After watching Luda and Nelly last night I’ve come to the conclusion that:

1) 20 songs is too many.

Most artists have 10 amazing surefire hits or great songs people know about.‬

But 20 means we get filler in the middle, like we got from Nelly and Jill Scott, while they wait to play the last 5 straight fire tracks.‬

There are very few artists that pound for pound have 20 straight amazing songs in a battle situation.

Erykah did. Luda did.

I’m sure Jay and Beyoncé and Whitney would.

Of course Stevie would.

But I think 20 songs is too much for this format because more artists don’t have that.

2) Also, Verzuz goes on a little too long with all the talking and starting 30 minutes late to let the people come in as Swizz says.

I suggest he and Timbaland cut it down to best no filler and most fire 10 songs with a bonus 5 for fun, kinda like Luda and Nelly did.

Maybe take the last 5 fun songs and explain more about them, whether it is a funny or interesting story or something cool about the arrangement.

Leave the actual battle songs alone re long talks in between because I feel like that throws the vibe off.

The big problem is NO ONE is sticking to the 1:30 time length per song. None of the songs are edited so IF it was a feature it starts closer to the feature (Luda and T-pain had show edits though).

It does make sense to have fewer songs. Nelly Definitely had 20 joints he coulda played yesterday but he straight up chose duds for no apparent reason.

I know they are moving platforms but they should do so before the next one. At least on YT or twitch they can use OBS like everyone else is doing to make it visually more fun as well. Playing videos in BG etc...

Double 0
DJ/Producer/Artist
Producer in Kidz In The Hall
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twitter: @godouble0
IG: @godouble0
www.thinklikearapper.com

I did notice Luda edited his songs but I thought it was funny that he let ALLLL of “Oh” by Ciara play before it got to his verse, I know it’s a hot song but I legit was like “Damn he’s not gonna start at the chorus before his verse??”

Lol.

I dig the fact the dude was enjoying himself the way he was. He ain’t give no fix about playing what people wanted to hear. Dude was doing his own thing.

I’ve never owned or listened to either one of their albums but I did enjoy the radio cuts they had during their respective runs.

--- praying for peace, love, and power

https://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=5&topic_id=3024504&mesg_id=3024504&page=#3024579

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If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

Ya know, MJ vs Prince, Whitney vs Mariah, stuff like that...

but for this magnitude, the fact that it's the actual artists themselves playing their songs is the entire appear behind it. Guarantee none of the battles would even have 10% of the hype with DJs playing their songs.

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50+ FREE Mixes on www.DJR-Tistic.com!

Twitter and Instagram - @DJ_RTistic

I think 20 songs is fine and for some battles, it hasn't even been enough (eg. going into OT, fans still complaining about faves not being played, etc).

If some artists have trouble coming up with a competitive top 20... maybe they don't need to be battling in the first place. That's where I'm at with it. The format strongly favors G.O.A.T.s/leaders in their respective spaces and almost functions like a retrospective on each artist's work. I'm not mad at there being a space for that.

Personally, the Nelly v. Luda matchup didn't excite me much (tho I know they both had their heyday) and it's one of very few I didn't at least check in on during or afterwards *shrug* If a viewer tuned in and was unimpressed that's kind of on the viewer imho (no one's forcing anyone to watch). I don't see why a less competitive matchup should alter the experience for when heavyweights *do* participate. If that's gonna be an issue then I'd rather verzuz competitors simply be restricted to heavyweights, tbh.

Like... maybe the world doesn't need lil bow wow to face off against lil mama. Or, maybe it does but not in the verzuz format. And that's cool. But cutting the format in half right before puff goes up against dre or whatever the verzuz finale ends up being would be really annoying imho.

Last thing I disagree with you on is the talking, stories, etc. Personally? I like all that and it makes the vibe feel more cordial, respectful... even educational in some instances. The vibe in between songs made the Erykah and Jill matchup feel the most *nourishing* to me, by far. Or in the Boi-1da v. Hit-Boy battle, they played a lot more instrumentals which viewers not as into production might have found boring *shrug* So just goes to show that lots of ppl enjoy these shows in different ways, and perhaps rules dictating every little detail would end up worsening the experience for more than it would help.

