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Lobby The Lesson topic #2608390

Subject: "it's a gotdamn, muhfuckin' shame that we* can't refute that Wilco post." Previous topic | Next topic
MISTA MONOTONE
Member since Jan 30th 2004
58562 posts
Fri Sep-30-11 09:28 AM

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"it's a gotdamn, muhfuckin' shame that we* can't refute that Wilco post."


  

          

we* = #RACEWARZ!!

and before anyone of us (read: fire ^ok) retorts with that Mint Condition shit, FOH. them turkeys don't count.

enlighten me...are there any Black (CAPITAL B!! RACEWARZ!!!) bands of note in existence? right today (OKSPORTS!! CROSS POST!!)? any up and comers?

this some sorry shit. (<----EBONICS!!)

how many of us* listen to Wilco?

------------------------------------------
latest mixtape:
https://www.mixcloud.com/mistamonotone/music-to-smack-motherfckers-to/

mistamonotone - taboo
http://mistamonotone.bandcamp.com/album/taboo

@mistamonotone
IG: mistamonotone

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
I love you
Sep 29th 2011
1
yeah, I was about to say... bands in general are on the decline
Sep 29th 2011
4
Do their beats bang in da club, doh!?
Sep 29th 2011
2
There's plenty of great 'black' bands if you're willing to look
Sep 29th 2011
3
what else would i mean? duuuuuuuh.
Sep 29th 2011
6
lol.
Sep 29th 2011
7
Black = african american, black = african diaspora nm
Sep 30th 2011
120
The Roots.
Sep 29th 2011
5
AAAARRGGGH!!! i meant to put that in the original post too.
Sep 29th 2011
9
well, then you're* screwed.
Sep 29th 2011
13
      *chops this reply*
Sep 29th 2011
15
you know, you're right
Sep 29th 2011
11
Post over.
Sep 29th 2011
16
lol, dammit... they definitely count to ME.
Sep 29th 2011
8
no money tracks. never counted. (to paraphrase maxxx.)
Sep 29th 2011
12
      to be fair, Wilco's never had much in the way of hit singles
Sep 29th 2011
17
      no? cmon
Sep 29th 2011
21
           i'm painting with broad strokes...but in the grand scheme of things?
Sep 29th 2011
22
                I guess they were too 'over the heads' of people
Sep 29th 2011
26
RE: it's a gotdamn, muhfuckin' shame that we* can't refute that Wilco po...
Sep 29th 2011
10
niggas don't listen to no gotdamb TV on the Radio. sorry.
Sep 29th 2011
14
      TV on the Radio is sorry, too. n/m
Sep 29th 2011
41
Meshell Ndgeocello
Sep 29th 2011
18
nope.
Sep 29th 2011
19
      ..not up there.
Sep 29th 2011
20
      Except that Sade is not a black band n/m
Sep 29th 2011
23
           now THIS time you are correct. LOL. welp!
Sep 29th 2011
32
I say Bad Brains!!
Sep 29th 2011
24
The past 25 years have not been good for Bad Brains...
Sep 29th 2011
27
They released an album 2 or three years ago right?
Sep 29th 2011
29
Quickness and God of Love are just as good as I against I
Sep 29th 2011
37
Build A Nation had moments - mostly live it sounded better
Sep 29th 2011
56
I thought Quickness was terrible...
Sep 29th 2011
61
      that's a black rock sound that metal bumpin' thing
Sep 29th 2011
64
      I thought they made one of the few decent albums
Sep 29th 2011
76
I disagree - Bad Brains had two celerbated albums and a new one
Sep 29th 2011
39
      Dude - I love Bad Brains, but if you cut it off at last 25 years...
Sep 29th 2011
42
           I mean if that's your opinion that's cool - that's just not mine.
Sep 29th 2011
44
                Sure, but we're still gonna talk about it, right? :)
Sep 29th 2011
46
                     Um... again .. .IN YOUR OPINION.
Sep 29th 2011
52
                     Seriously man - you can drop the "in your opinion"
Sep 29th 2011
57
                          I mean I just gave my picks like everyone else...
Sep 29th 2011
58
                               There's no problem, I just wanted to debate
Sep 29th 2011
68
                                    hahaha.. well if it helps I saw and had a few words with HR
Sep 29th 2011
72
                                         I wish you had asked him
Sep 29th 2011
79
                                              Here's what's crazy and I don't know if it's true cause you know HR
Sep 29th 2011
81
                                                   Oh it's not just that -
Sep 29th 2011
82
                                                       
Sep 29th 2011
85
                                                        Maybe that's why I had it on tape.. .funny to think but it's true
Sep 29th 2011
87
                                                             The official reissue on caroline sounds like that...
Sep 29th 2011
88
                                                                  Wow... see shit like that adds poorly to the legacy... wth?
Sep 29th 2011
101
                                                        Man did you get a boot by accident?
Sep 29th 2011
86
                     God of love is excellent probably better than Quickness
Sep 29th 2011
55
i wholeheartedly disagree that Prince is a band. n/m.
Sep 29th 2011
33
      He plays multiple instruments, he is a one man band n/m
Sep 29th 2011
34
      so Stevie Wonder is a band too, huh?
Sep 29th 2011
35
      A one man band isn't the same thing as a band
Sep 29th 2011
36
           i commend your rational, though painfully obvious response.
Sep 29th 2011
38
                Snarky version:
Sep 29th 2011
43
      Prince has had a somewhat consistent band though
Sep 29th 2011
84
Fishbone ? n/m
Sep 29th 2011
25
Tony Toni and the other Tone
Sep 29th 2011
28
The -> Black <- Keys n/m
Sep 29th 2011
30
What about massive attack? They're 3/4 black n/m
Sep 29th 2011
31
Burning Spear/ The Wailers/ Ziggy Marley and the Melody Makers
Sep 29th 2011
40
Post reopened
Sep 29th 2011
45
In your opinion.
Sep 29th 2011
47
One more band - STEREOLAB - better disco than ANYONE.
Sep 29th 2011
48
RE: In your opinion.
Sep 29th 2011
53
      RE: In your opinion.
Sep 29th 2011
62
           RE: In your opinion.
Sep 29th 2011
70
                Man I'm telling you Stripped To the Bone - Sly & Robbie? Whew
Sep 29th 2011
74
The Ziggy Marley comment made me chuckle tho...
Sep 29th 2011
49
      To be honest (opinion alert!) I'm not into any of the Marley kids like t...
Sep 29th 2011
75
           Yo let me ask you to reconsider Damien... especially live
Sep 29th 2011
77
                As a matter of fact, it was live stuff that turned me around
Sep 29th 2011
78
                     Actually I have and I couldn't agree more.. there is something
Sep 29th 2011
80
                          I can't even read Buju's name any more without
Sep 29th 2011
83
are we* REALLY going to bat for/listening to those groups?
Sep 29th 2011
51
      Well five decades of records says yes. Maybe not OKP but
Sep 29th 2011
54
           we* = (average?) black folx.
Sep 29th 2011
59
                as in the hood supported Wilco? C'mon man. OKP is not
Sep 29th 2011
60
                     you are totally, and i do mean TOTALLY, misinterpreting this post. n/m.
Sep 29th 2011
66
                          I just gave my list that's all. We don't have to agree.
Sep 29th 2011
67
                               my brother, we ain't even arguin'. n/m.
Sep 29th 2011
71
                                    Glad to hear.. but I'm sorry Stereolab trumps Wilco on a bad day
Sep 29th 2011
73
*chalks up another W*
Sep 29th 2011
50
this is a depressing post
Sep 29th 2011
63
Yep.
Sep 29th 2011
65
RE: it's a gotdamn, muhfuckin' shame that we* can't refute that Wilco po...
Sep 29th 2011
69
THAT'S THE WHOLE MUTHAFUCKIN' POINT!!!!
Sep 29th 2011
91
      so what?
Sep 29th 2011
92
      mista monotone?
Sep 29th 2011
94
           why is it a problem?
Sep 29th 2011
97
      But is that even true - when labels stopped signing them and I agree the...
Sep 29th 2011
99
why do we think we gotta have everything they* have?
Sep 29th 2011
89
RE: why do we think we gotta have everything they* have?
Sep 29th 2011
93
      ^^^ THAT'S THE WHOLE MOTHAFUCKIN' POINT!!
Sep 29th 2011
95
      RE: ^^^ THAT'S THE WHOLE MOTHAFUCKIN' POINT!!
Sep 30th 2011
121
      oh so it's just that again.
Sep 29th 2011
98
Bad Rabbits, N.E.R.D., J*Davey, Sa-Ra, Dam-Funk & Master Blasters
Sep 29th 2011
90
thanks.
Sep 29th 2011
96
Um... I dunno about a few of those... but yeah - Robert Randolph &amp; t...
Sep 29th 2011
100
      Well I considered The System a band
Sep 29th 2011
109
           I consider them an electronic duo - and yes they are the shit. still.
Sep 29th 2011
112
           Just for the record.... Mic Murphy also played the guitar
Sep 30th 2011
124
                Of course - generally however he didn't.
Sep 30th 2011
127
           lol.
Sep 30th 2011
119
*Gets ready to get shitted on* Umm........who is Wilco?
Sep 29th 2011
102
the best band of the last 25 years apparently
Sep 29th 2011
103
      Yo exactly it's some total bullshit aint it? There are so many better b...
Sep 29th 2011
104
      or is it because you cant name a band putting out material as good?
Sep 29th 2011
105
      can't? won't
Sep 29th 2011
107
      whatever you say Mr Side Step
Sep 29th 2011
113
           *raises hand slowly* not trying to step into ya'lls argument - I respect...
Sep 29th 2011
114
                sorry, I was responding to you on my phone and then got a call
Sep 29th 2011
116
                     nah no prob I fell asleep last night lol
Sep 30th 2011
129
      Allow me to name a few
Sep 29th 2011
108
           Wait
Sep 29th 2011
110
                Yep and here's why
Sep 29th 2011
111
                     sorry I'm not accepting the idea using a drum machines disqualifies you
Sep 30th 2011
123
                          Helluva argument. I totally feel you. TheTime are still playing.
Sep 30th 2011
126
      Correction
Oct 02nd 2011
132
steel pulse?
Sep 29th 2011
106
I should charge people copyright fees on right today...lol.
Sep 29th 2011
115
oh, that's you, brah? i didn't even know. LOL.
Sep 29th 2011
117
      it came from a post titled "Right today.....Bynum >>> Shaq"
Sep 29th 2011
118
dunno who Wilco is, but it's sickening to me...
Sep 30th 2011
125
Instead of being sickened...enlighten us
Oct 02nd 2011
131
i'd take Living Color and on the white side Dave Matthews band
Sep 30th 2011
128
I agree 100 percent. Vernone Reid is STILL the man.
Sep 30th 2011
130
The Dap-Kings are mad at that post
Oct 03rd 2011
133

