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Subject: "Encouraging Suicide: Criminal Conduct or Just a Dick Move? (swipe)" Previous topic | Next topic
veritas
Member since Sep 16th 2002
37201 posts
Mon Aug-31-15 06:32 PM

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"Encouraging Suicide: Criminal Conduct or Just a Dick Move? (swipe)"


          

Interesting case here.
This girl is obviously terrible, and I don't think anyone would dispute that.

But should she be tried for manslaughter? Should she be tried for any crime?

I'm not sure.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/08/31/its-now-or-never-texts-reveal-teens-efforts-to-pressure-boyfriend-into-suicide/?tid=sm_fb

‘It’s now or never': Texts reveal teen’s efforts to pressure boyfriend into suicide

By Abby Phillip August 31 at 2:45 PM

Michelle Carter listens to defense attorney Joseph P. Cataldo argue for the involuntary manslaughter charge against her to be dismissed, citing five separate arguments at Juvenile Court in New Bedford, Mass., on Aug. 24. (Peter Pereira/The New Bedford Standard Times via AP)

Michelle Carter knew that if anyone found her text messages to her boyfriend Conrad Roy III, she might go to jail.

“ read my messages with him I’m done. His family will hate me and I can go to jail,” Carter texted a friend after her 18-year-old boyfriend used a gas-powered water pump to commit suicide in the parking lot of a KMart.

Carter had asked Roy in a text message to delete her messages before he carried out the suicide last summer, but investigators found them anyway.

According to prosecutors, Carter pressured her boyfriend to go through with suicide for almost a week before he carried out the act. She counseled him to overcome his fears; researched methods of committing suicide painlessly; and lied to police, his family and her friends about his whereabouts during the act itself and after, prosecutors said.

Carter, who was 17 at the time of Roy’s death, now faces manslaughter charges in juvenile court in Massachusetts.

Her attorney argues, however, that the charges should be dropped because Carter’s messages are protected by free speech. According to attorney Joseph P. Cataldo, Carter was “brainwashed” into supporting Roy’s plan for suicide.

“He ultimately persuaded a young, impressionable girl,” Caldato told reporters, according to South Coast Today. “Eventually he gets her to endorse his plan.”

But in an indictment released Friday, prosecutors outlined in nauseating detail the extent of Carter’s alleged role in helping Roy overcome his doubts about suicide.

For more than a week in July 2014, Carter and Roy exchanged hundreds of messages in which Carter insisted that Roy would be better off dead.

“You’re finally going to be happy in heaven. No more pain,” she told him in one message. “It’s okay to be scared and it’s normal. I mean, you’re about to die.”

According to prosecutors, the two had struck up a romantic relationship — mostly online — in 2012. Her lawyer says they had only met a few times in person over the course of two years prior to Roy’s death.

Roy had a history of depression and had attempted suicide in the past, but his family was hopeful that he would get through it.

“He seemed to be pulling out of it,” his grandmother Janice Roy told WBZ.

Text messages recovered by police, however, suggest that by 2014, Carter had gotten tired of Roy’s idle talk of suicide and she wanted him to go through with it — now.

“You always say you’re gonna do it, but you never do,” Carter complained. “I just want to make sure tonight is the real thing.”

Another time, she texted: “You can’t keep pushing it off, though. That’s all you keep doing.”

Carter was insistent, even when Roy steered the topic to other things:

ROY: How was your day?

CARTER: When are you doing it?

Roy said he was having a good day, but Carter wasn’t satisfied.

CARTER: Really?

ROY: Yes.

CARTER: That’s great. What did you do?

ROY: Ended up going to work for a little bit and then just looked stuff up.

CARTER: When are you gonna do it? Stop ignoring the question???

Roy had doubts, and he was scared, according to his texts. What if it didn’t work and he ended up injured for the rest of his life? How would his family cope with the loss?

Carter had answers.

He would be her guardian angel in heaven.

She would comfort his family and they would move on.

If he followed the directions he had found online for killing himself with carbon monoxide, it would “100 percent work,” she said.

“There isn’t anything anyone can do to save you, not even yourself,” she told him.

But committing suicide would require tools. Roy thought about using a tube to channel the exhaust from his truck’s tailpipe into the vehicle but realized that the diesel engine emitted lower levels of carbon monoxide that might make failure more likely.


Carter was confident that it would work and told him why.

“If you emit 3200 ppm of it for five or ten minutes, you will die within a half hour,” she told him. “You lose consciousness with no pain. You just fall asleep and die.”

