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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
20939 posts
Sat Oct-05-13 04:14 PM

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"The Chicago Bulls 2013-2014 Regular Season Post: Grand Finale"


  

          

It all starts tonight...Pacers.

Rose looks/feels good. Jimmy gonna plug in the SG spot. Dunleavy to help our 3's. Noah's a little banged up (won't play tonight) but otherwise, we are healthy during camp so far. This is prolly the last run for this core group as next summer we are prolly gonna have 2 new starters. And yes, in my mind, it's CHAMPIONSHIP or BUST!

And if we don't win, it will land squarely on Rose's shoulders. We are good enough. I think we are a top 4 team as I only see SA, OKC and Miami on the same plane. I'm not fully sold on the Pacers yet though I respect them as a threat. The Clippers haven't even made the WCF prior and Brooklyn has yet to play a game together. Barring a major injury to a key guy, we should be right there fighting at the end.

We are good enough to win.

With that said, the first month of the season is kinda brutal:

at Heat
vs Knicks
at Sixers
at Pacers
vs Jazz
vs Cavs (aaaawww YEAH! KyKy vs Rose for the first time EVAH!!!)
at Raps
vs Pacers
vs Bobcats
at Nuggets (starts the circus trip)
at Blazers
at Clippers
at Jazz
at Pistons
at Cavs (aaaaawww YEAH! KyKy vs Rose round II!)

And December is a lil easier but not much with games against the Heat, Nets (xmas day), Thunder, Rockets, Grizz. Plus we got the Cavs (ROUND III), Knicks and Pistons again. 10+ wins and that first month is a W in my book. January and February lighten things up a bit so if we are in a division fight, that'll be the time to make a run because March is BRUTAL.

vs Knicks
at Nets
at Pistons
vs Grizz
vs Heat
vs Spurs
vs Rockets
vs Kings
vs Thunder (damn at this home stand!)
at Sixers
at Pacers
vs Sixers
vs Pacers (will be important for the division race prolly)
vs Blazers
at Celtics
vs Celtics

April is really soft so if we need some games due to March, that's where we'll need to cash out.

Should be fun. I'm ready. LET'S GOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

____________

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
#allredeverything
Oct 05th 2013
1
I liked the pick up too
Oct 06th 2013
4
RE: I liked the pick up too
Oct 07th 2013
9
      Spurs
Oct 07th 2013
14
           Interesting
Oct 07th 2013
16
he'll be blamed soon enough.
Oct 07th 2013
10
Bulls Bitch...!
Oct 05th 2013
2
THE FUCKING RETURN BITCH!!!!
Oct 05th 2013
3
Thoughts on last night's game:
Oct 06th 2013
5
I agree w/ this.
Oct 06th 2013
6
First Of All, FUCK THE BULLS...LOL
Oct 06th 2013
7
      Snell is going to be a problem.
Oct 07th 2013
12
Memphis tonight
Oct 07th 2013
8
Joakim Noah: The one-man zone
Oct 07th 2013
11
RE: Joakim Noah: The one-man zone
Oct 07th 2013
13
rose and jimmy are the most athletic backcourt in the league
Oct 07th 2013
15
gerald wallace agrees.
Oct 07th 2013
17
y'll are actin so stupid over some damn jimmy butler
Oct 07th 2013
18
so you're not going to disagree with my main point. noted
Oct 07th 2013
19
RE: so you're not going to disagree with my main point. noted
Oct 07th 2013
20
to tyrus...to ben...to taj...to rip...to marco. EVERY YEAR...a new cyse....
Oct 07th 2013
22
      RE: to tyrus...to ben...to taj...to rip...to marco. EVERY YEAR...a new c...
Oct 07th 2013
23
           BEN WALLACE, NIGGA!!! YOU NIGGAS TALKED TITLE WHEN HE SIGNED!
Oct 07th 2013
24
           RE: BEN WALLACE, NIGGA!!! YOU NIGGAS TALKED TITLE WHEN HE SIGNED!
Oct 07th 2013
25
                i remember what happened
Oct 07th 2013
26
                     RE: i remember what happened
Oct 07th 2013
28
                     I remember
Oct 08th 2013
32
           He said, most athletic backcourt in the league. He said it.
Oct 08th 2013
33
Jimmy Butler's Hollywood story is just beginning (SB Nation Swipe)
Oct 07th 2013
21
talked about it
Oct 07th 2013
27
Oh word?
Oct 08th 2013
31
      what's so outlandish abt that?
Oct 08th 2013
41
           2 things make it outlandish:
Oct 08th 2013
47
                i'm talking abt the "most athletic" comment, not the "dominating"
Oct 08th 2013
49
                     RE: i'm talking abt the "most athletic" comment, not the "dominating"
Oct 08th 2013
52
                          Which is weird, because we're talking about the Most Athletic Backcourt
Oct 08th 2013
66
                               you laughed it off tho.
Oct 08th 2013
68
Man auragin, you were right. Nov is tight.
Oct 07th 2013
29
And March looks worse....ugh
Oct 08th 2013
39
booz is in tremendous shape.
Oct 08th 2013
30
yeah he looks fantastic.
Oct 08th 2013
36
Rose, Boozer on the pick 'n roll.
Oct 08th 2013
37
He looked real good last night
Oct 08th 2013
42
Let Teague get some run before Hinrich hurts himself in pre-season.
Oct 08th 2013
34
he's getting tick this yr.
Oct 08th 2013
38
      no, he ain't. hinrich and mike james gettin that backup work
Oct 08th 2013
43
      you think so?
Oct 08th 2013
44
      Lol @ Mike James
Oct 08th 2013
46
           i don't see what's funny.
Oct 08th 2013
62
                Cuz he's been low-key horrible for years now.
Oct 08th 2013
69
      RE: he's getting tick this yr.
Oct 08th 2013
51
           agreed here.
Oct 08th 2013
57
                they're rotating 8 guys.
Oct 08th 2013
58
derrick is putting work in on defense
Oct 08th 2013
35
Let's hope that's his standard...I love it
Oct 08th 2013
40
      no lift on his jumper.
Oct 08th 2013
56
i should be rooting hard for this team, but y'all so hateful
Oct 08th 2013
45
lolz... i'm saying, dogg...
Oct 08th 2013
48
"Sorry Dahntay, we only have enough film for one more shot."
Oct 08th 2013
50
His contract not guaranteed.
Oct 08th 2013
55
      That's what makes it funny, cuz you know he wanted in.
Oct 08th 2013
64
      LMAO!!!
Oct 08th 2013
65
      Thanks A.B. for jinxing my dude ***swipe***
Oct 08th 2013
70
           lol. damn.
Oct 08th 2013
71
You got a prollem with TWO Bulls fans
Oct 08th 2013
54
      RE: You got a prollem with TWO Bulls fans
Oct 08th 2013
59
      RE: You got a prollem with TWO Bulls fans
Oct 08th 2013
60
      actually, you know who the most unreasonable dude has been?
Oct 08th 2013
61
           RE: actually, you know who the most unreasonable dude has been?
Oct 08th 2013
63
                don't wanna interrupt this fencing match, but ima make this point
Nov 04th 2013
114
RE: The Chicago Bulls 2013-2014 Regular Season Post: Grand Finale
Oct 08th 2013
53
RE: The Chicago Bulls 2013-2014 Regular Season Post: Grand Finale
Oct 08th 2013
67
      RE: The Chicago Bulls 2013-2014 Regular Season Post: Grand Finale
Oct 08th 2013
72
Utah interested in Teague.
Oct 12th 2013
73
if they get bedroom slippers and a lawn mower for him, it's a swindle
Oct 13th 2013
74
      http://beta.thescore.com/nba/news/321948
Oct 15th 2013
75
           he's an awful player.
Oct 15th 2013
77
I'm just saying I'm here
Oct 15th 2013
76
safe to say Derrick lost zero creativity around the hoop
Oct 16th 2013
78
I wanna see him 15 games in
Oct 17th 2013
82
RE: safe to say Derrick lost zero creativity around the hoop
Oct 17th 2013
84
      i assume he'll calm down eventually
Oct 17th 2013
88
I keep telling cats, Snell is a problem...
Oct 16th 2013
79
They drafted him to be Deng 2.0
Oct 17th 2013
80
he makes 10,000,000 less than Deng. That's enough for me
Oct 17th 2013
81
RE: They drafted him to be Deng 2.0
Oct 17th 2013
85
He has all the tools, but I would temper expectations.
Oct 17th 2013
83
      irony
Oct 17th 2013
86
      yeah, i don't know why ppl are pushing this "deng pt 2" angle.
Oct 17th 2013
87
RE: The Chicago Bulls 2013-2014 Regular Season Post: Grand Finale
Oct 18th 2013
89
Was he healthy on Wednesday?
Oct 18th 2013
90
Deng Concerned About Injuries (swipe)
Oct 21st 2013
91
rose's final preseason stats :
Oct 27th 2013
92
just want to go on record and say that we're still missing a piece...
Oct 28th 2013
93
i worry about this too
Oct 28th 2013
94
RE: i worry about this too
Oct 28th 2013
95
miami don't have a center or PF worth a damn....
Oct 28th 2013
97
      booz usually has issues with bosh's length
Oct 28th 2013
98
Breaking down the Chicago Bulls offense.
Oct 28th 2013
96
I don't like the signing of Mike James over a big
Oct 28th 2013
99
Man, that 2Q hurt us.
Oct 29th 2013
100
until we get another player that can create a shot/penetrate
Oct 30th 2013
101
this is fair...you basically saying what i been saying
Oct 30th 2013
102
I disagree.
Oct 30th 2013
103
RE: I disagree.
Oct 30th 2013
109
Me, you and Random been saying he has to be smarter since
Oct 30th 2013
106
oh, hey, look, derrick rose didn't make a difference at all
Oct 30th 2013
104
Hey look, it's the first game out of 82, STFU :-)
Oct 30th 2013
105
You don't have a "spark" from your bench anymore
Oct 30th 2013
107
They weren't going to keep Hinrich and Nate.
Oct 30th 2013
108
Failed in avoiding the score all day Saturday.
Nov 03rd 2013
110
More Teague Please!
Nov 03rd 2013
111
Nov 03rd 2013
112
Re: The Sixers Game
Nov 04th 2013
113
RE: Re: The Sixers Game
Nov 04th 2013
115
What about Evan Turner next summer?
Nov 10th 2013
116
our issues partially stem from the doubles & traps rose has been...
Nov 11th 2013
117
RE: our issues partially stem from the doubles & traps rose ...
Nov 11th 2013
118
shots fired fo sho
Nov 11th 2013
119
lol they gonna terminate thibs ass, he needs to chill.
Nov 11th 2013
120
      nah. he need's talk about it. n/m
Nov 11th 2013
121
most stars see doubles...that's a mega cyse
Nov 11th 2013
122
      of course. but i'm speaking about the beginning of this season
Nov 11th 2013
123
Jimmy out 2-3 weeks w/ turf toe
Nov 20th 2013
124
Damn...he was playing well too
Nov 20th 2013
125
this team and nagging injuries is an issue
Nov 20th 2013
126
Yet he played in the 4th.
Nov 20th 2013
127
RE: Yet he played in the 4th.
Nov 21st 2013
131
I expect Snell will get some tick
Nov 20th 2013
128
      slimmer charles
Nov 20th 2013
129
      Slim-Grim Reaper
Nov 20th 2013
130
      Pusha three
Nov 27th 2013
140
Do you have faith this FO can orchestrate this?
Nov 25th 2013
132
I don't
Nov 25th 2013
133
RE: I don't
Nov 25th 2013
134
I think the real question is, can this team miss the playoffs?
Nov 26th 2013
135
doubtful the vets are putting up with thibs for six more months...
Nov 26th 2013
136
Everything I'm reading says it's Thibs/Players vs. FO
Nov 26th 2013
137
Hence my orig. question:
Nov 26th 2013
138
I don't ..I have a feeling we gonna end up w some damn smello
Nov 27th 2013
139
if waiters for deng is really on the table we would be dumb not to do it
Nov 30th 2013
141
My Knick hate...
Dec 01st 2013
142
I agree...A LOT though I'd at least want to swap picks
Dec 01st 2013
143
      I was always indifferent when it came to Melo
Dec 01st 2013
144
           Basically and I wouldn't even start Dion
Dec 01st 2013
145
Bulls Assign Teague To D-League (swipe)
Dec 03rd 2013
146
RE: Bulls Assign Teague To D-League (swipe)
Dec 03rd 2013
147
      Bulls' Teague down and up in same day (swipe)
Dec 03rd 2013
148
      maybe clearing space for the blockbuster trade...
Dec 04th 2013
149
           lol
Dec 04th 2013
150
welp.
Dec 20th 2013
151
I'm not mad at all right now.
Dec 20th 2013
152
RE: I'm not mad at all right now.
Dec 20th 2013
153
this isn't going to happen btw.
Dec 20th 2013
154
I said in a perfect world Dula lol
Dec 20th 2013
155
      nigga, in a perfect world i'm the meat in a cassie / rihanna sammich.
Dec 20th 2013
156
           No chance?
Dec 20th 2013
160
                not happening, breh.
Dec 21st 2013
163
do we not just wait until that pick is unprotected in 2016?
Dec 20th 2013
157
      they don't get to choose.
Dec 20th 2013
158
           Thanks for clearing that up.
Dec 20th 2013
159
RE: welp.
Dec 20th 2013
161
      Whatever happens.....
Dec 22nd 2013
164
yup, tis the season to catch up on your regular season blackhawks.
Dec 21st 2013
162
ppl can be so fucking silly.
Jan 20th 2014
165
RE: ppl can be so fucking silly.
Jan 20th 2014
167
Snell & Kawhi are trying to bring back the Cornrows
Jan 20th 2014
166
DJ Augustine: 27, 27, 19, 16, 19
Jan 22nd 2014
168
Easily our long term back up. They can lose Kirk IMO
Jan 22nd 2014
169
booz for eric gordon?
Jan 23rd 2014
170
      Wouldn't Gordon's extra year..
Jan 24th 2014
173
           i guess it depends
Jan 24th 2014
174
tony snell's mom tho.
Jan 24th 2014
171
Tony replaced Malice as the other member of The Clipse
Jan 24th 2014
172
She also said Tony was a virgin in another interview
Jan 24th 2014
175
He should be the #1 Target for the Bulls this offseason.
Jan 26th 2014
176
Like I said to dula..
Jan 26th 2014
177
RE: Like I said to dula..
Jan 27th 2014
179
      RE: Like I said to dula..
Jan 27th 2014
181
           RE: Like I said to dula..
Jan 27th 2014
183
                that's not how it works.
Jan 29th 2014
184
                     Just took a look at the rules and yeah, you're right
Jan 29th 2014
186
                          as it stands, they'll have a little under 12M available
Jan 29th 2014
189
RE: He should be the #1 Target for the Bulls this offseason.
Jan 26th 2014
178
      Healthy Rose puts us top 3 in the league easy
Jan 27th 2014
180
      did you not see the playoffs last year?
Jan 27th 2014
182
           RE: did you not see the playoffs last year?
Jan 29th 2014
188
Melo for Boozer via the God Doug Thonus
Jan 29th 2014
185
I literally just detailed this lol
Jan 29th 2014
187
      man, that ain't happening. lolz.
Jan 29th 2014
190
           Dula you be killing my dreams left and right
Jan 30th 2014
191
paxson on waddle and silvy :
Feb 04th 2014
192
Melo for Deng, Gibson, Boozer & Mirotic.
Feb 04th 2014
193
RE: Melo for Deng, Gibson, Boozer & Mirotic.
Feb 04th 2014
194
kelly scaletta is probably my favorite bulls writer right now.
Feb 04th 2014
195
This is kinda exaggerated though
Feb 05th 2014
196
this melo plan just doesn't feel like a realistic option to me.
Feb 07th 2014
197
smallish market mentality and blue-collarism
Feb 07th 2014
198
I like this plan.
Feb 08th 2014
199
Here's my thing...
Feb 09th 2014
200
      you're wrong on stephenson.
Feb 09th 2014
201
           ESPN had it wrong then (which your article alludes to)
Feb 09th 2014
202
                indy ain't paying the lux tax, bro.
Feb 09th 2014
203
                     I just don't see them letting Lance walk for nothing
Feb 09th 2014
204
Signs pointing to Nikola Mirotic joining Bulls this offseason
Feb 12th 2014
205
Whoops.
Feb 13th 2014
208
      yeah, i'm with you.
Feb 13th 2014
209
      I think I'm gonna chill on this topic until the summer but
Feb 15th 2014
215
Feb 12th 2014
206
Signs pointing to Nikola Mirotic joining Bulls this offseason (swipe)
Feb 13th 2014
207
lolz.
Feb 13th 2014
210
Mirotic will decide on future soon, may be costly for Chicago (swipe)
Feb 13th 2014
211
Mid-Season Thoughts?
Feb 14th 2014
212
Halftime (c) NaS
Feb 14th 2014
213
      This also bothers me..
Feb 14th 2014
214
i hope bulls fans aren't getting too caught up in this melo/lance stuff
Feb 22nd 2014
216
RE: i hope bulls fans aren't getting too caught up in this melo/lance st...
Feb 22nd 2014
217
That wouldn't be a 'great' offseason. It would be a 'good' offseason.
Feb 23rd 2014
218
Feb 25th 2014
220
      Dula, but will any of that win a title next year? Year after? 3yrs out?
Feb 25th 2014
221
           fine, have it your way.
Feb 25th 2014
222
                Ok, apparently I'm pissing in your corn flakes so my bad
Feb 26th 2014
223
                     nah it's good, just saying don't put all yr eggs in the fagency basket,
Feb 26th 2014
224
                          I think we're on the same page
Feb 26th 2014
225
                               see...
Feb 26th 2014
226
                                    Dula, you killing me fam lol
Feb 26th 2014
227
                                         ok...
Feb 26th 2014
228
                                              lmao...I'm tapping out
Feb 26th 2014
229
                                                   lol... go watch the game
Feb 26th 2014
230
I don't want to get locked in a quick fix.
Feb 23rd 2014
219
we have been bawlin
Feb 26th 2014
231
Ben coming back?
Feb 27th 2014
232
Ha. Gordon & DJ in the same back court?
Feb 27th 2014
233
true, but thibs can't be happy about being last in the league in ppg
Feb 27th 2014
234
I'd prefer Jimmer
Feb 27th 2014
235
      Looks like you will get your wish...
Feb 28th 2014
238
           NOPE! JR CHEAP!
Feb 28th 2014
240
                i'm surprised
Feb 28th 2014
241
the new three headed monster.
Feb 28th 2014
236
I hope thibs has a Pop like run with us. No matter who's on the
Feb 28th 2014
237
      thibs isn't going anywhere.
Feb 28th 2014
239
great hinrich breakdown in sam smith's mailbag today...
Feb 28th 2014
242
Damn.....Taj pounded Dirk's coochie all game long
Feb 28th 2014
243
That was crazy to see, not used to seeing Dirk get hoed like that
Feb 28th 2014
244
The One Free Agent the Chicago Bulls Must Land This Offseason
Mar 02nd 2014
245
Melo @ 15 starting, if not, Lance @ 9-9.5 works
Mar 03rd 2014
246
      Just curious.
Mar 03rd 2014
248
           Lance is a bit of a hot head and he's at that "gotta get mine"
Mar 03rd 2014
249
           he's not.
Mar 03rd 2014
250
                I'm not beating a drum...I'm dreaming lol
Mar 03rd 2014
251
                     DOOOOONT WAAAAKE MEEEEEE
Mar 03rd 2014
252
Jo Noah DEMANDS excellence in ALL PARTS OF THE GAME!
Mar 03rd 2014
247
lol, jimmer's shooting chart is crazy.
Mar 03rd 2014
253
i'm turnt up like fuck for this march sked.
Mar 03rd 2014
254
dude we are in 3rd place this is crazy lol
Mar 04th 2014
255
New Scuttlebutt: Noah recruiting Melo
Mar 06th 2014
256
Nikola Mirotic 2013 Scouting Video (14 min., via DraftExpress)
Mar 06th 2014
257
I just hope Derrick's knee's hold up
Mar 06th 2014
258
Tear Down To Build Up With Carmelo? Shaky Strategy For Him, Suitors
Mar 07th 2014
259
15-16 mil per...I been saying it and it's the only way it happens
Mar 07th 2014
261
Another piece: How much less is Melo willing to take to leave New York?
Mar 07th 2014
262
      Ha. Consider me late in reading your swipe.
Mar 10th 2014
264
Noah is playing tonight vs. Memphis.
Mar 07th 2014
260
From Berger: Mirotic looking for a deal in the $3-4 million range (swipe...
Mar 10th 2014
263
weren't we expecting that 3/4 mil a year?
Mar 10th 2014
265
      I thought it was between 7-10 million range.
Mar 10th 2014
266
           thats what the Nick Friedell's of the world had it at
Mar 10th 2014
267
                Right?
Mar 10th 2014
268
Westbrook sitting out last 2 games...
Mar 16th 2014
269
Is there anyway Noah can be considered for MVP?
Mar 17th 2014
270
Realistically he should be in the mix
Mar 17th 2014
271
agreed. He won't win, but he'll get votes.
Mar 17th 2014
272
he, griffin and george will finish 3-5 in some order.
Mar 17th 2014
273
Mitch Lawrence typing things...
Mar 22nd 2014
274
The Phil Jackson stories ran out already?
Mar 22nd 2014
275
Rose begins non-contact drills, remains out for season (swipe)
Mar 27th 2014
276
Is Ronnie Brewer really better than Tony Snell?
Apr 08th 2014
277
i don't know that it makes much difference who those 5 minutes go to.
Apr 08th 2014
278

dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
21925 posts
Sat Oct-05-13 04:34 PM

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1. "#allredeverything"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

the dunleavy pickup was really underplayed in the natl hoops media imo. he was fantastic in milwaukee last yr. really like that signing, mike's a cerebral, versatile player and a serious minded professional who'll fit in really well w this group.

that's a guy who can def be an important contributor on a champion, he's just had some bad fortune landing on shitty teams for most of his career.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
20939 posts
Sun Oct-06-13 10:50 AM

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4. "I liked the pick up too"
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

he might not be as versatile as Belinelli was but he'll be a better rebounder and shooter.

I just hope he's healthy all season as we are gonna need his shooting.

____________

  

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Numba_33
Charter member
19335 posts
Mon Oct-07-13 11:15 AM

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9. "RE: I liked the pick up too"
In response to Reply # 4


  

          

>he might not be as versatile as Belinelli


Hol up, so both Belinelli and Nate Robinson are gone? Where did Belinelli end up?

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
20939 posts
Mon Oct-07-13 01:56 PM

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14. "Spurs"
In response to Reply # 9


  

          

____________

  

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Numba_33
Charter member
19335 posts
Mon Oct-07-13 02:14 PM

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16. "Interesting"
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

Did Belinelli leave because the Spurs had more money or did Thibs or who ever makes the personnel decisions for Chicago not want him anymore? Or did Belinelli want to bounce on his own accord? While he isn't automatic, dude can get streaky and provide some decent outside shooting to space things out for Chicago, at least from the limited games I saw him play.

  

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts
Mon Oct-07-13 11:27 AM

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10. "he'll be blamed soon enough. "
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Sat Oct-05-13 04:46 PM

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2. "Bulls Bitch...!"
In response to Reply # 0


          



I'm still in Bears mode......But I will def. be watching some of that preseason game...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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select_from_where
Member since Jan 03rd 2011
4342 posts
Sat Oct-05-13 05:42 PM

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3. "THE FUCKING RETURN BITCH!!!!"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I'm talking shit all night

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
20939 posts
Sun Oct-06-13 11:01 AM

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5. "Thoughts on last night's game:"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

-DRose looked GOOD; explosion there (no issue with the springs), speed there (he was the fastest dude on the court by far) and he LOOKS stronger. He was playing too fast though...you could tell he was extra excited about being back. Once the game slows down for him again, it'll be as it was. He didn't take many jumpers though so I'm interested in how his J looks as it's supposed to be improved.

Also I'm hoping last night was all about anxiety to finally play in a real game because he can't go 150rpm's into the lane like that all season. Being hurt should have taught him 3 things: he can't take all the punishment carrying the team, he needs to let the team carry him via distribution more often and his jumper needs to get better.

-Deng looked good, Jimmy looked good, Taj played to his contract (let's see if he keeps it up all season...would be HUGE for us). Booz looked like he was in shape and healthy. Teague looked more comfortable though he didn't play much. Kirk's activity on the boards was surprising. He looked healthy too.

-Dunny's energy looked great. He has to get comfortable with the defensive scheme's though. But his activity and rebounding was good.

-The rookies looked like come January they might be ready for consistent short run minutes (10-12 a night). Snell looked better but Murphy could be a definite stretch big for us. Once Snell adjusts to the league, he'll be a great reserve for us.

-The defense looks VERY good. Will definitely help us to start the season.

And we won on the road...not bad at all.

____________

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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Sun Oct-06-13 11:23 AM

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6. "I agree w/ this."
In response to Reply # 5


  

          

Taj played to his
>contract (let's see if he keeps it up all season...would be
>HUGE for us).

More than Butler, he's the player I want to see step up for us.
More so because I don't believe our front court can stay healthy (him included).
So if Boozer/Noah go down it's going to be him down low.

https://digife.com

  

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RexLongfellow
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Sun Oct-06-13 11:54 AM

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7. "First Of All, FUCK THE BULLS...LOL"
In response to Reply # 5


  

          

Had to get that in there...lol
But from what I saw
>-DRose looked GOOD; explosion there (no issue with the
>springs), speed there (he was the fastest dude on the court by
>far) and he LOOKS stronger. He was playing too fast
>though...you could tell he was extra excited about being back.
> Once the game slows down for him again, it'll be as it was.
>He didn't take many jumpers though so I'm interested in how
>his J looks as it's supposed to be improved.
I agree...he looked fast as hell. It looked like he was playing way faster than he should, or that his body was going faster than his mind. Had a couple of uncharacteristic TO's, but that's more rust. It was good to see him out there, and I was surprised at how easy he got to the rim, especially against a Pacer defense (albeit preseason)
I gotta see how the jumper looks, but it does look like he's trusting the knee, which is the most important hurdle.

>Also I'm hoping last night was all about anxiety to finally
>play in a real game because he can't go 150rpm's into the lane
>like that all season. Being hurt should have taught him 3
>things: he can't take all the punishment carrying the team, he
>needs to let the team carry him via distribution more often
>and his jumper needs to get better.
Agree completely. However, I did see him take some contact going towards the rim and in my opinion he NEEDS that right now because he'll trust the knee and his body more and more. The more he gets hit now and realizes that his body (esp. his knee) will be fine, the better off he'll be mentally.

>-Deng looked good, Jimmy looked good, Taj played to his
>contract (let's see if he keeps it up all season...would be
>HUGE for us). Booz looked like he was in shape and healthy.
>Teague looked more comfortable though he didn't play much.
>Kirk's activity on the boards was surprising. He looked
>healthy too.
Jimmy and Hinrich are the key. Those are the guys that have to contribute in a lot of ways to take the pressure off Rose. Hinrich with running the team, and Jimmy just getting better overall.

>-Dunny's energy looked great. He has to get comfortable with
>the defensive scheme's though. But his activity and
>rebounding was good.
His rebounding is overrated. You don't want to depend on him rebounding on a nightly basis. You got Noah, Booz, Deng, and Taj...let Dunleavy do what he does best and spread the floor with his shooting.

>-The rookies looked like come January they might be ready for
>consistent short run minutes (10-12 a night). Snell looked
>better but Murphy could be a definite stretch big for us.
>Once Snell adjusts to the league, he'll be a great reserve for
>us.
Snell looked solid. Again, first game ever, so we'll see how they develop

>-The defense looks VERY good. Will definitely help us to
>start the season.
>
>And we won on the road...not bad at all.
It's definitely a good start. Another thing you might want to worry about is Thibs learning to coach for the long term. He can't put the pedal to the metal on his players every game and burn them out. Watch for his rotations

  

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select_from_where
Member since Jan 03rd 2011
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Mon Oct-07-13 01:23 PM

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12. "Snell is going to be a problem. "
In response to Reply # 7


  

          

Very similar to Deng. he has the same frame, with way better handles. Dudes 3 pointer looks like str8 water.

At one point, I think I saw him jump up to yam it on Hibbert but changed his mind and passes once he saw the weak-side open. .

Lou gonna be gone anyway after this year. GarPax had a hell of a pickup.

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Mon Oct-07-13 10:19 AM

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8. "Memphis tonight"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Should be fun. Hopefully Noah is feeling better and we can see the team at full strength.

____________

  

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
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Mon Oct-07-13 11:56 AM

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11. "Joakim Noah: The one-man zone"
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By Mike Prada - @MikePradaSBN on Oct 7 2013, 9:23a

The fundamentals of Tom Thibodeau's famed strong-side zone defense haven't changed much since his days as an assistant coach for the Boston Celtics. There might be less trapping and more soft coverage on the pick and roll, but otherwise, it's still about sending an extra defender to the side of the floor with the ball and positioning the other three defenders to take away the simple passes.

Joakim Noah's importance in that system, on the other hand? That has changed for the better.

Noah was always a good defender, of course, but the Bulls' system used to live on fine without him. Some of this is because of Noah's replacements; Omer Asik could replicate a lot of the same responsibilities, and Taj Gibson was healthy and effective in ways he wasn't last season. But some of this was also because of Noah's own development. Perfectly molding his whirling dervish of a motor with an understanding of the system's principles has taken some time.

But we saw the optimal balance with Noah last year. There was still a lot of the same activity that we have seen for several years that has become the foundation of his success. Noah is still sleek enough to stay with perimeter threats on switches, like he does here with Dwyane Wade.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uu5OEXU0hpc

And he's still agile enough to close out on all sorts of players. A center should not be able to do this to Greivis Vasquez, especially in a late-game, don't-foul situation.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1YM2KDioEaE

Nor should they be able to cut off a guard like Dion Waiters in a late-game situation.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ppHo2l7qXd4

But Noah's improved defensive intelligence means he doesn't have to do these things as much anymore. Like Marc Gasol, Noah has developed an uncanny ability to both recognize and anticipate plays. He relies as much on positioning as he does on his natural abilities.

This obviously applies for isolations, against which Thibodeau's strong-side zone is most effective. Noah's positioning in this sequence from Game 2 of the Bulls' first-round playoff series win over the Nets could not be better.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VItzSuPCByw

This is a simple rotation in Thibodeau's system, but Noah's execution is pristine. Two things stand out. One, he immediately recognizes the Nets' play, so he doesn't even bother to come out at Lopez as he sets the screen to try to free Joe Johnson.

http://cdn0.sbnation.com/assets/3327363/Screen_Shot_2013-10-02_at_4.11.03_PM_medium.png

Two, he only turns to double-team Johnson when he's sure the man behind him, Carlos Boozer, will pick up his man. In past years, Noah may have doubled too quickly. This time, he waits until the right moment.

http://cdn1.sbnation.com/assets/3327371/Screen_Shot_2013-10-02_at_4.14.33_PM_medium.png

All that contributes to Johnson's air ball.

Noah also has figured out ways to conserve energy when defending pick and rolls. After spending more time hedging and recovering in previous years, Noah now almost exclusively drops back like most centers. Sometimes, he drops back really far, even against dangerous shooters like Kyrie Irving.

http://cdn0.sbnation.com/assets/3327451/Screen_Shot_2013-10-02_at_4.48.30_PM_medium.png

Noah's even further back on LeBron James here.

http://cdn2.sbnation.com/assets/3327507/Screen_Shot_2013-10-02_at_5.05.54_PM_medium.png

That's the kind of coverage you normally see from lumbering giants like Roy Hibbert, but Noah's smart about it. He knows that Irving and LeBron have no interest in pulling up for the jumper on these plays. What's the point of wasting energy to get out higher when they're hoping to drive anyway? Noah understands this and is able to contest both of their wild 10-foot floaters, which miss badly.

But Noah's spider sense has developed beyond his basic responsibilities in Thibodeau's system. He can play the Boozer role in the Johnson screenshots as well as anyone. Notice how he's perfectly positioned to guard two players as the Bulls double-team Klay Thompson here.

http://cdn0.sbnation.com/assets/3327419/Screen_Shot_2013-10-02_at_4.28.54_PM_medium.png

Thompson eventually throws the ball away to Noah trying to find David Lee.

Noah's play recognition off the ball has also dramatically improved, to the point where he might be Gasol's equal. Notice this play from the same Warriors game, where Noah blows up the Warriors' initial play -- a screen-the-screener set that called for Andrew Bogut to come from the opposite side to screen for Stephen Curry -- and their secondary play -- a down screen for Klay Thompson -- by positioning himself directly in the plays' paths before they are executed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qKrCXC5-Y-I

Noah's activity was on full display there, but he also needed to have the intelligence to understand the Warriors' set and triggers. The activity has always been there. The intelligence is what is now fully developed.

The combined package is what makes Noah the Bulls' most essential defender. Luol Deng, Jimmy Butler and Kirk Hinrich are all great and important, but they can't do the things they do without Noah. Noah's ability to be the Bulls' one-man zone allows them to guard their man tighter, making them look even better when their man flings the kind of wild shot that Johnson took in one of the above videos. It's no secret that the Bulls' defense looked positively unThibsian from the moment Noah's plantar fasciitis started becoming a problem in late March (see table)**. They need Noah more than ever.


His impact's no Joakim

TIME PERIOD - BULLS DRTG - DRTG WITH NOAH IN

Before March 18 - 99.6 - 98.4

March 18-end of season - 103.1 - N/A*

Data via NBA.com/stats.


Certainly, the absence of Asik and the lessening frontcourt depth has a lot to do with that. But the more important factor is Noah's own development. With the combination of his intelligence and athleticism, Noah truly is a one-man zone.

***

* Noah did play in three games down the stretch, but only for a total of 49 minutes, so this sample isn't statistically relevant.

