Make a choice based on that limited information.

Poll result (16 votes) First (1 votes) Vote Second (3 votes) Vote Third (8 votes) Vote Fourth (2 votes) Vote Fifth (2 votes) Vote

Comedy will tend to be 2 or maybe 3... dramas I feel like often peak even later.

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just talking dramas..
make or break, and even if its not their best season it's where most of the better shows really find their feet.

there are exceptions. I think Snowfall was a middling to good show for 2.75 seasons, and in Season 4 is really turning that corner to something special

Better Call Saul is better than ever but that's a pretty unique situation.

Most of them though... Sopranos, The Shield, Breaking Bad, Succession, Justified, Homeland, Mad Men and a bunch of others i'm sure i left out either came into their own or really started to pop in their second seasons

Even a shitty show like Sons of Anarchy had a good second season.

I look at The Wire...my favorite season is 4 but I could easily be swayed to 3 and I have a lot of love for 1 as well

If you look at a franchise like L&O though...especially the original. It didn't really get GOOD to me til season 5.

Martin...there's something redeemable about each season (though 5 is a STRUGGLE), but I think 3 is where it peaked.

Like after a stellar season, it's quite possible to follow that up with a middling season that they can shrug off as a one off wack turn. And a series can learn from that and get back to form. But if the show continues in the wrong direction for 2 seasons then they don't know how to fix it and then you have them move to a new location and add a new character.


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"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

Sopranos, Mad Men, The Wire, Breaking Bad, Better Call Saul ... there were others I can't recall right now ... all had terrific 3rd seasons and arguably their best.

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if you could only pick one season for dramas and even comedies, S3 would come out on top for most of them (to me).

most shows that peak in S2 aren't good enough to be worth five seasons anyway.

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execute on that vision.

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

The tone and vibe of the show should be well fleshed out by then.

So in S3 you can really kick things into full gear as a writer, I'd imagine.


>RE: If you find your groove by season 2, season 3 is when you can really
>execute on that vision.
>
>**********
>"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then
>they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson
>
>"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

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www.engadgethd.com - the other stuff i'm looking at

And since those are the first two shows I think of with 5 seasons, I went with that.

except for test dream which is probably my least favorite episode of the series.

S4 is flawed but has some gems.

S6 is problematic but i could always watch it.

4 is more than fine when you consider it has episodes like Whitecaps and Whoever Did This. 6A is definitely not up to snuff.

I literally *just* finished my third re-watch (it was my wife's 1st time). And this viewing pretty much solidified S2 as one of my least favorite seasons, definitely near the bottom.

The best season, IMO, is between 1, 3, and 4. It's probably 3.

I remember my first time through the series, being influenced by other folks' opinions of S5 because people were upset it focused so much on the Tony/Carmela dynamic and divorce. I thought S5 was *terrific* this time around. Gandolfini and Falco acted their *asses* off that entire season IMO; it may have been both their best performances.

S6A was really good too IMO. Better than I remembered.

My least favorite (as it always has been) was probably S6B but this time around I found a lot more to like about it than I'd remembered. And besides a brief "WTF" moment when I saw it live, I've always loved the final scene and thought it brilliant.

Terrific show. Not perfect by any means, but still my favorite of all time and it's not particularly close.

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>And this viewing pretty much solidified S2
>as one of my least favorite seasons, definitely near the
>bottom.

this is honestly the first time i've ever heard this opinion lol. i fucking LOVE season 2

... I hated it. It's just not as great as the rest IMO.

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I just love Ralphie as a character, basically.

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I think S2 has the most traditionally "mafia" storylines: Big Pussy's wiretap, Furio's introduction, Richie April coming out of the can, the two dunces Matt and Sean trying to come up...

...balanced by "Sopranos" storylines: Janice's introduction, Chris going to Hollywood, AJ coming of age and rejecting Catholicism, Junior on house arrest

they cram a lot in that season. S3 is my second favorite, behind S5.

