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Subject: "Why has Kellz' career thrived despite of assault allegations? (swipe)" Previous topic | Next topic
Firecracker
Member since Feb 20th 2007
1892 posts
Fri Dec-01-17 03:21 AM

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"Why has Kellz' career thrived despite of assault allegations? (swipe)"


  

          


https://www.newyorker.com/culture/cultural-comment/why-has-r-kellys-career-thrived-despite-sexual-misconduct-allegations


Each day brings news of men who have abused their positions of wealth, fame, and power to engage in sexual harassment and assault. Yet, as the list of perpetrators grows ever longer, the name of the Chicago singer, songwriter, and producer R. Kelly is conspicuously absent from those belatedly paying a price for their actions. And it’s worth asking why.
R. Kelly has sold an estimated hundred million records, and, at age fifty, he remains one of the dominant voices in R. & B. He also has a well-documented, twenty-five-year history of allegedly victimizing women and underage girls. Between 1996 and 2002, he was subject to four publicly filed lawsuits, three by teen-age girls who alleged illegal underage relationships. All were settled, with payments made in return for nondisclosure agreements—the favored tool of Harvey Weinstein and Bill O’Reilly. Since then, Kelly has reached out-of-court settlements with “numerous” other women, according to the lawyer who represented many of them. In 2002, he was indicted for making child pornography, stemming from a video that prosecutors said showed him having sex with and urinating into the mouth of a fourteen-year-old girl. The case took six years to go to trial, and Kelly was acquitted, largely, according to jurors, because the girl and her parents never testified, though prosecutors called a dozen witnesses who confirmed the relationship.

As the pop-music critic at the Chicago Sun-Times, I covered Kelly’s rise from busking on subway platforms in the early nineties to mainstream success. My first investigative story about the singer’s alleged predatory behavior ran on December 21, 2000; the videotape for which he was indicted was left anonymously in the mailbox at my home, on Chicago’s Northwest Side, in February, 2002. This summer, I published two stories about Kelly in BuzzFeed News. One told the tale of Jerhonda Pace, who broke a nondisclosure agreement to talk about a sexual relationship that she allegedly had with Kelly when she was sixteen, in 2009, shortly after she met the star at his trial for child pornography. The other documented what sources call “a cult” of six women that they say Kelly currently houses in properties in Chicago and Atlanta; Kelly, sources say, has “brainwashed” the women by separating them from friends and family. (Kelly has denied any wrongdoing.)

While Charlie Rose, Matt Lauer, Kevin Spacey, Louis C.K., and other stars have promptly seen their careers implode after their alleged behavior was exposed, the music industry seems unconcerned about the charges against Kelly. His record label, Sony Music, refuses to comment, and Live Nation, the global concert promoter, continues to stage his shows. A petition drive, a public protest, and a vote of censure by the county board of commissioners greeted Kelly’s concert at the Wolf Creek Amphitheater, in Atlanta, in August, but Live Nation’s only comment was, “The show will go on,” and the company is promoting three of his upcoming concerts. (Live Nation did not respond to requests to comment.)
None of the many stars for whom Kelly has written and produced hits have spoken out against him—from Jay-Z, with whom he made two albums and did two co-headlining tours, to Lady Gaga, a champion of female empowerment and herself a sexual-abuse survivor. Last December, Kelly appeared on the “Tonight Show,” singing his Christmas songs and getting a big hug from the host, Jimmy Fallon. Now Kelly is climbing the charts again with “Juicy Booty,” a collaboration with Chris Brown (who was vilified for assaulting Rihanna, in 2009) and the singer Jhené Aiko.

Popular music, arguably our most forward-looking art form, seems mired in the past when it comes to examining the reprehensible behavior of male stars; there’s been seemingly little progress from the days of Jerry Lee Lewis, Elvis Presley, and their teen-age brides. Kelly’s lure is a variation on that hoariest of ignoble show-biz clichés, the casting couch. Many of the women who’ve fallen under his spell were aspiring singers attracted by the promise of stardom from the self-proclaimed “Pied Piper of R. & B.” But Kelly hasn’t launched the career of a female protégé since Aaliyah, whom he illegally married, in 1994, when she was fifteen, shortly after producing and writing her début album, which he titled “Age Ain’t Nothing but a Number.”

When it comes to the heavy lifting necessary to expose sexual predators, the pop-music beat has attracted fewer investigative reporters than politics, or even Hollywood. Many critics have blithely ignored the long record of charges against Kelly while celebrating his hot-and-horny jams—such as “Sex in the Kitchen,” “The Zoo,” and that mostly a-capella epic of debauchery, “Trapped in the Closet”—as hypersexualized kitsch. The unexamined acceptance of Kelly continues: last month, the blue-eyed-soul singer Sam Smith sported a Kelly T-shirt at the after-party following his performance on “Saturday Night Live.”

