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Subject: "Wikileaks reveals 20,000 DNC emails that "marginalize Sanders"" Previous topic | Next topic
Vex_id
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65616 posts
Sat Jul-23-16 02:24 PM

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"Wikileaks reveals 20,000 DNC emails that "marginalize Sanders""


          

http://www.salon.com/2016/07/22/leaked_dnc_email_sanders_attempt_to_moderate_israel_stance_disturbing_clinton_campaign_used_it_to_marginalize_bernie/

Is this the DNC's strategy to unifying the party come November?

Yikes. Schultz has been horrible for the party.

From Robert Reich:

"Hillary should fire Debbie Wasserman Schultz. Now. Don’t wait until next week to replace her. Yesterday WikiLeaks published roughly 20,000 leaked emails from the Democratic National Committee that confirm what most of us already knew: Wasserman Schultz and other top officials of the DNC tried to sandbag Bernie’s campaign.

When the director of communications wanted to complain to CNN about a segment the network aired in which Bernie said he would oust the chairwoman if he were elected, Wasserman Schultz emails back, “he isn’t going to be president.” In reference to a Washington Post piece that said Bernie was seeking a more balanced approach to Israel and Palestine, she emails “the Israel stuff is disturbing,” prompting another official to email back that Hillary’s campaign had pushed the story. In other emails Wasserman Schultz refers to Bernie’s campaign manager as a "damn liar," and "an ASS."

Another email shows one DNC official trying to get reporters to write that Bernie’s campaign is “a mess.” In another, the DNC's chief financial officer seeks ways to bring attention to Bernie’s religious beliefs, “for KY and WVA can we get someone to ask his belief. Does he believe in a God. He had skated on saying he has a Jewish heritage. I think I read he is an atheist. This could make several points difference with my peeps.” Other emails show officials of the DNC using “us” language when referring to Hillary supporters and “them” language in reference to Bernie’s.

Fire her now."
-->

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
*crumples up tinfoil hat*
Jul 23rd 2016
1
DNC's contempt for Bernie was about as open a secret as Obama supporting...
Jul 23rd 2016
2
Democrats didn't like someone whose been a part time democrat
Jul 23rd 2016
3
DNC was supposed to be unbiased to their candidates.
Jul 24th 2016
19
      lol u still don't know how this works
Jul 25th 2016
58
      RNC wasn't unbiased to Trump, but he still won
Jul 25th 2016
147
Water is wet. Nonissue
Jul 23rd 2016
if by nonissue you mean that the DNC
Jul 24th 2016
20
      What did they actually DO "to the detriment" of Sanders?
Jul 24th 2016
29
           reply 27.
Jul 24th 2016
35
Water is wet. Nonissue
Jul 23rd 2016
4
This would be newsworthy if there is evidence that there was a
Jul 23rd 2016
5
Apologize to Bernie Sanders and his supporters here
Jul 23rd 2016
6
+100 replies, not 1 apology = noted
Jul 25th 2016
110
maybe be in another link.. this article doesnt show that
Jul 23rd 2016
7
The Reich quote was directly from his Facebook page
Jul 23rd 2016
10
and that's fine
Jul 23rd 2016
13
      RE: and that's fine
Jul 24th 2016
18
           RE: and that's fine
Jul 24th 2016
30
                alike most Clinton supporters - you need to brush up on Foreign Policy
Jul 24th 2016
39
i know you're not saying someone's op-ed piece...
Jul 23rd 2016
11
      i do?
Jul 23rd 2016
12
Shaun King is demanding a DNC apology within 48 hours (on FB)
Jul 23rd 2016
8
That class action "fraud" lawsuit just got a *little* bit more interesti...
Jul 23rd 2016
9
yup, was just talking about this.
Jul 23rd 2016
15
      This:
Jul 24th 2016
16
           ^^^^^
Jul 24th 2016
17
#BernieMustDisavow
Jul 23rd 2016
14
What's the difference between Repubs not fucking with Trump?
Jul 24th 2016
21
Repubs had 20 candidates butting heads. DNC had their favorite.
Jul 24th 2016
22
the difference is that the DNC wrote e-mails and conspired
Jul 24th 2016
27
Ding dong, the witc.... So, yeah, she's resigning
Jul 24th 2016
23
RE: Ding dong, the witc.... So, yeah, she's resigning
Jul 24th 2016
26
predictable. in effect - DWS didn't lose her job.
Jul 24th 2016
31
Please be less gullible.
Jul 25th 2016
142
doesn't matter anymore - she needed to resign months ago.
Jul 24th 2016
32
She completed her mission for HRC. This is useless.
Jul 24th 2016
42
Debbie Wasserman Schultz steps down....
Jul 24th 2016
24
....and right into Hillary's campaign as an honorary chair.
Jul 24th 2016
25
      Russians. I should've known. Anti-Semite, slippery Cossack sluts.
Jul 25th 2016
51
      RE: ....and right into Hillary's campaign as an honorary chair.
Jul 25th 2016
53
This is such a fucking travesty.
Jul 24th 2016
28
lol'z. You would defend DWS and the DNC on this.
Jul 24th 2016
33
Yes I would. She did nothing wrong.
Jul 24th 2016
34
lol this shit is comedy. I'm done with these people.
Jul 24th 2016
36
      Why fight for this party? Because it's the good one.
Jul 24th 2016
38
           RE: Why fight for this party? Because it's the good one.
Jul 24th 2016
43
                oh ya. this is what all this is about
Jul 25th 2016
138
Always a good look to Cuban B anti-Semitism
Jul 24th 2016
37
Come the fuck on about what?
Jul 24th 2016
40
Speaking of that, when Obama was thinking on replacing her a few years b...
Jul 24th 2016
41
      Yes - Obama wanted her ousted in 2012.
Jul 24th 2016
45
      I don't need to "affix Clinton to Obama's exceptional legacy."
Jul 25th 2016
131
      I'm having trouble finding an article that even implies this.
Jul 25th 2016
129
           it's mentioned on her wiki page. also mentioned in this Politico piece
Jul 25th 2016
141
Members of the DNC were instructing MSNBC how to frame coverage
Jul 24th 2016
44
Can you give an example of "instructing MSNBC how to frame coverage...
Jul 25th 2016
70
      Lookong for msnbc stuff now. I should have said campaign not charity.
Jul 25th 2016
92
      You know these board appointments are normally unpaid, right?
Jul 25th 2016
97
           Quid pro quo revealed. No biggie to you.
Jul 25th 2016
137
                A ceremonial unpaid position is not a quid pro quo!
Jul 25th 2016
139
      MSNBC coverage instruction and bonuses:
Jul 25th 2016
96
           You're not very good at this business of digging dirt.
Jul 25th 2016
120
                Yeah campaigns do. Funny you see the DNC as an extionsion of HRC camp
Jul 25th 2016
135
Oh! And how about INFILTRATING THE SANDERS CAMPAIGN
Jul 24th 2016
46
"Infiltrating the Sanders campaign"? You have to be fucking kidding me.
Jul 25th 2016
77
      They are supposed to be neutral but the game was rigged.
Jul 25th 2016
86
           The game was never rigged!
Jul 25th 2016
88
                1. Leaking info for Bernie hit pieces
Jul 25th 2016
100
                     Again, I have no idea what you even think you've found there.
Jul 25th 2016
122
                          RE: Again, I have no idea what you even think you've found there.
Jul 25th 2016
136
the travesty is that the dnc held on to a bad chairperson for so long
Jul 24th 2016
47
bruh, cmon...
Jul 25th 2016
55
      I'd happily say it if they'd actually fucked up.
Jul 25th 2016
81
I don't care if Schultz came to my front door and kicked me in the balls...
Jul 24th 2016
48
i mean, yeah, but you know the right is saying the same thing
Jul 24th 2016
49
It's fucking 1984.
Jul 25th 2016
50
I don't like that argument either,
Jul 25th 2016
87
      They are equal. I don't have any reason to believe anything either1 says
Jul 25th 2016
103
           She believes in the facts on those issues.
Jul 25th 2016
116
           And besides, have you even considered how much those "issues" matter?
Jul 25th 2016
123
                That kind of brand loyalty over "bigger issues" was the proble...
Jul 25th 2016
140
you may be content with that low bar - but many aren't.
Jul 25th 2016
60
Nothing will change if people don't go against the system
Jul 27th 2016
173
so which corrupt politician will be replacing the corrupt politician?
Jul 25th 2016
52
Here's a great defense of Hillary, btw.
Jul 25th 2016
54
Wow thanks for posting. Very interesting.
Jul 27th 2016
176
Sanders is not a Democrat and spoke of a revolution to upend
Jul 25th 2016
56
RE: Sanders is not a Democrat and spoke of a revolution to upend
Jul 25th 2016
57
Sanders could have been Hillary light and he woulda stil faced oppositio...
Jul 25th 2016
59
He isn't Hilary-lite and isn't a Democrat. He knew that the party
Jul 25th 2016
61
i know what bernie is...
Jul 25th 2016
62
Sanders has always caucused with Democrats.
Jul 25th 2016
63
RE: Sanders has always caucused with Democrats.
Jul 25th 2016
66
RE: Sanders has always caucused with Democrats.
Jul 25th 2016
67
      RE: Sanders has always caucused with Democrats.
Jul 25th 2016
68
           I don't know how much his Obama criticism hurt him but I think
Jul 25th 2016
85
                RE: I don't know how much his Obama criticism hurt him but I think
Jul 25th 2016
102
                     This is true.
Jul 25th 2016
133
                     It was opportunism by the Clinton campaign.
Jul 26th 2016
164
He caucased but ran as Independent most of his career
Jul 25th 2016
82
its not about "handing keys", its about a Democratic process.
Jul 25th 2016
91
      I'm not arguing in support of the DNC. I understand their motivations
Jul 25th 2016
94
           RE: I'm not arguing in support of the DNC. I understand their motivation...
Jul 25th 2016
99
           Cool, make that decision.
Jul 25th 2016
104
RE: Sanders could have been Hillary light and he woulda stil faced oppos...
Jul 25th 2016
65
      and now an outsider is running for the Repugs
Jul 25th 2016
69
      RE: and now an outsider is running for the Repugs
Jul 25th 2016
72
           yall kill me with that platform shit
Jul 25th 2016
78
                RE: yall kill me with that platform shit
Jul 25th 2016
80
      RE: Sanders could have been Hillary light and he woulda stil faced oppos...
Jul 25th 2016
74
           RE: Sanders could have been Hillary light and he woulda stil faced oppos...
Jul 25th 2016
76
                nah, having emails that expose this shit is a problem
Jul 25th 2016
83
                     RE: nah, having emails that expose this shit is a problem
Jul 25th 2016
95
                          so you admit there is a problem...
Jul 25th 2016
106
                               RE: so you admit there is a problem...
Jul 25th 2016
128
how many people has Hillary asked to run for office?
Jul 25th 2016
64
i don't see it as cheating and i was a bernie supporter
Jul 25th 2016
71
reply 27
Jul 25th 2016
93
I am not defending her or the party neither is she my candidate
Jul 25th 2016
75
      same boat... but now we have a DNC where Debbie and Russia are front
Jul 25th 2016
79
      It wasn't even necessary. She was probably going to win
Jul 25th 2016
84
           yup, but just in case they made sure of it...lol
Jul 25th 2016
111
      then why even have Democracy? Why even have the debate?
Jul 25th 2016
89
           All good questions, and speaking for myself, I make voting decisions
Jul 25th 2016
101
                RE: All good questions, and speaking for myself, I make voting decisions
Jul 25th 2016
109
                     meh, he's been able to do that for reasons that have little to do with h...
Jul 25th 2016
117
Game, Set, Match!
Jul 25th 2016
73
how many congressional seats/state offices have they lost under dws/kain...
Jul 25th 2016
119
Ramen Hair Debbie Dolezal needs to get the full Rev. Wright treatment
Jul 25th 2016
90
The only thing....
Jul 25th 2016
98
RE: The only thing....
Jul 25th 2016
105
RE: The only thing....
Jul 25th 2016
107
obviously they DO care about it. She needs to stfu
Jul 25th 2016
115
She brought up the teenage shooting victims and that she had cancer.
Jul 25th 2016
108
WTF????
Jul 25th 2016
114
dawg, she shouldn't be anywhere near Philly
Jul 25th 2016
112
Nevermind stacking the deck..were crimes committed?
Jul 25th 2016
113
Putin being behind the hack fucks up erything (link)
Jul 25th 2016
118
bruh, blaming russia sounds like a great way to lose
Jul 25th 2016
121
That's exactly what they said about "climategate."
Jul 25th 2016
124
a foreign govt. tinkering with our elections ain't a problem?
Jul 25th 2016
125
RE: a foreign govt. tinkering with our elections ain't a problem?
Jul 25th 2016
127
Exactly. Reince is on message today,
Jul 25th 2016
132
the DNC was warned a year ago about hackers
Jul 25th 2016
145
RE: bruh, blaming russia sounds like a great way to lose
Jul 25th 2016
126
you are completely missing the point
Jul 25th 2016
144
      nah, the shit sounds like a bad excuse...
Jul 26th 2016
150
Repug base has shifted to admiring Putin
Jul 25th 2016
130
      RE: Repug base has shifted to admiring Putin
Jul 25th 2016
134
      because, at the end of the day... WHITE. after years of red baiting and
Jul 25th 2016
143
sometimes, you have to win 5 vs 8
Jul 25th 2016
146
Assange shuttin down Russia connection, says its bs (swipe)
Jul 26th 2016
148
Well there's a guy with every reason to be honest and upfront
Jul 26th 2016
149
the content is the story
Jul 26th 2016
152
      There can be multiple stories.
Jul 26th 2016
154
           DWS was fired due to the content
Jul 26th 2016
155
           She was fired because it was the morning of the convention
Jul 26th 2016
156
           LOL, now George Will is out there saying
Jul 26th 2016
158
           it is rich aeeing Clinton supporters so up
Jul 27th 2016
166
                down playing how is stupider
Jul 27th 2016
168
Clinton will escalate conflict w/ Russia.
Jul 26th 2016
151
another story about some gotdamn emails..
Jul 26th 2016
153
He also blamed the jews.
Jul 26th 2016
157
RE: Assange shuttin down Russia connection, says its bs (swipe)
Jul 26th 2016
159
He may not have known, and lacks counter evidence... peep
Jul 26th 2016
161
Toobin: No scandal in the DNC emails.
Jul 26th 2016
160
telling that there's a paragraph downplaying the racism in the sony emai...
Jul 26th 2016
162
      exactly
Jul 27th 2016
175
Spy Agency Consensus Grows That Russia Hacked D.N.C. (NYT)
Jul 26th 2016
163
Assange has more emails coming... lol
Jul 27th 2016
165
can't wait. and no one has explained how
Jul 27th 2016
167
      Uhh, who ever said she is?
Jul 27th 2016
174
Seth with the reality check on....
Jul 27th 2016
169
more people out there wasting energy on Bernie or Bust
Jul 27th 2016
170
RE: more people out there wasting energy on Bernie or Bust
Jul 27th 2016
171
The reaction by Bernie diehards has only helped her case w/ voters
Jul 27th 2016
172

Mr. ManC
Member since Jan 26th 2009
11819 posts
Sat Jul-23-16 02:41 PM

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1. "*crumples up tinfoil hat*"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

that is all this proves.

most of us already knew this.

Hillary supporters won't care.

but at least we are vindicated.

Looking forward to the next batches. Hope something happens before the DNC but *wishful thinking*

________________________________________________
R.I.P. Soulgyal <3
SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

  

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Mynoriti
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38818 posts
Sat Jul-23-16 03:17 PM

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2. "DNC's contempt for Bernie was about as open a secret as Obama supporting..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Hillary.

