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Subject: "AIPAC Conference" Previous topic | Next topic
Vex_id
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Mon Mar-21-16 09:11 AM

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"AIPAC Conference"


          

Clinton is speaking right now to the conference in DC - pandering as usual to Netanyahu and the hard-line right Zionist wing, without one mention of Israel's need to furnish more progressive human rights initiatives within its own society.

Conversely - Bernie Sanders refused to show up to the Conference and was the first to boycott Netanyahu's treasonous speech to Congress last year.

They're exactly the same though, right?

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
no, they're different.
Mar 21st 2016
1
oooh, that good Bern
Mar 21st 2016
2
Hooray for compromising principles!!
Mar 21st 2016
9
      *shrugs*
Mar 21st 2016
14
      Contradiction and compromise are not the same.
Mar 21st 2016
40
           awesome.
Mar 21st 2016
43
      Compromising principles is how politics works, man...
Mar 21st 2016
19
I thought Bern's reasoning
Mar 21st 2016
3
RE: I thought Bern's reasoning
Mar 21st 2016
4
But...
Mar 21st 2016
28
      RE: But...
Mar 21st 2016
30
He's the Dick Cheney gangster of Israel.
Mar 21st 2016
31
      yep. a total irredemable asswipe.
Mar 21st 2016
64
      He's also more successful at inciting violence than Trump.
Mar 21st 2016
66
"Has even one HRC supporter denounced her disgusting speech today?"
Mar 21st 2016
5
i soundly denounce the speech.
Mar 21st 2016
6
RE: i soundly denounce the speech.
Mar 21st 2016
7
yup
Mar 21st 2016
11
Yeah.
Mar 21st 2016
29
DAMN
Mar 21st 2016
10
Compare it to the one Bernie just gave
Mar 21st 2016
35
      I've never seen a presidential candidate with such unshakeable integrity
Mar 21st 2016
44
           I feel the same way.
Mar 21st 2016
49
           His previous views on Israel were challenged hard
Mar 21st 2016
51
           Ralph Nader was like that. Third party Green folks
Mar 21st 2016
50
           Nader didn't have the consistent record that Sanders boasts
Mar 21st 2016
54
           Exactly. I'm never not proud to support him nm
Mar 21st 2016
59
           see Ron Paul in 2012
Mar 22nd 2016
72
                His views include denying service based on race and
Mar 22nd 2016
73
                     lol, this reads like a post from addictinginfo.org
Mar 30th 2016
79
So we're clear. This is politics, right?
Mar 21st 2016
8
We see it. That game is the whole point.
Mar 21st 2016
12
      It won't end. The fact that you wish it away won't make it so...
Mar 21st 2016
13
           While your cynicism is certainly understandable
Mar 21st 2016
15
           that's great.
Mar 21st 2016
16
           local/mid-term elections are what's most important moving forward
Mar 21st 2016
18
           word.
Mar 21st 2016
21
           Someone made a reference google doc to support this
Mar 21st 2016
32
                That's fantastic work - thanks for sharing.
Mar 21st 2016
33
                cool list
Mar 22nd 2016
78
           Why would we ever do this?
Mar 21st 2016
38
                there's always suicide, i guess.
Mar 21st 2016
42
                     Keep joking you gotta live here too nm
Mar 21st 2016
52
                          no, i don't.
Mar 21st 2016
53
           It's not cynicism and your "growing electorate" isn't new...
Mar 21st 2016
17
                k.
Mar 21st 2016
20
                Uprooted status quo operatives on Foreign Policy?
Mar 21st 2016
23
                     RE: Uprooted status quo operatives on Foreign Policy?
Mar 21st 2016
24
                          I have to disagree with you on Kerry
Mar 21st 2016
61
                               RE: I have to disagree here. Although HRC is well to Obama's right...
Mar 21st 2016
63
                Unless the many millions of supporters are all naive
Mar 21st 2016
48
           True. All we need is 51% to wish it away.
Mar 21st 2016
36
                ^^^
Mar 21st 2016
56
                Nail on the head.
Mar 21st 2016
68
                     Point is, he said all that for a reason.
Mar 21st 2016
70
Kasich now bowing to AIPAC
Mar 21st 2016
22
Obama's AIPAC Speech---2008 (Swipe)
Mar 21st 2016
25
I'm sure glad that 2016 Obama has grown considerably from that moment
Mar 21st 2016
26
      Conceivably she can be turned then.
Mar 21st 2016
27
      RE: Conceivably she can be turned then.
Mar 21st 2016
34
      oh well then.
Mar 21st 2016
37
      Whats the incentive if you're with her either way? Nm
Mar 21st 2016
39
           for sure.
Mar 21st 2016
41
      I can only hope Hillary does the same.
Mar 21st 2016
65
im in DC all week, got bum rushed by the crowd
Mar 21st 2016
45
Sanders on Netanyahu tonight (via Chris Hayes):
Mar 21st 2016
46
probably Malia.
Mar 21st 2016
47
I'd guess it's the candidate Obama is actually supporting.
Mar 21st 2016
57
      Interesting - there's been no formal endorsement of Clinton.
Mar 21st 2016
58
           LOL. Do you follow the news?
Mar 21st 2016
60
                Apparently you don't.
Mar 21st 2016
62
                     I'd be surprised by this level of wishful thinking...
Mar 21st 2016
67
                          Well - If I were Obama I would remain neutral as well
Mar 21st 2016
69
                               Wow, that's the best you've got?
Mar 21st 2016
71
great avi...
Mar 21st 2016
55
it's bizarre tomme that the sole Jewish candidate
Mar 22nd 2016
74
Hillary isn't compromising her principles in this speech
Mar 22nd 2016
75
i'm really excited about all the war that's coming.
Mar 22nd 2016
76
      It will be great for cable news ratings n/m
Mar 22nd 2016
77

SoWhat
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Mon Mar-21-16 09:14 AM

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1. "no, they're different."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

it looks like one of them is going to be the next POTUS and the other isn't.

fuck you.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79594 posts
Mon Mar-21-16 09:24 AM

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2. "oooh, that good Bern"
In response to Reply # 1


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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RaFromQueens
Member since Apr 18th 2006
19528 posts
Mon Mar-21-16 04:26 PM

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9. "Hooray for compromising principles!!"
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

The status quo is awesome!!

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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SoWhat
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Mon Mar-21-16 04:33 PM

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14. "*shrugs*"
In response to Reply # 9


  

          

i understand that the POTUS is always going to have to compromise her/his principles - at least some of them. which is a large reason why i don't want Bernie as POTUS. i don't want him to compromise his principles. i want something/someone to hold on to. someone/something to believe in. i'm fine w/Hillary compromising hers b/c i don't really see her as a particularly principled person. i mean - i'm not drawn to her b/c of her principles or whatever. it's something else much more cynical. something darker, almost. i understand that she has that edge that's needed to get whatever done as POTUS. and if it means she has to break some promises or whatever...eh that's fine b/c she doesn't have my heart so she can't break it.

it'd be different w/Bernie. he doesn't have my heart either (he way too old for my taste) but he's such a principled guy and has made all of these principled stands - it'd be a shame to see him contradict himself to get anything done. and if he didn't compromise his principles and contradict himself he wouldn't get anything done really and so then it's like what was the fucking point of electing him?

so...again...*shrugs*

throw more snark darts. i'm still voting for Hillary.

*shrugs*

fuck you.

  

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RaFromQueens
Member since Apr 18th 2006
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Mon Mar-21-16 07:26 PM

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40. "Contradiction and compromise are not the same. "
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

Making a compromise and compromising your self and your beliefs are also two different things.

