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Subject: "Dilla Time: The Life and Afterlife of J Dilla, the Hip-Hop Producer Who ..." Previous topic | Next topic
chincheckin
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Thu Jan-13-22 12:17 PM

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"Dilla Time: The Life and Afterlife of J Dilla, the Hip-Hop Producer Who ..."


          

Comes out February 1.....A MUST HAVE!

https://www.amazon.com/Dilla-Time-Afterlife-Producer-Reinvented/dp/0374139946/ref=sr_1_1?crid=1VC22KPDPQ4LH&keywords=dilla+time&qid=1642094171&sprefix=dilla+%2Caps%2C216&sr=8-1

http://soundcloud.com/deemack1

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
anxiously waiting for my pre-order.
Jan 13th 2022
1
ooh, nice
Jan 13th 2022
2
copped! Thanks for the heads up!
Jan 16th 2022
3
A must-read
Jan 17th 2022
4
Anyone know if Donuts are Forever/Dilla Day events are happening
Jan 19th 2022
5
Apparently, there’s a fake paperback version with the same name and co...
Feb 03rd 2022
6
Charles Hamilton still at it?
Feb 03rd 2022
7
WTF? You Sure That's Not Some Amazon Printed Bootleg?
Feb 03rd 2022
8
      Read the review.
Feb 06th 2022
12
Dilla & T3 are dissing each other on t
Feb 05th 2022
9
Did Dilla's ol man ghostwrite "It's A Shame"?
Feb 05th 2022
10
The footnote from different source accounts...
Feb 07th 2022
14
It’s an informative book, BUT…
Feb 06th 2022
11
Got the audiobook for this exact reason
Feb 07th 2022
15
a call from Raphael Saadiq....
Feb 07th 2022
13
Wasn't Jay & Raphael Both Apart Of UMMAH?
Feb 11th 2022
16
RE: Wasn't Jay & Raphael Both Apart Of UMMAH?
Feb 12th 2022
17
      Yeah way I read it was
Feb 15th 2022
18
      Curse out the brother, humble with the white guy?
Jun 04th 2022
45
There’s nothing remotely cool about that.
Jun 04th 2022
44
Finished this over the weekend and I thought it was great
Feb 17th 2022
19
Can We Address The Donuts Myth
Feb 25th 2022
20
Would love a follow up on this.
May 24th 2022
32
      Gotcha.
Jun 02nd 2022
40
           Thanks! n/m
Jun 03rd 2022
41
About 50% through...thoughts.
Apr 27th 2022
21
RE: About 50% through...thoughts.
Apr 28th 2022
22
RE: what happened with shoes?
May 24th 2022
33
      ^
May 24th 2022
34
      He posted some really vile stuff on social media attacking Ma Dukes
May 24th 2022
35
           *catalogue not dialogue
May 24th 2022
36
           RE: wow
May 25th 2022
38
           tried to tell yall Shoes won't shit
Jan 19th 2023
51
RE: I have never heard this Frank & Dank album that Jay Dee produced
May 03rd 2022
26
      RE: I have never heard this Frank & Dank album that Jay Dee produced
May 03rd 2022
27
      RE: I have never heard this Frank & Dank album that Jay Dee produced
May 03rd 2022
28
      RE: album as a whole isn't *amazing*
May 25th 2022
37
Hardcopy or audio book?
Apr 28th 2022
23
can only speak for the hard book
Apr 28th 2022
24
      RE: can only speak for the hard book
Apr 29th 2022
25
      RE: can only speak for the hard book
May 13th 2022
29
      damn!
May 23rd 2022
31
at about the 3/4 point
May 23rd 2022
30
A valiant effort, but I have mixed feelings
Jun 02nd 2022
39
Did he expand on that "small thinking" thought in the book at all?
Jun 03rd 2022
42
      For about a page but mostly as an extended aside
Jun 03rd 2022
43
           I disagree with this.
Jun 05th 2022
46
                RE: I disagree with this.
Jun 05th 2022
47
                You missed the point on my DOOM comment
Jun 05th 2022
48
This is probably a fairly dumb question
Jan 19th 2023
49
I think even if you're casual fan you will get something from it
Jan 19th 2023
50
there's a lot here — you'll get something from it
Jan 20th 2023
52
I would say it's great for anyone who loves music honestly
Jan 21st 2023
53

LeroyBumpkin
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Thu Jan-13-22 03:30 PM

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1. "anxiously waiting for my pre-order."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

@dseals | @digife
https://digife.com

  

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Options
Member since Nov 19th 2009
1007 posts
Thu Jan-13-22 06:54 PM

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2. "ooh, nice"
In response to Reply # 0


          

I never read the Donuts 33 1/3 book, but we're definitely due for more Dilla-related tomes. bring 'em on!

