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Subject: "PE/Bomb Squad’s lack of influence is what makes them so dope" Previous topic | Next topic
Zarathuckya
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Mon Jun-13-16 02:41 AM

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"PE/Bomb Squad’s lack of influence is what makes them so dope"


  

          

I’ve heard it stated around here before that PE and the Bomb Squad have had little in the way of influence in terms of people copying or being influenced by their production style, and or social commentary.

Just speaking on the first of those, the Bomb Squad’s style of production – perhaps the reason so few have copied that style is firstly because it’s such a hard style to master.

Another reason no doubt is that the sampling laws made that more difficult. But that didn’t stop people sampling at all. So PE’s style could technically still be achieved; nevertheless, people didn’t go there.

So what I’m saying is its works of art like that, that do some shit that is so original that it is un-biteable, say Saafir’s whole style, or Freestyle Fellowship, ODB, Cappadonna on Winter Warz – the stuff hasn’t been replicated – some of that should be held up as much as those whose influence is easily observed, e.g. Dilla and his impact on drum programming etc.

I digressed a bit but what I’m trying to say is that the Bomb Squad/PE is up there with Dilla and Primo etc, despite PE’s lesser influence.

Actually, come to think of it, the fact that so few picked up on social commentary based hip hop, or did it to the extent that PE did - that lack of influence shouldn't be seen as a strike against PE. That's a strike against everyone else really; and it's a further reason why PE is the shit.

Their lack of influence, musically and subject matter wise, it what makes them one of the illest ever.

I saw this presentation by Hank Shocklee which inspired this post:

Hank Shocklee: Musical Influences on the Makings of Public Enemy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xbOE_FJ6Oo8

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
Real shit...
Jun 13th 2016
1
my nigga if u ever tried to recreate one of them pe beats
Jun 13th 2016
2
I feel Dre may be one of those who came closest, mainly on
Jun 13th 2016
3
RE: I feel Dre may be one of those who came closest, mainly on
Jun 13th 2016
4
Good observation. And Cube IMMEDIATELY went to them when..
Jun 13th 2016
6
Came in here to say exactly this.
Aug 02nd 2022
13
I Will Say Terminator X's "Valley Of The Jeep Beets" Was Crazy
Jun 13th 2016
5
man....thank you.
Jun 13th 2016
7
RE: I Will Say Terminator X's "Valley Of The Jeep Beets" Was Crazy
Jun 13th 2016
8
It wasn't a great ALBUM but...
Aug 10th 2022
17
El-P gets compared to Bomb Squad pretty often in
Jul 31st 2022
9
BTW, New Jack Swing Beats were around from that era
Aug 01st 2022
10
Lack of influence? THE BOMB SQUAD?
Aug 01st 2022
11
^ for horn samples alone
Aug 01st 2022
12
I think by influence, they're referring to the lack of imitators
Aug 08th 2022
14
No mention of Ice Cube's Boogie Men or DJ Muggs? Interesting
Aug 09th 2022
15
Good points
Aug 09th 2022
16
anything that sounded chaotic
Aug 10th 2022
18
Run the Jewels production reminds me of the Bomb Squad.
Aug 11th 2022
19

Boogie Stimuli
Member since Sep 24th 2010
14000 posts
Mon Jun-13-16 02:54 AM

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1. "Real shit..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

>Actually, come to think of it, the fact that so few picked up
>on social commentary based hip hop, or did it to the extent
>that PE did - that lack of influence shouldn't be seen as a
>strike against PE. That's a strike against everyone else
>really; and it's a further reason why PE is the shit.

^^^ Perfectly stated.

I also agree that a lack of people biting your
style doesn't necessarily mean it wasn't great.
Sometimes it just means your shit ain't that
easy to master. I've felt this way for a long
time about certain artists and styles. Alotta
artists do falsetto, because it's easy... much
easier than the discipline it takes to sing like
Luther Vandross. Damn near ANYbody with any
chops can pull off a falsetto.

Definitely not shitting on the great, but alotta
people bit Prince because it's easy to throw a Linn
drum kick in your beat and sing falsetto. Who was
biting his guitar playing tho?
Alotta people tried to bite MJ's singing style but very
few could master his dancing, because his dancing
wasn't easily mastered. Some stuff is just style,
but truly disciplined accomplishments aren't easy
to bite.




~
~
~
~
~
Days like this I miss Sha Mecca

  

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LAbeathustla
Member since Jan 24th 2004
33858 posts
Mon Jun-13-16 11:16 AM

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2. "my nigga if u ever tried to recreate one of them pe beats"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

with all the sampled songs right in front of you then you know why on the production side..

