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Subject: "The impeachment and "normal" folks" Previous topic | Next topic
handle
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Wed Dec-04-19 11:19 AM

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"The impeachment and "normal" folks"


          

Talked to our security guard at work today - he's a nice guy - early 40's , black.

He wants to know "Name 5 things that Trump did that are illegal?"

And he told me "Joe Biden *admitted* to being guilt of sexual harassment."

I went HAM on him (Impeachment is political, doesn't have to be a CRIME - and that Trump claims to be immune from investigation, Trump has 19 women who've publicly accused him of rape, pressuring another country to help get dirt on an opponent is rigging the next election, Biden admitted to touching a woman's shoulders and apologized that he'd done something that made her uncomfortable not GUILTY of being a SEXUAL HARASSER, etc) - but he was unconvinced.

Also Trump PRE-ELECTION bothered him with the racial stuff, but since he's bee president it's been a lot better.

Look, I don't think he's a Trump guy but he's definitely not some racist goober.

He is an ex-cop, ex military, current security guard.

So if you think Trump is down and out - you're wrong. (I'm depressed now.)

------------


Gone: My Discogs collection for The Roots:
http://www.discogs.com/user/tomhayes-roots/collection

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
name 5 crimes he committed
Dec 04th 2019
1
lol right? why was 5 the standard?
Dec 04th 2019
2
My Top 5 (in no order)
Dec 04th 2019
4
      but did he state the statute while committing the crime?
Dec 04th 2019
5
People are crazy man. I had a guy from CT ...
Dec 04th 2019
3
it's all about "winning" vs "the libtards"..🙄
Dec 04th 2019
6
Rupubs play the LONG ball, the left is happy to be playing
Dec 04th 2019
43
conservatives are incapable of understanding empathy
Dec 04th 2019
9
Yeah, and it's not even just conservatives.
Dec 04th 2019
10
      ^all this. "normal" folks don't associate socialism with empathy
Dec 04th 2019
22
           Repugs win the war of defining everything.
Dec 04th 2019
31
                Dems suck at playing the game
Dec 05th 2019
63
                     Yea. The game is criminality and corruption so ...
Dec 05th 2019
64
                     sounds like you like losing. fitting...
Dec 05th 2019
78
                          Sounds like you're an idiot. Fitting.
Dec 05th 2019
81
                     How You Gonna Play by the Rules when them jokers.....
Dec 05th 2019
74
                          simple, DONT play by the rules. duh...
Dec 05th 2019
79
RE: People are crazy man. I had a guy from CT ...
Dec 11th 2019
108
think about it/don't think about it.
Dec 04th 2019
7
Truest thing I've ever read.
Dec 04th 2019
12
Exactly
Dec 04th 2019
28
i tell ppl that unless he directly denounces his base, they applaud...
Dec 04th 2019
46
could be another citizens united
Dec 05th 2019
86
Yeah, I'm flabbergasted when people talk like this is a threat to him.
Dec 04th 2019
8
"normal" folks aren't listening to endless Adam Schiff monologues
Dec 04th 2019
11
how did that work out in ky, la, va, pa, etc in november?
Dec 04th 2019
21
I agree with this
Dec 04th 2019
25
Me too.
Dec 04th 2019
34
      2014 was a pretty strong precursor to trump.
Dec 04th 2019
39
stop talking sense
Dec 04th 2019
27
RE: how did that work out in ky, la, va, pa, etc in november?
Dec 04th 2019
41
      i hear you n/m
Dec 04th 2019
52
btw this might be from a poll that has turned out to be a clear outlier
Dec 04th 2019
24
What ?
Dec 04th 2019
29
its this poll that also showed trump at 30+% approval with black voters.
Dec 04th 2019
32
      Ohhh yeah I remember that one
Dec 04th 2019
37
RE: btw this might be from a poll that has turned out to be a clear outl...
Dec 04th 2019
35
      Of course. Rightfully so.
Dec 04th 2019
40
agreed
Dec 05th 2019
57
After watching some of the hearings this morning
Dec 04th 2019
13
i was considering skipping it today but its been good
Dec 04th 2019
14
I lasted about 10 seconds into Doug Collins blathering.
Dec 04th 2019
16
Yea it's really disheartening. Russia's got a grip on us man.
Dec 04th 2019
15
It ain’t Russia. Americans have been dumbed down. Scholars?
Dec 04th 2019
18
      It's partly Russia. As repugnant as republicans have always been ...
Dec 04th 2019
26
Scholars and constitution talk!! That's how to get folks on your side!!!
Dec 04th 2019
33
This is why my skepticism of him losing remains high af
Dec 04th 2019
17
just watched A Time to Kill again this weekend, and I think we need
Dec 04th 2019
19
so dems are defending the constitution and the gop is dismissing it
Dec 04th 2019
20
"We have no idea what the Founding Fathers meant"
Dec 04th 2019
23
      Who said that ?!?
Dec 04th 2019
30
           Collins
Dec 04th 2019
36
most people dgaf as long as their checks cash on time
Dec 04th 2019
38
most folks don't care, and the Dems are shitty at making their case
Dec 04th 2019
42
They're bad at theatrics. Good at laying out a solid case.
Dec 04th 2019
44
      it's funny how many niggas here parrot
Dec 04th 2019
45
      horrible at theatrics and mediocre at a solid case
Dec 04th 2019
47
      You think so ?
Dec 04th 2019
49
           exactly. also the reason why theyve been killing it in court too.
Dec 04th 2019
51
                btw *67%* of people following closely think he should be removed.
Dec 05th 2019
55
                Haha right. Amazing what happens when you're openminded and ....
Dec 05th 2019
61
                Correct.
Dec 05th 2019
60
      Nah, they're terrible at making a case why folks should care
Dec 05th 2019
54
           this has always been a stupid take.
Dec 05th 2019
56
                thank you for giving me time back in my day
Dec 05th 2019
58
                fam we really are too dumb for democracy.
Dec 05th 2019
59
                It's not the morons that bother me, it's the smart people
Dec 05th 2019
65
                     ^^^^ all of this
Dec 05th 2019
68
                     100.
Dec 05th 2019
70
                     lemme give you and Soldado a standing ovation.
Dec 05th 2019
75
                     Nobody ever said it's a good thing that the President is above the law.
Dec 05th 2019
76
                          I know you didn't say that my dude
Dec 05th 2019
87
                Hahahaha I was about to say the same thing.
Dec 05th 2019
62
                     Y’all like to look good losing.
Dec 05th 2019
66
                     *sigh* it's like you're responding to the opposite of everything that's ...
Dec 05th 2019
71
                     and y'all act like the right-wing propaganda complex
Dec 05th 2019
72
                          Damn. This is the best response ever.
Dec 05th 2019
73
                          No one has ever said the GOP is complex. They dumb shit down
Dec 05th 2019
80
                               a said 'A complex' not complex
Dec 05th 2019
83
                               LOL it's so easy to tell who does and does not read things.
Dec 05th 2019
84
                               we're a simple nation?
Dec 05th 2019
85
                     why does it say soldado for reeq now???
Dec 05th 2019
67
                          soldado's sig.....
Dec 05th 2019
77
                               i guess i pay more attention to avatars than names lol
Dec 05th 2019
82
                Nah. You are wrong as fuck. You better do everything you can to
Dec 05th 2019
69
                Campaigning is definitionally a part of American politics.
Dec 06th 2019
89
                     This was your original comment:
Dec 06th 2019
90
                     Yes. If it's *their* position that this is a seismic political crisis
Dec 06th 2019
92
                          Fair enough. I can't really argue that.
Dec 06th 2019
93
                          honestly, I'm way left of the dem party, but I can see how
Dec 06th 2019
95
                               Oh see I don't really perceive it that way, personally.
Dec 06th 2019
98
                          Thank you.
Dec 06th 2019
102
                     These arty smarty dudes man..
Dec 06th 2019
101
                you're beating the shit outta several strawman arguments
Dec 06th 2019
94
This is politics in general
Dec 04th 2019
48
ikr...
Dec 04th 2019
50
That makes me normal
Dec 05th 2019
53
      the lesser evil?
Dec 05th 2019
88
Im starting to come around on impeachment being a good election strategy
Dec 06th 2019
91
LOL
Dec 06th 2019
97
      *shrug* Did it hurt him?
Dec 06th 2019
99
           The point is you said the same thing about the tax cuts
Dec 06th 2019
103
sitting next to 2 elderly YT men
Dec 06th 2019
96
What nauseates me:
Dec 06th 2019
100
For sure. It's deeply embedded in the fabric of this nation.
Dec 07th 2019
104
let's be real now, trump got 2020 on lock
Dec 07th 2019
105
just upping this
Dec 09th 2019
106
Yep.
Dec 09th 2019
107
I think Dems fucked this up man
Dec 11th 2019
112
      i dont know how to call it
Dec 11th 2019
113
Serious question
Dec 11th 2019
109
      R Senate doesn't find him guilty...
Dec 11th 2019
110
      There's no way to successfully remove him from office
Dec 12th 2019
115
RE: The impeachment and "normal" folks
Dec 11th 2019
111
Not all Trump supporters are "racist goobers"
Dec 11th 2019
114
I wasn’t a Hillary supporter but I voted for her in the general.
Dec 12th 2019
116
Nah they are all racist goobers too
Dec 12th 2019
117
That is correct.
Dec 12th 2019
118
in the sense that indifference and enabling are on that level, yes
Dec 12th 2019
126
      Nah rebranding doesn't work
Dec 16th 2019
132
Whats the difference?
Dec 12th 2019
123
I’m trying to be mindful of that...
Dec 14th 2019
129
      this place would have you thinking they don’t work with Trump supporte...
Dec 16th 2019
130
           i think the three people i work closely with all support trump
Dec 16th 2019
131
           dude...
Dec 16th 2019
133
don't know where to put it, but Pelosi...
Dec 12th 2019
119
Yea the rewriting of GWB history is one of the worst things ...
Dec 12th 2019
120
It makes sense, though. They give GWB a pass because his
Dec 12th 2019
121
      Oh that's definitely true, but I'm not referring to those people.
Dec 12th 2019
122
Pelosi has all the charisma and utility of a genital wart
Dec 12th 2019
127
I move to strike the last word!
Dec 12th 2019
124
ive been following threads on it
Dec 12th 2019
125
i cant believe i watched it last night
Dec 13th 2019
128

mista k5
Member since Feb 01st 2006
13321 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 11:26 AM

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1. "name 5 crimes he committed"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

8 times he farted in public

3 albums he doesnt like that are undisputedly great

  

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Stadiq
Member since Dec 21st 2005
4016 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 11:33 AM

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2. "lol right? why was 5 the standard?"
In response to Reply # 1


          


"Oh shit, I can only name 4! I guess he stays" ?!?