You can work with republicans, get what you can get and still keep to your principles. Bernie has done this.

When you change your platform, beliefs and priorities to fit the situation you are lying. This is not a requirement.

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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SoWhat
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Mon Mar-21-16 07:27 PM

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43. "awesome."
In response to Reply # 40


  

          

fuck you.

  

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CRichMonkey
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Mon Mar-21-16 04:48 PM

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19. "Compromising principles is how politics works, man... "
In response to Reply # 9


  

          

Systems that don't compromise principles are called dictatorships.


my avy: Deep in your heart, you know he's right: http://coreyrichardsonneedsajob.com/
my hustle: http://SupaSoulSounds.com

*RIP: John T. "220v" Richardson, Blessing Benson, and Dilla*

  

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
132214 posts
Mon Mar-21-16 10:06 AM

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3. "I thought Bern's reasoning"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

>Conversely - Bernie Sanders refused to show up to the
>Conference and was the first to boycott Netanyahu's treasonous
>speech to Congress last year.

was that he had a scheduling conflict.

side note:

lol @ Obama going to Cuba and sending Biden over there

one thing I'll say for Obama that I'll miss: while he didn't outright say "fuck you" to Bibi, Bibi was very antagonistic toward him, and Obama recognized it enough to call him out. LOL.

fuck Netanyahu, man. he's the George W. Bush of Israel. maybe even the Donald Trump of Israel.

Yes, I'm mad. Let's move on.

Jays | Cavs | Eagles | Sabres | Tarheels

PSN: Dr_Claw_77 | XBL: Dr Claw 077 | FB: drclaw077 | T: @drclaw77 | http://thepeoplesvault.wordpress.com

  

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Vex_id
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Mon Mar-21-16 11:03 AM

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4. "RE: I thought Bern's reasoning"
In response to Reply # 3


          


>was that he had a scheduling conflict.

That's a polite way of saying "I didn't think it was important to come to your conference."

Bernie knows that AIPAC is corrupt and he'll have no part of pandering to their special interests. Their lobby has done considerable damage to our democracy.

>lol @ Obama going to Cuba and sending Biden over there
>
>one thing I'll say for Obama that I'll miss: while he didn't
>outright say "fuck you" to Bibi, Bibi was very antagonistic
>toward him, and Obama recognized it enough to call him out.
>LOL.

Obama was courageous and should be celebrated for standing up to Netanyahu and implementing the "Obama Doctrine" which is a newfound foreign policy strategy to more responsibly and respectfully engage with the world. The Iran Deal will prove to be one of the seminal points of his presidency, assuming Clinton doesn't destroy the good will he worked so hard to cultivate - which is a big assumption.

>fuck Netanyahu, man. he's the George W. Bush of Israel. maybe
>even the Donald Trump of Israel.

He's a disaster.

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soulpsychodelicyde
Member since Nov 18th 2003
12151 posts
Mon Mar-21-16 06:07 PM

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28. "But... "
In response to Reply # 4


          

>
>>was that he had a scheduling conflict.
>
>That's a polite way of saying "I didn't think it was important
>to come to your conference."

That's a very, very different thing than boycotting it. C'mon. I'm #teambernie all day but let's not change the story to fit the narrative of the day. That don't help us.

  

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Vex_id
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Mon Mar-21-16 06:10 PM

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30. "RE: But... "
In response to Reply # 28


          


>That's a very, very different thing than boycotting it.
>C'mon. I'm #teambernie all day but let's not change the story
>to fit the narrative of the day. That don't help us.

I never claimed that Bernie boycotted the AIPAC conference. What I said was that he was the first Senator to boycott Netanyahu's speech to Congress last year - and that he was.


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rawsouthpaw
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Mon Mar-21-16 06:13 PM

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31. "He's the Dick Cheney gangster of Israel."
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

  

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
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Mon Mar-21-16 10:25 PM

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64. "yep. a total irredemable asswipe."
In response to Reply # 31


  

          

  

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RaFromQueens
Member since Apr 18th 2006
19528 posts
Mon Mar-21-16 10:29 PM

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66. "He's also more successful at inciting violence than Trump. "
In response to Reply # 31


  

          

Like. You know. The assassination of the Israeli prime minister.

http://www.salon.com/2016/01/30/rabins_death_was_netanyahus_victory_an_explosive_new_film_argues_that_bibi_is_morally_culpable_for_the_1995_assassination/

This guy is a super villain with a country behind him.

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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Vex_id
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Mon Mar-21-16 04:21 PM

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5. ""Has even one HRC supporter denounced her disgusting speech today?""
In response to Reply # 0


          

~Glenn Greenwald

http://www.commondreams.org/news/2016/03/21/critics-aghast-disgusting-speech-clinton-just-gave-aipac


-->

  

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SoWhat
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Mon Mar-21-16 04:23 PM

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6. "i soundly denounce the speech."
In response to Reply # 5


  

          

i ridicule it.

i spit on it.

i stomp on it.

and then i vote for Hillary in the general election if she's the nominee.

fuck you.

  

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Vex_id
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7. "RE: i soundly denounce the speech."
In response to Reply # 6


          

>i ridicule it.
>
>i spit on it.
>
>i stomp on it.
>
>and then i vote for Hillary in the general election if she's
>the nominee.

Fair enough.

-->

  

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Ashy Achilles
Member since Sep 22nd 2005
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Mon Mar-21-16 04:28 PM

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11. "yup"
In response to Reply # 6


          

  

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soulpsychodelicyde
Member since Nov 18th 2003
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Mon Mar-21-16 06:10 PM

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29. "Yeah."
In response to Reply # 6


          

  

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Ashy Achilles
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10. "DAMN"
In response to Reply # 5


          

  

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rawsouthpaw
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Mon Mar-21-16 07:00 PM

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35. "Compare it to the one Bernie just gave"
In response to Reply # 5


  

          


http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2016/03/bernie-sanders-foreign-policy-speech-utah

Bernie Sanders Walks a Tightrope in First Middle East Speech
—By Tim Murphy | Mon Mar. 21, 2016 7:24 PM EDT

Email
Post
Michael Vadon/Flickr
On Monday, Bernie Sanders did something his campaign has been toying with for months: He gave a speech laying out his vision for Middle East peace. With the other four remaining major party candidates traveling to Washington, DC, to speak at the American Israel Public Affairs Committee conference, Sanders opted to stay in Utah, where he is banking on a strong showing in Tuesday's Democratic caucus. Prior to addressing a packed Salt Lake City gymnasium, he spoke to a smaller crowd, offering the speech his people say he would have delivered at AIPAC.

"A lasting a peace will have to recognize Palestinians are entitled to control their own lives, and there is nothing human life needs more than water."
Consistent with his ongoing critique of economic inequality, Sanders, who is Jewish and spent time at a kibbutz after college, offered a plea for a more humane handling of the Israel–Palestine conflict. "To be successful, we have to be a friend not only to Israel, but to the Palestinian people, where in Gaza, they suffer from an unemployment rate of 44 percent—the highest in the world—and a poverty rate nearly equal to that," Sanders said, according to a prepared text of his remarks.

Israel, he argued, is compounding the suffering with its own aggressive policies. Sanders called on Israeli Prime Minister Bibi Netanyahu to pull back settlements in the West Bank and turn over hundreds of millions of shekels in tax revenue to Palestinians. Peace, he also said, "will mean a sustainable and equitable distribution of precious water resources so that Israel and Palestine can both thrive as neighbors…Right now, Israel controls 80 percent of the water reserves in the West Bank. Inadequate water supply has contributed to the degradation and desertification of Palestinian land. A lasting a peace will have to recognize Palestinians are entitled to control their own lives, and there is nothing human life needs more than water."