dalecooper
Member since Apr 07th 2006
3164 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 09:21 AM

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1. "I love you"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Do TV on the Radio count? I really like those guys but they're too young to have a formidable discography.

If it makes you* feel better, there's not a lot of white bands in contention any more, either. It's hard to come up with a reasonable list of names. That shit was a much lengthier conversation in the heyday of rock: you could reasonably start comparing The Kinks, The Who, The Beatles, The Stones, Led Zep, AC/DC, and a bunch of others. Nowadays the list is thinner, and bands that look like up-and-coming contenders blow away in the breeze, or lose their way very quickly.

--

  

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
131034 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 09:31 AM

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4. "yeah, I was about to say... bands in general are on the decline"
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

>If it makes you* feel better, there's not a lot of white bands
>in contention any more, either. It's hard to come up with a
>reasonable list of names. That shit was a much lengthier
>conversation in the heyday of rock: you could reasonably start
>comparing The Kinks, The Who, The Beatles, The Stones, Led
>Zep, AC/DC, and a bunch of others. Nowadays the list is
>thinner, and bands that look like up-and-coming contenders
>blow away in the breeze, or lose their way very quickly.

at least ones with long-reaching, well-known discographies

  

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Ishwip
Member since Jun 10th 2005
19850 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 09:22 AM

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2. "Do their beats bang in da club, doh!?"
In response to Reply # 0


          


__
I don't like the beat anymore because its just a loop. ALC didn't FLIP IT ENOUGH!

Flip it enough? Flip these. Flip off. Go flip some f*cking burgers.(c)Kno

Allied State of the National Electric Beat Treaty Organization (NEBTO)

  

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IslaSoul
Member since Aug 01st 2003
5920 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 09:27 AM

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3. "There's plenty of great 'black' bands if you're willing to look"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


outside the U.S.
Or do you mean black as in only African-American?

http://islasoul.bandcamp.com

  

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MISTA MONOTONE
Member since Jan 30th 2004
58562 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 09:33 AM

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6. "what else would i mean? duuuuuuuh."
In response to Reply # 3


  

          


>Or do you mean black as in only African-American?


#XENOPHOBIA WARZ!!!

------------------------------------------
latest mixtape:
https://www.mixcloud.com/mistamonotone/music-to-smack-motherfckers-to/

mistamonotone - taboo
http://mistamonotone.bandcamp.com/album/taboo

@mistamonotone
IG: mistamonotone

  

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shockzilla
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37796 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 09:33 AM

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7. "lol."
In response to Reply # 6


          

  

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Binlahab
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182569 posts
Fri Sep-30-11 05:17 AM

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120. "Black = african american, black = african diaspora nm"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          


do or die

  

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shockzilla
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37796 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 09:32 AM

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5. "The Roots."
In response to Reply # 0


          

Their discography is right up there.

  

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MISTA MONOTONE
Member since Jan 30th 2004
58562 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 09:34 AM

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9. "AAAARRGGGH!!! i meant to put that in the original post too."
In response to Reply # 5


  

          

although they have PLENTY of effin' singing in their records (sometimes to my chagrin), i'm not talkin' about no hippity hoppity ass band.

------------------------------------------
latest mixtape:
https://www.mixcloud.com/mistamonotone/music-to-smack-motherfckers-to/

mistamonotone - taboo
http://mistamonotone.bandcamp.com/album/taboo

@mistamonotone
IG: mistamonotone

  

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shockzilla
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37796 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 09:37 AM

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13. "well, then you're* screwed."
In response to Reply # 9


          

  

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MISTA MONOTONE
Member since Jan 30th 2004
58562 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 09:37 AM

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15. "*chops this reply*"
In response to Reply # 13


  

          

------------------------------------------
latest mixtape:
https://www.mixcloud.com/mistamonotone/music-to-smack-motherfckers-to/

mistamonotone - taboo
http://mistamonotone.bandcamp.com/album/taboo

@mistamonotone
IG: mistamonotone

  

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
131034 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 09:35 AM

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11. "you know, you're right"
In response to Reply # 5


  

          

the answer is right under our noses

and while I'm sure there will be some arguments with their music after Things Fall Apart I still think they have one of the best discographies in music

  

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come on people
Member since Dec 02nd 2007
17423 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 09:39 AM

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16. "Post over."
In response to Reply # 5


  

          

Go Smack yourself and then apologize to your hand for looking stupid - Case_One

http://i54.tinypic.com/nxros2.jpg

  

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
131034 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 09:34 AM

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8. "lol, dammit... they definitely count to ME."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

>and before anyone of us (read: fire ^ok) retorts with that
>Mint Condition shit, FOH. them turkeys don't count.

they fooled you with the "get you a girl" music, but "7..."
fuck it. that was a good record. and they've been around longer than their immediate contemporaries (even the Tonies split)

I wish they were more revered though.
unfortunately, Tyler Perry-ism runs rampant in the post-MJ world, where a known ephebophile can get a Mello Yello pass.

(yes, I'm being WILDE NUKKAPEDI-O)

  

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MISTA MONOTONE
Member since Jan 30th 2004
58562 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 09:36 AM

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12. "no money tracks. never counted. (to paraphrase maxxx.)"
In response to Reply # 8


  

          

>>and before anyone of us (read: fire ^ok) retorts with that
>>Mint Condition shit, FOH. them turkeys don't count.
>
>they fooled you with the "get you a girl" music, but "7..."
>fuck it. that was a good record. and they've been around
>longer than their immediate contemporaries (even the Tonies
>split)
>
>I wish they were more revered though.
>unfortunately, Tyler Perry-ism runs rampant in the post-MJ
>world, where a known ephebophile can get a Mello Yello pass.
>
>(yes, I'm being WILDE NUKKAPEDI-O)

Mint Condition, as dope as they are, are not on Wilco's level. i guess. *shrugs*

------------------------------------------
latest mixtape:
https://www.mixcloud.com/mistamonotone/music-to-smack-motherfckers-to/

mistamonotone - taboo
http://mistamonotone.bandcamp.com/album/taboo

@mistamonotone
IG: mistamonotone

  

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lonesome_d
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30438 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 09:41 AM

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17. "to be fair, Wilco's never had much in the way of hit singles"
In response to Reply # 12


          

I guess Heavy Metal Drummer was the closest they came, but their strength/popularity comes more from critical acclaim and album-format radio than from hit singles.

-------
so I'm in a band now:
album ---> http://greenwoodburns.bandcamp.com/releases
Soundcloud ---> http://soundcloud.com/greenwood-burns

my own stuff -->http://soundcloud.com/lonesomedstringband

avy by buckshot_defunct

  

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
131034 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 10:04 AM

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21. "no? cmon"
In response to Reply # 12


  

          

they had "money" tracks on their first couple of albums, it's the only reason they made a name for themselves.

they didn't have uptempo money tracks though

  

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MISTA MONOTONE
Member since Jan 30th 2004
58562 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 10:09 AM

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22. "i'm painting with broad strokes...but in the grand scheme of things?"
In response to Reply # 21


  

          

is Mint Condition gonna have a legacy or will they be a footnote?

...Mint Condition's Greatest Hits album. what would be on it/how many tracks would it be?

smh. i typed that ^^^ before i realized they actually have one already. SMH.

http://www.amazon.com/Best-Mint-Condition-Millennium-Collection/dp/B000FGG6CA

as far as "hits" go, i guess there is a respectable amount there. but still. ehhhh.

