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Subject: "Will organized football exist in 25 years? Some say no. (link)" Previous topic | Next topic
brown sugar
Member since Jan 22nd 2005
4536 posts
Thu May-03-12 04:41 PM

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"Will organized football exist in 25 years? Some say no. (link)"


  

          

Malcolm Gladwell raised some eyebrows this past week when he argued that college football will/should be banned. He was a little disorganized and incoherent with his logic (surprise, surprise) but the general premise is that liability exposure to universities will be too great as players with head trauma begin to sue. He kind of undermines this argument by pointing out that long term head trauma/CTE is caused not by "one big blow" but by "many small blows" over the course of a football career. That would make it very difficult to prove proximate causation in any lawsuit. The players would also have to successfully argue that they lacked informed consent/knowledge of the inherent risks before playing. That is more legitimate, as they are 18 year olds getting exploited for millions in revenues.

Gladwell also makes more normative arguments that college football should be banned because it undermines the educational missions of schools, is similar to dogfighting, and results in too many injuries. I don't buy the first two, but the last argument gives me pause and is difficult for me to make an informed judgment on.

The Gladwell interview is located here: http://www.slate.com/articles/sports/intelligence_squared/2012/04/the_next_slate_intelligence_squared_debate_is_may_8_why_malcolm_gladwell_thinks_we_should_ban_college_football_.html


Meanwhile, a few months ago, there was on article on Grantland by two economists that theorized how football as we know it (professional and college) could unravel. The basic premise is that lawsuits arising out of CTE/head trauma will cause insurers to stop insuring colleges for football-related injuries and then colleges will be forced to cut their programs. Then the NFL loses its feeder mechanism --> more awareness about CTE makes people less willing to let their children play in such a dangerous sport --> NFL goes poof.

Lots of tenuous logic here -- there's just too much damn money in football. On the other hand, and as the authors point out:

"This outcome may sound ridiculous, but the collapse of football is more likely than you might think. If recent history has shown anything, it is that observers cannot easily imagine the big changes in advance. Very few people were predicting the collapse of the Soviet Union, the reunification of Germany, or the rise of China as an economic power. Once you start thinking through how the status quo might unravel, a sports universe without the NFL at its center no longer seems absurd."

The Grantland piece is here: http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/7559458/cte-concussion-crisis-economic-look-end-football


Anyways, I obviously take all of this with a huge grain of salt, but it makes for some interesting discussion. The head trauma thing could really change football forever. Hopefully medical science can evolve fast enough to address these concerns. In the wake of Jr. Seau's death (if its connected w/ CTE), the buzz around these issues is just going to get louder.

I love watching football. At the same time, though, I'd never let my kids play.

What does OKS think about all of this?

<-- BAUGH SO HARD

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
it aint going anywhere.
May 03rd 2012
1
I don't know abt that but I was telling someone this morning that
May 03rd 2012
2
Would it be feasible to measure accumulated g-forces?
May 03rd 2012
3
They've started to do this...
May 04th 2012
62
absolutely - it would be pretty easy to do too.
Dec 03rd 2012
87
This is an awful comparison
May 03rd 2012
4
some say this concussion suit is biggest financial threat NFL ever faced
May 04th 2012
30
RE: some say this concussion suit is biggest financial threat NFL ever f...
May 04th 2012
33
This is the United States of America
May 04th 2012
36
      ^^old but has a short memory
May 04th 2012
37
      As I said in the edit...........
May 04th 2012
38
           is tobacco as big it was
May 04th 2012
39
           The tobacco industry sells about six trillion cigarettes each year
May 04th 2012
42
           you're a grandpa
May 04th 2012
43
                LOL
May 04th 2012
46
                     I actually agree with that, but fucking HOCKEY is in our sights!! lol
May 04th 2012
48
                          I thought it would already have exceeded Hockey
May 04th 2012
55
           right? US automakers would be defunct if not for gov't bailouts
May 04th 2012
45
                Your handle on this isn't too solid man
May 04th 2012
50
                     I'm actually happy to be corrected, I prefer good info to bad
May 04th 2012
52
                          It's all good
May 04th 2012
54
           RE: As I said in the edit...........
May 04th 2012
49
                Measures will be taken to make it make it palatable to the public...
May 04th 2012
53
                     RE: Measures will be taken to make it make it palatable to the public...
May 04th 2012
56
                          As I said, they found a way to justify selling cancer in a box
May 04th 2012
57
      right -- I don't think the NFL is going away, that's foolish
May 04th 2012
41
           Why do I get the feeling there is a soccer angle to all of this lol
May 04th 2012
44
                you said it, not me lol
May 04th 2012
47
.
Apr 27th 2016
128
At some point, a new helmet will be designed.
May 03rd 2012
5
^^^exactly what I was thinking
May 03rd 2012
7
Some people theorize that helmets make injuries worse.
May 03rd 2012
16
There are prototype helmets with foam on the outside.
May 03rd 2012
27
Bet! That's what I mentioned in post 10.
May 04th 2012
29
Cell phone posting...this was a response to post 27.
May 04th 2012
35
In 7-12 yrs. players will look like Master Chief on the field......
May 04th 2012
70
or this............
May 04th 2012
71
RE: At some point, a new helmet will be designed.
May 04th 2012
72
I wasn't one of those "I'll never let my kids play football" people...
May 03rd 2012
6
f'real...i don't care what helmets look like, if they are way more
May 04th 2012
32
helmet technology is *causing* these problems in a way
May 04th 2012
58
      It needs to be a completely different type of helmet.
May 04th 2012
60
if that comes to pass, that's a world I don't want to live in
May 03rd 2012
8
It will be a non-contact Passing League
May 03rd 2012
9
A simple improvement to helmets would be a softer exterior.
May 03rd 2012
10
      What about those new helmets in the NFL?
May 03rd 2012
14
never never never i say! NFL is here to stayyyyy nm
May 03rd 2012
11
wonder what would happen if
May 03rd 2012
12
it's kept on trucking through people getting paralyzed like a speed bump...
May 03rd 2012
15
      RE: it's kept on trucking through people getting paralyzed like a speed ...
May 03rd 2012
18
           i cant see how that's worse than literally watching a man get paralyzed
May 03rd 2012
20
                RE: i cant see how that's worse than literally watching a man get paraly...
May 03rd 2012
22
Really...
May 03rd 2012
13
Malcolm Gladwell said something stupid about sports? I'm shocked!
May 03rd 2012
17
^^^ this too, lol
May 03rd 2012
19
lol
May 03rd 2012
21
yeah his argument is illogical but it sparks an important debate
May 05th 2012
76
GOOD!! b-ball should be the national pastime anyway
May 03rd 2012
23
My God - your avatar!
Jan 20th 2016
124
25 years seems too close. But in 50, I think it could be gone.
May 03rd 2012
24
If it leads to this Im okay: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyberball
May 03rd 2012
25
Madden will advance to the point that this is moot
May 03rd 2012
26
But then there'll be a commish mode in addition to franchise owner mode
May 04th 2012
28
it hasn't advanced much since early last decade
May 04th 2012
59
it all depends on the current concussion lawsuit imo
May 04th 2012
31
The tobacco argument doesn't make sense because that is a
May 04th 2012
51
      you really think it was just PPV that hurt boxing? okay, player.
May 04th 2012
61
      Except MMA is growing at a fast rate
May 04th 2012
65
      honestly? I have no idea what to make of MMA
May 04th 2012
67
      The legal liability is WAY less because we're talking about thousands
May 04th 2012
68
      RE: The tobacco argument doesn't make sense because that is a
May 04th 2012
73
what about waivers signed in advance acknowledging
May 04th 2012
34
-
May 04th 2012
40
im not so sure those waivers would be enforceable in courts
May 05th 2012
77
Can we agree on one thing though, not really related to the CTE bit?
May 04th 2012
63
remeber boxing? horse racing?
May 04th 2012
64
Billion dollar stadiums, massive media deals, 8 figure merchandising
May 04th 2012
66
every collapsed industry
May 04th 2012
69
      Name one as big as the NFL that disappeared in 25 years
May 04th 2012
74
           rich people will stay making money
May 04th 2012
75
boxing and horse racing still exist though
Dec 03rd 2012
85
surprised with the reaction here
May 05th 2012
78
First "mega lawsuit" consolidated/filed (link)
Jun 08th 2012
79
It will exist. Current helmets will seem as archaic as leather straps
Jun 08th 2012
80
they'd just take the helmets off (ala rugby) first...
Jun 08th 2012
81
I've heard this argument a lot, and I think it's awesome.
Jun 08th 2012
82
why'd it take so long for this reply?
Dec 03rd 2012
91
I've heard this argument over and over, I am not buying it
Jun 17th 2013
96
      Self preservation isn't a learned habit
Jun 17th 2013
97
           and do those things account for all or even most concussions?
Aug 29th 2013
99
Study: New Cases of CTE in Football Players (link)
Dec 03rd 2012
83
In related news, the south will secede again in 25 years.
Dec 03rd 2012
84
it already has. In Philly. nm
Dec 03rd 2012
86
Yes. Next Question(c)Rosenhaus
Dec 03rd 2012
88
if so, it will be a completely different type of game than it is now
Dec 03rd 2012
89
Yup, taken over by competitive pat-a-cake
Dec 03rd 2012
90
Lem Barney agrees (swipe) :(
Jun 15th 2013
92
25 years is too soon, but 100 is a question IMO
Jun 15th 2013
93
lol! Everything is a question in 100 years
Jun 15th 2013
94
      well you know what i mean, 25 years is too short to consider ...
Jun 17th 2013
95
Gladwell: Football will become "ghettoized" (swipe)
Aug 29th 2013
98
it sort of already is, but OK.
Aug 29th 2013
100
Youth football participation drops (swipe)
Nov 14th 2013
101
lee corso said they just need to remove face masks
Nov 14th 2013
102
im for it
Nov 14th 2013
103
if America can stomach nosebleeds on TV
Nov 14th 2013
104
and a lot of missing teeth
Nov 14th 2013
105
these are all flawed, patchwork solutions
Sep 13th 2014
109
*TWO* High School players DIED this week. *swipes*
Nov 14th 2013
106
TIME just did a cover on this Stover kid, he was likely concussed
Oct 02nd 2014
114
3/10 ex-players develop Alzheimers/dementia (link)
Sep 13th 2014
107
Honestly, I thought it would have been worse than that.
Sep 13th 2014
108
scary to think that's only "at least twice" the rate of the general popu...
Sep 13th 2014
110
      Agreed, but this only covers Alzheimers/dementia
Sep 13th 2014
111
HS football player dies from head injury in on-field hit (swipe)
Oct 02nd 2014
112
Edit.
Oct 02nd 2014
113
Borland retires. Evidence is mounting. At some point...
Mar 18th 2015
115
do you like boxing?
Mar 19th 2015
116
I think football will go the way of boxing
Mar 19th 2015
117
i see zero ethical issues with my fandom
Mar 19th 2015
118
Antwaan Randle-El says maybe not (swipe)
Jan 19th 2016
119
36 years old.
Jan 19th 2016
120
i know
Jan 19th 2016
122
I've been thinking about this a lot recently
Jan 19th 2016
121
The moms will be the end-game.
Jan 20th 2016
123
Tyler Sash had "Junior Seau levels" of CTE @ death (age 27) [link]
Jan 27th 2016
125
Tackling banned in Ivy League practices (link)
Mar 09th 2016
126
SINGLE season of HS football produce measurable change in brain cells (s...
Apr 27th 2016
127
Tyler Varga and the concussion that lasted 4 months (swipe)
May 10th 2016
129
Holy shit Brian Price.
Jul 26th 2017
130
i'm glad he didn't get shot
Jul 26th 2017
131
Follow up with the story, including sit down with Brian and his wife...
Jul 26th 2017
133
He's lucky to be alive
Jul 26th 2017
134
Nope. They just gon be wearing Spaceballs helmets. Too much $$$$
Jul 26th 2017
132
While I don't necessarily disagree...
Jul 27th 2017
135
      ^^^^^^^^^
Jul 27th 2017
136
not upped for the 110 out of 111 ex-NFL brains having CTE? (link)
Jul 27th 2017
137
As others mentioned with similar studies:
Jul 27th 2017
138

BrooklynWHAT
Member since Jun 15th 2007
85078 posts
Thu May-03-12 05:22 PM

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1. "it aint going anywhere."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

<--- Big Baller World Order

  

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vee-lover
Member since Jul 30th 2007
20388 posts
Thu May-03-12 05:28 PM

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2. "I don't know abt that but I was telling someone this morning that"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I can foresee it undergoing a huge change in some way w/all these scandals surfacing...

