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Subject: "Sam Presti deserves to be fried." Previous topic | Next topic
theeraser
Member since Feb 11th 2007
7197 posts
Sun Mar-06-16 02:41 PM

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"Sam Presti deserves to be fried."


          

The narrative now seems to be that OKC has its deepest team ever, the deepest in the league some people like Barkley even (incorrectly) say. And I've heard a lot about how they're actually excellent right now with certain 5-man combinations, and how their problems are fixable if Billy Donovan could just get them to run better plays (or any plays at all in many instances). But IMO the fatal flaw here is NOT fixable by either coach or players, it's in how the team has been put together is: the most important members of the supporting cast are ONE-WAY PLAYERS. They play 4 on 5 at one end when Roberson is playing, and at the other end Kanter and Waiters can't guard anyone at all. Why would anyone think that approach could lead to a championship?? (Btw, this is why I think OKC's best hope may be rolling with Adams and Cam Payne).

I really don't understand why drafting KD, Russ, and Serge automatically means Presti has a lifetime pass. He never was fried adequately for one of the dumbest trades in league history. He stuck with Scott Brooks for years when it was blindingly obvious Brooks was adding little tactical value, and in fact holding the team back (took him years to develop any offensive sets, made the team play with one hand tied behind its back and basically gave away the 2012 Finals by stubbornly starting Perk, etc). And now he's getting praise for having supposedly built a deep, young team around KD, Russ, and Ibaka that gives them a chance to contend for years and should get the stars to re-up in FA -- when in fact common sense says no matter how good Durant and Westbrook are you can't beat GSW or SA when your starting SG is ignored by opposing defenses and your max-money post player is one of the worst defenders in the entire league.

This is an example of one reason (beyond the latent racism of the pro-analytics dialogue) why overall I'm more sympathetic to "anti-analytics" opinionators than "pro-analytics" ones. Both sides, ingenuously or not, construct strawmen of each other. And obviously getting better data on what's happening on the floor can help coaches make better lineup decisions, GMs make better player evaluations, and players get a better understanding of their own and opponents' strengths and weaknesses. But this stuff is really on the margins. When we're talking about the things that matter most to their' ultimate success, we have a lot of evidence by this point that analytics is not helping teams make the correct decisions.