** Chicago's defensive rating dipped to 106.8 in the playoffs as Noah hobbled around at much less than 100 percent, which is obviously much worse than 103.1. But playing Miami and the absences of Deng for some games and Hinrich for even more had a lot to do with that.

___

low end crazy, eastside crazy, wild hunnids crazy, englewood crazy.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Oct-07-13 01:54 PM

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13. "RE: Joakim Noah: The one-man zone"
In response to Reply # 11
Mon Oct-07-13 01:54 PM by murph71

          


This is all cool and all...But Thibs needs to cut down Jo's minutes...

He means too much to our team...Damn good coach and a defensive genius....Hopefully Thibs learns how to manage his team in a much more subdued manner...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
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Mon Oct-07-13 02:10 PM

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15. "rose and jimmy are the most athletic backcourt in the league"
In response to Reply # 0
Mon Oct-07-13 02:11 PM by RandomFact

  

          

the tandem has the potential to be dominant on the both ends.

glad to rose driving and drawing contact vs indiana. best to get that out of the way first. i assume his jumper will make an appearance tonight.

taj is bigger, which is good. plus his jumper looked how it needs to look.

and i can watch a youtube highlight vid of jimmy just rebounding. dude is everywhere.




  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Mon Oct-07-13 03:08 PM

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17. "gerald wallace agrees."
In response to Reply # 15


  

          

http://cdn0.sbnation.com/uploads/chorus_image/image/20566875/20130427_jla_ad4_062.0_standard_783.0.jpg

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
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Mon Oct-07-13 03:18 PM

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18. "y'll are actin so stupid over some damn jimmy butler"
In response to Reply # 15


  

          

y'all go through this every year. there's SOME bamma that y'all just gotta cyse against your better judgement.

yeah, i'm in your thread. and?

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
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Mon Oct-07-13 03:33 PM

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19. "so you're not going to disagree with my main point. noted"
In response to Reply # 18


  

          

you're just make lazy comparisons to tyrus.

you've ran out of ammo.


  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Oct-07-13 04:08 PM

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20. "RE: so you're not going to disagree with my main point. noted"
In response to Reply # 19


          


The crazy part is no one is saying the kid is going to be a flat out superstar...

Folks are just saying that playing next to Rose, Butler is going to be a highly effective player that has already shown a nose for the playoffs...

When people bring up say Tyrus Thomas it shows a bit of trolling...Thomas never had a real impact in a playoff setting...Never was the best player on the floor on any given night...

Butler was last year in spurts during the playoffs...

He will have a lot to prove to get to that next level...but it's obvious the talent is there...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
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Mon Oct-07-13 04:24 PM

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22. "to tyrus...to ben...to taj...to rip...to marco. EVERY YEAR...a new cyse...."
In response to Reply # 19


  

          

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Oct-07-13 04:46 PM

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23. "RE: to tyrus...to ben...to taj...to rip...to marco. EVERY YEAR...a new c..."
In response to Reply # 22
Mon Oct-07-13 05:04 PM by murph71

          

I rarely use this word...but you are being pretty dumb here...U r confusing the Bulls front office with the actual fans...

Tyrus? Let's not act like the fans were making dude out to be a all star...That draft pick was laughed at...Most of us wanted L.A. (remember we traded away that pick...)...We knew that kid was a bust that first year...

Ben? Really, dog...Ben Gordon? (and I hope u were not talking about Ben Wallace....)....When has anyone ever cysed Ben Gordon? A 6'2-6-3 SHOOTING GUARD, not named Iverson?...Saying BG was a better option than Keith Bogans is not a cyse...Chill with this strawman bullshit...

Marco?...More dumb shit...He actually played better than anyone ever expected...But no one thought that he would be a savior...

No, this whole thing is about Taj Gibson...U r ready to call him a bust...The jury is still out on that...But let's not bring up all those other players to make some convoluted, agenda driven, silly ass point....The only player out of all those named that has been anything close to being cysed is Taj...

The rest of this shit u should be ashamed of yourself....lol

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts
Mon Oct-07-13 08:36 PM

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24. "BEN WALLACE, NIGGA!!! YOU NIGGAS TALKED TITLE WHEN HE SIGNED!"
In response to Reply # 23


  

          

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Oct-07-13 09:04 PM

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25. "RE: BEN WALLACE, NIGGA!!! YOU NIGGAS TALKED TITLE WHEN HE SIGNED!"
In response to Reply # 24


          


U lying...lol...Damn dog...u losing your touch...Wallace??? That nigga signed with us in 2007...U see a few heads on here talking about Wallace putting us on top...But nobody thought Wallace being on the team equaled a ring...Hell, Rose had yet to even play a game (dude was drafted in 2008 and nobody knew how good he was going to be except the diehards)....

We finally started making it back to the playoffs...And u talking about titles????


LOL...Listen Basa...I know u sick with this agenda right now...But this is amateur hour...

Nigga go...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
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Mon Oct-07-13 09:09 PM

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26. "i remember what happened"
In response to Reply # 25


  

          

if you ain't say it...don't worry it. y'all always do this. pass the buck. bulls fans on this board talked fuckin title when ben wallace signed. it happened.

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Oct-07-13 09:18 PM

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28. "RE: i remember what happened"
In response to Reply # 26


          

>if you ain't say it...don't worry it. y'all always do this.
>pass the buck. bulls fans on this board talked fuckin title
>when ben wallace signed. it happened.


Dog...this is some crazy man shit...U get two or three people on a board talking about a ring after the signing of Wallace (???) and now that's an indictment on all Bulls fans???

Cut this fake straw man bullshit out...

u want to go at Rose? Fine...

U want to body Taj? I dig that....

Hell you can even be a weirdo and shit on a young kid like Jimmy Butler who plays the game the right way...

But this shit? Wallace?

Man go some where with this bullshit...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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TheRealBillyOcean
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Tue Oct-08-13 10:35 AM

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32. "I remember"
In response to Reply # 26


          

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

  

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TheRealBillyOcean
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33. "He said, most athletic backcourt in the league. He said it. "
In response to Reply # 23


          

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Oct-07-13 04:16 PM

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21. "Jimmy Butler's Hollywood story is just beginning (SB Nation Swipe)"
In response to Reply # 18
Mon Oct-07-13 04:17 PM by murph71

          


Or maybe some folks pay attention to the actual stats....Will the kid be a superstar? No one is saying that...Will he prove to be a waaaay better option at SG for the Bulls in more than a decade? Yep...And it starts with the kid's D and his improving jumper (42 percent from 3)...

Agendas aside, it's pretty silly hating on a 23 year old kid who plays the game the right way...But agendas makes sensible folks do some pretty puzzling things...

---



Jimmy Butler's Hollywood story is just beginning

By Ricky O'Donnell  @SBN_Ricky on Oct 7 2013

Jimmy Butler was abandoned by the single mother who raised him when he was 13 years old, left on the streets of Tomball, Texas, to fight for his life. Now, the Bulls guard spends his summers hanging out with movie stars, living the dream of a rising NBA star crowned by many savvy observers as the prototype wing for the modern game.

Butler is the ace up Chicago's sleeve entering his third season, but so much of his incredible tale has yet to be written.

The story of Butler's perseverance through personal turmoil and ascent up the NBA ranks is custom built for Hollywood, but don't expect expect a basketball version of "The Blind Side" to be hitting theaters anytime soon. Butler's made it this far because of his focus and work ethic as much as his natural ability. It's the reason he's become Tom Thibodeau's new favorite player while turning into the developmental boon Chicago needed to realize its dreams of coming out of the Eastern Conference.

Butler hardly played for Thibodeau as a rookie, but was given an opportunity after the Bulls decided against retaining Ronnie Brewer before last season. There was an opening for an athletic, defensive-minded wing on the bench, and Butler quickly proved he could do everything Brewer did and more.

Once Luol Deng suffered a hamstring injury in January, the floor was literally Butler's own. He hardly ever left. There were more moments of triumph than the speed bumps expected from young players, like when Butler flummoxed Kobe Bryant into a 7-for-22 shooting night in late January while his teammates shouted "Kobe Stopper!" as he walked off the court.

It's Butler's versatile brilliance at the defensive end that earned him playing time, but the rest of the season proved to show the Marquette alum could be so much more than a one-way specialist. No one would have ever pegged Butler to finish in the top 10 of individual offensive rating by the end of his second year, yet there he was. If defense is where Butler made his name, it's his offense that may determine how high the Bulls can fly.
More: All of SB Nation's NBA previews to date

Butler showed an incredible knack on the offensive glass, leading all players designated as a guard (per NBA.com's stats page) with a 7.3 offensive rebounding percentage. Memphis' Tony Allen (6.7) was the only other player close. It's good news, because once Butler got the ball near the rim, he was damn hard to stop. Butler took 45 percent of his shots within five feet last season and made 63.2 percent of those attempts. That placed Butler seventh in the NBA among players with at least 220 attempts, joining the likes of Bryant, Deron Williams, Dwyane Wade and Tony Parker.

Butler's finishing ability was a wonderful surprise for Chicago, but it's not nearly as exciting as the progress he showed from the outside. If Butler's late season three-point shooting was no aberration, the Bulls would appear to have stolen an all-around force on the wing with the No. 30 pick in the 2011 draft.

Butler was never thought of as a shooter, making 36 of 90 attempts his last two seasons in college. He attempted 11 threes as a rookie. But as his playing time shot up, so did his confidence from the outside. By March, Butler was hitting threes at a 42 percent clip. In April, he was connecting on an astonishing 56 percent of his attempts from three while taking 2.5 per game.

It all built to a memorable, if ill-fated, playoff run in which Butler personified on the Bulls' unbreakable resolve. He played all 48 minutes in five playoff games, the second-highest number of all-time. He defended LeBron James as tough as the four-time MVP can be defended and showed the type of poise few 23-year-olds could ever hope to display.

Now Thibodeau has named Butler his starter at shooting guard heading into the new season, where he'll team with superstar Derrick Rose. Butler's size, defensive prowess and ability to finish on cuts would seem to make him an ideal backcourt mate for Rose. It has the Bulls thinking big. The last time the Bulls were fully healthy was 2010-11, when they fell to the Heat in the Eastern Conference Finals in five games. That team did have Omer Asik leading an fantastic bench unit, but also started the offensively-incompetent Keith Bogans at the two.

With Deng's contract status unresolved heading into the season, this year amounts to a last shot for the Bulls with the current group. Minor additions like Mike Dunleavy and Kirk Hinrich have been made along the way, but Butler is Bulls' one real hope.

He's already a stud defensively, and his offense is just getting better. Butler may have a story made for the big screen, but don't write it yet. He's just getting started.

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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bshelly
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Mon Oct-07-13 09:12 PM

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27. "talked about it"
In response to Reply # 18


  

          

----
bshelly

"You (Fisher) could get fired, Les Snead could get fired, Kevin Demoff could get fired, but I will always be Eric Dickerson.†(c) The God

  

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TheRealBillyOcean
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31. "Oh word?"
In response to Reply # 15


          

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Tue Oct-08-13 11:40 AM

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41. "what's so outlandish abt that?"
In response to Reply # 31
Tue Oct-08-13 11:53 AM by dula dibiasi

  

          

"According to Draft Express’s combine database, only 11 first-round picks in NBA history have recorded 3:15 or better in the three-quarter-court sprint while measuring at least a 39 inch vertical. Two of those players are Rose and Butler.

If you want perspective, John Wall scored a 3:14 on the sprint test, just barely better than Butler’s 3:15. Both measured the same 39" vertical. Rose recorded a 3:05 and 40" respectively."

...

and rose has actually gained on his vert post-surgery, he was measured @ 42 this summer.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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TheRealBillyOcean
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47. "2 things make it outlandish:"
In response to Reply # 41


          

1.) My eyes
2.) Those 2 dominating on both ends.

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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49. "i'm talking abt the "most athletic" comment, not the "dominating""
In response to Reply # 47


  

          

http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=8&topic_id=2241127&mesg_id=2241127&page=#2243017

you got all incredulous and shit, like the nigga said dre miller and ledell eackles or something.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Tue Oct-08-13 01:03 PM

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52. "RE: i'm talking abt the "most athletic" comment, not the "dominating""
In response to Reply # 49


          

>http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=8&topic_id=2241127&mesg_id=2241127&page=#2243017
>
>you got all incredulous and shit, like the nigga said dre
>miller and ledell eackles or something.


This is what they do though...A lot of folks have issues turning off their hyperbole alarm....lol

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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TheRealBillyOcean
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66. "Which is weird, because we're talking about the Most Athletic Backcourt"
In response to Reply # 52


          

Yet I'm using hyperbole, because I disagree.

And me disagreeing is being seen as comparing them to "Andre Miller and Ledell Eackles".

Yep that sounds about right.

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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68. "you laughed it off tho. "
In response to Reply # 66


  

          

dismissed it like there's not even a case to be made.

i mean, the tired old "my eyes" rhetoric is fine and dandy, but i gave you numbers that certainly indicate that there's an argument. butler and rose are both among the best athletes at their respective positions.

it might help if you actually named some specific players as counterarguments.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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Mon Oct-07-13 09:45 PM

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29. "Man auragin, you were right. Nov is tight."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I'm looking forward to it but man that first month is killer.

https://digife.com

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Tue Oct-08-13 11:36 AM

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39. "And March looks worse....ugh"
In response to Reply # 29


  

          

____________

  

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
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Tue Oct-08-13 10:22 AM

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30. "booz is in tremendous shape. "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Tue Oct-08-13 11:29 AM

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36. "yeah he looks fantastic."
In response to Reply # 30


  

          

he talked abt wanting to get leaner this offseason since he knew the team was committing to running more. the jumper looks wet too. i think he has a big yr in store.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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37. "Rose, Boozer on the pick 'n roll."
In response to Reply # 30


  

          

https://digife.com

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Tue Oct-08-13 11:43 AM

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42. "He looked real good last night"
In response to Reply # 30


  

          

I like the lineup with him and Taj (when he is playing to contract...so far so good, but it's preseason).

I'm not so much worried about our big rotation if Taj plays his part and Booz plays as well as he did last year.

D-Rose seems to be realizing he doesn't have to do all the work (saw him push the ball ahead to Deng/Jimmy a few times on the break...when in the past he would have 'run fast' that shit up court).

I'm seeing good indicators so far. Booz in good shape, Rose seems to have learned something in his time off. Jimmy being a defensive beast and helping on O. Dunny doing what we paid him for and the rooks look good. Noah comes into the mix and our O gets more fluid (including Rose's J cuz he's shooting about 40% right now and them FT's is ass) and I like our chances.

____________

  

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TheRealBillyOcean
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34. "Let Teague get some run before Hinrich hurts himself in pre-season. "
In response to Reply # 0


          

So when Hinrich hurts himself in the regular season my guy is ready to go.

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Tue Oct-08-13 11:33 AM

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38. " he's getting tick this yr."
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

once the reg season starts, i see snell moving out of the rotation, Kirk getting a lot of the backup sg minutes and teague transitioning into the #2 pg. which will be his job fulltime next yr w hinrich's departure imminent.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
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43. "no, he ain't. hinrich and mike james gettin that backup work"
In response to Reply # 38


  

          

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Tue Oct-08-13 11:52 AM

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44. "you think so? "
In response to Reply # 43


  

          

i think kirk still is the primary backup @ pg but he'll play some backup 2 this yr. there'll be some minutes there for teague.

i don't know that mike even makes the final cut.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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TheRealBillyOcean
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46. "Lol @ Mike James"
In response to Reply # 43


          

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

  

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
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62. "i don't see what's funny. "
In response to Reply # 46


  

          

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

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TheRealBillyOcean
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69. "Cuz he's been low-key horrible for years now."
In response to Reply # 62


          

But I could see Thibs being a dick and playing him over Teague even though Mike doesn't play defense or hit shots.

Then it'd turn from me laughing to being outright furious.

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Tue Oct-08-13 01:01 PM

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51. "RE: he's getting tick this yr."
In response to Reply # 38
Tue Oct-08-13 01:04 PM by murph71

          

>once the reg season starts, i see snell moving out of the
>rotation, Kirk getting a lot of the backup sg minutes and
>teague transitioning into the #2 pg. which will be his job
>fulltime next yr w hinrich's departure imminent.


I don't think Snell is moving out of that rotation...At least later on in the season (And yeah...I know Thibs hates rookies...But.....)

That rookie looks like he's going to be pretty good. His size and shooting ability and more importantly his defensive mindset (that's what Thibs is all about, right?) makes him a perfect dude to play the utility role...I think he's going to play both back-up SG and SF alongside Dunny...I do think Kirk will see some small time at SG, but mainly back-up point because he's now up there in age and injuries...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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57. "agreed here."
In response to Reply # 51


  

          

>I don't think Snell is moving out of that rotation...At least
>later on in the season (And yeah...I know Thibs hates
>rookies...But.....)

I don't expect him to make the regular rotation. He didn't do much in summer league ball (well at least the games I went to), and his pre season thus far has been just as average. I'm willing to chalk it up to the nervousness of being in the NBA. The only saving grace for him is he's played well defensively.

https://digife.com

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Tue Oct-08-13 01:48 PM

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58. "they're rotating 8 guys."
In response to Reply # 57


  

          

naz will get some matchup-based tick against teams w/ size up front. teague will get token minutes @ the 1. other than that, it's the top 8. the rooks won't play much @ all.

kirk, taj and dun can all play multiple positions, and i expect them to get the lion's share of the reserve minutes. they'll all play well over 20 min per. the days of the 5-man hockey-line style bench substitutions is over. play the best guys.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
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Tue Oct-08-13 11:29 AM

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35. "derrick is putting work in on defense"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

never seen him d up this aggressively before.

i would be surprised if any of the other top pg's got off on him this year.

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Tue Oct-08-13 11:39 AM

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40. "Let's hope that's his standard...I love it"
In response to Reply # 35


  

          

His shooting is supsect right now though.

Was kinda happy to see him hit that 3 but I wanna see him take some more jumpers. Right now it looks like he just wants to take contact to solidify that knee.

____________

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
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Tue Oct-08-13 01:39 PM

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56. "no lift on his jumper. "
In response to Reply # 40


  

          

he barely jumped on that three he made last night.

>His shooting is supsect right now though.

after not playing for a year he's playing the more aggressive on d than ever before and he's making it a point to jump into the bodies of very large men on almost every other possession to shake off any fear. my guess is that his legs aren't conditioned yet for playing every aspect of the game at a high level.

>Was kinda happy to see him hit that 3 but I wanna see him take
>some more jumpers. Right now it looks like he just wants to
>take contact to solidify that knee.

yup.

  

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
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Tue Oct-08-13 12:10 PM

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45. "i should be rooting hard for this team, but y'all so hateful"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2013/1007/nba_a_bulls_gb1_576x324.jpg

i really SHOULD be with y'all, but you had to ruin it.

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Tue Oct-08-13 12:33 PM

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48. "lolz... i'm saying, dogg..."
In response to Reply # 45


  

          

i been waiting for you to stop bullshitting and just fully embrace the shit. like, i KNOW this nigga wanna get onboard. th'fuck yo?

bygones, man.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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TheRealBillyOcean
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50. " "Sorry Dahntay, we only have enough film for one more shot.""
In response to Reply # 45


          


"But the camera is digital?"

That's fucked up how they treat Dahntay from NJ.

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Tue Oct-08-13 01:27 PM

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55. "His contract not guaranteed."
In response to Reply # 50


  

          

No need having him in the press kit if he don't make the roster lol

You won't see Dexter Pitman or Mike James either.

____________

  

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TheRealBillyOcean
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Tue Oct-08-13 02:20 PM

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64. "That's what makes it funny, cuz you know he wanted in. "
In response to Reply # 55


          

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

  

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
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Tue Oct-08-13 02:22 PM

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65. "LMAO!!!"
In response to Reply # 64


  

          

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

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TheRealBillyOcean
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70. "Thanks A.B. for jinxing my dude ***swipe***"
In response to Reply # 55


          

http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/bulls-waive-guardforward-dahntay-jones.html

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Tue Oct-08-13 03:26 PM

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71. "lol. damn."
In response to Reply # 70


  

          

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Tue Oct-08-13 01:25 PM

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54. "You got a prollem with TWO Bulls fans"
In response to Reply # 45


  

          

Benedict the Moor or whatever and FromTheGo.

The rest of us just spar with you on some fun stuff.

Outside of that, it's just old feelings man. Gotta let it go. lol

____________

  

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Benedict the Moor
Member since Dec 06th 2011
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Tue Oct-08-13 01:57 PM

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59. "RE: You got a prollem with TWO Bulls fans"
In response to Reply # 54


  

          

So he has a problem w/ me for pointing out the obvious?

For the record, it's purely coincidence that Boozer is both sorry and a Duke alum.

◦◦◦
http://oi40.tinypic.com/2enp550.jpg
http://i.minus.com/iQBdCzZIftHZ2.gif

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Tue Oct-08-13 02:06 PM

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60. "RE: You got a prollem with TWO Bulls fans"
In response to Reply # 54


          

>Benedict the Moor or whatever and FromTheGo.
>
>The rest of us just spar with you on some fun stuff.
>
>Outside of that, it's just old feelings man. Gotta let it go.
>lol


"Just give peace a chance...." (see John L and them....)

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
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Tue Oct-08-13 02:06 PM

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61. "actually, you know who the most unreasonable dude has been?"
In response to Reply # 54


  

          

murph...

dude actually tries to justify how deng and booz have been treated the past few years and will say ANYTHING to defend how rose came up short against miami in 2011. he blamed all that on booz. all of it.

them two dudes you named i don't even take seriously, but murph be tryna be all earnest blaming booz for not being tim duncan. nah, dogg, he give y'all 16 and 9 and that's MARKET VALUE.

if noah could do what hibby does, this wouldn't be an issue, but since booz the ONLY post scoring threat, dudes get anxious and make his every possession life or death and let noah's offensive incompetence slide.

and don't get me started on taj. murph defends that dude on some "we had to pay him because booz wasn't gettin it done."...and watch him come up in here and try to deny he said that DUMB ASS GARBAGE.

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Tue Oct-08-13 02:16 PM

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63. "RE: actually, you know who the most unreasonable dude has been?"
In response to Reply # 61
Tue Oct-08-13 02:50 PM by murph71

          

>murph...
>
>dude actually tries to justify how deng and booz have been
>treated the past few years and will say ANYTHING to defend how
>rose came up short against miami in 2011. he blamed all that
>on booz. all of it.


I think u been watching Fox News...Or maybe you r not reading my post...I never said anything about how Deng was treated...My issue with you has been the timelines specifically....

Deng was the whipping boy for about two of three seaons...His contract and injuries were the main reason (not his actual play)...I've made that point so many times its not even funny...In fact, u haven't heard a negative word from me concerning Deng in damn near 3-4 years....I've lauded him for improving his 3 point shot...This is no longer a debate worth having...As others have said here you holding on to some old man shit...lol

As for Boozer....

>them two dudes you named i don't even take seriously, but
>murph be tryna be all earnest blaming booz for not being tim
>duncan. nah, dogg, he give y'all 16 and 9 and that's MARKET
>VALUE.


Booze has been an issue for me...But most other Bulls feel the same way about Booze...And yet, I admitted that dude played well in spurts...But again, you are nitpicking here...EVERY...and let me repeat EVERY Bulls fan on this site has talked about amnestying Boozer....

But this is where u get things twisted...

It's more about the money than anything else...The Bulls' luxury tax is crazy...So someone has to be let go...Boozer's contract points to him...


>if noah could do what hibby does, this wouldn't be an issue,
>but since booz the ONLY post scoring threat, dudes get anxious
>and make his every possession life or death and let noah's
>offensive incompetence slide.
>
>and don't get me started on taj. murph defends that dude on
>some "we had to pay him because booz wasn't gettin it
>done."...and watch him come up in here and try to deny he said
>that DUMB ASS GARBAGE.

I never defended Taj's actual play...NEVER...


But...


I defended him when it came to the level of u going crazy on the young boy after 1 season of sucking air and calling him a bust...

We cool Basa...Always been...My only STAN-like behavior has been on D. Rose...I will cop to that all day..lol...Still I will continue to debate u on just how much Rose was responsible for taking an L against the Miami heat while passing the ball to Keith Bogans....U will keep on that fight...Do you, brother...

But again, this is strawman stuff u r pulling...I simply think u take your Bulls hate to comical levels...

I got no beef with Deng...I want him to stay on my team...

I want Boozer gone...and yes that has to do with dude's lack of coming through in the big spots when we really need him...But MORE because of the money issue...We simply can't afford to pay him...

That's all I got...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Beamer6178
Member since Jan 09th 2006
6379 posts
Mon Nov-04-13 11:14 AM

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114. "don't wanna interrupt this fencing match, but ima make this point"
In response to Reply # 63


  

          


>We cool Basa...Always been...My only STAN-like behavior has
>been on D. Rose...I will cop to that all day..lol...Still I
>will continue to debate u on just how much Rose was
>responsible for taking an L against the Miami heat while
>passing the ball to Keith Bogans....U will keep on that
>fight...Do you, brother...
HE WASN'T PASSING THE BALL TO ANYBODY, MUCH LESS BOGANS. THAT was the problem. Rose was taking the majority of shots, almost twice as much as anyone else and shooting at a 35% clip or something awful like that. as a point guard that is unacceptable.

you can't preemptively phase out the rest of the team and justify it by virtue of them not being more dynamic scorers. this was NOT the 2009 Cavs where LeBron set those dudes up with open look after open look and they missed. Rose wasn't even setting dudes up.

NO ONE will tell me that "his way" was the only way that we had. Much less, that his way was BETTER than passing the damn ball around. You dead wrong on this one murph.


rest of this shit between you and Ba



  

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Benedict the Moor
Member since Dec 06th 2011
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Tue Oct-08-13 01:08 PM

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53. "RE: The Chicago Bulls 2013-2014 Regular Season Post: Grand Finale"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

i don't know what ya'll are seeing cuz boozer looks like ass. pouring in j's in a preseason games isn't impressive at all. meanwhile he's still getting stripped, blocked, and causing TOs for no reason.

i really wish they would make a trade already but alas he has zero value atm.

deng looks pedestrian thus far. dude needs to step the fuck up this year if he wants Cleveland to overpay for him in summer.

rest of the team is solid. i do hope jimmy is a bit more aggressive once the season starts. offensively he could be a tremendous help.

still no legit #2 scorer will be a problem come playoff time. i was one of the few who who was on board w/ the aldridge trade for this reason.

in terms of the regular season, bulls will be extremely tough to beat.

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Tue Oct-08-13 02:42 PM

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67. "RE: The Chicago Bulls 2013-2014 Regular Season Post: Grand Finale"
In response to Reply # 53


          


>deng looks pedestrian thus far. dude needs to step the fuck up
>this year if he wants Cleveland to overpay for him in summer.

Slow down dog...Deng was just laid up in the hospital with a serious condition...Let that dude cook....


>rest of the team is solid. i do hope jimmy is a bit more
>aggressive once the season starts. offensively he could be a
>tremendous help.

I agree...


>still no legit #2 scorer will be a problem come playoff time.
>i was one of the few who who was on board w/ the aldridge
>trade for this reason.

Let's wait and see...I want to give this team a chance before I go that route again...

>in terms of the regular season, bulls will be extremely tough
>to beat.

They will be hard to beat in the playoffs too....

Let's show some patience....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Noah Truth
Member since Apr 13th 2010
568 posts
Tue Oct-08-13 03:28 PM

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72. "RE: The Chicago Bulls 2013-2014 Regular Season Post: Grand Finale"
In response to Reply # 67


  

          


>
>Slow down dog...Deng was just laid up in the hospital with a
>serious condition...Let that dude cook....

His D looked good..
The Rose/Jimmy/Deng backcourt is gonna be a problem fa sho.

***

"I am a human being becoming, help me become."

  

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LeroyBumpkin
Charter member
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Sat Oct-12-13 10:51 PM

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73. "Utah interested in Teague."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

@ESPNSteinLine "Hearing: Utah has previously shown trade interest in Bulls' Marquis Teague and could well revisit interest depending on Trey Burke timetable

https://twitter.com/ESPNSteinLine/status/389229576376680449

https://digife.com

  

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts
Sun Oct-13-13 09:35 AM

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74. "if they get bedroom slippers and a lawn mower for him, it's a swindle"
In response to Reply # 73
Sun Oct-13-13 09:36 AM by Basaglia

  

          

because if i owned a team, i would straight up not trade my lawnmower for teague.

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
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Tue Oct-15-13 03:17 PM

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75. "http://beta.thescore.com/nba/news/321948"
In response to Reply # 74


  

          

http://beta.thescore.com/nba/news/321948

if can we get a lottery protected first rounder we'll be lucky.

  

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts
Tue Oct-15-13 10:53 PM

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77. "he's an awful player. "
In response to Reply # 75


  

          

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

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Darryl_Licke
Member since Jun 06th 2002
70279 posts
Tue Oct-15-13 10:48 PM

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76. "I'm just saying I'm here"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

but there is nothing wrong with being odd. i mean you arent inkast or adwhizz odd. - VABestBBW
Binlahab is a bitch.
I wouldn't trust okp, some of them don't even get any anymore since the Re's stopped - Anonymous OKP

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
8710 posts
Wed Oct-16-13 08:12 PM

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78. "safe to say Derrick lost zero creativity around the hoop"
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Oct-16-13 08:14 PM by RandomFact

  

          

also didn't lose any explosiveness.

i was concerned going into this year about that part of his game. figured he would be settling for jumpers more. dude still has the magic around the hoop.

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
20939 posts
Thu Oct-17-13 11:24 AM

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82. "I wanna see him 15 games in"
In response to Reply # 78


  

          

Legs are there, he's stronger, shot looks a lil flat but it's going in, D looks good, decision making is rusty.

Right now I feel like he's just getting a litmus on his body, which is fine but I need to see him develop.

This is the season for it. 15 games in, he'll be settled and it'll be easier to see what's improved and what still needs work.

____________

  

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Benedict the Moor
Member since Dec 06th 2011
1476 posts
Thu Oct-17-13 11:59 AM

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84. "RE: safe to say Derrick lost zero creativity around the hoop"
In response to Reply # 78


  

          

he's doing too much right now imo. dude needs to chill the fuck out. i don't know if he has something to prove or whatever but every game thus far he's plowed directly into the teeth of the defense and taken pretty hard falls.

i get that he wants to be aggressive but he seriously needs to learn the art of drawing contact ala pierce/chauncey/durant/harden etc. those guys shoot TONS of FTs w/out having to hit the floor each time.

other than that i'm ecstatic about how he looks atm

◦◦◦
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http://i.minus.com/iQBdCzZIftHZ2.gif

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
8710 posts
Thu Oct-17-13 12:47 PM

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88. "i assume he'll calm down eventually"
In response to Reply # 84


  

          

like auragin said above, he's testing his body.

i'm just glad the part of his game that set him apart from everyone else in the league is still there.

  

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select_from_where
Member since Jan 03rd 2011
4342 posts
Wed Oct-16-13 08:39 PM

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79. "I keep telling cats, Snell is a problem..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Dude isn't even using any creativity, he's just following thibs abc ass offense and hes still splashing.

If dude ever learns to play off the ball he's gonna be a killer from mid-range.

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
20939 posts
Thu Oct-17-13 11:20 AM

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80. "They drafted him to be Deng 2.0"
In response to Reply # 79


  

          

He gets his IQ up as high as Deng's (50/50 chance there), puts on some NBA muscle and he will be an advanced version.

He's just as long as Deng, has a commitment to D, got his 3pt range earlier (took Deng like 4-5 seasons) and he's a better ball handler.

If he develops right, I can see it.

____________

  

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FromTheGo
Member since Feb 04th 2003
10606 posts
Thu Oct-17-13 11:23 AM

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81. "he makes 10,000,000 less than Deng. That's enough for me"
In response to Reply # 80


  

          

†††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††
http://s17.postimg.org/6r7bfqpnz/kyrieglass.jpg - They Call Him Mr. Glass

  

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Benedict the Moor
Member since Dec 06th 2011
1476 posts
Thu Oct-17-13 12:03 PM

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85. "RE: They drafted him to be Deng 2.0"
In response to Reply # 80


  

          

man i wish snell could be deng 2.0 but he's looking more like chris douglas-roberts 1.5

◦◦◦
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Kajun
Member since Jan 11th 2008
1007 posts
Thu Oct-17-13 11:36 AM

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83. "He has all the tools, but I would temper expectations."
In response to Reply # 79


  

          

After watching this guy up close sleepwalk through game after game despite having more talent than anyone else on the floor...yeah.

Maybe his mentality will change in the league, but Snell was maddeningly inconsistent. Some guys just don't have that switch. Hopefully he finds it, but if college was any indication he is going to struggle to be much more than a role player if he doesn't show some damn hunger.


As we well know, skills to not always translate into success. I'll be rooting for him though.

  

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FromTheGo
Member since Feb 04th 2003
10606 posts
Thu Oct-17-13 12:23 PM

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86. "irony"
In response to Reply # 83


  

          

†††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††
http://s17.postimg.org/6r7bfqpnz/kyrieglass.jpg - They Call Him Mr. Glass

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
21925 posts
Thu Oct-17-13 12:27 PM

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87. "yeah, i don't know why ppl are pushing this "deng pt 2" angle."
In response to Reply # 83


  

          

dude was a late 1st rounder in a weak draft, and for a reason.

if he merely develops into a decent role guy -- and i think he will -- it's a win. any higher expectation than that is silly.




>After watching this guy up close sleepwalk through game after
>game despite having more talent than anyone else on the
>floor...yeah.
>
>Maybe his mentality will change in the league, but Snell was
>maddeningly inconsistent. Some guys just don't have that
>switch. Hopefully he finds it, but if college was any
>indication he is going to struggle to be much more than a role
>player if he doesn't show some damn hunger.
>
>
>As we well know, skills to not always translate into success.
>I'll be rooting for him though.
>

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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Benedict the Moor
Member since Dec 06th 2011
1476 posts
Fri Oct-18-13 01:58 PM

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89. "RE: The Chicago Bulls 2013-2014 Regular Season Post: Grand Finale"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Jo is out for a week or so w/ sore groin... shocker.

