay in school and get jobs.
>
>The program is called “My Brother’s Keeper.” Better we
>start more businesses and hire these black men and boys. Let
>the brothers keep themselves.
>
>“As shoppers, African Americans are influencers and
>trendsetters whose purchasing habits affect others,” Target
>Market News said. “They set trends in their purchase of
>apparel, autos and food and in their use of social media.”
>
>Surely we can influence more than that.
>
>The Atlantic article cited a speech by the black scholar
>W.E.B. Du Bois, given more than 80 years ago, titled “A
>Negro Nation Within a Nation.” In it, he declared:
>
>“The peculiar position of Negroes in America offers an
>opportunity. . . . With the use of their political power,
>their power as consumers, and their brainpower . . .
>Negroes can develop in the United States an economic nation
>within a nation . . . ”
>
>At the very least, we could stop expecting people who hate us
>to save us.






.
.
.
"America, stop turning our Court Houses of Justice into Dens for Justified Murderers."

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
42073 posts
Wed Jan-14-15 09:35 AM

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7. "that was pretty pointless *edit*"
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Jan-14-15 09:39 AM by imcvspl

  

          

pointless in the fact that equates political power almost soley with economic power, puts us down for contributing to the system which oppresses us, denies the small efforts that have been done, ignores the other systemic factors at work and then offers no solutions but do better.

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." � Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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Case_One
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54304 posts
Wed Jan-14-15 09:42 AM

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8. "So you can't see it huh?"
In response to Reply # 7


  

          

>pointless in the fact that equates political power almost
>soley with economic power, puts us down for contributing to
>the system which oppresses us, denies the small efforts that
>have been done, ignores the other systemic factors at work and
>then offers no solutions but do better.


Are you not able to see the correlation between Economic Power and Political Power, because Economics has been the most direct and effective tool since the beginning of time?

So are you missing it?




.
.
.
"America, stop turning our Court Houses of Justice into Dens for Justified Murderers."

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
42073 posts
Wed Jan-14-15 09:51 AM

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9. "yeah i'm a complete idiot"
In response to Reply # 8


  

          

how foolish of me to think it odd that if a quote from 80 years ago about the economic power of black people is still relevant today (despite the fact that black folk have actually made strides economically) that perhaps there's more to play in our situation than just the amassing of economic power to become political power.

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." � Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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Case_One
Charter member
54304 posts
Wed Jan-14-15 10:39 AM

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10. "I'm glad to see it. Now do better"
In response to Reply # 9


  

          

That's not what you said earlier.


.
.
.
"America, stop turning our Court Houses of Justice into Dens for Justified Murderers."

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
42073 posts
Wed Jan-14-15 10:46 AM

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11. "your reading comprehension sucks"
In response to Reply # 10


  

          

you still don't get what i said, but your ignorance will convince you otherwise.

let me add more for you to chew on.

imagine you and i are in the same economic class, we're both black and yet our values don't line up, how does the economic power translate into political power? how is it even possible that our values don't line up when we're of the same skin and of the same economic class? what could possibly have drawn this value divide between the two of us? and no its not the easy answer you may jump at immediately.

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." � Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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Case_One
Charter member
54304 posts
Wed Jan-14-15 10:54 AM

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12. "And you're a self-proclaimed Idiot. "
In response to Reply # 11


  

          

Dude I read your simpleton response. You can't see pass the micro issues long enough to understand the macro impact of the whole economic system that marginalizes minorities, thus marginalizing our political clout. At the same time, it's goofballs like yourself that contribute to the lack of political understanding and the associated power matrix which keeps simple black focused on being consumers instead of producers with real economic power, thus weakening our political advantages. But I digress and you can chew on that.




.
.
.
"America, stop turning our Court Houses of Justice into Dens for Justified Murderers."

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
42073 posts
Wed Jan-14-15 11:13 AM

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14. "Oh yes, I'm the one keeping blacks focused on being consumers"
In response to Reply # 12


  

          

>Dude I read your simpleton response.

You didn't answer my simpleton question though.

>You can't see pass the

'T'

>micro issues long enough to understand the macro impact of the
>whole economic system that marginalizes minorities, thus
>marginalizing our political clout.

Oh wow so you're saying that the whole economic system marginalizes our political clout, which would mean that buying into the economic system would raise our political clout? Interesting, because seemingly our trillion dollar economic clout would be able to do that except, it's not just about amassing that economic clout it's how we use it. So somewhere between the amassing of that economic clout and the using it toward political ends we get caught up in the beauty shop. Which would be based on the value base acquired during the amassing of said economic clout which is actually tied closer to that which oppresses us. Hmmmm and so the solution to dealing with that is...?