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
I almost rolled my eyes out of my skull the other night...
Mar 06th 2016
1
I like this. Here is how I see this problem:
Mar 06th 2016
2
I used to run analytics for Sony DVD sales. help them print Bieber dvds
May 30th 2016
15
yuuuuuup
Jun 26th 2018
65
The owners refused to pay Harden, not Sam Presti
Mar 06th 2016
3
Do you really think they split over $4M or whatever it was?
Mar 06th 2016
5
      It was both the money & his aspirations to be the man
Mar 06th 2016
6
As opposed to the two-way studs they let walk?
Mar 06th 2016
4
...
May 24th 2016
7
Does this mean the Harden trade wasn't bad? I'm confused.
May 25th 2016
10
      Yea. And I'll HAPPILY take an L if they chip. But still don't trust them...
May 25th 2016
12
Wildcard- who expected Durant to play defense
May 24th 2016
8
He looked like Marcus Camby for some stretches tonite.
May 25th 2016
9
Uh KD has been GREAT on D when he wants to be for years now.
May 25th 2016
11
      when he wants to be though, and hasn't done it in this situation
May 25th 2016
13
Dion and Roberson a combined 4-20, Kanter unplayable. I'll take the W
May 30th 2016
14
true.
May 30th 2016
16
Here it is
Jun 24th 2016
17
Here for my L. Presti killed that trade
Jun 24th 2016
18
How do people think he is average though?
Jun 24th 2016
19
Because he let James Harden go, Einstein.
Jun 24th 2016
20
Yes - AND because he put together pieces that don't fit.
Jun 24th 2016
21
Do you think he *wanted* to trade Harden, Oppenheimer?
Jul 05th 2016
27
      You win for "Oppenheimer." Good shit.
Jul 05th 2016
28
      lmao @ oppenheimer.
Jul 06th 2016
31
he gets zero credit for durant
Jun 24th 2016
22
      Someone tried to give Presit credit for Durant? Bwahahah
Jun 24th 2016
23
AND NOW IM HERE FOR A W
Jul 04th 2016
26
      LMAO!!!! good shit, shells.
Jul 06th 2016
29
      The worLLLLLd keep spinnin
Sep 23rd 2017
44
Kev with the flamethrower! LOL
Jul 04th 2016
24
lmao, no shit. rumblings all say russy gone, too.
Jul 04th 2016
25
      He may want to leave but there's no reason he should sign an extension
Jul 06th 2016
30
      well, that's not entirely true...
Jul 06th 2016
33
      That's only sorta true and it's not about willingness to extend now ....
Jul 06th 2016
34
      What's the chance's that Russ was staying long term anyway?
Jul 06th 2016
32
           yeah KD's departure bodes poorly for it in both senses
Jul 06th 2016
35
                I don't know any more than anyone else, but I never thought...
Jul 06th 2016
36
                     I don't suspect anyone was blindsided by this.
Jul 07th 2016
37
                          lulz @ "Westbrook face". my new hope...
Jul 07th 2016
38
                               Happy 4th, gang...
Jul 04th 2017
39
https://twitter.com/HowardBeck/status/911638955728211969
Sep 23rd 2017
40
https://twitter.com/DannyLeroux/status/911647707709632512
Sep 23rd 2017
42
https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-01-2016/WVkNEr.gif
Sep 23rd 2017
41
lol
Sep 23rd 2017
45
This L keep on giving
Sep 23rd 2017
43
This was a W, my G. Presti traded Harden and drove away KD
Sep 24th 2017
46
      drove away KD...the fuck are you talking about?
Sep 24th 2017
48
Respect where it's due, he made great moves for PG and Melo this summer
Sep 24th 2017
47
Not gonna lie bro, this + post 46 is confusing me
Sep 24th 2017
49
      Post 46, I was saying this agenda is a W (not that Presti got a W)
May 17th 2018
55
His legacy will be the guy that couldn't keep OKC together.
May 16th 2018
50
Harden was barely a top 150 at that time...
May 16th 2018
51
Bruh...KD is playing Harden in the WCF...OKC is fishing
May 16th 2018
52
+1, Daryl Morey disagrees with you
May 16th 2018
53
harden is the reason they beat the spurs and made it to the finals
May 17th 2018
56
      yeah, he killed the Spurs that year in the WCF
Jun 26th 2018
63
dude had 3 mvp's and kept the worst one lol.
May 16th 2018
54
      Would they have been the GSW
May 17th 2018
57
           Not with Brooks and Russ. They would've been more like the heat
May 17th 2018
58
                3 finals appearances and 2 chips...is the point.
May 17th 2018
59
                     ^
Jun 09th 2018
60
3 MVPs...squandered
Jun 25th 2018
61
I mean let's not pretend like they sucked with KD/Russ
Jun 26th 2018
62
      Cool, so neither Presti nor Scott Brooks deserves blame?
Jun 26th 2018
64
           Never been a fan of Brooks. Presti is an above average GM overall
Aug 12th 2019
74
                Based on? Letting James Harden go for.....what again?
Aug 19th 2019
84
OKC 1st Team in NBA History to Top $300M in Salary and Luxury Tax
Jul 05th 2018
66
White boyus, bro. I don't understand what's so difficult to grasp.
Jul 05th 2018
67
I am entertained
Jul 05th 2018
68
its coming.
Jul 05th 2018
69
stretching Melo and Singler was coming regardless
Jul 05th 2018
70
      which is another $20M off the tax bill if im not mistaken
Jul 05th 2018
71
      PISTONS GREAT KYLE SINGLER
Jul 05th 2018
72
the whole harden thing was so bizarre
Aug 12th 2019
76
Does he get props for making the best out of a bad situation? After...
Aug 12th 2019
73
credit? dunno. but in the end this disaster was good for his job securit...
Aug 12th 2019
75
I never said anything about "credit", the Clippers, PG and Kawhi bailed....
Aug 13th 2019
78
      props, credit, interchangeable to me.
Aug 13th 2019
82
Sets them up well for sure.
Aug 12th 2019
77
Jesus H. Christ. The copping sounds about white.
Aug 13th 2019
79
its really nothing new, look at Daryl Morey who was hailed as a genius.....
Aug 13th 2019
80
only if the same people are dumping on Paul
Aug 13th 2019
81
100. And he never put the right pieces around KD and Russ.
Aug 19th 2019
83

Dstl1
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Sun Mar-06-16 03:43 PM

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1. "I almost rolled my eyes out of my skull the other night..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

when Chuck was saying that shit.

...cleaned up my act, made a few violent songs...but, they wack like Glen Rice with New Balance on - Sean Price

  

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52595 posts
Sun Mar-06-16 04:45 PM

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2. "I like this. Here is how I see this problem:"
In response to Reply # 0
Sun Mar-06-16 04:48 PM by Orbit_Established

  

          

>This is an example of one reason (beyond the latent racism of
>the pro-analytics dialogue) why overall I'm more sympathetic
>to "anti-analytics" opinionators than "pro-analytics" ones.
>Both sides, ingenuously or not, construct strawmen of each
>other.

The difference is that people believe the one constructed
by the pro-analytics people, and it costs people jobs.

And obviously getting better data on what's happening
>on the floor can help coaches make better lineup decisions,
>GMs make better player evaluations, and players get a better
>understanding of their own and opponents' strengths and
>weaknesses. But this stuff is really on the margins. When
>we're talking about the things that matter most to their'
>ultimate success, we have a lot of evidence by this point that
>analytics is not helping teams make the correct decisions.

Here's my thing:

Building a business and a brand is best left in the hands of
people who are familiar with all areas of that business and brand.
That means people who had direct access to all areas, have
people skills, can draw on experiences, understand clients and
customers.

Failed companies and poorly run business don't fail because
they lack DATA. They fail because they lack intelligent people
who are smart, have good instincts, have their finger on the
pulse of movements, and intentions and behaviors.