I love Noah like everyone else but dude is NEVER healthy.

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LeroyBumpkin
Charter member
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Fri Oct-18-13 06:31 PM

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90. "Was he healthy on Wednesday?"
In response to Reply # 89


  

          

If not, he shouldn't have been playing then either.

https://digife.com

  

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LeroyBumpkin
Charter member
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Mon Oct-21-13 11:46 AM

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91. "Deng Concerned About Injuries (swipe) "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Butler, Noah & Hinrich all out tonight.

http://www.sheridanhoops.com/2013/10/20/tweet-of-the-night-luol-deng-concerned-about-injuries

https://digife.com

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
21925 posts
Sun Oct-27-13 12:31 PM

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92. "rose's final preseason stats :"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

27.4 MPG, 20.7 PPG, 5.0 APG, 3.3 RPG, 1.3 SPG, 47.6 FG%, 44.4 3P%, 80.3 FT%, 64.1 TS%, 54.8 eFG%, 125.1 ORtg, 94.0 DRtg, 35.45 PER

http://realtimeshortstories.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/42599c2671a8a9131bb7682dc495.jpg

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
8710 posts
Mon Oct-28-13 12:44 PM

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93. "just want to go on record and say that we're still missing a piece..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

unless jimmy develops into that 15ppg guy with a good three point shot (which is possible).

i'm not on that "we have enough" wagon yet.

when the game slows down in the half court come playoff time, someone else will need to create. same ol shit every year. not sure that we have a guy for that. again, hopefully jimmy develops and becomes that guy but i'm not sure.

we know exactly what we're getting from every person on the roster aside from rose and jimmy. can't join the "we have enough" crowd until i see significant improvements from both guys. them beasting (and health of the entire team) is what gets us past miami.

  

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mashpg89
Member since Dec 08th 2004
2867 posts
Mon Oct-28-13 02:19 PM

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94. "i worry about this too"
In response to Reply # 93


  

          

The fact that is Rose is still the only player on our roster that you can give the ball to with 5 seconds on the shot clock and he'll be able to create his own shot.

Brocolli Head doesn't have the offensive moves or handle for that, Lu is the 2nd best at doing it but not good enough.

I thought we had a good second scoring option in Nate, someone with instant offense that can create his own shot, and that's why I think we'll regret letting him walk.

I still think the Bulls might have enough, as all of our core players have individually gotten better over the years and learned to play together, but I worry about who's going to score when Derrick gets doubled in the playoffs.

One guy on our roster like Henderson, Tyreke Evans, Eric Gordon, or OJ Mayo and I think we're unstoppable.

But fuck it, still calling the Bulls are gonna win it all this year.

  

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Benedict the Moor
Member since Dec 06th 2011
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Mon Oct-28-13 04:23 PM

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95. "RE: i worry about this too"
In response to Reply # 94
Mon Oct-28-13 04:28 PM by Benedict the Moor

  

          

>The fact that is Rose is still the only player on our roster
>that you can give the ball to with 5 seconds on the shot clock
>and he'll be able to create his own shot.
>
>Brocolli Head doesn't have the offensive moves or handle for
>that, Lu is the 2nd best at doing it but not good enough.

>I thought we had a good second scoring option in Nate, someone
>with instant offense that can create his own shot, and that's
>why I think we'll regret letting him walk.

Bulls should have done everything in their power to keep Nate and ditch Kirk. Unfortunately, management enamors the 'white-n-scrappy' intangible that Kirk brings. Nate would have been 1000X more valuable in the playoffs point blank.

>I still think the Bulls might have enough, as all of our core
>players have individually gotten better over the years and
>learned to play together, but I worry about who's going to
>score when Derrick gets doubled in the playoffs.
>
>One guy on our roster like Henderson, Tyreke Evans, Eric
>Gordon, or OJ Mayo and I think we're unstoppable.

'Reke and Henderson can't shoot long range and EG is a HUGE liability on an already injury-prone team. OJ would have been ideal but the Bulls couldn't afford him.

>But fuck it, still calling the Bulls are gonna win it all this
>year.

Baring injury I'm confident the Bulls can compete w/ Miami if they can somehow slow down Wade. This would mean Bron goes full beast mode on us in the Playoffs (which will likely happen regardless) but at least we can neutralize the other two.

People forget the last time we faced Miami Bogans was are starting 2 guard. Wade basically played zone the ENTIRE time and doubled Rose every chance he got. Obviously Jimmy is a HUGE upgrade but he'll have to score to keep Wade honest. Defensively, IMO the Bulls can play switches better than any team in the league and are probably the toughest matchup for Miami (other than OKC).

The issue will be whether or not Jimmy and Taj can score in crunch time. I actually think they can and will. Of course, I'm saying all this assuming Boozer will be on the bench and a non-factor in tight games.

Like you said though, Nate would have put us over the top. Whereas now, I'd give it a 50/50 shot - baring injury, of course.

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts
Mon Oct-28-13 08:55 PM

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97. "miami don't have a center or PF worth a damn...."
In response to Reply # 93


  

          

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
8710 posts
Mon Oct-28-13 09:30 PM

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98. "booz usually has issues with bosh's length "
In response to Reply # 97


  

          

can't count on a w for that matchup. usually a wash.

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
21925 posts
Mon Oct-28-13 08:54 PM

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96. "Breaking down the Chicago Bulls offense."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z0mvW9EfJE4

Coach Nick dove into the preseason footage to see what Bulls coach Tom Thibodeau has changed in his offense this season. With a healthy Derrick Rose, it is natural to assume their offense will improve. With a No. 23 ranking last year, it's almost impossible not to improve, but they key to their chances in the playoffs is their offensive system. Can their offense generate good enough shots against other elite level defenses? Will Rose be more efficient letting the offense work for him? Can Mike Dunleavy fit in and play that Kyle Korver/Marco Belinelli role well enough?

These are all pressing questions that most Bulls fans have been waiting on ever since The Return. The early signs are encouraging, as Chicago has clearly added some creativity to their concepts. Coach Thibodeau seems to have sat down with the Spurs playbook and has adopted some of the plays from Gregg Popovich's team. While there has been little evidence of "Read and React" from the Bulls, there is evidence that they are focusing on better ball movement and spacing. And this could mean all the difference when they go up against the Miami Heat in the playoffs.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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mashpg89
Member since Dec 08th 2004
2867 posts
Mon Oct-28-13 10:22 PM

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99. "I don't like the signing of Mike James over a big"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

We've already got three guys who can play PG, yet only two players capable of playing center. Add to that Joakim's injury history, and him already starting the season hobbled, and it's a real questionable move.

I know it's the 13th player and Thibs won't play him much anyway, but if Jo goes down we'll be forced to play small, which could hurt us against the elite teams. Who will guard Hibbert, Lopez, Chandler, Bynum(?), and Drummond when Noah can't play and Nazr gets in foul trouble or gets tired cause he's old?

Hoping Noah won't get hurt is a bigger risk than taking on Dexter Pittman over a 4th string Mike James.

  

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LeroyBumpkin
Charter member
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Tue Oct-29-13 10:56 PM

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100. "Man, that 2Q hurt us."
In response to Reply # 0
Tue Oct-29-13 10:57 PM by LeroyBumpkin

  

          

+
31 from Boozer.
Butler's 2nd half.

-
Early Deng/Butler foul trouble (not even gonna put this on the refs, poor positioning)
Absent Rose.
18 turnovers!
Dunleavy didn't hit until the 4th I believe.

I'm not worried about Noah. Dude played 20 minutes of pre season ball?
He'll be fine. I liked that we were still (kinda) in it despite being down 23 at one point.
Thibs mad though. Ha ha. He gonna have 'em ready for Melo

https://digife.com

  

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JAESCOTT777
Member since Feb 18th 2006
28487 posts
Wed Oct-30-13 05:11 AM

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101. "until we get another player that can create a shot/penetrate"
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Oct-30-13 05:11 AM by JAESCOTT777

  

          

and until Rose learns how to use a pick and roll effectively
we will be exactly what we are 45-55 games and a 2nd round exit to the heat

Rose will avg 20+ per maybe 6-7 assists
but we won't get there

Rose is still my man
but too often he is still exploding off a P&R not even looking at making the pass until he is up in the air or completely trapped.

he got booz y'all seen what he can do if you just slow it down and hit him at the correct timing. shit shouldn't be that hard.

Dunny was off but he will do work he can create shots i seen him do it in MIL

and i believe Tony Snell can be a contributor as well

ill just charge this to the offense got to get back used to rose being there but he gotta play smarter.


  

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
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Wed Oct-30-13 07:12 AM

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102. "this is fair...you basically saying what i been saying"
In response to Reply # 101
Wed Oct-30-13 07:13 AM by Basaglia

  

          

i just don't agree with the second creator thing. bottomline, if the franchise played like a franchise, y'all would be right there. to be fair, this is one game and he coming off a major injury. he gotta get his timing back.

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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Wed Oct-30-13 07:20 AM

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103. "I disagree."
In response to Reply # 101


  

          

>Rose is still my man
>but too often he is still exploding off a P&R not even looking
>at making the pass until he is up in the air or completely
>trapped.

Some of those were the refs holding their whistles in my opinion.
We're not saying this if Rose is at the line 5-8 more times.

As for scoring, that's what we're hoping Jimmy Butler can be. If Boozer can be consistent, and Butler give us 15 per, the Bulls will be fine. I'm done complaining about getting a 2nd scorer. This is our team and it's probably not changing this season. Butler and Boozer are both capable of providing offense outside of Rose.

https://digife.com

  

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JAESCOTT777
Member since Feb 18th 2006
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Wed Oct-30-13 01:50 PM

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109. "RE: I disagree."
In response to Reply # 103
Wed Oct-30-13 01:55 PM by JAESCOTT777

  

          

>
>Some of those were the refs holding their whistles in my
>opinion.

This is true too but he can't help that. My thing is he shouldn't have to. Cj Watson while limited athletically ran the offense just fine and didn't have to crash the rack same with capt. The offense ran pretty efficient in the playoffs with scraps cause they weren't trying to do too much.

>We're not saying this if Rose is at the line 5-8 more times.
>
>As for scoring, that's what we're hoping Jimmy Butler can be.
>If Boozer can be consistent, and Butler give us 15 per, the
>Bulls will be fine. I'm done complaining about getting a 2nd
>scorer. This is our team and it's probably not changing thist
>season. Butler and Boozer are both capable of providing
>offense outside of Rose

If jimmy is gonna be that dude he gotta stop taking jumpers and figure out ways to get to the rack. If he can't do that I don't give a shit how shut down he is on D.

Booz it was proven he can be a scoring option. We just gotta get more creative on offense. This clear out and set screen and wait for a kickout 2001 allen iverson shit ain't gonna cut it.

Taj is fuckin sorry it's time to accept we made a huge mistake keeping him over omer. I think a chucker off the bench can help. Sadly Ben Gordon would be perfect off this bench.

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Wed Oct-30-13 08:52 AM

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106. "Me, you and Random been saying he has to be smarter since"
In response to Reply # 101


  

          

the ECF.

It's coming along, but he still has a ways to go.

That jump passing annoys the hell outta me. And you're absolutely right about patience on that P&R.

He's been making a few passes that D-Rose from 2 yrs ago wouldn't have made so I see the IQ improvement but he's still gotta get better at moving the ball.

Has to learn to use his dribble to make those passes and not his hops.

I disagree about the second creator due to all of the above. If he plays the way he's capable/should as a PG with his ability. We're right there.

____________

  

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bshelly
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Wed Oct-30-13 07:45 AM

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104. "oh, hey, look, derrick rose didn't make a difference at all"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

----
bshelly

"You (Fisher) could get fired, Les Snead could get fired, Kevin Demoff could get fired, but I will always be Eric Dickerson.†(c) The God

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Wed Oct-30-13 08:48 AM

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105. "Hey look, it's the first game out of 82, STFU :-)"
In response to Reply # 104


  

          

Hi Shelly!

____________

  

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Melanism
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Wed Oct-30-13 09:45 AM

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107. "You don't have a "spark" from your bench anymore"
In response to Reply # 0


          

No one's saying "Oh shit, here comes Dunleavy." Bellinelli and Robinson at least infused energy and three pointers.

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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Wed Oct-30-13 11:32 AM

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108. "They weren't going to keep Hinrich and Nate."
In response to Reply # 107


  

          

Hinrich still has another year on his contract. While I want to say it was a money thing, the Bulls have always had a thing for scrappy white guys so...*shrug*. Shame tho cause you're right, his instant offense fits in situations like last night. He'll get you 10 quick points and you got a team on their heels.

https://digife.com

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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110. "Failed in avoiding the score all day Saturday."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Watched the game on DVR anyway and all I kept thinking during the 1st half was, "How did we lose this?" Up 20+?

Those Rose turnovers in the 4Q were crucial.

Hawes, MCW, Turner balled. I hope this group makes the playoffs this year amongst all that tank talk.

As for the Bulls? Not worried. I'm giving them up until Christmas to get their stuff together.

https://digife.com

  

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TheRealBillyOcean
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111. "More Teague Please!"
In response to Reply # 0


          

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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112. ""
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

*IF* true, I see Thibodeau eventually leaving when his contract is up.

http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/11/03/report-bulls-front-office-taking-an-active-role-in-telling-coach-thibodeau-how-to-manage-players-minutes/

Tom Thibodeau is one of the NBA’s top coaches, but when it comes to managing minutes of his top players, he is going to get some help. Even if he doesn’t want it. The Bulls’ front office has been taking an active role in telling Thibodeau how he’ll dispense minutes to Joakim Noah, among others. And these are two parties that have had their differences in the past.

https://digife.com

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Mon Nov-04-13 10:15 AM

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113. "Re: The Sixers Game"
In response to Reply # 0
Mon Nov-04-13 10:15 AM by auragin_boi

  

          

The Good: First half was brilliant, every one was gelling on O and the D was working though Philly managed some good looks. The first half showed me what we could/should be this season. D creating O, O flowing well and Booz killing them inside.

The Bad: D-Rose's jump passing (such a low IQ thing to do ALL the time, it's a habit for him now). The ref's flat out refusal to call a foul on Derrick's 'fast drives' to the basket, though he's clearly getting hit and other guys get the same calls. Also his struggle to score at the basket. I can tell he's still working that out as he's getting the same moves to the basket as 2 yrs ago but he's missing those shots at a higher rate. And that 3pt shot is not consistent. If he hits 2-3 of those without having to take 8 I think the lane opens up for him more. I'm not trying to go to hard on him just yet...but i'm concerned at this point.

The Ugly: Pressing and turning the ball over (D-Rose). This loss was on him and Coach Thibs. Rose clearly tried to do too much instead of picking apart the D, he tried to take over and he's not there yet. Besides, picking apart the D is something he should be trying to get better at. We know he can take over a game.

Then a biiiiiiiig chunk of the second half, booz was on the bench, yet he was our BEST offensive weapon the whole game and has been so the whole season. He was killing Philly and when the O slowed he should have been in the game. The 2nd half is closer to where we are now. I'm giving us a month to sort it out, after that, I'm going to get more critical of this team if they haven't gained some sense of continuity and chemistry on both sides of the ball.

Indy on Wed is gonna be tough considering how we look and that PG is looking like he wants all NBA first team consideration this yr.

SMH...c'mon fellas.

Bonus: MCW is awesome for basketball (that is, if he keeps it up). Some guys are built for the NBA, he's one of them because he wasn't particulary awesome in college.

____________

  

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Benedict the Moor
Member since Dec 06th 2011
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Mon Nov-04-13 01:30 PM

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115. "RE: Re: The Sixers Game"
In response to Reply # 113
Mon Nov-04-13 01:37 PM by Benedict the Moor

  

          

rose is CLEARLY going to have to play himself back into nba form. i'll give him 2 weeks. after that i hit the panic button. though his athleticism/quickness appears to still be there, which is a good sign i suppose.

booz is balling. if he keeps this up i may have to turn the hate burners to low heat.

deng does nothing particularly impactful and his defense is overrated. i honestly have no clue why management/coaches love him so much.

most glaring issue is absolutely ZERO guard scoring from our bench. hinrich might be one of the worst scoring guards in the NBA and dunleavy isn't striking fear in anyone.

they better pick someone up before the deadline (ben gordon?) because the bench WILL get exposed in the playoffs.

>
>Bonus: MCW is awesome for basketball (that is, if he keeps it up). Some guys are built for the NBA, he's one of them because he wasn't particulary awesome in college.

ayo, fuck that juicy lip high yellow nigga n/h

◦◦◦
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http://i.minus.com/iQBdCzZIftHZ2.gif

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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116. "What about Evan Turner next summer?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Sixers didn't extend him so he's going to test the FA market.
Can create his own shot. Not sure about his 3PT range but...

All Chicago back court?

https://digife.com

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
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Mon Nov-11-13 01:31 PM

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117. "our issues partially stem from the doubles &amp;amp; traps rose has been..."
In response to Reply # 0
Mon Nov-11-13 01:35 PM by RandomFact

  

          

seeing since the miami game.

the heat flustered rose and the rest of the league has taken notice.

get the ball out of derrick's hands and the rest of the team will only make you pay up until a point... i.e. the rest of the team struggles on offense in the fourth quarter when defenses start keying in. same shit different year.

rose has been horrible navigating these doubles and traps so thats on him. but our lack of a second playmaker is making this transition harder than it should be.

i'm willing to bet that dude is the only player in the league is seeing doubles this early in the season. opposing defenses just aren't scared of our roster at this point.

http://espn.go.com/blog/chicago/bulls/post/_/id/15551/rose-getting-used-to-traps-again

  

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Benedict the Moor
Member since Dec 06th 2011
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Mon Nov-11-13 01:49 PM

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118. "RE: our issues partially stem from the doubles &amp;amp;amp; traps rose ..."
In response to Reply # 117
Mon Nov-11-13 01:49 PM by Benedict the Moor

  

          

>http://espn.go.com/blog/chicago/bulls/post/_/id/15551/rose-getting-used-to-traps-again
>

"I think that's why there's such a premium on shooting. You have to surround your best players with shooting."
-thibs

lol @ this^^^

◦◦◦
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http://i.minus.com/iQBdCzZIftHZ2.gif

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
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Mon Nov-11-13 02:21 PM

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119. "shots fired fo sho"
In response to Reply # 118


  

          


>"I think that's why there's such a premium on shooting. You
>have to surround your best players with shooting."
>-thibs
>
>lol @ this^^^
>
>

  

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select_from_where
Member since Jan 03rd 2011
4342 posts
Mon Nov-11-13 02:31 PM

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120. "lol they gonna terminate thibs ass, he needs to chill. "
In response to Reply # 118


  

          

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
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Mon Nov-11-13 02:48 PM

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121. "nah. he need's talk about it. n/m"
In response to Reply # 120


  

          

  

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts
Mon Nov-11-13 02:49 PM

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122. "most stars see doubles...that's a mega cyse"
In response to Reply # 117


  

          

he ain't the only one. that's why kyrie plays off-ball half the time, 'cause of doubles.

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
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Mon Nov-11-13 04:48 PM

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123. "of course. but i'm speaking about the beginning of this season"
In response to Reply # 122


  

          

usually this is something a seen in the playoffs or in a statement game. not really shown in games 1-4 out of 82.

  

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Benedict the Moor
Member since Dec 06th 2011
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Wed Nov-20-13 02:39 PM

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124. "Jimmy out 2-3 weeks w/ turf toe"
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Nov-20-13 02:39 PM by Benedict the Moor

  

          

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nba--bulls-guard-jimmy-butler-out-two-to-three-weeks-because-of-turf-toe-193425925.html


aaaaaand it begins...

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
20939 posts
Wed Nov-20-13 02:56 PM

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125. "Damn...he was playing well too"
In response to Reply # 124


  

          

AND it's right as we start the circus trip.

Guess Derrick is gonna have to find his game a lil faster or this trip might be a lot tougher than it already is.

____________

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
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Wed Nov-20-13 08:20 PM

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126. "this team and nagging injuries is an issue"
In response to Reply # 124
Wed Nov-20-13 08:21 PM by RandomFact

  

          

our starting lineup is perpetually banged up. this is an issue.


  

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LeroyBumpkin
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Wed Nov-20-13 08:23 PM

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127. "Yet he played in the 4th."
In response to Reply # 124


  

          

Thibs said trainer said it was ok.
Butler said it was ok (of course)
So he played.

Why do I get the feeling this doesn't happen on other squads?

https://digife.com

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Thu Nov-21-13 11:31 AM

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131. "RE: Yet he played in the 4th."
In response to Reply # 127


          

>Thibs said trainer said it was ok.
>Butler said it was ok (of course)
>So he played.
>
>Why do I get the feeling this doesn't happen on other squads?


This worries me...I love Thibs...But dammit, why do we have to the MASH unit of the NBA?

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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mashpg89
Member since Dec 08th 2004
2867 posts
Wed Nov-20-13 09:18 PM

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128. "I expect Snell will get some tick"
In response to Reply # 124


  

          

If he can make some spot up 3's that would be huge for us.


Snell needs a nickname btw

  

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nighttripper
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Wed Nov-20-13 09:38 PM

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129. "slimmer charles"
In response to Reply # 128


  

          

  

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mashpg89
Member since Dec 08th 2004
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Wed Nov-20-13 09:54 PM

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130. "Slim-Grim Reaper"
In response to Reply # 129


  

          

http://25.media.tumblr.com/ce723c3ab84fe68fc8438f55959bdd50/tumblr_mvglv73ude1qg861no1_500.jpg

  

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JAESCOTT777
Member since Feb 18th 2006
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Wed Nov-27-13 10:02 AM

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140. "Pusha three "
In response to Reply # 128


  

          

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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Mon Nov-25-13 12:59 PM

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132. "Do you have faith this FO can orchestrate this?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I don't.

https://digife.com

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Mon Nov-25-13 01:46 PM

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133. "I don't"
In response to Reply # 132


  

          

Considering they get hamstrung by JR most of the time cuz he's a cheap bastard and they focus intensely on 'character' guys, I'm not sure they know how to approach this.

Since Deng and Booz are prolly out after this season, they should aggressively look to trade each now. But only for quality (young talent on cheap contracts, expiring deals or draft picks).

I don't think they should trade Noah but if they can't get a competent back up for him, it might be worth exploring also.

The goal should be to win less than 30 games and get a top 7-10 pick with our own draft pick and hope Al Jeff lands the bobcats with a record between 10-15 so we get two great young talents at a very cheap rate (or possibly a package deal to move up).

From there, you got about 35 mil coming off the books this summer (Kirk, Nazr Deng via contract expiration and Boozer via amnesty) and now you have about 27 mil to chase free agents (we're about 8mil over the cap). IF they trade deng and/or booz, the goal would be to not take back salary beyond this year unless it's a star player.

Rose comes back next year with 1-2 star players next to him (maybe Milsap & Melo?), 1-2 top draft picks in a deep draft, Miriotic and we're ready to go.

____________

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Nov-25-13 01:55 PM

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134. "RE: I don't"
In response to Reply # 133


          

>Considering they get hamstrung by JR most of the time cuz
>he's a cheap bastard and they focus intensely on 'character'
>guys, I'm not sure they know how to approach this.
>
>Since Deng and Booz are prolly out after this season, they
>should aggressively look to trade each now. But only for
>quality (young talent on cheap contracts, expiring deals or
>draft picks).
>
>I don't think they should trade Noah but if they can't get a
>competent back up for him, it might be worth exploring also.
>
>The goal should be to win less than 30 games and get a top
>7-10 pick with our own draft pick and hope Al Jeff lands the
>bobcats with a record between 10-15 so we get two great young
>talents at a very cheap rate (or possibly a package deal to
>move up).
>
>From there, you got about 35 mil coming off the books this
>summer (Kirk, Nazr Deng via contract expiration and Boozer via
>amnesty) and now you have about 27 mil to chase free agents
>(we're about 8mil over the cap). IF they trade deng and/or
>booz, the goal would be to not take back salary beyond this
>year unless it's a star player.
>
>Rose comes back next year with 1-2 star players next to him
>(maybe Milsap & Melo?), 1-2 top draft picks in a deep draft,
>Miriotic and we're ready to go.


I'm with it....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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mashpg89
Member since Dec 08th 2004
2867 posts
Tue Nov-26-13 12:40 AM

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135. "I think the real question is, can this team miss the playoffs?"
In response to Reply # 132


  

          

I'm now fully on board with tanking. It would be completely idiotic to let pride get in the way and fight for 6-8th spot knowing that the team doesn't have enough to challenge MIA/IND. Last year's team was different because it was designed to pick up the slack from Rose's injury. This team has no chance in a seven game series against any top seeded Eastern team.

This is also going to be one of the strongest drafts of the past ten years. At least 3 players to build around and many that can be excellent secondary or role players. It would be foolish for any mediocre team to try to make the playoffs instead of the lottery.

So I ask you guys, which teams want to make the playoffs and who will?

This is the worst I've ever seen the EC, I predict the final standings could look something like:

1-3

IND
MIA
ATL

all trying to make the playoffs and definitely will.

4-5

NY
BKN

see themselves as playoff teams and will turn the season around.

6-11

DET
CLE
WAS
CHI
CHA
TOR

all capable of making the playoffs and might want to to show their fanbase some progress.

Boston is a wild card so I'll leave them out. Many see them tanking, but I wouldn't be surprised if their record dramatically improves when Rondo gets back.

So do you think we can have a worse record than three of the teams I listed from 6-11?

I'd say it's possible simply because our offense sucks, bench is weak, we're plagued by injuries, and our effort/defense has been lackluster so far this season. It'd be more likely if we make some trades of course.

I just hope the Bulls are smart about this. I will be very disappointed if we make the playoffs. Go ahead and say we have enough, next man up, blah blah blah, but behind closed doors we better figure out ways to lose and start scouting who could help our team for the next five years.

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
8710 posts
Tue Nov-26-13 01:38 AM

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136. "doubtful the vets are putting up with thibs for six more months..."
In response to Reply # 135
Tue Nov-26-13 01:45 AM by RandomFact

  

          

when we are playing for nothing. especially when guys know they're on the outs regardless.

at this point thibs militaristic style of coaching would probably best be suited for a younger team.

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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137. "Everything I'm reading says it's Thibs/Players vs. FO"
In response to Reply # 136


  

          

Especially the Rose/Deng camp. They're not too cool on GarPaxDorf.
So if Thibs wants to compete, they're going to. I doubt they'll check out on him.

https://digife.com

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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138. "Hence my orig. question:"
In response to Reply # 135


  

          

>I just hope the Bulls are smart about this.

I don't trust our FO to orchestrate what has a TON of decisions.

Trades?
Drafts?
Missing the playoffs?
Handling coaches?

https://digife.com

  

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JAESCOTT777
Member since Feb 18th 2006
28487 posts
Wed Nov-27-13 10:01 AM

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139. "I don't ..I have a feeling we gonna end up w some damn smello "
In response to Reply # 132


  

          

And end up a 7th seed

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
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Sat Nov-30-13 11:13 PM

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141. "if waiters for deng is really on the table we would be dumb not to do it"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

doesn't matter if we get a pick in return.

then make a serious run at melo this summer.

rose needs to come back to a team with *at least* two good shot creators next year. done are the days of him being asked to shoulder any load.

rose
waiters/snell
melo/jimmy
mirotic/taj
noah

take melo out of the mix and it's possible that we'll still be in good shape. it'll be up to mirotic living up to his billing and garpax spending wisely.





  

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LeroyBumpkin
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142. "My Knick hate..."
In response to Reply # 141


  

          

...is making it hard for me to like Melo at the UC but...*shrug*.

Honestly, I like that lineup without Melo.

https://digife.com

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Sun Dec-01-13 02:50 PM

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143. "I agree...A LOT though I'd at least want to swap picks"
In response to Reply # 141


  

          

They are sending out a disgruntled top pick with no track record for an allstar swingman with at least 4 solid years left in him.

If we could get Lu to agree to an extend and trade, the Cavs might do it.

Beyond that we'd have to take some salary back (lu makes 12 mil or so a year, Dior prolly something like 5 mil).

I'd still do it without the pick but I'd feel a slight way about it if we couldn't at least swap...I'd get over it though.

And Melo should be target #1 this summer.

____________

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
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Sun Dec-01-13 03:12 PM

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144. "I was always indifferent when it came to Melo"
In response to Reply # 143


  

          

But this team is not going to be able to tank properly in order to land a franchise guy in this upcoming draft. Gotta build thru fagency.

Bringing in a still prime Melo, a subdued Rose, a scorer in Dion while keeping the defensive pillars Jo/Jimmy/Taj will have us right back in the mix. Throw in Snells 3 point shot and Mirotic's potential and we're sitting pretty

Thing is, all of this is very possible. If the FO can't figure it out it'll be a travesty.

>
>And Melo should be target #1 this summer.

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Sun Dec-01-13 03:25 PM

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145. "Basically and I wouldn't even start Dion"
In response to Reply # 144


  

          

He's use to being a 6th man and with a green light, he could be Ben Gordon on roids (or a 6'4" more under control version of Nate) because he's a better ball handler and finisher and that J can be just as good with the proper set up and having 2 guys who need more attention from the D (Melo and Rose) he could feast when playing with the second group or the starters.

Rose
Jimmy
Melo
Taj
Noah

That starting 5 gets better O than this years team and loses nothing on D. And we don't have a weapon like Dion on the bench.

We do need some interior insurance though. Noah needs a backup that can play 15-20 mins a night effectively. Nazr is basically a corpse now.

____________

  

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j0510
Member since Feb 02nd 2012
2315 posts
Tue Dec-03-13 08:53 PM

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146. "Bulls Assign Teague To D-League (swipe)"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2013/12/03/bulls-assign-teague-to-d-league/

Bulls Assign Teague To D-League
December 3, 2013 11:53 AM

(CBS) The Bulls have assigned second-year point guard Marquis Teague to the D-League’s Iowa Energy.

The move comes as a bit of a surprise, as the Bulls are only carrying 13 players on their roster.

Teague, 20, can be recalled at any time.

He’s averaging 1.2 points and 0.8 assists in 8.9 minutes during nine games this season.

The Bulls selected Teague with the 29th pick in the 2012 NBA draft.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Tue Dec-03-13 08:55 PM

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147. "RE: Bulls Assign Teague To D-League (swipe)"
In response to Reply # 146


          

>http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2013/12/03/bulls-assign-teague-to-d-league/
>
>Bulls Assign Teague To D-League
>December 3, 2013 11:53 AM
>
>(CBS) The Bulls have assigned second-year point guard Marquis
>Teague to the D-League’s Iowa Energy.
>
>The move comes as a bit of a surprise, as the Bulls are only
>carrying 13 players on their roster.
>
>Teague, 20, can be recalled at any time.
>
>He’s averaging 1.2 points and 0.8 assists in 8.9 minutes
>during nine games this season.
>
>The Bulls selected Teague with the 29th pick in the 2012 NBA
>draft.


Stupid move...Let the boy play and rack up some L's....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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j0510
Member since Feb 02nd 2012
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Tue Dec-03-13 09:46 PM

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148. "Bulls' Teague down and up in same day (swipe)"
In response to Reply # 147


  

          

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/basketball/bulls/ct-spt-1204-bits-bulls-chicago-20131204,0,3979117.story

Bulls' Teague down and up in same day
Bulls sent 2nd-year guard to Development League on Tuesday but had to recall him because of injury to James

By K.C. Johnson, Chicago Tribune reporter
8:39 p.m. CST, December 3, 2013

The Bulls' colorful history with Development League assignments continued on Tuesday.

In a mild surprise, the Bulls early in the day assigned second-year point guard Marquis Teague to the Iowa Energy, their Development League affiliate.

But sources said Teague got recalled before landing because an MRI revealed veteran point guard Mike James suffered a sprained MCL before Monday's triple overtime loss to the Pelicans. James still gritted out 10 minutes.

James is expected to miss one to two weeks, gift-wrapping another opportunity for Teague.

The initial surprise about Teague stemmed from the Bulls historically frowning upon this avenue for development, citing NBA practices as more instructional. Plus, with Derrick Rose out the remainder of the season after right knee surgery and Jimmy Butler still week-to-week with turf toe, the Bulls now have just 10 healthy bodies for practice.

There are no plans to sign an additional player.

"It's not a long-term thing and something we may do occasionally throughout the season," general manager Gar Forman said about Teague, speaking before sources confirmed his recall and James' injury. "We knew when we drafted Marquis that he was young with potential. It's a good opportunity for him to receive significant minutes."

Teague had lost his rotational spot Saturday in Cleveland to James, the fourth-oldest player in the NBA at 38. Drafted 29th in 2012, Teague averaged 1.2 points and 0.8 assists in 8.9 minutes over nine games.

Memory lane: The Bulls have endured other wacky incidents after Development League assignments.

Martynas Andriuskevicius suffered a concussion and fractured skull when Proviso West product Awvee Storey punched him during a 2006 Dakota Wizards' practice. Second-round pick JamesOn Curry got arrested for public urination and resisting arrest during a 2008 stint with the Iowa Energy.

The last player the Bulls assigned to the Development League, James Johnson, got traded to the Raptors shortly after his recall in February 2011.

Worker bees: The Bulls have lost six of seven games and Derrick Rose for the season. Players dispute they remain in an emotional hangover.

"We have a great coach," Taj Gibson said. "And we have guys who understand that when it's going bad you have to work your way out of it. You can't sit back and whine about it. The East has been up and down. You get two straight wins and you'll be in third or fourth place."

Two losses in this stretch are in overtime, another is by three points and a fourth is by four.

"We have to get better executing down the stretch," Joakim Noah said. "We don't have Derrick. We don't have Nate (Robinson). Different guys have to step up."