But yeah, Schultz is the fucking worst. Watching her in interviews on some "Oh Bernie and his supporters are great!"/"Wether that nominee is Hillary or Bernie" lol shut up, lady.

I wish part of Bern's negotiations to endorse included having her replaced. Though, I say that knowing nothing about the process for choosing DNC chair.

  

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SeV
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50209 posts
Sat Jul-23-16 03:43 PM

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3. "Democrats didn't like someone whose been a part time democrat "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

His whole career

Where is the conspiracy?

____________

Dallas Cavericks LETS GO!!

  

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Mr. ManC
Member since Jan 26th 2009
11819 posts
Sun Jul-24-16 12:19 PM

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19. "DNC was supposed to be unbiased to their candidates."
In response to Reply # 3
Sun Jul-24-16 12:19 PM by Mr. ManC

  

          

Simple and plain.

The conspiracy is them conspiring to sandbag and deligitimize his campaign. Fine for Hillary to do that, but not the DNC. The fact that you see the DNC and Hillary as the same is basically the problem im an electiom which was supposed to be decided by the people.

On the contrary, Trump has been a Democrat and contributor to Hillary and the DNC for some time. Though he is "not a true Republican" the RNC didn't cut him off at the knees. They actually gave him more and more attention.

On top of this add the ballot switching, closed polling places, purged lists, etc, all of which are under the DNC's control, and tell me that everything was above board for this election.

________________________________________________
R.I.P. Soulgyal <3
SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

  

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SeV
Charter member
50209 posts
Mon Jul-25-16 08:05 AM

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58. "lol u still don't know how this works"
In response to Reply # 19


  

          

The DNC is made up of superdelegates whose role is to be basically be biased

They choose a candidate that they think is best representative of the party and likely to win in the General

So yes, they got Bias dawg

PLAIN AND SIMPLE

It's their job to be

It's to prevent the Platform from getting Trump'd





>The fact that you see the DNC and Hillary as the same is
>basically the problem im an electiom which was supposed to be
>decided by the people.

The fact u still have no clue on the election process is the problem



Hillary won the popular vote by 3.5 million

There wasn't no voter suppression

Bernie couldn't reach the Black & Latino vote

His supporters r majority white privileged millenials which is why Bernie bros don't mind Trump winning because they going to be good regardless. Im just confused by nyggas like u who stilk have no clue what is at stake this election cycle.




>
>On the contrary, Trump has been a Democrat and contributor to
>Hillary and the DNC for some time. Though he is "not a true
>Republican" the RNC didn't cut him off at the knees. They
>actually gave him more and more attention.
>
>On top of this add the ballot switching, closed polling
>places, purged lists, etc, all of which are under the DNC's
>control, and tell me that everything was above board for this
>election.

Lol 3.5 million votes dawg

Ur dumber than i think if u think the DNC managed to make Bernie lose by 3.5 million votes






____________

Dallas Cavericks LETS GO!!

  

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juce72
Member since Oct 20th 2011
56 posts
Mon Jul-25-16 08:43 PM

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147. "RNC wasn't unbiased to Trump, but he still won"
In response to Reply # 19


          

  

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BrooklynWHAT
Member since Jun 15th 2007
85073 posts
Sat Jul-23-16 03:55 PM

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"Water is wet. Nonissue "


  

          

<--- Big Baller World Order

  

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Mr. ManC
Member since Jan 26th 2009
11819 posts
Sun Jul-24-16 12:23 PM

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20. "if by nonissue you mean that the DNC"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

has been corrupt and unethical and conspired against one of their top candidates to his detriment for their benefit and their favorited candidate, then yeah.....politics as usual.

As long as folls recognize the impasses put in place for him not to succeed, then cool. But they cheated Hillary into her nomination. As long as you cool with that then yeah, water is wet.

Watch out in NC too. I'm already hearing reports of closed polling stations, restricted early voting, etc down their since the powers that be down there are Republicans. If you see that suppression creep up to keep Black people from voting (since Trump isn't exactly doing well with them) don't cry foul if some bullshiy goes down. That water is wet too.

________________________________________________
R.I.P. Soulgyal <3
SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
12698 posts
Sun Jul-24-16 04:30 PM

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29. "What did they actually DO "to the detriment" of Sanders?"
In response to Reply # 20
Sun Jul-24-16 04:30 PM by stravinskian

          

The party does not have to personally respect every candidate, especially if he doesn't respect them back.

  

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Mr. ManC
Member since Jan 26th 2009
11819 posts
Sun Jul-24-16 06:14 PM

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35. "reply 27."
In response to Reply # 29


  

          

and I'm pretty sure he stopped respecting them when they counted the super delegates from the beginning. It was a completely false narrative. They systematically made sure that he would be disadvantaged from a optics, political, and participation standpoint. They put the debates in odd times, ran negative press against him, closed polling places, restricted participation, and did everything they could to get a 200 delegate/3 million vote lead.

I'm sure you will find a way to dismiss it, but the ship has sailed. If DWS had stepped done it would have been a nice gesture. To then be added to the Clinton campaign 10 mins later? Fuck these mofos man.

Good luck against Trump.

________________________________________________
R.I.P. Soulgyal <3
SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

  

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BrooklynWHAT
Member since Jun 15th 2007
85073 posts
Sat Jul-23-16 03:55 PM

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4. "Water is wet. Nonissue "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

<--- Big Baller World Order

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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49415 posts
Sat Jul-23-16 04:15 PM

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5. "This would be newsworthy if there is evidence that there was a "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

violation of rules that materially affected the outcome. That the Party Establishment favored the front runner I think isn't that revealing.

The DNC establishment wanted Clinton to win in 2008, but the superior candidate won.




>http://www.salon.com/2016/07/22/leaked_dnc_email_sanders_attempt_to_moderate_israel_stance_disturbing_clinton_campaign_used_it_to_marginalize_bernie/
>
>Is this the DNC's strategy to unifying the party come
>November?
>
>Yikes. Schultz has been horrible for the party.
>
>From Robert Reich:
>
>"Hillary should fire Debbie Wasserman Schultz. Now. Don’t
>wait until next week to replace her. Yesterday WikiLeaks
>published roughly 20,000 leaked emails from the Democratic
>National Committee that confirm what most of us already knew:
>Wasserman Schultz and other top officials of the DNC tried to
>sandbag Bernie’s campaign.
>
>When the director of communications wanted to complain to CNN
>about a segment the network aired in which Bernie said he
>would oust the chairwoman if he were elected, Wasserman
>Schultz emails back, “he isn’t going to be president.”
>In reference to a Washington Post piece that said Bernie was
>seeking a more balanced approach to Israel and Palestine, she
>emails “the Israel stuff is disturbing,” prompting another
>official to email back that Hillary’s campaign had pushed
>the story. In other emails Wasserman Schultz refers to
>Bernie’s campaign manager as a "damn liar," and "an ASS."
>
>Another email shows one DNC official trying to get reporters
>to write that Bernie’s campaign is “a mess.” In another,
>the DNC's chief financial officer seeks ways to bring
>attention to Bernie’s religious beliefs, “for KY and WVA
>can we get someone to ask his belief. Does he believe in a
>God. He had skated on saying he has a Jewish heritage. I think
>I read he is an atheist. This could make several points
>difference with my peeps.” Other emails show officials of
>the DNC using “us” language when referring to Hillary
>supporters and “them” language in reference to
>Bernie’s.
>
>Fire her now."
>-->


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
16595 posts
Sat Jul-23-16 04:50 PM

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6. "Apologize to Bernie Sanders and his supporters here "
In response to Reply # 0
Sat Jul-23-16 04:51 PM by bentagain

  

          

I remember very specific examples we called out in real time

That were replied to with tin foil hats by the HRC contingency

Apologize.

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
16595 posts
Mon Jul-25-16 10:43 AM

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110. "+100 replies, not 1 apology = noted"
In response to Reply # 6
Mon Jul-25-16 10:44 AM by bentagain

  

          

LOL@the HRC fan boys defending any and all BS at any costs

you had a choice

now you're stuck with this shit show that alot of us feared

your girl can't get out of her own way

squeaked out a presumptive nominee W to this point

vs a socialist part-time democrat outsider relative unknown, etc...

with the party stacking cards against him

to date, the best platform her campaign can come up with is she's not Trump

LOL and SMH at the same damn time

ya'll missed the point long ago

you actually had a choice

this is what you wanted

Apologize.

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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akon
Charter member
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Sat Jul-23-16 04:59 PM

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7. "maybe be in another link.. this article doesnt show that"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

and i cant see the robert reich link.

however... this may be true,

"In a follow-up message, the DNC chair also linked to an op-ed in the Post titled “Sanders’s scorched-earth campaign is a gift to Trump.” This piece accuses Sanders of carrying out “scorched-earth attacks against the Democratic Party,” which “will succeed in only one thing: electing Donald Trump as president.” Wasserman Schultz did not comment on the article; she simply sent the link to Miranda."

there's a reason trump name-calls bernie whenever he can

.
http://perspectivesudans.blogspot.com/
i myself would never want to be god,or even like god.Because god got all these human beings on this planet and i most certainly would not want to be responsible for them, or even have the disgrace that i made them.

  

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Vex_id
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Sat Jul-23-16 05:26 PM

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10. "The Reich quote was directly from his Facebook page"
In response to Reply # 7


          

I thought it would be helpful to refer to his succinct account of the 20,000 emails rather than just dump hundreds of pages in a link w/ no context as to the offensive content within the leaked emails.

>"In a follow-up message, the DNC chair also linked to an op-ed
>in the Post titled “Sanders’s scorched-earth campaign is a
>gift to Trump.” This piece accuses Sanders of carrying out
>“scorched-earth attacks against the Democratic Party,”
>which “will succeed in only one thing: electing Donald Trump
>as president.” Wasserman Schultz did not comment on the
>article; she simply sent the link to Miranda."
>
>there's a reason trump name-calls bernie whenever he can

If anyone was carrying out "scorched-earth attacks" on the party - it was Schultz - who has done more to divide the party than any other ranking Democrat.

If we remember - it was Sanders supporters who first started protesting at Trump rallies. The notion that the Progressive/Sanders base is going to jump to support Trump is non-sense. However - they might jump to Stein or simply stay home - which is a serious danger.

But let me ask you this: What has the party done to harness the Sander energy and new-voters within the Left-Wing of the Democratic party?

As of now - there's been nothing but flat-out dismissal of that base - a base that came out and rendered Sanders the winner in 22 states in this primary.

Clinton is so intent on courting the Center-Right that she is taking the Progressive-Left for granted. Dangerous tactic.


-->

  

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akon
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Sat Jul-23-16 07:01 PM

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13. "and that's fine"
In response to Reply # 10


  

          

>I thought it would be helpful to refer to his succinct
>account of the 20,000 emails rather than just dump hundreds of
>pages in a link w/ no context as to the offensive content
>within the leaked emails.

but i would like some reference to the claims made
an op-ed piece is an opinion
i'd also like to form an opinion. lets see some of these offensive emails

>>"In a follow-up message, the DNC chair also linked to an
>op-ed
>>in the Post titled “Sanders’s scorched-earth campaign is
>a
>>gift to Trump.” This piece accuses Sanders of carrying out
>>“scorched-earth attacks against the Democratic Party,”
>>which “will succeed in only one thing: electing Donald
>Trump

i actually read that part of the email. and no the complaint was in his criticism of the democratic party
we already see trump using it in his campaign
so in that, the washpo (i believe it was) article was accurate in its assessment

>If anyone was carrying out "scorched-earth attacks" on the
>party - it was Schultz - who has done more to divide the party
>than any other ranking Democrat.

how did she attack the democratic party?

>If we remember - it was Sanders supporters who first started
>protesting at Trump rallies. The notion that the
>Progressive/Sanders base is going to jump to support Trump is
>non-sense. However - they might jump to Stein or simply stay
>home - which is a serious danger.

there are some progressives who will jump to stein
some might even jump to johnson. i think this is a given
there are also those who will abstain
the democratic party can only bend so far over backward to accomodate everyone
no one is going to be 100% satisfied with the platform
this process is about selecting which party you feel bests represents your views.


>But let me ask you this: What has the party done to harness
>the Sander energy and new-voters within the Left-Wing of the
>Democratic party?

you dont think the democratic party has adapted some of sanders campaign platforms?
it sounds like the issue here is that because the DP hasn't adopted all of it then thats a problem
but why should they? there are many different types of democrats. you are not going to please everyone
bernie's policy advisor said 80% of what they requested was included

>As of now - there's been nothing but flat-out dismissal of
>that base - a base that came out and rendered Sanders the
>winner in 22 states in this primary.

where is the evidence of that?

>Clinton is so intent on courting the Center-Right that she is
>taking the Progressive-Left for granted. Dangerous tactic.

give me an example of these progressive left issues that are being taken for granted.
i think of myself as a progressive.
there are certain things i'd like to see on the democratic platform that are not there
but i wasn't expecting it to agree with my views 95%
i'm happy with what i have read so far.
i read stein's platform- sounds great, but i also have concerns with the views on science, holistic medicine and vaccine policy
these are big enough issues for me to not be on board.

.
http://perspectivesudans.blogspot.com/
i myself would never want to be god,or even like god.Because god got all these human beings on this planet and i most certainly would not want to be responsible for them, or even have the disgrace that i made them.

  

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Vex_id
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Sun Jul-24-16 11:38 AM

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18. "RE: and that's fine"
In response to Reply # 13


          


>but i would like some reference to the claims made
>an op-ed piece is an opinion
>i'd also like to form an opinion. lets see some of these
>offensive emails

c'mon - the emails are right there in the original post and all over the internet/in print media (ny times, washington post). DNC officials coordinated to try and spin Bernie's views on spirituality/religion - said "he would never be president" in the midst of a tight race - and continually undermined his campaign calling it a 'mess' -- they are the neutral officiating bodies but they acted like Clinton campaign staff. Let's not play dumb.


>>If anyone was carrying out "scorched-earth attacks" on the
>>party - it was Schultz - who has done more to divide the
>party
>>than any other ranking Democrat.
>
>how did she attack the democratic party?

I didn't say she "attacked" the party - I said she has served to divide it. Thanks to Schultz - we are going into the Convention with far more fracture and tension than was necessary. She's been an abject failure as DNC Chair.

>there are some progressives who will jump to stein
>some might even jump to johnson. i think this is a given
>there are also those who will abstain
>the democratic party can only bend so far over backward to
>accomodate everyone

So you think the party has done enough to accommodate the Sanders/Progressive wing? With the Kaine VP pick - they are clearly going after the moderate, center-right vote. Hell, even their campaign logo is an arrow pointing to that right. The Progressive base *is* the traditional Democratic base.

>you dont think the democratic party has adapted some of
>sanders campaign platforms?
>it sounds like the issue here is that because the DP hasn't
>adopted all of it then thats a problem
>but why should they? there are many different types of
>democrats. you are not going to please everyone
>bernie's policy advisor said 80% of what they requested was
>included

Sanders did a great job in implementing some of his progressive ideals into the platform - I think most are happy with that (regardless of where you stand on the spectrum). The issue isn't that the DP hasn't adopted *all* of the progressive platform - that was never going to happen. The issue is that they never wanted Sanders to represent the party - regardless of the fact that he was running neck and neck with Clinton for a large segment of the primary. The strategy of downplaying the significance of the emerging progressive electorate is short-sighted and dangerous for the future of the party.

>>As of now - there's been nothing but flat-out dismissal of
>>that base - a base that came out and rendered Sanders the
>>winner in 22 states in this primary.
>
>where is the evidence of that?

ugh - how about this post (Wikileaks)? What more evidence would you need.

>give me an example of these progressive left issues that are
>being taken for granted.

Foreign policy. Clinton and the progressive base couldn't be further apart on war and foreign policy. From the Israel-Palestine conflict to the Nuclear deal - our relationship with Saudi Arabia - and interventionist regime-change war in Libya and Syria - none of the progressive platform as it pertains to war and foreign policy has been adopted by the DNC.




