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Nettrice
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Sat Jul-03-04 02:39 AM

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"What is power?"
Sat Jul-03-04 02:41 AM

  

          

Folks keep bringing it up but nobody is defining it. Supremacy, racism, sexism, etc. Well, IMHO the common denominator is power but what does that mean? How does that influence the way things work or how we should go about bringing about change?

<--- Blame this lady for Nutty.

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
Differences
Jul 03rd 2004
1
RE: What is power?
Jul 03rd 2004
2
RE: What is power?
Jul 03rd 2004
3
RE: What is power?
Jul 04th 2004
14
Service
Jul 03rd 2004
4
Power is tricky thing. U wanna go by the websters? n/
Jul 03rd 2004
5
RE: What is power?
kaleem1405
Jul 03rd 2004
6
It is as simple as this
Jul 03rd 2004
7
RE: What is power?
Jul 03rd 2004
8
power = work/time n/m
Jul 03rd 2004
9
The ability to get things done despite...
Jul 03rd 2004
10
Two definitions: one true, one false
Jul 03rd 2004
11
So there really is no one definition?
Jul 03rd 2004
12
RE: So there really is no one definition?
Jul 05th 2004
22
simple political science definition
Jul 03rd 2004
13
Power
Jul 04th 2004
15
Changing our names is a proper (re)action...
Jul 05th 2004
16
I've read this before
Jul 05th 2004
19
of course there is no 1 definition-- depends on CONTEXT
Jul 05th 2004
17
RE: of course there is no 1 definition-- depends on CON
Jul 05th 2004
18
wow. ..
Jul 05th 2004
24
I agree
Jul 05th 2004
20
That one is easy Power=Money....
Jul 05th 2004
21
power comes in many forms
Jul 05th 2004
23
up....
Jul 06th 2004
25
Self-Efficacy
Jul 06th 2004
26
RE: Self-Efficacy
Jul 06th 2004
27

Nettrice
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1. "Differences"
In response to Reply # 0
Sat Jul-03-04 02:50 AM

  

          

From http://www.wordiq.com/definition/Power_(sociology):
"Sociologists usually define power as the ability to impose one's will on others, even if those others resist in some way.

'By power is meant that opportunity existing within a social relationship which permits one to carry out one's own will even against resistance and regardless of the basis on which this opportunity rests.'
Max Weber, Basic Concepts in Sociology

The imposition need not involve coercion (force or threat of force). Thus "power" in the sociological sense subsumes both physical power and political power. In some ways it more closely resembles what everyday English-speakers call 'influence'.

More generally, one could define 'power' as the real or perceived ability or potential to bring about significant change, usually in peoples lives, through the actions of oneself or of others.

The exercise of power seems endemic to humans as social and gregarious beings."

Well, to me this really does not explain spiritual power. Many social, political and physical people are not spiritual beings. However, there are some people who, despite the circumstances, feel a sense of power over their own lives. Even in the midst of events, some people are centered and at peace.

Next up: Learned Helplessness vs Empowerment

<--- Blame this lady for Nutty.

  

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hip bopper
Member since Jun 22nd 2003
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Sat Jul-03-04 03:17 AM

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2. "RE: What is power?"
In response to Reply # 0


          

>Folks keep bringing it up but nobody is defining it.
>Supremacy, racism, sexism, etc. Well, IMHO the common
>denominator is power but what does that mean? How does that
>influence the way things work or how we should go about
>bringing about change?


to me power comes with service. some tend to think that if you rule with an iron fist you have power when in reality you create fear for those around you. if you look at people like malcolm, martin, and ghandi they were willing to serve those who were around them and became powerful because of their service to others. Jesus was the ultimate example of service as he served those around Him, and he was able to draw people because of what he did for them.