Copyright © 2013 Chicago Tribune Company, LLC

  

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PIMPINCHICAGO
Member since Mar 11th 2003
7441 posts
Wed Dec-04-13 01:16 AM

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149. "maybe clearing space for the blockbuster trade..."
In response to Reply # 147


  

          

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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Wed Dec-04-13 12:46 PM

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150. "lol"
In response to Reply # 149


  

          

"Chicago Bulls" & "Blockbuster Trade" have never been used in the same sentence.

https://digife.com

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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Fri Dec-20-13 01:07 PM

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151. "welp."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Bulls are cursed or we have a horrible training staff.

I say it's a little from column A and a little from column B.

https://digife.com

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
20939 posts
Fri Dec-20-13 02:50 PM

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152. "I'm not mad at all right now."
In response to Reply # 151


  

          

Team is gonna play hard. Coaching and heart is what carries us through all of it. But we are at a crossroads and it's time management stopped being cheap asses and realizing we don't have the talent to compete with these teams that have tanked for years, been patient and now that talent is developing.

We need an influx of younger talent. Our talent is worn and aging.

I love our team but as is, even WITH d-rose, it was only a slight chance we could win it all. That road will get even tougher over the next 2 yrs with teams like Clev, Det, Cha, Philly, Orl, Wash, NO, Phx, Port, etc. getting all that talent and it maturing now.

In a perfect world, we prolly miss the playoffs, get a top 10 pick, CHA makes a good run at them but misses the playoffs too and end up with pick #11, Mirotic comes over and is as good as advertised, Booz is traded for future assets and a promising young player and we rent Melo for 3 seasons (Or we bring Lu Back for like 9 mil a year). Getting Melo is a long shot but outside of bringing Lu back, not sure what's out there. Or we need a good trade to happen.

Either way...a change gon come. Question is, will the FO make the right moves for now AND the future.

____________

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Fri Dec-20-13 03:17 PM

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153. "RE: I'm not mad at all right now."
In response to Reply # 152


          


>In a perfect world, we prolly miss the playoffs, get a top 10
>pick, CHA makes a good run at them but misses the playoffs too
>and end up with pick #11, Mirotic comes over and is as good as
>advertised, Booz is traded for future assets and a promising
>young player and we rent Melo for 3 seasons (Or we bring Lu
>Back for like 9 mil a year). Getting Melo is a long shot but
>outside of bringing Lu back, not sure what's out there. Or we
>need a good trade to happen.


I like the Melo idea....And I don't think they are going to re-sign Deng after this season (no matter they are saying in those new reports)....They have to get something for him by the trade deadline....

But really, the Bulls front office just needs to play it like they are making solid franchise moves WITHOUT coming off like they are blatantly tanking...It can be done...But if the Bulls don't make any real moves it's going to be the same ol' shit...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
21925 posts
Fri Dec-20-13 04:28 PM

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154. "this isn't going to happen btw."
In response to Reply # 152
Fri Dec-20-13 04:42 PM by dula dibiasi

  

          

>In a perfect world ... CHA makes a good run at them but misses the
>playoffs too and end up with pick #11

the only way chicago gets charlotte's pick this yr is if the bobcats make the playoffs, which would put it @ #15 at the highest.

the pick is top 10 protected, which this yr in the east is essentially lottery protection. if charlotte misses the playoffs, their record will definitely be one of the league's 10 worst. shit, the 7 and 8 seeds in the east this yr might be bottom 10 teams.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Fri Dec-20-13 07:28 PM

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155. "I said in a perfect world Dula lol"
In response to Reply # 154


  

          

Right now they are at 15. Only 4 teams below them look prime for a run (Knicks, Nets, Pelly's, Griz) but the later two aren't locks with them being in the West. Clev and Bos might challenge them but they'll all end up with similar records. The Lakers might drop with their injuries and Minny is a K-Love injury away from another tank job.

I'm thinking it's a good chance they land between 9-12 so in essence it's a 50/50 shot. Al Jefferson makes them more competitive than they were last year and Cheesy wants to challenge for that 8th seed. Hell they might even make a midseason trade :-O lol

We'll see though but I keep rooting for them every time I see a boxscore.

____________

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Fri Dec-20-13 09:26 PM

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156. "nigga, in a perfect world i'm the meat in a cassie / rihanna sammich."
In response to Reply # 155


  

          

th'fuck?

meanwhile, back on planet earth, there's pretty much no chance that pick falls in the 11-14 range. in all likelihood, all 7 eastern conf lottery teams will be drafting in the top 10. and if charlotte makes the playoffs, the pick can't be higher than 15.

if chicago can get a pick in the 15-20 range from charlotte, have their own pick fall in the top 10, and convince niko to come over next yr for the MLE, their fans should be falling to their fucking knees and thanking god, yeezus and saint tebow. that's pretty much the best case scenario at this point.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
20939 posts
Fri Dec-20-13 10:44 PM

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160. "No chance? "
In response to Reply # 156


  

          

Who died and gave you psychic powers B? What makes you think the west bottom feeders are gonna all top out better than the east? I mean, they DO gotta play all them tough ass teams at the top of their conference waaaaaay more than the East lotto teams do. And Sac and Utah are gonna be worse than Cha. Cha might end up the best team in the lottery in the east (even ahead of us as it's looking). That's 8 fam. Then it's just Mem, Minny, NO and the lakers. Maybe Phx. Given the tough ass west, Cha could finish better than two of those teams.

Last season the top two lotto teams in the east were #11 and 12 in record with 34 wins. I can see the same thing happening this year.

Wouldn't be mad at a top 15 regardless but there is a 'chance' it's higher. Lakers gonna struggle for the next month unless Kendall Marshall Whoo Rides. Mem is in the same boat until Marc gets back and they weren't looking so hot when he WAS playing. Kevin Love misses more than 10 games and it's a wrap for them and NO is still figuring out how to win.

I'm rooting for Cha to make the playoffs though. #15 and us missing the playoffs is fine by me.

____________

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Sat Dec-21-13 10:39 AM

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163. "not happening, breh."
In response to Reply # 160


  

          

AND OF COURSE I'M PSYCHIC DUH

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
8710 posts
Fri Dec-20-13 09:32 PM

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157. "do we not just wait until that pick is unprotected in 2016?"
In response to Reply # 152


  

          

it is unprotected in 2016, right?

not sure if it's worth using next year for a mid first rounder when we can(?) hold out and get that shit unprotected in two years. based on past evidence, we should have faith in charlotte not being good in 2016.

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
21925 posts
Fri Dec-20-13 09:35 PM

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158. "they don't get to choose."
In response to Reply # 157


  

          

if it's outside the top 10 this yr, the bulls get it.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
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Fri Dec-20-13 10:40 PM

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159. " Thanks for clearing that up. "
In response to Reply # 158
Fri Dec-20-13 10:44 PM by RandomFact

  

          

I was always under the assumption that we got to choose.

  

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Benedict the Moor
Member since Dec 06th 2011
1476 posts
Fri Dec-20-13 11:15 PM

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161. "RE: welp."
In response to Reply # 151


  

          

assuming rose's injuries have been anomalous, this is actually the best scenario we could have hoped for.

if his injuries are a trend (more likely) it's the second best scenario.

see, we're used to winning so this season appears tragic, which it is. however, tanking is NEVER fun to watch - and believe me I stopped watching. but keep in mind, none of this matters until the lottery balls fall.

if chicago can snag a top 10 pick AND bring over nikola AND get another mid-first AND get Rose back relatively healthy, you essentially accomplished in a year's time what typically takes at least 3-4 years to pull off.

just keep in mind that our core, as presently constructed, is injury-prone and would never have been fully healthy deep in the playoffs. this way at least you purge a few overrated players (deng, boozer, kirk) while bringing in young, high-ceiling talent.

the best thing to do is just look at boxscores and assume every game is a loss. that way, if they lose you don't care and if they win you can be pleasantly surprised - while continuing to not care.

◦◦◦
http://oi40.tinypic.com/2enp550.jpg
http://i.minus.com/iQBdCzZIftHZ2.gif

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Sun Dec-22-13 12:48 PM

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164. "Whatever happens....."
In response to Reply # 161


          



....the Bulls front office would be committing franchise malpractice if they don't trade Deng while teams are ringing their phone...Can't let him walk for nothing....If you are not going to re-up with him do the smart thing and get something for him...Maybe a trade with Phoenix for some of their picks and a vet with an expiring contract?

Hopefully all these recent reports of the Bulls not trading Deng (who will go down as very important part of the Bulls story post MJ) is just a bluff...

If not? Pax and crew need to be shown the door....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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nighttripper
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Sat Dec-21-13 01:52 AM

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162. "yup, tis the season to catch up on your regular season blackhawks."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
21925 posts
Mon Jan-20-14 12:13 AM

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165. "ppl can be so fucking silly."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

need to get this off my chest.

i'm seeing a lot of bulls fans online in the last 2 weeks describing the picks from the deng trade as "worthless"

"aw man, those picks are worthless, we need a TOP FIVE PICK so we can draft a FRANCHISE GUY, those picks are worthless"

smfh. like teams are lining up to trade away unprotected top 5 picks. (no billy king-o)

do folks even know how cleveland got those 2nd rounders in the first place? they got them from portland, in exchange for allen crabbe, who they drafted with the first pick of the 2nd rd last year. now crabbe hasn't played this yr, due to portland being a really good team w/ a set 9 man rotation, but he was an all-american, and pac 10 player of the yr. most draft boards had him going in the 1st rd.

second rd picks are assets. portland was able to use 2 of them to take a non-guaranteed flyer on a guy with first rd talent. that's not nothing. those are exactly the type of moves that having extra picks allow you to make. the type of moves that smart teams like portland, houston, san antonio, okc etc use to fill in the back end of their rotations with cheap, quality talent. which is even more critical now in the repeater-tax era.

shit, the bulls traded 3 second round picks to get omer asik. is he worthless?

as for the sacramento pick, well, anyone calling a 1st rd pick worthless, in this day and age, is a fucking idiot who just doesn't know what the hell they're talking abt anyway. the bulls almost certainly won't get it this yr (top 12 protected) but it's then top 10 protected for the next 3 yrs. after that, it would turn into a 2nd rounder. which of course is the thing that all the cynical pessimistic armchair GM nerds are choosing to focus on, even tho there's basically a 0% chance that that actually happens (sacramento's drafted top 10 in the last 5 drafts, so we're hypothetically talking abt 9 consecutive top 10 picks, which has never happened in league history)

so that pick could end up being as high as #11

guys that have gone 11 or later in the last half dozen drafts:

hibbert
ibaka
ryan anderson
nic batum
jrue
ty lawson
jeff teague
klay thompson
kawhi leonard
nik vucevic
jeremy lamb
steven adams
jared sullinger
carter-williams
giannis adetokunbo

you telling me the bulls couldn't use any of these guys?

ppl can be so fucking silly.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Jan-20-14 04:04 PM

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167. "RE: ppl can be so fucking silly."
In response to Reply # 165


          


I agree with you, homie....

The power of 2nd round picks should not be dismissed (people only see the shiny toys, dog...U already know...)

But on an entirely different note, I'm still trying to figure out why the Bulls are still trying to win games?....lol

They can't even tank right...Maybe we need to lock Coach Thibs in a closet somewhere....Sheesh...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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FILF
Member since Jun 01st 2007
20180 posts
Mon Jan-20-14 12:36 AM

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166. "Snell & Kawhi are trying to bring back the Cornrows "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

AI would be proud

WHAT'S GOOD *****? What's REALLY good?!?!????!!! Ha HA!
http://40.media.tumblr.com/d8e2daf9f3f37244cd05436bcdf05973/tumblr_mt4qibKq4c1rgam01o1_1280.png

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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Wed Jan-22-14 10:17 PM

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168. "DJ Augustine: 27, 27, 19, 16, 19"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

No matter where you sit on the fence with tanking or making the playoffs, DJ has been balling in January (15ppg).

https://digife.com

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Wed Jan-22-14 11:44 PM

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169. "Easily our long term back up. They can lose Kirk IMO"
In response to Reply # 168


  

          

DJ's a keeper. Needs a multi year deal (2-3 seasons).

I'd take him on a 3-4 mil per basis.

____________

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
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Thu Jan-23-14 03:14 PM

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170. "booz for eric gordon?"
In response to Reply # 168


  

          

yes, please.

http://www.chicagonow.com/chicago-bulls-confidential/2014/01/eric-gordon-to-the-bulls-makes-a-whole-lot-of-sense/

Eric Gordon to the Bulls makes a whole lot of sense
53 comments

By DougThonus, January 15, 2014 at 6:17 am
Eric Gordon to the Bulls makes a whole lot of sense
It's not as sexy as the Kevin Love plan, but since a successful trade requires two teams to agree and a player to want to go to his new destination, we can't hitch our hopes to just one potential move. The Eric Gordon plan seems fraught with peril, but it actually fits awfully well into what the Bulls could do over the next few years.
Seriously, what could be better than building a team around two all-star guards with significant knee problems? Probably several things. However, the appealing part of the Gordon plan is the cost.

The Bulls trade Carlos Boozer for Eric Gordon. Maybe they throw in that iffy Sacramento pick as well, maybe they can keep it out.

The Pelicans are looking to dump Gordon on anyone they can and no one wants to take on his salary. Quite honestly, the Bulls probably don't want to take on his salary either. However, if the trade is Boozer for Gordon, they aren't really taking on so much.

Gordon will make around 30 million over the next two seasons, subtract off Boozers 16.8 million and that's just an extra commitment of 13 million. Given the Bulls may plan to amnesty Boozer and would likely have to pay him around 12 million not to play for the team, the Bulls real commitment becomes an extra 18 million for two years of Gordon vs nothing.

In effect, if the Bulls can pull off this trade, their real cost is Eric Gordon at nine million a year with likely no other change to their on court personnel. When put under the financial microscope that way, the deal doesn't look so bad anymore. Sure, I have concerns that Gordon can stay healthy just as I do Rose.

I also have concerns over his performance as he's averaging a career low in points. That said, his efficiency is up (54.6% TS% and 44% FGS 40% 3pt%), he can create shots, and he can hit the long ball. His defense next to Rose might be questionable as the Bulls would have a small back court, but the defensive battle is mostly won or lost by your interior players.

The move also keeps the Bulls above the cap which means they'll have to bring Nikola Mirotic over with the MLE. There's been some concern that the MLE might not be enough, but I can't think of any European prospect that's even gotten that much money to come over before, so I think it should work fine.

For Mirotic, the upside is that if he becomes a good NBA player he's making 15 million a year in four years rather, and the sooner he starts that cycle the better off he is. Even if five million just breaks him even with what he's doing in Europe, it's a peak there while his upside in the NBA dramatically better.

In short, I think the MLE will get it done.

The Bulls lineup in this scenario looks pretty darn good.

PG: Rose, Augustin
SG: Gordon, Butler
SF: Butler, Dunleavy
PF: Mirotic, Gibson
C: Noah

The Bulls will have multiple picks in the draft where they might find another big man (though you always should draft best player available), or they'll need to fill that back up center spot with the veteran minimum.

Is this the sexiest lineup imaginable? No, perhaps not. However, this lineup fixes several considerable problems the Bulls have had in the past. First, Gordon, Dunleavy, and Mirotic are dangerous three point shooters which gives the Bulls the option to truly open up spacing on the court. Even with Butler in the group the Bulls will have plenty of shooting and should have far more space to run their offense.

Gordon can create his own shot, so the Bulls won't be reliant on Rose to create so much offense anymore and should have someone who can shred defenses off the dribble in a double team rather than just hoping to find an open shooter off the double team.

Also, this lineup will keep the Bulls under the cap and create a ton of cap space in 2016 when Kevin Durant becomes a free agent. Maybe getting Kevin Durant is a pipe dream, a lot of things would need to fall correctly for it to be a possibility, that said, you might as well leave yourself open to the possibility now rather than closing it off early.

In the worst case scenario, Gordon doesn't work out in year one, he becomes a large contract to match against a star player in a trade the following year. If the Bulls can't do Love this year, they could potentially use Gordon as part of a deal for Love the following year .

I don't view Eric Gordon as a star player, but his skills, when healthy, lineup very well with what the Bulls need. His contract fits into what the Bulls would want to do, and his asking price might just be the exact price the Bulls can most afford to pay.

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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173. "Wouldn't Gordon's extra year.."
In response to Reply # 170


  

          

...keep us from signing Mirotic?

We'd have...

Rose
Noah
Gibson
Gordon
Bench
Rookie contracts

I don't think there's any room to sign Mirotic at that point.
I thought that was the point of the Deng trade, to free up money so they could bring him over.

https://digife.com

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
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Fri Jan-24-14 03:12 PM

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174. "i guess it depends"
In response to Reply # 173
Fri Jan-24-14 03:13 PM by RandomFact

  

          

if we can contend jr is supposed to go into the tax.

trade should be a no brainer though. unfortunately jimmy can't shoot so we need to upgrade that position. slide jimmy to sf and hope mirotic brings his shooting touch with him to the states.

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Fri Jan-24-14 11:28 AM

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171. "tony snell's mom tho."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

lolz.

http://thestarters.nba.com/tony-snells-mom-still-braids-his-hair/

Tony Snell’s Mom Still Braids His Hair
Trey Kerby , on January 23, 2014 , 3:00PM

We’ve all heard story after story after story about an NBA player getting to the league, setting up shop in whatever city his team plays in and then bringing along family and friends to ease the transition from college to the pros. That’s well-worn territory at this point.

However, most NBA rookies these days don’t have cornrows, as the pre-eminent look of the early 2000s has unfortunately faded from popularity in the past few years. But that’s where these two stories converge, as Tony Snell is that rare rookie who both has cornrows and a support system around him to make NBA life easier. “Why do the cornrows matter?,” you might be wondering. Well, because of this, from ChicagoSide Sports:

...

http://chicagosidesports.com/for-bulls-tony-snell-mama-knows-best/#

(Sherika Brown, Tony Snell's mother) and the rest of the family have since re-located to Chicago. Snell is spending his first NBA season living with his family in Highland Park — not quite Beverly Hills, but getting there. Mom makes him breakfast every morning (pancakes and eggs, no bacon), and braids his hair twice a week.

He plans to move out on his own next season, to a place of his own in the city.

“I have to grow up sooner or later,” he says, “and cut my hair.”

...

As a bro who is very close with his own mother, and who let his mom do his hair for the first 20-something years of his life, let me just say that I whole-heartedly endorse this. Not only is it very cost-conscious (especially for twice-a-week braiding sessions), but I think we can all agree that finding and having a hairdresser whom you are comfortable with can be a bit of a challenge. A challenge, however, that’s completely negated when said hairdresser is your own mom. It really makes it easy to get things fixed if you’re unhappy with your do. Trust me.

Not to mention, it should be mentioned that Tony Snell’s mom just seems awesome in general. To wit:

...

Brown had never been on a plane until she flew to Albuquerque to do a campus visit with Snell.

“I don’t believe in planes,” she said. “It was the scariest s–t in my life. Have you ever been on a plane with someone for the first time, and they are ‘aw’-ing and ‘oooh’-ing? I was so f—ing afraid.”

And also:

His performance in Las Vegas cemented it, but he would have to clear one final hurdle, an aggressive push by then-Lobo coach Steve Alford to keep his best shooter on the team for another season. According to Brown, when Alford heard Snell was leaning to the NBA, he angrily called a meeting with player and mother.



Brown inferred selfish motives in Alford’s efforts. Alford was the brand-name player, the white All-American with the charmed high school and college careers. He played his senior year at Indiana and ended up getting drafted in the second round.

“I called him a m———–r at the time,” says Brown.

...

Mrs. Quotes over here, getting all the zings in. Love it. I mean, it’s hard to blame Tony Snell for living with his mom when she’s this funny and also serves as his own personal braidstress. Seems like the total package mom-wise, as far as I’m concerned.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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temps2020
Member since Oct 21st 2003
8780 posts
Fri Jan-24-14 11:54 AM

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172. "Tony replaced Malice as the other member of The Clipse"
In response to Reply # 171


  

          

  

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mashpg89
Member since Dec 08th 2004
2867 posts
Fri Jan-24-14 03:59 PM

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175. "She also said Tony was a virgin in another interview"
In response to Reply # 171


  

          

That's about as "mom, you're embarassing me" as it gets.

I hope he moves out soon, it could help his game a lot.

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
20939 posts
Sun Jan-26-14 03:31 AM

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176. "He should be the #1 Target for the Bulls this offseason."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Him on the team NOW makes us neck and neck with Miami and Indy. And that's WITHOUT Rose. Add two mid first round picks (ours and likely Cha's), Mirotic, resign DJ and we're rocking and rolling next year. Rose being healthy would be the cherry on top. Granted it's far from a reality right now but even knowing it's a possibility is exciting.

http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/01/25/report-if-carmelo-anthony-leaves-new-york-he-is-leaning-toward-chicago/?ocid=Yahoo&partner=ya5nbcs


Report: If Carmelo Anthony leaves New York, he is leaning toward Chicago

Kurt Helin
Jan 25, 2014, 6:29 PM EST

In the end, I still believe that Carmelo Anthony will be a New York Knick next season. When he surveys all his options, he will choose Manhattan, he will choose to go down as a Knicks’ legend.

But ‘Melo is going to look at his options closely. His amazing 62-point performance aside, the 16-27 Knicks’ struggles are clearly wearing on him — it doesn’t help the Knicks are largely locked into this same roster next season. The idea that ‘Melo could leave as a free agent this summer has shifted from “no way he leaves” to “he has to consider his options.”

Anthony knows those options and if he bolts he’s thinking about Chicago not Los Angeles, reports Adrian Wojnarowski at Yahoo Sports.

The losing, the decaying roster, has inspired ‘Melo to consider closely the possibilities of free agency this summer. Within the past several weeks, a longtime confidant of Carmelo Anthony confesses, something changed. Never did he believe there was a chance Anthony would leave the New York Knicks – never the Madison Square Garden stage, never the $129 million contract extension.

Only now, the gloom of the Knicks’ season – the uncertainty of the franchise’s future – left that man to believe it’s possible Anthony could leave New York in free agency.

“Chicago is much more in play for him than L.A.,” the source said.

While the Lakers will have the cap space and likely would have a conversation with Anthony, the interest on their end isn’t as strong as some rumors suggest. They understand that a Kobe Bryant/’Melo team, with not much around that pair (they will be over the cap and not able to spend much on role players) is not going far in a deep West, nor is it building for the long term. That doesn’t even touch on the fact they would need to change coaches again. Expect the Lakers to be more aggressive in 2015 and beyond when they can go after players such as Kevin Love.

The Bulls are a more interesting fit. Chicago will have the cap space to sign Anthony after the Luol Deng trade and if they amnesty Carlos Boozer as expected (plus make a couple other small moves).

If you are going to win a title with Anthony on your team you need a strong point guard who can make sure the workload is shared and Anthony doesn’t become a black hole. The Bulls have Derrick Rose. Your team also needs a strong team commitment to defense and a big who can erase mistakes, because while Anthony has tried harder on defense the last couple seasons he’s still not good. The Bulls are the prototype of team defense. You need to be able to play Anthony at the four, which Chicago could do. ‘Melo would be an interesting fit in Chi-town.

I’m still not sold that the Tom Thibodeau/Anthony marriage would go well. I’m not sold the Rose/Anthony marriage goes all that well. I’m certainly not sold Anthony wants to leave being the guy at the center of the New York spotlight. I’m not sure he wants to leave that max guaranteed year of salary on the table (the Knicks can offer five years, the Bulls just four).

But it sounds like Anthony is going to seriously consider that option.

____________

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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177. "Like I said to dula.."
In response to Reply # 176


  

          

Will Carmelo take a massive pay cut to play in Chicago? (i say no)
More than that, will GarPaxDorf pay him? (again, I say no)
Besides, signing Melo means we'd have to do something with our core no?
At the very least there's no way we could sign Mirotic too.

We'd have to amnesty Boozer AND do something with either Gibson or Noah, right?
I stated it in the other post and here, I hope it doesn't happen.

https://digife.com

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Mon Jan-27-14 01:05 AM

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179. "RE: Like I said to dula.."
In response to Reply # 177


  

          

>Will Carmelo take a massive pay cut to play in Chicago? (i
>say no)

If he wants to lose his way to retirement, then I agree with you. Seeing Bron and co. take pay cuts to get 2 rings might motivate him to take the chance. Not to mention, if he does win, there's $ that will come with that (endorsements).

>More than that, will GarPaxDorf pay him? (again, I say no)

If the goal is championship next season (and for at least 2 after that), yes. He just dropped 62 in a game...best advertising he could do for a frugal Bulls team only willing to spend on a title team.

>Besides, signing Melo means we'd have to do something with our
>core no?

Not 100% on the particulars but only a few minor moves would need to be made but with losing Lu and Booz this summer, we'd be in a good spot to sign him out right.

>At the very least there's no way we could sign Mirotic too.

We have a midlevel exception (5.4 mil or so) from a prior trade that we can use to sign Mirotic. They say that was one of the motivators behind the Deng deal. Since trading Lu got us under the cap, we get the full midlevel as opposed to the tax-payer one. They want that to sign Mirotic and avoid it hitting the cap number (again, I'm not 100% certain how all this works but I'm thinking they clear the cap to sign melo, use the midlevel on Mirotic and then sign DJ to an extension since he's already on the roster and that would drive us over the cap but we can do so to sign our own free agents).

>We'd have to amnesty Boozer AND do something with either
>Gibson or Noah, right?

See above.

>I stated it in the other post and here, I hope it doesn't
>happen.

Well, I'm not with you on this one fam. Melo is exactly what we need and there are no other options for next season and 2015 is even more iffy (everyone will be throwing the kitchen sink at K-Love). Outside of stealing Lance away from Indy, I'm not sure we have a ton of FA upgrade options.

____________

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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Mon Jan-27-14 12:51 PM

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181. "RE: Like I said to dula.."
In response to Reply # 179
Mon Jan-27-14 01:01 PM by LeroyBumpkin

  

          

>Not 100% on the particulars but only a few minor moves would
>need to be made but with losing Lu and Booz this summer, we'd
>be in a good spot to sign him out right.

IF he takes a pay cut.

They want that to sign Mirotic and avoid it
>hitting the cap number (again, I'm not 100% certain how all
>this works but I'm thinking they clear the cap to sign melo,
>use the midlevel on Mirotic and then sign DJ to an extension
>since he's already on the roster and that would drive us over
>the cap but we can do so to sign our own free agents).

Mirotic is another player that would need to take a pay cut. Bulls can only pay a certain percentage of his buyout from Real Madrid. After that it's on Mirotic to pay it.

In a perfect world we'd keep DJ and send Hinrich off, but I think DJ will go to the highest bidder. From his perspective, he went from being waived to a starter playing solid minutes on a playoff team. I know there are some NBA GM's out there that are salivating at his play lately. I don't think the Bulls can keep DJ with the midlevel. I hope they try, but I don't think it'll happen. He's just playing too well.

>Well, I'm not with you on this one fam. Melo is exactly what
>we need and there are no other options for next season and
>2015 is even more iffy (everyone will be throwing the kitchen
>sink at K-Love). Outside of stealing Lance away from Indy,
>I'm not sure we have a ton of FA upgrade options.

I'd rather see the Bulls go after Lance Stephenson. He's younger and cheaper. Like dula, maxing out a 34 year old Carmelo kinda worries me. Don't get me wrong, Carmelo definitely alleviates Rose from having to score everything on his own, but I think the deal cripples the franchise.

https://digife.com

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Mon Jan-27-14 01:53 PM

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183. "RE: Like I said to dula.."
In response to Reply # 181
Mon Jan-27-14 01:55 PM by auragin_boi

  

          

>IF he takes a pay cut.

It's not a cut in the sense of annual salary, it's a cut in the sense of years (we can't offer as many years). Losing Boozer's salary (15), Kirk's (4) and Nazr and Shengelia (1.5) gives us roughly what Melo is making this year in cap space. There's his contract (4yrs @ 80+ mil or whatever). The guys I listed are all coming off the books this summer (Booz via amnesty).

>Mirotic is another player that would need to take a pay cut.
>Bulls can only pay a certain percentage of his buyout from
>Real Madrid. After that it's on Mirotic to pay it.

This is the case regardless of Melo coming or not. But the bulls now have the entire midlevel to use on him (5.15 mil...I did some research), instead of the taxpayer portion (3.09). And given the buyout will likely only affect the first season, Mirotic may accept the deal given 3-4 years.

>In a perfect world we'd keep DJ and send Hinrich off, but I
>think DJ will go to the highest bidder. From his perspective,
>he went from being waived to a starter playing solid minutes
>on a playoff team. I know there are some NBA GM's out there
>that are salivating at his play lately. I don't think the
>Bulls can keep DJ with the midlevel. I hope they try, but I
>don't think it'll happen. He's just playing too well.

Well Kirk is likely gone cuz of his contract expiring. Yeah and Nate did last season what DJ is doing right now, and Nate's more explosive. Yet Nate got EXACTLY what the bulls could have afforded to pay him but chose not to pursue (and it took a WHILE for Nate to get a deal). I think they like DJ's character more and will offer him that. The Market for DJ ain't as broad as you might think. We offer him a reasonable deal (2.5-4 mil over 2-3 years) and I think he'd take it (and it'd be on par for what the market would offer him also...what team in the NBA really NEEDS a PG like that?).

>I'd rather see the Bulls go after Lance Stephenson. He's
>younger and cheaper. Like dula, maxing out a 34 year old
>Carmelo kinda worries me. Don't get me wrong, Carmelo
>definitely alleviates Rose from having to score everything on
>his own, but I think the deal cripples the franchise.

Younger and Cheaper doesn't put us in the finals. I like Lance and wouldn't mind him as a consolation but I'd feel like we'd need to add one more guy around that same salary (10 mil or so) to nail what we could do in one signing with Melo. Also, Melo at 34 doesn't scare me for 3 reasons:

1-Melo's game isn't predicated on athleticism. So it'll translate better as he gets older. I mean Paul Pierce (who has a similar type game but less explosive) was 34 two years ago and was still putting up his career numbers.

2-Potentially getting two mid-first round picks this year AND Mirotic. Those guys should all be coming into their own in 3 seasons (not to mention Snell). Which would avoid us having to overpay Jimmy also.

3-Noah would likely be off the books or resigned at a lower rate as his deal expires first. So we'd have a little wiggle room if needed and hell, Melo could be trade bait that summer so we could lose both contracts if we needed to.

I'd much rather be an immediate favorite next year and the year after than simply a contender for the same period. Lance isn't a scorer, he's an all around player (basically Lu with a handle and better passing ability). He'd get us close. Melo would put us front and center for at least 3 seasons.

____________

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
21925 posts
Wed Jan-29-14 12:18 PM

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184. "that's not how it works."
In response to Reply # 183


  

          

>It's not a cut in the sense of annual salary, it's a cut in
>the sense of years (we can't offer as many years). Losing
>Boozer's salary (15), Kirk's (4) and Nazr and Shengelia (1.5)
>gives us roughly what Melo is making this year in cap space.
>There's his contract (4yrs @ 80+ mil or whatever). The guys I
>listed are all coming off the books this summer (Booz via
>amnesty).

the bulls are over the cap. when a team's payroll is over the salary cap, "X" amount of dollars in expiring contracts doesn't automatically open up the same amount of available cap space to sign free agents.

unless the bulls make trades, they're not going to have $20M in cap space available this summer, or anything close to that. carmelo would definitely have to take a sizable cut in annual salary to sign with them.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
20939 posts
Wed Jan-29-14 01:16 PM

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186. "Just took a look at the rules and yeah, you're right "
In response to Reply # 184
Wed Jan-29-14 01:22 PM by auragin_boi

  

          

http://data.shamsports.com/content/pages/data/salaries/bulls.jsp

Assuming the Cap is about 59 mil next year (it's a little under that number now) adding in Teague's trade to Brooklyn and Booz's 16.8 mil for next season and the Amnesty of Booz + the expirings would get us about 12-13 mil under the soft cap number.

A few other minor moves could push it to 13-14.

Most obvious move would be to trade Taj but a secondary move would be to Move Dunny, Murphy and Rip's residual contract for an extra 4.5 (approx.). They could also trade Mirotic after assigning him the MLE (I think, it's slippery how this works. I think the timing of the Booz amnesty factors in here).

That's 17-18 mil. So yeah we'd need to rebuild the bench but we could find a way to get relatively close to the number we need for Melo. We could sign DJ after the Melo deal is finalized as he's our FA.

Another option could be a sign and trade...The Knicks might want to Rent Booz for the year/use him in a midseason trade as his contract would expire next summer OR trade Booz to a team with an expiring for this summer...someone with a higher salary (Pau?) so there's that. The last option would likely require a multi-team deal to move Booz and free up about 20 mil for us and an exception might need to be included (though Pau/Booz straight up works...Lakers prolly wouldn't do it though, at least not without a draft pick).

Yeah, this would take some magic to pull off.

____________

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
21925 posts
Wed Jan-29-14 02:15 PM

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189. "as it stands, they'll have a little under 12M available"
In response to Reply # 186


  

          

2014-15 salary cap - 62,900,000 (projected)

assume they renounce the rights to all their own FAs (hinrich, augustin, mohammed, james, martin) and waive murphy (2nd rd pick, non guaranteed contract)

that leaves

rose - 18,862,876
boozer - 16,800,000
noah - 12,200,000
gibson - 8,000,000
dunleavy - 3,326,235
butler - 2,008,748
snell - 1,472,400
hamilton - 333,334 (last yr of contract waived in 2013, $1M cap hit spread over 3 yrs using stretch provision, this isn't tradeable btw)

7 players - 63,003,593

assuming boozer is amnestied

6 players - 46,203,593

2014 draft picks, based on current records

#15 pick - 1,546,100 (from charlotte)
#18 pick - 1,325,600

8 players - 49,075,293

4 cap holds for empty roster spots - 2,029,344 (4 x rookie scale min salary of 507,336)

for a total of 51,104,637, meaning about $11.8M in cap space. since they're under the cap, they'd also have the "room" mid-level exception, which for 14-15 is about $2.7M.

carmelo is eligible for a 1st yr salary of up to 22,458,401. so yeah, even if he came down from that slightly, chicago still has a lot more work to do, as far as having a realistic shot at signing him.

there are moves -- trading MDJ midseason for expiring money, using the draft on overseas "stash" players or just flipping the picks outright for futures or selling them for cash -- that could carve out a bit more space, but the most obvious would just be to move gibson. kind of risky to just give a guy like that away tho, for a relatively small chance @ a free agent signing.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sun Jan-26-14 07:54 PM

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178. "RE: He should be the #1 Target for the Bulls this offseason."
In response to Reply # 176


          

>Him on the team NOW makes us neck and neck with Miami and
>Indy. And that's WITHOUT Rose.

