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Subject: "Get your panties in a bunch...again. Oliver Stone's WTC movie trailer" This topic is locked.
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bignick
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Wed May-17-06 10:46 AM

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"Get your panties in a bunch...again. Oliver Stone's WTC movie trailer"


  

          

cue "it's too soon" bullshit.

http://www.apple.com/trailers/paramount/wtc/large.html

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
At least it LOOKS more interesting than United 93.
May 17th 2006
1
I agree
May 17th 2006
10
uh..but after seeing 93, it will be hard to top.
May 21st 2006
45
that trailer suggests a weirdly sentimental view
May 17th 2006
2
I'll bite...Here's my issue
May 17th 2006
3
My question is what's the difference between this and, say
May 17th 2006
4
fiction/non-fiction?
May 17th 2006
5
Its a good question
May 17th 2006
6
      This film is based on the true story of two first responders.
May 17th 2006
7
           Right but its Oliver Stone...lol...fact = fiction=fact=fiction...
May 17th 2006
8
                I've read that the story is being told in a straightforward manner.
May 17th 2006
9
hmmm
May 17th 2006
11
      well I think you've nailed it
May 17th 2006
12
           i have beef with them acting like it's some kind of affront.
May 17th 2006
13
                this takes us back to the "too soon" debate, no?
May 17th 2006
14
                yeah. but, for me, there is no debate.
May 17th 2006
17
                     tell that to anyone that worked or STILL works downtown
May 27th 2006
49
                          and none of that makes it wrong to make a movie about it.
May 27th 2006
50
                I agree with this
May 17th 2006
15
I just don't think it'll be very good
May 17th 2006
16
^^^Probably the truest statement of this thread
May 17th 2006
18
JFK???
May 17th 2006
21
I really didn't like it all that much
May 17th 2006
23
If even then
May 17th 2006
22
cosign on both points
May 18th 2006
26
Natural Born Killers?
May 18th 2006
27
      Any Given Sunday wasn't that bad but it wasn't that good either
May 18th 2006
29
      RE: Natural Born Killers was TIGHT
May 19th 2006
33
Maria Bello and Maggie Gyllenhall, eff the rest of that noise
May 17th 2006
19
I wonder about the WWII movies that came out during the war
May 17th 2006
20
When I saw the title of the post I thought Stone was
May 17th 2006
24
nicholas's mustache.
May 18th 2006
25
RE: Get your panties in a bunch...again. Oliver Stone's WTC movie traile...
May 18th 2006
28
You may call it 'bullshit'...
May 18th 2006
30
looks very good
May 18th 2006
looks very good
May 18th 2006
31
I agree n/m
May 31st 2006
55
the thing about this and U93
May 19th 2006
32
so you're not gonna see it because of how someone else will react to it?
May 19th 2006
34
      well, I have no interest in seeing it.
May 19th 2006
43
           i can but that, but...
May 22nd 2006
48
                admittedly, that's overstating things
May 27th 2006
51
*SPOILER ALERT*
May 19th 2006
35
*ADDITIONAL SPOILERS*
May 19th 2006
36
      no they didn't silly...
May 21st 2006
46
why August 9th???
May 19th 2006
37
wrong.
May 19th 2006
38
      fake ass celebrity, Kate Hudson ass nugga
May 19th 2006
39
           ^^^panties are DEFINITELY in a bunch^^^
May 19th 2006
40
                ^^^wishes he was the famous Nick Adams^^^
May 19th 2006
41
                     ^^^still mad. still wrong^^^
May 19th 2006
42
looks pretty stupid n/m
May 20th 2006
44
I'll watch those movies
May 22nd 2006
47
how am I the first one to say.................
May 28th 2006
52
there's a fine line between art and propaganda.
May 28th 2006
53
"It's too soon" has jumped the shark
May 28th 2006
54

Ryan M
Member since Oct 21st 2002
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Wed May-17-06 10:55 AM

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1. "At least it LOOKS more interesting than United 93."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

------------------------------
'19-'20 LA Lakers

James. Davis. Kuzma. Cousins. Rondo. Caldwell-Pope. Green. Cook. Bradley. McGee. Dudley. Caruso...