  

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Kozmikblak
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Sat Jul-03-04 03:46 AM

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3. "RE: What is power?"
In response to Reply # 2
Sat Jul-03-04 03:46 AM

  

          

>>Folks keep bringing it up but nobody is defining it.
>>Supremacy, racism, sexism, etc. Well, IMHO the common
>>denominator is power but what does that mean? How does that
>>influence the way things work or how we should go about
>>bringing about change?
>
>
>to me power comes with service. some tend to think that if
>you rule with an iron fist you have power when in reality
>you create fear for those around you. if you look at people
>like malcolm, martin, and ghandi they were willing to serve
>those who were around them and became powerful because of
>their service to others. Jesus was the ultimate example of
>service as he served those around Him, and he was able to
>draw people because of what he did for them.

I feel what you are saying about service to others.

But, at the risk of going off on a tangent you lump Ghandi, Malcolm, and Martin in the same category with Jesus. I'm curious as to why you state Jesus was the ultimate example. All the people you mentioned all gave their lives to the service of others.

-------------------------

"...you cats are undercover like GAY rappers dealing with MYSTERY." -Talib Kweli This means you, from Reflection Eternal

"I don't blame Tiger Woods, but I overstand the mental poison that's even worse than drugs" -nas poison

"For trees to grow in Brooklyn seeds need to be planted. I asked, "can you feel me?" and the crowd left me stranded" -Talib kweli

"Hip Hop can never be a way of life it doesn't tell you how to raise a child or treat a wife" -Q-tip A tribe called Quest

"...Cats sip champagne to toast death and pain like slaves on a ship talking about who has the flyest chain" -Talib Kweli Black Star

"We're the renegade we're the people with our own philosophy, we change the course of history. Everyday people like you and me." Afrika Bambaataa and the Soulsonic force Renegades of funk

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"Devil and nigga are the same to me." -Nettrice

"it's wack to me when the beat is more hype than the M.C. cuz what he is saying

  

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hip bopper
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14. "RE: What is power?"
In response to Reply # 3


          

>I feel what you are saying about service to others.
>
>But, at the risk of going off on a tangent you lump Ghandi,
>Malcolm, and Martin in the same category with Jesus. I'm
>curious as to why you state Jesus was the ultimate example.
>All the people you mentioned all gave their lives to the
>service of others.

i say that Jesus was the ultimate example because he spent his life serving others and it is His example that we should follow. i lumped ghandi, martin, and malcolm with Jesus because they were servants to the people of their day. this does not mean that they were perfect men, but they were powerful because they served.

  

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Nettrice
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4. "Service"
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

>to me power comes with service. some tend to think that if
>you rule with an iron fist you have power when in reality
>you create fear for those around you. if you look at people
>like malcolm, martin, and ghandi they were willing to serve
>those who were around them and became powerful because of
>their service to them

I agree here. Service is something that is a part of any activist's work. As it relates to empowerment, people who have authentic power also give some of it to others. Otherwise, they must rely on charm or intimidation but none of these things are real.

<--- Blame this lady for Nutty.

  

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FireBrand
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5. "Power is tricky thing. U wanna go by the websters? n/"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Avi? Go on head now Mr. Cosby...






___________________________

Inaugral Member of the OkaySports Hall of Fame
(They just don't allow me to speak on Roundball no mo')

"The events which transpired five thousand years ago; Five years ago or five minutes ago, have determined what will happen five minutes from now; five years From now or five thousand years from now. All history is a current event.
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Everything that touches your life must be an instrument of your liberation, or you must throw it into the trash can of history.
John Henrik Clarke






If something is yours by right, then fight for it or shut up. If you can't fight for it, then forget it.
Malcolm X
London School of Economics, February, 1965


"Slaves got options...cowards aint got shit." --PS
"Once upon a time, little need existed for making the distinction between a nigga and a blackat least not in this country, the place where niggas were invented" -- Donnell A

  

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kaleem1405

Sat Jul-03-04 06:40 AM

  
6. "RE: What is power?"
In response to Reply # 0


          

whadup nettrice, i'll give you a simplified answer...
power is knowlegde.
knowing your possibilities as well as your limits.
if you share this with fellow human beings, than you're helping the advancement of humanity
but if you use this knowlegde for your own ulterior motives, then you are truly a devil in flesh, a bloodsucker of the poor, and so on.
godblessyougwurl

  

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Taharka
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Sat Jul-03-04 08:01 AM

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7. "It is as simple as this"
In response to Reply # 0
Sat Jul-03-04 08:13 AM

  

          

something with the ability to reward or punish.

