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Subject: "Eyes Wide Shut [1999]" Previous topic | Next topic
Wordup
Member since Mar 03rd 2006
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Fri Feb-29-08 06:20 AM

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"Poll question: Eyes Wide Shut [1999]"


  

          

Saw it, not sure how I feel about this one.

Poll result (46 votes)
I like it (28 votes)Vote
I dont like it (18 votes)Vote

  

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
One of the worst films ever made. Don't fight it.
Feb 29th 2008
1
Said it all...
Feb 29th 2008
2
It got a strong reaction out of you though
Feb 29th 2008
3
      Not true. My mind holds onto stuff like that.
Feb 29th 2008
4
           lol
Feb 29th 2008
6
           But I have good dreams about Rosario Dawson's titties tho.
Feb 29th 2008
10
                ^^^^^^ Real talk right there.
Mar 04th 2008
59
That shit was shit...just TERRIBLE
Feb 29th 2008
5
The only thing worse than the movie...
Feb 29th 2008
7
It was ok... not terrible not good either
Feb 29th 2008
8
people say this man (Stanley) got killed for doing this movie...
Feb 29th 2008
9
Fucked up way to go.
Feb 29th 2008
13
      if the legend WAS true, he did succeed...
Feb 29th 2008
16
What the fuck was this movie really about though????
Feb 29th 2008
11
Dog, I've made people cry debating this film.
Feb 29th 2008
12
I think the little piano theme creeps people out
Feb 29th 2008
14
      lol @ this...
Mar 02nd 2008
45
Its pretty straight forward
Feb 29th 2008
15
its about a souped up vision of infiltration into a
Feb 29th 2008
17
      Yeah the Illuminati angle is interesting
Feb 29th 2008
21
I thought we alread had this post on why Kubrick made this...but..
Feb 29th 2008
18
Doesn't matter. The movie sucks.
Feb 29th 2008
19
why dont you write kubrick a letter?
Feb 29th 2008
20
Wow, What Amazing Heights In Bullshit That Writer Manages To Reach
Feb 29th 2008
22
Niggas are voting 'I like it' to personally antagonize me
Feb 29th 2008
23
rojo
Feb 29th 2008
24
RE: Eyes Wide Shut [1999]
Feb 29th 2008
25
Alright, I'll say it, it's a great movie.
Feb 29th 2008
26
RE: Alright, I'll say it, it's a great movie.
Feb 29th 2008
27
Well said.
Feb 29th 2008
28
LOL @ O_E having cats defensive and scared
Feb 29th 2008
29
      The best offense is a good defense, innit?
Feb 29th 2008
30
           Um. No.
Feb 29th 2008
31
                RE: Um. No.
Feb 29th 2008
32
                     Tsk, Tsk -- i hate seeing two of my favorite posters go at it like this.
Mar 04th 2008
57
*sits in post solely to watch O_E rip people up*
Mar 01st 2008
33
that's pretty limiting, isn't it?
Mar 01st 2008
34
The story doesn't have to be conventional or linear.
Mar 01st 2008
36
      You just described half of the "great" films of this year
Mar 01st 2008
38
           I wasn't emotionally removed from ANY of those characters.
Mar 01st 2008
39
I also thought that Aceyalone's Book Of Human Language
Mar 01st 2008
35
RE: Garbage
Mar 01st 2008
37
It's brilliant because of the message, not the director and not the stor...
Mar 01st 2008
40
General rule: If you HAVE to study to like it, it's not a good film.
Mar 01st 2008
41
ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
Mar 01st 2008
42
I mean, I don't go to the movies to get homework assignments.
Mar 01st 2008
43
      This is precisely why I use the term "Latte" so much.
Mar 01st 2008
44
hmmm
Mar 03rd 2008
47
      Occult symbolism
Mar 03rd 2008
48
           interesting stuff
Mar 03rd 2008
49
           Dude, 'Eyes Wide Shut' was about the compromise of 1877
Mar 03rd 2008
50
                that's the most hilarious joke I've ever read
Mar 03rd 2008
51
                     ^^^PROFOUND
Mar 03rd 2008
54
           RE: Occult symbolism
Mar 03rd 2008
52
                see now
Mar 03rd 2008
53
dug it
Mar 03rd 2008
46
The climax sucked
Mar 04th 2008
55
Or it could be that the whole movie sucked.
Mar 04th 2008
56
Why did I always feel that I was seeing everything except the actual sto...
Mar 04th 2008
58
So that settles it...
Mar 04th 2008
60

Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52927 posts
Fri Feb-29-08 07:19 AM

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1. "One of the worst films ever made. Don't fight it."
In response to Reply # 0
Fri Feb-29-08 07:20 AM by Orbit_Established

  

          

People want it to be brilliant and artful because
its a Stanley Kubrick film. It isn't and isn't. There's no
grand meaning to it, and isn't about anything worthwhile.

Not to mention that watching Nicole and Tom act high
is one of the most retarded things I've ever seen. The
acting was horrifying.

It sucks. Terribly.





----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"

  

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Ausar72
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Fri Feb-29-08 08:51 AM

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2. "Said it all..."
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

>People want it to be brilliant and artful because
>its a Stanley Kubrick film. It isn't and isn't. There's no
>grand meaning to it, and isn't about anything worthwhile.
>
>Not to mention that watching Nicole and Tom act high
>is one of the most retarded things I've ever seen. The
>acting was horrifying.
>
>It sucks. Terribly.


>----------------------------
>
>
>O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.
>
>
>
>"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."
>
>(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"


...

my thoughts,

peace.