  

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SammyJankis
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Wed May-17-06 01:41 PM

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10. "I agree"
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

i might actually see this one

___

And who are you; the proud lord said, that I must bow so low?

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biscuit
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Sun May-21-06 11:18 PM

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45. "uh..but after seeing 93, it will be hard to top."
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

That is one intense, moving film.

The music they chose for this trailer is corny as hell, btw.

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

*Effasig*

  

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DrNO
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Wed May-17-06 12:14 PM

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2. "that trailer suggests a weirdly sentimental view"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

of the pre 9/11 world, no?

_
http://youtube.com/watch?v=4TztqYaemt0
http://preptimeposse.blogspot.com/

  

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dr invisible
Member since Sep 19th 2002
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Wed May-17-06 12:41 PM

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3. "I'll bite...Here's my issue"
In response to Reply # 0


          

These fools capitalize on tragedy and the very lucrative and marketable sentimentality that goes along with it and do not not add or contribute to any type of dialogue/solution et al. I dont know about Stone's film yet though remain skeptical but United 93?? I suppose you could argue its a tribute but I personally dont buy it.

I dont entirely agree with the above pt but what the hell. Let's talk.

  

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ZooTown74
Member since May 29th 2002
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Wed May-17-06 12:58 PM

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4. "My question is what's the difference between this and, say"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

a 9/11 widow writing a book in 2002, or someone releasing a book of images from 9/11 during the same year.

I don't care either way, but I'm just posing a question.
___________________________________________________________________________________________
A thick b****
with big legs
yeah
it's Gutfest '89

  

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cereffusion
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Wed May-17-06 01:01 PM

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5. "fiction/non-fiction?"
In response to Reply # 4


  

          


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dr invisible
Member since Sep 19th 2002
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Wed May-17-06 01:09 PM

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6. "Its a good question"
In response to Reply # 4


          

I dont know. I think I get uncomfortable when money gets involved. That's my knee-jerk reaction.

You could argue the widow finds it therpuetic and wants to honor someone very close to her and expose truth. Are Stone and United 93 doing the same thing? Maybe.

Is there a difference, like cerefusion is saying, between journalism (ie) memoirs/photojournalism) and a fictionalized drama which ultimately serves as entertainment? There is and that gets at some of my initial reaction. Then again a movie like Battle of Algiers is a fiction, also tragedy, in some sense and really moves me.

  

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ZooTown74
Member since May 29th 2002
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Wed May-17-06 01:13 PM

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7. "This film is based on the true story of two first responders."
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

___________________________________________________________________________________________
A thick b****
with big legs
yeah
it's Gutfest '89

  

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dr invisible
Member since Sep 19th 2002
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Wed May-17-06 01:25 PM

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8. "Right but its Oliver Stone...lol...fact = fiction=fact=fiction..."
In response to Reply # 7


          

I'm interested either way and, who am i fooling, I'll more than likely see it at some pt. Its not like I'm a boycott it or anything. Just an issue I have with this sort of stuff. I'll always be skeptical.

  

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ZooTown74
Member since May 29th 2002
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Wed May-17-06 01:30 PM

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9. "I've read that the story is being told in a straightforward manner."
In response to Reply # 8
Wed May-17-06 01:43 PM by ZooTown74

  

          

No conspiracies or theories to be found anywhere. But I hear you.
___________________________________________________________________________________________
A thick b****
with big legs
yeah
it's Gutfest '89

  

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bignick
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Wed May-17-06 01:48 PM

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11. "hmmm"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

>These fools capitalize on tragedy and the very lucrative and
>marketable sentimentality that goes along with it and do not
>not add or contribute to any type of dialogue/solution et al.

his job isn't to contribute any dialogue or solution. his job is to make an entertaining movie. period.