------------------------------------------
latest mixtape:
https://www.mixcloud.com/mistamonotone/music-to-smack-motherfckers-to/

mistamonotone - taboo
http://mistamonotone.bandcamp.com/album/taboo

@mistamonotone
IG: mistamonotone

  

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
131034 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 10:14 AM

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26. "I guess they were too 'over the heads' of people"
In response to Reply # 22


  

          

but I think bands really started fading out in the 1980s...they're a bit of a throwback.

note, that I said bands.
there were still singing groups, but they, too, seem to be on the decline in R&B

  

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cjr2221
Member since Sep 04th 2011
1790 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 09:34 AM

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10. "RE: it's a gotdamn, muhfuckin' shame that we* can't refute that Wilco po..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

The Roots is a band.

Currently the only rock band with a majority of *us*, still making music, that I can think of is TV on the Radio. =\

  

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MISTA MONOTONE
Member since Jan 30th 2004
58562 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 09:37 AM

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14. "niggas don't listen to no gotdamb TV on the Radio. sorry."
In response to Reply # 10


  

          

>The Roots is a band.
>
>Currently the only rock band with a majority of *us*, still
>making music, that I can think of is TV on the Radio. =\

yes, i speak for all niggas. excuse my French.

------------------------------------------
latest mixtape:
https://www.mixcloud.com/mistamonotone/music-to-smack-motherfckers-to/

mistamonotone - taboo
http://mistamonotone.bandcamp.com/album/taboo

@mistamonotone
IG: mistamonotone

  

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dalecooper
Member since Apr 07th 2006
3164 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 12:45 PM

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41. "TV on the Radio is sorry, too. n/m"
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

--

  

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IslaSoul
Member since Aug 01st 2003
5920 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 09:56 AM

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18. "Meshell Ndgeocello"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


She's a band
when she's not, she performs with a band
her catalogue is very solid
I know I'm right

http://islasoul.bandcamp.com

  

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MISTA MONOTONE
Member since Jan 30th 2004
58562 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 09:58 AM

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19. "nope."
In response to Reply # 18


  

          


>I know I'm right

except you're not.

you may have touched on something though...Sade. now THAT's a band.

------------------------------------------
latest mixtape:
https://www.mixcloud.com/mistamonotone/music-to-smack-motherfckers-to/

mistamonotone - taboo
http://mistamonotone.bandcamp.com/album/taboo

@mistamonotone
IG: mistamonotone

  

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shockzilla
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20. "..not up there."
In response to Reply # 19


          

yikes.

<ducks and covers>

  

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IslaSoul
Member since Aug 01st 2003
5920 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 10:10 AM

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23. "Except that Sade is not a black band n/m"
In response to Reply # 19


  

          

http://islasoul.bandcamp.com

  

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MISTA MONOTONE
Member since Jan 30th 2004
58562 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 10:33 AM

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32. "now THIS time you are correct. LOL. welp!"
In response to Reply # 23


  

          

------------------------------------------
latest mixtape:
https://www.mixcloud.com/mistamonotone/music-to-smack-motherfckers-to/

mistamonotone - taboo
http://mistamonotone.bandcamp.com/album/taboo

@mistamonotone
IG: mistamonotone

  

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IslaSoul
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Thu Sep-29-11 10:13 AM

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24. "I say Bad Brains!! "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          



Or Prince,
Prince is also a band...

http://islasoul.bandcamp.com

  

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Jakob Hellberg
Member since Apr 18th 2005
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Thu Sep-29-11 10:16 AM

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27. "The past 25 years have not been good for Bad Brains..."
In response to Reply # 24


          

I know some people call "I against I" a classic but that's the only thing of value that they have to show in that era and personally, I find that record so hit-and-miss that it's impossible to give it props unconditionally.

Their great stuff meanwhile was done like 30 years ago...

  

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IslaSoul
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Thu Sep-29-11 10:18 AM

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29. "They released an album 2 or three years ago right?"
In response to Reply # 27


  

          


If I remember correctly, it wasn't that bad.

I love I against I by the way,

there's one album I really don't like, but I forgot the name,
it's with the singer not called HR

http://islasoul.bandcamp.com

  

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c71
Member since Jan 15th 2008
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Thu Sep-29-11 10:56 AM

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37. "Quickness and God of Love are just as good as I against I"
In response to Reply # 27


  

          

The last CD "build a nation" wasn't too good from what I remember.

  

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Artful Dodger
Member since Nov 20th 2009
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:19 PM

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56. "Build A Nation had moments - mostly live it sounded better"
In response to Reply # 37


          

God of Love - agreed. Just as good as I Against I just didn't have that hype and buzz.

  

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Jakob Hellberg
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61. "I thought Quickness was terrible..."
In response to Reply # 37


          

They did the late 80's funky "alternative metal" thing that was so trendy at the time but which I cannot stand. "¤Rise"¤ was similar if I remember correctly.

  

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c71
Member since Jan 15th 2008
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64. "that's a black rock sound that metal bumpin' thing"
In response to Reply # 61


  

          

when I transitioned out of Hardcore Punk to black rock, I was ready for it.

So it's not just alterna-metal, it's a black rock thing - latter day Bad Brains.

That's one of the reasons "build a nation" was so lackluster, on the punk tracks they tried to do the old sound, and they were better with the black rock sound of "I against I", "Quickness" and "God of love".

  

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dalecooper
Member since Apr 07th 2006
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76. "I thought they made one of the few decent albums"
In response to Reply # 61


  

          

in a style that I generally don't like much either. "I Against I" is definitely better though, kind of splitting the difference between "Quickness" and their punk years, and not getting as much into the whole funk metal riffing and rhythms.

--

  

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Artful Dodger
Member since Nov 20th 2009
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Thu Sep-29-11 12:36 PM

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39. "I disagree - Bad Brains had two celerbated albums and a new one"
In response to Reply # 27
Thu Sep-29-11 12:41 PM by Artful Dodger

          

coming. Just saw them perform.

Build A Nation
Omega Sessions EP
Rock For Light


When you consider their influence on American punk - nah I disagree.

I would say Bad Brains and Fishbone over Wilco.

Hell if you were talking Radiohead that would be difficult - but fucking Wilco?

I mean they are dope but c'mon.

  

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dalecooper
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42. "Dude - I love Bad Brains, but if you cut it off at last 25 years..."
In response to Reply # 39


  

          

they are NOT in the conversation. Black Dots, the s/t and Rock for Light all pre-date the cutoff. (Well, "Black Dots" was released after the cut, but recorded well before it... questionable, I guess.) "I Against I" is the only actual classic they had that qualifies. "Quickness" is a good album but not a great one. After that, what have they done? Some albums that mostly let down their hardcore fans, and a decent dub album that nobody heard.

--

  

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Artful Dodger
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44. "I mean if that's your opinion that's cool - that's just not mine."
In response to Reply # 42
Thu Sep-29-11 12:59 PM by Artful Dodger

          

I totally hear you but I Against I to me is their more accessible album while staying true to their genre. That's why it's a classic... it's also their most popular album which is why it's a classic. Even non-punk heads might have had it in their collection - that doesn't truly make it their best work. Either way I can't say I completely agree. They have released two or three albums in the last ten years... one I really liked alot and the new one on the way I love from what i saw them perform live just recently. They also noted a documentary coming as well.

  

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dalecooper
Member since Apr 07th 2006
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46. "Sure, but we're still gonna talk about it, right? :)"
In response to Reply # 44


  

          

Anyway, there's no denying that RFL doesn't meet the criteria - it's three years early. Here's what they have that falls within the last 25 years:

I Against I
Quickness
Rise
God of Love
I & I Survived
Build a Nation

Most Brains fans are only willing to go out on a limb for the first two. "Build a Nation" has some supporters but I don't think anybody would call it a classic, not by Brains standards (or any standards really). Nobody I know is fond of "God of Love" and even fewer like "Rise." "I & I Survived" is basically just a solid dub album and not much more - it's convincing, but I think if you're a dub head this is about the fiftieth album you'd think to listen to when in the mood for serious, deep dub tracks. Plus I think a lot of people just passed on it because they wanted the classic sound of the Bad Brains, and this clearly isn't it. I didn't count live albums because I just don't care about them, but I guess you could add a little something that way... still, I don't see near as much strength in this part of their discography as I do in 1982-89 (the REAL glory years).

--

  

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Artful Dodger
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52. "Um... again .. .IN YOUR OPINION. "
In response to Reply # 46
Thu Sep-29-11 01:17 PM by Artful Dodger

          

which I totally respect. Just isn't mine.

I don't think Wilco has all the classics they have been given.
I think they are good, solid, and consistent.

However for me and my peoples... Bad Brains would easily win.

Again. For me, cause this is only a matter of opinion:

Black Bands:
Sly and Robbie
Bad Brains
Fishbone

White Bands:
Stereolab
Radiohead

Sorry but that's my pick.
*shrugs*

  

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dalecooper
Member since Apr 07th 2006
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57. "Seriously man - you can drop the "in your opinion""
In response to Reply # 52


  

          

What we're doing is discussing opinions. Let's get past the meta-discussion hump and just talk about the albums.