-concussions leading to severe brain damage which has subsequently led to a huge lawsuit by former players

-not to mention how the commissioner is regulating how players can hit because of the above point

grassrootsphilosopher

  

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Buck
Member since Feb 15th 2005
16160 posts
Thu May-03-12 05:38 PM

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3. "Would it be feasible to measure accumulated g-forces?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

People who work around radioactive materials wear detectors that measure accumulated radiation doses. Could you do something similar with helmet-worn g-force detectors? Establish some kind of upper limit per season, or per career/player, and have the NFL & NCAA administer and track the g-forces over time, with forced retirements when a player got to a certain number?

  

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sfMatt
Member since Jun 20th 2002
10383 posts
Fri May-04-12 12:46 PM

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62. "They've started to do this..."
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

I remember hearing about Stanford wearing sensors last year to provide scientists with data on this...

I recently heard that Oregon was doing some similar stuff during the spring period that just wrapped up.

  

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40thStreetBlack
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Mon Dec-03-12 12:08 PM

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87. "absolutely - it would be pretty easy to do too."
In response to Reply # 3


          

just fit a small accelerometer in the helmet, they could track that stuff pretty easily. dunno how a forced retirement policy based on that would play out though.

___________________

Mar-A-Lago delenda est

  

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OldPro
Member since Dec 10th 2002
34401 posts
Thu May-03-12 05:58 PM

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4. "This is an awful comparison"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

"If recent history has shown anything, it is that observers cannot easily imagine the big changes in advance. Very few people were predicting the collapse of the Soviet Union, the reunification of Germany, or the rise of China as an economic power. Once you start thinking through how the status quo might unravel, a sports universe without the NFL at its center no longer seems absurd."

All of those changes were the result of economic troubles. The NFL is making money hand over fist... even if they are forced to change the way the game is played it will continue on for that very reason. Comparing counties to an extremely profitable private enterprise is one of the dumbest things I've read in a long time.

_________________________________
Reunion Radio Podcasts
Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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celery77
Member since Aug 04th 2005
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Fri May-04-12 09:20 AM

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30. "some say this concussion suit is biggest financial threat NFL ever faced"
In response to Reply # 4


  

          

and I don't think they're too far off base. the logical precedent to me seems to be the Big Tobacco lawsuits. those companies got nailed in court due to their practice of withholding and doctoring information, and while I'm not a lawyer, it DEFINITELY seems to me like the NFL has willfully been sweeping concussion issues under the rug for some time (see the '03 ESPN mag article I linked in the Seau thread, they were saying it was okay to put a concussed player back into a game as recently as 2003 when there was a WEALTH of outside evidence to recommend against exactly that).

I think that's the "big change" naysayers see looming in front of the NFL. if just one court rules in favor of the litigants in this case, that might open such a gigantic can of worms that organized football will be paralyzed by legal liabilities for quite some time.

and that's the "people don't want to see it" moment. I always look at the mortgage crisis as a better example -- that was a money problem, not a cultural change problem, and the NFL might be in a similar place -- exposure to liabilities people didn't even think was possible before which might very well prove fundamentally damaging to the structure of the game.

___________

HOPE!
https://vine.co/v/i7JjIBL3Qix
https://vine.co/v/i7JtqEFwxDu

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Fri May-04-12 09:28 AM

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33. "RE: some say this concussion suit is biggest financial threat NFL ever f..."
In response to Reply # 30


          

>and I don't think they're too far off base. the logical
>precedent to me seems to be the Big Tobacco lawsuits. those
>companies got nailed in court due to their practice of
>withholding and doctoring information, and while I'm not a
>lawyer, it DEFINITELY seems to me like the NFL has willfully
>been sweeping concussion issues under the rug for some time
>(see the '03 ESPN mag article I linked in the Seau thread,
>they were saying it was okay to put a concussed player back
>into a game as recently as 2003 when there was a WEALTH of
>outside evidence to recommend against exactly that).
>
>I think that's the "big change" naysayers see looming in front
>of the NFL. if just one court rules in favor of the litigants
>in this case, that might open such a gigantic can of worms
>that organized football will be paralyzed by legal liabilities
>for quite some time.
>
>and that's the "people don't want to see it" moment. I always
>look at the mortgage crisis as a better example -- that was a
>money problem, not a cultural change problem, and the NFL
>might be in a similar place -- exposure to liabilities people
>didn't even think was possible before which might very well
>prove fundamentally damaging to the structure of the game.


^^^^what he said.....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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OldPro
Member since Dec 10th 2002
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Fri May-04-12 10:43 AM

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36. "This is the United States of America"
In response to Reply # 30
Fri May-04-12 10:46 AM by OldPro

  

          

And in the USA corporations rule... if you don't believe that go to the store and see if they are still carrying "cancer sticks"

The NFL is a massive enterprise and people love it

If you really believe it's going to be squeezed out of business you go right ahead... just don't hold you're breath.

_________________________________
Reunion Radio Podcasts
Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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cereffusion
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Fri May-04-12 10:46 AM

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37. "^^old but has a short memory"
In response to Reply # 36


  

          

how many of the top businesses of the 70s or 80s are still around or still at their peak?

  

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OldPro
Member since Dec 10th 2002
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Fri May-04-12 10:49 AM

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38. "As I said in the edit..........."
In response to Reply # 37


  

          

They still sell cigarettes for god sake... basically packaged death.

The NFL will take some financial hit at some point but you have too many people making too much money to have it just go away.

Talking more about this is nothing but a waste of time really.
_________________________________
Reunion Radio Podcasts
Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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cereffusion
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39. "is tobacco as big it was "
In response to Reply # 38


  

          

20 years ago? 50?

Absolutely not. It's a fraction. So is boxing and horse racing and a thousand other things that had their prime and are now fading away or fulfilling a niche.

Many GIGANTIC corporations that were the epitome of success have died. it happens. It is common.

Shit, many of the biggest companies right now didn't exist 10-15 years ago or were much smaller - Facebook, Apple, Amazon, Google...

  

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OldPro
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42. "The tobacco industry sells about six trillion cigarettes each year"
In response to Reply # 39


  

          

Worldwide taxes alone bring in over $160 billion

And we're talking about a product that actually kills it's consumers

Seriously think what you want but the NFL ain't going anywhere in your lifetime
_________________________________
Reunion Radio Podcasts
Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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cereffusion
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43. "you're a grandpa"
In response to Reply # 42


  

          

so this whole 'life will always be how it is now' thing affects you more.

the NFL will probably still exist but this is going to have HUGE ramifications that change everything.

the age of soccer is upon us (and I don't really like soccer)

  

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OldPro
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Fri May-04-12 11:07 AM

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46. "LOL"
In response to Reply # 43


  

          

Post #44

>the age of soccer is upon us (and I don't really like soccer)

As I said think what you want... but I'll tell you right now Soccer will never be bigger than football in this country within either of our lifetimes.


_________________________________
Reunion Radio Podcasts
Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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celery77
Member since Aug 04th 2005
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Fri May-04-12 11:10 AM

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48. "I actually agree with that, but fucking HOCKEY is in our sights!! lol"
In response to Reply # 46
Fri May-04-12 11:10 AM by celery77

  

          

>As I said think what you want... but I'll tell you right now
>Soccer will never be bigger than football in this country
>within either of our lifetimes.

___________

HOPE!
https://vine.co/v/i7JjIBL3Qix
https://vine.co/v/i7JtqEFwxDu

  

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OldPro
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Fri May-04-12 11:31 AM

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55. "I thought it would already have exceeded Hockey"
In response to Reply # 48
Fri May-04-12 11:32 AM by OldPro

  

          

yeah I can totally see it passing Hockey.... and soon
_________________________________
Reunion Radio Podcasts
Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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celery77
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Fri May-04-12 11:06 AM

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45. "right? US automakers would be defunct if not for gov't bailouts"
In response to Reply # 39


  

          

and that was largely another problem where they created a lot of unfunded liabilities (pensions) all while remaining tone deaf to the changing taste of the auto consumer causing their revenues to dip at the same time.

it's really not too far fetched to suggest the NFL might lose its iron grip on its audience while at the same time seeing operating costs sky rocket. I'd guess it would stumble through, but look drastically different for the process.

___________

HOPE!
https://vine.co/v/i7JjIBL3Qix
https://vine.co/v/i7JtqEFwxDu

  

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OldPro
Member since Dec 10th 2002
34401 posts
Fri May-04-12 11:13 AM

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50. "Your handle on this isn't too solid man"
In response to Reply # 45


  

          

>and that was largely another problem where they created a lot
>of unfunded liabilities (pensions)

The pension issue was a red herring promoted by management and picked up as a right wing talking point... I come from a family with 3 generations of autoworkers so I know a little bit about this and the lies that have been accepted as fact.

But I really don't care to spend all morning arguing side points.

I've had my say and you've had yours.

Peace and have a good weekend



_________________________________
Reunion Radio Podcasts
Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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celery77
Member since Aug 04th 2005
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52. "I'm actually happy to be corrected, I prefer good info to bad"
In response to Reply # 50


  

          

and don't get me wrong, I'm pro-union. I wasn't trying to say they're the problem, I was trying to say unfunded liabilities are the problem (which is what the concussion lawsuit potentially represents).

in BOTH cases, good management would have foreseen the issue and made proactive moves to insure they could safely navigate the waters. but in both instances, management is generally more interested in maintaining a status quo than being proactive, sooo... that's where the parralel exists for me.

___________

HOPE!
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https://vine.co/v/i7JtqEFwxDu

  

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OldPro
Member since Dec 10th 2002
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54. "It's all good"
In response to Reply # 52


  

          

Didn't mean to make it sound like I was taking a shot at you... soccer yes but you no lol

Really though we can disagree on this that's cool. I know we've had some minor run ins in the past but bottom line is you seem like a good dude.
_________________________________
Reunion Radio Podcasts
Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Fri May-04-12 11:12 AM

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49. "RE: As I said in the edit..........."
In response to Reply # 38


          

>They still sell cigarettes for god sake... basically packaged
>death.
>
>The NFL will take some financial hit at some point but you
>have too many people making too much money to have it just go
>away.
>
>Talking more about this is nothing but a waste of time
>really.


I think it's about 1) negative public perception over ex players suing the NFL, 2) the college football machine getting spooked that insurance companies may no longer want to take the risk of insuring kids if and when lawsuits start flying their way and 3) the pure "fun" that may get taken out of the pro game for precautionary measures...

Again, the NFL is NOT going to be collapsing any time soon...

But players under 50 years old killing themselves because they are suffering from early dementia cannot be poo-poo'd...

The NFL better get on their game...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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OldPro
Member since Dec 10th 2002
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Fri May-04-12 11:23 AM

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53. "Measures will be taken to make it make it palatable to the public..."
In response to Reply # 49
Fri May-04-12 11:23 AM by OldPro

  

          

>But players under 50 years old killing themselves because they
>are suffering from early dementia cannot be poo-poo'd...

... and provide the league cover from future lawsuits. Will it actually end up being any safer? I doubt it. But when you have a public that wants to consume a product all they need is some sort of cover to justify that consumption. I agree this is a serious issue that needs to be addressed but expecting this system to side with people over money (especially this much money) is a little naive considering how this country really works.


_________________________________
Reunion Radio Podcasts
Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Fri May-04-12 11:32 AM

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56. "RE: Measures will be taken to make it make it palatable to the public..."
In response to Reply # 53
Fri May-04-12 11:32 AM by murph71

          

>>But players under 50 years old killing themselves because
>they
>>are suffering from early dementia cannot be poo-poo'd...
>
>... and provide the league cover from future lawsuits. Will it
>actually end up being any safer? I doubt it. But when you have
>a public that wants to consume a product all they need is some
>sort of cover to justify that consumption. I agree this is a
>serious issue that needs to be addressed but expecting this
>system to side with people over money (especially this much
>money) is a little naive considering how this country really
>works.

I agree with you...to a point...Demand often times trumps such concerns...

The fear is that you will get more players killing themselves because they no longer remember the names of their children...It's tough for any mammoth sports giant to continually side-step such a huge elephant in the room...

