This isn't to diminish his accomplishments at all. I'm a big fan. L was the first BIG solo rap star and the blueprint for so many that followed. He's on the Mount Rushmore of rap music, IMO.

And when I say THAT status, I mean rap dudes that my 60 year old, suburban mom and her friends know about. That when you ask the average, white collar dude on the street to name a rapper, he comes up. Pop icon shit.

Basically, Jay-Z, Eminem, Snoop Dogg level, where it transcends music and they're just known (I'd include Big and Pac, but we know their legacy is cemented as much by their death and what's been made of it)

Was hip hop too young when he was in his prime? The machine that propels one to that level wasn't quite in full swing just yet? Did he lack that ONE big hit that got on the radar of people who otherwise avoid hip hop like the plague? Too much spotty material? Was he too involved in side projects (Hollywood)?

Or did he and I just don't see it?

This is spun from a discussion with a friend of mine about which rapper someone would name if they were asked, randomly on the street, to drop ONE name, and I realized that I didn't think LL would come up amongst a lot of people.

___________________________
OL' DIRTY BASTARD on himself:
"I may curse, I may have a bad mouth, whatever whatever. I'm not that bad, yaknow'mean. Bad to y'all, I dunno how y'all... I don't give a fuck. Um, I'm a good person at heart, for real and shit.

.

___________________________
OL' DIRTY BASTARD on himself:
"I may curse, I may have a bad mouth, whatever whatever. I'm not that bad, yaknow'mean. Bad to y'all, I dunno how y'all... I don't give a fuck. Um, I'm a good person at heart, for real and shit.

No sure why he would. He has had a legendary career. He built Def Jam. He is an icon. Jay-Z is just an overall better MC after LL did Mr. Smith he faded. Jigga at that point (few years later) took the streets, then the clubs, then pop culture. LL is still dope when he want to be but he has always stayed away from Premo, Pete Rock, and some beat makers that could make him stand out ...get with some Just Blaze and Kanye.... He will not do it...trust me, if he did he could make a little noise still...

He might be a little jealous of jigga though..lol

"Highly developed spirits often encounter resistance from mediocre minds."-Albert Einstein

http://twitter.com/#!/TonyHanesPoetry

Marley in '90

Trackmasters in the mid 90's

Puffy and the Hitmen after that

Timbaland in '04 (last good album, IMO)

___________________________
OL' DIRTY BASTARD on himself:
"I may curse, I may have a bad mouth, whatever whatever. I'm not that bad, yaknow'mean. Bad to y'all, I dunno how y'all... I don't give a fuck. Um, I'm a good person at heart, for real and shit.

Yeah.....you got a point


I was just saying more chill beats to show lyrically ability that people sleep on

"Highly developed spirits often encounter resistance from mediocre minds."-Albert Einstein

http://twitter.com/#!/TonyHanesPoetry

he's made 10+ records
wrote a book
done movies
still on TV
hosting award shows

i' think he's ok with how things turned out

>he's made 10+ records
>wrote a book
>done movies
>still on TV
>hosting award shows
>
>i' think he's ok with how things turned out
indeed.


Cats actin' like LL is eating outta garbage cans.

______________



http://www.windimoto.com


http://ten2one.wordpress.com/ <-FEB

http://wallpapershi.net/wallpapers/2012/01/boba-fett-star-wars-star-wars-boba-fett-movie-anime-1080x1920.jpg

People always gonna downplay him b/c of his girl joints and beefs but not many have his track record or respect.

Sidebar: He's in the studio again...after the record w/Busta (Killin Em...where he killed busta) and the joint w/Ne-Yo (which was alright) I really want another LP....but it comes down to who's doing the beats.

phemom's the name, all-star writer/
searching 4 journalistic fame, mindframe igniter....www.twitter.com/hayabusaage

yep..I agree 100%

"Highly developed spirits often encounter resistance from mediocre minds."-Albert Einstein

http://twitter.com/#!/TonyHanesPoetry

______________________________________

Navem nu, cuando sol
Tutu nu, vondo nos nu
Vita em, no continous non
Nos nu ekta nos sepe ta, amen

When the sun shades the ship
We sweat and life is not safe
To swim or to touch not
When we unite we hedge amen

It's an age thing to me. LL always come up when me and my friends talk about hip hop. I'm 36. One of my co workers told me recently that LL was top 5 and his favorite MC so I believe its more of an age thing. I dont think LL could be any more popular than he is now. He was HUGE in the 80's, big comeback records in 90's, rap battles, TV shows, movies etc. He is an icon and looked at by old heads as a dope MC.

