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|Forum name||General Discussion|
|Topic subject||Depending on the Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ for favor and help|
13437910, Depending on the Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ for favor and help|
Posted by c71, Fri Jul-23-21 04:52 AM
let's share accounts of how good this is
13437968, you gave CASE your log in?|
Posted by rdhull, Fri Jul-23-21 01:47 PM
>let's share accounts of how good this is
Posted by Damali, Fri Jul-23-21 11:24 PM
"But rest assured, in my luxurious house built on the backs of people darker than me, I am sipping fine scotch and scoffing at how stupid you are." - bshelly
13438019, RE: Depending on the Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ for favor and help|
Posted by godleeluv, Sat Jul-24-21 12:09 AM
Agreed. Favor isn’t fair
... "A Beautiful Struggle"
13438035, was just thinking about you|
Posted by c71, Sat Jul-24-21 08:58 AM
13438021, Can you share examples where you can demonstrate that you've been helped|
Posted by Cold Truth, Sat Jul-24-21 12:36 AM
By a god?
13438036, The Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ allowed me to get hired and|
Posted by c71, Sat Jul-24-21 09:01 AM
keep several jobs when...........it looked REALLLLY bad.
and...........if you know how bad jobs get........
...you'll know it was The Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ favor doing the waymaking...
that's an obvious one...cause jobs get REALLLLY REALLLY BAD!!!
13438037, How did you determine thatHeavenly Father and Jesus were the mechanism?|
Posted by Cold Truth, Sat Jul-24-21 09:13 AM
How did you determine that god was the reason you got hired to begin with?
And even if the jobs got really bad, how did you determine that god was the reason you kept those jobs?
Apart from the fact that you believe in a god, what evidence lead you to that conclusion?
>keep several jobs when...........it looked REALLLLY bad.
>and...........if you know how bad jobs get........
>...you'll know it was The Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ
>favor doing the waymaking...
>that's an obvious one...cause jobs get REALLLLY REALLLY
13438038, the praying and the timing of breakthroughs and the REALLY BAD stuff|
Posted by c71, Sat Jul-24-21 09:17 AM
We've all heard about "foxhole" Christians etc.
obviously humans can't escape that reflex (stuff REALLY BAD cry to Jesus for HELP!!!!!!!!)
what separates the wise from those not are those who don't discount how that whole interaction (which happens several times) occurs.
13438048, People get hired all the time. People keep jobs, even when its really bad,|
Posted by Cold Truth, Sat Jul-24-21 10:16 AM
All the time.
These are not remotely exceptional occurrences.
Even in situations that are exceptional, the individual pieces of them are still relatively mundane.
Which is why I ask what evidence you have to conclude that the moving hand of a god where the reasons.
As it stands, all you're saying is that you wamted a job, and you got it, and that you also kept said job/jobs in really bad circumstances.
It's not surprise that the timing of the prayer and breakthroughs line up. In fact, that's how it would work regardless of what you prayed to.
If you're applying/interviewing for a job, the time you would be praying for that job would about the time you appplied or were interviewed.
If you get fired or laid off and know you need a job, you would then pray that you would get that new job about that time.
If you're havi g difficulty with the job/jobs you have, you would be praying for those situations during those difficult times.
The timing of your prayer will generally line up with the thing you're praying for.
Some jobs have a very long hiring process, and yes, some job issues take a long time to find a resolution, but these are still mundane occurrences.
So again I ask, what is the evidence that the hand of god was the mechanism for these occurrences?
13438051, It is how things work together|
Posted by c71, Sat Jul-24-21 10:30 AM
like you will see how your situation with the car will work together.
No one can escape seeing how things will work together
Especially over time.
13438052, How did you determine that a god is the cause/reason for that?|
Posted by Cold Truth, Sat Jul-24-21 10:42 AM
>like you will see how your situation with the car will work
I just prayed to my phone for a favorable outcome in that situation:
-That my car is fully covered and paid off
-That I am not at fault in any of it
If I get the outcomes I want, does that mean my phonr made it happen?
I assume you won't see it that way.
If i get the outcomes I want, is your god the reason?
>No one can escape seeing how things will work together
What does this have to do with a god?
>Especially over time.
Evolution agrees with you.
