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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
15894 posts
Thu Feb-18-16 02:46 PM

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"The Presidential Primary POAST"


          

It's kind of tedious having multiple posts going on for every new topic that comes up. So why not consolidate?

Let's make this the post for new polls, new attack ads, predictions, debates, mad making, etc.

_______________________________________

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
New poll has Bern up against all Repubs. Clinton losing to (almost) all
Feb 18th 2016
1
53.8% of Americans view Clinton as an "unfavorable" candidate
Feb 18th 2016
4
Those Bernie numbers really don't mean anything though.
Feb 18th 2016
5
We'll see...we'll see
Feb 18th 2016
8
      Going negative in the primaries cost them last time.
Feb 18th 2016
13
           i think not being prepared for the long game forced their hand
Feb 18th 2016
21
           RE: Going negative in the primaries cost them last time.
Feb 18th 2016
23
Just to register my disgust at this, once again.
Feb 18th 2016
7
It's not a predictor. It's a weak signal of which way the winds are blow...
Feb 18th 2016
14
But how anybody is *currently* viewed is irrelevant.
Feb 18th 2016
24
      I'm hopeful that the democratic machine would get behind Sanders
Feb 18th 2016
25
The irony is rich.
Feb 20th 2016
79
      Neck and neck IN A DIFFERENT RACE.
Feb 20th 2016
90
           I'm enjoying the irony of you as a loud & wrong denier of political scie...
Feb 20th 2016
96
                You actually think you understand what's going on.
Feb 20th 2016
99
                     if you're relying on historical precedent from past elections
Feb 20th 2016
100
                          LOL sure it has.
Feb 20th 2016
101
                               RE: LOL sure it has.
Feb 20th 2016
117
                                    That's not how science works. Even social science.
Feb 20th 2016
163
                                         lol politics just isn't really your strong suit, bruh.
Feb 20th 2016
164
                                              I wonder how many times someone said:
Feb 20th 2016
168
                                                   well, there's now - so that's 1 time.
Feb 20th 2016
174
RE: New poll has Bern up against all Repubs. Clinton losing to (almost) ...
Feb 18th 2016
15
Anyone kinda want to see Trump get the nomination?
Feb 18th 2016
2
Yeah. For the entertainment value
Feb 18th 2016
3
and that reason only
Feb 18th 2016
9
Only to help things on their way.
Feb 18th 2016
27
Why do ppl think Bernie would be more effective than BHO...
Feb 18th 2016
6
And Bernie's movement isn't nearly as big as Obama's was.
Feb 18th 2016
10
1) in negotiation, you never ask for what you want; you ask for more
Feb 18th 2016
12
^^^ you want a dollar, ask for 10
Feb 18th 2016
19
Yeah I don't think that the problem was not asking for enough
Feb 18th 2016
22
Cause he is white.... and jewish
Feb 18th 2016
18
He'll get a wake up call eventually
Feb 19th 2016
40
RE: Cause he is white.... and jewish
Feb 19th 2016
66
because Bernie's campaign is about
Feb 18th 2016
28
Obama made that case just as strongly as Bernie, if not stronger.
Feb 18th 2016
30
      ^^^I swear folks have amnesia.
Feb 19th 2016
39
           and Clinton will get us what we want?
Feb 19th 2016
47
                Nope. No President will.
Feb 19th 2016
56
                     yeah, we been doing that for years and shit doesn't work
Feb 19th 2016
65
                     people that are voting for bernie aren't voting for *bernie*
Feb 19th 2016
68
When you negotiate with the right from the center...
Feb 19th 2016
44
RE: The Presidential Primary POAST
Feb 18th 2016
11
WOW...TRUMP IS AN IDIOT!!!!
Feb 18th 2016
16
The Pope ain't shit either
Feb 18th 2016
26
      RE: The Pope ain't shit either
Feb 18th 2016
29
      Thank you
Feb 18th 2016
34
Well....
Feb 18th 2016
17
*Murph is obviously a Clinton relative or at least an employee.
Feb 19th 2016
35
      nigga is a one man firewall for Hillary
Feb 19th 2016
36
      RE: nigga is a one man firewall for Hillary
Feb 19th 2016
42
      RE: *Murph is obviously a Clinton relative or at least an employee.
Feb 19th 2016
43
           why you have to go that route?
Feb 19th 2016
46
                RE: why you have to go that route?
Feb 19th 2016
50
                     RE: why you have to go that route?
Feb 19th 2016
55
Hillary Clinton barked like a dog the other day
Feb 18th 2016
20
come get your girl Hillary with this "he wasn't even a Democrat" shit
Feb 18th 2016
31
Clinton camp scared. SuperPac is breaking into its war chest early (swip...
Feb 18th 2016
32
      its happening again, we tried to tell Clinton heads she isnt good at thi...
Feb 19th 2016
38
I will say this about Bernie though...he needs to be more flexible in hi...
Feb 18th 2016
33
Ben Carson said campaign attacks are like trying to divide slaves
Feb 19th 2016
37
Because that's what most of the popular black movies are about?
Feb 19th 2016
41
      Box set with 12 years, The Butler, The Help, Black or White
Feb 19th 2016
45
           lol
Feb 19th 2016
51
LOL at all these cheesy, slimeball ads/tricks coming from the
Feb 19th 2016
48
Cruz's eligibility going to trial in Chicago
Feb 19th 2016
49
I'm tapping out and standing in the sowhat line
Feb 19th 2016
52
its gonna be a long ride...
Feb 19th 2016
53
I think Jeb(!) is gonna suicide bomb and take Rubio with him
Feb 19th 2016
54
RE: I think Jeb(!) is gonna suicide bomb and take Rubio with him
Feb 19th 2016
57
Rubio does have that gay face... Cruz has it as well
Feb 19th 2016
58
      Yeah our local weekly ran a piece
Feb 19th 2016
60
           I think Cruz is has Rubio beat on that vibe
Feb 19th 2016
62
           Maher once said Cruz looks like he wears a bra & panties under his suit
Feb 19th 2016
71
           RE: Yeah our local weekly ran a piece
Feb 19th 2016
72
The GOP risks fucking up a swing state if they let them do that
Feb 19th 2016
59
#florida... they have to fuck it up.
Feb 19th 2016
63
      Trump's got them both beat by a mile in FL
Feb 19th 2016
64
Jeb's biggest negative is his last name
Feb 19th 2016
61
      RE: Jeb's biggest negative is his last name
Feb 19th 2016
67
      Nah, it's his lack of personality
Feb 19th 2016
69
      you're right but it's also his biggest positive.
Feb 19th 2016
70
      and the fact that he was a terrible Governor.
Feb 20th 2016
194
pretty sure we gonna end up with a republican president.
Feb 20th 2016
73
RE: pretty sure we gonna end up with a republican president.
Feb 20th 2016
74
thats a poll solely of sc democrats likely to vote in their primary.
Feb 20th 2016
75
      RE: thats a poll solely of sc democrats likely to vote in their primary.
Feb 20th 2016
82
           sc is 30% black. only 5% hispanic i think.
Feb 20th 2016
91
                RE: sc is 30% black. only 5% hispanic i think.
Feb 20th 2016
95
The one thing you're overlooking is if Trump doesn't get the Nom
Feb 20th 2016
76
cruz, rubio, and kasich all beat clinton in most national polls.
Feb 20th 2016
77
      they won't 1 v 1 this summer.
Feb 20th 2016
78
           its not as much about the repub side as it is about clinton imo.
Feb 20th 2016
80
                RE: its not as much about the repub side as it is about clinton imo.
Feb 20th 2016
83
                i agree about hillary but i'm not too worried about it
Feb 20th 2016
86
                     precisely why she's a loser in a General Election:
Feb 20th 2016
186
                          i know i'm in the minority on this one
Feb 20th 2016
188
RE: pretty sure we gonna end up with a republican president.
Feb 20th 2016
81
people dont trust clinton bro.
Feb 20th 2016
89
      RE: people dont trust clinton bro.
Feb 20th 2016
92
      i think trust is the wrong word, especially for okp and independents
Feb 20th 2016
94
           RE: i think trust is the wrong word, especially for okp and independents
Feb 20th 2016
97
it could feasibly happen, for sure.
Feb 20th 2016
85
      pretty much..
Feb 20th 2016
93
There are reports of large turnouts at NV caucuses
Feb 20th 2016
84
Same-day registration will boost turnout
Feb 20th 2016
87
RE: There are reports of large turnouts at NV caucuses
Feb 20th 2016
88
      a close win in Nevada is a bad look
Feb 20th 2016
106
           RE: a close win in Nevada is a bad look
Feb 20th 2016
109
Krugman: Sanders endangers reputation of Democrats as the rational party...
Feb 20th 2016
98
this is kind of what i was saying in post 33
Feb 20th 2016
103
RE: this is kind of what i was saying in post 33
Feb 20th 2016
114
      that's a misrepresentation
Feb 20th 2016
115
           RE: that's a misrepresentation
Feb 20th 2016
116
RE: Krugman: Sanders endangers reputation of Democrats as the rational p...
Feb 21st 2016
203
Nevada goes to Clinton (Fox News projects)
Feb 20th 2016
102
cnn round table is already giving blacks credit for the hillary win lol.
Feb 20th 2016
104
RE: cnn round table is already giving blacks credit for the hillary win ...
Feb 20th 2016
113
lol
Feb 21st 2016
205
MSNBC too now.
Feb 20th 2016
105
      lol, it just happened...
Feb 20th 2016
107
      and also the gang's all here.
Feb 20th 2016
108
      RE: lol, it just happened...
Feb 20th 2016
111
      Right? And on a Saturday afternoon at that lol
Feb 20th 2016
112
      Well this was the expected result
Feb 20th 2016
110
SuperDelegate Count in Nevada: Clinton 16; Sanders 1
Feb 20th 2016
118
RE: SuperDelegate Count in Nevada: Clinton 16; Sanders 1
Feb 20th 2016
120
RE: SuperDelegate Count in Nevada: Clinton 16; Sanders 1
Feb 20th 2016
121
RE: SuperDelegate Count in Nevada: Clinton 16; Sanders 1
Feb 20th 2016
127
      RE: SuperDelegate Count in Nevada: Clinton 16; Sanders 1
Feb 20th 2016
169
           RE: SuperDelegate Count in Nevada: Clinton 16; Sanders 1
Feb 20th 2016
193
                RE: SuperDelegate Count in Nevada: Clinton 16; Sanders 1
Feb 21st 2016
218
dem primary/caucus turnout so far has been less than impressive.
Feb 20th 2016
126
      this is where i'm at:
Feb 20th 2016
165
superdelegates shouldnt even exist.
Feb 20th 2016
123
      Yeah, I dont like the way they are doing this
Feb 20th 2016
133
      Need superdelegates to prevent party leaders from competing w/grassroots
Feb 20th 2016
135
           Her answer was so weird and so honest
Feb 20th 2016
138
           Rachel Maddow was super blown by her answer
Feb 20th 2016
166
           she's the worst
Feb 20th 2016
192
      superdelegates flipped in '08, they can do it again in '16.
Feb 20th 2016
145
           I see it having a real psychological impact at this point in time...
Feb 20th 2016
156
F##K! i need a double-shot of uygur to calm me down
Feb 20th 2016
119
dem voter turnout in nv was only 80k.
Feb 20th 2016
122
very discouraging turnout in Nevada.
Feb 20th 2016
124
i wanna laugh but this shit is so sad.
Feb 20th 2016
125
RE: dem voter turnout in nv was only 80k.
Feb 20th 2016
128
there are what? a bit more than 1 million eligible democratic voters in ...
Feb 20th 2016
129
im not sure what you are trying to say here.
Feb 20th 2016
130
RE: im not sure what you are trying to say here.
Feb 20th 2016
139
      ok i gotcha. still a 30% drop from 2 caucuses ago is noteworthy.
Feb 20th 2016
141
           RE: ok i gotcha. still a 30% drop from 2 caucuses ago is noteworthy.
Feb 20th 2016
152
Is it a different format from 2008?
Feb 20th 2016
131
nope. they started caucusing in 2008.
Feb 20th 2016
134
The caucus system needs to go away Right Today
Feb 20th 2016
132
nah - it's not just nevada. IA & NH numbers were down as well
Feb 20th 2016
137
      RE: nah - it's not just nevada. IA & NH numbers were down as well
Feb 20th 2016
147
Not a good show for a guy whose whole platform is predicated on the idea...
Feb 20th 2016
149
      Do you support Clinton or are you just anti-Sanders?
Feb 20th 2016
159
           I support a Democrat winning the general election.
Feb 20th 2016
167
                Most of the hardest Bern supporters i know are dissapointed in Obama
Feb 20th 2016
175
                     RE: Most of the hardest Bern supporters i know are dissapointed in Obama
Feb 20th 2016
180
                     i think that's unfair.
Feb 20th 2016
184
                     Well, I said people i know
Feb 20th 2016
191
                     I'm not disappointed in Obama
Feb 21st 2016
199
                          RE: I'm not disappointed in Obama
Feb 21st 2016
202
                               She's fiscally conservative, socially liberal.
Feb 21st 2016
207
                               RE: She's fiscally conservative, socially liberal.
Feb 21st 2016
213
                                    Going in circles here.
Feb 21st 2016
254
                                         not unviable as much as too ingrained
Feb 21st 2016
258
                               this is simply not true:
Feb 21st 2016
219
trump is killing shit. will prolly end up the repub nom.
Feb 20th 2016
136
Shit is amazing...never underestimate the anger of white folk
Feb 20th 2016
140
most people in the bible belt are not fans of the papacy.
Feb 20th 2016
142
Good point... I wonder who this man could offend that would turn off vot...
Feb 20th 2016
151
RE: most people in the bible belt are not fans of the papacy.
Feb 20th 2016
154
he about to rewrite political science textbooks for the next millenium.
Feb 20th 2016
143
he knows exactly how to talk to americans
Feb 20th 2016
148
      Yep
Feb 20th 2016
153
RNC is gonna start paying the fringe candidates to drop out
Feb 20th 2016
146
Carson and Cruz votes would just go to Trump
Feb 20th 2016
150
RE: RNC is gonna start paying the fringe candidates to drop out
Feb 20th 2016
157
My guess for the next few weeks in the GOP:
Feb 20th 2016
155
RE: My guess for the next few weeks in the GOP:
Feb 20th 2016
158
I think Bush is in it for the long haul. He's got money to burn
Feb 20th 2016
160
RE: I think Bush is in it for the long haul. He's got money to burn
Feb 20th 2016
161
He's got money, but
Feb 20th 2016
171
the money question is
Feb 20th 2016
177
.
Feb 20th 2016
178
Oop! There goes Jeb!!
Feb 20th 2016
172
RINCE PRIEBUS REMOVE THE PISTOL FROM YUR MOUTH
Feb 20th 2016
162
Trump will become the nominee unless the GOP can play crook
Feb 20th 2016
170
Jeb! Way to hold down 4th place
Feb 20th 2016
144
Bush drops out!
Feb 20th 2016
173
Poor Trump. Jeb was his plaything
Feb 20th 2016
176
RE: Bush drops out!
Feb 20th 2016
179
Seeing Trump's family...
Feb 20th 2016
181
lol
Feb 21st 2016
201
Why do you guys cheer "USA" during speeches lol
Feb 20th 2016
182
The Trump supporters aren't so sure.
Feb 20th 2016
183
USA vs Canada vs Cuba lol
Feb 20th 2016
185
in case the Iron Shiek wans to pop off
Feb 20th 2016
187
Anyone beliving this "Sanders supporters chant 'English Only!'" story?
Feb 20th 2016
189
i really hope the dems don't go dirty on each other
Feb 20th 2016
190
That's Hilary's ratfucking team putting that out.
Feb 20th 2016
195
RE: Anyone beliving this "Sanders supporters chant 'English Only!'&...
Feb 20th 2016
196
already shot down by a susan sarandon/snopes
Feb 20th 2016
197
smh i'm just glad somebody was recording the event
Feb 21st 2016
200
Rubio can get the nomination if he plays this right...
Feb 21st 2016
198
The one good thing Trump has done.....
Feb 21st 2016
204
no
Feb 21st 2016
214
      RE: no
Feb 21st 2016
215
           has it?
Feb 21st 2016
217
                RE: has it?
Feb 21st 2016
221
                     i don't understand what you're arguing
Feb 21st 2016
232
read these vid comments to clinton getting 77% of black votes in sc
Feb 21st 2016
206
RE: read these vid comments to clinton getting 77% of black votes in sc
Feb 21st 2016
208
      good point about trump.
Feb 21st 2016
209
           RE: good point about trump.
Feb 21st 2016
210
btw 66% of all ppl who caucused in nv were 45+ years old.
Feb 21st 2016
211
RE: btw 66% of all ppl who caucused in nv were 45+ years old.
Feb 21st 2016
212
Trump is a weak general election candidate
Feb 21st 2016
216
Maybe but he has wiggle room and an electorate with a no attention span
Feb 21st 2016
239
      RE: Maybe but he has wiggle room and an electorate with a no attention s...
Feb 21st 2016
251
Sanders is done. This will be good for Jill Stein.
Feb 21st 2016
220
RE: Sanders is done. This will be good for Jill Stein.
Feb 21st 2016
222
RE: Sanders is done. This will be good for Jill Stein.
Feb 21st 2016
224
      Clinton's problem isn't just that she voted to go to war in Iraq
Feb 21st 2016
225
           RE: Clinton's problem isn't just that she voted to go to war in Iraq
Feb 21st 2016
227
                c'mon bruh - you're better than this.
Feb 21st 2016
228
                     RE: c'mon bruh - you're better than this.
Feb 21st 2016
231
                          ah - so you admit that Sanders can compete in diverse states, finally:
Feb 21st 2016
236
                               RE: ah - so you admit that Sanders can compete in diverse states, finall...
Feb 21st 2016
240
                                    RE: ah - so you admit that Sanders can compete in diverse states, finall...
Feb 21st 2016
244
                                         RE: ah - so you admit that Sanders can compete in diverse states, finall...
Feb 21st 2016
249
                                              you're doing too much.
Feb 21st 2016
256
                                                   RE: you're doing too much.
Feb 21st 2016
261
RE: Sanders is done. This will be good for Jill Stein.
Feb 21st 2016
223
President Trump thanks you for your support
Feb 21st 2016
226
      I hate Trump, but I have a disgust threshold for lesser-evilism..
Feb 21st 2016
229
           RE: I hate Trump, but I have a disgust threshold for lesser-evilism..
Feb 21st 2016
233
           I understand being principled, but you're still helping Trump
Feb 21st 2016
234
                Lesser-evilism has to have a limit
Feb 21st 2016
238
                     RE: Lesser-evilism has to have a limit
Feb 21st 2016
241
                          By that logic, why not vote in a Republican primary?
Feb 21st 2016
243
                               RE: By that logic, why not vote in a Republican primary?
Feb 21st 2016
245
                                    No more than John Kasich=Ted Cruz
Feb 21st 2016
246
                                         RE: No more than John Kasich=Ted Cruz
Feb 21st 2016
247
The Evolution of the Myth of the Sanders "English Only" chant
Feb 21st 2016
230
RE: The Evolution of the Myth of the Sanders "English Only" chant
Feb 21st 2016
235
      RE: The Evolution of the Myth of the Sanders "English Only" chant
Feb 21st 2016
237
           RE: The Evolution of the Myth of the Sanders "English Only" chant
Feb 21st 2016
242
                RE: The Evolution of the Myth of the Sanders "English Only" chant
Feb 21st 2016
248
                     RE: The Evolution of the Myth of the Sanders "English Only" chant
Feb 21st 2016
252
Bernie is the practical and pragmatic choice for Democrats
Feb 21st 2016
250
RE: Bernie is the practical and pragmatic choice for Democrats
Feb 21st 2016
253
HC supporters say it's all about GE, yet have no real basis for
Feb 21st 2016
255
      RE: HC supporters say it's all about GE, yet have no real basis for
Feb 21st 2016
257
This is just fucking weird
Feb 21st 2016
259
      Nah, it shows how little anyone cares about the issues
Feb 23rd 2016
309
           is it just that they're both sincerely willing to fight establishments?
Feb 23rd 2016
312
RE: The Presidential Primary POAST
Feb 21st 2016
260
RE: The Presidential Primary POAST
Feb 21st 2016
262
Loyalty to who? Americans or Parties?
Feb 21st 2016
263
Perhaps a better read would be:
Feb 21st 2016
265
What have the Democrats done to earn loyalty...
Feb 21st 2016
266
LOL just realized Cruz came in 3rd
Feb 21st 2016
264
I honestly think Cruz's best option (his nuclear option)
Feb 21st 2016
267
      I don't think Trump wants him (or needs him)
Feb 21st 2016
268
      Like I said, it only makes sense for Trump if he thinks he needs it for ...
Feb 21st 2016
269
           true.. true
Feb 21st 2016
270
      RE: I honestly think Cruz's best option (his nuclear option)
Feb 22nd 2016
273
I think that the revolution will not be televised...and will be boring.
Feb 22nd 2016
271
RE: I think that the revolution will not be televised...and will be bori...
Feb 22nd 2016
275
Dems have a realistic shot at the senate
Feb 22nd 2016
287
superdelegates on some bullshit
Feb 22nd 2016
272
Peep game....
Feb 22nd 2016
274
      yeah, but that doesn't address my point
Feb 22nd 2016
276
      RE: yeah, but that doesn't address my point
Feb 22nd 2016
277
           I know they aren't new bruh...
Feb 22nd 2016
278
                They really shouldn't be talking about super delegates at all until the ...
Feb 22nd 2016
279
                RE: They really shouldn't be talking about super delegates at all until ...
Feb 22nd 2016
281
                     I realize they have done it for a while. I'm saying they shouldn't do it
Feb 22nd 2016
282
                          RE: I realize they have done it for a while. I'm saying they shouldn't d...
Feb 22nd 2016
283
                               who said it was a big deal tho?
Feb 22nd 2016
285
                                    RE: who said it was a big deal tho?
Feb 22nd 2016
288
                                         a few post on okp isnt a big deal
Feb 22nd 2016
290
                                              RE: a few post on okp isnt a big deal
Feb 23rd 2016
298
                                                   nah, just spare us the hyperbole
Feb 23rd 2016
302
                RE: I know they aren't new bruh...
Feb 22nd 2016
280
                     like I said and will say no more
Feb 22nd 2016
284
                          RE: like I said and will say no more
Feb 22nd 2016
286
      Are you ready to admit you were wrong about the delegate count?
Feb 22nd 2016
291
           RE: Are you ready to admit you were wrong about the delegate count?
Feb 23rd 2016
294
we all know Hillary has SC in the bag...
Feb 22nd 2016
289
RE: we all know Hillary has SC in the bag...
Feb 23rd 2016
293
RE: we all know Hillary has SC in the bag...
Feb 23rd 2016
295
Very important Hillary quote:
Feb 23rd 2016
292
It's bullshit because predatory lending decimated black wealth
Feb 23rd 2016
296
Good point.
Feb 23rd 2016
311
      There is a must-read article on this by Andrew Highsmith
Feb 23rd 2016
316
I think you are taking that quote out of context
Feb 23rd 2016
301
      She is being incredibly deceptive, though.
Feb 23rd 2016
304
Goldie Taylor breaks it down with simple math (Swipe)
Feb 23rd 2016
297
Spike Lee says Do the Right Thing
Feb 23rd 2016
299
Hillary has Trayvon, Sandra Bland AND Eric Garner moms
Feb 23rd 2016
300
lol
Feb 23rd 2016
303
So sayeth a friend of mine:
Feb 23rd 2016
305
RE: So sayeth a friend of mine:
Feb 23rd 2016
306
lmao
Feb 23rd 2016
308
Highlight of the thread
Feb 23rd 2016
313
Alright, this reply beats mine.
Feb 23rd 2016
320
Only if Rachel Dolezal moves to SC.
Feb 23rd 2016
307
      well played
Feb 23rd 2016
310
      lol
Feb 23rd 2016
314
      Underrated ^^
Feb 24th 2016
333
At least it makes more sense to me now.
Feb 23rd 2016
315
A lot of BLM folks are anti-capitalist and/or oppose Clinton
Feb 23rd 2016
317
RE: A lot of people in BLM are anti-capitalist and/or oppose Clinton
Feb 23rd 2016
318
      Sure. I'm not saying it's the dominant view.
Feb 23rd 2016
319
           From what I've seen....
Feb 23rd 2016
321
                There have always been cross-currents...
Feb 23rd 2016
322
                     Good points.
Feb 24th 2016
325
you're right about anti-capitalism being less a thing now....
Feb 24th 2016
323
      RE: the fact that he actually calls himself a socialist <-- Denny, this ...
Feb 24th 2016
365
Trump just said "I love the uneducated"
Feb 24th 2016
324
He's gonna be president.
Feb 24th 2016
326
      Slow down, homie...It's going to be OK...
Feb 24th 2016
327
           The point remains.....
Feb 24th 2016
328
           RE: The point remains.....
Feb 24th 2016
329
                I'm sorry but you don't know what you're talking about and are a Hillbot
Feb 24th 2016
330
                lol...
Feb 24th 2016
332
                     I forgot to add stop doing THIS^^^^^^^
Feb 24th 2016
334
                          RE: I forgot to add stop doing THIS^^^^^^^
Feb 24th 2016
336
                               Just saying....
Feb 24th 2016
338
                                    RE: Just saying....
Feb 24th 2016
340
                                         start reading people like they know them just because they read 10 of th...
Feb 24th 2016
343
                                              RE: start reading people like they know them just because they read 10 o...
Feb 24th 2016
346
                                              nothing wrong with a little shit talkikng while politic(ing)
Feb 24th 2016
347
                                              RE: start reading people like they know them just because they read 10 o...
Feb 24th 2016
351
                                                   RE: start reading people like they know them just because they read 10 o...
Feb 24th 2016
354
                But that says more about the Repubs' angry white base than anything else...
Feb 24th 2016
331
                     RE: But that says more about the Repubs' angry white base than anything ...
Feb 24th 2016
335
                          A bit about me and MY vote...
Feb 24th 2016
337
                               RE: A bit about me and MY vote...
Feb 24th 2016
339
           To get back on track.
Feb 24th 2016
341
                RE: To get back on track.
Feb 24th 2016
342
                RE: To get back on track.
Feb 24th 2016
350
                There's alot of pro-life blacks and hispanics.
Feb 24th 2016
355
                     hmmm...
Feb 24th 2016
358
                          lol
Feb 24th 2016
361
                RE: To get back on track.
Feb 24th 2016
344
                     Trump was able to meet with "100" Black pastors
Feb 24th 2016
345
                     LMAO, that meeting was cancelled...
Feb 24th 2016
348
                     RE: LMAO, that meeting was cancelled...
Feb 24th 2016
353
                          nah, this is the mind of the low info voter
Feb 24th 2016
356
                               RE: nah, this is the mind of the low info voter
Feb 24th 2016
357
                     RE: Trump was able to meet with &quot;100&quot; Black pastors
Feb 24th 2016
349
                          chill out with the misogyny
Feb 24th 2016
352
                     Trump will be against gay marraige.
Feb 24th 2016
359
                          RE: Trump will be against gay marraige.
Feb 24th 2016
360
                               What about my point about Hillary's personality?
Feb 24th 2016
362
                                    RE: What about my point about Hillary's personality?
Feb 24th 2016
364
Cuh..there aint enough cracka ass crackas in the US to give Trump
Feb 24th 2016
363
RE: Cuh..there aint enough cracka ass crackas in the US to give Trump
Feb 24th 2016
366

PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
15894 posts
Thu Feb-18-16 02:50 PM

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1. "New poll has Bern up against all Repubs. Clinton losing to (almost) all"
In response to Reply # 0
Thu Feb-18-16 02:57 PM by PimpTrickGangstaClik

          

Sanders beating all comers in head to head by wide margins. Clinton losing to all but Trump.
The key is the independent voters. If you look at the tables, you'll see Dems and Repubs won't really switch the alliances. But Sanders wins the Independent's votes against Repubs, while Clinton loses

http://www.quinnipiac.edu/images/polling/us/us02182016_Urpfd42.pdf

Presidential matchups among American voters show:
 Sanders over Trump 48 – 42 percent;
 Sanders tops Sen. Ted Cruz of Texas 49 – 39 percent;
 Sanders leads Sen. Marco Rubio of Florida 47 – 41 percent;
 Sanders beats Bush 49 – 39 percent;
 Sanders edges Kasich 45 – 41 percent.
 Clinton with 44 percent to Trump’s 43 percent;
 Cruz with 46 percent to Clinton’s 43 percent;
 Rubio topping Clinton 48 – 41 percent;
 Bush at 44 percent to Clinton’s 43 percent;
 Kasich beating Clinton 47 – 39 percent.

_______________________________________

  

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Mansa Musa
Member since Feb 16th 2009
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Thu Feb-18-16 03:02 PM

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4. "53.8% of Americans view Clinton as an "unfavorable" candidate"
In response to Reply # 1
Thu Feb-18-16 03:06 PM by Mansa Musa

          

Her favorability ratings have steadily declined since last summer.

http://elections.huffingtonpost.com/pollster/hillary-clinton-favorable-rating

Statistically speaking, according to Princeton political scientist Matt Karp, this makes Clinton the "most disliked presidential nominee in modern history," with the exception of Jimmy Carter.

https://www.jacobinmag.com/2016/02/karp-bernie-sanders-electability-clinton-republicans-trump-election/

And this is supposed to be our only hope against the Republicans? FOH.

Some of it might be sexism, but most of it is her combination of Goldman Sachs economics and neoconservative foreign policy.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Thu Feb-18-16 03:04 PM

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5. "Those Bernie numbers really don't mean anything though. "
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

The hillary numbers are way more reliable. Everyone knows Hillary and the folks that can vote for her are there and the folks who won't vote for her will not be persuaded otherwise.

Bernie has not faced the scrutiny that Hillary has faced. What happens when he faces the scrutiny the BHO did when he got the nomination? What happens when they find his Jeremiah Wright?

They will definitely be able to pull off quite a few voters for him.



**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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Thu Feb-18-16 03:17 PM

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8. "We'll see...we'll see"
In response to Reply # 5


          

You'd think Clinton's team would have dropped a bombshell already if there was one. Get him out of the race and save face and her money for the general.

_______________________________________

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Thu Feb-18-16 03:28 PM

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13. "Going negative in the primaries cost them last time."
In response to Reply # 8


          


In a general election it's easy to argue that someone is too much of a radical (left or right wing) to be trusted. You can't make that argument in a Democratic primary, for obvious reasons.

The fact that a candidate has an easy time in a primary does not mean that same candidate will have an easy time in a general election. Look at Ted Cruz.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Thu Feb-18-16 03:55 PM

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21. "i think not being prepared for the long game forced their hand"
In response to Reply # 13


          

they weren't prepared so they said fuck it, let's play dirty.

Same shit will happen this time of Bernie wins Nevada and has a strong showing in SC.

Clinton's are old school, they always go dirty when everything else fails.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Thu Feb-18-16 04:02 PM

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23. "RE: Going negative in the primaries cost them last time."
In response to Reply # 13


          



I don't think people understand that the Republican party is running against Hillary...They are running campaign ads against her. RIGHT NOW....lol

They are not bothering with Bernie. They have not ran any crazy ads against Bernie. No OPPO research yet...No surrogates coming out on the attack...

Because Repugs want Bernie....Bernie Sanders is a dream opposition candidate for the Repugs. Right now they are saying to themselves, "YOU MEAN WE CAN RUN AGAINST SOME JEWISH 74 YEAR OLD DUDE WHO CALLS HIMSELF SOCIALIST DEMOCRAT????" SIGN US UP!

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Thu Feb-18-16 03:17 PM

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7. "Just to register my disgust at this, once again."
In response to Reply # 1


          


Not all data is meaningful.

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/a-year-out-ignore-general-election-polls/

You can't poll a race that hasn't even begun yet.

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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Thu Feb-18-16 03:36 PM

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14. "It's not a predictor. It's a weak signal of which way the winds are blow..."
In response to Reply # 7


          

Of course lots of things can change (in any direction) from now until election day.