  

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DJR
Member since Jan 01st 2005
17597 posts
Sun Jan-16-22 07:28 PM

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3. "copped! Thanks for the heads up!"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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seandammit
Member since May 28th 2003
6509 posts
Mon Jan-17-22 02:17 AM

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4. "A must-read "
In response to Reply # 0


          

Compelling, revelatory, the story of the man/the producer/the real impact that he made on music as we know it. I can’t say enough good things about it. Everyone must read this book.

www.twitter.com/seandammit

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
16595 posts
Wed Jan-19-22 09:50 AM

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5. "Anyone know if Donuts are Forever/Dilla Day events are happening"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

this year?

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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JFrost1117
Member since Aug 12th 2005
23543 posts
Thu Feb-03-22 09:24 PM

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6. "Apparently, there’s a fake paperback version with the same name and co..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Some small pamphlet type thing by a completely different author.

____________
Twitter & IG: @rulerofmyself
SC: rulerofmyself17

Yes! She's on the drugs. (c) BoHagon

  

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DJR
Member since Jan 01st 2005
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Thu Feb-03-22 09:38 PM

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7. "Charles Hamilton still at it?"
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

  

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Dj Joey Joe
Member since Sep 01st 2007
13767 posts
Thu Feb-03-22 10:01 PM

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8. "WTF? You Sure That's Not Some Amazon Printed Bootleg?"
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

I wouldn't be surprised, I've heard of amazon taking older books that's out of print, finding a copy, and basically copying, pressing up their own copies.


https://tinyurl.com/y4ba6hog

---------
"We in here talking about later career Prince records
& your fool ass is cruising around in a time machine
trying to collect props for a couple of sociopathic degenerates" - s.blak

  

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JFrost1117
Member since Aug 12th 2005
23543 posts
Sun Feb-06-22 03:11 AM

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12. "Read the review."
In response to Reply # 8


  

          

https://www.amazon.com/Dilla-Afterlife-Hip-Hop-Producer-Reinvented/dp/B09RJJ3H8W/ref=sr_1_7?keywords=dilla+time&qid=1644135062&sr=8-7

If you search, there's also another version by someone else that's not Charnas.

____________
Twitter & IG: @rulerofmyself
SC: rulerofmyself17

Yes! She's on the drugs. (c) BoHagon

  

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High Society
Member since Oct 13th 2003
7327 posts
Sat Feb-05-22 01:27 PM

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9. "Dilla & T3 are dissing each other on t"
In response to Reply # 0


          

Keep It On

-----
Cameo
Soundshape Records

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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Sat Feb-05-22 11:23 PM

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10. "Did Dilla's ol man ghostwrite "It's A Shame"?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I'm just starting Dilla Time, but I love this type of stuff.
Charnas never confirms but it's a great "what if".

@dseals | @digife
https://digife.com

  

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The3rdOne
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9065 posts
Mon Feb-07-22 11:18 AM

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14. "The footnote from different source accounts..."
In response to Reply # 10


  

          

...are a dope addition to this book. Its really inconclusive to me. Interesting how a later chapter parallels this situation to Dilla's "Got Till ITs Gone" with Jimmy Jam ad Terry Lewis debacle as I first thought when they talked about Its A Shame.

  

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supablak
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Sun Feb-06-22 02:33 AM

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11. "It’s an informative book, BUT…"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I be FALLING ASLEEP to ALL the “These Are African Rhythms Printed Swing Tutorials”, sheesh..
Not a skimmer, but, man…every time the book turns to these diagrams, it’s like listening to someone trying to explain a “Holy Ghost”, to a cat

But it’s a wild read nonetheless, as a Detroiter…not sure about some of the accuracy of Dan Charnas timelines. But I applaud him for adding splashes of the city’s development, in context to Jay Dee’s contextual development.

s.blak
Y’all Ain’t Ready

keep: looking,searching,seeking,finding

  

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grey
Member since Apr 04th 2003
2056 posts
Mon Feb-07-22 03:22 PM

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15. "Got the audiobook for this exact reason "
In response to Reply # 11


          

Just started but I imagine reading the type of musical stuff is a lil tougher to digest for non-musician folk (me).