At some point, I just think it's helpful to remind ourselves that these performances are being put on for free to help people cope and find small pockets of fun/joy while covid wreaks havoc on folks' health, wellbeing, families, and communities. That's really the most important takeaway here.

>At some point, I just think it's helpful to remind ourselves
>that these performances are being put on for free to help
>people cope and find small pockets of fun/joy while covid
>wreaks havoc on folks' health, wellbeing, families, and
>communities. That's really the most important takeaway here.

Because it's like yes, it is great that it is free and is meant as a nice distraction during these quarantine times, but that doesn't mean if someone has suggestions for doing something a different way that that means they are ungrateful or are complaining.

Obviously everyone is free just not to watch something if they don't want but this idea that something is above light critiques or suggestions just because it is free is silly.

not trying to shut down the discussion but it’s like the 4th time people have had this same argument.

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TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

the comments if you feel like it’s rehashing things you’ve seen before.

I think discussing what works and what doesn’t is a valid discussion to have and shouldn’t be discouraged but someone saying the same arguments are had weekly really does have the option to walk on by and click on a post they like better.

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TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

You basically advocated for cutting the format in half but allowing for 5 bonus tracks, to accomodate matchups between less competitive catalogues. That would be a pretty significant change for them to make midway (and it shouldn't surprise that not everyone may like the idea).

I do find it interesting that you interpreted my use of "free" to mainly refer to you/viewers not being charged to watch, tho. That's part of it, but really what I was getting at is a fair amount of uncompensated effort still goes into organizing these matchups, not to mention artists (and members of their staff) themselves setting aside time that they could/would obv charge a lot more for.

So I could see light critiques/suggestions about keeping to start times, song times, sound quality, etc. Those are small fixes that would dramatically improve execution. But demands to alter the whole format and dictate if/how artists express themselves while performing just seems a bit much. Not sure why my sharing this annoys you since you asked for our opinions *shrug*

when did she ask our opinions?

^^^^
That part

Is t this the reason you gave your opinion below?

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TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

yup

.

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

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TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

It’s not a party.

I do agree the songs can go too long.

A DJ could easily pull this off with back and forth’s and proper editing of songs but that’s not what makes it so popular.

Seeing the actual artist play songs and talk about them is what makes everyone tune in.

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TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

now aint the time for everyone's armchair edits.

this aint a real venue.

personally, i think the whole execution is terrible.

seriously listening to music on ig live is whack within itself.

there is no quality.

but it's serving it's purpose.

short bursts of virtual fame, likes, follows. it's all there.

During Erykah’s and Jill’s episode, it was obvious to me that there were far more people who knew Jill’s music. To some folks, what Erykah played, aside from her known and classic hits, was “filler.” There were people in there who were asking for songs off of Jill’s last album from 15 which some of y’all hadn’t even listened to. Was different though when these artists had more radio play which is probably where most went to hear their music before buying or listening to the album.

20 songs is just fine. That’s one of the criteria. I’ve heard Swizz say that the artists has to have at least 20 in the chamber to even be considered. And that seemingly includes features. T-Pain ain’t have 20 by himself but he damned sure had 20+ when you considered his features, his productions, etc.

“Filler” though... What’s filler to you ain’t filler to e’rybody else.

--- praying for peace, love, and power

Nelly, Luda and Jill Scott have 20 songs even worth hearing, let alone "hits".

Luda has maybe 5 hits? Nelly might have 3 or 4, if you include Tip Drill.

*EDIT* Maybe it was Furtado? I ain't been watching.

STILL, gun to your head? Name 20 hits COMBINED between both Nelly's.

You are dead before you hit double digits.

But fair point.

this has to be trolling. no one you're this ignorant about the amount of hits they got. almost anyone can EASILY name 10-20 hit songs they both had. Easily.


p.s. Tip Drill was never really a hit song, at least radio wise.

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>p.s. Tip Drill was never really a hit song, at least radio
>wise.

Both were more for the strip clubs and BET Uncut.

--- praying for peace, love, and power

they worked in that medium, and that's what they were for.