-->

  

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akon
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Sun Jul-24-16 05:55 PM

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30. "RE: and that's fine"
In response to Reply # 18


  

          


>c'mon - the emails are right there in the original post and
>all over the internet/in print media (ny times, washington
>post).

i started going into my opinion on these emails - but then i realized that it wont change anything
these emails fit into a preconceived and on-going narrative-
that bernie deserves to have won the primaries, that the convention should hand him the nomination (i think previously it was -he is the only one capable of beating trump because polls), etc
its another variation of the same theme
what i would like to see, instead of focussing on he-wrote she wrote- is to see how this translated into what happened in the primaries.

>Let's not play dumb.

im not. im stating my views. thats allowed, no?

>>>If anyone was carrying out "scorched-earth attacks" on the
>>>party - it was Schultz - who has done more to divide the
>>party
>>>than any other ranking Democrat.
>>
>>how did she attack the democratic party?
>
>I didn't say she "attacked" the party - I said she has served
>to divide it.

you said she was carrying "scorched-earth attacks" on the
>>>party
i translated that to mean that she was attacking the party. but ok. perhaps you mis-wrote.

>So you think the party has done enough to accommodate the
>Sanders/Progressive wing? With the Kaine VP pick - they are
>clearly going after the moderate, center-right vote. Hell,
>even their campaign logo is an arrow pointing to that right.
>The Progressive base *is* the traditional Democratic base.

>Sanders did a great job in implementing some of his
>progressive ideals into the platform - I think most are happy
>with that (regardless of where you stand on the spectrum).

ok, so this is a bit of a contradiction. have they not done enough? or is because hillary picked Kaine that now we reverse position and say they have not done enough? and lol@ arrow pointing to the right.
the DP has shifted to the center (and i actually don't think its the center since the line is skewed right anyway.
- those who don't agree with this- have probably embraced the green party (which i already said i dont agree with)
those who still think the DP has things worthy of supporting have remained. i believe this is how it should be.
i think to win the elections, there are compromises to be made. it did prove successful before, i sure hope it does this time round too.

>>>As of now - there's been nothing but flat-out dismissal of
>>>that base - a base that came out and rendered Sanders the
>>>winner in 22 states in this primary.

how is there a flat out dismissal of the base if the DP has adapted some of sanders issues? it sounds like they have accomodated in order to reach out to the base
clearly the DP has placed limits on how far they are willing to go, but at 80% of the platform? i think thats pretty damn good. no?

>>give me an example of these progressive left issues that are
>>being taken for granted.
>
>Foreign policy. Clinton and the progressive base couldn't be
>further apart on war and foreign policy. From the
>Israel-Palestine conflict to the Nuclear deal - our
>relationship with Saudi Arabia - and interventionist
>regime-change war in Libya and Syria - none of the progressive
>platform as it pertains to war and foreign policy has been
>adopted by the DNC.

im not sure how adapting these would help clinton win the general election
i do agree the u.s overwhelming support for israel is troubling and palestinians deserve their own statehood - but i've also seen what happens when a politician tries to raise this (see obama). i can understand wanting to be more militant about the issue, but i dont see what gains there are in this. not if you are trying to win an election

what's wrong with the nuclear deal. i didnt realize the progressives stand with republicans on this.
i think a ten year respite and the concessions won on this will meaningfully change the risk of iran acquiring nuclear weapons. im an optimistic.
none of us know what the results of this deal will be - some choose to be pessimistic. but i dont think what was happening previously helped in addressing this issue- i havent heard alternatives to this. what was bernie's alternative?

this i dont get "and interventionist regime-change war in Libya and Syria"
whats the progressive's stance on this?

.
http://perspectivesudans.blogspot.com/
i myself would never want to be god,or even like god.Because god got all these human beings on this planet and i most certainly would not want to be responsible for them, or even have the disgrace that i made them.

  

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Vex_id
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Sun Jul-24-16 06:49 PM

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39. "alike most Clinton supporters - you need to brush up on Foreign Policy"
In response to Reply # 30
Sun Jul-24-16 06:50 PM by Vex_id

          

If you can't recognize the improprieties of Schultz and the DNC with regards to the leaked emails - then it's going to be difficult to have a reasoned conversation. But let's give it a go - one last time.

>>I didn't say she "attacked" the party - I said she has
>served
>>to divide it.
>
>you said she was carrying "scorched-earth attacks" on the
>>>>party
>i translated that to mean that she was attacking the party.
>but ok. perhaps you mis-wrote.

No - you just failed to read the complete sentence in its context. I said "if anybody is carrying out scorched-earth attacks on the party - it's Schultz" -- and you're seeing the consequences of her incompetence and inability to be neutral right now. It's not good for the party.


>the DP has shifted to the center (and i actually don't think
>its the center since the line is skewed right anyway.

That's a clear regression from the progressive achievements of the Obama Administration. The party was ripe for a true Progressive - but Clinton has effectively pulled the party to the center-right.

>how is there a flat out dismissal of the base if the DP has
>adapted some of sanders issues? it sounds like they have
>accomodated in order to reach out to the base
>clearly the DP has placed limits on how far they are willing
>to go, but at 80% of the platform? i think thats pretty damn
>good. no?

It's one thing to say you're going to "adopt a platform" - it's quite another to actually see it come to fruition in your administration. One thing we know about Clinton: She'll say anything when it's politically expedient to do so. From the TPP, to marriage equality - from the Iran deal to free public tuition for college - Clinton sways from side-to-side based on what is to her benefit at that particular time.


>i do agree the u.s overwhelming support for israel is
>troubling and palestinians deserve their own statehood

you know who doesn't? Clinton. She has been so hard-line pro Israel that she can't bring herself to say one critical thing about its current apartheid state and gross human rights violations in Gaza. Schulz went so far as to refer to the Sanders foreign policy stance on Israel-Palestine (which is to recognize Palestinian statehood) as "troubling" -- yikes.

>what's wrong with the nuclear deal. i didnt realize the
>progressives stand with republicans on this.

Lol. Clinton wants to take credit for the Iran Deal - but that was all Kerry and Obama. She has been antagonistic towards Iran (and still is) - and cautioned Obama about the Iran Nuclear Deal saying that she didn't believe would hold up its end of the deal.

In 2008, she promised if elected president to “obliterate” Iran if it attacked Israel—even if the United States was unthreatened and Congress had not authorized war: “I want the Iranians to know, if I am the president, we will attack Iran... And I want them to understand that... we would be able to totally obliterate them .”

All the while - she approved billion-dollar weapons deals with Saudi Arabia and furthers that alliance -- and that's precisely where the Wahhabi-brand of Sunni extremism (ISIS) emanates from. Clinton has made it clear that she's a part of the Old Foreign Policy NeoCon establishment re: foreign policy - but inexplicably - her supporters don't seem to care.

>this i dont get "and interventionist regime-change war in
>Libya and Syria"
>whats the progressive's stance on this?

Yes - Clinton is an interventionist and led the regime-change ousting of Gadaffi in Libya (which Obama regards as his biggest failure as President) - just as she wants to oust Assad in Syria. Progressives (alike Sanders) do not condone regime-change interventionist wars that exacerbate the problems and create vacuums for extremist groups in the MidEast to exploit.


-->

  

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PROMO
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Sat Jul-23-16 05:39 PM

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11. "i know you're not saying someone's op-ed piece..."
In response to Reply # 7


  

          

is vindication for Wasserman-Schultz and the DNC's tactics?

i mean, i know you suck Hillary's clit and just wish Bernie and his supporters never existed, but c'mon.

  

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akon
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Sat Jul-23-16 06:39 PM

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12. "i do?"
In response to Reply # 11


  

          


>i mean, i know you suck Hillary's clit and just wish Bernie
>and his supporters never existed, but c'mon.

no, im just asking for some evidence of the claims
last i checked one is allowed to do that

what i have read so far is that they questioned his policy on israel
and the comment on whether or not he is an atheist
as an apatheist - i really hope that he is one. and its unfortunate that atheists dont have a voice

.
http://perspectivesudans.blogspot.com/
i myself would never want to be god,or even like god.Because god got all these human beings on this planet and i most certainly would not want to be responsible for them, or even have the disgrace that i made them.

  

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Teknontheou
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32709 posts
Sat Jul-23-16 05:01 PM

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8. "Shaun King is demanding a DNC apology within 48 hours (on FB)"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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Vex_id
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Sat Jul-23-16 05:20 PM

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9. "That class action "fraud" lawsuit just got a *little* bit more interesti..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

http://www.browardpalmbeach.com/news/more-than-100-bernie-sanders-donors-sue-debbie-wasserman-schultz-for-fraud-7883715

-->

  

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Mr. ManC
Member since Jan 26th 2009
11819 posts
Sat Jul-23-16 10:01 PM

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15. "yup, was just talking about this."
In response to Reply # 9


  

          

at the very least the validity of these e-mail may be testified against under oath.

funny people see this as a non-issue, even though the rules are for the party to be unbiased and not show favoritism.

so Hillary was ahead, then Bernie started tracking her down, and then they kicked into gear. People use 2008 like it makes it fair game. Difference is that 2016 is the 2.0 version where 2008 failed.

Honestly, even looking at 2008 again, and Hillary's foreign policy, I think the intent was to go straight from Bush to Clinton. He was another disaster optic to pose her against. It was supposed to be Bush's failed policies + axis of evil + pragmatism/experience/etc = Clinton Presidency. The more I see the more it is evident that both parties are arms of the same puppet master. They were able to take legislation that Republicans couldn't pass and give it to Obama to make his landmark policy in Obamacare. It is the ultimate jedi mind trick. They got so many people fooled. They tricked us into voting against universal health care and $15 an hour minimum wage because it would be bad for us.

________________________________________________
R.I.P. Soulgyal <3
SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

  

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kayru99
Member since Jan 26th 2004
16105 posts
Sun Jul-24-16 06:58 AM

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16. "This:"
In response to Reply # 15


          

"The more I see the more it is evident that both parties are arms of the same puppet master. They were able to take legislation that Republicans couldn't pass and give it to Obama to make his landmark policy in Obamacare. It is the ultimate jedi mind trick. They got so many people fooled. They tricked us into voting against universal health care and $15 an hour minimum wage because it would be bad for us."

But people will yell "Chess, not checkers" while being played like an uno card by the mainstream parties.

It frustrating to watch, but it's par for the course


  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79594 posts
Sun Jul-24-16 07:07 AM

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17. "^^^^^"
In response to Reply # 16


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
16347 posts
Sat Jul-23-16 10:01 PM

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14. "#BernieMustDisavow"
In response to Reply # 0
Sat Jul-23-16 10:03 PM by Reeq

          

https://twitter.com/hashtag/BernieMustDisavow

his supporters might end up wrecking this election
one way or another.
they bout to turn on bernie himself.

  

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Heinz
Member since Dec 26th 2003
20759 posts
Sun Jul-24-16 12:28 PM

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21. "What's the difference between Repubs not fucking with Trump?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

You can't really sandbag a campaign as we see where Trump is now with no real support. It's a non issue. Only thing I think is wrong is why do these people keep this shit over email....old people.

  

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Jon
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Sun Jul-24-16 12:48 PM

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22. "Repubs had 20 candidates butting heads. DNC had their favorite."
In response to Reply # 21


          

  

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Mr. ManC
Member since Jan 26th 2009
11819 posts
Sun Jul-24-16 03:59 PM

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27. "the difference is that the DNC wrote e-mails and conspired"
In response to Reply # 21


  

          

to have Democratic leadership in Rhode Island close polling places because Bernie was polling ahead in the state. They went out of their way to put a candidate in their party at a disadvantage. As much as the RNC didn't agree with Trump he still got press, still got cameras on him, and they didn't go out of their way to sabotage him. The candidates can do that, but not the party.

https://wikileaks.org/dnc-emails/emailid/6564

this shit is disgusting, and we've been saying it. They legit said the governor was one of us and will play ball. Rhode Island only opened ONE THIRD of their polling places for their primary.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2016/04/21/open-one-third-its-polling-locations-for-primary/8zFCofk766ICWDxgsTIPKN/story.html

disgusting.

________________________________________________
R.I.P. Soulgyal <3
SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

  

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Mynoriti
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Sun Jul-24-16 03:02 PM

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23. "Ding dong, the witc.... So, yeah, she's resigning"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2016/07/24/dnc-chair-debbie-wasserman-schultz-resigns/

  

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Mr. ManC
Member since Jan 26th 2009
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Sun Jul-24-16 03:54 PM

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26. "RE: Ding dong, the witc.... So, yeah, she's resigning"
In response to Reply # 23


  

          

>https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2016/07/24/dnc-chair-debbie-wasserman-schultz-resigns/

https://www.hillaryclinton.com/briefing/statements/2016/07/24/hillary-clinton-statement-on-the-resignation-of-democratic-national-committee-chair-debbie-wasserman-schultz/

can't make this stuff up.

________________________________________________
R.I.P. Soulgyal <3
SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

  

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Vex_id
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Sun Jul-24-16 06:01 PM

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31. "predictable. in effect - DWS didn't lose her job."
In response to Reply # 26


          

She's still Chair of the Clinton campaign as she's been for the past +12 months.

-->

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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142. "Please be less gullible."
In response to Reply # 26


          


http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016/7/25/1551930/-Debbie-Wasserman-Schultz-did-not-get-promoted-and-she-s-not-running-Hillary-s-campaign


"Being an honorary chair does not mean that Debbie Wasserman Schultz is 'in charge of' Hillary Clinton’s campaign. It doesn’t mean anything. That is, unless you think President Obama’s 2012 campaign was run by actress Eva Longoria; or former Republican Senator Lincoln Chafee; or high school guidance counselor Loretta Harper—all of whom were among 24 people who served as honorary co-chairs of Obama’s 2012 campaign."

  

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Vex_id
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32. "doesn't matter anymore - she needed to resign months ago."
In response to Reply # 23


          

Justice will be done once Tim Canova ousts Schultz in Florida for her congressional seat.

-->

  

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Jon
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42. "She completed her mission for HRC. This is useless."
In response to Reply # 23


          

  

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Warren Coolidge
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24. "Debbie Wasserman Schultz steps down...."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

In a crazy way.... these emails could turn out to be a real positive for the Democrats....

DWS stepping down (effective Thursday) the day before the convention is a win for Bernie and his followers...... and Monday is HIS day at the convention...

the angle of Russia's involvement with email leaks, and a possible connection between Russia and the Trump campaign...particularly Manafort.... is an angle the Dems are really going to push...

  

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Mr. ManC
Member since Jan 26th 2009
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25. "....and right into Hillary's campaign as an honorary chair."
In response to Reply # 24


  

          

https://www.hillaryclinton.com/briefing/statements/2016/07/24/hillary-clinton-statement-on-the-resignation-of-democratic-national-committee-chair-debbie-wasserman-schultz/

talk about tone deaf. By Hillary. This shit is too messy, and there are probably MORE e-mails out there. They are seriously trying to blame RUSSIA for this.

unbelievable.

________________________________________________
R.I.P. Soulgyal <3
SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

  

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40thStreetBlack
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51. "Russians. I should've known. Anti-Semite, slippery Cossack sluts."
In response to Reply # 25


          

>there are probably MORE e-mails out there. They are seriously
>trying to blame RUSSIA for this.

What do you know about this goyim?

___________________

Mar-A-Lago delenda est

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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53. "RE: ....and right into Hillary's campaign as an honorary chair."
In response to Reply # 25
Mon Jul-25-16 06:50 AM by murph71

          

>https://www.hillaryclinton.com/briefing/statements/2016/07/24/hillary-clinton-statement-on-the-resignation-of-democratic-national-committee-chair-debbie-wasserman-schultz/
>
>talk about tone deaf. By Hillary. This shit is too messy, and
>there are probably MORE e-mails out there. They are seriously
>trying to blame RUSSIA for this.
>
>unbelievable.