As he moved on to a rehashing of his positions on ISIS and the Iran nuclear deal, Sanders hit on familiar themes, framing the failure of Middle Eastern nations to stop ISIS, in part, as a failure of wealthy elites. If Qatar could spend $200 billion on World Cup soccer stadiums, he said, it could surely spend as much fighting terrorists. Singling out Kuwait and Saudi Arabia, both of which have benefited from America's defense budget, Sanders added that, "wealthy and powerful nations in the region can no longer expect the United States to do their work for them."

"It is easy to use a war to remove a tyrant from power—but it is much more difficult to prevent total chaos afterward."
Last November, Sanders talked about his plans to fight ISIS as part of a larger policy speech on democratic socialism, but after initially hinting that a major foreign policy address would follow, his campaign backed down. During debates, he's often pivoted away from foreign policy to focus on domestic issues. But national security is one area where the differences between he and Hillary Clinton—and for that matter, the entire Republican field—are stark. Although he never mentioned Clinton by name, he acknowledged his Democratic rival in passing by taking a shot at one of their biggest areas of disagreement, military interventions.

"It is easy to use a war to remove a tyrant from power—but it is much more difficult to prevent total chaos afterward," Sanders said. "Just look at the cost we have paid in Iraq—a war I was proud to oppose. Just look at the chaos in Libya. It is my firm belief that the test of a great nation, with the most powerful military on Earth, is not how many wars we can engage in, but how we can use our strength to resolve international conflicts in a peaceful way."

You can read his speech here:
https://berniesanders.com/sanders-outlines-middle-east-policy/

  

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Vex_id
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Mon Mar-21-16 07:31 PM

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44. "I've never seen a presidential candidate with such unshakeable integrity"
In response to Reply # 35


          

on issue after issue.

It's just flat-out inspiring.

-->

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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Mon Mar-21-16 07:49 PM

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49. "I feel the same way."
In response to Reply # 44
Mon Mar-21-16 07:51 PM by denny

          

I barely knew anything about him before this campaign.

I assume that his greatest source of inspiration was MLK. Alot of his rhetoric sounds strikingly similar. Even when he takes a beating (like his comments on Cuba)...he's getting punished for being right and having integrity. He stands up for what he thinks is just even if it hurts him politically. His stance on guns is the lone issue that I've read/heard about that doesn't align with my worldview.

  

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rawsouthpaw
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Mon Mar-21-16 07:53 PM

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51. "His previous views on Israel were challenged hard"
In response to Reply # 49


  

          

by supporters in a town hall on youtube. Got way intense.

  

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rawsouthpaw
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50. "Ralph Nader was like that. Third party Green folks"
In response to Reply # 44


  

          

very likely too, but his profile was comparable to Sanders. Actually higher given his work in the 60s with the auto industry. SANDERS-NADER 2016

  

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Vex_id
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54. "Nader didn't have the consistent record that Sanders boasts"
In response to Reply # 50


          

and didn't have the ability to inspire with as clear and dynamic of a message as Sanders has been able to deliver. The way he sort of just surfaced and then vanished out of public life was a bit suspicious to me as well.

He certainly didn't inspire me the way that Sanders does.


-->

  

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RaFromQueens
Member since Apr 18th 2006
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Mon Mar-21-16 09:28 PM

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59. "Exactly. I'm never not proud to support him nm "
In response to Reply # 44


  

          

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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DeepAztheRoot
Member since Dec 19th 2003
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Tue Mar-22-16 01:10 AM

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72. "see Ron Paul in 2012"
In response to Reply # 44


  

          

Bernie is this election's version

whether or not you agreed with him, he wouldn't compromise his views either

<-Fear Ameer

  

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RaFromQueens
Member since Apr 18th 2006
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Tue Mar-22-16 01:42 AM

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73. "His views include denying service based on race and"
In response to Reply # 72


  

          

Blowing up the Irs building.

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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DeepAztheRoot
Member since Dec 19th 2003
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Wed Mar-30-16 12:46 AM

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79. "lol, this reads like a post from addictinginfo.org"
In response to Reply # 73


  

          

completely full of shit

<-Fear Ameer

  

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CRichMonkey
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8. "So we're clear. This is politics, right?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Not religion.

In politics, you tell muhfuckas what they want to hear because you want their support. In religion, you tell muhfuckas what they need to hear, because you want to save them.

Stop confusing the two.

People are voting for President, not looking for a political savior. That's why Bernie can't win. Not because his ideas aren't good or his plans are too lofty, but because he and his followers refuse to see the game for what it is and keep trying to make it something else.

You get in front of the Israel lobby and you damn right you're pro-Israel. Just like when she goes up in front of the NAACP this summer, she might walk on stage to Fuck The Police to let the crowd know she's with them.

End of the day, she's a politician. What else do you expect her to do?


my avy: Deep in your heart, you know he's right: http://coreyrichardsonneedsajob.com/
my hustle: http://SupaSoulSounds.com

*RIP: John T. "220v" Richardson, Blessing Benson, and Dilla*

  

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RaFromQueens
Member since Apr 18th 2006
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12. "We see it. That game is the whole point. "
In response to Reply # 8


  

          

We want it to end.

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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CRichMonkey
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13. "It won't end. The fact that you wish it away won't make it so... "
In response to Reply # 12


  

          

She is a woman running for the most powerful office on Earth and yet you think that she can stand in a room and project anything less than hawkish strength? If Hillary went in front of a crowd and offered up what Bernie Sanders is offering up we'd call her naive and say she's not ready to lead.

But back to the game you want to end.

It won't.

It can't.

It's been played since humans organized into tribes and decided one person was more fit to lead them than others. It's going on at work, at school, in the streets. It's how this whole system operates. You don't like it? Move to an island and make your own. But as long as there is power to be had, there will be people jockeying for its use.


my avy: Deep in your heart, you know he's right: http://coreyrichardsonneedsajob.com/
my hustle: http://SupaSoulSounds.com

*RIP: John T. "220v" Richardson, Blessing Benson, and Dilla*

  

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Vex_id
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15. "While your cynicism is certainly understandable"
In response to Reply # 13


          

It's also self-defeating and no longer acceptable to a growing segment of the electorate.

and GOOD.

-->

  

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SoWhat
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16. "that's great."
In response to Reply # 15


  

          

i hope they do something about it other than throw around snarky status updates and tweets. i hope they actually take some ACTION. first by voting for whomever gets the Dem nomination and then by holding that nominee accountable after she wins the general election. and more importantly that they do the same w/their local elected and appointed officials. and that they encourage others to do the same - either individually or as part of a collective.

i hope this fire they have doesn't burn out later this summer or in the fall.

fuck you.

  

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Vex_id
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18. "local/mid-term elections are what's most important moving forward"
In response to Reply # 16


          

> and more importantly that they
>do the same w/their local elected and appointed officials.
>and that they encourage others to do the same - either
>individually or as part of a collective.
>
>i hope this fire they have doesn't burn out later this summer
>or in the fall.

Well, we can agree on something, at least.

I do think that momentum will be sustained from the Progressive bastions all around the country - and that's why I want Sanders to continue his campaign all the way into the convention. We're already seeing a vibrant challenge to DWS in Florida - and here in NH I'm working with Mark Connolly to win the Governor seat - and then we'll deal with Shaheen/Ayotte after that.