<--- The lovely Ms Hill when she wasn't thrown off.

LOOK WHOS RAPPIN NOW
http://www.myspace.com/quil215

  

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urthanheaven
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Sat Jul-03-04 01:50 PM

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8. "RE: What is power?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

the ability to manipulate one's environment. or the lack of need to do so?

power over self power over others. it seems power is related to control. whatever has control has power. but control works both ways. just like what we own, owns us.

so power is a tricky construct. i'll take it in terms of energy. my blender needs energy to turn the motor to turn the blade to make the smoothie. power is the ability to manipulate one's environment. leverage. etc.

so in terms to an un asked question... knowledge equals leverage equals the amplification or thbe realisation of power. our ancestors and others such as some tibetan monks are said to be holding the planet together using the innerverse 'as on earth so in heaven' power. one little peice of well placed black mail can topple a governing official. therefore i believe that each human being is born with the same amount of power. knowledge of ones situatiuon and self gives one infinite power.

each life as far as an individual 1st person movie is different so you have relative definitions of power in what a person desires to manipulate.

i believe we are all equal. because we all live our lives from the same individual 1st person veiw. our highs and lows are gages relatively to eachother and no one would trully understand what it's like to be in another persons shoes because to do that you'd have to not be you. and since youd be them you couldn't be aware of being someone else... conjecture.

anyways, some of that is my logic on power. chinese say that chi is everywhere in everything but gong is the ability to manipulate that chi. so chi would be the even amount of power that we all have and gong would be the leverage or true/physical power that we can manifest with knowledge.


  

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k_orr
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9. "power = work/time n/m"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


http://breddanansi.tumblr.com/

  

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Intelligently95
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10. "The ability to get things done despite..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

the resistance & or opposition
of others.

Power is also the ability to determine/
control the quality & outcome of a situation.

Change is contigent upon awareness and
the percentage of dis-satisfaction outweighing
the percentage of satisfaction w/whatever
situation is deemed "necessary" to change.

"Fitness Facilitates The Platform That Provides Peak Performance in Life." Brendan Brazier

  

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Francirevolutionara
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11. "Two definitions: one true, one false"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

The way the world views the power is about having high positions, having contacts, influencing and controling the rest.... That is the false definition.

Power means to be able to control your own demons.

Power means to give back to the world. One who has the power has the ability to forgive. Power is the ability to fight that part of you who says "this is not worth it, why should I bother?". It means to fight the councioussness to not become lethargic, apathetic, indiferent, ignorant, biased, hateful, illiterate. Power means to refuse to become another particle in the "masses".

  

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Nettrice
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12. "So there really is no one definition?"
In response to Reply # 0
Sat Jul-03-04 07:33 PM

  

          

For some power is fleeting, external or out of reach. For others, power is attainable and real. It is internal as well as external.

People (including myself) toss around the word "power" but there is no common agreement on what it is...except for the people who have it.

IMHO power means having the ability or freedom to do something or the ability to manifest something...to act. Powerful people are not inactive unless they choose to be, they are not easily led or swayed. Authentic power is the knowledge that there is a purpose and act with intention. Thus, to me it is clear that:

service=action
knowledge (of one's situation)=action
reward and punish=action
manipulation and control=action
work...get me?

If we can agree that action is a key to power, having the ability or freedom to make something happen, then maybe we can also agree that some people have access to this key more than others? Why do some people--given equal resources and opportunities--overcome and succeed and others just give up?

<--- Blame this lady for Nutty.

  

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Francirevolutionara
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22. "RE: So there really is no one definition?"
In response to Reply # 12


  

          

It is internal as
>well as external.

>
>If we can agree that action is a key to power, having the
>ability or freedom to make something happen, then maybe we
>can also agree that some people have access to this key more
>than others? Why do some people--given equal resources and
>opportunities--overcome and succeed and others just give up?

