From the content, to the lyrics, to the music, what is the most mature hip-hop album of all-time in your opinion?

http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=5&topic_id=2528649&mesg_id=2528649&listing_type=search#2528976

any take on the issue though?

the diverse album that got kinda dismissed in your last post and the j-live albums i mentioned in the same reply come to mind; blackalicious' 'nia' and 'blazing arrow'; invincible's 'shapeshifters'; honestly, the album OKP imcvspl made a few years ago, 'the catalyst' by iPL, also qualifies

it was pretty good. it wasn't hip-hop's Cursive's Domestica but it was an interesting look into divorce from a hip-hop perspective.


~~~~~~~~~
"This is the streets, and I am the trap." � Jay Bilas
http://www.popmatters.com/pm/archive/contributor/517
Hip Hop Handbook: http://tinyurl.com/ll4kzz

especially considering the rapid growth from CIBAD to this album.

LWFC gets a nod too. but I always felt it was more a "forced", contrived attempt to cash in on burgeoning boho rap movement

This might get my vote too. No one did the introspective (pun intended) shit better than him at that moment in time.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

Just. . . yeah.

The fact that I first heard that album when I was 16 and I can still go back to it and here things in a new light is proof enough for me.

~Austin

os·ti·na·to
/ˌästəˈnädō/
noun
a continually repeated musical phrase or rhythm

http://austinato.bandcamp.com

https://www.discogs.com/lists/Favorites-of-2017/332378

on LWFC Com really sounds like he's growin' up.

... for some reason "deep as a skinny girl's cunt" stands out like a sore thumb for me. Haha.

But yea - both were grown ass man music. Which is funny. Comm was more immature during the Drake beef in his 40s than he was in his mid-to-late 20s making One Day .. and Like Water ..

>on LWFC Com really sounds like he's growin' up.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

Lol

Haha - I kept thinking "that wasn't the only cringe-worthy line..." but couldn't remember the other thing. That was it !

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

Peace,

Spirit (Alan)
http://wutangbook.com

Say what you want about, say, his homophobia, that's a reasonable criticism in the context of this discussion ... but like, battle raps and the like, they can be mature too IMO. In fact that is one of Common's greatest strengths and one of my favorite things about him as an MC, his uncanny ability to splice introspection and traditional battle raps/wordplay almost effortlessly, especially in his prime (which I'd argue this album is).

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

-----------------------------------------------------------------

I am a Stan of course but, you could (and looks like people did) name like half or more of Comm's discography and be right.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

.

_______________________________
gamblers and masturbators.

Own No Loops: A podcast about rap.
http://ownnoloops.com

http://twitter.com/urkelmoedee

the most mature sounding album i've ever heard.

___________________________
Add me on:
www.gooseohio.bandcamp.com
http://smallkidbigcity.wordpress.com/
http://smallkidbigcity.tumblr.com/
www.facebook.com/zgase
www.facebook.com/pages/Goose/207963479294713
www.twitter.com/gooseohio
www.dwightschrutebeetf

i said the same thing.

and that was after one listen and was mostly just hyperbole.

but after a few more listens, i think i might actually mean it.


avy: our new album. you may just like it. listen for free online @ http://theyesyesyalls.com

http://twitter.com/shamelessplug
http://theyesyesyalls.com

I think "30 something" was dope for what it was...except for he was almost 40 when he said "30's the new 20." But I honestly think that song changed things up a lil bit, just like he did before with Button Ups n all that. He basically dissed rims, buying out bars, and several other niggerish things that made some folks say "damn...maybe I'm focused on the wrong things!"

But with that...I might say The Black Album is even more mature, especially for a commercial album.

------------------------------

50+ FREE Mixes on www.DJR-Tistic.com!

Twitter and Instagram - @DJ_RTistic

>I think "30 something" was dope for what it was...except for
>he was almost 40 when he said "30's the new 20."

I mean at least Andre 3000 on the remix was 31. But yeah Jay-z was a little late on making that song, should have been on Blueprint 2 or The Black Album.

>

------------------------------

50+ FREE Mixes on www.DJR-Tistic.com!

Twitter and Instagram - @DJ_RTistic

is just an old ass guy having an excuse to act immature.

it's like these dudes don't want to grow up.

I would say that the track is very immature if you really break the shit down.

EDIT:

I just read the lyrics, and honestly, and you're my boy on here, if you think that shit is mature, then that is sad.

that is Jay pulling the wool over folks eyes again. it's like people are told the general concept is "i'm a grown up" and they buy it.

a mature man doesn't spend his time bragging and stating over and over again how much better he is than the next man.

a mature man doesn't call his wife a broad.

a mature man doesn't base his worth on material things.

I could go on for days but I'm sure I'll already have the ignorant Lesson heads coming out of the woodworks with just that.