"Highly developed spirits often encounter resistance from mediocre minds."-Albert Einstein

http://twitter.com/#!/TonyHanesPoetry

I mean he's on his 2nd starring tv show and has been in tons of big Hollywood films.

I say this as an 18 y/o.

Everyone knows LL, he's like the archetype of rapper.

I ask my grandmother who hasn't bought an album since Aretha to name some rappers, she'll say Puff Daddy, LL Cool J, and Kurtis Blow.

If anything LL is at that level, he was one of the first I'd hazard to guess.

/tangent kinda anecdotal though

When I was playing in academic quiz bowls in highschool, I remember I won a match answering a question about LL Cool J.

This rap superstar's name originated from how much Ladies loved cool james.
^^^^^^^^

I GEEKED hard lol.
My Hip-Hop knowledge got us the trophy .

I never heard a question about Jay-Z though, Eminem had one though.

He doesn't have an Illmatic, Reasonable Doubt, Doggystyle, Life after death, Get rich or die trying (impact wise, not saying the quality here was amazing/groundbreaking), or a Chronic.

Song wise....he has some songs that are classic as hell, but still no Nothin but a G thang, Juicy, Empire state of mind, Peter Piper, or even Humpty Dance. Even though everybody knows him, old old folks and younger folks may not be able to mention a song from him.

He's comparable to Will Smith, except his Rap career was much better and Will's acting career was MUCH much better...so Will wins, but they're still similar in that they came in the 80's and started as rappers, and are now known more for what they've done outside of Rap.

------------------------------

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>
>Song wise....he has some songs that are classic as hell, but
>still no Nothin but a G thang, Juicy, Empire state of mind,
>Peter Piper, or even Humpty Dance. Even though everybody knows
>him, old old folks and younger folks may not be able to
>mention a song from him.


I disagree with this...big time

jingling babies?....that was major. fucking a hip hop anthem the year it dropped

I;m bad? ...major, major

when LL dropped, he was the fucking boss of shit ...He was the first rapper to start the BOSS Run...everything was LL

I need love?


Booming System??

Around the way girl???

Mama Said knock you out? ....

He murdered that entire year!....

shit humpty aint bigger than most of the songs, neither is peter piper.


Those were serious chart toppers and anthems for LL...

I shot ya???

4,3,2,1????????

come on, man

fucking flavor in your ear remix?????

BUT.............are ANY of his songs as big as those there??? ANY??

Jingling babies, Booming system, NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOWHERE near.

I'm bad and I need love are closest...probably I need love, but even that isn't one of those songs that EVERYBODY of all ages and races knows like the songs I listed.

So yeah, I ride with that. If you look at a list of the top 10 or 20 biggest, most famous Rap songs of all time, he probably won't have anything in there...maybe I need love scrapes it. A Top 100, he might have 5-6.

------------------------------

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Everybody knows that song, don't they?

exactly, dude is bugging hard

from the 80's didn't get to reach the level of the huge songs in the 90's did. So at the time, for sure...shit might have been one of the biggest 3-4 Rap songs ever at that point. And you still hear it in commercials n shit.

------------------------------

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I'm not an asshole. I hear what you are saying , and I do understand, but be very careful with how you word stuff.


because: LL COOL IS HARD AS HELL

lol

>>
>>Song wise....he has some songs that are classic as hell, but
>>still no Nothin but a G thang, Juicy, Empire state of mind,
>>Peter Piper, or even Humpty Dance. Even though everybody
>knows
>>him, old old folks and younger folks may not be able to
>>mention a song from him.
>
>
>I disagree with this...big time
>
>jingling babies?....that was major. fucking a hip hop anthem
>the year it dropped
>
>I;m bad? ...major, major
>
>when LL dropped, he was the fucking boss of shit ...He was the
>first rapper to start the BOSS Run...everything was LL
>
>I need love?
>
>
>Booming System??
>
>Around the way girl???
>
>Mama Said knock you out? ....
>
>He murdered that entire year!....
>
>shit humpty aint bigger than most of the songs, neither is
>peter piper.
>
>
>Those were serious chart toppers and anthems for LL...
>
>I shot ya???
>
>4,3,2,1????????
>
>come on, man
>
>fucking flavor in your ear remix?????
>

I meant baby

lol

I didn't catch that at first...I can't stop laughin!!

