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Subject: "What is critical race theory?" Previous topic | Next topic
PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
15894 posts
Wed Mar-17-21 02:48 PM

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"What is critical race theory?"
Wed Mar-17-21 02:49 PM by PimpTrickGangstaClik

          

And why is it becoming the latest bogeyman? I keep hearing it more and more these days from the right.

I did my Wikipedia-ing (and read the critical theory page too to get some background), and my eyes glazed over. It just seems like some esoteric academic sociology/philosophy stuff.
It sounds like a debate between the two dudes in Good Will Hunting:
https://youtu.be/hIdsjNGCGz4?t=95s


What are the practical applications of critical race theory?
What does it mean to ban it (Trump did an EO banning it and Desantis banned it in Florida)?

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
RE: What is critical race theory?
Mar 17th 2021
1
Thanks
Mar 17th 2021
2
      Discussion on the education system is part of it, but it’s more
Mar 17th 2021
3
      Also has implications for workplace DEI-adjacent inititatives
Mar 17th 2021
4
      WHICH IS FUCKING FUNNY, because Coke in the 90s....
Jun 28th 2021
9
      It's a modernization of "history is written by the victors" essentially
Mar 17th 2021
5
I got some critical race theory for you.
Mar 17th 2021
6
How a Conservative Activist Invented the Conflict Over Critical Race The...
Jun 28th 2021
7
Makes sense as a scary language to organize grievance under one umbrella
Jun 28th 2021
16
      My mind was blown a little bit when it turns out Zoom Calls ignited all ...
Jun 28th 2021
32
Just another acronym with all the other acronyms.
Jun 28th 2021
8
Well, this certainly isn’t what it is.. sweet baby jesusl! smh
Jun 28th 2021
10
Critical Race Theory is an academic MOVEMENT that analyzes
Jun 28th 2021
13
Yeah no.
Jun 28th 2021
11
No, please open a few books.
Jun 28th 2021
12
This whole drama over it makes me very angry
Jun 28th 2021
14
I hear this. My new approach:
Jun 28th 2021
15
^This isn’t how life works.
Jun 28th 2021
18
      the only people saying white people today are responsible for slavery
Jun 28th 2021
20
      right?! goddamn. when did that enter the dialog.
Jun 28th 2021
38
      What are you even talking about?
Jun 28th 2021
22
      This is wrong as hell.
Jun 28th 2021
26
           K.
Jun 28th 2021
28
      you see how they do? respectfully sir, what the fuck are you doing?
Jun 28th 2021
33
      I want that, too.
Jun 28th 2021
35
      Dammmmmmmmmmn
Jun 29th 2021
55
The media coverage of it is so bad. Probably intentionally.
Jun 28th 2021
17
This part
Jun 28th 2021
19
The best way to discuss any of these topics is to ask questions.
Jun 28th 2021
21
the fact that it isn’t in schools
Jun 28th 2021
23
      Anything dealing with race = critical race theory
Jun 28th 2021
24
      Yeah it really highlights that they have no attacks for Biden
Jun 28th 2021
25
Its regular ass history, told truthfully and equitably.
Jun 28th 2021
27
^^Thank you!
Jun 28th 2021
29
LOL Exactly.
Jun 28th 2021
30
Thee end.
Jun 28th 2021
34
if this is the case....
Jun 29th 2021
41
muhphuckas concerned with the 'white gaze' coined the term
Jun 29th 2021
42
It's not. History is history. CRT is about the current
Jun 29th 2021
47
      you can keep the silos homey.
Jun 29th 2021
48
           You're acting just like them.
Jun 29th 2021
49
                RE: You're acting just like them.
Jun 29th 2021
51
                Additionallly...
Jun 29th 2021
52
The fact that they don't understand it is what makes this all so scary.
Jun 28th 2021
31
Right, CRT is simply a big scary boogie monster that they need to avoid
Jun 28th 2021
36
What should be taught differently?
Jun 28th 2021
37
Uh...no, there is a lot more to it.
Jun 28th 2021
39
      So, like, in order to get a HS diploma,
Jun 28th 2021
40
           is this actually happening though?
Jun 29th 2021
43
           its a weird ass question
Jun 29th 2021
45
           also saying they'll forget most of it anyway is a strange counter
Jun 29th 2021
50
                why teach at all?
Jun 29th 2021
53
                RE: why teach at all?
Jun 29th 2021
59
                RE: also saying they'll forget most of it anyway is a strange counter
Jun 29th 2021
58
           RE: is this actually happening though?
Jun 29th 2021
57
           Are you Black?
Jun 29th 2021
44
                RE: Are you Black?
Jun 29th 2021
60
CRT has become something of a catch-all term
Jun 29th 2021
46
No snark but you forgot "just talking about racism"
Jun 29th 2021
54
      I agree.
Jun 29th 2021
56
its a new buzzword for some old shit to rile people up.
Jun 29th 2021
61
You and Castro are both wrong.
Jun 30th 2021
62
      this. rw is deliberately and incorrectly expanding the definition to
Jun 30th 2021
63
      Its a lens for social theory. And that lens is based on equity
Jul 01st 2021
64
      RE: You and Castro are both wrong.
Jul 01st 2021
65
      You seem like you are just trying to win some nonexistent debate here.
Jul 01st 2021
66
      gotta try to carve out time to read this
Jul 01st 2021
67
           Of course.
Jul 01st 2021
68
                Hey thanks. Here's an excerpt from your first link
Jul 01st 2021
69
                     Yes, I agree with that. It's kind of long-winded, but yeah.
Jul 02nd 2021
71
It's a way of seeing systemic racism.
Jul 01st 2021
70