I'm not using these numbers to predict the size of the margin of victory in the general (which is what this article is critiquing). Or even if Dems or Republicans will win the general.

I'm using it to gauge how the general public feels about the candidates relative to their competitors. The poll is posing hypotheticals that can't be tested (except for the one pairing which ends up the Rep/Dem nominees).

Only thing I'm getting from this poll is the relative likability of the candidates. It takes away the "but he'll never get the nomination" factor.
The main thing I can glean from it is that Clinton is currently viewed unfavorably by independents.

_______________________________________

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Thu Feb-18-16 04:07 PM

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24. "But how anybody is *currently* viewed is irrelevant."
In response to Reply # 14


          

>Only thing I'm getting from this poll is the relative
>likability of the candidates. It takes away the "but he'll
>never get the nomination" factor.
>The main thing I can glean from it is that Clinton is
>currently viewed unfavorably by independents.

What matters is how people will be viewed in November, after the campaign, after the attack ads. Hillary's likability numbers will probably remain relatively stable (and indeed, this is bad news for Democrats, another reason it'd be nice if we weren't amplifying right-wing tropes).

But you can't dispute the fact that Bernie's numbers will plummet in a general election. Remember, Obama was in trouble for a while, over trivial things like Bill Ayers and Jeremiah Wright. Republicans falsely painted him as a socialist radical, and he came through it largely because there was a historically strong distrust for Republicans at the time.

There will be MUCH stronger, and much better-documented, attacks on Bernie Sanders and he won't have the "four more years of George W Bush" argument to fall back on. All Bernie will have to defend himself is a relatively uninspired movement within his own party.

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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Thu Feb-18-16 04:18 PM

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25. "I'm hopeful that the democratic machine would get behind Sanders"
In response to Reply # 24
Thu Feb-18-16 04:19 PM by PimpTrickGangstaClik

          

and lend him their support if he some how becomes the nominee. That would mitigate some of increase in attacks for the other side. I'm hopeful that sour grapes would not hold them back from surrogating and campaigning for whomever the Dem nominee is.

What would be interesting is whether or not Sanders would openly accept their support for a general election? Truthfully, I think the fact that he relies on small donors now is out of necessity. The big money is trying to find Bernie. But would he accept it if they starting beating down his door?

_______________________________________

  

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Vex_id
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79. "The irony is rich."
In response to Reply # 7


          

Bernie is neck & neck with Clinton nationwide -- the same Clinton whom you deem to be the most electable. But somehow the guy who is equalizing the alleged "most electable" candidate is not electable himself?

k.

-->

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Sat Feb-20-16 04:11 PM

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90. "Neck and neck IN A DIFFERENT RACE. "
In response to Reply # 79


          


How can you be having so much trouble with this? A candidate doing well in a primary does not mean that that candidate would do well in a general election.

Ted Cruz is doing pretty well in his primary. That doesn't mean he could ever be elected.

There's nothing revolutionary about a party's hardliners fooling themselves into thinking the country is on their side. It's happened dozens of times in this country's history. And the only revolution is for the other side, when they exploit that hubris.

  

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Vex_id
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Sat Feb-20-16 04:23 PM

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96. "I'm enjoying the irony of you as a loud & wrong denier of political scie..."
In response to Reply # 90


          

You have no evidence to back up your claims that Sanders won't perform well in a general election vs. Trump/Cruz. In fact, all of the experts/political scientists contradict your hardhead stance with every new piece of information we're getting nation-wide.

It's really not hard to understand: Sanders outperforms Clinton demonstrably with Independents - whom largely determine a general election. Further, one group where
Sanders is experiencing some difficulty with is the older black electorate. If he were to
win the primary, the overwhelming lion-share of older blacks would vote for Bernie over Trump/Cruz. Further, Clinton is far more polarizing than Sanders to undecideds. There are many people who simply won't vote for her because they just can't stand her (for reasons they often can't articulate very well). Even amongst the progressive wing, there are many who are so bitterly repulsed by Clinton that they may not even shore up in a general election to support her. Finally, in the year of the anti-establishment, droves of voters do not have the appetite to usher in any Clinton/Bush type of Superpac/royal family political family dynasty -- so in a wild-card election year where voter turnout could be historic, virtually all of the registered electorate would go to an anti-establishment stalwart candidate like Sanders.

Those are clear reasons why Sanders is outperforming Clinton in general election polls.

But please do keep this up.


-->

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Sat Feb-20-16 04:44 PM

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99. "You actually think you understand what's going on. "
In response to Reply # 96


          


You've constructed an elaborate fantasy, and I'd like to believe it, but history is not on your side.

http://www.vox.com/2016/2/5/10923304/bernie-sanders-general-election

  

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Vex_id
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100. "if you're relying on historical precedent from past elections"
In response to Reply # 99


          

to make your point - you're beyond reproach.

All historical precedent and conventional analysis has been obliterated in this primary season.

-->

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
12698 posts
Sat Feb-20-16 04:59 PM

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101. "LOL sure it has. "
In response to Reply # 100
Sat Feb-20-16 05:01 PM by stravinskian

          

I'd look forward to reminding you of just how naive you're being, if not for the fact that it will mean we lose at least two supreme court appointments.

> All historical precedent and conventional analysis has been obliterated in this primary season.

And you say I'm denying political science.

  

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Vex_id
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117. "RE: LOL sure it has. "
In response to Reply # 101


          

>if not for the fact that it will mean we lose at least
>two supreme court appointments.

Exactly - and that's why Sanders should get your support.

>> All historical precedent and conventional analysis has been
>obliterated in this primary season.
>
>And you say I'm denying political science.

I'm looking at current political science that is pertinent to *this* election. You're using past election data as a crutch to deny the data of the day. Have fun with that.


-->

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Sat Feb-20-16 08:15 PM

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163. "That's not how science works. Even social science. "
In response to Reply # 117


          


>I'm looking at current political science that is pertinent to
>*this* election. You're using past election data as a crutch
>to deny the data of the day. Have fun with that.

No, you're finding excuses to ignore the data you don't like. Specifically: the overwhelming preponderance of Democratic political history.

There's nothing special in the "data of the day." Bernie Sanders hasn't shown himself to be any different from any of the past feel-good liberal candidates. His turnout is no better, in fact it's much worse than Obama's was. His ideas are not new. This is a textbook Democratic campaign.

  

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Vex_id
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Sat Feb-20-16 08:19 PM

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164. "lol politics just isn't really your strong suit, bruh."
In response to Reply # 163


          

You constantly disqualify yourself from being taken seriously when you say there isn't anything new about the Sanders campaign.

lol k.

-->

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Sat Feb-20-16 08:29 PM

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168. "I wonder how many times someone said:"
In response to Reply # 164


          

>You constantly disqualify yourself from being taken seriously
>when you say there isn't anything new about the McGovern
>campaign.
>
>lol k.
>
>-->

  

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Vex_id
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174. "well, there's now - so that's 1 time."
In response to Reply # 168


          


-->

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Thu Feb-18-16 03:37 PM

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15. "RE: New poll has Bern up against all Repubs. Clinton losing to (almost) ..."
In response to Reply # 1
Thu Feb-18-16 03:40 PM by murph71

          




.......

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Binladen
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Thu Feb-18-16 02:52 PM

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2. "Anyone kinda want to see Trump get the nomination?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
15894 posts
Thu Feb-18-16 02:54 PM

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3. "Yeah. For the entertainment value"
In response to Reply # 2


          

But I'm starting to think he could really be a threat. More so than the "grown up" candidates.

_______________________________________

  

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Binladen
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Thu Feb-18-16 03:18 PM

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9. "and that reason only"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

  

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Atillah Moor
Member since Sep 05th 2013
13825 posts
Thu Feb-18-16 04:45 PM

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27. "Only to help things on their way. "
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

It'll certainly add a lot of clarity to my future decisions in life.

______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Thu Feb-18-16 03:10 PM

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6. "Why do ppl think Bernie would be more effective than BHO..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

in creating change?

There has always been the narrative that BHO wasn't radical enough that's why so much of his agenda got pushed back but do people really believe that?

As hard as it was to get Obamacare through folks think Medicaid for All can get through?

If Bernie had a slate of candidates running for all levels of government and part of a movement like Newt Gingrinch or the Tea Party maybe possibly I could see it.

But all of this change riding on the back of one 74 year old? That's more unrealistic than the expectations people had for BHO.

I think you have to be sniffing fairy dust to think that would happen.



**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
12698 posts
Thu Feb-18-16 03:22 PM

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10. "And Bernie's movement isn't nearly as big as Obama's was."
In response to Reply # 6


          


Bernie's always talking about "record turnout", but the only record turnout we've seen so far has been in the Republican contests. In Iowa and NH, Democratic turnout has been significantly below where it was in the 2008 race.

  

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magilla vanilla
Member since Sep 13th 2002
18749 posts
Thu Feb-18-16 03:24 PM

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12. "1) in negotiation, you never ask for what you want; you ask for more"
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

especially when you're negotiating with someone hostile. This way, when you come down, you'll land closer to where you want. Part of the disappointment with the ACA is that Obama clearly used the public option as a sacrificial lamb, when it should have been a core piece of the puzzle (and, funnily enough, the ACA WITH the public option was what the Republican Congress and the Heritage Foundation presented as the "common sense alternative" to Hillarycare in the 90s. If we knew now what we knew then, then maybe BHO would have been able to fight for single-payer after 16 years of wildly successful taxpayer-provided insurance. Le sigh . . . )

2) There's a small cadre of Congressional candidates who are, if not exactly of Bernie's ilk, at least represent a "new Progressive." People like Zephyr Teachout in New York, John Fetterman in Pennsylvania, and a few others.

---------------------------------
Photo zine(some images NSFW): http://bit.ly/USaSPhoto

"This (and every, actually) conversation needs more Chesterton and less Mike Francesa." - Walleye

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79557 posts
Thu Feb-18-16 03:47 PM

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19. "^^^ you want a dollar, ask for 10"
In response to Reply # 12


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Thu Feb-18-16 04:00 PM

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22. "Yeah I don't think that the problem was not asking for enough"
In response to Reply # 12


  

          

I mean Hillary asked for the Public Option, how come we didn't get Public Option with ACA with the Public Option?

I negotiate for a living and sometimes when someone comes in asking 10 and we think they are worth six we realize it's time to fire that person and hire someone who would do it for 4.

All that to say those fortune cookie negotiating advice doesn't always hold up.

At any rate I think ACA represents the compromised solution, not failing to aim high enough.


2.) You didn't nearly name enough people to point to an organized dispersed movement.


>especially when you're negotiating with someone hostile. This
>way, when you come down, you'll land closer to where you want.
>Part of the disappointment with the ACA is that Obama clearly
>used the public option as a sacrificial lamb, when it should
>have been a core piece of the puzzle (and, funnily enough, the
>ACA WITH the public option was what the Republican Congress
>and the Heritage Foundation presented as the "common sense
>alternative" to Hillarycare in the 90s. If we knew now what we
>knew then, then maybe BHO would have been able to fight for
>single-payer after 16 years of wildly successful
>taxpayer-provided insurance. Le sigh . . . )
>
>2) There's a small cadre of Congressional candidates who are,
>if not exactly of Bernie's ilk, at least represent a "new
>Progressive." People like Zephyr Teachout in New York, John
>Fetterman in Pennsylvania, and a few others.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79557 posts
Thu Feb-18-16 03:46 PM

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18. "Cause he is white.... and jewish"
In response to Reply # 6


          

I'm joking but not really, 99% of the friction with Obama is racial.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Atillah Moor
Member since Sep 05th 2013
13825 posts
Fri Feb-19-16 11:34 AM

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40. "He'll get a wake up call eventually "
In response to Reply # 18


  

          

______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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double 0
Member since Nov 17th 2004
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Fri Feb-19-16 04:35 PM

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66. "RE: Cause he is white.... and jewish"
In response to Reply # 18


          

U do understand anti-semitism runs centuries deep throughout the world

Double 0
DJ/Producer/Artist
Producer in Kidz In The Hall
-------------------------------------------
twitter: @godouble0
IG: @godouble0
www.thinklikearapper.com

  

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Mr. ManC
Member since Jan 26th 2009
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Thu Feb-18-16 06:41 PM

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28. "because Bernie's campaign is about"
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

getting the populace involved in the political process.

The laziest process I have heard against Bernie is "how will he get anything done through Congress when Obama couldn't?"

The difference is Bernie is solid enough to emphasize the mid-term and local elections as AS important as the general election. We can vote for Congress too! They are not some monolith that can't be moved. If they don't respond to the American consensus then VOTE THEM OUT.

We need a political revolution more than we need a new president on our side.

________________________________________________
R.I.P. Soulgyal <3
SUPA NERD LLC.
Knowledge Meets Nature
Musica Negra
#13irteen

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Thu Feb-18-16 07:06 PM

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30. "Obama made that case just as strongly as Bernie, if not stronger. "
In response to Reply # 28


          


>The difference is Bernie is solid enough to emphasize the
>mid-term and local elections as AS important as the general
>election. We can vote for Congress too! They are not some
>monolith that can't be moved. If they don't respond to the
>American consensus then VOTE THEM OUT.
>
>We need a political revolution more than we need a new
>president on our side.

All that stuff about how change comes from the bottom up, not from the top down. We all believed it and we all thought we'd remain a force in the midterms and beyond.

We weren't. The conservatives got angry and the liberals got complacent.

You can say Bernie will lead a bigger movement, but he isn't doing it so far. Turnout for Bernie this year isn't anything near what it was for Obama in 2008.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
Charter member
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Fri Feb-19-16 11:31 AM

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39. "^^^I swear folks have amnesia. "
In response to Reply # 30


  

          


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Fri Feb-19-16 12:23 PM

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47. "and Clinton will get us what we want? "
In response to Reply # 39


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Fri Feb-19-16 02:18 PM

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56. "Nope. No President will. "
In response to Reply # 47


          


So vote strategically for that, get what you can out of the presidency, and fight elsewhere for everything else.

It's TRUE that change comes from the bottom up. And that's a reason NOT to get into hero-worship with your presidential candidates.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Fri Feb-19-16 04:13 PM

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65. "yeah, we been doing that for years and shit doesn't work"
In response to Reply # 56


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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rob
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Fri Feb-19-16 09:12 PM

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68. "people that are voting for bernie aren't voting for *bernie*"
In response to Reply # 56
Fri Feb-19-16 09:13 PM by rob

  

          

and the attacks against bernie won't be against him personally, they will be on the practicality of his ideas.

it may not be a winning strategy, but it's not going to be a loser strategy in the same way that obama was and hillary will be when it comes to local politics.

in 2008, people who voted for obama mostly really were voting for him, personally. certainly, the opposition has been very personal.

  

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Mansa Musa
Member since Feb 16th 2009
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Fri Feb-19-16 12:10 PM

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44. "When you negotiate with the right from the center..."
In response to Reply # 6
Fri Feb-19-16 12:16 PM by Mansa Musa

          

...you end up with a center-right compromise. This is exactly what happened under Bill Clinton from 1992-2000, and it essentially what happened again under Obama. When you have a centrist, neoliberal Democrat negotiating with far-right Republicans, and both sides are funded by the same mega-banks and multinational corporations, you get a more culturally enlightened version of Reaganism.

If you negotiate with the right from the left, you will give more of an opening to social movements, and you won't give up as much in the end.

  

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Tiggerific
Member since May 24th 2007
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Thu Feb-18-16 03:22 PM

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11. "RE: The Presidential Primary POAST"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Okay, my thinking is that Bernie would be that dude. I know he's got his issues. BUT, I think Bernie's record of helping the poor and the minorities would be good.

WITH ALL THAT SAID...Bernie will not win the nomination. Even though I'm voting for him, he won't. So, I will jump on the Hillary train when it comes down to that.

But...Hillary has flip flopped so much, I am not quite sure if she won't be just as bad as a Republican candidate. I do question whether she would really try to get things done for minorities.

The thing I do like about the Democrats is that they aren't so focused on what's going on outside the US. THATS ALL THE REPUBLICANS TALK ABOUT. AND SEALING THE BOARDERS. THATS ALL.

They don't talk about how to better the economy and bring jobs to the working class. They don't talk about how to make health services available to the poor and working class. They don't care about them.

And the fact that people listen to Trump and all that they can say is that Trump is going to make america great again, just shows me that people aren't really hearing what he's saying. Because like the great Negro Poet Black Thought has said, "Aint Sayin Nuthin".

Buzzwords should not equal Presidential Candidate.

"We don't make mistakes, we just have happy little accidents" - Bob Ross

"I'm wearing a MSU Tshirt because I went to MSU, you are wearing a UM Tshirt because you went to Walmart!" -unknown.

http://bjsquirrelchronicles.blogspot.com

  

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Tiggerific
Member since May 24th 2007
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Thu Feb-18-16 03:37 PM

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16. "WOW...TRUMP IS AN IDIOT!!!!"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

So, he's mad because THE POPE questioned whether he's a Christian.

But...the President has had to deal with him being questioned whether he's a Muslim for YEARS.

Heck, Trump even questioned it.

And, to answer the Pope, Trump said that "its not fair for anyone to question another man about his faith".

Ask the current sitting president about that one, Trump.

"We don't make mistakes, we just have happy little accidents" - Bob Ross

"I'm wearing a MSU Tshirt because I went to MSU, you are wearing a UM Tshirt because you went to Walmart!" -unknown.

http://bjsquirrelchronicles.blogspot.com

  

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Atillah Moor
Member since Sep 05th 2013
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Thu Feb-18-16 04:43 PM

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26. "The Pope ain't shit either"
In response to Reply # 16


  

          

You'd think God's representative on earth wouldn't have a hard time keeping child molesters out of the pulpit.

______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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Tiggerific
Member since May 24th 2007
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Thu Feb-18-16 06:45 PM

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29. "RE: The Pope ain't shit either"
In response to Reply # 26


  

          

Truth.

"We don't make mistakes, we just have happy little accidents" - Bob Ross

"I'm wearing a MSU Tshirt because I went to MSU, you are wearing a UM Tshirt because you went to Walmart!" -unknown.

http://bjsquirrelchronicles.blogspot.com

  

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BlassFemur
Member since Mar 26th 2008
10309 posts
Thu Feb-18-16 11:57 PM

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34. "Thank you"
In response to Reply # 26


  

          

https://banafrit.com/
http://middlebrainmedia.com/

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Thu Feb-18-16 03:41 PM

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17. "Well...."
In response to Reply # 0


          



*Murph blinks.

*Murph reminds himself that the Republicans have not even gone after Bernie yet.

*Murph reminds himself that Clinton has been a Conservative punching bag and known commodity for over 20 years.

*Murph reminds himself that the only thing that the public knows about Bernie is that he's a Senator from Vermont and is a socialist.

*Murph reminds himself the attack ads against Bernie practically write themselves.

*Murph doesn't read national polls in February.

*Murph is reminded that Mitt Romney was beating Obama early on in polls.

*Murph remembers that once the media started going in and Democrats started running ads and surrogates against Mitt, those polls flipped...

*Murph is tired of this bullshit and needs a drink.

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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ThaTruth
Charter member
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Fri Feb-19-16 10:50 AM

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35. "*Murph is obviously a Clinton relative or at least an employee."
In response to Reply # 17


          

________________________________________
"Take the surprise out your voice Shaq."-The REAL CP3
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2H5K-BUMS0

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79557 posts
Fri Feb-19-16 10:54 AM

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36. "nigga is a one man firewall for Hillary"
In response to Reply # 35


          

he is in the media tho...

so he is making sure he has proof he was in her camp when it's time for those press passes

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Fri Feb-19-16 11:49 AM

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42. "RE: nigga is a one man firewall for Hillary"
In response to Reply # 36
Fri Feb-19-16 11:50 AM by murph71

          

>he is in the media tho...
>
>so he is making sure he has proof he was in her camp when it's
>time for those press passes


Nah....just spitting that trooooof.....But I get it. U want it all to be Politics for Dummy's.....And I don't get down like that.....Too many twists and turns....

Anyone putting stock in national poll elections in Feb. is doing too much....And yes...U have been known to do way too much, cool posting and all....This is why I don't even pay attention to general election poll numbers that have Hillary OVER Sanders...It's meaningless at this point....

What matters is Nevada and SC....And right now, at least in the former, it's anyone's race...Hell, Clinton could mess around and lose that Nevada caucus....Her only hope at this point is a low turnout which insiders are predicting because the caucus format is still new for Nevada voters..

Because high turnout = a win for Bernie....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Fri Feb-19-16 11:51 AM

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43. "RE: *Murph is obviously a Clinton relative or at least an employee."
In response to Reply # 35


          



Go play in the street with traffic, Homophobe T.....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Fri Feb-19-16 12:17 PM

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46. "why you have to go that route? "
In response to Reply # 43


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Fri Feb-19-16 01:32 PM

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50. "RE: why you have to go that route? "
In response to Reply # 46


          



If niggas gonna throw out baseless charges then I'm going to respond the way I see fit...

The only thing remotely pro Clinton I've said (and will continue to say) is how she gets punished for shit male politicians do all the time...

Other than that? My comments have been more about my worries about the future of the Democratic party more than who will win or lose....My issue with the current state of things as it pertains to this Presidential election is bigger than Hillary Clinton or Bernie Sanders......

I know we all have jokes...We have fun and wild out and shit...But I'm a serious man about some things...This is one of those things....

If people think Bernie or Hill Dawg is the answer to things, bully for them.

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Fri Feb-19-16 02:10 PM

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55. "RE: why you have to go that route? "
In response to Reply # 50


          

>
>
>If niggas gonna throw out baseless charges then I'm going to
>respond the way I see fit...
ok, that was wack tho...
>
>The only thing remotely pro Clinton I've said (and will
>continue to say) is how she gets punished for shit male
>politicians do all the time...

you playing the gender card? what is she getting punished for that others get away with when running for office?

>
>Other than that? My comments have been more about my worries
>about the future of the Democratic party more than who will
>win or lose....My issue with the current state of things as it
>pertains to this Presidential election is bigger than Hillary
>Clinton or Bernie Sanders......
>
>I know we all have jokes...We have fun and wild out and
>shit...But I'm a serious man about some things...This is one
>of those things....
>
>If people think Bernie or Hill Dawg is the answer to things,
>bully for them.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79557 posts
Thu Feb-18-16 03:53 PM

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20. "Hillary Clinton barked like a dog the other day"
In response to Reply # 0


          

can't make this shit up, she is awful at this.

Also heard rumblings about Clinton's team being restructured if they lose Nevada.

IMO, she has the superdelegates but if Nevada is an L or a slim win it's a problem. Once again she is in for a long primary season and that means she didn't learn from the last time.

Whole new generation of young voters and they like Bernies energy. Clinton still,using that old ass playbook,running power seeps and shit. Bernie got young head running the read option.

She needs to step her game up in SC big time and from what I hear that lead is shrinking too.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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rob
Charter member
23210 posts
Thu Feb-18-16 11:11 PM

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31. "come get your girl Hillary with this "he wasn't even a Democrat" shit"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

nothing good comes out of that angle.

how is she so bad at the long game?


  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
15894 posts
Thu Feb-18-16 11:35 PM

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32. "Clinton camp scared. SuperPac is breaking into its war chest early (swip..."
In response to Reply # 31


          

http://www.npr.org/2016/02/18/467216044/with-democratic-primary-fight-closer-pro-clinton-superpac-amps-it-up

Hillary Clinton's superPAC seemed to be essentially sitting out the primary, saving its war chest to fight Republicans in the general election. Now that's changed.

In the 10 days since Bernie Sanders thumped Clinton in the New Hampshire Democratic primary, the pro-Clinton superPAC Priorities USA Action has spent $1.3 million on her behalf.

The money went for radio ads in South Carolina, which holds its Democratic primary on Feb. 27, plus digital ads and direct mail for future Democratic contests in Arkansas, Georgia, Illinois, Louisiana and Tennessee.

Priorities spokesman Justin Barasky said the superPAC's messaging is the same as it would need to be for the general election: promoting Clinton and attacking Republican presidential candidates. He said the ads and mailers don't mention Sanders, who beat Clinton in New Hampshire last week by 22 percentage points.

The Priorities superPAC finished 2015 with $35.8 million in the bank. It raised $6 million from investor George Soros and $3 million from Hollywood's Haim and Cheryl Saban, among other donors for this election cycle.

Up till now, it has engaged in minimal primary spending — for example, $45,000 on TV in New Hampshire, according to the media firm SMG/Delta and NBC News. But with Sanders pulling close to Clinton in the Iowa caucuses and well ahead in New Hampshire, the wait-till-summer approach is out the window.

Sanders gets support from National Nurses United for Patient Protection, a political committee operated by the union National Nurses United. It has spent $1.7 million promoting the Vermont senator, according to the Sunlight Foundation. NNU members do grass-roots work for Sanders — something that Priorities, a superPAC without members, cannot provide for Clinton.

While Priorities and the nurses' political committee are the independent committees closest to the Democratic candidates, they're hardly the only outside groups in a primary season that has become a free-for-all of political spending.

Using Federal Election Commission data, the Sunlight Foundation calculates that outside groups have spent $2.8 million backing Clinton, $5.3 million attacking her, $1.8 million for Sanders and $829,194 against him.

_______________________________________

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79557 posts
Fri Feb-19-16 11:04 AM

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38. "its happening again, we tried to tell Clinton heads she isnt good at thi..."
In response to Reply # 32


          

but they swear the numbers ass up for her.

all that said, I agree it's still hers to lose because the establishment wants her to win but I don't see it happening even if she gets the nomination.

She is too polarizing, too stiff, too stiff and too old. Bernie is older but why the fuck is he able to rally the youth and tap into that new energy?

Once again Hillary's team expected a cakewalk and now they appear off balance and in panic mode.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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rob
Charter member
23210 posts
Thu Feb-18-16 11:43 PM

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33. "I will say this about Bernie though...he needs to be more flexible in hi..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

he's pretty terrible at follow up questions or challenges after questions, even when he has good answers available.

the rationing question today is a perfect example...great initial answer, then he's asked a solid follow up question about the VA.

he didn't answer the damn follow up question, which is actually pretty easy to answer: the VA was fucked up by some administrators, but also has inevitable problems as long as it's dealing with:

1) going to war over a decade
2) budget shortfalls
3) weird public/private shenanigans
4) boomers getting old
5) ww2/korea vets being SUPER OLD
6) the generally shitty nature of our overall healthcare system.

This is an actually an area where his democratic socialism would shine if he got specific instead of reiterating the stump speech.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79557 posts
Fri Feb-19-16 10:59 AM

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37. "Ben Carson said campaign attacks are like trying to divide slaves"
In response to Reply # 0


          

this nigga yo....Smh.

told a group of black students its like house slaves and field slaves... they are trying to divide us so we don't work together to overthrow the establishment.

now, the history of divide and conquer in our community is true but why is this dude always bringing up slavery?



****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Atillah Moor
Member since Sep 05th 2013
13825 posts
Fri Feb-19-16 11:35 AM

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41. "Because that's what most of the popular black movies are about? "
In response to Reply # 37


  

          

______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Fri Feb-19-16 12:15 PM

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45. "Box set with 12 years, The Butler, The Help, Black or White"
In response to Reply # 41


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Atillah Moor
Member since Sep 05th 2013
13825 posts
Fri Feb-19-16 01:38 PM

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51. "lol"
In response to Reply # 45


  

          

______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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Deebot
Member since Oct 21st 2004
26762 posts
Fri Feb-19-16 01:02 PM

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48. "LOL at all these cheesy, slimeball ads/tricks coming from the"
In response to Reply # 0


          

Cruz camp/supporters. That "Rubio/Obama Trade Pact" photoshop is a riot.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Fri Feb-19-16 01:17 PM

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49. "Cruz's eligibility going to trial in Chicago"
In response to Reply # 48


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
16595 posts
Fri Feb-19-16 01:39 PM

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52. "I'm tapping out and standing in the sowhat line"
In response to Reply # 0
Fri Feb-19-16 01:40 PM by bentagain

  

          

= I'm ready to vote.

it was entertaining, and I truly valued the previous posts and subsequent replies, etc...

shouts to murph

I was so interested initially, honestly, I watched every second of every debate

after the NH primary, I really don't have the stomach to continue entertaining the BS

if you can't see it by now, you probably won't, check the sig

the last of my effort IRT POTUS will be at the ballot box.

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Fri Feb-19-16 01:46 PM

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53. "its gonna be a long ride..."
In response to Reply # 52


          

prolly best to peak in after each primary election result.

and I really wish they would get rid of these damn caucuses and vote like normal people.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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j.
Member since Feb 24th 2009
3819 posts
Fri Feb-19-16 02:01 PM

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54. "I think Jeb(!) is gonna suicide bomb and take Rubio with him"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Dude is PISSED. It's personal. When it gets to that level he'll stop at nothing.

Christie was more of a lone wolf attack. Rubio did that to himself.

When Jeb(!) finishes in low digits in SC, the Bush family is gonna turn on the blast and decapitate the marcobot.

  

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Tiggerific
Member since May 24th 2007
13451 posts
Fri Feb-19-16 02:46 PM

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57. "RE: I think Jeb(!) is gonna suicide bomb and take Rubio with him"
In response to Reply # 54
Fri Feb-19-16 02:49 PM by Tiggerific

  

          

It's already starting. I saw some outrageous stuff about Rubio being in the gay clubs in his youth or something. I scrolled past it but I'll see what I can find.

They are going on the attack on Rubio. Get ready for the Nasty to come out of the GOP.

http://www.towleroad.com/2016/02/marco-rubio-gay/

"We don't make mistakes, we just have happy little accidents" - Bob Ross

"I'm wearing a MSU Tshirt because I went to MSU, you are wearing a UM Tshirt because you went to Walmart!" -unknown.

http://bjsquirrelchronicles.blogspot.com

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79557 posts
Fri Feb-19-16 03:04 PM

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58. "Rubio does have that gay face... Cruz has it as well"
In response to Reply # 57


          

^^^ someone said this in the comment section of one of those hit pieces
.... lmao

I can't lie... I could see both of those dudes at the podium talking about "that was way in the past"

one site had the back of a dudes head and said it was proof it was Rubio at a foam party.

this gone be goood

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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j.
Member since Feb 24th 2009
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Fri Feb-19-16 03:46 PM

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60. "Yeah our local weekly ran a piece"
In response to Reply # 58


  

          

Basically he was arrested at a gay cruising park when he was 18, one of the dudes he was with later rented a house to a gay porn company

http://www.miaminewtimes.com/news/marco-rubios-childhood-friend-tied-to-miamis-most-infamous-gay-porn-case-8203133

All this shit is whatever. But Marcobot has come out (see what I did there) against gay marriage and legal protection for LGBT

http://www.miaminewtimes.com/news/marco-rubio-roll-back-gay-marriage-and-protections-for-trans-people-8103638

This all sounds like that airport "wide stance" senator.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Fri Feb-19-16 03:51 PM

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62. "I think Cruz is has Rubio beat on that vibe"
In response to Reply # 60


          



He definitely has a toe tapping stall room vibe...

http://media.salon.com/2013/10/ted_cruz7.jpg
http://www.laprogressive.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/ted-cruz-350.gif

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Mynoriti
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71. "Maher once said Cruz looks like he wears a bra & panties under his suit"
In response to Reply # 62


  

          

which sounded pretty dead on

  

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Tiggerific
Member since May 24th 2007
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Fri Feb-19-16 11:21 PM

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72. "RE: Yeah our local weekly ran a piece"
In response to Reply # 60


  

          

I will say that Marco Rubio does sound like a great name for a gay porn star.

Just saying.

"We don't make mistakes, we just have happy little accidents" - Bob Ross

"I'm wearing a MSU Tshirt because I went to MSU, you are wearing a UM Tshirt because you went to Walmart!" -unknown.

http://bjsquirrelchronicles.blogspot.com

  

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cgonz00cc
Member since Aug 01st 2002
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Fri Feb-19-16 03:26 PM

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59. "The GOP risks fucking up a swing state if they let them do that"
In response to Reply # 54


  

          

Florida's 2 biggest republicans in a blood feud?