But Carter didn’t love that idea, either, because she feared that Roy would make up an “excuse” to explain why it didn’t work.

“I bet you’re gonna be like ‘oh, it didn’t work because I didn’t tape the tube right or something like that,'” she texted him “You always seem to have an excuse.”

When Roy decided to use a generator instead, Carter was impatient.

“Do you have the generator?” she asked him.

“Not yet LOL,” he replied.

“WELL WHEN ARE YOU GETTING IT?” she wrote.

Eventually, Roy did find a generator — his father’s — but it was broken. Carter told him to take it to Sears for repairs.

And if Roy couldn’t find a way to use carbon monoxide, Carter suggested alternatives: “I’d try the bag or hanging,” she told him. “Hanging is painless and take like a second if you do it right.”

The day of Roy’s death — July 12, 2014 — he and Carter exchanged texts in the early morning hours.

“You can’t think about it. You just have to do it,” Carter said, telling him she didn’t understand why he was hesitating.

“I’m gonna eventually,” he replied. “I really don’t know what I’m waiting for but I have everything lined up.”

She suggested that he take Benadryl to fall asleep and allow the fumes to work.

She worried that he wouldn’t go through with it because the sun would soon be coming up.

She suggested that he go to an empty parking lot.

They texted throughout the day about the plans, about Roy’s doubts, and about Carter’s insistence that “the time is right” and that he was ready.

At the same time, Carter appeared to be preparing her friends and Roy’s relatives for his eventual death. Days before his suicide, Carter texted a friend named Samantha and claimed that Roy was missing — though she was communicating with him at exactly the same time about how to fix his father’s broken generator.

The day before his death, she told her friend: “I’m thankful that our last words were I love you.”

At some point on the night of July 12, Roy went through with the suicide, using a gas-powered water pump. He died of carbon monoxide poisoning inside the cab of his pickup truck.

While he was in the truck with the pump running, he was on the phone texting and talking with Carter, she told her friend.

“Like, honestly I could have stopped it,” Carter texted Samantha months later. “I was on the phone with him and he got out of the car” because the carbon monoxide was working, she said. She added that she “told him to get back in.”

Roy’s body was found by police on the morning of July 13.

A judge will now decide whether Carter will face charges in his death. She will appear in court again on Oct. 2.

After his death, Carter became a self-proclaimed advocate for mental health.

She organized a fundraising tournament in Roy’s memory and posted on Facebook and Twitter about her attempts to save her boyfriend’s life.

“Even though I could not save my boyfriend’s life, I want to put myself out here to try to save as many other lives as possible,” she wrote on Facebook.

i still blame hip-hop.