Why is the pop-music world so reluctant to address Kelly’s alleged misdeeds? One reason may be that the genre has witnessed so much bad-boy behavior for so long that huge swaths of beloved sounds, from James Brown to the Rolling Stones, from Led Zeppelin to the many records produced by Dr. Dre, would be out of bounds if listeners didn’t separate the art from the artist. In general, we seem especially reluctant to believe the worst of artists whose music has touched us deeply. During my thirty years as a music critic, I never received more hate mail than whenever I dared to mention the sexual-abuse allegations against Michael Jackson, even when Jackson was directly addressing them in songs such as “Tabloid Junkie” and “D.S.”
Kelly’s public image also plays into toxic stereotypes about black men’s sexual appetites, desires, and even intelligence—he is often portrayed as all id, an idiot pop-savant; by his own admission, in “Soulacoasta: The Diary of Me,” he has trouble reading and doing math. Then, too, the allegations levelled against some celebrities are simply so distasteful that fans, critics, and journalists can’t bring themselves to discuss them—a condition that the critic Bill Wyman has called “the ick factor.” In Kelly’s case, it’s the urination in the notorious video, though Dave Chappelle had no problem parodying it in “Piss on You,” a skit from the first season of his television show.

Ultimately, though, I believe that there’s one reason above all others that Kelly isn’t facing the same scrutiny as other men in the rogues’ gallery of the moment. It’s one that Karen Attiah, the global-opinions editor of the Washington Post, expressed in a video op-ed, in July. “If even a fraction of the allegations against Kelly are true, his continued success hinges on the invisibility of black women and girls in America,” Attiah says. “As long as black women are seen to be a caste not worthy of care and protection, his actions will not receive widespread outcry . . . . The saga of Robert Kelly says more about America than it does about him.”
The women in R. Kelly’s “cult” are all African-American. The sources whom I talked to for my reporting in BuzzFeed say that Kelly controls when the women eat and sleep, whom they talk to, where they go, how they dress, and how they pleasure him in sexual encounters (which he records and shows to male friends). They also say that he punishes the women physically and mentally if they break his “rules.” Kelly has changed his modus operandi—the youngest of the women in the alleged cult were eighteen, nineteen, and twenty-one, all above the age of consent—but he did not reckon with four desperate parents who have been relentless in trying to bring their daughters home. Their efforts have, so far, come to naught: law-enforcement agencies in Georgia, Florida, and Illinois have declined to act, and, while the parents and other sources in my stories have been interviewed at length by federal agents, the F.B.I. will neither confirm nor deny whether an investigation is taking place.

One of the women in the “cult” has said that she is “happy where I am at.” None of the others have spoken publicly, but the parents continue to contact me regularly, asking why, given the current public conversation, Kelly’s history, and what they call his ongoing abuse, the media isn’t focussing more on him. Even seventeen years of reporting hasn’t been enough to turn as bright a spotlight on Kelly as the one exposing many others, because no one, it seems, matters less in our society than young black women.

Jim DeRogatis is a Chicago-based music journalist and critic, the co-host of the weekly public-radio show, “Sound Opinions,” and an associate professor at Columbia College Chicago.

