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Subject: "Full Diplo Relations with Cuba to be Restored" Previous topic | Next topic
Cam
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13185 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 10:59 AM

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"Full Diplo Relations with Cuba to be Restored"


  

          

Who's visiting?

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
Article link
Dec 17th 2014
1
1 YT man jailed in cuba = trade 3 spies to release
Dec 17th 2014
2
I am going!!!!
Dec 17th 2014
3
*PYERN*
Dec 17th 2014
4
Fcuk what you heard Obama has been killing it lately.
Dec 17th 2014
5
Yeah, if he finishes strong that's a big boost for the Dems in 2016
Dec 17th 2014
      Still a longs way off but I think the narrative will start to shift soon...
Dec 17th 2014
16
Travel now, because when Jeb is in office, its the Miami Cubans turn to
Dec 17th 2014
6
I thought this was about Diplo going to Cuba
Dec 17th 2014
7
Thanks Obama!
Dec 17th 2014
8
how does south fl. feel about this
Dec 17th 2014
9
calle ocho probably shut down with protestors right now
Dec 17th 2014
10
I bet the under 35 crowd supports it.
Dec 17th 2014
11
^^^^ they do. Old heads gonna hate
Dec 17th 2014
23
Rubio said just what I expected
Dec 17th 2014
17
i can finally visit fam.
Dec 17th 2014
12
OK:Re Havana 2016
Dec 17th 2014
13
feat Cubanos with only pickles
Dec 17th 2014
14
can we fit 30mil black folks on that island?
Dec 17th 2014
15
Was inevitable. It's pretty easy to go now, I hear
Dec 17th 2014
18
If they allow it, Cuba's economy could see double digit growth for a dec...
Dec 17th 2014
19
Where would Cuba fall on the dick destination vacation hierarchy?
Dec 17th 2014
20
I laffed but on the real, I bet it gets ranked pretty damn high n/m
Dec 17th 2014
21
gotta have less STD's than DR & Brazil for at least the first 6 months
Dec 17th 2014
22
Yeah, I believe the STD rate is pretty low there.
Dec 17th 2014
25
I was thinking of destinations for the ladies, ala Jamaica
Dec 17th 2014
27
pretty high, i imagine.
Dec 17th 2014
60
I'm excited about this.
Dec 17th 2014
24
This is huge. But fyi "regular" tourism is still prohibited
Dec 17th 2014
26
I was planning on going in 2016 anyway, so now I can go legally.
Dec 17th 2014
28
Not necessarily.
Dec 17th 2014
29
      i think that's what she means
Dec 17th 2014
30
           Those options have both been available for a long time
Dec 17th 2014
32
           nah I meant, i wouldn't have to do the roundabout method
Dec 17th 2014
41
Link - POTUS live statement
Dec 17th 2014
31
DGI just got a collective erection by the way.
Dec 17th 2014
33
This is cool...now pardon Assata
Dec 17th 2014
34
that ain't gonna happen
Dec 17th 2014
36
we have normal diplomatic realtions with several nations
Dec 17th 2014
37
      that's true
Dec 17th 2014
43
^^^^he'll prolly do it in his last 30 days. That would be awesome
Dec 17th 2014
67
just watched barry's speech
Dec 17th 2014
35
sounds good...
Dec 17th 2014
38
fuckin right!!!
Dec 17th 2014
39
Obama's speech (link)
Dec 17th 2014
40
I actually feel like this could maybe be a bad thing for Cuba
Dec 17th 2014
42
This shit scares me to death
Dec 17th 2014
44
don't they deal w/Russia?
Dec 17th 2014
61
...but what happens to the political activists like Assata?
Dec 17th 2014
45
Normalizing relations doesn't necessarily mean...
Dec 17th 2014
46
      ...bet, thanks.
Dec 17th 2014
47
Verboten Fructhe: Cuba is dope but merely built up in American minds
Dec 17th 2014
48
With less restrictions on trade Cuban food should improve exponentially
Dec 17th 2014
50
      Brazil has the best fruit I've ever eaten.
Dec 17th 2014
52
           RE: Brazil has the best fruit I've ever eaten.
Dec 17th 2014
53
           i can tell you the EXACT place too. cafe at corcovado.
Dec 17th 2014
54
           Cuban musical culture sons every other Caribbean
Dec 17th 2014
55
                Also, what other country besides Haiti is touching the
Dec 17th 2014
56
                     What Cuban artist is bigger than BOB MARLEY???
Dec 17th 2014
57
                     Cuba has no music? What? That's half the reason I went
Dec 17th 2014
58
                          again, Americans sensationalise Cuba
Dec 17th 2014
59
                          David Calzado y la Charanga Habanera
Dec 17th 2014
64
                          I agree with you, but Salsa comes from NYC
Dec 17th 2014
62
                               I was gonna make one more edit to say that
Dec 17th 2014
63
                               uh...no.
Dec 17th 2014
65
                                    No it didn't. Puerto Ricans in NYC developed it.
Dec 17th 2014
66
                                         See what I'm saying???
Dec 17th 2014
68
                                              There's nothing to what you're saying - you and Bin
Dec 17th 2014
70
                                              And again, Cuba's musical legacy is the Son.
Dec 17th 2014
71
                                              That first song sound like La Bamba
Dec 18th 2014
76
                                              Just holler at the Cuban music wiki
Dec 17th 2014
72
                     Brazil is deeper than Cuba but I agree.
Dec 17th 2014
69
                          Well Santeria was largely driven underground by the Communists.
Dec 17th 2014
73
The Pope and Canada helped make it happen *swipe*
Dec 17th 2014
49
#handsoffassata
Dec 17th 2014
51
^^^^^^
Dec 17th 2014
74
http://s2.postimg.org/p1it1zjwp/bocub.png
Dec 18th 2014
75