13438054, He always is|
Posted by c71, Sat Jul-24-21 10:55 AM
13438056, I'll ask again. What evidence do you have for this conclusion?|
Posted by Cold Truth, Sat Jul-24-21 11:11 AM
Merely asserting "he always is" doesn't answer that question.
Take my car for example.
We have a set of observable, verifiable facts that will determine outcome.
We have traffic laws in place that determine how this will play out.
I also have full coverage and GAP.
My car is less than a month old, which according to my claims rep means that I may even get a check in return.
Of course, it's possible that I got duped by the dealer and I wound up paying a higher price than the car was worth. In that case, my coverage still means that entirety of that car comes off the books.
We have money in savings, which means we'll be able to afford a down on another car.
I have decent credit and income, at least for this purpose, and ive had plenty of pre-approved offers coming in the mail for months already, both from dealerships and my own credit card companies. I can also got a preapproval from my credit union.
There are myriad observable facts of reality that determine how things will play out.
What evidence do you have to conclude that any of this is determined not just by a god, but your particular god, which is but one of thousands of god concepts?
13438059, You know what happened|
Posted by c71, Sat Jul-24-21 12:24 PM
13438061, You don't seem to be able to answer any direct questions about any of this.|
Posted by Cold Truth, Sat Jul-24-21 12:36 PM
With any specificity.
13438041, Here's the best example I could think of|
Posted by Mafamaticks, Sat Jul-24-21 09:28 AM
He was a Hillsong College grad so you know he had the direct line
13438049, He's right though. Corpses don't need vaccines.|
Posted by Cold Truth, Sat Jul-24-21 10:20 AM
13438053, damn that was tragic|
Posted by mikediggz, Sat Jul-24-21 10:49 AM
13438057, if he'd have taken the vaccine|
Posted by Mynoriti, Sat Jul-24-21 11:42 AM
he'd have maybe had a breakthrough that was a mild or bad cold.
proving the vaccine didn't work
and then he could have prayed, and a few days later he'd feel better
proving prayer worked
13438060, best example.....hmmmmm.............?|
Posted by c71, Sat Jul-24-21 12:34 PM
Hillsong direct line...hmmmm...
stacking the deck with Hillsong and THE best example
when you go by a church and see people having weddings, etc. you think the best that can come out of all that church/religious activity is people dying painful deaths like the direct line Hillsong guy?
13438062, Why haven't you provided a good example? |
Posted by Cold Truth, Sat Jul-24-21 12:40 PM
And no, saying I got a job and Jesus is why isn't a good example.
Please provide a good example of Jesus helpingg, and provide a good reationale- preferably citing actual evidence- for your conclusion that Jesus did it.
This is your topic, a discussion you started.
It's a little odd that you haven't lead the charge with good examples.
13438064, let the man speak for himself please|
Posted by c71, Sat Jul-24-21 12:44 PM
show how you can let others talk please
13438078, what did I say that was speaking for him?|
Posted by Cold Truth, Sat Jul-24-21 01:27 PM
Im not speaking for him.
I asked you a specific questions abdout you.
And to the "show how you let others talk please" bit, that's patently absurd.
This is a message board, not a cinference call where people are talking over each other.
Why is it that you cannot answer very simple questions regarding the topic you created?
13438063, but.. what about weddings? lol|
Posted by Mynoriti, Sat Jul-24-21 12:44 PM
you posted about the power of prayer
he provided an example and you're like but.. weddings
13438065, He posted what he called the "best example" do you agree with that?|
Posted by c71, Sat Jul-24-21 12:46 PM
13438066, it's a very direct example. your counter was what about weddings|
Posted by Mynoriti, Sat Jul-24-21 12:49 PM
13438067, but is it the best example?|
Posted by c71, Sat Jul-24-21 12:51 PM
what do you say?
13438068, yes. weddings is the best example|
Posted by Mynoriti, Sat Jul-24-21 12:52 PM
13438069, you were standing with him for a second but...now....yep|
Posted by c71, Sat Jul-24-21 12:55 PM
not with him anymore
I wouldn't want to stand with that on record as claiming a painful death is the best example of the power of prayer either.
You did good backing off
13438071, lol whoa easy there, slugger|
Posted by Mynoriti, Sat Jul-24-21 01:04 PM
fine i'll play along for a minute
he provided the best example in this post.
since you challenged it and you're so pressed on the word 'best' it's on you to provide a better example
unless we're sticking with 'what about weddings?'