See, for example, the Sony leaked e-mails. Sony has more data
on moviegoing than anyone can hope to have. They've hired
the smartest people to analyze movie-going trends. They've
disaggregated the data. They know who makes money, in which
movies, when. They are DECADES ahead of sports in analyzing
their market. It's Hollywood.

So why has Hollywood, save a few giant superhero movies,
had a REALLY rough last five years? Why is Gods of Egypt
tanking? Why will the Ghostbusters shit tank? Why did
RIP Department tank? And Green Lantern tank? And Concussion
tank? It's not just randomness.

What is the problem?

Read those leaked Sony e-mails.

The problem is that the people in charge are racist and sexist
and are overall idiots who have no idea what entertainment or
art is. That was CLEAR from the minute you read the e-mails.
DATA doesn't do shit for that problem. You can't fix that with
DATA. You can fix that with imagination, and experience and
fairness.

So with regards to sports:

Hire a college kid to travel with the team, track the data,
test new principles. They don't need FRONT OFFICE jobs,
because they don't know anything about anything. They are
good at what they do, and that is a PIECE of the pie. But
a PIECE.

What the analytics crowd has done is taken advantage of
everyone else's mathematical low self esteem and convinced
us that they deserve jobs. It's mostly a job-getting scheme,
not a "movement."

You have the 76ers being run by someone willing to throw
away THREE SEASONS for ping pong balls odds. That is the
great insight from analytics? How about a front office guy
who can relate to Okafor and keep him from fighting in the
street, almost ruining his LIFE? Got data for that? NO. Because
in order to build a solid locker room, you have to understand
how people act. Their GM does not.






----------------------------



O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"




"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "

  

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deejboram
Member since Sep 27th 2002
25755 posts
Mon May-30-16 10:36 PM

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15. "I used to run analytics for Sony DVD sales. help them print Bieber dvds "
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

Don't print up 10M discs if u only going to sell 7M

****
pink toes: http://i.imgur.com/WN7DPL1

  

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kayru99
Member since Jan 26th 2004
15622 posts
Tue Jun-26-18 04:34 PM

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65. "yuuuuuup"
In response to Reply # 2


          

"What the analytics crowd has done is taken advantage of
everyone else's mathematical low self esteem and convinced
us that they deserve jobs. It's mostly a job-getting scheme,
not a "movement." "

  

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FILF
Member since Jun 01st 2007
20177 posts
Sun Mar-06-16 04:53 PM

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3. "The owners refused to pay Harden, not Sam Presti "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

WHAT'S GOOD *****? What's REALLY good?!?!????!!! Ha HA!
http://40.media.tumblr.com/d8e2daf9f3f37244cd05436bcdf05973/tumblr_mt4qibKq4c1rgam01o1_1280.png

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71181 posts
Sun Mar-06-16 07:21 PM

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5. "Do you really think they split over $4M or whatever it was?"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

I read that the two sides were about $1M per year apart. I understand in luxury tax money it is or is potentially more than that to the franchise but I have a hard time believing that's all there was to it. I think he had other aspirations. If it was just about money why did they rush to do it? I guess the whole fucking thing doesn't make sense.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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FILF
Member since Jun 01st 2007
20177 posts
Sun Mar-06-16 07:47 PM

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6. "It was both the money & his aspirations to be the man"
In response to Reply # 5


  

          

He could have left money on the table like Klay but he wanted every dime & feel appreciated if he was going to stay.

He has stated that he wasn't confident about being good enough to be a franchise player but the OKC front-office made the decision easier on him by not kissing his ass.

WHAT'S GOOD *****? What's REALLY good?!?!????!!! Ha HA!
http://40.media.tumblr.com/d8e2daf9f3f37244cd05436bcdf05973/tumblr_mt4qibKq4c1rgam01o1_1280.png

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71181 posts
Sun Mar-06-16 07:19 PM

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4. "As opposed to the two-way studs they let walk?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Perkins? One-way player or really later a no-way player.

Thabo? One-way player, provided no offense.

Harden? Oddly somewhat of a two-way player, but was dying to be a one-way player as he has shown time and time again.

You can go down the line with Kevin Martin or Reggie Jackson or whomever.

I guess that could be seen as doubling down on the indictment of Presti or absolving him somewhat, depending how you looked at it.

One thing is for sure, these guys could use an Iguodala type player to glue shit together. But what good team couldn't?

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
21925 posts
Tue May-24-16 10:25 PM

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7. "..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52595 posts
Wed May-25-16 05:56 AM

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10. "Does this mean the Harden trade wasn't bad? I'm confused. "
In response to Reply # 7


  

          


----------------------------



O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"




"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "

  

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theeraser
Member since Feb 11th 2007
7197 posts
Wed May-25-16 07:57 AM

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12. "Yea. And I'll HAPPILY take an L if they chip. But still don't trust them..."
In response to Reply # 10


          

Do we REALLY trust Kanter to play good enough D to stay on the court? Actually he hasn't in this series, but it hasn't mattered because the small lineup is killing GSW. And two good offensive games from Roberson and some great defense and decision-making on O from Dion are things we simply haven't seen from those players before. Do we really trust them to do this consistently??

I will HAPPILY accept the L if the Thunder win the title. I hope they do. But based on what we've seen from these players for years I have no confidence we won't see them revert to form.