  

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The3rdOne
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Mon Feb-07-22 11:13 AM

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13. "a call from Raphael Saadiq...."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Saadiq: Your Without You remix needs more work....its too sparse.
DIlla : Suck my dick! (Then hangs up the phone)
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

  

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Dj Joey Joe
Member since Sep 01st 2007
13767 posts
Fri Feb-11-22 09:50 PM

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16. "Wasn't Jay & Raphael Both Apart Of UMMAH?"
In response to Reply # 13
Fri Feb-11-22 09:51 PM by Dj Joey Joe

  

          

>Saadiq: Your Without You remix needs more work....
>its too sparse.
>DIlla : Suck my dick! (Then hangs up the phone)
>😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

Wow, might have been an inside joke or on some serious resentment how the UMMAH group situation dissolved; either way I still liked Dwele's (the one that featured Phat Kat) remixed version compared to Jay's even though I think Dilla was going for that stripped down vibe on a few of his remixes at the time (such as the Macy Grey "I Try", Spacek "Eve", & the Toshi Kubota "Nothing But Your Love", etc.).


https://tinyurl.com/y4ba6hog

---------
"We in here talking about later career Prince records
& your fool ass is cruising around in a time machine
trying to collect props for a couple of sociopathic degenerates" - s.blak

  

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The3rdOne
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Sat Feb-12-22 09:32 PM

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17. "RE: Wasn't Jay & Raphael Both Apart Of UMMAH?"
In response to Reply # 16
Sat Feb-12-22 09:38 PM by The3rdOne

  

          

Saadiq was loosely affiliated with the UMMAH...but not on the same business contract as DIlla, Tip, and Ali. Reading Dilla Time and comprehending the context, Dilla did NOT like to be pushed or rushed no matter who it was. He snapped on cats he worked with seemingly random, but he definitely had a method to his madness. It was conveyed that he actually got pissed at Saadiq as opposed to having a very different and humbling approach to the dude in charge of the Blue Note Remix project (I forget his name). THey wanted Dilla to do his Brother Jack McDuff version of Oblighetto over. They anticipated Dilla blowing up, but he actually took the criticism like a champ and then blew the remake out of the water.

  

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High Society
Member since Oct 13th 2003
7327 posts
Tue Feb-15-22 08:56 PM

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18. "Yeah way I read it was"
In response to Reply # 17


          

Dilla was worried about messing with the original too much and Blue Note peeps told him, MORE DILLA. He said alright, and gave them a classic.

-----
Cameo
Soundshape Records

  

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spirit
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Sat Jun-04-22 10:39 PM

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45. "Curse out the brother, humble with the white guy?"
In response to Reply # 17
Sat Jun-04-22 10:43 PM by spirit

  

          

Don’t know if any of this happened like the book said, but (if it is true) the optics are awful.

Peace,

Spirit (Alan)
http://wutangbook.com

  

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spirit
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Sat Jun-04-22 10:36 PM

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44. "There’s nothing remotely cool about that."
In response to Reply # 13


  

          

That anecdote and numerous others in the book just made Dilla look like a dick. In some parts, it felt more like a hit piece than a book.

Some parts made him look like a moron. Wearing a Diamond necklace as he walked around Brazil, in terrible health, but still fronting with the tough guy role?

That weird DOOM anecdote?

(Told after he died, so he can’t defend himself)

It’s all fuckery.

Peace,

Spirit (Alan)
http://wutangbook.com

  

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DaKidFromHaiti
Member since Feb 19th 2006
1171 posts
Thu Feb-17-22 08:03 PM

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19. "Finished this over the weekend and I thought it was great"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I never read The Big Payback but I think I’ll check it out on the strength of this book alone. Highly recommended.

  

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jaymack
Member since Oct 30th 2003
1029 posts
Fri Feb-25-22 08:46 PM

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20. "Can We Address The Donuts Myth"
In response to Reply # 0
Fri Feb-25-22 08:46 PM by jaymack

  

          

So my understanding after reading this is that he actually laid out those Donuts chops and cuts on a DAW. Not a Boss SP-303 or even a 404, which seemed to be the interweb urban myth lore. Interesting.

  

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Nodima
Member since Jul 30th 2008
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Tue May-24-22 05:10 AM

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32. "Would love a follow up on this."
In response to Reply # 20


  

          

I should just buy the book, of course, but...

