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Subject: "The Serial Post 2.0" Previous topic | Next topic
nayaa
Member since Oct 06th 2009
20190 posts
Wed Dec-03-14 12:41 PM

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"The Serial Post 2.0"


  

          

the other one's getting kind of long. but lots of interesting POVs here:

http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=4&topic_id=12619975&mesg_id=12619975&page=

hope it's cool to do another.

So we're getting a new episode tomorrow after the thanksgiving break!

What are you hoping for? As someone mentioned in the other post, i'm also unnerved by my desire to see him released, despite not being certain he's innocent.

i also can't help but feel manipulated by his charm, a gift he says he's had all his life. smh.

~
IG: @fireysky

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
I'll say it again, it's not clear that a miscarriage of justice took pla...
Dec 03rd 2014
1
This isn't going to happen since we know for sure Jay was involved
Dec 03rd 2014
2
right.
Dec 03rd 2014
5
Oh yeah I forgot. Jay has to know something. nevermind Adnan did it.
Dec 03rd 2014
6
I've always been bothered by them determining the time of death based on...
Dec 03rd 2014
3
i wonder if the ice storm made it difficult for....
Dec 03rd 2014
7
Maybe time of death isn't that important. We know she left school
Dec 03rd 2014
8
I would also like to know how time of death was determined.
Dec 03rd 2014
4
he didn't have a good defense.
Dec 03rd 2014
9
Well, this episode made it clear to me why Adnan got found guilty.
Dec 04th 2014
10
man her style was killing me
Dec 04th 2014
11
i rationalized it this way.
Dec 04th 2014
12
      Made no sense that she would push for a mistrial in a case she was winni...
Dec 05th 2014
17
           yeah. no doubt.
Dec 05th 2014
20
yeah she was terrible, I wonder what was going on in her life...
Dec 05th 2014
14
lol @ anyone who has never worked on a trial
Dec 05th 2014
18
      no called her terrible, obviously she was one of the best,
Dec 05th 2014
19
           you're both being overly simplistic
Dec 05th 2014
21
                LOL.
Dec 05th 2014
22
                ok. so unless we are lawyers, we can't comment.
Dec 05th 2014
24
                     please read above and find where I said that
Dec 05th 2014
25
                          nope, you got it. n/m
Dec 05th 2014
26
                          you're being too literal.
Dec 05th 2014
28
                               she had over 20 complaints against her, and was disbarred
Dec 05th 2014
30
                                    oh, i feel you.
Dec 05th 2014
31
                                    i know you feel me,
Dec 05th 2014
32
                                    she had complaints about her in different cases
Dec 05th 2014
33
hm.
Dec 04th 2014
13
Adnan has nothing to say about Jay...
Dec 05th 2014
15
^^^^ alla dis
Dec 05th 2014
23
I'm more or less on the same page.
Dec 05th 2014
27
How Did Adnan explain Jay knowing where the car was?
Dec 05th 2014
16
      RE: How Did Adnan explain Jay knowing where the car was?
Dec 05th 2014
29
the weirdest thing to me is Adnan sayin he deserves 2 b in jail
Dec 07th 2014
34
yeah, that made me o_O
Dec 09th 2014
41
Serial solved ?!
Dec 09th 2014
35
been saying they both did it from the beginning
Dec 09th 2014
36
Mayne they didn't have anything knew we ain't been saying. Here is
Dec 09th 2014
37
RE: Mayne they didn't have anything knew we ain't been saying. Here is
Dec 09th 2014
39
that letter is what makes me think Adnan did it.
Dec 09th 2014
38
      Im cool with my boys and all but....
Dec 09th 2014
43
           You gotta remember that these are different times. It's the late 90s
Dec 09th 2014
47
Idk, the more you think about it is hard to consider anyone else but
Dec 09th 2014
40
It's pretty clear it's either Adnan or Jay...
Dec 09th 2014
45
      I think if Adnan didn't do it, he would have to point the finger at Jay ...
Dec 09th 2014
48
I dont get it at all...
Dec 09th 2014
42
Want a credible theory (that I have no basis for)?
Dec 09th 2014
44
Nah she had too much pride for that...
Dec 09th 2014
46
episode 11 has me shook
Dec 11th 2014
49
I highly doubt we will find out who the *real* killer is...
Dec 11th 2014
50
We must remind ourselves this isn't a tv show
Dec 11th 2014
53
Rumors...
Dec 11th 2014
51
yeah, i wanted to know what it was. like you can't leave us hanging like
Dec 11th 2014
52
She couldn't substantiate it, so it just becomes more stuff
Dec 11th 2014
55
So she shouldn't have put it out there period
Dec 11th 2014
56
I think she was using it as an extreme example...
Dec 12th 2014
74
totally get that, but why isolate it separate from other issues?
Dec 11th 2014
57
      Yeah, that was bullshit.
Dec 11th 2014
58
           lmao that's really what she did too.
Dec 11th 2014
59
Clickbait you can't click.
Dec 11th 2014
60
The whole "don't talk bad about Jay " angle
Dec 11th 2014
54
He does have feelings about it. He's says he does.
Dec 11th 2014
61
      also, we don't know the legal repercussions of doing that.
Dec 11th 2014
62
      That's true...
Dec 11th 2014
64
      Yeah, I heard him say that and don't buy it
Dec 11th 2014
63
           I think it's important to note that we don't know what else
Dec 11th 2014
69
                if my memory serves me well, he did make a direct comment to Jay
Dec 12th 2014
75
                     Yep. But that could mean one of two things.
Dec 12th 2014
82
Exactly What Type of Closure Are Y'all Expecting????
Dec 11th 2014
65
I mean, that's no where to go except to explain...
Dec 11th 2014
66
man you called it
Dec 23rd 2014
123
she was on Colbert Report yesterday apparently
Dec 11th 2014
67
it's fascinating to watch this play out b/c so far
Dec 11th 2014
68
this is very much how i feel about it all
Dec 13th 2014
83
      YUP
Dec 30th 2014
137
She has a face for radio
Dec 12th 2014
72
      ouch
Dec 12th 2014
73
This ep (11) was turribul
Dec 11th 2014
70
I feel I could have done w/o this episode
Dec 11th 2014
71
I'm sorry, that Best Buy tweet was fucking funny (LINK)
Dec 12th 2014
76
jesus h. christ. you can't even be funny anymore.
Dec 12th 2014
77
i cried real tears at that tweet, it was hilarious.
Dec 12th 2014
78
lmao i like it
Dec 12th 2014
79
u gotta be retarded to be offended by that tweet
Dec 12th 2014
80
or friends and family of Hae.
Dec 13th 2014
84
Haha
Dec 12th 2014
81
This was a good podcast...(*spoiler may be inside*)
Dec 18th 2014
85
definitely interested to know about...(spoiler possible)
Dec 18th 2014
86
I still think Adnan did it alone or with Jay but...
Dec 18th 2014
87
nah I feel like the West Side Hitman or whatever prolly did it.
Dec 18th 2014
89
well, they brought some of that hot fiyah back that they had in the firs...
Dec 18th 2014
88
They don't really believe Ronald Lee Moore has anything to do with it.
Dec 18th 2014
99
      I don't get why they need an excuse...
Dec 19th 2014
101
           They wouldn't have if the case was still open...
Dec 31st 2014
138
GOOOOOOOOODAMN THIS SHIT *spoiler*
Dec 18th 2014
90
speaking of mail kimp: did y'all see Koenig on Colbert last week?
Dec 18th 2014
91
why are you suprised? you know he has a trial in Jan!
Dec 18th 2014
92
this real life.
Dec 18th 2014
100
#TeamJay
Dec 18th 2014
93
Big picture man. Big picture.
Dec 18th 2014
98
      It took me listening to the AV Club's SERIAL SERIAL to realize....
Dec 19th 2014
112
           EXACTLY.
Dec 19th 2014
113
I stopped listening a couple episodes back
Dec 18th 2014
94
Me too. I've missed the past 2 eps and don't feel the urge to listen
Dec 18th 2014
97
*spoiler*
Dec 18th 2014
95
a weirdly satisfying* conclusion
Dec 18th 2014
96
Adnan's whole defense is "He doesn't seem like the type to do this"
Dec 19th 2014
102
That's not Adnan's defense, he doesn't have one...
Dec 19th 2014
105
      Not his legal defense, but it's the main thrust of the reporter
Dec 19th 2014
107
Don remembering more details from the 13th looks bad for Adnan
Dec 19th 2014
103
What if Adnan hired someone or some people to kill Hae
Dec 19th 2014
104
i said this above! LOL.
Dec 19th 2014
106
We solved the case!
Dec 19th 2014
109
I think all that is too complicated. I think dude didn't premeditate it...
Dec 19th 2014
108
The truth is stranger than fiction
Dec 19th 2014
110
NOPE.
Dec 19th 2014
111
      We don't know what Jay got for his deal
Dec 22nd 2014
119
Pretty funny SNL spoof (link)
Dec 21st 2014
114
hilarious
Dec 21st 2014
115
All of it was spot on
Dec 21st 2014
116
yeah, like A GIRL DIED MAN
Dec 23rd 2014
124
      Exactly...
Dec 23rd 2014
126
      They are satirizing the show, not the case. That's why it's ok to laugh
Dec 23rd 2014
128
           koenig is making a career off the death of this girl
Dec 23rd 2014
133
                Uhm. She's investigating the case...
Dec 23rd 2014
134
lmao this was hilarious...well done
Dec 23rd 2014
132
oh my God, fuck that ending.
Dec 22nd 2014
117
Serial Sucked And Wasted Everyone's Time(swipe)
Dec 22nd 2014
118
This reads like a personal vendetta.
Dec 22nd 2014
120
It does...
Dec 22nd 2014
121
I mean, I don't even really think so.
Dec 22nd 2014
122
      i don't agree too much...
Dec 23rd 2014
129
In the comments age admits she probably could have been less harsh
Dec 23rd 2014
125
thisi s hateful and over-the-top
Dec 23rd 2014
127
The show fell off on the last couple episodes
Dec 23rd 2014
130
Where is David Simon??
Dec 23rd 2014
131
Two Serial shirts that I want...
Dec 23rd 2014
135
INTERVIEW WITH JAY (link)
Dec 29th 2014
136
Whether you believe he did it or not...
Dec 31st 2014
139
The appeal process has begun (swipe)
Mar 24th 2015
140
I settled on the "Cops gave Jay the story to make the case" theory
Mar 24th 2015
141
Slightly right.
Mar 24th 2015
142
But what about the Nisha call?
Mar 24th 2015
143
      The Nisha call doesn't matter in this context
Mar 24th 2015
144
Appeal granted. New testimony to be allowed (swipe)
May 18th 2015
145

Buddy_Gilapagos
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49618 posts
Wed Dec-03-14 12:52 PM

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1. "I'll say it again, it's not clear that a miscarriage of justice took pla..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

His defense took a couple of strategies that in hindsight are questionable but a lot of good defense attorney's would not call their defendant to testify or put up a witness who has a changing story.