Not unbelievable...Everyone in the mainstream cyber community is talking about it....Now its being reported that this is the same Russia/Putin backed hacking group that hit the Pentagon.....

Peep this, from the cyber security site Defense One:

"Close your eyes and imagine that a hacking group backed by Russian President Vladimir Putin broke into the email system of a major U.S. political party. The group stole thousands of sensitive messages and then published them through an obliging third party in a way that was strategically timed to influence the United States presidential election. Now open your eyes, because that’s what just happened.

On Friday, Wikileaks published 20,000 emails stolen from the Democratic National Committee. They reveal, among other things, thuggish infighting, a push by a top DNC official to use Bernie Sanders’ religious convictions against him in the South, and attempts to strong-arm media outlets. In other words, they reveal the Washington campaign monster for what it is.

But leave aside the purported content of the Wikileaks data dump (to which numerous other outlets have devoted considerable attention) and consider the source. Considerable evidence shows that the Wikileaks dump was an orchestrated act by the Russian government, working through proxies, to undermine Hillary Clinton’s Presidential campaign.

“This has all the hallmarks of tradecraft. The only rationale to release such data from the Russian bulletproof host was to empower one candidate against another. The Cold War is alive and well,” Tom Kellermann, the CEO of Strategic Cyber Ventures told Defense One.

Here’s the timeline: On June 14, cybersecurity company CrowdStrike, under contract with the DNC, announced in a blog post that two separate Russian intelligence groups had gained access to the DNC network. One group, FANCY BEAR or APT 28, gained access in April. The other, COZY BEAR, (also called Cozy Duke and APT 29) first breached the network in the summer of 2015.

Cybersecurity company FireEye first discovered APT 29 in 2014 and was quick to point out a clear Kremlin connection. “We suspect the Russian government sponsors the group because of the organizations it targets and the data it steals. Additionally, APT 29 appeared to cease operations on Russian holidays, and their work hours seem to align with the UTC +3 time zone, which contains cities such as Moscow and St. Petersburg,” they wrote in their report on the group. Other U.S. officials have said that the group looks like it has sponsorship from the Russian government due in large part to the level of sophistication behind the group’s attacks.

It’s the same group that hit the State Department, the White House, and the civilian email of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. The group’s modus operandi (a spearphishing attack that uploads a distinctive remote access tool on the target’s computer) is well known to cyber-security researchers."



Full piece: http://www.defenseone.com/technology/2016/07/how-putin-weaponized-wikileaks-influence-election-american-president/130163/

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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28. "This is such a fucking travesty."
In response to Reply # 0


          

Not the emails, the travesty is this ridiculous media narrative that anything scandalous was in those emails. So now a good soldier for the Democratic party has her career upended as a blood sacrifice to these naive and egotistical Sandersites who just can't admit that they lost.

What was in those emails?

DNC staffers were privately worried that an unelectable candidate was gaining traction in the primary? That's news?

They were pissed off about the behavior of the Bernie supporters at the Nevada convention? They should have been.

People said Jeff Weaver is a liar and an asshole? All available evidence confirms this.

They were worried about whether an obvious atheist would be willing to pretend to be religious in the general election, as every electable candidate must? Yeah, so was I, and there are very few more militant atheists in the world than me.

The conspiracy theory has always been that the DNC somehow actually torpedoed Sanders in the primaries. How exactly was this even within their power? And where in these emails is the evidence of any such collusion? This is fucking childish. Yes they assumed Hillary would most likely be the candidate, as she was, and they hoped the eventual candidate would get through the primary unscathed, as the party should always want. But the party insiders were just as much on Clinton's side in 2008, and that didn't stop Barack Obama. If Sanders had been a stronger candidate, then he would have won (and the general election would look far bleaker than it does now).

Yeah, she has to step down. We don't want to be talking about this all week. And she has to give up her speaking slot at the convention, because the Sanders faction will boo her just like they booed Barbara Boxer and called her a cunt. But both Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton can see that Debbie's been smeared, so in the long run they'll help her land on her feet.

  

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Vex_id
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33. "lol'z. You would defend DWS and the DNC on this."
In response to Reply # 28


          

but at this point - I'm impressed w/ the extraordinary trolling you're doing. Please remain in character.

-->

  

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stravinskian
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34. "Yes I would. She did nothing wrong."
In response to Reply # 33


          

  

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Mr. ManC
Member since Jan 26th 2009
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36. "lol this shit is comedy. I'm done with these people."
In response to Reply # 33


  

          

Not just trolling entities, but like why fight this hard for this party? I bookmarked Canada immigration's page last night. Like there are populations in this world that have already gotten on the same page about these issues. People riding so hard for this lady that they don't even know why they are voting for her other than 1. if elected she keeps Trump from being elected, and 2. she represents them not having to pay attention.

but she's more for overturning Citizens United than Bernie. FOHWTBS lol

done.

#sameyoucanbelievein

________________________________________________
R.I.P. Soulgyal <3
SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

  

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stravinskian
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38. "Why fight for this party? Because it's the good one. "
In response to Reply # 36


          

There are two choices. One is led by Trump, and one is led by Obama and Clinton. If you can't see why to prefer the one led by Obama and Clinton, then you're either a right-winger or a fucking idiot.

>Not just trolling entities, but like why fight this hard for
>this party? I bookmarked Canada immigration's page last night.
>Like there are populations in this world that have already
>gotten on the same page about these issues. People riding so
>hard for this lady that they don't even know why they are
>voting for her other than 1. if elected she keeps Trump from
>being elected,

For the record, that's not my only reason for supporting her, by a long shot. I think, like Barack Obama does, that she is one of the most qualified people ever to run for this office, and I agree with her position on nearly every issue (as does Bernie, and as do you, I think, if you were honest).

But even if it were just about stopping Trump, would that not be enough?!

>and 2. she represents them not having to pay
>attention.

Not having to pay attention to what?

>but she's more for overturning Citizens United than Bernie.
>FOHWTBS lol

What is Bernie's plan for overturning Citizens United? How does it differ from Obama's or Hillary's? It doesn't. Pulling in a lot of money from millennials literally has nothing to do with Citizens United.

  

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Mr. ManC
Member since Jan 26th 2009
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43. "RE: Why fight for this party? Because it's the good one. "
In response to Reply # 38


  

          

>There are two choices. One is led by Trump, and one is led by
>Obama and Clinton. If you can't see why to prefer the one led
>by Obama and Clinton, then you're either a right-winger or a
>fucking idiot.
>
>>Not just trolling entities, but like why fight this hard for
>>this party? I bookmarked Canada immigration's page last
>night.
>>Like there are populations in this world that have already
>>gotten on the same page about these issues. People riding so
>>hard for this lady that they don't even know why they are
>>voting for her other than 1. if elected she keeps Trump from
>>being elected,
>
>For the record, that's not my only reason for supporting her,
>by a long shot. I think, like Barack Obama does, that she is
>one of the most qualified people ever to run for this office,
>and I agree with her position on nearly every issue (as does
>Bernie, and as do you, I think, if you were honest).
>
>But even if it were just about stopping Trump, would that not
>be enough?!
>
>>and 2. she represents them not having to pay
>>attention.
>
>Not having to pay attention to what?
>
>>but she's more for overturning Citizens United than Bernie.
>>FOHWTBS lol
>
>What is Bernie's plan for overturning Citizens United? How
>does it differ from Obama's or Hillary's? It doesn't. Pulling
>in a lot of money from millennials literally has nothing to do
>with Citizens United.
>

k. whatever you got to tell yourself. Trump is bad. I get it. Hillary gotta be the only candidate in history where if her opponent died, she would actually do worse. Not falling for the okey doke anymore. Don't miss layups. If your party loses to Trump then maybe you should have run the other guy. I'm done trying to logic people out of ignorance. I hope either some other e-mails drop that make the super delegates reconsider Sanders. It is like literally the last legit hope. If not, then Schultz will steal another election. I will look to support maybe a Stein/Turner ticket. Done with the DNC.

________________________________________________
R.I.P. Soulgyal <3
SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

  

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akon
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138. "oh ya. this is what all this is about "
In response to Reply # 43


  

          

>>I hope either
>some other e-mails drop that make the super delegates
>reconsider Sanders. It is like literally the last legit hope.

.
http://perspectivesudans.blogspot.com/
i myself would never want to be god,or even like god.Because god got all these human beings on this planet and i most certainly would not want to be responsible for them, or even have the disgrace that i made them.

  

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mrhood75
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37. "Always a good look to Cuban B anti-Semitism "
In response to Reply # 28


  

          

I don't buy that the e-mails proved the DNC rigged the primaries for Hilary,'but come the fuck on.

-----------------

www.albumism.com

Checkin' Our Style, Return To Zero:

https://www.mixcloud.com/returntozero/

  

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stravinskian
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Sun Jul-24-16 06:57 PM

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40. "Come the fuck on about what?"
In response to Reply # 37


          


Why is it wrong for people to say negative things about Bernie Sanders in private emails?

I guarantee RNC staffers said much more negative things about the Trump campaign. Does that mean the GOP contest was rigged against him?



Aside: I don't know what Cuban B means, or whether you're talking about anti-semitism against Sanders (which wouldn't make much sense, since the supposed scandal was them wondering if he's an atheist), or against DWS, which I honestly think is part of why it's been so easy to smear her.

  

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Mynoriti
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41. "Speaking of that, when Obama was thinking on replacing her a few years b..."
In response to Reply # 37


  

          

word was she had plans to try to have the move painted as anti-woman, and anti-semetic. I still don't know for sure if it was true, but I wouldn't put money against it. Politico and a few others were reporting it at the time.

  

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Vex_id
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45. "Yes - Obama wanted her ousted in 2012."
In response to Reply # 41


          

Just don't tell Clinton aide Stravinskian that - lest his desperate attempts to affix Clinton to Obama's exceptional legacy fail to stick.

-->

  

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stravinskian
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131. "I don't need to "affix Clinton to Obama's exceptional legacy.""
In response to Reply # 45


          


Obama does that, by now in pretty much every interview that he does.

  

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stravinskian
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129. "I'm having trouble finding an article that even implies this."
In response to Reply # 41


          


And it seems a little sketchy. Is the suggestion that Debbie Wasserman Schultz commanded such public respect that Barack Obama didn't dare to force her out?

I can find stories suggesting that she didn't get along with specific Obama campaign staffers in 2012, and a few reports of trivial scandal about whether the party should pay for clothing worn at the convention. She doesn't sound like an easy person to get along with. But if Obama wanted her out, then I don't see how she would have kept her job.

  

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Mynoriti
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141. "it's mentioned on her wiki page. also mentioned in this Politico piece"
In response to Reply # 129


  

          

http://www.politico.com/story/2015/02/senate-bid-could-be-solution-for-wasserman-schultz-115373

here's another one about tensions. which might be the one you were referencing
http://www.politico.com/story/2014/09/democrats-debbie-wasserman-schultz-111077

like i said, i don't know if it's true or not, but wouldn't put it past her saying those things, even if she was just spitballing.

  

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RaFromQueens
Member since Apr 18th 2006
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Sun Jul-24-16 10:06 PM

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44. "Members of the DNC were instructing MSNBC how to frame coverage"
In response to Reply # 28


  

          

Anti Sanders. That isn't wrong? You're ridiculous.

And there's evidence of illegal activity in the Clintons charity. Tell us how that doesn't matter either.

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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stravinskian
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Mon Jul-25-16 09:28 AM

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70. "Can you give an example of &quot;instructing MSNBC how to frame coverage..."
In response to Reply # 44
Mon Jul-25-16 09:46 AM by stravinskian

          

>And there's evidence of illegal activity in the Clintons
>charity. Tell us how that doesn't matter either.

Illegal activity in the Clintons' charity? What the fuck are you talking about? It's this a new story you're bringing up? Or is it just the long-debunked GOP talking point?

  

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RaFromQueens
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92. "Lookong for msnbc stuff now. I should have said campaign not charity. "
In response to Reply # 70


  

          

In the mean time promising appointments to donors also isn't a blog deal right?

https://wikileaks.org/dnc-emails/emailid/20352

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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stravinskian
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Mon Jul-25-16 10:24 AM

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97. "You know these board appointments are normally unpaid, right?"
In response to Reply # 92


          


And yes, it's been common practice for decades and I guarantee you Bernie does it too.

  

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RaFromQueens
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137. "Quid pro quo revealed. No biggie to you."
In response to Reply # 97


  

          

I'm shocked.

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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stravinskian
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139. "A ceremonial unpaid position is not a quid pro quo!"
In response to Reply # 137


          


Jesus Christ, man. Let it go. You're making shit up.

  

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RaFromQueens
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96. "MSNBC coverage instruction and bonuses:"
In response to Reply # 70


  

          

https://wikileaks.org/dnc-emails/emailid/6107

https://wikileaks.org/dnc-emails/emailid/13762

https://wikileaks.org/dnc-emails/emailid/11712

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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stravinskian
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120. "You're not very good at this business of digging dirt."
In response to Reply # 96
Mon Jul-25-16 01:00 PM by stravinskian

          

>https://wikileaks.org/dnc-emails/emailid/6107

The text of this:

"Can we pull the commentary segment right now on msnbc? Talking about the DNC and the relationship between the DNC and the Clinton campaign

"With rush transcript please once it wraps up."


Pull the commentary, meaning: get a transcript of the commentary! She specifically asked for a transcript. Note, she also said "once it wraps up", meaning, it was already running! "Pull" does does not mean stop it from running. If it did, then it wouldn't be very effective to give your order to "pull" it after it's started running! Jesus christ.

I don't even know what to say about the other two you posted. Campaigns talk to the media all the time. That's what they're supposed to do. They talk to executives off the record to try to improve their on-air representation, and put party figures on air. I honestly have no idea what you think you found in those last two emails.

This reminds me very much of "climate-gate", when right-wing operatives stole the emails of climate scientists and were so certain that there was a scandal in them that they combed through them for words like "manipulate", or for any example of them saying mean things about climate deniers, and sold it as evidence that climate science is a sham. And the media, who always love a scandal, ate it up even though it was all patently false. There was nothing there, and there is nothing here. You're being irrational, just like the Republicans want you to be.

  

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RaFromQueens
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135. "Yeah campaigns do. Funny you see the DNC as an extionsion of HRC camp"
In response to Reply # 120


  

          

during the primaries.

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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RaFromQueens
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46. "Oh! And how about INFILTRATING THE SANDERS CAMPAIGN "
In response to Reply # 28


  

          

https://wikileaks.org/dnc-emails/emailid/4776

Standard operating procedure right?

As more leaks come out and are parsed through its reassuring to know you'll be there to tell us it doesn't really mean anything lol

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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stravinskian
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Mon Jul-25-16 09:35 AM

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77. ""Infiltrating the Sanders campaign"? You have to be fucking kidding me."
In response to Reply # 46


          


It's presidential politics! People know people. You do understand, right, that the vast majority of Bernie's middle and upper level staffers are professional campaign operatives who have worked in and out of campaigns, and the DNC, for decades, right?

You are really reaching here. And doing it in all caps.

  

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RaFromQueens
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86. "They are supposed to be neutral but the game was rigged. "
In response to Reply # 77


  

          

I'm sure if I spent enough time I could find you dismissing allegations to that effect during the primaries. Fuckig Jake Tapper on cnn said the optics are terrible when you consider Sanders was running against corrupt, fixed systems. Do you know what that makes HRC?

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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stravinskian
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88. "The game was never rigged!"
In response to Reply # 86
Mon Jul-25-16 10:03 AM by stravinskian

          

How was it rigged? Disparaging comments in private emails don't amount to a rigging of the system.