Cam
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Wed Dec-17-14 11:01 AM

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1. "Article link"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://bigstory.ap.org/article/7f7f6bba9d934897a07b09039fd25e38/ap-source-cuba-releases-us-prisoner-alan-gross

WASHINGTON (AP) — The United States and Cuba will start talks on normalizing full diplomatic relations, marking the most significant shift in U.S. policy toward the communist island in decades, American officials said Wednesday. The announcement comes amid a series of new confidence-building measures between the longtime foes, including the release of American Alan Gross and the freeing of three Cubans jailed in the U.S.

President Barack Obama was to announce the policy changes from the White House at noon Wednesday.

Sen. Marco Rubio, R-Florida, said the U.S. and Cuba were moving toward normalized banking and trade ties. He also said the U.S. was poised to open an embassy in Havana in the coming months.

"This is going to do absolutely nothing to further human rights and democracy in Cuba," Rubio said in an interview. "But it potentially goes a long way in providing the economic lift that the Castro regime needs to become permanent fixtures in Cuba for generations to come."

Gross, 65, was on an American government plane bound for the U.S. Wednesday morning after being released on humanitarian grounds by the Cuban government at the request of the Obama administration. As part of the secret negotiations to secure his release, the U.S. was releasing three Cuban jailed in Florida for spying.

Cuba President Raul Castro planned to speak at noon about Gross' release, according to Cuba's U.N. mission.

Obama administration officials have considered Gross' imprisonment an impediment to improving relations with Cuba.

Cuba was also releasing a non-American intelligence "asset" along with Gross, according to a U.S. official. That official and others spoke on the condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to be identified by name before Obama's remarks.

Bonnie Rubinstein, Gross' sister, heard the news from a cousin, who saw it on television.

"We're like screaming and jumping up and down," she said in a brief telephone interview from her home in Texas.

Gross was detained in December 2009 while working to set up Internet access as a subcontractor for the U.S. government's U.S. Agency for International Development, which does work promoting democracy in the communist country. It was his fifth trip to Cuba to work with Jewish communities on setting up Internet access that bypassed local censorship.

Cuba considers USAID's programs illegal attempts by the U.S. to undermine its government, and Gross was tried and sentenced to 15 years in prison.

The three Cubans released in exchange for Gross are part of the so-called Cuban Five — a group of men who were part of the "Wasp Network" sent by Cuba's then-President Fidel Castro to spy in South Florida. The men, who are hailed as heroes in Cuba, were convicted in 2001 in Miami on charges including conspiracy and failure to register as foreign agents in the U.S.

Two of the Cuban Five were previously released after finishing their sentences.

In a statement marking the fifth anniversary of Gross' detention earlier this month, Obama hinted that his release could lead to a thaw in relations with Cuba.

"The Cuban Government's release of Alan on humanitarian grounds would remove an impediment to more constructive relations between the United States and Cuba," Obama said in a statement.

Gross' family has said he was in ailing health. His wife, Judy, said in a statement earlier this month that Gross has lost more than 100 pounds, can barely walk due to chronic pain, and has lost five teeth and much of the sight in his right eye. He has begun refusing to see his wife and daughter, the new chief of the U.S. Interests Section in Havana and members of Cuba's small Jewish community, who had been visiting him on religious holidays.

Obama has taken some steps to ease U.S. restrictions on Cuba after Raul Castro took over as president in 2010 from his ailing brother. He has sought to ease travel and financial restrictions on Americans with family in Cuba, but has resisted calls to drop the embargo.

Among the expected changes as a result of the improvement in U.S.-Cuba relations is that licensed American travelers to Cuba will now be able to return to the U.S. with $400 in Cuban goods, including tobacco and alcohol products worth less than $100 combined. This means the long-standing ban on importing Cuban cigars is over, although there are still limits, according to a U.S. official who spoke on condition of anonymity ahead of the official White House announcement.