Nodima
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Wed Mar-17-21 05:20 PM

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1. "RE: What is critical race theory?"
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Mar-17-21 05:28 PM by Nodima

  

          

https://www.nytimes.com/1997/05/05/us/for-black-scholars-wedded-to-prism-of-race-new-and-separate-goals.html

"Professor Banks is an adherent of a growing academic movement among minority scholars called critical race theory, which holds that people's perspectives on events are overwhelmingly determined by their racial background. For critical race theorists, such incidents are rarely straightforward or what they might seem to others."

-------

As for what it means to cancel it, it's mostly along the lines of Trump's campaign to stop schools from teaching "anti-American" theory in schools, such as those who would disparage capitalism or claim that American didn't go far enough during the Civil Rights Movement.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/02/26/opinion/speech-racism-academia.html

In September, Donald Trump’s Office of Management and Budget ordered federal agencies to “begin to identify all contracts or other agency spending related to any training on ‘critical race theory,’” which it described as “un-American propaganda.”

A month later, the conservative government in Britain declared some uses of critical race theory in education illegal. “We do not want teachers to teach their white pupils about white privilege and inherited racial guilt,” said the Tory equalities minister, Kemi Badenoch. “Any school which teaches these elements of critical race theory, or which promotes partisan political views such as defunding the police without offering a balanced treatment of opposing views, is breaking the law.”

------

I've never thought critical race theory is all that difficult. It's just trying to broaden the lens of history and how people of majority races see the systems they've created impact minorities differently. Going back to that 1997 article:

''Critical race theory wants to bring race to the very center of the analysis of most situations,'' said Prof. Anthony E. Cook, an adherent of the theory on the faculty at Georgetown University Law School. ''Its assumption is that race has affected our perception of reality and our understanding of the world -- in almost every way.''

~~~~~~~~~
"This is the streets, and I am the trap." � Jay Bilas
http://www.popmatters.com/pm/archive/contributor/517
Hip Hop Handbook: http://tinyurl.com/ll4kzz

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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Wed Mar-17-21 05:32 PM

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2. "Thanks"
In response to Reply # 1


          

That first NYT article helped.
So I guess it's all a fight over the education system? What is and isn't allowed to be taught? Kind of like evolution vs creationism?

  

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soulfunk
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Wed Mar-17-21 05:41 PM

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3. "Discussion on the education system is part of it, but it’s more"
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

broad than just that. Opponents of critical race theory push back against any discussion of white privilege or institutional racism.

It’s also likely hard for you to get clear, succinct definitions/explanations because the term “critical race theory” tends to be used as a bogeyman term by the people on the right opposing it. The people teaching or talking about institutional racism and/or white privilege aren’t using the term “critical race theory” nearly as often those opposing it. They make it seem like some hige conspiracy to take down the white race. Essentially the same way they talk about Antifa.

  

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shockvalue
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Wed Mar-17-21 05:46 PM

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4. "Also has implications for workplace DEI-adjacent inititatives"
In response to Reply # 2
Wed Mar-17-21 05:48 PM by shockvalue

          

Did you see the recent story about Coca-cola/Linkedin? Didn't add up to much but basically Coca-cola assigned some employees to take some elective courses through a Linkedin portal, from a broad menu not curated by Cocacola itself...

Apparently some of the white employees ended up accessing material from Robin DeAngelo ("White Fragility"), advocating among other things "Be(ing) less white". Coke preditably distanced itself from the material, but some of these academic approaches seem like legal landmines (or not...corporate lawyers are probably sanding off these edges as fast as they can).



  

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double negative
Member since Dec 14th 2007
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Mon Jun-28-21 12:13 PM

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9. "WHICH IS FUCKING FUNNY, because Coke in the 90s...."
In response to Reply # 4


  

          

https://www.wsj.com/podcasts/the-journal/what-corporate-america-can-learn-from-coke-reckoning-with-race/a57e5038-d07f-443c-8703-b1f3a61bea5d


long story short, Coke was sued for not promoting black employees through the ranks, then they pledged to do better and they DID do better on a level not seen anywhere else, but then that energy wasnt held up and things slid back into old patterns...

listen to the show, its a 20 minute history lesson thats kind of mind blowing

***********************************************************
https://soundcloud.com/swageyph/yph-die-with-me

  

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Nodima
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Wed Mar-17-21 05:51 PM

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5. "It's a modernization of "history is written by the victors" essentially"
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

Conservative people don't like it because you can't take, say, Black on Korean violence (and vice versa) in the '90s and let white people float above the fray. White wars caused a mistrust of Korean/Vietnamese immigrants, and the systematic oppression of both groups can lead both to conclude they're powerless to lash out against the white power structure surrounding them but will be "understood" if they lash out against each other.


https://www.vox.com/22321234/black-asian-american-tensions-solidarity-history
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/06/opinion/asian-american-violence-race.html



~~~~~~~~~
"This is the streets, and I am the trap." � Jay Bilas
http://www.popmatters.com/pm/archive/contributor/517
Hip Hop Handbook: http://tinyurl.com/ll4kzz

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Wed Mar-17-21 08:42 PM

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6. "I got some critical race theory for you. "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I have been researching the one recorded lynching in my hometown.

