Reading back over this has me tripping that this could even happen.

For John Gruden…


Then he won a Super Bowl *whispers "Dungys team"* so no one really thinks about this anymore but motherfucking gottdamn, that is a LOT.


On the real, right today, given the perceived value of draft picks in the current NFL…would a team give that kind of haul up for…Bill Belicheck? A man many say is the GOAT coach?


I'm thinking…no…besides maaaaybe Cleveland, who really couldn't anyway.

I'm from the lost black tribe of Israel, the Yos

http://coolehmag.com/frontEnd/

despite that insane return for a coach.

Even though it was Dungy's team and I give Dungy a lot of credit,
Tampa DID win a Super Bowl so its hard to say it wasn't worth it.

IMO a Super Bowl is worth everything so whatever the cost was its always going to be worth it. Even if the cost is a decade of losing, fuck it.

_________________________________________

might have been Dungy's team but Gruden's knowledge of the Raiders playbook definitely helped them win. Callahan left the team on auto pilot and didnt change anything. Same calls and everything.

November 8th, 2005 The greatest night in the history of GD!

I always thought Mike McCarthy was the luckiest but I might have to change that. Who inherits a damn good team and in the super bowl faces his old team who hasn't changed a thing?

www.engadgethd.com - the other stuff i'm looking at

That's the gist of it

________________________________________________
R.I.P. Soulgyal <3
SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

Winning a superbowl is hard, if it was easy than Dungy would have won a bunch with TB. Gruden had the same roster, but did different things as a coach and they won the superbowl which Dungy didn't do before him. Period.

Same thing gets said about Tomlin, he won with Cowher's team. Well winning the super bowl is real hard and Cowher only won 1 ever in his whole time in Pittsburgh. He had many good teams, Tomlin won immediately with them. Again, winning is hard and simply having a good team built does not win you a superbowl, you still have to coach it well. Nevermind that he has gone on to have one of the best first 10 year records in history of the NFL.

All of that basic point is not even taking into account that this isn't college. While some head coaches have more say than others on what players are on the team, the head coach doesn't build an NFL team like he does in College. In College you inherit teams because players come and leave due to coaches. Most coaches aren't out there building the contracts and setting the team up financially to be good after they leave.

It's dismissive of a coach to say he won a superbowl with someone elses team because he did the hardest part, the part the previous coach probably didn't do which is why he is gone.

in Tampa. Coaching football is hard in general that’s why despite a ton of offers guys like Gruden and Cowher have chosen to stick to the easy TV money.

So many playoff games and Super Bowls have been won and lost on one fluke play here and there and someone’s entire legacy can be painted based on that result.

________________________________________
"Take the surprise out your voice Shaq."-The REAL CP3
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2H5K-BUMS0

I'm really glad Dungy got his eventually - he's an all-timer. But you win, or lose, with the roster you have and that's that. Tampa Bay identified their rapidly-closing window, aggressively pursued an upgrade at coach, and proved to be 100% vindicated in doing so.

To give you a local example: wasn't a single fucking person in the Denver area yelling JOHN FOX'S TEAM! after Super Bowl 50. And there won't be any elegies for Kubiak if Vance Dogg takes us all the way this year.

I think if you win the first year you inherit an already successful team that couldn't get over the hump AND then proceed to do not much at all…people are going to detract a little bit from your achievement.

and it IS a significant achievement.


But if you don't do it again…or forget that, you do't even come anywhere near doing it again…it's going to get mentioned.

Yes, you won the Super Bowl and no one can take it away from you. But there's also levels to this shit.


Tomlin went to the SB again on his own. Gruden was under .500 the rest of the way.


Whether the trade "worked out" for Tampa Bay or not, and I would say it definitely did, is a different discussion.

I'm from the lost black tribe of Israel, the Yos

http://coolehmag.com/frontEnd/

The competition for him would be ridiculous, he could command more even in an era where picks are more valued.

To me the Bucs paid a lot at the time, I was definitely taken aback by that kind of compensation for a coach but they identified their guy and it worked out.

Dungy and Kiffin put in a lot to those Bucs but you know what? Rick Carlisle put a lot into the Pistons, too. It was nice to see both Dungy and Carlisle win elsewhere, but for those respective situations, their teams made the right moves.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

http://www.foxsports.com/nfl/gallery/nfl-trade-buccaneers-raiders-jon-gruden-facts-stats-history-052417

6 things you didn’t know about the 8th biggest trade in NFL history: Jon Gruden to the Bucs

Cameron DaSilva
Cameron DaSilva @camdasilva
May 24, 2017 at 9:28a ET

Head coaches are wildly important in the NFL – more so than in other sports. Responsibilities vary by team, with some calling plays while others are in charge of the 53-man roster and personnel. But regardless of the job, head coaches are among the most important people in the NFL.

That’s why, in 2002, the Buccaneers decided to make one of the biggest trades in NFL history by striking a deal for Jon Gruden. Tampa Bay sent first-round picks in 2002 and 2003, as well as second-round picks in 2002 and 2004, to the Raiders – along with $8 million in cash – for Gruden, landing their next head coach.

It was a deal that had an immediate impact on both teams with the two meeting in the Super Bowl less than a year after making the trade.