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
Of course she needs to pay for her crime.
Aug 31st 2015
1
Dick Move? nope, sociopath behavior
Aug 31st 2015
2
Potato/potato
Aug 31st 2015
7
She went beyond the pale.
Aug 31st 2015
3
Charged or not, she has to be removed from society....
Aug 31st 2015
4
Real interesting case. I don't think she should be charged with anything...
Aug 31st 2015
5
I'm struggling to find a crime of which I'd feel comfortable convicting ...
Aug 31st 2015
8
      Hrm if someone texts someone instructions on how
Aug 31st 2015
12
      conspiracy
Aug 31st 2015
15
           ^ Harassment is fitting here.
Aug 31st 2015
16
                yeah, i'll give you that. esp. with a reasonable person standard.
Aug 31st 2015
18
Let's go inside the hearts of men
Aug 31st 2015
6
Definite sociopath/psychopath
Aug 31st 2015
9
Kids really want to be famous so bad it's sick.
Aug 31st 2015
10
Infamy is what's in store for her.
Aug 31st 2015
13
looking forward to the ripped from the headlines SVU episode
Aug 31st 2015
11
If I incite someone to off someone else can I be charged with something?
Aug 31st 2015
14
holla at Brandenburg
Aug 31st 2015
17
      RE: holla at Brandenburg
Aug 31st 2015
21
      I read this in Sarah Palin's voice.
Aug 31st 2015
22
      well her intent was for him die...
Sep 01st 2015
33
           this is a big part of why it's so interesting. She clearly had a crimina...
Sep 01st 2015
38
           The defense would have to argue that...
Sep 01st 2015
57
      Admittedly my legal experience is commercial and Kiwi in jurisdiction bu...
Sep 01st 2015
25
           short answer: I'm not sure
Sep 01st 2015
29
she was focused... but I think she walks
Aug 31st 2015
19
Charles Manson never actually killed anybody.
Aug 31st 2015
20
oh yea her ass need to be locked up
Aug 31st 2015
23
not sure if this is relevant -
Aug 31st 2015
24
Can we juxtapose this with Dr. Kevorkian's case
Sep 01st 2015
26
Kevorkian made overt acts to assist suicide, she only encouraged w words
Sep 01st 2015
28
This is why the legal system is seriously flawed
Sep 01st 2015
27
JUST DO IT!
Sep 01st 2015
30
questioning if conduct meets the element of a crime isn't looking for a ...
Sep 01st 2015
31
      I don't hate lawyers
Sep 01st 2015
37
is it a crime i'm on the fence on that
Sep 01st 2015
32
This is disturbing on so many levels...
Sep 01st 2015
34
does Massachusetts have an anti-bullying law? Honest question
Sep 01st 2015
36
      i honestly don't have a clue...
Sep 01st 2015
40
man, wtf. that chick crazy af.
Sep 01st 2015
35
shes evil. simple and plain.
Sep 01st 2015
39
omg. the more I read about this situation the more psycho the girlfriend...
Sep 01st 2015
41
I googled her name and facebook, then clicked images... smh.
Sep 01st 2015
42
Brady lawyers would have those texts looking so innocuous
Sep 01st 2015
43
http://media.masslive.com/breakingnews/photo/2015/08/24/michelle-carter-...
Sep 01st 2015
44
she could have ended suicide for one guy tho
Sep 01st 2015
45
"I will never understand why this had to happen" © Michelle Carter
Sep 01st 2015
46
fucking psycho
Sep 01st 2015
47
      seems like she wanted attention/people to feel sorry for her.
Sep 01st 2015
48
Yooo she look like Chucky and Wednesday Addams had a daughter!!
Sep 01st 2015
60
okp's encourage suicide regularly. all the 'go kill yourself' reply's ar...
Sep 01st 2015
49
while i don't condone people that say that on here
Sep 01st 2015
50
      I get that but still, someone who is down doesn't need to here that at a...
Sep 01st 2015
51
           who are these same OKPs? call them out...
Sep 01st 2015
54
                I remember ColdTruth saying it and then months later he had a post about
Sep 01st 2015
56
                     its not the same thing
Sep 01st 2015
58
RE: Encouraging Suicide: Criminal Conduct or Just a Dick Move? (swipe)
Sep 01st 2015
52
Wayment "gas powered water pump" ???
Sep 01st 2015
53
the water pump pumped carbon monoxide into his car...
Sep 01st 2015
55
      pretty sure he is aware of how it the method works...
Sep 01st 2015
59

Kira
Member since Nov 14th 2004
28833 posts
Mon Aug-31-15 06:42 PM

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1. "Of course she needs to pay for her crime."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

If this was another person that encouraged someone to commit sucide and assisted them properly no one would raise a fuss over this. The fact she tried to cover this up is proof she knew the ramifications of her actions.

Hopefully the system does its job and brings justice to this unfortunate young man's family.

  

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eclipsedInI
Member since Jul 29th 2002
92867 posts
Mon Aug-31-15 06:52 PM

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2. " Dick Move? nope, sociopath behavior"
In response to Reply # 0


          

_____________________
puttin' the roota in the toota since 98'

  

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veritas
Member since Sep 16th 2002
37201 posts
Mon Aug-31-15 08:16 PM

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7. "Potato/potato"
In response to Reply # 2


          

i still blame hip-hop.

  

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mrhood75
Member since Dec 06th 2004
44688 posts
Mon Aug-31-15 07:03 PM

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3. "She went beyond the pale."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

When I first heard about the story, I had figured it was some type of thing where he was determined to kill himself and she was telling him, "Okay, if you have to, just end your pain."

But after reading the articles it seems it was much more like -

Him: How are you doing today?

Her: Have you killed yourself yet?

Him: No, I think I'm feeling better about myself today.

Her: That'll pass. Go ahead and kill yourself. It's for your own good.




So, yeah, prosecute her.