Also we don't truly know all the evidence that was presented at trial.

There was no evidence the jury was tampered with.

I'd like to know what went on with cop interview with jay those three hours that weren't recorded.

Also think it's fair to say that the reporter is not really trying to be completely objective and is actively working to prove Adnan's innocence though she has momentary lapses and doubts.

I think Adnan is innocent but I would love to see a psychological evaluation to see if he has sociopathic or psychopathic tendencies. I'd like to know his IQ as well because if he did it he is a psychopathic genius.

I have a hard time believing just any kid would be that good at lying and suckering people.

There is an inconsistency in that Hae told some folks she was off to see Don and told the other girl she would be traveling with the wrestling team. Knowing Time of death would go a long way to help.


The other big question I have is are there any other similar murders that happened around that time.

If you have seen enough innocence project story there is always this crazy reveal that the real killer was some other person who had killed other people similarly within miles of the crime scene.





**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
15900 posts
Wed Dec-03-14 02:08 PM

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2. "This isn't going to happen since we know for sure Jay was involved"
In response to Reply # 1


          

It can't be a random serial killer. Either Jay did it alone, his story is truthful and really helped Adnan do it, or Jay knows exactly who did it ands is framing Adnan.


>
>The other big question I have is are there any other similar
>murders that happened around that time.
>
>If you have seen enough innocence project story there is
>always this crazy reveal that the real killer was some other
>person who had killed other people similarly within miles of
>the crime scene.
>

_______________________________________

  

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PROMO
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31257 posts
Wed Dec-03-14 03:31 PM

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5. "right. "
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

the killer can only be Adnan, Jay, a combination of the two or someone else that Jay knows (and maybe Adnan also knows). that's the only way Jay could have taken the cops to Hae's car.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Wed Dec-03-14 04:48 PM

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6. "Oh yeah I forgot. Jay has to know something. nevermind Adnan did it."
In response to Reply # 2
Wed Dec-03-14 04:49 PM by Buddy_Gilapagos

  

          

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

  

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Very-Effortless
Member since May 07th 2011
7452 posts
Wed Dec-03-14 02:12 PM

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3. "I've always been bothered by them determining the time of death based on..."
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

Like, yall didn't have a forensic team do any additional work on that.

Hell, maybe she had only been dead a couple of days vs. weeks. It just doesn't seem right.

And while they are like Don had an alibi - he was at work... I'm also wondering - if that was her man, he wasn't looking for her? How come Sarah hasn't interviewed him?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The Green Mile is a movie where the magical black man wrongly dies and the white man who let it happen lives forever.

  

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dapitts08
Member since Apr 03rd 2008
8204 posts
Wed Dec-03-14 05:27 PM

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7. "i wonder if the ice storm made it difficult for...."
In response to Reply # 3
Wed Dec-03-14 05:28 PM by dapitts08

          

>Hell, maybe she had only been dead a couple of days vs. weeks.
> It just doesn't seem right.

a forensics team to create a timeline based on the level of decay.
i'm thinking maybe the length of time she was dead based on forensics was inconclusive.

the key to happiness is not being rich;
it's doing something arduous and
creating something of value and then
being able to reflect on the fruits of your labor

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Wed Dec-03-14 07:13 PM

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8. "Maybe time of death isn't that important. We know she left school"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

and she would have without a doubt picked up her niece unless something was wrong. So we know the time of kidnap (or time of kidnapping) occured between the time between end of school and time she was expected to pick up her cousin.

That almost makes it positive that it (kidnapping or murder) happened at the school.

Which makes short list of suspects.


>Like, yall didn't have a forensic team do any additional work
>on that.
>
>Hell, maybe she had only been dead a couple of days vs. weeks.
> It just doesn't seem right.
>
>And while they are like Don had an alibi - he was at work...
>I'm also wondering - if that was her man, he wasn't looking
>for her? How come Sarah hasn't interviewed him?


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

  

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PROMO
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Wed Dec-03-14 03:29 PM

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4. "I would also like to know how time of death was determined."
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

Because from everything presented in the pod it seems like it wasn't determined forensically, but from their assumption that Adnan is the killer and that the 2:36pm phone call is Adnan telling Jay to come get him after he killed Hae.

  

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Zion3Lion
Member since Dec 23rd 2002
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Wed Dec-03-14 07:20 PM

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9. "he didn't have a good defense. "
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

>His defense took a couple of strategies that in hindsight are
>questionable but a lot of good defense attorney's would not
>call their defendant to testify or put up a witness who has a
>changing story.

and the witness, Aisha, who wrote the letter about him being in the library didn't change her story until AFTER Adnan got convicted and she didn't change her story more so refused to come fwd.

  

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PROMO
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Thu Dec-04-14 11:57 AM

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10. "Well, this episode made it clear to me why Adnan got found guilty."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

He had terrible representation.

I mean, TECHNICALLY & ETHICALLY, maybe it was fine.

But what she chose to focus on (or not focus on) and her style at trial?

Yeah, I can see why the jury came back how they did.

  

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nayaa
Member since Oct 06th 2009
20190 posts
Thu Dec-04-14 01:01 PM

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11. "man her style was killing me"
In response to Reply # 10


  

          

just the tiny snippet we listened to was enough to make me want to turn the podcast off. i don't know how people sat through hours of it without flipping a table and running out

i'd be biased against him just based on her style

~
IG: @fireysky

  

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PROMO
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Thu Dec-04-14 01:17 PM

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12. "i rationalized it this way."
In response to Reply # 11


  

          

imagine sitting through a college course or seminar that you've paid for but the presenter is boring as fuck or not on point or rambling - how easy it for your mind to wander or for you to just not "get" it even when it's something you're paying for in order to help you.

now take that situation and apply it to the jury where technically the outcome doesn't affect their lives.

i mean, at the end of the episode, outside of all the money stuff (which is still problematic), i definitely got the impression that due to her health or something else that maybe she shouldn't be doing trials.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Fri Dec-05-14 11:38 AM

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17. "Made no sense that she would push for a mistrial in a case she was winni..."
In response to Reply # 12


  

          

Also very clear that by the second trial she was very sick physically and mentally.



**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

  

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PROMO
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Fri Dec-05-14 12:30 PM

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20. "yeah. no doubt."
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

this episode made me wonder how this special appeals board thing will turn out.

i mean, it definitely SEEMS like Adnan got poor counsel, but will there be enough there for him to be granted an appeal.

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
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Fri Dec-05-14 11:32 AM

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14. "yeah she was terrible, I wonder what was going on in her life..."
In response to Reply # 10


  

          

maybe gambling? maybe she got really sick and was using the money to find alternative cures (seeing as how she died a few short years after this case).

She's agitated, she's chain smoking, she keeps collecting money from her clients...all points to gambling to me. she got herself in a bad way and had no way out of it...which lead to her distraction.

quite unfortunate for Adnan because he could have been left off if not for her unfocused attempts.

Also, I like how the through the Whitman's into the mix...I wonder if that will be the next case in Serial. lol

  

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woe.is.me.
Member since Aug 06th 2007
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Fri Dec-05-14 12:26 PM

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18. "lol @ anyone who has never worked on a trial"
In response to Reply # 10
Fri Dec-05-14 12:27 PM by woe.is.me.

  

          

calling her "terrible"
real life and real trials don't look or sound like a "Law & Order" episode

---
www.ikirejones.com
FW16: After Migration.

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
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Fri Dec-05-14 12:29 PM

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19. "no called her terrible, obviously she was one of the best, "
In response to Reply # 18


  

          

she was renowned in Baltimore until whatever going on happened.

However, her representation and her style from this particular case (based on what was read and heard), WAS terrible. She hit the mark on a few things, no one concedes that, but overall, she focused on the wrong things and dragged out things that led to confusion. Adnan even admits that it things got confusing and no one knew where she was going...how is that not terrible?

  

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woe.is.me.
Member since Aug 06th 2007
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Fri Dec-05-14 12:38 PM

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21. "you're both being overly simplistic"
In response to Reply # 19
Fri Dec-05-14 12:41 PM by woe.is.me.

  

          

to a point that borders on obtuse.

if we listened to the same episode, then you also heard jurors on the jury stating that their perception of his "culture" and how muslims allegedly treat women may have influenced their decision. I raise that as just an example. There are literally hundreds of reasons why a jury may go one way or the other.

the fact that you don't like the way an attorney sounds, what kind of arguments she made, or the notion she made a strategic error by not calling a witness, etc...does not necessarily make him or her "terrible".

based on the broadcast, it sounds like she was having some serious issues toward the end of her life. perhaps she had lost some of her luster in the court room, but there is little indication that her representation of adnan was "terrible".

it's pretty ridiculous to make a professional assessment of anyone based on a few minutes of a story about their performance.

from what little *I* could hear, as someone who has actually worked in this arena, I heard an attorney who worked hard and fought for her client but didn't win that one. That's all I can say in good conscience without actually being privy to all the facts or watching the whole trial.

---
www.ikirejones.com
FW16: After Migration.

  

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PROMO
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Fri Dec-05-14 12:44 PM

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22. "LOL."
In response to Reply # 21


  

          


  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
1373 posts
Fri Dec-05-14 12:55 PM

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24. "ok. so unless we are lawyers, we can't comment. "
In response to Reply # 21


  

          

ok. so i guess, that applies to all jobs. we can't comment about what a cop did unless we are cops. or a chef, or a doctor, or a fashion designer..makes sense.

  

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woe.is.me.
Member since Aug 06th 2007
13957 posts
Fri Dec-05-14 01:00 PM

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25. "please read above and find where I said that"
In response to Reply # 24
Fri Dec-05-14 01:02 PM by woe.is.me.

  

          

I brought up my specific experience as a lawyer to indicate that I actually know what "terrible" lawyering looks like.

I personally didn't hear enough from the show to make that kind of assessment about her in that instance. Other lawyers may disagree, and I'd respect their opinion if they did.
It's my suspicion that most lawyers wouldn't make that kind of statement either way without more info.

My point is that it is pretty silly to say "person x did a REALLY bad job" when you only have cherry-picked examples of that job to choose from, and when you've never even worked that job yourself, or know what that job entails in detail.

to me, this is common sense.

---
www.ikirejones.com
FW16: After Migration.

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
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Fri Dec-05-14 01:04 PM

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26. "nope, you got it. n/m"
In response to Reply # 25


  

          

  

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PROMO
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28. "you're being too literal."
In response to Reply # 25


  

          

but it's fine.

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
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Fri Dec-05-14 01:21 PM

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30. "she had over 20 complaints against her, and was disbarred"
In response to Reply # 28


  

          

she left ppl confused. that's what the jurors said. that's what her client said. her other clients complained against her. but unless you're a lawyer, or work in the law field, you can't say that her defense in this case was terrible.

if everyone is confused as to your defense and where you're going, you're doing a terrible job.