>I dont know about Stone's film yet though remain skeptical but
>United 93?? I suppose you could argue its a tribute but I
>personally dont buy it.

it doesn't have to be a tribute. it's just a movie.

  

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DoctorBombay
Member since Jan 02nd 2004
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Wed May-17-06 02:03 PM

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12. "well I think you've nailed it"
In response to Reply # 11


          

>his job isn't to contribute any dialogue or solution. his job
>is to make an entertaining movie. period.

there are people who don't want to be entertained by 9/11. To call that view bullshit is silly of you.

  

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bignick
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Wed May-17-06 02:07 PM

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13. "i have beef with them acting like it's some kind of affront."
In response to Reply # 12
Wed May-17-06 02:08 PM by bignick

  

          

>there are people who don't want to be entertained by 9/11. To
>call that view bullshit is silly of you.

but just because someone tries to make an entertaining, compelling film that's based on a tragedy doesn't mean they're being exploitative or sleazy. and it doesn't mean that the movie is necessarily going to be bad.

if Spielberg had thought that way, he wouldn't have made some of his best movies.

  

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DoctorBombay
Member since Jan 02nd 2004
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Wed May-17-06 02:09 PM

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14. "this takes us back to the "too soon" debate, no?"
In response to Reply # 13


          

>if Spielberg had thought that way, he wouldn't have made some
>of his best movies.

  

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bignick
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Wed May-17-06 02:43 PM

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17. "yeah. but, for me, there is no debate."
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

besdies, we're talking about something that happened FIVE YEARS AGO.

  

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Justin_Maldonado_7
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Sat May-27-06 12:19 PM

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49. "tell that to anyone that worked or STILL works downtown"
In response to Reply # 17


          

>besdies, we're talking about something that happened FIVE
>YEARS AGO.

i was working at 1 liberty plaza last year and to say that it was just 5 years ago, shows you have no clue as to how much 9/11 has affected NYC..

we still get our bags checked on the trains and they are now installing bomb sniffers at penn station..police will be walking around with these gadgets scanning people for biochemical weapons and bombs...

the threat of that shit happening again is something people in NYC live with everyday...reason being...there is next to nothing the govt can do to really prevent another terrorist attack...so in my opinion 5 years is way too soon....he is taking advantage of the fact that wtc is still fresh...to me its tasteless...

holocaust movies were made how many years after ?
pearl harbor was made how many years after ?
platoon and all those big nam movies..?
even the jamie fox persian gulf movie was made more than 10 years after and that war lasted only a few months...

  

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bignick
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Sat May-27-06 12:58 PM

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50. "and none of that makes it wrong to make a movie about it."
In response to Reply # 49


  

          

  

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dr invisible
Member since Sep 19th 2002
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Wed May-17-06 02:40 PM

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15. "I agree with this"
In response to Reply # 13


          

>>but just because someone tries to make an entertaining, compelling film that's based on a tragedy doesn't mean they're being exploitative or sleazy. and it doesn't mean that the movie is necessarily going to be bad.

but its a fine line and that's what i'm getting at. and "compelling" suggests in some ways of opening up dialogue, no? like on a message board? lol. good pts. though. thanks.

  

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johnny_domino
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Wed May-17-06 02:41 PM

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16. "I just don't think it'll be very good"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I haven't seen anything from Oliver Stone that I've really liked since the 80s.

  

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dr invisible
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Wed May-17-06 02:59 PM

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18. "^^^Probably the truest statement of this thread"
In response to Reply # 16


          

  

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theprofessional
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Wed May-17-06 04:34 PM

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21. "JFK???"
In response to Reply # 16


  

          

"i smack clowns with nouns, punch herbs with verbs..."

  

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johnny_domino
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Wed May-17-06 07:45 PM

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23. "I really didn't like it all that much"
In response to Reply # 21


  

          

Plus it was 91, so it barely counts, even if you think it's good.