In the meantime...



~~~~~~~~~
"This is the streets, and I am the trap." � Jay Bilas
http://www.popmatters.com/pm/archive/contributor/517
Hip Hop Handbook: http://tinyurl.com/ll4kzz

  

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jaymack
Member since Oct 30th 2003
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Thu Jun-02-22 06:52 PM

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40. "Gotcha."
In response to Reply # 32
Thu Jun-02-22 06:53 PM by jaymack

  

          

"At first, Wolf wasn't sure what he was listening to. These weren't warm neo-soul Jay Dee beats...This kind of "time stretching" wasn't possible on an MPC. He'd done all these beats right on his laptop, via his Pro Tools software, which enabled James to see the waveforms--dice and recombine them, squeeze and stretch them--in ways he never before attempted. Created in a burst of energy after James's discharge from Cedars-Sinai in early 2005, Donuts emerged as a complete thought."

  

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Nodima
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Fri Jun-03-22 04:39 AM

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41. "Thanks! n/m"
In response to Reply # 40


  

          


~~~~~~~~~
"This is the streets, and I am the trap." � Jay Bilas
http://www.popmatters.com/pm/archive/contributor/517
Hip Hop Handbook: http://tinyurl.com/ll4kzz

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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Wed Apr-27-22 11:07 AM

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21. "About 50% through...thoughts."
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Apr-27-22 11:08 AM by LeroyBumpkin

  

          

I'll try to leave out spoilers?
I don't know.

So many thoughts:

- This is a must have book for any fan of Jay Dee or the Soulquarian era. Like most of the Soulquarian stuff I knew, but it helped to give context to how they saw Jay. Like I walked out of this even more convinced Jay Dee WAS the 2nd wave of Neo Soul. Dan's research and interviews in this book proves it.

- Had no idea some of the albums Jay Dee could have worked on, but passed.
Reading about his journey, it's like do you want to water down your art and get bigger,
or stay pure to your art but stay small?

- So much of his art is about him doing it HIS way (again, to the point above). I see a lot of myself in him in that I want the freedom to make whatever I want to make, but when your art becomes a business like this, you have to make sacrifices. I kept reading this thinking, "Dude, if you had done production on X album, the power you'd have later would have given you even more freedom."

- Kinda odd reading about his personal life. He comes off as moody and a jerk at times. If this is the detail they're going into on this, I know it's gonna be rough once I get to the part where he passes.

- Welcome Back 2 Detroit (smh)

- I have never heard this Frank & Dank album that Jay Dee produced.

- Jay Dee's wanting to be his own man (not under the Ummah, not under Soulquarians)...I get it. Again, I'm going through the same thing. But Jay Dee didn't have the structure (manager, etc) to help guide that other aspect of his career. Actually let me take that back. The ONLY structure he had was making music. Part of me wants to say "Oh, he would have gone so much further had he...", but maybe that's not what he wanted. Maybe that's me as a fan wishing more people would discover his genius. Honestly, maybe if he had ever reached those things, I would have abandoned him (he's not underground anymore...etc.).

- EDIT...oh, I still don't believe the Got 'Til' It's Gone story. Even after they explained it...ha ha.

@dseals | @digife
https://digife.com

  

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The3rdOne
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Thu Apr-28-22 10:57 AM

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22. "RE: About 50% through...thoughts."
In response to Reply # 21
Thu Apr-28-22 10:58 AM by The3rdOne

  

          

>- Kinda odd reading about his personal life. He comes off as
>moody and a jerk at times. If this is the detail they're
>going into on this, I know it's gonna be rough once I get to
>the part where he passes.
>

The footnotes describing the banter between Ma Dukes and Joy started to get cringeworthy and downright physically exhausting to listen to (I have the audiobook). The crazy thing is that I had a chance to chop it up with Ma Dukes a few months ago as she came to town. She told me that it gets deeper and there are even more documentary books being made that will delve more into personal shit. And why Househoes is even allowed to walk around without crutches is beyond me. Dave New York was gonna hang him off the balcony if he had a chance.....RIP

  

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rmcphedr
Member since Feb 11th 2006
481 posts
Tue May-24-22 06:23 AM

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33. "RE: what happened with shoes?"
In response to Reply # 22


          

curious about this...

