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Subject: "trying to find a new career path (my programmer bruhs come ere)" Previous topic | Next topic
Madvillain 626
Member since Apr 25th 2006
10018 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 06:02 PM

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"trying to find a new career path (my programmer bruhs come ere)"


  

          

So I'm trying to find a new path to sink my teeth into so I get get bread like yall are.

Based on my personality type, I should be looking for something that allows me autonomy so I can break stuff down and find solutions. I'm naturally skeptical and don't like authority or menial/boring work.

Torn between accounting with a statistics minor or getting into computer programming.

For my programmer bros, if I'm 25 and just starting out, what languages should I mess with if I'm trying to be employable by say...27/28? (ready to go 0-100 real quick and can devote mad hours to learning this)

any other INTP types on here? Just trying to find a line of work/career path where I can thrive.

-------------------------------
If life is stupendous one cannot also demand that it should be easy. - Robert Musil

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
RE: don't like authority or menial/boring work.
Dec 17th 2014
1
i mean i know i gotta pay dudes
Dec 17th 2014
2
my guess is you need 5 - 10 years before you start calling the shots
Dec 17th 2014
3
None of this is necessarily true, provided he finds the right people, co...
Dec 17th 2014
5
RE: provided he finds the right people, company...that's a big IF
Dec 17th 2014
8
      Sounds like it's time for you to start consulting, honestly.
Dec 17th 2014
10
my chemistry teacher said the same thing when I told her I wanted to be
Dec 18th 2014
16
RE: trying to find a new career path (my programmer bruhs come ere)
Dec 17th 2014
4
Acct + Stat would give you a bunch of options once you finish
Dec 17th 2014
6
It depends on your focus.
Dec 17th 2014
7
computer programming 100%
Dec 17th 2014
9
Your post title is sexist
Dec 18th 2014
11
your reply is bigoted
Dec 18th 2014
12
Lol. Are Indians not Asian anymore?
Dec 18th 2014
14
      most people don't think of Indians as Asian.
Dec 18th 2014
17
could be seen that way
Dec 18th 2014
13
There are a lot of lanes for different languages nowadays
Dec 18th 2014
15
cosign some of this
Dec 18th 2014
18

deejboram
Member since Sep 27th 2002
25755 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 06:09 PM

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1. "RE: don't like authority or menial/boring work. "
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Dec-17-14 06:12 PM by deejboram

  

          

>don't like authority or menial/boring work.

>Torn between accounting with a statistics minor or getting into
>computer programming.


them things don't go together
especially if you're just starting out as a jr programmer
you will be the bottom person on a team
you will have a senior person tell you what to code and how to code it

you will lose all sense of coding autonomy

you will be forced to adhere to whatever coding system they already have in place

the work can be boring and very repetitive
many times businesses find one thing that works
and repeat that process hundreds if not thousands of times after it has been efficientized making them the most profit

they are not going to reinvent the wheel each go round


EDIT:
i've done all that work that you mentioned
Forensic Accountant
Statistician
Biostatistician
Data Modeller

****
pink toes: http://i.imgur.com/WN7DPL1

  

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Madvillain 626
Member since Apr 25th 2006
10018 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 06:17 PM

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2. "i mean i know i gotta pay dudes"
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

gotta answer to somebody authority unless you self employed. i said i don't like authority not that i'm completely unwilling to follow

-------------------------------
If life is stupendous one cannot also demand that it should be easy. - Robert Musil

  

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deejboram
Member since Sep 27th 2002
25755 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 06:30 PM

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3. "my guess is you need 5 - 10 years before you start calling the shots"
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

>gotta answer to somebody authority unless you self employed.
>i said i don't like authority not that i'm completely
>unwilling to follow


unless you're some sort of super whiz

that shit they teach you in school be outdated and generally not what is or HOW it is done in the real world

that school shit is theory
in the real world they want it done just good enough but FAST ENOUGH to make the most profit as possible

different shops are run differently of course
but my 14 years in the game i have yet to run across a shop that wants to let me spend ample time dilly dallying on a pet project
most times they dont even want me to "show my work"
they're like "does the shit work? yes? so SEND IT!"