Lol

WHAT A TIME TO BE ALIVE

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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63. "#florida... they have to fuck it up. "
In response to Reply # 59


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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j.
Member since Feb 24th 2009
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Fri Feb-19-16 04:06 PM

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64. "Trump's got them both beat by a mile in FL"
In response to Reply # 63


  

          

it's gonna be a cakewalk for him. The fucker owns the most valuable real estate in south florida and the cracker panhandle is obsessed with him. Nothing better for him than for Jeb(!) and Marcobot to go at each other. Divide and conquer.

  

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ThaTruth
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61. "Jeb's biggest negative is his last name"
In response to Reply # 54


          

________________________________________
"Take the surprise out your voice Shaq."-The REAL CP3
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2H5K-BUMS0

  

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Tiggerific
Member since May 24th 2007
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67. "RE: Jeb's biggest negative is his last name"
In response to Reply # 61


  

          

Nah, his biggest negative is that he's an idiot.

"We don't make mistakes, we just have happy little accidents" - Bob Ross

"I'm wearing a MSU Tshirt because I went to MSU, you are wearing a UM Tshirt because you went to Walmart!" -unknown.

http://bjsquirrelchronicles.blogspot.com

  

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Mynoriti
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69. "Nah, it's his lack of personality"
In response to Reply # 61


  

          

While his last name isn't exactly a positive, it's not what's keeping him from frontrunner status

He's running for POTUS and he comes off as someone who'd struggle to speak up if he got the wrong food order.

Conttrast him with Trump who's managing to sell himself as this ultimate alpha male and, and Jeb has become his favorite target. I fully expect Trump to headlock noogie him at some point, or make him punch himself. "Stop hitting yourself, Jeb!"

  

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rob
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70. "you're right but it's also his biggest positive. "
In response to Reply # 61


  

          

which is why he's probably almost no one's first choice candidate or worst choice candidate.

  

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Castro
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194. "and the fact that he was a terrible Governor."
In response to Reply # 61


  

          

------------------
One Hundred.

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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73. "pretty sure we gonna end up with a republican president."
In response to Reply # 0


          

hillary will win the dem nomination with plenty of controversy.
old/conservative/uninformed blacks will be scapegoated
(media coverage is already slanting that way in sc).
young voters will be demoralized.
progressives will be demoralized.
oddly enough...a good segment of women will be demoralized.
independents will be uninspired to vote dem.
dem convention will be a mess.
dem voter turnout for the general will be low.

republicans galvanize the party behind their candidate
against hillary and a 3rd barack obama term.
they pull the gloves off
and attack her on bill/barack/emails/low favorability or complete distrust by her own partys voters/etc.
repubs walk away with the strap.

like i said before
old/conservative/uninformed blacks will be scapegoated for the whole thing
going back to hillary getting the nom.
bernie closed the gap and is virtually tied in nv now
and media coverage is basically "latinos are getting it right".
hillary still has a sizeable lead in sc
and coverage is basically "enough blacks arent informed, are too loyal to the clintons, voting solely on name value, etc"
i can already see fox news fanning the flames
and thanking black people for voting hillary lol.





  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 12:35 PM

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74. "RE: pretty sure we gonna end up with a republican president."
In response to Reply # 73


          



This is a smart ^^^ interesting take.

I'm going to disagree though....The Supreme Court justice battle is going to put a fire underneath the left wing base no matter who wins (Bernie/Hillary)...It will work more for the left than the right because the general pubic will see the Republicans drag their feet and shit on Obama's moderate supreme court pick (oh...and the curve pitch that's been mentioned now is that pick will undoubtedly be a minority...There's a Mexican and an Indian that's leading the pack of picks right now. What happens when Repugs try to stonewall a VERY qualified LATINO candidate?...The Left will be energized and the middle will look at the Repugs as a can't do no right party...)

I don't think the young and very progressive will be staying home because Bernie failed to pick up the nomination....In fact don't take my word for it. Peep it yourself: https://twitter.com/wccubbison/status/700432187443773441




GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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75. "thats a poll solely of sc democrats likely to vote in their primary."
In response to Reply # 74


          

http://media.bloomberg.com/bb/avfile/rYvhghpmwySE

behind barack
both clintons are the next two highest rated in net favorability lol
(they are actually tied with each other).
thats their land.

>https://twitter.com/wccubbison/status/700432187443773441

and i dont think the scotus appointment matters much to the general electorate.
thats not something that typically "electrifies" the base.
like 2/3 of all americans cant even name 1 supreme court justice

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 03:41 PM

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82. "RE: thats a poll solely of sc democrats likely to vote in their primary."
In response to Reply # 75


          

>http://media.bloomberg.com/bb/avfile/rYvhghpmwySE
>
>behind barack
>both clintons are the next two highest rated in net
>favorability lol
>(they are actually tied with each other).
>thats their land.

People r using SC as the norm considering its bigger racial demographics.....I think when you get to the Caucus states that's when you are more likely to see that far left/right rigid mindset...



>>https://twitter.com/wccubbison/status/700432187443773441
>
>and i dont think the scotus appointment matters much to the
>general electorate.
>thats not something that typically "electrifies" the base.
>like 2/3 of all americans cant even name 1 supreme court
>justice


U r correct....But u know what else doesn't normally happen? An entire political party stonewalling the President's right to make a Supreme Court pick..

Again, it's not choosing a Supreme Court justice that's ginning up the Democratic base...It's hearing Republican leaders and candidates say that the President has NO right MAKE THAT PICK.....In terms of voting I'm talking more about the Latino/Minority vote...If Obama picks the Mexican nominee as the buzz seems to suggest then a no vote will be viewed a lot differently....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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Sat Feb-20-16 04:15 PM

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91. "sc is 30% black. only 5% hispanic i think."
In response to Reply # 82


          

def not being used as the norm in terms of the general population.
its just more reflective of voter diversity (combined with nv)
than nh and vt.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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95. "RE: sc is 30% black. only 5% hispanic i think."
In response to Reply # 91
Sat Feb-20-16 04:23 PM by murph71

          


Yeah...But in other states like Florida, Penn and Ohio, Blacks AND Latinos make up a sizable chunk of the electorate....That's a big chunk of the Obama voting block, which Clinton is running to....

This is a Caucus state (advantage Bernie) vs. normal voting states (Clinton) battle...Clinton has to win a few Caucus states and hold the majority lead she has right now in the regular voting states and swing states to win...

Bernie HAS to win Nevada....If he loses this race it will fall like a domino in Clinton's favor...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Melanism
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76. "The one thing you're overlooking is if Trump doesn't get the Nom"
In response to Reply # 73


          

Trump is bringing new voters/voters who were turned off by politics to the table while demonizing the very nature of the GOP.

If he loses the nominations to Cruz or Rubio, it may be difficult to keep the voters from just tuning out which is important because they need an incredibly large voter turnout to take back the throne.

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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77. "cruz, rubio, and kasich all beat clinton in most national polls."
In response to Reply # 76


          

trump actually loses to her.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/2016_presidential_race.html

  

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rob
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78. "they won't 1 v 1 this summer."
In response to Reply # 77


  

          

most americans still don't really know cruz or rubio or kasich. they just know they're not trump.

people are gonna hate cruz. if it wasn't for texas, he wouldn't even be on the national stage. (what's scary to me is texans keep upping the ante on this shit with jim abbott and some of these congressmen).

i'm a little worried about rubio, but it seems more and more likely that he is a choke artist.

kasich is just paul ryan's dad...republicans aren't going to nominate that, but if they did, he's going to have nothing to say when he's not running against crazy.

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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Sat Feb-20-16 03:01 PM

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80. "its not as much about the repub side as it is about clinton imo."
In response to Reply # 78
Sat Feb-20-16 03:20 PM by Reeq

          

her trust/believability numbers are pretty damning.
the flip flopping on key issues like trade, immigration, gay marriage, etc
is starting to kill her.
this email shit isnt going away any time soon.
now they looking at pay for play donations to her foundation too.
her being compromised by wall street/big money donors is hurting her too.

and her campaign cant figure out
how she is losing so much ground to sanders? lol.

her campaign manager just held a meeting to address all of this.
at the park ave offices of marc lasry.
a big time wall street hedge fund manager lol.
you cant make this up.

the dems are gonna have to run a 'lesser of two evils' campaign
and try to remind voters what life was like under a repub prez.
historically thats been hard to do
when it follows a 2 term gap.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 03:43 PM

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83. "RE: its not as much about the repub side as it is about clinton imo."
In response to Reply # 80


          



One on one she will beat them all...The only one to be worried about is Rubio...It's that simple....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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rob
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86. "i agree about hillary but i'm not too worried about it"
In response to Reply # 80


  

          

i'm not voting for hillary in the primary, but myself and people like me will almost all vote for her in the general. i think she's a huge liability long term, but i think for *this* election, the competition just isn't out there to erode her base.

the republicans are just really bad potential presidents. i don't think this can be overstated.

and i just don't think the base can possibly be demoralized enough to cede this election, especially once we're focused.

but as i've said before, i don't see how hillary is anything but a "meh" move. if we're that desperate to beat the republicans and this is about a third obama term, it's not too late to draft biden. and if that's what hillary's about, then she should step the fuck out of his way.

  

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Vex_id
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Sat Feb-20-16 09:10 PM

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186. "precisely why she's a loser in a General Election:"
In response to Reply # 86


          


>but as i've said before, i don't see how hillary is anything
>but a "meh" move.

That will not bring out voters. It could result in an astonishingly low democratic voter turnout where all the energy would be with the Trump electorate.

She could actually lose to Donald Trump in a general election - like, for serious.


-->

  

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rob
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188. "i know i'm in the minority on this one"
In response to Reply # 186


  

          

but i just don't believe people are that stupid.

and the republicans are really historically unlikeable.


  

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double 0
Member since Nov 17th 2004
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81. "RE: pretty sure we gonna end up with a republican president."
In response to Reply # 73


          

Dont think people will just sit home on the left with whats at stake regarding social issues..

Immigration, planned parenthood fight, voter id, police reform, american "safety"

I actually think clinton can court more moderate and establishment repubs because she'll be a little more hawkish in gen election.

On a local level the republicans have been extremely effective but their optics on a national level paint an extremely fascist state that most sensible republicans wouldn't want to vote for.

Double 0
DJ/Producer/Artist
Producer in Kidz In The Hall
-------------------------------------------
twitter: @godouble0
IG: @godouble0
www.thinklikearapper.com

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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Sat Feb-20-16 04:08 PM

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89. "people dont trust clinton bro."
In response to Reply # 81
Sat Feb-20-16 04:19 PM by Reeq

          

we obviously dont trust her on okp lol.
and over 60% dont trust her
in florida, ohio, and pennsylvania.
those are your biggest swing states right there.
and those numbers are going UP.
once these emails drop the day before super tuesday
this whole thing might be a shit show.
that will be too late to sink the remaining primaries for her
but obviously early enough to wreck the general.

if she gets the nom
its not gonna be pretty.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 04:16 PM

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92. "RE: people dont trust clinton bro."
In response to Reply # 89
Sat Feb-20-16 04:16 PM by murph71

          


It's about who a candidate goes up against...That's how politics works in the real world...

We can bitch and moan about Clinton all day...But when it comes down to it in a general election? It will be Clinton vs. Trump or Cruz (unlikely) or Rubio....

She's going to kill Trump with the Latino vote...And Cruz is Barry Goldwater 2.0...Rubio is the one u worry about. But my point stands. Democrats will be coming out in droves because there's too much at stake...This ain't a game...Repubs got both the House and Senate....They will vote for Clinton...

As for that whole trustworthy thing, I just read an interesting outgoing voting poll from Nevada just a few minutes ago.....They asked how much being honest is important them...The numbers was in 82 percent ...Very high...Very much for Bernie...

But then when they asked how important experience was to them as a voter the numbers went up even more to 92...which points to Clinton....



GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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rob
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Sat Feb-20-16 04:22 PM

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94. "i think trust is the wrong word, especially for okp and independents"
In response to Reply # 89


  

          

i'm pretty sure i know exactly what kind of president hillary is going to be. i trust that i will/won't be disappointed. i just think we can do better...representing my interests is not a big priority for her.

i don't like that she isn't making stronger statements about what her presidency would be like, but it's not that she's being dishonest...that's who she is and what she's learned as a politician. she's pretty comfortable with the past 20 years of American politics and she'll do her best to keep us on that course.

i think people who say there are specific politicians that they can't "trust" (and others that they can trust) might be dumb.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 04:24 PM

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97. "RE: i think trust is the wrong word, especially for okp and independents"
In response to Reply # 94


          


>i think people who say there are specific politicians that
>they can't "trust" (and others that they can trust) might be
>dumb.



^^^^^^^^^

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Vex_id
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85. "it could feasibly happen, for sure."
In response to Reply # 73


          

but then again - that would be nothing new. The masses have long been manipulated to uphold a status-quo that actually doesn't confer significant benefit to them. This would be another instance of that happening.

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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Sat Feb-20-16 04:21 PM

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93. "pretty much.."
In response to Reply # 85


          

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 03:46 PM

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84. " There are reports of large turnouts at NV caucuses"
In response to Reply # 0
Sat Feb-20-16 03:48 PM by PimpTrickGangstaClik

          

So big that many are leaving because of long lines.

Sounds like bad news for Clinton. A close win would still be a major loss for her. This was supposed to be her territory. Not the lily white NH or Iowa

_______________________________________

  

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Mansa Musa
Member since Feb 16th 2009
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Sat Feb-20-16 03:58 PM

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87. "Same-day registration will boost turnout"
In response to Reply # 84


          

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 04:00 PM

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88. "RE: There are reports of large turnouts at NV caucuses"
In response to Reply # 84
Sat Feb-20-16 04:01 PM by murph71

          

>So big that many are leaving because of long lines.
>
>Sounds like bad news for Clinton. A close win would still be a
>major loss for her. This was supposed to be her territory. Not
>the lily white NH or Iowa

If we were talking a squeak out of a win in SC, you would def. be right....But in Nevada, a close win by Clinton going into a state where she has a double digit lead (SC) and with Super Delegates on her side? Nah...No L there...

The only thing that would give Bernie the momentum he needs is a win in Nevada...That's when Clinton can start panicking...That's a real L...

Also, there's two reports coming out that the large turnout r first time voters heavy with Latinos...And they are saying there are ALOT of union members voting....Union members vote in blocks (and the news reports r saying that union leaders are telling their members to vote for Clinton...)

Oh...and THIS shit right here...lol...Republican college students and organizations r urging their folks to vote for Bernie...in a Caucus primary you can vote in BOTH races...

The Right playing dirty as fuck....lol....

link: http://www.attn.com/stories/6073/republicans-for-bernie-dem-caucus

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79557 posts
Sat Feb-20-16 05:24 PM

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106. "a close win in Nevada is a bad look"
In response to Reply # 88


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 05:31 PM

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109. "RE: a close win in Nevada is a bad look"
In response to Reply # 106
Sat Feb-20-16 05:41 PM by murph71

          

Caucus states = Bernie...

Regular states = Hillary...

Nevada is a caucus state...Hillary just won Nevada, a caucus state....Caucus states USUALLY benefit ideological voters, homie (I. e. them Bernie voters...)....RABID, hardcore voters because of the way one votes in a caucus state....

Hillary is OK....Gonna be a slugfest the rest of the way...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
12698 posts
Sat Feb-20-16 04:38 PM

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98. "Krugman: Sanders endangers reputation of Democrats as the rational party..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

This is actually something that's bothered me about Sanders and his supporters for a long time. There's a strong streak of anti-intellectualism among liberals. The only reason we've noticed it more among the Republicans is because the anti-intellectual liberals have been toothless so far. The Sanders movement is changing that.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/19/opinion/varieties-of-voodoo.html

Varieties of Voodoo
Paul Krugman FEB. 19, 2016

America’s two big political parties are very different from each other, and one difference involves the willingness to indulge economic fantasies.

Republicans routinely engage in deep voodoo, making outlandish claims about the positive effects of tax cuts for the rich. Democrats tend to be cautious and careful about promising too much, as illustrated most recently by the way Obamacare, which conservatives insisted would be a budget-buster, actually ended up being significantly cheaper than projected.

But is all that about to change?

On Wednesday four former Democratic chairmen and chairwomen of the president’s Council of Economic Advisers — three who served under Barack Obama, one who served under Bill Clinton — released a stinging open letter to Bernie Sanders and Gerald Friedman, a University of Massachusetts professor who has been a major source of the Sanders campaign’s numbers. The economists called out the campaign for citing “extreme claims” by Mr. Friedman that “exceed even the most grandiose predictions by Republicans” and could “undermine the credibility of the progressive economic agenda.”

That’s harsh. But it’s harsh for a reason.

The claims the economists are talking about come from Mr. Friedman’s analysis of the Sanders economic program. The good news is that this isn’t the campaign’s official assessment; the bad news is that the Friedman analysis has been highly praised by campaign officials.

And the analysis is really something. The Republican candidates have been widely and rightly mocked for their escalating claims that they can achieve incredible economic growth, starting with Jeb Bush’s promise to double growth to 4 percent and heading up from there. But Mr. Friedman outdoes the G.O.P. by claiming that the Sanders plan would produce 5.3 percent growth a year over the next decade.

Even more telling, I’d argue, is Mr. Friedman’s jobs projection, which has the employed share of American adults soaring all the way back to what it was in 2000. That may sound possible — until you remember that by 2026 more than a quarter of U.S. adults over 20 will be 65 and older, compared with 17 percent in 2000.

Sorry, but there’s just no way to justify this stuff. For wonks like me, it is, frankly, horrifying.

Still, these are numbers on a program that Mr. Sanders, even if he made it to the White House, would have little chance of enacting. So do they matter?

Unfortunately, the answer is yes, for several reasons.

One is that, as the economists warn, fuzzy math from the left would make it impossible to effectively criticize conservative voodoo.

Beyond that, this controversy is an indication of a campaign, and perhaps a candidate, not ready for prime time. These claims for the Sanders program aren’t just implausible, they’re embarrassing to anyone remotely familiar with economic history (which says that raising long-run growth is very hard) and changing demography. They should have set alarm bells ringing, but obviously didn’t.

And there’s an even larger issue here: Good ideas don’t have to be sold with fairy dust.

Mr. Sanders is calling for a large expansion of the U.S. social safety net, which is something I would like to see, too. But the problem with such a move is that it would probably create many losers as well as winners — a substantial number of Americans, mainly in the upper middle class, who would end up paying more in additional taxes than they would gain in enhanced benefits.

By endorsing outlandish economic claims, the Sanders campaign is basically signaling that it doesn’t believe its program can be sold on the merits, that it has to invoke a growth miracle to minimize the downsides of its vision. It is, in effect, confirming its critics’ worst suspicions.

What happens now? In the past, the Sanders campaign has responded to critiques by impugning the motives of the critics. But the authors of the critical letter that came out on Wednesday aren’t just important economists, they’re important figures in the progressive movement.

For example, Alan Krueger is one of the founders of modern research on minimum wages, which shows that moderate increases in the minimum don’t cause major job loss. Christina Romer was a strong advocate for stimulus during her time in the White House, and a major figure in the pushback against austerity in the years that followed.

The point is that if you dismiss the likes of Mr. Krueger or Ms. Romer as Hillary shills or compromised members of the “establishment,” you’re excommunicating most of the policy experts who should be your allies.

So Mr. Sanders really needs to crack down on his campaign’s instinct to lash out. More than that, he needs to disassociate himself from voodoo of the left — not just because of the political risks, but because getting real is or ought to be a core progressive value.

  

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rob
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Sat Feb-20-16 05:05 PM

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103. "this is kind of what i was saying in post 33"
In response to Reply # 98


  

          

though if we're going to be rational, let's ditch the shade.

paul krugman and these economists didn't say "bernie's economics are bad."

they said "this one interpretation of bernie's economics by this one guy is bad, and also inevitably the upper middle class will have to take on some of the burden of bernie's economic policies."

i am okay with that. most americans will be too.

though if we want to really be grown ups, eventually we will have to have conversation about the centrality of growth in most economists' models, and whether that makes sense in a world dealing with population bubbles and environmental collapse.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 05:39 PM

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114. "RE: this is kind of what i was saying in post 33"
In response to Reply # 103


          

>though if we're going to be rational, let's ditch the shade.
>
>
>paul krugman and these economists didn't say "bernie's
>economics are bad."
>
>they said "this one interpretation of bernie's economics by
>this one guy is bad, and also inevitably the upper middle
>class will have to take on some of the burden of bernie's
>economic policies."


But it doesn't help that Bernie is using "this one guy is bad"'s number as its main source of why his economic numbers hold up...That's why they are going hard at Bernie...

Trust, as this election goes on and the media starts looking closely at Bernie's economic platform it's no longer going to be an easy ride...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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rob
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Sat Feb-20-16 05:55 PM

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115. "that's a misrepresentation"
In response to Reply # 114


  

          

this is a new report, authored by a hillary supporter, and it's not as crazy as the spin on the letter would suggest. he seems like a reasonable guy.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/02/18/the-economist-who-validated-bernie-sanders-big-liberal-plans-is-voting-for-hillary-clinton/

but, more importantly, the logic of bernie's campaign isn't something that he pulled out of his ass last week. there will be more economists. even some of these 4 (and i'm avoiding criticizing both their motives and their blindspots) have advocated policies that hillary would have avoided because they were outside of the mainstream a few years ago.

socialism is a thing. it works in other countries. it's worked when it's been implemented partially here.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 06:21 PM

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116. "RE: that's a misrepresentation"
In response to Reply # 115


          

>this is a new report, authored by a hillary supporter, and
>it's not as crazy as the spin on the letter would suggest. he
>seems like a reasonable guy.
>
>https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/02/18/the-economist-who-validated-bernie-sanders-big-liberal-plans-is-voting-for-hillary-clinton/
>
>but, more importantly, the logic of bernie's campaign isn't
>something that he pulled out of his ass last week. there will
>be more economists. even some of these 4 (and i'm avoiding
>criticizing both their motives and their blindspots) have
>advocated policies that hillary would have avoided because
>they were outside of the mainstream a few years ago.
>
>socialism is a thing. it works in other countries. it's worked
>when it's been implemented partially here.


I think socialism def. works....

In certain settings....

Americans are simple folk....They don't like paying more taxes than they have to...In a lot of the countries overseas where socialism is successful taxes are pretty high across the board, fueling open and free universities, free healthcare, ect....But there is more of a communal frame of mind in those countries....

America is a I GOTTA GET MINE BEFORE U GET YOURS kind of place....A lot of Bernie's economic numbers = taxes not just on the 1 percent...But on folks making $75 K and under...

Again, I realize that its a simplistic notion to just bristle at ANY reality that taxes will be raised to help the bottom line. I WILL CONTINUE TO AGREE WITH U ON THAT VERY POINT...Just saying the American mindset is very different from Sweden....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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Sun Feb-21-16 08:09 AM

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203. "RE: Krugman: Sanders endangers reputation of Democrats as the rational p..."
In response to Reply # 98
Sun Feb-21-16 08:28 AM by denny

          

A couple things.....Krueger and Romer's criticism was that Sander's economic plan wouldn't lead to the 'miracle growth' that he admittedly try to claim. NOT that it was impossible/unsustainable. In other words....yes, it is totally possible to raise the standard of living for the majority of Americans. It just won't result in huge economic growth. And by the way....Krueger's endorsement of raising the minimum wage ALSO concedes that it won't have a net growth impact for the economy as whole. We're not trying to make America great again and hoping for trickle-down. We need more equality before anything else.

Second....the claim that there will be 'losers and winners' in growing the social safety net is self-explanatory and understood by everybody but the most naive Bernie supporter. Of course there will be losers amongst the upper-middle class. Again, we're ok with that and so should everybody else in light of the crisis currently experienced in the lower classes.

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 05:04 PM

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102. "Nevada goes to Clinton (Fox News projects)"
In response to Reply # 0
Sat Feb-20-16 05:05 PM by PimpTrickGangstaClik

          

About a 4 point lead right now.

_______________________________________

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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Sat Feb-20-16 05:23 PM

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104. "cnn round table is already giving blacks credit for the hillary win lol."
In response to Reply # 102


          

nv latinos are defecting to bernie in good numbers.
young people are a given.

so how is clinton winning nevada?
according to cnn:
black people lol.

blacks are gonna carry clinton right into the nom.
thats how the media will cover it.

i want everyone in here
to start watching how pro bernie whites
talk about black voters from here on out.
bernie losing the nom is gonna be placed squarely on our shoulders.


  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 05:34 PM

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113. "RE: cnn round table is already giving blacks credit for the hillary win ..."
In response to Reply # 104


          

>nv latinos are defecting to bernie in good numbers.
>young people are a given.

The Latino vote in Nevada is skewing VERY young...That gives credence to Bernie's youth vote edge....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
11281 posts
Sun Feb-21-16 08:22 AM

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205. "lol"
In response to Reply # 104
Sun Feb-21-16 08:22 AM by denny

          

All those racist socialists gonna come out the woodwork.

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Sat Feb-20-16 05:23 PM

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105. "MSNBC too now. "
In response to Reply # 102


          


Don't know if I've ever heard OKP so quiet.

I'll admit, I'm relieved.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Sat Feb-20-16 05:26 PM

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107. "lol, it just happened... "
In response to Reply # 105


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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rob
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Sat Feb-20-16 05:31 PM

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108. "and also the gang's all here."
In response to Reply # 107


  

          

don't think anyone's surprised hillary barely won a state where she was doubling bernie's polling a couple months ago. he picked up basically everyone who was undecided.

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Sat Feb-20-16 05:33 PM

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111. "RE: lol, it just happened... "
In response to Reply # 107


          


19 minutes between post 102 and post 104.

I'm just missing the old days, I guess.

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 05:33 PM

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112. "Right? And on a Saturday afternoon at that lol"
In response to Reply # 107
Sat Feb-20-16 05:34 PM by PimpTrickGangstaClik

          

OKP is usually the walking dead at this time

_______________________________________

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 05:32 PM

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110. "Well this was the expected result"
In response to Reply # 105
Sat Feb-20-16 05:59 PM by PimpTrickGangstaClik

          

A Sanders win would be news.
Actually the margin of victory is kind of unexpected considering the projected margins just about a month ago.

But this was a needed win for Clinton to stonewall Sanders' momentum going into Super Tuesday. If she lost NV, I could see the cards start tumbling down.

_______________________________________

  

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Vex_id
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Sat Feb-20-16 06:47 PM

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118. "SuperDelegate Count in Nevada: Clinton 16; Sanders 1"
In response to Reply # 0


          

Sanders performed well in Nevada - but once again, the Super Delegates are ensuring that it isn't a fair fight.

-->

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 06:56 PM

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120. "RE: SuperDelegate Count in Nevada: Clinton 16; Sanders 1"
In response to Reply # 118


          

>Sanders performed well in Nevada - but once again, the Super
>Delegates are ensuring that it isn't a fair fight.



Hillary's Super delegates in Nevada is NOT why she won...She's edged him on regular delegates as well..This wasn't a tie like Iowa or a win for Bernie in NH where Clinton still racked up on the SD count....

If Clinton wins the primaries I hope Bernie voters don't cry, sit on their asses and don't vote...We need everybody...Fuck dem Repugs...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Vex_id
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Sat Feb-20-16 07:04 PM

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121. "RE: SuperDelegate Count in Nevada: Clinton 16; Sanders 1"
In response to Reply # 120


          


>Hillary's Super delegates in Nevada is NOT why she won...She's
>edged him on regular delegates as well..

edged him yes - but the total delegate count doesn't reflect that - it reflects a commanding Clinton victory in Nevada which actually didn't happen.

Also - the nominee is ultimately decided by delegate count. So what's more important than who wins the popular vote in each of these states is who left each respective state with the most delegates. In an ideal world, the Super Delegates would reflect and echo their constituents. Thus far, the Super Delegates have voted as if 95% of the electorate supports Clinton over Sanders. It's out of proportion with the pulse of the people - and decisively undemocratic.

The fact that Sanders has picked up exactly 1 Super Delegate thus far is a travesty.

>If Clinton wins the primaries I hope Bernie voters don't cry,
>sit on their asses and don't vote...We need everybody...Fuck
>dem Repugs...

It's a real problem if Clinton is the nominee - which is why it's imperative for her to run a dignified and honest campaign against Sanders. You can't win the general if you alienate a significant portion of the progressive base.

-->

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 07:15 PM

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127. "RE: SuperDelegate Count in Nevada: Clinton 16; Sanders 1"
In response to Reply # 121


          

>
>>Hillary's Super delegates in Nevada is NOT why she
>won...She's
>>edged him on regular delegates as well..
>
>edged him yes - but the total delegate count doesn't reflect
>that - it reflects a commanding Clinton victory in Nevada
>which actually didn't happen.



She beat him...And not by a squeaker....


>Also - the nominee is ultimately decided by delegate count.
>So what's more important than who wins the popular vote in
>each of these states is who left each respective state with
>the most delegates. In an ideal world, the Super Delegates
>would reflect and echo their constituents. Thus far, the
>Super Delegates have voted as if 95% of the electorate
>supports Clinton over Sanders. It's out of proportion with
>the pulse of the people - and decisively undemocratic.

Sanders has only proven that he can compete (and win) in really white states....This is not pre school. U don't get an A for effort. There are winners and losers. If Bernie beats Clinton in the Southern states, then we can talk about delegates and super delegates...


>The fact that Sanders has picked up exactly 1 Super Delegate
>thus far is a travesty.

Politicians don't believe that a socialist can win a general election....

>>If Clinton wins the primaries I hope Bernie voters don't
>cry,
>>sit on their asses and don't vote...We need everybody...Fuck
>>dem Repugs...

>It's a real problem if Clinton is the nominee - which is why
>it's imperative for her to run a dignified and honest campaign
>against Sanders. You can't win the general if you alienate a
>significant portion of the progressive base.

They are both throwing slime at each other....And the Bernie Bros are getting out of hand...There are reports that some Bernie Bros were screaming ENGLISH ONLY when someone was attempting to walk a Latino voter through some caucus paperwork....Shit is wild out there....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Vex_id
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Sat Feb-20-16 08:30 PM

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169. "RE: SuperDelegate Count in Nevada: Clinton 16; Sanders 1"
In response to Reply # 127


          


>Sanders has only proven that he can compete (and win) in
>really white states....This is not pre school. U don't get an
>A for effort. There are winners and losers. If Bernie beats
>Clinton in the Southern states, then we can talk about
>delegates and super delegates...

He just competed strongly in Nevada - which you're already downplaying. Clinton's lead with minority voters narrows with each passing day. The main problem Sanders has is time - because as every day voters become aware of who he really is - you're seeing a significant electoral shift. The younger black vote has migrated to Sanders in a way that very few predicted would happen a month ago - and latinos in Nevada supported Sanders in larger numbers than anyone predicted weeks ago. So he can compete in non-white states: he just did.

>>The fact that Sanders has picked up exactly 1 Super Delegate
>>thus far is a travesty.
>
>Politicians don't believe that a socialist can win a general
>election....

Nice GOP-like deflection to not address the Super Delegate disparity.

>They are both throwing slime at each other....And the Bernie
>Bros are getting out of hand...There are reports that some
>Bernie Bros were screaming ENGLISH ONLY when someone was
>attempting to walk a Latino voter through some caucus
>paperwork....Shit is wild out there....

lol @ "there were reports" -- c'mon fam.

Sanders has gone after Clinton *hard* on substantive issues. Pestering her to release her speaking transcripts to Wall Street isn't 'throwing slime.' For the most part, both Clinton and Sanders have run a dignified campaign - but there's a sense that Clinton doesn't play fair - and she has a very real issue when it comes to trustworthiness which weakens her General Election candidacy.

I know you're a Clinton supporter - but you can't deny that she has glaring weaknesses as a General Election candidate.