Was the game rigged against Barack Obama in 2008? I guarantee you if someone took the time to hack DNC communications in 2008 they'd find isolated comments just as disparaging about Barack Obama or any of the other candidates. But somehow he became the nominee.

  

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RaFromQueens
Member since Apr 18th 2006
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100. "1. Leaking info for Bernie hit pieces "
In response to Reply # 88


  

          

https://wikileaks.org/dnc-emails/emailid/11712

2. They had their horse picked by the beginning of May. The voting was ceremony

https://wikileaks.org/dnc-emails/fileid/5254/2728

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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stravinskian
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122. "Again, I have no idea what you even think you've found there."
In response to Reply # 100


          


What info was leaked for a "Bernie hit piece?" All I see in the email you posted was a back and forth about whether Wasserman-Schultz should do an interview with Mika Brzezinski.

As for your point 2., I have no idea what that file is. Was that a DNC document or was it a Clinton campaign document. Just because it was on a DNC server doesn't mean it was written by DNC staffers. Campaigns share their talking points with the party all the time, again, that's their job!

  

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RaFromQueens
Member since Apr 18th 2006
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136. "RE: Again, I have no idea what you even think you've found there."
In response to Reply # 122


  

          

>
>What info was leaked for a "Bernie hit piece?" All I see in
>the email you posted was a back and forth about whether
>Wasserman-Schultz should do an interview with Mika
>Brzezinski.

> Yes, and Hilary sent part of that. Mika is willing to do a call with you, so we need to know if you want to make that happen too. We figure it can’t get worse, so worth having a call. > > > > <image001.png>Luis Miranda, Communications Director > Democratic National Committee > 202-863-8148 – MirandaL@dnc.org - @MiraLuisDC > > > From: hrtsleeve@gmail.com > Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2016 1:05 PM > To: Miranda, Luis; Paustenbach, Mark; Banfill, Ryan > Subject: MSNBC story > > This is a good story. Did we get them the info near the bottom?

They were supplying information about a candidate running for their party's nom for a negative piece about them. I'm sure you believe that's totally standard and above board.

>As for your point 2., I have no idea what that file is. Was
>that a DNC document or was it a Clinton campaign document.
>Just because it was on a DNC server doesn't mean it was
>written by DNC staffers. Campaigns share their talking points
>with the party all the time, again, that's their job!
>

So you're willing to concede it's damaging if it's a DNC staffer? Or does this go in the 'no biggie' file too?

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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rob
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47. "the travesty is that the dnc held on to a bad chairperson for so long"
In response to Reply # 28


  

          

after the failures they've had nationally

but not a surprise considering the dnc chairperson before her (who ran the show when the party bled in 2009-2010) is now joining her on the hillary campaign.

  

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legsdiamond
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55. "bruh, cmon... "
In response to Reply # 28


          

is it really too hard to say they fucked up and still be a Hillary supporter?

you better be getting paid for this shit

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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stravinskian
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81. "I'd happily say it if they'd actually fucked up."
In response to Reply # 55


          


I still haven't seen any details about where the scandal is, in the press or on OKP. In the press it's just breathless headlines, on OKP it's the same thing along with some tinfoil hat shit and "we all know" thrown in.

This is yet another manufactured scandal, and the party that's supposed to be intellectual is falling for it hook, line, and sinker.

  

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
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48. "I don't care if Schultz came to my front door and kicked me in the balls..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Trump has to lose. Hillary is the only other realistic candidate. I agree with Hillary on many issues. I agree with Trump on zero issues.

I have too many friends who would be marginalized in the case of a Trump presidency. They cannot afford to have Trump win.

So I will exercise my right to be outraged by some of Hillary's fuck ups in November, after she has won, when Trump is no longer on the table as an option for president.

My movies: http://russellhainline.com
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rob
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49. "i mean, yeah, but you know the right is saying the same thing"
In response to Reply # 48


  

          

talk radio was in full-on "a vote for anyone but trump is a vote for hillary" after the convention.

so i'm hoping everybody follows through after november, and finding a new chair for the dnc should be a big part of that.

  

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RaFromQueens
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50. "It's fucking 1984. "
In response to Reply # 48


  

          

I've always hated that cliche but I feel like I'm in the twilight zone. Trump is the answer to everything. HRC could eat a baby at the convention but fuck it what are you gonna do vote for Trump?

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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stravinskian
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87. "I don't like that argument either,"
In response to Reply # 50


          


because anyone actually paying attention should support Hillary, and not need to be scared of Trump. Even if you supported Bernie you should admit that their actual proposals were broadly the same.

But still, there really are only two options. Hillary Clinton will be the President, or Donald Trump will be the President. If you think Hillary would be better, vote for her, if you think Trump will be better, vote for him. If you actually think they are exactly equal options (and you don't; nobody does) then sit it out or vote for an irrelevant third party.

  

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RaFromQueens
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103. "They are equal. I don't have any reason to believe anything either1 says"
In response to Reply # 87


  

          

HRC moved left to be able to compete with Bernie on a lot of issues and she's now going to "pivot" to grab the center and what she does in office is anyone's guess.

You don't know what she believes of fracking, the keystone pipeline, the TPP, or any of the things she's 'evolved' on.

This is her nature https://youtu.be/dMzvIivSk6I

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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stravinskian
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116. "She believes in the facts on those issues."
In response to Reply # 103


          


And yes, it's a shame that so many who are supposedly in our party do not.

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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123. "And besides, have you even considered how much those "issues" matter?"
In response to Reply # 103
Mon Jul-25-16 01:35 PM by stravinskian

          

Compared to, say, ACTUAL efforts to reduce CO_2 emission? Or raising the minimum wage? Further expanding access to health care? Reducing student debt? Targeting tax hikes to the wealthy? Fighting off the recurrent attempts to privatize Social Security and Medicare? Strengthening rather than weakening current Wall Street regulations? Continuing our membership in fucking NATO?!

There is a reason that Bernie Sanders has repeatedly said that "even on her worst day" she's be a far better President than Donald Trump. So unless you think Bernie Sanders is in someone's pocket, no, they're not equal. You're just emotional.

>You don't know what she believes of fracking, the keystone
>pipeline, the TPP, or any of the things she's 'evolved' on.

  

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RaFromQueens
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140. "That kind of brand loyalty over &quot;bigger issues&quot; was the proble..."
In response to Reply # 123
Mon Jul-25-16 04:49 PM by RaFromQueens

  

          

Bill got away with fucking POC with tough on crime policies, signing more pro corporate legislation than GWB and abdicated the duties of someone supposedly representing progressives by abandoning the poor and important issues like the death penalty.

Fuck. That.

The biggest enemy of people fighting for the greater good isn't some evil bogeyman, however convenient that may be, it's the people who believe in good enough.

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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Vex_id
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60. "you may be content with that low bar - but many aren't."
In response to Reply # 48
Mon Jul-25-16 08:25 AM by Vex_id

          

But beyond that - the idea that these DNC email leaks aren't bothersome to so many is troubling - and indicative of just how cynical the electorate has become.

Also - it's a bit late to be playing the "this is about defeating Trump!" card. If that was the case - the party would've elected the stronger candidate in a general election as it pertains to defeating Trump: Sanders.

Also - the "We just have to Hillary elected and all will be right in the world" stance is apathetic. So many will breathe a sigh of relief if/when Clinton wins - and I get it - it will be a relief not to have a fascist in the White House. But the work must continue as Clinton has a propensity for secrecy and agenda (within Wall Street; foreign policy establishment etc..)

So yes - Clinton is far preferable to Trump - and there's no way in hell Progressives are going to vote for Trump - but let's not act like this all comes down to a faux binary choice of good v. evil - and if Clinton wins - the good guys win and the world is great again!


-->

  

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DeepAztheRoot
Member since Dec 19th 2003
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Wed Jul-27-16 11:39 AM

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173. "Nothing will change if people don't go against the system"
In response to Reply # 48
Wed Jul-27-16 11:39 AM by DeepAztheRoot

  

          

What incentive do they have to change when the gag-reflex is to vote for (D) or (R) no matter what?

this election is about fear

Trump: fear of Islam, minorities, science, education

HRC: fear of Trump presidency


It's a joke, I want to vote for someone with leadership skills, experience, ethics, integrity, and a plan for the future.... not a vote against somebody

That's why it's Johnson/Weld for me

<-Fear Ameer

  

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RobOne4
Member since Jun 06th 2003
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52. "so which corrupt politician will be replacing the corrupt politician?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

November 8th, 2005 The greatest night in the history of GD!

  

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Frank Longo
Member since Nov 18th 2003
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54. "Here's a great defense of Hillary, btw."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

As if she needed one this season when running against an openly hateful, openly bald-faced lying lunatic with dictatorial tendencies. But people still try to equate their relative "corruptness," which is crazy to me.

http://m.dailykos.com/story/2016/6/11/1537582/-The-most-thorough-profound-and-moving-defense-of-Hillary-Clinton-I-have-ever-seen

My movies: http://russellhainline.com
My movie reviews: https://letterboxd.com/RussellHFilm/
My beer TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@thebeertravelguide

  

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cbk
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Wed Jul-27-16 12:06 PM

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176. "Wow thanks for posting. Very interesting. "
In response to Reply # 54


          

Happy 50th D’Angelo: https://chrisp.bandcamp.com/track/d-50

  

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stattic
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56. "Sanders is not a Democrat and spoke of a revolution to upend"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


the status quo, of course no one in the party machinery wanted him to win. I applaud Bernie for raising important and issues, and his candidacy suggests that perhaps there is an alternative to the broken system that we had.

At the same time, if I were working for the Democratic Party, I would have been working actively to undermine his campaign because it places too much emphasis on the national ticket. Most of the legislation that directly impacts us on an everyday basis occurs locally and in our state legislatures, and at this time, it is arguably more prudent to unify and strengthen the entire Democratic ticket than to throw all of one's eggs into the presidential race.

Earlier on, if Bernie had been more welcoming of down ticket candidates, i.e., hitting the stump and articulating a national strategy to affect change that included other Democrats, I think that he could have minimized the opposition from the party. His candidacy opens the door for a more politically astute agent of change.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Jul-25-16 07:59 AM

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57. "RE: Sanders is not a Democrat and spoke of a revolution to upend"
In response to Reply # 56


          

>
>the status quo, of course no one in the party machinery wanted
>him to win. I applaud Bernie for raising important and issues,
>and his candidacy suggests that perhaps there is an
>alternative to the broken system that we had.
>
>At the same time, if I were working for the Democratic Party,
>I would have been working actively to undermine his campaign
>because it places too much emphasis on the national ticket.
>Most of the legislation that directly impacts us on an
>everyday basis occurs locally and in our state legislatures,
>and at this time, it is arguably more prudent to unify and
>strengthen the entire Democratic ticket than to throw all of
>one's eggs into the presidential race.
>
>Earlier on, if Bernie had been more welcoming of down ticket
>candidates, i.e., hitting the stump and articulating a
>national strategy to affect change that included other
>Democrats, I think that he could have minimized the opposition
>from the party. His candidacy opens the door for a more
>politically astute agent of change.


....period....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79594 posts
Mon Jul-25-16 08:07 AM

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59. "Sanders could have been Hillary light and he woulda stil faced oppositio..."
In response to Reply # 56


          

i think the "shock" is working with the media to do it and having the emails to back it up.



****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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stattic
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61. "He isn't Hilary-lite and isn't a Democrat. He knew that the party"
In response to Reply # 59


  

          


was taking action against him, he didn't need to see emails to convince him of that. I don't see how anyone would think that the party would enthusiastically hand the keys to someone who up until recently was not a member of your party and did not show any interest in supporting your down ticket. Sanders has been around too long to think otherwise, and his response to DWS falling on the sword appropriately signals that this is just a distraction. Although Trump is hysterically trying to make something of this on twitter, this will pass with Sanders' speech at the Convention.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Mon Jul-25-16 08:53 AM

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62. "i know what bernie is..."
In response to Reply # 61


          

thats why I said even if he was a loyal Dem who played ball he wasnt getting the support of Debbie and the DNC in 2016.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Vex_id
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63. "Sanders has always caucused with Democrats."
In response to Reply # 61


          

which is why Sanders has been entitled to committee assignments that have contributed to give Dems a majority in some instances.

He's a Progressive (you know - the Traditional/Left "Great Society" wing of the party). Also - dismissing him as "not a Democrat" trivializes the 43% of votes he received in the primary. The idea that the party doesn't want that gigantic voting bloc because of some restrictive idea of what it means to be a "real Democrat" is absurd at best, suicidal to the party at worst.

Never thought the Democratic Party would be trying to turn itself into a smaller, more restrictive political tent.




-->

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Jul-25-16 09:02 AM

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66. "RE: Sanders has always caucused with Democrats."
In response to Reply # 63


          



Sanders shitted on Obama many times...Even said that someone should run against him during his second term....Dems remember that....

Bernie was viewed as an outsider who while he broke bread with the Dems from time to time, also made it his business to go at them...

Bernie lost the election because he couldn't turn on the Obama coalition. It's really that simple....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Vex_id
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67. "RE: Sanders has always caucused with Democrats."
In response to Reply # 66
Mon Jul-25-16 09:16 AM by Vex_id

          

LOL Bernie didn't "shit on Obama" nearly as much as the Clintons did in 2008 - dog-whistling to prejudiced Democrats.

Give me a break. Obama and Sanders have always had a lot of mutual respect for each other - and Obama continues to compliment Sanders - and vice versa. Having differences with Obama on certain policies is not "shitting on him"

Shitting on him doing what Bill and Hillary did during the 2008 primary - which was shameful.

You're doing way too much.


-->

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Jul-25-16 09:25 AM

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68. "RE: Sanders has always caucused with Democrats."
In response to Reply # 67
Mon Jul-25-16 09:33 AM by murph71

          

The Clintons shitted on Obama DURING A HOTLY CONTESTED PRIMARY ELECTION before he even set foot in the White House...

But the Clintons never were going at dude when he became President because they r hardcore Democrats with a big D...They are about the establishment as Obama had become....And they r all about beating Republicans.

Sanders was never viewed as a Democrat. When he was calling for someone to run against President Obama following his first term that said a lot. When he put Professor C. West (who publicly noted that Obama wasn't even a real black man and that his Presidency was a failure) on the team, people saw that....

Dems never viewed Bernie as a member of their own party. And they voted as such....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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stattic
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85. "I don't know how much his Obama criticism hurt him but I think"
In response to Reply # 68


  

          


that the Clinton primary was the only real obstacle to Obama's presidency. When she fell in line as she lost the primary, and Slick Willie started to stump for him, she pretty much guaranteed that she would have Obama's full support which is meaningful.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Jul-25-16 10:31 AM

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102. "RE: I don't know how much his Obama criticism hurt him but I think"
In response to Reply # 85


          



It hurt with the Obama coalition.....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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stattic
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133. "This is true. "
In response to Reply # 102


  

          

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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Tue Jul-26-16 11:53 PM

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164. "It was opportunism by the Clinton campaign."
In response to Reply # 102


          

Unless you guys are addressing something else....Bernie was criticizing the SYSTEM under which Obama won. So Bernie's philosophy on campaign financing could be construed as a critic of EVERY mainstream politician, including Obama. Clinton seized this by saying 'Obama took money from the corporate world too'....thereby suggesting that if Bernie is calling her 'compromised'...then he's also calling Obama compromised. This obviously didn't play out well with Obama supporters from Bernie's perspective.

  

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stattic
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82. "He caucased but ran as Independent most of his career"
In response to Reply # 63


  

          


and has expressed disdain for the two-party system - that is part of his appeal. Perhaps the Democratic party erred in not warming up to a man that has openly scorned its existence and that move will alienate his supporters. Perhaps he should have shown more willingness to support the down ticket and raised some money for those candidates. If you are a Democrat, I think that Hillary is the better choice because she is an established member of the party and has raised a substantial amount of money for the down ticket. I don't think that this will have much of an impact on the election. The number of his supporters who feel so alienated as to not vote for her or vote for Trump will likely decrease by election date.