Let's turn it down, dog....lol

U already know I want Melo...He would be perfect on the Bulls...But in order for us to beat the likes of Miami and Indy we need Rose to at least be able to stay on the floor...

Without that we would be a second round out even with Melo...The good thing about having Melo though is Rose would no longer have to be MVP Rose...But dude has to at least be healthy enough to play more than 20 plus games in a season...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Mon Jan-27-14 01:12 AM

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180. "Healthy Rose puts us top 3 in the league easy"
In response to Reply # 178


  

          

Melo on this team right today? The guy putting up 27/9/3 and a steal on 45% shooting and 42% from 3? The team that's currently 5th in the east and one game back of 3rd?

Him + us right today puts us on par with Indy and Miami. Our defense makes us tough and he'd basically be replacing Rose's production as our star and we thought we'd be contenders THIS season.

Not saying it'd be a guarantee but I'd call it a toss up.

WITH Rose (and the youth infusion of two late lotto/mid teens draft picks, Mirotic, DJ back, a year of development under Snell's belt and Jimmy fully accustomed to his new role), we'd have to be the fav's.

____________

  

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PIMPINCHICAGO
Member since Mar 11th 2003
7441 posts
Mon Jan-27-14 01:35 PM

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182. "did you not see the playoffs last year?"
In response to Reply # 178


  

          

We had no Rose or Deng and we got with NJ and Miami Mollywhopped us but you are discrediting Thibodeau and his system.


The players in the league see it.


Any PG and 2 that can score and is willing to commit to the defensive team concept can get money.


First it was John Lucas and last time it was Nate, now it's DJ. There are countless plug and play scorers that can get money in our system


Melo here playing PF and or the 3 with Taj at the 4 creates a hell of a matchup problem. Butler and Snell will get money with 2 other players commanding a double team.


  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Wed Jan-29-14 01:47 PM

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188. "RE: did you not see the playoffs last year?"
In response to Reply # 182
Wed Jan-29-14 01:50 PM by murph71

          

>We had no Rose or Deng and we got with NJ and Miami
>Mollywhopped us but you are discrediting Thibodeau and his
>system.
>
>
>The players in the league see it.
>
>
>Any PG and 2 that can score and is willing to commit to the
>defensive team concept can get money.
>
>
>First it was John Lucas and last time it was Nate, now it's
>DJ. There are countless plug and play scorers that can get
>money in our system
>
>
>Melo here playing PF and or the 3 with Taj at the 4 creates a
>hell of a matchup problem. Butler and Snell will get money
>with 2 other players commanding a double team.


U guys are not hearing me....I WANT MELO...lol

In fact, we would be a vastly better team with Melo...We would not be 10 games under .500 with Melo...We would be a top 4-5 team with Melo...And if Rose is even 75 percent we will be a contending team....

But u guys are making jump off assumptions here...U still need a second guy in order to beat the likes of Miami and Indy...And that's the question mark...Can Rose even stay on the floor to be that second guy...?

I could care less what we did against a weak minded Brooklyn team last season...And while it's cool to see what DJ is doing we should all turn it down...DJ is a journey man for a reason...I would love DJ as a back-up...He can help Rose cut down those crazy minutes that Thibs like to play...And if DJ is starting in the playoffs he will def. do damage against teams like Brooklyn, the Knicks, ect...

But Miami and Indy are on another level...

Bring on Melo!...Hell, I want this team to tank so we can really make some things happen...But Rose is still the X-factor IN THE PLAYOFFS when it comes to Indy and Miami....Not what we do against Brooklyn or Atlanta....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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DVS
Member since Sep 13th 2002
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Wed Jan-29-14 12:37 PM

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185. "Melo for Boozer via the God Doug Thonus"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://www.chicagonow.com/chicago-bulls-confidential/2014/01/carmelo-anthony-via-carlos-boozer-the-only-way-to-have-a-chance/

Carmelo Anthony via Carlos Boozer, the only way to have a chance
54 comments

By DougThonus, Monday at 6:24 am
Carmelo Anthony via Carlos Boozer, the only way to have a chance
While the Bulls have opened up some room under the cap this summer, I've noted several times that the bar to using this cap space to bring in a max player is so high that Chicago shouldn't even really consider the idea. However, using Carlos Boozer as a trade chip, technically remaining above the cap, and then having more exceptions might allow the Bulls to pursue big time free agents including Carmelo Anthony.
Prerequisites to a Melo trade

1: Melo had to tell New York he's not coming back and make them believe it.
2: Melo has to limit the destination to Chicago and one other team that can take him without New York's help in order to force New York to accept that he's leaving.
3: The Bulls have to outbid that other team.
4: The Knicks will have to be willing to stomach one year of Carlos Boozer
5: Melo has to ultimately choose the Bulls

How this could possibly work

First, looking at the top five things, it's a long list, but all of them are reasonable. I think New York probably expects Melo to bolt. A source recently came out and identified the Bulls and Lakers as two teams he'd be into going to, and listed the Bulls as favorites. The Knicks don't seem like a team scared of taking on some salary in order to improve themselves, they have massive, massive amounts of revenue.

The Lakers qualify as "the other team to apply leverage" as they have room to sign Melo to a max deal, however, L.A., while having cap room, won't have much of anything useful to give up for Melo unless they're willing to part with their draft pick in this draft (unlikely if it's a star potential player).

Chicago offers up Carlos Boozer, their first, Charlotte's first, and the 1st rounder from the Kings acquired as part of the Luol Deng trade for Carmelo Anthony. While none of the first round picks projects into a star player, New York is bereft of draft picks to build around if they get rid of Anthony, getting three firsts for him will allow the front office to hit the reset button and start building through the draft again.

They'll be able to fill in the cheap type of role players that will allow them to build a talented team and still have some cap room available to make a big splash the next chance they get or possibly get their own star through one of their own picks later or a surprise player from one of these selections.

It's not a great offer, but it's probably better than what teams will typically get for a star who's leaving as a FA either way where there isn't a ton of leverage. The trick to limiting the Knicks leverage is the threat of the other team to pry Melo away without the Knicks help.

What this leaves the Bulls

Player 2014/2015
Derrick Rose $18,862,876
Carmelo Anthony $22,000,000
Joakim Noah $12,200,000
Taj Gibson $8,000,000
Mike Dunleavy Jr $3,326,235
Jimmy Butler $2,008,748
Tony Snell $1,472,400
Richard Hamilton buyout $333,334
Nikola Mirotic $5,000,000
Vet min x5 $4,576,215
Total $77,779,808
Projected Tax $76,000,000
The Bulls are over the projected luxury tax line by almost two million dollars, probably not all that big a deal in the grand scheme of things. They could also potentially drop the minimum salary commitment by getting rookie 2nd rounders (I've slotted in 3rd year vet minimum players which is the amount any player going into his third year or longer would receive).

The Bulls could also offer D.J. Augustin the Bi-Annual exception which would add two a shade over a million dollars on top of this number. I think D.J. will demand more than that on the open market, and while I'm sure he's appreciative of his opportunity in Chicago, he'll likely be thinking that this window of opportunity won't look quite so good with Rose back next year. Certainly not good enough to take a smaller offer to stay.

The Bulls would still need to find a back up center and a back up point guard. However, if Mirotic translates this team might be the best team the Bulls have fielded in the post-Jordan era even if Rose never comes back to superstar levels. If he does, it's trivially the best team.

The Bulls could have three premier offensive threats in Rose, Melo, and Mirotic if all goes well. If they're still able to bring a similar caliber defense that they've done in the past, they'll finally have the multi-faceted offense to attack their opponents with multiple players that can create for themselves and multiple players who can shoot the three at the same time.

Shot creation, three point shooting, spacing, and depth... It could all be there for the Bulls.

It would remain to be seen if Rose could make a full come back, whether Carmelo can learn to be an effective team player, and whether Mirotic could translate, but it's a team that could potentially become a title favorite instead of a "puncher's chance" type of squad.

It won't be easy to pull off, but Carmelo Anthony via trade might be the Bulls best shot at a title in the next three seasons.

vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv

Waldorf and Statler Vol 4:CONAN IS OUT NOW!!!: http://waldorfandstatler.bandcamp.com

and don't forget to check "DVS 4 ALDERMAN"

http://windimoto.bandcamp.com/album/dvs-4-alderman-bandcamp-exclusive-expanded-editio

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
20939 posts
Wed Jan-29-14 01:29 PM

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187. "I literally just detailed this lol"
In response to Reply # 185


  

          

I like everything here minus giving up 3 picks. I'd want to keep at least CHA's pick this year and with Melo locked in to leave, NY wouldn't have a much better deal (hopefully lol).

____________

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Wed Jan-29-14 02:46 PM

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190. "man, that ain't happening. lolz."
In response to Reply # 187


  

          

they'd have to throw every pick they own on the table for the knicks to even consider this.

lmao. and you call reinsdorf stingy.





>I like everything here minus giving up 3 picks. I'd want to
>keep at least CHA's pick this year and with Melo locked in to
>leave, NY wouldn't have a much better deal (hopefully lol).

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Thu Jan-30-14 01:47 PM

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191. "Dula you be killing my dreams left and right"
In response to Reply # 190
Thu Jan-30-14 01:48 PM by auragin_boi

  

          

Let the bulls do it fam!!! lol


See, now I'm nervous because they let Lu go and even an Amnesty of Booz won't get us the space we need to get a guy who can really take the load off Rose without us losing other assets (I really don't wanna lose Taj if we let Carlos go).

And I don't think we can pry Lance away from Indy.

Rose + 2 mid first rounders + Mirotic is ok but I doubt we end up in the finals toting that out against Indiana or Miami next season.


Ugh! I'm just gonna cross my fingers and pray to the Lord Allahovabudda that GarPax FINALLY makes an explosive move that doesn't cripple our core in the process.

____________

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Tue Feb-04-14 06:53 PM

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192. "paxson on waddle and silvy :"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://espn.go.com/espnradio/chicago/play?id=10371655

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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Tue Feb-04-14 08:10 PM

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193. "Melo for Deng, Gibson, Boozer & Mirotic."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Best column I've read on what a trade for Carmelo would cost the Bulls.

Counting the Cost of a Carmelo Anthony Trade
http://bullsbythehorns.com/raging-bull-counting-cost-carmelo-anthony-trade/

Not the whole article, but I thought this was interesting:

"That’s what’s happened with the other teams that have failed. They put too much stock in their starting five, assemble a ragtag bench, and the teams get so top-heavy they can’t sustain an injury. Then, when the injuries happen, they collapse.

Depth matters, and gutting your bench for a superstar has been counter-productive of late. That’s why I said earlier, the injuries aren’t really a good reason to excuse the teams who made trade struggling now. They put themselves in this position by the trades they made.

Think of it this way: If you were Gar Forman before the Deng trade, and you got a call from the Knicks offering Anthony for Deng, Gibson, Boozer and Mirotic, would you take it? Because in effect, that’s what you’re giving up to sign Anthony."

https://digife.com

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Tue Feb-04-14 08:15 PM

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194. "RE: Melo for Deng, Gibson, Boozer & Mirotic."
In response to Reply # 193


          

>Best column I've read on what a trade for Carmelo would cost
>the Bulls.
>
>Counting the Cost of a Carmelo Anthony Trade
>http://bullsbythehorns.com/raging-bull-counting-cost-carmelo-anthony-trade/
>
>Not the whole article, but I thought this was interesting:
>
>"That’s what’s happened with the other teams that have failed.
>They put too much stock in their starting five, assemble a
>ragtag bench, and the teams get so top-heavy they can’t
>sustain an injury. Then, when the injuries happen, they
>collapse.


This part^^^^made me laugh considering that's been happening to Bulls even with a strong ass bench....

Injuries...Collapse....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Tue Feb-04-14 08:42 PM

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195. "kelly scaletta is probably my favorite bulls writer right now."
In response to Reply # 193


  

          

his positions are always reasoned, well thought out and articulated, even the ones i don't agree with.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Wed Feb-05-14 03:22 PM

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196. "This is kinda exaggerated though"
In response to Reply # 193


  

          

They were prolly gonna lose Deng anyway because they didn't want to pay him.

It's a 50/50 shot they can even get Mirotic over here this season. And there's no guarantee his game will translate here either.

Booz is gone for financial reasons (so trading him for Melo wouldn't be the end of the world).

Taj would be the only REAL loss in this scenario as he's primed to start next year.

Personally, I'm at the point where I think we pitch Melo on winning (we have the coach to do it, the roster gives max effort almost every night, I doubt Rose goes down with another major injury...or at least I hope so and we'd have a youth infusion). We let him decide if it's more important to him to get 14-15 mil a year as opposed 22-23 mil a year (Wade, Bron & Bosh sacrificed and won) or win a title, which would supplement his income nicely anyway with endorsements. Hell, maybe even load the contract with incentives that would help to make him whole (if possible to do so...they did it with Taj's deal).

If he decides it's not worth it, you move on with the picks, Mirotic if he comes and use the left over cap space to sign/trade for a guy who might breakout/mid-tier scorer (if possible).

Losing Taj, Booz and Deng and ONLY getting Melo is an L. Keep Taj and it's a much better move.

____________

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Fri Feb-07-14 05:58 PM

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197. "this melo plan just doesn't feel like a realistic option to me."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

i think i'm for it, and i know there are ways to make the math work on paper, but for whatever reason it just doesn't seem realistic.

now, amnestying boozer, signing mirotic and stephenson, bringing augustin back and drafting a backup center? that feels way more realistic.

luckily the bulls are in a situation where they have more than one way they can go.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
8710 posts
Fri Feb-07-14 06:45 PM

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198. "smallish market mentality and blue-collarism"
In response to Reply # 197
Fri Feb-07-14 06:48 PM by RandomFact

  

          

our reality should be based in this.

> but for whatever reason it just doesn't
>seem realistic.

> and drafting a backup center?

bringing back nazr was a cheap, lazy, and detrimental move. it was clear he didn't belong in the league last year. i'm angry about this.

rose/dj
lance/?
buckets/snell
taj/mirotic (maybe start mirotic if he's good)
noah/serviceable backup/taj

this lineup would be fine to compete for a titile with granted rose comes back at like 90% of his old self and mirotic is as advertised.

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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Sat Feb-08-14 02:03 AM

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199. "I like this plan."
In response to Reply # 198


  

          

It may be conservative, but I just don't think the risk of Melo is worth it
(auragin, I know you're about to say you have to take risks to get that ring...ha).
I get that. But if Melo doesn't work out? Like he suddenly regresses and averages 15 a game and can't defend?
The Bulls are screwed.

Is it because Melo fits a need that we're so blinded by other less risky options?

https://digife.com

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Sun Feb-09-14 03:21 PM

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200. "Here's my thing..."
In response to Reply # 197
Sun Feb-09-14 03:24 PM by auragin_boi

  

          

Rose's people already grumbled about the level of help he has on offense. Low key, I think that's why they think he's getting injured so much. For the bulls to win like 55-60 games, Rose has to 'carry' the offense. Not to mention, it was rumored his people suggested going after Melo a yr or two ago. Add to that, the fact that Melo has always had Chicago high on his list of teams he'd like to play for (go back and read when he was leaving the nuggets) and there's already been scuttlebutt this season about the Bulls and Lakers being his preferred destinations if he leaves NY with us at the top of the list.

I know, rumors but where there's smoke...

I'm not sure how MUCH Melo wants to win but after watching Bosh, Wade and Bron sacrifice $$$ to get rings, I think Melo's at the point where he'd consider taking a cut for likely his next to last contract if the situation is right. He's made more than all 3 of those guys while they've been contenders so maybe he feels like he got his $$ and it's time to win. Slim chance I know, but possible.

A big move needs to happen. We haven't had one in years. I don't think you hurt the core to make that move but it's worth exploring (I think the front office feels like I do).

Melo's expressed interest in winning a title and wants to explore his options this summer. He WANTS to see if he can find a better situation. That alone says he should be priority 1.

Secondly, everyone keeps assuming that we'd be able to steal Lance from Indy when he's expressed NO interest in leaving, they can offer more $$ than anyone else and he's a RESTRICTED FA, so they can always match. So if we go after Lance first, lose out and during said time Melo goes to the Lakers or resigns with NY cuz we dragged ass, then what? And guess what, Lance OR Melo is all predicated on amnestying Boozer.

We have a certain amount of time to amnesty Booz this summer and if we don't do it by then, we'll hold him thru next year for trade bait.

Here's what I think is going to happen:

1) Bulls will have serious talks with Melo about coming here. If he says he'll take a slight pay cut to say 15-16 mil, the bulls will explore trade options for Boozer and if nothing pans out, they'll use the amnesty on him, do a sign and trade with NY, give them a draft pick and some salary to open up the extra $$ needed for Melo's deal. Such a deal will keep us in a place to use our exception still and they'll bring Mirotic over and try to resign DJ.

2) If Melo is unwilling to take a cut, Bulls will speak to Lance, learn his asking price and determine how likely it is that Indy will match. With Granger coming off the books, I think they look to keep Lance and the Bulls won't have the cap (nor mindset) to poison pill pay him to leave.

3) This will lead to the Bulls exploring trade options for Boozer. Not sure what they can get but it'll be cap friendly for 2015.

4) If no trade can be found, there's a 50/50 chance we keep him as an in-season trade chip for next year or possibly just free money next off-season. Possibly to send him and a few draft picks to Minny for K-Love.

5) We'll keep both draft picks (ours and the bobcats) this summer UNLESS it facilitates a trade for a superstar (melo, love, etc) and resign DJ regardless.

____________

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Sun Feb-09-14 05:29 PM

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201. "you're wrong on stephenson."
In response to Reply # 200


  

          

>everyone keeps assuming that we'd be able to steal
>Lance from Indy when he's expressed NO interest in leaving,
>they can offer more $$ than anyone else and he's a RESTRICTED
>FA, so they can always match.

a) he isn't restricted.
b) other teams can and will offer him more than the pacers will.

...

per zach lowe of grantland:

http://grantland.com/the-triangle/the-growing-legend-of-lance-stephenson/

"It also presents Indiana with an enormous dilemma: If Stephenson is a more versatile player than the league anticipated, how much will he be worth this summer? Can the Pacers still afford him?

It seems almost mean to talk about next summer when the Pacers are the feel-good story of the league today, and Stephenson won’t do it. “The future holds itself,” he says. “I’m not worrying about my contract. I’m worrying about winning.” But this is how franchises have to think. This Indiana core has a championship window now, but the league’s beefed-up luxury tax will make it very hard for Indiana to keep its fearsome starting lineup together beyond this season — assuming the Pacers will avoid paying the tax at all costs.

Indiana’s salary situation is unusually fluid, because we won’t know the actual value of Paul George’s max-level contract extension until after this season. George is eligible for a rare pay bump that would kick in if he wins the MVP (unlikely) or makes the All-NBA team, as he did last season. I predicted George would not snag one of the four available All-NBA frontcourt spots (LeBron James and Kevin Durant get the first two), mostly because the competition would be so fierce this year. George is making that prediction look foolish early.

If he misses out, George will earn about $14.5 million next season, assuming the cap for that season falls around $62 million, as the league currently projects. If he makes the All-NBA team, he could earn up to $17.55 million, or any amount in between. (Russell Westbrook, for instance, passed on the raise even though he was eligible for it.) If George takes the full raise, the Pacers would be looking at a minimum of about $65.6 million in salary committed to just eight players (http://data.shamsports.com/content/pages/data/salaries/pacers.jsp) plus $1.5 million or so in charges for empty roster spots — about $67 million total. They’d have to fill those roster spots with actual players who might cost more than those temporary charges, and getting to this number also involves buying out Luis Scola’s partially guaranteed contract. Scola’s a useful player and another guy they’d have to replace.

Keep Scola on the books for his full $4.9 million, and you’re up to just about $70 million with a couple of spots left to fill. (Both scenarios assume the Pacers keep Donald Sloan and Orlando Johnson on minimum-level deals.) In related news, the league expects the luxury tax line for 2014-15 to come in around $75.7 million. That would leave the Pacers only about $6 million under the threshold in this scenario. Stephenson, given his improved play and young age, is going to earn more than that on the open market. You can see how this might be a problem for a franchise that has lost money in recent years.

And Stephenson will hit the open market. Several media reports over the last few months have listed him as a restricted free agent, indicating the Pacers would be able to match any contract a rival team offers. This is wrong. Stephenson is an unrestricted free agent under the quirky rules (http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/post/_/id/71049/second-round-first-priority-ricky-ledo-and-exploiting-the-cbas-inefficiencies) that govern second-round picks."

...

per sean deveney of sporting news:

http://www.sportingnews.com/nba/story/2014-02-06/lance-stephenson-pacers-free-agency-contract-salary-cap-paul-george-roy-hibbert-bulls-lakers-bobcats

"Stephenson has insisted he will stay with the Pacers, and Indiana is willing to pay Stephenson as much as possible to keep him. But that’s where things get murky—the Pacers will not cross the league’s luxury-tax threshold, and with the current construction of the roster, they would have to do so in order to give Stephenson fair-market value.

If the Pacers don’t address the Stephenson problem, there will be wolves with cap space lurking. The Lakers, Bulls and Bobcats will be among the teams who can and would offer an ample payday and increased opportunity for Stephenson this summer.

As things stand, the Pacers are looking at a payroll of $68 million next summer. The luxury tax is projected to kick in at $75.7 million, which, obviously, leaves the Pacers at a $7.7 million starting point for signing Stephenson. Under NBA rules, the Pacers could sign Stephenson to a deal worth $44 million over five years, or an average of $8.8 million per year.

That’s probably not market value for Stephenson, though, not after a year in which he has averaged 14.1 points, 7.2 rebounds and 5.3 assists—and considering he is only 23 years old. He has exceeded expectations this season and could well win Most Improved Player, but in doing so, he has upped his price tag. One general manager told Sporting News that Stephenson should expect a deal that starts, “in eight-figure land.”

Eight-figure land is $10 million, of course. That’s five years, $57 million. If the Pacers can’t give him that, surely a team with cap space will give him four years, $43 million. (Under NBA rules, the Pacers can offer a five-year contract, and other teams can offer four.)"

...

per bryan rose of fansided:

http://fansided.com/2014/02/06/nba-rumors-lakers-bulls-bobcats-interested-lance-stephenson/

"The Indiana Pacers are going to have to make a financial commitment this offseason to Lance Stephenson, a free agent to be. Most believe they will, but the Pacers have been adamant in their stance that they have no plans to hit the NBA’s luxury tax limit – something they’ll be bordering on (or eclipsing) if they re-sign Stephenson.

Knowing this, the Los Angeles Lakers , Chicago Bulls  and Charlotte Bobcats  are all expected to make a run at Stephenson, assuming he hits the open market, this according to SportingNews. The Pacers will own Stephenson’s Bird Rights, meaning they can pay him more (and provide more years) than any other team in free agency. Of course, it’s not known if the Pacers are comfortable doing that, though they may have to if they want to retain the talented swingman."

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Sun Feb-09-14 06:17 PM

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202. "ESPN had it wrong then (which your article alludes to)"
In response to Reply # 201


  

          

and I couldn't find the 2014 list on NBA.com but still...he likes Indy and I think these talking heads are exaggerating Indy's reluctance to spend.

If he gets 10-11 mil from Indy, I think he stays. That's 3-4 mil over the expected cap. If Indy makes the finals (win or lose), they'll open the check book. The Pacers will make money off of dethroning Miami alone.

And they'll likely make a 'hard' decision on a few guys like OKC did with Harden. I wouldn't be shocked if Mahinmi, Hill, Copeland or David West was eventually dealt to help them stay under the cap line.

It does improve our chances though so my stance on the Lance option changes a bit.

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Sun Feb-09-14 06:46 PM

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203. "indy ain't paying the lux tax, bro."
In response to Reply # 202


  

          

they won't go even a single cent over the threshold. if you believe nothing else that the talking heads say, believe that.

again: they've actually LOST money in recent seasons. meaning, not even a small but ultimately positive profit, but actually operating at a net negative for the year.

i still don't think ppl realize the complete ramifications of this repeater tax. that shit's going to completely change the financial landscape of the league over the next few years. i mean, the 2 time defending champs are more than likely going to break up this summer behind that shit. shit is real.

when you take the tyreke/afflalo/gordon extensions into account, lance is certainly going to get 10-12 per on the open market. indy's not going to be able to match that. he'd have to take a pay cut out of loyalty to stay there.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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204. "I just don't see them letting Lance walk for nothing"
In response to Reply # 203


  

          

If I had to guess, they are working the shit outta the phones for this deadline to move one of those dudes I just mentioned to open up some space for that 10-11 mil offer to him.

And if they don't make it happen before the deadline, it'll be in the works for the summer...especially if they make the finals.

They may be reluctant to pay that repeater tax but they ain't letting Lance go. It'll be someone else first. Mahinmi's 4 mil or George Hill's 8 mil might be the prime candidates.

I'd be shocked if Indy didn't work some magic to keep dude.

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Wed Feb-12-14 12:23 PM

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205. "Signs pointing to Nikola Mirotic joining Bulls this offseason"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://www.blogabull.com/2014/2/11/5401280/nikola-mirotic-chicago-bulls-nba-free-agency-2014

"The Bulls could get $13.287 million under the cap if they amnesty Boozer and trade Mike Dunleavy Jr. If they don't trade Dunleavy, it's likely the Bulls would only be able to add Mirotic and no one else in free agency.

This is fine with me. I think the Bulls need to do whatever they can to get Mirotic on the team next season. I'm not in love with the idea of Carmelo Anthony starting a five-year, $129 million contract in Chicago after his 30th birthday, though I certainly don't blame the folks who want that. The Bulls are in a good position going forward with draft picks and young players if they're able to add Mirotic.

Maybe the Bulls won't be title contenders next season like they would be with Anthony, but I'm fine with a slow-ish burn. It's about building something sustainable. The health and creeping age of Joakim Noah and Taj Gibson is certainly a factor here, but it seems like it's going to be a chore to ever get Mirotic over if they don't do it this summer. Just sign Niko! We need to see what this guy can do in the NBA. I think it's time."

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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Thu Feb-13-14 02:37 PM

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208. "Whoops."
In response to Reply # 205


  

          

But man, I'm with Rick on this.

Rose/Augustine
Stephenson/Butler
Mirotic
Gibson
Noah

C'mon.

https://digife.com

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Thu Feb-13-14 02:56 PM

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209. "yeah, i'm with you."
In response to Reply # 208


  

          

even if they "only" sign mirotic or stephenson (it's increasingly looking like they won't realistically be able to sign both), bring augustin back, get a healthy returning rose, and land 2 mid rd 1sts in a deep draft, just adding those players to the current team and amnestying boozer would certainly qualify as a win of an offseason, even tho i know a lot of bulls fans wouldn't see it that way and would continue to criticize garpax for "striking out" on another "big fish" in carmelo.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Sat Feb-15-14 06:38 PM

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215. "I think I'm gonna chill on this topic until the summer but"
In response to Reply # 208


  

          

Here's my order of preference:

Right now, with a Boozer Amnesty and all our expiring contracts (kirk/Nazr, etc), we'd have about 10-11 mil in cap space with the current cap number (58 mil). Next year's cap is rumored to possibly hit mid 60's. If it hits 60-65 mil, we'll have 12-18 mil in cap space.

Gold medalist - Melo takes the pay cut he's rabbling about this weekend to come to Chi because NY can't make any significant moves. Let's say it's 13-15 mil a year starting. Deal Dunny (3.1 mil) for a future late first or second rounder. That would leave us enough room to still offer Mirotic the mid-level. And since DJ is ours we should be able to go over the cap for him (slightly). Something comparable to what Nate got would be cool. And we keep both draft picks.

Silver medalist - We whiff on Melo but sign Lance and everything else above plays out (though we keep Dunny as we don't need the extra cap room for Lance's deal which should be in the 10-11 mil range).

Bronze medalist - We get Melo at the aforementioned discount but have to deal Dunny and 1 or both draft picks to get Mirotic over and we lose DJ. We had CJ, Nate and DJ...I think finding a back up PG won't be tough to do. Bigger concern would be back up big but I think we'd find one to eat 10-12 mins at the vet min.

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Wed Feb-12-14 12:37 PM

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206. ""
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Taj Gibson’s Offensive Development
by Eric Nehm on February 8, 2014 in Features

After a solid rookie season, in which he started 70 of the Bulls’ 82 games, Taj Gibson settled into a role on the bench for Chicago in his sophomore season and hasn’t left that position in the last three years. Gibson became a valuable asset for the team as he headlined strong bench units that blitzed teams defensively and managed to get by offensively. After remaining stagnant for much of the last three seasons, Gibson has made some improvements offensively and is averaging over ten points a game for the first time in his career.

Gibson’s offensive development has been a pleasant surprise and one of the constants for a team mired in a turbulent season that has featured new lineups because of both injuries and trades. After averaging between 7.1 and 9 points per game in his first four seasons, Gibson is averaging 12.5 points per game this season. Not surprisingly, Gibson is taking more shots each game this season, which can be typical of a player scoring points at a career pace per game. Though this is helpful, it does not give us an accurate representation of the improvements Gibson has made. To truly understand why Gibson has been more successful, we need to take a closer look at two things: Gibson’s shooting and assisted basket profiles.

http://bullsbythehorns.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Shooting-Accuracy-Combined-1024x575.jpg

One of the reasons for Gibson’s success this season on the offense end is his improved midrange shooting and shot selection. For a helpful comparison, let’s take a look at Gibson’s shooting accuracy both last season and this season. Last season, Gibson made 32 of his 90 shots from what we’ll term the “short midrange” for a shooting percentage of 35.6%. For the most part, he shot these at a level below league average excluding “short midrange” shots in the middle of the floor, which he shot over 50%.

Now, if we take a look at Gibson this season, Gibson has made 47 of his 122 shots from this “short midrange” area for a shooting percentage of 38.5%. A few things should stick out. The first is obviously the amount of shots that Gibson has taken from this area in the last two seasons. Gibson has already taken 32 more shots from this area in just 47 games (stats taken before Phoenix game on February 4) compared to the 65 games it took for him to amass 90 shots from that area last season. The second thing that you should see is a shooting percentage three percentage points higher. Gibson is not just taking more shots, but he’s also making the shots he’s taking from those spots on the floor at a higher percentage.

If we move out a bit further and take a look at Gibson’s shooting percentages from what we’ll call the “deep midrange”, we’ll also see a few interesting trends. Last season, Gibson made 26 of the 87 shots he took from these areas for a shooting percentage of 29.9% This season, Gibson has also increased his accuracy on these “deep midrange” shots as he is shooting these shots at a 34.5% clip, making 29 of his 84 attempts.

When taking a look at Gibson’s shooting in this area last season, we will see a bit of a hot spot near the right elbow extended where he shot a league 40% last season. Gibson has removed a majority of the jumpers from that extended elbow area this season and started taking some more shots on both baselines. He has been particularly effective from the left baseline where he is shooting above league average at 50%.

http://bullsbythehorns.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Shot-Selection-Combined-1024x574.jpg

Taking an even closer look at Gibson’s shot distribution paints a more vivid picture of his offensive profile. In our first graphic, we looked at Gibson’s shooting percentages in each area of the court, while this second graphic takes a look at the percentage of shots Gibson takes in each of those same areas.

Last season, Gibson took 19.7% of his shots from the “deep midrange” where as we covered earlier he shot under 30% last season. Gibson has removed some of those “deep midrange” shots this season, especially those from the extended right elbow, and has started to take a more of his shots from the closer “short midrange”. In just one season, Gibson has transformed his midrange shooting profile and now takes a larger percentage of his shots from an easier location on the floor. Gibson’s midrange game isn’t the only thing that has seen an improvement this season.

http://bullsbythehorns.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Taj-Assisted-Basket-Profile.jpg

One of the things many have commented about on Twitter this season is the improvement in Gibson’s ability to score one-on-one in the post and the numbers bear this out. When reviewing Gibson’s midrange profile, it became apparent that he had improved as a midrange shooter, but those numbers didn’t help explain the situation in which those shots were taken. Reviewing Gibson’s assisted basket profile will help make that picture a bit clearer.

The first thing that sticks out in the above graphic is that Gibson is shooting better in many situations. The most obvious spot in which Gibson’s shooting percentage has not improved is within five feet of the basket. Though this may be a bit disheartening at first, it is important to take a look at the percentage of made baskets assisted. Within five feet of the basket, only 64.1% of Gibson’s baskets have been assisted this season while last season that percentage was at 72.4%. This would suggest that Gibson has been more willing to challenge his defender one-on-one in the post, which is exactly what many have posited on Twitter and this website.

As we move further from the basket, these numbers become even more impressive as even fewer of Gibson’s made baskets have been assisted. Last season, Gibson shot just 24% from five to ten feet away from the basketball and 66.7% of his made baskets were assisted. Now, Gibson is shooting 44.1% while only 43.3% of his made baskets have been assisted. Gibson has not just become a better shooter, but a better shooter while being defended, which is quite the offensive development.