  

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My_SP1200_Broken_Again
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56422 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 11:45 AM

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4. "My Top 5 (in no order)"
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

Obstructing Justice
Profiting from the Presidency
Soliciting Foreign Interference in US Elections
Violating Immigrants' Right to Due Process
Violating Campaign Finance Laws



  

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mista k5
Member since Feb 01st 2006
13321 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 11:47 AM

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5. "but did he state the statute while committing the crime?"
In response to Reply # 4


  

          

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
20228 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 11:40 AM

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3. "People are crazy man. I had a guy from CT ..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

... who's a friend of a friend I went to school with, unabashed republican, gun-owning, freak of a human who has never explicitly stated his Individual 1 support but clearly supports him ... tell me yesterday via an e-mail chain we're on together, that "socialism can eat a dick" but had no response to my response in which I linked several articles related to Nunes' criminal activity/corruption/conflicts of interest.

I truly don't understand how a human brain that can operate like that: being empathetic and kind to others can "eat a dick" but blatant, top-to-bottom corruption at the highest levels of government - what's the big deal ?!?

Fucking weirdos.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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My_SP1200_Broken_Again
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6. "it's all about "winning" vs "the libtards"..🙄"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

  

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seasoned vet
Member since Jul 29th 2008
5532 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 03:22 PM

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43. "Rupubs play the LONG ball, the left is happy to be playing"
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

  

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seasoned vet
Member since Jul 29th 2008
5532 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 12:04 PM

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9. "conservatives are incapable of understanding empathy"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

waste all the time you want sending the articles or trying to reach them using logic, you will only upset yourself

they honestly do not get it

but i spent years talking to them and listening to conservative radio in an effort to understand the conservative mind

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
12272 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 12:11 PM

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10. "Yeah, and it's not even just conservatives."
In response to Reply # 9
Wed Dec-04-19 12:15 PM by stravinskian

          

Most people don't associate socialism with empathy, as much as I think we all agree they logically should. At best, they associate it with gulags. At worst, they associate it with "other people" getting things that they think they're personally entitled to.

And the very idea that empathy in general is a good thing --- it's something we've all heard and like to think we agree on. But deep down it's something we're conditioned by evolution to value only within our own self-imposed groups. Letting starving immigrants into the country might take jobs away from "hard-working Americans," and all that.

  

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Mynoriti
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Wed Dec-04-19 01:35 PM

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22. "^all this. "normal" folks don't associate socialism with empathy"
In response to Reply # 10


  

          

conservatives are still winning the war of defining socialism, which is easy because outside of maybe Bernie and AOC, dems run from that word like its cooties

--------
http://ambitiondeficitdisorder.tumblr.com/

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
20228 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 02:11 PM

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31. "Repugs win the war of defining everything."
In response to Reply # 22


          

Dems/progressives are *always* backpedaling, hence why progress is always snail paced.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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seasoned vet
Member since Jul 29th 2008
5532 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 11:11 AM

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63. "Dems suck at playing the game"
In response to Reply # 31


  

          

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
20228 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 11:14 AM

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64. "Yea. The game is criminality and corruption so ..."
In response to Reply # 63


          

.. in some ways I'm glad they suck at playing it.

But obviously it's frustrating at the same time.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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seasoned vet
Member since Jul 29th 2008
5532 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 02:04 PM

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78. "sounds like you like losing. fitting..."
In response to Reply # 64


  

          

its also a big reason our culture continues to lose.

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
20228 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 02:08 PM

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81. "Sounds like you're an idiot. Fitting."
In response to Reply # 78


          

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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RaphaelSoulLee
Member since May 21st 2003
3760 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 01:11 PM

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74. "How You Gonna Play by the Rules when them jokers....."
In response to Reply # 63


          

*sighs*…...are defining, re-defining, re-shaping, throwing stones, hiding hands....it's crazy.

I do like that they can't F* with the facts, though.

It takes all kinds to make up a world, son. -My pops

I just live for the comments -Da wiz

  

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seasoned vet
Member since Jul 29th 2008
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Thu Dec-05-19 02:06 PM

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79. "simple, DONT play by the rules. duh..."
In response to Reply # 74


  

          

but hey, at least ‘the facts’ give you that warm tingly feeling inside right?

  

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Willong
Member since Jun 08th 2009
235 posts
Wed Dec-11-19 04:43 PM

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108. "RE: People are crazy man. I had a guy from CT ..."
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

Yeah government corruption is a really good reason to be anti-socialist.

  

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double negative
Member since Dec 14th 2007
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Wed Dec-04-19 11:54 AM

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7. "think about it/don't think about it. "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

since 2016 I will visit the subreddits for ask trump supporters and ask the donald because I keep waiting for some cracks to form on the base.

each big negative moment is ALWAYS countered with a neat explanation.


Even for the supporters that HATE some of the things hes done, they are still ride or die for him.


hot take:

as long as...

the sky isnt falling
bombs arent over our heads
things still cost a dollar on the dollar menu
HBO still makes good TV
gas is below 5 dollars a gallon
the lights are on
civil war is an abstract concept
they still spelling names on pay checks correctly
the white man is still the white man
the idea that we're all just temporarily embarrassed billions is not broken
black friday happens
401k/pensions are not taking massive loses
the economy is moving



people are going to kinda not give a fuck and keep it pushing.



***********************************************************
https://soundcloud.com/swageyph/yph-die-with-me

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Wed Dec-04-19 12:18 PM

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12. "Truest thing I've ever read. "
In response to Reply # 7


  

          


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
15011 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 01:58 PM

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28. "Exactly"
In response to Reply # 7


  

          

From a practical day to day standpoint, ain't much changed from Jan 2017 to now. Yeah you have the everyday foolishness, and I think that might irk some people and they may be tired of it all.
But overall, the sky hasn't fallen like people were saying it would.

And that's why support for him hasn't really changed either. If they voted for him before, why would they change now? If anything, I can picture him gaining more support this time around since its been shown that he won't bring the whole thing crumbling down.

This impeachment stuff doesn't matter one bit for his overall support because, again, how does it affect people's everyday life. Are people going to lose their jobs because some Ukraine stuff? Are we about to send people to war because of it?

The one thing that Trump's future hinges on is the economy. Let that start slipping, then people will have less excuses for his foolishness.

The Ukraine stuff can be easily ignored. It's hard to explain. It's hard to see the impact of it.
But let 20 people you know get laid off because of something that can be attributed to Trump, shiiiitttt.

Scary thing is...he might be able to run the clock out on the economy. It looks to be slowing, but not to the degree to cause huge impacts prior to November.

_______________________________________
You ain't the only one whose got problems. You ain't the only one who knows pain. Get up off your ass and just solve them. You still got a chance to try to change, try the shit again.
Devin tha Dude

  

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mikediggz
Member since Dec 02nd 2003
9247 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 05:02 PM

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46. "i tell ppl that unless he directly denounces his base, they applaud..."
In response to Reply # 7
Wed Dec-04-19 05:03 PM by mikediggz

  

          

his bad behavior or at a minimum shrug it off. unless he point blank says these poor white idiots (and confused negros) are dumb as fuck for supporting me, its pretty much trump is just trumping...nothing to see here

  

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mista k5
Member since Feb 01st 2006
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Thu Dec-05-19 02:22 PM

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86. "could be another citizens united"
In response to Reply # 7


  

          

a lot of people were making noise about it but the general public didnt understand how serious it was. now we are seeing consequences of it but if their every day life is "okay" then they go with the flow.

republican supporters wont be moved on impeachment.

dems in general support impeachment but will consider potential downfalls to it and a few might not support it because of this fear.

there are some people that are waiting to see more to decide where they lie on this. if theyre paying attention at all i dont see how they dont support impeachment anymore.

the rest fall into what is being described, people who cant be bothered by it and will complain downline the line when they start seeing the consequences.

i think we all need to call our representatives and let them know where we stand on this. it wont make a difference to some but if we arent voicing it directly then what are we doing to change their minds?

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
12272 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 11:55 AM

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8. "Yeah, I'm flabbergasted when people talk like this is a threat to him. "
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Dec-04-19 11:59 AM by stravinskian

          

I've come around to the fact that impeachment is something Democrats HAVE to do. Because by now the illegality is just too clear and profound to ignore, even though we're powerless to stop it.

But the impeachment process is not set up in such a way that it can remove a president supported by the base of a majority of senators. And that base's opinion isn't changing. Anyone who thinks people will come around isn't being honest about human nature or the current political dynamics.