>At the same time, it's
>goofballs like yourself that contribute to the lack of
>political understanding and the associated power matrix which
>keeps simple black focused on being consumers instead of
>producers with real economic power, thus weakening our
>political advantages. But I digress and you can chew on
>that.

Oh I get it because I'm saying its bigger than economics I'm obviously saying keep spending your money niggers so as to weaken both our economic and political clout. Geeze I'm such a goofball.

How do we free ourselves from this Case? School me please!!!

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." � Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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Case_One
Charter member
54304 posts
Wed Jan-14-15 11:25 AM

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18. "You really love living within the margins of exaggerations huh?"
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

See you in class.


.
.
.
"America, stop turning our Court Houses of Justice into Dens for Justified Murderers."

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
42073 posts
Wed Jan-14-15 11:27 AM

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20. "do you know what 'margin' and 'exaggeration' mean?"
In response to Reply # 18


  

          

sorry i actually want you to answer my other questions first. i'll wait.

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." � Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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Case_One
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22. "Yes. "
In response to Reply # 20


  

          

Depending on the subject and the perspectives, the Margins are on the edge of the notions of what is normal or desirable And you are exaggerating the margins.

See, now you have to stay for detention.


.
.
.
"America, stop turning our Court Houses of Justice into Dens for Justified Murderers."

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
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Wed Jan-14-15 11:54 AM

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25. "but teacher, you didn't answer my initial questions"
In response to Reply # 22


  

          

>Depending on the subject and the perspectives, the Margins
>are on the edge of the notions of what is normal or desirable
>And you are exaggerating the margins.

So in this specific instance what are the notions of what is normal or desirable for which I am on the edge? And if one is on the edge of those normal and desirable things can they exaggerate the edge or are they exaggerating the normal and desirable?


█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." � Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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Case_One
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30. "Your only question was " "do you know what 'margin' and 'exaggeration' m..."
In response to Reply # 25


  

          

And now you are just talking gibberish.

I'm going to send you back one grad.



.
.
.
"America, stop turning our Court Houses of Justice into Dens for Justified Murderers."

  

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ThaAnthology
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33. "A lot of space in this post "
In response to Reply # 30


  

          

was taken up by ya'll bickering. Perhaps tHIS is the true microcosm of many of our problems.

www.anthologyfmn.com

Enter the Written World of Fahim Malik Nassar

The House of Caine (available)

Melancholoy Funk (available)

Tha Anthology (Words 2001-2003) Poetry inspired by OKP and Wash, DC
(available)

The Spook who sat by the Radio Poetry (av

  

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Case_One
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36. "A lot of unnecessary space in this post "
In response to Reply # 33


  

          

>was taken up by ya'll bickering. Perhaps tHIS is the true
>microcosm of many of our problems.


Well, It gets my goat when people start with a negative Crab in a Bucket response when they have no solutions. They act like any idea that did spawn from their own loins is a waste of time.


.
.
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"America, stop turning our Court Houses of Justice into Dens for Justified Murderers."

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
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Wed Jan-14-15 05:51 PM

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45. "let's just be clear on that space"
In response to Reply # 33


  

          

case posts up an article. i respond that it's pointless because it doesn't take the broader issues into account or offer any solutions.

case's knee jerk reaction to anything which isn't a direct cosign is to insinuate that folk don't get it. doesn't address my points at all just says you don't get it, despite the fact that my post makes it very clear that i do get it.

my response is sarcasm which also makes it pretty clear i get it and exemplifies again that i do get the point but think it's too narrow to really address the problem. but that goes over case's head because again it's not a complete cosign.

again he fails to address the issues but rather plays into my sarcasm because that's the only thing he probably understood. so i further illustrate what i see as being one issue, and ask how economics translate into political power without a common value base.

again completely over his head so his reaction is that now i'm the cause of the problem, get this, because i'm the reason we're not using our economic power correctly. so i further illustrate the problems of reducing the issue to economic power as political power. even offer him the opportunity to present a solution based off of how he's representing the issue.

but rather than presenting a solution he tells me i'm living on the margins of exaggeration. i don't even know what that means. so i ask him to explain it. he provides some gibberish. i restate his gibberish as questions to clarify his meaning, and he tells me i'm speaking gibberish.

now he's saying that my problem is i'm negative and offer no solutions, not realizing that the lack of solutions comes from the framing of the problem, which goes back to my original critique of the article.

now a relevant question is why do i bother? shit why'd i even bother this play by play? i do wonder sometimes, but i guess its the thought that if case can come around to see the broader scope of the problem rather than consuming the age old talking points that don't do much to help, well then maybe we may be on the road to progress.

perhaps my snarky tone defeats that purpose in some regard, but i've had enough convo's with case to know that even if i remove the snark from my tone he'll still resist if it's not a cosign. but i don't know, i'll probably keep at it next post because i have hope for us, though i'm probably shooting myself in the foot because case will just use this post to say i'm stalking him or something which will lead to only more dismissiveness.

again, why do i bother?


