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Jason_A
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Wed Oct-10-01 07:17 PM

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"Alan Moore's "Watchmen""


  

          

Good shit...matter of fact, this is probably the best book I've ever read.

I suck at writing reviews, so i'll just copy/paste a review that pretty much sums up how I feel about it: http://waterholes.com/~dennette/comix/watchmen/891125.htm

Watchmen: A Review
by Dennette A. Harrod, Jr

The first image you see is a yellow smiley-face button with a drop of something red crossing one eye. You soon realize that the button is resting in a gutter full of the red stuff, which turns out to be blood. By the time you reach the bottom of the page, it becomes obvious that someone wearing the button was defenestrated from a great height and landed on the pavement below.


This is the first page of what most people would call a comic book, but with 384 pages and a $14.95 cover price, Watchmen by Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons is more of a graphic novel. It is definitely not for children. This is pretty strong even for some adults. As an introduction to the genre, it is a work of epic proportions that will keep you glued to the pages well into the late hours of the night.

It starts as a murder mystery. The victim was a "costumed vigilante" called The Comedian, whose career began in the late 1930's. In the first chapter, we meet several of his contemporaries, most of whom are in forced retirement. It turns out that society eventually rebelled against the plethora of "caped crusaders." Congress passed a law banning super-heroes after a nation-wide police strike to protest their activities. One of the "masks", a mysterious characters known as Rorschach, refused to retire. He undertakes the investigation of the death of The Comedian.

In a story that covers three weeks of October, 1985, we are treated to forty years of "alternate" American history through flash-backs, magazine articles, and excerpts from an autobiography. We meet Dr. Manhattan, a being with god-like superpowers that are the result of a nuclear accident in the 1950's. Thanks to his intervention, America won the war in Viet Nam, and the Soviets refuse to negotiate arms reduction until we include Dr. Manhattan as a "weapon". Nixon is in his third term. The Comedian single-handedly freed the American hostages from Iran.

The characters are anything but cardboard. The second Silk Spectre is a woman who is bitter about her mother having denied her a normal childhood by training her as a replacement. Confined to a nursing home, mom is vicariously attempting to continue an adventurous life through her daughter's exploits. Rorschach is the abused, bastard son of a prostitute, but his psychotic behavior is based on a noble value system. Dr. Manhattan is a bit like Vonnegut's Billy Pilgrim from Slaughterhouse Five in that he lives simultaneously in the past, present, and future.

The second chapter revolves around the funeral of The Comedian, and we see him through the eyes of different people who knew him during his career. It is not a pretty picture. For a "good guy," he is not what you would call a role-model. The flash-backs segue with the funeral in a fluid, almost cinematic way. It might take the reader a while to get used to the segues between action taking place simultaneously in New York and California. In another cinematic device, the words from one scene are frequently superimposed on the images of the other. This is actually preparing the reader for things to come.

There is a very interesting sub-plot which involves a kid reading a "traditional" comic book, a pirate story, in which the words and images fuse with the events going on around him. In fact, a lot of the story takes places in a neighborhood in New York City which centers around one intersection where an old man runs a news stand. Most of the characters eventually pass through this intersection and pass the boy reading his comic, although none engage him in conversation. It really takes a second reading to appreciate the importance of this corner, and the way in which the characters have been so long inter-related without being aware of each other.

This work was originally published over the course of a year, in twelve monthly installments as a "maxi-series" of comic books. At the end of each "chapter", there are a few pages of text which provide background for the characters and the plot. There are chapters from the first Night Owl's autobiography, in which we discover that some of the men (and women) who wore skin-tight costumes and capes were closet homosexuals. There is an article by the second Night Owl from an ornithological journal. There is a Playboy-type interview with the first Silk Spectre and clippings from her scrap-book. There is a page from Rorschach's police blotter and psychiatric reports from the foster home where he was raised. The essay entitled, "Dr. Manhattan: Super-powers and the Superpowers," explores the geo-political consequences of having a real superman on America's side.

Alan Moore spent five years creating this story, and the beauty of it is that he has described each panel in such intricate detail that Dave Gibbons' pen makes us forget we are looking at static pictures on paper. There are several scene's involving Rorschach where we are treated to three or more pages of nine panels each where there is not a single word spoken, nor is any needed. There are other places where the segue between two scenes is like a cinematic dissolve, because the graphic elements of the two panels are identical. The words and pictures of the pirate story that the kid is reading are intermixed with the words and pictures of the story we are reading. The symbols of one matching the symbols of another form a kind of verbal/visual pun-manship which is delightful.

*THIS NEXT PARAGRAPH CONTAINS A MAJOR SPOILER SO READ AT YOUR OWN RISK...OR SOMETHING*

The title Watchmen is derived from the same source as the epigraph of the Tower Commission Report; "Quis custodiet ipsos custodes," or "Who watches the watchmen?" Watchmen starts as a murder mystery, and ends with a man killing half the population of New York City in order to save the world from thermonuclear destruction. One is compelled to ponder when is a heinous act not as heinous as inaction (Truman's dilemma in using the atomic bomb against Japan), and who has the right to make such a decision?