  

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Marauder21
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Wed May-17-06 06:10 PM

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22. "If even then"
In response to Reply # 16


  

          

I loathe Oliver Stone.

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Mynoriti
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Thu May-18-06 02:43 AM

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26. "cosign on both points"
In response to Reply # 16


  

          

  

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IkeMoses
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27. "Natural Born Killers?"
In response to Reply # 16
Thu May-18-06 02:53 AM by IkeMoses

  

          

actually, i'm not a fan of that joint, but Any Given Sunday wasn't that bad.

-30-

Ryan Francis
1987-2006
r.i.p.

http://www.myspace.com/ikemoses

  

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johnny_domino
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Thu May-18-06 09:46 AM

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29. "Any Given Sunday wasn't that bad but it wasn't that good either"
In response to Reply # 27


  

          

I just don't trust Stone to really put together a good movie, and the jump cuts show that a) he doesn't film action sequences that well at this point and b) I'm dizzy.

  

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violence
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Fri May-19-06 09:37 AM

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33. "RE: Natural Born Killers was TIGHT"
In response to Reply # 27


          

.

  

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JungleSouljah
Member since Sep 24th 2002
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Wed May-17-06 02:59 PM

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19. "Maria Bello and Maggie Gyllenhall, eff the rest of that noise"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I'm not a New Yorker so I won't sit around and decide what they should or should not still be raw about. I'm not going to pass judgement on something that I really know nothing about.

I know what you're all saying: "But this is PTP, that's what we do here. We talk about movies we haven't seen and discuss their important symbolism that we don't really understand." Not this time.

That being said, I could see myself catching this on DVD, no real desire to see it in the theater. Which is exactly what I said about United 93.

______________________________
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REDeye
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Wed May-17-06 03:59 PM

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20. "I wonder about the WWII movies that came out during the war"
In response to Reply # 0


          

Or Vietnam movies that came out before the end of that war.

Issues seem clear at first, then they become muddled, then, in some instances, they become clear again -- clearly different than first thought.

An easy example: Did any of the early WWII movies touch on what our government knew about Japanese attack plans prior to Pearl Harbor? I'm sure they didn't cover the treatment of Japanese Americans immediately after.

People can make entertaining, compelling movies anytime the want. And when emotions are still raw and the issues are still fresh in people's minds, frankly, it's not the hardest thing to do, not for the talented. (Does anyone doubt that a story about individuals lost in this tragedy can be compelling?)

But perspectives change, often radically, from year to year after an event. People are caught up in whatever emotion is involved in the event, whether it's anger, grief or compassion. Very often, however, new, relevent information comes out much after the fact that changes how the people affected by the events feel about it.

I never doubted that Paul Greengrass or Oliver Stone could make an entertaining and compelling movie covering events surrounding 9/11. My problem with it is that I am not convinced that we, collectively, have made up our minds how we feel about what happened. Let's face it, we still don't *know* what happened. And that has nothing do with conspiracy theories. One only has to look at the recently concluded Moussaoui trial to understand this.

And it's not about a fear of overly patriotic propaganda. I would have as little faith in a movie lambasting the government for 9/11 as would in a late '60s anti-Vietnam movie.

Still, I feel one of the main reasons for these movies (and books) right now is the filmmaker's or writer's desire to tell "their side of the story." For example, I've read that the reason some the families of United 93 victims agreed to cooperate with filmmakers of the TV movie was because they wanted their story told. Can't really fault them for that, but their side of the story is necessarily an incomplete part of the whole picture.

Everyone fights to get their version of events out in the airwaves, in varying degrees, to influence the collective consciousness, to have their part of the story be part of the "official story." Not that anyone has any disingenuous motives, but it makes each individual story a little more suspect.

And now I am done rambling.

RED
http://arrena.blogspot.com

  

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sonofodin
Member since Mar 31st 2005
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Wed May-17-06 08:55 PM

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24. "When I saw the title of the post I thought Stone was"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

working with Wu Tang Clan.....damn....