--

  

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Artful Dodger
Member since Nov 20th 2009
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:22 PM

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58. "I mean I just gave my picks like everyone else... "
In response to Reply # 57


          

what's the problem? those are my picks. *shrugs*

I like the albums i mentioned.

  

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dalecooper
Member since Apr 07th 2006
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:41 PM

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68. "There's no problem, I just wanted to debate"
In response to Reply # 58


  

          

You're sucking the fun out of it! Pouty face, foot stomp.

--

  

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Artful Dodger
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72. "hahaha.. well if it helps I saw and had a few words with HR "
In response to Reply # 68


          

In DC a few weeks ago. BB performed and they did new songs and it was great. Great show. Sound was a little off cause of the PA's.. but hey it's punk I'd be worried if they sounded great live. haha.

  

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dalecooper
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79. "I wish you had asked him"
In response to Reply # 72


  

          

when or if anyone is going to reissue Rock for Light with a proper mastering. That current CD that's out there just pisses me off, and I can't find an original copy.

--

  

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Artful Dodger
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Thu Sep-29-11 02:36 PM

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81. "Here's what's crazy and I don't know if it's true cause you know HR"
In response to Reply # 79
Thu Sep-29-11 02:36 PM by Artful Dodger

          

He said they have a few albums they recorded themselves they are only selling at shows. They are doing pre-mixes on them now then on to final mix and master. I cannot wait man cause the new stuff sounds great - classic old stuff. Still pinpoint razor sharp.

I think the main new release is on a smaller, new punk label tho.

Yeah I know.. that is so true.. the mix on that record is ... muddy.

  

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dalecooper
Member since Apr 07th 2006
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Thu Sep-29-11 02:39 PM

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82. "Oh it's not just that -"
In response to Reply # 81


  

          

The Caroline reissue (the only CD version you can find any more) is pitched up half a step from where it's supposed to be on most (maybe all) of the tracks. It makes the hardcore songs in particular sound ridiculous - they're too fast and HR's vocals are too high. If you compare it to the LP or the original CD - the one I can't get my hands on - it sounds just silly. One of those things that I have no idea how it slipped through.

--

  

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Jakob Hellberg
Member since Apr 18th 2005
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Thu Sep-29-11 03:16 PM

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85. ""
In response to Reply # 82


          

Not sure about the missing thing, I need to check that. But yes, that's one fucked-up reissue. Theproduction on the original is bad too though-the self-titled/ROIR-tape sounds much doper and has many of the same songs in better versions but there's some dope stuff you can only find on "RFL" and some versions are better than the s/t versions outside of the sound-perspective (¤more intense,"¤thrashier" performances) which makes it frustrating... I still like "RFL" though...

  

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Artful Dodger
Member since Nov 20th 2009
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Thu Sep-29-11 03:44 PM

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87. "Maybe that's why I had it on tape.. .funny to think but it's true"
In response to Reply # 85
Thu Sep-29-11 03:45 PM by Artful Dodger

          

I know they got beat by a few out of date labels that tried to cash on on their name so I'm wondering if some of the reissues floating were just boots.. poor boots but boots nonetheless.

Jakob you had the same problem with the half step up pitch?

WTF that's insane!

  

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Jakob Hellberg
Member since Apr 18th 2005
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Thu Sep-29-11 03:49 PM

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88. "The official reissue on caroline sounds like that..."
In response to Reply # 87


          

They fucked up and Dr Know himself is to blame I think because he helped out with the remix. Maybe they wanted to exaggerate how fast bad Brains were which is silly because they were already fast as fuck-no need to make them sound like smurfs or something. I LOE fast music but I wouldn't w4ant to he4ar4 Slaye4r's "Reign in blood" s4p4ed4 up just so it could4 compe4te w4ith grindcore4-albums. Just a te44rr4ible4 re4master/remix and it *should* be replaced and go4 OOP...

  

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Artful Dodger
Member since Nov 20th 2009
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101. "Wow... see shit like that adds poorly to the legacy... wth?"
In response to Reply # 88


          

didn't know.

  

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Artful Dodger
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86. "Man did you get a boot by accident?"
In response to Reply # 82


          

  

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c71
Member since Jan 15th 2008
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:17 PM

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55. "God of love is excellent probably better than Quickness"
In response to Reply # 46


  

          

"build a nation" ain't good, so I know how to distinguish good later era Bad Brains - I don't just accept anything from them.

"Rock for light" is the earliest era I appreciate from them.

  

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MISTA MONOTONE
Member since Jan 30th 2004
58562 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 10:34 AM

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33. "i wholeheartedly disagree that Prince is a band. n/m."
In response to Reply # 24


  

          

>
>
>Or Prince,
>Prince is also a band...
>

------------------------------------------
latest mixtape:
https://www.mixcloud.com/mistamonotone/music-to-smack-motherfckers-to/

mistamonotone - taboo
http://mistamonotone.bandcamp.com/album/taboo

@mistamonotone
IG: mistamonotone

  

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IslaSoul
Member since Aug 01st 2003
5920 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 10:38 AM

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34. "He plays multiple instruments, he is a one man band n/m"
In response to Reply # 33


  

          

http://islasoul.bandcamp.com

  

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MISTA MONOTONE
Member since Jan 30th 2004
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35. "so Stevie Wonder is a band too, huh? "
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

------------------------------------------
latest mixtape:
https://www.mixcloud.com/mistamonotone/music-to-smack-motherfckers-to/

mistamonotone - taboo
http://mistamonotone.bandcamp.com/album/taboo

@mistamonotone
IG: mistamonotone

  

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dalecooper
Member since Apr 07th 2006
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Thu Sep-29-11 10:53 AM

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36. "A one man band isn't the same thing as a band"
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

in the conventional sense. Most people think of Prince as a solo artist. If he starts taking the stage and manages to play all those instruments simultaneously somehow, it's worth revisiting.

--

  

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MISTA MONOTONE
Member since Jan 30th 2004
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Thu Sep-29-11 12:16 PM

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38. "i commend your rational, though painfully obvious response."
In response to Reply # 36


  

          

i didn't think that silliness deserved it. i prefer snark.

------------------------------------------
latest mixtape:
https://www.mixcloud.com/mistamonotone/music-to-smack-motherfckers-to/

mistamonotone - taboo
http://mistamonotone.bandcamp.com/album/taboo

@mistamonotone
IG: mistamonotone

  

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dalecooper
Member since Apr 07th 2006
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Thu Sep-29-11 12:51 PM

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43. "Snarky version:"
In response to Reply # 38


  

          

Talk to me when Prince is doing this on stage - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzVdv4Igwh0

--

  

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OldPro
Member since Dec 10th 2002
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84. "Prince has had a somewhat consistent band though"
In response to Reply # 33


  

          

it's gone through turn over every few years but they are still very much black band... I might even make an argument for Sade counting here too.
_________________________________
Reunion Radio Podcasts
Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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IslaSoul
Member since Aug 01st 2003
5920 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 10:13 AM

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25. "Fishbone ? n/m"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://islasoul.bandcamp.com

  

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atruhead
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Thu Sep-29-11 10:17 AM

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28. "Tony Toni and the other Tone"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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IslaSoul
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Thu Sep-29-11 10:19 AM

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30. "The -> Black <- Keys n/m"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://islasoul.bandcamp.com

  

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IslaSoul
Member since Aug 01st 2003
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Thu Sep-29-11 10:23 AM

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31. "What about massive attack? They're 3/4 black n/m"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://islasoul.bandcamp.com

  

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Artful Dodger
Member since Nov 20th 2009
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Thu Sep-29-11 12:38 PM

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40. "Burning Spear/ The Wailers/ Ziggy Marley and the Melody Makers"
In response to Reply # 0
Thu Sep-29-11 12:38 PM by Artful Dodger

          

Sly and Robbie as well.

Post over.

  

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dalecooper
Member since Apr 07th 2006
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Thu Sep-29-11 12:58 PM

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45. "Post reopened"
In response to Reply # 40


  

          

That Wilco post was about the last 25 years. The Wailers have dropped zero albums in that time frame. Burning Spear's best years were just behind him by the mid-eighties even though he kept at it for a long time after that; also, Burning Spear is a guy, not a band. Ziggy Marley... guffaw. I'm the biggest reggae fan you'll care to meet and I can't cosign that - he's like the third most talented living Marley. Sly and Robbie.. that's a weird case because they were the power behind a lot of classics (though the albums released under their own name are mostly a lot of hodge podge dub collections and stuff). But personally, if I look at a rack of official Sly & Robbie albums, I see more middle-of-the-road stuff with bombass production than classics that I couldn't live without.

--

  

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Artful Dodger
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:04 PM

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47. "In your opinion."
In response to Reply # 45
Thu Sep-29-11 01:07 PM by Artful Dodger

          

* Which I totally respect. But in my opinion...