>not with him anymore
>I wouldn't want to stand with that on record as claiming a
>painful death is the best example of the power of prayer
>You did good backing off
13438072, I provided an example in reply #6 so play along and answer if you agree|
Posted by c71, Sat Jul-24-21 01:07 PM
with what he said
>fine i'll play along for a minute
>he provided the best example in this post.
>since you challenged it and you're so pressed on the word
>'best' it's on you to provide a better example
13438073, it seems CT had that covered|
Posted by Mynoriti, Sat Jul-24-21 01:12 PM
you did good backing off
13438074, You backed off from the man and I agree that was wise of you|
Posted by c71, Sat Jul-24-21 01:15 PM
No more need to play along anymore. That's it. you backed off.
13438075, who's "the man"|
Posted by Mynoriti, Sat Jul-24-21 01:21 PM
Posted by c71, Sat Jul-24-21 01:22 PM
best esample man I've been asking if you agree with his statement
13438077, we covered this. now it's just getting boring|
Posted by Mynoriti, Sat Jul-24-21 01:27 PM
13438079, It is because it is over. You backed off from the question you don't want |
Posted by c71, Sat Jul-24-21 01:29 PM
to answer if you agree with the best example.
it IS over.
You dancing around not wanting to answer. You backed off.
Posted by Mynoriti, Sat Jul-24-21 01:39 PM
13438082, Oh he absotely gave the best example of the efficacy of prayer.|
Posted by Cold Truth, Sat Jul-24-21 01:57 PM
You're far too deeply indoctrinated to see that. .
Because those prayers were either "dear god, please kill this blowhard", in which case, it was answered in the affirmative, or the prayers for healing and recovery were denied.
Therein lies a significant problem, because it's essentially a multiple choice test where you're always right.
Cletus Christian gets sick and asks god for healing.
If Cleatus is healed, hallelujah, praise Jesus! He's been healed by his mighty hand!
If Cletus isn't healed?
The prayer was answered?, but the answer was no.
And with that comes a flood of posthoc rationalizations.
God works in mysterious ways.
God had to call his angel home.
God had a higher purpose.
This was the result of the fallen world in whcih we live.
It wasn't gods will.
He wasn't right with god.
He must have had sin in his life.
And on and on and on and on and on.
This is also why you've avoided a direct, specific response to my direct, specific question.
Because once we push aside all the fluffy cliches, coffee mug sentimentality and canned platitudes, we do not have examples that show clear connective tissue between the the request and outcome, and a god as the actual cause of the outcome.
And often enough, just as you did, the thing for whcoh god is surmised as the explanation is something relatively mundane and has an equality mundane explanation.
The example given simply wasn't the positive outcome most Christians like to cherry pick to prop up their myth, but that's what made a great example.
For all your arrogance in here, you're demonstrating that you lack either the capacity or willingness to excercise even minimal critical thinking in the subject.
13438090, LATE HAVE I LOVED YOU, BEAUTY SO ANCIENT AND SO NEW|
Posted by Walleye, Sat Jul-24-21 04:26 PM
Every account is good. Only one account is so good that it demands to be read.
13438127, IMPOSSIBLE TO DESCRIBE THE WAY IN WHICH GOD WOUNDS THE SOUL|
Posted by Walleye, Sun Jul-25-21 12:57 PM
Teresa of Avila's "Life". Not her absolute best work (that's "interior castle") but an account in line with the question prompt and one that's always worth reading.
13438099, god has helped me so much.|
Posted by tariqhu, Sat Jul-24-21 09:39 PM
I've been employed my full adult life. only been without a job once.
oh wait.....nevermind. that wasn't god. sorry.
has anybody ever prayed to rid the earth of racism or sexism? not sure it's working.
13438102, Where's Ted Gee Seal these days? He's good for conversations like this. |
Posted by Cold Truth, Sat Jul-24-21 11:29 PM
We'd certainly disagree on most things in the subject, but he'd also hold up his end with sincere, thoughtful dialogue.
Not at all like what we got here.
13438103, CT you gotta realize tho...this is a touchy subject for a lot of ppl.|
Posted by mikediggz, Sat Jul-24-21 11:46 PM
you may not be a believer and thats fine, but there are many many ppl who are and thats fine too. faith is an intangible thing and your lawyer style of rapidfire questioning doesnt lend well to that fact. although i grew up going to church i have my share of questions and my own skepticisms, but i remain respectful towards ppl who are all in with both feet. felt like u were goin kinda hard at dude.