>He doesn't have an Illmatic, Reasonable Doubt, Doggystyle,
>Life after death, Get rich or die trying (impact wise, not
>saying the quality here was amazing/groundbreaking), or a
>Chronic.
>

"Bigger and Deffer" is one of Hip-Hop's greatest Solo albums. Period.


>Song wise....he has some songs that are classic as hell, but
>still no Nothin but a G thang, Juicy, Empire state of mind,
>Peter Piper, or even Humpty Dance.


You must've never heard "I'm Bad", "Jack The Ripper" ( which is one of the best diss tracks EVAR), "Around The Way Girl","Going Back To Cali", "I Can't Live Without my Radio"...I could keep going.

Even though everybody knows
>him, old old folks and younger folks may not be able to
>mention a song from him.

That's not true. I'd put money on it. ( and seriously. Who gives a shit if "old old people" like Hip-Hop? I don't see how that factors in. )




>

>He's comparable to Will Smith, except his Rap career was much
>better and Will's acting career was MUCH much better...so Will
>wins, but they're still similar in that they came in the 80's
>and started as rappers, and are now known more for what
>they've done outside of Rap.

You're kinda reducing one of the legends of Hip-Hop to playing the sidekick on a couple episodes of "NCIS", but yeah, I see where you're headed.

______________



http://www.windimoto.com


http://ten2one.wordpress.com/ <-FEB

http://wallpapershi.net/wallpapers/2012/01/boba-fett-star-wars-star-wars-boba-fett-movie-anime-1080x1920.jpg

fuck

I forgot about " going back to cali" ...off the less than zero soundtrack

Without hit albums by LL and other pioneers, the success achieved by the later rappers wouldn't have been possible. Plus... You mentioned Illmatic and (?) Reasonable Doubt--two albums that took a looooong time to go platinum. Not to mention that the artists for those albums abandoned their more street-level style in search of crossover success that LL had already had for several years and several albums by that point.

Respect the architects.

he might not be seen in the same way as the others.

Even here, you don't hear him being talked about as much as the others. I was shocked to see everybody here say that "I need love" was corny as hell...I'd never heard that before, and never believed it.

I would say that if anything, maybe he came too soon, since most of the main legends and notable albums/mega hit songs came in the 90's.

------------------------------

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who said " I need love" is corny as hell"?

People here were saying that a lot of folks thought so when it came out...I was like wait, for real??

------------------------------

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i was a lil dude in the movie theatre when krush groove was out...those few seconds with earl was a all time hip hop moment you had to be there i guess,,,,and remember ll was like a potsie cunningham suburban hollis queens type...where like a contemporary like grap was from a rough fuckin block in queens corona i think like just ice just a fucked up block not queensbridge projects but not far from it...kool g rap was a wild teen that nigga cut school held guns smoke after hour spots, not ll, he pro;;y was out just as late but he was doing shit like talent shoes and malt shops stayin away from the stone and robert types

STOP IT DUMMY.

Mama Said Knock You Out is a classic, and he's got hits that people go crazy over...and yes, they are comparable better than some of the other hits u named...

....

"yes, sometimes my rhymes are sexist, but you lovely bitches and hos should know i'm tryin to correct it"- hiphopopotamus

Radio, BAD and Mama Said were huge. The Critics love Mama and esp Radio!!

So, I'm unsure one can say LL never had a classic or iconic album.

LL is a Top 10 MC. Period.*

*And I'm not even that big of a fan of his.

http://unprogrammedminds.wordpress.com/

No one in the history of hip hop has had a greater run then LL ...no one

From like 1984-2006




22 years of putting out bangers( underground and chart hits)


no one!