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no

he said no one could name 20 songs from both combined. you completely didn't list any Luda songs


nelly:

hot in herre
country grammer
dilemma
air force ones
ride wit me
e.i.
shake ya tailfeather
grillz


luda:

roll out
stand up
southern hospitality
whats your fantasy
area codes
move bitch
welcome to atlanta
saturday
money maker
splash waterfalls
how low


that's 19. took me 5 minutes to think of them all, and I know there's a bunch i'm forgetting. luda has TONS of hit songs.

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the two Nelly's, as in Furtado and rapper Nelly.

I mean I know he said it as a joke but still..

I stand by his point though that rapper Nelly don't have that many hits to be in the battle, sure maybe if you reply heavily on features like Girlfriend with NSync but other than that nah...

Luda was relying heavily on features too during Verzuz but I personally think he has enough hits on his own to have a rightful spot in the Verzuz series.

Nelly? No.

and definitely not enough hits.

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I just like two people playing music and enjoying the moment.

I'd like it if they can figure out a way to get it on a better platform. Keep it on IG for the chat, but have a much better setup on Youtube or Twitch with improved sound/video.

interacting with each other, playing music and giving commentary. if i just wanna hear songs mixed by a dj i can buy a mixtape smh. ppl making this way too hard

>I just like two people playing music and enjoying the moment.
>
>
>I'd like it if they can figure out a way to get it on a better
>platform. Keep it on IG for the chat, but have a much better
>setup on Youtube or Twitch with improved sound/video.

--

"You can't beat white people. You can only knock them out."

What I see is a greatest hits battle between artists, and usually one of the artists has more hits while the other has a better catalog.

With Jill, to me she has better albums I can listen to from beginning to end but with Erykah I can only listen to her singles and a few songs off each album but not entire albums.

With Ludacris, he's got better music than anything Nelly has done, but Nelly has more pop appeal but among hip-hop listeners Luda has the best songs regardless if it was a hit or not (except I couldn't tell you one song off his last two albums to save my life).

With the Teddy vs. Babyface, clearly Teddy has gigantic hits and has dominated the new jack swing and radio for over 30 years but Babyface written & produced some big hits too but almost all of them are slow jams & ballads, and of course his own songs; but c'mon who can compete with one of the most popular rap songs in history "The Show" by Doug E. Fresh & Slick Rick, Ted will forever be a legend.

With RZA vs. Dj Premier, to me Dj Premier could've played songs he has produced up to year 2000 and still have more bangers while RZA only has a short window of hits but Wu-Tang has a world wide fan base bigger than most of the songs Dj Premier has produced which the average rap listener probably only knows a tenth of Primo's catalog; but how many of RZA's songs are entirely produced by him even though it's still an impressive resume in that short time when he produced & executive produced 11 albums in a five year span without all of them not sounding the same, Premier couldn't do that feat if he tried.

What I'm saying is if they choose battles between artists who have a decent enough list of songs to go thru 20 songs then it's worth it but just because someone got a few hits and it's well known doesn't mean they need to be in these "Versez Battles" but personally I don't like these battles, they're quite boring.

Like Joe Budden said on SOTC once, I rather see battles between producers with them playing new beats, not artists playing their hit songs.

https://tinyurl.com/y4ba6hog

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"We in here talking about later career Prince records
& your fool ass is cruising around in a time machine
trying to collect props for a couple of sociopathic degenerates" - s.blak

First of all, LOL at keep it shorter. They're playing music on a Saturday night from a country where almost everything is shut the fuck down. Where does everyone have to be? What else do they have to do? This isn't Short Attention Span Theater.

Seriosuly, and without the talking in-between, what's the point? If I wanted to just hear the songs I'd play them myself. Them talking in-between giving information and feeling about the songs makes things interesting.

It's be like complaining about Ice Cube breaking down the history and tracks on AmeriKKKa's Most Wanted yesterday during the listening party. Why would I watch if he's just going to play the album in its entirety? Shit, I've heard it more times than almost every other album in existence.

-----------------

www.albumism.com

Checkin' Our Style, Return To Zero:

https://www.mixcloud.com/returntozero/

.