█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." � Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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Case_One
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49. "Dude, you said the article was pointless. I asked you a question"
In response to Reply # 45


  

          

I didn't insinuate anything. SO I asked:


"Are you not able to see the correlation between Economic Power and Political Power, because Economics has been the most direct and effective tool since the beginning of time?

So are you missing it?"



You, on the other hand love coming at me on the regular with your High and Mighty perception of yourself. You seem to think that your are intellectually superior to me and your come off as a ASS. Noe you are trying to play the matter off like, I'm missing the points that are germane to the conversation. Man, get on with that mess.

If you want to have a real conversation then show some real respect.


.
.
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"Today is your day to have a better life -- it's your right."

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
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43. "I'm speaking gibberish, by asking questions from your definition"
In response to Reply # 30


  

          

Maybe, just maybe, your definitions are gibberish.

Nah couldn't be that, because you clearly understand your own definition, just for whatever reasons can't answer questions about them. Or any other questions for that matter. In fact it seems you don't want anything you say to be questioned ever.

Interesting.



█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." � Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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Case_One
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47. "Homes, you asked ONE Question and I answered it."
In response to Reply # 43


  

          

>Maybe, just maybe, your definitions are gibberish.
>

No even you just want to be contrary.

>Nah couldn't be that, because you clearly understand your own
>definition, just for whatever reasons can't answer questions
>about them. Or any other questions for that matter. In fact
>it seems you don't want anything you say to be questioned
>ever.
>
>Interesting.

Doc, I don't mind questions, but when you act like an Ass you get treated like and Ass.



.
.
.
"Today is your day to have a better life -- it's your right."

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
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51. "questions (sentences with ? at the end) from above"
In response to Reply # 47


  

          

"imagine you and i are in the same economic class, we're both black and yet our values don't line up, how does the economic power translate into political power? how is it even possible that our values don't line up when we're of the same skin and of the same economic class? what could possibly have drawn this value divide between the two of us?"

"Oh wow so you're saying that the whole economic system marginalizes our political clout, which would mean that buying into the economic system would raise our political clout? Interesting, because seemingly our trillion dollar economic clout would be able to do that except, it's not just about amassing that economic clout it's how we use it. So somewhere between the amassing of that economic clout and the using it toward political ends we get caught up in the beauty shop. Which would be based on the value base acquired during the amassing of said economic clout which is actually tied closer to that which oppresses us. Hmmmm and so the solution to dealing with that is...?"

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." � Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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Case_One
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Thu Jan-15-15 11:56 AM

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52. "In summary,"
In response to Reply # 51


  

          

>"imagine you and i are in the same economic class, we're both
>black and yet our values don't line up, how does the economic
>power translate into political power? how is it even possible
>that our values don't line up when we're of the same skin and
>of the same economic class? what could possibly have drawn
>this value divide between the two of us?"
>


I already addressed this part of the conversation.



>"Oh wow so you're saying that the whole economic system
>marginalizes our political clout, which would mean that buying
>into the economic system would raise our political clout?
>Interesting, because seemingly our trillion dollar economic
>clout would be able to do that except, it's not just about
>amassing that economic clout it's how we use it. So somewhere
>between the amassing of that economic clout and the using it
>toward political ends we get caught up in the beauty shop.
>Which would be based on the value base acquired during the
>amassing of said economic clout which is actually tied closer
>to that which oppresses us. Hmmmm and so the solution to
>dealing with that is...?"
>


The solution to helping people orientate their priorities to something that matters is socioeconomic awareness, financial literacy & education, (not just in schools), and the realization or actualization of results that benefit the whole community.

Sometimes I believe that Black People need a Moral Enema and an Ethical Vaccination because our long-term priorities seem to be messed up and we are suffering from a identity disease.


  

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Atillah Moor
Member since Sep 05th 2013
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Wed Jan-14-15 11:00 AM

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13. "True,"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

The black politicians these days aren't even interested in finding ways to improve things for their own people in their own communities.

______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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b.Touch
Member since Jun 28th 2011
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Wed Jan-14-15 11:17 AM

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15. "Would any of this actually happen?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

It's nice to say that people "should" start black-owned business to hire "all these" black people, but in what industry? What are the average skill karts of these unemployed? What about all of the impediments that are the reasons why many people of any race do not start small business in the first place?