----------------------------------
"BE, not foolish, as temporary king of the mountaintop."
-Com's Pops, BE 2006

  

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Deebot
Member since Oct 21st 2004
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Fri Feb-29-08 10:28 AM

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3. "It got a strong reaction out of you though"
In response to Reply # 1


          

Some might say the horrible movies you don't remember at all are the worst.

Eyes Wide Shut is pretty damn bad, just sayin

  

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
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Fri Feb-29-08 10:43 AM

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4. "Not true. My mind holds onto stuff like that."
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

>Some might say the horrible movies you don't remember at all
>are the worst.
>
>Eyes Wide Shut is pretty damn bad, just sayin


I still have nightmares about 'Alexander'



----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"

  

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Deebot
Member since Oct 21st 2004
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Fri Feb-29-08 11:17 AM

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6. "lol"
In response to Reply # 4


          

  

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
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Fri Feb-29-08 12:10 PM

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10. "But I have good dreams about Rosario Dawson's titties tho."
In response to Reply # 4


  

          

For beer lovers: http://thebeertravelguide.com
For movie lovers: http://russellhainline.com

  

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jadedeejay
Member since Sep 22nd 2006
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59. "^^^^^^ Real talk right there."
In response to Reply # 10


  

          


"Fuck the streets!"

-?uestlove

www.myspace.com/djjedi1

  

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jwhorl
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Fri Feb-29-08 11:08 AM

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5. "That shit was shit...just TERRIBLE"
In response to Reply # 0


          

  

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gmltheone
Member since Jun 11th 2003
8564 posts
Fri Feb-29-08 12:00 PM

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7. "The only thing worse than the movie..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

People trying to convince you how good that piece of shit really was.


----------------------------
It's on!

  

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SammyJankis
Member since Jan 29th 2003
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Fri Feb-29-08 12:04 PM

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8. "It was ok... not terrible not good either"
In response to Reply # 0
Fri Feb-29-08 12:05 PM by SammyJankis

  

          

just alright.

___

And who are you; the proud lord said, that I must bow so low?

www.twitter.com/JayTeeDee

www.juwandickerson.com

  

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The3rdOne
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Fri Feb-29-08 12:07 PM

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9. "people say this man (Stanley) got killed for doing this movie..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

obviously he was trying to say something in it, wether it be a conspiracy theory or not.

EWS was not my kind of flick, but I kinda like John Carpenter's "They Live" Not because of the flick itself, but I like what Carpenter was trying to depict

  

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
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Fri Feb-29-08 01:13 PM

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13. "Fucked up way to go."
In response to Reply # 9


  

          

>obviously he was trying to say something in it, wether it be
>a conspiracy theory or not.

Well he didn't succeed.

It sucked.


----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"

  

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The3rdOne
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Fri Feb-29-08 02:54 PM

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16. "if the legend WAS true, he did succeed..."
In response to Reply # 13


  

          

...if they gonna cancel you over some shit like that.

  

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BLACK_ADAM
Member since Mar 21st 2006
4791 posts
Fri Feb-29-08 12:13 PM

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11. "What the fuck was this movie really about though????"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I watched it and was like: WTF is really going on?!?! Is there something I'm not getting? Everyone is saying this shit is highbrow and I'm just not seeing it?!?!


Can somebody that liked this shit tell me the "why's and what fors...." I would like to be able to say that I didn't waste my time watching this....


"If you want what they GOT then go GET it...It's all GAT!" - MF DOOM

  

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
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12. "Dog, I've made people cry debating this film."
In response to Reply # 11


  

          


One review in USA Today called it "an epiphany on
screen." Another I read said it had "magisterial vision."

It wasn't about anything. It sucked.

People don't think for themselves and think they
are supposed to like Kubrick films, which are supposed
to be profound.

Problem is, this wasn't.

  

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Deebot
Member since Oct 21st 2004
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Fri Feb-29-08 01:51 PM

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14. "I think the little piano theme creeps people out"
In response to Reply # 12


          

so they buy into the weirdness and everything.

Because really, all I remember from that movie is the piano and tits

  

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al_sharp
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45. "lol @ this..."
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

>Because really, all I remember from that movie is the piano
>and tits

me too.


www.myspace.com/shamelessplug
www.myspace.com/dumhi
www.myspace.com/shamelessplug2
www.myspace.com/theyesyesyalls

avy: painting by felix (www.myspace.com/pheelix)

  

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Wordup
Member since Mar 03rd 2006
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Fri Feb-29-08 02:15 PM

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15. "Its pretty straight forward"
In response to Reply # 11


  

          

>I watched it and was like: WTF is really going on?!?! Is
>there something I'm not getting? Everyone is saying this shit
>is highbrow and I'm just not seeing it?!?!
>
>
>Can somebody that liked this shit tell me the "why's and what
>fors...." I would like to be able to say that I didn't waste
>my time watching this....
>
>
>"If you want what they GOT then go GET it...It's all GAT!" -
>MF DOOM



it was about the doctor being able to pay 50 dollars to the lady at McDonalds for going out her way to give him extra ketchup packets

because he's a doctor, you know

  

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The3rdOne
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17. "its about a souped up vision of infiltration into a"
In response to Reply # 11


  

          

secret society sex ritual with hoes off the streets. That's all.

AND

Nicole Kidman takes 5 mins to say the phrase "let's fuck" at the end.