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People and critics openly complaining about the meandering nature of the show.

It's got some great episodes though. Whitecaps, Everybody Hurts, Intervention... the "college" episode and University is kind of a Godfather/Goodfellas dynamic. The former from S1 being almost poetic and honorable, the latter being pure savage

You get more unfocused stuff like the HUD, ep (black criminals on the Sopranos were always pretty cringy), What they did to Furio was pretty jarring. He came to town as the coldest one and they turned him into this sensitive romance novel guy out of nowhere, and Carm being into him came out of nowhere, Tony's ominous trailer scene in the turning out to be over a horse...truly none of these things really stand out as all that bad on a rewatch but I remember some of them being jarring at the time

I never read critics' thoughts about S4 but I probably should. Cuz I don't really disagree with much of what you said below; it is kind of meandering - at least relative to the seasons that came before it - and a lot of those specific plot points you mentioned *are* jarring now that you write them out like that.

But as you mentioned, White Caps/Everybody Hurts/Intervention/University ... those are ALL among the very best episodes in the show's run. So perhaps that, on some level (along with my aforementioned affection for Ralph as a character) is why I've always held S4 in such high regard. All 4 of those episodes are arguably top 10 Sopranos episodes.

But again I agree with most everything you said below in regards to the jarring plotpoints as well. Specifically the Furio 180. That shit was crazy and still doesn't make a ton of sense. You're right, he was cold as HELL when he first came on. Then he kinda went quiet and suddenly in S4 he's Pepe Le Pew.

The one point you made that I will disagree with though, related to the Furio plotline, is that the Carmela stuff came out of nowhere. They'd planted seeds about her vengeful wandering eye twice before that (with the priest then the carpenter guy working on her house) so I don't necessarily agree that it came out of nowhere. Maybe you mean re: Furio specifically, but I still wouldn't really agree with that - the Sopranos introduced several storylines throughout its run that seemingly developed behind the scenes, out of the view of us as viewers. So I didn't find the introduction of Carm's feelings for Furio, especially considering they were introduced in the first episode of a new season, to be especially jarring or out of nowhere.


>People and critics openly complaining about the meandering
>nature of the show.
>
>It's got some great episodes though. Whitecaps, Everybody
>Hurts, Intervention... the "college" episode and University is
>kind of a Godfather/Goodfellas dynamic. The former from S1
>being almost poetic and honorable, the latter being pure
>savage
>
>You get more unfocused stuff like the HUD, ep (black criminals
>on the Sopranos were always pretty cringy), What they did to
>Furio was pretty jarring. He came to town as the coldest one
>and they turned him into this sensitive romance novel guy out
>of nowhere, and Carm being into him came out of nowhere,
>Tony's ominous trailer scene in the turning out to be over a
>horse...truly none of these things really stand out as all
>that bad on a rewatch but I remember some of them being
>jarring at the time

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Since Ralphie goes out in S4, could be argued 3 was more his season? Agreed on his character overall. The casting seemed so weird at first but it works so well.

>The one point you made that I will disagree with though,
>related to the Furio plotline, is that the Carmela stuff came
>out of nowhere. They'd planted seeds about her vengeful
>wandering eye twice before that (with the priest then the
>carpenter guy working on her house) so I don't necessarily
>agree that it came out of nowhere. Maybe you mean re: Furio
>specifically, but I still wouldn't really agree with that -
>the Sopranos introduced several storylines throughout its run
>that seemingly developed behind the scenes, out of the view of
>us as viewers. So I didn't find the introduction of Carm's
>feelings for Furio, especially considering they were
>introduced in the first episode of a new season, to be
>especially jarring or out of nowhere.