The surprise prisoner swap has echoes of the deal the U.S. cut earlier this year to secure the release of Army Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl, who had been held by the Taliban. In exchange for his release in May, the U.S. turned over five Taliban prisoners held at the Guantanamo Bay detention center.

_

Associated Press writers Jessica Gresko, Jack Gillum, Ken Dilanian and Edie Lederer contributed to this report.

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
14551 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 11:01 AM

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2. "1 YT man jailed in cuba = trade 3 spies to release"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

murder of unarmed citizens by police = crickets

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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EAS
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1558 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 11:02 AM

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3. "I am going!!!!"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

well........not yet.........but i am excited.

  

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Castro
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Wed Dec-17-14 11:03 AM

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4. "*PYERN*"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

------------------
One Hundred.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Wed Dec-17-14 11:13 AM

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5. "Fcuk what you heard Obama has been killing it lately. "
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Dec-17-14 11:14 AM by Buddy_Gilapagos

  

          

Russia looks weak as shit as the sanctions kicking in.
Fuel is as cheap as it's been in a minute (of course nothing to do with BHO).
Jobs report.

Now this here!?!??! Yo if he gets a deal with Iran. This is history books stuff.


This is has been on the top of my list for the last 5 presidencies. I love it.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

  

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Marbles
Member since Oct 19th 2004
21384 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 11:18 AM

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"Yeah, if he finishes strong that's a big boost for the Dems in 2016"


  

          

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Wed Dec-17-14 11:27 AM

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16. "Still a longs way off but I think the narrative will start to shift soon..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

If he can do the things I mention and successfully resolve Syria he will be alright.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

  

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Castro
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48751 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 11:14 AM

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6. "Travel now, because when Jeb is in office, its the Miami Cubans turn to "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

burn...

------------------
One Hundred.

  

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Teknontheou
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32247 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 11:16 AM

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7. "I thought this was about Diplo going to Cuba"
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Dec-17-14 11:19 AM by Teknontheou

  

          

to jack beats.

  

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T Reynolds
Member since Apr 16th 2007
41622 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 11:18 AM

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8. "Thanks Obama!"
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Dec-17-14 11:18 AM by T Reynolds

  

          

Resort World here we come!

Meanwhile I know mad people that were going in the last few years to beat the crowds lol

  

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southphillyman
Member since Oct 22nd 2003
90059 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 11:18 AM