But I would agree that it would be a huge let-down if this momentum failed to effectuate any seat-changes on the local levels.

-->

  

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SoWhat
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21. "word."
In response to Reply # 18


  

          

fuck you.

  

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rawsouthpaw
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32. "Someone made a reference google doc to support this"
In response to Reply # 18


  

          


https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1MZGzbSWESE8t18GGzrgc2FfL0b5tz-vmNf-F_-w5yN4/edit?pref=2&pli=1#gid=0

  

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Vex_id
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33. "That's fantastic work - thanks for sharing."
In response to Reply # 32


          


-->

  

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Jay Doz
Member since Dec 13th 2005
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78. "cool list"
In response to Reply # 32


  

          

the Georgia run of candidates is pretty accurate from my vantage point, especially having met all of them and having a good idea where they stand. i'd note that of the four people listed, one is giving up her seat at the end of this term (six contenders are vying for that seat) and one is *also* running for mayor next year. the other two are first time candidates and were the only Democrats to qualify in their races, so they'll also be the de facto candidates come November. point being thatm, at least for the new candidates, it should be relatively easy to coalesce support since these aren't contentious races on the Democratic side. aka no establishment vs. the people rhetoric that has colored the national contests.

it's too bad all of our municipal races are non-partisan because i think that's the best way to build your bench, and i'm sure there's a ton of folks out there that would love to carry the torch but have no machine to back them.

-------
"A man who is good enough to shed his blood for his country is good enough to be given a square deal afterwards. More than that no man is entitled, and less than that no man shall have." - TR

  

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RaFromQueens
Member since Apr 18th 2006
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Mon Mar-21-16 07:20 PM

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38. "Why would we ever do this?"
In response to Reply # 16


  

          

>i hope they do something about it other than throw around
>snarky status updates and tweets. i hope they actually take
>some ACTION. first by voting for whomever gets the Dem
>nomination and then by holding that nominee accountable after
>she wins the general election.

We can't hold Hillary accountable today because we need her to win and Trump to lose. We can't hold Hillary accountable once she wins because she needs our help to fight those republicans. We have to support her people in the midterms. We need to re-elect her lest we end up with a republican!! And then more of the same.

When you excuse hypocrisy to fight for "the team" you begin a cycle that does not end. Falling in line by definition changes nothing and is a vote to keep things the same.

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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SoWhat
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42. "there's always suicide, i guess."
In response to Reply # 38


  

          

*shrugs*

fuck you.

  

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RaFromQueens
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52. "Keep joking you gotta live here too nm "
In response to Reply # 42


  

          

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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SoWhat
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53. "no, i don't."
In response to Reply # 52


  

          

not if it's as bad as you ppl say it will be in the coming years. why go on? i don't HAVE to and i know it.

fuck you.

  

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CRichMonkey
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17. "It's not cynicism and your "growing electorate" isn't new... "
In response to Reply # 15


  

          

Ask your parents how things worked out with President McGovern.

The point I'm making is that you cannot enter the realm of politics as a true believer in a thing and not expect to have to compromise that belief at some point. This is why I'm so frustrated with Sanders supporters, you all act as if you can make systemic change simply through the strength of ideological purity without realizing that we live in a political system designed to move slowly.

It's not cynical to understand how a system works and have an honest view of its pros and cons. I'd be cynical if I said there's nothing that can be done about it. Instead, I say that there is something to be done, but it requires incremental changes that will take a while to really see in society. Not a revolution, but a steady tacking in a new direction.

Bernie Sanders supporters are going to be wholly disappointed if and when they're exposed to the levers of power and find them to be wonky, rusty, and slow. But that's how they're meant to be.



my avy: Deep in your heart, you know he's right: http://coreyrichardsonneedsajob.com/
my hustle: http://SupaSoulSounds.com

*RIP: John T. "220v" Richardson, Blessing Benson, and Dilla*

  

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Vex_id
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20. "k. "
In response to Reply # 17


          


>This is why I'm so
>frustrated with Sanders supporters, you all act as if you can
>make systemic change simply through the strength of
>ideological purity without realizing that we live in a
>political system designed to move slowly.

Firstly - there is a variance amongst the Sanders base (just as there is within the Clinton base) - it's not a one-size fits all monolithic scenario. But to your point - what most Sanders supporters largely agree on is that you can't create systemic change by electing candidates committed to upholding the status-quo.

I strongly supported President Obama (twice) - and have been very complimentary of his presidency (particularly his second term). He has been an incredible diplomat and has uprooted status-quo operatives - particularly on foreign policy - but there's still more work to be done. Clinton does not have the DNA to carry the baton and push forward with the Progressive foundation that Obama was able to lay - and her speech today to AIPAC was a clear indicator of that.



-->

  

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CRichMonkey
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23. "Uprooted status quo operatives on Foreign Policy?"
In response to Reply # 20


  

          

Like the current Secretary of State and 2004 Democratic nominee for President, John Kerry?

Suuuure.


my avy: Deep in your heart, you know he's right: http://coreyrichardsonneedsajob.com/
my hustle: http://SupaSoulSounds.com

*RIP: John T. "220v" Richardson, Blessing Benson, and Dilla*

  

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Vex_id
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24. "RE: Uprooted status quo operatives on Foreign Policy?"
In response to Reply # 23


          

>Like the current Secretary of State and 2004 Democratic
>nominee for President, John Kerry?

Yes - that's right. Kerry has always been insightful and wise on foreign policy - particularly on his hesitancy to engage in interventionist wars. From his energetic protest of the Vietnam war to the instrumental role he has played in negotiating the Iran Deal - Kerry has been an exemplary diplomat who has made significant contributions to a paradigm-shift in our foreign policy prescriptions.

  

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Mansa Musa
Member since Feb 16th 2009
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Mon Mar-21-16 09:41 PM

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61. "I have to disagree with you on Kerry"
In response to Reply # 24
Mon Mar-21-16 09:52 PM by Mansa Musa

          

I agree with a lot of what you say in this thread. But Kerry is a billionaire Aspen/Hampton's/Martha's Vineyard liberal, who voted for the Iraq War, the Patriot Act, increased prison construction, and NAFTA. He opposed gay marriage until recently, and the Kyoto protocol when it mattered. His Congressional voting record is as conservative as Joe Lieberman's, which helps explain the VP pick. As a candidate, he was the Democrats' Mitt Romney, from the privileged background to the bland personality to the flaccid performance. He is slightly less hawkish than Clinton, but in the end they both serve the interests of the super-rich more than anything else.

  

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Vex_id
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63. "RE: I have to disagree here. Although HRC is well to Obama's right..."
In response to Reply # 61


          

>...Kerry is a billionaire representative of the Democrats'
>right wing, who voted for the Iraq War, the Patriot Act,
>increased prison construction, and opposed gay marriage until
>recently, and the Kyoto protocol when it mattered. His
>Congressional voting record is as conservative as Joe
>Lieberman's, which helps explain the VP pick. He is slightly
>less hawkish than Clinton, but in the end they both serve the
>interests of the super-rich more than anything else.

Fair enough. I do not disagree with what you said - but I do commend Kerry for his diplomatic contributions over the past 4 years.