I just this week found articles about it.

https://sites.lib.jmu.edu/valynchings/va1887072601/

Read the accounts in the old articles. Truth is there are two or three accounts of it but I can not begin at all to trust these accounts as being honest accounts of what happened. These stories are told through the perspective of white supremacy.

I would love just one account of this story from a black person who was there.



**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Mon Jun-28-21 11:40 AM

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7. "How a Conservative Activist Invented the Conflict Over Critical Race The..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


https://www.newyorker.com/news/annals-of-inquiry/how-a-conservative-activist-invented-the-conflict-over-critical-race-theory



**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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Mon Jun-28-21 01:01 PM

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16. "Makes sense as a scary language to organize grievance under one umbrella"
In response to Reply # 7


          

And abstract enough, so everything can be tied back to or blamed on critical race theory.

“Its connotations are all negative to most middle-class Americans, including racial minorities, who see the world as ‘creative’ rather than ‘critical,’ ‘individual’ rather than ‘racial,’ ‘practical’ rather than ‘theoretical.’ Strung together, the phrase ‘critical race theory’ connotes hostile, academic, divisive, race-obsessed, poisonous, elitist, anti-American.”




Another thing that stood out to me in the article is how easy it was to manipulate Trump. Dude went on Tucker, did the whole "I'm calling on the president to ...." thing.

Then:
"The next morning, Rufo was home with his wife and two sons when he got a phone call from a 202 area code. The man on the other end, Rufo recalled, said, “ ‘Chris, this is Mark Meadows, chief of staff, reaching out on behalf of the President. He saw your segment on ‘Tucker’ last night, and he’s instructed me to take action.” "


_______________________________________

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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32. "My mind was blown a little bit when it turns out Zoom Calls ignited all ..."
In response to Reply # 16


  

          


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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allStah
Member since Jun 21st 2014
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Mon Jun-28-21 11:56 AM

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8. "Just another acronym with all the other acronyms."
In response to Reply # 0
Mon Jun-28-21 11:57 AM by allStah

          

It’s all civil rights movement or the fight for human rights.

It’s like WOKE. We called it Knowledge of Self back in the day or
Right Knowledge.

Just focus on fighting for social justice and and equal rights without the Acronyms.

Social Justice Warrior
WOKE
Knowledge of Self
Civil Rights Activist
Critical Race Theory ( which is a movement and not a theory)
Black Lives Matters

Stop buying those acronyms with your hard earned intelligence...




ALL HAIL THE KING of LOSING: LEBRON
Bulls | Bears | White Sox | Yankees | Notre Dame | Illinois | Chelsea | Real Madrid

  

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legsdiamond
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Mon Jun-28-21 12:18 PM

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10. "Well, this certainly isn’t what it is.. sweet baby jesusl! smh"
In response to Reply # 8


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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allStah
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Mon Jun-28-21 12:36 PM

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13. "Critical Race Theory is an academic MOVEMENT that analyzes"
In response to Reply # 10
Mon Jun-28-21 12:47 PM by allStah

          

and challenges laws and legislation in regards to ethnicity ( black ethnicity
in specific)

There have been several groups and movements that have done similar
actions ...I’m not degrading it’s practice.

What I’m saying is just teach the history, laws and factual
events and quit trying to specialize, title or label things.

I just feel our efforts sometimes get lost in all these different movements,
acronyms and titles.....which often leads to hostility, and the actual mission
gets lost.

ALL HAIL THE KING of LOSING: LEBRON
Bulls | Bears | White Sox | Yankees | Notre Dame | Illinois | Chelsea | Real Madrid

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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11. "Yeah no. "
In response to Reply # 8


  

          


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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double negative
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12. "No, please open a few books. "
In response to Reply # 8


  

          

***********************************************************
https://soundcloud.com/swageyph/yph-die-with-me

  

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double negative
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14. "This whole drama over it makes me very angry"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Its just rude as fuck to be mad about something you do not understand

I'm really done with anyone who wants to fight against this because I'm black and white on this one. Either slavery and white supremacy have fucked us (and when I say us, I mean all of us) all up or you are full of shit and need to do yourself a favor and slap some knowledge into yourself.

***********************************************************
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Brew
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15. "I hear this. My new approach:"
In response to Reply # 14


          

When someone proves themselves unqualified to have a productive conversation on the subject (whether by not being able to define CRT, or explain the BLM movement, or gets facts wrong about redlining or police murders or whatever) I just straight up tell them that and in those words ("sorry but you're just not qualified to be having this conversation since you don't even understand the subject you're trying to talk about" or something to that effect). That way I save us both the frustration.

I may leave them with some content to read or watch or listen to, or something, telling them to feel free to reach back out when they've studied up a bit more. But they never do of course. Saves me a lot of time and frustration.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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allStah
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18. "^This isn’t how life works."
In response to Reply # 14
Mon Jun-28-21 01:12 PM by allStah

          

Life is evolution, and we didn’t and don’t all evolve out of the same circumstances
and backgrounds.