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
a few things and facts
Dec 01st 2017
1
Actually a pretty sober & thorough reply from his GD mans
Dec 01st 2017
4
He wasn’t completely: he had the song with Gaga & SNL
Dec 01st 2017
6
I just don’t want to see you say shit about any of these other men
Dec 01st 2017
9
Agreed
Dec 05th 2017
60
there's a VERY good chance he would double down
Dec 05th 2017
61
lmao
Dec 06th 2017
68
i don't condone his actions, I respect his Musical talent
Dec 07th 2017
69
LOL first reply
Dec 01st 2017
41
this dude has been tryna take down r kelly for 15 years.
Dec 01st 2017
2
RE: this dude has been tryna take down r kelly for 15 years.
Dec 01st 2017
3
because black folks refuse to stop playing his music
Dec 01st 2017
5
imho, if white woman sexuality isn’t valued, yt tears and all
Dec 01st 2017
7
Correct answer... and when that tape came out
Dec 01st 2017
8
It’s interesting right...
Dec 01st 2017
10
      Zeke Elliott lost 6 NFL game checks over some college shit
Dec 01st 2017
13
           Some sad blatant shit...smh
Dec 01st 2017
17
           the nfl investigator even said dont suspend him lmao. that shit is brazy
Dec 01st 2017
19
See Also Chris Brown. Sadly because his victims are black wome
Dec 01st 2017
14
      Rihanna basically forgave him and co-signed his shit
Dec 01st 2017
16
      Rihanna is a black woman, so her forgiving him makes my point.
Dec 01st 2017
21
           gotcha
Dec 01st 2017
25
      he had a huge initial backlash
Dec 01st 2017
37
RE: Why has Kellz' career thrived despite of assault allegations? (swipe...
Dec 01st 2017
11
^^^^^^^^
Dec 01st 2017
12
Ehh...
Dec 01st 2017
15
      Trapped in thr Closet was after the pee tape+trial
Dec 01st 2017
20
           yep
Dec 01st 2017
22
           Agreed. Those Dailybeast articles were a mortal blow
Dec 01st 2017
27
                Yep.
Dec 01st 2017
31
           RE: Trapped in thr Closet was after the pee tape+trial
Dec 01st 2017
39
                Hating on an Artist with a almost 30 year career
Dec 01st 2017
42
                     RE: Hating on an Artist with a almost 30 year career
Dec 02nd 2017
44
                          RE: Hating on an Artist with a almost 30 year career
Dec 03rd 2017
55
                               Bullshit. You defend him, R Kelly, the person. Don't fuck around.
Dec 08th 2017
71
                                    look turkey i don't know R.Kelly the person only the music
Dec 08th 2017
72
cause Ignition remix is fire.
Dec 01st 2017
18
RE: cause Ignition remix is fire.
Dec 01st 2017
23
at the end of the day folks just want to dance and party
Dec 01st 2017
24
The brain/booty split is something alot of black feminists talk about.
Dec 01st 2017
28
      how do they rationalize it.
Dec 01st 2017
29
           The ones I've talked to don't try to. They just acknowledge that it's a ...
Dec 01st 2017
30
                I mean don't act like guys don't do it to. We love ratchet
Dec 01st 2017
32
                     It's not a contradiction against most black men's professed
Dec 01st 2017
33
                     if murder, drug abuse, and sexual violence isnt against your beliefs...
Dec 09th 2017
73
                     yeah but theres no moral or ideological hypocrisy there for men.
Dec 01st 2017
34
                     "guys" doesn't describe supporters of any particular ideology
Dec 01st 2017
38
It was actually Step In The Name Of Love
Dec 01st 2017
26
NIGGAS DONT WANNA STEP IN THE NAME OF JUSTICE THO
Dec 01st 2017
40
      They ain't trying to see another Black male sacrificed to the PIC.
Dec 02nd 2017
52
Well, not since 2007.
Dec 02nd 2017
49
mostly black fan base and most if not all involved are black right?
Dec 01st 2017
35
Pretty much.
Dec 02nd 2017
47
It's simple people keep giving him money
Dec 01st 2017
36
Musically He is the Last Great R&B Artist
Dec 02nd 2017
43
Yeah. You'd let him
Dec 02nd 2017
50
the only correct answer is his victims are black girls
Dec 02nd 2017
45
Like Trump, he peed on the masses
Dec 02nd 2017
46
But unlike Trump, Kellz never needed White people for his success.
Dec 02nd 2017
53
      he is to Black listeners what Trump is to White voters
Dec 04th 2017
57
Because he's Black. His victims were Black. His audience
Dec 02nd 2017
48
^^^^^^
Dec 02nd 2017
51
True but Kellz is one the best selling male artist in American history
Dec 05th 2017
67
Because Black folks ESPECIALLY WOMEN
Dec 02nd 2017
54
Hasn't thrived for at least the last 5 years. He's toast now.
Dec 04th 2017
56
didn't he basically get off because the victims families declined to...
Dec 04th 2017
58
1st time I've heard about him paying people off not to testify.
Dec 04th 2017
59
long and short of it, that's exactly why
Dec 05th 2017
62
Pretty sure there wasn't a trial until the victim was legal age
Dec 05th 2017
63
yup. he's essentially settling out of court
Dec 11th 2017
74
Has anyone said because black youth are disposable yet?
Dec 05th 2017
64
Who's fault is that? A lot of black folks in Chicago still worship that ...
Dec 05th 2017
65
Kellz' career has declined b/c of nature not the allegations/charges
Dec 05th 2017
66
dope music...
Dec 08th 2017
70
Correct me if I'm wrong (I very well could be)
Dec 11th 2017
75

mistermaxxx08
Member since Dec 31st 2010
16076 posts
Fri Dec-01-17 03:32 AM

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1. "a few things and facts"
In response to Reply # 0


          

the Man is a musical Genius and he is a Black Man who wasn't painted to cross over.

R.kelly in the same boat as Marvin Gaye and seen as a Black Man Success story and yeah he has had big time cross over success, however still as a Black thing.