------------------------------------
2019 CABG Survivor

2016 OK Survivor Champion

be about it or be without it

RIP GOATs

  

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-DJ R-Tistic-
Member since Nov 06th 2008
51981 posts
Mon Jun-13-16 11:32 AM

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3. "I feel Dre may be one of those who came closest, mainly on"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

"Straight outta Compton." That song sounds way more Bomb Squad than anything else L.A. made at the time. "Murder Rap" also feels a bit like it came from their template

------------------------------

50+ FREE Mixes on www.DJR-Tistic.com!

Twitter and Instagram - @DJ_RTistic

  

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LAbeathustla
Member since Jan 24th 2004
33858 posts
Mon Jun-13-16 12:18 PM

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4. "RE: I feel Dre may be one of those who came closest, mainly on"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

>"Straight outta Compton." That song sounds way more Bomb
>Squad than anything else L.A. made at the time. "Murder Rap"
>also feels a bit like it came from their template


good ones...definitely those were influenced by bomb squad

------------------------------------
2019 CABG Survivor

2016 OK Survivor Champion

be about it or be without it

RIP GOATs

  

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liveguy
Member since Jan 01st 2004
8002 posts
Mon Jun-13-16 06:47 PM

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6. "Good observation. And Cube IMMEDIATELY went to them when.."
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

he left NWA, so there is some truth to that.

That sound was not something many could duplicate, which is why most didn't even try...

Their stuff was way too intricate for most people to even understand, let alone attempt to copy.

We see through all that boo boo like it's ghost shit... (c) Quelle Chris

| http://liveguy.bandcamp.com |
| www.soundcloud.com/liveguy |
| www.twitter.com/liveguy |
| www.instagram.com/theREALliveguy |
| XBOX ONE GT: theREALliveguy |

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
24375 posts
Tue Aug-02-22 10:40 AM

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13. "Came in here to say exactly this."
In response to Reply # 3


          

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Dj Joey Joe
Member since Sep 01st 2007
13770 posts
Mon Jun-13-16 06:21 PM

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5. "I Will Say Terminator X's "Valley Of The Jeep Beets" Was Crazy "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

The way they had that shit sounding was crazy with the stereophonics and still is, some times they would have the same sample playing at different speeds like 95.0 bpm on the right channel and 85.5 bpm on left every 2 bars, shit like that nobody was really doing, or having layered samples while one was in stereo in the back but have some mono sample in the front with reverb but have other samples in between with no efx or in one channel comin' in at different times but never the same time.

Now that's what I call layering and mixing cause they paid attention to that shit, it's tedious work doing that for a song after song.


https://tinyurl.com/y4ba6hog

---------
"We in here talking about later career Prince records
& your fool ass is cruising around in a time machine
trying to collect props for a couple of sociopathic degenerates" - s.blak

  

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rorschach
Member since Nov 10th 2004
7723 posts
Mon Jun-13-16 07:50 PM

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7. "man....thank you."
In response to Reply # 5


  

          

You just put me on to a dope album. I never heard this until you mentioned it.

---------------------------------------


---------------------------------------

  

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Lil Rabies
Member since Oct 12th 2005
1586 posts
Mon Jun-13-16 07:56 PM

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8. "RE: I Will Say Terminator X's "Valley Of The Jeep Beets" Was Crazy "
In response to Reply # 5


  

          

I have to revisit this. Had the tape back in day.

Taking shots in the dark/that's a bad call
Going straight for your head/ gotta saw it off

  

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handle
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18917 posts
Wed Aug-10-22 09:03 AM

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17. "It wasn't a great ALBUM but..."
In response to Reply # 5


          


Buck Whylin' , as the single, is still my favorite song from it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZO-6YAWbG8

But it was a little too "current" and now is dated on other songs:
Terminator X - Homey Don't Play Dat (Feat. Bonnie 'N' Clyde)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKvl1kzbp-k


Some of it LEGIT sounds like music tracks the didn't use on Fear:
Terminator X - back to the scene of the bass
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GJCmVwGJrc


The followup album Super Bad wasn't it for me.

------------


Gone: My Discogs collection for The Roots:
http://www.discogs.com/user/tomhayes-roots/collection

  

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Adwhizz
Member since Nov 12th 2003
40916 posts
Sun Jul-31-22 01:40 PM

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9. "El-P gets compared to Bomb Squad pretty often in"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

terms of how his beats sound kinda chaotic and Bombastic, and his lyrics often are political

Him linking up with Killa Mike just furthered strengthened comparisons

R.I.P. Loud But Wrong Guy
Dec 29th 2009 - Dec 17th 2017

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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49335 posts
Mon Aug-01-22 03:36 PM

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10. "BTW, New Jack Swing Beats were around from that era"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Not sure who influenced who but listeners, in general, were more capable of appreciating chaotic beats back in the day.