-->

  

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rawsouthpaw
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48. "Unless the many millions of supporters are all naive"
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

we understand that you get him in office and you continue the street mobilization capacity and action. It would have to be resemble perpetual mass movement and disruption like the civil rights movement, Occupy, etc. This is not unusual in non-complacent, union heavy societies but it would be novel here. The fact that young people know they're fucked if they don't get off their assess now and in the years to come if he's in the White House based on their overwhelming support and economic plight is a basis for optimism on practical policy impacts. Normally policymakers completely ignore the masses, as has been shown via crazy recent research. The fact a former organizer from the civil rights movement has a chance to develop mass movements is exactly what those who want radical changes should be pushing.

  

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RaFromQueens
Member since Apr 18th 2006
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Mon Mar-21-16 07:11 PM

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36. "True. All we need is 51% to wish it away."
In response to Reply # 13
Mon Mar-21-16 07:13 PM by RaFromQueens

  

          

>She is a woman running for the most powerful office on Earth
>and yet you think that she can stand in a room and project
>anything less than hawkish strength?


Let's start here. These shrewd, calculated moves to put on the face people want to see are a problem. That's not the way it has to be, it's just the way it is. For now. Ideally, candidates would be themselves and if their acting doesn't fit their older scripts the people would be smart enough to call them on that and vote accordingly. And hopefully more illuminated souls like you and sowhat would allow us to call hypocrisy and inconsistency by their names. If HRC is acting like a hawk to get into office where she will behave differently that's just lying. You can tell me that's how it is like I was born on Mars until you're blue in the face. Don't tell it's okay or that it's got to be that way.

If Hillary went in front
>of a crowd and offered up what Bernie Sanders is offering up
>we'd call her naive and say she's not ready to lead.

And people say that about Bernie. And he has his supporters in addition to his detractors. He is who he is and you have a chance to vote knowing the truth about him.

Honestly, I thought we turned a corner with that "you know what I mean even though I have to say this" bullshit game. Everybody should be ashamed.

>But back to the game you want to end.
>
>It won't.
>
>It can't.
>
>It's been played since humans organized into tribes and
>decided one person was more fit to lead them than others.
>It's going on at work, at school, in the streets. It's how
>this whole system operates. You don't like it? Move to an
>island and make your own. But as long as there is power to be
>had, there will be people jockeying for its use.

This is a load of bullshit. Yes people will be jockeying for power no matter what, but the skills qualifying you to be in power (read: the preferences of the followers) have not remained consistent for even the last century. Never mind human history. The leadership tests faced by Barack Obama and Genghis Khan could not be more different. In Iceland having a woman leader is not only normal most prefer it so your line about HRC up there having to play a game are only accurate in this country. Only for today.

The United States isn't the only democracy in the world. But it is the only one where money is legally speech. It is the only democracy where huge corporate interests craft our national media to fit their narratives. And this is the only democracy that I know of where you can chastise people for wanting the system to work and mask your preference for corruption as sophistication.

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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Vex_id
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56. "^^^"
In response to Reply # 36


          


-->

  

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
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68. "Nail on the head."
In response to Reply # 36


  

          

> Honestly, I thought we turned a corner with that "you know
>what I mean even though I have to say this" bullshit game.
>Everybody should be ashamed.

that should have been the lesson of the Obama presidency.

he had more of those moments than not, chief among them being marriage equality.

show of hands of people who thought he ACTUALLY believed "marriage was between one man and one woman"

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Mon Mar-21-16 10:39 PM

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70. "Point is, he said all that for a reason. "
In response to Reply # 68


          


>show of hands of people who thought he ACTUALLY believed
>"marriage was between one man and one woman"

A candidate has to win before he can be president. He has to be smart (diplomatic, in fact) to win. The fact that Bernie doesn't play as much of that game might mean, in part, that he's honest. But the one thing we can say for sure is that it makes him a worse candidate.

  

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Vex_id
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22. "Kasich now bowing to AIPAC"
In response to Reply # 0


          

This is what I mean when I say that Clinton is indistinguishable from NeoCon warhawks on war and foreign policy.

She basically undermined the Obama Administration's efforts to progress with the Iran Nuclear Deal today and create a new paradigm in the Mid-East re: Iran, Saudi Arabia, and Israel. But she's the one who is the rightful heir to the Obama legacy?

nah.

-->

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Mar-21-16 05:16 PM

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25. "Obama's AIPAC Speech---2008 (Swipe)"
In response to Reply # 0


          



Sounds like the same speech Clinton made today, doesn't it? Key quote:

"That starts with ensuring Israel's qualitative military advantage. I will ensure that Israel can defend itself from any threat — from Gaza to Tehran. Defense cooperation between the United States and Israel is a model of success, and must be deepened. As president, I will implement a Memorandum of Understanding that provides $30 billion in assistance to Israel over the next decade — investments to Israel's security that will not be tied to any other nation. First, we must approve the foreign aid request for 2009. Going forward, we can enhance our cooperation on missile defense. We should export military equipment to our ally Israel under the same guidelines as NATO. And I will always stand up for Israel's right to defend itself in the United Nations and around the world...."



-----

Complete AIPAC speech--

Senator Barack Obama--2008

"It's great to see so many friends from across the country. I want to congratulate Howard Friedman, David Victor and Howard Kohr on a successful conference, and on the completion of a new headquarters just a few blocks away.

Before I begin, I want to say that I know some provocative e-mails have been circulating throughout Jewish communities across the country. A few of you may have gotten them. They're filled with tall tales and dire warnings about a certain candidate for president. And all I want to say is — let me know if you see this guy named Barack Obama, because he sounds pretty frightening.

But if anyone has been confused by these e-mails, I want you to know that today I'll be speaking from my heart, and as a true friend of Israel. And I know that when I visit with AIPAC, I am among friends. Good friends. Friends who share my strong commitment to make sure that the bond between the United States and Israel is unbreakable today, tomorrow and forever.

One of the many things that I admire about AIPAC is that you fight for this common cause from the bottom up. The lifeblood of AIPAC is here in this room — grass-roots activists of all ages, from all parts of the country, who come to Washington year after year to make your voices heard. Nothing reflects the face of AIPAC more than the 1,200 students who have traveled here to make it clear to the world that the bond between Israel and the United States is rooted in more than our shared national interests — it's rooted in the shared values and shared stories of our people. And as president, I will work with you to ensure that this bond is strengthened.

I first became familiar with the story of Israel when I was 11 years old. I learned of the long journey and steady determination of the Jewish people to preserve their identity through faith, family and culture. Year after year, century after century, Jews carried on their traditions, and their dream of a homeland, in the face of impossible odds.

The story made a powerful impression on me. I had grown up without a sense of roots. My father was black; he was from Kenya, and he left us when I was 2. My mother was white; she was from Kansas, and I'd moved with her to Indonesia and then back to Hawaii. In many ways, I didn't know where I came from. So I was drawn to the belief that you could sustain a spiritual, emotional and cultural identity. And I deeply understood the Zionist idea — that there is always a homeland at the center of our story.

I also learned about the horror of the Holocaust, and the terrible urgency it brought to the journey home to Israel. For much of my childhood, I lived with my grandparents. My grandfather had served in World War II, and so had my great-uncle. He was a Kansas boy who probably never expected to see Europe — let alone the horrors that awaited him there. And for months after he came home from Germany, he remained in a state of shock, alone with the painful memories that wouldn't leave his head.

You see, my great-uncle had been a part of the 89th Infantry Division — the first Americans to reach a Nazi concentration camp. They liberated Ohrdruf, part of Buchenwald, on an April day in 1945. The horrors of that camp go beyond our capacity to imagine. Tens of thousands died of hunger, torture, disease, or plain murder — part of the Nazi killing machine that killed 6 million people.