-->

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 10:07 PM

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193. "RE: SuperDelegate Count in Nevada: Clinton 16; Sanders 1"
In response to Reply # 169
Sat Feb-20-16 10:19 PM by murph71

          

>I know you're a Clinton supporter - but you can't deny that
>she has glaring weaknesses as a General Election candidate.


I'm not a hardcore Clinton backer...I'm not a Clinton booster....I'm a Democrat who is going with the candidate who I think can win in a general election (and I don't read into general election polls in Feb. We already know Hillary can survive a constant drubbing by the Republican machine and the media...With Bernie, we have no idea....)

If JOE BIDEN was running against Bernie I would be backing Biden...U catch my drift?

I don't think a 74 year old socialist can be elected President of the United States...But I'm no Hillary Fan Boy...I voted for Obama the last go around.....I don't worship candidates...I'm pretty pragmatic....And I'm more concerned about the future of the Democratic Party than anything else...

No need to make it more complex than that....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Vex_id
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218. "RE: SuperDelegate Count in Nevada: Clinton 16; Sanders 1"
In response to Reply # 193


          

>I'm not a hardcore Clinton backer...I'm not a Clinton
>booster....I'm a Democrat who is going with the candidate who
>I think can win in a general election

That's what is peculiar about your Clinton support - because Sanders is out-performing Clinton in General Election hypothetical match-ups - but you haven't even considered him as a viable candidate and actively seek to denigrate his candidacy with GOP talking points like:

>I don't think a 74 year old socialist can be elected President
>of the United States...

..which is a gross oversimplification.

But I'm no Hillary Fan Boy...I voted
>for Obama the last go around.....I don't worship
>candidates...I'm pretty pragmatic....And I'm more concerned
>about the future of the Democratic Party than anything
>else...

I think that's where there's a lot of splinter among progressives/democrats. You may not be a fan boy for Clinton - but you're a fan boy for the Democratic Party, en masse. A lot of progressives hold no such loyalty to the Democratic Party because they do not see the Party as an engine for substantive Progressive change, but instead an upholder of status-quo politics.

The support for Sanders really isn't about Bernie Sanders the man -- there is far more hero worship for Clinton as the golden girl of the Democratic Party than there is Bernie worship. Bernie's campaign is really about implanting a voice to the progressive wing that has historically felt alienated by the political process until Obama's candidacy.

-->

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
16347 posts
Sat Feb-20-16 07:15 PM

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126. "dem primary/caucus turnout so far has been less than impressive."
In response to Reply # 120
Sat Feb-20-16 07:18 PM by Reeq

          

i think it will trend even lower
as the clinton nom looks more likely
(especially after a big win in sc)

>If Clinton wins the primaries I hope Bernie voters don't cry,
>sit on their asses and don't vote...We need everybody...Fuck
>dem Repugs...

im a bernie dude.
im def voting clinton if she gets the nom.
i think a lot of people will stay home tho.

  

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Vex_id
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Sat Feb-20-16 08:21 PM

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165. "this is where i'm at:"
In response to Reply # 126


          


>im a bernie dude.
>im def voting clinton if she gets the nom.
>i think a lot of people will stay home tho.

lot of people will stay home for sure - it's another reason why she's the weaker general election candidate to Sanders. She's incredibly polarizing.

-->

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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Sat Feb-20-16 07:09 PM

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123. "superdelegates shouldnt even exist. "
In response to Reply # 118


          

but since they do
they shouldnt be able to publicly declare/commit til the convention.

nothing is official til the convention
but its clear how early declaration can influence the race.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Sat Feb-20-16 07:31 PM

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133. "Yeah, I dont like the way they are doing this "
In response to Reply # 123


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 07:37 PM

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135. "Need superdelegates to prevent party leaders from competing w/grassroots"
In response to Reply # 133
Sat Feb-20-16 07:38 PM by PimpTrickGangstaClik

          

(c) Wasserman Schultz

_______________________________________

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Sat Feb-20-16 07:44 PM

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138. "Her answer was so weird and so honest"
In response to Reply # 135
Sat Feb-20-16 07:49 PM by legsdiamond

          

.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Vex_id
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166. "Rachel Maddow was super blown by her answer"
In response to Reply # 135


          

as was I. I can't remember a more inept DNC Chair.

-->

  

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Mynoriti
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192. "she's the worst"
In response to Reply # 135


  

          

>(c) Wasserman Schultz

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Sat Feb-20-16 07:57 PM

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145. "superdelegates flipped in '08, they can do it again in '16."
In response to Reply # 123


          


Yeah, it's a stupid system, but it's such a minor thing in practice. The superdelegates are never going to flip a nomination. So there's no reason to complain about them.

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 08:07 PM

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156. "I see it having a real psychological impact at this point in time..."
In response to Reply # 145
Sat Feb-20-16 08:13 PM by PimpTrickGangstaClik

          

And it does have a real impact in a close race.

A lot of this whole process is about perception. If early on you look like you will win, you will get more support and more money. With a huge amount of super delegates publicly pledging their vote for one candidate, it discourages people from supporting the other because it appears that it is futile.

In a runaway election where it is clear who the voting public overwhelmingly support, the super delegate stuff doesn't matter (i.e Obama 2008).
But if there is a close race where public support isn't obviously leaning in one direction, the super delegates decide the race

_______________________________________

  

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2.tears.in.a.bucket
Member since Sep 04th 2009
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Sat Feb-20-16 06:55 PM

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119. "F##K! i need a double-shot of uygur to calm me down"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


was hoping bernie could pull nevada outta his ass

♚♚♚♚

#BYLUG >>> https://goo.gl/1ooFp6

♚♚♚♚

screamin' mothafuck a 12 /
bitches ain't shit /
cops ain't neither /
they huntin' my people /

- i. rashad

♚♚♚♚

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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Sat Feb-20-16 07:05 PM

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122. "dem voter turnout in nv was only 80k."
In response to Reply # 0


          

it was 120k in 2008.

repub voter turnout
was greater than dem turnout
in iowa and nh.
both iowa and nh were dems states in 2012.

not much is being made of this
but it could be a bad sign for dems.

  

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Vex_id
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124. "very discouraging turnout in Nevada."
In response to Reply # 122
Sat Feb-20-16 07:10 PM by Vex_id

          



-->

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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125. "i wanna laugh but this shit is so sad."
In response to Reply # 124


          

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 07:18 PM

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128. "RE: dem voter turnout in nv was only 80k."
In response to Reply # 122


          




Nevada is notoriously shitty when it comes to Caucus voting...This is all new for them....

U should never judge Nevada as a template to anything...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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rob
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129. "there are what? a bit more than 1 million eligible democratic voters in ..."
In response to Reply # 128


  

          

low turnout *is* the template to how our political/electoral system works.

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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Sat Feb-20-16 07:24 PM

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130. "im not sure what you are trying to say here."
In response to Reply # 128


          

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 07:46 PM

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139. "RE: im not sure what you are trying to say here."
In response to Reply # 130
Sat Feb-20-16 07:50 PM by murph71

          

They JUST not too long ago recently changed to a caucus system....Unlike NH, which has some miles in it...Nevada is a weird caucus state....That's the reason why there were not many polls coming out before the match up between Bernie/Clinton....Because the polling firms view the Nevada caucus as too disorganized to judge it cut and dry....

That's what I'm trying to say here...

Peep this story from the Boston Globe breaking down the Nevada caucus...It's messy as hell...

https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/politics/2016/02/19/the-nevada-caucuses-are-mess-again/K7DX03kCO873SXPb8izsBO/story.html

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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Sat Feb-20-16 07:51 PM

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141. "ok i gotcha. still a 30% drop from 2 caucuses ago is noteworthy."
In response to Reply # 139


          

no matter how you slice it.
especially as part of an overall trend of lukewarm dem turnout so far.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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152. "RE: ok i gotcha. still a 30% drop from 2 caucuses ago is noteworthy."
In response to Reply # 141


          

>no matter how you slice it.
>especially as part of an overall trend of lukewarm dem turnout
>so far.

It's a state that u can't depend on...There are too many curve pitches....Some voters are not even even able to vote because of their work schedules on Saturday (a great deal of the voters work in the casinos and hotels)..

Voter turnout should only be judged by the non caucus states and caucus states that know what they are doing (unlike Nevada), that are also NOT majority white (Blacks and Latinos are a huge part of the Dem base now)...

If we get a low turnout in say SC or Georgia, then the Dems should then panic...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Sat Feb-20-16 07:29 PM

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131. "Is it a different format from 2008? "
In response to Reply # 128


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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134. "nope. they started caucusing in 2008."
In response to Reply # 131


          

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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132. "The caucus system needs to go away Right Today"
In response to Reply # 128


          

I just read a NV account of the whole process. Ain't no one got time for all that. It discourages participation. A lot of folks showed up and left because it took to long and it was confusing.

I'd probably skip it too. All that standing around and no anonymity? No sir, not me.
Why the hell would I want to talk this shit out with other voters?

_______________________________________

  

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Vex_id
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137. "nah - it's not just nevada. IA & NH numbers were down as well"
In response to Reply # 128


          


-->

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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147. "RE: nah - it's not just nevada. IA &amp; NH numbers were down as well"
In response to Reply # 137
Sat Feb-20-16 07:59 PM by murph71

          


U guys need to calm down...lol...Have some tea....It's going to be alright....Seriously...

The day we should all judge future voter turnout on 1 Lily white caucus state (Iowa) and a Lily white, small ass state that's heavily independent (NH) and a disorganized caucus state that is still learning the system (Nevada) is the day Chris Christie misses a lunch...

If we start seeing small turnouts in states that know what they are doing and more eclectic demographic states then it may spell trouble for the Dems....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Sat Feb-20-16 07:59 PM

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149. "Not a good show for a guy whose whole platform is predicated on the idea..."
In response to Reply # 122


          


that he'll bring the masses out in droves.

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
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159. "Do you support Clinton or are you just anti-Sanders?"
In response to Reply # 149


          

I don't think I've seen one post from you where you actually support her lol.

_______________________________________

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Sat Feb-20-16 08:28 PM

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167. "I support a Democrat winning the general election. "
In response to Reply # 159


          


It would be a catastrophe if we lost this general election. And we'll be up against a natural headwind. So we can't afford to play games.

Hillary isn't a perfect candidate, but I don't have anything particularly against her. And I don't mean that negatively. I think her presidency would be nearly identical, in all ways that matter, to Obama's, and I'm very happy with the Obama Presidency. Sometimes I wonder how happy the Sanders supporters are with the Obama Presidency.

I don't have much against Bernie either, though. I'd happily vote for him in a general election, if it came to that. My criticisms of him specifically are relatively minor. I'm far more offended by his supporters than I am by him (though as an avowed technocrat, I really do wish he'd flesh out a few of his proposals).

  

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Mynoriti
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175. "Most of the hardest Bern supporters i know are dissapointed in Obama"
In response to Reply # 167


  

          

But they also seem to have it in their head that Obama ran on a platform much closer to Bernie's than Hillary's, but then sold out once he got into office. It's like a lot of them didn't listen to anything he actually had to say, except the word "change"

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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180. "RE: Most of the hardest Bern supporters i know are dissapointed in Obama"
In response to Reply # 175


          

>But they also seem to have it in their head that Obama ran on
>a platform much closer to Bernie's than Hillary's, but then
>sold out once he got into office. It's like a lot of them
>didn't listen to anything he actually had to say, except the
>word "change"



^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^Needs to be shouted from the mountain top for the hardcore Bernie heads to get....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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rob
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184. "i think that's unfair. "
In response to Reply # 175


  

          

the people disappointed in obama got over that shit 5 years ago. i never was one of those people, but...

what has become clear is that even a brilliant, charismatic president (one with an inspiring and historical personal story) couldn't win when he was playing traditional politics.

what has become clear is that the leaders that establishment democrats have picked for the party aren't very savvy.

what has become clear is that the *no-fucking-way* things that democrats wanted 10 years ago (marriage equality, health care, living wages) are huge successes for the party...

while the bipartisan stuff that should be easy to get done (immigration reform, getting congress to do anything, nominating bureaucrats and judges) is a train wreck.

what has become clear is we need to get mainstream american politics moving left because the climate is falling apart and boomers are turning 70.

so when someone says they're all-in on hillary, i'm just like "ok...and then what? what's your plan? how are we going to change this situation?" because she'll be better than a disaster, but....dems aren't even going to get a bump in 2016! 2016! electing her. it's just a stay of execution.

i don't see why they have the nerve to call everyone else irrational.

  

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Mynoriti
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191. "Well, I said people i know"
In response to Reply # 184


  

          

As in the people i talk to regularly, who are pushing Bernie, and claim they don't see much difference between BHO and Dubya.

Which concerns me because they tend to have a mindset of let's elect a president and go on about our business. People who can't even be bothered to vote in mid-terms. And the political revolution Bernie is proposing rests absolutely on keeping them consistently engaged and involved.

>so when someone says they're all-in on hillary i'm just like
>"ok...and then what? what's your plan? how are we going to
>change this situation?" because she'll be better than a
>disaster, but....dems aren't even going to get a bump in 2016!
>2016! electing her. it's just a stay of execution.

There aren't many people who say "I'm all in on Hillary" it's more people who feel she has a better chance of winning a general election, or dont want to risk losing the SCOTUS for the next 30 years. Her plan is pretty clear. it's BHO 2.0. Work within the system for incremental change wherever possible. It's not very exciting but it's clear enough

Bernie's contention is that the system is the problem and needs to be turned on it's ass, and replaced by, or made to work for people instead of just institutions. While i absolutely agree with him more, It's the "how" that I'm not sold on. He seems to rest on this hope that a Sanders victory will also sweep in a democratic congress, and kick off this political revolution. We know the house ain't happening because of gerrymandering, and it's too deeply red, but even with the senate going blue (best case scenario), it's not like Democrats are about shit, or not beholden to the same institutions he's a threat to. Which in one way I agree makes a stronger case for Bernie, but also means it comes back down to people being constantly involved and pressuring their leaders. I just don't see it, or have that kind of faith in people. I think things will have to get far worse for it to happen.

That said, I may still vote for him.

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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Sun Feb-21-16 02:55 AM

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199. "I'm not disappointed in Obama"
In response to Reply # 175
Sun Feb-21-16 02:56 AM by denny

          

He didn't run on a campaign of sweeping reform. He did pretty much what I expected.

I want Americans to have a full year of mat leave.

I want a simple, single-payer health care system for all.

I want descendants of slaves to have free university/college and tax breaks in a form of reparations...something that resembles the privileges that Natives are afforded in Canada.

I want really rich people to pay alot more taxes.

I want corporations to pay alot more taxes.

And I want government intervention in the form of tariffs to prevent corporate exploitation of cheap labor/regulations abroad.

There's more.....but I basically want you guys to become more like Canada....more like England....more like France etc etc etc. Obama didn't promise to do all that so I'm not disappointed in him. Life is turning to shit in America and I want more democratic socialism to make the society more civil. Obama is a laissez-faire capitalist with liberal social policies. It was a better alternative to Mitt....but it's not a better alternative to present-day Bernie.

The Bernie v Obama shit is an extremely disingenuous and cynical ploy by Clinton to pander to voters that love Obama for the historical significance of his achievement in becoming the first black president. And she leverages that love with 'but Obama did it too' when confronted with the fact that her economic policies are NOT progressive. She's conservative. And there will be very little (if any) difference in income inequality 4 years from now under Hillary, Jeb, Rubio or Kasich. Probably even Trump.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sun Feb-21-16 07:59 AM

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202. "RE: I'm not disappointed in Obama"
In response to Reply # 199


          


>The Bernie v Obama shit is an extremely disingenuous and
>cynical ploy by Clinton to pander to voters that love Obama
>for the historical significance of his achievement in becoming
>the first black president. And she leverages that love with
>'but Obama did it too' when confronted with the fact that her
>economic policies are NOT progressive. She's conservative.
>And there will be very little (if any) difference in income
>inequality 4 years from now under Hillary, Jeb, Rubio or
>Kasich. Probably even Trump.


I think anyone that was in Obama's cabinet would move close and embrace the most popular Democrat in the party. It's a no brainer. People need to get over that....

And the push back that you r referring too is for real....A lot of hardcore Libs that support Bernie do see Obama as a disappointment....They don't think he went far enough. Hell, I'm friends with many of them (a lot of my activist friends who r stomping for Bernie...)

The issue I have r the Hill-bots making it out like Sanders hates Obama....lol....It's not fair to turn criticism of Obama's policies into Bernie being anti-Obama. They need to slow down with that shit...

As for your comments about Hillary being a Conservative I'm sure that would be news to her...lol....After 20 plus years of being painted as a Feminist Liberal by the Right I'm sure she would laugh at that accusation.

Clinton is as Liberal as Joe Biden (who I would have voted for over Bernie as well).....That's to say a moderate Liberal who at times goes hard in the paint on foreign affairs....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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Sun Feb-21-16 08:30 AM

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207. "She's fiscally conservative, socially liberal."
In response to Reply # 202


          

But it's fiscal policy that is most important right now.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sun Feb-21-16 09:18 AM

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213. "RE: She's fiscally conservative, socially liberal."
In response to Reply # 207


          

>But it's fiscal policy that is most important right now.


She's a Joe Biden liberal...The only reason we are talking about this shit is because Bernie is so far to the left....lol

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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254. "Going in circles here."
In response to Reply # 213


          

Bernie is only 'so far left' because conservative fiscal policy has been normalized amongst democrats via Clinton/Obama. You guys have been convinced that these basic, civil social institutions are a pipe dream and economically unviable. Even in the face of the proof constituted by literally EVERY other rich western nation.

  

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Mynoriti
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258. "not unviable as much as too ingrained"
In response to Reply # 254
Sun Feb-21-16 06:07 PM by Mynoriti

  

          

take single payer alone which is absolutely the way to go if we were starting a healthcare system from scratch, but the system in place is a 5th of our economy, literally employs millions of people, and has a ton of moving parts. Aside from the drug companies, etc... you have a good portion of the country who ARE happy with their heathcare, that you're going to sell on something else, or explain why their taxes going up, not to mention what would happen during the transitional period (lay-offs, paycuts, etc..), the hit to the economy because the money can never stop flowing, but never mind all that because...

the impossibility of Bernie ever getting that through congress filled with the obama/clinton style Dems you speak of and who are all getting fed from same hands of the institutions Bernie is railing against. Obamacare took a year with a DEM controlled congress, and even though they all knew benefited insurance companies, the political dog and pony show of Republicans screaming socialism and death panels at the top of their lungs because their only goal was to deny Obama a W. That's how hard it is to get something done that only tweaks the system, and it's still probably the largest piece of legislation in most of our lifetimes.

I think the very best we could get or push for would be a public option. if that worked out well more people would sign on, and it could grow. Probably also impossible to push through congress though.

IMO for most of the things Bernie propose require either constant involvement from most citizens, or a complete collapse. i have more faith in the latter ever happening.

  

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Vex_id
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219. "this is simply not true:"
In response to Reply # 202


          


>lot of hardcore Libs that support Bernie do see Obama as a
>disappointment....

This really is a gross mis-characterization of both Bernie and his supporters. What the bulk of Sanders supporters believe is that Obama did a great job in setting the foundation for the progressive movement - but that now we need somebody who can advance that progressive movement and not merely freeze in its growth. Also - many progressives feel that we need go further on many issues than Obama did (be it challenging Wall Street, scaling back the military industrial complex, or challenging the federal ban of marijuana legalization) - but that does not mean that most progressives are disappointed with Obama - they just support the candidate who they feel will advance his progressive foundation the most.

>As for your comments about Hillary being a Conservative I'm
>sure that would be news to her...lol....After 20 plus years of
>being painted as a Feminist Liberal by the Right I'm sure she
>would laugh at that accusation.

It's interesting that you keep pointing to GOP talking points to support your opinions on Clinton/Sanders.



-->

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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Sat Feb-20-16 07:43 PM

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136. "trump is killing shit. will prolly end up the repub nom."
In response to Reply # 0


          

cruz was posed to hold sc
due to evangelicals.
aint happen.

trump got 2 straight states in the bag.
prolly woulda been 3 straight
if he didnt skip the fox news debate.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Sat Feb-20-16 07:48 PM

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140. "Shit is amazing...never underestimate the anger of white folk"
In response to Reply # 136


          

This guy shitted on W for 9/11 and had beef with the pope and won convincingly in the bible belt.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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rob
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142. "most people in the bible belt are not fans of the papacy. "
In response to Reply # 140


  

          

maaaaaaaybe 1 in 50 republicans in south carolina are catholic. he actually probably won support in s.c. with that one.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Sat Feb-20-16 08:04 PM

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151. "Good point... I wonder who this man could offend that would turn off vot..."
In response to Reply # 142


          

Cause right now it looks like anything he says is misic to their ears.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 08:06 PM

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154. "RE: most people in the bible belt are not fans of the papacy. "
In response to Reply # 142


          

>maaaaaaaybe 1 in 50 republicans in south carolina are
>catholic. he actually probably won support in s.c. with that
>one.



^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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Sat Feb-20-16 07:54 PM

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143. "he about to rewrite political science textbooks for the next millenium."
In response to Reply # 140
Sat Feb-20-16 07:54 PM by Reeq

          

.

  

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Mynoriti
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Sat Feb-20-16 07:58 PM

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148. "he knows exactly how to talk to americans"
In response to Reply # 140


  

          

just break down complex issues like a 10 year old would, and don't take any shit from anyone. 'mericans will eat it up

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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153. "Yep"
In response to Reply # 148


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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146. "RNC is gonna start paying the fringe candidates to drop out"
In response to Reply # 136


          

Trump is going to high step to the nom as long as the vote is split among many candidates

_______________________________________

  

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Mynoriti
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150. "Carson and Cruz votes would just go to Trump"
In response to Reply # 146


  

          

Jeb and Kasich to Rubio

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 08:07 PM

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157. "RE: RNC is gonna start paying the fringe candidates to drop out"
In response to Reply # 146


          




Yep...they are about to put that pressure on....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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155. "My guess for the next few weeks in the GOP:"
In response to Reply # 136


          


Bush and Kasich drop out soon (things looked good for Kasich a week ago, but this proves it was just a NH thing). Their voters go straight to Rubio.

Carson drops out whenever he runs completely out of cash. His voters go straight to Cruz.

Trump stays pretty much where he is, which slowly becomes bad news for him.

It'll be a 3-way race through March, but Rubio will finally be in the driver's seat. Not because Trump or Cruz collapse, just because the majority of GOP voters now have one place to go.


It'll be a Clinton/Rubio race in the fall, and it'll be tough. Here's hoping the Dems come together.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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158. "RE: My guess for the next few weeks in the GOP:"
In response to Reply # 155


          

>
>Bush and Kasich drop out soon (things looked good for Kasich a
>week ago, but this proves it was just a NH thing). Their
>voters go straight to Rubio.
>
>Carson drops out whenever he runs completely out of cash. His
>voters go straight to Cruz.
>
>Trump stays pretty much where he is, which slowly becomes bad
>news for him.
>
>It'll be a 3-way race through March, but Rubio will finally be
>in the driver's seat. Not because Trump or Cruz collapse, just
>because the majority of GOP voters now have one place to go.
>
>
>It'll be a Clinton/Rubio race in the fall, and it'll be tough.
>Here's hoping the Dems come together.




^^^^^^^^^^Listen to this^^^^^^^^^^^

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 08:13 PM

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160. "I think Bush is in it for the long haul. He's got money to burn"
In response to Reply # 155


          

_______________________________________

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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161. "RE: I think Bush is in it for the long haul. He's got money to burn"
In response to Reply # 160
Sat Feb-20-16 08:17 PM by murph71

          


Nah...5th place vote (Kasich has now overtaken him....)? The money donors and the RNC r about to force Bush out....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Sat Feb-20-16 08:36 PM

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171. "He's got money, but "
In response to Reply # 160


          


I don't know how much more fruitless punishment he's willing to take, especially if it means nominating Trump or Cruz.

Trump's childish taunting, that Jeb is an embarrassment to his family name, is becoming more convincing with every primary.

  

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rob
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177. "the money question is"
In response to Reply # 171


  

          

where do the votes go when the field narrows?

i think people assumed they would go to rubio, but that hasn't happened with christie or carly's supporters.

we know bush's financial backers will go (and already have gone) to people like rubio if they see a route for him to the nomination.

but the people still voting for bush have to be delusional, right? i think the conventional wisdom is they ultimately avoid the extremists....but....can we really apply logic to their decision-making at this point?

these are people who could easily flip for trump or cruz too depending on why the hell they like bush. hell, if carson is just gonna keep running, i don't see why these aren't people who would throw carson a "fuck you at least he's decent" vote.

  

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Ted Gee Seal
Member since Apr 18th 2007
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178. "."
In response to Reply # 160
Sat Feb-20-16 08:51 PM by Ted Gee Seal

  

          

. Too slow

Just IMO though.

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Sat Feb-20-16 08:43 PM

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172. "Oop! There goes Jeb!!"
In response to Reply # 155


          

  

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LAbeathustla
Member since Jan 24th 2004
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Sat Feb-20-16 08:15 PM

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162. "RINCE PRIEBUS REMOVE THE PISTOL FROM YUR MOUTH"
In response to Reply # 136


  

          

its going to be okay buddy

------------------------------------
2019 CABG Survivor

2016 OK Survivor Champion

be about it or be without it

RIP GOATs

  

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Vex_id
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170. "Trump will become the nominee unless the GOP can play crook"
In response to Reply # 136


          


-->

  

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Mynoriti
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144. "Jeb! Way to hold down 4th place"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

He dusted off Dubya in the one state where he was popular, and didn't even make a dent

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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173. "Bush drops out!"
In response to Reply # 0


          

_______________________________________

  

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Mynoriti
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176. "Poor Trump. Jeb was his plaything"
In response to Reply # 173


  

          

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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179. "RE: Bush drops out!"
In response to Reply # 173


          




I told u...lol

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Sat Feb-20-16 08:56 PM

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181. "Seeing Trump's family..."
In response to Reply # 0


          


makes me want to go find someone in a suit to punch square in the face.

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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Sun Feb-21-16 05:41 AM

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201. "lol"
In response to Reply # 181


          

Might have to steal that one.

  

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Heinz
Member since Dec 26th 2003
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Sat Feb-20-16 09:06 PM

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182. "Why do you guys cheer "USA" during speeches lol"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

No other country is involved in these races...

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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183. "The Trump supporters aren't so sure."
In response to Reply # 182


          


They need to see some birth certificates.

>No other country is involved in these races...

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
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185. "USA vs Canada vs Cuba lol"
In response to Reply # 183
Sat Feb-20-16 09:10 PM by PimpTrickGangstaClik

          

.

_______________________________________

  

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Mynoriti
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187. "in case the Iron Shiek wans to pop off"
In response to Reply # 182


  

          

  

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Mynoriti
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189. "Anyone beliving this "Sanders supporters chant 'English Only!'" story?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://www.vox.com/2016/2/20/11079706/huerta-english-only-sanders?utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook&utm_campaign=voxdotcom&utm_content=saturday

I've def come across some Bern supporters who've acted like dicks but this doesn't seem very characteristic. I'm not hearing it in the clip either.

  

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rob
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190. "i really hope the dems don't go dirty on each other"
In response to Reply # 189


  

          

because there's no point to it.

on the other side, the nurses union outrage is also bullshit.

  

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Castro
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195. "That's Hilary's ratfucking team putting that out."
In response to Reply # 189


  

          

------------------
One Hundred.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sat Feb-20-16 10:32 PM

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196. "RE: Anyone beliving this &quot;Sanders supporters chant 'English Only!'&..."
In response to Reply # 189
Sat Feb-20-16 10:34 PM by murph71

          




Here's the complete story...It's coming from Dolores Huerta herself (below)...If true, does it mean Bernie supporters r all on some bullshit? Nope...Just a few bad apples...The same as the Hill surrogates who say that women voting for Bernie are turning their back on women....Anyway, for folks that don't want to click on a link....


Huffington Post
Civil Rights Legend Says Sanders Supporters Yelled 'English Only' At Her

Dolores Huerta, a civil rights leader who has endorsed Hillary Clinton, said Saturday that Bernie Sanders supporters shouted her down when she tried to offer Spanish-language translations at a Las Vegas caucus location -- including by chanting "English-only" -- ahead of Clinton's win in the Nevada Democratic caucuses.

"Shouting 'English-only' -- that is completely against the spirit of everything that we're working for," Huerta told The Huffington Post in a phone interview.

Actress America Ferrera, also there to support Clinton, tweeted about the incident, which they said took place at a caucus location in Harrah's Las Vegas Hotel and Casino.


Many of the caucus-goers were workers who spoke only Spanish, so she volunteered to do translation, Huerta said. But she said some Sanders supporters began to yell "No, no, no" and "English only," and in the end, they went without translation entirely.

"To deprive these voters at this crucial time of having a translation of what was going on -- this is something they need to know what's taking place," she said. "The caucus is a kind of complicated procedure. So the Bernie supporters would rather them not have any sort of translation rather than have someone like myself, who just happened to be a Hillary supporter, do the translation."

Had she translated something inaccurately, Huerta said, there were Spanish-speaking Sanders supporters who would have corrected her.

MoveOn.org, which endorsed Sanders, replied to Ferrera and Huerta on Twitter to say it would be "totally unacceptable" if such reports were true.


The Sanders campaign did not immediately respond to a request for comment.

Huerta has been highly critical of Sanders, particularly over immigration and his past vote against comprehensive immigration reform in 2007.

link: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/bernie-sanders-english-only-dolores-huerta_us_56c8f49de4b041136f174654

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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Sat Feb-20-16 11:20 PM

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197. "already shot down by a susan sarandon/snopes"
In response to Reply # 189


          

https://twitter.com/SusanSarandon/status/701225399867420672
https://twitter.com/SusanSarandon/status/701235496119197696

http://www.snopes.com/sanders-english-only-huerta/

  

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sndesai1
Member since Feb 02nd 2013
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Sun Feb-21-16 05:26 AM

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200. "smh i'm just glad somebody was recording the event"
In response to Reply # 189
Sun Feb-21-16 05:30 AM by sndesai1

  

          

n/m

  

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Warren Coolidge
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198. "Rubio can get the nomination if he plays this right..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

but he's seems pretty lightweight so it's anybody's guess..

either way Hillary will stomp em...

her best bet would be to pick a running mate that could get the Bernie supporters, and ignite the Obama coalition...

but the best choice for that, Elizabeth Warren, puts 2 females on a ticket, and then you have to watch for White Males who may not be racist, but are still sexist...

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sun Feb-21-16 08:18 AM

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204. "The one good thing Trump has done....."
In response to Reply # 0
Sun Feb-21-16 08:19 AM by murph71

          

...is put to bed this notion of the hardcore Conservative/Tea Party base ruling the Presidential election.

Cruz slightly coming in 3rd IN ONE OF THE MOST EVANGELICAL STATES IN THE COUNTRY is the real story. What these very Conservative people who emphatically picked Trump over Cruz are saying is WE DON'T AGREE WITH U. WE DON'T THINK WE LOST AGAINST AGAINST OBAMA BECAUSE "REAL" CONSERVATIVES DIDN'T COME OUT AND SUPPORT. WE LOST BECAUSE THE REPUBLICAN PARTY/TEA PARTY IS FULL OF SHIT....

Think about it. Cruz is losing to a guy who put his name on a book called THE ART OF THE DEAL. Cruz' main talking point is politicians who make deals. He doesn't believe in making deals. Cruz is losing to a man who just this primary cycle said he likes the healthcare mandate (the heart of Obamacare)....

That whole conservative Tea Party purity thing has come back to bite Republicans in the ass...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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rob
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214. "no"
In response to Reply # 204


  

          

the tea party is why donald trump is saying what he's saying. and they love him (for the most part) because they see him as a way of mainstreaming their movement.

the tea party has a guy NOBODY LIKES as the only one to beat trump in a primary so far

the tea party turned rubio into a robot on a debate stage

the tea party killed jeb bush, chris christie, paul rand, john boehner, eric cantor, etc. etc.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sun Feb-21-16 10:14 AM

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215. "RE: no"
In response to Reply # 214


          

>the tea party is why donald trump is saying what he's saying.
>and they love him (for the most part) because they see him as
>a way of mainstreaming their movement.
>
>the tea party has a guy NOBODY LIKES as the only one to beat
>trump in a primary so far
>
>the tea party turned rubio into a robot on a debate stage
>
>the tea party killed jeb bush, chris christie, paul rand, john
>boehner, eric cantor, etc. etc.