  

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Wordup
Member since Mar 03rd 2006
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Fri Feb-29-08 04:39 PM

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21. "Yeah the Illuminati angle is interesting"
In response to Reply # 17
Fri Feb-29-08 04:39 PM by Wordup

  

          

>secret society sex ritual with hoes off the streets. That's
>all.
>
>AND
>
>Nicole Kidman takes 5 mins to say the phrase "let's fuck" at
>the end.
>
>

  

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The3rdOne
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18. "I thought we alread had this post on why Kubrick made this...but.."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Read this swipe...

http://www.gettingit.com/article/136

"If I told you their names, I don't think you'd sleep so well." -- Sydney Pollack, "Eyes Wide Shut"

To claim Stanley Kubrick -- arguably the finest film director ever -- was a major 20th century figure is an understatement. In a just world, his death this March would have received the same media attention as was unnecessarily heaped upon pea-brained pretty boy John-John's demise.

... from October 4, 1999 It's nice to know that some conspiracy lovers -- ready to challenge official reality -- question if Kubrick died from natural causes or was assassinated. It's quite refreshing, actually, after hearing countless theories over whether the supposedly significant death of JFK Jr. was really murder (amusing in its assumption that the "mastermind" behind wimpy political rag George was somehow a threat to the power structure).

Kubrick's swan song, Eyes Wide Shut, reveals kinky sex-magick and suspicious slayings that, in retrospect, hardly seem like Tom Cruise blockbuster material. Conspiracy rumors argue the film earned Kubrick his death certificate: Considering his career of anti-authoritarian auteurship, it may be a lifetime achievement award.

If anyone deserved to be whacked by The Man, it was Kubrick. Oliver Stone gets the "conspiracy" smear for his flick about the death of John-John's daddy, but it's Kubrick who was the true cinematic expositor of the secret and suppressed. It's incredible he was allowed to keep a camera.

His career was one of unequaled subversion: the anti-war Paths of Glory (1957), the homoerotic slave revolt celebration Spartacus (1960), and the mockery of the dark military machine Dr. Strangelove (1964). He warned of things to come way ahead of the curve: Lolita (1962) was a sexual taboo-smasher, 2001 (1968) anticipated Von Daniken's Ancient Astronaut craze, and A Clockwork Orange (1971) predicted the violently grim Brave New World Order police state.

Some also allege Kubrick filmed NASA's faked "moon landings" and wrote the "script" for the Apollo 13 disaster/hoax. This is unlikely -- not because the theory is far-fetched, but because the camera work on the moon landing lacked Kubrick's unique style.

Eyes Wide Shut, a sexual thriller about the decadent underbelly of the rich and powerful, has a creepiness that chills almost as much as his 1980 work The Shining. The film's highlight (besides showing Nicole Kidman naked) is a masked-ball orgy into which Cruise's character sneaks, barely evading punishment when his uninvited entry is discovered. What follows is an Antonioni-esque Blow-Up mystery: Are the death and the disappearance that follow cabalistic revenge killings? Or are they merely two unrelated events that randomly follow his attempted deception? Is it coincidence or conspiracy? The film presents no definite proof, but implies the events are indeed linked.

In light of Kubrick's death, watching a film in which two likely murders are explained away without investigation is disturbing. Kubrick warns that anyone who reveals upper-crust secrets can be snuffed without punishment. Was he predicting (and warning of) his own farewell?

Kubrick wouldn't be alone: As Uri Dowbenko's film review on Steamshovel Press noted, Mozart died soon after he revealed Masonic mysteries in "The Magic Flute," Stephen Knight, who wrote about Freemasonry and the Jack the Ripper slayings in two books, died mysteriously while working on a third, and 19th-century author William Morgan appears to have been murdered after he exposed Masonic activities.

The last major film to reveal occult secrets like Eyes Wide Shut was Roman Polanski's Rosemary's Baby. Soon after its release, Polanski's lover and unborn child were slaughtered by Manson's occult "family," and he was later run out of the States. (Polanski screwing a 13-year-old girl didn't help.)

The sex rituals in Kubrick's film appear inspired by the Hellfire Club, an 18th-century British Masonic offshoot founded by Sir Francis Dashwood. Founding Father (and high-ranking Freemason) Benjamin Franklin is said to have engaged regularly in these Satanic orgies. More recently, self-proclaimed Great Beast Aleister Crowley created similar rituals for his Masonic-inspired Ordo Templi Orientis (OTO).

Crowley's top American prot�g�, JPL rocket scientist Jack Parsons, was befriended by future Scientology founder L. Ron Hubbard in the late 1940's. Hubbard supposedly admired Crowley obsessively, and some researchers claim secret Church of Scientology trainings are heavily influenced by OTO rites. Some Kubrick rumors note Cruise and Kidman are famous Scientologists, though the connection seems tenuous.

Is there anything to this? Was Kubrick knocked off? Perhaps. But maybe the truth is even stranger. Rumors swirled around A.I., another proposed Kubrick project. Officially, the idea was shelved, yet others allege it was being filmed, and it would continue over a 20-year period, using a young actor who would age over the years during filming. Certainly this was a fascinating concept, and the rumors even reached print in Wired.

Perhaps Kubrick did start this project, and, as he desired to keep it in utmost secrecy, faked his own death. That way, the film could continue without scrutiny, as any future A.I. rumors could be dismissed like crackpot Elvis sightings. Indeed, perhaps Kubrick is hanging out with Elvis right now (along with Jim Morrison, Hitler and Andy Kaufman, all on that secret island famous people go to after faking their death), while he slowly finishes his final masterpiece.

Implausible, you say? Perhaps so. Then again, Kubrick was a very well-connected guy. And, as Eyes Wide Shut suggests, those with power can arrange just about anything.