And it will cost us electorally. There have already been anti-impeachment protestors at Democratic town halls, and while plenty of people think Trump broke the law, even the ones who want him removed are still listing impeachment as a low priority. We've set ourselves up for GOP challengers to run against a House that supposedly isn't acting on "the important issues." This is exactly how it went for Republicans in '98, in a history that a lot of progressives insist on revising.

And when Trump is "acquitted," he's gonna milk the everloving fuck out of it. We've already seen this with the Russia investigation. Nobody seriously denies the crimes outlined in the Mueller report. But Trump supporters have turned it into a vindication and Democrats fret over how it was all a sad waste of time.

  

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Vex_id
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Wed Dec-04-19 12:17 PM

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11. ""normal" folks aren't listening to endless Adam Schiff monologues "
In response to Reply # 0


          

They're wondering why their wages are stagnated and why their health care premiums are making them decide between Christmas or going to see that specialist that triggers a multi-hundred dollar co-pay office visit.

Trump is a criminal and a cancer. That's *been* known. Have your pick of impeachable offenses - they're there, from the jump. Launching impeachment at year 1? Cool. Doing it in year 3 of his term with elections on the horizon - *knowing* damn well that nothing will come out of this proceeding (because the GOP-led Senate won't magically be inspired by the findings) except for benign procedural formality? Political malpractice.

Data is already showing that Impeachment is helping drum up Trump's base and it's not moving the needle at all with Independents. If anything, it's turning Independents and non-partisans off.


-->

  

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Soldado
Member since Apr 13th 2006
294 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 01:32 PM

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21. "how did that work out in ky, la, va, pa, etc in november?"
In response to Reply # 11


  

          

>Data is already showing that Impeachment is helping drum up
>Trump's base and it's not moving the needle at all with
>Independents. If anything, it's turning Independents and
>non-partisans off.

2019 elections have consistently shown that dem turnout is up over lackluster repub turnout (especially in rural areas) and normally solid red suburbs (dems/indies/crossover repubs) that dems havent won in decades or ever are turning blue.

https://twitter.com/ashtonpittman/status/1196539297551269891
https://twitter.com/Redistrict/status/1195924841913896960
https://twitter.com/riseandresistny/status/1192178235024584711

etc etc etc.

mind you...trump campaigned heavy in ky and la and off-year election turnout has a history of being *more* favorable to republicans (whiter, older, more rural) than the prez general will be.

this idea that impeachment is rallying trumps base or hurting democrats...i have no idea where people are getting it from. because actual election results (the only data that really matters) have shown the exact opposite.

i mean...dude has ~20% higher support for impeachment than any recent president before him other than nixon (and he isnt too far off nixons highest number).
https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1199515763964436480

you dont think those numbers (and the people who are represented by those numbers) are moving the needle?

---
bka Reeq.

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
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Wed Dec-04-19 01:56 PM

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25. "I agree with this"
In response to Reply # 21


  

          

>>Data is already showing that Impeachment is helping drum up
>>Trump's base and it's not moving the needle at all with
>>Independents. If anything, it's turning Independents and
>>non-partisans off.
>
>2019 elections have consistently shown that dem turnout is up
>over lackluster repub turnout (especially in rural areas) and
>normally solid red suburbs (dems/indies/crossover repubs) that
>dems havent won in decades or ever are turning blue.
>
>https://twitter.com/ashtonpittman/status/1196539297551269891
>https://twitter.com/Redistrict/status/1195924841913896960
>https://twitter.com/riseandresistny/status/1192178235024584711
>
>etc etc etc.
>
>mind you...trump campaigned heavy in ky and la and off-year
>election turnout has a history of being *more* favorable to
>republicans (whiter, older, more rural) than the prez general
>will be.
>
>this idea that impeachment is rallying trumps base or hurting
>democrats...i have no idea where people are getting it from.
>because actual election results (the only data that really
>matters) have shown the exact opposite.
>
>i mean...dude has ~20% higher support for impeachment than any
>recent president before him other than nixon (and he isnt too
>far off nixons highest number).
>https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1199515763964436480
>
>you dont think those numbers (and the people who are
>represented by those numbers) are moving the needle?
>

^^^^^^ yep

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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Wed Dec-04-19 02:13 PM

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34. "Me too."
In response to Reply # 25
Wed Dec-04-19 02:14 PM by Brew

          

From a macro level we may not be seeing it, but we didn't see Individual 1 winning on a macro level in 2016 either. Everything was happening on the ground.

The same may be happening here, at least as it relates to 2020 (not necessarily impeachment).

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Soldado
Member since Apr 13th 2006
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Wed Dec-04-19 02:38 PM

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39. "2014 was a pretty strong precursor to trump."
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

dems got hammered there. and those apathy/turnout woes followed into the prez election.

2018/2019 has been a nightmare for trump/gop and getting worse (especially the acceleration in the suburbs).

election results (on a macro level) dont come out of nowhere. theyre results of stable shifts/trends.

any other candidate in trumps shoes...with the election results and polling numbers during his term...would be getting their last rites read to them by the political press.

im actually happy that the media (and a lot of dems frankly) think trump has a great shot at winning in 2020 instead of viewing him as the weakest incumbent since carter. complacency kills while fear/anger motivate.

---
bka Reeq.

  

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navajo joe
Member since Apr 13th 2005
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Wed Dec-04-19 01:57 PM

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27. "stop talking sense"
In response to Reply # 21


  

          

"Regardless if you listen to me, in the end we'll see."
-Cee-Lo

"You’ve had 4 years of Trump University and are still failing the final exam smh"
-Bree Newsome Bass

  

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Vex_id
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Wed Dec-04-19 02:43 PM

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41. "RE: how did that work out in ky, la, va, pa, etc in november?"
In response to Reply # 21


          


>i mean...dude has ~20% higher support for impeachment than any
>recent president before him other than nixon (and he isnt too
>far off nixons highest number).
>https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1199515763964436480
>
>you dont think those numbers (and the people who are
>represented by those numbers) are moving the needle?

We'll see. Impeachment *should* move the needle - particularly in this case where there are so many diff. impeachable offenses under Trump. One could also argue that the timing of it also isn't so bad given that the Democratic Primary still has a lot of sorting out to do.

That said, essentially all of the top Dem candidates have been consistently topping Trump in prospective head-to-head match-ups - some with significant margins. I think it's a mistake to focus too tightly on impeachment. Dems have the aspirational, logical, and compassionate message - it's a powerful and affirmative rebuke of Trump's failed presidency. I think the more that is the focus, the better is it for Dems in the ballot box.
-->

  

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Trinity444
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Wed Dec-04-19 11:29 PM

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52. "i hear you n/m "
In response to Reply # 41


  

          

  

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Soldado
Member since Apr 13th 2006
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24. "btw this might be from a poll that has turned out to be a clear outlier"
In response to Reply # 11


  

          

and got endless circulation among gop talking points to craft a narrative that has failed to hold up. im not sure if thats where you got your data from.

>If anything, it's turning Independents and
>non-partisans off.

as usual...its always best to look at the average/aggregate. support for impeachment is right there at the same peak it was in oct. it isnt swinging back against dems.

https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/status/1199335495140040704

---
bka Reeq.

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
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Wed Dec-04-19 01:58 PM

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29. "What ?"
In response to Reply # 24


  

          

>and got endless circulation among gop talking points to craft
>a narrative that has failed to hold up. im not sure if thats
>where you got your data from.
>
>>If anything, it's turning Independents and
>>non-partisans off.
>
>as usual...its always best to look at the average/aggregate.
>support for impeachment is right there at the same peak it was
>in oct. it isnt swinging back against dems.
>
>https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/status/1199335495140040704


Where is Vex getting these numbers and why does he leave the links out ?

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Soldado
Member since Apr 13th 2006
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32. "its this poll that also showed trump at 30+% approval with black voters."
In response to Reply # 29


  

          

https://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=4&topic_id=13355672&mesg_id=13355672&listing_type=search#13357158

emerson notoriously had a national poll just a while ago that had andrew yang in 4th place with 10% of the vote lol (he has averaged under 3% the entire primary). they seem to be making a name for themselves. and not in a good way.

---
bka Reeq.

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
4050 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 02:26 PM

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37. "Ohhh yeah I remember that one"
In response to Reply # 32


  

          

>https://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=4&topic_id=13355672&mesg_id=13355672&listing_type=search#13357158
>
>emerson notoriously had a national poll just a while ago that
>had andrew yang in 4th place with 10% of the vote lol (he has
>averaged under 3% the entire primary). they seem to be making
>a name for themselves. and not in a good way.

Damn they trying to get that Rasmussen spot.

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Vex_id
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35. "RE: btw this might be from a poll that has turned out to be a clear outl..."
In response to Reply # 24


          

>and got endless circulation among gop talking points to craft
>a narrative that has failed to hold up. im not sure if thats
>where you got your data from.

Morning Consult, Emerson, Politico etc..The Hill reported on it.

>as usual...its always best to look at the average/aggregate.
>support for impeachment is right there at the same peak it was
>in oct. it isnt swinging back against dems.
>
>https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/status/1199335495140040704

Good. BTW: This is an instance where I hope I'm wrong. I'd love for impeachment to turn out to be appetizing to swing-voters - and would love for the Senate to validate impeachment and effectively remove Trump from office.

I would - however - remain cautious about how palatable impeachment will be to the aggregate general electorate.