simple as that

you got some cats that code for the googs here and maybe they run a tighter ship
but the ships i've been part of the crew was pretty fast and loose

it took me like 5 years before i even felt like i was mastering my craft/language (biostatistics and SAS/Stata)
then 5 more years before i felt like i could teach/manage someone else to do what i do

in forensic accounting i was basically trying to find ways folks were hiding money in accts or doing "pump n dump" schemes in commodities markets.
i had autonomy
i now work on a team peddling cancer drugs so we all have to adhere to a similar coding structure or shit will just be too disparate for any of our code segments to work with one another

we each code a bunch of modules then at the end put them all together, ensure they work cohesively, then package it up and send it to the client

i'm doing the same boring work for different clients and different drugs
all in all the want to know the same thing MARKETSHARE and profit margin
very easy to compute
the complexity comes in when you're trying to link up several different data sources to work with each other

that's always new and refreshing

triptych had a dope "ask me" post a short while ago
check that out cause he gave some great recs that even i'm going to look into myself
always be multilingual
i cant tell you the number of times i've gotten gigs/contracts because i'm multilingual AND i have the statistics background as a foundation
many folks can code
but most dont know what they hell they're coding or why they're coding it like that

i work with a bunch of indians (these are the illegal mexican immigrants of the white collar world) and they are good for "knowing SAP/BizObjects" but dont know what the fuck the problem theyre trying to solve

****
pink toes: http://i.imgur.com/WN7DPL1

  

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MiQL
Member since Sep 03rd 2002
7206 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 06:35 PM

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5. "None of this is necessarily true, provided he finds the right people, co..."
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

I work w/ jr devs all the time and they have great ideas.
A jr dev just this past weeked helped us win a hackathon from his ideas.
He works at a chill ass company on the front lines of IoT.
Thanks to him, I got a new Tessel.

Anyhow, if he wants to kneel @ the altar of PHP, Java, and .NET, then, sure, lots of menial labor ahead.
There's A LOT of those shitty jobs around.
He just has to pay attention to company culture and what those companies use.


>>don't like authority or menial/boring work.
>
>>Torn between accounting with a statistics minor or getting
>into
>>computer programming.
>
>
>them things don't go together
>especially if you're just starting out as a jr programmer
>you will be the bottom person on a team
>you will have a senior person tell you what to code and how to
>code it
>

They actually go great together.
There's been an explosion of statistics in programming in the form of data science and big data.

>you will lose all sense of coding autonomy
>
>you will be forced to adhere to whatever coding system they
>already have in place
>
>the work can be boring and very repetitive
>many times businesses find one thing that works
>and repeat that process hundreds if not thousands of times
>after it has been efficientized making them the most profit
>
>they are not going to reinvent the wheel each go round
>
>
>EDIT:
>i've done all that work that you mentioned
>Forensic Accountant
>Statistician
>Biostatistician
>Data Modeller

It's all about what org you're a part of and what team.

"a little air restriction ain't hurt nobody." - BSR

  

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deejboram
Member since Sep 27th 2002
25755 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 06:52 PM

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8. "RE: provided he finds the right people, company...that's a big IF"
In response to Reply # 5


  

          

>>>don't like authority or menial/boring work.
>>
>>>Torn between accounting with a statistics minor or getting
>>into
>>>computer programming.
>>
>>
>>them things don't go together
>>especially if you're just starting out as a jr programmer
>>you will be the bottom person on a team
>>you will have a senior person tell you what to code and how
>to
>>code it
>>
>
>They actually go great together.
>There's been an explosion of statistics in programming in the
>form of data science and big data.
>




generally speaking,
what you're talking about isn't "sexy"
accounting?
statistics?
comp programming?

those are not "sexy" things to general public
that kinda shit gets me hard so that's why i've been in the field this long
and that "data scientist" title is bullshit to me
it's like ppl in nyc and san francisco always finding "cool" new names for the same old neighborhoods
SoBro
SoMa
SoCo (south of congress for my austin heads)

i handle "big data" daily
literally millions of patients im filtering through
tens of thousands of fields across dozens of databases in different settings Oracle, SQL Server and SAS
i'm a statistician
i provide analytics to Big Pharma
i just don't find this "exciting" once you write the same code for different clients multiple times
but maybe i'm pessimistic and jaded as i've been doing it almost 15 years
if i went to a new company it would be exciting for the first year i'm sure


there are always exceptions to rules
but chances are he is going to need to "prove" himself before someone drops a $500,000+ project in his lap to be in control of

****
pink toes: http://i.imgur.com/WN7DPL1

  

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MiQL
Member since Sep 03rd 2002
7206 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 07:06 PM

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10. "Sounds like it's time for you to start consulting, honestly."
In response to Reply # 8


  

          

Maybe you're just over it in general?
There's A LOT of baggage and bullshyt I'd like to share, but I'm not going to let that get in the way of someone who's motivated.

I'll readily admit that my knowledge is limited regarding the data science field.
Hell, I'm so over CRUD apps and moving over to hardware.
And the shyt is exciting all over again.
I have no idea wtf I'm doing, but it's great working w/ different kinds of people since this fields is so new.