It might be related to the characteristics of an individual. Some might not give up on their own wishes, but forced to.
If we say a teacher has the power to influence his/her students that can be based on dedication, performances, open-mindness and such. If one individual has the power in herself/himself to act to change things, in that arena the enemy is the compromise. If an individual believes that ideology itself can change and affect people, and that person is kicked out of the system....is that person just giving up or becomes a victim?

I think the system or the environment in which the individual works and acts, it is probably the most important factor. Those outside scenarios can be a party, an organization, a community group etc. the system can work towards the individual or not. so i guess what i am saying is that the system can allow/not allow the individual to exercise his/her power.

  

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rogue_scholar
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13. "simple political science definition"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

power is the ability or means to secure what is in one's interest.

basically, it's being able to do something or have something done that results in getting what you want or need.


**************
rS

--Any belief worth having must survive doubt--

----------------
rs

  

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Solarus
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15. "Power"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Power= the ability to define one's reality.

Through this definition, the statement "Black people can't be racist" is understood by the fact that on a larger societal level, black people exist in realm of social institutions not defined by them but someone else's cultural worldview. On a personal level we can all argue that every person engages in a bit of self-definition. However this self-definition must be seen in the same light that the law sees statutory rape or sexual harassment in the workplace.

While the female and/or minor maybe a willing participant in a sexual relationship with the other person involved, it is understood that the other is in a predetermined, predefined position of power. Being older, male or an authority figure gives one more say in defining the reality of a subordinate.

The institution is defined by a particular group's worldviews and beliefs, in order to determine the further defining capabilities of the people living within that institution. Thus there are many levels of power that eventually trickle down to that individual.

Unfortunately many Black people still believe that changing their names, is enough to take back that power.

We have a long way to go...

____________________________
"the real pyramids were built with such precision that you can't slide a piece of paper between two 4,000 lb stones, and have shafts perfectly aligned so that you can see a tiny aperture through dozens of these mammoth blocks

  

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Intelligently95
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16. "Changing our names is a proper (re)action..."
In response to Reply # 15


          

in the direction for power though.

That's not all there is to it
ofcourse...other than that, I
concur w/your analysis...Peace
Solarus

"Fitness Facilitates The Platform That Provides Peak Performance in Life." Brendan Brazier

  

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Nettrice
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19. "I've read this before"
In response to Reply # 15


  

          

>Power= the ability to define one's reality.

Maybe this was from you. Anyway, I agree with the premise. I read somewhere else that it was about mastering one's own dream or destiny (Don Miguel Ruiz).

<--- Blame this lady for Nutty.

  

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Zorasmoon
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17. "of course there is no 1 definition-- depends on CONTEXT"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

on one hand "power" can be described as access to resources
(even maintaining exclusivity to those resources through threat of physical force)

"Power" can also be described as knowing how to use one's knowledge...

A more interesting question, imo, would be why do certain people (racially, gender) appear to desire "power" more than others?
How is the pursuit of "power" perceived culturally?
What are the (social, cultural) barriers of attaining and redefining "power"? What is the future of "power"?

This is what is of real interest to me.




~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~




No person is your friend who demands your silence, or denies your right to grow. -- Alice Walker ..Humanist of the year 1997


"a fuel efficient hummer"
thats like having a pimp who supports the womens right movement. okp imperial








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GdChil1
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18. "RE: of course there is no 1 definition-- depends on CON"
In response to Reply # 17


  

          


>A more interesting question, imo, would be why do certain
>people (racially, gender) appear to desire "power" more than
>others?


No matter what sect/classification, everyone in some way, shape or form desires true power. Wether it be authorative "power", "power" over one's self, influential "power", political "power"; I believe it's wrought into our existence.



>How is the pursuit of "power" perceived culturally?


Depends on what culture we're talking and weather or not we're breaking it down into social-economic categories as well. Black vs. White vs. Gay vs. Straight vs. Western vs. Eastern cultures can all be perceived entirely differently or alike, just depends on you perspective.


>What are the (social, cultural) barriers of attaining and
>redefining "power"? What is the future of "power"?