-----------------

www.albumism.com

Checkin' Our Style, Return To Zero:

https://www.mixcloud.com/returntozero/

  

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Sarah_Bellum
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Mon Aug-31-15 07:25 PM

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4. "Charged or not, she has to be removed from society...."
In response to Reply # 0
Mon Aug-31-15 07:26 PM by Sarah_Bellum

  

          

If I were her parents I wouldn't be able to sleep with both eyes closed.
___________________________________________________________


DJTB YOMM

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
15893 posts
Mon Aug-31-15 08:00 PM

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5. "Real interesting case. I don't think she should be charged with anything..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

Ultimately he did it to himself. Yes, she was encouraging him (persistently) to kill himself.
But she didn't have a direct hand in his death.

Who is to say he wouldn't have done it without her encouragement? It's obvious that he was suicidal to begin with.



_______________________________________

  

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veritas
Member since Sep 16th 2002
37201 posts
Mon Aug-31-15 09:26 PM

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8. "I'm struggling to find a crime of which I'd feel comfortable convicting ..."
In response to Reply # 5


          

I wouldn't want to defend her either though really

i still blame hip-hop.

  

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ndibs
Member since Aug 06th 2012
12715 posts
Mon Aug-31-15 10:30 PM

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12. "Hrm if someone texts someone instructions on how "
In response to Reply # 8


          

To hack a bank and or how to breach security to get into a bank and rob it physically I think they will get charged.

Or if someone asks someone to kill someone and that person is impressionable enough to do it, the person who asked will get charged even they didn't physically do it themselves.

So I think manslaughter is correct.

  

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MiracleRic
Member since Oct 21st 2002
45200 posts
Mon Aug-31-15 10:46 PM

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15. "conspiracy"
In response to Reply # 8


  

          

suicide is considered a crime...

this is basically harassment-themed assisted suicide

im sure they can think of something...

criminally negligent fuckery

Let me sport my Air Hyperbole 2010s in peace. (c) ansomble

Building repetoires (c) spm since 1983

  

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Moonlit_Force
Member since Oct 10th 2005
8643 posts
Mon Aug-31-15 10:48 PM

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16. "^ Harassment is fitting here."
In response to Reply # 15


  

          

  

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veritas
Member since Sep 16th 2002
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Mon Aug-31-15 10:55 PM

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18. "yeah, i'll give you that. esp. with a reasonable person standard."
In response to Reply # 16


          

Section 43A. (a) Whoever willfully and maliciously engages in a knowing pattern of conduct or series of acts over a period of time directed at a specific person, which seriously alarms that person and would cause a reasonable person to suffer substantial emotional distress, shall be guilty of the crime of criminal harassment and shall be punished by imprisonment in a house of correction for not more than 21/2 years or by a fine of not more than $1,000, or by both such fine and imprisonment. The conduct or acts described in this paragraph shall include, but not be limited to, conduct or acts conducted by mail or by use of a telephonic or telecommunication device or electronic communication device including, but not limited to, any device that transfers signs, signals, writing, images, sounds, data or intelligence of any nature transmitted in whole or in part by a wire, radio, electromagnetic, photo-electronic or photo-optical system, including, but not limited to, electronic mail, internet communications, instant messages or facsimile communications.

i still blame hip-hop.

  

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csuave03
Member since May 20th 2007
3067 posts
Mon Aug-31-15 08:04 PM

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6. "Let's go inside the hearts of men"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

*shrug*

  

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Moonlit_Force
Member since Oct 10th 2005
8643 posts
Mon Aug-31-15 10:01 PM

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9. "Definite sociopath/psychopath"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I can't imagine some of the conversations she must have had with this
guy's friends and family in order to organize that fundraising event.
Imagine the amount of false consolation she gave to genuinely bereaved
people. Imagine the amount of solace people offered her!

They must be sick to their stomachs. Shit, I am.

  

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ndibs
Member since Aug 06th 2012
12715 posts
Mon Aug-31-15 10:22 PM

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10. "Kids really want to be famous so bad it's sick. "
In response to Reply # 0


          

She had the whole fundraising/advocate thing lined up.

All he had to do was die.

  

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Moonlit_Force
Member since Oct 10th 2005
8643 posts
Mon Aug-31-15 10:35 PM

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13. "Infamy is what's in store for her."
In response to Reply # 10


  

          

She should be ostracized the same way convicted sexual offenders are.
Her neighbors, potential employers... hell, her local grocery store baggers
need to know who they're dealing with.