>>>>don't like authority or menial/boring work.
>>>
>>>>Torn between accounting with a statistics minor or getting
>>>into
>>>>computer programming.
>>>
>>>
>>>them things don't go together
>>>especially if you're just starting out as a jr programmer
>>>you will be the bottom person on a team
>>>you will have a senior person tell you what to code and how
>>to
>>>code it
>>>
>>
>>They actually go great together.
>>There's been an explosion of statistics in programming in
>the
>>form of data science and big data.
>>
>
>
>
>
>generally speaking,
>what you're talking about isn't "sexy"
>accounting?
>statistics?
>comp programming?
>

Programming is the art of abstracting the boring.
Laziness is a virtue.
Low morale @ a company is something code can't fix, though - that's a people problem.

>those are not "sexy" things to general public
>that kinda shit gets me hard so that's why i've been in the
>field this long
>and that "data scientist" title is bullshit to me
>it's like ppl in nyc and san francisco always finding "cool"
>new names for the same old neighborhoods
>SoBro
>SoMa
>SoCo (south of congress for my austin heads)
>
>i handle "big data" daily
>literally millions of patients im filtering through
>tens of thousands of fields across dozens of databases in
>different settings Oracle, SQL Server and SAS
>i'm a statistician
>i provide analytics to Big Pharma
>i just don't find this "exciting" once you write the same code
>for different clients multiple times
>but maybe i'm pessimistic and jaded as i've been doing it
>almost 15 years
>if i went to a new company it would be exciting for the first
>year i'm sure
>

You're in Big Pharma?
Ah hell.
You're better than me, man.

>
>there are always exceptions to rules
>but chances are he is going to need to "prove" himself before
>someone drops a $500,000+ project in his lap to be in control
>of

Certainly.
I'm not saying this dude just shows up knowing futures, list comprehensions, and decorators and suddenly folks are throwing $100 bills @ him.

I'm saying that provided he knows what companies to avoid (unlike you and I), he'll do just fine.

"a little air restriction ain't hurt nobody." - BSR

  

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jimi
Charter member
4572 posts
Thu Dec-18-14 01:21 PM

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16. "my chemistry teacher said the same thing when I told her I wanted to be"
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

an accountant...

She saw my grades realized I had potential asked what my major was and she literally said the same thing

I ended up in MIS


@silentintellect

  

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southphillyman
Member since Oct 22nd 2003
90059 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 06:31 PM

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4. "RE: trying to find a new career path (my programmer bruhs come ere)"
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Dec-17-14 06:42 PM by southphillyman

  

          

> don't like
>authority or menial/boring work.
>


i've never had a job where i was micro managed
the vast majority of my jobs i'm actually telling what ever non technical superior i have how i'm going do whatever the business needs
now if you work closely with a technical superior or do an agile methodology with a technical lead it may be different but that hasn't been my experience. even they usually have a hands off approach assuming u aren't missing mad deadlines/fucking up constantly

outside of design and architectural meetings i never feel like i'm answering to someone
i rarely even see/communicate with my "boss"

"boring work" is relative. the vast majority of jobs are CRUD applications you won't care about. ie: wells fargo website or their back end check processing systems.....YAYE!
the excitement is in having design/architectural autonomy to deliver those apps


>For my programmer bros, if I'm 25 and just starting out, what
>languages should I mess with if I'm trying to be employable by
>say...27/28? (ready to go 0-100 real quick and can devote mad
>hours to learning this)