It's going to be interesting....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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OldPro
Member since Dec 10th 2002
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57. "As I said, they found a way to justify selling cancer in a box"
In response to Reply # 56


  

          

They will find a way to allow grown men making millions to run into each other
_________________________________
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Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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celery77
Member since Aug 04th 2005
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41. "right -- I don't think the NFL is going away, that's foolish"
In response to Reply # 36


  

          

but if you don't see the potential for a HARD left turn in the league's immediate future, you're just as deluded.

yeah, they're still selling cigarettes, but without knowing anything about the relevant statistics, I'd be willing to bet their sales are down at LEAST 50% from the mid '70s. last one I remember was that young white people have like a 6% smoking rate and when I was in college, smoking was banned on ALL of campus except a few designated smoking areas (which I thought was stupid, but it's a sign of the times) and most states don't allow smoking in public establishments of any kind any more, either. also there's government funded advertising AGAINST smoking cigarettes for chrissakes. your tax dollars are being used to tell people not to smoke.

so yeah, we'll have football from now and into perpetuity. but the money (and participation) flowing through the game might drastically change within our lifetimes, and there's a pretty good chance we're sitting atop the tipping point right now.

___________

HOPE!
https://vine.co/v/i7JjIBL3Qix
https://vine.co/v/i7JtqEFwxDu

  

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OldPro
Member since Dec 10th 2002
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44. "Why do I get the feeling there is a soccer angle to all of this lol"
In response to Reply # 41


  

          


_________________________________
Reunion Radio Podcasts
Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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celery77
Member since Aug 04th 2005
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47. "you said it, not me lol"
In response to Reply # 44


  

          

I did see a quote from the owner of the KC Chiefs, though, who's also invested in MLS at this point, saying his father, Lamar Hunt, the financial godfather of soccer in the US, something like "he got into US soccer 50 years ago, which was just about 45 years too early."

it's not just wackos like me who see greener pastures in MLS' future right now...

___________

HOPE!
https://vine.co/v/i7JjIBL3Qix
https://vine.co/v/i7JtqEFwxDu

  

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pretentious username
Member since Jun 18th 2010
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128. "."
In response to Reply # 4
Wed Apr-27-16 02:06 PM by pretentious username

  

          

.

  

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soulfunk
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5. "At some point, a new helmet will be designed."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

There's WAY too much money at stake here for the NFL and college to not be investing millions into development of new helmet technology that would reduce the head trauma from collisions in football. There really hasn't been a big advance in helmet technology since they got rid of leather helmets in the 50's.

There has to be some way to design a helmet that either absorbs the force of collision or spreads it out in a way that doesn't cause concussions. I'm sure that within the next 5 years we'll see it developed, and within 10 years it will be required equipment in both college and the NFL.

  

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ThaTruth
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7. "^^^exactly what I was thinking"
In response to Reply # 5


          

>There's WAY too much money at stake here for the NFL and
>college to not be investing millions into development of new
>helmet technology that would reduce the head trauma from
>collisions in football. There really hasn't been a big advance
>in helmet technology since they got rid of leather helmets in
>the 50's.
>
>There has to be some way to design a helmet that either
>absorbs the force of collision or spreads it out in a way that
>doesn't cause concussions. I'm sure that within the next 5
>years we'll see it developed, and within 10 years it will be
>required equipment in both college and the NFL.

________________________________________
"Take the surprise out your voice Shaq."-The REAL CP3
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2H5K-BUMS0

  

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
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16. "Some people theorize that helmets make injuries worse."
In response to Reply # 5


  

          

I forget where I heard this-- some documentary or sports science or something-- but the theory was put forward that because players "feel" safer, they are more prone to launch themselves like missiles leading with the head, which lead to more concussions and neck/spine problems.

It's all theoretical, of course. I just wonder what helmet could ACTUALLY keep a head safe over countless head collisions in a few years.

My movies: http://russellhainline.com
My movie reviews: https://letterboxd.com/RussellHFilm/
My beer TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@thebeertravelguide

  

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Stringer Bell
Member since Mar 15th 2004
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27. "There are prototype helmets with foam on the outside."
In response to Reply # 16


          

They reduce the shock tremendously, and are only not in use because of economic concerns about how the absence of the sound of the helmet, and the odd appearance of such a helmet will affect league revenues.

  

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soulfunk
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29. "Bet! That's what I mentioned in post 10. "
In response to Reply # 5


  

          

Something like that is going to be required in the future. Players and teams are always slow to accept new equipment, but they are gonna have to get used to it.

  

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soulfunk
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35. "Cell phone posting...this was a response to post 27."
In response to Reply # 29


  

          

  

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WarriorPoet415
Member since Sep 30th 2003
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70. "In 7-12 yrs. players will look like Master Chief on the field......"
In response to Reply # 5


  

          


______________________________________________________________________________

"There's a fine line between persistence and foolishness..."
-unknown

"To Each His Reach"
-George Clinton

  

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WarriorPoet415
Member since Sep 30th 2003
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71. "or this............"
In response to Reply # 70


  

          

http://images.wikia.com/community-sitcom/images/b/b1/Pillowman.png
______________________________________________________________________________

"There's a fine line between persistence and foolishness..."
-unknown

"To Each His Reach"
-George Clinton

  

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cyrus
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72. "RE: At some point, a new helmet will be designed."
In response to Reply # 5


  

          

A concussion isn't caused by a collision on the outside of the head (though it doesn't help), it's the brain colliding with the inside of the skull. Extra padding on the outside of the skull won't reduce the brain's impact with the inside of the skull, in terms of frequency or of force, as much as you would think.

  

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ThaTruth
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6. "I wasn't one of those "I'll never let my kids play football" people..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

but I'm seriously rethinking that stance now.

I think more money could be invested in helmet technology research to hopefully prevent some of these issues.

________________________________________
"Take the surprise out your voice Shaq."-The REAL CP3
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2H5K-BUMS0

  

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temps2020
Member since Oct 21st 2003
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32. "f'real...i don't care what helmets look like, if they are way more"
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

>but I'm seriously rethinking that stance now.
>
>I think more money could be invested in helmet technology
>research to hopefully prevent some of these issues.

safer and can properly absorb contact then this is a better alternative then no football at all.

  

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cgonz00cc
Member since Aug 01st 2002
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Fri May-04-12 11:49 AM

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58. "helmet technology is *causing* these problems in a way"
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

air helmet with a teardrop facemask and people think their head cant be injured

no one would be leading with their head if you gave them a leather bucket instead of a composite plastic warhead

  

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soulfunk
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60. "It needs to be a completely different type of helmet."
In response to Reply # 58


  

          

On that has some type of padding on the outside to reduce the helmet to helmet impact as well as a better, more absorbent interior.

  

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DeepAztheRoot
Member since Dec 19th 2003
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Thu May-03-12 07:20 PM

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8. "if that comes to pass, that's a world I don't want to live in"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I think it can be mitigated with hazard pay on a scale (Running back makes more additionally than a kicker) and assumed risk

just like the fisherman in the Bering Sea who sometimes get swept out to sea hunting lobster, however some are willing to make that trade for quality of life, a very high salary for mostly unskilled labor

yes they should be working on technologies to make it safer but it still should be up to the person and what level of risk the person is willing to accept before aversion

<-Fear Ameer

  

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DolphinTeef
Member since Oct 25th 2009
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Thu May-03-12 07:29 PM

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9. "It will be a non-contact Passing League"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Not sure how u can update helmets without needing to also support the neck and spine. The force has to dissipate somewhere. bubble suits maybe?

what if they develop avatars for the players?

that CTE shit is crazy to me. They said they found it in Chris Henry's brain when he died.

  

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soulfunk
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10. "A simple improvement to helmets would be a softer exterior. "
In response to Reply # 9
Thu May-03-12 08:01 PM by soulfunk

  

          

Much of the head injury trauma comes from helmet to helmet contact. If there was a helmet that had some type of padding outside of the hard plastic that could reduce some of the force of helmet to helmet contact when you basically have two brick walls running into each other. I'm not sure how it would have to be designed as far as not making the helmets larger or heavier than they are now, but I'm sure something could be done.

Another idea would be to have some kind of built in "airbag" on the inside of the helmet instead of the hard foam that's there now.

  

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calij81
Member since Jan 17th 2007
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Thu May-03-12 08:35 PM

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14. "What about those new helmets in the NFL? "
In response to Reply # 10


          

I know they don't completely eliminate concussions but aren't they supposed to provide better protection to players and help protect against a possible concussion?

Plus, the NFL should require all players to wear mouthpieces. I know it is still up for debate just how much, if any difference a mouthpiece can make in protecting an athlete from sustaining a concussion.

  

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Binlahab
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11. "never never never i say! NFL is here to stayyyyy nm"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


do or die

  

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electricflower
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12. "wonder what would happen if "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

a player dies on the field from getting hit really hard, will the game still survive after that ?

numbers look crooked like king kong shook it - jdilla

  

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BrooklynWHAT
Member since Jun 15th 2007
85078 posts
Thu May-03-12 08:45 PM

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15. "it's kept on trucking through people getting paralyzed like a speed bump..."
In response to Reply # 12


  

          

<--- Big Baller World Order

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Thu May-03-12 09:08 PM

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18. "RE: it's kept on trucking through people getting paralyzed like a speed ..."
In response to Reply # 15


          



That was before past and recent players were lining up to sue the NFL...

It used to be the oldtimers just suing for players union money post NFL...

Now you got cats that haven't been out the NFL for 6 years suing...That's some other shit...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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BrooklynWHAT
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Thu May-03-12 09:14 PM

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20. "i cant see how that's worse than literally watching a man get paralyzed"
In response to Reply # 18
Thu May-03-12 09:15 PM by BrooklynWHAT

  

          

i mean, youre watching a person get maimed beyond repair in an instant.

and then we keep on watching the next play.

that shit cray.

<--- Big Baller World Order

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Thu May-03-12 09:33 PM

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22. "RE: i cant see how that's worse than literally watching a man get paraly..."
In response to Reply # 20
Thu May-03-12 09:41 PM by murph71

          

>i mean, youre watching a person get maimed beyond repair in
>an instant.
>
>and then we keep on watching the next play.
>
>that shit cray.



It's not worst because getting paralyzed is looked at as a bang-bang play...it's almost freakish....And it doesn't happen a lot...

But the more and more you hear stories about ex players speaking out about brain injuries or hear stories about players killing themselves that's something entirely different......That's about the future health of the NFL players...I mean, this just happened...And Jamal Anderson is not even 43 yet....




Yahoo Sports

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nfl-faces-lawsuit-more-100-181158937--nfl.html

ATLANTA (AP) More than 100 former NFL players have filed a federal lawsuit in Atlanta claiming that pro football didn't properly protect its players from concussions.

The plaintiffs in the lawsuit include former Atlanta Falcon Jamal Anderson, ex-Georgia star Lindsey Scott and veteran quarterback Don Majkowski.

The lawsuit, filed Thursday in federal court in Georgia, claims the league failed to protect NFL players from brain injuries linked to football-related concussions.

They are among more than 1,000 former NFL players suing the league. The cases say not enough was done to inform players about the dangers of concussions in the past, and not enough is done to take care of them today.

The league has said any allegation that the league intentionally sought to mislead players is without merit.

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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13. "Really..."
In response to Reply # 0
Thu May-03-12 08:14 PM by murph71

          


On the real, ANYTHING can happen when lawsuits are involved...

All u have to do is go online and Google the growing amount of players suing the NFL because they at times can't remember the name of their wives...Or where they have been the day before...and they are not even 45 yet...Shit is getting crazy for the NFL...It's the reason why Goodell came down hard on the Saints...It had nothing to do with the honor of the game...It had everything to do with covering their asses against future lawsuits from players who may have gotten injured during any of those years...

What does this mean? Once you water down the game (oh, it's coming...) and start taking the hard hits out of it that we love or Insurance companies getting spooked covering the college game (that can really happen, btw), anything can happen. The NFL is facing a crossroads....

I don't think this is going to happen in the next decade...But I wouldn't be surprised if football starts facing the barrel of that gun in the next 20 plus years...