  

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dba_BAD
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Mon Aug-31-15 10:26 PM

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11. "looking forward to the ripped from the headlines SVU episode"
In response to Reply # 0


          

n/m

__

fairweather

  

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Ted Gee Seal
Member since Apr 18th 2007
10091 posts
Mon Aug-31-15 10:36 PM

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14. "If I incite someone to off someone else can I be charged with something?"
In response to Reply # 0
Mon Aug-31-15 10:37 PM by Ted Gee Seal

  

          

Let's remove hate crimes from this equation for the moment.

Just IMO though.

  

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veritas
Member since Sep 16th 2002
37201 posts
Mon Aug-31-15 10:53 PM

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17. "holla at Brandenburg"
In response to Reply # 14


          

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imminent_lawless_action

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brandenburg_v._Ohio

I think there's a relatively strong argument that this girl's speech was intended to incite imminent lawless action, but that only means it's not protected by the First Amendment. So maybe we don't have protected speech here, but what crime have we committed?

Massachusetts statutory law does not define voluntary manslaughter. Rather, Massachusetts common law, as announced by the courts, provides a definition for manslaughter:
The unlawful killing of another, intentionally caused from a sudden transport of passion or heat of blood:
(1) upon a reasonable provocation and without malice or upon sudden combat; or
(2) from the excessive use of force in self-defense.

As with voluntary manslaughter Massachusetts statutory law does not define involuntary manslaughter. Rather, Massachusetts common law, as pronounced by the courts, provides the definition for involuntary manslaughter:
One can commit involuntary manslaughter through:
(1) an unintentional killing occasioned by an act which constitutes such a disregard of the probable harmful consequences to another as to be wanton or reckless; or
(2) an unintentional killing resulting from a battery.

Based on a quick google of what constitutes manslaughter in Mass, I don't think we have manslaughter. At best you can maybe argue the first point of involuntary manslaughter, but then you have to make text communication not just unprotected speech, but an act, AND an act that was in disregard of PROBABLE harmful consequences. I don't see it.

i still blame hip-hop.

  

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ndibs
Member since Aug 06th 2012
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Mon Aug-31-15 11:06 PM

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21. "RE: holla at Brandenburg"
In response to Reply # 17


          

Second part 1

Unless she gets up on the stand and says she intended for him to die.

Mrs sociopath did you mean for your bf to die?

Yes - automatic conviction

No - fits the statute

Maybe she doesn't take the stand. But her lawyers going to have to argue that the her motive and intention was for him to die.

  

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veritas
Member since Sep 16th 2002
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Mon Aug-31-15 11:14 PM

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22. "I read this in Sarah Palin's voice."
In response to Reply # 21


          

i still blame hip-hop.

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
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Tue Sep-01-15 08:57 AM

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33. "well her intent was for him die..."
In response to Reply # 21


  

          

the day he killed himself during the process, he got out of the car and she was on the phone like "get back in the car and do it." then she stayed on the phone with him until he did it. as soon as he was done, she text her friend saying "i think he killed himself." her intent was well known, which is why she erased all of her text messages to him and asked him to delete hers to him.

  

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veritas
Member since Sep 16th 2002
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Tue Sep-01-15 09:10 AM

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38. "this is a big part of why it's so interesting. She clearly had a crimina..."
In response to Reply # 33


          

Of mind.

But did she commit any criminal act?

i still blame hip-hop.

  

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ndibs
Member since Aug 06th 2012
12715 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 04:09 PM

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57. "The defense would have to argue that..."
In response to Reply # 33


          

And that's not really a defense.

Nor can anyone read her mind and really know.

  

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Ted Gee Seal
Member since Apr 18th 2007
10091 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 01:40 AM

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25. "Admittedly my legal experience is commercial and Kiwi in jurisdiction bu..."
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

While I admit I am besides the point (potentially) re: manslaughter, my question was if I could be charged with something if I incited someone to off someone else.

OK. So, maybe manslaughter wouldn't fit. But to get legal, that doesn't cover my question. Is there something I could be charged for if I incited someone to kill someone else sans something hate crime related and (adding this now) payment.

But. Just bullshitting out loud, if I pay someone to kill someone else I would get done (I assume). Take away the money and leave the instruction, surely I still get done (I assume) given what can happen in organised crime. So now we're left with the distinction between killing someone else and getting someone to kill themselves. I'm assuming again, though, that if I incited some kind of kill yourself death cult that the authorities would find some way to charge me if the body count was high enough. So, my question remains, is there some way the authorities could get at me, whether or not manslaughter is relevant?

Just IMO though.