And yes the Harden trade was still dumb. Presti misgauged the salary cap. Basically gave up a shot at contending in 2012-13 for the sake of the future. And if he was going to trade him he should've been able to get more. Who's to say OKC would still be ringless in 2016 if they'd kept him or gotten a better deal for him?

  

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Riot
Member since May 25th 2005
14601 posts
Tue May-24-16 10:46 PM

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8. "Wildcard- who expected Durant to play defense"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

That was a unknown unknown



)))--####---###--(((

bunda
<-.-> ^_^ \^0^/
get busy living, or get busy dying.

  

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Castro
Charter member
48724 posts
Wed May-25-16 01:37 AM

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9. "He looked like Marcus Camby for some stretches tonite."
In response to Reply # 8


  

          

------------------
One Hundred.

  

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theeraser
Member since Feb 11th 2007
7197 posts
Wed May-25-16 07:50 AM

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11. "Uh KD has been GREAT on D when he wants to be for years now."
In response to Reply # 8


          

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71181 posts
Wed May-25-16 08:57 PM

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13. "when he wants to be though, and hasn't done it in this situation"
In response to Reply # 11


  

          

i dont think he is like mcgrady levels of selectively applying himself on d but he could be a lot more consistent. another reason i would love to see him on the spurs, though this run probably has him staying.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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theeraser
Member since Feb 11th 2007
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Mon May-30-16 10:33 PM

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14. "Dion and Roberson a combined 4-20, Kanter unplayable. I'll take the W"
In response to Reply # 0


          

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
21925 posts
Mon May-30-16 10:37 PM

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16. "true."
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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B9
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43120 posts
Fri Jun-24-16 07:09 AM

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17. "Here it is"
In response to Reply # 0


          

Sam Presti found a team dumb enough to give him a haul of young guys for Serge Ibaka.
Win.

  

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bshelly
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Fri Jun-24-16 09:32 AM

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18. "Here for my L. Presti killed that trade"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I've been a huge critic of Presti. I thought he was average at best. But he went against all his tendencies last night. He made a bold choice and sold an asset that is probably depreciating for peak value, because he recognized that he has plenty of guys on the roster who can recreate what serge gave them. In exchange, he finally got Russ and KD a real third option, and a damn good one at that. All that and ensure the pipeline of white bamma centers continues unabated.

----
bshelly

"You (Fisher) could get fired, Les Snead could get fired, Kevin Demoff could get fired, but I will always be Eric Dickerson.” (c) The God

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
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Fri Jun-24-16 10:03 AM

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19. "How do people think he is average though?"
In response to Reply # 18


  

          

I love the thinking of "Well if you strip away his great draft picks and all the games he has won, he really ain't shit!"

Basically you can fry him for the Harden trade, though personally I think there were various factors at play there. It shouldn't fall squarely on him but sure, he is the GM, so he has to accept that it does.

Beyond that he has drafted well and managed assets well. He made the most of the Jackson situation and killed it here. They have drafted Durant, Westbrook, Ibaka, Jackson and Adams. The Waiters trade kinda sucked but he took what he could get to fill a need. I don't see how anyone could see Presti as anything less than above average. Have you seen some of the stiffs employed as NBA GMs?

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52595 posts
Fri Jun-24-16 10:24 AM

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20. "Because he let James Harden go, Einstein. "
In response to Reply # 19


  

          


>Basically you can fry him for the Harden trade, though
>personally I think there were various factors at play there.
>It shouldn't fall squarely on him but sure, he is the GM, so
>he has to accept that it does.

There is no copping pleas.

He let Harden go.

We took it EASY on him, if anything.

----------------------------



O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"




"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "

  

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theeraser
Member since Feb 11th 2007
7197 posts
Fri Jun-24-16 02:14 PM

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21. "Yes - AND because he put together pieces that don't fit."
In response to Reply # 20


          

Everyone was hyping Kanter and Dion and Roberson when they had a couple good games this spring...Then Kanter proved unplayable vs GSW, and Dion and Roberson reverted to form, to the tune of a combined 4-for-20 in Game 7 shooting...One-way players.

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71181 posts
Tue Jul-05-16 07:35 PM

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27. "Do you think he *wanted* to trade Harden, Oppenheimer? "
In response to Reply # 20


  

          

In the hierarchy of people who wanted that deal you had 1) Ownership 2) Player 3) Management. Ownership didn't want the luxury tax and decided instead to diversify assets. Harden would also absolutely not have continued in that role. If that were his desire, why would he balk at their offer over roughly $1M per year? They offered him a deal *very* close to the max.

Presti is clearly above average, not great, but above average.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52595 posts
Tue Jul-05-16 07:39 PM

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28. "You win for "Oppenheimer." Good shit. "
In response to Reply # 27


  

          


You wrong, tho

But you mentioned Oppenheimer

  

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Cenario
Member since Aug 24th 2005
56841 posts
Wed Jul-06-16 09:23 AM

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31. "lmao @ oppenheimer."
In response to Reply # 27


  

          

-The Knicks’ coaching search still includes a lone frontrunner, Kurt Rambis, whose qualifications for the position include a strong relationship with Jackson and a willingness to take the job.