Indeed...which is why I posted this last line:

"That whole conservative Tea Party purity thing has come back
to bite Republicans in the ass..."

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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rob
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217. "has it?"
In response to Reply # 215


  

          

i don't think the bushes or christie or kasich or techno-conservatives were ever pro-tea party. their personal losses don't matter here.

the republicans control local and state governments + the legislature for the foreseeable future

they *might* lose the presidency. maybe.

they forced an extremely gifted democratic politician with majorities in congress to do little for much of his first term term, and then made it so the things that he did get done creatively later would be reversible if they won the next election.

they're trying to hold back the tide of history...their exercise of white anger has been an impressively successful display of stubborness.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sun Feb-21-16 12:31 PM

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221. "RE: has it?"
In response to Reply # 217


          



Yeah...it has...Because the Tea Party wasn't just about creating a litmus test. It also distorted what a Conservative is....

So, on one side u have the establishment candidates like Jeb, Kasich, and Christie not gaining any traction or getting forced out BECAUSE the Tea Party contingent has deemed them not conservative enough...

But here's where the sucker punch comes in. Not only has the Tea Party shitted on the Establishment/Moderate Republicans, it has also grown into something much more bigger and dangerous. The Tea Party has now evolved into the angry party who has gotten sick and tired of being lied to...They feel used. They feel like the Repugs didn't do enough to defeat Obamacare (hilarious) and that those threats of impeaching Obama did not come to fruition....They want blood....

Now they have turned on their master. Now they r giving a middle finger to not only to the establishment, but to Ted Cruz' of the world (Religious Evangelicals)...

That's why Trump is winning. He is the angry white working class and political Tea Partiers wet dream: A MAN THAT WILL GET THINGS DONE AND PUT THOSE BLACK/LATINO/MUSLIM TAKERS IN THEIR PLACE....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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rob
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232. "i don't understand what you're arguing"
In response to Reply # 221
Sun Feb-21-16 01:13 PM by rob

  

          

the tea party always wanted to be that.

they were angry before, and from their point of view, they would still be angry/angrier without what they're doing. their anger has a social function...like teenagers bonding over sad music.

it's not an L for the tea party unless you're looking from the outside in and imagining them as different people.

it *might* be an L for neo-cons and some libertarians, who are certainly frustrated by what's happened to the republican party, but i suspect even many of them see riding this train as preferable to democrats.

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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206. "read these vid comments to clinton getting 77% of black votes in sc"
In response to Reply # 0
Sun Feb-21-16 08:30 AM by Reeq

          

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8oGDweR2mY

tyt subscribers are generally liberal/progressive
well informed
and 'ethnically sensitive'.

black people
get prepared to be blamed for a trump presidency.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sun Feb-21-16 08:38 AM

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208. "RE: read these vid comments to clinton getting 77% of black votes in sc"
In response to Reply # 206
Sun Feb-21-16 08:47 AM by murph71

          

>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8oGDweR2mY
>
>black people
>get prepared to be blamed for a trump presidency.


Trump is winning in a Republican primary. Trump needs to expand his base. Trump's support is showing to be very static....He's getting a lot of white working class folks. Over 95 percent of people who voted Republican in the SC were white....(http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/does-donald-trump-have-a-ceiling/).....Trump needs more than 35 percent to win a general election....Even when you add Ben Carson's numbers to Trump it's not enough (The moderate, establishment Rubio/Kasich voters r not fucking with Trump. And Cruz' voters don't think Trump is Conservative enough...)...And Blacks and Latinos r not going to come out for Trump like that....

Fuck those Youtube comments....That's one of the main reason blacks have not come out in support of Sanders....Some of these Bernie Bros be saying some wild (on the low) disrespectful shit...Charles Blow pointed it out (http://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/11/opinion/campaign-stops/stop-bernie-splaining-to-black-voters.html?_r=0)...That's who we are talking about here......

Don't fall for the banana in the tailpipe....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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209. "good point about trump."
In response to Reply # 208


          

i think in general the repub demographic base
is pretty slim.
and obama has been building such a diverse voter coalition
since 2008.

but ima say it again.
i dont think its about who votes for the repub candidate.
i think its gonna be about who WONT vote for clinton.

i hope im wrong tho.



  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sun Feb-21-16 08:57 AM

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210. "RE: good point about trump."
In response to Reply # 209
Sun Feb-21-16 09:00 AM by murph71

          

>i think in general the repub demographic base
>is pretty slim.
>and obama has been building such a diverse voter coalition
>since 2008.



All they have is white anger...U can't win a general election off of that....And here's another rub. Hillary Clinton or Bernie will get more of the white vote than Obama....That will matter....


>but ima say it again.
>i dont think its about who votes for the repub candidate.
>i think its gonna be about who WONT vote for clinton.
>
>i hope im wrong tho.


It's too politicized out here for people to stay home....Again...once this Supreme Court battle starts (more about the Repugs' constant obstruction than anything else. Add the fact that Obama is rumored to be going for a minority nominee shit could def. blow up...) and the Dems start running commercials about Trump's deportation plans and his racist tweets about Blacks, Dems will be coming out in droves in the states that matter...

Oh...one more thing...Take away the youth vote that Obama was able to get, the same vote that everyone was celebrating as transformative, he still would have had enough votes in the bag to beat McCain and Romney...

Just some perspective...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
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Sun Feb-21-16 08:59 AM

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211. "btw 66% of all ppl who caucused in nv were 45+ years old."
In response to Reply # 0


          

if theres any defining line between sanders and clinton voters
its age.

young people didnt come out in great numbers.
might have to do with the caucus format/time i guess.

either way,
older voters, crazy union support, black voters...
and clinton only won by 4 or 5 points.

bit of a silver lining for bernie folks.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sun Feb-21-16 09:04 AM

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212. "RE: btw 66% of all ppl who caucused in nv were 45+ years old."
In response to Reply # 211


          

>if theres any defining line between sanders and clinton
>voters
>its age.
>
>young people didnt come out in great numbers.
>might have to do with the caucus format/time i guess.
>
>either way,
>older voters, crazy union support, black voters...
>and clinton only won by 4 or 5 points.
>
>bit of a silver lining for bernie folks.

Good point about the caucus format...I think that may be the case...

But on the real? The youth vote is highly overrated......As I said in a previous post, u take away the strong youth vote that Obama got against McCain and he still would have had enough to beat him....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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wluv
Member since Jan 27th 2003
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Sun Feb-21-16 10:28 AM

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216. "Trump is a weak general election candidate"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

anyway you slice it.

The Dem camp cant wait to expose and destroy in if he gets the nom.

He will get exposed in debates as a paper tiger with no real clear vision for the country, outside of the hyperbolic, inflammatory statements he still loves to make, but has no real substance or plausible detail behind them. Those soundbites the media eats up now will have to be explained further in the general and thats when he will hit a wall or look crazy.

He has painted himself into a corner with Latinos and cant get the necessary 35 to 40 percent, he would absolutely need to win a general. He wont get over 26 percent.

With Trump at the top of the ticket, Repubs will lose some seats in November. Not enough to lose the House, but they could definitely lose some Senate seats, which make it a little more difficult to ram legislation through.

The RNC sees the disaster and thats why they been trying to sabatoge this guy for the last 8 months to no sucess.

That being said, a Trump-Rubio ticket would make things a little more interesting. Would Rubio be willing to play second banana and risk being apart of a close but losing campaign that may hurt his future Presidential aspirations? We'll see.

  

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Mynoriti
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239. "Maybe but he has wiggle room and an electorate with a no attention span"
In response to Reply # 216


  

          

He's not locked in to any positions because he doesn't have any real positions. He's gone so far off the rails with his rhetoric that all he has to do is scale it back some and he looks semi-reasonable and empathetic. Not everyone pays attention in the primaries so come general election time, people who weren't and have only been turned off by headlines, by the time they hear him, they don't think he's so bad. He may be a shitbag, but he's also been a master at playing the media, and telling people exactly what they want to hear. Now he just has to tweak his message for more than just angry whites.

I have no idea of that will happen but just about everyone has underestimated this guy's skillset as a politician.

  

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murph71
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Sun Feb-21-16 03:24 PM

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251. "RE: Maybe but he has wiggle room and an electorate with a no attention s..."
In response to Reply # 239


          


Trump is cleaning their clocks because they are all splitting the vote....

I'm sure he can pick up a few more believers in a general election....He should def. not be slept on....But Trump needs Latinos and Blacks to win....Thats not gonna happen....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Mansa Musa
Member since Feb 16th 2009
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Sun Feb-21-16 12:31 PM

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220. "Sanders is done. This will be good for Jill Stein."
In response to Reply # 0


          

I will still cast a primary vote for Sanders. In the GE, I will either stay home or vote Green Party. Someone who voted to invade Iraq will never be a "lesser" enough evil. I hate the Republicans too, but I can't vote for Hillary.

  

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Vex_id
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222. "RE: Sanders is done. This will be good for Jill Stein."
In response to Reply # 220


          

>I will still cast a primary vote for Sanders. In the GE, I
>will either stay home or vote Green Party. Someone who voted
>to invade Iraq will never be a "lesser" enough evil. I hate
>the Republicans too, but I can't vote for Hillary.

^representative of a significant amount of the Progressive vote - and it's why Clinton is a problematic General Election candidate.

To your point re: Iraq -- I can't blame you at all and that's a legitimate reason to abstain from voting for Clinton - whose foreign policy prescriptions are indistinguishable from NeoCons.

-->

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sun Feb-21-16 12:36 PM

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224. "RE: Sanders is done. This will be good for Jill Stein."
In response to Reply # 222
Sun Feb-21-16 12:40 PM by murph71

          

>>I will still cast a primary vote for Sanders. In the GE, I
>>will either stay home or vote Green Party. Someone who voted
>>to invade Iraq will never be a "lesser" enough evil. I hate
>>the Republicans too, but I can't vote for Hillary.
>
>^representative of a significant amount of the Progressive
>vote - and it's why Clinton is a problematic General Election
>candidate.
>
>To your point re: Iraq -- I can't blame you at all and that's
>a legitimate reason to abstain from voting for Clinton - whose
>foreign policy prescriptions are indistinguishable from
>NeoCons.


I wonder if y'all would be voting for Biden as well? He's Obama's Vice President, yet he voted for the Iraq war as well....

Is he a Neocon too? Is any Dem that voted for the war a Neocon? I'm just going down that extreme rabbit hole trying to follow y'all. I really wanna know...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Vex_id
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225. "Clinton's problem isn't just that she voted to go to war in Iraq"
In response to Reply # 224


          

It's that she supported (and continues to support) the military interventionism in Libya and Syria as well, and has supported the Patriot Act and the degradation of civil liberties in favor of giving the military-industrial complex more power/money and control. That's a big issue for many progressive, and rightfully so.

-->

  

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murph71
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Sun Feb-21-16 12:55 PM

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227. "RE: Clinton's problem isn't just that she voted to go to war in Iraq"
In response to Reply # 225


          



That's the main issue Bernie folks bring up. That's the one they run too..SHE'S A NEOCON THAT VOTED FOR THE WAR.

Here's the deal. Biden not only voted for the war, but he also relented and finally supported our move into Libya....

I get some Bernie folks r pissed that Clinton will most likely win. A lot of lashing out going on out there...Blaming of blacks for backing her; blaming the youth because they didn't really come out in droves in Nevada and NH to support Bernie.

But don't transform that anger into misguided bullshit. The same ultra Progressive folks mad that Clinton may be the nominee r the same folks that would have been able to roll with Biden....

I keep telling y'all. I'm a Democrat. And I'm going for who I think will win. I would be going for Biden too.

This is what I meant by saying that Tea Party element on the Left is worth keeping an eye on...They may kill any chance for the Dems to win the Oval Office because they deem candidate A or B not Progressive enough...

Ask the Republican Party how they feel about THEIR Tea Party...It's already destroyed them.....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Vex_id
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228. "c'mon bruh - you're better than this."
In response to Reply # 227


          

>
>
>That's the main issue Bernie folks bring up. That's the one
>they run too..SHE'S A NEOCON THAT VOTED FOR THE WAR.

really - that's the the "one" issue they run to and not financial corruption, Citizens United, and Wall Street influence? C'mon.

>Here's the deal. Biden not only voted for the war, but he also
>relented and finally supported our move into Libya....

Not sure why you keep bringing up Biden - but ok.

>I get some Bernie folks r pissed that Clinton will most likely
>win. A lot of lashing out going on out there...Blaming of
>blacks for backing her; blaming the youth because they didn't
>really come out in droves in Nevada and NH to support Bernie.

Actually - Bernie is polling well with younger blacks (under 45) -and
his campaign is not overly concerned with the black vote outside of
very traditional, conservative places like S. Carolina. He'll do well w/ the black
vote in more progressive states.

>But don't transform that anger into misguided bullshit. The
>same ultra Progressive folks mad that Clinton may be the
>nominee r the same folks that would have been able to roll
>with Biden....

I don't refer to what Mansa just laid out was "misguided bullshit" - that's a real, viable concern that you keep downplaying. It may not be an issue for you and stravinskian, but it's a very real issue for the progressive base.

>This is what I meant by saying that Tea Party element on the
>Left is worth keeping an eye on...They may kill any chance for
>the Dems to win the Oval Office because they deem candidate A
>or B not Progressive enough...
>
>Ask the Republican Party how they feel about THEIR Tea
>Party...It's already destroyed them.....

I'm not going to even dignify a ridiculous comparison you're trying to make to the Sanders campaign and the Tea Party.

-->

  

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murph71
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Sun Feb-21-16 01:09 PM

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231. "RE: c'mon bruh - you're better than this."
In response to Reply # 228


          

>>
>>
>>That's the main issue Bernie folks bring up. That's the one
>>they run too..SHE'S A NEOCON THAT VOTED FOR THE WAR.
>
>really - that's the the "one" issue they run to and not
>financial corruption, Citizens United, and Wall Street
>influence? C'mon.
>
>>Here's the deal. Biden not only voted for the war, but he
>also
>>relented and finally supported our move into Libya....
>
>Not sure why you keep bringing up Biden - but ok.



I'm bringing him up to show that the ultra Progressive complaints against Clinton are full of shit...

>>I get some Bernie folks r pissed that Clinton will most
>likely
>>win. A lot of lashing out going on out there...Blaming of
>>blacks for backing her; blaming the youth because they
>didn't
>>really come out in droves in Nevada and NH to support
>Bernie.

>Actually - Bernie is polling well with younger blacks (under
>45) -and
>his campaign is not overly concerned with the black vote
>outside of
>very traditional, conservative places like S. Carolina. He'll
>do well w/ the black
>vote in more progressive states.

U haven't been keeping up...Blacks are being talked up AS THE REASON Clinton won Nevada....In fact, it's the black vote that's saving Clinton...

passage from a piece: "Entrance polling points to a more fundamental reason for Sanders’s defeat. While an NBC poll showed him winning Hispanics 54 percent to 43 percent, the senator lost black voters by a crushing 52-point margin, vaulting Clinton to an easy overall victory with minority voters. That bodes poorly for his chances in South Carolina next weekend, where 55 percent of the Democratic electorate is black. And it makes his uphill climb on Super Tuesday that much harder in states like Alabama, Georgia, and Virginia."

U do the math....

>>But don't transform that anger into misguided bullshit. The
>>Ask the Republican Party how they feel about THEIR Tea
>>Party...It's already destroyed them.....
>
>I'm not going to even dignify a ridiculous comparison you're
>trying to make to the Sanders campaign and the Tea Party.


U don't have to. BECAUSE I NEVER SAID THE SANDERS CAMPAIGN = TEA PARTY....

I said the ultra Progressive wing of his campaign = Tea Party. Anyone saying that H. Clinton, a woman that has been demonized by the Right as an extreme Liberal, equals a Republican is on some Leftwing Tea Party shit. I would feel the same way if they said that shit about Obama, Biden or any other moderate Democrat/Progressive....

Let's not mix up my words here....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Vex_id
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236. "ah - so you admit that Sanders can compete in diverse states, finally:"
In response to Reply # 231


          


>passage from a piece: "Entrance polling points to a more
>fundamental reason for Sanders’s defeat. While an NBC poll
>showed him winning Hispanics 54 percent to 43 percent

Well, at least we're making some progress : )

And I wouldn't be too prideful about Clinton (thus far) polling exceedingly well with the black vote - I don't think that's necessarily a positive indicator for progressives or the political psyche of the aggregate traditional black democratic community.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sun Feb-21-16 01:33 PM

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240. "RE: ah - so you admit that Sanders can compete in diverse states, finall..."
In response to Reply # 236
Sun Feb-21-16 01:35 PM by murph71

          

>
>>passage from a piece: "Entrance polling points to a more
>>fundamental reason for Sanders’s defeat. While an NBC poll
>>showed him winning Hispanics 54 percent to 43 percent

No diss, dog...But u r not a fast study on this political shit...

Let me help u out here....That Latino vote? Hillary won them solidly in the biggest area in Nevada. She beat Bernie in the biggest county that tips the balance of power WITH LATINOS. Bernie won the Latino vote outside of Las Vegas...But here's the rub: BERNIE'S EDGE WIN OF LATINOS WAS SKEWED WITH THE YOUTH VOTE.

In other words, Bernie beat Hillary with the youth vote, which was helped by Latino voters who have the biggest demographic of YOUNG voters out of ANY Minority voters....And given what Trump and others have been saying about immigration, they are not staying home if Clinton is the nominee....

Make no mistake about it. This race is far from over. Bernie will win the overtly Progressive states like Minnesota and Massachusetts...But even needs more of the South and fly over states to win. Meanwhile, Hillary isn't just getting the old black vote in SC she's beating Bernie in polls with the BLACK youth vote...

It's a battle, but I see Hill winning it out and Bernie backing Clinton when its all said and done...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Vex_id
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244. "RE: ah - so you admit that Sanders can compete in diverse states, finall..."
In response to Reply # 240


          


>Let me help u out here....That Latino vote? Hillary won them
>solidly in the biggest area in Nevada. She beat Bernie in the
>biggest county that tips the balance of power WITH LATINOS.
>Bernie won the Latino vote outside of Las Vegas...But here's
>the rub: BERNIE'S EDGE WIN OF LATINOS WAS SKEWED WITH THE
>YOUTH VOTE.

LOL so because the lion share of those votes were youth votes the data is skewed?

Those superficial youth voters! They don't really count!

Classic.

>Make no mistake about it. This race is far from over. Bernie
>will win the overtly Progressive states like Minnesota and
>Massachusetts...But even needs more of the South and fly over
>states to win. Meanwhile, Hillary isn't just getting the old
>black vote in SC she's beating Bernie in polls with the BLACK
>youth vote...

We'll see - I think Bernie pulls even (or slightly head) with the black youth vote before it's all said & done -- but the discussion has to be had as to why Clinton is the better candidate for black voters -- that has not been adequately answered.

>It's a battle, but I see Hill winning it out and Bernie
>backing Clinton when its all said and done...

I also see Clinton winning the nomination - but largely because of the Super Delegate system which will ensure that it's not a fair fight.


-->

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sun Feb-21-16 03:18 PM

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249. "RE: ah - so you admit that Sanders can compete in diverse states, finall..."
In response to Reply # 244
Sun Feb-21-16 03:20 PM by murph71

          

>I also see Clinton winning the nomination - but largely
>because of the Super Delegate system which will ensure that
>it's not a fair fight.

I think this is what u r wishing for....

Did you know that Clinton also beat Bernie in the female vote too in Nevada? And she also beat him across the board with the minority vote. Don't take my word for it, homie...

Here ya go from USA Today: "Clinton won all six at-large precincts set up on Las Vegas Strip for on-duty casino and hotel shift workers on Saturday, Nevada Democratic Party results showed. At the Paris casino, the caucusgoers were almost exclusively Latino and black – and Clinton snagged more than twice the delegates Sanders received."

U gotta chill with all that Super delegate talk...The Super Delegate vote does not come into play unless you have a contested convention....That most likely won't happen. U have to remember there is a difference between Super Delegates and delegates. Clinton is still beating Bernie in the normal delegate count...

U know what's funny? U kind of sound like a lot of Hillary Clinton voters back in 2008 who got mad that she was beating Obama with the popular vote but still losing in delegates. Remember, Obama lost to Clinton in the 2008 Nevada primary. BUT HE STILL WON THE DELEGATE COUNT....The irony? Clinton beat Bernie in normal delegate votes too as well as the popular vote.....





GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Vex_id
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256. "you're doing too much."
In response to Reply # 249
Sun Feb-21-16 03:50 PM by Vex_id

          

You're abandoning your own credibility when you refuse to acknowledge basic facts.

You've been saying (ad nauseum) that Sanders can't compete in non-white, diverse states.

He competed in Nevada and won the latino vote, period. So, he can compete in diverse states and even win the minority (latino) vote. That's now a veritable fact that you can't deny if you want to have credibility in political debate.

>U gotta chill with all that Super delegate talk...The Super
>Delegate vote does not come into play unless you have a
>contested convention....That most likely won't happen. U have
>to remember there is a difference between Super Delegates and
>delegates. Clinton is still beating Bernie in the normal
>delegate count...

You're actually incorrect yet again (unsurprisingly) -- You actually might want to invest in a refresher on how delegates v. super delegates operate.

Both Clinton and Sanders have 51 earned delegates after Nevada.

Of the 35 delegates up for grabs in Nevada, multiple outlets are estimating that Clinton is set to nab 18-20 delegates, while Sanders is set to snag 15 to 17 of them.

However - because of the Super Delegates - Clinton can now claim 502 delegates after the Nevada caucus, while Sanders can claim 70. The vast majority of Clinton's current delegate count comes from the increasingly-controversial super delegates - not earned delegates.

In 2008, the Super Delegates were far more proportionate to what was actually happening in the voting booth. This year, the DNC has wholly ignored its own base - and are using the Super Delegate system to directly circumvent the political process.

I won't expect anything credible from you in response to this - so I"ll sign off. You're far too #ReadyForHillary than I can currently stomach.

-->

  

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murph71
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Sun Feb-21-16 06:07 PM

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261. "RE: you're doing too much."
In response to Reply # 256


          



U r arguing with yourself at this point, homie...

U said Clinton is going to win this election on the strength of Super Delegates...

This ^^^^is not true...I stated why. Even made the point that Clinton beat Bernie in super delegate AND regular delegate counts in Nevada....

U pointed to Bernie winning the Latino vote as proof that he can compete with minorities nationwide....

I simply pointed out not so fast.....that the Latino vote in Nevada skewed very heavy with the youth vote. Which Bernie has over Clinton...Unfortunately, Clinton's lock on older voters far exceeded Bernie's youth numbers in Nevada...

I think Bernie can win in Minnesota and very left leaning places like that. But there are not enough of those states on the board that fits Bernie's strengths.

That's not a diss...I'm just stating facts. Don't kill the messenger, dog...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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murph71
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Sun Feb-21-16 12:33 PM

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223. "RE: Sanders is done. This will be good for Jill Stein."
In response to Reply # 220


          

>I will still cast a primary vote for Sanders. In the GE, I
>will either stay home or vote Green Party. Someone who voted
>to invade Iraq will never be a "lesser" enough evil. I hate
>the Republicans too, but I can't vote for Hillary.


Taking the ball and going home^^^^^^^^

When the Repubs control the House AND Senate AND the Oval Office u r going to see what true pain means...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Mynoriti
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Sun Feb-21-16 12:52 PM

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226. "President Trump thanks you for your support"
In response to Reply # 220


  

          

  

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Mansa Musa
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Sun Feb-21-16 01:03 PM

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229. "I hate Trump, but I have a disgust threshold for lesser-evilism.."
In response to Reply # 226
Sun Feb-21-16 01:14 PM by Mansa Musa

          

...and Hillary exceeds it. If that's not the case for you, I respect that. But I didn't march and organize against that war so that I could vote for one of its cheerleaders later on. I can't do it.

  

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murph71
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Sun Feb-21-16 01:12 PM

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233. "RE: I hate Trump, but I have a disgust threshold for lesser-evilism.."
In response to Reply # 229


          

>...and Hillary exceeds it. If those two lying, ultra-rich
>imperialists are the only viable candidates, I would rather
>stay home or cast a protest vote. Fuck them both.


Oh...So u were just Bernie Bro-ing? U wasn't about making sure that the Repugs didn't take this country through another hell ride?

Question....Would u have voted for Obama if the rules changed and allowed a 3rd Term?
Clinton is def. a politician...She's got chinks and warts. But if u think she's the same as Ted Cruz I have to question your whole agenda...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Mynoriti
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234. "I understand being principled, but you're still helping Trump"
In response to Reply # 229


  

          

or Rubio (or god fucking help us, Cruz)

If Bernie doesn't pull this off, he'll be out riding hard for Hillary because he's been clear on how important it is to keep a republican out of office. Particularly with congress being all red.

  

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Mansa Musa
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Sun Feb-21-16 01:30 PM

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238. "Lesser-evilism has to have a limit"
In response to Reply # 234


          

I understand your pragmatic calculations, but I have a breaking point with lesser-evilism. Maybe it has to do with the number of corpses involved.

  

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murph71
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Sun Feb-21-16 01:38 PM

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241. "RE: Lesser-evilism has to have a limit"
In response to Reply # 238


          

>I understand your pragmatic calculations, but I have a
>breaking point with lesser-evilism. Maybe it has to do with
>the number of corpses involved.


Pragmatic????....

It's Ted Cruz/Trump vs. Hillary Clinton.

U think THEY are all the same..????...lol

Like for real....?

Is that how far the Left has gone....? God help us....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Mansa Musa
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Sun Feb-21-16 02:00 PM

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243. "By that logic, why not vote in a Republican primary?"
In response to Reply # 241
Sun Feb-21-16 02:05 PM by Mansa Musa

          

After all, some of the Republicans are less evil than the others. The reason not to, of course, is that all of the Republicans are too far to the right for you to ever vote for.

Well, that's true for a lot of people and Hillary. And she IS well to the right of Obama, especially on foreign policy.

If it's any consolation to you, a lot of the people who would vote for Sanders in a GE would've stayed home or voted Green if he had never run. Hillary may throw a few bones to Sanders voters now. It's hardly the case, though, that some massive shift to the left has made a progressive candidate look conservative. It's more like a rightward-shifting Democratic Party, following an extremist Republican Party, is going to lose a lot of votes. Hillary was never going to capture the votes of the anti-war left, which is small anyway.

  

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murph71
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Sun Feb-21-16 02:08 PM

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245. "RE: By that logic, why not vote in a Republican primary?"
In response to Reply # 243
Sun Feb-21-16 02:10 PM by murph71

          



But u seem to be an extremist liberal painting yourself in a corner...

The question is simple: Do you think Hillary Clinton = Ted Cruz...

If u think this^^^^then you are either certifiably nuts, trolling or to the extreme in your ideology.....

No diss. We all good here. U seem like good folk. I'm just trying to figure this shit out....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Mansa Musa
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Sun Feb-21-16 02:18 PM

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246. "No more than John Kasich=Ted Cruz"
In response to Reply # 245
Sun Feb-21-16 02:19 PM by Mansa Musa

          

And I respect your viewpoint as well. We will probably have to agree to disagree.

My point is, if I have to choose between moderate and extreme versions of influenza, or rotten meatloaf, or getting my home burglarized, I will reject the framing of the choice.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sun Feb-21-16 02:21 PM

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247. "RE: No more than John Kasich=Ted Cruz"
In response to Reply # 246


          

>And I respect your viewpoint as well. We will probably have
>to agree to disagree.
>
>My point is, if I have to choose between moderate and extreme
>versions of influenza, or rotten meatloaf, or getting my home
>burglarized, I will reject the framing of the choice.

Gotcha.....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Vex_id
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230. "The Evolution of the Myth of the Sanders "English Only" chant"
In response to Reply # 0


          

This is so undignified and shameful - but par-for-the-course for the Clinton Machine:

http://studentactivism.net/2016/02/21/the-evolution-of-the-myth-of-the-sanders-english-only-chant/

^just motivated thousands of liberals to stay-home in a Clinton-Trump General Election.

-->

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sun Feb-21-16 01:17 PM

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235. "RE: The Evolution of the Myth of the Sanders "English Only" chant"
In response to Reply # 230


          



U notice Clinton herself didn't even jump on this, right?...

Surrogates from the "English Only" woman to even the homie Killer Mike have said some pretty stupid shit this Primary...This is par for the course.....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Vex_id
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237. "RE: The Evolution of the Myth of the Sanders "English Only" chant"
In response to Reply # 235


          

I'll now accept your apology for promoting this story last night.


-->

  

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murph71
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Sun Feb-21-16 01:42 PM

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242. "RE: The Evolution of the Myth of the Sanders "English Only" chant"
In response to Reply # 237


          

>I'll now accept your apology for promoting this story last
>night.

Dog...On the real...U serious? U trolling me?

We are not kids here. This is not a game. This is grown folks shit. It's the same reason u didn't see me dwell on Mike's dumb ass uterus comment.....THIS IS SOME MESSY SHIT. Politics is messy.

It's as if this is your first time voting. U got people in the Republican Party calling each other liars....lol. What's going on between Bernie/Clinton is child's play compared to them bomb throwers on the other side.

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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sndesai1
Member since Feb 02nd 2013
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Sun Feb-21-16 02:47 PM

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248. "RE: The Evolution of the Myth of the Sanders "English Only" chant"
In response to Reply # 242


  

          

probably because there was nothing to dwell on with killer mike

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sun Feb-21-16 03:27 PM

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252. "RE: The Evolution of the Myth of the Sanders "English Only" chant"
In response to Reply # 248


          

>probably because there was nothing to dwell on with killer
>mike

It was enough for a Bernie spokesperson to distance the campaign from Mike's off the cuff statement.

And lets be real here. There are ALOT of loose cannons around both campaigns. I mean Bernie's brother just got shut down for calling Bill Clinton a rapist. Those exact words...Gloria Steinem saying dumb shit...

It;s the silly season....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Jon
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250. "Bernie is the practical and pragmatic choice for Democrats"
In response to Reply # 0
Sun Feb-21-16 03:33 PM by Jon

          

who want to win the general.

It's obvious Hillary's supporters just want anyone with a D to win, amply motivated to keep the R from winning. Cool. So Bernie would have almost all her voters.

It's also obvious Bernie's supporters are filled with people who would just stay home or vote for Jill Stein. Therefore, Hillary would lose a huge portion of Bernie's voters.

Bernie also has the capacity to steal voters from Trump, as independent voters have indicated, and if Rubio or Cruz is nominated, a portion of Trump's voters would actually roll over to Bernie.

If Clinton supporters really just want to be pragmatic in order to keep a Republican nut out of the white house, they should just back the more electable candidate, the one with far more momentum and cross-party/independent/swing-state appeal: Bernie Sanders.

Hillary's platform is more centrist etc, but that doesn't change the fact that her appeal is farrr more niche and limited than Bernie's. Attitudes about her are strong, divisive, and set in stone.

My coworker is a Cruz fan who told me she and her fellow Cruz fan friend would vote for Bernie if Trump is nominated. My mother always voted Republican, stayed home, but keeps calling me up because she heard something new Bernie said that got her excited.

Hillary has about half of the left in her pocket, the other 3/4 of the country cant stabd her, dont trust her and want her to go the fuck away. And y'all are talking about SHE's the pragmatic choice for a general? I don't get it

I mean, back Hillary if you and you high-life well to do cosmopolitan friends just want a gay-friendly feminist Republican who approves of your self-centered lavish lifestyle...but don't condescend Bernie supporters as if you're voting for her out of political realism.