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
20228 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 02:39 PM

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40. "Of course. Rightfully so."
In response to Reply # 35


          

>I would - however - remain cautious about how palatable
>impeachment will be to the aggregate general electorate.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Crash Bandacoot
Member since May 13th 2003
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Thu Dec-05-19 10:05 AM

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57. "agreed"
In response to Reply # 11


          

>

  

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sectachrome86
Member since Dec 22nd 2007
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Wed Dec-04-19 12:26 PM

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13. "After watching some of the hearings this morning"
In response to Reply # 0


          

Its just sad. They got these scholars up here breaking it down and explaining the constitution to people in clear terms.

But Republicans and Trump supporters are going to willfully ignore the facts, cutting off their noses to spite their face. Pathetic. Embarassing.

Trump is just one asshole. Its really the people that continue to defend and support him that are the stain on this country.

-------------------------------------------------
http://www.soundcloud.com/sectachrome

  

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mista k5
Member since Feb 01st 2006
13321 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 12:33 PM

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14. "i was considering skipping it today but its been good"
In response to Reply # 13


  

          

gop about to do their 45 mins questioning

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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Wed Dec-04-19 12:54 PM

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16. "I lasted about 10 seconds into Doug Collins blathering."
In response to Reply # 14


          

I know what's coming so I couldn't put myself through the frustration of listening to their lies and misdirections. Have too much work to do.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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Wed Dec-04-19 12:54 PM

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15. "Yea it's really disheartening. Russia's got a grip on us man."
In response to Reply # 13


          

>Its just sad. They got these scholars up here breaking it
>down and explaining the constitution to people in clear terms.
>
>
>But Republicans and Trump supporters are going to willfully
>ignore the facts, cutting off their noses to spite their face.
>Pathetic. Embarassing.
>
>Trump is just one asshole. Its really the people that continue
>to defend and support him that are the stain on this country.

Kompromat got these fools forgetting everything and like you touched on, these poor scholars, professors, legal experts, intelligence officials, actual America-loving lawmakers, are up there straight PLEADING for us to save the republic and the fascists are just continuing their charade to save themselves.

It's so pathetic.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
67963 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 01:11 PM

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18. "It ain’t Russia. Americans have been dumbed down. Scholars? "
In response to Reply # 15


          

These fools don’t trust colleges

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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26. "It's partly Russia. As repugnant as republicans have always been ..."
In response to Reply # 18


          

... I don't think we'd have seen folks Lindsay Graham'ing Nixon if the evidence of misconduct/corruption/impeachable offenses were this endless and dangerous.

I may be wrong.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
15011 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 02:12 PM

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33. "Scholars and constitution talk!! That's how to get folks on your side!!!"
In response to Reply # 13


  

          

_______________________________________
You ain't the only one whose got problems. You ain't the only one who knows pain. Get up off your ass and just solve them. You still got a chance to try to change, try the shit again.
Devin tha Dude

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Wed Dec-04-19 01:10 PM

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17. "This is why my skepticism of him losing remains high af"
In response to Reply # 0


          

Politics is like sports... most folks always see the other team fouling or committing penalties yet cry like a baby when it’s called on their team

I really wonder if republicans don’t have a conscious.

Ken Starr was on the other day talking about “we have to respect the president, I’m so appalled..”

Really?

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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T Reynolds
Member since Apr 16th 2007
42097 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 01:31 PM

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19. "just watched A Time to Kill again this weekend, and I think we need"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

a McConaughey "now imagine she's white" moment from Schiff to change the public opinion lol

  

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mista k5
Member since Feb 01st 2006
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20. "so dems are defending the constitution and the gop is dismissing it"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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navajo joe
Member since Apr 13th 2005
6224 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 01:52 PM

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23. ""We have no idea what the Founding Fathers meant""
In response to Reply # 20


  

          

I never in my life thought I'd here a Republican say that

"Regardless if you listen to me, in the end we'll see."
-Cee-Lo

"You’ve had 4 years of Trump University and are still failing the final exam smh"
-Bree Newsome Bass

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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30. "Who said that ?!?"
In response to Reply # 23


          

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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navajo joe
Member since Apr 13th 2005
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36. "Collins "
In response to Reply # 30


  

          

“This just keeps getting more amazing, I think we just put into the jury pool the Founding Fathers and said 'what would they think,' I don't think we have any idea what they would think, in all due respect, with this,”

So now y'all don't know what the founding fathers think? Fucking clowns

"Regardless if you listen to me, in the end we'll see."
-Cee-Lo

"You’ve had 4 years of Trump University and are still failing the final exam smh"
-Bree Newsome Bass

  

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BrooklynWHAT
Member since Jun 15th 2007
80140 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 02:34 PM

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38. "most people dgaf as long as their checks cash on time"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

<--- Big Baller World Order

  

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kayru99
Member since Jan 26th 2004
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Wed Dec-04-19 03:14 PM

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42. "most folks don't care, and the Dems are shitty at making their case"
In response to Reply # 0


          

for them to care
All the palace intrigue, fake Sorkin drama? Completely irrelevant to most people.

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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44. "They're bad at theatrics. Good at laying out a solid case."
In response to Reply # 42


          

Unfortunately repugs/fascists aren't objective at all so "facts" don't matter. To them it's all about narrative and theatrics.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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navajo joe
Member since Apr 13th 2005
6224 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 03:35 PM

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45. "it's funny how many niggas here parrot "
In response to Reply # 44


  

          

republican talking points like word for word.

especially the "blackity blackest"

"Regardless if you listen to me, in the end we'll see."
-Cee-Lo

"You’ve had 4 years of Trump University and are still failing the final exam smh"
-Bree Newsome Bass

  

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seasoned vet
Member since Jul 29th 2008
5532 posts
Wed Dec-04-19 05:25 PM

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47. "horrible at theatrics and mediocre at a solid case"
In response to Reply # 44


  

          

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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49. "You think so ?"
In response to Reply # 47


          

>mediocre at a solid case

I think they've done a great job of building a strong, fact-based case laying everything out.

We can argue the strategy for sure. But any weakness in the case is explained by the obstruction of justice/congress issues which, of course, lay out another article of impeachment.

So considering what they have I think they've done a tremendous job, brought out great witnesses, and put together a strong case that's near-airtight if not for the obstruction-caused lack of information to close the loopholes.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Soldado
Member since Apr 13th 2006
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Wed Dec-04-19 11:21 PM

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51. "exactly. also the reason why theyve been killing it in court too."
In response to Reply # 49


  

          

i was skeptical at first.

but its pretty amazing what theyve been able to bring to the surface despite full on obstruction of justice.

people dont even question whether trump is guilty (because the facts overwhelmingly point that way). they just question whether it clears the bar for impeachment.

70% of americans believe trump pressing ukraine was wrong.
https://twitter.com/MSNBC/status/1196605523749154816

thats not exactly a failure at 'making their case'.

if dems got access to the relevant communications (call logs, emails, etc) then it would be even higher...which is pretty remarkable when you think about it.

right now support for impeachment itself is around 50% in most reputable polls. support for nixons impeachment was only in the low 50s...in a less partisan environment without a prevalent right wing media echo chamber...*after* nixon was caught on tape literally saying 'i did it'.

---
bka Reeq.

  

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Soldado
Member since Apr 13th 2006
294 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 09:23 AM

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55. "btw *67%* of people following closely think he should be removed."
In response to Reply # 51


  

          

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/70-americans-trumps-actions-tied-ukraine-wrong-poll/story?id=67088534

so those are the people who have a genuine interest in staying informed about the state of our country. and dems have clearly done a good job persuading *them*.

but dems cant make everyone else care about the collapse of our democracy and the importance of holding an authoritarian accountable. thats the fault of a largely ignorant/apathetic populace and one of the main reasons we are in this position in the first place.

---
bka Reeq.

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
20228 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 10:44 AM

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61. "Haha right. Amazing what happens when you're openminded and ...."
In response to Reply # 55


          

>https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/70-americans-trumps-actions-tied-ukraine-wrong-poll/story?id=67088534
>
>so those are the people who have a genuine interest in staying
>informed about the state of our country. and dems have
>clearly done a good job persuading *them*.

... ctually care to be informed. It's sad that an entire major American political party is anti-intellectual but I guess that's the only way they can continue to be racist and bigoted without pushback. Keep the people stupid.


>but dems cant make everyone else care about the collapse of
>our democracy and the importance of holding an authoritarian
>accountable. thats the fault of a largely ignorant/apathetic
>populace and one of the main reasons we are in this position
>in the first place.

Correct. My wife's uncle said, while the initial hearings were taking place, "I'm not even gonna watch that crap" then went on pontificating about how "they" have been after Individual 1 since day one.

Not that it did any good because, again, if you're not willing to be informed then what's the point - but I did try to explain that maybe, MAYBE ... "they" have been after him because, bear with me here, he's fucking endlessly criminal, corrupt, and dangerous and *should* be under constant scrutiny. I know it sounds crazy.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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Thu Dec-05-19 10:30 AM

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60. "Correct."
In response to Reply # 51


          

>i was skeptical at first.
>but its pretty amazing what theyve been able to bring to the
>surface despite full on obstruction of justice.

I was skeptical, too. It's all documented here. I thought Dems would flub the shit out of this. And while I'm still of the belief that he'd never be removed from office, I think they've done an exceptional job at laying out this case considering the roadblocks.


>people dont even question whether trump is guilty (because the
>facts overwhelmingly point that way). they just question
>whether it clears the bar for impeachment.

Trump doesn't even question whether he's guilty. I mean he outright admitted it then solicited further campaign help. The fact that some people are shrugging it off is what's confounding. Madison literally wrote the rule for this exact reason.