  

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bshelly
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22. "he gets zero credit for durant"
In response to Reply # 19


  

          

Yeah, he made two amazing draft picks and one really good one in Ibaka. He's a great drafter. But before yesterday, he had made exactly zero good FA or trade decisions. He has failed utterly in his ability to put satisfactory pieces around Westbrook and durant, and he kept a mediocre head coach for way too long.

----
bshelly

"You (Fisher) could get fired, Les Snead could get fired, Kevin Demoff could get fired, but I will always be Eric Dickerson.” (c) The God

  

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52595 posts
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23. "Someone tried to give Presit credit for Durant? Bwahahah"
In response to Reply # 22


  

          


Being white is the shiznit

  

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bshelly
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26. "AND NOW IM HERE FOR A W"
In response to Reply # 18


  

          

----
bshelly

"You (Fisher) could get fired, Les Snead could get fired, Kevin Demoff could get fired, but I will always be Eric Dickerson.” (c) The God

  

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49393 posts
Wed Jul-06-16 06:09 AM

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29. "LMAO!!!! good shit, shells. "
In response to Reply # 26


  

          

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

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bshelly
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44. "The worLLLLLd keep spinnin"
In response to Reply # 26


  

          

----
bshelly

"You (Fisher) could get fired, Les Snead could get fired, Kevin Demoff could get fired, but I will always be Eric Dickerson.” (c) The God

  

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theeraser
Member since Feb 11th 2007
7197 posts
Mon Jul-04-16 11:03 AM

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24. "Kev with the flamethrower! LOL"
In response to Reply # 0


          

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71181 posts
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25. "lmao, no shit. rumblings all say russy gone, too."
In response to Reply # 24


  

          

DA said Russy ain't talking extension, period.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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Ryan M
Member since Oct 21st 2002
40129 posts
Wed Jul-06-16 09:20 AM

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30. "He may want to leave but there's no reason he should sign an extension "
In response to Reply # 25


  

          

I mean the cap rises again next year - he'd be lighting money on fire by signing this year.

------------------------------
'19-'20 LA Lakers

James. Davis. Kuzma. Howard. Rondo. Caldwell-Pope. Green. Cook. Bradley. McGee. Dudley. Caruso...

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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33. "well, that's not entirely true..."
In response to Reply # 30


  

          

http://espn.go.com/espnradio/play?id=16769911

windhorst and amin do a good job of explaining it in this podcast (skip to about 17 minutes in; although the whole thing's worth a listen) but in short, what the thunder can essentially do, since they now have cap space, is renegotiate this last year on westbrook's contract to bump him up to a true max in 16-17, which takes him from 17m up to ~26m, and then extend up to 3 additional years, with an opt out after 17-18, when russ would have 10 yrs of service and thus be eligible to cash in on the super-max.

it would benefit both parties, okc gets an assurance of at least 2 more seasons of westbrook and can plan accordingly, and russ essentially gets a free extra 8m next season and still hits fagency after his 10.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
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34. "That's only sorta true and it's not about willingness to extend now ...."
In response to Reply # 30


  

          

it's about them gauging his desire to stay with the team, the same way trading for him is about gauging his willingness to stay with the team that gets him.

let me just say that "tampering" is the word use for when a GM says too much. if they do too much quietly, it's never caught. put it this way, russy's agent got a phone bill that looks like BIG's circa 1994 right about now.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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Cocobrotha2
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32. "What's the chance's that Russ was staying long term anyway?"
In response to Reply # 25


          

He may have signaled KD he was leaving in a year, regardless, so KD took his "golden" opportunity to leave now.

<-><-><-><-><-><-><-><-><->
<-><-><-><-><-><-><-><-><->

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
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35. "yeah KD's departure bodes poorly for it in both senses"
In response to Reply # 32
Wed Jul-06-16 11:59 AM by ConcreteCharlie

  

          

what he had planned to do previously and, regardless of that, what he plans to do now.

LET THE DOMANTAS SABONIS ERA COMMENCE!!!

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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Dstl1
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36. "I don't know any more than anyone else, but I never thought..."
In response to Reply # 35


          

he would stay long term. Apparently, KD and Russ hung out in L.A. last week. I just think there's no way possible they didn't discuss all this.

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71181 posts
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37. "I don't suspect anyone was blindsided by this. "
In response to Reply # 36


  

          

Presti started the rebuilding process already with the Ibaka trade.

It'll be very interesting to see what happens with Westbrook and when. The best thing he could do is be up front about his goals and where he wants to go. If they can identify a small handful of places where he'd re-up, then they can get a healthy competition between trading partners and a good return. If he just gives them the Westbrook face and says he'll decide next June, eh, they might get screwed in the deal.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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Dstl1
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38. "lulz @ "Westbrook face". my new hope..."
In response to Reply # 37


          

is that Russ says fuck it...let's ball and goes hard to show he can carry a team, gets like 25 triple doubles this season and next summer after losing in the 2nd round again...Blake comes home to Oklahoma. Russ, Blake, Dipo, Adams...that's a good ass core.