LL is the greatest all-around MC of all time ( movies, battles,concerts)

LL never gave a wack concert performance

you want battle rhymes- you got it
Love song rhymes- you got it
move the crowd rhymes - you got it!

Yeah he is the GOAT Hip Hop artist not Jay Z. He came up and won during the most competitive times in Hip Hop in the 80s and 90s and did cool during Hip Hop's weakest era of the 00s.

I know loads of white people, white people who don't listen to hip hop, who know of him. And they know him as "the rapper on tv," "the safe rapper for their kids to listen to," "the rapper whose work they are casually familiar with (Mama Said Knock You Out, songs with Boyz II Men, a couple other hits of his)."
I think the reason he's not included with your list is because he was THAT rapper before Jay-Z, Eminem, etc. Most of the white folks I know were familiar with him from the movies, tv, "being famous," before Eminem came out and before Jay-Z appealed to white folks.


"Your current frequencies of understanding outweigh that which has been given for you to understand." Saul Williams

because LL has spread his brand out into other areas beyond music.

------------------------------

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yep, who you think is watching his tv show...people over 50!!

Booming system hit number 1 on the rap singles and 48 on billboard hot 100s when it dropped


peter piper wasn't even released as a single


Mama Said Knock You Out (song):

The song was included in The Rock and Roll Hall of Fame's 500 Songs that Shaped Rock and Roll.

song went gold, and was number 17 on the billboard 100s

YALL NIGGAS ARE BUGGING

Around the way girl:


Chart (1991) Peak
position
Billboard Hot 100 9
Billboard Hot R&B/Hip-Hop Singles & Tracks 5
Billboard Hot Rap Singles 1
Billboard Hot Dance Music/Maxi-Singles Sales 7
Billboard Dance Music/Club Play Singles 7

and it went gold.


STOP BUGGIN!

LL COOL J is the GOAT Rapper Ever.

got the stats got the jewlery

forget him being a Rapper for a second how many R&B,Pop,country acts,etc.. you know who hit in the 80's,90's and 00's??

if that ain't reaching the status i don't know what is.

bro Man hosting grammys

Bro Man got the songs

got the albums

got the live game

still got the baddest unplugged show Eva IMO

i'll put his catelog up against any other rapper period and he will Win.

ain't nobody seeing him for the run he had.

LL can do his hits from the 80's and 90's and hold it down for a good solid 2 plus hours.

Lay Z does his hits from the 80's and he will get cracker jack and no prizes tossed at him.

LL stayed in his lane and he could battle you or he could be smooth.

he changed the game period.

mistermaxxx R.Kelly, Michael Jackson,Stevie wonder,Rick James,Marvin Gaye,El Debarge, Barry WHite Lionel RIchie,Isleys EWF,Lady T.,Kid creole and coconuts,the crusaders,kc sunshine band,bee gees,jW,sd,NE,JB

Miami Heat, New York Yankees,buffalo bills

Just that, in my experience, he isn't recognized on that same level among common folks as the names I mentioned are.

___________________________
OL' DIRTY BASTARD on himself:
"I may curse, I may have a bad mouth, whatever whatever. I'm not that bad, yaknow'mean. Bad to y'all, I dunno how y'all... I don't give a fuck. Um, I'm a good person at heart, for real and shit.

Eminem was on this Elvis Presley of Hip Hop tip

Jay Z came after Biggie and also the corporate boutqiue label and also the persona,etc..


Snoop associated with Dr Dre and the west coast and alot of other factors.

you see LL came along during a time where your mouthpiece was your hype and your music was your center piece and the end all be all.

He wasn't marketed as those cats.

it truly was a different era and you have to make note of that.

like i said to you before how many other rappers from his era exactly giving that kind of shine?

he did Tv, film, however LL wasn't controversial as those others either.

Jigga had his case and whatnot and of course his cut throat dealings with Damon dash,etc.. never trust Lay Z the camal will walk funny on you with money

eminem had drama and it added to his legacy be good or bad depending on whom you talk to

Snoop had his drama,etc.