I’m African-American and I’m proud of it, but white people in this era
are not responsible for my ancestors being slaves or being forced
into bondage. And nor should they be responsible for the actions of their
white ancestors.

That would be up there with someone being considered a slave or servant
because their ancestors were slaves or servants...a caste system that still
exist in India.

However, I do believe in fighting for reparations, because that is something
that we are entitled to based on our ancestors building this country, and
the companies and corporations that exist because of it.

I also believe in teaching the history of every culture, and how laws were
used to segregate and integrate certain cultures and people....I support that
100 percent.

But those things should be taught in all US Law, History and Social Study classes...
It doesn’t need a special title, acronym or practice.






ALL HAIL THE KING of LOSING: LEBRON
Bulls | Bears | White Sox | Yankees | Notre Dame | Illinois | Chelsea | Real Madrid

  

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legsdiamond
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20. "the only people saying white people today are responsible for slavery"
In response to Reply # 18


          

are white people

not one Black person has ever said white people in 2021 are responsible for slavery.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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double negative
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38. "right?! goddamn. when did that enter the dialog. "
In response to Reply # 20


  

          

***********************************************************
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soulpsychodelicyde
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Mon Jun-28-21 01:23 PM

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22. "What are you even talking about?"
In response to Reply # 18


          


>I’m African-American and I’m proud of it, but white people
>in this era
>are not responsible for my ancestors being slaves or being
>forced
>into bondage. And nor should they be responsible for the
>actions of their
>white ancestors.

Who said anything about people alive today being responsible for slavery? I don't think I can blame my white neighbor for slavery. HOWEVER, she is absolutely responsible and should be held accountable for a life marked by a continual benefit of the effects of slavery and white supremacy. And that includes knowing -- at minimuj -- WTF CRT is before they march in the streets against it.
>
>That would be up there with someone being considered a slave
>or servant
>because their ancestors were slaves or servants...a caste
>system that still
>exist in India.

America *is* a caste system. We can pretend otherwise if we want, but that doesn't change the truth.

>

  

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allStah
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Mon Jun-28-21 01:47 PM

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26. "This is wrong as hell."
In response to Reply # 22
Mon Jun-28-21 02:16 PM by allStah

          

“HOWEVER, she is absolutely responsible and should be held accountable for a life marked by a continual benefit of the effects of slavery and white supremacy”

Your focking white neighborhood ain’t responsible for that, and nor should
she be held accountable. That’s the dumbest shit I ever heard of it.

You don’t control a person’s volition or free will of what they want and
don’t want to do. You got people who just want to work, eat, raise their
kids, and then pass away. They are entitled to that regardless of culture.

Only thing your white neighbor or any neighbor is responsible for is to fight
and support equal rights for all people of this country...Now if your neighbor
is against equality, that is when it is a problem and is uncivilized.


Someone being held accountable for what they didn’t create nor
support?

ALL HAIL THE KING of LOSING: LEBRON
Bulls | Bears | White Sox | Yankees | Notre Dame | Illinois | Chelsea | Real Madrid

  

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soulpsychodelicyde
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Mon Jun-28-21 02:08 PM

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28. "K."
In response to Reply # 26


          

  

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double negative
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33. "you see how they do? respectfully sir, what the fuck are you doing?"
In response to Reply # 18
Mon Jun-28-21 03:29 PM by double negative

  

          

>
>I’m African-American and I’m proud of it, but white people
>in this era
>are not responsible for my ancestors being slaves or being
>forced
>into bondage. And nor should they be responsible for the
>actions of their
>white ancestors.
>


https://gph.is/2mJRUNC

don't do that.

don't do this.

At a minimum, I want people to stop pretending as if slavery was just a weird thing that happened a long time ago and then it ended and we all lived happily ever after



DUDE, here is where I am:

I'm mad as fucking hell that historic exclusionary policies have FUCKED things up for everyone. Think about the lost innovative/economic greateness that was squashed to protect whiteness. Think about lost GDP.
Think about the wasted potential for black, white and all others.

I don't think of American slavery as something that just happened to black people. It happened to us. Think about the times when they used to make public hanging a good ol' family time. You don't think seeing that shit in such a casual light ruined the well-being of the adults and children there?

And now...we can't have a single goddamn thing good because every possible good thing is viewed through a zero sum lens. Motherfuckers are clutch-ING to whiteness and dying for it.

Like I said, these people will crash and burn this whole airplane if a single brown face is sitting in first class.

I don't want a kumbaya moment. I want equity and a chance TO earn wealth and generational wealth undisturbed. I'm tired of there being some forgetfulness that there was a thumb on the scale.

I want us to stop pretending as if the only color that mattered was green.


SOOOOOOOOOOoooooooOOOOOOOooo

what I see in CRT is a framework to discuss the how and why things are they way they are. To deny that there is a how and why by saying CRT is bad...ok, where do you want me to go from there? I'm not going to hand hold because, I know, people are willing to DIE for whiteness, maintaining the mirage is that important for some people.

***********************************************************
https://soundcloud.com/swageyph/yph-die-with-me

  

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allStah
Member since Jun 21st 2014
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35. "I want that, too. "
In response to Reply # 33
Mon Jun-28-21 03:54 PM by allStah

          

And I fight for that, but I don’t need the white man next door to show
accountability or responsibility for the history of this country, when he isn’t
responsible for that history.