Why do you need a black publishing company (especially in 2015) to publish a black children's book?

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
42073 posts
Wed Jan-14-15 11:19 AM

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16. "stop being an idiot and publish a black children's book"
In response to Reply # 15


  

          

because obviously nobody's done that in the past 80 years.

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." � Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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Atillah Moor
Member since Sep 05th 2013
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Wed Jan-14-15 11:23 AM

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17. "It's foolish to expect non-blacks to positively cater to blacks "
In response to Reply # 15


  

          

______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
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19. "more foolish to think this is the crux of our issues n/m"
In response to Reply # 17


  

          


█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." � Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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Atillah Moor
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Wed Jan-14-15 11:31 AM

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21. "not the crux, but we have to be responsible for our image"
In response to Reply # 19
Wed Jan-14-15 11:32 AM by Atillah Moor

  

          

that's not unrealistic.

______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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Case_One
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Wed Jan-14-15 11:40 AM

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23. "No one ever said it was the crux of our issues n/m"
In response to Reply # 19


  

          


.
.
.
"America, stop turning our Court Houses of Justice into Dens for Justified Murderers."

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
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27. "but it is the crux of this article n/m"
In response to Reply # 23


  

          


█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." � Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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Case_One
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Thu Jan-15-15 10:30 AM

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50. "The article is only addressing on issue. This is not a Doctoral Disserta..."
In response to Reply # 27


  

          


.
.
.
"Today is your day to have a better life -- it's your right."

  

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b.Touch
Member since Jun 28th 2011
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Wed Jan-14-15 11:44 AM

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24. "and it isn't neccesary in this example."
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

If you write and illustrate a book that's good enough, you will find a publisher instead of trying to start a business in a shrinking/dying field. It's not going to be rejected out of hand because the protagonists are black: there's plenty of black children's books, YA novels, novels, etc.

Or you could e-publish it online without needing to start a business.

These hypotheticals seem to be set up to say things people just want to hear vs. actual analyses of the market. Where are the wholes in industry that small black-owned businesses could take advantage of? Don't just say "more small black businesses": they really ought to specify at least a generic type or industry

  

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Atillah Moor
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26. "Every ghetto has the potential to turn empty lots and buildings"
In response to Reply # 24


  

          

into small scale farms. Urban terraces could be formed to grow organic produce that could then be sold in the city at 100% markup to the more affluent inhabitants of said city. That's jobs, money, and food back to the community right there.

Collecting and breaking down obsolete or broken electronics and appliances into copper and other reusable materials could also perhaps provide employment to the minimally skilled.

Bottled water production using tap water with sales being made to Africa or other 3rd world economies could maybe create jobs.

Lastly a number of folks could be trained as security for overseas work as mercenaries (high risk high reward) or security detail i.e the real "black water".


______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
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28. "sure once they become communities and not ghettos n/m"
In response to Reply # 26


  

          


█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." � Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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Atillah Moor
Member since Sep 05th 2013
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29. "That's how you turn them into communities "
In response to Reply # 28


  

          

gotta have something to rally around.

______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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Reuben
Member since Mar 13th 2006
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31. "whilst work can be an organising factor in peoples lives"
In response to Reply # 29


  

          

Providing discipline,send of purpose etc

I don't think it creates communities.

_______________________________________
When discourse of Blackness is not connected to efforts to promote collective black self determinism
it becomes simply another recourse appropriated by the colonizer

http://hardboiledbabesanddarkchocolate.tumblr.co

  

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Atillah Moor
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32. "won't disagree but can't agree until it's actually attempted "
In response to Reply # 31


  

          

______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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ThaAnthology
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35. "gotta try before we say it won't work "
In response to Reply # 32


  

          

www.anthologyfmn.com

Enter the Written World of Fahim Malik Nassar

The House of Caine (available)

Melancholoy Funk (available)

Tha Anthology (Words 2001-2003) Poetry inspired by OKP and Wash, DC
(available)

The Spook who sat by the Radio Poetry (av

  

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Castro
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Wed Jan-14-15 03:08 PM

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34. "Does he talk about how redistricting has had a role in this?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Because that is a huge reason for our struggles

------------------
One Hundred.

  

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Case_One
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37. "Maybe because redistricting is cause by the elected officials. "
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

Hence Money helps to elect the people that propose redistricting as a means to hold power for their base.
.
.
.
"America, stop turning our Court Houses of Justice into Dens for Justified Murderers."