I think I am educated enough to be able to make that claim.

we wrong Promo.

  

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PROMO
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31. "oh, i feel you."
In response to Reply # 30


  

          

i was just talking about woeisme's hit dog hollarin'

i even qualified my use of "terrible" so that you couldn't take it literally and then explained what i thought it must be like for the jurors.

so yeah, i dunno why he's beefin.

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
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Fri Dec-05-14 01:37 PM

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32. "i know you feel me, "
In response to Reply # 31


  

          

I'm just being sarcastic.
i just hate the implication that if you don't work in this field you can't comment negatively...i'm sure if we said that was amazing, no one would say "lol at y'all saying she's good".

  

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woe.is.me.
Member since Aug 06th 2007
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Fri Dec-05-14 02:01 PM

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33. "she had complaints about her in different cases"
In response to Reply # 30
Fri Dec-05-14 02:02 PM by woe.is.me.

  

          

what do complaints in other cases have to do with THIS specific case we are discussing? We are talking about Adnan's 2nd trial right?

her client said he had great respect and admiration for her to this day. does that sound like someone who believed they received "terrible" representation?

(Noted that he is filing an appeal based on the point that she did not agree with him taking a deal, as he should because it is an avenue he has yet to exhaust)

>she left ppl confused. that's what the jurors said. that's
>what her client said.

yes, he said he didn't always know what her plan was, and her lines of questioning weren't always effective as the prosecution.

HEY GUESS WHAT, THIS HAPPENS ALL THE TIME!
Almost every trial and lawyer has points of confusion and arguments that just don't come across well.
Arguing and cross examination is hard!
Ask Sowhat. Stop any trial lawyer in the street and ask them!

>but unless you're a lawyer, or work in the law field, you
>can't say that her defense in this case was terrible.

this is my point entirely.
I didn't say she did a great job. I have no idea.
I stated that based on the information provided, i have no basis to say she did a terrible job.
My point is that as a lawyer, I understand that these things alone do not indicate that someone's performance was woeful.

I personally found her cadence annoying in the tiny portions I heard her speaking. But that has nothing to do with her capability, effectiveness and dedication as a lawyer in that trial.

>if everyone is confused as to your defense and where you're
>going, you're doing a terrible job.

this is just a gross over-simplification with little factual basis.

---
www.ikirejones.com
FW16: After Migration.

  

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jane eyre
Member since Jan 16th 2007
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Thu Dec-04-14 01:55 PM

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13. "hm."
In response to Reply # 0


          

Started listening because of this post.

I think Adnan has something to do with the murder. And may have done it. I'm on episode 9.

The thing I can't get past: in my mind Adnan hasn't given a sufficient or convincing explanation about all things Jay.

Why would Jay name Adnan? Connect him to the crime? I don't buy the theories floated by Koenig. I think Adnan and Jay are lying. I think both are likely telling some truth, too.

No matter how Jay's version of events are discredited and change, I always come back to Jay knowing where the body and car was etc. How'd he come to know that? It's odd to me that Adnan hasn't asserted or implied that Jay killed Hae or had something to do with her murder (unless I missed that).

Annoying that it took Koenig 6-7 months to talk to Jay and that the suggestion that she should was so "gasp" worthy. Not sure, at this point, she's as objective as she could be. Talking to Jay seems like a no brainer. Maybe she didn't want to face the possibility Adnan might he guilty. Not being so impacted by her meeting with him was intense and odd. Wish we could hear from Hae's parents, too.

Adnan is charming. Blah. When he was telling Koenig she didn't know him, I was like: game set match. She better listen to that.

Not mad about the news of an appeal, yet feel Hae has been lost in all of the coverage about Adnan. I feel badly for her family. And the podcast puts him center stage in away that I sometimes struggle with.

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
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Fri Dec-05-14 11:34 AM

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15. "Adnan has nothing to say about Jay..."
In response to Reply # 13


  

          

he doesn't know why his friend would do this (yes he does, even if he's innocent he knows why), and he's seems uncaring about the whole situation with Jay. While I understand "the truth needs no proof", I'd be damned if I let my "friend" lie on me...everything is such a mess and the whole thing with jay is the reason why i can't be 100% with Adnan.

  

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Sarah_Bellum
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Fri Dec-05-14 12:46 PM

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23. "^^^^ alla dis"
In response to Reply # 15


  

          

Jay has expressed no direct anger at Jay, at least from what we've heard. That doesn't seem right or natural. A friend straight up lied on you and you're doing 20 years behind bars on a murder and you're response is "I don't know why he did that" followed by a shoulder shug. He's not even saying Jay did the murder, which is the only the only logical response is Adnan didn't do it. Adan definitely know something more. There's a lot he's not saying.
___________________________________________________________


DJTB YOMM

  

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jane eyre
Member since Jan 16th 2007
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Fri Dec-05-14 01:07 PM

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27. "I'm more or less on the same page."
In response to Reply # 15


          

>he doesn't know why his friend would do this (yes he does, even if >he's innocent he knows why)

That's what I think, too.

My ears perked up when a member of the track team, 15 years later, reported to Koenig that it wasn't unusual to see Jay and Adnan riding together because Jay would drop Adnan off at track practice all the time-- and no one even thought about it.

That memory/account strikes me as fairly reliable.

Yet Adnan can't remember much about Jay or his "friendship" with Jay? Jay who seems, by all accounts, to have been "high school weird"?

>and he's seems uncaring about the whole situation with Jay.

Agreed.

Koenig says flat out to Adnan, when discussing blame and accountability (as Adnan is taking responsibility for his actions) that he could blame Jay.

He downplays it and doesn't even say anything about it.

>While I understand "the truth needs no proof", I'd be damned if I >let my "friend" lie on me...

Right.

Not getting why not more outrage about Jay. Maybe there's a reason for it that makes perfect sense.

Even if I was a forgiving soul, I would be trying to understand WHY Jay was pinning a crime on me, if I was innocent.

I don't understand why part of Adnan's claim about his innocence doesn't include a more vigorous examination of Jay or the day in question.

>and the whole thing with jay is the reason why i can't be 100% >with Adnan.

Agreed.

The Jay factor is the only thing that bothers me. Something isn't right there. It's possible that the something not being right has nothing to do with Adnan and his guilt or innocence.

Did Jay do it? Alone? With someone else? Then pin it on Adnan?
Did Jay hear about the murder from someone else and then pin it on Adnan? Hear it from Adnan? Was he with Adnan? Did he and Adnan agree to a story and then Jay decided not to go along with the agreement?

I mean. Ok. Jay has this story. WHY is Adnan part of it?!

I want to know how/where Jay got his story!!

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Fri Dec-05-14 11:36 AM

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16. "How Did Adnan explain Jay knowing where the car was?"
In response to Reply # 13


  

          


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

  

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jane eyre
Member since Jan 16th 2007
715 posts
Fri Dec-05-14 01:13 PM

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29. "RE: How Did Adnan explain Jay knowing where the car was?"
In response to Reply # 16


          

Hm....I'm not sure Adnan explains that.

  

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thegodcam
Member since Oct 22nd 2004
41531 posts
Sun Dec-07-14 08:48 PM

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34. "the weirdest thing to me is Adnan sayin he deserves 2 b in jail"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

i wanna give him the benefit of the doubt but he often sounds like he's at peace being in jail because he knows he actually responsible 4 the murder....

but honestly, i have n oidead wtf happened.... yo yhis shit is addictive

*******************************************************
i will not let finite disappointment undermine infinite hope
- Cory Booker

Football is a simple game; 22 men chase a ball for 90 minutes, and at the end the Germans always win
- Gary Lineker

  

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rambunctious
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Tue Dec-09-14 03:24 PM

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41. "yeah, that made me o_O"
In response to Reply # 34


          

  

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Euameio
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Tue Dec-09-14 02:58 PM

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35. "Serial solved ?!"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


http://josephkahn.tumblr.com/post/104768051478/i-solved-the-serial-podcast

  

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Zion3Lion
Member since Dec 23rd 2002
16767 posts
Tue Dec-09-14 03:01 PM

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36. "been saying they both did it from the beginning "
In response to Reply # 35


  

          

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Tue Dec-09-14 03:11 PM

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37. "Mayne they didn't have anything knew we ain't been saying. Here is"
In response to Reply # 35


  

          

the problem with this theory. If Jay helped, why wouldn't Adnan put the blame on Jay?

Think about it, assuming they both were involved, Jay points the finger at Adnan why would he not point the finger back and say it wasn't me it was the other dude!??!?

If if more evidence points to Adnan it would still be an argument that creates reasonable doubt.

Doesn't make sense. Unless...


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

  

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rambunctious
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Tue Dec-09-14 03:17 PM

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39. "RE: Mayne they didn't have anything knew we ain't been saying. Here is"
In response to Reply # 37


          

>the problem with this theory. If Jay helped, why wouldn't
>Adnan put the blame on Jay?
>
>Think about it, assuming they both were involved, Jay points
>the finger at Adnan why would he not point the finger back and
>say it wasn't me it was the other dude!??!?
>
>If if more evidence points to Adnan it would still be an
>argument that creates reasonable doubt.
>
>Doesn't make sense. Unless...

My guess is because pointing the finger at Jay shows that Adnan knows more than he lets on and/or it would unearth evidence that strongly points at Adnan.

  

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rambunctious
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Tue Dec-09-14 03:14 PM

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38. "that letter is what makes me think Adnan did it."
In response to Reply # 35
Tue Dec-09-14 03:19 PM by rambunctious

          

he says he was not upset about their last break-up. yett, he was upset the other times they broke and this time he was cool even though she found a new boyfriend quick fast and he's older, too? not to mention the feeling of betraying one's culture and lying to his parents so he can be with Hae...yeah i think he did and Jay either helped kill or helped him move Hae. I think Jay is probably more involved than he lets on and kept mum to get a better deal, which he did get. It makes no sense to me as to why Jay would kill Hae alone. Like said above, there's a witness showing that Jay picked up Adnan. Also, if Jay and Adnan weren't that close, why would he let Jay borrow his car and phone.

Lastly, who else would want to kill Hae?

I also think Adnan's personality makes it easier to have reasonable doubt cause he seems like an affable person and reminds us of people we may know. We're hearing this from Adnan's point of view through the series.

With all that said, there is enough doubt that would have led me to not convict him, though.

  

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TR808
Member since Oct 24th 2012
2012 posts
Tue Dec-09-14 04:00 PM

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43. "Im cool with my boys and all but...."
In response to Reply # 38


  

          

I might let them use my car if they needed it... but my phone...??


nah

You take the blue pill, the story ends. You wake up in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. You take the red pill, you stay in Wonderland, and I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes.

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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Tue Dec-09-14 06:08 PM

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47. "You gotta remember that these are different times. It's the late 90s"
In response to Reply # 43


          

Cell phones weren't really out there like that and they weren't an item essential to life. I'd argue if you were willing to lend a car, then you were definitely more than willing to lend your phone.