>Not at all like what we got here.
13438105, You don't think I realize that?|
Posted by Cold Truth, Sun Jul-25-21 01:30 AM
A few things, just to be clear.
1. I used to be a Christian myself, and people came at me hard as fuck on the boards. To a degree, that scrutiny outside my bubble helped me find my way out.
2. This isn't my first rodeo with that poster on this subject. They wonce told me i was never a true christian, which is flat out disrespectful.
3. With due respect, my question was very simple. I'd Gary call my question "rapid fire" or lawyer like.
I simply asked what evidence he had to conclude that a god existed and responsible. That's it.
And that's kid glove light.
Trust....If I wanted to go hard, it would look very different.
If they want to proselytize, fine. More power to them. But they're not at all victims if someone presents a challenge.
They can also choose to engage, or not. And if you read this thread objectively, they were willing to engage in a smug, snarky back and forth- but were unwilling to have a sincere dialogue on the subject when they are being asked to provide evidence for their claims.
Further, if you're being objective, and actually read the entire post, you'd see I took two very different tacts at dfferent points in the post.
Early, I was simply asking an epistemological question, which is perfectly fair game when someone chooses to broach the subject in a public forum.
I didn't start breaking shit down until he got in his arrogant ass atritude with Mynority, talking about he was smart to back off.
That's when I took a different tact, but even then, it was a direct response to his own smug ass retort about the example being the best.
So I obliged. And I you think that was lawyerly, I barely scratched the surface.
They brought it up.
I asked a question.
They got VERY arrogant and started trash talking somene they felt couldn't hang on the subject.
I posed valid issues with the efficacy of prayer- entirely in line with his question, and fair game.
With due reapect, you're objectively and observably off base here trying to criticize me here. It's a little white knight.
13438106, just seemed like dude was making alil feel good post celebrating his|
Posted by mikediggz, Sun Jul-25-21 01:36 AM
love for the Lord lol. jawnt took a hard left but it goes like that around here sometimes
13438107, That's not what his exchange with mynority looks like.|
Posted by Cold Truth, Sun Jul-25-21 01:42 AM
And im sorry, this isn't church.
They don't get a bully pulpit, and others don't have to be quiet while they talk.
And again- I took twondifferent tacts at two different points, and there's a very clear and obvious reason for that change.
If you're going to take me to task and says I went a lil hard, you should at least address my rebuttal on the matter.
Because they were doing anything but professing love for their lord when that happened.
13438108, fair enough.|
Posted by mikediggz, Sun Jul-25-21 01:47 AM
>Because they were doing anything but professing love for their
>lord when that happened.
13438110, this place is so miserable, maybe they should shut it back down|
Posted by ThaTruth, Sun Jul-25-21 08:22 AM
13438119, Why? |
Posted by Cold Truth, Sun Jul-25-21 11:12 AM
13438120, Post reset - Following replies avoid the post - jack agenda of some|
Posted by c71, Sun Jul-25-21 11:38 AM
This post is about the accounts of those who have found the goodness of depending on the Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ for help and favor
Obviously some want to challenge Christianity
Obviously, they have done their post jack
This post will now be reset to people accounts of their experience depending on the Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ for favor and help
If anybody want to take this post away from the topic stated:
account of depending on the Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ for halp and favor
...it should be clear that those who post-jack are doing it for their agenda because how many have an agenda to post-jack Islam posts or the like.
If you have to post-jack a Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ post AFTER a significant crew already did a post-jack, then...that's your agenda making you be you.
13438122, Intwresting that you deflected yo ranting about post jacking and agendas|
Posted by Cold Truth, Sun Jul-25-21 12:00 PM
If you REALLY want to rail against post jacking and "agendas", you should gave a long, hard look in the mirror:
I didn't bitch and moan when people like you and case and a few others brought forth all manner of offense and ignorance.
I addressed it, directly. And your tact was grossly disrespectful from jump.my question to you in here was anything but disrespectful.
I didn't respond by avoidong you and going to some other spot in the room so that I could talk about you within earshot.
And you don't get to play a victim when your took an arrogant, trash talking approach to Mynority's surface commentary.
Posted by Cold Truth, Sun Jul-25-21 12:05 PM