R.Kelly has had backlash and met with protests,etc,, however he hit with the right song and timing.

however he is "Whiteballed" from winning anymore awards. the Cat at this stage should be getting lifetime and legend awards and while he has been nominated at the grammys,American Music awards, etc.. he hardly gets anything.

so the backlash been real.
however his base ain't really waviered and he still keeps fans for his tours.

some artists can handle controversy and others it breaks them.

Kellz always does his best with pressure
and again he is seen as Mainly an R&B cat. nobody trips enough.

let this be John Legend and then the Lion King is outta work.

mistermaxxx R.Kelly, Michael Jackson,Stevie wonder,Rick James,Marvin Gaye,El Debarge, Barry WHite Lionel RIchie,Isleys EWF,Lady T.,Kid creole and coconuts,the crusaders,kc sunshine band,bee gees,jW,sd,NE,JB

Miami Heat, New York Yankees,buffalo bills

  

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Firecracker
Member since Feb 20th 2007
1892 posts
Fri Dec-01-17 04:12 AM

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4. "Actually a pretty sober & thorough reply from his GD mans"
In response to Reply # 1


  

          


*tips hat*

  

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BigReg
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Fri Dec-01-17 07:49 AM

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6. "He wasn’t completely: he had the song with Gaga & SNL"
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

and Trapped In The Closet was a huge cross over phenom.

I agree tho now he could drop crossover r&b/hip hop album of the year, get his due on black radio, but will be effectively ignored by mainstream America even tho thatnis basically pop music in 2017

  

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Anonymous
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Fri Dec-01-17 08:31 AM

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9. "I just don’t want to see you say shit about any of these other men"
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

So because he has what you deem “good music” and is what you deem a “Black success” you choose to turn a blind eye to his real issues?

That’s part of the fucking problem.

If Kells was pissing on your sister would you stil take the same stance?

  

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Chicane
Member since Feb 05th 2010
369 posts
Tue Dec-05-17 07:13 AM

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60. "Agreed "
In response to Reply # 9


  

          

n/m

__________________
Okayplaying since '00

  

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Garhart Poppwell
Member since Nov 28th 2008
18115 posts
Tue Dec-05-17 09:03 AM

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61. "there's a VERY good chance he would double down"
In response to Reply # 9


  

          

"yeah Kells fucked my sister when she was 14 but that was when he had the whole World in His Palm and had the Piped Piper thing Going, too many Money Cuts for jail to stop His Flow"

__________________________________________
CHOP-THESE-BITCHES!!!!
------------------------------------
Garhart Ivanhoe Poppwell
Un-OK'd moderator for The Lesson and Make The Music (yes, I do's work up in here, and in your asscrease if you run foul of this

  

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Pete Burns
Member since Oct 18th 2005
5446 posts
Wed Dec-06-17 07:04 AM

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68. "lmao"
In response to Reply # 61


          

  

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mistermaxxx08
Member since Dec 31st 2010
16076 posts
Thu Dec-07-17 01:34 AM

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69. "i don't condone his actions, I respect his Musical talent"
In response to Reply # 9


          

big difference and acting like other artists before him were't seperated from act and talent is in denial.

Hollywood has a seperate system of that.

My Sister wouldn't be star struck Turkey because if you have morals about yourself then you don't put yourself in that situation.

Champion an Artist and being in there scene is different lanes.

alot of People Pimp there very Own people off to the Delusion
and its better to respect the greatness from afar

mistermaxxx R.Kelly, Michael Jackson,Stevie wonder,Rick James,Marvin Gaye,El Debarge, Barry WHite Lionel RIchie,Isleys EWF,Lady T.,Kid creole and coconuts,the crusaders,kc sunshine band,bee gees,jW,sd,NE,JB

Miami Heat, New York Yankees,buffalo bills

  

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Mynoriti
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Fri Dec-01-17 02:36 PM

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41. "LOL first reply"
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
16347 posts
Fri Dec-01-17 03:45 AM

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2. "this dude has been tryna take down r kelly for 15 years."
In response to Reply # 0


          

  

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double 0
Member since Nov 17th 2004
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Fri Dec-01-17 04:03 AM

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3. "RE: this dude has been tryna take down r kelly for 15 years."
In response to Reply # 2


          

Someone got to

Double 0
DJ/Producer/Artist
Producer in Kidz In The Hall
-------------------------------------------
twitter: @godouble0
IG: @godouble0
www.thinklikearapper.com

  

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seasoned vet
Member since Jul 29th 2008
6029 posts
Fri Dec-01-17 06:30 AM

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5. "because black folks refuse to stop playing his music"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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BigReg
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Fri Dec-01-17 07:52 AM

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7. "imho, if white woman sexuality isn’t valued, yt tears and all"
In response to Reply # 0
Fri Dec-01-17 07:53 AM by BigReg

  

          

What’s the going rate on black female/black children? If it was a stock I wouldn’t buy shit in it

Its a penny stock

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79605 posts
Fri Dec-01-17 08:09 AM

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8. "Correct answer... and when that tape came out"
In response to Reply # 7


          

There were a lot of older Black women who refused to believe it was legit.