  

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Brew
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23045 posts
Tue May-24-22 08:53 AM

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34. "^"
In response to Reply # 33


          

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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topaz
Member since Nov 28th 2002
6236 posts
Tue May-24-22 09:53 AM

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35. "He posted some really vile stuff on social media attacking Ma Dukes"
In response to Reply # 33


  

          

Basically accused her of milking Dilla's dialogue without giving much thought to Dilla's artistic vision. That's putting it nicely, his actual words were extremely foul and disrespectful, and he got beat up when he returned to Detroit after a show apparently.

-
Gang Starr / Nujabes blend - https://youtu.be/lsci1vu6ick
DOOM Tribute - https://youtu.be/qmBQ2BDefKM
Donut of the Heart cover in Javascript - https://youtu.be/afLc2CkC8lk

  

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topaz
Member since Nov 28th 2002
6236 posts
Tue May-24-22 08:33 PM

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36. "*catalogue not dialogue"
In response to Reply # 35


  

          

-
Gang Starr / Nujabes blend - https://youtu.be/lsci1vu6ick
DOOM Tribute - https://youtu.be/qmBQ2BDefKM
Donut of the Heart cover in Javascript - https://youtu.be/afLc2CkC8lk

  

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rmcphedr
Member since Feb 11th 2006
481 posts
Wed May-25-22 10:35 AM

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38. "RE: wow"
In response to Reply # 35


          

WHO THE FUCK IS YOU SHOES?

  

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Garhart Poppwell
Member since Nov 28th 2008
18037 posts
Thu Jan-19-23 09:22 PM

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51. "tried to tell yall Shoes won't shit"
In response to Reply # 35


  

          

nobody listened to me but I knew it then, the way he was carrying on after Dilla died about how they were brothers and shit like that

__________________________________________
CHOP-THESE-BITCHES!!!!
------------------------------------
Garhart Ivanhoe Poppwell
Un-OK'd moderator for The Lesson and Make The Music (yes, I do's work up in here, and in your asscrease if you run foul of this

  

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topaz
Member since Nov 28th 2002
6236 posts
Tue May-03-22 06:28 AM

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26. "RE: I have never heard this Frank & Dank album that Jay Dee produced"
In response to Reply # 21


  

          

I think the album is 48 Hours - https://music.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_nhWd7TKrCygAECCoUt68UI7OKE9_OfAhQ

What I REALLY want to hear is the original cut of the album with the samples. Anyone got that?

-
Gang Starr / Nujabes blend - https://youtu.be/lsci1vu6ick
DOOM Tribute - https://youtu.be/qmBQ2BDefKM
Donut of the Heart cover in Javascript - https://youtu.be/afLc2CkC8lk

  

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QBoogie
Member since Jun 05th 2002
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27. "RE: I have never heard this Frank & Dank album that Jay Dee produced"
In response to Reply # 26


  

          

I think it exists and is out there but I recall it turning up way after my personal hype for it dwindled.

  

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QBoogie
Member since Jun 05th 2002
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Tue May-03-22 03:17 PM

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28. "RE: I have never heard this Frank & Dank album that Jay Dee produced"
In response to Reply # 26


  

          

I think it exists and is out there but I recall it turning up way after my personal hype for it dwindled.

  

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rmcphedr
Member since Feb 11th 2006
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Wed May-25-22 04:04 AM

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37. "RE: album as a whole isn't *amazing* "
In response to Reply # 26


          

but this beat is fucking phenomenal

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZirWfHChww

  

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xangeluvr
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23. "Hardcopy or audio book? "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Are there things in the hard copy of the book that need to be visualized that I won't get from the audio book? Nowadays most books that I read are audiobooks as I'm driving to work because I don't tend to have the time to sit down with a book in hand anymore.

GamerTag and PSN: PokeEmAll

  

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seandammit
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24. "can only speak for the hard book "
In response to Reply # 23


          

There are some interesting visual diagrams used to illustrate the points about rhythm and the techniques that he employed that are pretty cool.

Another cool feature of the book is the index that lists his entire discography, which is a great/easy reference if you ever want to quickly check what he produced in, say, 2003.

www.twitter.com/seandammit

  

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xangeluvr
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25. "RE: can only speak for the hard book "
In response to Reply # 24


  

          

Hardcopy it is then

GamerTag and PSN: PokeEmAll

  

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JtothaI
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29. "RE: can only speak for the hard book "
In response to Reply # 24


  

          

>There are some interesting visual diagrams used to illustrate
>the points about rhythm and the techniques that he employed
>that are pretty cool.
>
>Another cool feature of the book is the index that lists his
>entire discography, which is a great/easy reference if you
>ever want to quickly check what he produced in, say, 2003.