Burning Spear
Calling Rastafari 2000
Free Man 2004
Our Music 2005
The Burning Spear Experience 2008
Jah Is Real 2008

Sly and Robbie DJ Riot 1990 Island
Sly and Robbie Dubs for Tubs 1990 Rohit
Sly and Robbie Sixties Seventies and Eighties 1991 Mango
Sly and Robbie Dub Rockers Delight 1991 Magnum Music Group
Sly and Robbie Sound of Sound 1991 Pow Wow
Sly and Robbie Remember Precious Times 1992 RAS Taxi
Sly and Robbie Ragga Pon Top 1993 Pow Wow
Sly and Robbie Many Moods of 1994 Sonic Sounds
Sly and Robbie present Mykall Rose 1995 Taxi
Sly and Robbie Funkcronomicon 1995 Axiom
Sly and Robbie Hail up the Taxi 1996 Island
Sly and Robbie Mysteries of Creation 1996 Axiom
Sly and Robbie meet King Tubby 1996 House of Reggae
Sly and Robbie The Punishers 1996 Island
Sly and Robbie Mambo Taxi 1997 Island
Sly and Robbie Hail up Taxi 2 1998 Tabou1 / Taxi
Sly and Robbie present Taxi Christmas 1998 RAS
Sly and Robbie Friends 1998 Island
Sly and Robbie Drum and Bass Strip to the Bone by Howie B 1999 Palm Pictures
Sly and Robbie Massive 1999 nyc music
Sly and Robbie Sly & Robbie 1999 Rhino
Sly and Robbie Version Born (produced by Bill Laswell) 2004 Palm

  

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Artful Dodger
Member since Nov 20th 2009
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:05 PM

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48. "One more band - STEREOLAB - better disco than ANYONE."
In response to Reply # 47


          

Period.

  

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dalecooper
Member since Apr 07th 2006
3164 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 01:17 PM

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53. "RE: In your opinion."
In response to Reply # 47
Thu Sep-29-11 01:18 PM by dalecooper

  

          

>* Which I totally respect. But in my opinion...

Goes without saying, you can't have a music discussion without opinions entering into it.

>are you really a big reggae fan?

Oh, yes. There's a shot that I own more reggae albums and spend more time listening to them than anybody on this site - if not quite that, I'm pretty sure I'm in the top three. My reggae/dancehall playlists in iTunes are close to 8000 tracks and 99% of that was paid for, not torrented (I make exceptions only for rare vinyl tracks that can't be had legally).

>Burning Spear
>Calling Rastafari 2000
>Free Man 2004
>Our Music 2005
>The Burning Spear Experience 2008
>Jah Is Real 2008

To me there are some really good albums there, but they're not fucking with pre-'86 Spear. I have to cop to a particular bias though: these old guys, I tend to vastly prefer the work they did in the 70s and first half of the 80s. Like the Wailing Souls are one of my favorite groups in any genre, period, but after about 1985 they got pretty bad and started using too many keyboards and drum machines, and winning Grammys for far inferior work. Burning Spear had some bad years as well, though generally he kept it true to his roots and didn't succumb half as badly as some of his contemporaries. His best albums after 1990 are some good shit, no doubt - yet every time I hear them I kind of want to just hear "Marcus Garvey" or "Hail H.I.M." instead. Maybe this is a personal stumbling block though. Spear's chanting, somewhat non-melodic style of reggae gets a little monotonous to me, so I don't go to his albums (even his classics) as often as I should. Maybe I can get by on the "he's a solo artist" technicality? If we weren't ruling out solo artists, I could think of several modern artists I'd want to include in the conversation - unfortunately reggae isn't a group-oriented genre any more though, and dancehall never was.

>Sly and Robbie DJ Riot 1990 Island
>Sly and Robbie Dubs for Tubs 1990 Rohit
>Sly and Robbie Sixties Seventies and Eighties 1991 Mango
>Sly and Robbie Dub Rockers Delight 1991 Magnum Music Group
>Sly and Robbie Sound of Sound 1991 Pow Wow
>Sly and Robbie Remember Precious Times 1992 RAS Taxi
>Sly and Robbie Ragga Pon Top 1993 Pow Wow
>Sly and Robbie Many Moods of 1994 Sonic Sounds
>Sly and Robbie present Mykall Rose 1995 Taxi
>Sly and Robbie Funkcronomicon 1995 Axiom
>Sly and Robbie Hail up the Taxi 1996 Island
>Sly and Robbie Mysteries of Creation 1996 Axiom
>Sly and Robbie meet King Tubby 1996 House of Reggae
>Sly and Robbie The Punishers 1996 Island
>Sly and Robbie Mambo Taxi 1997 Island
>Sly and Robbie Hail up Taxi 2 1998 Tabou1 / Taxi
>Sly and Robbie present Taxi Christmas 1998 RAS
>Sly and Robbie Friends 1998 Island
>Sly and Robbie Drum and Bass Strip to the Bone by Howie B 1999
>Palm Pictures
>Sly and Robbie Massive 1999 nyc music
>Sly and Robbie Sly & Robbie 1999 Rhino
>Sly and Robbie Version Born (produced by Bill Laswell) 2004
>Palm

Like 2/3 of those are forgettable to me (though some I've never heard, to be straight with you). Sly & Robbie are great but they made a lot of interchangeable stuff, which is an issue in reggae generally (well - to be clear, it's an issue when you're comparing them to the discographies of song-oriented bands like Wilco and the rest; me personally, I will listen to a good enough riddim even without a vocal on it, but that's not what most people would think of as an awesome SONG).

--

  

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Artful Dodger
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:31 PM

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62. "RE: In your opinion."
In response to Reply # 53


          

"To me there are some really good albums there, but they're not fucking with pre-'86 Spear."

I hear you - and I know why you are saying that but I don't agree. Even if they are not fucking with pre 86 spear they are fuckign with Wilco. Lol.

"I have to cop to a particular bias though: these old guys, I tend to vastly prefer the work they did in the 70s and first half of the 80s."

For me Reggae in the 70's is always tops.

"Like the Wailing Souls are one of my favorite groups in any genre, period, but after about 1985 they got pretty bad and started using too many keyboards and drum machines, and winning Grammys for far inferior work. "

Agreed.

"Burning Spear had some bad years as well, though generally he kept it true to his roots and didn't succumb half as badly as some of his contemporaries."

Exactly and when his years were bad in the studio they were always great on stage.

"His best albums after 1990 are some good shit, no doubt - yet every time I hear them I kind of want to just hear "Marcus Garvey" or "Hail H.I.M." instead. Maybe this is a personal stumbling block though."

Perhaps - attachment to a certain period or artist in a certain period happens.

"Spear's chanting, somewhat non-melodic style of reggae gets a little monotonous to me, so I don't go to his albums (even his classics) as often as I should. Maybe I can get by on the "he's a solo artist" technicality? If we weren't ruling out solo artists, I could think of several modern artists I'd want to include in the conversation - unfortunately reggae isn't a group-oriented genre any more though, and dancehall never was."

I think what's interesting about him is most of his work will have a place in my life... there are only a few out of the dozens of albums that I'm not partial to.



"Like 2/3 of those are forgettable to me (though some I've never heard, to be straight with you). Sly & Robbie are great but they made a lot of interchangeable stuff, which is an issue in reggae generally (well - to be clear, it's an issue when you're comparing them to the discographies of song-oriented bands like Wilco and the rest; me personally, I will listen to a good enough riddim even without a vocal on it, but that's not what most people would think of as an awesome SONG)."

Then I recommend you revisit. Stripped to the Bone was sick. There is another that I have that i listen to quite frequently that I didn't include in this list... it's amazing cover to cover and while it will never be hailed as a classic - every band, producer, and singer that comes after that steals the very beats, programming, melodies and bass lines.. .will get the credit.


  

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dalecooper
Member since Apr 07th 2006
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:47 PM

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70. "RE: In your opinion."
In response to Reply # 62


  

          


>I hear you - and I know why you are saying that but I don't
>agree. Even if they are not fucking with pre 86 spear they
>are fuckign with Wilco. Lol.

HA! Good point.

>Exactly and when his years were bad in the studio they were
>always great on stage.

Without a doubt, although that doesn't influence this particular conversation, which is strictly from a discographical point of view. (Spellcheck tells me that discographical isn't a word, but it also tells me Spellcheck isn't a word... hmmm.)

>I think what's interesting about him is most of his work will
>have a place in my life... there are only a few out of the
>dozens of albums that I'm not partial to.

I feel you. I have certain artists that I know I rate more highly than anybody else - they just mean too much to me to look at them even semi-objectively. To an extent, Wilco is even one of those, mostly because I was playing "Summerteeth" non-stop the year I separated from my wife. That album in particular brings back some feelings.

>Then I recommend you revisit.

It's on my agenda.

--

  

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Artful Dodger
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:54 PM

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74. "Man I'm telling you Stripped To the Bone - Sly & Robbie? Whew"
In response to Reply # 70


          

in fact there are about 7 albums they have in that genre of instrumental beats... mid 90's... that made way for Massive Attack, Portishead, 4Hero... so many producers and recording artists that would follow suit. They have no influenced four decades of music. I used to think outside of Grace - what is there? Man.

  

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Artful Dodger
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:06 PM

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49. "The Ziggy Marley comment made me chuckle tho..."
In response to Reply # 45


          

and again that's opinion. I know that's popular opinion but still opinion.