Remember, there was a time when horse racing was as big as baseball...just saying...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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bignick
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17. "Malcolm Gladwell said something stupid about sports? I'm shocked!"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
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19. "^^^ this too, lol"
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

My movies: http://russellhainline.com
My movie reviews: https://letterboxd.com/RussellHFilm/
My beer TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@thebeertravelguide

  

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guru0509
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21. "lol"
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

  

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brown sugar
Member since Jan 22nd 2005
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Sat May-05-12 12:16 AM

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76. "yeah his argument is illogical but it sparks an important debate"
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

malcolm gladwell and coherent argumentation aren't exactly synonymous

<-- BAUGH SO HARD

  

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melmag
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23. "GOOD!! b-ball should be the national pastime anyway"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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Mongo Slade
Member since Jun 28th 2002
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124. "My God - your avatar!"
In response to Reply # 23


  

          


- sheezuz


oh word - nah b football's better

*****************************************
http://mephonics.com/
*****************************************

  

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smooth va
Member since May 02nd 2005
6059 posts
Thu May-03-12 10:18 PM

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24. "25 years seems too close. But in 50, I think it could be gone."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

"This is dedicated to whom it may concern."-Donny Hathaway

  

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ShawndmeSlanted
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25. "If it leads to this Im okay: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyberball"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyberball

---
"though time has passed, im still the future" (c) black thought

  

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MothershipConnection
Member since Nov 22nd 2003
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Thu May-03-12 11:08 PM

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26. "Madden will advance to the point that this is moot"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

.

  

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mtbatol
Member since May 22nd 2002
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Fri May-04-12 12:28 AM

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28. "But then there'll be a commish mode in addition to franchise owner mode"
In response to Reply # 26


          

..and then you'll have to deal with the various simulated lawsuits hitting you after a similated 10 years running the league.

And remember "Daft Runner08" you created that was your star running back in the league making 8 pro bowls in a row and accumulating 2500 yards a season? Well, after his 8th season he suffered a career ending 3rd concussion. And the AI hits you with a big class lawsuit from the other star players. With the mandatory downloaded expansion pack for carrying out the lawsuit you're going to the federal level in a case for the Future Of The NFL. Can you win it? For the future of the league is depending on this huge case!!

  

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My_SP1200_Broken_Again
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59. "it hasn't advanced much since early last decade"
In response to Reply # 26


  

          

  

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celery77
Member since Aug 04th 2005
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Fri May-04-12 09:25 AM

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31. "it all depends on the current concussion lawsuit imo"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

if that goes wrong for the NFL, football will be thrown into a state of paralysis. Big Tobacco has never actually "recovered" from the lawsuits it faced, it's just continued on at a smaller level. same thing with the "50 years ago the most popular sports were boxing and horse racing" argument. yeah, that's true, but those sports haven't "disappeared" either. they've just gone down in popularity and exposure, but they're still kicking around.

so it's foolish to suggest football will disappear, but undergoing a radical change in the landscape? yeah, I think that's extremely plausible, but it all depends on how this lawsuit breaks first...

___________

HOPE!
https://vine.co/v/i7JjIBL3Qix
https://vine.co/v/i7JtqEFwxDu

  

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soulfunk
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51. "The tobacco argument doesn't make sense because that is a "
In response to Reply # 31


  

          

business that had NO way to significantly reduce the risk. Tobacco causes cancer, and it's that simple. With football however, it isn't the mere act of playing football that causes the risk, its the collisions and impact involved. If they can reduce the collisions and reduce the head trauma when collisions do occur with new helmet technology, then the risk could be greatly reduced. The other factor that makes this comparison bad is that the risk in tobacco is on the customers of the business, while in football the risk is on the employees of that business.

Horse racing and boxing aren't really comparable because their decline in popularity have nothing to do with risks involved with playing the sport. Boxing is of course dangerous but that's not the reason it isn't as popular - the general public's taste has changed and the sport isn't as accessible as it used to be because of the cost of pay per view.

  

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celery77
Member since Aug 04th 2005
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61. "you really think it was just PPV that hurt boxing? okay, player."
In response to Reply # 51
Fri May-04-12 12:17 PM by celery77

  

          

>business that had NO way to significantly reduce the risk.
>Tobacco causes cancer, and it's that simple. With football
>however, it isn't the mere act of playing football that causes
>the risk, its the collisions and impact involved. If they can
>reduce the collisions and reduce the head trauma when
>collisions do occur with new helmet technology, then the risk
>could be greatly reduced. The other factor that makes this
>comparison bad is that the risk in tobacco is on the customers
>of the business, while in football the risk is on the
>employees of that business.

it's not about the risk. football players accept risk and that will never change. it's about the legal liability and the potential damages that could arise from a class action lawsuit, which is currently underway. the NFL might have 50 years worth of exposure to liability claims from its past employees, which could cripple its operating revenue as they are forced to pay out large judgments to a pool of former players larger than its current player pool. don't think about the challenge Big Tobacco had selling its product. think about how much Big Tobacco had to pay in civil judgments to smokers for using their product.

>Horse racing and boxing aren't really comparable because their
>decline in popularity have nothing to do with risks involved
>with playing the sport. Boxing is of course dangerous but
>that's not the reason it isn't as popular - the general
>public's taste has changed and the sport isn't as accessible
>as it used to be because of the cost of pay per view.

you don't think watching the Greatest (Ali) succumb to "early onset Alzheimer's" aka becoming punch drunk had anything to do with the altered perception around boxing? I think that had EVERYTHING to do with the altered perception around boxing. it just lost its appeal as the sadness became undeniable and sports entertainment consumer looked towards less exploitative and damaging sports to follow. it's VERY MUCH like the universal sadness people are experiencing hearing the news about a heroic competitor like Junior Seau possibly succumbing to the physical toll of football. when does "fearless" become "reckless" etc.?

and I don't really know shit about horse racing, although who knows maybe changing attitudes about animal rights could be tied in there. just pointed out that just being on top doesn't guarantee you a spot there forever. you have to keep earning it, which horse racing didn't do, and the NFL must keep working to maintain.

___________

HOPE!
https://vine.co/v/i7JjIBL3Qix
https://vine.co/v/i7JtqEFwxDu

  

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OldPro
Member since Dec 10th 2002
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Fri May-04-12 12:50 PM

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65. "Except MMA is growing at a fast rate"
In response to Reply # 61


  

          

>you don't think watching the Greatest (Ali) succumb to "early
>onset Alzheimer's" aka becoming punch drunk had anything to do
>with the altered perception around boxing? I think that had
>EVERYTHING to do with the altered perception around boxing.
>it just lost its appeal as the sadness became undeniable and
>sports entertainment consumer looked towards less exploitative
>and damaging sports to follow.

and is even more violent than boxing.

soulfunk is right about ppv... that and the lack of a dynamic American heavyweight is what's hurt boxing... the shit has nothing to do with how violent it is... Americans damn near worship violence.


_________________________________
Reunion Radio Podcasts
Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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celery77
Member since Aug 04th 2005
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67. "honestly? I have no idea what to make of MMA"
In response to Reply # 65


  

          

I don't think it's ever going to be "mainstream," which means that while I recognize it's growing, I wonder about the ceiling on that growth potential. I also think there's a pretty good chance that it's just going to be a sport primarily popular with lower class (i.e. income level) men. I also think it's going to be extremely regional in its draw, e.g. rodeo. and depending on just how organized and popular it gets? I can definitely see an organized backlash against it developing.

and while MMA has some weird #s it boasts for its popularity, I'd personally say it's less popular than soccer, but obviously that's filtering through my biases. and if I went home and spent a week in San Jose, I might see the bubble I'm living in here in Portland a little more clearly, too.

but yeah -- I dunno about MMA. from where I sit it's a fringe sport with a tenuous future.

but seriously, when we talk about the decline of the heavyweight, do you really deny that the decline of Ali went basically lockstep with how that division transformed? cuz there's a clear connection there to me...

___________

HOPE!
https://vine.co/v/i7JjIBL3Qix
https://vine.co/v/i7JtqEFwxDu

  

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soulfunk
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68. "The legal liability is WAY less because we're talking about thousands"
In response to Reply # 61
Fri May-04-12 01:38 PM by soulfunk

  

          

vs. hundreds of millions when you talk about class action suits for current/former pro athletes vs class action suits for smokers.

As far as boxing, I didn't say that it was just about PPV, but that is a big part of it. People's tastes change when it comes to sports. Baseball used to be by far the number one sport, now it isn't. Tennis used to be more popular. You already mentioned horse racing.

Did Ali's condition contribute to the decline in popularity of the heavyweight division? Maybe, but it isn't biggest reason that boxing isn't as popular. People like watching violence. If we had someone right now like Tyson knocking cats out in the first round, the heavyweight division would be huge.

  

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cyrus
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73. "RE: The tobacco argument doesn't make sense because that is a "
In response to Reply # 51


  

          

>business that had NO way to significantly reduce the risk.
>Tobacco causes cancer, and it's that simple. With football
>however, it isn't the mere act of playing football that causes
>the risk, its the collisions and impact involved.

I would contend this point. There is a competitive advantage, and ample opportunity within the rules, to injure your opponent. The new "unprotected receiver" and "driving into the ground" rules are the same as "light" and "low tar" cigarettes. The mere act of playing football for 20 years is probably more risky to your health than smoking for 20 years at this point.

  

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Tw3nty
Member since Jan 02nd 2007
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Fri May-04-12 09:46 AM

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34. "what about waivers signed in advance acknowledging"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

the risk of long term injury and the inability to sue the league in the future due to those injuries

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

  

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cereffusion
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40. "-"
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

it won't help for all of the players that could/will sue them now - which is the real problem.

Also, if the government steps in - waivers may not even matter.

Additionally, if more high profile players end up like Seau then public opinion will turn on the NFL - driving down revenue.

  

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brown sugar
Member since Jan 22nd 2005
4536 posts
Sat May-05-12 10:13 AM

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77. "im not so sure those waivers would be enforceable in courts"
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

also as the poster above said, the potential class base is already so large with former players.

<-- BAUGH SO HARD

  

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sfMatt
Member since Jun 20th 2002
10383 posts
Fri May-04-12 12:48 PM

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63. "Can we agree on one thing though, not really related to the CTE bit?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I love college football, I think that's pretty obvious.

But there's no doubt in my mind that it absolutely contributing in a significant way to the decline of our institutions of higher education, particularly the ones that are public.

There's no way the arms race and donor dollars pouring into athletic departments are anything but bad for the academic enterprise.

  

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spawn2k
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Fri May-04-12 12:49 PM

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64. "remeber boxing? horse racing?"
In response to Reply # 0


          

at one point those sports were the biggest things going and were making money hand over fist. now they're relegated to the fringes. things change and they can change much quicker than you think.

men are so simple, and so subject to present necessities, that he who seeks to deceive will always find someone who will allow himself to be deceived. (c)Niccol Machiavelli

  

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OldPro
Member since Dec 10th 2002
34401 posts
Fri May-04-12 12:58 PM

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66. "Billion dollar stadiums, massive media deals, 8 figure merchandising"
In response to Reply # 64


  

          

300 million is generated just off adds for the Super Bowl

Yes boxing and horse racing were once popular but neither was close to the money making behemoth the NFL is. Just saying well this sport was popular once and applying that to the NFL is ignoring an awful lot of factors.
_________________________________
Reunion Radio Podcasts
Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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cereffusion
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69. "every collapsed industry"
In response to Reply # 66


  

          

thought the same shit.

  

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OldPro
Member since Dec 10th 2002
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Fri May-04-12 05:23 PM

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74. "Name one as big as the NFL that disappeared in 25 years"
In response to Reply # 69


  

          

I swear you cats in here talking like you don't understand how lucrative this shit is. Last time I'm going to say this... THAT SHIT AIN'T GOING NO WHERE
_________________________________
Reunion Radio Podcasts
Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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cereffusion
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75. "rich people will stay making money"
In response to Reply # 74
Fri May-04-12 10:54 PM by cereffusion

  

          

but if public opinion turns and the lawsuits/legal ramifications take their toll then this shit will have a diminished return. I swear you have no idea how the world works, dog. As long as something is lucrative - it's lucrative. But once it's not - it's not. Rich dudes will stay rich and athletes will play something else. And we'll watch.

Tobacco will always be around but it's not what it was. Same with church -and that's not even a business (well...) but in 50 years there's going to be a lot less people at church if things keep going the way they are.

Remember AOL? Everyone had that shit! And now only grandpa does.

BestBuy is doomed...staples to follow. Shit changes. It doesn't matter the scale. People used to be able to have lifelong careers in mills, mines, auto plants, whatever - not anymore. It's rough for some but it happens because that's progress. In 25 years life will be even more different from now than 1987 is.