  

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murph71
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Sun Feb-21-16 03:32 PM

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253. "RE: Bernie is the practical and pragmatic choice for Democrats"
In response to Reply # 250


          



I've never seen Bernie and practical in the same sentence before...Hopeful? Yep. Outsider? Check. Galvanizing? Ditto. But, practical? That's not the way I would describe Bernie...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Jon
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255. "HC supporters say it's all about GE, yet have no real basis for"
In response to Reply # 253


          

the claim that she has more appeal in a GE.

She'd lose a shit ton of Bernie's supporters and she sure as shit has zero appeal outside of loyal Democrats

Bernie would retain most of Hilary's base and he has shown his appeal expands well beyond that.

  

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murph71
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Sun Feb-21-16 04:14 PM

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257. "RE: HC supporters say it's all about GE, yet have no real basis for"
In response to Reply # 255


          



I don't think u get where I'm coming from....The GE election comments don't ONLY have to do with being practical...It's how Bernie's "socialist" tag will be painted by the Repubs. The problem a lot of Bernie supporters have is giving the American public too much credit. They think Middle America and the South knows the difference between being a socialist and communist. When it comes to people like us? We def. know the difference. I KNOW....

Unfortunately, the American public largely won't know that difference....Bernie will = Stalin by the time they are finished with him.

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Mynoriti
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259. "This is just fucking weird"
In response to Reply # 250


  

          

>My coworker is a Cruz fan who told me she and her fellow Cruz
>fan friend would vote for Bernie if Trump is nominated.

Shows how little anyone pays attention to anything

  

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Cocobrotha2
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309. "Nah, it shows how little anyone cares about the issues"
In response to Reply # 259


          

>>My coworker is a Cruz fan who told me she and her fellow
>Cruz
>>fan friend would vote for Bernie if Trump is nominated.
>
>Shows how little anyone pays attention to anything


<-><-><-><-><-><-><-><-><->
<-><-><-><-><-><-><-><-><->

  

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Mynoriti
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312. "is it just that they're both sincerely willing to fight establishments?"
In response to Reply # 309


  

          

because it's hard to find two people who are more opposite in their beliefs, or even in the type of human being they are.

Bernie is as solid, genuine, caring of a human being as Ted is a vile festering pile of shit.

  

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jane eyre
Member since Jan 16th 2007
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Sun Feb-21-16 06:06 PM

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260. "RE: The Presidential Primary POAST"
In response to Reply # 0


          

One of my primary problems with Sanders: I'm big on loyalty.

Sanders has been an Independent for many years (if memory serves, he's the longest serving Independent in the history of the US congress). His political affiliation, I believe, is sincere, principled, and by choice. But he's also used it to his political advantage.

His declaration as a Democrat is calculated. Opportunistic. But that's politics. Sanders should thank his lucky stars that a Democratic party exists for him to hitch his Presidential hopeful wagon to.

He's campaigned against Democrats and defeated Democrats in order to gain political power and office. And yes, he's also worked with Democrats. Fair and square.

My point: I'm a Democrat. I want to vote for a Democrat. I want to elect a candidate who's loyal to the Democratic party.

Sanders is not a loyal Democrat and has used the party for his own agenda. And why shouldn't he? He can. He has to-- and should. In some ways, Sanders can't be an effective politician without the Democrats. And while he's been able to be *elected* to political office as an Independent, once elected, there's little he's been able to do without the political power and capital of the Democrats.

No secret: third party candidates don't fare well in national elections.

Of course, there's some ideological and policy agreement between Sanders and the Democrats. Differences, too. But Sanders is really pushing it by playing the similarities and differences as existing within the Democratic party.

What Sanders has to say, yes, I agree with in many ways. But he's also pushing it by connecting his revolution to the Democratic party.

Sanders has said about running as a third party candidate:
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/bernie-sanders-on-why-he-wont-run-as-in-independent/

"What I did not want to do is run as a third party candidate, take votes away from the Democratic candidate and help elect some right-wing Republican. I did not want responsibility for that. So what I said at the beginning of the campaign is that I was not going to run as an independent. And I say it now, that if I do not win this process I will not run as an independent."

*Sigh*





  

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Vex_id
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262. "RE: The Presidential Primary POAST"
In response to Reply # 260


          

I think that's certainly a significant factor in this election. There are many who agree with you and won't consider Sanders simply because they don't feel he's a true Democrat. Conversely, there is a significant wave of new voters who identify as "progressives" who aren't married to partisan politics and they do not have any loyalty towards the party. It's a fascinating clash of identity politics.

However, I often hear this same argument implying that Sanders isn't a true Democrat and is somehow in opposition to Democrats....but the facts and record prove otherwise. Ask yourself this: How many times has Sanders voted with the Democrats on key votes throughout his extensive voting history record in the Senate and House? You'll find that virtually every single vote of his aligns with Democratic consensus.



-->

  

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Jon
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263. "Loyalty to who? Americans or Parties?"
In response to Reply # 260


          

  

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rob
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265. "Perhaps a better read would be: "
In response to Reply # 260


  

          

For most of Bernie's political run, there have been clear majorities. The two major political parties took their either-or status for granted, and Bernie responded by taking them for granted.

When the Democrats needed him for a majority in the Senate, he came on board. When the Democrats were looking at a weak/centrist candidate as their nomination for President *by default*, he came on board to challenge the party to be better. He could have avoided all this mess and ran third party and really screwed the Democrats, but we'll come out of this process with a lot of that already out of the way.

I suspect a lot of people that would have voted for Bernie or Jill Stein are going to (as long as Hillary and the DNC don't totally fuck it up) appreciate that the left has (even with some bullshit) been more present in the nomination conversation that it looked like they would have a year or two ago. They're going to realize how serious this election is (as long as Hillary and the DNC don't fuck it up and continue suppressing turnout).

  

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Mansa Musa
Member since Feb 16th 2009
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Sun Feb-21-16 07:02 PM

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266. "What have the Democrats done to earn loyalty..."
In response to Reply # 260
Sun Feb-21-16 07:05 PM by Mansa Musa

          

...from progressives, given their cowardly betrayal of the poor, disproportionately African-Americans and Latinos, since the ascendancy of the New Democrats in the 1980s? It's completely understandable that a left candidate would try to move the party left, rather than remaining in the protest lane. The alternative is the tightening stranglehold of neoliberalism over a party that pretends to be progressive. Disrupting that consensus is a lot more admirable than "loyalty" to me. But do you. I respectfully disagree.

  

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Mynoriti
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264. "LOL just realized Cruz came in 3rd"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

In a place like SC, that's gotta be a big let down.
Rubio will now suck up Bush's votes, and Kasich's if he drops out.

Or Rubio flubs again, and Kasich takes the establishment spot

If Doc Ben drops out his votes will probably split between Trump and Cruz, but last week Ben was still talking about how he has a good shot at being the nominee

  

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rob
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267. "I honestly think Cruz's best option (his nuclear option)"
In response to Reply # 264


  

          

is to realize he can go no further as a mainstream Republican unless we're talking a Handmaid's Tale/V for Vendetta/Hunger Games/full-on-dystopia scenario.

He was all-in as a Bush wonk, they didn't like him in D.C.. He went all-in in Texas to get to the Senate, and they still don't like him in D.C.

He doesn't beat Rubio. He doesn't beat Trump. The Rubio people don't want him.

Best option? His worst case either way is to eat shit in the Senate for as long as Texas will have him, so he should get in behind Trump as a V.P. to ensure Rubio doesn't catch up.

But maybe he's too proud for that. Maybe Trump is sure he's got the nom sown up and wants someone more likable. But it's Cruz's best option for 2016.

  

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Mynoriti
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268. "I don't think Trump wants him (or needs him)"
In response to Reply # 267


  

          

Birther stuff aside, bringing Cruz on as his VP doesn't get Trump anything he won't already have (Jon's 2 co-workers notwithstanding). Even though Cruz is the far right darling, and all those am radio guys are mad at Trump right now, they're all gonna fall in line against either deomocrat. In fact they were all fine with Trump before he started picking on Cruz... only then did they start bitching how Trump's not a real conservative

With the far right out of the way Cruz would just be a negative. He's about as unlikable as a human being can get.

I don't see him dropping out either though. He just seems to stubborn for that

  

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rob
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269. "Like I said, it only makes sense for Trump if he thinks he needs it for ..."
In response to Reply # 268
Sun Feb-21-16 07:22 PM by rob

  

          

...for the nom.

But it makes a ton of sense for Cruz.

Neither are sensible, humble men though.

  

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Mynoriti
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270. "true.. true"
In response to Reply # 269


  

          


>But it makes a ton of sense for Cruz.
>
>Neither are sensible, humble men though.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Feb-22-16 12:20 PM

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273. "RE: I honestly think Cruz's best option (his nuclear option)"
In response to Reply # 267
Mon Feb-22-16 12:21 PM by murph71

          

>is to realize he can go no further as a mainstream Republican
>unless we're talking a Handmaid's Tale/V for Vendetta/Hunger
>Games/full-on-dystopia scenario.
>
>He was all-in as a Bush wonk, they didn't like him in D.C.. He
>went all-in in Texas to get to the Senate, and they still
>don't like him in D.C.
>
>He doesn't beat Rubio. He doesn't beat Trump. The Rubio people
>don't want him.
>
>Best option? His worst case either way is to eat shit in the
>Senate for as long as Texas will have him, so he should get in
>behind Trump as a V.P. to ensure Rubio doesn't catch up.
>
>But maybe he's too proud for that. Maybe Trump is sure he's
>got the nom sown up and wants someone more likable. But it's
>Cruz's best option for 2016.


I agree mostly with all of this^^^^^^especially your breakdown of Cruz' evolution....

But I don't think Trump has any room for him....By going full on Birther on Cruz, that's a partnership that will never happen....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Mon Feb-22-16 12:04 PM

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271. "I think that the revolution will not be televised...and will be boring. "
In response to Reply # 0
Mon Feb-22-16 12:04 PM by Buddy_Gilapagos

  

          

I think no real change is coming very soon. I will just go ahead and admit that.

Namely because of structural impediments. Specifically, because of gerrymandering and how primaries catapult extremely partisan people to congressional office.


I think the way the system is currently set up the GOP is structurally unable to win the white house and the Dems are structurally unable to take over congress.

I think the GOP Establishment will re-write the rules so that they could continue to be the establishment and they will weed out alot of tea party folks over the next decade.

I think the real fight will be when district maps are redrawn with the next census to make all districts more competitive.

I think at some point I have to admit that I am a centrist and incrementalist mainly because I am cynical about the ideal of radical sudden change happening anytime soon without something catastrophic happening like a real great depression.


I think change will happened not by a partisan victory or by making things more partisan but rather by politics becoming infinitely less partisan and a lot of boring people coming into government making changes that everyone agrees is common sense unless you are super partisan.

I think the most positive thing I got from the Trump campaign is that alot of the conservative ideology isn't that airtight with their supporters. There are alot of people who call themselves Conservatives don't care about big or small government, taxes, guns, planned parenthood, etc. (Unfortunately, the least positive thing I got confirmed from the Trump Campaign is that alot of people who call themselves conservatives are just looking for vessels to channel their racial animosity).

Anyway, all that to say I know alot of people are looking at this election for an opportunity for a big dramatic change in government and I just don't see any reason why that would happen regardless of which Dem becomes president.



**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Feb-22-16 12:33 PM

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275. "RE: I think that the revolution will not be televised...and will be bori..."
In response to Reply # 271


          




This^^^^ is where I'm at....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Mynoriti
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287. "Dems have a realistic shot at the senate"
In response to Reply # 271


  

          

but yeah, the house is lost for a long ass time, mainly because of gerrymandering.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Mon Feb-22-16 12:13 PM

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272. "superdelegates on some bullshit"
In response to Reply # 0


          

from what I remember in 2008 they didn't add the superdelegates this early or at all until the end..

superdelegates can change their vote too so why add them this early in the game?

maybe I'm mistaken but I don't remember seeing 500 delegates for Clinton after only 3 or 4 primaries.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Feb-22-16 12:29 PM

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274. "Peep game...."
In response to Reply # 272
Mon Feb-22-16 12:52 PM by murph71

          

A look into the past gives us all a better understanding...From the New York Times on Bernie's and Clinton's delegate race...

"Still, while Mrs. Clinton is far from reaching 2,383 delegates, she is poised to create the sort of mathematical quandary for Mr. Sanders that she faced in 2008 (against Obama). That winter, Barack Obama used an 11-state winning streak to establish a lead of 100 delegates that Mrs. Clinton was never able to surmount. While a similar streak is unlikely this year, advisers to Mr. Sanders concede that Mrs. Clinton could generate a significant delegate lead now that she has momentum from her Nevada win. But they say they are not out of the running.

(further in the story) "David Plouffe, the architect of Mr. Obama’s delegate strategy in 2008 and Mr. Obama’s campaign manager, said Mr. Sanders would need “surprising landslides in surprising places” if Mrs. Clinton did well on Super Tuesday. If Mrs. Clinton builds a small but stable lead, Mr. Sanders would need to overwhelm her in major primaries later in the spring. It is likely Sanders would have to win by double digits, if not by 20 points, in Pennsylvania, New Jersey and California to begin to crawl out of what seems like a small but, in fact, is a deep and persistent hole” in the delegate count, said Mr. Plouffe, who is supporting Mrs. Clinton."

All this^^^^will most likely be done without a super delegate count...

Basically, think of super delegates as IN CASE OF EMERGENCY BREAK deal. It's moot unless Bernie starts actually winning the big states....Super delegates are sitting on the sidelines like they did when Obama and Clinton were running against each other. Super delegates were on Clinton's side back then, BUT ONCE THEY SAW THAT OBEEZY COULD PICK UP DELEGATES IN BIG STATES, THEY SWITCHED TO OBAMA.

Bernie has to simply start winning the big states to push the super delegates on his side (and the only time u pay attention to super delegates is when the race is close or u r losing).

link: http://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/22/us/politics/delegate-count-leaving-bernie-sanders-with-steep-climb.html?_r=0

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Mon Feb-22-16 01:13 PM

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276. "yeah, but that doesn't address my point"
In response to Reply # 274


          

from what I remember in 2008 the super delegates were on the sideline until the end.

Like I said, maybe they did this in 2008 but I don't remember any talk of super delegates early on.


I think it' s weird how they are counting them already.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Feb-22-16 01:25 PM

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277. "RE: yeah, but that doesn't address my point"
In response to Reply # 276
Mon Feb-22-16 01:39 PM by murph71

          

>from what I remember in 2008 the super delegates were on the
>sideline until the end.


No...that was part of the link that I posted....In 2008 the super delegates were rolling with Hillary. To be more specific, one of the most prominent super delegates, John Lewis, was rolling hard with Clinton, as others were. THE MEDIA REPORTED ON THIS. It wasn't until late Feb 28th (after Obama started winning the early delegate counts) that Lewis signaled to the other Super Delegates that it was OK to back Obama...

This story from back in 2008 breaks it down better than I can: http://articles.latimes.com/2008/feb/28/nation/na-endorse28

Oh...And Lewis was vocally supporting Clinton AS A SUPER DELEGATE back in 2007. He wasn't looking Obama's way:

(http://firstread.nbcnews.com/_news/2007/10/12/4429945-john-lewis-endorses-clinton)

Hillary Clinton was counting super delegates back then...She was counting on those super delegate votes and did stump speeches with them....So was Gore when he was running in his primary....Super delegates have long been part of the Left's primary runs...But its rarely been used as a shield....

The only way that happens is if Bernie faces off against Clinton during the Democratic Convention...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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278. "I know they aren't new bruh..."
In response to Reply # 277


          

but what I'm saying is right now it's being reported that Hillary has 502 delegates to Bernie's 70.

back in 2008 I don't remember them adding super delegates to the total this early.

pretty sure they waited until later in the game to add the super delegate totals.

I don't remember Obama or Clinton losing a close primary while also gaining 90 super delegates







****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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Mon Feb-22-16 03:31 PM

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279. "They really shouldn't be talking about super delegates at all until the ..."
In response to Reply # 278


          

All it does is encourage herding behavior. Same thing with the over reporting and emphasis on polling results.

People want to be supporting the winning team. Nobody wants to throw their money, effort, and votes behind a losing cause. So if it looks like someone has a huge lead, folks will see the final result as inevitable and support the leader or just stay home.

Right now, it looks like Clinton is winning by a huge margin according to graphics I keep seeing. But in terms of earned delegates, Sanders and Clinton are about tied.
Still, people will look at the huge "lead" and think what's the point of participating.


_______________________________________

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Feb-22-16 03:47 PM

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281. "RE: They really shouldn't be talking about super delegates at all until ..."
In response to Reply # 279
Mon Feb-22-16 03:48 PM by murph71

          


They have always talked about super delegates early. U guys just weren't paying attention to it back then...lol

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
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282. "I realize they have done it for a while. I'm saying they shouldn't do it"
In response to Reply # 281
Mon Feb-22-16 03:54 PM by PimpTrickGangstaClik

          

Especially when the delegates commitment at this point means nothing.

_______________________________________

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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283. "RE: I realize they have done it for a while. I'm saying they shouldn't d..."
In response to Reply # 282


          

>Especially when the delegates commitment at this point means
>nothing.


It's never had a negative effect on a race....It's not a big deal accept for people who want to find more reasons to hate Hillary Clinton or any other candidate they don't like...


GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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legsdiamond
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285. "who said it was a big deal tho? "
In response to Reply # 283


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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murph71
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288. "RE: who said it was a big deal tho? "
In response to Reply # 285


          



The same people saying that they never remember super delegates being counted so early in past elections.....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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legsdiamond
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290. "a few post on okp isnt a big deal"
In response to Reply # 288


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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murph71
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Tue Feb-23-16 08:38 AM

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298. "RE: a few post on okp isnt a big deal"
In response to Reply # 290


          



Huh? Hell, we may as not even have any debates on this board if that's the case....lol

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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legsdiamond
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Tue Feb-23-16 04:18 PM

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302. "nah, just spare us the hyperbole"
In response to Reply # 298


          

anytime someone says something you disagree with you go overboard...lol

I enjoy the discussion tho...

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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murph71
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280. "RE: I know they aren't new bruh..."
In response to Reply # 278
Mon Feb-22-16 03:54 PM by murph71

          

>but what I'm saying is right now it's being reported that
>Hillary has 502 delegates to Bernie's 70.

I guess what it comes down to is this: they were reporting the same thing in 2007 and early 2008 when Clinton had the super delegate lead. In fact, Clinton had a HUGE delegate lead over Obama. And u know what? Obama supporters weren't crying about it. Because they had their eyes on the White House as a Democratic party.


I know u said u don't remember. So here ya go...Cut and pasted, below...(btw, while half of the super delegates were still waiting it out to see what Clinton would do, she still had a whopping 169 super delegates to Obama's 63...keep in mind. Those super delegates were spread out amongst five OTHER candidates. Clinton would have had even more super delegates if it was just her against Obeezy...)....

Here ya go.....I hope this helps...
---


Hillary Clinton Leads Race for Democratic Superdelegates
Published December 02, 2007
Associated Press

WASHINGTON – New Hampshire and Iowa will have to wait.

The nation's first presidential primary, for Democrats anyway, is being waged among hundreds of party insiders — superdelegates who could play a big part in selecting the nominee at next summer's national convention.

So far, most of them still haven't been sold on any of the candidates.

The Associated Press contacted 90 percent of the 765 superdelegates, mostly elected officials and other party officers, who are free to support anyone they choose at the convention, regardless of what happens in the primaries.

Hillary Rodham Clinton leads Barack Obama by more than a 2-1 margin among those who have endorsed a candidate.

Clinton has the endorsement of 169 superdelegates. She is followed by Obama, 63; John Edwards, 34; Bill Richardson, 25; Chris Dodd, 17; Joe Biden, 8, and Dennis Kucinich, 2.

Superdelegates tend to support the front-runner, said David Rohde, a political scientist at Duke University. "They want to be on the winning side," he said.

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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legsdiamond
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284. "like I said and will say no more"
In response to Reply # 280


          

I DON'T REMEMBER SUPERDELEGATES BEING ADDED TO THE TALLY THIS EARLY!!!

lol, damn.. that's it, that's all.

It's early as shit murph... the only reason I think people are pointing to the superdelegates THIS time around is because the primary W's have been pretty close yet the delegate count makes it look like a landslide.

I didn't say they weren't discussed or they didn't already choose sides in 2008. I'm saying I don't remember 300 or so delegates being added to anyone's total after 2 or 3 primaries.

I'm pretty sure MSNBC and CNN kept them to the side when tallying delegate totals. No one cried about super delegates early on in 2008 because they were talked about but were kept to the side until later in the game.

IMO it doesn't make any sense to add them now because they can switch.

I would prefer if they kept them off the board.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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murph71
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Mon Feb-22-16 04:29 PM

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286. "RE: like I said and will say no more"
In response to Reply # 284
Mon Feb-22-16 04:35 PM by murph71

          

Yeah...that's a different debate.....U can say that u want them kept off the board. I'm not here to debate that...I would not have even wasted my time with that....lol

I'm talking about the fact that folks r acting like this is some new thing...Like Super Delegates have never been a part of the discussion or have been used by candidates to show the power they have in the election...Like this is some new thing...lol....i'm calling bullshit on that....

Also, do you ever think that maybe you are making a big deal out of this because the delegate numbers for Clinton vs. Bernie looks so lopsided?

U want to know why they look so lopsided? BECAUSE IT'S A ONE ON ONE BATTLE....They would have looked lopsided as well back in 2007, early 2008 against Clinton and Obama if those super delegates weren't spread out amongst 6 different candidates.....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Vex_id
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291. "Are you ready to admit you were wrong about the delegate count?"
In response to Reply # 274


          

Both Clinton & Sanders have 51 earned delegates - despite your inaccurate statements above.

Once we correct your faulty statements perhaps we can continue to discourse.

-->

  

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murph71
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Tue Feb-23-16 07:46 AM

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294. "RE: Are you ready to admit you were wrong about the delegate count?"
In response to Reply # 291


          

>Both Clinton & Sanders have 51 earned delegates - despite
>your inaccurate statements above.
>
>Once we correct your faulty statements perhaps we can continue
>to discourse.


Final delegate count after Nevada: 52 (Hillary), 51 (Bernie)...(even 1 to two more delegates matter in an election...This is not horse shoes...)

I have no idea where u r getting your figures from (my source: http://www.politico.com/blogs/2016-dem-primary-live-updates-and-results/2016/02/nevada-final-count-2016-21963)

And again....I'll say it until the cows come home....If folks have an issue with actual Democratic process of including super delegates early on that's an entirely different discussion...

The only thing I have balked at is A) people suggesting that this is the first time they remember this happening (bullshit) and B) that this is somehow giving Clinton an unfair advantage....

It's not.

Super Delegates really don't matter until the race becomes extended....It's all about Super Tuesday. If Bernie can survive that then that's when the super delegates become a concrete debate....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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legsdiamond
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Mon Feb-22-16 05:09 PM

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289. "we all know Hillary has SC in the bag..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

and people say this is the when the real race starts...

but outside of VA what states in the south are in play for Dems in the general?

What does a convincing primary win in SC do for us in the general?

Florida? NC didn't go for Obama when we had the DNC in Charlotte so we know that aint happening in 2016.

just wondering why people keep saying this is when the race starts since IMO none of the southern states are in play in the general

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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wluv
Member since Jan 27th 2003
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Tue Feb-23-16 05:51 AM

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293. "RE: we all know Hillary has SC in the bag..."
In response to Reply # 289


  

          

Here's an article on this subject. For Dems, the delegate math to the nomination starts to add up faster and for the Repubs, South Carolina usually picks their nominee. So Trump winning here, according to past history makes him the odds on favorite for the nom.

http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/features/2016/02/south-carolina-primary-important-election-republicans-democrats-160217105427419.html

How important are the South Carolina primaries?

The US presidential primary election is hitting its stride with votes taking place in 14 states in the next three weeks. As the battle moves down to South Carolina, presidential contenders will be looking to consolidate their win (or make a comeback following a loss) in Iowa or New Hampshire.

But South Carolina, where Republicans will vote on Saturday and Democrats a week later, is more diverse and representative of the country as a whole than the previous two states: here the African American population is larger, and with its myriad military bases and academies, it is home to many veterans.

Traditionally, South Carolina has supported the Bushes and the Clintons: on February 15, former president George W Bush came out to North Charleston in a show of support for his brother, Jeb, who is running on the Republican ticket. But surprises can happen in South Carolina.

The Palmetto State is known for its ability to predict the Republican nomination: With one exception since 1980, every victor in the primary has gone on to become the nominee.

While known for its southern charm, South Carolina is also the place where the gloves come off: From accusations of fathering illegitimate children to spreading rumours about mental illness, South Carolina's gritty primary politics are legendary.

While the back-stabbing and rumour-spreading have been kept to a minimum (so far), the race leading up to South Carolina's primary has been heated. The Republican presidential debate on February 13 drew cheers and boos from the crowd, and the anger was palpable among the contestants - a sign of how important this southern state will be in the race to the White House.


Former US President George W Bush, centre, speaks for his brother, US Republican presidential candidate Jeb Bush, left, at a campaign event in South Carolina
Why is South Carolina important to the Republicans?

Iowa, with its relatively low turnout, and New Hampshire, which is known for being more moderate, is unrepresentative of the Republican base. But South Carolina traditionally picks the Republican winner.

"South Carolina is a mix of both, and therefore it's a real test of what America wants," said Scottie Nell Hughes, the news director for the Tea Party News Network, a conservative news site.

READ MORE: Why do the Iowa caucuses matter?

Since Ronald Reagan won in 1980, only Newt Gingrich has lost the Republican nomination after winning the primary there in 2012. The South Carolina Republican party prides itself on its ability to select the eventual nominee, so much so that it proclaims on its website: "We take our primaries very seriously - We pick presidents!"

Hughes told Al Jazeera that the state's primary electorate best mirrors the nation's Republican base, because it comprises a "broad range of the urban vote, evangelical vote, establishment vote" - a mixture of conservatives, more moderate voters, and fiscally conservative but socially liberal retirees in the coastal areas who hail from northern states such as New York.

South Carolina also has 50 delegates up for grabs to Republican candidates - a larger number than those offered by Iowa or New Hampshire. "It will certainly help if you win South Carolina because you will grab more delegates than you could have in both states combined. After all, it comes down to a numbers game," Hughes said.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Tue Feb-23-16 08:15 AM

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295. "RE: we all know Hillary has SC in the bag..."
In response to Reply # 289
Tue Feb-23-16 08:42 AM by murph71

          

>just wondering why people keep saying this is when the race
>starts since IMO none of the southern states are in play in
>the general

None of this matters historically^^^^


Obama/Biden didn't simply depend on southern states to win. They depended specifically on southern states like Florida (which Dems won) and other BIG electorate states like California, Ohio, and ILL, which have some of the biggest electorate takes...

As for why folks say the race BEGINS with Nevada/SC? It's because of their more diverse demographics. It gives u a better indication how other folks beyond people in small WHITE very ideological states (Iowa/NH) will vote.

Nevada/SC represents a run up to Super Tuesday. And Super Tuesday (the most important run in the Democratic primary), which will be coming up soon, has non southern states like Colorado, Massachusetts, Minnesota and Oklahoma and Vermont. Bernie will win Vermont....Hillary will win Colorado and Oklahoma. Bernie will give her a run for her money in Mass (it's a toss up) and Minnesota may tip Bernie's way....

By then though, Clinton will have already racked up delegates in the southern states, which matters more in a Democratic primary than a general....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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Tue Feb-23-16 01:29 AM

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292. "Very important Hillary quote:"
In response to Reply # 0


          

"Yes, does Wall Street and big financial interests, along with drug companies, insurance companies, big oil, all of it, have too much influence? You're right. But if we were to stop that tomorrow, we would still have the indifference, the negligence that we saw in Flint. We would still have racism holding people back. We would still have sexism preventing women from getting equal pay. We would still have LGBT people who get married on Saturday and get fired on Monday.”

This right here is an excellent example of the difference between Sanders and Clinton. First off....Reigning in capitalism IS related to racial inequality. In part....because in order to provide social programs that attempt to correct for underprivileged groups we need to collect taxes. And the more taxes we collect....the more the government can intervene to address racial inequalities ie reparations.

I also think Clinton's position shows a misunderstanding of the issue. Income inequality is a RESULT of racism. They are not two seperate issues. She's moving the conversation away from suggestions to actually DO something about the consequences of racism towards empty rhetoric. I mean....what's she's saying is 'we need to stop being racist' which is the equivalent of saying nothing at all. What practical consequences come from that? Nothing.

At the same time....I'm extremely disappointed that Bernie has not seized the opportunity to be more specific in appealing to black voters. You hear Hillary say 'we must learn from the mistakes we made in the past'.....what she's referring to is the Anti-drug abuse act of 1986. She won't specifically name it....but she'll point out that Sanders voted for it at the time and that although her husband brought forth the bill....she didn't cast a vote. I guess that's why he hasn't been more specific. lol.

Both are trying to appeal to the black vote....and neither of them are being specific enough. The easiest thing to do that is specific is promise to correct that legislation. Over and over again. The only way I see Bernie getting the momentum back again is if he owns up to making a mistake on that act....and then promising to change it when elected OVER AND OVER AGAIN. There's a clear opportunity there and he's not taking it.

  

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Mansa Musa
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Tue Feb-23-16 08:24 AM

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296. "It's bullshit because predatory lending decimated black wealth"
In response to Reply # 292
Tue Feb-23-16 08:31 AM by Mansa Musa

          

Her friends at the too-big-to-fail banks, who clap every time she scorns breaking them up, are deeply implicated in poverty and mass foreclosures across Black America. But framing her opposition to Glass-Steagall as part of an "intersectional" approach to injustice is the kind of cynical move Hillary specializes in.

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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Tue Feb-23-16 05:59 PM

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311. "Good point."
In response to Reply # 296


          

Also....what happened in Flint IS a capitalist/socialist issue. It's a social infrastructure problem. America's love of capitalism and disdain for socialism is WHY social infrastructure is falling apart. If we collected a proper share of taxes from the rich and corporations we would be able to afford to take care of the roads, the water system, the bridges....all that 'socialist' stuff.

  

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Mansa Musa
Member since Feb 16th 2009
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Tue Feb-23-16 08:52 PM

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316. "There is a must-read article on this by Andrew Highsmith"
In response to Reply # 311
Tue Feb-23-16 08:54 PM by Mansa Musa

          

See below. Essentially, if I can summarize the story: first, GM used the place as a toxic waste dumping ground for fifty years, then cut its workforce from about 80,000 to 10,000 in search of cheaper labor. (And with help from massive government subsidies for plant relocation.) During the same period, racist housing policies forced African-Americans to live in ghettoes, surrounded by white suburbs. The former bore the brunt of the collapse of the local tax and employment base. Then, amid crumbling schools and declining quality of life, the banks (grown huge and deregulated with Bill Clinton's help) swooped in and sold predatory high-interest loans to low-income African-Americans, resulting in a wave of home foreclosures and deeper poverty. Then, the racist, right-wing Republican governor put democracy on "freeze" by appointing an Emergency Financial Manager, who sold off the city's most valuable assets to the governor's cronies. Meanwhile, the same governor passed a $2 billion business tax cut. Finally, the Emergency Financial Manager went after the final remaining public asset, the city water department, slashing its budget by laying off workers and switching to a cheaper water source (the river polluted by GM), while refusing to spend money on basic safety measures. The result: mass poisoning.

To deal with these problems, we need to connect the racial injustice against African-Americans in Flint with the neoliberal ideology ("the era of big government is over") that spurns aggressive financial and environmental regulation, higher taxes on the wealthy, and large-scale public investments.

Read Highsmith's recent piece in the Los Angeles Times:

http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la-oe-0131-highsmith-flint-water-crisis-20160131-story.html

Flint's toxic water crisis was 50 years in the making

Andrew R. Highsmith

January 29, 2016

In the fall of 1966, African American activists from the impoverished North End of Flint, Michigan, turned out en masse for a series of hearings on racial inequality sponsored by the state's Civil Rights Commission. One of those who testified, Ailene Butler, drew links between the segregationist policies that had created the North End and the corporate practices that had immiserated its inhabitants.