  

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dalecooper
Member since Apr 07th 2006
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:54 PM

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75. "To be honest (opinion alert!) I'm not into any of the Marley kids like t..."
In response to Reply # 49


  

          

I like Stephen best, but his production can be a little faceless (a little too all-things-to-all-people) and it spooks me that I like his voice mainly because it reminds me of Bob. Damien is good at what he does but I don't love any of his stuff, not even Jamrock. Nothing against any of the clan, but I definitely think that they would be nobodies (relatively speaking) if it weren't for the family name - there are lots of reggae artists I think are better than any of them. I will give them this though, they are all seasoned pros. They don't put out any awful or sloppy music, though some of it is stuff I don't need to hear more than once.

--

  

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Artful Dodger
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Thu Sep-29-11 02:05 PM

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77. "Yo let me ask you to reconsider Damien... especially live"
In response to Reply # 75
Thu Sep-29-11 02:10 PM by Artful Dodger

          

I know that's not the conversation.. but Damien truly embodies the spirit of his father more than anyone. He's amazing live and Jamrock is that joint!

Yo a few years ago one of the Marley girls performed an acoustic number.. it was crazy beautiful but I could never find the performance or her name.

I hear you tho... Ziggy however - when it's all said and done watch how people go back to his work with fresh ears and eyes.
Not right now, music is too glossy, flashy, gimmicky.. he's more of a traditional musician.

  

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dalecooper
Member since Apr 07th 2006
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Thu Sep-29-11 02:10 PM

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78. "As a matter of fact, it was live stuff that turned me around "
In response to Reply # 77


  

          

on Damien, at least a little bit. I was never that big on him and didn't own a single album until I saw some live stuff. Then I ended up buying "Jamrock" and the Nas album and a couple other things. I'm still not a huge fan of his recorded material as such - it's not bad, just not my preferred style of reggae/dancehall music - but live, he is quite a presence.

By the way, have you ever seen Capleton doing his thing live? Now Capleton is someone I've always liked on record, but when I saw him live it blew my mind. He is a FORCE.

--

  

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Artful Dodger
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Thu Sep-29-11 02:16 PM

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80. "Actually I have and I couldn't agree more.. there is something"
In response to Reply # 78


          

about Capleton in general that is just fantastic. The man has presence ... almost a divine like power. Yeah Capleton is THAT dude...

Buju was dope too but me thinks his energy went the other direction.

Poor Buju man... set that cat up.

  

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dalecooper
Member since Apr 07th 2006
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Thu Sep-29-11 02:42 PM

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83. "I can't even read Buju's name any more without "
In response to Reply # 80


  

          

letting out a long, sad sigh.

--

  

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MISTA MONOTONE
Member since Jan 30th 2004
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:14 PM

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51. "are we* REALLY going to bat for/listening to those groups?"
In response to Reply # 40


  

          

i thainketh not. historically no.

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Artful Dodger
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:17 PM

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54. "Well five decades of records says yes. Maybe not OKP but"
In response to Reply # 51
Thu Sep-29-11 01:18 PM by Artful Dodger

          

what's OKP in the grand scheme of ... anything?

  

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MISTA MONOTONE
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59. "we* = (average?) black folx."
In response to Reply # 54


  

          

"the 'hood" been supporting these acts? not coffee shop chicks and white dudes?

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Artful Dodger
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:26 PM

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60. "as in the hood supported Wilco? C'mon man. OKP is not "
In response to Reply # 59


          

average black folx. Don't kid yourself.

  

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MISTA MONOTONE
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:36 PM

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66. "you are totally, and i do mean TOTALLY, misinterpreting this post. n/m."
In response to Reply # 60


  

          

------------------------------------------
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mistamonotone - taboo
http://mistamonotone.bandcamp.com/album/taboo

@mistamonotone
IG: mistamonotone

  

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Artful Dodger
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:40 PM

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67. "I just gave my list that's all. We don't have to agree."
In response to Reply # 66
Thu Sep-29-11 01:40 PM by Artful Dodger

          

I gave a list of black bands.

A list of white bands.

Wilco aint fucking with the list I gave. PERIOD.

I don't give a damn how many albums they got and I love I Just Wanna Break Your Heart. The irony right?

  

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MISTA MONOTONE
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:49 PM

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71. "my brother, we ain't even arguin'. n/m."
In response to Reply # 67


  

          

------------------------------------------
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https://www.mixcloud.com/mistamonotone/music-to-smack-motherfckers-to/

mistamonotone - taboo
http://mistamonotone.bandcamp.com/album/taboo

@mistamonotone
IG: mistamonotone

  

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Artful Dodger
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:51 PM

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73. "Glad to hear.. but I'm sorry Stereolab trumps Wilco on a bad day"
In response to Reply # 71
Thu Sep-29-11 01:51 PM by Artful Dodger

          

Discography
songwriting
live show you name it.

  

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Anonymous
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:09 PM

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50. "*chalks up another W*"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

lol

I agree though. It is a shame and I wish it wasn't the truth.

  

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mr_graff
Member since Jan 25th 2006
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:32 PM

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63. "this is a depressing post"
In response to Reply # 0
Thu Sep-29-11 01:35 PM by mr_graff

          

Everone knows black bands with exposure have been declining since the mid 80s. We can debate the reasons why that is true, but the charts/articles/videos speak for themselves.

If pressed, I would say Fishbone, the Roots, Living Colour, Tony Tone Toni, Mint Condition. I'd bet there are still reggae bands making noise but I'm too out of touch to know who they are.

If we included multi-racial acts I'd throw Incognito and Brand New Heavies in the mix.

Me'Shell and Kindred the Family Soul always have a tight band but their joints are solo releases.

I like BSTC, the Kevin Chandler Band, and Mambo Sauce but it seems they make one album then are ghost.

  

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Artful Dodger
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:35 PM

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65. "Yep. "
In response to Reply # 63


          

My point exactly. I hate when people wanna judge music but use Rolling Stone's critical review section as a guide or the classic "did it sell" argument. Not saying that's happening here but there are many reasons as to why something would become a novelty versus it deserving real acclaim and it never gets it.

The Biggie post proves that.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Thu Sep-29-11 01:44 PM

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69. "RE: it's a gotdamn, muhfuckin' shame that we* can't refute that Wilco po..."
In response to Reply # 0


          



As many have said the Roots get the nod...

But this entire thread may be moot...Because "bands" within the black music side of things is basically dead...Been that way since the late '90s...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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MISTA MONOTONE
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Thu Sep-29-11 04:09 PM

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91. "THAT'S THE WHOLE MUTHAFUCKIN' POINT!!!!"
In response to Reply # 69
Thu Sep-29-11 04:09 PM by MISTA MONOTONE

  

          

>Because "bands" within
>the black music side of things is basically dead...Been that
>way since the late '90s...

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http://mistamonotone.bandcamp.com/album/taboo

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SoWhat
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Thu Sep-29-11 04:11 PM

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92. "so what?"
In response to Reply # 91


  

          

i mean, why is it a problem?

fuck you.

  

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MISTA MONOTONE
Member since Jan 30th 2004
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Thu Sep-29-11 05:20 PM

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94. "mista monotone?"
In response to Reply # 92


  

          

>i mean, why is it a problem?

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SoWhat
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Thu Sep-29-11 05:24 PM

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97. "why is it a problem?"
In response to Reply # 94


  

          

fuck you.

  

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Artful Dodger
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Thu Sep-29-11 05:47 PM

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99. "But is that even true - when labels stopped signing them and I agree the..."
In response to Reply # 91
Thu Sep-29-11 05:49 PM by Artful Dodger

          

stop signing them and instead brought on nothing but beatmakers for awhile... they either left the stage or went underground and stuck it out.

Black people turned their backs on bands.

So they turned to white folks.

Americans turned their backs on bands.

So they turned to Europe and Japan.

No deal, but still playing.

The problem with most OKP's is they equate "being" a musician or band with releasing records or having a deal.

What I loved about punk? Most punk bands didn't want a deal. They wanted no dealings with the machine - and there were a ton of em. A ton of em that you never heard, but they were in existence.

People can say what they want about Prince - being a band or not...
he at least kept live music relevant in the Black Community long after it became a past time.

Even when Stevie went electronic, Prince knew how to keep both sides of the coin on deck.

I know that's not the topic but just building off your previous convo.

  

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SoWhat
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89. "why do we think we gotta have everything they* have?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

fuck you.

  

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Deacon Blues
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Thu Sep-29-11 05:16 PM

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93. "RE: why do we think we gotta have everything they* have?"
In response to Reply # 89


  

          

>

it's not as much about having to have something they have but more about something we used to have (with a great leagacy) that is gone now and the decline of black instrumental music in general or at least the decline of funk bands. But this has already been discussed too often on this board so i will just shut up now.

dude

  

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MISTA MONOTONE
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Thu Sep-29-11 05:21 PM

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95. "^^^ THAT'S THE WHOLE MOTHAFUCKIN' POINT!!"
In response to Reply # 93


  

          

>>
>
>it's not as much about having to have something they have but
>more about something we used to have (with a great leagacy)
>that is gone now and the decline of black instrumental music
>in general or at least the decline of funk bands. But this has
>already been discussed too often on this board so i will just
>shut up now.