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the whole point is to get a vibe from the artists about the tracks they're playing or whatever else they feel like discussing.

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

The others I've poked my head in and out of but I love the banter, the mutual respect, the stories ... stripping it down to just like 35 minutes and 5 songs would ruin everything that makes the whole thing cool and special. Would be an awful idea. Keep it as is.

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"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

occurred to me to do...

Folks have said they have it on in the background as they do other stuff, they've said they've watched part of it and come back.

When I'm in I'm in and committed to the whole thing.

I guess that's the difference between me and some other folks, they don't feel the need to watch the whole thing so they are less concerned with wanting it retooled...

they can be tiring, but I'll also have other stuff that I'm doing. so I may have vs on ipad, but will be elsewhere on my laptop. I can still hear what's happening without being full engaged.

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

The music itself has changed enough to cater to short attention spans.
That would be the most miserable thing ever for the people we now consider to be "old school" artists.

But it does deserve a better platform.

10 would be better for most artists, but remember.. it started out as superproducer and songwriter thing.. that group usually has more "hits" than your standard recording artist since a lot of their work is recorded by other artists.

Also, I would recommend specific rounds, something like but not limited to this..

Round 1: Debut or Breakthrough Hit
Round 2: Slow Jam
Round 3: Midtempo Jam
Round 4: Uptempo/Dancefloor Hit
Round 5: Collaboration
Round 6: Song from an OST
Round 7: Hit Anthem/Torch Song
Round 8: Live Recording
Round 9: Cover Song
Round 10: Undeniable Classic Banger

something sort of like that so the song matchups are more comparable, or is that doing too much?

LOL. yeah probably

i just think a little structure could give the competitors a little more edge in preparation so they achieve the maximum amount of punch in their matchups.. of course, I understand that not all artists will have hit songs that neatly fit into every single category that is set up for them.

Cult Classic Album Cut

prototype

stand ur ground, believe in urself,
believe in love, prepare urself for love, remove the negativity from ur life, and accept the love u kno u deserve

My general critique is that these events are underproduced but a specific critique is that they should have a moderator who does prep work and facilitates the discussion, keeps the conversation moving and general breaks up to people just pushing play and letting songs play. I think categories would make a lot of sense to put some structure to the program.

These events are hella boring. There is sooo much more that could be done if more thought went into them besides just have people show up with almost no prep and play music. Even a panel discussion requires some prep.



**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

https://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=5&topic_id=3024504&mesg_id=3024504&page=#3024634

https://youtu.be/3-XxzRIyI_U

Salute to the legends...they killed last night

Of course, Jamaicans figured out the sound system...finally.

That was a fucking jam

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

My assumptions were correct, it’s not that they actually “figured out” the sound system. I’ve noticed whenever 2 parties go live together there is a significant loss in bandwidth. Them going live from a singular account eliminated a lot of the technical issues the previous battles experienced. Obviously social distancing was out the door for them, so I can’t see this continuing with other artists...we will see Monday during the 112 vs JE battle.

You stay classy okayplayer!!

Hilarious they said we don’t give a fuck about social distancing lmao but that one dancer girl had on a mask.

She said y’all can fuck around if you want to Hahahaha

I don’t think they threw distancing out the window completely. It was a close knit group from each camp.

im not even a big fan of either artist or reggae/dancehall in general but i had a ball.

and that was great, but this was amazing.

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--
Sometimes you have to look reality in the face and say 'No!'
-Ben (Reaper)

If you need any help, don't. Hesitate to ask.

just wanna say there’s no way they even have 20 hits together combined lol.

Plus 5 album cuts

Not a 112 fan so I don't know about them

_______________________________________

I can cull 20 pretty easily

Not a fan of either but anytime I hear some old slow jams and ask who did that song it’s usually jagged edge or 112 or one of them mint condition type groups.. lol.

Peaches and Cream tho.. gotdamn that shit is hard af.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=07sz_7s9LUs

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TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

I'm kinda verzuz'd out, unless it's an artist I ADORE, and the artists I ADORE aren't doing verzuz :/

last few weeks havent been my thing, which is cool. it kind of gives me hope that they will do more niche ones that not everyone is meant to check in for.