LL had issues with def jam but we are talking like 20 years deep and he finished up his business and kept his business on the low low.

and you might not agree but without controversy that has hurt LL in reaching those certain heights you are talking about.

mistermaxxx R.Kelly, Michael Jackson,Stevie wonder,Rick James,Marvin Gaye,El Debarge, Barry WHite Lionel RIchie,Isleys EWF,Lady T.,Kid creole and coconuts,the crusaders,kc sunshine band,bee gees,jW,sd,NE,JB

Miami Heat, New York Yankees,buffalo bills

>
>Lay Z does his hits from the 80's and he will get cracker jack
>and no prizes tossed at him.

This post was paid for by the following.

www.twitter.com/13Rose
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www.mothergreen.com

Remember MJ The Great!
PSN: ThirteenRose

when he takes on a movie role as a gay character and gets that oscar nom, he'll be will smith, latifa, and marky mark status.

until then, he's rubbing elbows with ice-t.

Happy 50th D’Angelo: https://chrisp.bandcamp.com/track/d-50

------------------------------

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I might be very wrong about him not having songs that were MEGA hits like some of the others I listed...but regardless, there's no way in hell that I'm dissing him or showing a lack of respect. Some of y'all, mainly All Stah, need to realize that shit for sure.

I do feel that LL is one of the biggest Rap stars as a whole, especially outside of Rap...so in a way, the OP is wrong. But at the same time, I realize that he's NEVER mentioned with the "Greats" or anyone's Top 5 and Top 10 lists. I always see Nas, Jay, Rakim, KRS, sometimes Eminem, Black Thought (on OKP, of course), sometimes Kool G, a few others....but NEVER LL. So all I did was gave a few reasons to why this might be the case.

Seems like nobody ever mentions his albums in the way that they mention those major albums I listed...can't tell me I'm wrong. With the songs, I do feel that "Mama said knock you out" "I'm bad" and "I need love" were HUGE, yet because of the era (and possibly my age but eff y'all for saying it), it feels like they may not have been as huge as some of the 90's and 2000's major singles that were literally every damn where. I'm also the same guy who said Jay never had a MAJOR huge single before "Empire state of mind" although he had a whole lot of big singles.

So yea...just had to clarify. I know how y'all are...I'll be in a whole diff post, and y'all will pop up like "what??? You said Terrence Trent D'Arby ain't at the same level as Prince? Well you're the same idiot who said Nelly was better than LL." That's typical Lesson style...so let me dead that shit.

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now mind you I dug Rakim more, and there are a few other cats in the argument, however when you factor in the whole nine,impact and career ain't nobody seeing no LL COOL J.

that ole Octopus Liver Lip jive turkey Lay Z can't carry LL's Chap Stick.

Nas neither and Nas IMO wanted to be like LL in the worst way as have others they just ain't admit it.

mistermaxxx R.Kelly, Michael Jackson,Stevie wonder,Rick James,Marvin Gaye,El Debarge, Barry WHite Lionel RIchie,Isleys EWF,Lady T.,Kid creole and coconuts,the crusaders,kc sunshine band,bee gees,jW,sd,NE,JB

Miami Heat, New York Yankees,buffalo bills

I agree. I think he is the greatest HIP HOP ARTIST OF ALL TIME

NOT GREATEST MC OFF ALL TIME.


There were a lot of MCs, lyrically, better than LL.

also, nas didn't want to be like LL...Nas took more after Rakim.

obviously he was influenced by Rakim, however the LL versatility an apppeal factor especially when Nas did the colabs with R&B and Pop acts was a direct reference toward LL.

mistermaxxx R.Kelly, Michael Jackson,Stevie wonder,Rick James,Marvin Gaye,El Debarge, Barry WHite Lionel RIchie,Isleys EWF,Lady T.,Kid creole and coconuts,the crusaders,kc sunshine band,bee gees,jW,sd,NE,JB

Miami Heat, New York Yankees,buffalo bills

lol...