I just knew Kellz was going to jail and my boy laughed and said “that man makes too much money for the industry”

If he was a rapper or didn’t write hits he may have gone down but dude was rewriting hits for Celine Dion (sp)

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Anonymous
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Fri Dec-01-17 08:33 AM

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10. "It’s interesting right..."
In response to Reply # 8


  

          

Just like when black men kill other black men, these white folks don’t give a fuck.

If Kells was pissing on one of these white politicians daughters then he would’ve been locked up for life.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79605 posts
Fri Dec-01-17 08:57 AM

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13. "Zeke Elliott lost 6 NFL game checks over some college shit "
In response to Reply # 10


          

and they didn’t even press charges.

Had her text message saying “who will they believe? A white girl or a nigga?”

Only time white folks care about Black on Black crime is when they use it to downplay a cop killing a Black man.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Anonymous
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Fri Dec-01-17 09:31 AM

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17. "Some sad blatant shit...smh"
In response to Reply # 13


  

          

  

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BrooklynWHAT
Member since Jun 15th 2007
85075 posts
Fri Dec-01-17 09:32 AM

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19. "the nfl investigator even said dont suspend him lmao. that shit is brazy"
In response to Reply # 13


  

          

<--- Big Baller World Order

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Fri Dec-01-17 09:13 AM

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14. "See Also Chris Brown. Sadly because his victims are black wome"
In response to Reply # 7
Fri Dec-01-17 09:14 AM by Buddy_Gilapagos

  

          

n, and ironically because his fan base is black women.

As victims, black women get the least amount of empathy. As a fan base, the most forgiving.




**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79605 posts
Fri Dec-01-17 09:21 AM

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16. "Rihanna basically forgave him and co-signed his shit"
In response to Reply # 14


          

so that’s a little different.

I will say it’s similar to the Gabby situation. Plenty of women are on some “what did she do to provoke him?”

Fan is short for fanatic so it’s not too shocking to hear them make excuses for artist they love.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Fri Dec-01-17 10:00 AM

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21. "Rihanna is a black woman, so her forgiving him makes my point. "
In response to Reply # 16


  

          

Everyone we talking about has fans. We are talking about how certain fans are more forgiving.


>so that’s a little different.
>
>I will say it’s similar to the Gabby situation. Plenty of
>women are on some “what did she do to provoke him?”
>
>Fan is short for fanatic so it’s not too shocking to hear
>them make excuses for artist they love.
>
>


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79605 posts
Fri Dec-01-17 10:05 AM

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25. "gotcha"
In response to Reply # 21


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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MiracleRic
Member since Oct 21st 2002
45200 posts
Fri Dec-01-17 01:22 PM

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37. "he had a huge initial backlash"
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

and domestic violence treated somewhat different than rapey shit

Let me sport my Air Hyperbole 2010s in peace. (c) ansomble

Building repetoires (c) spm since 1983

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Fri Dec-01-17 08:40 AM

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11. "RE: Why has Kellz' career thrived despite of assault allegations? (swipe..."
In response to Reply # 0
Fri Dec-01-17 08:41 AM by murph71

          


Yeah....this a disturbing, informative piece...The issue I have with it is the thrust of it...

Kelly has NOT seen his career thrive since the onslaught of allegations.

Dude is playing to half packed performance halls. He is no longer commercially viable. He's been blacklisted from most R&B and Urban radio stations across the country. And he's basically become a punchline.

The right question to ask: Why hasn't Kellz faced real legal action?

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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kayru99
Member since Jan 26th 2004
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12. "^^^^^^^^"
In response to Reply # 11


          

and that's a LEGAL question, and not one of cultural/public morality

  

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soulpsychodelicyde
Member since Nov 18th 2003
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Fri Dec-01-17 09:16 AM

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15. "Ehh... "
In response to Reply # 11


          

>Kelly has NOT seen his career thrive since the onslaught of allegations. Dude is playing to half packed performance halls. He is no longer commercially viable. He's been blacklisted from most R&B and Urban radio stations across the country. And he's basically become a punchline.<

I think we want to be a bit careful about overstating this. While yes, his career has taken a hit in recent years, the bottom line is he still has one. He's still booking shows, performing and recording. As someone who's a serial rapist and sexual predator, this isn't a victory. Him being a punchline is offensively unacceptable as a punishment. We should not be satisfied or OK with that.