Butler owned a funeral parlor not far from a massive complex of smoke-belching Buick factories operated by General Motors. A throat cancer survivor, she spoke at length about the dreadful conditions that existed in her neighborhood: “There is a heavy smog caused by the Buick factory, which has been in existence for about 18 years.... The houses in this district are eaten up by a very heavy deposit, something like rust.... You can imagine what we go through down there breathing when this exists on just material things.”

The political coup behind the Flint water crisis

When asked why she and her neighbors had not simply moved away, Butler pointed out that discriminatory real estate practices — particularly redlining — had trapped black people in the North End. “No matter what their credit is, no matter how many years they've been working for Buick.... They have no place to go.”

Although the plants that once choked Butler's lungs are long gone, structural inequality and environmental degradation are still twin problems today in Flint, a city now constantly in the news thanks to a toxic water crisis.

———————

Many details surrounding Flint's latest disaster have recently come to light. Here is what we know so far: In November 2011, Michigan Gov. Rick Snyder, after declaring that the city was in a state of financial emergency, appointed the first in a series of four unelected managers who have controlled municipal government for much of the past several years. Their mandate was to cut costs and balance budgets. Between that time and April 2015, when Snyder declared Flint's emergency resolved and turned the municipality over to an advisory board, the governor's appointees implemented a series of reforms they claimed would return Flint to financial solvency. Chief among these was the decision to cancel Flint's longstanding water agreement with Detroit in order to join a newly formed regional water authority that had proposed to build a pipeline to Lake Huron. Boosters proclaimed that the pipeline would save the city $18 million over eight years, but it could not be completed until well into 2016. To meet immediate water needs, Flint's emergency managers elected to use the polluted Flint River.

Since that switch occurred in the spring of 2014, local citizens have complained of discolored, foul-tasting, awful-smelling water. This water, which has made many sick, is laced with toxic levels of lead. According to medical experts, the lead exposures that have occurred are likely to have lifelong detrimental health effects on an as yet undetermined number of residents.


Why does affluent Porter Ranch get more urgent environmental relief than working-class Boyle Heights?

As with so many environmental disasters, this one was preventable. Evidence suggests that the simple failure to use proper anti-corrosive agents led to the leaching of lead into the city's water. It has also become apparent that the slow responses of local, state and federal officials to this crisis — as well as their penchant for obfuscation — prolonged the lead exposure.

It would be a mistake, however, to conclude that Flint's predicament is simply the result of government mismanagement. It's also the product of a variety of larger structural problems that are much more difficult to untangle and remedy.

Over the past three-quarters of a century, waves of deindustrialization, disinvestment and depopulation eviscerated Flint's tax base, making it all but impossible to improve — or even maintain — the city's crumbling infrastructure. Flint — which once claimed 200,000 residents — now contains fewer than 100,000, nearly half impoverished, more than half African American. The economic prospects of locals are grim. After decades of plant closures and layoffs, GM's workforce in the area, which once surpassed 80,000, is less than 10,000. The hemorrhaging of jobs has produced unemployment rates that routinely reach into the double digits.

Among the many forces behind Flint's economic plunge were two migrations, both government sanctioned. Following World War II, GM, like other American companies, took advantage of local, state and federal subsidies that encouraged the relocation of industry from cities to suburbs and rural areas. Over the same period, the home mortgage insurance programs implemented by the Federal Housing Administration and the Veterans Administration enabled millions of white Americans — including tens of thousands of Flint residents — to relocate from central cities to racially homogeneous suburbs.

Because lenders and government officials largely excluded African Americans from participating in such programs and categorically refused to issue mortgages in many urban neighborhoods, federal housing policies contributed to increasing levels of racial segregation. These policies also deepened the economic chasms between majority-black cities such as Flint and the predominantly white suburbs surrounding them.

Signs of economic distress appeared in Flint as early as the 1950s and 1960s, when city officials began confronting periodic budget shortfalls. Over the past generation, though, as Flint's urban crisis gathered momentum, the quality of city services and the state of Flint's infrastructure declined dramatically.

On the ground, Flint's economic troubles translated into deep service cuts, layoffs for municipal workers, a host of new fees for basic services, deferred maintenance on the city's increasingly decrepit infrastructure, and, of course, the state takeover that led to the current calamity. What is happening now is in many ways a culmination of Flint's long-established urban crisis.

If there was ever a canary in Flint's coal mine, it may have been Ailene Butler. When she stepped forward in 1966, she crystallized the tight connections between environmental inequality and social injustice. To be sure, much has changed since Butler sounded the alarm half a century ago. Whereas in the 1960s it was the encroachment of industrial plants upon black neighborhoods that fueled local resentment, Flint's current water crisis stems in many ways from the absence of those plants — and the jobs, taxes, services and infrastructure they supported. Still, looking ahead at Flint's uncertain future, Butler's message seems more relevant than ever.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Tue Feb-23-16 04:18 PM

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301. "I think you are taking that quote out of context"
In response to Reply # 292


  

          

The quote in context is that Bernie Sanders is a one issue politician and if you executed his plan you would still have the issues that can't be addressed by fixing income inequality alone.

More context and the strategy discussed here

http://www.vox.com/2016/2/11/10976502/democratic-debate-hillary-clinton-bernie-sanders


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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Mansa Musa
Member since Feb 16th 2009
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Tue Feb-23-16 05:07 PM

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304. "She is being incredibly deceptive, though."
In response to Reply # 301
Tue Feb-23-16 05:37 PM by Mansa Musa

          

Her position on Glass-Steagall is HORRIBLE for communities of color, so her attempt to drop it into an anti-racist statement is disgusting. She supports policies that wiped out half of Black America's wealth in the past decade. My point is not at all that Sanders doesn't deserve criticism on racial justice grounds (although Clinton is far worse than Sanders on racial justice, as Michelle Alexander has explained). Rather, my point is that Clinton is cynically using this critique of Sanders to justify her opposition to Glass-Steagall, even though it directly led to predatory lending that set racial justice back a generation.

Notice that she didn't just say "we have to deal with racial and gender and LGBT inequality as well as class inequality." She INTENTIONALLY threw in her support for maintaining too-big-to fail banks in the same sentence. That's beyond cynical.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Tue Feb-23-16 08:34 AM

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297. "Goldie Taylor breaks it down with simple math (Swipe)"
In response to Reply # 0
Tue Feb-23-16 08:47 AM by murph71

          

It's important that folks not conflate what's happening in Democratic primaries with a general election.....It's more about Clinton's ability to rack up early delegate counts (before we even take the super delegate count as a factor) in the primaries. Add the fact that many of the college voters that Bernie will be depending on in the spring will be on spring break, then the math def. points Clinton's way. In a general election, it's less about dominating southern states and more about holding your own in those southern states, winning Florida (the biggest southern prize) and dominating the electoral map (Ohio, ILL, ect...).

----
Daily Beast
DO THE MATH (2.22.16)
This Is the Date Berne Sanders Berns Out

Goldie Taylor

With South Carolina and Super Tuesday looming ahead, Bernie Sanders’s campaign is fast approaching an expiration date.

Not only will the revolution not be televised—at least in the case of Sen. Bernie Sanders—it appears to have an expiration date.

Despite collecting millions in small-dollar donations and packing thousands of people into arenas around the country, despite topping Hillary Clinton for the first time in a national poll of likely Democratic voters, the path to victory has narrowed sharply for Sanders. Some would argue that a window of opportunity slammed shut Sunday night in Nevada and that the upcoming race in South Carolina is the proverbial kitty-bar.

Sanders may well have the volunteers and the money to keep going, but after March 15 he’ll have to grapple with a new set of questions. Does he still have the ability to push Clinton further left? And can he bring enough new voters into the process to exert any real influence?

Undoubtedly, Sanders will lose the South Carolina primary set for Feb. 27. The bad news is—with the exception of possibly Vermont, Massachusetts, and Wisconsin—he’ll likely keep losing though April. The polls are not kind and, with less than two weeks before Super Tuesday, pulling off wins in states like Georgia, Virginia, North Carolina, and Texas seems all but impossible. According to FiveThirtyEight.com, Clinton holds a 50-99 percent likelihood of winning some of the most delegate-rich and highly diverse states on the calendar.

Sanders, the self-professed anti-establishment candidate, has run on a platform that attacks income inequality, as well as promises to expand access to health care and college education. His message has attracted support from mostly white progressives who are convinced that Sanders is the best candidate to carry the Democratic banner in the fall campaign. For them, Clinton represents all that is wrong in Washington.

The problem for Sanders is that he has nowhere to grow. Black voters, who will dominate many of the coming primaries, have not responded to his message. Even black millennials, thought to be good prospects, are breaking in favor of Clinton. They are, it appears by the ballots cast in Nevada and polling in upcoming states, voting with their parents and grandparents. It must be said that Clinton won the Nevada black vote by a 3-to-1 margin and that crossed age and income. And despite what entrance polling data said in Nevada, according to analysis published by NBC News, she may have won Hispanics as well.
After Sanders won New Hampshire and nearly bested the former secretary of state in Iowa, many began to challenge the notion of Clinton’s inevitability. There were cracks, they said, in the “firewall.” Expectations were managed downward ahead of Nevada, even by the Clinton campaign—which started organizing in the state last April. The Sanders camp appeared to be stunned by their good fortunes. By comparison, they did not put boots on the ground until late winter, when it became clear that he could be competitive there.

But then Hispanic civil-rights leaders and members of Congress, including California Rep. Xavier Becerra and Dolores Huerta, rang in and openly challenged Sanders on past immigration policy votes. Then, too, endorsements began to roll through the piedmonts of the Palmetto State. Black pastors and elected officials began digging a trench around South Carolina.

Taken together, if the trend holds, there is no path to victory left for Sanders. At this late stage in the campaign, unlike Republicans, there is limited growth potential for either candidate in such a small field.

More critically, one rationale for the Sanders candidacy dries up under scrutiny. Turnout numbers and the anticipated brief nature of the primary mean he has not and will not drive increased voter participation. The wave never arrived and there is no sign of it on the horizon.

One of the more vexing things about this election year is the open hostility to basic election math and the exhausting comparisons between Sanders and the road that then-Sen. Barack Obama faced in 2008. There are a paucity of similarities between Sanders and President Obama as candidates and even fewer parallels in terms of campaign and election-year dynamics.

One day soon, Sanders will take to a lectern and announce that he is suspending his campaign. What follows could be a push for Clinton to embrace single-payer health care or take on student loan debt in a more substantial way. Sanders could harness his coalition ahead of the Democratic convention and attempt to force Clinton’s hand on any number of issues. Or Sanders could decide to actively campaign for U.S. Senate and House candidates and help deliver a new Congress that will take up those reforms.

Ultimately, what Sanders does after he exits will reveal if the movement was about him or us.

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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MEAT
Member since Feb 08th 2008
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Tue Feb-23-16 04:13 PM

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299. "Spike Lee says Do the Right Thing"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016/2/23/1489692/-Spike-Lee-Cuts-SC-Ad-FeelTheBern

------
“There is no fate that cannot be surmounted by scorn.” -Albert Camus

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Tue Feb-23-16 04:16 PM

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300. "Hillary has Trayvon, Sandra Bland AND Eric Garner moms"
In response to Reply # 0


          

stumping in SC.

Is it possible to get 101% of the Black vote?

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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Tue Feb-23-16 04:30 PM

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303. "lol"
In response to Reply # 300
Tue Feb-23-16 04:31 PM by PimpTrickGangstaClik

          

<
<Is it possible to get 101% of the Black vote?

_______________________________________

  

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mrhood75
Member since Dec 06th 2004
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Tue Feb-23-16 05:19 PM

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305. "So sayeth a friend of mine:"
In response to Reply # 300


  

          

"Hillary and Bernie are whipping out Black celebrity endorsements like they are playing a game of ‪#‎NegroPokemon‬."

-----------------

www.albumism.com

Checkin' Our Style, Return To Zero:

https://www.mixcloud.com/returntozero/

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Tue Feb-23-16 05:23 PM

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306. "RE: So sayeth a friend of mine:"
In response to Reply # 305


          

>"Hillary and Bernie are whipping out Black celebrity
>endorsements like they are playing a game of
>‪#‎NegroPokemon‬."



Fucking LOL!!!!!!!!!

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Tue Feb-23-16 05:46 PM

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308. "lmao"
In response to Reply # 305


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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Tue Feb-23-16 07:14 PM

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313. "Highlight of the thread"
In response to Reply # 305


          

lol

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Tue Feb-23-16 09:17 PM

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320. "Alright, this reply beats mine."
In response to Reply # 305


          

  

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stravinskian
Member since Feb 24th 2003
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Tue Feb-23-16 05:26 PM

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307. "Only if Rachel Dolezal moves to SC."
In response to Reply # 300


          


>Is it possible to get 101% of the Black vote?

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Tue Feb-23-16 05:47 PM

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310. "well played"
In response to Reply # 307


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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Tue Feb-23-16 07:15 PM

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314. "lol"
In response to Reply # 307


          

  

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TheAlbionist
Member since Jul 04th 2011
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Wed Feb-24-16 07:07 AM

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333. "Underrated ^^"
In response to Reply # 307


  

          

Well played.

_______________________________

))<>((
forever.

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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Tue Feb-23-16 08:37 PM

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315. "At least it makes more sense to me now."
In response to Reply # 0
Tue Feb-23-16 08:49 PM by denny

          

Vex id had a really good, long thread going about Sanders and the minority vote. I just couldn't understand why minorities didn't like Sanders. But after watching the Black panther doc I came to realize that this current black activist movement does NOT equate racial equality with capitalism like the black activism of the 60's did.

So Bernie's stance against unchecked capitalism doesn't appeal to the BLM movement the way it would with the Panthers and MLK. The current black activism sees racism as an independent issue.....not a result of capitalism. I DO see racism as a result of capitalism...and that's why I was so confused before by the lack of support for Bernie amongst minorities.

Does that seem like a fair characterization/distinction to the black people here?

  

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Mansa Musa
Member since Feb 16th 2009
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Tue Feb-23-16 08:56 PM

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317. "A lot of BLM folks are anti-capitalist and/or oppose Clinton"
In response to Reply # 315
Tue Feb-23-16 09:03 PM by Mansa Musa

          

Keeanga-Yamahtta Taylor should straighten you out. She's a hardcore socialist and isn't riding for either Clinton or Sanders. Check out her book:

http://www.haymarketbooks.org/pb/From-BlackLivesMatter-to-Black-Liberation

Also check out the Black Youth Project 100, which connects racial justice with a left economic agenda

http://byp100.org/
http://agendatobuildblackfutures.org/

Be careful about generalizing here.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Tue Feb-23-16 08:59 PM

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318. "RE: A lot of people in BLM are anti-capitalist and/or oppose Clinton"
In response to Reply # 317


          



Some r...but not enough.....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Mansa Musa
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Tue Feb-23-16 09:03 PM

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319. "Sure. I'm not saying it's the dominant view."
In response to Reply # 318


          

But it's an important current.

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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Tue Feb-23-16 09:18 PM

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321. "From what I've seen...."
In response to Reply # 319


          

BLM has embraced Beyoncé's new video. I think that's a pretty good indication that reigning in capitalism is not really on their agenda.

No way that shit would've been supported by the black activism of the 60's.

  

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Mansa Musa
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Tue Feb-23-16 10:03 PM

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322. "There have always been cross-currents..."
In response to Reply # 321
Tue Feb-23-16 10:08 PM by Mansa Musa

          

...within organizations. The Ford Foundation threw a lot of money around to try to influence community organizations in the 1960s and 1970s, as private foundations and big philanthropists continue to do today. And a lot of the radical counterculture (Black and white) was part of the mass consumer economy (pins, T-shirts, records) from the beginning. Then you get Hollywood looking to make a buck off anything that seems appealing. That's why Blaxploitation movies linked a visual representation of Black Power aesthetics to badass muscle cars, fashionable clothing, and pop music. Yes, consumerism has penetrated our society more deeply since then, and the level of activism is lower, but let's be careful not to oversimplify either the past or the present. Also, in the social media age it's harder than ever to generalize about diffuse organizations with branches that crop up all over the place.

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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Wed Feb-24-16 01:40 AM

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325. "Good points."
In response to Reply # 322


          

Yep yep

  

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Warren Coolidge
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Wed Feb-24-16 01:20 AM

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323. "you're right about anti-capitalism being less a thing now...."
In response to Reply # 315


  

          

with Black activism...

but Bernie's primary problem is that he's king of older...and the fact that he actually calls himself a socialist, I don't think people believe he can win...

on the one hand though it pretty big that he's gotten the support he's gotten even though he's a socialist...


But I tell you.... Elizabeth Warren could have come with a pretty similar message as Bernie, and Black folks would have felt more comfortable choosing her over Hillary...


Black folks like the Clintons...but it's 2016....we ain't geeked out about them... Elizabeth Warren could have much easier gotten the Obama coalition to rally for her and beat Hillary again...

but... Hillary will do.

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
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Wed Feb-24-16 10:36 AM

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365. "RE: the fact that he actually calls himself a socialist <-- Denny, this ..."
In response to Reply # 323


  

          

what I was talking about in the Vanguard post

the BPP for self defense were socialists

they were practicing socialism

teaching socialism

it wasn't explicitly stated in that doc

but their actions speak for themselves

as I said in that thread, The Murder of Fred Hampton doc has excerpts where he's actively campaigning for the demise of capitalism and the shift toward socialism

really strikes me as just flat out weird that people, whom I would assume can identify with the BPP for self defense's platform

have this allergic reaction to the word socialism today

really weird, IMO.

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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Warren Coolidge
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Wed Feb-24-16 01:22 AM

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324. "Trump just said "I love the uneducated""
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

this guy is such a clown...

seeing Chris Mathews try and paint this gibberish as some sort of brilliance is really sickening...

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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Wed Feb-24-16 03:31 AM

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326. "He's gonna be president."
In response to Reply # 324
Wed Feb-24-16 03:33 AM by denny

          

People say he can't because of the black and hispanic votes. They said the same thing about Rob Ford here in Toronto. Ford ended up WINNING the black vote while saying bigoted and racist things along the way.

There's enough black and hispanic voters who are homophobic...who hate illegal immigration....who are islamaphobic....who hate government.....and who love the anti-intellectual persuasion of a bully like Trump. Plus, like white people, there are enough uneducated black wrestling fans that will vote for the first time in their lives because Trump will compell them. He may not WIN the minority vote....but he'll do better than people realize. Hispanics in nevada voted for Trump over Rubio for christ's sake.

I've seen this whole thing already. I can't believe it's happening again.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Wed Feb-24-16 04:56 AM

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327. "Slow down, homie...It's going to be OK..."
In response to Reply # 326
Wed Feb-24-16 05:18 AM by murph71

          

U gotta go inside the numbers, denny...Yes, Trump won the Latino vote...But....

from Nate Silver: "About 16,000 Hispanics participated in the Democratic NV caucus, versus maybe 5,000-6,000 in the GOP one depending on where turnout ends up."

Trump's "win" with Latinos in Nevada is kind of like being the tallest midget....Also, there have been no campaign ads aimed at Trump's racist comments against Latinos yet. The other Republican candidates have not even touched that (in fact, they are stealing Trump's "deport" EVERYONE deemed "illegal" talking point. Republicans r scared of their racist white base....

Wait until u see those Democratic ads getting at Trump where is calling Mexican rapists in the general election....Trump will not get the Latino vote he needs to win it all....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
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Wed Feb-24-16 05:12 AM

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328. "The point remains....."
In response to Reply # 327
Wed Feb-24-16 05:36 AM by denny

          

There's been a couple arguments made amongst us over and over again.

One...that I was partially persuaded by....was that as candidates dropped out Trump would sink. It's not happening. And Rubio is gonna run out of money soon. The donations are gonna stop coming in. I think the suggestions that Rubio will run as Trump's VP are feasible.

Second....that Trump can never win the general election because blacks and hispanics won't vote for him. We haven't really explored this argument much....but I have to appeal again to what I saw with Rob Ford because everyone in my city (including myself) said the exact same thing. This is a guy that publically used racial slurs over and over again. Yet minorities STILL voted for him. Overwhelmingly so....against a liberal, racially sensitive intellectual type.

Why? I still haven't figured it out. Couple things to kick around though.....The Fords went to black neighborhoods and gave out twenty dollar bills. I'm not joking. They also espoused homophobia which appealed to muslims, the chinese, west-indians. I guess there was some 'strange bed-fellows' scenarios that were at play like that. Rob Ford said 'I'm more popular with black voters than Obama'.

But the MAIN thing....was that Ford's elections broke voter turnout records BY FAR. Trump is doing that already. His media campaign will be even bigger during the general election....his rhetoric even more provocative. People who have never voted before....never even followed politics....they're gonna come out the woodwork.

Here....I found an old article. I know it's off-topic...but this is exactly why I think Trump will surprise us in holding his own with the minority vote in a general. The parallels are EXACT:

http://www.thestar.com/news/city_hall/2014/07/21/rob_ford_a_divisive_figure_in_torontos_black_community.html

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Wed Feb-24-16 05:37 AM

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329. "RE: The point remains....."
In response to Reply # 328
Wed Feb-24-16 05:52 AM by murph71

          

>There's been a couple arguments made amongst us over and over
>again.
>
>One...that I was partially persuaded by....was that as
>candidates dropped out Trump would sink. It's not happening.
>And Rubio is gonna run out of money soon. The donations are
>gonna stop coming in. I think the suggestions that Rubio will
>run as Trump's VP are feasible.


This ^^^^ premise was left at the door a minute ago, dog.....

Trump will be the Republican nominee....I stopped thinking that Rubio had a chance when the early poll numbers for SC started coming out....Also, Rubio will not be Trump's VP pick. Trump just said that Rubio "may" be an illegal. Dude came out his mouth and said Rubio should not even be allowed to run for President because his folks are not American....

It's highly unlikely...


>Second....that Trump can never win the general election
>because blacks and hispanics won't vote for him. We haven't
>really explored this argument much....but I have to appeal
>again to what I saw with Rob Ford because everyone in my city
>(including myself) said the exact same thing. This is a guy
>that publically used racial slurs over and over again. Yet
>minorities STILL voted for him. Overwhelmingly so....against a
>liberal, racially sensitive intellectual type.

I just gave u the inside numbers....Remember, McCain and Mitt Romney didn't lose the election because they didn't get the minority vote. They didn't win because THEY DIDN'T GET ENOUGH OF THE MINORITY VOTE....

U live in Canada right? Well, in the US its important to separate primaries from general elections...If u r getting 44 percent of the Latino vote in a Republican primary, with just 5000 Republican Latino voters vs. 16,000 Latinos voting for Democrats, u do the math...

What Ford was able to do in Canada is moot. People who study the numbers r going by GENERAL ELECTION trends, ever changing American demographics (this is most important), and Republican hostility against minorities....

We r not talking about a city like Toronto....We are talking about an entire country....Trump will def. be the Republican nominee. Anyone refuting this is not being honest with themselves....But that says more about the Repubs' angry white base than anything else...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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maryhattalillamb
Member since May 27th 2006
149 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 06:33 AM

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330. "I'm sorry but you don't know what you're talking about and are a Hillbot"
In response to Reply # 329


          

http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=4&topic_id=12842850&mesg_id=12842850


I've watched you (and Hitokori, Big Reg, Mynorti, AstralBlack, amongst others) spout this and that about Donald Trump and how he is not really running, only wants to sell books, is "hurting his brand", only gets poor white uneducated trash votes, the list goes on.

I've watched this for nearly a year now.

You yourself have been campaigning for HRC for quite some time and never gave Bernie a chance but as Bernie has been gaining steam you conveniently "move the goal post". I recall you're firewall being "oh, the race was close in Iowa because they are too white"
or
"the HRC lost Vermont because Sanders is from the state next door, besides the race doesn't REALLY start until South Carolina because it is more diverse"
You say this when over 50% of SC Dem voters are BLACK and the POTUS demographics are only like 11% Black.
Same for Vegas.
Not to mention if you dig deeper in SC demographics they are no way representative of the entirety of the US with their level of education, amount of religion in their lives, or even their deeply conservative (whites and blacks alike) southern ways

At first you say Trump doesn't have a chance now you are saying the "Repugs" have lost it and Trump WILL BE the RNC nominee.

You are just saying whatever the pundits on TV say

You want to throw out 538 as if they are the gold standard when even THEY aren't even predicting this

You sulk when HRC loses a state but you gloat when she wins.

You even said Nevada have been historically HORRIBLE at caucusing but this is only their SECOND go at this.

You talk down to people like most of us have not lived through Bush 1, Clinton twice, Bush 2 twice and the Obama campaigns.
As if you're some wise sage bestowing your knowledge of the political process on us.
You know noting more than we know by watching TV and reading HuffPost and Politico
You probably know even LESS than us that live in Red states (Texas) because we are IN the belly of the beast and know exactly what those that vote for Trump and Cruz IN THEIR HEARTS are thinking.

This is rather long and quite scathing but you needed to be brought down several notches from your high horse.

You're disparaging Denny with his Rob Ford comparison but what he said (and you refuted) is EXACTLY HAPPENING


You're not even sure HRC is going to get the DNC nomination
Every political thread you preach doom and gloom if HRC doesn't get the nod.
You talk about supreme court justices and VPs
I'd bet 98% of the voting public can't even name ONE supreme court justice or who Al Gore's VP running mate was just a mere 16 years ago.

OK, I'm all over the place now but boy you doing too much.





>>There's been a couple arguments made amongst us over and
>over
>>again.
>>
>>One...that I was partially persuaded by....was that as
>>candidates dropped out Trump would sink. It's not happening.
>
>>And Rubio is gonna run out of money soon. The donations are
>>gonna stop coming in. I think the suggestions that Rubio
>will
>>run as Trump's VP are feasible.
>
>
>This ^^^^ premise was left at the door a minute ago,
>dog.....
>
>Trump will be the Republican nominee....I stopped thinking
>that Rubio had a chance when the early poll numbers for SC
>started coming out....Also, Rubio will not be Trump's VP pick.
>Trump just said that Rubio "may" be an illegal. Dude came out
>his mouth and said Rubio should not even be allowed to run for
>President because his folks are not American....
>
>It's highly unlikely...
>
>
>>Second....that Trump can never win the general election
>>because blacks and hispanics won't vote for him. We haven't
>>really explored this argument much....but I have to appeal
>>again to what I saw with Rob Ford because everyone in my
>city
>>(including myself) said the exact same thing. This is a guy
>>that publically used racial slurs over and over again. Yet
>>minorities STILL voted for him. Overwhelmingly so....against
>a
>>liberal, racially sensitive intellectual type.
>
>I just gave u the inside numbers....Remember, McCain and Mitt
>Romney didn't lose the election because they didn't get the
>minority vote. They didn't win because THEY DIDN'T GET ENOUGH
>OF THE MINORITY VOTE....
>
>U live in Canada right? Well, in the US its important to
>separate primaries from general elections...If u r getting 44
>percent of the Latino vote in a Republican primary, with just
>5000 Republican Latino voters vs. 16,000 Latinos voting for
>Democrats, u do the math...
>
>What Ford was able to do in Canada is moot. People who study
>the numbers r going by GENERAL ELECTION trends, ever changing
>American demographics (this is most important), and Republican
>hostility against minorities....
>
>We r not talking about a city like Toronto....We are talking
>about an entire country....Trump will def. be the Republican
>nominee. Anyone refuting this is not being honest with
>themselves....But that says more about the Repubs' angry white
>base than anything else...

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 07:00 AM

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332. "lol..."
In response to Reply # 330
Wed Feb-24-16 07:04 AM by murph71

          

>http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=4&topic_id=12842850&mesg_id=12842850
>
>
>I've watched you (and Hitokori, Big Reg, Mynorti, AstralBlack,
>amongst others) spout this and that about Donald Trump and how
>he is not really running, only wants to sell books, is
>"hurting his brand", only gets poor white uneducated trash
>votes, the list goes on.

>I've watched this for nearly a year now.


I stopped thinking this^^^^once Trump won the Evangelical vote....Other than that, I've taken glee in Trump destroying the Republican party....

>You yourself have been campaigning for HRC for quite some time
>and never gave Bernie a chance but as Bernie has been gaining
>steam you conveniently "move the goal post". I recall you're
>firewall being "oh, the race was close in Iowa because they
>are too white"

Actually this^^^is not true...

After the close Iowa vote and Bernie's win in NH I've stated that if Bernie wins in Nevada and SC it's over for Clinton....Well, Clinton won Nevada and it looks like she will win SC....And the reasons for that is obvious...And yes, it has to do with a more expansive demographic...Oh, and Clinton even beat Bernie with women in Nevada, an issue she had early on....


>or
>"the HRC lost Vermont because Sanders is from the state next
>door, besides the race doesn't REALLY start until South
>Carolina because it is more diverse"

How is this ^^^ wrong though?

>You say this when over 50% of SC Dem voters are BLACK and the
>POTUS demographics are only like 11% Black.
>Same for Vegas.


>Not to mention if you dig deeper in SC demographics they are
>no way representative of the entirety of the US with their
>level of education, amount of religion in their lives, or even
>their deeply conservative (whites and blacks alike) southern
>ways

I take it u r voting for Bernie, right?



>At first you say Trump doesn't have a chance now you are
>saying the "Repugs" have lost it and Trump WILL BE the RNC
>nominee.

Actually, I said Trump was dangerous after coming in 2nd in Iowa....He came in second in a state where home schoolers and Evangelicals rule. SECOND. After that, it was clear that Trump should be taken seriously....


>You are just saying whatever the pundits on TV say

>You want to throw out 538 as if they are the gold standard
>when even THEY aren't even predicting this

538 has Trump winning the nomination. I have no idea what u r going about...


>You sulk when HRC loses a state but you gloat when she wins.


U sound very angry...

>You even said Nevada have been historically HORRIBLE at
>caucusing but this is only their SECOND go at this.

Take it up with them and everyone else pointing out that Nevada was still getting the grasp of how to run a Caucus: http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2016/02/20/3751818/nevada-caucus-chaos/


>You talk down to people like most of us have not lived through
>Bush 1, Clinton twice, Bush 2 twice and the Obama campaigns.
>As if you're some wise sage bestowing your knowledge of the
>political process on us.

Nope...I'm all about the numbers....

>You know noting more than we know by watching TV and reading
>HuffPost and Politico
>You probably know even LESS than us that live in Red states
>(Texas) because we are IN the belly of the beast and know
>exactly what those that vote for Trump and Cruz IN THEIR
>HEARTS are thinking.

I'm from Illinois.....Hardly a blue state...Illinois has voted in Red Governors....

>This is rather long and quite scathing but you needed to be
>brought down several notches from your high horse.


U need to have some tea...

>You're disparaging Denny with his Rob Ford comparison but what
>he said (and you refuted) is EXACTLY HAPPENING

Disparaging? What the fuck r u talking about. I was very respectful to Denny. U can disagree with me all u want. I got no beef with that. But don't lie....

I skipped over the rest because it's obvious u r in your feelings...

Listen, I don't know who u r. I've never seen u on these boards before. U suddenly pop up and start reading folks like u know them...U DON'T KNOW A GOD DAMN THING ABOUT ME....

I'm a Democrat. I would be voting for Biden if he was running. But f it was decision of me voting for Bernie against a Trump, I'm going with Bernie...

All this to say...who the fuck r u?

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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maryhattalillamb
Member since May 27th 2006
149 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 07:16 AM

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334. "I forgot to add stop doing THIS^^^^^^^"
In response to Reply # 332


          

you use the Shift+6 too much
Over half your post are THIS^^^^^^ or just ^^^^^^




>I take it u r voting for Bernie, right?


See here. You just deflected.
Don't worry about who I'm voting for.
You just pop shhh like you know but you don't.
When you get called out, you deflect.
Typical male pattern.