The third part of our 10-day series on the biggest trades in NFL history looks back at some of the lesser-known facts from this deal.

*6. Gruden was the third coach to win the Super Bowl in his first season with a team
Only twice in NFL history had a coach won the Super Bowl in his first season with a team before Gruden became the third in 2002. It was a remarkable feat on his part, especially because of the team he beat in the Super Bowl: the Oakland Raiders.

Just one year prior, Gruden was the head coach of the Raiders, but a rift between him and owner Al Davis forced the two to split. Do you think Davis regretted dealing Gruden to the team that would eventually beat his in the big game less than a year later? You bet he did, even if he wouldn’t admit it.

“Oh no, no, I don’t. No. Not at all. Nope. Because look, Jon beat us in the (expletive) Super Bowl, that’s the only thing I regret. But take a look at Jon’s performance at Tampa.”

Davis and many other pundits tried to pin the Buccaneers’ Super Bowl win on the brilliance of previous coach Tony Dungy, but Gruden definitely left his mark on the team – even if it did struggle in the years after winning it all.

*5. Gruden more than tripled his salary with the Buccaneers
With the Raiders, Gruden was the youngest head coach in the NFL. He was unproven and inexperienced, but Al Davis was willing to give him a shot. He just didn’t pay the coach much, giving him a salary of about $1.2 million per year – far below the league average of $2 million with at least 20 coaches making more.

However, when he was traded to the Buccaneers and eventually signed a five-year deal in Tampa Bay, he more than tripled his salary, earning above the league average. His contract was worth almost $4 million per year, which was a nice raise from his previous salary.


*4. The Bucs were the first team to win the Super Bowl without a first- or second-round pick that year
After the Buccaneers traded for Gruden, they were left without first-round picks in 2002 and 2003 and second-round picks in 2002 and 2004. It was a big haul for a head coach, but it proved to be worth it after winning the Super Bowl in his first year at the helm.

One would have imagined the lack of draft picks in the first two rounds would have handicapped the Buccaneers in 2002, but with an already strong roster, they didn’t believe a couple of rookies would make a huge difference. And they were right.

Tampa Bay became the first team ever to win it all in a year in which it didn’t have picks in the first two rounds. That’s telling of just how great the Buccaneers already were, and how capable they were of surrendering those picks without much effect on the roster.

*3. The NFL temporarily banned teams from trading draft picks for coaches after the Gruden deal
Trading for coaches was much more common 10, 20 years ago. The Jets did exactly that to land Bill Parcells, and the Buccaneers did the same a few years later. However, after Tampa Bay acquired Gruden, the NFL banned teams from exchanging picks for coaches. Commissioner Paul Tagliabue sent a memo out to teams after it was completed explaining that they would no longer be able to agree to deals of this nature for the fact that it might undermine the value of the draft.

Since then, the league has amended this rule to allow picks to be exchanged for “head coaches and high-level club employees,” but the magnitude of the Buccaneers’ trade for Gruden clearly sent shockwaves through the NFL.

*2. The Raiders were a complete disaster after the trade
Yes, Oakland reached the Super Bowl one year after trading Gruden to the Bucs. Granted, it lost, but the fact that the Raiders continued to have success post-Gruden was a sign that maybe the trade wasn’t a colossal mistake.

It was.

The Raiders didn’t have a single winning season from 2003 to 2015, with their first coming this past year when they went 12-4. They cycled through nine head coaches after dealing Gruden, who would go on to spend seven years with the Buccaneers.

Bill Callahan, the guy who replaced Gruden, lasted only two years in Oakland before leaving the coaching game completely until becoming the Cowboys’ offensive coordinator 10 years later in 2012. So essentially, the Raiders dumped a young, fast-rising coach for nine guys who failed to match his level of success – outside of Jack Del Rio in 2016. To put it into perspective, the Raiders made the playoffs twice in four years under Gruden, and just once from 2002-15.

As for the Raiders’ four draft picks, they had very little impact in Oakland. After myriad trades, the Raiders wound up selecting Phillip Buchanon, Langston Walker, Tyler Brayton and Sam Williams. Williams had the longest tenure with the Raiders (seven years), but none of the four players made a single Pro Bowl or started more than 50 games in Oakland.

*1. Bill Parcells backed out of becoming the Buccaneers’ head coach before the trade
Before trading for Gruden, the Buccaneers made an offer to a very high-profile coach in Parcells. He was a couple years removed from being the Jets’ head coach, but there appeared to be some interest on his part in resuming his career. However, after it looked like the Buccaneers would be landing their guy, Parcells pulled out and said he wouldn’t be accepting the offer.

"I am not coaching anymore," Parcells said at the time. "I can't make the commitment. The Tampa job was very appealing ... but I'm done. There won't be any more people writing, 'You just never know with Bill Parcells,' because I'm done with coaching."

Of course, Parcells wasn’t in fact done coaching because he joined the Dallas Cowboys a year later for his last run in the NFL. The Cowboys made the playoffs twice in four years under Parcells, while the Buccaneers won a Super Bowl with Gruden. You be the judge of whether the Bucs lucked out.

Kirby Lee-USA TODAY Sports Kirby Lee



*skatin' the rings of saturn*


..and miles to go before i sleep...