  

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Dstl1
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39. "Happy 4th, gang..."
In response to Reply # 38
Tue Jul-04-17 05:19 PM by Dstl1

          

just sipping on a lil something strong...waiting for it to get dark so Jr and I can go out and launch these missiles...safely, though...no JPP. Almost nailed that...missed it by like a MILLION triple-doubles and no Dipo with PG instead of Blake.

https://www.sbnation.com/nba/2017/6/30/15907106/thunder-paul-george-trade-sam-presti-nba-rabbit-out-of-hat

...cleaned up my act, made a few violent songs...but, they wack like Glen Rice with New Balance on - Sean Price

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
21925 posts
Sat Sep-23-17 12:12 PM

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40. "https://twitter.com/HowardBeck/status/911638955728211969"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

https://twitter.com/HowardBeck/status/911638955728211969

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
21925 posts
Sat Sep-23-17 12:46 PM

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42. "https://twitter.com/DannyLeroux/status/911647707709632512"
In response to Reply # 40


  

          

https://twitter.com/DannyLeroux/status/911647707709632512

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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Dstl1
Charter member
48053 posts
Sat Sep-23-17 12:30 PM

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41. "https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-01-2016/WVkNEr.gif"
In response to Reply # 0


          

https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-01-2016/WVkNEr.gif

...cleaned up my act, made a few violent songs...but, they wack like Glen Rice with New Balance on - Sean Price

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
7644 posts
Sat Sep-23-17 04:47 PM

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45. "lol"
In response to Reply # 41


  

          

------

  

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Cenario
Member since Aug 24th 2005
56841 posts
Sat Sep-23-17 01:28 PM

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43. "This L keep on giving"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

-The Knicks’ coaching search still includes a lone frontrunner, Kurt Rambis, whose qualifications for the position include a strong relationship with Jackson and a willingness to take the job.

  

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theeraser
Member since Feb 11th 2007
7197 posts
Sun Sep-24-17 05:41 PM

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46. "This was a W, my G. Presti traded Harden and drove away KD"
In response to Reply # 43


          

  

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Dstl1
Charter member
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48. "drove away KD...the fuck are you talking about?"
In response to Reply # 46


          

.

...cleaned up my act, made a few violent songs...but, they wack like Glen Rice with New Balance on - Sean Price

  

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theeraser
Member since Feb 11th 2007
7197 posts
Sun Sep-24-17 05:41 PM

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47. "Respect where it's due, he made great moves for PG and Melo this summer"
In response to Reply # 0


          

  

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snacks
Member since Sep 15th 2005
5441 posts
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49. "Not gonna lie bro, this + post 46 is confusing me"
In response to Reply # 47


          

Like a lot

_____________________________________

Train yourself to let go of everything you fear to lose.

http://www.twitter.com/phntmd
http://instagram.com/phntmd
https://themonarchbrand.com/

  

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theeraser
Member since Feb 11th 2007
7197 posts
Thu May-17-18 09:17 AM

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55. "Post 46, I was saying this agenda is a W (not that Presti got a W)"
In response to Reply # 49


          

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
14488 posts
Wed May-16-18 02:52 PM

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50. "His legacy will be the guy that couldn't keep OKC together."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

5 years later...OKC looks ready to blow the whole thing up.

Only thing he got right was not overpaying Ibaka, IMO

Dude squandered a core of 3 top 10 players

that will be his legacy.

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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Creole
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51. "Harden was barely a top 150 at that time..."
In response to Reply # 50
Wed May-16-18 03:58 PM by Creole

  

          

He choked in the playoffs when he had a chance.

And then, he wanted more than needed to pay him.

I can’t think of anyone who thought Harden would be as good as he is today while also still being a liability on defense.

--- praying for peace, love, and power

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
14488 posts
Wed May-16-18 04:29 PM

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52. "Bruh...KD is playing Harden in the WCF...OKC is fishing"
In response to Reply # 51
Wed May-16-18 04:33 PM by bentagain

  

          

after being embarrassed by Utah in the 1st round

OKC = 3rd in payroll

Most think PG will opt out

but Melo opting in

OKC is destined to blow the whole thing up summer of 19'

That's his legacy

5 years later = nada.

OKC was 19th in payroll when they had the big 3 (4 if you want to throw Ibaka in there, he was still playing at a high level)

So he ended up cutting the check for lesser talent anyway.

double nada

nada nada LOL.

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
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53. "+1, Daryl Morey disagrees with you"
In response to Reply # 51
Wed May-16-18 06:16 PM by bentagain

  

          

There was a GM who saw the franchise leader potential in a 23Y.O. 6th man of the year on a finals team...if given the minutes

...and paid him as such...

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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BrooklynWHAT
Member since Jun 15th 2007
78454 posts
Thu May-17-18 09:29 AM

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56. "harden is the reason they beat the spurs and made it to the finals"
In response to Reply # 51


  

          

yeah he choked but dont act like he came out of nowhere. they shouldve kept him.