_______________________________________

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Tue Dec-09-14 03:18 PM

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40. "Idk, the more you think about it is hard to consider anyone else but"
In response to Reply # 0
Tue Dec-09-14 03:19 PM by Buddy_Gilapagos

  

          

Adnan.


Let's start with Jay definitely was involved. Either he did it or he helped the person who did it.

If he did it why wouldn't the cops focus on him? Why didn't Adnan point the finger at Jay (especially if he knew he had some involvement)? Have you ever heard a case of the cops so actively not trying to pin a wrap on the black kid who they know was involved? More importantly, Adnan could have easily made Jay a credible suspect and gotten Jay convicted or at the very least create reasonable doubt for himself.

So if Jay didn't do it, then that means he at least helped. Could have helped someone else? No, because Adnan would have again at least been trying to pin the wrap on Jay.

It had to be Adnan. It had to be someone who had access to Hae during that short window where she left the school and then did not pick up her young family member. That most likely points to someone at the school. Someone who asked her for a ride and then told the police that he asked her for a ride but changed his story when it was clear that would be incriminating.


Had to be Adnan because, like Jay said, who else could it be?



**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
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Tue Dec-09-14 05:09 PM

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45. "It's pretty clear it's either Adnan or Jay..."
In response to Reply # 40


  

          

however, if it's Jay on his own (or some one else other than Adnan), then how could Adnan ever say "it was Jay", he can't point the finger at him, he has no proof. All he has is the fact that Jay knew where the car was...and he has no explanation for that, but Jay does...so either Jay did it without Adnan and pinned it on him OR

Adnan and Jay did it. And like someone said above, Adnan can't contest it or say what really happened without implicating himself. And he wont do that now because he's claimed innocence so long...but if Adnan was involved, he killed her. And Jay helped but moreso than he's saying.

I actually want to believe Adnan didn't do it but when you think about it, there's really only two ways this went and if Jay had of said he knew nothing he doesn't know what that girl was talking about, denied everything chances are Adnan wouldn't have gone to jail.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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48. "I think if Adnan didn't do it, he would have to point the finger at Jay ..."
In response to Reply # 45


  

          

He would be like, "Everything Jay is saying is a lie, and he knew where the car was, since I know I didn't do it, he must be involved".

Instead he is saying something more like I don't know why Jay is saying what he is saying.



>however, if it's Jay on his own (or some one else other than
>Adnan), then how could Adnan ever say "it was Jay", he can't
>point the finger at him, he has no proof. All he has is the
>fact that Jay knew where the car was...and he has no
>explanation for that, but Jay does...so either Jay did it
>without Adnan and pinned it on him OR
>
>Adnan and Jay did it. And like someone said above, Adnan can't
>contest it or say what really happened without implicating
>himself. And he wont do that now because he's claimed
>innocence so long...but if Adnan was involved, he killed her.
>And Jay helped but moreso than he's saying.
>
>I actually want to believe Adnan didn't do it but when you
>think about it, there's really only two ways this went and if
>Jay had of said he knew nothing he doesn't know what that girl
>was talking about, denied everything chances are Adnan
>wouldn't have gone to jail.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

  

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TR808
Member since Oct 24th 2012
2012 posts
Tue Dec-09-14 03:24 PM

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42. "I dont get it at all..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Jay knew too many details not to be charged for any involvement in this mess..

and Adnon.... is too lax and really his whole demeanor is like "i dont know anything"


You take the blue pill, the story ends. You wake up in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. You take the red pill, you stay in Wonderland, and I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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44. "Want a credible theory (that I have no basis for)?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I've been struggling with why did Adnan's lawyer push for a mistrial in a case she was winning?

My theory is that she at some point figured out Adnan was indeed the murderer. Once she found out she threw the trial, and then did a bad job on the next go round.

Go ahead and let your head explode.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
1373 posts
Tue Dec-09-14 05:11 PM

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46. "Nah she had too much pride for that..."
In response to Reply # 44


  

          

she shouldn't have requested the mistrial when it looked like Adnan would get off...maybe she didn't have faith.

More reasonable though is that she requested the mistrial so she could work on the case and get more money...because as we all know, she kept taking money from her clients and not paying ppl and they have no clue where that money went. What she didn't bank on was the second trial not going the way the first one did.

  

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L_O_Quent
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Thu Dec-11-14 07:51 AM

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49. "episode 11 has me shook "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

because it doesn't seem like there will be even a semblance of closure.

Also, where the hell is Don?

The offspring :-D

PSN & XBL: LOQuent

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
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Thu Dec-11-14 09:25 AM

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50. "I highly doubt we will find out who the *real* killer is..."
In response to Reply # 49


  

          

Adnan's appeal goes to trial in Jan and while they could be keeping info secret, the apparent basis of his appeal is the mishandling of the trials by Guitteriez and his alibi for the date the murder supposedly happened.


  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Thu Dec-11-14 11:47 AM

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53. "We must remind ourselves this isn't a tv show"
In response to Reply # 49


  

          

Short the show itself generating new information from listeners I don't see how the story can neatly resolve itself.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
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Thu Dec-11-14 09:28 AM

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51. "Rumors..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I wonder why Sarah didn't mention the rumor that she heard that she wasn't able to verify. It seems odd for her to even reference it and then not say what it is that she heard. No?

  

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earthseed
Member since Feb 26th 2004
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Thu Dec-11-14 10:19 AM

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52. "yeah, i wanted to know what it was. like you can't leave us hanging like"
In response to Reply # 51


  

          

that...

maybe? hopefully? it'll come up next week

probably not, but i can hope.

now go runtelldat, ho.

  

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Dae021
Member since Mar 12th 2003
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Thu Dec-11-14 12:12 PM

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55. "She couldn't substantiate it, so it just becomes more stuff"
In response to Reply # 51


          

To weight against Adnan really for no reason. So there's no reason to put it out there.

Get out the room,
http://getouttheroom.podomatic.com

http://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/get-out-the-room/id525657893

Situation Podemy love

https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/situation-podemy/id620232249

Situation Podemy : www.situationpodemy.wordpres

  

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Oak27
Member since Apr 17th 2005
13204 posts
Thu Dec-11-14 12:18 PM

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56. "So she shouldn't have put it out there period"
In response to Reply # 55


  

          

What's the point of saying "I heard this rumor but can't confirm or deny so I won't get into it" ?

  

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Frank Mackey
Member since May 23rd 2006
2907 posts
Fri Dec-12-14 10:43 AM

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74. "I think she was using it as an extreme example..."
In response to Reply # 56


          

of all the shit she & the show are getting thrown at her from "sources" and the probable amount of time they spend rifling through it all.

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
1373 posts
Thu Dec-11-14 12:20 PM

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57. "totally get that, but why isolate it separate from other issues? "
In response to Reply # 55


  

          

like she said there were some minors ones, couldn't substantiate, then says "there's a story so incriminating, that if it's true, we're done" an then says someone said something and i looked into it and it wasn't true...i don't get the point if pointing it out specifically if she didn't want to say what it was...she could have easily said i heard these things going from small to major but when i followed up with ppl,i could never substantiate and most ppl said xyz, but then there's the stealing...
blah blah blah...

i mean whatever is clever but that would have been interesting to hear.

  

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CaptNish
Member since Mar 09th 2004
14496 posts
Thu Dec-11-14 12:33 PM

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58. "Yeah, that was bullshit."
In response to Reply # 57


  

          

I mean, that really pissed me off. Don't sell it as such a bombshell and then come with a "Or nah."

_
Yo! That’s My Jawn: The Podcast - Available Now!
http://linktr.ee/yothatsmyjawn

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
1373 posts
Thu Dec-11-14 12:34 PM

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59. "lmao that's really what she did too."
In response to Reply # 58


  

          

  

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Ryan M
Member since Oct 21st 2002
43814 posts
Thu Dec-11-14 12:57 PM

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60. "Clickbait you can't click."
In response to Reply # 51


  

          

------------------------------

17x NBA Champions

  

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Sarah_Bellum
Charter member
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Thu Dec-11-14 11:59 AM

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54. "The whole "don't talk bad about Jay " angle"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Sorry... it doesn't make sense. I don't buy it. It's clear that if Adnan is innocent Jay is the only person that openly admits to knowing about the killing of Hae. He would have had to frame Adnan. He's the only person that points the finger directly at Adnan. To have nothing to say about it?!?! So, Adnan wants us to believe that the real killer is running free and he has no feelings about it or even comment about it. Naw, homes.
___________________________________________________________


DJTB YOMM

  

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Monkey Genius
Member since Mar 04th 2005
8107 posts
Thu Dec-11-14 01:12 PM

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61. "He does have feelings about it. He's says he does."
In response to Reply # 54


  

          

Or rather he says how could you think he has no feelings on it.

He just doesn't think it's to his advantage to speak on it.

----------------------------------
I have a webcomic: www.watchthecomic.com

My webcomic has a page: www.facebook.com/watchyourheadcomic

  

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PROMO
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Thu Dec-11-14 01:29 PM

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62. "also, we don't know the legal repercussions of doing that. "
In response to Reply # 61


  

          

right now his focus is on saying he got incompetent representation and that's why he should get a new trial.

to start screaming "Jay did it!!! I didn't do it!!!" might throw off that defense he's trying to orchestrate.

  

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Sarah_Bellum
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Thu Dec-11-14 01:40 PM

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64. "That's true..."
In response to Reply # 62
Thu Dec-11-14 01:42 PM by Sarah_Bellum

  

          

but saying, "I'm mad that jay made these claims about me that aren't true" is different than saying Jay did it and none of what Jay said is true. He doesn't have to specify exactly where Jay lied but just that he lied about him murdering Hae, and that's upsetting.
___________________________________________________________


DJTB YOMM

  

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Sarah_Bellum
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Thu Dec-11-14 01:39 PM

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63. "Yeah, I heard him say that and don't buy it"
In response to Reply # 61


  

          

That was his response after Konig basically said.... Hey people have a problem believing you because you haven't said so much as a peep about Jay who, if your innocent, must have lied to set you up for 20 years in the bing.
Once again Adnan is making the wrong decisions about when to be aloof when being direct could help him gain support. His silence on this has the opposite affect of making him look guilty.
His whole story all along has been... I don't know, I don't know, I don't know. But he certainly is aware of his own feelings about the person that would have had to set him up, he won't talk about it. He doesn't have to speculate about how Jay did it or when it happened or why.
At minimum any where a long the line he could have said he's mad that Jay would say these things that didn't happen and he's paying the consequences. He never said he was mad that Jay lied or betrayed him or anything. He only said, "I don't know why Jay would say that" and followed by a pregnant silence and "I have feelings about it but it won't help me to share them." That is not a normal response someone getting your locked up for something you had no part in. There's no way he got over a wrong that big. I think his feelings about this are wrapped up in a truth he hasn't told. He can't express those feelings without revealing some of the truth that he doesn't us to know.