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rambunctious
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Thu May-18-06 02:42 AM

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25. "nicholas's mustache."
In response to Reply # 0


          

on the ep of Reno 911 when they were trying
to petition to keep their mustches, one person
they asked to sign the petition said they looked
liked gigolos.

yeah, thats what nick cage looks like to me.


the legendary sigs:
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ToeJam
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Thu May-18-06 03:09 AM

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28. "RE: Get your panties in a bunch...again. Oliver Stone's WTC movie traile..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

Boooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

  

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FrankEinstein
Member since Dec 03rd 2003
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Thu May-18-06 10:25 AM

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30. "You may call it 'bullshit'..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

...but I wonder if I'll ever be ready and willing to watch a movie like this.

  

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fire
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Thu May-18-06 01:01 PM

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"looks very good"


  

          

________________________________________
who gonna check me boo?!

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http://instagram.com/firefire100
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fire
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Thu May-18-06 01:01 PM

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31. "looks very good"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

________________________________________
who gonna check me boo?!

www.twitter.com/firefire100
http://instagram.com/firefire100
www.philadelphiaeagles.com

  

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MME
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Wed May-31-06 11:24 AM

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55. "I agree n/m"
In response to Reply # 31


  

          

>

  

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magilla vanilla
Member since Sep 13th 2002
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Fri May-19-06 07:31 AM

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32. "the thing about this and U93"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

is that it's being made while people are still politicizing the events of September 11th. So it gives people in flyover country a reason to break out their Lee Greenwood singles and American flag underwear, and hop back on the 9/11 bandwagon. And when that happens, as we've seen in two straight elections, stupid, backward thinking motherfuckers get elected/re-elected. So no, I will not be seeing either film.

---------------------------------
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bignick
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Fri May-19-06 12:26 PM

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34. "so you're not gonna see it because of how someone else will react to it?"
In response to Reply # 32


  

          

  

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magilla vanilla
Member since Sep 13th 2002
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Fri May-19-06 11:50 PM

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43. "well, I have no interest in seeing it."
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

I saw enough of it the morning of.

And, quite simply, I really don't see the chance for artistic statement; especially with Nic Cage. It's an event that far too many people have USED for their own gain, politically, financially, and emotionally, and I'm really fucking sick of people piling on.

---------------------------------
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"This (and every, actually) conversation needs more Chesterton and less Mike Francesa." - Walleye

  

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bignick
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48. "i can but that, but..."
In response to Reply # 43


  

          


>And, quite simply, I really don't see the chance for artistic
>statement; especially with Nic Cage.

come on man. you don't even see the CHANCE for artistic statement?

  

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magilla vanilla
Member since Sep 13th 2002
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Sat May-27-06 06:03 PM

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51. "admittedly, that's overstating things"
In response to Reply # 48


  

          

but I think that whatever artistic statement that comes out of it will be far overshadowed by a) the studio's marketing engine and b) the reaction of a lot of dumb motherfuckers.

---------------------------------
Photo zine(some images NSFW): http://bit.ly/USaSPhoto

"This (and every, actually) conversation needs more Chesterton and less Mike Francesa." - Walleye

  

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Guinness
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35. "*SPOILER ALERT*"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

the towers fall down.

  

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
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Fri May-19-06 12:46 PM

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36. "*ADDITIONAL SPOILERS*"
In response to Reply # 35


  

          

The Muslims did it.

For beer lovers: http://thebeertravelguide.com
For movie lovers: http://russellhainline.com

  

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biscuit
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46. "no they didn't silly..."
In response to Reply # 36


  

          

THE U.S. GOVERNMENT DID.