That's fair. I was mostly put off by what they did to him, but Carm being into Furio in anything other than looks felt a bit forced. Carm LOVES her status as the bosses wife, and she's gonna suddenly be in love with the enforcer/driver? I could see Roe doing some shit like that. Suppose I'm overthinking it though because its not like these things don't happen. Plus if you're attracted enough you can tell yourself anything.

Its Furio's end that bugged me more because he kind of lived up to her idealized version of him which i found weird. aside from them abruptly softening him up i just don't see why he was in love with Carmela. The way Furio started out in the states, he seemed more like a cold hearted fuck that would probably have been creepily eyeing Maedo

Its a storyline I always struggled with but it's ultimately worth it because Whitecaps is so good. Also, Furio briefly considering killing Tony.

>Since Ralphie goes out in S4, could be argued 3 was more his
>season? Agreed on his character overall. The casting seemed so
>weird at first but it works so well.
>
>>The one point you made that I will disagree with though,
>>related to the Furio plotline, is that the Carmela stuff
>came
>>out of nowhere. They'd planted seeds about her vengeful
>>wandering eye twice before that (with the priest then the
>>carpenter guy working on her house) so I don't necessarily
>>agree that it came out of nowhere. Maybe you mean re: Furio
>>specifically, but I still wouldn't really agree with that -
>>the Sopranos introduced several storylines throughout its
>run
>>that seemingly developed behind the scenes, out of the view
>of
>>us as viewers. So I didn't find the introduction of Carm's
>>feelings for Furio, especially considering they were
>>introduced in the first episode of a new season, to be
>>especially jarring or out of nowhere.
>
>That's fair. I was mostly put off by what they did to him, but
>Carm being into Furio in anything other than looks felt a bit
>forced. Carm LOVES her status as the bosses wife, and she's
>gonna suddenly be in love with the enforcer/driver? I could
>see Roe doing some shit like that. Suppose I'm overthinking it
>though because its not like these things don't happen. Plus if
>you're attracted enough you can tell yourself anything.
>
>Its Furio's end that bugged me more because he kind of lived
>up to her idealized version of him which i found weird. aside
>from them abruptly softening him up i just don't see why he
>was in love with Carmela. The way Furio started out in the
>states, he seemed more like a cold hearted fuck that would
>probably have been creepily eyeing Maedo
>
>Its a storyline I always struggled with but it's ultimately
>worth it because Whitecaps is so good. Also, Furio briefly
>considering killing Tony.

LOL yea I totally hear you, it was definitely a 180 on Furio's character. This time around I was actually more shocked at just how cold he was when he came around in S2,e because my memory of him from the first two times I watched was the latter, softer version of Furio from S4. So yea, I agree that it was a really weird plot turn with him.

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>RE: there isn't a bad season

... I only mean that it's not my favorite. But I still love it and think it's great. Because they all are. lol


>I think S2 has the most traditionally "mafia" storylines: Big
>Pussy's wiretap, Furio's introduction, Richie April coming out
>of the can, the two dunces Matt and Sean trying to come up...

Yep - all really good storyline.


>...balanced by "Sopranos" storylines: Janice's introduction,
>Chris going to Hollywood, AJ coming of age and rejecting
>Catholicism, Junior on house arrest

See I hate Janice with the heat of a trillion suns, so that doesn't help my thoughts about it.

I also noticed the one major inconsistency in the storytelling: at the end of S1 Tony mentioned that they'd sold his mother's house. In S2 he claims it's still on the market and there's no explanation for what happened to that initial buyer. So that annoyed me. Probably more than it should have haha but it stuck out in what was otherwise a near-flawless show in terms of writing and storytelling/consistency.


>they cram a lot in that season. S3 is my second favorite,
>behind S5.

Wow so S5 is your favorite ? I don't think I'd ever heard that from anyone. But I love it, too.

Come to think of it I don't think I've ever actually ranked the seasons. I love them all so I just kinda speak in generalities (i.e. "near the bottom") rather than trying to parse it out. I still don't know if I could.