When the Americans marched in, they discovered huge piles of dead bodies and starving survivors. Gen. Eisenhower ordered Germans from the nearby town to tour the camp, so they could see what was being done in their name. He ordered American troops to tour the camp, so they could see the evil they were fighting against. He invited congressmen and journalists to bear witness. And he ordered that photographs and films be made. Explaining his actions, Eisenhower said that he wanted to produce "firsthand evidence of these things, if ever, in the future, there develops a tendency to charge these allegations merely to propaganda."

I saw some of those very images at Yad Vashem, and they never leave you. And those images just hint at the stories that survivors of the Shoah carried with them. Like Eisenhower, each of us bears witness to anyone and everyone who would deny these unspeakable crimes, or ever speak of repeating them. We must mean what we say when we speak the words "never again."

It was just a few years after the liberation of the camps that David Ben-Gurion declared the founding of the Jewish State of Israel. We know that the establishment of Israel was just and necessary, rooted in centuries of struggle and decades of patient work. But 60 years later, we know that we cannot relent, we cannot yield, and as president I will never compromise when it comes to Israel's security.

Not when there are still voices that deny the Holocaust. Not when there are terrorist groups and political leaders committed to Israel's destruction. Not when there are maps across the Middle East that don't even acknowledge Israel's existence, and government-funded textbooks filled with hatred toward Jews. Not when there are rockets raining down on Sderot, and Israeli children have to take a deep breath and summon uncommon courage every time they board a bus or walk to school.

I have long understood Israel's quest for peace and need for security. But never more so than during my travels there two years ago. Flying in an helicopter, I saw a narrow and beautiful strip of land nestled against the Mediterranean. On the ground, I met a family who saw their house destroyed by a Katyusha rocket. I spoke to Israeli troops who faced daily threats as they maintained security near the blue line. I talked to people who wanted nothing more simple, or elusive, than a secure future for their children.

I have been proud to be a part of a strong, bipartisan consensus that has stood by Israel in the face of all threats. That is a commitment that both John McCain and I share, because support for Israel in this country goes beyond party. But part of our commitment must be speaking up when Israel's security is at risk, and I don't think any of us can be satisfied that America's recent foreign policy has made Israel more secure.

Hamas now controls Gaza. Hezbollah has tightened its grip on southern Lebanon, and is flexing its muscles in Beirut. Because of the war in Iraq, Iran — which always posed a greater threat to Israel than Iraq — is emboldened and poses the greatest strategic challenge to the United States and Israel in the Middle East in a generation. Iraq is unstable, and al-Qaida has stepped up its recruitment. Israel's quest for peace with its neighbors has stalled, despite the heavy burdens borne by the Israeli people. And America is more isolated in the region, reducing our strength and jeopardizing Israel's safety.

The question is how to move forward. There are those who would continue and intensify this failed status quo, ignoring eight years of accumulated evidence that our foreign policy is dangerously flawed. And then there are those who would lay all of the problems of the Middle East at the doorstep of Israel and its supporters, as if the Israeli-Palestinian conflict is the root of all trouble in the region. These voices blame the Middle East's only democracy for the region's extremism. They offer the false promise that abandoning a stalwart ally is somehow the path to strength. It is not, it never has been, and it never will be.

Our alliance is based on shared interests and shared values. Those who threaten Israel threaten us. Israel has always faced these threats on the front lines. And I will bring to the White House an unshakeable commitment to Israel's security.

That starts with ensuring Israel's qualitative military advantage. I will ensure that Israel can defend itself from any threat — from Gaza to Tehran. Defense cooperation between the United States and Israel is a model of success, and must be deepened. As president, I will implement a Memorandum of Understanding that provides $30 billion in assistance to Israel over the next decade — investments to Israel's security that will not be tied to any other nation. First, we must approve the foreign aid request for 2009. Going forward, we can enhance our cooperation on missile defense. We should export military equipment to our ally Israel under the same guidelines as NATO. And I will always stand up for Israel's right to defend itself in the United Nations and around the world.

Across the political spectrum, Israelis understand that real security can only come through lasting peace. And that is why we — as friends of Israel — must resolve to do all we can to help Israel and its neighbors to achieve it. Because a secure, lasting peace is in Israel's national interest. It is in America's national interest. And it is in the interest of the Palestinian people and the Arab world. As president, I will work to help Israel achieve the goal of two states, a Jewish state of Israel and a Palestinian state, living side by side in peace and security. And I won't wait until the waning days of my presidency. I will take an active role, and make a personal commitment to do all I can to advance the cause of peace from the start of my administration.

The long road to peace requires Palestinian partners committed to making the journey. We must isolate Hamas unless and until they renounce terrorism, recognize Israel's right to exist, and abide by past agreements. There is no room at the negotiating table for terrorist organizations. That is why I opposed holding elections in 2006 with Hamas on the ballot. The Israelis and the Palestinian Authority warned us at the time against holding these elections. But this administration pressed ahead, and the result is a Gaza controlled by Hamas, with rockets raining down on Israel.

The Palestinian people must understand that progress will not come through the false prophets of extremism or the corrupt use of foreign aid. The United States and the international community must stand by Palestinians who are committed to cracking down on terror and carrying the burden of peacemaking. I will strongly urge Arab governments to take steps to normalize relations with Israel, and to fulfill their responsibility to pressure extremists and provide real support for President Abbas and Prime Minister Fayyad. Egypt must cut off the smuggling of weapons into Gaza. Israel can also advance the cause of peace by taking appropriate steps — consistent with its security — to ease the freedom of movement for Palestinians, improve economic conditions in the West Bank, and to refrain from building new settlements — as it agreed to with the Bush administration at Annapolis.

Let me be clear. Israel's security is sacrosanct. It is non-negotiable. The Palestinians need a state that is contiguous and cohesive, and that allows them to prosper — but any agreement with the Palestinian people must preserve Israel's identity as a Jewish state, with secure, recognized and defensible borders. Jerusalem will remain the capital of Israel, and it must remain undivided.

I have no illusions that this will be easy. It will require difficult decisions on both sides. But Israel is strong enough to achieve peace, if it has partners who are committed to the goal. Most Israelis and Palestinians want peace, and we must strengthen their hand. The United States must be a strong and consistent partner in this process — not to force concessions, but to help committed partners avoid stalemate and the kind of vacuums that are filled by violence. That's what I commit to do as president of the United States.

The threats to Israel start close to home, but they don't end there. Syria continues its support for terror and meddling in Lebanon. And Syria has taken dangerous steps in pursuit of weapons of mass destruction, which is why Israeli action was justified to end that threat.

I also believe that the United States has a responsibility to support Israel's efforts to renew peace talks with the Syrians. We must never force Israel to the negotiating table, but neither should we ever block negotiations when Israel's leaders decide that they may serve Israeli interests. As president, I will do whatever I can to help Israel succeed in these negotiations. And success will require the full enforcement of Security Council Resolution 1701 in Lebanon, and a stop to Syria's support for terror. It is time for this reckless behavior to come to an end.

There is no greater threat to Israel — or to the peace and stability of the region — than Iran. Now this audience is made up of both Republicans and Democrats, and the enemies of Israel should have no doubt that, regardless of party, Americans stand shoulder to shoulder in our commitment to Israel's security. So while I don't want to strike too partisan a note here today, I do want to address some willful mischaracterizations of my positions.

The Iranian regime supports violent extremists and challenges us across the region. It pursues a nuclear capability that could spark a dangerous arms race and raise the prospect of a transfer of nuclear know-how to terrorists. Its president denies the Holocaust and threatens to wipe Israel off the map. The danger from Iran is grave, it is real, and my goal will be to eliminate this threat.