  

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
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19. "Doesn't matter. The movie sucks."
In response to Reply # 18


  

          


n/m


----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"

  

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The3rdOne
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20. "why dont you write kubrick a letter?"
In response to Reply # 19


  

          

  

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Bombastic
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22. "Wow, What Amazing Heights In Bullshit That Writer Manages To Reach"
In response to Reply # 18


  

          

.

www.somethinginthewudder.com

https://twitter.com/nostrabombus

https://www.facebook.com/matt.koelling.96

https://www.instagram.com/something_in_the_wudder/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/matt-koelling-438a803?trk=hp-identity-name

  

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
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Fri Feb-29-08 08:19 PM

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23. "Niggas are voting 'I like it' to personally antagonize me"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


I see you.

----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"

  

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jetblack
Member since Nov 14th 2004
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Fri Feb-29-08 08:53 PM

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24. "rojo"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

---
Knock knock, Neo...
---
Stay +.
---

  

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negritagoddess
Member since Jun 13th 2007
98 posts
Fri Feb-29-08 09:58 PM

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25. "RE: Eyes Wide Shut [1999]"
In response to Reply # 0


          

I am absolutely certain that either A)Making this movie killed Krubrick because he knew it was bad and Tom Cruises' control freakedness made him ill.Or B)He did not direct this piece of trash.After such a stellar career it's very tragic that his last film was this laugh-fest.I honestly busted out laughing at parts that were not supposed to be funny.I thinking are you serious? This is a movie?AAAAARRRRRGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!!!

define irony.

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Fri Feb-29-08 10:16 PM

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26. "Alright, I'll say it, it's a great movie."
In response to Reply # 0


          

And the fact that it gets OE worked up into such a frenzy of childishness makes me love it even more.

What's it about? Well, it's about all sorts of things, and I'm sure it's about different things for different viewers. But it doesn't need to be about anything. This:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/0/0c/%27Magenta%2C_Black%2C_Green_on_Orange%27%2C_oil_on_canvas_painting_by_Mark_Rothko%2C_1947%2C_Museum_of_Modern_Art.jpg

isn't about anything, but that doesn't mean it isn't interesting, or even "important." If you want to, you can just think of Eyes Wide Shut as the most well-shot soft porn flick that's ever been made. As far as I'm concerned, there's much more to it than that, but OE clearly wants a flamewar and I'm not gonna give it to him.

None of this is to say that I found it to be any sort of earth-shattering artistic revelation. I've only watched it a few times, and the thing I like about it most has little to do with Kubrick. This is where I first heard Ligeti's "Musica Ricercata" (that's what that piano music was ... and it gets much better than the section that was in the movie).

When I first heard Bitches Brew as a kid, I dismissed it as a sellout record, as the beginning of the end of Miles Davis the "artist." I was naive. Now I try not to be judgmental. If I'm interested in something, I'm interested in it, if I'm not, I'm not. If it came from someone I respect, then it's probably my problem, not his.

Fuck a latte. I drink my espresso straight.

  

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negritagoddess
Member since Jun 13th 2007
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Fri Feb-29-08 10:21 PM

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27. "RE: Alright, I'll say it, it's a great movie."
In response to Reply # 26


          

Do they squeeze some extra bitch caffeine into that espresso for you.Or do you drink your bitch juice on the side,cause your a bitch


define irony.

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
12403 posts
Fri Feb-29-08 10:24 PM

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28. "Well said."
In response to Reply # 27


          

  

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52927 posts
Fri Feb-29-08 10:33 PM

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29. "LOL @ O_E having cats defensive and scared"
In response to Reply # 26


  

          


LOL

I don't actually giveth a flying fucketh if you like
this movie or not, dunny.

This world is full of people who think differently
than I. Most of them have dumbass opinions,
and its all good.

I mean, you like it for personal, subjective reasons.
That's fine. That's your right.

At least you're fair about your opinion -- you're not
actually trying to manufacture a reason why the film is
good. You've all but made fun of your own opinion. I dig that.

Hell, I like all sorts of shit no one else likes.
I thought 'The Mask' was Jim Carrey's best film, by
far. I feel that way for personal reasons, and as far
as I'm concerned, that's all I need to like it.

I'm not, however, going to construct an organized theory
as to why 'The Mask' was a "cinematic epiphany." That is what
the Latte crowd does around films like EWS.


So no,

Miss with that shit, fam, and no, you
intro to the philosophy of art lecture isn't necessary
or wanted here. EWS got shit to do with 'Bitches Brew'
or the Museum of Modern Art.

I don't want to discuss "what art means," especially
with y'all.

And even if I did, it wouldn't be relevant here.


Thanks.


>And the fact that it gets OE worked up into such a frenzy of
>childishness makes me love it even more.
>
>What's it about? Well, it's about all sorts of things, and
>I'm sure it's about different things for different viewers.
>But it doesn't need to be about anything. This:
>
>http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/0/0c/%27Magenta%2C_Black%2C_Green_on_Orange%27%2C_oil_on_canvas_painting_by_Mark_Rothko%2C_1947%2C_Museum_of_Modern_Art.jpg
>
>isn't about anything, but that doesn't mean it isn't
>interesting, or even "important." If you want to, you can
>just think of Eyes Wide Shut as the most well-shot soft porn
>flick that's ever been made. As far as I'm concerned, there's
>much more to it than that, but OE clearly wants a flamewar and
>I'm not gonna give it to him.
>
>None of this is to say that I found it to be any sort of
>earth-shattering artistic revelation. I've only watched it a
>few times, and the thing I like about it most has little to do
>with Kubrick. This is where I first heard Ligeti's "Musica
>Ricercata" (that's what that piano music was ... and it gets
>much better than the section that was in the movie).
>
>When I first heard Bitches Brew as a kid, I dismissed it as a
>sellout record, as the beginning of the end of Miles Davis the
>"artist." I was naive. Now I try not to be judgmental. If
>I'm interested in something, I'm interested in it, if I'm not,
>I'm not. If it came from someone I respect, then it's
>probably my problem, not his.
>
>Fuck a latte. I drink my espresso straight.
>
>


----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
12403 posts
Fri Feb-29-08 10:56 PM

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30. "The best offense is a good defense, innit?"
In response to Reply # 29
Fri Feb-29-08 10:58 PM by stravinskian

          

>I'm not, however, going to construct an organized theory
>as to why 'The Mask' was a "cinematic epiphany." That is what
>the Latte crowd does around films like EWS.