I alway hated that song and the fact that people bought into the shit.

a near 40 year old man trying his hardest to state that he is mature by pinning himself against young people.

Talk about not understanding the meaning of what your discussing,

Mature people don't need to tell you they're mature, they let their actions show it.

I see what you mean, but compared to most Rap, including what he had done before, he was speaking on shit that you NEEEEEEEEEEVER hear in Rap. Yeah, he was being slightly immature by putting down the "immature" folks, but I don't think him saying "30's the new 20" meant "30 year olds should still act 20"...it was more saying that "20 is supposed to be your prime, but I'm letting y'all know that 30 is your prime in a different way than you're used to hearing."

He did it in typical arrogant Jay fashion of course, and some of his wording was off like "better broad"...but serious, who in Rap ever made a hit song where they bragged about NOT sagging, not having a flashy watch, not buying out the bar, not putting on tints, etc. etc? It basically gave 30+ folks something to be proud about, instead of feeling like they have to keep up and be trendy like the young folks out there.

------------------------------

50+ FREE Mixes on www.DJR-Tistic.com!

Twitter and Instagram - @DJ_RTistic

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

GodSon

I see your God's Son and raise you "Life is Good"


https://soundcloud.com/phenixbeats/tracks

don't me wrong there are moments of mature introspective as you'd expect with nas, but you also get shit like 'on some jet li shit, i let the hammers blow, wet three kids'

plenty of fairly ignorant songs on there

----

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

One Way feat Al Hudson
So Afraid It's Over
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lmuq2ttuxpw

_____________________________________________________________
Everyone here hates pop music, but loves Michael Jackson... Okay Player...

Gets my vote. No wonder it pissed off so many people when it came out.

I liked it at the time because it seemed like it was about damn time somebody said something about all the bullshit that I hated.

But in retrospect, it *does* sound like a bunch of bitter, grumpy old men getting very cynical towards everything.

(which is maybe why I still like it so much?)

Overall though, way too much shit talking on that album for it to be considered 'mature.'

EDIT: Although, over the course of Mosaic Thump, Bionix and Grind Date, De La did make some genuinely mature and resonating hip hop for the older crowd. Chief example is obviously 'Trying People.'

~Austin

os·ti·na·to
/ˌästəˈnädō/
noun
a continually repeated musical phrase or rhythm

http://austinato.bandcamp.com

https://www.discogs.com/lists/Favorites-of-2017/332378

>I liked it at the time because it seemed like it was about
>damn time somebody said something about all the bullshit that
>I hated.
>
>But in retrospect, it *does* sound like a bunch of bitter,
>grumpy old men getting very cynical towards everything.
>
>(which is maybe why I still like it so much?)

The easy way out of someone critiquing anything nowadays is to call someone "old" or "bitter". De La were still young men and they have never been the bitter types. They had fun with that record and challenged the status quote which is what they've done their entire career.
>
>Overall though, way too much shit talking on that album for it
>to be considered 'mature.'

I don't think discussing/debating stereotypical norms is shit talking. They did it in an entertaining way. Mature doesn't have to be boring, reflective and non confrontational.
>
>EDIT: Although, over the course of Mosaic Thump, Bionix and
>Grind Date, De La did make some genuinely mature and
>resonating hip hop for the older crowd. Chief example is
>obviously 'Trying People.'
>
>~Austin

And he managed to talk all the stereotypical hip hop 'normie' shit on that album and still sound years past his peers (with integrity to boot).

~Austin

os·ti·na·to
/ˌästəˈnädō/
noun
a continually repeated musical phrase or rhythm

http://austinato.bandcamp.com

https://www.discogs.com/lists/Favorites-of-2017/332378

I love that album and agree it would be one of my choices too I just think you're criticism of De La is odd when you cite an album with lines like "tell your bitch to calm down, must wanna give me skull telling me to take my hat off" as a better representation of maturity.

De La Soul Buhloone Mindstate

Almost TOO fucking grown...made as if the prior 10 years of hip-hop didn't exist.

phemom's the name, all-star writer/
searching 4 journalistic fame, mindframe igniter....www.twitter.com/hayabusaage

Too much 'look at me, I'm different!' sort of shit � even though it worked. But still, don't draw attention to yourself.

Stuff like 'Got a Right Ta' and the concept of 'New Wave' always kind of bugged me in this respect.

~Austin

os·ti·na·to
/ˌästəˈnädō/
noun
a continually repeated musical phrase or rhythm

http://austinato.bandcamp.com

https://www.discogs.com/lists/Favorites-of-2017/332378

n/m

----------------------------

Young Broadway Star Urgently Needs a Bone Marrow Donor. Is it you? http://MatchShannon.com/







O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"




"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "

Definitely up there...

Integrity is the Cornerstone of Artistry...