>70% of americans believe trump pressing ukraine was wrong.
>https://twitter.com/MSNBC/status/1196605523749154816
>
>thats not exactly a failure at 'making their case'.
>
>if dems got access to the relevant communications (call logs,
>emails, etc) then it would be even higher...which is pretty
>remarkable when you think about it.
>
>right now support for impeachment itself is around 50% in most
>reputable polls. support for nixons impeachment was only in
>the low 50s...in a less partisan environment without a
>prevalent right wing media echo chamber...*after* nixon was
>caught on tape literally saying 'i did it'.

Trump did that too lol.

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kayru99
Member since Jan 26th 2004
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Thu Dec-05-19 07:00 AM

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54. "Nah, they're terrible at making a case why folks should care"
In response to Reply # 44


          

About the Ukraine/Biden shit.
Just like the Russian scare shit.
There's massive labor/economic protests happening nationwide...a housing crisis...etc.
Dumbass palace intrigue ain't gonna move the needle in the general populace.
Especially this close to an election

  

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Soldado
Member since Apr 13th 2006
294 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 09:56 AM

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56. "this has always been a stupid take."
In response to Reply # 54
Thu Dec-05-19 10:17 AM by Soldado

  

          

its not the dems job to make grown ass people care about their own country. thats a really infantile outlook and treats people like mental dependents incapable of any proactive engagement.

the reason why we even have the issues you listed is because of decades (at least) of people already not caring about shit that affects them.

are you gonna say dems shouldnt address judges and the supreme court because people only care about their wages? lol. where do you think these laws are decided? all this shit is connected.

people shouldnt care about a president/party trampling on democracy (and erasing the political voice of millions of people) because housing costs too much? how do you think housing gets fixed?

should dems ignore voter suppression because people in the rust belt are more concerned about manufacturing layoffs and farm bankruptcies?

how do you even expect to address political issues when you dont care about politics? lol.

shit is dumb as hell and doesnt make any logical sense to anyone that applies some actual thought to it.

you do realize the purpose of having a democracy and even voting at all right? then i assume you understand the importance of protecting that democracy and that ability to vote.

the countries where people have the most productive political outcomes and enjoy the highest quality of life are generally the countries where citizens are most informed and participate in democracy the most. like 70% turnout rates.

we are lucky to crack 50% over here. and thats just registered voters. not eligible-to-register voters. and we ended up exactly where we are supposed to be when you have people who willingly sit out the process that directly accounts for addressing the issues you deem priorities.

the solution to that is not waiting around for a party to devise the perfect plan to make us care. if youre still waiting to care then you already lost.

but hey who cares if we become a dictatorship or one party fascist oligarchy if dems are focusing on something other than my paycheck?! lol.

---
bka Reeq.

  

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navajo joe
Member since Apr 13th 2005
6224 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 10:13 AM

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58. "thank you for giving me time back in my day"
In response to Reply # 56
Thu Dec-05-19 10:14 AM by navajo joe

  

          

I was really about to write basically what you did and then was like 'let me work first'

now I don't have to!

People only think things are all connected on 'The Wire'

"Regardless if you listen to me, in the end we'll see."
-Cee-Lo

"You’ve had 4 years of Trump University and are still failing the final exam smh"
-Bree Newsome Bass

  

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Soldado
Member since Apr 13th 2006
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Thu Dec-05-19 10:25 AM

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59. "fam we really are too dumb for democracy."
In response to Reply # 58


  

          

dude called a president fixing an election some meaningless 'palace intrigue' then proceeded to say we have more important things to look at in an election year lol.

---
bka Reeq.

  

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navajo joe
Member since Apr 13th 2005
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Thu Dec-05-19 11:15 AM

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65. "It's not the morons that bother me, it's the smart people"
In response to Reply # 59


  

          

who are like 'this will hurt election chances'

So don't impeach because the Senate isn't gonna convict which means we have a president that is above the law and a Senate that will aid and abet anything he does no matter how many laws he violates.

Ok bet, then you can give up any hope of a free and fair election so the election chances don't matter. This whole thing is about him violating the law to influence the election. Y'all want to let that slide so that we can beat him by....an election? Ok, player.

A man who is going to prison for the rest of his life if he loses? Most of his team who isn't ALREADY in jail is going to jail should he lose? And you don't think he will do any and everything to stay in power? Especially emboldened by a lack of conviction much less by the Dems pursuing impeachment?

Oh and the Republicans aren't winning shit again unless they fucking cheat. That's why they've gone so hard. Why at every turn they've gerrymandered, cheated, fought tooth-and-nail to take the right to vote from everyone that isn't white. They know that this is last ditch effort and if they don't get their way it's a fucking wrap for a minute. White supremacy rule in this country is at stake and they are willing to sell everything out to keep power.

Y'all think the last couple years have been real? They will make this shit look like a cake walk and I can tell by how a lot of y'all post that they will be the first to feel the effects.

Let this cracker continue unabated and watch what happens. Let him get another Supreme Court judge. Let him keep installing life-long appointments. Let him GET AWAY WITH HIGH CRIMES AND MISDEMEANORS and watch what happens.

'Oh it doesn't affect me as long as my checks cash"...If you're a person whose primary concern is there check coming on time you're already fucked (and that includes me too). You just don't know it yet.

Niggas need to start looking alive.

"Regardless if you listen to me, in the end we'll see."
-Cee-Lo

"You’ve had 4 years of Trump University and are still failing the final exam smh"
-Bree Newsome Bass

  

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Stadiq
Member since Dec 21st 2005
4016 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 12:14 PM

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68. "^^^^ all of this"
In response to Reply # 65
Thu Dec-05-19 12:15 PM by Stadiq

          

....

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
20228 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 12:21 PM

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70. "100."
In response to Reply # 65


          

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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PROMO
Charter member
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Thu Dec-05-19 01:24 PM

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75. "lemme give you and Soldado a standing ovation."
In response to Reply # 65


  

          

STAND OUT HAND OUTS: http://basquiatwhenipaint.tumblr.com

TWEET ME: @PROMO206

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
12272 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 01:49 PM

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76. "Nobody ever said it's a good thing that the President is above the law."
In response to Reply # 65


          


Only that it's the reality that we have to contend with.

A lot of conservatives feel better when they say global warming is a hoax. And a lot of progressives feel better when they pretend the House has the power to "hold this President to account." Neither claim is true.

  

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navajo joe
Member since Apr 13th 2005
6224 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 02:26 PM

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87. "I know you didn't say that my dude"
In response to Reply # 76


  

          

Wouldn't put that evil on you.

This is the test where we see if Trump is in fact above the law, and while I don't have high hopes either, I still have some hope precisely because of this process.

If not he is, an election the election won't be fair and it won't really matter no matter who the Democrats put forward.

Either this shit breaks here or it doesn't break.

"Regardless if you listen to me, in the end we'll see."
-Cee-Lo

"You’ve had 4 years of Trump University and are still failing the final exam smh"
-Bree Newsome Bass

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
20228 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 10:46 AM

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62. "Hahahaha I was about to say the same thing."
In response to Reply # 58


          

"Thanks for saving me 20 minutes, reeq" haha.

----------------------------------------

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
67963 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 12:09 PM

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66. "Y’all like to look good losing. "
In response to Reply # 62


          

If you don’t think it’s the Dems job to make a case for the public... smh.

What you think the GOP is doing? They speak DIRECTLY to their base.



****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
20228 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 12:24 PM

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71. "*sigh* it's like you're responding to the opposite of everything that's ..."
In response to Reply # 66


          

>RE: Y’all like to look good losing.

We're literally saying the opposite of this. Read again.


>If you don’t think it’s the Dems job to make a case for
>the public... smh.

We're literally saying the opposite of this. Read again.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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navajo joe
Member since Apr 13th 2005
6224 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 12:34 PM

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72. "and y'all act like the right-wing propaganda complex "
In response to Reply # 66


  

          

y'all act like they haven't invested BILLIONS of dollars and 30 years to get to a point where they can tell people literally anything and they will believe them. They have waged a protracted war on science, on education and on journalism. Really they've waged a protracted war on critical thought.

You don't have to make a case when you teach people no matter what you are always right and anyone else is always wrong. Then you can feed people bullshit and they'll not only eat it, they'll ask for more.

So please stop with the 'well they just have to make the case' the Republicans don't have a case but they've worked REALLY hard for a really long time so they don't even have to make one.


The Democrats do, and making cases is hard. Thinking is hard. Democracy is hard. And all of it takes time and effort. But if you don't allow for that you're not a democratic society anyway. That's the risk.

(That's why baseline a third of people want authoritarianism. They want to be told what to think and they want to be relieved of that burden no matter the cost to themselves but particularly to others)

Most of all, the very systems in place to combat this shit y'all can't be bothered to understand and think are 'too hard to understand,' 'too boring' or 'wypipo palace intrigue that doesn't affect me'.







"Regardless if you listen to me, in the end we'll see."
-Cee-Lo

"You’ve had 4 years of Trump University and are still failing the final exam smh"
-Bree Newsome Bass

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
20228 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 12:37 PM

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73. "Damn. This is the best response ever."
In response to Reply # 72


          

>RE: and y'all act like the right-wing propaganda complex
>y'all act like they haven't invested BILLIONS of dollars and
>30 years to get to a point where they can tell people
>literally anything and they will believe them. They have waged
>a protracted war on science, on education and on journalism.
>Really they've waged a protracted war on critical thought.
>
>You don't have to make a case when you teach people no matter
>what you are always right and anyone else is always wrong.
>Then you can feed people bullshit and they'll not only eat it,
>they'll ask for more.
>
>So please stop with the 'well they just have to make the case'
>the Republicans don't have a case but they've worked REALLY
>hard for a really long time so they don't even have to make
>one.
>
>
>The Democrats do, and making cases is hard. Thinking is hard.
>Democracy is hard. And all of it takes time and effort. But if
>you don't allow for that you're not a democratic society
>anyway. That's the risk.
>
>(That's why baseline a third of people want authoritarianism.
>They want to be told what to think and they want to be
>relieved of that burden no matter the cost to themselves but
>particularly to others)
>
>Most of all, the very systems in place to combat this shit
>y'all can't be bothered to understand and think are 'too hard
>to understand,' 'too boring' or 'wypipo palace intrigue that
>doesn't affect me'.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
67963 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 02:07 PM

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80. "No one has ever said the GOP is complex. They dumb shit down"
In response to Reply # 72


          

The SNL skit of John Kerry is a good example. Dude would make great points during the debate and win but then he was keep fucking talking for 5 minutes and you would forget his point

Then dude gets on stage when Obama was the nominee and spit hot fire... the type of fire that woulda won the election if he used that same delivery.