But just as we are cleareyed about the threat, we must be clear about the failure of today's policy. We knew, in 2002, that Iran supported terrorism. We knew Iran had an illicit nuclear program. We knew Iran posed a grave threat to Israel. But instead of pursuing a strategy to address this threat, we ignored it and instead invaded and occupied Iraq. When I opposed the war, I warned that it would fan the flames of extremism in the Middle East. That is precisely what happened in Iran — the hard-liners tightened their grip, and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad was elected president in 2005. And the United States and Israel are less secure.

I respect Sen. McCain, and look forward to a substantive debate with him these next five months. But on this point, we have differed, and we will differ. Sen. McCain refuses to understand or acknowledge the failure of the policy that he would continue. He criticizes my willingness to use strong diplomacy but offers only an alternate reality — one where the war in Iraq has somehow put Iran on its heels. The truth is the opposite. Iran has strengthened its position. Iran is now enriching uranium and has reportedly stockpiled 150 kilos of low enriched uranium. Its support for terrorism and threats toward Israel have increased. Those are the facts, they cannot be denied, and I refuse to continue a policy that has made the United States and Israel less secure.

Sen. McCain offers a false choice: stay the course in Iraq, or cede the region to Iran. I reject this logic because there is a better way. Keeping all of our troops tied down indefinitely in Iraq is not the way to weaken Iran — it is precisely what has strengthened it. It is a policy for staying, not a plan for victory. I have proposed a responsible, phased redeployment of our troops from Iraq. We will get out as carefully as we were careless getting in. We will finally pressure Iraq's leaders to take meaningful responsibility for their own future.

We will also use all elements of American power to pressure Iran. I will do everything in my power to prevent Iran from obtaining a nuclear weapon. That starts with aggressive, principled diplomacy without self-defeating preconditions, but with a cleareyed understanding of our interests. We have no time to waste. We cannot unconditionally rule out an approach that could prevent Iran from obtaining a nuclear weapon. We have tried limited, piecemeal talks while we outsource the sustained work to our European allies. It is time for the United States to lead.

There will be careful preparation. We will open up lines of communication, build an agenda, coordinate closely with our allies, and evaluate the potential for progress. Contrary to the claims of some, I have no interest in sitting down with our adversaries just for the sake of talking. But as president of the United States, I would be willing to lead tough and principled diplomacy with the appropriate Iranian leader at a time and place of my choosing — if, and only if, it can advance the interests of the United States.

Only recently have some come to think that diplomacy by definition cannot be tough. They forget the example of Truman, and Kennedy and Reagan. These presidents understood that diplomacy backed by real leverage was a fundamental tool of statecraft. And it is time to once again make American diplomacy a tool to succeed, not just a means of containing failure. We will pursue this diplomacy with no illusions about the Iranian regime. Instead, we will present a clear choice. If you abandon your dangerous nuclear program, support for terror, and threats to Israel, there will be meaningful incentives — including the lifting of sanctions, and political and economic integration with the international community. If you refuse, we will ratchet up the pressure.

My presidency will strengthen our hand as we restore our standing. Our willingness to pursue diplomacy will make it easier to mobilize others to join our cause. If Iran fails to change course when presented with this choice by the United States, it will be clear — to the people of Iran, and to the world — that the Iranian regime is the author of its own isolation. That will strengthen our hand with Russia and China as we insist on stronger sanctions in the Security Council. And we should work with Europe, Japan and the Gulf states to find every avenue outside the U.N. to isolate the Iranian regime — from cutting off loan guarantees and expanding financial sanctions, to banning the export of refined petroleum to Iran, to boycotting firms associated with the Iranian Revolutionary Guard, whose Quds force has rightly been labeled a terrorist organization.

I was interested to see Sen. McCain propose divestment as a source of leverage — not the bigoted divestment that has sought to punish Israeli scientists and academics, but divestment targeted at the Iranian regime. It's a good concept, but not a new one. I introduced legislation over a year ago that would encourage states and the private sector to divest from companies that do business in Iran. This bill has bipartisan support, but for reasons that I'll let him explain, Sen. McCain never signed on. Meanwhile, an anonymous senator is blocking the bill. It is time to pass this into law so that we can tighten the squeeze on the Iranian regime. We should also pursue other unilateral sanctions that target Iranian banks and assets.

And we must free ourselves from the tyranny of oil. The price of a barrel of oil is one of the most dangerous weapons in the world. Petrodollars pay for weapons that kill American troops and Israeli citizens. And the Bush administration's policies have driven up the price of oil, while its energy policy has made us more dependent on foreign oil and gas. It's time for the United States to take real steps to end our addiction to oil. And we can join with Israel, building on last year's U.S.-Israel Energy Cooperation Act, to deepen our partnership in developing alternative sources of energy by increasing scientific collaboration and joint research and development. The surest way to increase our leverage in the long term is to stop bankrolling the Iranian regime.

Finally, let there be no doubt: I will always keep the threat of military action on the table to defend our security and our ally Israel. Sometimes there are no alternatives to confrontation. But that only makes diplomacy more important. If we must use military force, we are more likely to succeed, and will have far greater support at home and abroad, if we have exhausted our diplomatic efforts.

That is the change we need in our foreign policy. Change that restores American power and influence. Change accompanied by a pledge that I will make known to allies and adversaries alike: that America maintains an unwavering friendship with Israel, and an unshakeable commitment to its security.

As members of AIPAC, you have helped advance this bipartisan consensus to support and defend our ally Israel. And I am sure that today on Capitol Hill you will be meeting with members of Congress and spreading the word. But we are here because of more than policy. We are here because the values we hold dear are deeply embedded in the story of Israel.

Just look at what Israel has accomplished in 60 years. From decades of struggle and the terrible wake of the Holocaust, a nation was forged to provide a home for Jews from all corners of the world — from Syria to Ethiopia to the Soviet Union. In the face of constant threats, Israel has triumphed. In the face of constant peril, Israel has prospered. In a state of constant insecurity, Israel has maintained a vibrant and open discourse, and a resilient commitment to the rule of law.

As any Israeli will tell you, Israel is not a perfect place, but like the United States it sets an example for all when it seeks a more perfect future. These same qualities can be found among American Jews. It is why so many Jewish Americans have stood by Israel, while advancing the American story. Because there is a commitment embedded in the Jewish faith and tradition: to freedom and fairness; to social justice and equal opportunity. To tikkun olam — the obligation to repair this world.

I will never forget that I would not be standing here today if it weren't for that commitment. In the great social movements in our country's history, Jewish and African Americans have stood shoulder to shoulder. They took buses down south together. They marched together. They bled together. And Jewish Americans like Andrew Goodman and Michael Schwerner were willing to die alongside a black man — James Chaney — on behalf of freedom and equality.

Their legacy is our inheritance. We must not allow the relationship between Jews and African Americans to suffer. This is a bond that must be strengthened. Together, we can rededicate ourselves to end prejudice and combat hatred in all of its forms. Together, we can renew our commitment to justice. Together, we can join our voices together, and in doing so make even the mightiest of walls fall down.

That work must include our shared commitment to Israel. You and I know that we must do more than stand still. Now is the time to be vigilant in facing down every foe, just as we move forward in seeking a future of peace for the children of Israel, and for all children. Now is the time to stand by Israel as it writes the next chapter in its extraordinary journey. Now is the time to join together in the work of repairing this world.