I'm not saying it WILL but I think football has a good chance of losing this top spot. It's too dangerous right now...and if a few more dudes end up like Junior....it's not going to be pretty.


Edit: Shit, you think in 25 years I'll still be putting gas in my car? Oil >>> NFL. Or reading a printed book? Or calling from a land line? Or sending a fax? Or using the post office?

  

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40thStreetBlack
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85. "boxing and horse racing still exist though"
In response to Reply # 64


          

football may not always be the be-all/end-all that it currently is, but it's not going to just disappear.

___________________

Mar-A-Lago delenda est

  

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brown sugar
Member since Jan 22nd 2005
4536 posts
Sat May-05-12 10:15 AM

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78. "surprised with the reaction here"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

thought it was going to be 90% "STFU football will never die this is stupid", but some good points all around on both sides.

not so sure about helmet design being touted as the ultimate solution. if it was easy as adding exterior cushioning, why has the league not done so yet? can't be just aesthetics, they would get vilified if it were found they had a better design on the table but didn't implement it because it looked weird.

<-- BAUGH SO HARD

  

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brown sugar
Member since Jan 22nd 2005
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79. "First "mega lawsuit" consolidated/filed (link)"
In response to Reply # 0
Fri Jun-08-12 12:17 AM by brown sugar

  

          

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/8020190/former-nfl-players-say-league-hid-brain-injury-links

is it beginning?

<-- BAUGH SO HARD

  

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SoulHonky
Member since Jan 21st 2003
25919 posts
Fri Jun-08-12 02:37 AM

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80. "It will exist. Current helmets will seem as archaic as leather straps"
In response to Reply # 0
Fri Jun-08-12 02:39 AM by SoulHonky

          

Someone will make a lot of money by designing a better helmet. I wouldn't be stunned if it was some sort of soft foam type that cushioned the blow for the hitter and lessened the hit on the person getting tackled. Sure, some diehards will whine about the crack of the pads being gone but it will be a safer game and save lives.

I mean, shit, we still have boxing and have gone to an arguably even more brutal version with MMA. I also wouldn't be stunned if we saw more byes and more recovery time for teams.

----
NBA MOCK DRAFT #1 - https://thecourierclass.com/whole-shebang/2017/5/18/2017-nba-mock-draft-1-just-lotto-and-lotta-trades

  

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GdChil1
Member since Dec 05th 2003
14709 posts
Fri Jun-08-12 11:33 AM

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81. "they'd just take the helmets off (ala rugby) first..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

just my opinion. i call it the superman complex. when motherfuckers start feeling those bullets (aka hits) they will adjust.

everybody in here has probably played a game of backyard tackle football, you adjust your game to the situation.

Wow, my login still works 🤦🏾‍♂️

  

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
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Fri Jun-08-12 01:23 PM

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82. "I've heard this argument a lot, and I think it's awesome."
In response to Reply # 81


  

          

It'd cause fewer concussions and would be simply cooler to watch.

My movies: http://russellhainline.com
My movie reviews: https://letterboxd.com/RussellHFilm/
My beer TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@thebeertravelguide

  

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d.
Member since Dec 13th 2009
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Mon Dec-03-12 12:36 PM

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91. "why'd it take so long for this reply?"
In response to Reply # 81


  

          

it's the obvious solution if everything else fails

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71387 posts
Mon Jun-17-13 01:26 PM

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96. "I've heard this argument over and over, I am not buying it"
In response to Reply # 81


  

          

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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B9
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Mon Jun-17-13 01:42 PM

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97. "Self preservation isn't a learned habit"
In response to Reply # 96


          

The pads come off, new approaches take hold. Dumbasses won't be spearing or leading with the top of their heads if they have more to lose.

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
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Thu Aug-29-13 08:50 PM

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99. "and do those things account for all or even most concussions?"
In response to Reply # 97


  

          

look at rugby, there are still a good number of concussions and there has not even been an adjustment there. these guys learned from a young age not to lead with their head and they still get banged around.

and what about the lower levels of the game? no helmets in pop warner and high school? good luck getting any school district (and its lawyers and insurance companies) to buy that.

this is an absurd idea, sorry, like saying taking seat belts out of cars will make people drive slower and limit accidents.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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brown sugar
Member since Jan 22nd 2005
4536 posts
Mon Dec-03-12 11:33 AM

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83. "Study: New Cases of CTE in Football Players (link)"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/page/OTL%20CTE%20study/boston-university-researchers-discover-28-new-cases-chronic-brain-damage-deceased-football-players

<-- BAUGH SO HARD

  

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40thStreetBlack
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Mon Dec-03-12 11:38 AM

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84. "In related news, the south will secede again in 25 years."
In response to Reply # 0


          

___________________

Mar-A-Lago delenda est

  

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poetx
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Mon Dec-03-12 11:51 AM

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86. "it already has. In Philly. nm"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


peace & blessings,

x.

www.twitter.com/poetx

=========================================
** i move away from the mic to breathe in

  

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Bombastic
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88. "Yes. Next Question(c)Rosenhaus"
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vee-lover
Member since Jul 30th 2007
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Mon Dec-03-12 12:25 PM

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89. "if so, it will be a completely different type of game than it is now"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

and in order to do that, you have to (try) and tamp down on the violent hits which the league is attempting to do now...so who knows what type of game you'll have if the league continues to go down this path

but the problem is once you go down this path, you run the risk over time of losing the football purists as well as the casual fans who also watch the sport because of its violent nature.

lets remember boxing was once the most popular sport in the country a century ago up until the 70s and we all know its lost some of its luster over the years.

There are many former football players who are steering their kids away from the game and into other more safer sports like futbol which is also growing rapidly.

grassrootsphilosopher

  

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The Real
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90. "Yup, taken over by competitive pat-a-cake"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Make Money: http://jamesjenkins.acnrep.com
Save Money: http://jamesjenkins.acndirect.com

  

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guru0509
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92. "Lem Barney agrees (swipe) :("
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/9387994/lem-barney-says-sees-end-football-10-20-years


SOUTHFIELD, Mich. -- Bigger, stronger and faster football players are going to kill the sport.

At least that's what Lem Barney believes.

"The game is becoming more deadly today," the Pro Football Hall of Famer said Friday. "It's a great game. I think it's the greatest game if you like gladiators. It's the greatest game for yesteryear's gladiators. But I can see in the next 10 to maybe 20 years, society will alleviate football altogether."

Barney shared his thoughts at the Sound Mind Sound Body Football Academy while sitting next to coaches such as Michigan's Brady Hoke, Michigan State's Mark Dantonio and Wisconsin's Gary Anderson along with Denver Broncos defensive tackle Kevin Vickerson.

The camp's co-founder, Curtis Blackwell, said his goal was to conduct baseline tests on about 600 high school players this week so that the data was available if any of them have head injuries during the season.

Barney is among the hundreds of former football players suing the NFL over how it handled head injuries.

"I found out after I was out of the game that I had seven, maybe eight concussions," he said.

While none of the coaches backed Barney's belief that football won't exist in a decade or two, Vickerson said the notion isn't far-fetched.

"They're trying to make the game safer, but it's a gladiators' sport and there's only so much safety you can bring to it," Vickerson said. "The best thing we can do is give these kids tools to learn how to tackle the right away."

Concussion awareness was part of the program for high school football players, who packed an auditorium as Dantonio used practice video to show how the Spartans are taught to avoid head injuries.

"Tackling is not a science, it's an art," Dantonio said.

Hoke, who praised Dantonio for his presentation, said providing instruction is one way to combat the dangers of playing fast, hard-hitting football.

"Is it a contact game, sometimes violent? There's no question," Hoke said. "But at the same time, I think there are better ways that we can continue to teach."


Copyright 2013 by The Associated Press

-------------------
I wanna go to where the martyrs went
the brown figures on the walls of my apart-a-ment...

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
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93. "25 years is too soon, but 100 is a question IMO"
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And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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calminvasion
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94. "lol! Everything is a question in 100 years"
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>

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
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95. "well you know what i mean, 25 years is too short to consider ..."
In response to Reply # 94
Mon Jun-17-13 01:25 PM by ConcreteCharlie

  

          

the complete disappearance, but over a longer period of time, yes, i could see it going. and that could even be the case absent other serious motivation (fledgling finances, declined popularity, lawsuits, etc).

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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brown sugar
Member since Jan 22nd 2005
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98. "Gladwell: Football will become "ghettoized" (swipe)"
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http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/writer/dennis-dodd/23380419/author-malcolm-gladwell-says-football-will-become-ghettoized

In a new documentary, acclaimed author Malcolm Gladwell says football will become ghettoized -- attracting only those whom the risks are acceptable because of the threat posed by head injuries.

Gladwell is interviewed in the new film United States of Football which documents the head trauma issue from youth football to the NFL. The film by Sean Pamphilon opens across the country in theaters on Friday.

Because of that threat of head injuries, we will go to a middle position where we will disclose the risks and essentially dare people to play , says Gladwell, best-selling author of The Tipping Point and Outliers;. That's what the Army does. So we leave the Army for kids who have other options, for whom the risks are acceptable.

That's what football is going to become. It's going to become the Army. That's a very, very different situation. That's a ghettoized sport, not a mainstream American sport.

Gladwell did not respond to email requests for comment. Explaining the ghettoized remark, Pamphilon said, I think his implication is pretty clear. Suburban white kids or their parents are going to opt out More affluent people are going to decide they don't want to put their kids in that position.

His assertion is that it's going to stay relevant at least for the time being in lower income areas and then also football hot beds such as Ohio, Pennsylvania, certainly Texas, places were it transcends socio-economic conditions.

Jesse Jackson's Rainbow PUSH did not respond to a CBSSpots.com request for comment.

His assertion is in places where football isn't the only thing to do, those fans are going to opt out first, Pamphilon told CBSSports.com. Certain colleges are going to follow and there will be a steady decline in the participation of the game.

It means the future of football is going to become very much in line with the military. We're going to have to own the fact that we're putting people in certain situations and it's going to be less glorified, there's less of that glamorous veneer.

The NFL settled a lawsuit on Thursday with 4,500 former players who had sued the league over head trauma issues. The NCAA is in a similar position, named as a defendant in lawsuit filed by four former athletes.

Pamphilon is known as the person who released the audio of former New Orleans defensive coordinator Gregg Williams telling his players to target the heads of opponents. That tape became a large part of the Bountygate scandal.

CBSSports.com was sent an advance screening of the film.

<-- BAUGH SO HARD

  

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ConcreteCharlie
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100. "it sort of already is, but OK."
In response to Reply # 98


  

          

my main thing has always been that they should make the field wider, it would put a little more speed in but also a lot more caution and contained aggression.

i wonder what the concussion data is like in the CFL.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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brown sugar
Member since Jan 22nd 2005
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101. "Youth football participation drops (swipe)"
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http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/page/popwarner/pop-warner-youth-football-participation-drops-nfl-concussion-crisis-seen-causal-factor


Youth football participation drops

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
By Steve Fainaru and Mark Fainaru-Wada
ESPN.com


The nation's largest youth football program, Pop Warner, saw participation drop 9.5 percent between 2010-12, a sign that the concussion crisis that began in the NFL is having a dramatic impact at the lowest rungs of the sport.

According to data provided to "Outside the Lines," Pop Warner lost 23,612 players, thought to be the largest two-year decline since the organization began keeping statistics decades ago. Consistent annual growth led to a record 248,899 players participating in Pop Warner in 2010; that figure fell to 225,287 by the 2012 season.

Pop Warner officials said they believe several factors played a role in the decline, including the trend of youngsters focusing on one sport. But the organization's chief medical officer, Dr. Julian Bailes, cited concerns about head injuries as "the No. 1 cause."

"Unless we deal with these truths, we're not going to get past the dropping popularity of the sport and people dropping out of the sport," said Bailes, a former Pittsburgh Steelers neurosurgeon whose 10-year-old son, Clint, plays Pop Warner outside Chicago. "We need to get it right."