I need him, MOVING FOWARD, to support equal opportunities for all cultures
financially, academically, medically and globally....and to teach his loved ones
those same values.

That’s how we move the fock on.

My fight is more with the government. That is where the true fight should be,
in regards to black people being given a certain percentage of land, monetary
compensation, etc

I don’t give a fock about a history lesson if no wealth or reparation is tied to it....
Jews went and took back everything that was stolen from them during the war....
paintings, goods, documents, property.

Let me know when that movement takes off..I’ll be the first brother on board.




ALL HAIL THE KING of LOSING: LEBRON
Bulls | Bears | White Sox | Yankees | Notre Dame | Illinois | Chelsea | Real Madrid

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
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55. "Dammmmmmmmmmn"
In response to Reply # 18


  

          

You going hard for whites.

---------------------------
Signature

  

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Soldado
Member since Apr 13th 2006
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17. "The media coverage of it is so bad. Probably intentionally."
In response to Reply # 0


          

They don't even bring up the two biggest facts of reality regarding the rush to ban CRT in high schools.

1. CRT isn't taught in high schools
2. Republicans have no idea what CRT is

Because if the media were to highlight both of these facts, it would diffuse most of the intrigue around this issue and eliminate the need for horse-race Dems vs Reps political coverage of it.

---

  

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GOMEZ
Member since Feb 13th 2003
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19. "This part"
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

>2. Republicans have no idea what CRT is

I'm only slightly familiar w/CRT, and there are certain parts I have questions about, need clarification on, and maybe even disagree with.

But the idea that you should pre-emptively prohibit teaching something because you heard on Fox News that might contradict with your world view is about as stupid as it gets. 99.9% of the people who are so opposed haven't even read the source material.

In a generation of swine, the one-eyed pig is king.
-Hunter S. Thompson

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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21. "The best way to discuss any of these topics is to ask questions. "
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

If anyone bashes BLM or CRT and you respond defending BLM or CRT you wasting your time.

When you hard press to simply explain what there issue is specifically they fall apart.

ASk them what exactly they object to about CRT and ask them for specific examples of what they are talking about and they start to crumble.




**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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legsdiamond
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23. "the fact that it isn’t in schools"
In response to Reply # 17


          

yet people believe its already being taught is a great example of GOP/Fox News duping folks.

they know white people are mad af or want to be mad at something and since Biden isn’t playing with poop on the WH lawn they turned to CRT.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
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24. "Anything dealing with race = critical race theory"
In response to Reply # 23


          

GOP/Fox News does thrive in catching one off examples of cringey stuff to attach to their CRT narrative.
Like goofy teachers fresh off of reading "How to be an anti-racist" creating some ill-advised class assignments.

They take those one off events and package them together to make it look common

_______________________________________

  

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Soldado
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25. "Yeah it really highlights that they have no attacks for Biden"
In response to Reply # 23


          

or his actual policies.

Fox News was Obama-mania leading up to the midterms in 2010. Now it's all about CRT, Lori Lightfoot, cancel culture and wokeness.

I saw a stat about how many books conservative publishers put out about Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama. And how they're struggling to publish books or find any audience for anything Anti-Biden.

---

  

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Castro
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27. "Its regular ass history, told truthfully and equitably. "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

------------------
One Hundred.

  

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allStah
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29. "^^Thank you!"
In response to Reply # 27


          

Somebody with some motherfocking common sense.

ALL HAIL THE KING of LOSING: LEBRON
Bulls | Bears | White Sox | Yankees | Notre Dame | Illinois | Chelsea | Real Madrid

  

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Heinz
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30. "LOL Exactly."
In response to Reply # 27


  

          

I hate that we keep trying to put a title to it. People on the right think it's a whole new agenda or an actual theory based on the bad labeling by the left. It's just history. Let's start teaching ACTUAL history rather than what we grew up on as what white people felt was okay for us to know.


----------

IG @erichrigonan

  

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double negative
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34. "Thee end. "
In response to Reply # 27


  

          

***********************************************************
https://soundcloud.com/swageyph/yph-die-with-me

  

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The3rdOne
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41. "if this is the case...."
In response to Reply # 27


  

          

then why is it considered a "theory"?

  

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Castro
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42. "muhphuckas concerned with the 'white gaze' coined the term"
In response to Reply # 41


  

          

'theory' is because they are trying to get white people to accept the truth and engage in history equitably.

To the rest of us, its regular ass history. Carry on.

------------------
One Hundred.

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
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47. "It's not. History is history. CRT is about the current"
In response to Reply # 27


          

CRT isn't about teaching "the real history".

It's about understanding/critiquing society as it currently stands. History of course feeds into it, but it's more sociology, law, and communications than history.

_______________________________________

  

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Castro
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48. "you can keep the silos homey. "
In response to Reply # 47


  

          

Go look at the recent 'history' of Texas, slavery and textbooks.

Parsing it out into sections just gives racists more geography in which they will continue to dig in with excuses, fake scholarship and political grandstanding.

------------------
One Hundred.

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
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49. "You're acting just like them. "
In response to Reply # 48


          

Taking something and defining it for your own purposes.