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Vex_id
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26. "I'm sure glad that 2016 Obama has grown considerably from that moment"
In response to Reply # 25


          

While Clinton is singing the same old tune.

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SoWhat
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27. "Conceivably she can be turned then."
In response to Reply # 26


  

          

If Obeezy saw the light then there's hope for her too.

fuck you.

  

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Vex_id
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34. "RE: Conceivably she can be turned then."
In response to Reply # 27


          

Had I not read Clinton's (now declassified) emails from 2012 where she justified toppling Assad to preserve Israeli Hegemony in the mid-east - I might entertain that notion. After all - I'm a dreamer/idealist by nature. Anything can happen.

But Clinton has been a pro-Netanyahu stalwart for decades now - which is something that should be very worrisome to those who endorse her so-called superior foreign policy capacity.

Her speech today was jarring in its content which really undermines the two-term efforts by the Obama Administration to change course re: Iran/Israel/Saudi Arabia and the mid-east at large. A regressive scale-back to Bush Admin. era foreign policy prescriptions re: Israel would be a disaster for the region.

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SoWhat
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37. "oh well then."
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

*shrugs*

fuck you.

  

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RaFromQueens
Member since Apr 18th 2006
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Mon Mar-21-16 07:22 PM

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39. "Whats the incentive if you're with her either way? Nm "
In response to Reply # 27


  

          

---
"People that need positivity around them all the time are weak individuals in my book" - @lilduval

  

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SoWhat
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41. "for sure."
In response to Reply # 39


  

          

fuck you.

  

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
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Mon Mar-21-16 10:27 PM

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65. "I can only hope Hillary does the same."
In response to Reply # 26


  

          

maybe if Bibi acts as sexist toward her as he was racist toward Obama...she'll turn

  

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seasoned vet
Member since Jul 29th 2008
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Mon Mar-21-16 07:32 PM

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45. "im in DC all week, got bum rushed by the crowd"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

heading into the Verizon Center

  

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Vex_id
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46. "Sanders on Netanyahu tonight (via Chris Hayes):"
In response to Reply # 0


          

"<You have to> understand that he's a hard-line right wing politician - a man who crashed the U.S. Congress - undermining President Obama - using it for political purposes in Israel; a man who has supported the growth of settlements and refused a two-state solution. You have to reach out to Palestine and Arab communities to engage with that region."

Who again is the rightful heir to Obama's progressive achievements?




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SoWhat
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47. "probably Malia."
In response to Reply # 46


  

          

i hear that Sasha is a terror!

fuck you.

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Mon Mar-21-16 09:11 PM

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57. "I'd guess it's the candidate Obama is actually supporting. "
In response to Reply # 46


          


>Who again is the rightful heir to Obama's progressive
>achievements?

  

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Vex_id
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58. "Interesting - there's been no formal endorsement of Clinton."
In response to Reply # 57


          

But sure.

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stravinskian
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60. "LOL. Do you follow the news? "
In response to Reply # 58


          


No, there hasn't been a 'formal' endorsement. Sitting presidents don't normally do that. But...

  

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Vex_id
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62. "Apparently you don't."
In response to Reply # 60


          

I pay attention to what Obama thoughtfully instructs his Press Secretary (Josh Earnest) to say. As of yesterday (via Bloomberg) - Earnest reiterated that Obama has in fact not backed Hillary Clinton.

You know who Obama did come out to publicly support? Joe Biden. It's no secret that he wanted to endorse Biden should he have run - and he made it clear that he thought Biden would be an exceptional President. Since Obama's personal choice - Joe Biden - declined to enter the race, Obama has remained neutral.

You would know that if you stopped reading FiveThirtyEight bedtime stories every night.


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stravinskian
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Mon Mar-21-16 10:29 PM

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67. "I'd be surprised by this level of wishful thinking..."
In response to Reply # 62


          

if I forgot who I was talking to.

>I pay attention to what Obama thoughtfully instructs his
>Press Secretary (Josh Earnest) to say. As of yesterday (via
>Bloomberg) - Earnest reiterated that Obama has in fact not
>backed Hillary Clinton.

Yes, so as we agreed, no formal endorsement. And again, that's normally how it works when the sitting VP isn't running. However:

http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/presidential-races/268994-jay-carney-obama-would-prefer-clinton-over-sanders

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/18/us/politics/obama-hillary-clinton-bernie-sanders.html

>You know who Obama did come out to publicly support? Joe
>Biden. It's no secret that he wanted to endorse Biden should
>he have run - and he made it clear that he thought Biden would
>be an exceptional President.

He's also made it clear that he thinks Clinton would be an exceptional president. He's said he doesn't know Bernie as well, but that he'd probably be fine.

>Since Obama's personal choice -
>Joe Biden - declined to enter the race, Obama has remained
>neutral.
>
>You would know that if you stopped reading FiveThirtyEight
>bedtime stories every night.

I don't know why you're quite so obsessed with FiveThirtyEight. Yes, they are among the smartest sources of political discussion these days, because they base their arguments on data instead of feelings. That said, I only remember linking to a single one of their posts, and that was on a basic point that nobody who knows anything about polls would dispute. I guess it must have stung, though, just how wrong you were.

  

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Vex_id
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69. "Well - If I were Obama I would remain neutral as well"
In response to Reply # 67


          

- particularly when Clinton Machine is out there calling his Presidency "an awful legacy" ->

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9bsP2As3uc

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/bill-clinton-slams-barack-obamas-awful-legacy/article/2586419#.VvCbRH4KQe0.facebook




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stravinskian
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71. "Wow, that's the best you've got?"
In response to Reply # 69
Mon Mar-21-16 10:53 PM by stravinskian

          

The Washington Examiner? Hey, you see that watermark at the bottom right-hand corner of the video? That symbol tells you how likely it is that you'll get an honest view of the situation from that clip.

It's funny how often the Bernie supporters do the work of the Republican party for them.

If you listened to what he actually said there, you'd note that Bill was talking about bipartisanship, and the "awful legacy" of bipartisanship we've had in the last seven years "and the eight years before that." Obama said he'd make the government work, he failed. W said the same, he failed. Bill Clinton said the same in '92, and he failed. Bill is saying that Hillary will find a way to make all sides come together. He's lying, obviously, but it's the same lie that every modern candidate makes, including Bernie.

  

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sosumi
Member since May 30th 2012
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Mon Mar-21-16 08:42 PM

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55. "great avi..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

reeks of "Bill tapped that"

  

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philpot
Member since Apr 01st 2007
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Tue Mar-22-16 03:55 AM

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74. "it's bizarre tomme that the sole Jewish candidate"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Was the only one not to speak at this conference

Says a lot about who "controls" Jewish identity in mainstream politics

________________________________________________________________
whenever you did these things to the least of my brothers you did them to me

  

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Mansa Musa
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75. "Hillary isn't compromising her principles in this speech"
In response to Reply # 0
Tue Mar-22-16 07:34 AM by Mansa Musa

          

At heart, she is a neocon, and her worldview has a great deal in common with AIPAC.

It's when she adopts "liberal" positions on a handful of issues, at the encouragement of her handlers, that she seems to fighting her own inclinations. It's like she wants to say, "Look, you know I don't really believe this shit about getting tough on Wall Street and companies exporting jobs, right? I just have to get elected, so bear with me." By contrast, in speeches like this, she is able to really let it rip.

  

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SoWhat
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76. "i'm really excited about all the war that's coming."
In response to Reply # 75


  

          

fuck you.

  

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Mansa Musa
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77. "It will be great for cable news ratings n/m"
In response to Reply # 76


          

  

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