The statistics, which have not been previously disclosed, are consistent with declining participation rates reported in youth football across the country. USA Football, a national governing body partially funded by the NFL, said participation among players ages 6 to 14 fell from 3 million to 2.8 million in 2011, a 6.7 percent decline.
Pop Warner, founded in 1929, is the largest youth football organization in the world; the NFL players union estimates that 60 to 70 percent of all NFL players started in the program. After years of steady growth, the organization saw participation drop 5.7 percent for the 2011 season, according to the internal Pop Warner data provided to "Outside the Lines." Last year, the figures fell 4 percent. Officials said they do not have statistics for the 2013 season but expect that participation rates will be flat.

The decline in participation is not reflected on Pop Warner's website, which boasts that "participation has steadily increased to today's record numbers," adding that "over 250,000 youths participated in Pop Warner-sanctioned football programs in 2010, and those numbers are continuing to grow."

Representatives from Pop Warner and USA Football suggested the reasons for the drop in participation were unclear and could be attributed to several factors. Among those cited were the nation's economy and the ongoing trend of youth specializing in a single sport. Officials pointed to a survey showing declines in participation in other team sports, including baseball and basketball, although dips among core participants were not as severe.

The downward trends in youth football participation coincide with a series of ominous reports about football and brain damage in the NFL. In 2005, the first of dozens of confirmed cases of former NFL players with neurodegenerative disease was reported. In 2009, Congress held hearings on the NFL's long-standing efforts to conceal the connection between concussions and mental illness. In 2010, a league spokesman acknowledged for the first time a connection between concussions and "long-term problems."

In early 2011, former Chicago Bears defensive back Dave Duerson committed suicide by shooting himself in the chest to preserve his brain for study. He was later diagnosed with Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy, or CTE, a brain disease that has been linked to football.

Tony Strickland, an associate clinical professor of neurology at UCLA's Geffen School of Medicine who sits on the Pop Warner's Medical Advisory Committee, said he believes participation dropped "in part because of the description of individual cases and the information out there about the incidence of CTE. If I'm a parent, anybody hearing that information, in the absence of other science, would be foolish not to be cautious."

But Strickland, who is CEO of the Sports Concussion Institute, said concerns about football and head injuries have outstripped the pace of scientific evidence, creating unwarranted hysteria about the risks of playing football.

"I have felt that the pendulum swung way ahead of the science and what we know," Strickland said.

In 2012, Pop Warner significantly cut back on the amount of tackling permitted during practice. This year, the organization announced a partnership with the NFL to endorse "Heads Up" football, a program launched by USA Football and designed to teach proper tackling techniques to minimize head contact.

In the coming months, Pop Warner's Medical Advisory Committee is expected to take up more rule changes that some officials believe could foreshadow where football is headed, as parents and players continue to reassess the risks.

One proposal under consideration would take all linemen out of the three-point stance. Bailes, its chief proponent, said requiring players to start upright would cut down on head-to-head collisions that can lead to brain injuries.

Bailes co-authored a study in the November issue of the Journal of Neurosurgery showing how repeated "subconcussive impacts" can lead to brain damage. One way to minimize those impacts in football, the study concluded, might be to have linemen start in a "squatting position, to remove them from the inexorable, ubiquitous, gratuitous head contact on every play."

"I really think we need to limit the number of head impacts," said Bailes, who also leads the department of neurosurgery at NorthShore Neurological Institute in Evanston, Ill. "I think that's where the sport needs to go."



What I've stated from the beginning is that I desperately want kids to play sports; I want sports participation to go up. I just want the most dangerous sports for head trauma to be played in a way that's safe.

-- Dr. Robert Cantu

Jon Butler, Pop Warner's executive director, said the move to take linemen out of the three-point stance is "in the very early stages. The concern with a rule that sweeping is that politically it's going to change the game to the point where people get turned off. My personal feeling is that that is where football is ultimately going to go. The question is how we get there."

Strickland said there needs to be more study to determine if such a measure would have the desired effect. "What is intuitively a good idea may not necessarily be so," he said. "We want to make sure any policies that we implement we can evaluate and track their efficacy."

At the same time, youth football officials emphasized that they believe football is safe relative to other sports.

"It's an emotional decision for a parent, but statistically we can prove that football is as safe if not safer than other sports," said Butler. "If you take kids' activities, including bicycle-riding and skateboarding, the rate of concussion is tremendously higher in those activities."

Dr. Robert Cantu, a neurosurgeon and concussion expert at Boston University's Center for the Study of Traumatic Encephalopathy, has advocated for banning tackle football for children younger than 14 because "the young brain is much more susceptible to the shock associated with concussion."

"What I've stated from the beginning is that I desperately want kids to play sports; I want sports participation to go up," said Cantu. "I just want the most dangerous sports for head trauma to be played in a way that's safe."

Cantu, who serves as a senior advisor to the NFL on concussions, said he hoped that younger children would play flag football before they reach high school.

Bailes, though, emphasized he believes the research shows the youngest players are not as likely to suffer concussions as those playing at the high school level and above. He said the key is minimizing exposure through rule changes at the youth level.

"We need to help try to morph the game where it needs to go," said Bailes. "Numbers are down, but it's a wakeup call. None of us are saying football should end. I'm saying the opposite -- football should continue."



<-- BAUGH SO HARD

  

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JAESCOTT777
Member since Feb 18th 2006
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102. "lee corso said they just need to remove face masks"
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cgonz00cc
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103. "im for it"
In response to Reply # 102


  

          

Deweaponizing the head is the only way to have an immediate effect on older players

The NFHS could do a lot but it will take time for that to trickle up

  

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colonelk
Member since Dec 10th 2002
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104. "if America can stomach nosebleeds on TV"
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Even if nobody's going for the head, faces are going to get hit.

--------

hell-below.com

  

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LAbeathustla
Member since Jan 24th 2004
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105. "and a lot of missing teeth"
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------------------------------------
2019 CABG Survivor

2016 OK Survivor Champion

be about it or be without it

RIP GOATs

  

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ConcreteCharlie
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109. "these are all flawed, patchwork solutions"
In response to Reply # 102


  

          

the bottom line is that to make the game safer, a ton of contact has to be taken out. where would that leave it?

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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KosherSam
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Thu Nov-14-13 10:17 PM

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106. "*TWO* High School players DIED this week. *swipes*"
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http://espn.go.com/espn/story/_/id/9976227/mo-football-player-dies-2-weeks-injury

TIPTON, Mo. -- A Missouri high school football player who has been hospitalized with a brain injury since an October playoff game died Thursday, according to the school district's superintendent.

Chad Stover, a junior at Tipton High School, had been hospitalized in critical condition since Oct. 31, when he was taken off the football field near the end of the game and taken by ambulance to the hospital. He died at a hospital in Columbia, said Scott Jarvis, superintendent of the Tipton School District.

Officials have not said how Stover was injured. Jarvis said last week he couldn't discuss details of the injury but described it as "very serious."

Jason West, spokesman for the Missouri State High School Activities Association, said the association had been made aware of Stover's injury and death, but he was uncertain how Stover was injured. "We do know the game was halted at that time," West said.

He said the MSHSAA would review how the injury was dealt with at the field in Sedalia where the game was played. The association recommends having some type of medical service available at football games, but requires only that each school have an action plan in place to deal with medical emergencies. He said preliminary information indicates the school did follow its action plan.

The school and family have received outpourings of support since Stover was hospitalized. Schools around Missouri displayed red ribbons in honor of Tipton's school colors or displayed Stover's No. 18 on their fields. Residents also covered his central Missouri town of Tipton in red ribbons.

Stover's mother, Amy, had been posting updates on her son's hospitalization on the Caring Bridge website. In her last post on Tuesday, she said he seemed "to slip backwards a little more everyday."

"He has so many different injuries going on in that beautiful head of his," her entry said.

Chad was a very popular, intelligent student, and the Stovers are active members of the Tipton school community, Jarvis said last week.

"If you wanted to pick a kid to be your son, that'd be the one you'd pick," Jarvis said.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/nov/12/arizona-student-football-dies-head-injury

A high school footballer has died after sustaining a head injury in a game. Charles Youvella, of Hopi High School in Kearns Canyon, on the Hopi Indian Reservation in north-eastern Arizona, sustained the injury in a game on Saturday night.

The Arizona Interscholastic Association confirmed the senior's death on Monday and released a statement which said: "We are deeply saddened by the tragic loss of Charles Youvella Charles loved football and was a wide receiver. During Saturday's Division V first round playoff game against Arizona Lutheran Academy, Charles suffered a traumatic brain injury. While hospitalized, Charles passed away. His father Wallace and family were by his side."

The website azcentral.com reported that Youvella, who scored Hopi's only touchdown in a 60-6 defeat, was engaged "in what appeared to be a typical football tackle" when he hit the back of his head on the ground. The website said the player collapsed after taking part in two more plays, and was conscious and talking when he was taken to St Joseph's Hospital and Medical Center in Phoenix.

Football has been the subject of increasing scrutiny into the effects of head injuries sustained on the field at all levels. In August, a proposed $765m settlement was announced, between the National Football League and 4,500 former players who had been seeking redress for head injuries sustained in the game. Last week, Hall of Fame Dallas Cowboys running back Tony Dorsett said he had been given a diagnosis of chronic traumatic encephalopathy, or CTE.

Other professional sports are also contending with the effects of head injuries. In the UK last week a leading sports doctor, Barry O'Driscoll, warned another contact sport, rugby union, about potential legal claims from former professional players, similar and possibly similarly expensive to those settled by the NFL.

In the US, concern now reaches beyond collision sports and to recreational pursuits. According to a report in the December issue of Outside magazine, "the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention estimates that between 1.6 million and 3.8 million sports-related concussions occur in the US each year". The magazine also cites a City of New York study which found that brain injuries were responsible for 74% of deaths in cycling accidents, and an American Association of Neurological Surgeons estimate that 600 cyclists die each year as a result of head injuries.

Awareness of the possible effects of head injuries is also increasing. Outside says that in 2010, head injuries suffered while skiing or snowboarding accounted for 14,947 visits to the doctor, up from 9,308 in 2004.

In Arizona, the AIA said an account would be established to help the Youvella family with costs arising from their son's death.

*Jews you*

"this is okp tho, reading is completely optional" (c) desus

Proceed with caution. I am overtly racist.

<-- In Pigpen we trust

  

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celery77
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114. "TIME just did a cover on this Stover kid, he was likely concussed"
In response to Reply # 106


  

          

and then allowed to re-enter the game. They mention he took a bad shot, and then the coaches asked him how he was doing. He said he was fine, so they let him back in. He then suffered another hit that proved fatal.

They also make some mention of a lack of ambulance or trainer at the game, because it's not required in Missouri's rules (although some high school voluntarily provide them), but it would definitely seem to me that a lack of awareness about the dangers of brain injury was the much bigger issue. The days of asking the athlete how they feel about playing need to end. There needs to be independent monitors at all these games who don't need to answer to anyone but the safety record of their players.

___________

HOPE!
https://vine.co/v/i7JjIBL3Qix
https://vine.co/v/i7JtqEFwxDu

  

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brown sugar
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107. "3/10 ex-players develop Alzheimers/dementia (link)"
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not the best week for the NFL:

http://time.com/3342795/nfl-concussions-alzheimers-dementia/

  

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j0510
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108. "Honestly, I thought it would have been worse than that."
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>not the best week for the NFL:
>
>http://time.com/3342795/nfl-concussions-alzheimers-dementia/

  

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ConcreteCharlie
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110. "scary to think that's only "at least twice" the rate of the general popu..."
In response to Reply # 107


  

          

and i don't think that's staggering, doubling your risk doing what they do sounds about right if not a little low. i mean the average person is not undergoing near that amount of contact and exposed to anything close to that potential for brain injury.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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brown sugar
Member since Jan 22nd 2005
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111. "Agreed, but this only covers Alzheimers/dementia"
In response to Reply # 110


  

          

I'm sure there are other forms of brain damage inflicting
these players that were not captured by the study.

Anecdotal evidence is one thing, but once researchers start
pegging cold hard quantitative measures to the damage
caused by football, the entire sport increases its exposure.

  

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brown sugar
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112. "HS football player dies from head injury in on-field hit (swipe)"
In response to Reply # 0
Thu Oct-02-14 05:55 AM by brown sugar

  

          

http://7online.com/333292/

NEW YORK (WABC) -- A Shoreham-Wading River High School football player died Wednesday night.

Junior Tom Cutinella, a guard/linebacker, collapsed during the game against John Glenn High School after taking a big hit by an opponent and suffering a head injury.

The incident occurred in the third quarter of game at John Glenn High School.