  

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Castro
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38. "An elected official would not vote to redistrict themselves out"
In response to Reply # 37


  

          

of office....

and many districts that have been power bases for African Americans have been compromised by redistricting

------------------
One Hundred.

  

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Case_One
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39. "RE: An elected official would not vote to redistrict themselves out"
In response to Reply # 38


  

          

>of office....
>
>and many districts that have been power bases for African
>Americans have been compromised by redistricting


I agree and I'm saying the economics has played a part in that move.

.
.
.
"America, stop turning our Court Houses of Justice into Dens for Justified Murderers."

  

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Castro
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40. "true."
In response to Reply # 39


  

          

------------------
One Hundred.

  

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Musa
Member since Mar 08th 2006
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Wed Jan-14-15 05:49 PM

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44. "Its true"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

black people have a bunch of happy niggas with better jobs and pay forgetting that people usually black literally sacrificed for you to be in that position.

The myth of individualism in capitalism is something black folk cling to almost as much if not more than white Jesus.

Now with that said we have no political party of our own (default democrats).

Many of our people fell for the President Obama okie doke and have seen the undoing of many civil rights advances along with freedoms that actual 1st class citizens enjoy but hey no excuses your president is Black.

<----

Soundcloud.com/aquil84

(HIP HOP)
http://aquil.bandcamp.com

  

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Atillah Moor
Member since Sep 05th 2013
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Thu Jan-15-15 10:26 AM

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48. "no excuses your president is Black."
In response to Reply # 44


  

          

Yup. Saw this one coming a mile away.

______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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Mori
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Thu Jan-15-15 10:16 AM

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46. "Black folks are comfortable with White Ppl solving their problmes"
In response to Reply # 0


          

I work in an office with important, powerful black people. HOWEVER, when there are problems, the people who helped solve them are whites. The people who restore order are whites.

Black people as a culture have to learn to solve problems and restore order in a way that functions within America.

We are still evolving as a culture within a culture. We like to have to the benefits of both cultures. But we haven't yet embodied the best of the both worlds.

Rise & Shine
Thrive & Grind
Heart & Mind

  

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Case_One
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Thu Jan-15-15 11:57 AM

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53. "And we are the only ones that believe in this nonsense. "
In response to Reply # 46


  

          


.
.
.
"Today is your day to have a better life -- it's your right."

  

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Mori
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Thu Jan-15-15 11:44 PM

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56. "Yes, we are the only ones"
In response to Reply # 53


          

Black Americans are in trapped in an adolescent like thinking where we can act a fool and some great hope will come and fix it. It is evident in that we depend so heavily on the government system to manage our families. From child support, financial assistance, health care, schools, etc... We rarely have a privatized approach to problem solving.

Rise & Shine
Thrive & Grind
Heart & Mind

  

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Riot
Member since May 25th 2005
14596 posts
Thu Jan-15-15 02:52 PM

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54. " what kinda problems ?"
In response to Reply # 46


  

          



)))--####---###--(((

bunda
<-.-> ^_^ \^0^/
get busy living, or get busy dying.

  

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Mori
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Thu Jan-15-15 11:48 PM

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58. "Schools, Health, Relationships"
In response to Reply # 54


          

Schools are shitty and we as a collective really believe that attending white schools vs. building and improving our own schools will solve our education challenges.


Health
We have no private hospitals, insurance companies and medical experts (outside of the natural black health community) who are committed to building an industry around black health disparities.

Relationships
Pregnant, Divorced, Married, STDs, Single- We wait for other people to research our relationships, tell us what we are doing wrong and we try to fit into a model that does not prove to work in the long run for black people. Instead of developing our own rules and social codes, we expect that adopting white/european relationship models will fix everything.

These are examples that reflect how the average group of people think and function.

Rise & Shine
Thrive & Grind
Heart & Mind

  

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Riot
Member since May 25th 2005
14596 posts
Thu Jan-15-15 03:20 PM

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55. "foh at putting democrats election collapse on blk ppl"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

-majority of that was not in states with any "black" districts
-the candidates chose to run from obama, so why would obama's base come out for them

the larger argument of political clout, i guess u could put at the hands of CBC, local mayors, grassroots political parties, etc


that has nothing (directly) to do with childrens books, eric garner, or black banks.

he's confusing symptons with sickness





)))--####---###--(((

bunda
<-.-> ^_^ \^0^/
get busy living, or get busy dying.

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71175 posts
Thu Jan-15-15 11:47 PM

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57. "there was a lot of truth minus fact and fact minus truth"
In response to Reply # 55


  

          

then again, it is a column. fake ass george will approach to writing it.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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