>The right question to ask: Why hasn't Kellz faced real legal action?<

Actually, I think the OP's question *is* the right question. He went to trial. So, at least on some level, the legal system did what it was supposed to do. Yes he got off b/c he can pay for lawyers, sure. But also because there is a large motherfuckin' population of black folks that still support him, and that support has directly resulted in his being able to reinvent himself and make money as a performer, and enabled him to move from child rape to a predator who preys on children who are just becoming adults.

  

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BigReg
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20. "Trapped in thr Closet was after the pee tape+trial"
In response to Reply # 15


  

          

Id argue his falling off has more to do with the shifting sound that for once he’s having an issue adapting to rather than people growing a concience

  

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makaveli
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22. "yep"
In response to Reply # 20


  

          

although very recent events might make things worse for him.

“So back we go to these questions — friendship, character… ethics.”

  

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BigReg
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27. "Agreed. Those Dailybeast articles were a mortal blow"
In response to Reply # 22
Fri Dec-01-17 10:12 AM by BigReg

  

          

but the reason he was walking wounded was that R&B is in a weird place that actively plays against his talents not because of the allegations.

I mean, remember the R.Kelly Ignition remix petition?

https://www.buzzfeed.com/ryanhatesthis/there-is-a-petition-to-make-r-kellys-ignition-remix-the-nati?utm_term=.kgZ31gWx8#.uvqjRNAO9

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/05/ignition-remix-white-house-petition_n_2813914.html

Huffpro/buzzfeed would have covered it MUCH MUCH MUCH differently if anyone cared about the rapes and molestations.

  

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soulpsychodelicyde
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Fri Dec-01-17 11:39 AM

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31. "Yep."
In response to Reply # 27


          


>Huffpro/buzzfeed would have covered it MUCH MUCH MUCH
>differently if anyone cared about the rapes and molestations.

And we're the ones telling them not to care.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Fri Dec-01-17 01:42 PM

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39. "RE: Trapped in thr Closet was after the pee tape+trial"
In response to Reply # 20
Fri Dec-01-17 01:42 PM by murph71

          

>Id argue his falling off has more to do with the shifting
>sound that for once he’s having an issue adapting to rather
>than people growing a concience


I'm talking over the last few years....Not a year after the trial he skated from.

Remember, since THAT trial more women have come out against Kellz....

In 2017 R. Kelly's career is a walking corpse....

Again...the issue is...Why hasn't he faced more serious legal ramifications....?

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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mistermaxxx08
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42. "Hating on an Artist with a almost 30 year career"
In response to Reply # 39


          

cat done worked with practically all of your favorite rappers and most R&B legends and Pop heavyweights and still tours and is making some coin.

not a bad walking corpse who still writes on Chris brown albums and makes coin off of that.

he still collects while you still hate.

mistermaxxx R.Kelly, Michael Jackson,Stevie wonder,Rick James,Marvin Gaye,El Debarge, Barry WHite Lionel RIchie,Isleys EWF,Lady T.,Kid creole and coconuts,the crusaders,kc sunshine band,bee gees,jW,sd,NE,JB

Miami Heat, New York Yankees,buffalo bills

  

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murph71
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44. "RE: Hating on an Artist with a almost 30 year career"
In response to Reply # 42


          


Dog...U r on the wrong side of history......Look around and see how women r speaking out. This Micky Mouse shit u r doing is played out....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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mistermaxxx08
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55. "RE: Hating on an Artist with a almost 30 year career"
In response to Reply # 44


          

i defend his musical genius and his impact as a artist.

mistermaxxx R.Kelly, Michael Jackson,Stevie wonder,Rick James,Marvin Gaye,El Debarge, Barry WHite Lionel RIchie,Isleys EWF,Lady T.,Kid creole and coconuts,the crusaders,kc sunshine band,bee gees,jW,sd,NE,JB

Miami Heat, New York Yankees,buffalo bills

  

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mellowboogie
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71. "Bullshit. You defend him, R Kelly, the person. Don't fuck around. "
In response to Reply # 55


  

          

'Music expresses that which cannot be said and on which it is impossible to be silent. ~Victor Hugo'

  

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mistermaxxx08
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72. "look turkey i don't know R.Kelly the person only the music"
In response to Reply # 71


          

just like Marvin Gaye and others.

mistermaxxx R.Kelly, Michael Jackson,Stevie wonder,Rick James,Marvin Gaye,El Debarge, Barry WHite Lionel RIchie,Isleys EWF,Lady T.,Kid creole and coconuts,the crusaders,kc sunshine band,bee gees,jW,sd,NE,JB

Miami Heat, New York Yankees,buffalo bills

  

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BrooklynWHAT
Member since Jun 15th 2007
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18. "cause Ignition remix is fire."
In response to Reply # 0
Fri Dec-01-17 09:31 AM by BrooklynWHAT

  

          

edit: also his career is absolutely not thriving.