He underwent surgery but later died at Huntington Hospital.

The Superintendent of Shoreham-Wading River Schools released a statement saying, "The Shoreham-Wading River School District community is terribly saddened to learn of the tragic death of Tom Cutinella, a high school junior and varsity football player. Tom passed away after colliding with an opponent in Wednesday night's game against Elwood John H. Glenn High School."

"Our school community is truly devastated by this awful news and we all extend our deepest condolences to Tom's family and friends during this difficult time."

"Tom played football for the district since he entered the high school in ninth grade, becoming a member of the varsity team this year. In addition, Tom played lacrosse and was a member of the Natural Helpers program, which focuses on peers helping peers. He excelled academically, had a great sense of humor and was just a great individual overall. He was well-liked among students and staff and he will truly be missed."

"Each student is a valued member of our educational community and a young person's death is always tragic. A sudden loss like this can have a profound effect on the entire school community. Grief counselors will be made available to students and staff for as long as needed as we mourn and cope with the loss of such an amazing life."

  

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High Society
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113. "Edit."
In response to Reply # 112
Thu Oct-02-14 05:04 PM by High Society

          

Most likely due to head trauma.
See 106.

-----
Cameo
Soundshape Records

  

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brown sugar
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115. "Borland retires. Evidence is mounting. At some point..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I have to seriously consider the ethical
implications of my own football fandom, esp
at the amateur level.

<-- BAUGH SO HARD

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
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Thu Mar-19-15 03:42 AM

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116. "do you like boxing?"
In response to Reply # 115


  

          

i dunno, to me it's not an ethical thing for fans. it's more about participation, mainly your kids participating or not.

i don't think i would let my kids play football or ice hockey. hoops, tennis, baseball, stuff in the pool, soccer. there are a lot of sports out there that don't present these risks.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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Cocobrotha2
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Thu Mar-19-15 08:32 AM

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117. "I think football will go the way of boxing"
In response to Reply # 116
Thu Mar-19-15 08:33 AM by Cocobrotha2

          

>i dunno, to me it's not an ethical thing for fans. it's more
>about participation, mainly your kids participating or not.
>
>i don't think i would let my kids play football or ice hockey.
>hoops, tennis, baseball, stuff in the pool, soccer. there are
>a lot of sports out there that don't present these risks.

In the near future, people are going to look at you funny when you say you (or your kid) want to make a profession of being beat about the head.

<-><-><-><-><-><-><-><-><->
<-><-><-><-><-><-><-><-><->

  

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cgonz00cc
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Thu Mar-19-15 10:07 AM

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118. "i see zero ethical issues with my fandom"
In response to Reply # 115


  

          

The game is taught to be head free

No one is taught to tackle or block with or at the head

WHAT A TIME TO BE ALIVE

  

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brown sugar
Member since Jan 22nd 2005
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Tue Jan-19-16 04:41 PM

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119. "Antwaan Randle-El says maybe not (swipe)"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/steelers/2016/01/19/If-I-could-go-back-I-wouldn-t-play-football/stories/201601190177?utm_medium=social&utm_source=Facebook&utm_campaign=echobox&utm_term=Autofeed

Last sentence:

“Right now,” he said, “I wouldn’t be surprised if football isn’t around in 20, 25 years.”

<-- BAUGH SO HARD

  

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Buck
Member since Feb 15th 2005
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Tue Jan-19-16 04:55 PM

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120. "36 years old."
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Ashy Achilles
Member since Sep 22nd 2005
4551 posts
Tue Jan-19-16 05:01 PM

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122. "i know"
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pretentious username
Member since Jun 18th 2010
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Tue Jan-19-16 04:57 PM

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121. "I've been thinking about this a lot recently"
In response to Reply # 119


  

          

The NFL will survive in some form for a long time, but I don't think a big league can truly thrive if it doesn't continue to have world class talent. Less and less parents are signing their kids up and it won't be long before that starts thinning the talent pool.

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
11281 posts
Wed Jan-20-16 01:08 AM

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123. "The moms will be the end-game."
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Jan-20-16 01:09 AM by denny

          

I think Canada will experience something similar with hockey. Participation with kids hasn't dropped yet but it will eventually. It's an unnatural, dangerous activity. When parents start disallowing their kids to play these sports....the end is already nigh. It's just a matter of time.

I wouldn't let my kid play meither of these sports. And I played AAA hockey in Ontario....so I've played with the best growing up. There's NOTHING that can be provided by hockey and football that can't also be provided by baseball, basketball, soccer, etc.

As for all the money and stadiums? That's just entertainment-based infrastructure. Something else will fill the void.

25 years sounds completely reasonable.

  

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brown sugar
Member since Jan 22nd 2005
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Wed Jan-27-16 12:06 PM

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125. "Tyler Sash had "Junior Seau levels" of CTE @ death (age 27) [link]"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/14655379/tyler-sash-former-new-york-giants-safety-had-high-level-cte

<-- BAUGH SO HARD

  

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brown sugar
Member since Jan 22nd 2005
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Wed Mar-09-16 04:30 PM

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126. "Tackling banned in Ivy League practices (link)"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Fissures turning into cracks.


http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/writer/jon-solomon/25503252/eliminating-full-contact-tackling-at-practice-will-be-new-normal-for-football

<-- BAUGH SO HARD

  

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brown sugar
Member since Jan 22nd 2005
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Wed Apr-27-16 01:48 PM

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127. "SINGLE season of HS football produce measurable change in brain cells (s..."
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Head impacts from single season of high school football produce measurable change in brain cells
Date:
April 25, 2016
Source:
UT Southwestern Medical Center
Summary:
Repeated impacts to the heads of high school football players cause measurable changes in their brains, even when no concussion occurs, according to new research.

Repeated impacts to the heads of high school football players cause measurable changes in their brains, even when no concussion occurs, according to research from UT Southwestern Medical Center's Peter O'Donnell Jr. Brain Institute and Wake Forest University School of Medicine.

Researchers gathered data from high school varsity players who donned specially outfitted helmets that recorded data on each head impact during practice and regular games. They then used experimental techniques to measure changes in cellular microstructure in the brains of the players before, during, and after the season.

"Our findings add to a growing body of literature demonstrating that a single season of contact sports can result in brain changes regardless of clinical findings or concussion diagnosis," said senior author Dr. Joseph Maldjian, Chief of the Neuroradiology Division and Director of the Advanced Neuroscience Imaging Research Lab, part of the Peter O'Donnell Jr. Brain Institute at UT Southwestern.

In the study, appearing in the Journal of Neurotrauma, a team of investigators at UT Southwestern, Wake Forest University Medical Center, and Children's National Medical Center evaluated about two dozen players over the course of a single football season. The group of players was not large enough to draw conclusions about the differences in impacts between positions, researchers said, and additional studies will be needed to determine what the deviations mean clinically for individuals.

"Studies like this are important to understand how and where long-term damage might be occurring, so that we can then take the necessary steps to prevent it," said first author Dr. Elizabeth Davenport, a postdoctoral researcher in the Department of Radiology and the Advanced Imaging Research Center at UT Southwestern.

During the pre-season each player had an MRI scan and participated in cognitive testing, which included memory and reaction time tests. During the season they wore sensors in their helmets that detected each impact they received. Post-season, each player had another MRI scan and another round of cognitive tests.

Researchers then used diffusional kurtosis imaging (DKI), which measures water diffusion in biological cells, to identify changes in neural tissues. DKI analysis has been used to detect changes in neural tissues to study brain development, as well as brain injury and disease including autism spectrum disorders, attention deficit/hyperactivity disorder (ADHD), Alzheimer's disease, traumatic brain injury (TBI), stroke, schizophrenia, and mild cognitive impairment.

DKI also allowed the researchers to measure white matter abnormalities. White matter consists of fibers that connect brain cells and can speed or slow signaling between nerve cells. In order for the brain to reorganize connections, white matter must be intact and the degree of white matter damage may be one factor that limits the ability of the brain to reorganize connections following TBI.

"Work of this type, combining biomechanics, imaging, and cognitive evaluation is critical to improving our understanding of the effects of subconcussive impacts on the developing brain," said Dr. Maldjian, Professor of Radiology and the Advanced Imaging Research Center at UT Southwestern. "Using this information, we hope to help keep millions of youth and adolescents safe when engaged in sports activities."

Football has the highest concussion rate of any competitive contact sport, and there is growing concern -- reflected in the recent decrease in participation in the Pop Warner youth football program -- among parents, coaches, and physicians of youth athletes about the effects of subconcussive head impacts, those not directly resulting in a concussion diagnosis, researchers noted. Previous research has focused primarily on college football players, but recent studies have shown impact distributions for youth and high school players to be similar to those seen at the college level, with differences primarily in the highest impact magnitudes and total number of impacts, the researchers noted.

The findings contribute to a growing body of knowledge and study about concussions and other types of brain injury by researchers with the Peter O'Donnell Jr. Brain Institute. Among them:

• In the first study of its kind, former National Football League (NFL) players who lost consciousness due to concussion during their playing days showed key differences in brain structure later in life. The hippocampus, a part of the brain involved in memory, was found to be smaller in 28 former NFL players as compared with a control group of men of similar age and education.

• A study examining the neuropsychological status of former National Football League players found that cognitive deficits and depression are more common among retired players than in the general population.

• CON-TEX includes one of the nation's first registries of concussion patients ages 5 and older to capture comprehensive, longitudinal data on sports-related concussion and mild traumatic brain injury patients.

• The Texas Institute for Brain Injury and Repair (TIBIR), a state-funded initiative to promote innovative research and education in traumatic brain injury, includes a comprehensive Concussion Network that delivers expert brain injury education to coaches, school nurses, athletic trainers, and parents about the risks of sports-related injuries.

Story Source:

The above post is reprinted from materials provided by UT Southwestern Medical Center. Note: Materials may be edited for content and length.

Journal Reference:

Elizabeth M. Davenport, Kalyna Apkarian, Christopher T Whitlow, Jillian E Urban, Jens H Jensen, Eliza Szuch, Mark A. Espeland, Youngkyoo Jung, Daryl A. Rosenbaum, Gerry Gioia, Alexander K Powers, Joel D Stitzel, Joseph A Maldjian. Abnormalities in Diffusional Kurtosis Metrics Related to Head Impact Exposure in a Season of High School Varsity Football. Journal of Neurotrauma, 2016; DOI: 10.1089/neu.2015.4267

<-- BAUGH SO HARD

  

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j0510
Member since Feb 02nd 2012
2315 posts
Tue May-10-16 08:59 PM

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129. "Tyler Varga and the concussion that lasted 4 months (swipe)"
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http://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nfl/colts/2016/05/09/tyler-varga-and-concussion-lasted-4-months/84145580/

Tyler Varga and the concussion that lasted 4 months
Zak Keefer
9:52 a.m. EDT May 10, 2016

Want to see the ugly side of professional football? Tyler Varga can show you.

Chances are you forgot about him. He was the surprise survivor of the Indianapolis Colts’ final cuts last August; the Yale grad with the incredible backstory; the running back who began training camp sixth on the depth chart who never saw any practice snaps and the player no one gave a shot to make the team.

Then he did. Then he played in a few games.

Then he disappeared.

What you didn’t see was the concussion that lasted four months, the days and weeks he spent inside dark rooms, the test he kept failing, the words that got stuck in his mind that his mouth couldn’t spit out. Tyler Varga can tell you about the headaches, the nausea, the dizziness and the doubts. He'll tell you about the drugs he says the Colts told him to take and why he refused. He'll tell you why, after all that, he still wants to play football.

One hit — one jarring hit that popped his helmet loose and had him wobbling to the wrong sideline. That’s all it took for a 22-year-old who had never suffered a diagnosed concussion in his life to watch his rookie season in the NFL go up in smoke, and maybe his career. It took him two full days to tell the Colts’ team doctors what he already knew but refused to admit.

You know why. We all know why.

“I didn’t want to go through the concussion protocol and maybe lose my job,” Varga says now. “That’s the pressure. I can’t miss anything. There’s no wiggle room. I hardly get any reps in practice as it is, and I’m missing days, I’m getting even fewer. I don’t get to show the coaches I know my stuff. And if I don’t get to play in the game, I get replaced.”

It’s an NFL reality. Varga is right: Like a lot of NFL players, he’s one play from being replaced. Couple that with the age-old tough guy mentality ingrained in professional football — “rub some dirt on it and get back out there” — and this is a league, no matter the rule changes and buckets of money it has poured into concussion research, that can never truly protect its players from their greatest foe: themselves.