  

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veritas
Member since Sep 16th 2002
37201 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 08:10 AM

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29. "short answer: I'm not sure"
In response to Reply # 25


          

I think it would have to be a specific Massachusetts statute, and I'm no expert on Mass law.

i still blame hip-hop.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79349 posts
Mon Aug-31-15 11:02 PM

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19. "she was focused... but I think she walks"
In response to Reply # 0


          

She also has a big head

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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FrankEinstein
Member since Dec 03rd 2003
3758 posts
Mon Aug-31-15 11:05 PM

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20. "Charles Manson never actually killed anybody."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

That we know of, at least. And he ain't never getting out.

  

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wluv
Member since Jan 27th 2003
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Mon Aug-31-15 11:14 PM

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23. "oh yea her ass need to be locked up"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

she anxiously orchestrated that shit right up to telling him to get back into the truck to finish the job.

cant be more blatantly abetting than that.

  

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cgonz00cc
Member since Aug 01st 2002
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Mon Aug-31-15 11:33 PM

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24. "not sure if this is relevant -"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

But according to the DSM he had Suicidal Behavior Disorder, a medically defined mental illness

He wasnt in his right mind, and not capable of responding rationally to her messages

WHAT A TIME TO BE ALIVE

  

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DaHeathenOne76
Member since May 11th 2003
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Tue Sep-01-15 07:22 AM

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26. "Can we juxtapose this with Dr. Kevorkian's case"
In response to Reply # 0


          

Precedent??

Euthanasia by proxy?

He provided the methods but the person pushed the button.
IS this the same?

Although she seems terrifying. UGH
*****************************************
. . . If I have something to say when there is a reason involved, I am perfectly willing to talk. Katherine Hepburn

  

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veritas
Member since Sep 16th 2002
37201 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 08:08 AM

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28. "Kevorkian made overt acts to assist suicide, she only encouraged w words"
In response to Reply # 26


          

From a legal perspective that is a MASSIVE distinction.

i still blame hip-hop.

  

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Anonymous
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Tue Sep-01-15 07:40 AM

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27. "This is why the legal system is seriously flawed"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

This girl persistently assisted and motivated someone to kill themselves and we're discussing if there's a loophole in which she shouldn't get locked up.

Some of this shit is black and white and we've been trained to search and find the grey area when it isn't necessary.

What kind of person takes the action of this girl? Answer that question. There has to be something severely wrong with you to do something like that. I'm sure an attorney would even try to get her off on insanity if they can.

Fuck that...let this girl rot in jail for that shit.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79349 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 08:16 AM

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30. "JUST DO IT! "
In response to Reply # 27


          

when are you gonna do it?

you bullshittin'

ole girl is evil as Fuck. If I raised her I would feel like such a failure.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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veritas
Member since Sep 16th 2002
37201 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 08:31 AM

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31. "questioning if conduct meets the element of a crime isn't looking for a ..."
In response to Reply # 27


          

At least not from my perspective.

I suppose that differing perspective is part of why people hate lawyers though

i still blame hip-hop.

  

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Anonymous
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Tue Sep-01-15 09:10 AM

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37. "I don't hate lawyers"
In response to Reply # 31


  

          

Shit, my wife is a lawyer.

But let's not act as if finding loopholes isn't a part of the job.

As dumb and extreme of an example it is, the Martin stand-up in which he asks "what the fuck is the trial about" in regards to evidence against Jeffrey Dahmer.

There are hundreds of millions of dollars wasted on our legal system. And I'm all for people getting a fair trial because obviously people have been innocently convicted but like I said above, something are simply black and white. I'm not even getting to the technicalities of if there was a criminal act committed. The evidence spells out that she is a piece of shit and that is going to override all else in my mind. There are times when the laws and the ways they're written don't add up.

  

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esb225
Member since Nov 12th 2003
41415 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 08:55 AM

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32. "is it a crime i'm on the fence on that "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

BUT she needs to be in a mental facility for sure...

i mean hell if she gets enough followers she now creates a church of folks who wish to kill themselves and mass suicides...

i mean if that was my son i'd at the very least track her down and punch her in the sternum

I got a good life man

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
1373 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 09:04 AM

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34. "This is disturbing on so many levels..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

as I read more and more on the case, it seems that the guy wanted someone to talk to and was trying to do better but found someone who did the opposite of what he needed at the time. i have no clue what hold this girl had over him but it's unfortunate that she held so much influence in his life...she was power tripping and she did this for the sympathy, attention, and fame this would garner her. How she thought no one would ever see her texts or the call logs is beyond me.