I never said, though, that such an argument could not be made for Eyes Wide Shut. I think it could, and I did say in the subject line that it's a "great" movie. What I said was that I wasn't interested in making the argument, mostly because I don't expect people to consider the question seriously. (These people being, by the way, from what we see comparing the thread to the poll result, the vocal minority.)


>So no,
>
>Miss with that shit, fam, and no, you
>intro to the philosophy of art lecture isn't necessary
>or wanted here.

I don't know you all that well, but one thing I do know is that I shouldn't care what you consider to be necessary or wanted.

>EWS got shit to do with 'Bitches Brew'
>or the Museum of Modern Art.

All sorts of things have all sorts of things to do with all sorts of other things. But that isn't necessary or wanted here.


  

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52927 posts
Fri Feb-29-08 11:28 PM

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31. "Um. No."
In response to Reply # 30


  

          


>I never said, though, that such an argument could not be made
>for Eyes Wide Shut. I think it could, and I did say in the
>subject line that it's a "great" movie. What I said was that
>I wasn't interested in making the argument, mostly because I
>don't expect people to consider the question seriously.


People like me don't take the question of whether
or not EWS is a great movie seriously because
we've heard dozens of miserable arguments from people
trying so hard to convince themselves that it is
good. None of them are coherent, or consistent,
and most have to do with either a bullshit appeal
to the "brilliance" of Stanley Kubric, or some
similarly bullshit appeal to the movie "not needing
to be about anything," which is sort of your
argument.

All are just plea cops and not reasons.


>(These people being, by the way, from what we see comparing
>the thread to the poll result, the vocal minority.)

People don't voice their opinion in here because they
are generally afraid of meeting the same fate as you
are.

Their reasons for liking it are probably dumber than
yours.

This it PTP, after all, and most of the guys don't have
Y chromosomes, and probably want to fuck Tom Cruise.


>I don't know you all that well, but one thing I do know is
>that I shouldn't care what you consider to be necessary or
>wanted.

I don't know you at all, but I do know bullshit when
I see it.

And miss me with that "what is art?" appeal.

Nobody asked for it. Not necessary.

Keep it moving, yo.



>All sorts of things have all sorts of things to do with all
>sorts of other things. But that isn't necessary or wanted
>here.

Well that point certainly was out of place and unnecessary.
It also has nothing to do with anything.

So there you go.


----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
12403 posts
Fri Feb-29-08 11:45 PM

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32. "RE: Um. No."
In response to Reply # 31


          

>People like me don't take the question of whether
>or not EWS is a great movie seriously because
>we've heard dozens of miserable arguments from people
>trying so hard to convince themselves that it is
>good. None of them are coherent, or consistent,
>and most have to do with either a bullshit appeal
>to the "brilliance" of Stanley Kubric, or some
>similarly bullshit appeal to the movie "not needing
>to be about anything," which is sort of your
>argument.

Hey! I thought you said you respected that argument. Now I'm offended.
(But again, it wasn't an argument. Just an observation.)

>All are just plea cops and not reasons.

I'm glad to see that you've got it all figured out.


>>(These people being, by the way, from what we see comparing
>>the thread to the poll result, the vocal minority.)
>
>People don't voice their opinion in here because they
>are generally afraid of meeting the same fate as you
>are.

^ Great. He already thinks he's in a flamewar.

You're too emotional. Go have a latte and calm down.


>Their reasons for liking it are probably dumber than
>yours.
>
>This it PTP, after all, and most of the guys don't have
>Y chromosomes, and probably want to fuck Tom Cruise.

Tom Cruise is a Scientologist. They have special powers.


>>I don't know you all that well, but one thing I do know is
>>that I shouldn't care what you consider to be necessary or
>>wanted.
>
>I don't know you at all, but I do know bullshit when
>I see it.
>
>And miss me with that "what is art?" appeal.
>
>Nobody asked for it. Not necessary.

Nobody asked for your opinion on my opinion, either. But oddly enough, you're giving it anyway. You're a man of mystery.

>Keep it moving, yo.
>
>
>
>>All sorts of things have all sorts of things to do with all
>>sorts of other things. But that isn't necessary or wanted
>>here.
>
>Well that point certainly was out of place and unnecessary.
>It also has nothing to do with anything.
>
>So there you go.

"A structure is like a bridge, from nowhere, to nowhere."

So there you go.

  

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Airbreed
Charter member
29386 posts
Tue Mar-04-08 01:46 PM

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57. "Tsk, Tsk -- i hate seeing two of my favorite posters go at it like this."
In response to Reply # 32


  

          

.

  

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
85466 posts
Sat Mar-01-08 03:29 AM

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33. "*sits in post solely to watch O_E rip people up*"
In response to Reply # 0
Sat Mar-01-08 03:30 AM by Frank Longo

  

          

Guys, the question isn't whether the film is well-shot (it is), whether the mood is appropriately creepy (it is), or whether there are lots of vague activities you could spend hours making theories for (you could).

The question is, is it a good film? To me, a film tells a story. And to me, the story in Eyes Wide Shut was dull, nonsensical, and I'm not entirely sure existed. We can say we "appreciated the cinematography" or "found the mood eerie and effectively tense"... but those aren't the MOVIE. They're just small elements.