------------------------------------------
latest mixtape:
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mistamonotone - taboo
http://mistamonotone.bandcamp.com/album/taboo

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murph71
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Fri Sep-30-11 09:02 AM

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121. "RE: ^^^ THAT'S THE WHOLE MOTHAFUCKIN' POINT!!"
In response to Reply # 95
Fri Sep-30-11 09:04 AM by murph71

          

It didn't seem like that was the point, Tone....I thought this was about the shame of Wilco being consistent as a artistically great band and the fact that we cannot say the same for other black "bands"...

Not that it was shame that there are really no black bands recording music...Because that point has been discussed for years on the Lesson...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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SoWhat
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98. "oh so it's just that again."
In response to Reply # 93


  

          

eh.

fuck you.

  

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OldPro
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Thu Sep-29-11 04:04 PM

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90. "Bad Rabbits, N.E.R.D., J*Davey, Sa-Ra, Dam-Funk & Master Blasters"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Soulive, Dumpstaphunk, Michael Jefferies Son & Daughter, Incognito, etc

They are out there... just not in the numbers we used to see
_________________________________
Reunion Radio Podcasts
Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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MISTA MONOTONE
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Thu Sep-29-11 05:23 PM

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96. "thanks."
In response to Reply # 90


  

          

i've heard a few of those and seen several of their names before. a couple are new to me.

------------------------------------------
latest mixtape:
https://www.mixcloud.com/mistamonotone/music-to-smack-motherfckers-to/

mistamonotone - taboo
http://mistamonotone.bandcamp.com/album/taboo

@mistamonotone
IG: mistamonotone

  

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Artful Dodger
Member since Nov 20th 2009
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Thu Sep-29-11 05:55 PM

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100. "Um... I dunno about a few of those... but yeah - Robert Randolph &amp; t..."
In response to Reply # 90
Thu Sep-29-11 06:00 PM by Artful Dodger

          

Ben Harper


SA RA and JDavey? I don't think so.
And I love both but I don't think they qualify.

I also don't think a band term qualifies if your music is programmed on record and played live in concert. Those bands generally don't play live in concert anyway. Maybe with a drum machine or a backing track or a MPC so I dunno if that counts. Maybe that's a whole nother post?

  

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OldPro
Member since Dec 10th 2002
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Thu Sep-29-11 06:38 PM

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109. "Well I considered The System a band"
In response to Reply # 100
Thu Sep-29-11 06:39 PM by OldPro

  

          

But I can see your point about duos like that

But the whole thing about this Wilco group is a moot point any way.... because from what I heard they aren't seeing Mint Condition.
_________________________________
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http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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Artful Dodger
Member since Nov 20th 2009
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Thu Sep-29-11 07:41 PM

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112. "I consider them an electronic duo - and yes they are the shit. still."
In response to Reply # 109
Thu Sep-29-11 07:44 PM by Artful Dodger

          

But I wouldn't call them a band. One cat who's an extremely talented pianist who's converted to synths and synth programming while another sings. Before I go any further let me point out I LOVE The System.

Calling them a band would be like calling the cat who sang all those wack ass Lionel Richie songs at your High School assembly along with a pianist a band. lol.

Another similar situation - programmed electronic albums but would sometimes play live with a drum machine while playing live on synths.
Or would sometimes have an electronic drummer and guitarist.

Your right the Wilco argument is some bullshit. They damn sure aint seeing Mint Condition on any kinda day.

They also not seeing The Time (regardless of the time period) and a whole host of other bands.

It's ridiculous to put Wilco over Radiohead or Stereolab... totally revisionist bullshit.

Hell who said they even got pass Green Day and I'm not even a huge fan of Green Day. Or Nirvana or the Foo Fighters who I do love.
Or Pearl Jam and even Phish. I mean it's an opinion gone way too far.

  

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OldPro
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124. "Just for the record.... Mic Murphy also played the guitar"
In response to Reply # 112


  

          

>But I wouldn't call them a band. One cat who's an extremely
>talented pianist who's converted to synths and synth
>programming while another sings. Before I go any further let
>me point out I LOVE The System.

But I'm sure you knew that

_________________________________
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Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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Artful Dodger
Member since Nov 20th 2009
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Fri Sep-30-11 11:43 AM

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127. "Of course - generally however he didn't. "
In response to Reply # 124


          

And honestly - that is another post that would be kinda fun talking about the System. ?

Also let's look at it this way - would you consider Simon and Garfunkel a band? Or a duo who sometimes played with a band?

I dunno, it's blurry for me.

Some people would probably say they are, some would say no - and then when you think of the system and know that it was primarily - 2 or 3 drum machines, a ton of synth, both pre-programmed and live, plus a lead vocalist who would sometimes play licks. I dunno.

One thing is for sure, in the era of minimalist regalia, it's a fucking shame how people ignored them.

  

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shockzilla
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Fri Sep-30-11 01:23 AM

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119. "lol."
In response to Reply # 109


          

  

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-DJ R-Tistic-
Member since Nov 06th 2008
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Thu Sep-29-11 06:00 PM

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102. "*Gets ready to get shitted on* Umm........who is Wilco?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

------------------------------

50+ FREE Mixes on www.DJR-Tistic.com!

Twitter and Instagram - @DJ_RTistic

  

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howisya
Member since Nov 09th 2002
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Thu Sep-29-11 06:03 PM

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103. "the best band of the last 25 years apparently"
In response to Reply # 102


  

          

i didn't click the other topic because the idea is so laughable to me, not that the "black" "band" suggestions here are better

  

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Artful Dodger
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Thu Sep-29-11 06:08 PM

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104. "Yo exactly it's some total bullshit aint it? There are so many better b..."
In response to Reply # 103


          

fucking Wilco that it's crazy.

Revisionism at it's absolute finest I'm telling you.

What's next R.E.M. where better than the Beatles?

Hilarity.

  

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Anonymous
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Thu Sep-29-11 06:22 PM

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105. "or is it because you cant name a band putting out material as good?"
In response to Reply # 103


  

          

You always have some smart ass way to side step the topic at hand.

If you think its 'laughable' then speak the fuck up.

Who has put out a run of high quality albums like they have?

*waits for you to name a 'safe' act that has maybe 2 albums that can compete with Wilco's 7*

  

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howisya
Member since Nov 09th 2002
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Thu Sep-29-11 06:25 PM

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107. "can't? won't"
In response to Reply # 105


  

          

shoutout to wilco and all their fans, but that conversation is a waste of my time

  

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Anonymous
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Thu Sep-29-11 07:43 PM

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113. "whatever you say Mr Side Step"
In response to Reply # 107


  

          

Nm

  

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Artful Dodger
Member since Nov 20th 2009
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Thu Sep-29-11 07:57 PM

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114. "*raises hand slowly* not trying to step into ya'lls argument - I respect..."
In response to Reply # 113


          

without a doubt but I did name quite a few bands.

How do you figure Wilco is seeing

Radiohead?
Stereolab?
Sea and Cake?
The Cure?
Lamb?

just to name a very small few.

  

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Anonymous
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Thu Sep-29-11 08:23 PM

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116. "sorry, I was responding to you on my phone and then got a call"
In response to Reply # 114


  

          

>without a doubt but I did name quite a few bands.
>
>How do you figure Wilco is seeing
>
>Radiohead?
>Stereolab?
>Sea and Cake?
>The Cure?
>Lamb?
>
>just to name a very small few.

Radiohead seems to be the band that most people name.
I honestly Radiohead is more gimmick than substance. I love some of their work…but some of it comes off as being creative for the sake of being creative. With that said, I understand people naming them.

Stereolab to me is a great band but they just don't have the same quality as Wilco.

Sea and Cake I am definitely not up on so I need to check them out. That was the underlying point of my other post, I wanted to get recommendations as well so thanks.

The Cure…Nah…they're decent. But what I've been getting at is that (and this is if you like Wilco) Wilco doesn't miss. They are damn near perfect at such a high level it's damn near unmatchable.

Lamb…see Sea and Cake.

  

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Artful Dodger
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Fri Sep-30-11 11:59 AM

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129. "nah no prob I fell asleep last night lol"
In response to Reply # 116
Fri Sep-30-11 12:02 PM by Artful Dodger

          

Radiohead seems to be the band that most people name.
I honestly Radiohead is more gimmick than substance.

=== I have heard this before from non Radiohead fans and it's a huge untruth. I often times think that most people who are not fans have no idea really and truly what they are doing live. I could be wrong tho. The fact that they have went from rock to rock/electrofusion, and done so poetically, sonically, and have someone still remained both the world's most famous band and underground band is just...
a revelation. ====


I love some of their work…but some of it comes off as being creative for the sake of being creative. With that said, I understand people naming them.

===== I hear you, could just not be your thing. Maybe it's just exposure? Alot of their career has been so closely followed that having the chance to take the ride with them has been great. I know some people who tried to dive into their work and just couldn't get it. I would imagine that's the case with most bands that challenge the ear.


Stereolab to me is a great band but they just don't have the same quality as Wilco.

======= Aw bro, I totally disagree. Wilco doesn't have a Dots and Loops... and by and far Stereolab has taken way more sonic and musical chances than Wilco ever has. In fact I find Wilco very safe, a good solid band, but safe when stacked against Radiohead or Stereolab. Now in terms of engineering and mix I often think that while taking those challenges it's also difficult to mix. Whereas safer bands already have a platform to base off of. No disrespect to Wilco cause I love Interpol - and truth be it told they are fairly safe for their lane. I fucking LOVE their lane tho. =========

Sea and Cake I am definitely not up on so I need to check them out. That was the underlying point of my other post, I wanted to get recommendations as well so thanks.