<--- Big Baller World Order

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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23. "RE: cause Ignition remix is fire."
In response to Reply # 18


  

          

https://www.spin.com/2013/03/r-kelly-ignition-remix-national-anthem-petition/


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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24. "at the end of the day folks just want to dance and party"
In response to Reply # 18


          

not spend all evening debating why Kellz still has a career.

I bet you could have 12 feminist in a room shitting on Kellz and if you played a mix of his greatest hits 10 of them will be dancing, singing or tapping their toes.

music is a helleva drug

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Teknontheou
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28. "The brain/booty split is something alot of black feminists talk about."
In response to Reply # 24


  

          

The fact that they know alot of the music and pop culture violates feminist principles, but then when the music comes on, they can't hold back their enjoyment of it.

  

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BrooklynWHAT
Member since Jun 15th 2007
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29. "how do they rationalize it."
In response to Reply # 28


  

          

<--- Big Baller World Order

  

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Teknontheou
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30. "The ones I've talked to don't try to. They just acknowledge that it's a ..."
In response to Reply # 29


  

          

contradiction.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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32. "I mean don't act like guys don't do it to. We love ratchet "
In response to Reply # 30


  

          

nigga, nigga, nigga music too.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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Teknontheou
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33. "It's not a contradiction against most black men's professed"
In response to Reply # 32


  

          

beliefs, though.

However, I was actually thinking of mentioning black Christians alongside black feminists as struggling with this.

  

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Brotha Sun
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73. "if murder, drug abuse, and sexual violence isnt against your beliefs..."
In response to Reply # 33


          

theres a problem.

hopefully....HOPEFULLY black men feel conflicted listening to a song about killing niggas.

not men. niggas.

"They used to call me Baby Luke....but now? The whole damn 2 Liiiive Crew."

  

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BrooklynWHAT
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34. "yeah but theres no moral or ideological hypocrisy there for men."
In response to Reply # 32


  

          

<--- Big Baller World Order

  

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Boogie Stimuli
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38. ""guys" doesn't describe supporters of any particular ideology"
In response to Reply # 32


          

He didn't say women... he said feminists


~
~
~
~
~
Days like this I miss Sha Mecca

  

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Teknontheou
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26. "It was actually Step In The Name Of Love"
In response to Reply # 18


  

          

Alot of radio stations were adamant about banning him until Step In The Name Of Love came out. The song was too good for alot of people to deny enjoying and listening to, even though many, many people tried to.

  

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Madvillain 626
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40. "NIGGAS DONT WANNA STEP IN THE NAME OF JUSTICE THO"
In response to Reply # 26


  

          

-------------------------------
If life is stupendous one cannot also demand that it should be easy. - Robert Musil

  

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Shaun Tha Don
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52. "They ain't trying to see another Black male sacrificed to the PIC. "
In response to Reply # 40


          

Rest In Peace, Bad News Brown

  

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Shaun Tha Don
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49. "Well, not since 2007. "
In response to Reply # 18


          

>edit: also his career is absolutely not thriving.

Rest In Peace, Bad News Brown

  

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Atillah Moor
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35. "mostly black fan base and most if not all involved are black right? "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

the machine doesn't really go after that

  

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Shaun Tha Don
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47. "Pretty much. "
In response to Reply # 35


          

Rest In Peace, Bad News Brown

  

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Heinz
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36. "It's simple people keep giving him money "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I can listen to his music but I dont stream, go to his concerts none of that. Yes he's a musical genius. Learn to like the artist and not support the man.
----------

IG @h_n_z

  

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mistermaxxx08
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43. "Musically He is the Last Great R&B Artist"
In response to Reply # 0


          

and if you are going by catelog, longevity, musical impact
and inportance R.Kelly can go toe to toe with any of the all time greats. musically he is just that important.

i learned long ago to seperate the stage
and the person they aren't the same.

mistermaxxx R.Kelly, Michael Jackson,Stevie wonder,Rick James,Marvin Gaye,El Debarge, Barry WHite Lionel RIchie,Isleys EWF,Lady T.,Kid creole and coconuts,the crusaders,kc sunshine band,bee gees,jW,sd,NE,JB

Miami Heat, New York Yankees,buffalo bills

  

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Mynoriti
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50. "Yeah. You'd let him"
In response to Reply # 43


  

          

  

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atruhead
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45. "the only correct answer is his victims are black girls"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

let him urinate on/kidnap/do anything with an underage white girl, authorities are knocking down his door and publicly lynching him like it's the 1920s

  

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Dr Claw
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46. "Like Trump, he peed on the masses"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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Shaun Tha Don
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53. "But unlike Trump, Kellz never needed White people for his success."
In response to Reply # 46


          

Rest In Peace, Bad News Brown

  

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Dr Claw
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57. "he is to Black listeners what Trump is to White voters"
In response to Reply # 53


  

          

Trickle-down entertainment

  

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Shaun Tha Don
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48. "Because he's Black. His victims were Black. His audience"
In response to Reply # 0


          

and the people seemingly willing to sweep it under the rug due to their dependence on him for their livelihoods are Black. Aside from that brief moment under the sun in the late 1990's, White people never really checked for him like that to turn on him the way they're turning on the White men mentioned in the article.