There is also a spotify playlist that is in the order of the songs mentioned in the book, kind of a companion piece to the book and I believe Charnas put it together.

  

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Small Pro
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31. "damn!"
In response to Reply # 24
Mon May-23-22 10:59 AM by Small Pro

  

          

just realized i never bought the hard cover, just the audiobook. would defiinitely love a list of his productions in order...the last time i had that was on this poster: https://www.musicismysanctuary.com/j-dilla-the-specialist-lithograph-poster

--------------------------------------
https://smallprofessor.bandcamp.com

  

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Options
Member since Nov 19th 2009
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Mon May-23-22 03:43 AM

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30. "at about the 3/4 point"
In response to Reply # 0


          

been taking my sweet time working through this, and I've been really enjoying it. even though "The Life of~" is right there in the subtitle, it's MUCH more expansive than I anticipated. I always figured that at some point several books on Dilla would pop up, but after this, I don't really know what's left for anyone else to cover, haha.

I do feel like the author has used every bit of every interview, tho — I'm not particularly interested in reading about all of Dilla's cousins or the intricacies of his love life. but the highs are so very high, and having the details behind events I'm already familiar with colored in has been great. the analogies and connections made are truly excellent at times; in particular, The Matrix comparison made me put the book down for a moment in awe/appreciation of the skill on display. Charnas killed it.

by the way: anyone else come across the obviously bootleg 12" stamped with the Dilla Time cover image?

  

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spirit
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39. "A valiant effort, but I have mixed feelings"
In response to Reply # 0
Thu Jun-02-22 12:24 PM by spirit

  

          

The author’s take around page 237 that Jay Dee disliking people biting his technique was “small thinking”? WTF? Writing in the context of art form like hiphop where biting is (for a sizable contingent of participants) considered to be clown shit, that was…weird.

Would have liked to read more quotes on the record from Tip, Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis about that Got Til It’s Gone “issue” (to be honest, I don’t know who to believe after reading the book).

I could have lived without knowing a lot of the personal details (fights with significant others, cheating, etc).

The section on European versus African music was interesting, as was the Detroit street design section (although I could see how someone else might say “hey get back Dilla” I dug it).

Not sure about all the charts and the attempt to quantify Dilla’s technique so specifically (we all know generally he is playing with time and placement of the percussion, but I doubt that he was doing it the same way on every track, which is somewhat of the impression I got from the book; as if Dilla had a lab coat on and was like “there, got that hi hat exactly three milliseconds behind the fourth measure”). I think he was sequencing free hand and the elements fell where they fell. But what do I know, I don’t make beats.

Got over a hundred pages left to read. It is a quick read tho. Great for vacation reading.

  

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Nodima
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Fri Jun-03-22 04:45 AM

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42. "Did he expand on that "small thinking" thought in the book at all?"
In response to Reply # 39


  

          

It's been a minute but when he was doing the press rounds and hit a couple of the podcasts I listen to, I also remember him bringing this up (specifically the Janet Jackson/Q-Tip situation if I remember correctly) and elaborating that if Dilla had been a little more willing to swallow his pride artistically or even just professionally, there were a lot of doors opened to him that he either chose to ignore or personally slammed shut, but that he was so consistent about it people pretty quickly chalked that up to Dilla being Dilla and mostly stopped trying to build bridges for/to him because of it so he got stuck as an underdog that didn't necessarily have to be.