>>At first you say Trump doesn't have a chance now you are
>>saying the "Repugs" have lost it and Trump WILL BE the RNC
>>nominee.
>
>Actually, I said Trump was dangerous after coming in 2nd in
>Iowa....He came in second in a state where home schoolers and
>Evangelicals rule. And he came is second. After that, it was
>clear that Trump should be taken seriously....


All of this happened within the last three WEEKS
After you have been shown 3 cards of the deck but two of those are aces, you have a great chance to know what Trump's hand will look like in the end.
You're not "predicting" anything but you want to seem like some wise sage.
Just stop.







>
>
>>You are just saying whatever the pundits on TV say
>
>>You want to throw out 538 as if they are the gold standard
>>when even THEY aren't even predicting this
>
>538 has Trump winning the nomination. I have no idea what u r
>going about...
>
>
>>You sulk when HRC loses a state but you gloat when she wins.
>
>
>U sound very angry...
>

Not really.
Don't post much but you sound like you want to "be right" and see like "you know it all" all the time.
I'm just pointing things out as a bystander.




>Listen, I don't know who u r. I've never seen u on these
>boards before. U suddenly pop up and start reading folks like
>u know them...U DON'T KNOW A GOD DAMN THING ABOUT ME....
>
>I'm a Democrat. I would be voting for Biden if he was running.
>But f it was decision of me voting for Bernie against a Trump,
>I'm going with Bernie...
>
>All this to say...who the fuck r u?


I read this board and others.
Very rarely post.
I really only come here for concert/music information.
I only know what I read form your posts and they are ALL HRC backing.
You've been called a Hillbot by your "friends" or I guess posters that know you very well above, so I'm not out of line thinking that about you.

You have over 500 posts about this election within the last six months so you don't think THAT is enough for some stranger to go off of?
You've never said anything 'nice' about any candidate except for HRC.
You say you're a Democrat but you preach the end of the world if Bernie is nominated he'd never have a chance at general election


Lastly, is it because I am a woman you are dismissing my remarks/comments?
I see why only like two women are here anymore.
I can read the posts and tell who are male/female and this is an "old boys club".

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 07:31 AM

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336. "RE: I forgot to add stop doing THIS^^^^^^^"
In response to Reply # 334


          



>Lastly, is it because I am a woman you are dismissing my
>remarks/comments?
>I see why only like two women are here anymore.
>I can read the posts and tell who are male/female and this is
>an "old boys club".


No....Anyone on this board knows I'm one of the most supportive of women on this board....

No...My dismissive tone is because u r an idiot who is trying to read people u don't really know...

Oh yeah.....^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I hope that helps....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
11281 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 07:40 AM

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338. "Just saying...."
In response to Reply # 336
Wed Feb-24-16 07:44 AM by denny

          

Murph's never disparaged me. It's always been a good conversation around here and I think it's silly for us to focus on 'I told you so' shit. Who cares? We're all worried about the same thing and ultimately on the same side....kicking around these convos is a benefit. I learn alot by coming here.

I find no use in pulling old threads to see who said what about when. I come here for the perspectives and debate. There's new territory to cover. Specifically, how trump will do with minorities during the general. Being accurate about past predictions has nothing to do with the current ones. So I'm not on board with what Mary's doing here or the tone of it.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 08:02 AM

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340. "RE: Just saying...."
In response to Reply # 338


          

>Murph's never disparaged me. It's always been a good
>conversation around here and I think it's silly for us to
>focus on 'I told you so' shit. Who cares? We're all worried
>about the same thing and ultimately on the same
>side....kicking around these convos is a benefit. I learn alot
>by coming here.
>
>I find no use in pulling old threads to see who said what
>about when. I come here for the perspectives and debate.
>There's new territory to cover. Specifically, how trump will
>do with minorities during the general. Being accurate about
>past predictions has nothing to do with the current ones. So
>I'm not on board with what Mary's doing here or the tone of
>it.

'Thank u Denny...

Politics is a crazy thing. It makes people say some pretty wild shit male or female...Hell, I've gone off the hinges a few times...

But it's best that other folks don't come on a board and start reading people like they know them just because they read 10 of their posts....

But yeah...we are all passionate on this board....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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maryhattalillamb
Member since May 27th 2006
149 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 08:26 AM

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343. "start reading people like they know them just because they read 10 of th..."
In response to Reply # 340
Wed Feb-24-16 08:28 AM by maryhattalillamb

          

I'm sorry but you have HUNDREDS probably even over one THOUSAND posts on this political season
In this post and that "don't look now but Donald Trump..." post you probably have 300 posts

There are ~700 posts total in both combined.
I'd be willing to bet you're at 40% of all of them

Again, you're not being very genuine here.

And "reading" you?
I'm merely showing you what you put out.
Would I be wrong to "read" ThaTruth on his misogynistic views?
You all do it.
I see/read it in his posts.

Again, a few times I've read where you had this "above it all" air about yourself regarding politics.

Post #242 in here is one of them...

"...We are not kids here. This is not a game. This is grown folks shit..."

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 08:35 AM

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346. "RE: start reading people like they know them just because they read 10 o..."
In response to Reply # 343
Wed Feb-24-16 08:37 AM by murph71

          

>I'm sorry but you have HUNDREDS probably even over one
>THOUSAND posts on this political season
>In this post and that "don't look now but Donald Trump..."
>post you probably have 300 posts


I don't know u...And I've only started engaging in discussion with u for less than two weeks...There's a reason why I 've never branded u...There's a reason why I never made disparaging remarks about your politics or jumped to conclusions...BECAUSE I'VE ONLY ENGAGED U ON ONE SUBJECT....I've offered several reasons why I THOUGHT u were voting for Bernie. But I've never boiled it down to one big point.


>There are ~700 posts total in both combined.
>I'd be willing to bet you're at 40% of all of them
>
>Again, you're not being very genuine here.
>
>And "reading" you?
>I'm merely showing you what you put out.
>Would I be wrong to "read" ThaTruth on his misogynistic
>views?
>You all do it.
>I see/read it in his posts.
>
>Again, a few times I've read where you had this "above it all"
>air about yourself regarding politics.
>
>Post #242 in here is one of them...
>
>"...We are not kids here. This is not a game. This is grown
>folks shit..."

U tried to stir up some shit about me being disparaging to Denny...Then u tried to act like I was some knuckle dragging misogynist because I disagreed with your political views...

U showed your hand. U can't keep pulling out quotes or links without presenting the broader picture....(that quote was from a back and forth with Vex)....

U seem more interested in trafficking in GOTCHA bullshit than having real debate. I've tried to be as respectful to u as possible...

Stop creating things that r not there....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79557 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 08:35 AM

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347. "nothing wrong with a little shit talkikng while politic(ing)"
In response to Reply # 343


          



****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
11281 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 08:49 AM

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351. "RE: start reading people like they know them just because they read 10 o..."
In response to Reply # 343
Wed Feb-24-16 08:50 AM by denny

          

You're probably right about us being a bit of a boys club. Guys who talk politics tend to sound like they're 'above it all' commonly. I'm sure some of my posts sound like that too sometimes.

Murph is a journalist and knows more about the nuts and bolts of the political process than the majority of us. That's probably why he's got so many posts....and I'm glad he does. We can disagree with him even though he has more familiarity with the process. Just so happens that this Trump phenomenon has duped alot of people who follow politics closely because it's so unprecedented. Sometimes familiarity with the norm can blind you to new things happening.

But you're attacking HIM instead of talking about the issues which I think is unfair. He is willing to respectfully debate with anyone about anything and he doesn't throw his journalist background in our face as a testimony to his side.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 09:00 AM

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354. "RE: start reading people like they know them just because they read 10 o..."
In response to Reply # 351
Wed Feb-24-16 09:13 AM by murph71

          

>You're probably right about us being a bit of a boys club.
>Guys who talk politics tend to sound like they're 'above it
>all' commonly. I'm sure some of my posts sound like that too
>sometimes.

>Murph is a journalist and knows more about the nuts and bolts
>of the political process than the majority of us. That's
>probably why he's got so many posts....and I'm glad he does.
>We can disagree with him even though he has more familiarity
>with the process. Just so happens that this Trump phenomenon
>has duped alot of people who follow politics closely because
>it's so unprecedented. Sometimes familiarity with the norm
>can blind you to new things happening.
>
>But you're attacking HIM instead of talking about the issues
>which I think is unfair. He is willing to respectfully debate
>with anyone about anything and he doesn't throw his journalist
>background in our face as a testimony to his side.


And this is all I'm saying......Do I come off as a know it all? Fuck yeah...lol

Do I have jokes for people on this board? Yep...

Do I disrespect folks who r respectful of me? No. I don't....And yeah, we should def. have more women on this board. But I'm not the one to be playing that MISOGYNIST tag-you're-it game. I'll let others speak on my behalf, though....

Also, I downplay my journalistic background because at the end of the day, while it helps, in this crazy ass election cycle that shit has often times had no impact...

Trump is about to win the GOP nomination. Just five months ago, I thought we were all being punked. I thought it was all a joke...

Well, that's not the case....Shit is real...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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maryhattalillamb
Member since May 27th 2006
149 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 06:58 AM

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331. "But that says more about the Repubs' angry white base than anything else..."
In response to Reply # 329


          

49% of Democrats are voting for a man talking about sending us into DEEP socialism.
Does he think he's going to get the votes of those that work in the industries that he plans on shutting down (health insurance, big banks/finance, etc)?

Another 49% of Democrats are voting for a woman who couldn't say with a straight face or answer directly that she won't lie to them and at the same time is refusing to release speeches that she gave to the very groups she's supposedly campaigning against (big banks).

That sums up 98% of the Democrat base.

There are angry voters on BOTH sides.
Voting with their hearts (religion) and pocketbooks, not mind.

If you think Trump won Nevada because of poor uneducated angry white racist voters, you need to do your homework again.
Trump won the Latino vote in Nevada
You tried to disparage that saying only 9% of those republicans caucusing in Nevada are Latino
but it still remains that Nevada has the HIGHEST percentage of undocumented Latinos living there
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-immigration-nevada-idUSKCN0J300H20141119

For Trump to even get more that 5% of the latino voting republicans is mindboggling.


Again, either you're being VERY disingenuous with your political discourse or you REALLY don't know what the hell you're talking about
But I see in all these political posts you have about 40% of all the replies so...

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 07:22 AM

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335. "RE: But that says more about the Repubs' angry white base than anything ..."
In response to Reply # 331
Wed Feb-24-16 07:33 AM by murph71

          

>49% of Democrats are voting for a man talking about sending
>us into DEEP socialism.
>Does he think he's going to get the votes of those that work
>in the industries that he plans on shutting down (health
>insurance, big banks/finance, etc)?


I've never disagreed with any of this^^^^

>Another 49% of Democrats are voting for a woman who couldn't
>say with a straight face or answer directly that she won't lie
>to them and at the same time is refusing to release speeches
>that she gave to the very groups she's supposedly campaigning
>against (big banks).

I think people vote for who they connect with and who they think will win a general election.... I think Clinton edges out Bernie because she (for a myriad of reasons) is courting a much older, more dependable and more diverse voting block.


>That sums up 98% of the Democrat base.
>
>There are angry voters on BOTH sides.
>Voting with their hearts (religion) and pocketbooks, not
>mind.

>If you think Trump won Nevada because of poor uneducated angry
>white racist voters, you need to do your homework again.
>Trump won the Latino vote in Nevada
>You tried to disparage that saying only 9% of those
>republicans caucusing in Nevada are Latino
>but it still remains that Nevada has the HIGHEST percentage of
>undocumented Latinos living there
>http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-immigration-nevada-idUSKCN0J300H20141119


I never said any of this^^^^^^U guys gotta stop doing this.. Maybe u r debating with too many people and conflating me with others. But I've said the same thing: Trump is winning over a mix of white, ANGRY voters, (yes...dumb) lower working class whites who blame their lack of jobs for Obama's policies and the Republican base who thinks the Repugs have used and abused them....

Also, My Latino comment? It was a comparison between Latinos voting for the Dem and Latinos voting for Repugs...In Nevada, it's being reported that over 16,000 Latino voters went for Sanders/Clinton. 5000 voted for the Repugs....


>For Trump to even get more that 5% of the latino voting
>republicans is mindboggling.

16,000 vs. 5000

>Again, either you're being VERY disingenuous with your
>political discourse or you REALLY don't know what the hell
>you're talking about

What r we arguing about here? That u think I'm being disingenuous because I think Clinton has the Demographic numbers on her side against Bernie?

That I think that in a general election against Trump that the sound bite of Trump calling Mexicans rapists and drug dealers won't get major replay in ads?

I take Trump very seriously...Angry white people should be taken very seriously. Angry whites dominate the Trump vote....

I just think that there is more of US then there is of them.....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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maryhattalillamb
Member since May 27th 2006
149 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 07:35 AM

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337. "A bit about me and MY vote..."
In response to Reply # 335


          

I'm unsure of whom I'm voting for but my vote went to Obama the last two elections.

My family is directly effected by the oil industry.
My husband is an attorney for O+G but was laid off last month because of the downturn.
My father and brothers engineers in the oil patch
Cousins who work in the oil field
A great number of them have been recently laid off
My family has oil and gas royalties from land we own.
The royaltes aren't much these days because of low oil/gas prices.

That Keystone Pipeline will be a real BOON for us.
More jobs to be had and maybe even raise the price of oil a bit to get my family back working.

A republican in office gives us a shot at the Keystone, both democrats said they'll keep it shut down.
How am I to vote?

I'm a nurse. My hourly rate (in some way) is based upon what insurance companies want to pay.
Bernie Sanders wants to kill all health insurance companies.
How am I to vote?

I'd LOVE to have a (Black) woman in the Oval Office but at THIS point in time I can't just throw my vote to ANYone right now.



Anywho, I come here to get y'alls POV
Yall seem to be Black and educated which is the polar opposite of what I read on other sites or even my daily dealings around Dallas.

But I know MANY blacks and latinos voting republican simply because we're in Texas and republicans are pro-oil



>>49% of Democrats are voting for a man talking about sending
>>us into DEEP socialism.
>>Does he think he's going to get the votes of those that work
>>in the industries that he plans on shutting down (health
>>insurance, big banks/finance, etc)?
>
>
>I've never disagreed with any of this^^^^
>
>>Another 49% of Democrats are voting for a woman who couldn't
>>say with a straight face or answer directly that she won't
>lie
>>to them and at the same time is refusing to release speeches
>>that she gave to the very groups she's supposedly
>campaigning
>>against (big banks).
>
>I think people vote for who they connect with and who they
>think will win a general election.... I think Clinton edges
>out Bernie because she (for a myriad of reasons) is courting a
>much older, more dependable and more diverse voting block.
>
>
>>That sums up 98% of the Democrat base.
>>
>>There are angry voters on BOTH sides.
>>Voting with their hearts (religion) and pocketbooks, not
>>mind.
>
>>If you think Trump won Nevada because of poor uneducated
>angry
>>white racist voters, you need to do your homework again.
>>Trump won the Latino vote in Nevada
>>You tried to disparage that saying only 9% of those
>>republicans caucusing in Nevada are Latino
>>but it still remains that Nevada has the HIGHEST percentage
>of
>>undocumented Latinos living there
>>http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-immigration-nevada-idUSKCN0J300H20141119
>
>
>I never said any of this^^^^^^U guys gotta stop doing this..
>Maybe u r debating with too many people and conflating me with
>others. But I've said the same thing: Trump is winning over a
>mix of white, ANGRY voters, lower working class whites who
>blame their lack of jobs for Obama's policies and the
>Republican base who thinks the Repugs have used and abused
>them....
>
>Also, My Latino comment? It was a comparison between Latinos
>voting for the Dem and Latinos voting for Repugs...In Nevada,
>it's being reported that over 16,000 Latino voters went for
>Sanders/Clinton. 5000 voted for the Repugs....
>
>
>>For Trump to even get more that 5% of the latino voting
>>republicans is mindboggling.
>
>16,000 vs. 5000
>
>>Again, either you're being VERY disingenuous with your
>>political discourse or you REALLY don't know what the hell
>>you're talking about
>
>What r we arguing about here? That u think I'm being
>disingenuous because I think Clinton has the Demographic
>numbers on her side against Bernie?
>
>That I think that in a general election against Trump that the
>sound bite of Trump calling Mexicans rapists and drug dealers
>won't get major replay in ads?
>
>I take Trump very seriously...Angry white people should be
>taken very seriously. Angry whites dominate the Trump
>vote....
>
>I just think that there is more of US then there is of
>them.....
>

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 07:56 AM

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339. "RE: A bit about me and MY vote..."
In response to Reply # 337


          

>I'm unsure of whom I'm voting for but my vote went to Obama
>the last two elections.
>
>My family is directly effected by the oil industry.
>My husband is an attorney for O+G but was laid off last month
>because of the downturn.
>My father and brothers engineers in the oil patch
>Cousins who work in the oil field
>A great number of them have been recently laid off
>My family has oil and gas royalties from land we own.
>The royaltes aren't much these days because of low oil/gas
>prices.

Does you fam live in Texas?


>That Keystone Pipeline will be a real BOON for us.
>More jobs to be had and maybe even raise the price of oil a
>bit to get my family back working.

Interesting...

>A republican in office gives us a shot at the Keystone, both
>democrats said they'll keep it shut down.
>How am I to vote?

Vote for your best interest.....


>I'm a nurse. My hourly rate (in some way) is based upon what
>insurance companies want to pay.
>Bernie Sanders wants to kill all health insurance companies.
>How am I to vote?

Interests....

>I'd LOVE to have a (Black) woman in the Oval Office but at
>THIS point in time I can't just throw my vote to ANYone right
>now.

>Anywho, I come here to get y'alls POV
>Yall seem to be Black and educated which is the polar opposite
>of what I read on other sites or even my daily dealings around
>Dallas.


True...

>But I know MANY blacks and latinos voting republican simply
>because we're in Texas and republicans are pro-oil

I know...it gets scary out here. I mean, I go to a lot of places when I travel. And I see A LOT of Trump bumper stickers and even some Ben Carson...

I just have to trust that the continuing trend of minorities voting less and less for Republicans will continue. I have t hope that the demographics will continue to go the opposite way...That's my hope, anyway...


>>>49% of Democrats are voting for a man talking about sending
>>>us into DEEP socialism.
>>>Does he think he's going to get the votes of those that
>work
>>>in the industries that he plans on shutting down (health
>>>insurance, big banks/finance, etc)?
>>
>>
>>I've never disagreed with any of this^^^^
>>
>>>Another 49% of Democrats are voting for a woman who
>couldn't
>>>say with a straight face or answer directly that she won't
>>lie
>>>to them and at the same time is refusing to release
>speeches
>>>that she gave to the very groups she's supposedly
>>campaigning
>>>against (big banks).


It's all going to sort itself out. I think Bernie has done something very important here. He's become the conscience of the Dem party....While I don't he will win, I'm happy that he is putting Clinton on blast to go further left....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
11281 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 08:14 AM

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341. "To get back on track."
In response to Reply # 327


          

This is why I think Trump will do better with minorities than we think in the general:

Firstly....he's not running against a minority like Mccain/Romney did. So not only will this result in more minorities going with Trump....it will lower the overall turnout for minority voters as well.

Secondly, there are 'strange bedfellow' issues like the ones Ford took advantage of. Homophobia, anti-abortion, islamophobia, anti-immigration works in some of the minority population.

Thirdly, like Ford...there will be an anti-establishment sentiment. People see Trump like an outlaw or an outsider. This can work with minorities. Also, going against Clinton makes this more acute than it would with Sanders. The more educated, the more experienced, the more intellectual his opponent....the more Trump/Ford tactics work. It's a big eff you to the system for people who feel disenfranchised (which is outlined in the article I provided)

I don't think he'll WIN the minority vote. But like you said....he just needs to do good enough to neutralize the lopsided vote that Obama got from minorities.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79557 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 08:25 AM

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342. "RE: To get back on track."
In response to Reply # 341
Wed Feb-24-16 08:30 AM by legsdiamond

          

>This is why I think Trump will do better with minorities than
>we think in the general:
>
>Firstly....he's not running against a minority like
>Mccain/Romney did. So not only will this result in more
>minorities going with Trump....it will lower the overall
>turnout for minority voters as well.

this is true...
>
>Secondly, there are 'strange bedfellow' issues like the ones
>Ford took advantage of. Homophobia, anti-abortion,
>islamophobia, anti-immigration works in some of the minority
>population.

this is false. Trump will get the white latino vote tho and that may be enough.
>
>Thirdly, like Ford...there will be an anti-establishment
>sentiment. People see Trump like an outlaw or an outsider.
>This can work with minorities. Also, going against Clinton
>makes this more acute than it would with Sanders. The more
>educated, the more experienced, the more intellectual his
>opponent....the more Trump/Ford tactics work. It's a big eff
>you to the system for people who feel disenfranchised (which
>is outlined in the article I provided)
>
>I don't think he'll WIN the minority vote. But like you
>said....he just needs to do good enough to neutralize the
>lopsided vote that Obama got from minorities.
>
>

this sounds much better than your previous post about Trump getting the minority vote. That isn't happening. What he will get tho is first time voters who think Obama stole the election and put our country on the wrong track.


****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 08:44 AM

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350. "RE: To get back on track."
In response to Reply # 342


          


>What he will get tho is first time voters who think Obama stole the
>election and put our country on the wrong track.



^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^(hi Mary...)

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
11281 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 09:03 AM

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355. "There's alot of pro-life blacks and hispanics."
In response to Reply # 342


          

I'd argue that Obama being the first black president over-rided an issue like that for alot of minority voters. It won't with Clinton.

And that's the same for alot of other issues. Gay marraige. Immigration.

I see it like this. There's a huge chunk of the population that vote by those social issues. Frankly, they tend to be uneducated and these are the issues they can UNDERSTAND. So within that demographic.....the hispanics and blacks over-rided those issues to vote for 'the first black president' while the whites voted Mccain/Romney. I'm suggesting that those minority voters will NOT over-ride those issues to vote for Hillary Clinton. So gay marraige, immigration and abortion will see a big chunk of minority voters swinging the other way and Trump can seize that.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79557 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 09:25 AM

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358. "hmmm... "
In response to Reply # 355


          

I think the bigger problem is the first time voter who went out and voted for Obama... those people aren't going to come out this time around.

as far as the Black voters who vote GOP based on abortion. Not enough to sway the election IMO. Older Black voters love the Clinton's and will vote for her in large numbers.

The youth and first time voters are the real problem. Especially when you add in the white first time voters who are rolling with Trump. You also have those conservative Latinos who swear they are white now who will vote for him because they hate illegals because they been here for a generation or did it the right way.

I think once Cruz drops out we will see a clearer picture. Will Rubio get all those voted or will they split or stay home?

I still think Rubio has a shot if he gets Cruz's voters.

Shit is crazy tho, I really underestimated the anger of the white voting block. Should have realized how angry they are when they kirked out over Beyonce.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
11281 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 09:39 AM

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361. "lol"
In response to Reply # 358


          

Seems like abusing prescription drugs, going on killing sprees and making memes about Kanye West has begun to grow tiresome. Trump better hurry before they all commit suicide.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 08:26 AM

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344. "RE: To get back on track."
In response to Reply # 341


          

>This is why I think Trump will do better with minorities than
>we think in the general:
>
>Firstly....he's not running against a minority like
>Mccain/Romney did. So not only will this result in more
>minorities going with Trump....it will lower the overall
>turnout for minority voters as well.

This is the best reasoning I can think of....U may be on to something...But....


>Secondly, there are 'strange bedfellow' issues like the ones
>Ford took advantage of. Homophobia, anti-abortion,
>islamophobia, anti-immigration works in some of the minority
>population.

Trump doesn't do homophobia...And his anti-abortion flip is viewed as a joke (He still says he supports Planned Parenthood...Repugs r willing to look the other way, though)

>Thirdly, like Ford...there will be an anti-establishment
>sentiment. People see Trump like an outlaw or an outsider.
>This can work with minorities. Also, going against Clinton
>makes this more acute than it would with Sanders. The more
>educated, the more experienced, the more intellectual his
>opponent....the more Trump/Ford tactics work. It's a big eff
>you to the system for people who feel disenfranchised (which
>is outlined in the article I provided)
>
>I don't think he'll WIN the minority vote. But like you
>said....he just needs to do good enough to neutralize the
>lopsided vote that Obama got from minorities.


I think it really comes down to this: Trump would have to equal W. Bush's minority totals to win...And that's very unlikely given that W. made it a point to OPENLY court Latinos and present a not so negative Immigration reform...He also courted Black evangelics and black churches. Trump won't be able to set foot in a reputable black church...lol

I "HOPE" that the numbers will continue to be on our side...The numbers r all I got...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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maryhattalillamb
Member since May 27th 2006
149 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 08:31 AM

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345. "Trump was able to meet with "100" Black pastors"
In response to Reply # 344


          

> Trump won't be
>able to set foot in a reputable black church...lol

http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/28/politics/black-religious-leaders-donald-trump-endorsement/


Again, money talks
You've been wrong too many times in the last six months for someone to trust your judgement.
Even though Trump didn't get "endorsed" by these Black pastors, wait until his money/connections start flowing.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79557 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 08:39 AM

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348. "LMAO, that meeting was cancelled... "
In response to Reply # 345


          

please stop embarrassing yourself.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 08:51 AM

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353. "RE: LMAO, that meeting was cancelled... "
In response to Reply # 348


          



Straight trolling......That's the feeling I'm getting here....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79557 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 09:14 AM

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356. "nah, this is the mind of the low info voter "
In response to Reply # 353


          

no snark either, it's how voters who peak in for a day or two and then take a month off and circle back view politics...

lmao at her Trump card...

100 black pastors bruh... what, WHAAAAAT!!!

I have a feeling she won't be back for another month or 2.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 09:22 AM

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357. "RE: nah, this is the mind of the low info voter "
In response to Reply # 356
Wed Feb-24-16 09:25 AM by murph71

          

>no snark either, it's how voters who peak in for a day or two
>and then take a month off and circle back view politics...
>
>lmao at her Trump card...
>
>100 black pastors bruh... what, WHAAAAAT!!!
>
>I have a feeling she won't be back for another month or 2.


Nah...she's def NOT low info...She knows the issues....She's just mad and trolling...

I welcome her back though. It's a free country....

I got no beef other than she took the lazy route and dropped bombs instead of trying to have a level headed discussion. The homie Goldie (Taylor) who has been going at it with Bernie supporters on Twitter, she warned that this was going to happen.

Hill-bots can be assholes...But u know what's worst than being an asshole? Lashing out at folks because u think your candidate has a losing hand....The irony is it's still early. ANYTHING can happen...Hell, Hill Dawg can get in even more hot water with this email/FBI mess....

We all need to just calm the fuck down...lol

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 08:41 AM

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349. "RE: Trump was able to meet with &quot;100&quot; Black pastors"
In response to Reply # 345
Wed Feb-24-16 08:43 AM by murph71

          

>> Trump won't be
>>able to set foot in a reputable black church...lol
>
>http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/28/politics/black-religious-leaders-donald-trump-endorsement/

Yeah...But u missed the punchline to that story....

http://www.newsday.com/news/nation/donald-trump-s-endorsement-by-100-black-ministers-fizzles-1.11173860

I'm kind of giving u the side-eye right now...Like seriously....What's going on here? Are u trolling?

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79557 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 08:50 AM

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352. "chill out with the misogyny"
In response to Reply # 349


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
11281 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 09:25 AM

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359. "Trump will be against gay marraige."
In response to Reply # 344


          

Not a doubt in my mind. He'll say he changed his mind if he has to.

It doesn't matter that he flip-flopped on abortion. This particular demographic (defined by people who vote on social issues) doesn't care about consistency of actual views/content.....they care about consistency in the presentation.

A little off-topic....So I think it's almost irrelevant to point out how Trump said this or said that in the past. For the people who support him....it's absolutely irrelevant. He can't be beat that way. And TRYING to beat him like that just draws you into his trap. Like George Bush. I see Hillary doing that too. She's going to be unlikeable while attacking him. She's also gonna look ridiculous. It's like trying to reason with a 5 year old. By engaging in it you come off as unlikeable and it won't matter that she's actually 'right'. That's how he appeals to the anti-intellectuals.

The only way to beat him is to create a presentation that is likeable when attacking him. We both know I'm a bernie supporter.....but I can say objectively, that Bernie has a much better chance of solving the enigma. How do you attack someone like that? I think you have to be funny. It's easy to be right against Trump....but you need to be likeable in the demonstration. This is gonna be a war of personality. Just happens to be Clinton's weakness.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 09:32 AM

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360. "RE: Trump will be against gay marraige."
In response to Reply # 359
Wed Feb-24-16 09:33 AM by murph71

          


I don't think any of this^^^^matters though...

The only thing that matters with Trump is his anti-immigration stance and JOBS-CREATOR tag....They don't care about the culture war shit....

Angry white folks think that they haven't gotten a fair shake under the 1st black President...That's really all it is....

Gay marriage, religion, tea-party philosophy, hardcore Conservatism...All that shit is moot now....Racist white folk and working class white folks HATE the Republican party. The base is revolting. But I don't think they have enough numbers on their side...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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denny
Member since Apr 11th 2008
11281 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 09:53 AM

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362. "What about my point about Hillary's personality?"
In response to Reply # 360
Wed Feb-24-16 10:04 AM by denny

          

You saw what happened to Jeb Bush. I mean, if one actually read a transcript and followed the logic.....Jeb was absolutely correct in everything he said. But he was throttled. I've never seen anything like that. How could Jeb have lost SO BAD (like historically bad) while being SO RIGHT?!?!

That's what I find scary. Like genuinely creepy with goosebumps and the like. How do you beat someone in a debate if being right doesn't matter?

You have to win people's love. And again with the Rob Ford comparison....his opponent was an artsy, harvard-education intellectual. From that pattern I can derive......the uneducated demographic will feel like Hillary is calling them stupid while she legitimately wins the debate. The more thoroughly she wins the debate...the more victimized the uneducated will FEEL. Trump knows this. He will bait her into intellectually bullying him and win people's hearts while losing the content of the talking points. It's a self-defeating position. What she will be TRYING to do will actually work against her.

And a last thing that I've mentioned in earlier posts....Trump can do no wrong. He can't HAVE a scandal. He said himself....he could shoot someone on the street in broad daylight and still do well in the polls. He does this by NEVER playing defence. Hillary will pay the normal, established price for any slip of the tongue....any flip-flopping....any skeleton in the closet that might emerge. Trump is immune to those things.

I feel like this is how crazy notorious world leaders emerge and we're witnessing it right in front of our eyes. It's so fucking scary.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 10:12 AM

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364. "RE: What about my point about Hillary's personality?"
In response to Reply # 362


          



I don't think that's going to be enough to make more voters come out...White people already freaked out when the black guy was running for President....That's as hot blooded as it will get even with the WILD hatred the Right has for Clinton...

I think the only thing people should be worried about with Clinton is this email flap...I'm spooked on that with the FBI sniffing around....

But I'm willing to roll the dice on Hillary Clinton more than I am Bernie....I would vote for both though...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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LAbeathustla
Member since Jan 24th 2004
33858 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 10:04 AM

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363. "Cuh..there aint enough cracka ass crackas in the US to give Trump "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

the general....he wouldnt only need ALLL the crackass cracka votes..but hed need some SANE white people to vote for him too..along with dam near ALL the messicans and All the blacks...im not worried one bit about him being president...i just love sitting back watching and the RNC is basically a shell of their former selves..This is really the dem nominee vs the Tea Party......and the tea party aint winning no presidency..

------------------------------------
2019 CABG Survivor

2016 OK Survivor Champion

be about it or be without it

RIP GOATs

  

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Red07
Member since Oct 19th 2005
482 posts
Wed Feb-24-16 12:16 PM

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366. "RE: Cuh..there aint enough cracka ass crackas in the US to give Trump "
In response to Reply # 363


          

and not enough fired up folks for HRC either..I'd say Trump has advantage in General Election...People do not want a 3rd Obama term, period!!! Only if you live on the left or right coasts does she matter..

  

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