<--- Big Baller World Order

  

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LegacyNS
Member since Jan 16th 2004
37956 posts
Tue Jun-26-18 12:49 AM

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63. "yeah, he killed the Spurs that year in the WCF"
In response to Reply # 56


  

          


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<---- 5....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlgiritpmfo

=======================================

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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54. "dude had 3 mvp's and kept the worst one lol."
In response to Reply # 50


  

          

------

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
14488 posts
Thu May-17-18 11:19 AM

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57. "Would they have been the GSW"
In response to Reply # 54


  

          

3 top 10 players

The alpha dog
KD = Steph

Robin
Russ = Klay

DPOTY candidate
Ibaka = Green

Reinforcements
Harden = Iggy and Livingston

of course with KD going to GSW it's not an exact correlation to today's roster

but that 1st iteration of the GSW...that could have been OKC had they found a way to make it work, IMO

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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BrooklynWHAT
Member since Jun 15th 2007
78454 posts
Thu May-17-18 12:38 PM

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58. "Not with Brooks and Russ. They would've been more like the heat "
In response to Reply # 57


  

          

<--- Big Baller World Order

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
14488 posts
Thu May-17-18 01:17 PM

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59. "3 finals appearances and 2 chips...is the point."
In response to Reply # 58
Thu May-17-18 01:17 PM by bentagain

  

          

had Presti figured it out...I'm sure that group would have been together longer than 3 years...IMO

but sure MIA

poe tae toe

poe tah toe

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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ThaTruth
Charter member
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60. "^"
In response to Reply # 59


  

          

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
14488 posts
Mon Jun-25-18 10:21 PM

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61. "3 MVPs...squandered "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

...and Melo gettin his Kobe on....

Dude still got a job?

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71181 posts
Tue Jun-26-18 12:26 AM

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62. "I mean let's not pretend like they sucked with KD/Russ"
In response to Reply # 61


  

          

KD leaving for nothing fucked them and they've been reacting ever since. Look at what happened to LA when their all-in moment didn't work out, total tailspin. At least these guys have been in the playoffs and shit. The Melo trade was terrible, they knew it was a two-year deal and they knew he was washed. George deal in hindsight was kinda bad but I think almost every GM would have made it.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52595 posts
Tue Jun-26-18 01:18 AM

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64. "Cool, so neither Presti nor Scott Brooks deserves blame? "
In response to Reply # 62


  

          



Both have jobs.

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71181 posts
Mon Aug-12-19 05:36 PM

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74. "Never been a fan of Brooks. Presti is an above average GM overall"
In response to Reply # 64


  

          

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52595 posts
Mon Aug-19-19 01:01 PM

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84. "Based on? Letting James Harden go for.....what again?"
In response to Reply # 74


  

          


You do realize they COULD have kept him, right?

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
14488 posts
Thu Jul-05-18 04:34 PM

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66. "OKC 1st Team in NBA History to Top $300M in Salary and Luxury Tax"
In response to Reply # 0
Thu Jul-05-18 04:35 PM by bentagain

  

          

I don't even have an OKC agenda

but this shit is hilarisad

$300M for a 1st round exit

dude still has a job

when's the fire sale?

Remember when they didn't have the money to pay Harden?

LOL&SMH.

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52595 posts
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67. "White boyus, bro. I don't understand what's so difficult to grasp. "
In response to Reply # 66


  

          


If you are white and have the right haircut, people
think everything you do is cerebral, and you'll get
all the credit for good things and none of the blame
for bad things.

It's almost never not true.

----------------------------



O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"




"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
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Thu Jul-05-18 04:56 PM

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68. "I am entertained"
In response to Reply # 67


  

          

This post was made 2 years ago

The mental gymnastics and plea coppage ensued

and here we are

Allegedly, it was a $4M difference in the Harden negotiations that was an impasse

but they're shelling out money like they printing it for PG and Melo

Allegedly in an attempt to keep Russ

LOL

This shit writes itself

YT boys got a great sense of humor...or irony...or both.

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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cgonz00cc
Member since Aug 01st 2002
32266 posts
Thu Jul-05-18 05:02 PM

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69. "its coming."
In response to Reply # 66


  

          

stretching Melo will be worth $101M off the tax bill alone

WHAT A TIME TO BE ALIVE

  

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Dstl1
Charter member
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Thu Jul-05-18 05:07 PM

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70. "stretching Melo and Singler was coming regardless"
In response to Reply # 69


          

.

...cleaned up my act, made a few violent songs...but, they wack like Glen Rice with New Balance on - Sean Price

  

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cgonz00cc
Member since Aug 01st 2002
32266 posts
Thu Jul-05-18 05:17 PM

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71. "which is another $20M off the tax bill if im not mistaken"
In response to Reply # 70


  

          

WHAT A TIME TO BE ALIVE

  

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Rjcc
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90524 posts
Thu Jul-05-18 06:10 PM

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72. "PISTONS GREAT KYLE SINGLER"
In response to Reply # 70


          


www.engadgethd.com - the other stuff i'm looking at

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71181 posts
Mon Aug-12-19 05:41 PM

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76. "the whole harden thing was so bizarre"
In response to Reply # 66


  

          

they were an inch away from maxing him but supposedly he got pissed because they didn't (offer was like a mil per under the max). they had time to work on a deal but didn't take it (why?). i still feel like we dunno the whole story there. but we do know that avoiding the luxury tax was the reason they dinked around at all--not that we know if it mattered for sure or not though--and then they turned around and paid it for other teams later.

bizarre.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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ThaTruth
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89042 posts
Mon Aug-12-19 03:07 PM

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73. "Does he get props for making the best out of a bad situation? After..."
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getting embarrassed by Portland in the first round you know he was dying for a way to reboot that shit.