She should be locked up. Criminally. Is there a crime to charge her with? if nothing else, bullying. You don't have to be stereo-typically mean to be a bully...but she did bully him. she pretended to be his friend and led him down a path of despair and any time he tried to break free, she returned him on that path. This is all disgusting. I hope she dies a horrible death alone and full of pain.

  

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veritas
Member since Sep 16th 2002
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Tue Sep-01-15 09:09 AM

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36. "does Massachusetts have an anti-bullying law? Honest question"
In response to Reply # 34


          

i still blame hip-hop.

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
1373 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 09:24 AM

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40. "i honestly don't have a clue..."
In response to Reply # 36


  

          

but that was the first thing that popped into my mind. bullying. harassment.

i think Charles Manson is a great example of someone who didn't technically commit a crime and is in jail for conspiracy. This is hard considering it was a suicide. but involuntary manslaughter perhaps is the best fit considering the below:

Elements of the Offense

Three elements must be satisfied in order for someone to be found guilty of involuntary manslaughter:

1. Someone was killed as a result of act by the defendant.
2. The act either was inherently dangerous to others or done with reckless disregard for human life.
3. The defendant knew or should have known his or her conduct was a threat to the lives of others.

if nothing else, she admitted she knew what she was doing and she could have stopped it but didn't. even when he tried to stop it, she kept pushing.

  

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KiloMcG
Member since Jan 01st 2008
27561 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 09:06 AM

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35. "man, wtf. that chick crazy af."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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Binlahab
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182954 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 09:11 AM

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39. "shes evil. simple and plain."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

to constantly pump someone to off themselves THEN capitalize on their death afterwards is just evil.


does it really matter?

wonder what bin's doing?
http://i.imgur.com/phECCMp.jpg

  

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sweet ruffian
Member since Jul 11th 2003
8129 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 01:11 PM

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41. "omg. the more I read about this situation the more psycho the girlfriend..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I hope he has at least one crazy family member that can beat the brakes off that girl

  

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Moonlit_Force
Member since Oct 10th 2005
8643 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 01:21 PM

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42. "I googled her name and facebook, then clicked images... smh."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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Cenario
Member since Aug 24th 2005
59131 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 01:53 PM

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43. "Brady lawyers would have those texts looking so innocuous"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

“You always say you’re gonna do it, but you never do,”
“I just want to make sure tonight is the real thing.”
“You can’t think about it. You just have to do it"

talking bout sex for the 1st time

“I bet you’re gonna be like ‘oh, it didn’t work because I didn’t tape the tube right or something like that,'”
“You always seem to have an excuse.”

contraceptive use

-The Knicks’ coaching search still includes a lone frontrunner, Kurt Rambis, whose qualifications for the position include a strong relationship with Jackson and a willingness to take the job.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79349 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 01:58 PM

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44. "http://media.masslive.com/breakingnews/photo/2015/08/24/michelle-carter-..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

http://media.masslive.com/breakingnews/photo/2015/08/24/michelle-carter-82415-0982d0b8a3c90eb3.jpg

gotdamn she got a big head and it was filled with some evil...

how she gonna post #wecanendsuicide

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Cenario
Member since Aug 24th 2005
59131 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 01:59 PM

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45. "she could have ended suicide for one guy tho"
In response to Reply # 44


  

          


>how she gonna post #wecanendsuicide
>
>

-The Knicks’ coaching search still includes a lone frontrunner, Kurt Rambis, whose qualifications for the position include a strong relationship with Jackson and a willingness to take the job.

  

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Moonlit_Force
Member since Oct 10th 2005
8643 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 02:03 PM

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46. ""I will never understand why this had to happen" © Michelle Carter"
In response to Reply # 44


  

          

http://www.returnofkings.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/michelle-carter.png


  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79349 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 02:22 PM

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47. "fucking psycho"
In response to Reply # 46


          

I really widely she would just tell us what her motive was for doing this..

gofundme page?

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Cenario
Member since Aug 24th 2005
59131 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 02:28 PM

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48. "seems like she wanted attention/people to feel sorry for her."
In response to Reply # 47


  

          

-The Knicks’ coaching search still includes a lone frontrunner, Kurt Rambis, whose qualifications for the position include a strong relationship with Jackson and a willingness to take the job.

  

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-DJ R-Tistic-
Member since Nov 06th 2008
51981 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 04:18 PM

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60. "Yooo she look like Chucky and Wednesday Addams had a daughter!!"
In response to Reply # 44


  

          

------------------------------

50+ FREE Mixes on www.DJR-Tistic.com!