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9. "how does south fl. feel about this"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

~~~~~~

  

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T Reynolds
Member since Apr 16th 2007
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Wed Dec-17-14 11:19 AM

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10. "calle ocho probably shut down with protestors right now"
In response to Reply # 9


  

          

  

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Teknontheou
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Wed Dec-17-14 11:19 AM

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11. "I bet the under 35 crowd supports it."
In response to Reply # 9


  

          

  

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j.
Member since Feb 24th 2009
3819 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 11:38 AM

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23. "^^^^ they do. Old heads gonna hate"
In response to Reply # 11


  

          

but the hardcore hardliners are dying off, the new generation has been taking over

ICYMI: Miami has a Dem mayor, Obama won both times, even Crist won here in the last gov election.

Of course due to gerrymandering Lehtinen and Diaz-Balart will stay in Congress for life, but Dade county is blue.

Old heads will make noise, but that's all

  

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Marbles
Member since Oct 19th 2004
21384 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 11:28 AM

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17. "Rubio said just what I expected"
In response to Reply # 9
Wed Dec-17-14 11:29 AM by Marbles

  

          

I imagine there's a big segment of the Cuban-American population down there that's pissed. And it's probably the ones with lots of old money.

This is from the NY Times article:

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/18/world/americas/us-cuba-relations.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&module=span-ab-top-region®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news

Senator Marco Rubio of Florida, considered a prospect for the 2016 Republican presidential nomination, told The Associated Press: “This is going to do absolutely nothing to further human rights and democracy in Cuba. But it potentially goes a long way in providing the economic lift that the Castro regime needs to become permanent fixtures in Cuba for generations to come.”

  

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Fishgrease
Member since Feb 13th 2006
34430 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 11:20 AM

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12. "i can finally visit fam. "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

---------------------------------------
blog: www.wonderfullyhorrible.blogspot.com
instagram: Fishgrease
twitter: wooly_caesar
Podcast www.soundcloud.com/circlegang

  

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Mongo
Member since Oct 26th 2005
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Wed Dec-17-14 11:23 AM

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13. "OK:Re Havana 2016"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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T Reynolds
Member since Apr 16th 2007
41622 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 11:25 AM

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14. "feat Cubanos with only pickles"
In response to Reply # 13


  

          

HOLD THE PORK AND MAYO

  

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Atillah Moor
Member since Sep 05th 2013
13825 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 11:25 AM

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15. "can we fit 30mil black folks on that island?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I'll be going-- sign me up.

______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71201 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 11:29 AM

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18. "Was inevitable. It's pretty easy to go now, I hear"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Shit has been lax for a minute (all of OBeezy's presidency and maybe longer).

I would say go now or at the very latest the earliest part of it opening up.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Wed Dec-17-14 11:30 AM

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19. "If they allow it, Cuba's economy could see double digit growth for a dec..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

They could also stay true to their socialist history and pump so much of that money into infrastructure, education and public goods.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

  

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John Forte
Member since Feb 22nd 2013
15295 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 11:31 AM

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20. "Where would Cuba fall on the dick destination vacation hierarchy?"
In response to Reply # 0


          

  

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Marbles
Member since Oct 19th 2004
21384 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 11:33 AM

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21. "I laffed but on the real, I bet it gets ranked pretty damn high n/m"
In response to Reply # 20


  

          

  

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T Reynolds
Member since Apr 16th 2007
41622 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 11:33 AM

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22. "gotta have less STD's than DR & Brazil for at least the first 6 months"
In response to Reply # 20


  

          

  

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Teknontheou
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Wed Dec-17-14 11:41 AM

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25. "Yeah, I believe the STD rate is pretty low there."
In response to Reply # 22


  

          

Castro was rounding up people who tested positive for HIV and putting them in camps, at one point.

  

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John Forte
Member since Feb 22nd 2013
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Wed Dec-17-14 11:48 AM

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27. "I was thinking of destinations for the ladies, ala Jamaica"
In response to Reply # 22


          

  

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SoWhat
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Wed Dec-17-14 03:11 PM

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60. "pretty high, i imagine."
In response to Reply # 20


  

          

the Cubans son mucho exoticos.

fuck you.

  

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Starbaby Jones
Member since Mar 08th 2003
5034 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 11:40 AM

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24. "I'm excited about this. "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I still have fam down there and this should be a good look.

http://soundcloud.com/forestbrooks

  

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Hitokiri
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Wed Dec-17-14 11:42 AM

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26. "This is huge. But fyi "regular" tourism is still prohibited "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