  

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Mr. ManC
Member since Jan 26th 2009
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Mon Jul-25-16 10:08 AM

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91. "its not about "handing keys", its about a Democratic process."
In response to Reply # 61


  

          

so Sanders was able to come into their party, against their manipulation and convince 47% of their party that they agreed with him. It is not the Democratic Party's role to offset voters to their invested interests. If you are making that argument then you are basically against democracy. Voters be damned because the DNC wanted their favorite candidate and the end justifies the means, huh?

100% unacceptable. You would think the party with democracy in its name wouldn't fuck it up.

________________________________________________
R.I.P. Soulgyal <3
SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

  

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stattic
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94. "I'm not arguing in support of the DNC. I understand their motivations"
In response to Reply # 91


  

          


and, and if in their shoes, would likely be inclined to support Clinton over Sanders. Our political system is not the purest manifestation of democracy, and the DNC is not an engine of perfect democracy. Their concerns lie with what's best for the party, and they acted accordingly. Directing your angst at me is not productive because you are attacking things that I did not say and beliefs that I do not hold. It is an exercise in futility.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Jul-25-16 10:27 AM

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99. "RE: I'm not arguing in support of the DNC. I understand their motivation..."
In response to Reply # 94


          

>
>and, and if in their shoes, would likely be inclined to
>support Clinton over Sanders. Our political system is not the
>purest manifestation of democracy, and the DNC is not an
>engine of perfect democracy. Their concerns lie with what's
>best for the party, and they acted accordingly. Directing your
>angst at me is not productive because you are attacking things
>that I did not say and beliefs that I do not hold. It is an
>exercise in futility.

Basically...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Mr. ManC
Member since Jan 26th 2009
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Mon Jul-25-16 10:37 AM

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104. "Cool, make that decision."
In response to Reply # 94


  

          

Arrive at that conclusion.

AFTER the votes have been accounted for.

Otherwise you are tilting the scales in place of democracy. That is unacceptable.

________________________________________________
R.I.P. Soulgyal <3
SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Jul-25-16 08:58 AM

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65. "RE: Sanders could have been Hillary light and he woulda stil faced oppos..."
In response to Reply # 59


          



Legs...Everyone knew the DNC didn't want any parts of Sanders. I mean, that much was evident given that the debates were scheduled during odd days to lessen the blow of any impact....

What was inside of those emails was a political party that viewed Bernie as an un-welcomed guest. Because he essentially was...lol

In the end, though, Bernie didn't lose because the DNC was tampering with the state-by-state voting results like some hardcore Bernie heads are now preaching.... He lost because he couldn't get enough blacks and Latinos to back him...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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MiracleRic
Member since Oct 21st 2002
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69. "and now an outsider is running for the Repugs"
In response to Reply # 65


  

          

outsiders are good dude

it's okay to recognize the status quo as shitty

it's ok to want better but still being realistic...still say you want fucking better

that's my issue with most ardent hillary supporters...

i don't even think these emails are that big a deal in the grand scheme but they clearly paint a picture of a political landscape that needs as much change as Obama promised

it's not naive or ill-advised to continue to pressure for that change change WHILE still being smart enough to realize that Hill-dawg is likely to be less of a fuckshit in office...it's ok to recognize both yo

Let me sport my Air Hyperbole 2010s in peace. (c) ansomble

Building repetoires (c) spm since 1983

  

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murph71
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72. "RE: and now an outsider is running for the Repugs"
In response to Reply # 69


          



Fuck Trump....

As for Bernie, he got what he wanted....He has a good amount of his platform in the DNC's own Convention Platform....He's even turned the tide for TPP....Now you can't even be for that shit without looking like a heartless bastard...lol

This entire shit is overblown.....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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MiracleRic
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78. "yall kill me with that platform shit"
In response to Reply # 72


  

          

that shit appears to be complete lip-service but ok

Let me sport my Air Hyperbole 2010s in peace. (c) ansomble

Building repetoires (c) spm since 1983

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Jul-25-16 09:42 AM

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80. "RE: yall kill me with that platform shit"
In response to Reply # 78
Mon Jul-25-16 09:42 AM by murph71

          

>that shit appears to be complete lip-service but ok

U actually think it's lip service given the current political climate and push back against trade policies that seem to shit on everyday workers?

Nah dog....TPP is Obama's baby....For the Democrats to come out and make that a huge part of their agenda says a lot. The TPP issue has now become bigger than political infighting. Dems r not stupid. They have to join that wave....Or else...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Mon Jul-25-16 09:31 AM

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74. "RE: Sanders could have been Hillary light and he woulda stil faced oppos..."
In response to Reply # 65


          


>
>In the end, though, Bernie didn't lose because the DNC was
>tampering with the state-by-state voting results like some
>hardcore Bernie heads are now preaching.... He lost because he
>couldn't get enough blacks and Latinos to back him...

which makes it a head scratcher why the DNC would go one record in emails trying to find ways to hit Bernie.

We all knew Bernie wasnt going to win southern states and would have a hard time winning so why did they do it?

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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76. "RE: Sanders could have been Hillary light and he woulda stil faced oppos..."
In response to Reply # 74


          

>
>>
>>In the end, though, Bernie didn't lose because the DNC was
>>tampering with the state-by-state voting results like some
>>hardcore Bernie heads are now preaching.... He lost because
>he
>>couldn't get enough blacks and Latinos to back him...
>
>which makes it a head scratcher why the DNC would go one
>record in emails trying to find ways to hit Bernie.

No head scratcher at all...The DNC is in the business of electing Democrats. Bernie was not viewed as a Democrat. It's really that simple...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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legsdiamond
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83. "nah, having emails that expose this shit is a problem"
In response to Reply # 76


          

i know yall think its shrugs/cap obvious but having a paper trail is dumb shit.



****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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95. "RE: nah, having emails that expose this shit is a problem"
In response to Reply # 83


          

>i know yall think its shrugs/cap obvious but having a paper
>trail is dumb shit.

No...the only problem is that people now see how the sausage is made....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Mon Jul-25-16 10:39 AM

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106. "so you admit there is a problem... "
In response to Reply # 95


          

thank you

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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128. "RE: so you admit there is a problem... "
In response to Reply # 106


          



No......I admit that the DNC is in the business of pushing Democrats.....Unless the DNC was barnstorming states and making it hard for Bernie voters to vote for their man, then this is basically noise...

Does the optics look bad? Sure.

But there was nothing said in those emails that was a ah-hah!!! moment. We knew from the jump that DNC did not think Bernie was a true Dem and was just utilizing the party to get his platform out there....

Bernie-or-Bust folks have a hard time understanding that it was Obama's coalition that did them in....Not a tipping of the scales...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Mr. ManC
Member since Jan 26th 2009
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Mon Jul-25-16 08:56 AM

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64. "how many people has Hillary asked to run for office?"
In response to Reply # 56


  

          

Bernie has built a coalition. Bernie wants to break the status quo. You are in here defending a party that colluded against the will of the people for their private interests. That is not to your benefit. It is such a catch 22. "Bernie should have run as an Independent". Yeah, and then they would have further excluded him from the national spotlight. "Bernie isn't a real Democrat". Which is what? Being for big banks, against health care and a social safety net? I thought that was what we had Republicans for.

People don't even care about the ISSUES. Yall think Hillary will be a great President, because we can't afford Trump. That is not an argument. If Trump died from a heart attack today your candidate would actually be worse off and would be the most unfavorable candidate of all time, for legitimate reasons.

That you all are so ready to explain away blatant corruption is beyond me. She won, but they cheated. There is no argument there. You are still ok to support that political machine. More power to you and the fight in November. Just know that you are doing so to the exclusion of millions of Americans, and they are not showing up for your candidate.

________________________________________________
R.I.P. Soulgyal <3
SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

  

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MiracleRic
Member since Oct 21st 2002
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71. "i don't see it as cheating and i was a bernie supporter"
In response to Reply # 64


  

          

the DNC doesn't have the people's interests at heart...the have the DNC's interests...

we have to demand the right shit from them and pick a time with slightly lower stakes to completely disavow the party

Let me sport my Air Hyperbole 2010s in peace. (c) ansomble

Building repetoires (c) spm since 1983

  

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Mr. ManC
Member since Jan 26th 2009
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Mon Jul-25-16 10:17 AM

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93. "reply 27"
In response to Reply # 71


  

          

________________________________________________
R.I.P. Soulgyal <3
SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

  

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stattic
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Mon Jul-25-16 09:32 AM

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75. "I am not defending her or the party neither is she my candidate"
In response to Reply # 64


  

          

However, I am not naive enough to think that the Democratic Party would or should support someone who is only running to be the candidate and has not vested interest in the party. The rest of your reply is noise. I never said that I supported Hillary nor that I believe what they DNC did was ethical, just that I understand their motivations and that he could have helped himself out if he had been more willing to compromise.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79594 posts
Mon Jul-25-16 09:36 AM

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79. "same boat... but now we have a DNC where Debbie and Russia are front"
In response to Reply # 75


          

and center because the DNC was so giddy for HRC they got sloppy.

We all knew the DNC was for Hillary gotdammit, dud we really need to see the proof in emails?

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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stattic
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84. "It wasn't even necessary. She was probably going to win"
In response to Reply # 79


  

          


Certainly foolish and tone def to the myriad ways electronic communications can be accessed.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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111. "yup, but just in case they made sure of it...lol"
In response to Reply # 84


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Mr. ManC
Member since Jan 26th 2009
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Mon Jul-25-16 10:05 AM

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89. "then why even have Democracy? Why even have the debate?"
In response to Reply # 75


  

          

Why call yourself the Democratic if democracy doesn't matter?

Party first or country first? They didn't marginalize Bernie Sanders. He's still going to be in the Senate. They marginalized his supporters, VOTERS, and that's ok? Why because the voters don't know what they want, because they should want Hillary?

And then people defend this 2 party system. What is even the point then? If my vote doesn't matter and they can just do what they want then why should it matter whether I vote for Hillary or not in November? I can't believe people are so willing to accept all this.

(not specifically at you, but overall)

________________________________________________
R.I.P. Soulgyal <3
SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

  

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stattic
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101. "All good questions, and speaking for myself, I make voting decisions"
In response to Reply # 89


  

          


based on my options. There are two now, and I feel one is preferable over the other. I agree with everything that you said, but I am also pragmatic and don't think Bernie was the candidate to affect real change as a President. I think that requires someone younger, with a little more savvy, and who is willing to view the long game. Maybe I'm wrong and change will never happen.

  

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Mr. ManC
Member since Jan 26th 2009
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Mon Jul-25-16 10:42 AM

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109. "RE: All good questions, and speaking for myself, I make voting decisions"
In response to Reply # 101


  

          

>
>based on my options. There are two now, and I feel one is
>preferable over the other. I agree with everything that you
>said, but I am also pragmatic and don't think Bernie was the
>candidate to affect real change as a President. I think that
>requires someone younger, with a little more savvy, and who is
>willing to view the long game. Maybe I'm wrong and change will
>never happen.

So the guy who can't get things done was able to in one year sweep into the Democratic party, talk half of it, and then leverage that into at the very least lip service for major progressive issues, however he needs to be a little more savvy and pragmatic? He has been an example in savvy politicking and pragmatism. He endorsed your candidate because he knew the deck is stacked against him and there numbers aren't there for a 3rd party run, but he got more done in this PRIMARY than Hillary has done as a Senator or Secretary of State for progressive issues.

________________________________________________
R.I.P. Soulgyal <3
SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

  

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MiracleRic
Member since Oct 21st 2002
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Mon Jul-25-16 11:23 AM

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117. "meh, he's been able to do that for reasons that have little to do with h..."
In response to Reply # 109


  

          

the same reasons trump was even worthy of mentioning in the first place...

it's kinda weird to be anti-establishment for so long and then join the establishment's party...

I was teamBernie....more bc i don't like anything Clinton than any of the other good reasons to be so...

people are desperately looking for change...voting for the lesser of 2 evils aint change but it's necessary here as much as i hate to admit it...

3rd party folks simply need to wreck shit locally for a sustainable amount of time before a 3rd party becomes viable...the whole if you can't beat em join em strategy was flawed from jump and it appears "most" of the conspiring these folks did really didn't mean shit

Let me sport my Air Hyperbole 2010s in peace. (c) ansomble

Building repetoires (c) spm since 1983

  

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Case_One
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Mon Jul-25-16 09:31 AM

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73. "Game, Set, Match!"
In response to Reply # 56


          


.
.
.

  

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rob
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119. "how many congressional seats/state offices have they lost under dws/kain..."
In response to Reply # 56


  

          

the internal logic of claiming bernie's dnc problem is he doesn't care about the party isn't very strong when you hold up the mirror. i don't think they really believe that, and it's part of the same messaging as the dishonesty you see in the leaks.

at least, i hope they aren't lying to themselves about that. the optics and effectiveness indicate that dnc strategists haven't been working towards anything but electing hrc this cycle. they had real trouble getting people to run for big offices, and no success at all recruiting credible candidates for smaller ones.

other than bho and the people the dnc have held at arms length, where is the excitement in the party? where's the voter turnout? where's the organization and message?

  

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
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Mon Jul-25-16 10:06 AM

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90. "Ramen Hair Debbie Dolezal needs to get the full Rev. Wright treatment"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

i.e. people don't shut up about her until Hillary has to completely remove her from her campaign

she fucked this up. Hillary couldn't just let her be a "surrogate" in a state.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Jul-25-16 10:26 AM

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98. "The only thing...."
In response to Reply # 0


          



any Dem should be worried about is if Shultz is allowed to speak at the convention. If she is allowed to gavel in the proceedings tonight, The Dems deserve to lose....That's political malpractice....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Vex_id
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Mon Jul-25-16 10:38 AM

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105. "RE: The only thing...."
In response to Reply # 98


          

bruh - she already spoke this morning.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lddlSFXWxNQ

the arrogance is astounding. She's making this about her.

-->

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Jul-25-16 10:41 AM

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107. "RE: The only thing...."
In response to Reply # 105
Mon Jul-25-16 10:42 AM by murph71

          

>bruh - she already spoke this morning.
>
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lddlSFXWxNQ
>
>the arrogance is astounding. She's making this about her.


No...that's not the Convention....She was talking to her Florida delegates...No one gives a shit about that....

But all hell will break loose if she gavels in the actual Convention. Like I said, the Dems deserve to lose if they let her step foot on that floor...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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115. "obviously they DO care about it. She needs to stfu"
In response to Reply # 107


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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RaFromQueens
Member since Apr 18th 2006
19528 posts
Mon Jul-25-16 10:42 AM

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108. "She brought up the teenage shooting victims and that she had cancer. "
In response to Reply # 105


  

          

This woman is scum.

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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114. "WTF???? "
In response to Reply # 105


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Mon Jul-25-16 11:03 AM

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112. "dawg, she shouldn't be anywhere near Philly"
In response to Reply # 98


          

she should be in Florida or in the beltway getting her hair permed

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Overqualified
Member since May 03rd 2006
4543 posts
Mon Jul-25-16 11:04 AM

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113. "Nevermind stacking the deck..were crimes committed?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Possible money laundering to the Clinton campaign? Collusion with the Governor of RI to impact the election? That's what's most troubling.

Streets won't let me chill.

