Like at what exact point did we realize
They were making this shit up as they
Went along and didn't have nothing set
Up past the pilot?
Do most serial shows have every episode
Mapped out in advance
or do they wing it and write and plan a few out
And add on as they get there?

life always offers you a 2nd chance...it's called tomorrow. use it wisely

and specifically after ben was introduced.

Stay strong

Lexx

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life always offers you a 2nd chance...it's called tomorrow. use it wisely

That's when it got REALLY apparent, all this shit was just baloney.

********************************

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then it was less about surviving as a whole

Stay strong

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he was good and all but the shows raw premise was lost

Stay strong

Lexx

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The Others don't really work without a fearless leader, one who manipulated even them to his own ends. Too many cooks happens when we get MIB/Locke, Widmore, Ben, Jacob's ghost, Lennon, Samurai Guy (forgot his name), I mean... too many cooks came waaaaaay later.

-Sig-

“Why didn’t you do this in your own god damn country?"

-All Stah's view on undocumented immigrants wanting to be treated like human beings.

they were mythical. Ben sort of set them up to be just regular ass people. That's my whole point. After his entrance we had a different kind of mystery, one that wasn't based on the fear of the unknown anymore

Stay strong

Lexx

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that the scene where desmond is like "i think i crashed your plane brotha" is still like my biggest "whoa" moment ever on a tv show.

ok maybe with the exception of the breaking bad "run" scene.

but still tho...i loved lost from beginning to end. was it flawed? sure. but it's still the most fun i've ever had watching a tv show.


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>i loved lost from beginning to end. was it
>flawed? sure. but it's still the most fun i've ever had
>watching a tv show.

_
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but afterwards it was tough realizing the whole thing was pointless.

they had no plan, they changed the plot 25 times, and they never really explained what the island was.

in the end I'm not sure it was worth the time I invested in it.

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>that the scene where desmond is like "i think i crashed your
>plane brotha" is still like my biggest "whoa" moment ever on a
>tv show.

yeah that was such a great moment.

___________________

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I thoroughly enjoyed the WOW of that ending, but starting immediately at the beginning of the final season, every single moment seemed dedicated to "let me answer all of these questions in a painful, stilted, let-me-spell-it-out-for-you manner."

Also, the Jacob flashback episode is easily the worst episode in the series. That might be the REAL moment right there.

But I simply like to pretend the final season never happened.

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and brought him back all grown & shit

unless it's some kind of gary coleman situation, kids don't stay kids for multiple flashback-heavy seasons

that's when i figured they hadn't really thought this thing through

i shoulda just listened to rjcc from jump

***************************************
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***************************************

>and brought him back all grown & shit
>

That's what happened? Im glad I stopped watching mid second season lol.

the end of season 2 into season 3 was pretty damn awesome.


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Well, one question answered... but only if that question was "does Jack have a son?!"

I think they went back and re-wrote the entire show based on his departure. Also agree with the Walt thing. You will never convince me that he wasn't one of the most important characters, but they had to dump him for continuity's sake once he hit puberty.

You know what, it's still one of the best shows ever. That last season didn't negate all the enjoyment I had watching the previous seasons.

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the island acts as a damn time warp! they really couldn't figure out how to work that one out?

and yeah building Walt up as one of the most important characters/links to the mystery of the island and then dropping his storyline was a huge fuck-up.

___________________

Mar-A-Lago delenda est

>I think they went back and re-wrote the entire show based on
>his departure. Also agree with the Walt thing. You will never
>convince me that he wasn't one of the most important
>characters, but they had to dump him for continuity's sake
>once he hit puberty.


I think once they had to work around those two issues and 'pulled it off' (using that term loosely) they just kinda winged everything else.

Just one of the most chilling moments really I've ever seen on a TV show.

Unfortunately, when they dragged it out the next season and he became roughly the size of a high school basketball player, that showed a lack of foresight. I refuse to believe they couldn't have found a satisfying way to tie up the "Walt has powers" storyline.

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Walt, or what they were gonna do with him. having no idea WTF was going on any more than Walt, Michael or Sawyer did during that scene made it that much more chilling.

>Just one of the most chilling moments really I've ever seen
>on a TV show.
>
>Unfortunately, when they dragged it out the next season and he
>became roughly the size of a high school basketball player,
>that showed a lack of foresight. I refuse to believe they
>couldn't have found a satisfying way to tie up the "Walt has
>powers" storyline.

dude, the island acts as a time warp! how hard would it be to explain Walt shooting up overnight when they had all that time warp/time travel stuff going on all over the place? just inexplicable how they blew that storyline so badly.

___________________

Mar-A-Lago delenda est

despicable ambiguous horseshit of an explanation - they could have said the island was like a gateway or holding area before they went into purgatory or something damn!...lol
__________________________________________________________
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Wasn't at all necessary to explain it. Somethings are better left as mystery.


**********
"naive as the dry leaves on the ground looking past the trees to the blue sky asking 'why me?'" -Blu

They should've accepted that nothing was going to be satisfying and just kept focusing on the characters and the mood instead of insisting hand-over-foot that answers were coming.

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to me, all the explanation I needed was in the last season when Jacob held the bottle of liquid to Richard and talked about the island keeping the 'evil' from getting out (smoke monster). I thought that was perfect - it was simple and made me satisfied with the current scenario.

But then, a few episodes later, the story of Jacob and his brother is revealed and the smoke monster is revealed to simply be a mistake caused by Jacob, completely negating the previous analogy, which set my mind back to square 1.