Now, if we take a look at Gibson’s shooting from ten to fifteen feet away from the basketball, we’ll see a decrease in shooting percentage, but once again that decrease is accompanied by a significant decrease in the percentage of assisted baskets. Now, obviously it would be great to see Gibson shooting a better percentage in all situations, but the fact that Gibson is able to put up passable shooting percentages while having a lesser amount of assisted baskets suggests that Gibson has become more comfortable in situations when he is forced to become a playmaker offensively.

A look at these numbers show that Gibson has indeed improved offensively this season, which might explain the career-high scoring nights and swirling trade rumors. Gibson has been able to improve in two areas that can turn a solid bench player into a starter on most teams in the league. Not only has Gibson become a better midrange shooter through improved shot selection and accuracy, but also improved his playmaking ability scoring on more unassisted baskets this season than ever before and thus become a much bigger threat offensively.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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Thu Feb-13-14 01:39 PM

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207. "Signs pointing to Nikola Mirotic joining Bulls this offseason (swipe) "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://www.blogabull.com/2014/2/11/5401280/nikola-mirotic-chicago-bulls-nba-free-agency-2014

I'm with Rick on this:

"I think the Bulls need to do whatever they can to get Mirotic on the team next season. I'm not in love with the idea of Carmelo Anthony starting a five-year, $129 million contract in Chicago after his 30th birthday, though I certainly don't blame the folks who want that. The Bulls are in a good position going forward with draft picks and young players if they're able to add Mirotic.

Maybe the Bulls won't be title contenders next season like they would be with Anthony, but I'm fine with a slow-ish burn. It's about building something sustainable. The health and creeping age of Joakim Noah and Taj Gibson is certainly a factor here, but it seems like it's going to be a chore to ever get Mirotic over if they don't do it this summer. Just sign Niko! We need to see what this guy can do in the NBA. I think it's time."

https://digife.com

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Thu Feb-13-14 02:59 PM

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210. "lolz."
In response to Reply # 207


  

          

you even swiped the same passage that i did.

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it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Thu Feb-13-14 03:04 PM

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211. "Mirotic will decide on future soon, may be costly for Chicago (swipe)"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Mirotic will decide on future soon, may be costly for Chicago
By DougThonus, today at 6:25 am

According to a Spanish newspaper report covering Real Madrid, Nikola Mirotic will decide on his future soon. Real Madrid doesn't expect to keep him, but the price tag mentioned in his leaving is significant.

The original article, if you read Spanish, is here.

However, a Spanish reader did some work to translate here.


- The president of Real Madrid is personally conducting Mirotic extension in Europe. Note: The president rarely does that.

- Everybody is expecting Niko to leave as he wants to play in the NBA.

- He has nothing left to prove in Europe and he feels he is ready to take the next step.

- The article says Niko will have a decision soon as the pressure from both sides (Real/Bulls) is bothering him.

- Article says the Bulls could go as high as 10mm to sign Niko and Real cant compete with that.


Now the most important note about the article is the Bulls potentially going as high as 10 million to sign him in the off-season. My speculative guess is this is Real Madrid covering it's bases when preparing fans for the idea that he might leave.

10 million is pretty close to the most cap room the Bulls can realistically have right now, so when they say the Bulls could go as high as 10 million, that's probably as high as they could go.

It's possible the Bulls have pre-negotiated with Nikola but unlikely they'd commit to any such plan or get to the phase they are making promises. Especially given they don't know what other opportunities may come to them in free agency.

What has become clear watching the Bulls play without Boozer is that Nikola Mirotic likely upgrades the roster immediately next year if he comes over. There's always some risk with a European transfer, but his defense can't be any worse than Boozer's and even if his offense lacks the potency Chicago hopes for, the extra floor spacing will help the team tremendously.

As I've noted in the past, if the Bulls were to give Nikola Mirotic five million per season for three years, it would become the richest first contract an international player has ever signed (in terms of money per year) in his first deal in the US.

Maybe that Nikola wants more, but I'm not sure the Bulls have a lot of incentive to offer more. Much will depend on whether Boozer is amnestied or whether the Bulls work the trade lines and attempt to stay above the cap line so that they have more exceptions to use.

Of course whether or not they can sign Nikola with just the five million dollars may trigger which option they choose as well. If the Bulls amnesty Boozer, sign Nikola, and sign Augustin it won't likely be viewed as a big win for the franchise. However, a team of:

PG: Rose, Augustin
SG: Butler
SF: Dunleavy
PF: Gibson, Mirotic
C: Noah

Has seven of the nine pieces you'd want answered for a playoff roster. Tony Snell still has potential to fill in as one of those pieces as well if he can improve his game.

The Bulls will likely have two first rounders to add to the equation to fill in the depth. I'd suggest their odds of getting one additional piece with those two picks are very high.

Say they use six million on Mirotic and three million on Augustin, they'd then likely have a couple million left in cap room plus the room exception to bring in two more guys at above the veteran minimum to help fill out the roster as well.

Given the Bulls basically need a reserve wing and a reserve center, and have one guy on the roster (Snell) who looks like he can compete for a rotation player slot in one of those positions already, that doesn't seem like a big ask to fill out the depth of the team.

Of course, this off-season will look disappointing on the surface, the Bulls will again have "failed to make the big move", but their big move options really don't exist as much as some fans/writers would like to imply.

Assuming LeBron, Wade, and Bosh stick in Miami, Chicago's only true FA target is Melo whom they don't really like all that much anyway and aren't likely to blow up the roster to get with cap room. I believe Chicago would try and work a S&T for Melo, but the odds of NY cooperating aren't so high.

In the end, Carmelo dreams are a much, much bigger long shot than the 2010 plan to sign LeBron. It could happen, but there are many barriers since the Bulls don't have enough salary space to offer Melo a max deal. Even clearing Gibson off the roster has Melo taking a pay cut.


The depth plan isn't so bad as you think


Imagine if in 2010 the Bulls has signed more guys to smaller shorter contracts rather than reaching for Boozer because he was all that was left. Do you think the team would be better or worse than it is right now?

In the end, there aren't guys worth gambling for with huge contracts in this free agency class. Not the way the Bulls would be forced to gamble anyway. Melo's worth a big deal, but he'll be looking for a 20+ million dollar deal, and I don't know that he's really a super max caliber guy given that teams haven't really had much success with him and his lack of team play.

He's also never been an elitely conditioned athlete by NBA standards and is crossing the 30 barrier. Don't be surprised if a four year deal with Melo starts to look pretty crappy in three years. I think if you could get him, even at that price, you'd have to do it, but it's not the no brainer fans think.

Lance Stephenson will likely get matched by Indiana, and I'm not sure he's so good that I leave Mirotic in Europe for another year given that it might coerce him into another long term non-buy-out friendly contract.

Luol Deng might be the next best guy, but I don't see him considering us, and I certainly would rather bring Mirotic over than bring Deng back. I'm very curious to see what he gets in free agency now. I think his stint in Cleveland will really hurt his value. A guy who's supposed to bring wins with his intangibles has seen his old team continue winning at a higher rate after his exit and his new team flailing more since he came.

I don't think either of those things are related to Deng directly, but clearly he's not providing the impact on winning he's credited for either. Signing him to a big money deal now would remind me of Richard Jefferson getting 40 million from the Spurs when it was clear he wasn't really worth it.

In short, if initial talks with NY on a Melo S&T don't go anywhere, I'd bank on the Bulls making Nikola Mirotic their primary off-season acquisition, and while that isn't as sexy as we'd hope, it's likely a better long term plan than the alternative gambles available.

http://www.chicagonow.com/chicago-bulls-confidential/2014/02/mirotic-will-decide-on-future-soon-may-be-costly-for-chicago/

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
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Fri Feb-14-14 06:13 PM

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212. "Mid-Season Thoughts?"
In response to Reply # 0
Fri Feb-14-14 06:16 PM by RandomFact

  

          

I will start.

Pros:

We are two games above 500 and have not lost a step after the Deng trade. Thibs deserves 12 mil a year. He's as valuable (if not more valuable) as any player on the court.

The hardest part of our schedule is behind us. I would not be surprised if we finished 8-10 games above.

Taj. Taj is awesome. His jumper is very milky. And his back to the basket game is legit.

Jo. Jo is also awesome and I hope he retires as a Bull. He epitomizes everything a Thibs coached team is about. He is also arguably our best playmaker, which is crazy.

DJ is the ideal backup PG for this team. Smart, can create, can shoot, and Thibs seems to like him. Hopefully we get a deal on his services for next year.

Cons:

Buckets still can't shoot.

Dunleavy and Kirk are very streaky.

Nazr's corpse.

Lastly, I'm still holding on to the thought that Derrick will be back. We're not finishing below a five seed. A playoff series against average competition (Toronto/BK/ATL) could be a positive thing looking ahead to next year. Get a jump start with the on-court recovery portion.

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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Fri Feb-14-14 07:26 PM

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213. "Halftime (c) NaS"
In response to Reply # 212


  

          

A / THIBODEAU: "We have more than enough. Next man up." Cliche? Yes. But the team has completely bought in. Well, I should say that the leaders of this team have bought in, and the rest have fallen in line. The fact that we're a playoff team after losing Rose (again) is a testament to his system. I'm convinced Thibs's defense is the reason you should watch Bulls games. Like watching some Buddy Ryan / Lovie Smith football. Every player on defense is tied to each other with Noah as the anchor. The switching, doubling and my favorite part...PLAYERS NOT LEAVING THEIR FEET TO DEFEND SHOTS! I applaud him for that. I read that he took on some elements of the Spurs offense this summer, but I'm sure some of that had to get scrapped when Rose got hurt. He's found a way to use Noah in the high post that has kept us going. He's given playing time to Snell to be of service and was patient with Augustine as he learned the offense/defense. And this team has almost played better after losing it's most tenured captain. Hate to be pessimistic, but I fear Thibs will coach another team before he retires. This front office...don't truss it.

A / NOAH: His playmaking abilities have helped our offense find some sort of identity. It forces everyone to touch the ball. While he's not the strongest 5 in the league, he has to be the most athletic. Definitely one of the fastest big men in the game. Loved seeing him, Taj and Boozer tear though the Nets frontline yesterday.

B+ / GIBSON: I truly feel the Bulls/Thibs locker room breeds a culture of off season development. It's not talked about much, but Rose and Gibson have both added new elements to their game. That's why I'm hopeful Snell can be a solid role player IF he works this summer. But that jumper like Random mentioned IS wet. I thought some of Taj's moves were due to him guarding Boozer in practice, but it came out that he's been watching tapes of Bernard King. When Boozer went down last week, I wanted Taj to stay the starter. But I understand the philosophy that you can't lose your spot to injury. That's Thibs call. Doesn't matter cause Taj is playing in the 4th. I really want Gibson/Noah to be our frontline for years to come.

B / AUGUSTINE: This dude took a bad situation (getting waived) and turned it into a positive. I think it was his acquisition that kept the Bulls from tanking. I don't think GarPaxDorf expected him to be that good. Once he learned the offense he moved a lot faster and essentially won some games for us while HInrich was out. Sometimes a liability on defense to his size, but his shot creation ability is the best the Bulls have seen since Rose got hurt. Unfortunately unless he LOVES playing for the Bulls, I think he's gone at the end of the season to the highest bidder. I would love to see him backing up Rose next year.

C+ / DUNLEAVY: I'm not as down on Dunleavy as some of y'all. He's no Korver, but he's a MUCH better finisher at the rim than I expected. Especially on the break.

C / BUTLER: I think my expectations for Butler were too high this summer. After that playoff run, I had very high hopes for him. He's still a solid defender and quick to fill lanes for steals, but the jumper isn't where it needs to be for a starting SG. Anyone notice if he's driving less? I'd like to see him get to the line more.

I don't have any thoughts on Boozer, Hinrich, Mohammaed, or Snell. *shrug*

https://digife.com

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
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Fri Feb-14-14 09:04 PM

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214. "This also bothers me.."
In response to Reply # 213
Fri Feb-14-14 09:05 PM by RandomFact

  

          

>C / BUTLER: Anyone notice if he's driving less? I'd like to
>see him get to the line more.
>

he's too passive. although i think he will be much better when/if rose comes back and plays at a semi-elite level. defenses don't have to honor anyone or anything at the moment, leaving jimmy locked up tightly for an entire game. rose's addition should open everything up and jimmy's driving game, and hopefully shot, will improve.

  

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
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Sat Feb-22-14 03:41 PM

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216. "i hope bulls fans aren't getting too caught up in this melo/lance stuff"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

nothing wrong with considering the possibilities, but ppl should be smart enough and realistic enough to know that acquiring either of those guys is a long shot at best.

it's much much more likely that the offseason consists of the 2 mid 1st rounders, signing niko (who would be a top 10 pick in the upcoming draft if not top 5), resigning augustin, and getting a healthy rose back.

which would be GREAT. let's not lose sight of that. even if that's "all" the team ends up doing, that's a phenomenal offseason.

the future is bright.

___

low end crazy, eastside crazy, wild hunnids crazy, englewood crazy.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sat Feb-22-14 03:57 PM

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217. "RE: i hope bulls fans aren't getting too caught up in this melo/lance st..."
In response to Reply # 216


          

>nothing wrong with considering the possibilities, but ppl
>should be smart enough and realistic enough to know that
>acquiring either of those guys is a long shot at best.
>
>it's much much more likely that the offseason consists of the
>2 mid 1st rounders, signing niko (who would be a top 10 pick
>in the upcoming draft if not top 5), resigning augustin, and
>getting a healthy rose back.
>
>which would be GREAT. let's not lose sight of that. even if
>that's "all" the team ends up doing, that's a phenomenal
>offseason.
>
>the future is bright.

Bright? Don't know homie....

There are a lot of questions that scare the fuck out of me....

I was driving that "let's get Melo" bus....But the reality is (as u stated) too many moving parts to pull something like that off...

But really what's got me spooked?

1. Rose's health...That's not looking good...dude hasn't played a full season is a minute...And when u r dealing with knee injuries to a player who relies on explosiveness that's not something that can checked off as an afterthought...

2. Coach Thibs' future with the Bulls...Yeah...we all know he has a contract with some years left on it...But he's been in engaged in a secret war with the Bulls front office...I don't see it lasting....Bill Simmons spelled it out in a recent Grantland column...The Bulls clipped Thibs right hand man and traded Deng away for nothing...That was their way of tanking...But Thibs ain't having it....He's coaching up ONE all-star, role players, youngins and few bums....That's basically him saying FUCK U to the Bulls brass...

I won't even get into whether Niko will be the real deal in the NBA (I'm keeping the faith on that one...), and whether or not we can attract a real free-agent...

I'm glad there's people like u too keep the faith homie....We need more people like u around...lol

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Sun Feb-23-14 12:10 PM

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218. "That wouldn't be a 'great' offseason. It would be a 'good' offseason."
In response to Reply # 216
Sun Feb-23-14 12:12 PM by auragin_boi

  

          

>nothing wrong with considering the possibilities, but ppl
>should be smart enough and realistic enough to know that
>acquiring either of those guys is a long shot at best.

I think most of us don't get our hopes up too high given the FO history of not being able to land the biggest caliber FA's/trades (Kobe, Melo, Pau, Wade, Bron, Bosh, etc.). For the most part, we are all just stating the best possible opportunities and understanding that it'd take a lot to pull them off but they are options.

>it's much much more likely that the offseason consists of the
>2 mid 1st rounders, signing niko (who would be a top 10 pick
>in the upcoming draft if not top 5), resigning augustin, and
>getting a healthy rose back.
>
>which would be GREAT. let's not lose sight of that. even if
>that's "all" the team ends up doing, that's a phenomenal
>offseason.
>
>the future is bright.

I would disagree with phenomenal. Too many variables at play (depending on young mid-first round talent and an unproven Euro). I think it'd be a good offseason and give us a lot of interesting eval to do next season but ultimately it doesn't scream 'let's try and win this title next season'.

I think we're past the holding pattern stage. We are clipping heels for the 3rd seed in a season in which our two leading scorers are not with the team and the guy we expect to be 'the' man on the team hasn't been healthy in two FULL seasons. I think the franchise is at the point where they either think:

'we're going all in for a legit shot at the title for the next 3 seasons' - In which case getting some high caliber offensive firepower to go along with our stellar D, coaching and core group should be job 1. It would also insulate us against overly depending on Rose for offense.

or

'we are gonna slow burn because we aren't going to be at that point for the next 2 seasons'. - In which case what you stated is perfect. We get a few seasons to see how the draft picks and mirotic develop, evaluate Rose's return to health and expectations are lowered. But the risk here is that by the time we are ready to contend again, Noah and Buckets are due for re-ups (both will command raises), Rose and Taj are one year away and the new blood is looking at extensions...so, another crossroads.

Personally, I feel it's best to strike while the iron is hot. The east is weak, Miami is aging and will have cap issues and Indy is vulnerable if they don't make the 'right' moves this summer.

I think a two pronged focus (title now while netting future assets) is the way to go. Mirotic OR the draft picks (or him and one of them) + an offense improving FA signing is what I think works best.

HOW that's done is the mystery but the most visible options are Melo and Lance. If it happens via a good trade for someone else plausible (without retracting too much from the core group), I'd be ok with that too.

____________

  

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
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220. ""
In response to Reply # 218


  

          

i'm sorry, man. but i disagree with you completely.

having the equivalent of 3 top 20 picks -- charlotte's in the 11-15 range, their own in the 16-20 range, and mirotic who would easily be a top 10 pick -- in a deep draft + returning a 25 yr old former mvp qualifies as a great offseason, that sets up the next 5-10 yrs of bulls basketball. not to mention an extra 1st rounder from sacramento coming down the line. that's how you rebuild on the fly without bottoming out. the front office deserves a lot of credit for what they've been able to do.

___

low end crazy, eastside crazy, wild hunnids crazy, englewood crazy.

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Tue Feb-25-14 09:47 PM

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221. "Dula, but will any of that win a title next year? Year after? 3yrs out?"
In response to Reply # 220
Tue Feb-25-14 09:48 PM by auragin_boi

  

          

Firstly, we aren't rebuilding. We haven't missed the playoffs in like 6 seasons. If anything, we're re-tooling the bench that JR dismantled 2 seasons ago. We'll just be doing it with younger talent with more upside.

What does it matter though if our pick turns out to be Tyrus Thomas-ish, the CHA pick turns out to be James Johnson-ish and Mirotic is more Donatas Motiejunas than Kukoc or Dirk? And that Sac pick is so protected that it never gets lower than top 10 for 3 seasons then turns into a second rounder (lest we forget they play in the deep ass western conference and haven't finished outside the top 10 in 6 years). Draft is always a crap shoot.

Then what you'll have is this core (aging), plus Rose and marginal role players coming off the bench. I'm sorry but I'm not putting all my eggs in the mid-first round basket. Even if they develop and are players then we got maybe 2 seasons before it fully pays off and puts us in contention (which is basically what I said up top). But in 2 seasons you got cap issues again and some decisions about Noah, Jimmy, Extensions, Rose and Taj have to be made.

Yes, the front office deserves a ton of credit for getting us here but we should be on the doorstep to winning a ring IMO. If we do nothing but draft and bring Mirotic over, I'll temper my expectations then because it'll be obvious winning a title next year isn't priority 1 but as you said, being set for maybe 3 years from today while keeping a competitive playoff team on the floor is.

You also gloss over the fact that Rose has been down for TWO full seasons with knee injuries. Likely because he's tasked with carrying our offense too much and unless Mirotic is an offensive beast (nothing in his scouting report or current stats suggest he'd be any better on O than Taj or Booz) we come back next season with possibly the same scenario. And if Rose goes down again then what? If Noah goes down?

Melo is playing the best ball of his career and I'd think he has 2-3 more seasons in him at this level before there's any drop off. Lance is young and developing. IF we can net one of them AND keep a few of our future assets (Mirotic and/or a combo of our picks) why not go for it?

____________

  

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
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Tue Feb-25-14 11:03 PM

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222. "fine, have it your way."
In response to Reply # 221


  

          

derrick is done.

despite drafting as well as any organization in the league over the last decade, all of their future picks will turn out to be busts.

although it's literally never happened in league history, the kings will be the first to draft in the top ten 9 yrs in a row, and that pick will convert to a 2nd.

and unless this extremely unlikely fantasy longshot scenario of overpaying 30 yr old carmelo anthony or contract year role player lance stephenson comes to fruition, the bulls future as a franchise is utterly dismal and doomed.

swell. good luck w all that.

___

low end crazy, eastside crazy, wild hunnids crazy, englewood crazy.

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Wed Feb-26-14 02:05 PM

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223. "Ok, apparently I'm pissing in your corn flakes so my bad"
In response to Reply # 222


  

          

>derrick is done.

Never said that but he is injury prone. Good to have some protection against it because right now, any title hopes we have highly rely on Derrick. I mean, unless you don't care if we're championship competitive.

>despite drafting as well as any organization in the league
>over the last decade, all of their future picks will turn out
>to be busts.

James Johnson
Taj Gibson
Kevin Seraphin (traded to the Wiz)
Norris Cole (traded to Minn w/Lee for Mirotic)
Jimmy Butler
Malcolm Lee
Marquis Teague
Tony Snell
Erik Murphy

^^^All of our post 10 slot draft picks since we've been a playoff team in the new millennium. Taj is the best of that bunch and he's a cog to a title team, not a catalyst. Same with Snell and Butler. I never said they couldn't get a decent player but don't act like we've drafted all-stars in the mid first or later since 2008.

>although it's literally never happened in league history, the
>kings will be the first to draft in the top ten 9 yrs in a
>row, and that pick will convert to a 2nd.

Ok...You're right. It's never happened. But if any team has a perfect storm set up for it, it's the Kings. But I suppose a good draft and decent trade could set them up in a few seasons. I wouldn't bet money on it though.

>and unless this extremely unlikely fantasy longshot scenario
>of overpaying 30 yr old carmelo anthony or contract year role
>player lance stephenson comes to fruition, the bulls future as
>a franchise is utterly dismal and doomed.

Never said we overpay Melo. He's claiming he'd take a pay cut. I've said repeatedly that if he's willing to do so, we try to make that work. Melo at 20+ mil a year? No thanks. Though it's funny that Bron will be 30 this year too but no one is scared of giving him 4 years and Melo is having almost as good a season as Bron. Lance's asking price should be comfortable for us (10-12 mil) and he's unrestricted as you pointed out, so how is that a longshot fantasy?

We pay Taj 8 mil a year (who turns 29 this year and has 3 more years left on his deal) and he doesn't have as much potential as the 23 year old 'role player'. Stephenson has allstar potential, Taj will probably never be one.

I will say that if we don't get Derrick a legit offensive co-option or secondary option (someone the opposing D has to focus on) we likely won't win a title during Derrick's tenure with the Bulls.

>swell. good luck w all that.

I want to be championship competitive right now and for at least 3 seasons while still keep future assets to remain long term competitive. You want a competitive team to watch for 10 years in hopes that in one of those years, the team will break through for a title run. Cool. Agree to disagree.

____________

  

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
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Wed Feb-26-14 03:28 PM

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224. "nah it's good, just saying don't put all yr eggs in the fagency basket,"
In response to Reply # 223


  

          

it seems like a lot of bulls fans are just very optimistic / cheery / glass-half-full with regards to the melo / lance scenarios -- not acknowledging the potential downsides at all -- while at the same time being very pessimistic and cynical and negative about any alternative options. which again are much much more likely to occur. setting themselves up for disappointment and giving themselves an excuse to bash the front office / ownership yet again.

unrestricted free agency by nature is always a longshot proposition, you're vying with several other suitors for a player's services, too many factors at play, plus his incumbent team always has a inherent bargaining advantage due to how the system is set up.

re: melo, a big part of me wonders if the team's interest there is really even all that strong. i almost feel like the melo thing is nothing but the old telephone game. 100% media and fan driven speculation, gone out of control. bulls need scoring, melo needs a new team, league would love him in a big market, stir and add water. but idk that the team is really even looking in that direction. i think their #1 priority this summer is mirotic, they certainly haven't (and obv can't, due to tampering rules) given any indication to think that melo's on their radar like that. and i don't even know that melo wants to come here. almost just seems like a rumor taking on a life of its own. and as i've stated before, it just doesn't seem realistically feasible. they won't have the cap space to sign him outright (they'll have abt 11-12M, he's eligible to make 22+, he ain't taking that big a pay slice) without salary-dumping gibson and forgoing bringing mirotic over. and that's after already jettisoning boozer and deng w/ no return. too steep a price.

the only somewhat realistic melo option would have to be a s+t, you'd need to convince nyk to take boozer's expiring back (unlikely) to match salaries, and then attach additional sweeteners, prolly multiple draft picks, maybe butler. again, a long shot, lots of moving parts, and probably not worth it. if that's the direction they're going in, i'd much MUCH rather they make a similar run @ kevin love with the same type of package.

re: lance, even setting aside the fact that he doesn't really want to leave indy at all and they're gonna do whatever it takes to keep him, he'll have many many other suitors as well and his price may end up being exorbitant. sorry, i like lance but he's not a "12M per" guy, any team giving him a 4/48 or 4/52 type deal will likely end up ruing it. and yes, you may not want to acknowledge it, but he is a career role player having his first solid season in his contract year. there's a track record for those situations that can't be ignored. like sam smith said, someone is going to pay stephenson and maybe find out they have eddie robinson.

and you are aware that stephenson, the potential all star who you want to give $50M to, was a 2nd rd pick, right? oh but the bulls (who draft as well as anyone, fuck the dumb shit) won't find anybody good @ 15 tho, huh? mirotic can't potentially develop into that? see that's what i'm talking abt, man. that cynical, grass-is-greener shit. i can't stand it.

i'm just saying, don't be all doom and gloom and "the sky is falling" and start the same tired old "garpax suck, JR cheap" stuff when these free agt scenarios don't materialize. because they probably won't... AND THAT'S FINE.

___

low end crazy, eastside crazy, wild hunnids crazy, englewood crazy.

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Wed Feb-26-14 05:07 PM

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225. "I think we're on the same page"
In response to Reply # 224
Wed Feb-26-14 05:11 PM by auragin_boi

  

          

Like I've stated, I prefer a two pronged approach. As long as the FO does due diligence on my preferred options, I'm good. If it doesn't work, it doesn't work and what's in front of us is a great 'consolation'. Just saying a great offseason vs good offseason would be my rating if we couldn't pull off my preferred options.

>re: melo, a big part of me wonders if the team's interest
>there is really even all that strong. i almost feel like the
>melo thing is nothing but the old telephone game. 100% media
>and fan driven speculation, gone out of control. bulls need
>scoring, melo needs a new team, league would love him in a big
>market, stir and add water. but idk that the team is really
>even looking in that direction. i think their #1 priority this
>summer is mirotic, they certainly haven't (and obv can't, due
>to tampering rules) given any indication to think that melo's
>on their radar like that. and i don't even know that melo
>wants to come here. almost just seems like a rumor taking on a
>life of its own. and as i've stated before, it just doesn't
>seem realistically feasible. they won't have the cap space to
>sign him outright (they'll have abt 11-12M, he's eligible to
>make 22+, he ain't taking that big a pay slice) without
>salary-dumping gibson and forgoing bringing mirotic over. and
>that's after already jettisoning boozer and deng w/ no return.
>too steep a price.

>the only somewhat realistic melo option would have to be a
>s+t, you'd need to convince nyk to take boozer's expiring back
>(unlikely) to match salaries, and then attach additional
>sweeteners, prolly multiple draft picks, maybe butler. again,
>a long shot, lots of moving parts, and probably not worth it.
>if that's the direction they're going in, i'd much MUCH rather
>they make a similar run @ kevin love with the same type of
>package.

I think Melo's interested (he himself has said he likes Chicago before, when he wanted to leave Den) but the media is blowing it out of proportion and it's far less a guarantee he'd move.

I think conversations will need to be held between the FO and Melo to gauge how it would go. If Melo would take 15-16 mil and says he'd like to play for the bulls if they can make the $ work, they probably trade Dunny's 4 mil to open up the cap to get him outright. Then they'd probably have to trade Mirotic for a future 1st because they won't have the room to sign him.

I'd gladly do that with a team like SAC or Philly or Orl. So long as the protections are top 6 and lower over the next few seasons. But even if not with those, anything 1st round, due within 2 seasons with minimal protections would work (I mean, they would be getting a prospective top 10-type player in return right?). Then we can keep our two picks this year and the SAC pick in the future and have another future 1st in tow. <--Championship focus now, future assets still on board. GREAT offseason!

I know I make that sound VERY easy but...it's all possible. Not saying it's even remotely plausible but the possibility is there and I want that explored before we invest in Mirotic and DJ.

However, I'd do everything you listed to get Love (Mirotic, Butler, Picks, etc.).

>re: lance, even setting aside the fact that he doesn't really
>want to leave indy at all and they're gonna do whatever it
>takes to keep him, he'll have many many other suitors as well
>and his price may end up being exorbitant. sorry, i like lance
>but he's not a "12M per" guy, any team giving him a 4/48 or
>4/52 type deal will likely end up ruing it. and yes, you may
>not want to acknowledge it, but he is a career role player
>having his first solid season in his contract year. there's a
>track record for those situations that can't be ignored. like
>sam smith said, someone is going to pay stephenson and maybe
>find out they have eddie robinson.

See this is that 'afraid to take the leap' mentality that conservative Bulls fans have. Lance has improved every season he's been in the league (and started his career playing behind Granger and George). He has more upside than Jimmy Butler (who we LOVE) yet we relegate his development to 'contract year hustle'. He's waaaaaaaay more fiery than Eddie Robinson was on his best day. His skillset (good shooter, ball handler, passer, rebounder and defender) all suggest he'll only get better.

http://tinyurl.com/ndgke9d

^^^C'mon fam. His ast/TO ratio trumps both those dudes too. Now imagine if he was getting 16 shots a night. Right.

I got not issues offering dude 4/40 or 4/44. Sorry. We gave Kirk 10 mil per and he wasn't nearly as talented.

>and you are aware that stephenson, the potential all star who
>you want to give $50M to, was a 2nd rd pick, right? oh but the
>bulls (who draft as well as anyone, fuck the dumb shit) won't
>find anybody good @ 15 tho, huh? mirotic can't potentially
>develop into that? see that's what i'm talking abt, man. that
>cynical, grass-is-greener shit. i can't stand it.

Bulls don't show a track record in drafting late round potential stars. We don't have Ginobli's or Arenas' or Pekovics in our recent history. Have James Johnson, Taj Gibson and Tony Snell. We draft blue collar guys that will work hard and do the job. Which works but I don't see us netting the allstar caliber gem (plus it's just hard to do). Even still, I'd welcome the chance to be wrong about all of this.

But right today, if you're asking me on a quest to win a ring in the coming two seasons, would I rather have a perennial all-star or a guy on the cusp of allstar level play, that I've SEEN play in the NBA or 3 unproven talents that are likely a few years away from major impact, I'm going with the former.

Still, why is it that we can't get one of those guys and still try to keep a combo of our mid 1st and/or Mirotic. That's actually MY preference.

>i'm just saying, don't be all doom and gloom and "the sky is
>falling" and start the same tired old "garpax suck, JR cheap"
>stuff when these free agt scenarios don't materialize. because
>they probably won't... AND THAT'S FINE.

If they do everything financially plausible yet franchise friendly to try and net the FAgents and it doesn't work, I wouldn't piss on them. And I'd be happy with what's left on the table. But I won't be expecting us to win the title next season...I'd be more wait and see.

____________

  

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
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Wed Feb-26-14 06:57 PM

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226. "see..."
In response to Reply # 225


  

          

>If Melo would take 15-16 mil
>and says he'd like to play for the bulls if they can make the
>$ work, they probably trade Dunny's 4 mil to open up the cap
>to get him outright.

no offense, but this is just pie-in-the-sky wishful thinking to me. i can't imagine that he'd take anywhere near that type of pay cut, bro. ppl talk abt lebron and bosh taking pay cuts to sign in miami but that was only 3M. they could've made 19M per year w/ their original teams but signed with miami for 16. this isn't the same thing, carmelo ain't leaving no 7-10M dollars a year on the table, and that's not abt him not wanting to win or placing dollars over winning, that's just reality.

also, if you reread that quote, he says he'd take a pay cut to STAY IN NEW YORK and help the knicks build around him. a hometown discount, essentially. i seriously doubt he's giving anyone else that same deal.

and mdj only makes 3 and change next yr, not 4. dumping him would put them at abt 15M in space (i posted the exact numbers up top, in reply 189). i just don't think it's feasible to expect dude would sign @ that number. to make him a realistic offer they'd have to move taj. hard to accept, i know, but it's not abt me killing your dreams lol. again, it's just reality.

>See this is that 'afraid to take the leap' mentality that
>conservative Bulls fans have. Lance has improved every season
>he's been in the league (and started his career playing behind
>Granger and George). He has more upside than Jimmy Butler
>(who we LOVE) yet we relegate his development to 'contract
>year hustle'. He's waaaaaaaay more fiery than Eddie Robinson
>was on his best day. His skillset (good shooter, ball
>handler, passer, rebounder and defender) all suggest he'll
>only get better.

again: stephenson's good. like him a lot. and i do think he's still improving. i'd be completely open to signing him at the right price, but i also understand why teams would be leery to go to 8 figures annual to get him, and i can also envision a scenario where the signing goes for bad, where his production plateaus and his personality issues emerge and you end up paying $12M a yr to a surly glue guy.

>Still, why is it that we can't get one of those guys and still
>try to keep a combo of our mid 1st and/or Mirotic. That's
>actually MY preference.

which is cool, just don't get your hopes up.

>If they do everything financially plausible yet franchise
>friendly to try and net the FAgents and it doesn't work, I
>wouldn't piss on them. And I'd be happy with what's left on
>the table. But I won't be expecting us to win the title next
>season...I'd be more wait and see.

___

low end crazy, eastside crazy, wild hunnids crazy, englewood crazy.