======== Definitely you will love em. The lead singer also has a series of albums that are equally excellent. in fact they have a whole collective of musicians from Sea and Cake, Stereolab. They alsdo dj and do a ton of electro records under various names sorta like the whole Tom Tom Club/Talking Heads thing. ===========


The Cure…Nah…they're decent. But what I've been getting at is that (and this is if you like Wilco) Wilco doesn't miss. They are damn near perfect at such a high level it's damn near unmatchable.

========= I hear you and your right it's all opinion. Wilco doesn't have a KissMe Kiss Me Kiss Me in my opinion but there you have it, I'm huge on them so. Ya know it's open to opinion. ======



Lamb…see Sea and Cake.


======== Lamb is everything Portishead tried to be. Even smaller in outfit but just fantastic. Sea & Cake are just incredible. ======

  

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Artful Dodger
Member since Nov 20th 2009
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Thu Sep-29-11 06:35 PM

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108. "Allow me to name a few"
In response to Reply # 105


          

Radiohead
Stereolab
Sea & Cake
Beastie Boys
The Roots
Lamb
The Cure

again it comes down to opinion but I'm saying...

  

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OldPro
Member since Dec 10th 2002
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Thu Sep-29-11 06:41 PM

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110. "Wait"
In response to Reply # 108


  

          

You're disqualifying J*Davey and Sa-Ra as a band but listing the Beastie Boys?



_________________________________
Reunion Radio Podcasts
Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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Artful Dodger
Member since Nov 20th 2009
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Thu Sep-29-11 07:26 PM

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111. "Yep and here's why"
In response to Reply # 110


          

what makes a band? can you play, live. the basic, live drums, live instrumentation. No gimmicks.

The Beasties have done tours like this and recorded like this.

Not a backing band, them.

Sa Ra and Jdavey uses drum machines, MPC's most notably, and preprogrammed backing tracks. That is NOT live. Even when they have bands it's purely situational. They almost never record live and when they do add live instrumentation it sounds like The Gap trying to sell anarchy Tshirts. They however - for what they do is great.

Also consider this.

Radiohead went from live band to a fusion of live instrumentation and electronica - yet they have proven time and time again they are true musicians and can do both.

The Beasties are sort of the reverse. Yet have done so.


I give you points for singling out the weakest out of my picks - well played. lol.

  

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OldPro
Member since Dec 10th 2002
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Fri Sep-30-11 10:01 AM

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123. "sorry I'm not accepting the idea using a drum machines disqualifies you"
In response to Reply # 111


  

          

if that's your criteria then fine.... but it makes no sense to me. It's like saying The Time isn't a real band since they don't use real horns.
_________________________________
Reunion Radio Podcasts
Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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Artful Dodger
Member since Nov 20th 2009
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Fri Sep-30-11 11:38 AM

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126. "Helluva argument. I totally feel you. TheTime are still playing."
In response to Reply # 123
Fri Sep-30-11 12:19 PM by Artful Dodger

          

Yeah it's true, the lines get blurry. I mean maybe I'm not the guy to make that decision but for me when I see someone playing with a drum machine they might as well be playing a record or a backing track.

With synths you still have to know how to play.

See electronic drums (with sound presets) are one thing - you still have to play.

Drum machines are pre-programmed, something you could have done weeks ago while sipping expresso's in LA. lol.

Synth horns, you can still fuck up if you can't play and sound horrible like any instrument cause you still playing a piano spread. It's just the sound isn't an acoustic piano. It's a preset - horns.



  

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lakai336
Member since Aug 17th 2009
1306 posts
Sun Oct-02-11 01:40 PM

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132. "Correction"
In response to Reply # 103


          

Wilco is the greatest sleep medication of the last 25 years. Shit is instant.

  

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justin_scott
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Thu Sep-29-11 06:24 PM

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106. "steel pulse?"
In response to Reply # 0


          

.

************************************************************

  

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Warren Coolidge
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Thu Sep-29-11 08:17 PM

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115. "I should charge people copyright fees on right today...lol."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

right today (OKSPORTS!! CROSS
>POST!!)?

seriously.

  

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MISTA MONOTONE
Member since Jan 30th 2004
58562 posts
Thu Sep-29-11 10:22 PM

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117. "oh, that's you, brah? i didn't even know. LOL."
In response to Reply # 115


  

          

i made *one* thing that stuck in OK Sports...Joey Blueskies. it doesn't matter anymore 'cause Joey Harrington ain't relevant at all.

------------------------------------------
latest mixtape:
https://www.mixcloud.com/mistamonotone/music-to-smack-motherfckers-to/

mistamonotone - taboo
http://mistamonotone.bandcamp.com/album/taboo

@mistamonotone
IG: mistamonotone

  

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Warren Coolidge
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Thu Sep-29-11 10:41 PM

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118. "it came from a post titled "Right today.....Bynum >>> Shaq""
In response to Reply # 117


  

          

Right today comes from the movie Wattstaxx...

there's a scene where 2 men are talking about women....the lighter skinned man with shades on is talking about how he had a women he bought a bunch of stuff for, but then she dogged him....and how he would be in his car sitting in his car by himself because she had his nose open..

anyways the man says... "and Right today.....I still got feelings for that woman"

lol..

yeah..okaysports been biting Warren Coolidge vernacular for the longest....

Whoo-Ride...and Right today are just the more known ones.

  

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builtfromwax
Member since May 01st 2007
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Fri Sep-30-11 10:49 AM

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125. "dunno who Wilco is, but it's sickening to me..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

that mofos OVERLOOK, fail to understand or acknowledge that go-go is the last bastion for BLACK (not capital B, but Capitol B) bands.

there's been a resurgence of bands in the DC area for the last couple years. it's no where near the level it was 10, 15 years ago (mainly cuz venues ain't trynna have bands with percussionist in their spots), but there's been an increase...tho' slight.

it's funny cuz folks that i've talked to would LOVE to have Chuck Brown's career. the man been tourin' and giggin' for damn near 40+ years! still releases albums that actually chart on Billboard. still sells out venues IF he decides to play. and he's 75 YEARS OLD!

but then again, this is The Lesson. so i shouldn't be surprised.

  

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Luke Cage
Member since Dec 14th 2005
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Sun Oct-02-11 02:00 AM

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131. "Instead of being sickened...enlighten us"
In response to Reply # 125


  

          

>that mofos OVERLOOK, fail to understand or acknowledge that
>go-go is the last bastion for BLACK (not capital B, but
>Capitol B) bands.

I don't think most people know any Go Go artists not named Chuck Brown, EU or Rare Essence. It would be great if we knew of a place online to check out other artists that are putting it down for Go Go.
>
>there's been a resurgence of bands in the DC area for the last
>couple years. it's no where near the level it was 10, 15 years
>ago (mainly cuz venues ain't trynna have bands with
>percussionist in their spots), but there's been an
>increase...tho' slight.

I've heard of Mambo Sauce and a couple of other ones but in general I don't own much Go Go music. I've always thought it as a live genre that didn't necessarily translate well onto record. If I'm wrong and there's some shit I should be checking out by all means point me in the right direction.
>
>it's funny cuz folks that i've talked to would LOVE to have
>Chuck Brown's career. the man been tourin' and giggin' for
>damn near 40+ years! still releases albums that actually chart
>on Billboard. still sells out venues IF he decides to play.
>and he's 75 YEARS OLD!

People know Chuck Brown but again that's about as far as it goes with Go Go.
>
>but then again, this is The Lesson. so i shouldn't be
>surprised.

So there are other music sites that are much more up on Go Go than here? Do tell.

  

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mistermaxxx08
Member since Dec 31st 2010
16076 posts
Fri Sep-30-11 11:49 AM

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128. "i'd take Living Color and on the white side Dave Matthews band"
In response to Reply # 0


          

Living Color had the tracks and musicianship plus singing.

Dave Matthews Band is bigger and more known than Willco and I can't stand them but it is what it is.

mistermaxxx R.Kelly, Michael Jackson,Stevie wonder,Rick James,Marvin Gaye,El Debarge, Barry WHite Lionel RIchie,Isleys EWF,Lady T.,Kid creole and coconuts,the crusaders,kc sunshine band,bee gees,jW,sd,NE,JB

Miami Heat, New York Yankees,buffalo bills

  

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Artful Dodger
Member since Nov 20th 2009
8361 posts
Fri Sep-30-11 12:03 PM

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130. "I agree 100 percent. Vernone Reid is STILL the man."
In response to Reply # 128


          

  

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Garhart Poppwell
Member since Nov 28th 2008
17913 posts
Mon Oct-03-11 09:13 AM

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133. "The Dap-Kings are mad at that post"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

__________________________________________
CHOP-THESE-BITCHES!!!!
------------------------------------
Garhart Ivanhoe Poppwell
Un-OK'd moderator for The Lesson and Make The Music (yes, I do's work up in here, and in your asscrease if you run foul of this

  

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