I think The Village sets a great mood, and has great cinematography. Doesn't excuse the story from sucking (and I'm a defender of Night Dogg's first three flicks too). Same with Eyes Wide Shut (and again, I'll defend a good number of Kubrick's flicks too). Both movies, at the end of the day, aren't good. I don't care what you think the films' endings say about society or whatever cockamamie nonsense plea you're ready to strike.

Eyes Wide Shut, to me, is The Village, with fewer monsters, fewer disabilities, and more titties.

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For movie lovers: http://russellhainline.com

  

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AZ
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12930 posts
Sat Mar-01-08 03:47 AM

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34. "that's pretty limiting, isn't it?"
In response to Reply # 33
Sat Mar-01-08 03:49 AM by AZ

          

your 'tells a good story' requirement. i assume you think a film like The 400 Blows isn't a good film.

not saying EWS is a good film. i haven't even seen it.

  

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
85466 posts
Sat Mar-01-08 10:28 AM

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36. "The story doesn't have to be conventional or linear."
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

I like 400 Blows. But I cared what was happening in 400 Blows. I felt emotionally invested.

If your story wanders around and you're totally emotionally removed from what's occuring, then it's gonna be boring, it's gonna be uninteresting, and it's gonna suck. That's what happened with Eyes Wide Shut.


For beer lovers: http://thebeertravelguide.com
For movie lovers: http://russellhainline.com

  

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SoulHonky
Member since Jan 21st 2003
25919 posts
Sat Mar-01-08 01:52 PM

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38. "You just described half of the "great" films of this year"
In response to Reply # 36


          

"If your story wanders around and you're totally emotionally removed from what's occuring, then it's gonna be boring, it's gonna be uninteresting, and it's gonna suck"

Assassination of Jesse James, There Will Be Blood, your beloved The Savages, hell, even No Country for Old Men could be described like that to a certain extent. The issue isn't the story; it's the characters.

The foundation of "Eyes Wide Shut" was the characters. The main conflict was an internal struggle and it was basically a character piece with a loose mystery built-in. Once people didn't care about the main character, thus not caring for his struggle/conflict, the focus moved to the mystery which supposed to bear the weight of the film. Add in the very slow pacing and you have a film that is going to miss the mark with most of the audience.

Personally, I thought "Eyes Wide Shut" was an intriguing failure but to say the problem is just the story seems wrong. I think you could remake the film using almost the exact same story and come away with a quality film. (Ditto for AI)



----
NBA MOCK DRAFT #1 - https://thecourierclass.com/whole-shebang/2017/5/18/2017-nba-mock-draft-1-just-lotto-and-lotta-trades

  

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
85466 posts
Sat Mar-01-08 02:06 PM

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39. "I wasn't emotionally removed from ANY of those characters."
In response to Reply # 38


  

          

>"If your story wanders around and you're totally emotionally
>removed from what's occuring, then it's gonna be boring, it's
>gonna be uninteresting, and it's gonna suck"
>
>Assassination of Jesse James, There Will Be Blood, your
>beloved The Savages, hell, even No Country for Old Men could
>be described like that to a certain extent. The issue isn't
>the story; it's the characters.
>
>The foundation of "Eyes Wide Shut" was the characters. The
>main conflict was an internal struggle and it was basically a
>character piece with a loose mystery built-in. Once people
>didn't care about the main character, thus not caring for his
>struggle/conflict, the focus moved to the mystery which
>supposed to bear the weight of the film. Add in the very slow
>pacing and you have a film that is going to miss the mark with
>most of the audience.
>

The problem is Kubrick's style kept me from getting invested in the character in any way. I was totally hanging on every move that the characters in the films you named made. Maybe it's more than story... maybe it's the perfect storm of a meandering story, characters we didn't care about, and Kubrick's totally detached style.

>Personally, I thought "Eyes Wide Shut" was an intriguing
>failure but to say the problem is just the story seems wrong.
>I think you could remake the film using almost the exact same
>story and come away with a quality film. (Ditto for AI)

Perhaps. It'd need a new script and a new director to execute said script.

There were additional problems with the film. But it begins with story. And the main point I wanted to make is I believe Kubrick often gets the pass since his films are well-shot and have a distinct mood. But that's simply not enough.

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For movie lovers: http://russellhainline.com

  

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The3rdOne
Charter member
9040 posts
Sat Mar-01-08 04:08 AM

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35. "I also thought that Aceyalone's Book Of Human Language"
In response to Reply # 33


  

          

album was trash...i'm gonna rip you about that - i have a feeling.

O-E = a poor attempt at jamboning.

  

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maternalbliss
Member since Jul 05th 2005
2553 posts
Sat Mar-01-08 12:32 PM

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37. "RE: Garbage"
In response to Reply # 0


          

I dob't know what was going on with Tom at that time. I think he also made Vanilla Sky and Magnolia around that that time also.
They are all a bunch of pretentious films influenced by his scientology beliefs. They try hard too be more enlightening than what they are. Vanilla sky is entertaining though. I had a crush on that shit although I knew it was horrible film. I will never watch it again though.

  

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Kevan
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6244 posts
Sat Mar-01-08 05:54 PM

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40. "It's brilliant because of the message, not the director and not the stor..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

It's all about the symbolism. If you didn't like this movie, then you missed the point. Symbols are all around us and relay a message. Movies have in symbols in them too. But this movie had symbols all over the place. Masks, rainbows, the lighting, the colors. It's not just artistic license here, everything had a purpose.