_______________________________________

  

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Castro
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51. "RE: You're acting just like them. "
In response to Reply # 49


  

          

Not at all. I am simply confident that an equitable telling of history is going to interrupt the acculturation process that maintains white supremacy. That doesn't mean that everything in history skews positively in favor of Black people or Asian people or Latinx. In fact, people who identify as white will be able to regain ethnic connections that get lost when one identifies as 'white'.

------------------
One Hundred.

  

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Castro
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52. "Additionallly..."
In response to Reply # 49


  

          

this means that Blk scholarship undergoes the same scrutiny. Everybody wins and humanity advances when history is recorded and told equitably.

------------------
One Hundred.

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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31. "The fact that they don't understand it is what makes this all so scary."
In response to Reply # 0


          

Legislatures are banning "critical race theory" in the schools without actually defining it. If they actually put an academic definition of the subject in their bills then those bills would do nothing, because from what I understand real CRT is really only discussed in law schools.

But because they only define it via vague insinuations, the bills either ban (or ban "in effect" by making teachers afraid to discuss) anything involving race or racism in any way. Are teachers not allowed to say that racism is bad? Are teachers not allowed to say that slavery had economic consequences? Teachers and curriculum committees won't want to take the risk, so basically any classroom discussion of topics involving race will be avoided or diluted to the point of uselessness.

And that's the real point. The goal of these Republican legislatures was never to curtail this arcane subfield of legal theory that almost nobody ever sees in a classroom anyway. Their goal is to avoid letting students think that something could or should be done about racism.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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36. "Right, CRT is simply a big scary boogie monster that they need to avoid"
In response to Reply # 31


  

          

saying that teaching about racism and the racist history of this country may make them feel bad.


But as Professor Crenshaw pointed out in the article I shared above, the opposition is very good about framing the discussion so now we are arguing over "Critical Race Theory" instead of the substance of CRT.

"As she saw it, the campaign against critical race theory represented a familiar effort to shift the point of the argument, so that, rather than being about structural racism, post-George Floyd politics were about the seminars that had proliferated to address structural racism."



**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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Fire1986
Member since Jul 15th 2005
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37. "What should be taught differently?"
In response to Reply # 0


          

Once you know about slavery, Jim Crow, and all that, what else do you need to learn? I thought everyone knew about slavery and America's history of racism already?...

Everything has been figured out except how to live.

  

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double negative
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39. "Uh...no, there is a lot more to it. "
In response to Reply # 37


  

          

>Once you know about slavery, Jim Crow, and all that, what
>else do you need to learn? I thought everyone knew about
>slavery and America's history of racism already?...

I went to blackety black private schools

I went to African American cultural centers each year to celebrate Kawanza

I went to weekend black history seminars in middle school

I had the ENTIRE collection of the Golden Legacy illustrated black history books - http://golden-legacy.com/


I bring up those things because I am still learning a lot about what happened. If anything, what I realize now is how much shit is dropped

Example: American Revolution & the connection to the second half of third verse in the star spangled banner -

"No refuge could save the hireling and slave

From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave,

And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave

O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave."

Written by Francis Scott Key the district attorney under Andrew "Jackie Baby" Jackson - who then influenced Jackson to appoint his brother in law Roger B. Taney the motherfucker who wrote the Dred Scott decision 🤯

NONE of that shit was talked about in school.

***********************************************************
https://soundcloud.com/swageyph/yph-die-with-me

  

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Fire1986
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40. "So, like, in order to get a HS diploma,"
In response to Reply # 39


          

people should know facts like that?

Or does knowing that, if I'm a cop, make me a more understanding police officer?

Or if I'm an underwriter, does that make me more sensitive to the blemishes on black loan applications?

What if I learn about that in school, but forget about it in my later years, like many people do with algebra or even facts about George Washington? For that matter, what if I just memorize for the test and willingly toss it aside once I graduate and get a job? How can you make sure that people learn it AND embrace it?

I can see if I'm going for advanced study in history, but for my diploma? I don't know.

Everything has been figured out except how to live.

  

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Mynoriti
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43. "is this actually happening though?"
In response to Reply # 40


  

          

I don't know enough about CRT to have any strong opinion on it but i thought it wasn't being taught in K-12, even though there a bunch of new state laws banning it.

IS it being taught in HS (or before)?
Is there a push for it to be?
If so is it/will it be a requirement to receive a diploma?

or are we just at the next we'll be marrying our dogs end of the slippery slope.

  

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legsdiamond
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45. "its a weird ass question "
In response to Reply # 43


          

how dare kids have to know about the history of America without it being white washed.

what could they possibly learn?

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Mynoriti
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50. "also saying they'll forget most of it anyway is a strange counter"
In response to Reply # 45


  

          

it's not necessarily false, i don't remember much of what i learned in HS, but if that's the case, then, A) why even have problem with it? B) Does that mean we should stop teaching america fuckyeah history as well?

  

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legsdiamond
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53. "why teach at all? "
In response to Reply # 50


          

just put the kids in cages and throw them food once a day for 8 hours.. lol.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Fire1986
Member since Jul 15th 2005
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59. "RE: why teach at all? "
In response to Reply # 53


          

>just put the kids in cages and throw them food once a day for
>8 hours.. lol.
>
>

It could be argued that this is case already for many inner city students...

Everything has been figured out except how to live.