Rest In Peace, Bad News Brown

  

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Sofian_Hadi
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51. "^^^^^^"
In response to Reply # 48


          

Yup

---------------------------------------

"The world is before you and you need not take it or leave it as it was when you came in." - James Baldwin

  

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ramaj1
Member since May 20th 2008
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67. "True but Kellz is one the best selling male artist in American history"
In response to Reply # 48


  

          

You surely don't sell millions upon millions with ONLY black folks. The majority of his fans seem black but trust, the others have always fucked with him hard. FWIW, he has a strong Mexican fanbase in the Southwest.

  

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Musa
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54. "Because Black folks ESPECIALLY WOMEN"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

buy his albums and go to his shows.

<----

Soundcloud.com/aquil84

(HIP HOP)
http://aquil.bandcamp.com

  

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rdhull
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56. "Hasn't thrived for at least the last 5 years. He's toast now."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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ThaTruth
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58. "didn't he basically get off because the victims families declined to..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

press charges and refused to cooperate with the authorities after he paid them off?

________________________________________
"Take the surprise out your voice Shaq."-The REAL CP3
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2H5K-BUMS0

  

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Shaun Tha Don
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59. "1st time I've heard about him paying people off not to testify."
In response to Reply # 58


          

Rest In Peace, Bad News Brown

  

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Garhart Poppwell
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62. "long and short of it, that's exactly why"
In response to Reply # 58


  

          

__________________________________________
CHOP-THESE-BITCHES!!!!
------------------------------------
Garhart Ivanhoe Poppwell
Un-OK'd moderator for The Lesson and Make The Music (yes, I do's work up in here, and in your asscrease if you run foul of this

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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63. "Pretty sure there wasn't a trial until the victim was legal age"
In response to Reply # 58


          

and then they refused to cooperate.

He paid and played them well.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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kayru99
Member since Jan 26th 2004
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74. "yup. he's essentially settling out of court"
In response to Reply # 58


          

just not "officially"

  

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DVS
Member since Sep 13th 2002
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Tue Dec-05-17 10:33 AM

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64. "Has anyone said because black youth are disposable yet?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Has it been mentioned that he knows exactly who to prey upon so that he would never REALLY be held accountable?

Anyone said that no matter how many teenagers he peed on, all he had to do was make a steppers cut and he was guaranteed prime time spins in his city?

I mean....someone had to mention it.

vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv

Waldorf and Statler Vol 4:CONAN IS OUT NOW!!!: http://waldorfandstatler.bandcamp.com

and don't forget to check "DVS 4 ALDERMAN"

http://windimoto.bandcamp.com/album/dvs-4-alderman-bandcamp-exclusive-expanded-editio

  

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ThaTruth
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65. "Who's fault is that? A lot of black folks in Chicago still worship that ..."
In response to Reply # 64


          

including people that are related to some of the girls he pissed on.

________________________________________
"Take the surprise out your voice Shaq."-The REAL CP3
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2H5K-BUMS0

  

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ramaj1
Member since May 20th 2008
1393 posts
Tue Dec-05-17 08:56 PM

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66. "Kellz' career has declined b/c of nature not the allegations/charges"
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Kellz is 50 years old, y'all. Of course, he won't be as omnipresent on the pop charts and on the radio as he was when he was younger. He's simply aged out of the youth demo ...and he's been around since the early '90s. Of course, he'd have a commercial decline. It's simply nature. The charges and allegations against him NEVER hurt his career, for better or worse.

  

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gumz
Member since Jan 09th 2005
20118 posts
Fri Dec-08-17 10:25 AM

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70. "dope music..."
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people tend to forget if you give them great content or performances...just like great athletes make people forget the scandal when they dominate on the field/court, he dropped a ton of dope tracks and people chose to forget

http://www.youtube.com/user/gumzization
twitter: @BrosefMalone

  

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Tw3nty
Member since Jan 02nd 2007
8466 posts
Mon Dec-11-17 11:47 AM

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75. "Correct me if I'm wrong (I very well could be)"
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But did any women come forward and claim unwanted sexual contact?
It seems like we should be talking about underage relations vs sexual assualt :ie congressional style.

Also the black community at least from my perspective (DMV) doesn't really come down hard on that kind of behavior.

It seems like all of the R. Kelly cases involve some parent essentially signing over a young girl to R. Kelly.

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