In the beginning of the movie Tom Cruise is at a high-brow party. He and his wife are doctors. Doctors are about as high up as you can go in regular society as far as respect goes. These parties tend to have doctors, judges, politicians, celebrities, etc. This is nothing new, but when he went to that other party it was a whole new world.

"I know what happened last night," he continues. "I don't think you realize what kind of trouble you're in... If I told you their names, I don't think you'd sleep so well."

Doctors can pretty much go anywhere but this party, he was in trouble just for going. Because of what he saw. Everyone was disguised so no names were known, so how could he be in trouble just for going in disguise? He could never turn anyone in. What's the problem?

Because it's not just a sex party. He was to be killed just for going and the girl who overdosed, was murdered. Not an overdose. It's pretty ill because nothing is as it appears hence the ending. This movie was great. But it goes over a lot of peoples heads because it goes into subjects that are openly discussed. So unless you've studied some of subject matter, it would come off as a boring stupid movie.


IMO Uri Dowbenko breaks it down the best in his review:
http://www.umsl.edu/~thomaskp/offline7.htm

  

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
85466 posts
Sat Mar-01-08 06:42 PM

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41. "General rule: If you HAVE to study to like it, it's not a good film."
In response to Reply # 40
Sat Mar-01-08 06:42 PM by Frank Longo

  

          

It becomes a 2-hour actor-filled supplement to some reading material.

A good film can captivate you and intrigue you to the point where you want to read more about the story and the subject. But if you HAVE to do the research first in order to find the movie captivating, it's simply not doing its job.

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52927 posts
Sat Mar-01-08 07:32 PM

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42. "ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ"
In response to Reply # 40


  

          

ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
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----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"

  

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
85466 posts
Sat Mar-01-08 08:07 PM

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43. "I mean, I don't go to the movies to get homework assignments."
In response to Reply # 42


  

          

If my movie preview says, "Read up on So-and-So's Theory of Such-and-Such before watching!", I'm gonna say, "Fuck that. I'd rather watch Transformers. There's no homework assignment for Transformers."

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For movie lovers: http://russellhainline.com

  

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
52927 posts
Sat Mar-01-08 09:18 PM

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44. "This is precisely why I use the term "Latte" so much."
In response to Reply # 43
Sat Mar-01-08 09:49 PM by Orbit_Established

  

          

>If my movie preview says, "Read up on So-and-So's Theory of
>Such-and-Such before watching!", I'm gonna say, "Fuck that.
>I'd rather watch Transformers. There's no homework assignment
>for Transformers."

Because sadly, some movies are made to sell coffee, and not
to be watched and enjoyed.

And some movie "types" spend more time drinking
Latte than eating popcorn(I don't mean this literally,
of course).

Some movies aren't meant to be watched, they are meant to
be discussed, which is bullshit because if the movie
is really good, than it will be both watched and discussed.

Trying to outsmart an audience is the lamest shit in the
world. Make a motherfucking movie that your audience can
watch and enjoy. If its good, we'll talk about it forever.

For example, 'Goodfellas', in my personal top 10 ever,
is a joy to watch, and can be talked about forever.

Hell, same with the original 'Star Wars'.

Both are smarter movies than 'Eyes Wide Shut'. Way smarter.
Waaay smarter. And neither needed all sorts of bullshit
hidden-agenda shit to make it good. Surely, both films CAN
BE DISSECTED after the fact. But they don't NEED TO BE
in order to be watched and enjoyed.

I think the place even me and you part ways on this issue is
in my feelings for Tarantino, who imo, is the one MOST guilty
of this bullshit, which is why I think his entire career is
a farce. I think 'Pulp Fiction' didn't make a grain of sense,
not until you have 300 conversations about the briefcase.

But that's neither here nor there.

We agree on this one, and on the central point, so
its all good.


----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"

  

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BigWorm
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47. "hmmm"
In response to Reply # 40


          

I'm not so sure it was about the symbols.

I know the moral take on the movie, and I've heard about the conspiracy theory one. Both aren't really that hard to grasp. But heavy symbolism, I don't know. Unless I totally missed it.

  

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Kevan
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Mon Mar-03-08 09:08 AM

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48. "Occult symbolism"
In response to Reply # 47


  

          

And most wouldn't know them unless they studied the occult or conspiracy theories.

If you research Satanic Ritual Abuse, whether real or fiction, you will see many similarities.

This link is the best explanation I could muster up as they said it better than I would've. He goes into the mind control aspects as well as other elements.
http://www.konformist.com/flicks/eyeswideshut.htm

  

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BigWorm
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49. "interesting stuff"
In response to Reply # 48


          

I had heard the basic ideas of that several years ago, but they go into much more detail.

While I don't buy it all (I think in many places they were stretching it) I think there certainly is something to it.

But let's not forget, one of Kubrick's big things was making movies that can be read a few different ways.

That reading's pretty damn interesting though...

  

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Orbit_Established
Member since Oct 27th 2002
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Mon Mar-03-08 11:32 AM

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50. "Dude, 'Eyes Wide Shut' was about the compromise of 1877"
In response to Reply # 49


  

          


Dude,

Tom Cruise = Rutherford Hayes

Nicole Kidman - Samuel Tilden


And the orgy was used to symbolize the confused state of
the US at the time.

And the music represented the distant beating drums
of the Civil War that had passed.


PROFOUND




----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"

  

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BigWorm
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51. "that's the most hilarious joke I've ever read"
In response to Reply # 50


          

I'm bout to go tell all my latte buddies about that joke, if they aren't too busy drinking latte that is!!!