You have to keep tailoring your message to the voters you have, not the voters you wish America had.

We are a simple nation... lol. Keep that shit simple or keep wondering why the idiots keep winning.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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navajo joe
Member since Apr 13th 2005
6224 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 02:13 PM

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83. "a said 'A complex' not complex"
In response to Reply # 80


  

          

jesus.

"Regardless if you listen to me, in the end we'll see."
-Cee-Lo

"You’ve had 4 years of Trump University and are still failing the final exam smh"
-Bree Newsome Bass

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
20228 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 02:18 PM

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84. "LOL it's so easy to tell who does and does not read things."
In response to Reply # 83


          

Basically, they just echo repug talking points and soundbytes and mischaracterize things you say.

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"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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navajo joe
Member since Apr 13th 2005
6224 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 02:19 PM

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85. "we're a simple nation? "
In response to Reply # 80


  

          

bruh, you can't even understand an HBO series and then want to apply your reductionist ass views to a America?

You know very little about a whole lot and think because you're simple everything else is.

Log off and read a fucking book.

"Regardless if you listen to me, in the end we'll see."
-Cee-Lo

"You’ve had 4 years of Trump University and are still failing the final exam smh"
-Bree Newsome Bass

  

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mista k5
Member since Feb 01st 2006
13321 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 12:14 PM

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67. "why does it say soldado for reeq now???"
In response to Reply # 62


  

          

we can change our user names now???????

  

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tariqhu
Charter member
15536 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 01:54 PM

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77. "soldado's sig....."
In response to Reply # 67


          

but no you can't change usernames.

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

  

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mista k5
Member since Feb 01st 2006
13321 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 02:10 PM

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82. "i guess i pay more attention to avatars than names lol"
In response to Reply # 77


  

          

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
67963 posts
Thu Dec-05-19 12:18 PM

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69. "Nah. You are wrong as fuck. You better do everything you can to "
In response to Reply # 56


          

make people care about this country if you are a Dem.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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kayru99
Member since Jan 26th 2004
15785 posts
Fri Dec-06-19 11:20 AM

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89. "Campaigning is definitionally a part of American politics."
In response to Reply # 69


          

Campaigning is making your case/drumming up support.
All that Sorkin-ass shit above is why the Dems stay losing.

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
20228 posts
Fri Dec-06-19 11:39 AM

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90. "This was your original comment:"
In response to Reply # 89
Fri Dec-06-19 11:44 AM by Brew

          

>RE:Nah, they're terrible making a case why folks should care
>About the Ukraine/Biden shit.
>Just like the Russian scare shit.
>There's massive labor/economic protests happening nationwide...a housing crisis...etc.
>Dumbass palace intrigue ain't gonna move the needle in the general populace.
>Especially this close to an election

The dems are literally laying out indisputable facts via public hearings one by one, trotting out excellent witnesses who are all saying, in unison, out loud, "this man is bribing a foreign nation for personal gain and has obstructed justice to avoid paying for his blatant crimes"

They've gone on every media platform multiple times and exposed these high crimes and misdemeanors methodically for several weeks (which was my initial complaint about the handling of this whole thing, that they weren't being loud enough about it).

I'm not really sure what else you want them to do to "make people care," ... waterboard independents til they pledge that they care about their country ? Repugs are throwing hissy fits, lying, and distracting from the truth, *without even really ever denying that the president has committed these crimes*, and people are buying it. Unfortunately, it's difficult to combat a major political party that has zero integrity or shame.

And to your last point re: other issues, they're doing all this WHILE addressing hundreds of other issues via passing FOUR HUNDRED House bills which are being stalled in the Senate by Moscow Mitch because repugs ain't shit.

And your problem is with the democrats ?!?

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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kayru99
Member since Jan 26th 2004
15785 posts
Fri Dec-06-19 11:56 AM

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92. "Yes. If it's *their* position that this is a seismic political crisis"
In response to Reply # 90


          

Then it's their responsibility to convince the populace to agree with them.
If they can't/don't, they're shit at their jobs, or the case needs to be stronger.

Whining about the Republicans spending the past 30 years building up a bullet proof political apparatus that defines & supports their directives is much less effective than doing the same fucking thing for your party.

"Trust us, we know better" is a shit starting point for a political organization.

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
20228 posts
Fri Dec-06-19 12:03 PM

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93. "Fair enough. I can't really argue that."
In response to Reply # 92


          

I'm def not gonna go in any deeper arguing that dems are great at messaging. From the beginning my main point was just that they've done a better job with the impeachment process than I originally thought they would.

But your point is well taken, that if they're not convincing the folks they need to convince then they're definitely *not* doing their jobs effectively. Can't argue that.

But I think the polling figures show that they have moved the needle, to the extent that they're probably realistically able considering the electorate. But I'd have to look back.


>Then it's their responsibility to convince the populace to
>agree with them.
>If they can't/don't, they're shit at their jobs, or the case
>needs to be stronger.
>
>Whining about the Republicans spending the past 30 years
>building up a bullet proof political apparatus that defines &
>supports their directives is much less effective than doing
>the same fucking thing for your party.
>
>"Trust us, we know better" is a shit starting point for a
>political organization.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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kayru99
Member since Jan 26th 2004
15785 posts
Fri Dec-06-19 03:33 PM

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95. "honestly, I'm way left of the dem party, but I can see how "
In response to Reply # 93


          

impeaching trump could be HELLA useful to the party long term (the modern grassroots Right partially came outta the Clinton impeachment), but the way the Dems are playing it seem wrong headed as hell. The contempt for people who don't care is game goofy. MAKE them care, and build the infrastructure to keep them in your funnel.

Instead, they're congratulating themselves on cable news.

It doesn't seem to be a part of any long-term strategy to do anything other than say "we impeached Trump in the House".

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
20228 posts
Fri Dec-06-19 03:48 PM

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98. "Oh see I don't really perceive it that way, personally."
In response to Reply # 95


          

>RE: honestly, I'm way left of the dem party, but I can see how

Me too, for the record. Hella, unapologetically left of the party and the country. But in these discussions I try to be as objective and realistic as possible, sometimes to the detriment of my own arguments admittedly haha.


>impeaching trump could be HELLA useful to the party long term
>(the modern grassroots Right partially came outta the Clinton
>impeachment), but the way the Dems are playing it seem wrong
>headed as hell. The contempt for people who don't care is game
>goofy. MAKE them care, and build the infrastructure to keep
>them in your funnel.

Can you give me examples of them showing contempt for the people who don't care ? Honest request - because that's not the way I've been seeing it *at all*. I think they've been doing their best to lay out the facts without coming off as hella partisan, and that's what I've been most impressed by.

I'm not necessarily arguing that they've done *enough* to make the ambivalent people care. In this instance I'm just arguing against your claim that Schiff, Pelosi, etc. have actual *contempt* for people who are independent/apolitical/indifferent about the Ukraine stuff. I don't see it that way at all but certainly could be missing some signs.


>Instead, they're congratulating themselves on cable news.

Do you have examples of this, too ? Cause I'm not seeing this either, haha. Again, serious request - not trying to be difficult or snarky.


>It doesn't seem to be a part of any long-term strategy to do
>anything other than say "we impeached Trump in the House".

*this* I can maybe agree with. And that's mostly because they took so damn long to actually open up an inquiry. Trump's been giving them impeachment ammo since before he even got in office (I know you can't use evidence from a pre-presidency campaign to impeach but you know what I mean) so the fact that Pelosi/Schumer/et al waited til damn near the last fucking minute, while watching the world burn in the meantime, makes me think you may be right. Add that to the fact that they made this a limited inquiry rather than opening it up to *all* this clown's crimes and corruptions and you're almost definitely onto something by saying they just want to go into the election year saying "hey look we did something about him !"

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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102. "Thank you. "
In response to Reply # 92


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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101. "These arty smarty dudes man.. "
In response to Reply # 89


          

and these same folk shocked Trump won and still has a good chance at re-election even tho he is trash.

These dudes stay on some “it’s not our job to educate the masses”

Ok

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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kayru99
Member since Jan 26th 2004
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Fri Dec-06-19 03:26 PM

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94. "you're beating the shit outta several strawman arguments"
In response to Reply # 56
Fri Dec-06-19 03:27 PM by kayru99

          

congrats?

If you're making a political argument, but are somehow above lobbying to the populace why that argument is important and valid and should get their focus above all else...you are a shitty politician.

We JUST saw the results of this line of thinking in 2016.

Dems can't just brush off people not caring about Ukraine as a failing of the populace. You're a politcal party. Fucking rally them to your side.

All that other smug fuckshit you typed is pretty irrelevant

  

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naame
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48. "This is politics in general"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

normal people don't know shit and don't want to know shit because they want to eat hamburgers and watch football. This is why with even a few good people running for office, there is a possibility of making change at a local level. I mean, Pete Buttigieg became mayor with 9000 votes and now he's a nationally known figure.