**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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Garhart Poppwell
Member since Nov 28th 2008
18111 posts
Mon Aug-01-22 06:02 PM

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11. "Lack of influence? THE BOMB SQUAD?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

>I’ve heard it stated around here before that PE and the
>Bomb Squad have had little in the way of influence in terms of
>people copying or being influenced by their production style,
>and or social commentary.
>
>Just speaking on the first of those, the Bomb Squad’s style
>of production – perhaps the reason so few have copied that
>style is firstly because it’s such a hard style to master.
>
>Another reason no doubt is that the sampling laws made that
>more difficult. But that didn’t stop people sampling at all.
>So PE’s style could technically still be achieved;
>nevertheless, people didn’t go there.
>
>So what I’m saying is its works of art like that, that do
>some shit that is so original that it is un-biteable, say
>Saafir’s whole style, or Freestyle Fellowship, ODB,
>Cappadonna on Winter Warz – the stuff hasn’t been
>replicated – some of that should be held up as much as those
>whose influence is easily observed, e.g. Dilla and his impact
>on drum programming etc.
>
>I digressed a bit but what I’m trying to say is that the
>Bomb Squad/PE is up there with Dilla and Primo etc, despite
>PE’s lesser influence.
>
>Actually, come to think of it, the fact that so few picked up
>on social commentary based hip hop, or did it to the extent
>that PE did - that lack of influence shouldn't be seen as a
>strike against PE. That's a strike against everyone else
>really; and it's a further reason why PE is the shit.
>
>Their lack of influence, musically and subject matter wise, it
>what makes them one of the illest ever.
>
>I saw this presentation by Hank Shocklee which inspired this
>post:
>
>Hank Shocklee: Musical Influences on the Makings of Public
>Enemy
>
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xbOE_FJ6Oo8
>


__________________________________________
CHOP-THESE-BITCHES!!!!
------------------------------------
Garhart Ivanhoe Poppwell
Un-OK'd moderator for The Lesson and Make The Music (yes, I do's work up in here, and in your asscrease if you run foul of this

  

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Roadblock
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Mon Aug-01-22 08:32 PM

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12. "^ for horn samples alone"
In response to Reply # 11
Mon Aug-01-22 08:34 PM by Roadblock

  

          

once Rebel Without a Pause hit piercing horn loops became pandemic throughout Hip hop

@GetoutTheroom
http://getouttheroom.podomatic.com
******************************************
https://twitter.com/Jayric

  

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obsidianchrysalis
Member since Jan 29th 2003
8740 posts
Mon Aug-08-22 07:39 PM

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14. "I think by influence, they're referring to the lack of imitators"
In response to Reply # 11
Mon Aug-08-22 07:39 PM by obsidianchrysalis

  

          

Like there are a million and one G-Funk producers and even more boom-bap producers by way of Premier or RZA. (very few of them coming close to the level of mastery shown by the originators)

But outside of the examples listed above, there was no copycat of The Bomb Squad. For a group with such a revolutionary and marketable sound (PE was the #1 selling group of their time, right?) and in a genre that bites as much as hip-hop (although not as much as the time The Bomb Squad was active) it's remarkable that no one tried to ape their style much less take it in a new or fresh direction.

That is a sign of a truly unique take on music.

<--- Me when my head hits the pillow

  

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chincheckin
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Tue Aug-09-22 11:48 AM

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15. "No mention of Ice Cube's Boogie Men or DJ Muggs? Interesting"
In response to Reply # 0


          

The Boogie Men (Sir Jinx, DJ Pooh, and DJ Bobcat) were considered The Bomb Squad-West in the early '90s

Check out the following albums:
Ice Cube - multiple albums (Kill At Will, Death Certificate, Th Predator)
Yo-Yo - Make Way for the Motherlode and Black Pearl
Del The Funke Homosapien - I Wish My Brother George Was Here
Threat

Then you had DJ Muggs (of Cypress Hill)

Cypress Hill - their early 90's stuff definitely sounds like some Bomb Squad shit
House Of Pain - Fine Malt Lyrics

http://soundcloud.com/deemack1

  

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obsidianchrysalis
Member since Jan 29th 2003
8740 posts
Tue Aug-09-22 11:16 PM

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16. "Good points"
In response to Reply # 15


  

          

I forgot about those producers.

<--- Me when my head hits the pillow

  

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FunkyBoss
Member since Aug 31st 2002
1198 posts
Wed Aug-10-22 07:22 PM

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18. "anything that sounded chaotic"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I was like, oh that's bomb squad influenced

  

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tariqhu
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Thu Aug-11-22 12:58 PM

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19. "Run the Jewels production reminds me of the Bomb Squad."
In response to Reply # 18


          

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

  

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