true...

https://soundcloud.com/phenixbeats/tracks

n/m

----------------------------

Young Broadway Star Urgently Needs a Bone Marrow Donor. Is it you? http://MatchShannon.com/







O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"




"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "

_______________________________

DUMHI - We Are The World
Snoop Doggy Dogg - The Doggumentary
One Gud Cide - Look What The Streets Made

ॐ शांति

_______________________________

DUMHI - We Are The World
Snoop Doggy Dogg - The Doggumentary
One Gud Cide - Look What The Streets Made

ॐ शांति

lurkin since 1999. werd.

that track is transcendent. Great album.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

http://i54.tinypic.com/2j51hj4.jpg

.

_______________________________________________________________________________________

Just playin...

they're intheir early 20s trying to find themselves and all that, but damn if they dont come off sounding like grown ass men. i wouldnt say its the most mature album in hip hop, but i think its a very "mature for their age" record. same could be said about ATLiens.

___________________________
Add me on:
www.gooseohio.bandcamp.com
http://smallkidbigcity.wordpress.com/
http://smallkidbigcity.tumblr.com/
www.facebook.com/zgase
www.facebook.com/pages/Goose/207963479294713
www.twitter.com/gooseohio
www.dwightschrutebeetf

>they're intheir early 20s trying to find themselves and all
>that, but damn if they dont come off sounding like grown ass
>men. i wouldnt say its the most mature album in hip hop, but i
>think its a very "mature for their age" record. same could be
>said about ATLiens.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

Peace,

Spirit (Alan)
http://wutangbook.com

on the strength of Liberation alone

I had to mature to appreciate it.

Taking shots in the dark/that's a bad call
Going straight for your head/ gotta saw it off

I gotta dig that album up.

Common (One Day, LWFC, Be) and Atmosphere records (their last two) definitely came to mind...

I'd throw in the Minstrel Show too...

Peace,

Spirit (Alan)
http://wutangbook.com

Aceyalone - A Book of Human Language.


Peep "The Guidelines", http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TlhZBX_LL08

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bqnW1j4XBQ

nah foreal, i'ma have to go with that Aquemeni or maybe even The Ecstatic.

... now that i think about it even more... free of value judgements, Reasonable Doubt is an album i would consider up there with the others when it comes to "mature" albums.

_____________________________________________________________
Everyone here hates pop music, but loves Michael Jackson... Okay Player...

____________

I recall expecting a more mature gangsta rap album than I got from it...had hoped some of the thuggery would have been left behind by that point in Scarface's career.

Masta Ase-Disposable Art

I love Africans, but HATE the N-gger in YOU!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVBWy-aYgF4

Evolution of Man is another mature track
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sAFfvRxzl7E&feature=related

--sig--
n/a

And on a lot of their records to be honest...but for some reason some of his bars on JFK2LAX, My Advice to You, Moment of Truth, She Knows What She Wants, etc. all popped into my head at the same time...

Its a travesty how undervalued he is in terms of mainstream music fans...

----

-----------------------------------------------------------------

and willing to make himself vulnerable if the situation called for it
plus instead of just throwing out answers to problems, he asked questions for you think about it for yourself
that's some grown man shit right there

__________________________________________
CHOP-THESE-BITCHES!!!!
------------------------------------
Garhart Ivanhoe Poppwell
Un-OK'd moderator for The Lesson and Make The Music (yes, I do's work up in here, and in your asscrease if you run foul of this

______________________________________________________________
Blog: http://potholesinmyblog.com/
Twitter: http://twitter.com/Gedi

"This is your world. Shape it or someone else will." - Gary Lew

Along with the songs you mentioned, Robbin Hood Theory is another great example on that album.

<----------------------------------------
"Consider me the entity within the industry without a history of spittin the epitomy of stupidity!" - Talib Kweli
http://www.takotron.com/news/2006/mets_cap.jpg

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

My Advice 2 You is one of my favorite Gang Starr songs

******************************************
Falcons, Braves, Bulldogs and Hawks

Geto Boys, Poison Clan, UGK, Eightball & MJG, OutKast, Goodie Mob

The album dropped when I had some serious business to handle and own up to. Heard the title track and was reduced to tears, like he was talking directly to me. 2 days later I handled my business, let the wave hit me, and came out the other side.

<-- Dave Thomas knows what's up...
__________________________

Jay: Look here homie, any nigga can get a hit record. This here is about respect.
Game: Like Gladys Knight.
Jay: Aretha Franklin.
Game: Word, I like her too.
Jay: Nigga...

Music is amazing.

Glad you got thru whatever you were going thru.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

Pure storytelling & that ODB tribute is nuts.

hard dialogue without a whole bunch of cursing, while pulling women.

it's pretty much a blueprint for those able.