and the embargo is to remain in place.
These are incredible first steps to take.
I has just been thinking over the past week how I wanted to go back to Cuba.

--
"You can't beat white people. You can only knock them out."

"There is only one god and his name is death. And there is only one thing we say to death: not today."

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
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Wed Dec-17-14 11:50 AM

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28. "I was planning on going in 2016 anyway, so now I can go legally."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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Hitokiri
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Wed Dec-17-14 11:51 AM

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29. "Not necessarily."
In response to Reply # 28


  

          

Tourism is still prohibited.
But there will be ways to travel on arts-based, or educational trips.

--
"You can't beat white people. You can only knock them out."

"There is only one god and his name is death. And there is only one thing we say to death: not today."

  

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ALmighty44
Member since Feb 09th 2004
19824 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 11:54 AM

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30. "i think that's what she means"
In response to Reply # 29


  

          

if i had stayed in school and gone the grad/post-grad route i was going to go for research purposes

  

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Hitokiri
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Wed Dec-17-14 12:05 PM

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32. "Those options have both been available for a long time"
In response to Reply # 30


  

          

limited in numbers, but available. These new measures should open them up quite a bit. So I took her "legally" statement to mean tourism, because to there HAVE been ways to go legally.

--
"You can't beat white people. You can only knock them out."

"There is only one god and his name is death. And there is only one thing we say to death: not today."

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
1373 posts
Wed Dec-17-14 12:41 PM

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41. "nah I meant, i wouldn't have to do the roundabout method"
In response to Reply # 30


  

          

that no one would have to sneak...but if tourism is still going to be restricted, then either I will still have to go the bootleg way or try to do it for "research purposes." which might work if I can finish developing this hypothesis about child birth and maternal health in the US vs other nations. Cuban can always be a good source.

  

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Cam
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Wed Dec-17-14 12:04 PM

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31. "Link - POTUS live statement"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://www.whitehouse.gov/live/president-obama-delivers-statement-cuba

  

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Mongo
Member since Oct 26th 2005
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Wed Dec-17-14 12:06 PM

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33. "DGI just got a collective erection by the way. "
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Binlahab
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Wed Dec-17-14 12:09 PM

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34. "This is cool...now pardon Assata"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Before hoe ass dog the bounty hunter catches feelings

  

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Zion3Lion
Member since Dec 23rd 2002
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36. "that ain't gonna happen"
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

but if the U.S. does fully normalize relations with Cuba how would that would jeopardize Assata's status. would it be possible that she could be extradited?

  

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John Forte
Member since Feb 22nd 2013
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37. "we have normal diplomatic realtions with several nations"
In response to Reply # 36


          

with whom we have no extradition treaty.

  

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Zion3Lion
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43. "that's true"
In response to Reply # 37


  

          

possibility is always there though.
guess it remains to be seen.

  

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blkprinceMD05
Member since Nov 29th 2004
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67. "^^^^he'll prolly do it in his last 30 days. That would be awesome "
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

prototype

stand ur ground, believe in urself,
believe in love, prepare urself for love, remove the negativity from ur life, and accept the love u kno u deserve

  

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Ananse
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35. "just watched barry's speech"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

significant portions of his speech had a tenor of being the great savior - uplifting the cuban people.

he did share some wisdom about doing the same things expecting different results. he even used china and vietnam as examples of countries in which we have relations.

<--- Peace to Bayete Ross-Smith.

  

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BlassFemur
Member since Mar 26th 2008
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Wed Dec-17-14 12:35 PM

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38. "sounds good..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

https://banafrit.com/
http://middlebrainmedia.com/

  

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SoWhat
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39. "fuckin right!!!"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

fuck you.

  

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Hitokiri
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40. "Obama's speech (link)"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acPgLpsSRzs

--
"You can't beat white people. You can only knock them out."

"There is only one god and his name is death. And there is only one thing we say to death: not today."

  

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Atillah Moor
Member since Sep 05th 2013
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Wed Dec-17-14 12:45 PM

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42. "I actually feel like this could maybe be a bad thing for Cuba"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

if there's too much connecting with the US. Right now we're the only terrorists they have to deal with.

______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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Hitokiri
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44. "This shit scares me to death"
In response to Reply # 42


  

          

as a person who's been to Cuba and hearing Obama talk about US corporations' interests in the region...

It also has me hopeful that the lives of Cubans will soon be getting easier.

--
"You can't beat white people. You can only knock them out."