America has imported more warlord theocracy from Afghanistan than it has exported democracy.

  

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Trinity444
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50. "ikr..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I think normal people have given up on life. not like killing themselves, like a hopelessness.

  

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Vector
Member since Jan 05th 2006
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Thu Dec-05-19 04:30 AM

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53. "That makes me normal"
In response to Reply # 50


  

          

I gave up years ago when I realised they're all the same lying, cheating, out-for-themselves, mofos.

  

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Trinity444
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88. "the lesser evil? "
In response to Reply # 53


  

          

facts matter but doesn’t necessarily move the crowd. Biden cussed out a voter today, a good spark and it might get some folks off the sofa.

I know shit ain’t really going to change lol. He gotta go tho...







  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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Fri Dec-06-19 11:50 AM

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91. "Im starting to come around on impeachment being a good election strategy"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

A last ditch election strategy. Because Trump is looking real strong in my opinion.

I think the state of the economy is going to be the biggest factor in this election. And it keeps humming along, no matter how much he tries to mess it up. There was another good jobs report this morning. And between now and November, there isn't much time for things to flip dramatically in the economy.

Democrats need something like impeachment to throw a monkey wrench in Trump's ability to coast on "his" economic results

_______________________________________
You ain't the only one whose got problems. You ain't the only one who knows pain. Get up off your ass and just solve them. You still got a chance to try to change, try the shit again.
Devin tha Dude

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
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Fri Dec-06-19 03:41 PM

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97. "LOL"
In response to Reply # 91


  

          

Didn't you say Trump's tax cut was going to help him and the Dems better do something ?

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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99. "*shrug* Did it hurt him?"
In response to Reply # 97


  

          

I don't know...sounds like something I would say lol

The tax cut definitely didn't produce the results they said it was going to produce (really high economic growth). But I don't think the tax cut is going to be any attach ads against Trump.

So maybe I'm missing what you are getting at.

>Didn't you say Trump's tax cut was going to help him and the
>Dems better do something ?

_______________________________________
You ain't the only one whose got problems. You ain't the only one who knows pain. Get up off your ass and just solve them. You still got a chance to try to change, try the shit again.
Devin tha Dude

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
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103. "The point is you said the same thing about the tax cuts "
In response to Reply # 99


  

          

Dems better watch out. Now you are saying it about the economy.


>The tax cut definitely didn't produce the results they said it
>was going to produce (really high economic growth). But I
>don't think the tax cut is going to be any attach ads against
>Trump.
>
>So maybe I'm missing what you are getting at.
>

If "state of the economy is going to be the biggest factor in this election" where was it during the midterms ? Why are the burbs moving away from him ?

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
15106 posts
Fri Dec-06-19 03:39 PM

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96. "sitting next to 2 elderly YT men"
In response to Reply # 0
Fri Dec-06-19 03:39 PM by bentagain

  

          

IRT the testimony this week

overheard

“That woman is an idiot”

Followed by a dissertation on notable higher learning institutions like Harvard and Stanford being worthless

i.e. attack the messenger, attack the process...disregard all facts

This is America (c)

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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jane eyre
Member since Jan 16th 2007
699 posts
Fri Dec-06-19 04:57 PM

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100. "What nauseates me:"
In response to Reply # 0


          

The "reasoning" behind this type of "logic" is driven by the fantasy-fueled, superstitious, mythological, garbage narratives and feverish desires of White Supremacist ideology.

Lack of information and the consequences of a failed education system is one thing. Not feeling--in your BODY--the weight and darkness of the lies pumped out for "normal" people to consume? A moral failure and spiritual crisis.


  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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104. "For sure. It's deeply embedded in the fabric of this nation. "
In response to Reply # 100


          

And Trump's election and everything that's happened since has convinced me that we'll never figure it out.

It's depressing as hell.


>The "reasoning" behind this type of "logic" is driven by the
>fantasy-fueled, superstitious, mythological, garbage
>narratives and feverish desires of White Supremacist ideology.
>
>
>Lack of information and the consequences of a failed education
>system is one thing. Not feeling--in your BODY--the weight and
>darkness of the lies pumped out for "normal" people to
>consume? A moral failure and spiritual crisis.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Hellyeah
Member since Jul 05th 2008
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Sat Dec-07-19 08:11 AM

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105. "let's be real now, trump got 2020 on lock"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

those dem candidates are weak as hell and them cancel culture activists on social media are a turn off

  

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navajo joe
Member since Apr 13th 2005
6224 posts
Mon Dec-09-19 06:14 PM

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106. "just upping this "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

because niggas would rather talk about Lizzo's ass but then turn around and say 'but they never made the case'

"Regardless if you listen to me, in the end we'll see."
-Cee-Lo

"You’ve had 4 years of Trump University and are still failing the final exam smh"
-Bree Newsome Bass

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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Mon Dec-09-19 07:05 PM

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107. "Yep."
In response to Reply # 106


          

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Stadiq
Member since Dec 21st 2005
4016 posts
Wed Dec-11-19 06:47 PM

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112. "I think Dems fucked this up man"
In response to Reply # 107


          


They should have gone all in.

We all know the Senate is going to give him a pass- if they take it up at all.

Shit will probably turn into an investigation of Biden.


Everything should have been on the table. Impeach Trump for every possible/reasonable thing and hang it around the GOP's neck.

Call every witness. Go to court to get the blocked witnesses to appear.

Etc.


Instead, the judiciary rushed through it and they dropped TWO (lol) articles and quickly hid their hands.

They even gave him a trade win on the SAME day! They didn't even let impeachment marinate.


They look like they regret it or never believed it in the first place (outside of Schiff at times).

Nadler fucking looked and sounded like he was giving a book report on something he got bored of and just skimmed the end or some shit.


Hell, I don't see the relative downside of dragging the house hearings out another year and truly put the senate on the line in 2020. Air out all of this shit.

If the election is a "referendum on Trump" then lets do it.


Yeah pass some bills that will die in the senate, but keep exposing all of Trumps awfulness.


Now TWO (lol lol) articles will be sent to the senate, where they will quickly give him a pass or worse- drag out their trial with an investigation of Biden and force most of our Presidential candidates to put their campaigns on hold.


Random but related- did you see Joe Biden said recently he doesn't want Democrats to have too much power- that he wants the GOP around? The he doesn't think either party should have too much power?


I reference this because their timidness (most of the time) with impeachment, Biden's comment, their obvious disdain for Warren/Sanders, etc I think is just more and more proof that Democrats really want to be a minority party.

They aren't there to advance a progressive agenda. They are just there to make sure the GOP doesn't goo *too* far.


Shit has me fucked up man. I think its been this way at least since Reagan kicked their asses so bad Bill Clinton essentially had to run as a Republican- and he needed a spoiler at that.


I get that Democrats can only do so much to educate and inform the public.

But they could have done a lot fucking more and acted like they believed in their own mission/purpose/whatever you want to call it.

Looking like/acting like they had to hurry and get through this was a huge mistake.


And again, two articles? Clinton got two for lying about a blow job. And one of those was obstruction of justice. How did Trump not get an article for obstruction of justice?






  

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mista k5
Member since Feb 01st 2006
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Wed Dec-11-19 07:01 PM

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113. "i dont know how to call it "
In response to Reply # 112


  

          

theres been times where i think the dems were so stupid then the next day i saw why they did it and it made sense. theyre revising these tonight and tomorrow right? no idea if that will somehow turn out better or just a chance for the GOP to complain more.

theres so much contradictory reporting on how the trial will go in the senate, i cant really predict what will happen. i dont expect a conviction in the senate but im not ruling out the trial still being a bad look for trump and hurting him in the election.

  

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Vex_id
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Wed Dec-11-19 04:48 PM

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109. "Serious question"
In response to Reply # 106


          

You've been one of the strongest advocates here for going full bore on impeachment. While virtually all of us agree that Trump *should* be impeached - how do you envision this playing out in actuality?

Are you satisfied just with the House issuing articles of impeachment and voting to impeach Trump? When the inevitable happens (impeachment gets halted in its tracks in the Senate) - what to speak of the aftermath? Do you see a positive political outcome for Democrats? What does that look like?

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
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Wed Dec-11-19 05:32 PM

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110. "R Senate doesn't find him guilty..."
In response to Reply # 109


  

          

They will become the communist party

Why frame the trial as having a negative impact on Ds?

R stands for Ruskie.

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71326 posts
Thu Dec-12-19 02:49 AM

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115. "There's no way to successfully remove him from office"
In response to Reply # 109


  

          

The path is just not there, similar to how it wasn't there for Clinton.

What I inferred somewhat from his post above and what I certainly believe is that they need this to drag on for as long as possible. They shot their wad pretty quickly here and I don't see the rush. They've got the house majority through the next election. Stretch it out like Caramelo here. Call mad witnesses. Inundate them with allegations. The traction they got here was from people like Sondland and Hill getting allegations and critiques out there. Hill was sharper than the whole fucking house put together and Sonland was a character; he had real charisma.

There are enough bureaucrats, diplomats, military people and other people involved in some aspect of government that despise Trump's ass to fill the calendar chock full of testimony.

They seem eager to push this through like that is somehow advantageous. I don't understand what it serves them to try to force this upon the Senate when it's evident AF that they won't vote the same way. This is such an opportunity for negative press (which we know Trump is great at spinning, but still, his followers are pretty much locked in anyway). It also lets pressure mount for the many down-ballot races in 2020. Get the Senate vote or lack thereof as close to the election as possible. Weaponize that outcome instead of getting it out of the way.