___________________________________________________________


DJTB YOMM

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
1373 posts
Thu Dec-11-14 03:39 PM

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69. "I think it's important to note that we don't know what else"
In response to Reply # 63


  

          

has happened all these years he was in prison, we don't know what reactions he has, we don't know how mad or upset or angry he has been. All we know Sarah's side of their conversations, which are edited and presented from her point of view.

If he was on these calls, angry mad or upset, it does look like "y'all said he couldn't get mad or angry, but y'all are wrong." he's actually exhibiting behavior I learned in anger management, it's a coping mechanism. He's right, it doesnt' benefit him to be mad now. At all. it wont' change the situation.

however, i do think if jay lied on him, he knows why. he just doesn't want to expose whatever it is.

and if jay didn't lie on him, that's why he's quiet.

  

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thegodcam
Member since Oct 22nd 2004
41531 posts
Fri Dec-12-14 10:46 AM

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75. "if my memory serves me well, he did make a direct comment to Jay"
In response to Reply # 69


  

          

when they were in court... something about how he should be ashamed of himself... and I think the judge asked him to behave himself....

but it's blurry... anybody else remember that?

*******************************************************
i will not let finite disappointment undermine infinite hope
- Cory Booker

Football is a simple game; 22 men chase a ball for 90 minutes, and at the end the Germans always win
- Gary Lineker

  

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Monkey Genius
Member since Mar 04th 2005
8107 posts
Fri Dec-12-14 01:40 PM

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82. "Yep. But that could mean one of two things."
In response to Reply # 75


  

          

----------------------------------
I have a webcomic: www.watchthecomic.com

My webcomic has a page: www.facebook.com/watchyourheadcomic

  

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WarriorPoet415
Member since Sep 30th 2003
17897 posts
Thu Dec-11-14 01:50 PM

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65. "Exactly What Type of Closure Are Y'all Expecting????"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I hear so many people say "I wonder what's going to happen?" or "how will this end?"

YOU ALREADY KNOW.

Sarah made it clear that most of these episodes are only produced about a week before they are available for download. And she's still talking to Adnan in jail.

This past week, she told some of the people from the local mosque that they can still write Adnan in jail if they wanted to.

Your boy is in the bing and if there was a decision coming down on his status from the courts, I doubt they'd wait for the airing of the last ep of a podcast to announce it.

We're just not going to get your typical TV/Movie style closure here.

I expect next week to just more or less a recap of what we've learned, and I'm sure Sarah will have some soliloquy on how looking into this case changed her, blah, blah blah, then a final legal status statement on Adnan's appeals or whatever and then we'll be left adrift.

Anything revelatory is highly unlikely.
______________________________________________________________________________

cscpov.blogspot.com

"There's a fine line between persistence and foolishness..."
-unknown

"To Each His Reach"

  

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PROMO
Charter member
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Thu Dec-11-14 02:06 PM

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66. "I mean, that's no where to go except to explain..."
In response to Reply # 65


  

          

where things are now and how that might turn out for Adnan.

So, I don't expect some revelation like "boom, Jay actually did do it!"

  

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atruhead
Charter member
85230 posts
Tue Dec-23-14 12:15 AM

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123. "man you called it"
In response to Reply # 65


  

          

>I hear so many people say "I wonder what's going to happen?"
>or "how will this end?"
>
>YOU ALREADY KNOW.
>
>Sarah made it clear that most of these episodes are only
>produced about a week before they are available for download.
>And she's still talking to Adnan in jail.
>
>This past week, she told some of the people from the local
>mosque that they can still write Adnan in jail if they wanted
>to.
>
>Your boy is in the bing and if there was a decision coming
>down on his status from the courts, I doubt they'd wait for
>the airing of the last ep of a podcast to announce it.
>
>We're just not going to get your typical TV/Movie style
>closure here.
>
>I expect next week to just more or less a recap of what we've
>learned, and I'm sure Sarah will have some soliloquy on how
>looking into this case changed her, blah, blah blah, then a
>final legal status statement on Adnan's appeals or whatever
>and then we'll be left adrift.
>
>Anything revelatory is highly unlikely.
>______________________________________________________________________________
>
>cscpov.blogspot.com
>
>"There's a fine line between persistence and foolishness..."
>-unknown
>
>"To Each His Reach"

  

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LES
Member since Oct 17th 2006
4533 posts
Thu Dec-11-14 02:24 PM

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67. "she was on Colbert Report yesterday apparently"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://thecolbertreport.cc.com/guests/sarah-koenig

__________
http://leswrite.com/

  

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woe.is.me.
Member since Aug 06th 2007
13957 posts
Thu Dec-11-14 02:30 PM

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68. "it's fascinating to watch this play out b/c so far"
In response to Reply # 67
Thu Dec-11-14 02:30 PM by woe.is.me.

  

          

it appears that the only winners in any of this are...the makers of "Serial".

---
www.ikirejones.com
FW16: After Migration.

  

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blackrussian
Member since Oct 17th 2010
6498 posts
Sat Dec-13-14 07:27 AM

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83. "this is very much how i feel about it all"
In response to Reply # 68


  

          

>it appears that the only winners in any of this are...the
>makers of "Serial".

it makes me uncomfortable, despite the fact that i too have been reeled in.

  

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astralblak
Member since Apr 05th 2007
20029 posts
Tue Dec-30-14 01:45 PM

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137. "YUP"
In response to Reply # 83


  

          

.

  

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Dae021
Member since Mar 12th 2003
39375 posts
Fri Dec-12-14 10:35 AM

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72. "She has a face for radio"
In response to Reply # 67


          

Get out the room,
http://getouttheroom.podomatic.com

http://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/get-out-the-room/id525657893

Situation Podemy love

https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/situation-podemy/id620232249

Situation Podemy : www.situationpodemy.wordpres

  

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thegodcam
Member since Oct 22nd 2004
41531 posts
Fri Dec-12-14 10:41 AM

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73. "ouch"
In response to Reply # 72


  

          

*******************************************************
i will not let finite disappointment undermine infinite hope
- Cory Booker

Football is a simple game; 22 men chase a ball for 90 minutes, and at the end the Germans always win
- Gary Lineker

  

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John Forte
Member since Feb 22nd 2013
15361 posts
Thu Dec-11-14 05:04 PM

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70. "This ep (11) was turribul"
In response to Reply # 0


          

I'd rather listen to her read the Serial subreddit for 42min.

  

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Niq96st
Member since Jun 16th 2005
8396 posts
Thu Dec-11-14 06:10 PM

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71. "I feel I could have done w/o this episode "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Like everything was just a foregone conclusion...like filler material.

With one episode left, I feel Sarah's either going to drop a bombshell which provides Adnan DIDN'T do it

or

she'll just leave us without a resolution. Which seems extremely likely.

I gather that she just likes Adnan too much to tell the rest of the world that yes indeed, he is a pathological killer. She probably knew--and could prove--from the beginning that he was innocent. Well, that's how I hope it shapes up.

I'll just say this, though: if it's indeed proven that Adnan did do it, then I'm even more naive about this world than I thought. Because throughout the series, he's been convincing as fuck.

_______________________________
Maintain chill at all times.

  

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CaptNish
Member since Mar 09th 2004
14496 posts
Fri Dec-12-14 11:19 AM

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76. "I'm sorry, that Best Buy tweet was fucking funny (LINK)"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/best-buy-apologizes-insensitive-serial-tweet-article-1.2042390

Fuck you, that's awesome. No one is really fucking offended.

_
Yo! That’s My Jawn: The Podcast - Available Now!
http://linktr.ee/yothatsmyjawn

  

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PROMO
Charter member
31257 posts
Fri Dec-12-14 12:37 PM

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77. "jesus h. christ. you can't even be funny anymore."
In response to Reply # 76


  

          

i get why all these comics are so on edge now (something Chris Rock has discussed a lot lately).

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
1373 posts
Fri Dec-12-14 12:58 PM

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78. "i cried real tears at that tweet, it was hilarious. "
In response to Reply # 76


  

          

  

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nayaa
Member since Oct 06th 2009
20190 posts
Fri Dec-12-14 01:01 PM

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79. "lmao i like it"
In response to Reply # 76


  

          

~
IG: @fireysky

  

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thegodcam
Member since Oct 22nd 2004
41531 posts
Fri Dec-12-14 01:32 PM

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80. "u gotta be retarded to be offended by that tweet"
In response to Reply # 76


  

          

*******************************************************
i will not let finite disappointment undermine infinite hope
- Cory Booker

Football is a simple game; 22 men chase a ball for 90 minutes, and at the end the Germans always win
- Gary Lineker

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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49618 posts
Sat Dec-13-14 08:22 AM

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84. "or friends and family of Hae."
In response to Reply # 80


  

          

If a reference to your daughter's murder was used in a marketing tweet you may feel differently.

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
15900 posts
Fri Dec-12-14 01:33 PM

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81. "Haha"
In response to Reply # 76


          

_______________________________________

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
1373 posts
Thu Dec-18-14 09:10 AM

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85. "This was a good podcast...(*spoiler may be inside*)"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

it really left me wanting to know more about Syad's case and I hope that he his conviction is overturned and he's let out of jail. We shall see.

In typical fashion, this episode presents all of the info we learned from previous episodes but does present some new info (such as the letter to Don/Dom, info on Hae's plans for that day, etc). They do revisit the Innocence Project and they present an alternative scenario which I had heard before, (serial killer), and I think that would actually work IF it wasn't for the fact Jay knew where the car was. After doing the DNA work, if it was the Ronald Lee Moore, then how did Jay know where the car was? Was Jay in any way connected to Ronald? So many questions...and how crazy is Jay to tell random ppl he helped Adnan?

Anyway I think Jay did it. I think Adnan knows this and he knows why or how. And he can't say because he knows Jay will kill his family. And Jay is the real psycho path. That's what I'm going with.

  

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earthseed
Member since Feb 26th 2004
26989 posts
Thu Dec-18-14 10:44 AM

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86. "definitely interested to know about...(spoiler possible)"
In response to Reply # 85


  

          

how the dna information will turn out.

hopefully they'll have a special serial update when that comes back.

i will be doing a checking of all the information periodically to see what's up with his case.

and hopefully the new serial season 2 will be equally as attention grabbing as this one!

now go runtelldat, ho.

  

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Melanism
Charter member
20453 posts
Thu Dec-18-14 10:49 AM

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87. "I still think Adnan did it alone or with Jay but..."
In response to Reply # 85


          

...all of this was for his family. I think the letter at the end of the last episode sealed it for me. I think his concern is that SK is going to convince the only people left who believes he's innocent that he committed this crime and then he'll have no one.