no idea really. android flavored java? c#? scala? javascript? oracle?
python is probably the easiest to learn and most natural to write
i wouldn't get hung up on that too much at first. you'll end up learning 10+ languages anyway if you work for any meaningful length of time
i'd read a design pattern book, a book called clean code and this book by ade oshineye http://www.amazon.com/Apprenticeship-Patterns-Guidance-Aspiring-Craftsman/dp/0596518382
the VAST majority of programming goes on inside of your head (or your copybook or white board)
a lot of it is thinking through design/architecture and creating algorithms to do whatever you're trying to do

~~~~~~

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
15544 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 06:42 PM

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6. "Acct + Stat would give you a bunch of options once you finish"
In response to Reply # 0


          

I'd actually push to reverse that (Stat major, business minor).
Learn a little programming on the side (which you'll have to do with a statistics degree anyways), and you would be so employable

_______________________________________

  

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MiQL
Member since Sep 03rd 2002
7206 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 06:46 PM

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7. "It depends on your focus."
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Dec-17-14 06:52 PM by MiQL

  

          

>So I'm trying to find a new path to sink my teeth into so I
>get get bread like yall are.
>
>Based on my personality type, I should be looking for
>something that allows me autonomy so I can break stuff down
>and find solutions. I'm naturally skeptical and don't like
>authority or menial/boring work.
>
>Torn between accounting with a statistics minor or getting
>into computer programming.
>
>For my programmer bros, if I'm 25 and just starting out, what
>languages should I mess with if I'm trying to be employable by
>say...27/28? (ready to go 0-100 real quick and can devote mad
>hours to learning this)
>

You can't go wrong w/ Python w/ a little R mixed in since they both are great tools regarding data analysis, data science, and statistics (you can even try Julia later on down the road).

Holler @ Triptych since he's the resident Pythonist.
http://search.oreilly.com/?q=data+analysis&x=0&y=0

Also check out Packt Publishing and Apress Books.

A good start w/ Python can be Learn Python The Hard Way: http://learnpythonthehardway.org/book/

>any other INTP types on here? Just trying to find a line of
>work/career path where I can thrive.

I'm a more JavaScript/Node guy, so if you have questions, give me a shout.

"a little air restriction ain't hurt nobody." - BSR

  

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initiationofplato
Member since Nov 06th 2013
2420 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 07:02 PM

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9. "computer programming 100%"
In response to Reply # 0


          

Learn it and don't look back. Apart from gaining a skill set that pays very well, is creative, and can be used anywhere on the planet, it will provide you with insight into people and the structure of society. Computer programming is built on our best interpretations of structure and order as logic.

  

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Goldmind
Member since Oct 28th 2004
27522 posts
Thu Dec-18-14 02:44 AM

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11. "Your post title is sexist"
In response to Reply # 0


          

I know it may seem like nitpicking, but that bothered me. I hope that as a Black man considering the field, you'll do things to make tech more inclusive for all others who fall outside of the white or Asian boys' club.

  

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PoppaGeorge
Member since Nov 07th 2004
10384 posts
Thu Dec-18-14 03:03 AM

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12. "your reply is bigoted"
In response to Reply # 11


  

          

You know damned well Indians belong in your list too.

  

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Goldmind
Member since Oct 28th 2004
27522 posts
Thu Dec-18-14 12:13 PM

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14. "Lol. Are Indians not Asian anymore?"
In response to Reply # 12


          


  

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PoppaGeorge
Member since Nov 07th 2004
10384 posts
Thu Dec-18-14 01:58 PM

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17. "most people don't think of Indians as Asian."
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

Just like they don't consider people from Uzbekistan, Kazakhstan, Turkmenistan, and Cypress as "asian", even though technically they are.

I had a few friends in college from Cypress that got grants for being Asian students.

---------------------------

forcing myself to actually respond to you is like bathing in ebola virus. - Binlahab

Like there is stupid, and then there is you, and then there is dead. - VAsBestBBW

R.I.P. Disco D

  

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Madvillain 626
Member since Apr 25th 2006
10018 posts
Thu Dec-18-14 03:41 AM

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13. "could be seen that way"
In response to Reply # 11
Thu Dec-18-14 03:41 AM by Madvillain 626

  

          

when i made it i guess i was going for more of a "OKmentors huddle up and help a young G walk the right path" vibe

was trying to get jewels from those with a similar outlook who have more experience. my okfees are welcome too, of course

-------------------------------
If life is stupendous one cannot also demand that it should be easy. - Robert Musil

  

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8-bit
Member since Jan 12th 2010
10841 posts
Thu Dec-18-14 12:31 PM

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15. "There are a lot of lanes for different languages nowadays"
In response to Reply # 0
Thu Dec-18-14 12:32 PM by 8-bit

  

          

If you actually like programming, for learning I recommend starting with C (or C++ if you can handle its' complexity) and Python. If you can understand C, and get good at Python then other languages will be fairly easy to pick up.

I'm a web dev, and the languages that I use daily are C#, Python & PHP. For my personal projects, I code in C, C++, Python, Ruby & Go. Java is very big too, but I just don't like coding in it.


Edit: Forgot about SQL (which is a real language), tho I mainly write CRUD applications so I barely scratch the surface of it. Good if you want to get into databases.

---
http://twitter.com/logicalhood
http://instagram.com/hoodlogic

  

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PoppaGeorge
Member since Nov 07th 2004
10384 posts
Thu Dec-18-14 02:01 PM

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18. "cosign some of this"
In response to Reply # 15


  

          

Python is getting bigger, Ruby/Ruby on Rails seems to be in high demand, and PHP is always going to be in demand.

Haskell is another one to look into. Haskell is what many, if not all, of the high frequency trading platforms are built on. Right now a good Haskell programmer that can build something like that can pretty much write his own ticket.


---------------------------

forcing myself to actually respond to you is like bathing in ebola virus. - Binlahab

Like there is stupid, and then there is you, and then there is dead. - VAsBestBBW

R.I.P. Disco D

  

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