One of the things that really bugged me about the show was I couldn't figure out why we were supposed to be seeing the smokey guy as the 'baddie'. All he wanted to do is leave the island, which is all our heroes wanted to do, so we're just supposed to accept he's the villain for some reason. He was right though - he was there by accident, his mother is murdered in arguably the show's most chilling scene, and he's kept there against his will under the pretense of lies. And he's the bad guy why??

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>Do most serial shows have every episode
>Mapped out in advance
>or do they wing it and write and plan a few out
>And add on as they get there?

I think most shows like this have the first season mapped out so they can pitch it in it's entirety. After that there is no promise the show will be back.

This is why so many shows come in with an amazing first season then have no where to go.


_____________________
<---- At least we have this

so as a writer it's tough.

you have to write as if it's your last season AND as if it's a plot that will continue.

________________

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Pitching a high-concept TV show should require that you have a concept when you pitch it.

Heroes fell victim to this as well.

<--- Big Baller World Order

Yeah I noticed storylines were abandoned for no apparent reason (Walt, prenancy issue) but I was hype as hell when they got the band back together to go back to the island. But once they got back nothing that happened after that made any sense.

**********
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when Ben became the focus of the show or the main conflict, instead of the island & the mysteries themselves.

when Jacob become more prominent yet was still never really explained (except for one episode), nor did we learn what the island actually was.

There was also the point at which we learned the Island was an eternal struggle of good vs evil, so the Dharma era of the island's history was just a blip in the historical length of its existence.

therefore we spent like 4 seasons being completely focused on the Dharma era yet in "reality" it only represented a very small period of the island's history.

then they largely abandoned the Dharma plot point anyway.

So were we supposed to be focusing on Ben/Dharma/Penny's Dad/all that shit or on Eternal Good v Evil/Jacob v his brother?

The answer is: neither, really.

________________

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there is no other argument.

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Just bad writing too, really. It's impossible to sustain excitement with your main characters in cages.

If they wanted to show us the inside of the Others' operation, have Jack imprisoned and the others trying to free him or something. Don't imprison so many people.

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WHERE THE SHOW IS GOING

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Maybe you can blame it on the writer's strike.

But it wasn't until the first half of season 3 that I thought "These guys don't have the slightest idea where to go with this story."

>Like at what exact point did we realize
>They were making this shit up as they
>Went along and didn't have nothing set
>Up past the pilot?
>Do most serial shows have every episode
>Mapped out in advance
>or do they wing it and write and plan a few out
>And add on as they get there?

didnt read all of the posts so i'm sure there are similar experiences as mine...

in my house, my wife and i watched season 1 and liked it.
we both watched season 2 and liked** it too....BUT...

**my wife (a chemist/scientist type) liked and was intrigued enough by the questions to continue. I, on the other hand, became suspicious at that point that they were starting to make things up as they went. i felt like they didnt really have a long term mapping of the various cans of worms they had begun to open....so, after season 2 i bailed. (i may have watched an ep or two of season 3 but thats it.

My wife on the other hand stayed invested throughout. She had faith (like so many) that the writers were meticulously mapping the always expanding plotlines, questions, theories, historical, scientific and spiritual/religious references in an intentional way that, if a viewer took the time to piece together the zillions of 'clues', a viewer could 'figure it all out' whatever 'it' was...

My wife and her work crew would research discuss their different theories and stuff...scientific theories, mythological metaphors, etc etc...

so yeah she was all in.
but even though I am one who LOVES 'figure it out' movies and stuff, i was out after season 2 because i just felt like they (the writers) actually DIDNT have it figured out and were just throwing sheet out there .

so after 7 years, when the last season finally came, (the season finale specifically) i sat with my wife and watched it with her.


her reaction?

well..let me explain it this way....

to this day, you do NOT mention "Lost" in our house without risking an eye cutting evil look from the mrs...

...she no likey the wrap-up...

for many reasons, she felt jilted, duped, ripped off.

while she is definitely ok with spiritual elements too, and appreciated the characterizational elements throughout the series...i think, coming from her scientific background, in the end she ALSO wanted SOME kind of tangible resolution to some of the 'seemingly' solid physical island mysteries (which i dont blame her for wanting at least SOMETHING in that regard)...but she got none of that....

she's STILL bitter over that sheet....

she blames Damon Lindelof for her not enjoying Prometheus as much as she could have. (Ironically, I liked Prometheus and i actually have faith that, with Prometheus, there IS a mapped out plan/resolution...but my faith in that is really based on Ridley Scotts involvement.) My wife on the other hand, still salty from the Lost issue, has NO faith in Prometheus's 'big picture storyline being reslolved ' due to Lindelof's involvement...

so, she admits now that I was right about my "Lost is making that crap up as they go..." theory after season 2...
She thinks she is right about her "Do NOT invest any extra energy trying to figure out the answers to some of the questions Prometheus poses, Lindelof is just throwing ideas out there with no real overarching end-game"...

ahh well...we'll see how THAT one ends up....

or will we?

�
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RIP David Williams:

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Lindelof was involved with the writing it immediately LOST(pun intended) points with me, I still enjoyed it though even if it had some flaws that were discussed on the boards already...lol
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... of unexplained/dangling plot points. I'm still curious about the 4 toed statue, Hurley and Libby being in the same asylum , why claire couldn't give the baby up for adoption, and why Smokey didn't kill Locke or Abedisi the first time he met them?

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I wanted the asylum explained but also who her husband was, who died before she gave Desmond the boat to sail round the world on. I used to think it would be revealed to be the guy that Sun was having the affair with but the timings of that were about 3 years in between each other so it couldn't have been him.

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once abc tried to make it water cooler again for the final season, I should have known.