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Wed Feb-26-14 07:40 PM

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227. "Dula, you killing me fam lol"
In response to Reply # 226
Wed Feb-26-14 07:55 PM by auragin_boi

  

          

>no offense, but this is just pie-in-the-sky wishful thinking
>to me. i can't imagine that he'd take anywhere near that type
>of pay cut, bro. ppl talk abt lebron and bosh taking pay cuts
>to sign in miami but that was only 3M. they could've made 19M
>per year w/ their original teams but signed with miami for 16.
>this isn't the same thing, carmelo ain't leaving no 7-10M
>dollars a year on the table, and that's not abt him not
>wanting to win or placing dollars over winning, that's just
>reality.

Bosh, Bron and Wade all signed for 14 mil starting. The deals grow each year. That was the only way they could get all 3 and be under the cap. All 3 deals avg 18 mil a year.

Sooo using that contract structure:

Melo yr 1 - 15 mil
Melo yr 2 - 17 mil
Melo yr 3 - 20 mil
Melo yr 4 - 23 mil

75 mil total, he leaves 20 on the table. Bron & Co. left 15 on the table (sign and trades though for Bron and Bosh so they all got their 6 years). Maybe add in 5 mil or so for incentives (based on playoff success).

We could do that if he's SERIOUS about winning and thinks he can do it with us...he'll consider it...strongly. No one else is in the same position as us. Dunny traded, it works.

>also, if you reread that quote, he says he'd take a pay cut to
>STAY IN NEW YORK and help the knicks build around him. a
>hometown discount, essentially. i seriously doubt he's giving
>anyone else that same deal.

That was advertising to the entire league fam. He has to stay loyal so the NY media don't eat him alive and so he doesn't hurt his future FAgency but ANY star saying "I'll take a pay cut" is a ploy. He won't be competing for a title if he doesn't take a cut and he KNOWS it. He saw what Bron, Bosh and Wade did. Dirk is talking pay cut. It's what the league is now. He doesn't want to wait on a team to get there so he's gonna have to work with them.

>and mdj only makes 3 and change next yr, not 4. dumping him
>would put them at abt 15M in space (i posted the exact numbers
>up top, in reply 189). i just don't think it's feasible to
>expect dude would sign @ that number. to make him a realistic
>offer they'd have to move taj. hard to accept, i know, but
>it's not abt me killing your dreams lol. again, it's just
>reality.

I don't think the bulls move Taj to pay him 22 mil. Plus we have a hole at PF if Taj is gone. If the goal is to win a ring, Melo gonna take that 15 starting.

>again: stephenson's good. like him a lot. and i do think he's
>still improving. i'd be completely open to signing him at the
>right price, but i also understand why teams would be leery to
>go to 8 figures annual to get him, and i can also envision a
>scenario where the signing goes for bad, where his production
>plateaus and his personality issues emerge and you end up
>paying $12M a yr to a surly glue guy.

I can see that too. There's risk either way. But what we do know is that Stephenson can produce on a title contender. We don't know that about any of the undrafted or euro prospects. To counter that though, Lance at 10-11 doesn't stop us from getting the two draft picks and makes it a lot easier to make room to get Mirotic (again, trading Dunny). At worse, we have to find him a new suitor and we have all our assets in tact. At best, he adds to what we have and helps push us to the finals.

>which is cool, just don't get your hopes up.

Cautiously optimistic. We'll see what's really important to who this summer. Either way, the Chicago Bulls are in a good space.

____________

  

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
3295 posts
Wed Feb-26-14 08:04 PM

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228. "ok..."
In response to Reply # 227


  

          

>Bosh, Bron and Wade all signed for 14 mil starting. The deals
>grow each year. That was the only way they could get all 3
>and be under the cap. All 3 deals avg 18 mil a year.

yeah i was off, i said 19 to 16 instead of 17 to 14, didn't look it up, i remembered it was $3M tho.

>Sooo using that contract structure:
>Melo yr 1 - 15 mil
>Melo yr 2 - 17 mil
>Melo yr 3 - 20 mil
>Melo yr 4 - 23 mil
>
>75 mil total, he leaves 20 on the table.

this isn't accurate. they couldn't give him annual raises that big. raises can only be 4.5% of the 1st yr salary on a straight signing, or 7.5% on a sign & trade.

the difference between a 4 yr contract starting @ 15M vs one starting @ 22M is over 30 million dollars.

>We could do that if he's SERIOUS about winning and thinks he
>can do it with us...he'll consider it...strongly.

lolz

>I don't think the bulls move Taj to pay him 22 mil. Plus we
>have a hole at PF if Taj is gone. If the goal is to win a
>ring, Melo gonna take that 15 starting.


lolz

___

low end crazy, eastside crazy, wild hunnids crazy, englewood crazy.

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
20939 posts
Wed Feb-26-14 08:33 PM

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229. "lmao...I'm tapping out"
In response to Reply # 228


  

          

>this isn't accurate. they couldn't give him annual raises that
>big. raises can only be 4.5% of the 1st yr salary on a
>straight signing, or 7.5% on a sign & trade.
>
>the difference between a 4 yr contract starting @ 15M vs one
>starting @ 22M is over 30 million dollars.

He prolly gonna want 19 @ min if that's the case, unless the Knicks work with us and that ain't happening without draft picks.

Oh well...

Now watch they trade Taj to get him and piss us all off.

____________

  

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
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Wed Feb-26-14 09:00 PM

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230. "lol... go watch the game"
In response to Reply # 229


  

          

noah's so good, man. i love that dude.

___

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LeroyBumpkin
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Sun Feb-23-14 07:49 PM

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219. "I don't want to get locked in a quick fix."
In response to Reply # 216


  

          

...cause if it doesn't work, the best years of our core will be wasted.

Flexibility is key.

https://digife.com

  

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JAESCOTT777
Member since Feb 18th 2006
28487 posts
Wed Feb-26-14 09:13 PM

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231. "we have been bawlin"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
8710 posts
Thu Feb-27-14 06:21 PM

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232. "Ben coming back?"
In response to Reply # 0
Thu Feb-27-14 06:23 PM by RandomFact

  

          

Ramona Shelburne ✔ @ramonashelburne
Follow
Teams such as Bulls, Clippers and Rockets are said to be pitching Gordon on two-year deal with team option in Year 2

He hasn't done much in six years since he's left Chicago. At the least he'll be a spark off the bench + shoot better than Jimmy and Kirk.

I find it kind of weird that we're in the market for these rental castoffs. Either management is trying to appease Thibs, or they know something about Derrick's health and return that they're not letting on. Hard to believe that GarPaxDorf is doing this to field a better team in this lost season out of pure charity.

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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Thu Feb-27-14 06:37 PM

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233. "Ha. Gordon & DJ in the same back court?"
In response to Reply # 232


  

          

Yeah, Thibs is gonna love that.

https://digife.com

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
8710 posts
Thu Feb-27-14 06:48 PM

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234. "true, but thibs can't be happy about being last in the league in ppg"
In response to Reply # 233
Thu Feb-27-14 06:50 PM by RandomFact

  

          

and if there is a plan to attempt to compete more than one round in the playoffs we'll obviously need more weapons.

>Yeah, Thibs is gonna love that.

  

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mashpg89
Member since Dec 08th 2004
2867 posts
Thu Feb-27-14 07:10 PM

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235. "I'd prefer Jimmer"
In response to Reply # 232


  

          

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
8710 posts
Fri Feb-28-14 03:26 PM

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238. "Looks like you will get your wish..."
In response to Reply # 235


  

          

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/10525785/chicago-bulls-cleveland-cavs-interested-jimmer-fredette-sources-say

The Chicago Bulls are closing in on signing former Sacramento Kings guard Jimmer Fredette, according to sources close to the process.

EnlargeJimmer Fredette
AP Photo/Rich Pedroncelli
Shooting guard Jimmer Fredette's buyout was finalized on Thursday.
Sources told ESPN.com on Thursday that -- while stressing a deal was not yet complete -- serious mutual interest between the sides has made Fredette's landing with Chicago look increasingly likely.

After completing a contract buyout Thursday with the Kings, Fredette can't officially sign a contract with the Bulls or any other team before clearing waivers Saturday at 5 p.m. ET.

But sources say the former BYU star, drafted No. 10 overall in 2011, is highly intrigued by the prospect of playing for Bulls coach Tom Thibodeau, who -- in spite of his defense-heavy reputation -- has put score-first guards such as Nate Robinson and more recently D.J. Augustin in position to flourish.

While Thibodeau wouldn't discuss Fredette specifically, he did say the Bulls would welcome any shooting help they could get. Fredette is shooting 49.3 percent from beyond the arc this season.

"I don't want to speak specifically about players yet," Thibodeau said before Friday morning's shootaround, when asked about Fredette's reputation. "There are a number of guys that are good and sometimes as we saw with D.J. it's an opportunity to step in and add to what a team may need, so whoever we sign -- if we do sign someone -- whatever their strengths are, we want them to play to their strengths, to cover up their weaknesses, to understand what our team's strengths are, what are weaknesses are, and fit in."

When told of Fredette's buyout, Bulls forward Taj Gibson seemed pleased about the potential move and believes the young shooter would benefit from a change of scenery.

"I've seen that he's got talent," Gibson said. "It's just that the team that he was on, he never really got a chance to do much because they've got the characters on that team where they don't seem too serious, you know what I'm saying? Playing on strict, good teams kind of brings the best out of a player."

ESPN.com reported earlier Thursday that the Bulls and Cleveland Cavaliers were expressing the strongest interest in Fredette after the Memphis Grizzlies claimed former New York Knicks guard Beno Udrih off waivers Wednesday. NBA.com subsequently reported that Fredette was "strongly leaning" toward signing with the Bulls.

Even before the buyout was reached, Fredette's representatives had begun talks with interested teams, with one source saying the third-year shooting guard is giving strong consideration to signing with a contender in the East.

The Bulls have been handcuffed all season by luxury-tax concerns but, according to sources, quickly threw themselves into the Fredette mix after it became apparent this week that the sharpshooter would be parting company with Sacramento.

Chicago is roughly $600,000 below the luxury-tax threshold and believes it can sign a player to a prorated minimum deal and avoid going down as a tax team at season's end.

  

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
3295 posts
Fri Feb-28-14 03:35 PM

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240. "NOPE! JR CHEAP!"
In response to Reply # 238


  

          

>The Bulls have been handcuffed all season by luxury-tax
>concerns but, according to sources, quickly threw themselves
>into the Fredette mix after it became apparent this week that
>the sharpshooter would be parting company with Sacramento.

quickly!

as cheap as ppl love to claim the front office is, they just keep on doing things that don't really support that narrative (pursuing fredette for the 13th slot instead of just riding out the varnado/mike james 10-day types for the rest of the season, signing mdj w/ an exception that they could've just kept in their pocket, refusing to dump rip last feb to avoid the tax, going several millions dollars into the tax the last 2 seasons, starting this season w/ 4 guys making 11M+, etc)

___

low end crazy, eastside crazy, wild hunnids crazy, englewood crazy.

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
8710 posts
Fri Feb-28-14 03:45 PM

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241. "i'm surprised"
In response to Reply # 240
Fri Feb-28-14 03:45 PM by RandomFact

  

          

if it was up to jr and we still had a pushover for a coach (i.e. vinny) the signing would not happen. especially in this non-title season

front office is trying to make thibs relatively happy.

  

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
3295 posts
Fri Feb-28-14 01:46 PM

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236. "the new three headed monster."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

"In winning seven of their last eight, Boozer, Noah and Gibson have been the catalysts. Boozer has averaged 14.1 points and 9.0 rebounds in that time, while Noah (15.4 points, 12.6 rebounds and 6.5 assists) and Gibson (17.3 points and 7.4 rebounds) also are on fire."

...

http://blogs.bulls.com/2014/02/bulls-new-three-headed-monster-is-roaring/

They have been three amigos, even if they don’t exactly spend all their time together. They have been good, bad and ugly on occasion, but hardly stooges. They have become the Bulls Big Three, the current version of the team’s Three Headed Monster: Joakim Noah, Taj Gibson and Carlos Boozer.

“We bring the juice for this team,” Boozer said following Tuesday’s 103-83 win over the Golden State Warriors when they combined for 44 points and 35 rebounds. “We’re very loud and passionate and try to hold the fort down inside.”

And that’s what the Bulls’ three interior big men have been doing as Chicago heads into Dallas Friday 8-4 in February and 19-8 since the beginning of January, one of the league’s hottest teams the last two months.

Noah has been getting a lot of attention with his All-Star appearance in which he was crucial down the stretch for the winning Eastern Conference. Noah is averaging 13.5 points, 12.1 rebounds and six assists in February and overall for the season 12.1 points, 11.5 rebounds and 4.6 assists.

But it’s been more than Noah in what arguably is the league’s top three-man interior rotation.

All are averaging in double figures while Gibson and Noah are in the top 15 in blocks and Noah and Boozer are in the top 20 in rebounding. There really is no three-man center/power forward group that is a true rival. The Pistons’ Andre Drummond, Greg Monroe and Josh Smith also place players among the leaders in blocks and rebounds. But all start as Smith plays small forward.

The Warriors have Andrew Bogut, David Lee and Jermaine O’Neal, though O’Neal doesn’t average double figures in any category. The Clippers have DeAndre Jordan and Blake Griffin, but no other true support. Which is why they brought in Glen Davis. The Trail Blazers have LaMarcus Aldridge and Robin Lopez, but little reliable otherwise. Indiana has Roy Hibbert and David West, but no longer a high level of production from Luis Scola or Ian Mahinmi. Andrew Bynum hasn’t played yet for them. There really hasn’t been a front line threesome this season to match the all around production of Noah, Gibson and Boozer.

“Taj is playing at a really high level,” said Noah. “Carlos gave us some great minutes (against the Warriors). Teams plays small against us, we have to find ways to punish them inside and a lot of guys stepped up.”

It’s been a big month for Noah, Gibson and Boozer, one that started warily as Boozer, during the road trip before a blowout loss in Sacramento, asked for more fourth quarter playing time. Noah was ejected during the game. Was this team splitting apart?

Instead, the Bulls won eight of their next 10 to move to a season high five games over .500 at 31-26 as they prepare for the Mavericks. The Bulls lost to Dallas Dec. 28 at the United Center, 105-83. Shawn Marion and Vince Carter gave Dallas big games in support of Dirk Nowitzki and Monta Ellis and the Bulls weren’t able to match Dallas’ scoring. But the Bulls have turned into an offensive force of late, scoring more than 100 points in three of their last four games and averaging 100 points the last seven games even with that 79 points in the loss to Miami last Sunday.

A lot of it has come thanks to the efforts on the offensive boards to provide second chances as well as defense that’s produced turnovers and open court opportunities.

Noah, Gibson and Boozer have been responsible for a lot of that in a balanced scoring game that has the top seven players in the Bulls’ rotation all averaging double figures this month.

They’re led by Gibson at 16.7 per game in February. Then it’s Noah at 13.5; Jimmy Butler at 13.4; Boozer at 12.9, D.J. Augustin at 12.8; Mike Dunleavy at 11.1 and Kirk Hinrich at 10.6.

But it’s been the regular contribution from Noah, Gibson and Boozer, averaging a combined 40 points and 27 rebounds in February.

Bulls coach Tom Thibodeau, calling them all starters, has settled into a rotation with Gibson off the bench and then being the first substitute in the first quarter for Noah. Boozer generally plays the entire first quarter and Gibson will play the entire second quarter. Nazr Mohammed, who had a strong eight points in nine minutes in the Golden State game, starts the second quarter. Noah subs for him to join Gibson, and Boozer will later sub for either Noah or Gibson.

The starters open the second half and Boozer’s third quarters have been crucial with his scoring. Gibson will again sub for Noah in the third and then Gibson and Noah generally will play the fourth quarter. Boozer does only when some late scoring is needed, but he made his point and being pushed by Gibson has seemed to make him more aggressive on offense.

The result has been a highly versatile and effective triumvirate, the Three Bulls.

The so-called Three Headed Monster was a vital component of the last three Bulls championship teams from 1996-1998 with Luc Longley and Bill Wennington and then being supported by James Edwards, Robert Parish, Brian Williams or Joe Kleine. It was initially to deal with Shaquille O’Neal, but it became an important part of the team. But that group was merely depth at center compared with this group with all around contributions.

“We’re taking advantage of mismatches, going at them when we see them and Jo is making great plays off the post and in the post,” said Gibson. “We’re going inside out, getting the ball in the post and kicking out. Just trying to take advantage and attack.”

...

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/basketball/bulls/25877866-579/noah-boozer-and-gibson-are-monsters-of-the-middle.html

Carlos Boozer’s comments did not go unnoticed.

After all, it isn’t very often that fourth-quarter playing time is questioned, but the Bulls power forward did just that in early February.

General manager Gar Forman didn’t like it, and coach Tom Thibodeau liked it even less.

But in the locker room? It was embraced.

Not because of some sort of coup in the works, that would never happen under Thibodeau’s reign. Rather, Boozer’s teammates know that the sacrifice and selflessness asked of them on a nightly basis sometimes leads to venting.

“It didn’t bother any of us at all,’’ Taj Gibson said. “As a matter of fact, we told him we wanted him to be like that, talk like that. To be honest, there are times I want him in there in the fourth. There have been games where I just didn’t have it going, and I wanted him to lift me up.

“You look at his defense, and his defense is getting better, so he should be able to do it in the fourth, but it’s up to the coach. Sometimes Thibs sees things we just don’t see.’’

All Thibodeau sees right now is what he calls “the three-headed monster.’’ The interchangeable parts of Gibson, Boozer and Joakim Noah have different skill sets but are rarely on the floor together.

Noah is the constant, while Boozer is the starter and Gibson the finisher. That’s what Boozer has had a problem with. That’s also why his teammates reminded him that unselfishness is seldom seen and is a trait only displayed by championship teams.

“This league is full of selfish teams,’’ Gibson said. “That’s why we’re able to do what we do every year, even short-handed. The one thing Tom has established here and put in our heads is when we win, everyone shines.

“We don’t tolerate guys not going hard. Those guys don’t stay around here very long.’’

As contradictory as it sounds, Boozer shares that same opinion. That takes a certain amount of sacrifice, starting with putting his ego in check.

Dwyane Wade has done that in Miami and has back-to-back titles to show for it. Kobe Bryant and Shaquille O’Neal couldn’t keep it going, and the dynasty crumbled in Los Angeles.

“Nah, not when you’re trying to win,’’ said Boozer, when asked if it has been a difficult adjustment for him. “You sacrifice for the group, and that’s what we’re trying to do right now, sacrifice for the group so we can win. We all have different roles at different times, but (the three of us) bring the juice for this team.’’

And the juice has been brought.

In winning seven of their last eight, Boozer, Noah and Gibson have been the catalysts. Boozer has averaged 14.1 points and 9.0 rebounds in that time, while Noah (15.4 points, 12.6 rebounds and 6.5 assists) and Gibson (17.3 points and 7.4 rebounds) also are on fire.

“Can we be the best front line in the league come playoff time?’’ Gibson said. “That remains to be seen. I do know when Joakim and Booze start a game off on that rampage, I think we’re unstoppable.

“We all work hard, all humble, all pull for one another, all wait because you know your time will come if you handle business the right way. That’s the bright spot here. You shine, I shine.’’

___

low end crazy, eastside crazy, wild hunnids crazy, englewood crazy.

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
20939 posts
Fri Feb-28-14 02:56 PM

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237. "I hope thibs has a Pop like run with us. No matter who's on the "
In response to Reply # 236


  

          

team.

Why would anyone who wants to win NOT want to play with this group/for this coach?

And Booz has been a class guy all the way. I didn't even mind his remarks about playing in the fourth. Like what is he supposed to say, "I like not being in the game when it's at it's most crucial point"?

Also...another post-separation L for Basa is Taj's contract. Looks appropriate right now and will look even MORE so next season.

I also agree with your feelings on Noah. He's the type of guy I love to watch play. His game will never get old.

____________

  

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
3295 posts
Fri Feb-28-14 03:26 PM

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239. "thibs isn't going anywhere."
In response to Reply # 237


  

          

simmons and those guys need to let it go, idk what else thibs has to say or do to kill that story.

dude has said repeatedly that he loves his team and the city of chicago. he has a great relationship with the reinsdorfs. he's already got a great core in place, with his type of players, and retooling + reinforcements on deck. and he's in the first year of a 4 yr contract. he's not walking. to go to new york? and deal with that mess?!

his relationship with the front office isn't great but it's nowhere near as fractured as is being reported. he obvs didn't like the adams firing or the deng trade but they get along more than well enough to continue working together.

>And Booz has been a class guy all the way. I didn't even mind
>his remarks about playing in the fourth. Like what is he
>supposed to say, "I like not being in the game when it's at
>it's most crucial point"?

i didn't mind his comments at all, for 2 reasons. first, if you read what he said, it wasn't about him, it was about the team. he said, if i'm _playing well_ and i have a good game going, i want to be out there in the 4th to help the team win, and more often than not when he takes me out and sits me we lose. that's not selfish, the guy wants to win and to contribute.

secondly, whenever a player puts the spotlight on himself like that, his ass is the one on the line and he's got to go out and back it up and produce. i like when guys put the pressure on themselves, rather than just fall back and collect the checks.

but of course it was booz who said it, and every bulls fan hates the guy, so of course they spun it into something negative.

>Also...another post-separation L for Basa is Taj's contract.
>Looks appropriate right now and will look even MORE so next
>season.

that post was dumb when he made it and couldn't be more wrongheaded. gibson's actually on one of the league's BEST value contracts, a high quality defensively stellar 16&8-ish starting calibre PF @ 8M a yr, if the bulls do decide this summer to move him for extra cap space there'll be a long line of suitors.

>I also agree with your feelings on Noah. He's the type of guy
>I love to watch play. His game will never get old.

my favorite player. nobody else like him.

___

low end crazy, eastside crazy, wild hunnids crazy, englewood crazy.

  

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
3295 posts
Fri Feb-28-14 06:03 PM

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242. "great hinrich breakdown in sam smith's mailbag today..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

ppl who are automatically assuming that he'll be gone after this season may be in for a surprise. i know that thibs and his mates value his game tremendously and it wouldn't shock me at all to see him back at a modest price.

...

"Sadly, Father Time has robbed Hinrich of his athleticism. He can't jump like he used to for sure and the nicks take longer to repair themselves. However. He's as smooth as butter. He keeps his balance so well whether in backpedal, slide step, or sprint. He cheats the screen by bodying his guy through it. Bulls switch but he gives the big a little edge by holding on to the handoff for that extra moment that lets the big cleanly engage. It's a dumb subtle thing that his teammates I bet appreciate. Folks watching on TV can't hear, but I suspect that Hinrich is also really good at calling for rotation when he's beat and he's smart enough at this point to know what's his plan B. Bulls bigs get a lot of credit that they deserve. Noah in particular is freakishly mobile for a guy that size. Hinrich sets a lot of that up, though by breaking the rhythm of the guard which lets the big lock up cleanly. Another thing Hinrich does: consistently skew the passing lane just by not taking possessions off. He also has really good hands in traffic for the rake. Hinrich is not going to swat you from behind a la LBJ. He's too smart to get into the habit of jumping the route because he knows that ends up breaking the defensive concept. Let's check some tape and see how often Hinrich gets beat at the back door. Answer: just about never, and across his career he's played the likes of Wade. If Thabo had stuck around, that pair would have rivalled Sloan & Van Lier on the defensive end though for entirely different reasons. Problem with the pairing: you needed a front court of Kareem, 'Nique, and Bird. Yeah, he screws up Curry and John Wall pretty regularly, and actually he does a pretty good job on Jeff Teague (though not so much the other night), but he's been doing that stuff his entire career that I've seen. Hinrich is a lovely piece of work. I've always liked his game, just not as anyone's centerpiece. To me, the bonus is the distributor part. He knows his group and gets them into the right spots. Augustin is obviously a different player entirely, but when Hinrich is out for a couple of games you see spacing get all hosed up. When his shot is clicking and he's healthy, he's really valuable."

___

low end crazy, eastside crazy, wild hunnids crazy, englewood crazy.

  

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FILF
Member since Jun 01st 2007
20180 posts
Fri Feb-28-14 10:56 PM

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243. "Damn.....Taj pounded Dirk's coochie all game long"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

WHAT'S GOOD *****? What's REALLY good?!?!????!!! Ha HA!
http://40.media.tumblr.com/d8e2daf9f3f37244cd05436bcdf05973/tumblr_mt4qibKq4c1rgam01o1_1280.png

  

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select_from_where
Member since Jan 03rd 2011
4342 posts
Fri Feb-28-14 11:21 PM

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244. "That was crazy to see, not used to seeing Dirk get hoed like that"
In response to Reply # 243


  

          

  

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
3295 posts
Sun Mar-02-14 04:29 PM

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245. "The One Free Agent the Chicago Bulls Must Land This Offseason"
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http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1977360-the-one-free-agent-the-chicago-bulls-must-land-this-offseason

The One Free Agent the Chicago Bulls Must Land This Offseason
By Kelly Scaletta, Featured Columnist
Mar 1, 2014

Strap on your fake Chicago Bulls’ GM hat and pretend you need to sign one free agent this offseason. Who is it going to be? While many are going to propose Carmelo Anthony, allow me to introduce a better alternative: Lance Stephenson.

I understand the thought that the Bulls need a second superstar to help Derrick Rose carry the team. I get the appeal of Anthony. He’s a great player. Over the last two seasons, the only three players with a higher player efficiency rating (PER) than Anthony’s 25.0 are LeBron James, Kevin Durant and Chris Paul. (http://bkref.com/tiny/a6O6o)

In a perfect world, where the Bulls could just add Anthony to the roster without any subtraction, it’s a great idea to bring him on board. But that’s not the case. There would be a heavy cost to acquire him.

Stephenson would meet all the needs the Bulls have, fit better in the Bulls system and come at a much cheaper price.

This is a case where Plan B needs to be promoted over Plan A.

...

How Stephenson Meets the Bulls Needs

During the Miami Heat vs. New York Knicks broadcast, February 27, on TNT, Steve Kerr initiated a discussion that Joakim Noah is now a top-10 player in the league. The other broadcasters agreed.

On February 28, Sekou Smith, who compiles NBA.com’s Race to the MVP Ladder (http://www.nba.com/mvp-ladder) had Noah in the 10th spot for the second week in a row, saying,

"The Bulls have won seven of their last eight games with Noah driving them from end to end. He's the backbone of this franchise now, having assumed that leadership role during what has been a trying time for Derrick Rose, the franchise, the entire city of Chicago and the legion of Bulls fans worldwide. Noah does whatever the Bulls need him to do -- scoring, rebounding, defending, blocking shots. Bulls coach Tom Thibodeau knows that Noah helped keep this team together after the Luol Deng trade and acknowledges that Noah has become its driving force."

Noah is literally in the discussion as a top-10 player in the league. One can debate whether he *should* be or not, but he is being discussed. That makes him a star.

No, what the Bulls “need” is not a “second star.” They have two stars. Their need is a second “scorer.”

The two things are not synonymous. Anthony is a star because he’s a great scorer. Noah is a star in spite of the fact that he’s not a scorer. Stephenson is not a star, but he’s a solid scorer, particularly where the Bulls need help—a second player who can handle the ball, create shots and get to the rim.

This one table convinced me Stephenson was the best way to go. Look at what Anthony does inside the restricted area in comparison to Stephenson.

Carmelo Anthony vs. Lance Stephenson Inside the Restricted Area

Player | FG | FGA | FG% | Asstd | Unasstd

Carmelo Anthony | 157 | 272 | 0.577 | 50 | 107
Lance Stephenson | 175 | 251 | 0.697 | 70 | 105

If one just looks at production, Stephenson is actually better at the rim than Anthony. He is more efficient and just as good at getting there on his own. He has more assisted field goals, nearly as many unassisted ones (he’s tied for 10th in the NBA) and has a higher field-goal percentage.

And, for those who think that stats don’t tell you everything, here’s the visual.

Lance Stephenson's "Houdini" Ball Fake and Score : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4KxRF6L8bOw
Play of the Day Nov 23, 2012 - Lance Stephenson : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j3sXN6RiG9I

Stephenson might not be a superstar like Anthony is, but in terms of filling the Bulls’ need for a player who can create shots off the dribble, drive to the rim and take some of the pressure off of Rose, he would be just as effective as Anthony.

Now granted, Anthony is a better scorer in other aspects, but those aren’t needs the Bulls have. Those are niceties, not necessities. The point here isn’t to argue that Stephenson is just as good of a scorer, but that he’s just as good in the area they need scoring the most.

You don’t need a bazooka to shoot a bothersome squirrel. Would it do the job? Sure! But so would a pellet gun, and the pellet gun is cheaper and wouldn’t risk as much collateral damage. Anthony would fill the Bulls’ needs, certainly, but so would Stephenson.

...

Stephenson Fits Better

Anthony is a better overall scorer and rebounder, but Stephenson is better in some areas, too.

The completeness of Stephenson’s game—a triple-double threat (http://bkref.com/tiny/wEah6) who plays both ends of the ball—makes him a better fit for the Bulls.

Stephenson is averaging 14.2 points, 7.3 rebounds and 5.1 assists per game. Players who can beat those numbers this season are limited to LeBron James and Kevin Durant. (http://bkref.com/tiny/3zbDC)

Stephenson is not the scorer those two are—and I’m not going to even try to pretend he is—but he gets the points where the Bulls need them. And, he does it as an all-around player who facilitates and doesn’t stop the ball.

Lance Stephenson's AMAZING In-Air Circus Assist : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zOZkU6_8Ezs

One argument I get on twitter about Stephenson is that he’s just playing well because he’s in the right system, but how is that going to change in Chicago? If anything, that should be a plus. He’s a proven system player. Chicago is a system team.

Stephenson is thriving in a one-star system predicated on sharing the ball. The concern should be whether Anthony can play in a system when he’s not actually the system.

Stephenson, unlike Anthony, has shown that he can have an impact on games without being a ball-dominant player. He is sixth in win shares among players who have a usage percentage below 20 percent. He leads all shooting guards in that regard. (http://bkref.com/tiny/maKc6)

Lance Stephenson EMBARRASSES JR Smith : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXZucq4SDr0

Furthermore, he’s a much better defensive player who has shown a commitment to play in a defensive system. Per 82games.com, Stephenson’s opponent’s PER is 10.6. (http://www.82games.com/1314/1314IND.HTM) Anthony’s opponents post a PER of 14.1. (http://www.82games.com/1314/1314NYK.HTM) While such defensive measures are, in part, an issue of team defense, a reputation for bad defense is one that has followed Anthony through the years. (http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/2214/testing-the-theory-that-carmelo-anthony-is-a-lousy-defender)

Lance Stephenson is a round peg filling a round hole. Anthony might be a prettier, glossier, gold-layered, diamond-crusted, platinum-set peg, but he’s a square one.

Why bother trying to force him in when you can just fill the hole with right-shaped peg?

...

Stephenson Comes at a Much Cheaper Price

According to Amin Elhassan of ESPN Insider (http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/10525164/nba-ranking-top-30-free-agents-2014?refresh=true&refresh=true) the cost of Carmelo Anthony would be 23.5 million per year, and the cost of Stephenson would be $9.5 million per year. For the math-challenged, that’s a difference of $14 million.

That’s not just a difference in the accounting book. That’s a difference on the court, because that’s $14 million in one player that can’t be filled by others as a result of Anthony’s contract.

For the Bulls to afford Anthony, it would require losing Carlos Boozer, Taj Gibson, Nikola Mirotic, Mike Dunleavy Jr. and the Charlotte pick (No. 16 projected). They would be able to add Anthony and their own pick.

For the Bulls to acquire Stephenson, it would require amnestying Boozer and trading Dunleavy. In addition to Stephenson, they would add the Charlotte pick, and, believe it or not, Mirotic, while keeping Gibson.

So, it’s not a question of Anthony or Stephenson. It’s a question of Anthony or Stephenson, Gibson, Mirotic and the Charlotte pick. Here’s how I got that.

If we work out max raises for Stephenson, his first year would cost the Bulls $8.9 million to reach the four-year, $38 million projected by Elhassan (who uses DeMar DeRozan’s contract as a gauge).

Stephenson, contrary to what some have him listed as, is an unrestricted free agent (http://grantland.com/the-triangle/the-growing-legend-of-lance-stephenson/) so the Indiana Pacers couldn't match. And, they will be limited in what they can offer him.

However, they are already committed to $66.8 million (http://data.shamsports.com/content/pages/data/salaries/pacers.jsp) and after accounting for cap holds, they would be over $77 million if they matched. This doesn't include Danny Granger, Evan Turner or LaVoy Allen. That’s well over the tax limit and even over the apron, where the tax becomes more punitive.

That could be further complicated if Paul George qualifies for the "Rose Rule" (he probably will), which will raise the value of his contract. The Pacers will owe $71.9 million. Giving Stephenson a market-value contract would have them well over the tax threshold.

They haven’t paid the tax since 2005-06. (http://www.shamsports.com/2014/02/the-tax-paid-by-title-winners.html) It’s unlikely they would pay such a hefty bill to keep Stephenson. They are still a small market team after all.

So, if Stephenson takes $8.9 million out of the Bulls cap space for the first year of his contract, it leaves $6.4 million after cap holds to offer Mirotic in the first year. Once again, using max raises, that would come out to a four-year, $27.2 million deal to offer him.

bwin MVP for October: Nikola Mirotic, Real Madrid : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=af3jTTp76bI

Also, according to Eurohoops, Mirotic is ready to come to Chicago for $20 million. (http://www.eurohoops.net/2014/02/dunks/42988) Some expect that won’t be enough. However, the Bulls can pay up to $27.2 million over four years. Either way, it’s enough for Mirotic to buy out his Real Madrid contract with the 2.5 million Euros ($3.4 million US) he owes—and make more money than he is now.

"Real Madrid already knows that Nikola Mirotic is leaving the club for the NBA. Jan Vesely and Doellman main options. ( vía @Hectorfernandez)"
https://twitter.com/jondelapresa/statuses/436639747264757761

Mirotic’s best friend, Hector Fernandez, says that Real Madrid is preparing for his departure, per Jon de la Presa, who covers the ACB. That suggests that Mirotic isn’t planning to play hardball in negotiations, especially since he doesn’t have much to bargain with, other than staying in Spain.