It'd be kinda weird if the book didn't get into that much considering it was one of the more significant things I remember from when this book was dropping. I think that conversation might've even specifically been on the NY Times Popcast with Jon Caramanica.


~~~~~~~~~
"This is the streets, and I am the trap." � Jay Bilas
http://www.popmatters.com/pm/archive/contributor/517
Hip Hop Handbook: http://tinyurl.com/ll4kzz

  

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spirit
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43. "For about a page but mostly as an extended aside"
In response to Reply # 42


  

          

Basically the author seem to feel like Dilla’s techniques were an “idea” he put out into the universe that was “bigger than him” which strikes me as bullshit. I wonder how the author would feel if someone took whole passages from this book and put it in another book, with minimal changes, and said “thanks for putting that idea out there” LOL

Also just got to the part where he claimed DOOM said at the service for Dilla that he had a dream that Dilla wanted to do a posthumous album with him and let him keep most of the royalties. Saying something like that, after DOOM is dead and can’t defend himself, strikes me as a violation.

I also don’t like how so much of the book is devoted to Dilla’s health struggle. Between that and all the print devoted to Dilla’s interpersonal “drama” makes the book feel almost like a tabloid

Peace,

Spirit (Alan)
http://wutangbook.com

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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46. "I disagree with this."
In response to Reply # 43


  

          

>Also just got to the part where he claimed DOOM said at the
>service for Dilla that he had a dream that Dilla wanted to do
>a posthumous album with him and let him keep most of the
>royalties. Saying something like that, after DOOM is dead and
>can’t defend himself, strikes me as a violation.

Dan Charnas was meticulous about his sources for events. Between events that happened in studio sessions all the way to the drama between his baby mother and his mother. So I'd find it very difficult to believe he's include that DOOM moment as his memorial without sourcing it from a variety of people. I mean, other people were there. That's not something that would be difficult to verify.


>I also don’t like how so much of the book is devoted to
>Dilla’s health struggle. Between that and all the print
>devoted to Dilla’s interpersonal “drama” makes the book
>feel almost like a tabloid

Definitely disagree here. His health issues and how his career ended are intertwined. You can't tell one story without the other. There's been a entire myth built around Jay Dee making Donuts from his hospital bed with his mother massaging his fingers so he could continue to make beats. All untrue. Also the most illuminating part of the book for me was how much Jay Dee ignored his health condition later in his career. That European trip? The South American trip? I was reading and thinking, "Oh wait, no they didn't let this dude get on a plane to Europe!" All of this is part of the story.

@dseals | @digife
https://digife.com

  

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spirit
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47. "RE: I disagree with this."
In response to Reply # 46


  

          

“ His health issues and how his career ended are intertwined. ”


He kept working until he died. His health issues didn’t end his career, death did. That’s a pretty weird analysis. Death ends everyone’s career LOL

That still doesn’t justify spending that much time in the book on Dilla being in the hospital. He needed to sleep in order for his brain to have the capacity to keep working well enough to make beats. Should the author have dedicated twenty pages to describing Dilla’s mattress, the thread count of his sheets, and his preferred sleeping position?

Peace,

Spirit (Alan)
http://wutangbook.com

  

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spirit
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48. "You missed the point on my DOOM comment"
In response to Reply # 46


  

          

1) unless you can corroborate the sourcing or you personally eyewitnessed what happened, your “counter argument” is guesswork.

2) Even if he had a dozen ironclad sources corroborating, DOOM is dead and what he included in the book is unnecessary to the story he was trying to tell, so he could have left it out. Maybe decency is an old school concept now.

Peace,

Spirit (Alan)
http://wutangbook.com

  

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Numba_33
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49. "This is probably a fairly dumb question"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

But would someone that is a cursory Dilla admirer get great insight from this book or is this only for folks that are truly devoted fans of his? I happen to like some of the stuff he did for non-okayplayer and non-Detroit folks (De La Stakes is High material, Pharcyde's second album, that one Chino XL track from a while ago), but for the most part didn't like stuff he did for his solo records or okayplayer related ventures outside of Dynamite for The Roots.

I promise I'm not trying to troll and I don't mean any disrespect given that the man is dead.

"Sean sparks like John Starks, nah, Sean ball like John Wall" - Rest In Power Forever Sean Price.

  

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seandammit
Member since May 28th 2003
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Thu Jan-19-23 04:55 PM

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50. "I think even if you're casual fan you will get something from it "
In response to Reply # 49


          

It's just extremely well-written, researched, and illuminative. I consider myself a hardcore fan and still learned a lot, so I think it's really something that anybody can get into.

www.twitter.com/seandammit

  

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Options
Member since Nov 19th 2009
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Fri Jan-20-23 05:08 AM

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52. "there's a lot here — you'll get something from it"
In response to Reply # 49


          

just know that you'll also probably miss a lot if you aren't knowledgeable about most of Dilla's catalogue.

that being said, you may find the backstories and context interesting even if you don't love all of the music itself.

  

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makaveli
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53. "I would say it's great for anyone who loves music honestly "
In response to Reply # 49


  

          

I'm reading right now and loving it.

“So back we go to these questions — friendship, character… ethics.”

  

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