Hey guy if you want to join us, come on by, in a few hours we're also gonna be starting up our chainsaws and mowing down our strawmen, just before we do our annual Pulp Fiction marathon (all Pulp Fiction, all day yo!!!). You may not have heard of Pulp Fiction, usually only us film snobs know about it. It's this movie directed by Jesus Christ I mean Quentin Tarantino. I don't know about you, but I just can't get enough of how deep and artsy that movie is, especially that part when Sam Jackson says fuck.

Also, you seem like a guy that might like the new movie by Kawastilakjakmani. He's this foreign guy that makes awesome subtitled movies that are way deep and will maybe never be released in the US--which is partly what makes it so cool! Much better than that Tyler Perry garbage that shames black people everywhere!

You'd love it, ninja!

  

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Orbit_Established
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54. "^^^PROFOUND"
In response to Reply # 51


  

          

>I'm bout to go tell all my latte buddies about that joke, if
>they aren't too busy drinking latte that is!!!

Shit, tell them to bring their lattes with
them.


>Hey guy if you want to join us, come on by, in a few hours
>we're also gonna be starting up our chainsaws and mowing down
>our strawmen, just before we do our annual Pulp Fiction
>marathon (all Pulp Fiction, all day yo!!!).

But will you have briefcases with you?

You may not have
>heard of Pulp Fiction, usually only us film snobs know about
>it. It's this movie directed by Jesus Christ I mean Quentin
>Tarantino. I don't know about you, but I just can't get enough
>of how deep and artsy that movie is, especially that part when
>Sam Jackson says fuck.

Dude, that was ill. Fornication Under the Consent of the
King. He was, of course, referring to Jesus Christ himself,
and the briefcase represented the fornication between you
and your bad posts.

>Also, you seem like a guy that might like the new movie by
>Kawastilakjakmani. He's this foreign guy that makes awesome
>subtitled movies that are way deep and will maybe never be
>released in the US--which is partly what makes it so cool!

Yeah, except that one Asian film tarantino directed...
...House of Flying Crouching Heroes.


>Much better than that Tyler Perry garbage that shames black
>people everywhere!


Dude,

What a disgrace.


>You'd love it, ninja!

What Ninja? The one in House of Flying Crouching Heroes?



  

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maternalbliss
Member since Jul 05th 2005
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Mon Mar-03-08 03:07 PM

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52. "RE: Occult symbolism"
In response to Reply # 48


          

You right and Magnolia was about traumatized chidren/childhood but even with an understanding of the symbolism these films were still really bad.

  

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BigWorm
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53. "see now"
In response to Reply # 52


          

>You right and Magnolia was about traumatized
>chidren/childhood but even with an understanding of the
>symbolism these films were still really bad.

Can't really argue that one. There's plenty of times where you see a movie, someone that 'got it' explains it to you and you're like, "Oh, I get it...yeah, I still don't like that movie."

You know, some big fans could probably break down the last two Matrix movies down to the very last compound...and it wouldn't make me like them not one bit more.


  

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BigWorm
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46. "dug it"
In response to Reply # 0


          

Didn't at first, because it's one of those movies that knows what the audience is anticipating, and then sort of holds out on it.

But as for what it was saying, it was kinda cool. Another movie that kept me thinking long after I finished watching it, which most movies don't really do for me.

I don't know, what I got out of it initially was just: married couple kinda wants to cheat on each other; Tom wants to cheat on Nicole, vice versa. Only Nicole would think about it and not do it, Tom would actually try to do it but circumstances keep him back. Finally after a whole night of failing at getting his creep on, shit gets so close to home that he cracks up and confesses everything. Together Tom and Nicole realize that the key to a happy marriage is just some good fuckin. The end.

The only part that really pisses me off is knowing that the US version cut most of the orgy scene.

Here's a funny story: legend has it that Kubrick specifically made this movie cause he wanted to do his own version of a porn. As in he teases you right up to a huge sex filled payoff.

I don't know, as a twisted off-beat thriller that screws with you I give it about a B...but as a porn I would probably give it a D, even with the whole orgy scene intact.

  

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Wordup
Member since Mar 03rd 2006
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Tue Mar-04-08 12:47 AM

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55. "The climax sucked"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

When the Doctor understood that Nick went off to a mansion and he got the password and all that, they should've made what was going inside more elaborate.

Showed more inside the secret society. Perhaps some child rape or little something from "SALO." You know something extremely disturbing that they are ashamed of or hiding from.

But i guess its set up to use our imagination.

And what about that last part where Alice suggests they have to fukk.

Yeah, all this was somewhat of a let down.

  

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Orbit_Established
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56. "Or it could be that the whole movie sucked."
In response to Reply # 55


  

          


>But i guess its set up to use our imagination.

Sure, just like with most sucky movies.

I mean, I was watching 'Batman and Robin' imagining
that what was on the screen was not on the screen,
and that something not on the screen, good stuff,
was on the screen.

Same with 'Eyes Wide Shut'.

Odd thing is this: People imagine shit that isn't
there and give actual credit to this film because it
"made" them imagine shit.

Uh, no.



----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"

  

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rorschach
Member since Nov 10th 2004
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Tue Mar-04-08 02:04 PM

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58. "Why did I always feel that I was seeing everything except the actual sto..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

There were all these moments in the film that seemed a little interesting on their own but when it came down to actually being a tight plot I kept getting lost.

To this day, I can't quite explain what I saw. And it's not like 2001, where you knew you saw a complete story that you knew was great even if you couldn't fully explain it. Eyes Wide Shut was literally a film that went nowhere. People can say what they want but that was a very weak film and I hate that it was Kubrick's last film.

  

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The3rdOne
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Tue Mar-04-08 05:34 PM

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60. "So that settles it..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Eye Wide Shut is one the top 25 flicks of OKP Pass The Popcorn.

NEXT

  

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