Twitter and Instagram - @DJ_RTistic

  

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SuiteLady
Member since Oct 19th 2004
16191 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 03:17 PM

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49. "okp's encourage suicide regularly. all the 'go kill yourself' reply's ar..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

around here ...

♥ Inescapably Me ♥

"Love is never any better than the lover" Toni Morrison (The Bluest Eye)

  

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Cenario
Member since Aug 24th 2005
59131 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 03:27 PM

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50. "while i don't condone people that say that on here"
In response to Reply # 49


  

          

its not even in the same stratosphere

-The Knicks’ coaching search still includes a lone frontrunner, Kurt Rambis, whose qualifications for the position include a strong relationship with Jackson and a willingness to take the job.

  

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SuiteLady
Member since Oct 19th 2004
16191 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 03:44 PM

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51. "I get that but still, someone who is down doesn't need to here that at a..."
In response to Reply # 50
Tue Sep-01-15 03:46 PM by SuiteLady

  

          

whether from friends, family, foes, internet trolls, ect

Nobody knows what is going on on the other side of a computer screen. Okp's type that phrase all the time then I see the same okp's showing outrage and sympathy for actual victims of suicide and telling people to reach out for help.

Maybe that is just the nature of the internet though. I don't do any other message boards or social networking so, maybe people do that on other sites too.

♥ Inescapably Me ♥

"Love is never any better than the lover" Toni Morrison (The Bluest Eye)

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
1373 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 03:55 PM

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54. "who are these same OKPs? call them out..."
In response to Reply # 51


  

          

because it has been stated plenty of times on this board that it shouldn't be tolerated. We have lost quite a few okps and their family members to suicide. I think after the death of radin, people here have been more mindful about what they say. The few ppl who *might* still say it have been jerks, and always are...and they aren't the ppl in this thread or any other suicide thread acting like they care...

yes ppl have joked, but for the most part, that's over. That was never the same as what this girl did. and the false comparisons belittle the situation at hand. While we can agree that it's a bad thing to say, in no way are the events the same.

  

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SuiteLady
Member since Oct 19th 2004
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Tue Sep-01-15 04:04 PM

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56. "I remember ColdTruth saying it and then months later he had a post about"
In response to Reply # 54
Tue Sep-01-15 04:09 PM by SuiteLady

  

          

seeking help/encouraging people to seek help. This must have been 2012/2013 though. I've been told to go kill myself on here before - can't remember by whom.

(I fully realize that by calling him out he will launch an attack on me. Let's see if he uses those words though)

♥ Inescapably Me ♥

"Love is never any better than the lover" Toni Morrison (The Bluest Eye)

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79349 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 04:12 PM

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58. "its not the same thing"
In response to Reply # 56


          

not even close...

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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ILLwiLL132
Member since Jul 14th 2011
217 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 03:47 PM

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52. "RE: Encouraging Suicide: Criminal Conduct or Just a Dick Move? (swipe)"
In response to Reply # 0


          

She certainly should be locked up for her actions. If she was encouraging him to pull the trigger on someone else and killed that person she would be locked up for murder. Put her ass in jail.

I'm for truth no matter who tells it. I'm for justice no matter who it's for or against. - el Hajj Malik el Shabazz

  

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ShinobiShaw
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48550 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 03:51 PM

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53. "Wayment "gas powered water pump" ???"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

"used a gas-powered water pump to commit suicide in the parking lot of a KMart."

Ok of all the ways to go.

http://soundcloud.com/djshinobishaw
http://www.rareformnyc.com
http://twitter.com/DJShinobiShaw
https://twitter.com/RareFormNYC
PSN: ShinobiShaw

"Arm Leg Leg Arm How you doin?" (c)T510

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
1373 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 03:55 PM

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55. "the water pump pumped carbon monoxide into his car..."
In response to Reply # 53


  

          

he actually was aware that he was dying but it's one of the more easier ways to go because essentially you just fall asleep and don't wake up.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79349 posts
Tue Sep-01-15 04:16 PM

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59. "pretty sure he is aware of how it the method works..."
In response to Reply # 55


          

just seems odd to use a water pump in a parking lot.

I had a friend who was ashamed to let his family know he was down and out and sleeping in his car... he died from CO2 poisoning because his car was fucked up and he left the engine on to stay warm.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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