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
1373 posts
Thu Dec-18-14 11:20 AM

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89. "nah I feel like the West Side Hitman or whatever prolly did it."
In response to Reply # 87


  

          

Like Adnan wanted Hae dead, Jay was like "i know someone". they tried to do a proper alibi but it got messed up so Adnan played stupid, Jay put it on Adnan cuz the real killer will kill everyone. Adnan cant' say what really happened but he ain't kill her. maybe he killed her then called and told them to come get her dead ass body and then adnan and jay had to bury her, putting adnan in shock and jay scared.

lol.

but nah, i feel like Sarah. If Adnan did it, why would he agree to this?

  

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PROMO
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31257 posts
Thu Dec-18-14 11:16 AM

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88. "well, they brought some of that hot fiyah back that they had in the firs..."
In response to Reply # 85


  

          

half of the season.

i wonder if we'll ever hear some real proof to adnan's guilt one way or the other?

i guess if they can get this DNA testing done we'll hear about it in the news if nothing else.

  

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Monkey Genius
Member since Mar 04th 2005
8107 posts
Thu Dec-18-14 10:23 PM

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99. "They don't really believe Ronald Lee Moore has anything to do with it."
In response to Reply # 85


  

          

He's just the loophole they're using to get the DNA tested. That's what old girl meant by 'Big picture'.

----------------------------------
I have a webcomic: www.watchthecomic.com

My webcomic has a page: www.facebook.com/watchyourheadcomic

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
1373 posts
Fri Dec-19-14 10:54 AM

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101. "I don't get why they need an excuse..."
In response to Reply # 99


  

          

do you actually need an excuse to get DNA tested in a criminal case? seems to me just the fact that "this could exonerate me" would be enough of an "excuse."

But I get what you're saying. It just seems to me that the male lawyer helper thinks that it *could* be him and it's not just an excuse for him.

  

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gumz
Member since Jan 09th 2005
20118 posts
Wed Dec-31-14 03:42 PM

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138. "They wouldn't have if the case was still open..."
In response to Reply # 101


  

          

but it's considered solved so they have to get permission to touch the evidence again. Should've been tested at the offset though.

http://www.youtube.com/user/gumzization
twitter: @BrosefMalone

  

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double negative
Member since Dec 14th 2007
22151 posts
Thu Dec-18-14 11:36 AM

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90. "GOOOOOOOOODAMN THIS SHIT *spoiler*"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

no fucking conclusion? after all that shit? no fucking release? how dare they stroke my mail kimp and not help me get off.

***********************************************************
https://soundcloud.com/swageyph/yph-die-with-me

  

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PROMO
Charter member
31257 posts
Thu Dec-18-14 11:53 AM

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91. "speaking of mail kimp: did y'all see Koenig on Colbert last week?"
In response to Reply # 90


  

          

i fucking died when he was asking about how it would conclude and whether or not by the end of the series the girl would learn how to pronounce "mail chimp."


http://thecolbertreport.cc.com/videos/8i6klx/sarah-koenig

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
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Thu Dec-18-14 11:55 AM

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92. "why are you suprised? you know he has a trial in Jan!"
In response to Reply # 90


  

          

so of course, ain't no conclusion.

  

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IkeMoses
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Thu Dec-18-14 11:48 PM

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100. "this real life."
In response to Reply # 90


  

          

-30-
You know it's drama, but it sound real good.

  

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CaptNish
Member since Mar 09th 2004
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Thu Dec-18-14 12:16 PM

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93. "#TeamJay"
In response to Reply # 0
Thu Dec-18-14 12:16 PM by CaptNish

  

          

Sarah's producer is the only person on this show that has spoken logically about this case lol. I'm glad she gave her the floor.

Look, I'm just not buying the random killer theory. Nothing about that explains Jay one bit. HE KNEW WHERE THE FUCKING CAR WAS AND WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A RANDOM KILLER!!!! Jesus Christ....

There are three things I see as plausible:

- Jay did it (or hired someone to do it)
- Adnan did it (or hired someone to do it)
- Jay and Adnan did it (or hired someone to do it)

I don't buy Jay doing it alone because I do not see a motive at all. Not any of this "He was mad that Adnan was friends with his girl." None of this "He wanted to fuck Haw to get back at Adnan's friendship with his girl." Nothing. I'm open to listening to any theory of Jay's motive, but I see none so far that have given me pause. The fact that in 12 episodes, Sarah Koenig did not directly ask Adnan, "Why would Jay put this on you?" or drill him about Jay is crazy to me.

That conversation with Don was perfect in pointing out how ludicrous it is that Adnan "doesn't remember" what he did that day. And then the friend of Jay's who didn't know Adnan's name but knew Jay was scared for his life? Maaaaaaaan....

I'm satisfied with the ending, and had I been a juror, even with my thinking he did it, I would've voted to acquit much like Sarah, but until anyone can tell me a plausible motive for Jay to lie, I ain't buying that Adnan is innocent.

_
Yo! That’s My Jawn: The Podcast - Available Now!
http://linktr.ee/yothatsmyjawn

  

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Ryan M
Member since Oct 21st 2002
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Thu Dec-18-14 09:29 PM

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98. "Big picture man. Big picture."
In response to Reply # 93


  

          

------------------------------

17x NBA Champions

  

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CaptNish
Member since Mar 09th 2004
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Fri Dec-19-14 04:38 PM

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112. "It took me listening to the AV Club's SERIAL SERIAL to realize...."
In response to Reply # 98


  

          

...what she meant here. It isn't about it being the random killer dude. It's about getting the DNA tested. I get it now.

_
Yo! That’s My Jawn: The Podcast - Available Now!
http://linktr.ee/yothatsmyjawn

  

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PROMO
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Fri Dec-19-14 04:46 PM

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113. "EXACTLY."
In response to Reply # 112


  

          

Because even if it doesn't match the rapist dude, if it doesn't match Adnan it could exculpate him.

  

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Zion3Lion
Member since Dec 23rd 2002
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Thu Dec-18-14 12:41 PM

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94. "I stopped listening a couple episodes back"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

i honestly got bored with it and nothing they were saying had changed my mind.
Decided to listen to the finale, and yea I still believe Adnan did it with Jay.
That DNA evidence could be a game changer but then you still have how did Jay know about the car location?
for me this podcast started out really good and interesting and engaging but yea it lost it's luster for me after awhile, the finale was no diff.

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
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Thu Dec-18-14 09:23 PM

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97. "Me too. I've missed the past 2 eps and don't feel the urge to listen"
In response to Reply # 94


          

It started out on fire and kind of lost it's luster imo

_______________________________________

  

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Chanson
Member since Nov 09th 2004
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Thu Dec-18-14 07:27 PM

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95. "*spoiler*"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Really interested to see how the DNA thing plays out.

mind
--------
matter

  

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nayaa
Member since Oct 06th 2009
20190 posts
Thu Dec-18-14 09:16 PM

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96. "a weirdly satisfying* conclusion"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

*as satisfying as can be given the facts, of course.

~
IG: @fireysky

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Fri Dec-19-14 02:49 PM

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102. "Adnan's whole defense is "He doesn't seem like the type to do this""
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I really can't put any weight on people swearing up and down they remember what happened that day. I mean how can anyone say with certainity things like "I definitely remember him putting the cellphone on the table that day".

That's why the timelines and phone calls just don't mean anything to me. There was no significance attached to that day so why would they be so certain on details.

The thing that sticks out to me the most is the dude remembering Jay being scared. That is something that sticks out and it is not an instance where Jay could be lying.

Sounds though like he was scared of someone more than Adnan. Maybe Adnan told him Muslim killers would get him. I don't know.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
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Fri Dec-19-14 03:18 PM

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105. "That's not Adnan's defense, he doesn't have one..."
In response to Reply # 102


  

          

his only statement is I didn't do it. I don't know why Jay is lying. Matter of fact he says "I wish people would stop saying oh he's such a nice guy, he couldn't have done it. I want people to say I'm innocent because I am innocent based on facts, not because I'm a nice guy."

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Fri Dec-19-14 03:32 PM

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107. "Not his legal defense, but it's the main thrust of the reporter "
In response to Reply # 105


  

          

>his only statement is I didn't do it. I don't know why Jay is
>lying. Matter of fact he says "I wish people would stop saying
>oh he's such a nice guy, he couldn't have done it. I want
>people to say I'm innocent because I am innocent based on
>facts, not because I'm a nice guy."
>


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

  

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Amritsar
Member since Jan 18th 2008
32128 posts
Fri Dec-19-14 03:02 PM

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103. "Don remembering more details from the 13th looks bad for Adnan"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


I didn't go into the last episode expecting any final conclusion or bombshell.


This whole experience was like reading a great detective novel. The journey mattered as much as the actual resolution.

  

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Chanson
Member since Nov 09th 2004
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Fri Dec-19-14 03:14 PM

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104. "What if Adnan hired someone or some people to kill Hae"
In response to Reply # 0
Fri Dec-19-14 03:14 PM by Chanson

  

          

Adnan had to dispose of the body after it was done.

He gets Jay involved.

Jay starts talking about helping Adnan to other people.

Word gets back to the killer(s) and they threathen Jay.

Jay flips on Adnan to protect himself.

Technically Adnan didn't do the actually killing but can't tell the truth because obviously he's still responsible for Hae's murder

Jay won't tell the truth because he's fearful about retaliation.

Weirdo dude knew where the body was because he overheard Jay talking about it at the porn shop.

Yes? No? Maybe so?

mind
--------
matter

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
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Fri Dec-19-14 03:24 PM

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106. "i said this above! LOL. "
In response to Reply # 104


  

          

  

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Chanson
Member since Nov 09th 2004
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Fri Dec-19-14 03:42 PM

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109. "We solved the case!"
In response to Reply # 106


  

          

mind
--------
matter

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Fri Dec-19-14 03:34 PM

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108. "I think all that is too complicated. I think dude didn't premeditate it..."
In response to Reply # 104


  

          

But snapped. Maybe accidently killed her. Jay being a dumb teenager helped him out. Then realized later that he was stuck and involved.


>Adnan had to dispose of the body after it was done.
>
>He gets Jay involved.
>
>Jay starts talking about helping Adnan to other people.
>
>Word gets back to the killer(s) and they threathen Jay.
>
>Jay flips on Adnan to protect himself.
>
>Technically Adnan didn't do the actually killing but can't
>tell the truth because obviously he's still responsible for
>Hae's murder
>
>Jay won't tell the truth because he's fearful about
>retaliation.
>
>Weirdo dude knew where the body was because he overheard Jay
>talking about it at the porn shop.
>
>Yes? No? Maybe so?


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

  

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Chanson
Member since Nov 09th 2004
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Fri Dec-19-14 03:43 PM

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110. "The truth is stranger than fiction"
In response to Reply # 108


  

          

mind
--------
matter

  

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PROMO
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Fri Dec-19-14 04:34 PM

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111. "NOPE."
In response to Reply # 104


  

          

because if Jay squealed to the cops then these killers are REALLY gonna come for him and that didn't happen nor is there any indication the police were protecting him from said people (and we'd have heard of it if this was a real thing).