And its players, particularly those clinging to the bottom of the roster, are willing to risk anything to be a part of that machine. Tyler Varga’s story embodies it.

“I’m pretty sure everybody who plays the game the way we’re taught to play it has had some sort of head trauma, and that’s the unfortunate truth,” he says.

The Hit and the Aftermath

It was September. Week 3. Varga, a rookie running back and special teamer, exited the Colts’ 35-33 win over the Tennessee Titans after absorbing a vicious hit on kickoff coverage. “It was like, 'Whatever, shake it off,’” he remembers. “I’ve had hits like that before.” He had no clue the reverberations of that hit would linger for four months and make him question ever wanting to play football again. He wouldn’t take another snap all year. His season was over. He wouldn’t be right until January.

He remembers calling his parents on the bus ride after the game, waking up the next morning feeling like he had the flu, then ignoring it and showing up for work anyway. He lifted weights. He practiced. He went home and went to bed.

“I wanted to believe I was just sick,” he says.

He wasn’t. The following day, Tuesday, was when Varga was forced to come to grips with what was wrong. He’d been denying the obvious to himself, ignoring the signs — the fatigue, the dizziness, the confusion. It was the Colts’ off day. Varga was apartment shopping. He toured four complexes that afternoon, then, sitting in the parking lot after he walked out of the last one, it hit him: He couldn’t remember being inside any of the apartments. Something was wrong.

“It was pretty scary at that point,” Varga says. “I mean, I was in one of the apartments like five minutes earlier.”

On Wednesday morning, he showed up at the Colts’ West 56th Street practice facility and told the team doctors that he thought he’d suffered a concussion. So the Colts did with Varga what they do with any player in a similar situation — they had him take the ImPACT examination, which a player must pass before resuming on-field work. (Nearly 50 percent of NFL players are back on the field within five days of suffering a concussion, meaning they don't miss a game.)

Only Varga failed the test miserably. “I had a feeling while I was taking it, ‘This isn’t going good,’” he says. They told him to stay home for a week. So he did. They told him not to exercise, not to look at screens, not to do much of anything at all. So he did.

The Colts beat the Jacksonville Jaguars in overtime in Week 4. Varga stayed at home. A day later, he took the ImPACT test a second time. Failed it again. He took it a third time that Friday, nearly two weeks after the concussion. Failed it again. What had begun as a hit to the head had suddenly placed his season in jeopardy. Worst of all, he couldn't shake the symptoms.

One morning the following week, Varga’s phone buzzed. It was a text message from one of the team doctors, instructing him to arrive at the facility at 2 p.m. that day to pick up some drugs to aid his recovery. “They’ll make you feel better,” he remembers the message saying. Varga hesitated.

“My first impulse reaction: What are the drugs? I’m not just taking things. I’m smarter than that.”

Indeed. Varga owns an evolutionary biology degree from Yale and hopes to one day become an orthopedic surgeon. Prescription drugs are not foreign to him: In his final high school game, he tore the peroneal tendon in one of his legs, which led to acute compartment syndrome, which led to him nearly losing that leg. Amputation was considered but eventually dismissed. He spent months in the hospital and eventually recovered. He ran for 2,985 yards and 31 touchdowns at Yale.

Varga said he spoke with a Colts team doctor — he won’t say who — and explained that he wasn’t going to take a drug he knew nothing about. The drug in question was Amantadine, which the doctor said, according to Varga, is commonly prescribed to players who’ve suffered a concussion. “You should definitely take it,” Varga remembers the doctor telling him. (The Colts do not discuss individual players’ injuries and declined to comment on the Varga situation.)

Varga said he wanted to know more. He reached out to a handful of doctors he knew from Yale and asked for advice.

“They got back to me within five minutes,” he says. “And all of them were like, ‘Don’t take that.’”

What Varga learned: Amantadine was developed to treat Parkinson's disease. Most concussion experts acknowledge the drug is sometimes used to treat concussionlike symptoms, but after hearing from his own doctors, Varga wanted nothing to do with it. The side effects were what scared him most.

“The worst case, they told me, were some psychotic reactions like schizophrenia,” he says. “And you just can’t stop taking it. You up the dosage until you’re symptom-free. That’s my understanding of it. It sounded pretty scary to me.”

So he called the Colts’ team doctor back, told him he wasn’t taking Amantadine and told him why.

“It sounds like you got some good advice,” Varga says the doctor told him. “You should go with your gut.”

So he did. And about 45 minutes later, Varga’s phone buzzed again. The Colts wanted to see him. They were putting him on injured reserve.

‘No one has a tough brain’

The message was clear.

“This is not something to play around with,” Varga said Colts General Manager Ryan Grigson told him that day. “You should take some time off and get your head better. We’re putting you on injured reserve, and we want you back next year.”

That was the end of Varga’s rookie season, in the middle of October. The lingering effects of his concussion would last until late January.

“I totally understand it from a roster perspective,” he says. “It was the right thing to do on their part. I couldn't play."

It took him about another month before he felt comfortable driving home to Canada. When he did, he sought to learn more about why his body was still feeling the effects of a hit he had suffered six weeks before. It’s among the greatest riddles in sports: Some athletes return from a concussion in three days. Some, like NHL star Sidney Crosby, don’t return for 16 months.

Every concussion is different because every brain is different. As the research evolves, so does our understanding.

“We sort of have this cultural understanding that it’s easy, that it’s two weeks at most and you’re back out there,” said Dr. Patrick Kersey, the medical director of USA Football, a former physician for the Colts and a concussion expert with Indianapolis-based St. Vincent Sports Performance. “Like you just press a Staples easy button and move on. But in reality, each concussion is its own individual entity.”

Kersey has worked in sports and studied concussions for decades. He’s seen the tough-guy mantra up close. He knows it oftentimes camouflages the severity of these injuries, and drives athletes to exercise impatience instead of prudence. He knows the dangers that follow.

“That warrior mentality,” Kersey calls it. “With some injuries, players can just tough them out. These are different. A colleague once summed it up like this: ‘You can be a tough person. But no one has a tough brain.’”

Dr. John Leddy, director of the University at Buffalo’s Concussion Management Clinic, is another leading expert in the field. While it’s important to note neither Kersey or Leddy treated Varga, their understanding of the injury paints a broader picture as to how much uncertainty remains. The advice Varga got initially — stay at home in a darkened room until the symptoms go away— is what Leddy calls the “cocoon method.” He doesn’t agree with it.

“That’s starting to fall out of favor,” Leddy said. “It’s important for someone to rest initially, but we know that activity and exercise are good for the brain. It helps it heal and balance the nervous system. When people are having a prolonged recovery, telling them to rest until the symptoms go away is exactly the wrong thing to do.”

Both Kersey and Leddy said that Amantadine is sometimes prescribed to treat concussionlike symptoms, but neither is a staunch believer. “I don’t use it that often,” Leddy said. "I know some people do. What I’ve found is most people stop taking it because of the side effects.”

Because he resisted taking the drug, Varga never had to deal with those side effects. The Colts asked him back to Indianapolis for an on-field workout in early December, almost three months after he’d suffered his concussion. He slipped on shoulder pads and a helmet for the first time since the injury. With the training staff watching, he ran through drills, including hitting the tackling dummies.

Problem was, it stirred up his symptoms. Varga felt awful after the workout.

“Basically I went backwards,” he says. “I came back in the locker room afterwards and some of the guys were like, ‘Why are you doing that? Why do they have you hitting stuff if you’re on injured reserve? I was like, ‘I don’t know.’”

He had more workouts scheduled with the Colts’ training staff for the following day, but refused. “I don’t think it’s a good idea,” he told them. So the Colts flew him back to Canada.

At this point Varga began to wonder if he’d ever get right again — and if he’d ever play football again. One hit? One jarring hit that popped his helmet loose and sent him wobbling to the wrong sideline? That’s all it would take to end his NFL career?

“Scary,” he calls it. “I’d be lying, anybody would be lying, to say that wasn’t a thought that crossed my mind. I just remember thinking, ‘Thank God I went to Yale.’”

The road back

So that’s where he retreated to. Varga took an internship at the Yale Investments Office, working as a financial analyst for three months, and waited for his mind to heal itself. It did. Slowly.

“The internship sort of forced me to think creatively, to think outside of the box, and mentally I started to feel better,” he says. “By February I felt like I could express myself normally again. I was feeling creative again, and that’s something I was really missing before. I was like, ‘Thank God. It’s finally over.'"

He thought long and hard about giving up football for good. In the end, he couldn’t. So he dug into his training, lifting weights and running through auxiliary workouts five days a week. He focused on flexibility and mobility on the other two days.

In his words, he wanted to “fix himself.”

Then there he was, at the Colts’ first voluntary offseason workout in late April, anxious to begin the quest of earning a spot on the 53-man roster for the second consecutive season. He still hasn’t put on the pads. He’s still not sure how his body — and his brain — will respond to contact. It's been seven months since he left the field in Tennessee.

“Obviously it was a hard decision, an extremely hard decision,” he says. “You have to look at both outcomes, and if you don’t, you’re not thinking right.

“But it comes down to this: I’m back here because I wanted to compete again.”

  

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wallysmith
Charter member
7808 posts
Wed Jul-26-17 09:14 AM

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130. "Holy shit Brian Price."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

https://www.clickondetroit.com/news/former-nfl-player-describes-shocking-ypsilanti-township-incident

This video is shocking. Yes, it may not just be CTE but he's also only 28. He was never a knucklehead at UCLA so...

  

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BigJazz
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24443 posts
Wed Jul-26-17 10:32 AM

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131. "i'm glad he didn't get shot"
In response to Reply # 130


  

          


***
I ain't lyin. This shit i'm making up is true...

  

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wallysmith
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7808 posts
Wed Jul-26-17 02:33 PM

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133. "Follow up with the story, including sit down with Brian and his wife..."
In response to Reply # 130


  

          

https://www.clickondetroit.com/news/former-nfl-player-discusses-tremendous-difficulties-of-living-with-symptoms-of-cte

  

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ThaTruth
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99998 posts
Wed Jul-26-17 04:05 PM

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134. "He's lucky to be alive"
In response to Reply # 130


          

________________________________________
"Take the surprise out your voice Shaq."-The REAL CP3
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2H5K-BUMS0

  

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts
Wed Jul-26-17 12:11 PM

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132. "Nope. They just gon be wearing Spaceballs helmets. Too much $$$$"
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____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

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wallysmith
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Thu Jul-27-17 09:01 AM

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135. "While I don't necessarily disagree..."
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... interpreting the letter of the analysis is ignoring the spirit of it. If the NFL's popularity even dipped to approach the levels of the U.S.'s second-favorite sport in 25 years that would still be a tectonic shift.

Viewership is already declining just based on the product of the field but what happens if and when CTE attention reaches critical mass? That's when we'll really see if the NFL can survive in its current form.

  

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pretentious username
Member since Jun 18th 2010
12493 posts
Thu Jul-27-17 05:57 PM

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136. "^^^^^^^^^"
In response to Reply # 135


  

          

The NFL will remain this popular if it can keep replenishing it's pool of talent but that's seeming less and less likely. As others have noted, kids that are great athletes are gravitating toward (or being pushed toward) sports that have less injury risk. Even just anecdotally every parent I know doesn't want their kids playing football. If won't be long before that affects the talent pool. If some of the top talents keep retiring early a la Megatron it's only going to accelerate things.

  

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celery77
Member since Aug 04th 2005
25307 posts
Thu Jul-27-17 08:05 PM

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137. "not upped for the 110 out of 111 ex-NFL brains having CTE? (link)"
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that's why I thought this bounced back to the front -- 99% of donated brains from ex-NFL players (so there's sample selection problems, but still) show signs of CTE. It's not great.

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/sports/large-report-finds-evidence-brain-disease-most-former-football-players-n786386

___________

HOPE!
https://vine.co/v/i7JjIBL3Qix
https://vine.co/v/i7JtqEFwxDu

  

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pretentious username
Member since Jun 18th 2010
12493 posts
Thu Jul-27-17 09:32 PM

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138. "As others mentioned with similar studies: "
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"donated" brains definitely skews results, but it still looks REAL bad. It's particularly damning when they find college and high school players with CTE... yikes.

  

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