"There is only one god and his name is death. And there is only one thing we say to death: not today."

  

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SoWhat
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61. "don't they deal w/Russia?"
In response to Reply # 42


  

          

fuck you.

  

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Walk On
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45. "...but what happens to the political activists like Assata? "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

...I'm only asking... I have no clue.

<--- #LoveCitees

message brought to you by...

www.onustees.com

  

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Mongo
Member since Oct 26th 2005
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46. "Normalizing relations doesn't necessarily mean..."
In response to Reply # 45


  

          

...extradition treaties will exist.

  

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Walk On
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47. "...bet, thanks."
In response to Reply # 46


  

          

<--- #LoveCitees

message brought to you by...

www.onustees.com

  

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deejboram
Member since Sep 27th 2002
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Wed Dec-17-14 01:12 PM

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48. "Verboten Fructhe: Cuba is dope but merely built up in American minds"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

If you didn't know any better you couldn't tell if you were in Havana or Santo Domingo
Well, besides the 1950s cars.

Americans have a love affair with all things forbidden by our govt.
Kinda like weed.
Weed is cool, but it is usually sensationalised to be something greater by the likes of Snoop Dog

If the price is right it makes for a nice vacay

Otherwise, there are better islands to visit.
Cuba's beaches ain't touching Anguilla's or St Barth's
Cuba's food is trash
The people were cool.
I think Jamaica has more culture than Cuba.

Heh.

****
pink toes: http://i.imgur.com/WN7DPL1

  

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Hitokiri
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50. "With less restrictions on trade Cuban food should improve exponentially"
In response to Reply # 48


  

          

But I agree, the food their by in large isn't great. Fruits are off the chain. I've never had a better mango, pineapple, guava, papaya... but cooked dishes tend to be lacking.

I don't know how some place could have "more" or "less" culture than some place else, but, that's your opinion i guess.

--
"You can't beat white people. You can only knock them out."

"There is only one god and his name is death. And there is only one thing we say to death: not today."

  

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deejboram
Member since Sep 27th 2002
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52. "Brazil has the best fruit I've ever eaten."
In response to Reply # 50


  

          


>I don't know how some place could have "more" or "less"
>culture than some place else, but, that's your opinion i
>guess.


I guess I mean projected culture.
Just like American is projected around the world very deeply folks say Americans have more culture than Pakistan.

When you think of "cuban culture" what do you think of?
When you think of "jamaican culture" what do you think of?
When you think of "japanese culture" what do you think of?

****
pink toes: http://i.imgur.com/WN7DPL1

  

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Very-Effortless
Member since May 07th 2011
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53. "RE: Brazil has the best fruit I've ever eaten."
In response to Reply # 52


  

          

Yo! I have to wholeheartedly support this. Everytime I go down there I get pissed that customs regulations won't let me bring back persimmons.

True story - Brazil is the only place where I will eat beets. Their beets are just SO GOOD. tried them in the US, hated them. But I fuck up some beets in Brazil.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The Green Mile is a movie where the magical black man wrongly dies and the white man who let it happen lives forever.

  

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deejboram
Member since Sep 27th 2002
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54. "i can tell you the EXACT place too. cafe at corcovado."
In response to Reply # 53


  

          

it was a plate of mixed fruit
but the mango and pineapple stood out like POW!!!

im soooo mad i didn't steal that plate
actually i tried to but my potna wouldn't let me stick it in her purse

hawaii has the best guava
with jamaica coming a close second

nothing in cuba really stood out to me food wise

and churrrascaria
oooo LAWD


i still think some countries have more culutre than others.
like, what is cayman islands culture?
what is canadian culture?
gravy and cheese curds on french fries, i guess.
timmy hortons?

****
pink toes: http://i.imgur.com/WN7DPL1

  

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Teknontheou
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55. "Cuban musical culture sons every other Caribbean"
In response to Reply # 52


  

          

Island. And I say that as someone who has tremendous respect for Jamaica, Trinidad, and loves Haitian music.

  

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Teknontheou
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56. "Also, what other country besides Haiti is touching the "
In response to Reply # 55


  

          

richness of Cuban black folk-religious culture? In the Caribbean, I mean.

  

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deejboram
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57. "What Cuban artist is bigger than BOB MARLEY???"
In response to Reply # 56


  

          

>richness of Cuban black folk-religious culture? In the
>Caribbean, I mean.


nobody dont even know any Cuban artist besides Ricky Ricardo
what is "cuban music"?
there is none.
but REGGAE is authentically JAMAICAN
SoCa has been co-opted by Trinidad and fed to the world via Trinis

Jamaicans make up all them passa-passa dances

Hey Mon!

One Love!

them are two widely known "jamaican sayings" said in whack jamaican accents by ofays around the world

back to the music...
jamaica has put out DOZENS of HOUSEHOLD NAMED music artist
cuba has no form of music it can call it's own
salsa?
that's in every latin american country
some say originated in cuba
some say puerto rico
some say venezuela
new yuricans say the bronx

im not sure many think "cuba" when they think salsa or hear celia cruz
but soon as they hear bob marley or buju banton they think jamaica and weed

****
pink toes: http://i.imgur.com/WN7DPL1

  

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Teknontheou
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58. "Cuba has no music? What? That's half the reason I went "
In response to Reply # 57
Wed Dec-17-14 03:00 PM by Teknontheou

  

          

there.

Salsa comes from Son. There's basically unanimous agreement that Salsa used Cuban Son as its foundation and added jazz and Boogaloo on top of that.

But to the point, Cuban music has a respected and admired place throughout basically all of Latin America today, more or less. Edited to include Timba, which has been big in Latin America for the last 25 years.

One more edit to include the impact of Cuban music on West African popular music since the 40s.