  

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Sarah_Bellum
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Mon Dec-22-14 08:08 PM

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119. "We don't know what Jay got for his deal"
In response to Reply # 111
Mon Dec-22-14 08:11 PM by Sarah_Bellum

  

          

He could have gotten some protection. That certainly wouldn't be something that Konig would have access to find out about. All she's got is jays purposefully redacted tape, trial transcripts, Adnan's lawyers papers and people after the fact accounts. She has almost nothing of Jay.
The last episode said that Jay was scared out of his mind that someone was going to come snatch him up at the porn store and he was waiting for the police. He basically ran to the police for safety because he was scared for his life, he says of Adnan but I doubt it. He said he was scared of muslims snatching him… but even after Adnan got knocked it seems like no one bothered to investigate the other muslims in the community for helping out Adnan do the dirty deed.
That's why I think he was scared of a hit man.
We know that the prosecution was giving Jay all kindsa special treatment. They went out of their way to get him a private lawyer so he could broker a deal to put Adnan away and not do much time, if any himself. The prosecution may have been after bigger fish, like an organized crime hit man but couldn't work it out and dropped it before it ever got too deep, but they made sure to protect Jay all the way and took Adnan instead. Otherwise Jay should be doing time right along side with Adnan,
My guess... I think Steph and Chanson are right.
Adnan wanted a hit man, Jay said he knew someone, maybe through a weed connect. They both went to the grimy part of town to find him. Who knows what happened next but some how they got stuck burying the body and cleaning up the mess. Maybe cause Adnan didn't pay up fully, that's anyone's guess really. They were both supposed to keep their mouths shut but after things got botched Jay got scared and went to the police. Adnan is still keeping saying "I don't know what happened" while Jay pointed his finger at the only person who had motive, Jay stays off the hit mans clean up list and stays outta jail.
___________________________________________________________


DJTB YOMM

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
15900 posts
Sun Dec-21-14 06:34 PM

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114. "Pretty funny SNL spoof (link)"
In response to Reply # 0


          

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjidkNvN-Ps

The Adnan impression is spot on lol

_______________________________________

  

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thegodcam
Member since Oct 22nd 2004
41531 posts
Sun Dec-21-14 07:28 PM

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115. "hilarious"
In response to Reply # 114


  

          

*******************************************************
i will not let finite disappointment undermine infinite hope
- Cory Booker

Football is a simple game; 22 men chase a ball for 90 minutes, and at the end the Germans always win
- Gary Lineker

  

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Sarah_Bellum
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Sun Dec-21-14 08:24 PM

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116. "All of it was spot on"
In response to Reply # 114


  

          

All the voices and inflections were perfect.
Konig's mousy white woman reflections.
Adnan's "so what I'm saying is like…"
Them trying to put together that sled.
I just couldn't laugh though because the situation is not funny.
___________________________________________________________


DJTB YOMM

  

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GirlChild
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Tue Dec-23-14 12:29 AM

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124. "yeah, like A GIRL DIED MAN"
In response to Reply # 116


  

          

how funny or entertaining is this to her family?

i just can't with this anymore

  

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Sarah_Bellum
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Tue Dec-23-14 01:42 AM

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126. "Exactly..."
In response to Reply # 124
Tue Dec-23-14 01:47 AM by Sarah_Bellum

  

          

If anything it reminds me of how Hae's humanity was on the back burner for the whole podcast. At this point she's more like a plot device than a teenage girl who lived or breathed with a whole life ahead of her. If Konig really brought it home that Hae was a living, breathing person cut down on her way from high school then SNL wouldn't have been making jokes about the podcast because it would be too off color. Like, a child was killed! Who does that?
Although I know the podcast was supposed to be about Adnan and was he guilty or not..... and if there is too much sympathy for Hae it will color listener's opinions of his guilt but something still doesn't sit right with me it. Innocence projects are needed for sure and there are lots of innocent people sitting in jail. I think there is a balance between those two places and konig never found it with this case.

I've heard a lot of critic about the racial elements of the show, Konig.. a white women in this black community, talking about immigrants as an outsider with her cultural biases and I never agreed with it....but the one thing I will say is if Hae were a white child I think there would have been more done in the podcast to make sure she didn't get lost in all the, who done it entertainment for sure.

I may be biased though because I'm 85% sure Adnan had Hae killed by a hitman.
___________________________________________________________


DJTB YOMM

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
15900 posts
Tue Dec-23-14 02:42 AM

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128. "They are satirizing the show, not the case. That's why it's ok to laugh"
In response to Reply # 124


          

Most satire is about serious issues. The Chappelle Show made a living off this (e.g. R. Kelly sketches).
The situation in NK is very dire, but The Interview is satire on their issues.

I've seen spoofs of To Catch a Predator and those true crime shows. Both cover very serious situations, but the spoofs don't make light of yhe crimes. They simply make fun of the setup of the show

_______________________________________

  

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GirlChild
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Tue Dec-23-14 02:56 PM

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133. "koenig is making a career off the death of this girl"
In response to Reply # 128


  

          

so no, i can't agree with anything you're saying
this just do not sit well with me at all

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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Tue Dec-23-14 02:59 PM

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134. "Uhm. She's investigating the case..."
In response to Reply # 133
Tue Dec-23-14 03:01 PM by Brew

          

By your standards, there shouldn't be any attorneys involved or investigators because they're making a career or at least continuing one "off the death of this girl." That makes no sense at all.

Re: The SNL skit, in no way was it distasteful or disrespectful to the departed. It made fun of the format of the show.

This is weird.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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gumz
Member since Jan 09th 2005
20118 posts
Tue Dec-23-14 02:34 PM

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132. "lmao this was hilarious...well done"
In response to Reply # 114


  

          

even got the annoying Defense attorney's voice down...they should have had her say "Did you not?" after every sentence though

http://www.youtube.com/user/gumzization
twitter: @BrosefMalone

  

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atruhead
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Mon Dec-22-14 05:46 PM

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117. "oh my God, fuck that ending."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I got all into this story because the whole world said I should

I want my time back.

  

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Zion3Lion
Member since Dec 23rd 2002
16767 posts
Mon Dec-22-14 07:35 PM

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118. "Serial Sucked And Wasted Everyone's Time(swipe)"
In response to Reply # 0
Mon Dec-22-14 07:35 PM by Zion3Lion

  

          

i pretty much agree with her assessment.
especially this part

"The first three episodes were great. The next three were decent. And then there's a shift. To me, it felt like Koenig ran out of reporting."

http://theconcourse.deadspin.com/serial-sucked-and-wasted-everyones-time-1673349627/all


What do I know after listening to every episode of Serial? Nothing. I know absolutely nothing, except that it wasted my damn time, and I really hate it when that happens. Did you know sometimes we send people to prison on flimsy evidence? Did you know investigators can manipulate a witness narrative to fit the evidence they think they have? Did you know sometimes the wrong people go to jail? Did you know the American criminal justice system sucks?

Yes. You did. Either you did, or you should have before listening to Serial. If you didn't, please don't be proud of just now realizing this. That's like admitting you just learned where to vote; it implies all those times you weren't voting. And you gotta ignore a lot of things to think anything Serial showed us was new. Unless, of course, you get most of your news from public radio, which mostly ignores local murders, making you that person who has no idea about the local string of smash-and-grabs at the 7-Eleven, but knows all about the government in the Balkans. Great: That person learned something. Maybe that counts for a bonus point.

Let me back up a little. Serial is a podcast that's been putting out a new episode each week for 12 weeks; it's from the people behind This American Life, so they know how to tell a story. This story was supposed to be about Adnan Syed, found guilty in the murder of his high school ex-girlfriend, Hae Min Lee. Was he falsely convicted? Syed has maintained his innocence for years, and in the first episode of Serial, host Sarah Koenig lays out some pretty solid reasons why Syed might be right. The first episode also was launched on TAL, incredibly popular in its own right, giving the enterprise an insane boost right out of the gate. Serial took that and ran with it. I listen to TAL and quickly got hooked on this, too. The first three episodes were great. The next three were decent. And then there's a shift. To me, it felt like Koenig ran out of reporting.

I know what it feels like to run out of reporting, because I have run out of reporting. It happens to crime reporters all the time. Your boss tells you they've saved a 15-inch hole on 1B for the story, but you've only maybe six inches of copy. The witnesses aren't talking (this happens to Koenig). The cops aren't talking (this happens to Koenig). The victim's family won't speak (this happens to Koenig). Here's the backwards relationship of all crime stories: The minute it happens is when most people want to know everything, but it's also when you know the least about what happened. So you plug. You describe the people crying, the blood splatter, the evidence strewn across the ground, the sounds of the tears, the tagging of the bullet shells, the sheet strewn across the body, how wide an area the cops taped off, even the weather. You talk about what you don't know: the questions the cops won't answer, the stoic silence of the family, the open-ended questions that naturally exist in these situations. The fancy term for this is "reporting with your eyes." Sometimes, these details do come in handy later. Other times, you look back on the story and go, "Yeah, I just had to fill."

Crime reporters do this every day in America. It's just part of the job. We cover crimes, and years later, we revisit crimes. If you're lucky, your story gets on 1A and maybe earns some Internet love. If you're really lucky, somebody prominent blogs about it. But somehow Serial has convinced America this is some fancy-pants new take on radio journalism/longform/podcasting/nonfiction/true crime/magazine writing/all writing forever and ever and ever. It's not. Gene Miller (famously of my journalism alma mater, the Miami Herald) won the Pulitzer Prize twice for his reporting showing four cases of people in Florida wrongly convicted of murder. One case involved a pair of black men, Freddie Lee Pitts and Wilbert Lee, convicted by an all-white jury and sentenced to death in Florida's panhandle in 1963 for a murder they did not commit. Their case was awash in police brutality, bad lawyers, and straight-up racism. Miller's reporting freed them and was expanded into a book, Invitation to a Lynching. You can get it on Amazon right now, used, for less than $3.

And even less value than those $3 should be assigned to Serial, because 20 years from now, that's where it should be: in the bargain bin of journalism. Throughout its run, people have tried to decide what makes it "problematic." Is it race? Is it a lack of understanding Baltimore at the time? Is it our own biases? No. I think these all stem from one big problem right at the source: Nobody involved knew what they were doing. That's why Koenig is surprised to learn the phrase "gen-pop." That's why half the episodes go by before looping in the Innocence Project. That's why Koenig unfairly spends too much tape whining about her angst over whether Syed is a good person or not, as if she can't wrap her brain around the idea that sometimes good people kill people while many assholes go their whole lives without murdering. Crime reporting is a skill. You get better at it over time. And when you don't do it, you sound like an idiot—like Serial does, over and over and over, until it's practically tripping over itself near the end to pretend like it didn't pick a dud.