Chicago doesn’t have to outbid the NBA free market, they only have to pay Mirotic enough to buy out his contract in Spain and still make at least what he is presently earning.

And he’s worth it. He was named the ACB MVP for the second season in a row. He shot 53.8 percent. And then there’s this form Scott Howard-Cooper of NBA.com,

"One executive, after seeing Mirotic play, said the power forward originally from Montenegro would go “top two or three for sure” if he was in the 2014 draft and “maybe even one.” Mirotic could be in Chicago next season."

“Maybe even one.” In a draft that is possibly the deepest in a generation of players, Mirotic might go first if he were available. The Bulls may very well be sitting on the 2014-15 Rookie of the Year.

This is a team that has played surprisingly well after their awful start. Since January 1, no team in the NBA has won more games than the Bulls. And it’s not just because they’re beating Eastern Conference pushovers, either.

Over the last 25 percent of their games, they are tied for the eighth hardest schedule, with their opponents boasting a .519 winning percentage.

I’m not trying to make an argument that they’re the best team in the NBA, but I will argue they aren’t in dire need of an overhaul.

Intentionally mixing metaphors here, if you go all in for Anthony, you’re not just filling the hole with the wrong peg, you’re digging other holes in order to do it.

...

Remember, you’re the GM. You have a team that has won as much as anyone over a two-month period. Next season you can upgrade Dunleavy to Stephenson and Boozer to Mirotic. You can fill the two biggest needs in doing so—driving and three-point shooting.

You can also add a No. 16 pick and a No. 19 pick.

And, just for giggles, you have a former league MVP returning.

That would give you a deeper roster with a starting five all under the age 30, and three of your premier players, Rose, Stephenson and Mirotic, all under 26.

Or, you can gut your roster and rebuild around a 30-year-old Anthony.

The responsibility of a GM isn’t to get a team a second star, it’s to improve the team. The Bulls could land Anthony, win the battle and lose the war. The aggregate cost of him, in terms of both players and money, could end up being greater than the reward he provides.

On the other hand, the relatively cheap cost of Stephenson could allow the Bulls to flesh out a younger, deeper team that maintains its chemistry, has a defensive mentality matching the coach and fills out its weaknesses.

The Stephenson signing would make the Bulls a better, younger, more complete team, and that’s why he’s the one player they have to get in this year’s offseason.

___

low end crazy, eastside crazy, wild hunnids crazy, englewood crazy.

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
20939 posts
Mon Mar-03-14 02:24 PM

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246. "Melo @ 15 starting, if not, Lance @ 9-9.5 works"
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I don't care about Lance's D so much, with Taj, Jimmy and Noah starting, it's not as much of a concern. While it'd be great to have, we need a guy who can get 20+ppg a night on 15-16 shots.

I want a DEFINITE shot at it all for at least 2 seasons.

1) Amnesty Booz, Melo @ 15 (Dunny traded), trade a pick to carve out a lil room for Mirotic, keep a pick...resign DJ if possible.

^^^I'm doing the cabbage patch

2) Amnesty Booz, Lance @ 9.5 (Dunny traded), sign Mirotic, keep both picks, resign DJ if possible.

^^^I'm doing the running man

3) Keep booz as we can't sign a FA (though looking at it, we may HAVE to trade or amnesty him this summer), Mirotic, keep both picks, resign DJ.

^^^Approving nod.

____________

  

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LeroyBumpkin
Charter member
36966 posts
Mon Mar-03-14 02:46 PM

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248. "Just curious."
In response to Reply # 246


  

          

What in that article didn't convince you?

Granted I was already leaning towards the Bulls going after Lance this off season.
But this swipe along with:

"That would give you a deeper roster with a starting
five all under the age 30, and three of your premier
players, Rose, Stephenson and Mirotic, all under 26.
Or, you can gut your roster and rebuild around a
30-year-old Anthony."

That convinced me. I don't think Melo is going to take that much of a pay cut, and I definitely have no interest in gutting the team to get him. Honestly, what's the difference in your #1 option and what the Knicks did to get Melo in the first place?

A core of...
Rose
Melo
Noah
...doens't get it done for me either.
Why not go the cheaper younger route?

https://digife.com

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
20939 posts
Mon Mar-03-14 03:16 PM

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249. "Lance is a bit of a hot head and he's at that "gotta get mine""
In response to Reply # 248
Mon Mar-03-14 03:23 PM by auragin_boi

  

          

stage of his NBA career. That and I'm not sold 100% on him as a primetime player. While I like adding him more than not adding him, it does come with risk (Dula made some valid points in our earlier discussion).

Additionally, I think we have leverage in a Melo negotiation. He's at the "I'm paid, got mine, I have win now cuz the end is within 5 yrs" stage of his career. He's gonna go hard for at least 3 seasons cuz he wants his legacy to reflect something more. To me he has the better motivation to win. I also think if we land Melo at my desired price, it's a no brainer to get him and still work out keeping most of our assets.

If it's what the article list (Melo maxed) of course it's a bad deal. No you don't do it. But he's flung around 'pay cut' and 'Winning is the most important thing' and 'it's frustrating to score 40-44 points and lose'. I think it'll be a loooooooooooooong shot but if we go into a meeting with him and say, '15 is the most we can offer starting without losing key ingredient to a title contender' he has to listen and then REALLY decide what's more important - 60 extra mil to play for a losing franchise, 25 extra mil to play for a marginal team that may take 2-3 years to get a shot at a title or a bonafied shot at it for 3 seasons.

We have options too so he can't play hardball with us over a figure.

>That convinced me. I don't think Melo is going to take that
>much of a pay cut, and I definitely have no interest in
>gutting the team to get him. Honestly, what's the difference
>in your #1 option and what the Knicks did to get Melo in the
>first place?
>
>A core of...
>Rose
>Melo
>Noah
>...doens't get it done for me either.
>Why not go the cheaper younger route?

My option 1 isn't what you have here...my option 1 is:

Rose/maybe DJ
Jimmy/2014 First rounder
Melo/Snell
Taj/Mirotic
Noah/Vet min back up

We'd need to move a few assets (picks, one this year and maybe a future 1st for cash...basically a player we can waive for a minimal cap hit) and Dunny to get Melo and have a shot to keep Mirotic. If not trade Mirotic for a future first and keep both picks. All are workable.

____________

  

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
3295 posts
Mon Mar-03-14 03:49 PM

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250. "he's not."
In response to Reply # 248


  

          

>I don't think Melo is going to take that much of a pay cut

no chance. idk why auragin keeps beating this "he'll sign @ 15 to win" drum. it's a pipe dream.

per larry coon (salary cap guru):

"Anthony is eligible for a 2014-15 salary of up to $22,458,401. If he re-ups with the Knicks, he could ink a five-year contract worth $129,135,806. If he signs with another team, the maximum he can earn is $95,897,372 over four years."

a four yr deal starting at 15 w/ annual raises would be somewhere in the 65-70M range. no way in hell he leaves all that gotdamn money on the table. to sign him, the bulls would have to offer him something in the 20M/yr neighborhood, and they'd have to significantly overhaul the roster to do that.

at the very least, they'd have to amnesty boozer, trade gibson, let hinrich and augustin walk, and leave mirotic in europe.

___

low end crazy, eastside crazy, wild hunnids crazy, englewood crazy.

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
20939 posts
Mon Mar-03-14 03:55 PM

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251. "I'm not beating a drum...I'm dreaming lol"
In response to Reply # 250


  

          

Option 1 is the 'hit the lotto' dream. While the odds are very low, it CAN happen.

Let me cook! Cuz if it goes down...I'm gonna moonwalk all over this post.

____________

  

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
3295 posts
Mon Mar-03-14 04:04 PM

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252. "DOOOOONT WAAAAKE MEEEEEE"
In response to Reply # 251


  

          

___

low end crazy, eastside crazy, wild hunnids crazy, englewood crazy.

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
20939 posts
Mon Mar-03-14 02:25 PM

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247. "Jo Noah DEMANDS excellence in ALL PARTS OF THE GAME!"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://ftw.usatoday.com/2014/03/joakim-noah-chest-bump-bulls/

hahahahaha

____________

  

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
3295 posts
Mon Mar-03-14 04:15 PM

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253. "lol, jimmer's shooting chart is crazy."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://l.yimg.com/os/en/blogs/sptusnbaexperts/JFsc3114.jpg

___

low end crazy, eastside crazy, wild hunnids crazy, englewood crazy.

  

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
3295 posts
Mon Mar-03-14 04:29 PM

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254. "i'm turnt up like fuck for this march sked."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

mem, mia, sas, hou, okc, ind, pdx. all at the UC. can't wait.

#neverscared

___

low end crazy, eastside crazy, wild hunnids crazy, englewood crazy.

  

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JAESCOTT777
Member since Feb 18th 2006
28487 posts
Tue Mar-04-14 10:15 AM

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255. "dude we are in 3rd place this is crazy lol "
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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
20939 posts
Thu Mar-06-14 07:26 PM

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256. "New Scuttlebutt: Noah recruiting Melo"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://espn.go.com/chicago/nba/story/_/id/10562283/joakim-noah-recruits-carmelo-anthony-new-york-knicks-join-chicago-bulls

*sigh*

I actually spent about 30 mins this weekend on ESPN's trade machine seeing if there was a way we could do a 4 team trade to offer NY a sign and trade deal that allowed us to keep at least one of our picks and Mirotic while only losing Boozer and Dunny.

My brain KNOWS this won't happen but man my gut is like 'don't be surprised'.

I'm enjoying this season waaaaay more than I thought I would after Rose went down.

____________

  

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j0510
Member since Feb 02nd 2012
2315 posts
Thu Mar-06-14 10:48 PM

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257. "Nikola Mirotic 2013 Scouting Video (14 min., via DraftExpress)"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Nikola Mirotic 2013 Scouting Video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjaHc9Vp9wU

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
8710 posts
Thu Mar-06-14 11:34 PM

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258. "I just hope Derrick's knee's hold up"
In response to Reply # 257


  

          

And he can be like 88% of what he was pre-injury

Because the Jo, Taj, Mirotic, Derrick foursome could be a terror.

  

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dula dos pistolas
Member since Sep 12th 2006
3295 posts
Fri Mar-07-14 10:53 AM

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259. "Tear Down To Build Up With Carmelo? Shaky Strategy For Him, Suitors"
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Tear Down To Build Up With Carmelo? Shaky Strategy For Him, Suitors

http://hangtime.blogs.nba.com/2014/03/06/tear-down-to-build-up-with-carmelo-shaky-strategy-for-him-suitors/

If Carmelo Anthony leaves the New York Knicks as a free agent this summer and signs for less money elsewhere – and it’s a huge “if,” roughly the size of 30 million dollar bills stacked one atop the other – his avowed motive will be to join a team with which he’d have a better shot at winning an NBA title.

OK, fine. Those teams exist, because the Knicks’ avenues to improve are largely blocked by massive salary obligations to other players and a shortage of draft picks. Locking in with the Knicks for another five seasons, at approximately $129 million, mostly would assure Anthony of more of the same: frustration, eliminations and his nose pressed against the Finals glass while his buddies are grabbing hardware.

So even among Anthony’s supporters and critics – rarely on the same page about the high-scoring, ball-dominating All-Star forward’s polarizing game – there seems consensus that, if he truly craves that which he cannot buy, he’d best be served by seeking it somewhere else.

(Insert decision tree here: Those who doubt Anthony's single-minded lust for a championship, over all the attention, fun and earning opportunities that flow to him win or lose by virtue of playing in New York, can stop reading right now. So, too, can those who believe the extra $30 million, mostly at age 34 in the fifth year of a deal he cannot get elsewhere, renders moot any other-team scenario. What follows is of interest only to readers who actually believe Anthony will change teams in July…)

Then the question becomes: If the team he chooses has to start throwing pieces overboard just to pay him, won’t that be counterproductive to achieving the very goal he purportedly is seeking?

Anthony, remember, has been there, done this. When he leveraged his trade out of Denver in February 2011, he ostensibly got what he wanted – New York in all its Big Apple glory. But it came at a hefty price in the form of valuable Knicks players (Wilson Chandler, Danilo Gallinari, Timofey Mozgov) and draft picks (including the 2014 first-rounder this June).

Even as the Knicks added Anthony as a marquee scorer, what they gave up all but killed the plan at its genesis. Cue the sad trombone.

So, fast-forwarding to the summer of 2014, what can we expect? Anthony and a team that covets him making the exact same mistake?

If, say, the Chicago Bulls – the team currently in the media’s crosshairs as fitting, wanting and flat-out needing Melo, with or without center Joakim Noah‘s supposed “recruiting” advice – tries to dredge enough salary-cap space to compete monetarily with the Knicks, it effectively will have to do what New York did. Either via sign-and-trade or the outright purging of players, Chicago would start any Anthony acquisition process by taking several steps backward.

First, the Bulls would have to amnesty Carlos Boozer to shed the $16.8 million due him in 2014-15. They would have to renounce cap holds on players such as Kirk Hinrich, D.J. Augustin, Nazr Mohammed and a few other near the bottom of their payroll.

And still, Chicago might need to shed more. Power forward Taj Gibson, for instance, might have to be traded to clear his $8 million salary. So what if Gibson, the Bulls’ Boozer replacement, has become a legitimate candidate for the NBA’s Sixth Man Award? His money would be all that mattered, just so VP John Paxson and GM Gar Forman could shove it across the table toward Anthony.

At which point Anthony – if he were really serious about wanting to win – ought to push it right back and say, “Not necessary, gentlemen.”

That’s right. Turn down money. Turn down a lot of money.

It’s the only way a move by Anthony to another team makes sense and serves both parties’ needs. And both parties’ needs do merge: If the Bulls or anyone else tear down their roster so much that they go backward before they can go forward, they likely won’t get where they want to go and he won’t either.

A team that has or painlessly can create cap space to max out (or near-max) Anthony’s contract probably doesn’t already have in place the pieces or track record he can trust to win big now and into his late prime. A team that would wince to do so ought to beware.

Chicago is way more viable as a contender with Gibson, to name one, than without him. Which looks better, a frontline of Anthony, Noah and Gibson, or one of Anthony, Noah and Phil N. DaBlanc, some low-salary schmoe scrounged after the rest of the money is in Anthony’s pocket?

The thing is, Anthony should want this, too. And he can afford it.

By the end of this, his 11th NBA season, Anthony will have been paid approximately $135 million. That’s about $6 million more than LeBron James, a four-time MVP. Since the start of the 2010-11 season, Anthony has pulled in more than $10 million more than James, who was playing for less money while going to three straight Finals and winning two of them.

This is where critics might ask: What has Anthony done to justify premium pay over what the game’s best player earns? Sticking to the topic, though, we’ll simply ask: Why can’t Anthony afford to take less now, the way James (and Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh) did, to chase what he allegedly really craves? When Paul Pierce, Kevin Garnett and Ray Allen negotiated new deals in their 30s to keep their Big Three together in Boston, they took a combined pay cut of $23 million annually.

Keep in mind, Anthony’s off-court income from endorsements and other enterprises was recently estimated to be $8 million annually. His wife LaLa is an entertainer, bringing more cash into their celebrity household. The Anthonys might end up hosting telethons but they’ll never need to be the beneficiaries of one.

Fitting into Chicago’s ideal cap number would push Anthony’s paycheck down considerably; without stripping themselves of Noah, Gibson, Derrick Rose, Jimmy Butler, Mike Dunleavy, Tony Snell and a few others, the Bulls might only be able to offer $11 million or $12 million in starting pay, building out to about $52 million over four years. That’s even a steep discount from approximately $95 million over four if he maxes out with a new team.

An insult? No, because Anthony would be getting while giving. He’d be getting the best possible cast of teammates, into which he could air-drop as the primary scorer. He’d be getting a fresh start in a market poised to adore him for what he might bring. He’d be getting one of the league’s most respected and resource coaches, Tom Thibodeau, who engenders blood loyalty in his locker room (if not his front office).

There would also be a bonus benefit of Anthony accepting a much lower offer, as in, money, meet mouth. If he prefers to max out financially, then he’s tracking a vastly different scoreboard than James, Kobe Bryant or Kevin Durant. But no team should prostrate itself at that particular altar for him, least of all the Bulls. I’ve already gone on record that his and their cultures, at any price, would mix about as well as brown shoes and tuxedos or, y’know, Mike D’Antoni and Dwight Howard.

If, on the other hand, Anthony truly wants a title, he in essence could buy an enhanced path to one by making sure the roster he joins is the strongest possible. That’s how four years, $52 million, compared to five years, $129 million, can literally have a better ring to it.

___

low end crazy, eastside crazy, wild hunnids crazy, englewood crazy.

  

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auragin_boi
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Fri Mar-07-14 03:46 PM

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261. "15-16 mil per...I been saying it and it's the only way it happens"
In response to Reply # 259


  

          

he either takes the huge cut to win (realizing he's made more than guys better than him in the league) or we move on.

June/July can't come quick enough for this resolution.

____________

  

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j0510
Member since Feb 02nd 2012
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Fri Mar-07-14 04:03 PM

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262. "Another piece: How much less is Melo willing to take to leave New York?"
In response to Reply # 259


  

          

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/writer/ken-berger/24471880/how-much-less-is-melo-willing-to-take-to-leave-new-york

How much less is Melo willing to take to leave New York?
Ken Berger
March 7, 2014 2:40 pm ET

The idea of Carmelo Anthony joining Derrick Rose and Joakim Noah in Chicago is fun. It would involve the rare example of a superstar free agent voluntarily taking less money to go from one team to another.

This hardly ever happens, even when the difference in money is minimal or the star in question is young enough to get another max contract. Dwight Howard did it this past summer, taking a four-year, $88 million deal with the Rockets when he could've stayed with the Lakers on a five-year, $118 million deal. Howard, of course, is only 28 and likely will get another max contract, so he'll have a chance to make up for the shortfall.

There's a common misperception that LeBron James, Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh signed on for the minimum wage when they teamed up in Miami in 2010. In order to fit under the cap, all three did agree to start their six-year deals -- with maximum percentage increases, mind you -- at a lower number than they could've otherwise received.

James and Bosh started at $14.5 million, and Wade $14.2 million when the max was $16.6 million at that time. Through the compounding effect, James and Bosh will have made $9.6 million less through the end of this season by taking a South Beach haircut than they would have made to this point on a true max deal. Wade gave up a little more. Some of that shortfall is mitigated by Florida's lack of a state income tax, and the rest could be recouped if any of the players opts out this summer or next.

Either way, $9 million is nothing to sneeze at -- until you get a load of what Anthony would have to give up if, in fact, he wants to chase a championship with Rose and Noah in Chicago. The plan, if there is one, is fraught with pitfalls.

If the Bulls amnesty Carlos Boozer, the starting point for the cap room they could offer Anthony, according to league salary sheets, is $13.8 million. To even get there, they would have to renounce free agent Kirk Hinrich (and lose his Bird rights) and trade their first-round pick and the pick they are getting from Charlotte (which together would amount to another $2.7 million on Chicago's books).

Further, if the Bulls are under the cap, they'd only have their $2.7 million room exception to bring 2011 pick Nikola Mirotic over from Spain. League sources say Mirotic would be looking for a deal in the $3 million-$4 million range. (He's no longer governed by the rookie scale, and the Bulls have planned for needing the bulk of their non-taxpayer mid-level exception of $5.3 million on him, sources say.)

But let's play along, shall we? Let's say the Bulls renounced Hinrich ($5.2 million cap hold gone), kept their picks, and traded Taj Gibson ($8 million) and Mike Dunleavy ($3.3 million) while bringing back no salary in the process. They would be able to start Anthony at about $20 million in the first year of a four-year, $85.4 million deal -- give or take, depending on how much they need to sign Mirotic.

That would leave the Bulls with a lineup of Anthony, Rose coming off a second straight season lost to injury, Jimmy Butler, Noah and a giant hole at the other forward spot. Their bench would be Tony Snell, Mirotic and their two first-round picks. When all was said and done, they'd be able to offer minimum deals to other free agents and they'd have their room exception of $2.7 million available.

But before we get too far ahead of ourselves, let's back up to where Anthony's four-year deal with Chicago would start: $20 million. That's $1.7 million less than Anthony is making this season and $3.3 million less than he'd make in the first season of a five-year, $130.9 million deal he could get from the Knicks. The compounding effect of Anthony's initial sacrifice, plus forgoing the fifth year the Knicks could offer at $30.3 million, would mean that Anthony would be leaving $45 million on the table to sign with the Bulls.

Does anybody really think that's going to happen? I can safely say that Anthony's agent, Leon Rose, hopes that it doesn't. The Bulls apparently don't think it will, either, since I'm told they haven't gotten as far as we have here in crunching these numbers. Even if the Bulls could somehow clear enough room to offer Anthony the true max for four years, that's never been how they've operated -- not for a soon-to-be 30-year-old free agent, anyway.

But the whole discussion introduces an interesting possibility into Anthony's free-agent equation. What if he decided to opt in for the 2014-15 season with the Knicks at $23.3 million and waited to see if A) a new coach, and B) another max free agent in the summer of 2015 could bring the Knicks back to contention? If Anthony then decided to re-up with the Knicks in 2015, the five-year max deal he'd get then, plus his max salary in 2014-15, would maximize his earnings over a six-year period more than any other option currently fathomable. The question, of course, is whether Anthony and his agents would want to incur the injury risk that would come along with that decision.

It's difficult to predict what Anthony ultimately will do, other than to say he's not leaving $45 million on the table. Beyond that, you can only go by his past behavior. In 2011, under the old CBA rules, he made sure that he got traded to the team of his choice AND got every dollar available to him at the time (three years, $65 million in an extend-and-trade, a provision that no longer exists).

On this go-round, Anthony will have to sacrifice something. If his behavior or that of any of his free-agent contemporaries means anything, a massive amount of money won't be it.

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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264. "Ha. Consider me late in reading your swipe."
In response to Reply # 262


  

          

https://digife.com

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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260. "Noah is playing tonight vs. Memphis."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://www.blogabull.com/2014/3/7/5481710/joakim-noah-injury-thumb-bulls-grizzlies

https://digife.com

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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263. "From Berger: Mirotic looking for a deal in the $3-4 million range (swipe..."
In response to Reply # 0
Mon Mar-10-14 12:11 PM by LeroyBumpkin

  

          

(if true) How does this change things?

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/writer/ken-berger/24471880/how-much-less-is-melo-willing-to-take-to-leave-new-york

"Further, if the Bulls are under the cap, they'd only have their $2.7 million room exception to bring 2011 pick Nikola Mirotic over from Spain. League sources say Mirotic would be looking for a deal in the $3 million-$4 million range. (He's no longer governed by the rookie scale, and the Bulls have planned for needing the bulk of their non-taxpayer mid-level exception of $5.3 million on him, sources say.)

https://digife.com

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
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Mon Mar-10-14 01:31 PM

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265. "weren't we expecting that 3/4 mil a year?"
In response to Reply # 263


  

          

seems like reports have been hinting at that since the outset.

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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266. "I thought it was between 7-10 million range."
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https://digife.com

  

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select_from_where
Member since Jan 03rd 2011
4342 posts
Mon Mar-10-14 03:44 PM

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267. "thats what the Nick Friedell's of the world had it at"
In response to Reply # 266


  

          

then again Nick Friedell is a piece of shit, so that doesn't surprise me

Thats not bad AT ALL

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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268. "Right?"
In response to Reply # 267


  

          

...Pax & them have options.

https://digife.com

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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269. "Westbrook sitting out last 2 games..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

...but will play Chicago tomorrow.

Oh yeah, YOU GON play us Russ!

https://digife.com

  

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JAESCOTT777
Member since Feb 18th 2006
28487 posts
Mon Mar-17-14 06:30 AM

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270. "Is there anyway Noah can be considered for MVP?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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DVS
Member since Sep 13th 2002
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Mon Mar-17-14 12:48 PM

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271. "Realistically he should be in the mix"
In response to Reply # 270


  

          

He's having a banner year and he is the engine that has pushed the Bulls into the 3rd/4th seed of the Playoffs.

His numbers don't jump out at you as he's not averaging a double-double and his scoring is normally in the low to mid-teens....but his intangibles are off the charts....

I look at it this way...you take LeBron off the Heat or Durant off OKC (with a healthy Russy)....they probably still make the playoffs.

You take Noah off the Bulls? We are in the lottery guaranteed.

He'll get votes...and he deserves every one.

D

vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv

Waldorf and Statler Vol 4:CONAN IS OUT NOW!!!: http://waldorfandstatler.bandcamp.com

and don't forget to check "DVS 4 ALDERMAN"

http://windimoto.bandcamp.com/album/dvs-4-alderman-bandcamp-exclusive-expanded-editio

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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272. "agreed. He won't win, but he'll get votes."
In response to Reply # 271


  

          

>He'll get votes...and he deserves every one.

I also like how Noah has handled the "What do you think of the MVP chants?" question.

Very loyal to Rose which says a lot about the chemistry of this team.

https://digife.com

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
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Mon Mar-17-14 01:55 PM

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273. "he, griffin and george will finish 3-5 in some order."
In response to Reply # 270


  

          

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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RandomFact
Member since Dec 10th 2005
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Sat Mar-22-14 07:04 PM

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274. "Mitch Lawrence typing things..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/lawrence-knicks-coach-doesn-run-phil-triangle-offense-article-1.1730415

... It’s no joke — the Bulls really are expecting Derrick Rose to make it back from his latest knee injury in time for the playoffs.…

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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275. "The Phil Jackson stories ran out already?"
In response to Reply # 274


  

          

The press conference is a week old, I figured they'd get at least a month worth of material from that move.

https://digife.com

  

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j0510
Member since Feb 02nd 2012
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Thu Mar-27-14 07:28 AM

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276. "Rose begins non-contact drills, remains out for season (swipe)"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/basketball/bulls/chi-derrick-rose-begins-noncontact-drills-20140326,0,5499969.story

Rose begins non-contact drills, remains out for season
By K.C. Johnson, Tribune reporter
11:33 p.m. CDT, March 26, 2014

Derrick Rose is out for the season.

The Bulls have made that clear and never have wavered from that position since Nov. 25, the day his torn right medial meniscus was repaired surgically. Rose suffered the injury in Portland, Ore., on Nov. 22.

But all along, the Bulls and Rose expressed hope he could return to the practice court before season’s end. And coach Tom Thibodeau said after Wednesday’s practice at the Berto Center that Rose has begun participating in non-contact drills.

This always has been part of the plan.

“He’s moving along fine,” Thibodeau said. “He has picked it up a little bit. But there’s still no contact. He’s out for the year, but he’s doing well.”

Teams almost never scrimmage at this point of the season. And there has been zero talk internally of Rose doing anything more than practicing. And even that participation could be limited to non-contact portions for the remainder of this season.

“Last week, he was doing parts of the non-contact (drills),” Thibodeau said. “You know, we’re not practicing real long this time of the year. (Now) all the non-contact stuff he’s doing.”

Given that Rose has played in just 50 NBA games over the last three seasons, any court time with teammates is a positive.

“He’s upbeat, in a real good place mentally,” Taj Gibson said.

Rose remains on target to participate in the July minicamp for USA Basketball, from which the World Cup roster will be selected. That squad will play in the FIBA World Cup of Basketball in Spain in September.

As the Bulls disclosed in November, Rose’s operation featured surgeons reattaching the torn meniscus. While that’s better for Rose’s long-term career and limits the chances of arthritis developing, it calls for a lengthier rehabilitation process of up to six months or more.

Rose’s rehabilitation has gone smoothly, and he has been gradually increasing his running and individual workouts over the last several weeks. Performing non-contact drills with teammates is consistent with Rose being around more during this rehabilitation, which is less rigorous and time-consuming than recovering from ACL surgery.

Rose has been a constant presence to teammates and traveled to games since mid-January. His teammates have pointed consistently to his work ethic through two lengthy rehabilitations as an inspiration.

There are others.

“It’s a dog-eat-dog world in this league and I learned that early in the year when we were in that big hole and our bandwagon was really empty,” Gibson said. “And like Thibs said (Wednesday), ‘Remember everybody that doubted you and remember everybody that talked bad.’ Just believe in ourselves and that’s what we’re doing right now.”

Indeed, the Bulls, in the midst of a rare three-day break at this point of a season, are focused on a strong stretch run. Beyond needing a Knicks loss to clinch a playoff berth, the Bulls got back to their winning formula in an impressive outing against the Pacers.

They won the rebounding battle. They defended. They got to loose balls.

“We probably played one of our best games of the season,” Joakim Noah said. “That’s encouraging.”

Layups: Noah, on LaMarcus Aldridge, in town Friday with the Trail Blazers: “He’s probably the most polished big in the NBA in terms of scoring. He’s such a problem.” … Tickets for the first two playoff rounds go on sale 11 a.m. Friday at Bulls.com, NBATickets.com, the United Center and 1-800-462-2849.

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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277. "Is Ronnie Brewer really better than Tony Snell?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://www.blogabull.com/2014/4/7/5590408/bulls-sign-ronnie-brewer-how-does-it-impact-tony-snell-and-jimmy

It is official: Ronnie Brewer is once again a member of the Chicago Bulls. The Bulls made room for the 29-year-old swingman by releasing forward Erik Murphy last week. Brewer has been out of the league since Feb. 21 when he was released by the Houston Rockets. He appeared in just 158 minutes over 23 games this season.

Brewer, of course, was part of the first free agent class signed by the Bulls under Tom Thibodeau in the summer of 2010. He was a key reserve on teams that finished with the No. 1 overall seed in the Eastern Conference in 2010-11 and 2011-12. Brewer was let go following a loss in the playoffs to the 76ers, and the emergence of Jimmy Butler has ultimately made him expendable. Since he's left the tender care of Thibs, Brewer has had a difficult time sticking in the league.

He played 46 games for the Knicks last season before signing on with the Thunder for the final 14 games. He was unable to crack Kevin McHale's rotation in Houston this season. In Chicago, he'll have an opportunity to play for a coach and a system he knows just as things are about to start getting serious.

Is that a good thing? It depends, I suppose. We all like Ronnie Brewer and have fond memories of his work on what were the first actually good Bulls team of the post-Jordan era. His arrival could have a couple different implications, or it could have zero, depending on if he's able to steal some minutes at the precipice of the playoffs. If Brewer can find playing time, here's what we would be looking at:

1. No more Tony Snell

The 22-year-old rookie has largely been cut out of the rotation recently has Thibodeau has opted to only give seven players real time. Snell averaged only 9.1 minutes per game in March and wasn't particularly productive when he was out there. Snell has already played more than any rookie under Thibs ever, but it's clear the coaching staff doesn't trust him in big spots quite yet. Enter Brewer, a player they know well and are already comfortable with.

Here's the thing, though: is Ronnie Brewer really better than Tony Snell? Even with the rookie's uneven performance as of late, I think I would rather have Snell out there. Brewer had a reputation as being an athletic dynamo entering the league, but he really hasn't been particularly explosive since suffering a leg injury in Memphis in 2009. I would think Snell is more athletic. There's no debate that Snell is a capable shooter.

Fact is, you don't have to guard Brewer out on the perimeter. He's made only 24 three-pointers since leaving the Bulls, and is 1-for-8 beyond the arc this season. Teams like the Heat and Pacers are smart enough to know when they can cheat off perimeter players to double when the ball goes inside to Taj and Noah. I'm a bit worried any real minutes for Brewer would fudge the Bulls' spacing offensively.

Defense is the other side of the coin. I think Snell has been pretty good there -- length + young legs is generally a winning formula -- but I can't hate on Thibs if he'd prefer a veteran in there. At 6'7, 225 lbs., Brewer has the size to match up with Dwyane Wade, Terrence Ross and Lance Stephenson on the perimeter. The question is: does he have the athleticism?

2. Maybe Jimmy Butler won't be pitching a complete game anymore

YO. Have you looked at Butler's minutes totals lately? They are predictably preposterous. He's played at least 41 minutes in 10 of the last 11 games, and it isn't really an outlier. Jimmy ended March averaging 41.9 minutes per game after playing 39.3 minutes per night in February and 41.4 minutes per night in January. We're far past the point of excessive, here.

Thing is, Jimmy has held up very well after some early season injury troubles. He hasn't been as productive as the organization has hoped this year, seeing his shooting percentage dip across the board, but his athleticism on the wing is still ultra valuable to a Bulls team without any other thoroughbreds there.

As it stands, Butler enters the league fourth overall in minutes before Carmelo, Durant and DeRozan with a Deng-like season average of 38.3 minutes per night. The difference between Butler and those other three? Well, the other three were each All-Stars. But also: Butler is the only one really forced to give 100 percent effort defensively at all times.

Anthony and Durant are skilled enough offensively to take some possessions off when the other team has the ball (though KD's defense has been pretty good this year). Butler is not. He's the best perimeter defender on a great defense, and the Bulls are going to need to him to play a lot in the playoffs, just as he did last year in logging all of those consecutive complete games against the Nets and then Heat.

Butler has also absorbed a lot of contact this season, leading the team with 313 attempts from the foul line. That's a lot of physical punishment that would normally make me worry for Jimmy's well-being. On the other hand: if Thibs has been giving him 42 minutes per night through the last few months, why the hell would he let up when the games actually start to matter? He shouldn't and I doubt he will.

So yeah, Ronnie Brewer! It's nice to have him, I guess, but I hope he doesn't screw anything up. He probably won't.

https://digife.com

  

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dula dibiasi
Member since Apr 05th 2004
21925 posts
Tue Apr-08-14 12:50 PM

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278. "i don't know that it makes much difference who those 5 minutes go to."
In response to Reply # 277


  

          

at worst, brewer's another emergency big-wing defender who you can throw on lebron/wade/pierce/johnson/livingston in the event of foul trouble or injury.

it's a good playoff-reinforcements type pickup.

___

it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes

  

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