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
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Mon Jul-25-16 11:31 AM

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118. "Putin being behind the hack fucks up erything (link)"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Especially considering Trump's alleged ties.

http://motherboard.vice.com/read/all-signs-point-to-russia-being-behind-the-dnc-hack

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." � Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Mon Jul-25-16 01:10 PM

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121. "bruh, blaming russia sounds like a great way to lose"
In response to Reply # 118


          

the hack isnt the problem, the info in the emails is the problem

and lets say Russia is behind it... all it shows is the DNC is weak on defense.

emails and Hillary isnt a good look any way you slice it.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Mon Jul-25-16 01:28 PM

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124. "That's exactly what they said about "climategate.""
In response to Reply # 121


          

>the hack isnt the problem, the info in the emails is the
>problem

But there was nothing in those emails, just like there's nothing in these emails. They just give fodder to idiots with an axe to grind. It is a politically manufactured distraction.

The hack IS the problem.

  

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SeV
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Mon Jul-25-16 01:43 PM

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125. "a foreign govt. tinkering with our elections ain't a problem?"
In response to Reply # 121


  

          

Via hacking?

Yal Bernie bros r incredibly short sighted

The info in those emails ain't shyt

I can't imagine the shyt that was said about Obama if u think that's bad


____________

Dallas Cavericks LETS GO!!

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Jul-25-16 02:20 PM

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127. "RE: a foreign govt. tinkering with our elections ain't a problem?"
In response to Reply # 125


          

>Via hacking?
>
>Yal Bernie bros r incredibly short sighted
>
>The info in those emails ain't shyt
>
>I can't imagine the shyt that was said about Obama if u think
>that's bad

Fuck Obama...Imagine what Rence and the RNC gang was saying about Trump....lol

It's amazing...I even read somewhere where a Bernie supporter said during a Philly march that she would rather have 4 years of Trump doing nothing than four years of Clinton. These people are nuts...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Mon Jul-25-16 02:37 PM

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132. "Exactly. Reince is on message today,"
In response to Reply # 127


          


saying "it's outrageous how the DNC treated Bernie Sanders! RNC staffers would have never said any such thing about a Republican candidate!" Does anyone actually believe those fuckers held their tongues about Donald Trump in the primaries? They said harsher things about Donald Trump IN PUBLIC. One can only imagine what they said in emails.

And so far the press is completely falling for it.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Mon Jul-25-16 07:04 PM

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145. "the DNC was warned a year ago about hackers"
In response to Reply # 125


          

why the hell they using email for this info?

and if there wasn't anything in them was is Debbie resigning?

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Jul-25-16 02:14 PM

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126. "RE: bruh, blaming russia sounds like a great way to lose"
In response to Reply # 121
Mon Jul-25-16 02:17 PM by murph71

          


lol....

Nah...

This is a national security action that can affect all strains of our government...The same Putin/Russia-backed group that hacked into the DNC also hacked into the Pentagon....

There's no way to discount that in any shape, form or fashion...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
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144. "you are completely missing the point"
In response to Reply # 121


  

          

It's no longer about the candidates, or individual security when a foreign party is actively interfering with our election cycle. I honestly don't give two shits about any of this shit, but I'll be damned if I'm ok with Putin playing chess using US politicians as pawns. And if Trump has any ties to it, it is really fucked.

If the allegations are true its an effort to further divide the party by outside forces to help the worst candidate have the best chance of winning. That's some scary ass shit fam.

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." � Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Tue Jul-26-16 01:55 PM

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150. "nah, the shit sounds like a bad excuse... "
In response to Reply # 144


          

when caught... blame russia, muslims, etc..

yeah, cause thats the real problem

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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j.
Member since Feb 24th 2009
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Mon Jul-25-16 02:31 PM

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130. "Repug base has shifted to admiring Putin"
In response to Reply # 118


  

          

you know, a strong leader who takes no shit from anyone
they're basically sending him flowers at this point
thanking him for exposing the DNC

It's sad really

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Jul-25-16 03:21 PM

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134. "RE: Repug base has shifted to admiring Putin"
In response to Reply # 130


          

>you know, a strong leader who takes no shit from anyone
>they're basically sending him flowers at this point
>thanking him for exposing the DNC
>
>It's sad really

This ^^^^^ is the scary point that few people want to talk about....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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poetx
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Mon Jul-25-16 05:56 PM

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143. "because, at the end of the day... WHITE. after years of red baiting and "
In response to Reply # 130


  

          

commie bashing -- all the saul alinskky shit is a VERY recent example, they are openly admiring a russian dictator. shit is nuts.

the mccain wing, and his foreign policy people were egging on the country to go to war with russia over georgia. think about that shit. but trump sending this ni&&a love letters.

they have zero morals, scruples, nor even the semblance of continuity in their beliefs.


peace & blessings,

x.

www.twitter.com/poetx

=========================================
I'm an advocate for working smarter, not harder. If you just
focus on working hard you end up making someone else rich and
not having much to show for it. (c) mad

  

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juce72
Member since Oct 20th 2011
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Mon Jul-25-16 08:40 PM

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146. "sometimes, you have to win 5 vs 8"
In response to Reply # 0


          

part of the deal, when the refs screw you, you still have to find a way, they couldn't do it.

and more evident this year, when trump did what bernie couldn't, win the nomination in spite of the party's national committee not wanting him to win it

please get over it.

  

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_explain555
Member since Oct 15th 2009
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Tue Jul-26-16 01:47 PM

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148. "Assange shuttin down Russia connection, says its bs (swipe)"
In response to Reply # 0


          



Says its what Hilldawg camp wants people to think


woooweee!


http://www.cnbc.com/2016/07/25/wikileaks-founder-julian-assange-no-proof-russian-intelligence-responsible-for-dnc-hack.html

WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange says "there is no proof whatsoever" that Russian intelligence is behind the thousands of hacked emails from the Democratic National Committee that WikiLeaks released.

"The real story is what these emails contain and they show collusion," Assange said during an interview with NBC News that will air Monday night on "NBC Nightly News with Lester Holt."

While three cybersecurity experts told NBC that the DNC emails were hacked by Russian intelligence, Assange stressed that Wikileaks has not disclosed the source of the leak.

"Well there is no proof of that whatsoever. We have not disclosed our source, and of course, this is a diversion that's being pushed by the Hillary Clinton campaign," he said in an interview.
Since the emails came to light, Debbie Wasserman Schultz has announced she will resign as chair of the Democratic National Committee.

Wasserman Schultz came under fire after emails showing officials from the DNC plotted against Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders' presidential campaign.

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Tue Jul-26-16 01:53 PM

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149. "Well there's a guy with every reason to be honest and upfront"
In response to Reply # 148


          


about his sources.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Tue Jul-26-16 02:03 PM

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152. "the content is the story"
In response to Reply # 149


          

and its best to just admit it, fire DWS and move on.

It would be foolish to try and prove it was russia and drag this "non story" any further

ficking idiots, stop blaming russia, stfu and let it die down.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Tue Jul-26-16 02:09 PM

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154. "There can be multiple stories."
In response to Reply # 152


          


The content of the emails was a complete non-story that got inflated by tabloid press and has already died down as nobody has actually found any troubling content.

The question of Russian involvement is an entirely separate story.

  

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legsdiamond
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Tue Jul-26-16 02:18 PM

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155. "DWS was fired due to the content"
In response to Reply # 154
Tue Jul-26-16 02:20 PM by legsdiamond

          

and making this about russia and dragging it out is a horrible idea.

best thing to do was eat it, throw Debbie to the wolves and KIM.

now we will hear about this russia bullshit for the next month and if the DNC and Hilldawg are lying, its not a good look.

if Russia did hack, OK... but its russia, now what? whats the next move?

eat it and move the fuck on. nothing good will come of stretching this story out.



Do you really want more stories about this shit? You really want Trump screaming about how incompetent the DNC is and how they tried to blame him? That is a horrible, horrible idea. Are yall really this dumb? This gullible?

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Tue Jul-26-16 02:33 PM

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156. "She was fired because it was the morning of the convention"
In response to Reply # 155


          


and we didn't have time to argue about it.

>and making this about russia and dragging it out is a
>horrible idea.

Nobody's "making" it about Russia. It either is about Russia or it isn't about Russia. That question is an entirely separate story. And, I feel, a far more interesting one.

>best thing to do was eat it, throw Debbie to the wolves and
>KIM.

As they did.

>now we will hear about this russia bullshit for the next month
>and if the DNC and Hilldawg are lying, its not a good look.

Lying about what? DNC people never claimed to have direct evidence. All they've said is that independent security experts found even before the data dump that the DNC email system appears to have been hacked by Russian agents, and said so publically. If they turn out to be wrong, so be it, good look or otherwise.

>if Russia did hack, OK... but its russia, now what? whats the
>next move?

I don't know, and I don't think anybody does. That's why it's an interesting story.

>eat it and move the fuck on. nothing good will come of
>stretching this story out.

Nobody is stretching it out. I guarantee you nobody will bring up the DNC emails in the convention speeches tonight.


>Do you really want more stories about this shit? You really
>want Trump screaming about how incompetent the DNC is and how
>they tried to blame him?

Do you really think anybody has control over what Trump screams about?

Even so, do you really think Trump is helped when people are reminded of his bromances with autocratic dictators?

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Tue Jul-26-16 04:01 PM

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158. "LOL, now George Will is out there saying"
In response to Reply # 155
Tue Jul-26-16 04:01 PM by stravinskian

          

the reason Trump isn't releasing his tax returns is that they will reveal the amount of money he's getting these days in loans from Russian oligarchs. (The Trump children have admitted that he gets a lot of money from Russian oligarchs now that banks don't want to associate with him. But we don't have numbers on paper yet.)

Yes, we do want to be talking about Trump's tax returns.

  

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Mr. ManC
Member since Jan 26th 2009
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Wed Jul-27-16 05:59 AM

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166. "it is rich aeeing Clinton supporters so up"
In response to Reply # 154


  

          

in arms about this hack and Russia and their ulterior motive when just 2 weeks ago the vulnerability of her orivate server was no big deal.

DNC leaks getting out? Russia is such a bad guy. Confidential e-mails exposed to Russia? Eh, Hillary didn't mean to do that.

Plus if Russia is behind this and wants Trump elected what stops them from releasing more e-mails on November 7th?

It's the risk you take.

________________________________________________
R.I.P. Soulgyal <3
SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
42239 posts
Wed Jul-27-16 06:10 AM

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168. "down playing how is stupider"
In response to Reply # 166


  

          

I'm apolitical.
I know some tech shit.
I don't read the political shit.
I read the tech shit.
But even I can recognize how politics, especially global politics are being affected by this tech shit.

"The larger operation, with its manipulative traits, fits well into the wider framework of Russia’s evolving military doctrine, known as New Generation Warfare or the “Gerasimov Doctrine,” named after Valery Gerasimov, the current Chief of the General Staff of the Armed Forces. This new mindset drastically expands what qualifies as a military target, and it expands what qualifies as military tactic. Deception and disinformation are part and parcel of this new approach, as are “camouflage and concealment,” as the Israeli analyst Dima Adamsky pointed out in an important study of Russia’s evolving strategic art published in November last year.

“Informational struggle,” Adamsky observes, is at the center of New Generation Warfare. Informational struggle means “technological and psychological components designed to manipulate the adversary’s picture of reality, misinform it, and eventually interfere with the decision-making process of individuals, organizations, governments, and societies.”

*****

We're talking cointelpro on the global scale. AS was noted in another link, thes things are now a part of standard espionage practice. All of the big gov's are hacking each other right now as we speak. What they aren't doing is making that information public to affect other nations or at least not so blantantly against the US. This type of thing can be a tipping point because as was noted making them public has the affect of weaponizing, and after we start going down that slippery slope it's not long before you get to acts of war.

That's the shit I'm concerned about far more than the contents of the emails. The how and why and when doesn't add up to anything but....

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." � Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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Vex_id
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Tue Jul-26-16 01:59 PM

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151. "Clinton will escalate conflict w/ Russia."
In response to Reply # 148


          

Her foreign policy will deviate considerably from the brilliant diplomacy and restraint that Obama has shown. During the Russia-Ukraine crisis - many voices were calling for escalation (including Clinton) - but Obama exercised restraint and was on record saying he didn't want to start a nuclear war over the Ukraine situation - as troubling as it was.

The situation in that region is incredibly delicate - particularly with the newfound instability and unreliability of Turkey (an actual party to NATO). Calm, measured, and diplomatic minds are needed right now - not those who want to escalate conflicts for geo-strategic positioning.

Re: WikiLeaks coordinating with Russia (who is in league w/ Trump) is hyperbole - but it's a known fact that Russia (along with many other governments) actively hack into our servers. If Clinton has direct evidence that Putin is in league with Trump and released these e-mails directly to hurt her campaign - then she should show their work and present evidence before launching some dangerous allegations that will only escalate tension in a delicate relationship.

-->

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79594 posts
Tue Jul-26-16 02:06 PM

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153. "another story about some gotdamn emails.."
In response to Reply # 151


          

and its lazy as shit to blame our enemy for doing what enemies do.

makes us look weak on security.

smarten up and stop using email to do dirt.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Tue Jul-26-16 02:41 PM

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157. "He also blamed the jews. "
In response to Reply # 148


  

          

https://www.rawstory.com/2016/07/wikileaks-accused-of-anti-semitism-for-using-echoes-in-tweet-insulting-critics/


>
>
>Says its what Hilldawg camp wants people to think
>
>
>woooweee!
>
>
>http://www.cnbc.com/2016/07/25/wikileaks-founder-julian-assange-no-proof-russian-intelligence-responsible-for-dnc-hack.html
>
>WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange says "there is no proof
>whatsoever" that Russian intelligence is behind the thousands
>of hacked emails from the Democratic National Committee that
>WikiLeaks released.
>
>"The real story is what these emails contain and they show
>collusion," Assange said during an interview with NBC News
>that will air Monday night on "NBC Nightly News with Lester
>Holt."
>
>While three cybersecurity experts told NBC that the DNC emails
>were hacked by Russian intelligence, Assange stressed that
>Wikileaks has not disclosed the source of the leak.
>
>"Well there is no proof of that whatsoever. We have not
>disclosed our source, and of course, this is a diversion
>that's being pushed by the Hillary Clinton campaign," he said
>in an interview.
>Since the emails came to light, Debbie Wasserman Schultz has
>announced she will resign as chair of the Democratic National
>Committee.
>
>Wasserman Schultz came under fire after emails showing
>officials from the DNC plotted against Vermont Sen. Bernie
>Sanders' presidential campaign.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Tue Jul-26-16 04:36 PM

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159. "RE: Assange shuttin down Russia connection, says its bs (swipe)"
In response to Reply # 148


          



Yeah...it doesn't matter what Assange says...

It really doesn't even matter what the Clinton team says....The only word that matters is the hacking community which really could give two shits if Clinton or Trump wins...And the mainstream investigative work that's been presented says that Russia-backed hackers targeted a rival nations' political party...Whether it was to benefit Trump or just to be on some mischievous shit is moot. Any foreign hostile attacking our country should be not be treated like a joke...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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imcvspl
Member since Mar 07th 2005
42239 posts
Tue Jul-26-16 07:04 PM

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161. "He may not have known, and lacks counter evidence... peep"
In response to Reply # 148
Tue Jul-26-16 07:04 PM by imcvspl

  

          

That Assange's source isn't Russian is whatever. The question of how it actually was stolen is where the indicators are.

"The two groups were well-known in the security industry as “APT 28” and “APT 29.” APT stands for Advanced Persistent Threat—usually jargon for spies."

"APT 29, suspected to be the FSB, had been on the DNC’s network since at least summer 2015. APT 28, identified as Russia’s military intelligence agency GRU, had breached the Democrats only in April 2016, and probably tipped off the investigation."

"The metadata in the leaked documents are perhaps most revealing: one dumped document was modified using Russian language settings, by a user named “Феликс Эдмундович,” a code name referring to the founder of the Soviet Secret Police, the Cheka, memorialised in a 15-ton iron statue in front of the old KGB headquarters during Soviet times. The original intruders made other errors: one leaked document included hyperlink error messages in Cyrillic, the result of editing the file on a computer with Russian language settings. After this mistake became public, the intruders removed the Cyrillic information from the metadata in the next dump and carefully used made-up user names from different world regions, thereby confirming they had made a mistake in the first round."