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>See I hate Janice with the heat of a trillion suns, so that
>doesn't help my thoughts about it.

but through re-watches I appreciate her a *lot* more. she is such a great counterpoint to Tony, while embodying his flaws to the ugliest degree.

>Wow so S5 is your favorite ? I don't think I'd ever heard that
>from anyone. But I love it, too.

S5 is so good to me. it has the great main story arcs (Tony and Carm's separation, the end of Chris and Adriana, Tony and Tony, the end of the tenuous peace between New York and Jersey) while every episode is very self-contained and remarkable on its own.

and S5 has the best closings.

Chris driving alone after spending the weekend with both Tonys, followed by Tony inciting another Janice breakdown and walking into the distance smirking ("Cold Cuts" is a top ten episode to me).

Carm in tears watching Tony in the pool while Meadow tells her she's getting engaged.

Tony and Junior sitting on the couch -- "don't you love me?"

Tony and Carm hooking up after her dad's birthday party, followed immediately by Tony B setting off a war.

Tony, Carmelo, Christopher and Adriana all eating dinner together at Vesuvio after Tony and Adriana's car crash, in a total Godfather moment.

Tony ending the season running from the Feds and being the "returning bear" from the woods.

got damn, I'm gonna go watch S5 now...

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in cold cuts was such an immature dirtbag move and I think I felt about as much joy as Tony did when he did it.

The release of all the prisoners in S5 was a great touch. Even cutting Feech short as the season's main foil turned out to be a solid move.

>in cold cuts was such an immature dirtbag move and I think I
>felt about as much joy as Tony did when he did it.

That shit was coooooooold.


>The release of all the prisoners in S5 was a great touch. Even
>cutting Feech short as the season's main foil turned out to be
>a solid move.

Oh hell yea - I agree completely. And the way they did it was awesome too. "Fuuuuuck you Feech it's fuckin parkin'" that line has always cracked me up.

Paulie's tree-worker beatdown stands out too lol.

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>but through re-watches I appreciate her a *lot* more. she is
>such a great counterpoint to Tony, while embodying his flaws
>to the ugliest degree.

Really good point. I hated her but she was a *terrific* character. And (blanking on actress name) absolutely snapped in that role. In a show overflowing with perfect actor/character marriages, Janice stands out for sure.


>S5 is so good to me. it has the great main story arcs (Tony
>and Carm's separation, the end of Chris and Adriana, Tony and
>Tony, the end of the tenuous peace between New York and
>Jersey) while every episode is very self-contained and
>remarkable on its own.
>
>and S5 has the best closings.
>
>Chris driving alone after spending the weekend with both
>Tonys, followed by Tony inciting another Janice breakdown and
>walking into the distance smirking ("Cold Cuts" is a top ten
>episode to me).
>
>Carm in tears watching Tony in the pool while Meadow tells her
>she's getting engaged.
>
>Tony and Junior sitting on the couch -- "don't you love me?"
>
>Tony and Carm hooking up after her dad's birthday party,
>followed immediately by Tony B setting off a war.
>
>Tony, Carmelo, Christopher and Adriana all eating dinner
>together at Vesuvio after Tony and Adriana's car crash, in a
>total Godfather moment.
>
>Tony ending the season running from the Feds and being the
>"returning bear" from the woods.
>
>got damn, I'm gonna go watch S5 now...

LOL - yea you're right. I definitely subconsciously noticed this trend watching S5 this time around, now that you put it all in writing. Those were all fucking *powerful* closings. And they make you fiend the next episode. The whole series was pretty good with that IMO But S5 definitely stands out.

The more I think about it, I think S5 is top-tier as well. I've never actually ranked the seasons but I think that in the past, I was influenced by other folks' negative opinions about S5 and just flippantly said it was lower tier when asked. But I absolutely *loved* it this time around.

Fuck it. Gonna try now.

S3
S1
S5
S4
S6A
S2
S6B

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