IMO one can never attain "true" power because we are born mortal, with mortal tendancies and flaws, temptation, guilt, lust, pride, sucess, greed, love, hate and ultimately death. One can reach to attain "fools" power. The future of power will be the same as the past of power, just with different players and parameters, always contingent upon the pursuit of happiness and perfection in one's life.
>
>This is what is of real interest to me.
>
>
>
>
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>
>
>
>No person is your friend who demands your silence, or denies
>your right to grow. -- Alice Walker ..Humanist of the year
>1997
>
>
>"a fuel efficient hummer"
>thats like having a pimp who supports the womens right
>movement. okp imperial
>
>
>
>
>
>
>online OKPMEN
>2004 calendar>
>
>"Heidi Fleiss of OKP" -eclipsedini
>
>

Wow, my login still works 🤦🏾‍♂️

  

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Zorasmoon
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24. "wow. .."
In response to Reply # 18


  

          

the mysteries of the universe have just been revealed.

amazing.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~




No person is your friend who demands your silence, or denies your right to grow. -- Alice Walker ..Humanist of the year 1997


"a fuel efficient hummer"
thats like having a pimp who supports the womens right movement. okp imperial








"Heidi Fleiss of OKP" -eclipsedini






http://www.youtube.com/user/kimmayluv

  

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Nettrice
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20. "I agree"
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

but I do think is is as simple as "the ability to define one's reality". I'd also add "and be able to act on this".

More later...

<--- Blame this lady for Nutty.

  

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Yank
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21. "That one is easy Power=Money...."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

"I care not of a country's laws as long as I can control their money"

-John D. Rockefeller Sr

Lies run sprints.
Truths run marathons.

  

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jahlove7
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23. "power comes in many forms"
In response to Reply # 21


  

          

but it starts with self-empowerment. that's first and foremost.

inaugural member - okayplayer sports hall of fame.


what i'm digging right now:

chocolate butterfly - self-titled
laura jane - welcome to my planet boo
me & this japanese guy - waiting for the miracle
wade3 - dreams
tracey amos - who are we really?

  

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Francirevolutionara
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25. "up...."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

......................................

  

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Nettrice
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26. "Self-Efficacy"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

"The belief in your mastery over your life and your ability to meet challenges as they arise is what psychologists call self-efficacy--it's yourself being effective." - Adversity Quotient by Paul Stoltz

Many folks are taught all their lives that power is external to them, outside of themselves. They are taught that they are helpless. One of the greatest things that happened to me as a young teen was overcoming depression...helplessness. Early intervention from the adults around me helped me develop as a person and I was able to bounce back.

Sometimes all it takes is the belief that people can control their own lives, rewards, punishments, etc. Research shows that these people are more resilient and less likely to feel powerless about situations. In this case, power is internal, enduring, ever present.

<--- Blame this lady for Nutty.

  

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Francirevolutionara
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27. "RE: Self-Efficacy"
In response to Reply # 26


  

          

>"The belief in your mastery over your life and your ability
>to meet challenges as they arise is what psychologists call
>self-efficacy--it's yourself being effective." - Adversity
>Quotient by Paul Stoltz

I think that depends a lot of an individual goals in life. Basically , what exactly is he/she tries to achieve. As a common ground, most people want to live ok. they do not want to struggle. BUT are they contributing to the well being of the society, or are just using any methods possible to achieve what they want?
For myself it is more like "this can't be it", "am I going to live 80 years (?) just for this?", "i have to do more".

>
>Many folks are taught all their lives that power is external
>to them, outside of themselves.

That it is so true. silly example: my parents, mostly my mother, wanted me to pursue some carrers that in their mind will bring in some position of power, or being able to control my life and not struggling. My opinion is much different than that. i think expanding my education and knowledge, like intermedia sculpture, made me more confident and gave me more power in my self.
power is within.

They are taught that they
>are helpless. One of the greatest things that happened to
>me as a young teen was overcoming depression...helplessness.
> Early intervention from the adults around me helped me
>develop as a person and I was able to bounce back.
>
>Sometimes all it takes is the belief that people can control
>their own lives, rewards, punishments, etc. Research shows
>that these people are more resilient and less likely to feel
>powerless about situations. In this case, power is
>internal, enduring, ever present.

  

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