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." � Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
12698 posts
Tue Jul-26-16 06:49 PM

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160. "Toobin: No scandal in the DNC emails."
In response to Reply # 0


          

It's funny how people are slowly coming around to realize that this whole fiasco arose completely out of people's imaginations.

http://www.newyorker.com/news/daily-comment/why-the-d-n-c-e-mails-arent-scandalous

WHY THE D.N.C. E-MAILS AREN’T SCANDALOUS
By Jeffrey Toobin , 07:15 P.M.


Te great e-mail-leak crisis of the Democratic National Convention may soon become yesterday’s news, but the story offers a useful window into what’s likely to be an increasingly common scenario.

To review: shortly before the Democratic Convention opened in Philadelphia this week, Wikileaks released a collection of almost twenty thousand e-mails by and to staff members of the Democratic National Committee. In the resulting brouhaha, Debbie Wasserman Schultz, the Florida congresswoman, was forced to step down as the chair of the committee. (No one mourned her departure, apparently, because she was universally unpopular.)

Why did D.W.S., as she is known, have to leave the D.N.C.? Well, the gist is that Bernie Sanders and his supporters took offense at what appeared in several e-mails to be bias in favor of Hillary Clinton at Democratic Party headquarters, which is supposed to be neutral territory in a nomination fight. (The Washington Post has helpfully laid out “the most damaging things” contained in the e-mails.)

Sanders and his campaign had long publicly maintained that D.W.S. and the D.N.C. had worked to help Clinton during the primaries—by, for example, scheduling only a handful of debates, often in the viewing ghetto of Saturday night. In other words, there was already bad blood between the Sanders team and the D.N.C., which made this week’s unpleasantness deeply unsurprising. What was so terrible about the e-mails? In one, a D.N.C. staffer raised the possibility of Sanders being asked about his religious views, though it appears nothing came of the suggestion. In another, D.W.S. referred to a Sanders campaign official who had criticized her as a “damn liar.” A third showed her explicitly criticizing Sanders himself, saying he had “no understanding” of the Democratic Party. (This might be because Sanders has never been elected as a Democrat but, rather, always as an independent who caucuses with the Democrats in the Senate.)

Do these e-mails strike anyone as appalling and outrageous? Not me. They strike me as . . . e-mails. The idea that people might speak casually or caustically via e-mail has been portrayed as a shocking breach of civilized discourse. Imagine! People bullshitting on e-mail!

But that is what people do on e-mail. They spout off, sound off, write first, and think later. Of course, people should do none of these things. They should weigh carefully the costs and benefits of each e-mail that they write, and consider the possibility that someone might make the e-mails public someday. (They should also change their passwords regularly and get lots of exercise.) Last year, unfiltered talk on e-mail also got several people in trouble in the notorious Sony hack. But the real question is whether any of these e-mails really matter. Do they reveal deep-seated political or philosophical flaws? Do they betray horrible character defects? In the case of the Democrats, it seems clear that the answer to these questions is no. The vast majority of the e-mails contain normal office chatter, inflated into a genuine controversy by people who already had axes to grind.

These sorts of issues are likely to recur, in the political world, the business world, and elsewhere. Hacks are virtually certain to become more common. Russian operatives are suspected of orchestrating the D.N.C. hack in an attempt to disrupt the Democratic Convention and help Vladimir Putin’s favored Presidential candidate, Donald Trump. But, beyond this single case, the sophistication of hackers, Russian or otherwise, is likely to outpace the rigor of e-mail-security measures for the foreseeable future. That means we’ll again be asked to parse the meaning of barely thought-through e-mails that were never meant to be public. We’ll all be better off if we evaluate e-mails in the spirit in which they’re written—or, better yet, write them off accordingly.

  

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rob
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Tue Jul-26-16 07:17 PM

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162. "telling that there's a paragraph downplaying the racism in the sony emai..."
In response to Reply # 160


  

          

casual bias is still bias.

  

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DeepAztheRoot
Member since Dec 19th 2003
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Wed Jul-27-16 11:52 AM

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175. "exactly"
In response to Reply # 162


  

          

it's funny that Trump, and rightly so, gets criticism for his attacks on Islam

but the DNC can target Bernie for his Jewish faith

Trump calls Mexican immigrants murderers and rapists and has a much ridiculed social media post pandering to Latinos with a taco bowl.

the DNC says "the taco bowl demographic"

....Meanwhile Gary Johnson truthfully says they are more law abiding than native American citizens and Trumps comments are racist and incendiary

<-Fear Ameer

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Tue Jul-26-16 09:15 PM

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163. " Spy Agency Consensus Grows That Russia Hacked D.N.C. (NYT)"
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Tue Jul-26-16 09:17 PM by murph71

          




Spy Agency Consensus Grows That Russia Hacked D.N.C.

By DAVID E. SANGER and ERIC SCHMITTJULY 26, 2016


WASHINGTON — American intelligence agencies have told the White House they now have “high confidence” that the Russian government was behind the theft of emails and documents from the Democratic National Committee, according to federal officials who have been briefed on the evidence.

But intelligence agencies have cautioned that they are uncertain whether the electronic break-in at the committee’s computer systems was intended as fairly routine cyberespionage — of the kind the United States also conducts around the world — or as part of an effort to manipulate the 2016 presidential election.

The emails were released by WikiLeaks, whose founder, Julian Assange, has made it clear that he hoped to harm Hillary Clinton’s chances of winning the presidency. It is unclear how the documents made their way to the group. But a large sampling was published before the WikiLeaks release by several news organizations and someone who called himself “Guccifer 2.0,” who investigators now believe was an agent of the G.R.U., Russia’s military intelligence service.

The assessment by the intelligence community of Russian involvement in the D.N.C. hack, which largely echoes the findings of private cybersecurity firms that have examined the electronic fingerprints left by the intruders, leaves President Obama and his national security aides with a difficult diplomatic and political decision: Whether to publicly accuse the government of President Vladimir V. Putin of engineering the hack.

Such a public accusation could result in a further deterioration of the already icy relationship between Washington and Moscow, at a moment when the administration is trying to reach an accord with Mr. Putin on a cease-fire in Syria and on other issues. It could also doom any effort to reach some kind of agreement about acceptable behavior in cyberspace, of the kind the United States has been discussing with China.

Stealing information about another country’s political infighting is hardly new, and the United States has conducted covert collection from allies like Germany and adversaries like Russia for decades. Publishing the documents — what some have called “weaponizing” them — is a different issue. Mrs. Clinton’s campaign has suggested that Mr. Putin was trying to even the score after the former secretary of state denounced a 2011 Russian election as filled with fraud.

“The first thing that the secretary of state did was say that they were not honest and not fair, but she had not even yet received the material from the observers,” Mr. Putin said at the time. “She set the tone for some actors in our country and gave them a signal,” Mr. Putin continued. “They heard the signal and, with the support of the U.S. State Department, began active work.”

Campaign officials have also suggested that Mr. Putin could be trying to tilt the election to Donald J. Trump. But they acknowledge that they have no evidence.

Asked on Tuesday at the Democratic convention in Philadelphia whether “there’s more to the Trump/Russian relationship that hasn’t come out,” John Podesta, the Clinton campaign chairman, said, “Well he certainly has a bromance with Mr. Putin, so I don’t know.” Mr. Podesta said that while Russia has a “history” of interfering in democratic elections in Europe, it would be “unprecedented in the United States.”

The Republican platform, adopted last week in Cleveland, calls on the United States to “respond in kind and in greater magnitude” to cyberattacks, saying that “Russia and China see cyber operations as part of a warfare strategy during peacetime. Our response should be to cause diplomatic, financial and legal pain.”

But the Trump campaign has dismissed the accusations about Russia as a deliberate distraction, meant to draw attention away from the content of nearly 20,000 emails and documents from the Democratic committee that were released by WikiLeaks starting on Friday. They showed efforts to impugn Senator Bernie Sanders of Vermont in his effort to challenge Mrs. Clinton for the nomination.

Secretary of State John Kerry raised the attack on the D.N.C. with his Russian counterpart, Sergey V. Lavrov, on Tuesday at a meeting of foreign ministers in Vientiane, Laos. Mr. Lavrov dismissed the idea that Russia was involved, telling reporters who asked about the charges: “I don’t want to use four-letter words.”

Mr. Kerry made no accusations, saying that he had to allow the F.B.I. to “do its work” before he drew “any conclusions in terms of what happened or who’s behind it.”

The federal investigation, involving the F.B.I. and the intelligence agencies, has been going on since the Democratic National Committee first called in a private cybersecurity firm, Crowdstrike, in April.

Preliminary conclusions were discussed on Thursday at a weekly cyberintelligence meeting for senior officials. The Crowdstrike report, supported by several other firms that have examined the same bits of code and telltale “metadata” left on documents that were released before WikiLeaks’ publication of the larger trove, concludes that the Federal Security Service, known as the F.S.B., entered the committee’s networks last summer.

The G.R.U., a competing, military intelligence unit, was a later arrival. Investigators believe it is the G.R.U. that has played a bigger role in releasing the emails.

In an essay published on Lawfare, a blog that often deals with cyberissues, Susan Hennessey, previously a lawyer for the National Security Agency, called the published evidence about Russian involvement “about as close to a smoking gun as can be expected when a sophisticated nation-state is involved.” Mr. Assange’s threat to release documents, she wrote, “means, put simply, that actors outside the U.S. are using criminal means to influence the outcome of a US election. That’s a problem.”

But American intelligence agencies have their doubts that the Russian intention, at least initially, was to sway the American election. The intrusion began just shortly after Mr. Trump announced his candidacy for the Republican nomination. At the time, his chances looked minuscule. One senior official noted that while the cyberattack might have been intended to embarrass Mrs. Clinton, who was the presumptive nominee, it could not have been aimed at bolstering Mr. Trump.

It is far from clear that Mr. Obama or the F.B.I. director, James Comey, would ever name Russia as the origin of the hack. Mr. Obama has only once accused a country of attacking an American organization, when he said that North Korea was the source of the 2014 attack against Sony Pictures Entertainment. But the United States has no relationship with North Korea, and there was little to lose from identifying it.

In the case of Russia and China — countries with which the United States has complex relationships — Mr. Obama has in the past made the opposite decision. He never named the Russian intelligence agencies as the perpetrators of hacks on the State Department and White House unclassified email systems, or on the Joint Chiefs of Staff.

While the administration has called out the People’s Liberation Army of China for stealing intellectual property, it never publicly accused the Chinese intelligence services of stealing the security-clearance files on more than 21 million Americans who held or applied for clearances.

By happenstance, the intelligence report on the D.N.C. hack was circulating here on the day that Mr. Obama issued a new policy, long in development, to organize the government’s response to major cyberattacks and to set up a six-point “grading system” to assess the severity of strikes against American companies, government agencies and organizations.

The action against the Democratic committee, they said, would qualify as a “significant cyber incident,” which was defined as one that causes “demonstrable harm to the national security interests, foreign relations or economy of the United States, or to the public confidence, civil liberties or public health and safety of the American people.”

Ranking the D.N.C. hack in the pantheon of other penetrated networks is difficult. The top ranking under Mr. Obama’s system would be reserved for an attack that disabled American power grids, for example, akin to the suspected Russian attack on Ukraine’s electrical system in December. The attack on the Office of Personnel Management and Sony, which destroyed 70 percent of the studio’s computers, would also rank above the “category 3” level, which defines a “significant” attack.

But the ranking system does not mandate what kind of response the president would authorize. And it was designed before many in Washington imagined the use of cyberattacks to release information in the midst of a dizzying, and volatile, presidential campaign.

David E. Sanger reported from Washington, and Eric Schmitt from Colorado Springs. Amy Chozick contributed reporting from Philadelphia.





GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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LegacyNS
Member since Jan 16th 2004
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Wed Jul-27-16 01:30 AM

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165. "Assange has more emails coming... lol"
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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<---- 5....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlgiritpmfo

=======================================

  

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Mr. ManC
Member since Jan 26th 2009
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Wed Jul-27-16 06:01 AM

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167. "can't wait. and no one has explained how"
In response to Reply # 165


  

          

Hillary is safe from another leak release, in an "October surpruse" sort of way. If it IS Russia's fault.

________________________________________________
R.I.P. Soulgyal <3
SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
12698 posts
Wed Jul-27-16 11:45 AM

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174. "Uhh, who ever said she is?"
In response to Reply # 167


          


Are you trying to claim that she's somehow MORE susceptible to October surprises than other candidates?

Given that the opposition has been throwing their best ammunition at her for decades, and that her team has a lot of experience at dealing with such crises, I think most would agree that she's less susceptible than most candidates, not more. But nobody can completely rule out the possibility of an October surprise.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Wed Jul-27-16 07:26 AM

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169. "Seth with the reality check on...."
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...the Bernie or Bust folk....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HvV2JY8kbgI

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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rob
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Wed Jul-27-16 08:00 AM

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170. "more people out there wasting energy on Bernie or Bust"
In response to Reply # 169


  

          

than actual Bernie or Bust people. it really isn't worth the time.

kind of ridiculous for a group of people who claim to be all business to act like shaming, belittling, and jokes is what's going to change people's minds. it's especially ridiculous when by all accounts the shift from Bernie to Hillary is already well under way among his supporters, and when it seems obvious that giving them some time and letting hold outs hear it from sympathetic people within the Sanders faction would be more effective.

this is one way people are doing it, while being respectful of people's perspectives and journeys:
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/election/king-stop-donald-trump-voting-hillary-clinton-article-1.2726614

besides that, that tiny (minuscule) hardened section of sarandons that can't be convinced certainly isn't going to be swayed by anything.


this shit is as self-indulgent as it claims they're being. seth has ratings to compete for, so i get that...but, honestly...you think this is really worth sharing?

http://paulgoodenough.com/principal/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/image11.jpg

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Wed Jul-27-16 09:08 AM

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171. "RE: more people out there wasting energy on Bernie or Bust"
In response to Reply # 170
Wed Jul-27-16 09:21 AM by murph71

          


There are some intelligent, passionate Bernie people out there. They truly don't agree with the two-party system...They got real beef...And they will ride out on anyone they deem as pushing that bullshit.

I think what people like Seth is getting at is the folks who exemplify the Bernie Bro caricature. These are the folks that were booing and screaming while Elizabeth Warren, one of the most progressive mainstream voices in the Democratic party, was giving a speech. A lot of the Bernie people who were being interviewed didn't come off in a good light.

My hope is that the Bernie folk and everyone else that identifies with liberal causes, put that energy into flipping Congressional seats.

More fuckery: http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/07/27/f-ck-you-old-man-daily-show-s-trevor-noah-hits-bernie-or-bust-for-turning-on-sanders.html

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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stattic
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Wed Jul-27-16 09:25 AM

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172. "The reaction by Bernie diehards has only helped her case w/ voters"
In response to Reply # 169


  

          


and is just a blip. The protesters' whining and unwillingness to accept defeat affirmed the perception that Sanders and his followers were just activists with gripes and not part of a serious movement with concrete ideas and solutions. They are playing right into that narrative.

Meanwhile, the speeches at the DNC contrast that behavior with a positive tone and a narrative of a candidate who is an experienced agent of change with the political skills to get things done. For the people who matter in this election, those who may have been inclined to vote Republican but are put off by his schtick, this sober-minded portrayal will be compelling.

The hardcore BernieBros and Broettes claiming that they will vote for Jill Stein are not Democrats and probably do not even vote in general elections. The extreme supports are probably former participants in the Ron Paul experience, i.e., they are naive and unseasoned. Regardless, they are an insignificant population of voters.

  

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