Serial does nothing particularly great: The structure is sloppy, the reporting bring us little clarity, there's filler all over it, promises go unfulfilled. This is not a master class of investigative journalism, because it accomplished zero. Ultimately, Koenig does what reporters do when they don't nail a story: She makes it about herself, her quest, and what she learned instead. I got that same advice years ago in a writers group about what to do when you can't nail a story your boss wants. It's the ultimately writerly punt. And here's a punt being called a revolution. But boy, does listening to Serial make you look smart! Kinda like talking about the Balkans! All this show did was make a bunch of sheltered, oblivious, middle-class Americans feel very smart about themselves. Out here, stuck in real life with the rest of us, it was just another day in the courthouse.

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
24658 posts
Mon Dec-22-14 10:45 PM

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120. "This reads like a personal vendetta. "
In response to Reply # 118


          

It's kinda uncomfortable to read.

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"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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ODotSoHot
Member since Apr 02nd 2013
1171 posts
Mon Dec-22-14 11:02 PM

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121. "It does..."
In response to Reply # 120


  

          

...but definitely some valid points.

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
24658 posts
Mon Dec-22-14 11:18 PM

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122. "I mean, I don't even really think so."
In response to Reply # 121
Mon Dec-22-14 11:21 PM by Brew

          

Basically the author just said we didn't learn anything from it, which I guess is true....if there's anyone out there who actually expected that this would be some kind of mind blowing revelation about the American justice system or some shit.

People who went in with modest expectations got a good story out of it, and now will follow the appeals. Nothing more nothing less. I suppose a good percentage of the listeners maybe expected the end of the show to provide a firm answer about Adnan but even those people must feel like they got some form of entertainment hearing about this case.

The one part I agreed with in this article was the part the OP posted about the first 3 episodes being the best by a long shot. As it went on I realized we wouldn't be getting a Hollywood finish, which was fine with me. I'm just now interested in following the story in the news.

But anyway .... that was a long way of saying this author got a serious hardon for Koenig. Or at the very least is EXTREMELY fucking jealous of the shine she's getting off this podcast. It's awkward.

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"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
1373 posts
Tue Dec-23-14 09:40 AM

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129. "i don't agree too much..."
In response to Reply # 122


  

          

i feel like i learned a lot about the case and how things played out...a lot of things in this case I had NO CLUE about and I lived in Baltimore at the time and remember that case and him being convicted because of a star witness, but none of us knew that the witness didn't serve time, or anything.

if nothing else, it was informative and basically a podcast version of a criminal show but more realistic (whereas Law and Order is solved in an episode or two), this played out how things play out in court. it's not always a quick fix or win.

but then again, like you said, i didn't expect much...i just knew everyone was ranting about it.

  

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Zion3Lion
Member since Dec 23rd 2002
16767 posts
Tue Dec-23-14 01:37 AM

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125. "In the comments age admits she probably could have been less harsh"
In response to Reply # 120


  

          

But a harsh critique never hurt anyone.
Still agree with the overall gist

  

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b.Touch
Member since Jun 28th 2011
20514 posts
Tue Dec-23-14 02:09 AM

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127. "thisi s hateful and over-the-top"
In response to Reply # 118


  

          

  

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sectachrome86
Member since Dec 22nd 2007
2729 posts
Tue Dec-23-14 01:19 PM

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130. "The show fell off on the last couple episodes"
In response to Reply # 0


          

I really enjoyed the first several, but by the end it just seemed like they were struggling to have anything else to say about the case. And then the end was basically "We started out not knowing shit and we still dont. Bye."

I'm not sure what kind of ending I was expecting but I feel like they could have done a better job with a conclusion somehow. Kind of mad I donated money for a second season to be honest. It was interesting but kind of feels like it was a waste of time now.

-------------------------------------------------
http://www.soundcloud.com/sectachrome

  

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handle
Charter member
18994 posts
Tue Dec-23-14 02:34 PM

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131. "Where is David Simon??"
In response to Reply # 0


          

I'd like to hear his point of view.

  

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341
Member since Jun 27th 2006
933 posts
Tue Dec-23-14 06:43 PM

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135. "Two Serial shirts that I want..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

http://teespring.com/mailkimp

and

http://teespring.com/serialday

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
1373 posts
Mon Dec-29-14 11:05 PM

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136. "INTERVIEW WITH JAY (link)"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2014/12/29/exclusive-interview-jay-wilds-star-witness-adnan-syed-serial-case-pt-1/

So this came out today...and Jay is still lying like shit. This interview actually muddles things more because he mentions stop snitching, but he told on Adnan.

He only smoke with Adnan two or three times, isn't that how many times they smoked that particular day....we know y'all were friends.

He doesn't know what Hae's car looks like...but then when the reporter says "hae's body was in her own car" and he goes yes. so at what point did you learn that was Hae's car and if you knew that was Hae's car, then why can't you or don't you remember if it was in the parking lot.

the cell phone record says they were at Leakin Park around 6...but then he says they buried the body after midnight.

What is the truth here...we will never know.

  

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gumz
Member since Jan 09th 2005
20118 posts
Wed Dec-31-14 03:45 PM

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139. "Whether you believe he did it or not..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

they really didn't have enough to commit him. He never should have served that time. All they have is the word of a witness who's credibility is in question. I wonder if anything will turn up with the DNA. Not sure why they'd end the series before finding out those results.

http://www.youtube.com/user/gumzization
twitter: @BrosefMalone

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
15900 posts
Tue Mar-24-15 03:46 PM

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140. "The appeal process has begun (swipe)"
In response to Reply # 0


          

Do y'all think he would have a shot of acquittal in a new trial?
From the podcast, there was definitely a whole bunch of reasonable doubt. So if he gets a new trial, I think he's home free.

They're trying to get a new trial based off ineffectual counsel. How successful are these things?
Help me out SoWhat.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/03/23/adnan-syed-appeal_n_6926238.html?ncid=fcbklnkushpmg00000021

BALTIMORE (AP) — The convicted killer at the center of the popular podcast "Serial" is making his case that an appeals court should toss his conviction because his lawyer failed to interview an alibi witness and never inquired about the possibility of a plea deal.

An attorney for Adnan Syed, now 34, filed a brief Monday with the Maryland Court of Special Appeals, which has agreed to take up Syed's case.

Syed was at the center of the wildly popular podcast that raised questions about the integrity of the case, the fairness of the trial and his guilt.

Prosecutors maintain that Syed strangled his former high school sweetheart Hae Min Lee in 1999 after the two broke up and she began dating someone else. Syed, who was 17 at the time of Lee's death, has been in prison since 2000, serving a life sentence.

The Court of Special Appeals agreed to hear Syed's appeal in February after two unsuccessful attempts.

The basis of Syed's appeal is that his former lawyer, Christina Gutierrez, failed to interview Asia McClain, a student at Syed's school who said she was with him in the library at the approximate time of Lee's death. McClain had written to Syed after his arrest offering to speak with investigators and his attorney. In her letters, McClain also mentioned two other witnesses who said they saw Syed at the library. But Gutierrez, who was later disbarred by consent after questions arose about her handling of client funds, never interviewed McClain nor called her as a witness.

"It is hard to imagine that Gutierrez could have done anything worse than failing to pick up the phone and call Syed's witness," Syed's appeals attorney, Justin Brown, wrote in the filing.

Additionally, Brown argues that Gutierrez told Syed that prosecutors would not offer him a plea deal when in fact she never inquired as to whether one was on the table.

Brown characterized Syed's former lawyer's failure to inquire about a possible plea deal and interview a potentially crucial alibi witness as running "deeper than the typical error or omission that is considered under the umbrella of 'effective assistance of counsel.'"

"It not only violates something fundamental to the trial process," Brown wrote, "but it violates the duty of loyalty that is at the heart of attorney-client relationship ... his lawyer effectively stopped representing him."

The attorney general's office, which is prosecuting the case, declined to comment Monday.

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John Forte
Member since Feb 22nd 2013
15361 posts
Tue Mar-24-15 03:49 PM

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141. "I settled on the "Cops gave Jay the story to make the case" theory"
In response to Reply # 0


          

Neither he nor Adnan did it. Cops busted Jay on a drug charge and they wanted to close the murder case, so they concocted a story and he went along with it. That's why neither his nor Adnan's stories add up.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
Charter member
49618 posts
Tue Mar-24-15 03:54 PM

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142. "Slightly right. "
In response to Reply # 141


  

          

I don't think it's disputed how the police got to Jay. Jay mentioned the crime to a friend (forget her name). She tells the police. THEN the police approach Jay.

So I think it's hard to dispute that Jay knew something before being approached by the police.

But once the police approached him, they definitely fixed his story to make it all easier to prosecute Adnan.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson


"One of the most important things in life is what Judge Learned Hand described as 'that ever-gnawing inner doubt as to whether you're

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
15900 posts
Tue Mar-24-15 04:10 PM

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143. "But what about the Nisha call?"
In response to Reply # 141
Tue Mar-24-15 04:10 PM by PimpTrickGangstaClik

          

I forgot what the Nisha call was all about lol.
But I remember it being some big kink in Adnan's innocence

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John Forte
Member since Feb 22nd 2013
15361 posts
Tue Mar-24-15 04:27 PM

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144. "The Nisha call doesn't matter in this context"
In response to Reply # 143


          

neither of them did it. Neither of them knows who did it. It was a mundane day, the details of which escape them. The Nisha call is only relevant if Jay was actually involved. He literally knows nothing except for the narrative the police gave him.

  

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PimpTrickGangstaClik
Member since Oct 06th 2005
15900 posts
Mon May-18-15 08:32 PM

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145. "Appeal granted. New testimony to be allowed (swipe)"
In response to Reply # 0


          

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2015/05/18/adnan_syed_ruling_asia_mcclain_now_allowed_to_testify_in_the_serial_star.html


Serial’s Adnan Syed Gains an Alibi Witness and a Chance at Freedom

Adnan Syed, the Baltimore County man—and Serial podcast star—convicted in 2000 of murdering his high school girlfriend is one step closer to a shorter sentence.

On Monday, Chief Judge Peter B. Krauser of the Court of Special Appeals of Maryland ruled to allow Syed’s request for post-conviction relief to be reopened in a circuit court. Syed had filed a motion for post-conviction relief (i.e., less time in jail) on the grounds that his attorney, Christina Gutierrez, had been incompetent. That motion was denied in January 2014, but in the wake of the podcast—which revealed, among other things, that Gutierrez had failed to contact Asia McClain, a potential alibi witness—Syed appealed the decision.

Now his appeal has been stayed in the Special Appeals Court so that it can be hashed out in the Circuit Court for Baltimore County, which matters because lawyers in the circuit court are permitted to introduce new evidence. What kind of new evidence? Testimony from McClain, who did not speak at Syed’s 2000 trial but filed an affidavit in January stating that she remembered seeing Syed at the library at the time the prosecutors claimed he was murdering his girlfriend. McClain has said she would be willing to testify in a resuscitated trial, and a tweet from Syed’s friend and ally Rabia Chaudry suggests that that is indeed what will happen. If McClain is able to convince the court that her story is true, the now-34-year-old Syed may have a chance to escape his life sentence.

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