He couldn't trade Russ first because the fans and everybody else would've let him have it. He probably pissed his pants when the PG "trade request" came up. That's exactly what he needed. He knew at that point Russ would be be ready to go and the fans would understand. Yeah its still kind of a bad look to have drafted 3 of the last 6 league MVP's and not have shit to show for it, but he got an assload of picks back for both of those guys even though he did end up getting stuck with CP3 and his contract he might have to spend so money to buy him and and it won't be cheap you know CP3 wants ALL of his money.

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71181 posts
Mon Aug-12-19 05:38 PM

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75. "credit? dunno. but in the end this disaster was good for his job securit..."
In response to Reply # 73


  

          

trade two stars for a huge grab bag of draft picks, pray to trade another one for a pick or two (questionable but maybe if he bounces back after some more money comes off his deal) and then be like LET ME SEE THIS REBUILD THROUGH. this could be the longest rebuild ever.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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ThaTruth
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89042 posts
Tue Aug-13-19 09:31 AM

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78. "I never said anything about "credit", the Clippers, PG and Kawhi bailed...."
In response to Reply # 75


  

          

Presti out big time with this move, if anything Presti just got lucky as hell.

After getting embarrassed in the first round from the end of the season and through almost the first full week of free agency it looked like almost every other team in the west had gotten better.

It would be a bad look at that point to try to trade PG or Russ but if THEY asked for a trade he was more than happy to oblige them and was probably clicking his heels why he was doing it.

Its just funny how certain media types try to put it all on the players saying they have "too much power" and try to paint George as a bad guy. Presti didn't have to make that deal, he was begging to. What was PG going to do? Hold out a year after he had signed a deal as an unrestricted free agent and professed his love for Russ and OKC?

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71181 posts
Tue Aug-13-19 05:38 PM

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82. "props, credit, interchangeable to me."
In response to Reply # 78


  

          

i don't see any reason to chastise george, the players should have the power because they are what make the league. i thought what kerr said was bullshit and my reaction to it was kind of in step with what you're saying here. would presti have preferred to get a big ass haul of picks, a good young point guard and a tradeable contract (or at least cap relief) for PG or *fucking nothing at all* when his contract expired?

i don't know if presti deserves props or not but i think we agree that fortune kind of smiled on him, in a relative way at least. they weren't winning anything with this group and sooner or later george was going to bounce on him. the fans also would rather see a semi-contender than a shit team so they'd have turned on him for shopping one star or both. he also managed to get rid of russ's godawful contract, even though theoretically his playing it out would have been fine. he gets a couple picks here for maybe the only equivalently bad contract in the league.

but does he deserve props? i dunno, seems mostly circumstantial. if he can manage to foist CP3's contract onto someone and get even OK return--just a straight salary dump or a shitty but shorter contract and a pick--then i'll say he deserves props.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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Ryan M
Member since Oct 21st 2002
40129 posts
Mon Aug-12-19 08:24 PM

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77. "Sets them up well for sure. "
In response to Reply # 73


  

          

But still drafting 3 straight MVPs, having them play TOGETHER, and only getting one finals appearance out of it is an L no matter what.

------------------------------
'19-'20 LA Lakers

James. Davis. Kuzma. Howard. Rondo. Caldwell-Pope. Green. Cook. Bradley. McGee. Dudley. Caruso...

  

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52595 posts
Tue Aug-13-19 12:19 PM

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79. "Jesus H. Christ. The copping sounds about white. "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


This man had THREE LEAGUE MVPs and ANOTHER TOP 3 MVP finalist
and is being coddled because of what he MIGHT do with the draft picks in 3014

This is why everything sucks and nobody who doesn't look a
certain way can't get a fucking job.

Meanwhile, Rich Paul EARNS it, and has the universe
conspire against him

And YES -- they are related




----------------------------



O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"




"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "

  

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ThaTruth
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89042 posts
Tue Aug-13-19 01:51 PM

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80. "its really nothing new, look at Daryl Morey who was hailed as a genius....."
In response to Reply # 79


  

          

by many people in here for his "analytics" and he basically threw all that of the window and traded for Russ lol.

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71181 posts
Tue Aug-13-19 04:56 PM

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81. "only if the same people are dumping on Paul"
In response to Reply # 79
Tue Aug-13-19 04:57 PM by ConcreteCharlie

  

          

The NCAA decided to crack the whip on them and between Paul's own excoriation of their fuckery and an almost unanimous verdict in the court of public opinion, it's the NCAA that's looking like dog shit now.

Presti has done a decent job and it's more the OKC ownership that has been manic and unable to maintain a winning culture despite having the talent to win.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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theeraser
Member since Feb 11th 2007
7197 posts
Mon Aug-19-19 12:14 PM

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83. "100. And he never put the right pieces around KD and Russ."
In response to Reply # 79


          

  

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