*wink*

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

*Effasig*

  

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Jay Cam
Member since Apr 19th 2005
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Fri May-19-06 07:09 PM

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37. "why August 9th???"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

why not September obviously???

plus, it looks like NOBODY wanted to be in this movie, horrible casting, 3 known actors

  

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bignick
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38. "wrong."
In response to Reply # 37
Fri May-19-06 07:48 PM by bignick

  

          

>plus, it looks like NOBODY wanted to be in this movie,
>horrible casting, 3 known actors

these are all very well known actors:
Nic Cage
Maggie Gyllenhaal
Stephen Dorff
Maria Bello
Patti D'Arbanville
Nicholas Turturro
Frank Whaley

plus people who follow movies and TV know who these guys are:
Jay Hernandez
Danny Nucci

this is exactly the kind of shit i'm talking about.

  

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Jay Cam
Member since Apr 19th 2005
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Fri May-19-06 09:42 PM

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39. "fake ass celebrity, Kate Hudson ass nugga"
In response to Reply # 38


  

          

Nic Cage, Maggie Gyllenhaal, Stephen Dorff, Maria Bello, Patti D'Arbanville, Nicholas Turturro, Frank Whaley, Jay Hernandez and Danny Nucci...exactly

you stupid fucking cocksucker, I know who everyone of these people are, my point is, if I was the casting director for an Oliver Stone movie based on one of the most important events in United States history, with a guaranteed 100 million plus grossing, I would hire someone besides the "dude from Blade" as my main supporting actor

  

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bignick
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40. "^^^panties are DEFINITELY in a bunch^^^"
In response to Reply # 39
Fri May-19-06 09:56 PM by bignick

  

          

don't be mad. just be wrong. now go outside and play.

  

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Jay Cam
Member since Apr 19th 2005
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Fri May-19-06 10:15 PM

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41. "^^^wishes he was the famous Nick Adams^^^"
In response to Reply # 40
Fri May-19-06 10:16 PM by Jay Cam

  

          

so predictable, of course you were going to respond, so let me guess..."panties in a bunch" is your clichéd catch phrase

I think you should spend your free time worrying about the Amazon reviews you obviously monitor every 30 seconds and your two cats, cause we all know REAL MEN love cats

  

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bignick
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Fri May-19-06 10:33 PM

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42. "^^^still mad. still wrong^^^"
In response to Reply # 41
Fri May-19-06 10:33 PM by bignick

  

          

let's see...childish name calling didn't work.
getting personal didn't work.
you got anything else?

  

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dba_BAD
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Sat May-20-06 01:32 AM

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44. "looks pretty stupid n/m"
In response to Reply # 0


          

n/m

__

fairweather

  

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Nettrice
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Mon May-22-06 08:05 AM

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47. "I'll watch those movies"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

When they catch Bin Laden.

Until then I'm watching Why We Fight and Power of Nightmares.

<--- Blame this lady for Nutty.

  

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mc_delta_t
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Sun May-28-06 01:00 AM

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52. "how am I the first one to say................."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

that shit looked completely overdramatic, cheesy, sentimental, and all those other awful conventions the PTPers (rightfully) hate?

I guess people probably give a pass cause of the subject matter, but come on, it looks REAL bad.

  

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ororo_munroe
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Sun May-28-06 08:13 PM

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53. "there's a fine line between art and propaganda."
In response to Reply # 0
Sun May-28-06 08:14 PM by ororo_munroe

  

          

in context, stuff like this just seems so clearly on the "propaganda" side of things from my point of view.

panties ain't in a bunch or nothing.

that's all.

______________________________
for a minute there, i lost myself.

  

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SoulHonky
Member since Jan 21st 2003
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Sun May-28-06 09:45 PM

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54. ""It's too soon" has jumped the shark"
In response to Reply # 0


          

My friend who recently got dumped and I were watching TV and an ad for the Break Up comes on. He kind of sighs and says, "It's too soon for that movie." I just looked at him. I didn't know which was worse, him unwittingly comparing his break up to 9/11 or his thinking that Hollywood should cater their release schedule to his social life.

----
NBA MOCK DRAFT #1 - https://thecourierclass.com/whole-shebang/2017/5/18/2017-nba-mock-draft-1-just-lotto-and-lotta-trades

  

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