LL Cool J is a hip hop GOD...He reached THAT status....After Mama Said...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

so they barely remember in "In the House" let alone his peak and Prime but those heads 30 and Up know about James T.Smith

mistermaxxx R.Kelly, Michael Jackson,Stevie wonder,Rick James,Marvin Gaye,El Debarge, Barry WHite Lionel RIchie,Isleys EWF,Lady T.,Kid creole and coconuts,the crusaders,kc sunshine band,bee gees,jW,sd,NE,JB

Miami Heat, New York Yankees,buffalo bills

>so they barely remember in "In the House"


lol....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

>so they barely remember in "In the House"

he did transcend rap to get into acting.

ask anyone who LL is and they know.

http://twitter.com/Menphyel7


"F you Im better in tune with the Infinite"

______________________________________________________________________________

"There's a fine line between persistence and foolishness..."
-unknown

"To Each His Reach"
-George Clinton

And he transitioned into the acting and had some decent parts, but can't really match Cube, who arguably a few years later in term of his hey day.

LL's name rings bells though, at least throughout black America under 45. But seems everyone knows who Ice Cube is, and Cube's best material was just a few years after LL's.

him and Will were the first two rappers to reach THAT status, and they damn near did it in sync. and maybe Pac was third or in the middle somewhere.

anybody who thinks LL isn't up THERE is crazy, seriously, he made IT. I like THIS style of describing things, ITS so useful.

PEACE LOVE and MONEY

https://soundcloud.com/dabeatnik/drumpf-beer

Dude has been on top too many times to say hardly anyone could name him (outside of heads). Too much exposure outside of hip hop (in mainstream movies, shows, and media) for him to NOT be on that level.



Since 1976

I mean... he is.
LL had hits before rap became the new pop music. Rap became the new pop music, and LL had more hits.
And for a minute people were talking about "LL is done," and he came out with tracks just to show that he was done when he said he was done, and not a minute earlier.

He isn't Jay-Z because Jay-Z marketed his image in a way LL didn't.
He isn't Snoop, because Snoop marketed his personality in a way LL didn't.
He isn't Eminem because Eminem marketed his personal life in a way LL didn't.
I mean, even as a man who has had multiple television shows and movie roles, LL as a musician is pretty straightforward. There aren't really any gimmicks. His music kind of succeeds or fails on the merit of his music, and just his music. Consider that his music career is actually built on music, and he's still around. He came out before the time when people sold their personalities before they sold an album, and he still works that way.

He called himself the GOAT 12 years ago, and nobody has really disputed his statement. He's been around longer than just about any other rapper out now, and he's still not an "old time rapper." When he wants a single, he has one.

And my gramma knows who LL is.

LL is one year older than Jay-Z. Let that sink in for a minute.

Everything Jay-Z accomplished in the last ten years LL did before Jay-Z's first single.

Why does this matter. Jay-Z couldn't have done what LL did when they were peers, and he couldn't have done what he did if LL hadn't paved the way. The only reason LL couldn't have been Jay in the 00's is BECAUSE he was already a legend. Jay was a fresh face who just happened to be old as shit.

And even beyond that. LL is on fucking network TV every goddamn week. CBFUCKINGS no less. You don't get anymore American houehold name than CBS and a fucking CSI spinoff. Even if you can't stand fucking niggers you might like that boy on CSI. And he hosted the fucking Grammy's. I mean c'mon!! LL has nothing to prove... well except to himself.
________
Big PEMFin H & z's
█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am one thing, a musician." © Miles Davis

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

Period

If you know about Hip Hop as a whole....there is no Top 10 MC discussion without LL

Forget that corny MTV Round Table

"Highly developed spirits often encounter resistance from mediocre minds."-Albert Einstein

http://twitter.com/#!/TonyHanesPoetry

funny guy.


outside of a few singles, I never really cared for him.

....in fact, a 60 year old especially will know LL Cool J better than Eminem or Jay-Z, not only by his "name" but his music as well

<---https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DL9AVTQ

granted LL era of hip hop is not Jay Z 's
historical context plays a role here.

@GetoutTheroom
http://getouttheroom.podomatic.com
******************************************
https://twitter.com/Jayric

>
>And when I say THAT status, I mean rap dudes that my 60 year
>old, suburban mom and her friends know about. That when you
>ask the average, white collar dude on the street to name a
>rapper, he comes up. Pop icon shit.

Since when do we care about 60 yr old suburban moms think about rap. This is part of the problem. I understand rappers going for the suburban $ but LL is in a class by himself; a pioneer of raps 2nd wave and an icon.