Already the GOP has seized on the chance to turn the partisanship of these hearings--which is stark on both sides, let's be honest--into a favorable facet for them. On one hand, the GOP will defend any and all things Trump does, up until very ridiculous statements that amount to "well he didn't shout I AM COMMITTING EXORTION!" while allegedly committing extortion" and "well, you didn't see it with your own eyes so how do you know it happened?" But they have managed to largely portray themselves as the aggrieved party here and, to those who they actually can convince, it's worked. Meanwhile the Dems have been pushing impeachment from the start and the votes, investigations and so forth pile up to suggest that this is a "witch hunt," again to those who are prone to that suggestion. Now, even though I will acknowledge that there has been a press to remove Trump (when there should have been a press to counter his actions!), that is actually immaterial provided there were impeacable offenses committed here, which, in a sane world, there were.

All this blathering is to say I agree mostly, that the proceedings should have been comprehensive and lengthy. Don't nut so quick, get up in those guts, do some damage to the side walls. But the DNC is the party of premature ejaculation.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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allStah
Member since Jun 21st 2014
3368 posts
Wed Dec-11-19 06:00 PM

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111. "RE: The impeachment and &quot;normal&quot; folks"
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Dec-11-19 06:07 PM by allStah

          

And to add to that, there are wealthy democrats who have the support of trump, because they are totally against Warren and Sanders. Wall Street dems have already stated that they would vote for trump if sanders or warren wins the democratic nomination.

This is why Bloomberg has been pushed into the election.

The wealthy fear the wealth tax more than anything else, considering the tax will be applied to not only income but to all assets, including unrealized gains on stock.

So even though this man has committed bribery and treason, which are listed as high crimes in US constitution, powerful entities of America are not going to allow him to be removed or voted out of office, especially if warren or sanders get the nod.


I always questioned the law that the lower house is solely responsible for all impeachments , and the upper house is solely responsible for all impeachment hearings or trials. How could there not be a conflict of interest if the majority of both or one of those houses make up the party that the president represents?

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
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Wed Dec-11-19 10:57 PM

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114. "Not all Trump supporters are "racist goobers""
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Some of them are ignorant motherfuckers and others are greedy pieces of shit.

You also get the odd opportunist and aloof nihilist, but most fall into those other three categories.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
67963 posts
Thu Dec-12-19 08:51 AM

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116. "I wasn’t a Hillary supporter but I voted for her in the general. "
In response to Reply # 114


          

I’m sure a good portion of Republican voters are the same way. They just vote for whoever has the R next to their name



****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
4050 posts
Thu Dec-12-19 09:59 AM

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117. "Nah they are all racist goobers too"
In response to Reply # 114


  

          

They use all the other excuses to hide it.

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
20228 posts
Thu Dec-12-19 10:40 AM

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118. "That is correct."
In response to Reply # 117


          

I've never met a convincing repug.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
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Thu Dec-12-19 06:23 PM

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126. "in the sense that indifference and enabling are on that level, yes"
In response to Reply # 117


  

          

but in the sense that they are actual bigots or motivated by their bigotry, not necessarily. some people are just some whats-in-it-for-me motherfuckers and others just want to see mad-making. if you're on this board, you can understand the latter to some extent, although maybe not to the extent that the leader of the "free world" should be the mad-maker in chief

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
4050 posts
Mon Dec-16-19 11:55 AM

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132. "Nah rebranding doesn't work"
In response to Reply # 126


  

          

>but in the sense that they are actual bigots or motivated by
>their bigotry, not necessarily. some people are just some
>whats-in-it-for-me motherfuckers and others just want to see
>mad-making. if you're on this board, you can understand the
>latter to some extent, although maybe not to the extent that
>the leader of the "free world" should be the mad-maker in
>chief


If they support the racist orange clown, they are bigots motivated by bigotry. They can try to use the excuse of "owing the libarards or doing it for the 401k", it's still just an excuse used to cover up supporting a bigot.

The Klan tried to rebrand and say they were a civil rights organization, nope still the Klan. Atwater admitted, they say state's rights and thats what Trump supporters are doing , faking it.

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sectachrome86
Member since Dec 22nd 2007
2610 posts
Thu Dec-12-19 01:08 PM

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123. "Whats the difference?"
In response to Reply # 114


          

Im not a racist, but I am a Christian and the KKK meetings have really good coffee and donuts.

-------------------------------------------------
http://www.soundcloud.com/sectachrome

  

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Trinity444
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Sat Dec-14-19 10:25 PM

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129. "I’m trying to be mindful of that..."
In response to Reply # 114


  

          

I learned the director of my new employer is a proud supporter. He doesn’t come across as racist...probably more ignorant. I need to find ways to coexist because I’m extremely uncomfortable in his presence...


  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
67963 posts
Mon Dec-16-19 11:24 AM

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130. "this place would have you thinking they don’t work with Trump supporte..."
In response to Reply # 129


          

but most of them do. They either don’t know it or just lie to themselves to feel better about themselves.

They are everywhere.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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mista k5
Member since Feb 01st 2006
13321 posts
Mon Dec-16-19 11:41 AM

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131. "i think the three people i work closely with all support trump"
In response to Reply # 130


  

          

not sure if they all voted for him but they have definitely made comments that they support what hes done or that they disapprove that theyre trying to take him down.

then they complain that they pay too much for health insurance.

  

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Trinity444
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Mon Dec-16-19 08:02 PM

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133. "dude..."
In response to Reply # 130


  

          

someone gifted him a trump doll at the holiday party. He held that bitch up like, “yeah”. I put my head down...

  

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
130868 posts
Thu Dec-12-19 10:57 AM

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119. "don't know where to put it, but Pelosi..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

...is a prime example of how much I hate how right wingers can easily preempt and co-opt legit beefs with bad actors.

she was on a CNN Town Hall recently, answering a question regarding impeachment, and in her response, she mentioned that the actions of the George W. Bush regime did not "rise to impeachment", even when it was known they weren't telling the truth about weapons of mass destruction... to start a war.

that she's the one leading this charge EVEN with the knowledge of the GOP Senate basically deading this whole affair, does not bode well.

whole thing reminded me of for as how bad Trump is... George W. Bush might still be worse, if not the WOAT

Yes, I'm mad. Let's move on.

Jays | Cavs | Eagles | Sabres | Tarheels

PSN: Dr_Claw_77 | XBL: Dr Claw 077 | FB: drclaw077 | T: @drclaw77 | http://thepeoplesvault.wordpress.com

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
20228 posts
Thu Dec-12-19 11:05 AM

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120. "Yea the rewriting of GWB history is one of the worst things ..."
In response to Reply # 119
Thu Dec-12-19 11:08 AM by Brew

          

... about Individual 1's Reign of Horror. You've got folks glorifying and longing for the GWB years, which is just totally insane if you actually take just a second and try and remember just how bad those 8 years were. The easiest way to look at it is to remember that the Bush Jr./Cheney years were SO BAD that Racist Ass America elected a black president to succeed him.

I hesitate to call the GWB years "worse" than what's happening now (I think the longterm ramifications of what I-1 is doing will be harder to reverse) but they are not far off. Just an entirely different variety of horrible.


>...is a prime example of how much I hate how right wingers
>can easily preempt and co-opt legit beefs with bad actors.
>
>she was on a CNN Town Hall recently, answering a question
>regarding impeachment, and in her response, she mentioned that
>the actions of the George W. Bush regime did not "rise to
>impeachment", even when it was known they weren't telling the
>truth about weapons of mass destruction... to start a war.
>
>that she's the one leading this charge EVEN with the knowledge
>of the GOP Senate basically deading this whole affair, does
>not bode well.
>
>whole thing reminded me of for as how bad Trump is... George
>W. Bush might still be worse, if not the WOAT

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"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Teknontheou
Charter member
32424 posts
Thu Dec-12-19 11:38 AM

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121. "It makes sense, though. They give GWB a pass because his "
In response to Reply # 120


  

          

personal comportment was not and is not boorish and uncouth, like Trump. That's what animates alot of people the most - the way Trump talks and acts and carries himself. They don't necessarily mind a president doing terrible things that lead to many deaths and world turmoil, as long as he carries himself similar to the way they do.

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
20228 posts
Thu Dec-12-19 11:50 AM

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122. "Oh that's definitely true, but I'm not referring to those people."
In response to Reply # 121


          

I'm referring to the people who WERE disgusted by Bush at the time, because of the terrible things and many deaths ... but who now say shit like "in hindsight he wasn't that bad a president." Know what I mean.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71326 posts
Thu Dec-12-19 06:26 PM

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127. "Pelosi has all the charisma and utility of a genital wart"
In response to Reply # 119


  

          

I've been reading the centrist-splaining of her "brilliant tactics" on this trade deal and honestly it's about as bad as reading people defend Trump's policies.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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walihorse
Member since Aug 03rd 2006
16036 posts
Thu Dec-12-19 04:43 PM

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124. "I move to strike the last word!"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I love it.

If a fat guy falls in the woods and there is no one around to see it, do the trees laugh?

  

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mista k5
Member since Feb 01st 2006
13321 posts
Thu Dec-12-19 04:59 PM

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125. "ive been following threads on it"
In response to Reply # 124


  

          

i couldnt get myself to watch today. been listening to music instead. i watched them argue last night. that was enough until the next step.

  

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mista k5
Member since Feb 01st 2006
13321 posts
Fri Dec-13-19 10:31 AM

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128. "i cant believe i watched it last night"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

cant help myself.

it was funny to see collins so mad that nadler pushed the vote to this morning at the very end. GOP was stalling all day and theyre mad nadler didnt wrap it up yesterday.

vote was pretty straight forward except for Ted Lieu missing the vote because he was sick.

what now?

  

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