  

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Fire1986
Member since Jul 15th 2005
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58. "RE: also saying they'll forget most of it anyway is a strange counter"
In response to Reply # 50


          

>it's not necessarily false, i don't remember much of what i
>learned in HS, but if that's the case, then, A) why even have
>problem with it? B) Does that mean we should stop teaching
>america fuckyeah history as well?
>

In addition to the idea I put forth above about students only having only so much time each day to focus on the most important subject matter (i.e., math over historical minutiae better suited to grad school), I'd want to know what CRUCIAL element is currently being left out of the way students are taught American history today in grade school? Again, once you've covered slavery, Jim Crow, Civil Rights, what else needs to be taught to a 16 year old that wouldn't be better learned in college, grad school, or through personal reading?

Everything has been figured out except how to live.

  

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Fire1986
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57. "RE: is this actually happening though?"
In response to Reply # 43


          


>IS it being taught in HS (or before)?
>Is there a push for it to be?

Yes. California has approved an ethnic studies model curriculum and it is being recommended for statewide use.( https://www.cnn.com/2021/03/22/us/california-ethnic-studies-high-school-trnd/index.html )

Connecticut is requiring ethnic studies for its high school students. And on the local level, San Francisco has approved a K-12 Black studies program. (mentioned in the article linked above)

You may say, none of these mention CRT explicitly, but the language in the San Francisco curriculum, for instance, reads, "The Black Studies curriculum will include University of California a-g approved courses for SFUSD high schools and required unit plans for grades PK-8 that introduce students to the concept of race, racial identity, African and African American history, equity, and systemic racism." ( https://www.sfusd.edu/about/news/current-news/board-of-education-approves-k-12-black-studies-curriculum )

Allowing the government to introduce pre-kindergartners to the concepts "equity" and "systemic racism" worry me most. Especially in a state whose students are already under-performing in math and reading.

Is it one less hour of decimals or fractions so that we have time to teach kids about lynching using sock puppets?



Everything has been figured out except how to live.

  

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legsdiamond
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44. "Are you Black? "
In response to Reply # 40


          

because the tone of your questions sound like you don’t think its possible for this information to have a positive outcome

like you said, its just like any other subject.

You can apply it, dig deeper or just say fuck it and ignore it completely. That is definitely up to the student.

but what you can’t do is claim it is a lie because it wasn’t taught in school.


****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Fire1986
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60. "RE: Are you Black? "
In response to Reply # 44


          

Yes.

Everything has been figured out except how to live.

  

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mind_grapes
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46. "CRT has become something of a catch-all term "
In response to Reply # 0


          

for everything from Black Marxist studies, AfAm legal theory, and affirmative action to Afro-pessimism, the philosophy of race, and criminal justice reform.

This is a pretty good op-ed by Cheryl Harris, who published "Whiteness As Property" in the 1993 Harvard Law Review:

https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/trump-critical-race-theory/

https://harvardlawreview.org/2020/08/reflections-on-whiteness-as-property/

I think CRT's origin in legal criticism is frequently overlooked when discussing CRT: which emphasizes the effects that owning African Americans as property has had on our legal system.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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54. "No snark but you forgot "just talking about racism""
In response to Reply # 46


  

          

Here is the thing. I think its pretty challenging for most people to digest, let alone teach, concepts like "whiteness as property" on a collegiate level, let alone in elementary school or in 1 hour corporate break out DEI sessions at a job during black history.


But that's not the discussion being had on fox news. I think what is freaking out the fox news crowd is the idea of elementary kids learning that the declaration of independence and the constitution aren't truthful documents because of slavery or teaching kids that their parents are probably racist and contributing to structural racism.



**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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mind_grapes
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56. "I agree. "
In response to Reply # 54


          

And I think the whole controversy around trying to ban CRT is reminiscent of the post-2010 State legislatures trying to ban the use of Sharia Law in any of its local and state courts. It's just a way for conservatives to ineffectually virtue signal their blanket opposition to any alternative or foreign system of jurisprudence: despite its very limited existing use in individual contract law or family disputes between two Muslim parties. Their current opposition to CRT is similarly rooted in fear, against any alternative legal, political, and historical frameworks that contradict the constitution's claim that all men are created, and should thus be treated, as equals.

  

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BrooklynWHAT
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61. "its a new buzzword for some old shit to rile people up."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

like Castro said CRT is just regular ass history. except honest.

<--- Big Baller World Order

  

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inpulse
Member since May 23rd 2007
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62. "You and Castro are both wrong."
In response to Reply # 61
Wed Jun-30-21 01:44 PM by inpulse

          

First, it isn't so much about history, nor is it a traditional capital T theory. It's more of a methodology that guides social science research research and law practice. The goal is to understand all types of racial disparities and challenge racial hierarchies.

Second, CRT is generally taught in grad or law school, so the current portrayal of it being taught in regular K-12 classes is misleading. It really isn't even taught in-depth at the undergrad level. (edit: This part isn't addressed to you. I just threw it in for those who may not know.)

There are lots of books and articles about CRT. A short and straightforward one –

Ford, C. L., & Airhihenbuwa, C. O. (2010). Critical race theory, race equity, and public health: toward antiracism praxis. American journal of public health, 100(S1), S30-S35.