Not to mention Mambo and Cha Cha, which are also offshoots of Son.

Trues Bob Marley is a world icon of Third World music, but Reggae is a narrower genre than Son and it's offshoots, especially within the Latin American world.

  

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deejboram
Member since Sep 27th 2002
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Wed Dec-17-14 03:09 PM

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59. "again, Americans sensationalise Cuba"
In response to Reply # 58


  

          

cool.
you went to cuba for music.
worldwide "cuban music" aint known
nor are the artist
but REGGAE music?
Bob Marley?
you could play Eek-A-Mouse to someone in Baghdad and they will tell you it hails from jamaica.
Play some chan-chan to someone from Belarus and they wouldn't be able to pinpoint the country.

That's all I'm saying.

Play some Jazz, Muddy Watters or Kendrick Lamar to someone in Turkmenistahn and they will say AMERICA!

brand recognition m'dude.

Cuban music might be respected and admired by PhD music theorist
but to the layman on the street or in the club
nobody dont know Cuban artists specifically

kinda like Steel Pan music is the catchall for the caribbean
brand recognition

I think Cuba is cool
But it's not some magical place like Disneyland
like I said, there are far better beaches in the caribbean

Old San Juan, Santo Domingo and Havana are interchangeable to me


On the sensationalise part...
even folks in this thread are big upping Cuba's black population
when Dominican Republic gots HELLA blacks


So I can be educated
can you name a few Cuban artist you're feeling so I can be down?
if it helps,
some of my fave Dominican artists are:
Tono Rosario
Juan Luis Guerra
Sergio Vargas




>there.
>
>Salsa comes from Son. There's basically unanimous agreement
>that Salsa used Cuban Son as its foundation and added jazz and
>Boogaloo on top of that.
>
>But to the point, Cuban music has a respected and admired
>place throughout basically all of Latin America today, more or
>less.
>
>Not to mention Mambo and Cha Cha, which are also offshoots of
>Son.
>
>Trues Bob Marley is a world icon of Third World music, but
>Reggae is a narrower genre than Son and it's offshoots,
>especially within the Latin American world.

****
pink toes: http://i.imgur.com/WN7DPL1

  

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Teknontheou
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Wed Dec-17-14 03:37 PM

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64. "David Calzado y la Charanga Habanera"
In response to Reply # 59


  

          

Benny More
Bambleo (their pre 2004 stuff is best)
Los Van Van
Pupy y Los Que Son Son
Haila Mompie
Arsenio Rodriguez
Celia Cruz
Manolito Simonet
Chappotin
Trio Matamoros
Maravillas de Florida
Adalberto Alvarez
Issac Delgado
NG La Banda
Irakere


  

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John Forte
Member since Feb 22nd 2013
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Wed Dec-17-14 03:16 PM

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62. "I agree with you, but Salsa comes from NYC"
In response to Reply # 58


          

  

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Teknontheou
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Wed Dec-17-14 03:26 PM

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63. "I was gonna make one more edit to say that"
In response to Reply # 62


  

          

but I didn't feel like it.

Puerto Ricans uptown and in the Bronx took first and foremost Cuban Son, then Bomba, Plena, jazz and Soul and mixed them up to make salsa in the 60s.

  

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Binlahab
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65. "uh...no. "
In response to Reply # 62


  

          

Salsa came from Puerto Rico

Cmon man

  

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Teknontheou
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66. "No it didn't. Puerto Ricans in NYC developed it."
In response to Reply # 65


  

          

It didn't happen in Puerto Rico.

  

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deejboram
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Wed Dec-17-14 05:02 PM

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68. "See what I'm saying???"
In response to Reply # 66


  

          

I told you above Salsa is not a CUBAN music
but no one will EVER refute that reggae isn't jamaica or jazz or hip hop isn't American

I'm still yet to see an AUTHENTICALLY "cuban culture"

the british have Drum and Base

Spanish have Flamenco

Mexicans have that La Tigres Del Norte music with that heavy ass baseline and all them gritas (shout out to Garibaldi Square)

****
pink toes: http://i.imgur.com/WN7DPL1

  

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Teknontheou
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70. "There's nothing to what you're saying - you and Bin "
In response to Reply # 68


  

          

don't know what you're talking about about the origins of Salsa. All the real fans of Salsa will tell you that it came together in NYC by mostly Puerto Ricans in the 60's. Just because you and him didn't know that doesn't mean that it isn't settled and well understood.

  

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Teknontheou
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71. "And again, Cuba's musical legacy is the Son."
In response to Reply # 68


  

          

I'm starting to think you just don't now what the Son is.

This is moreso Mambo, but it's still part of the "Son Complex"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-4pHTGxjiI

This is the original Son. I think they used this in this song past season of Boardwalk Empire:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GGAyEskVDY

This is Chapottin iplaying Son Montuno

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3W01XaLTvzM

The last two clips are from Cuban television in the 50's or 60's

Salsa was built on top of this music by Puerto Ricans in New York. Willie Colon would tell you as much.

  

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deejboram
Member since Sep 27th 2002
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Thu Dec-18-14 11:59 AM

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76. "That first song sound like La Bamba"
In response to Reply # 71


  

          

Again,
you have to be a musical historian or really give a hoot in order to know about "the son"
reggae music is known WORLDWIDE that it comes from jamaica
same with JAZZ and HIPHOP
rock n roll???
AMERICA!
bossa nova?
BRAZIL

yes, other islands such as Anguilla has their own culture and musicians (shout out to The Mussingtons, Sprocka, Banky Banx and British Dependency) but that don't mean it's widely known
this was about a one country having more or less "culture" than another.

fact remains Jamaica has a bigger cultural influence on music than cuba does/did






>I'm starting to think you just don't now what the Son is.
>
>This is moreso Mambo, but it's still part of the "Son
>Complex"
>
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-4pHTGxjiI
>
>This is the original Son. I think they used this in this song
>past season of Boardwalk Empire:
>
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GGAyEskVDY
>
>This is Chapottin iplaying Son Montuno
>
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3W01XaLTvzM
>
>The last two clips are from Cuban television in the 50's or
>60's
>
>Salsa was built on top of this music by Puerto Ricans in New