  

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poetx
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63. "this. rw is deliberately and incorrectly expanding the definition to "
In response to Reply # 62


  

          

cover a bunch of shit that is not.

it's bad faith arguments, demagoguery and bullshit all around.


peace & blessings,

x.

www.twitter.com/poetx

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not having much to show for it. (c) mad

  

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Castro
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64. "Its a lens for social theory. And that lens is based on equity"
In response to Reply # 62


  

          

But HOW that gets framed in the public discourse is what matters here, and that is why so called progressives keep losing. They aren't selling that CRT is bad to law professors, they are selling its bad to pastors and bus drivers and walmart cashiers.

This shit is Lee Atwater 101 type stuff and we keep engaging in the argument about the nomenclature instead of the message itself.

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One Hundred.

  

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Castro
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65. "RE: You and Castro are both wrong."
In response to Reply # 62


  

          

Nothing you typed can be used in a 30 second soundbite. Nobody in the republican party would even bother stating much of this beyond the sunday morning talk shows....when they sell CRT as a wedge issue, they a stating it a manner similar to how I distilled it. You can keep typing about the 'structure' of CRT...and keep losing.

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One Hundred.

  

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inpulse
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66. "You seem like you are just trying to win some nonexistent debate here."
In response to Reply # 65


          

I'm simply telling you that your definition/conceptualization of CRT is categorically incorrect. The one in post 27 that BrooklynWhat supports. I even provided a source to confirm such. CRT is interdisciplinary, so yes, there is some history involved. But that is such a small part of the work. To say CRT is just regular ass history is just factually wrong.

I'm not looking to get into how it is portrayed by Republicans; that would be an utter waste of my time. I also don't care about the losing and winning argument you are trying to make, especially since you are grounding it on the idea that your distillation of CRT aligns with the bad faith Republican position.

FWIW, I am a social science researcher and doctoral student. One of my main collaborators and mentors is one of the leading CRT scholars in sociology, and another of my mentors is literally one of the OG crit race scholars.



  

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T Reynolds
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Thu Jul-01-21 10:24 AM

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67. "gotta try to carve out time to read this"
In response to Reply # 62


  

          

thank you man


>
>Ford, C. L., & Airhihenbuwa, C. O. (2010). Critical race
>theory, race equity, and public health: toward antiracism
>praxis. American journal of public health, 100(S1), S30-S35.

  

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inpulse
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Thu Jul-01-21 10:35 AM

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68. "Of course."
In response to Reply # 67


          

That article is pretty brief and to the point, so that's why I recommended it. I can send you a PDF if you want. For further reading, here are the two books that I think are the bibles of CRT that maybe you could try to get from the library.


https://www.amazon.com/Critical-Race-Theory-Third-Introduction/dp/147980276X/ref=pd_lpo_14_t_0/135-9038277-4303547?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=147980276X&pd_rd_r=afb09043-b79c-4f9e-8a5d-3e57ec5c65af&pd_rd_w=WhekE&pd_rd_wg=PdbG0&pf_rd_p=fb1e266d-b690-4b4f-b71c-bd35e5395976&pf_rd_r=PH5TD8H2ZS5FK9XE7Y28&psc=1&refRID=PH5TD8H2ZS5FK9XE7Y28

https://www.amazon.com/Critical-Race-Theory-Writings-Movement/dp/1565842715/ref=sr_1_12?crid=3CTSNW8NTGMD6&dchild=1&keywords=critical+race+theory&qid=1625153460&s=books&sprefix=critical+%2Caps%2C169&sr=1-12

  

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shockvalue
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69. "Hey thanks. Here's an excerpt from your first link"
In response to Reply # 68


          

A. What Is Critical Race Theory?
The critical race theory (CRT) movement is a collection of activists and scholars engaged in studying and transforming the relationship among race, racism, and power. The movement considers many of the same issues that conventional civil rights and ethnic studies discourses take up but places them in a broader perspective that includes economics, history, setting, group and self-interest, and emotions and the unconscious. Unlike traditional civil rights discourse, which stresses incrementalism and step-by-step progress, critical race theory questions the very foundations of the liberal order, including equality theory, legal reasoning, Enlightenment rationalism, and neutral principles of constitutional law. - page 3 of the Introduction of Critical Race Theory third edition

Would you agree with this definition?

  

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inpulse
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71. "Yes, I agree with that. It's kind of long-winded, but yeah."
In response to Reply # 69
Fri Jul-02-21 05:45 PM by inpulse

          

Here's the main points to remember:

1. it is not a traditional theory in that it explains a particular thing (an example of this would be classical conditioning)
-I like how the definition you cited called it a movement; I've been taught to think of it as a methodology, framework, or guide

2. it's interdisciplinary (e.g., legal studies, sociology, public health, criminology, etc.)

3. it seeks to understand and challenge race and power
-and how race and power are understood in both society and scholarship


In the social sciences, whenever something is called critical ________ (e.g., critical criminology, critical sociology) that means it seeks to challenge the status quo for that discipline. Like what has generally been accepted by science and scholars due to past research. So critical social scientists tend to be super progressive and their journals have research that really challenges how we understand society and people. So the critical in Critical Race Theory works in the same way. CRT scholars are really looking to push how we understand race in the social science world and broader society.

I hope that helps.

  

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naame
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Thu Jul-01-21 12:40 PM

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70. "It's a way of seeing systemic racism. "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

It decodes racist impact from undisclosed racist intention

America has imported more warlord theocracy from Afghanistan than it has exported democracy.

  

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