>York. Willie Colon would tell you as much.

****
pink toes: http://i.imgur.com/WN7DPL1

  

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Teknontheou
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Wed Dec-17-14 09:18 PM

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72. "Just holler at the Cuban music wiki"
In response to Reply # 68


  

          

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Music_of_Cuba


The music of Cuba, including its instruments, performance and dance, comprises a large set of unique traditions influenced mostly by West African and European (especially Spanish) music. Due to the syncretic nature of most of its genres, Cuban music is often considered one of the richest and most influential regional musics of the world. For instance, the son cubano merges an adapted Spanish guitar (tres), melody, harmony, and lyrical traditions with Afro-Cuban percussion and rhythms. Almost nothing remains of the original native traditions, since the native population was exterminated in the 16th century.

Since the 19th century Cuban music has been hugely popular and influential throughout the world. It has been perhaps the most popular form of regional music since the introduction of recording technology. Cuban music has contributed to the development of a wide variety of genre and musical styles around the globe, most notably in Latin America, the Caribbean, West Africa and Europe. Examples include rhumba, Afro-Cuban jazz, salsa, soukous, a wide variety of West African re-adaptations of Afro-Cuban music (Orchestra Baobab, Africando), Spanish fusion genres (notably with flamenco), and a wide variety of genres in Latin America.

  

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deejboram
Member since Sep 27th 2002
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Wed Dec-17-14 05:08 PM

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69. "Brazil is deeper than Cuba but I agree."
In response to Reply # 56


  

          

>richness of Cuban black folk-religious culture? In the
>Caribbean, I mean.


If the embargo wouldn't have happened maybe Cuba would be on par with Brazil with their Santeria/Candomble houses and such

Ile Aiye and Olodum are the biggest groups of their type in Brazil.
I wonder what the equivalent would have become in Cuba over the last 50 years?

Domincan Republic has a large Black population but not as much Santeria going on.
That's reserved for the Haiti side of Hispaniola.

But then again,
I'm not sure how much Santeria I witnessed in Cuba either.
But in Brazil candomble's presence was THICK

****
pink toes: http://i.imgur.com/WN7DPL1

  

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Teknontheou
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Wed Dec-17-14 09:26 PM

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73. "Well Santeria was largely driven underground by the Communists."
In response to Reply # 69


  

          

They had to practice it in secret from basically 1960 through maybe 2000. But I went to a Tambor in Old Havana when i was there and probably 40 - 50 people from the neighborhood (almost all black) rolled through like it was a family reunion.

And Brazilian music is extremely deep, but because it's the only Portuguese speaking country in Latin America, there wasn't as much of a market for it outside of Brazil or maybe Buenos Aires before Bossa Nova came along.

  

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Mongo
Member since Oct 26th 2005
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Wed Dec-17-14 01:13 PM

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49. "The Pope and Canada helped make it happen *swipe*"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://www.vox.com/2014/12/17/7408955/cuba-deal-pope-francis-canada

The negotiations that led to today's announcement, in which the US and Cuba will take major steps toward normalization, took 18 long months, according to a report in the New York Times. And many of those negotiations were held in Canada, formally but secretly hosted by the Canadian government.

Canada was helping to solve two crucial problems. First, the talks needed to remain secret to have any hope of succeeding — had they leaked, the political backlash in the US would have almost certainly killed the deal.

Second, for diplomatic reasons, the talks could not be held on US or Cuban soil, but the negotiators needed a physical meeting place. The Canadian government, which unlike the US does have ties with Cuba but is also extremely close to the US government, was an obviously attractive broker for the US. While Canadian officials did not officially participate in the talks, their role in providing a secret and official channel was crucial, according to US officials.

The Pope actively participated in getting the deal

If Canada was essential for providing the Americans with a safe and secure forum for talks, then Pope Francis played a similar role in helping to bring the Cuban leaders to the negotiating table. And, unlike Canadian officials, who did not sit at from the formal talks, Vatican officials participated actively in discussions.

Pope Francis' role included sending a personal letter to both Obama and Raul Castro over the summer urging them to reach a deal (talks were already ongoing at that point). Francis also reportedly raised the issue repeatedly in his meeting with Obama in March. And Francis hosted the final negotiation session at the Vatican, where Vatican officials participated in the talks.

Pope Francis has an obvious and very important role to play in talks, especially in building trust with the Cuban leadership. Francis, the first-ever pope from Latin America, is seen in the region as someone who can talk to the US but who is sympathetic to long-held Latin apprehensions about American dominance in the region. So he is politically well-positioned as an intermediary that the Cubans can trust.

Francis was also able to push Cuban leaders to continue negotiating. The Catholic church has deep roots in majority-Catholic Cuba, even after Fidel Castro's experiment with Communist-style state atheism, and still plays a real role in politics there. As pope, Francis would have real diplomatic capital and connections within Havana.

This is Francis's first major diplomatic accomplishment since he became pope in 2013. Pope John Paul II, who served from 1978 to 2005, also had a long record of brokering diplomatic negotiations, including in Latin America.

  

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SHAstayhighalways
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Wed Dec-17-14 01:34 PM

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51. "#handsoffassata"
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#handsoffassata

www.royallegacy.org

For Real (Official Video):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hBRoCPO8esE

  

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Castro
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74. "^^^^^^"
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------------------
One Hundred.

  

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DavidHasselhoff
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Thu Dec-18-14 11:41 AM

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75. "http://s2.postimg.org/p1it1zjwp/bocub.png"
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http://s2.postimg.org/p1it1zjwp/bocub.png

  

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