The last image you see is a yellow smiley-face with a drop of something red crossing one eye. This time, the red stuff is borscht


------------
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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
RE: Alan Moore's "Watchmen"
Oct 11th 2001
1
I saw that
Oct 11th 2001
2
dude.
Oct 11th 2001
3
i'm getting back into the whole comics thing
Oct 11th 2001
4
      re: comics.
Oct 11th 2001
5
      yep.
Oct 11th 2001
8
           hmm- but i fit in both categories
Oct 16th 2001
10
      RE: i'm getting back into the whole comics thing
Oct 11th 2001
6
           that should be brianwood.com
Oct 11th 2001
7
RE: Alan Moore's "Watchmen"
knicksrule
Oct 12th 2001
9
Reading frank miller and alan moore...
Oct 16th 2001
11
I notice that too
Oct 16th 2001
12
RE: Alan Moore's "Watchmen"
Oct 17th 2001
13
v for vendetta?
knicksrule
Oct 17th 2001
14
Alan Moore...
Oct 17th 2001
15
      RE: Alan Moore...
Oct 17th 2001
16
great Alan Moore article:
Oct 25th 2001
17
Also note the web-only bonus Qs n/m
Oct 25th 2001
18
coming to the big screen
Oct 26th 2001
19

Don_Jawnson
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Thu Oct-11-01 11:12 AM

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1. "RE: Alan Moore's "Watchmen""
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://www.stahl.bau.tu-bs.de/~hildeb/watchmen/


thats an appendix to the series....points out a lot of things that people might have missed. it gets pretty deep.


i liked watchmen...the chapters on rorschach were just fascinating...um...when ive got something to say with more substnce, i'll come back....but check out the appendix.




donny

random list of links:

the genius of the late comedian bill hicks: http://www.sacredcow.com/videos/media_hicks_standup.html

'direct your own custom made porno video': http://www.privatelabelporn.com/

the art of beating the fuck out of someone: http://furiousg.com/videos/

don jawns website 'more fun than pissing blood': http://www.geocities.com/wormswilleatyou/

  

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Jason_A
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Thu Oct-11-01 11:54 AM

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2. "I saw that"
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

I spent a couple hours last night just going through all of those...I was really amazed at the amount of detail packed into the book.

------------
Respect the cock...and tame the cunt! Tame it!

http://jdawg2.freeservers.com - you know you wanna go there

---------------------
AIM: jdawgtheaggie



Atheism - a non-prophet organization

  

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Mosaic
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16409 posts
Thu Oct-11-01 01:25 PM

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3. "dude."
In response to Reply # 0


          

i was just thinking of "Watchmen" the other day -- it's been years since i read the collected version, and back then, i only caught a few of the allusions and stuff ...

-----
sintegrity & greudian slips.

  

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Jason_A
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Thu Oct-11-01 01:40 PM

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4. "i'm getting back into the whole comics thing"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

found out about a lot of good shit I've missed, so I've been checking out the "heavyweights" like dark knight returns, and watchmen of course...frank miller and alan moore are "that hot shit" as I believe the kids say.

wait, they're not comics, they're "graphic novels".

yeah that's it.

...

I'm trying to pick up "From Hell" next, and seeing how it compares with the movie.

------------
Respect the cock...and tame the cunt! Tame it!

http://jdawg2.freeservers.com - you know you wanna go there

---------------------
AIM: jdawgtheaggie



Atheism - a non-prophet organization

  

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Mosaic
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16409 posts
Thu Oct-11-01 02:18 PM

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5. "re: comics."
In response to Reply # 4


          

if i spent what i wanted on 'em, i'd always be broke, i'd never have no Silly Putty to grope.

for real, though, my last great run of enjoying comic books was about 3 summers ago when Kevin Smith was writing Daredevil ...

i was reading Top 10, 100 Bullets, Inhumans, and a handful of Vertigo titles ... plus some Jim Mahfood stuff.

you'd think once they cut all the multiple chromium, die cut, holographic covers they'd get cheaper ... blah.

thank god they use better paper than back in the day, though.

what?

me a fanboy?

-----
sintegrity & greudian slips.

  

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Jason_A
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Thu Oct-11-01 02:32 PM

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8. "yep."
In response to Reply # 5


  

          

>for real, though, my last great
>run of enjoying comic books
>was about 3 summers ago
>when Kevin Smith was writing
>Daredevil ...

I read somewhere that there are two kinds of people currently reading "Green Arrow":

1) those that have a bit of nostalgia for the character, and are glad to see him come back

2) and those that read it because they were already kevin smith fans

I'm in category number 2...good shit, even though I didn't know jack about the character beforehand

I've been getting into marvel recently, mostly because I'm familiar with those characters, and the comics are actually pretty damn good...excellent writing (Brian Michael Bendis is dope)

And fuck, Image brought back GI Joe...I had to get it, even though it was mostly just nostalgia that drove me to buy it...

ahh well, I need a paper route or something to pay for this shit.

------------
Respect the cock...and tame the cunt! Tame it!

http://jdawg2.freeservers.com - you know you wanna go there

---------------------
AIM: jdawgtheaggie



Atheism - a non-prophet organization

  

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shockzilla
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Tue Oct-16-01 12:56 PM

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10. "hmm- but i fit in both categories"
In response to Reply # 8


          

shocking
fanboy
(please read the guidelines before posting http://www.okayplayer.com/guidelines.html)
(questions about okayplayer.com should be directed to help@okayplayer.com)
(you can reach me at bboombap@hotmail.com, or aim: shockdiggy)

  

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Don_Jawnson
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2917 posts
Thu Oct-11-01 02:20 PM

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6. "RE: i'm getting back into the whole comics thing"
In response to Reply # 4


  

          

check out the following: brian wood's channel zero. available as a trade for something like 12 bucks. www.brainwood.com

trasmetroplitan: 5 trades are currently available, the first one being 'back on the street'. 3 issues, 7 bucks, good shit. check out www.warrenellis.com for more info.

and youve probably heard of preacher. 9 trades (the one titled ancient history collects specials outside of the main series. you could just skip that one and go straight to the next one.) the first trade is..........dammit. something like gone to texas, i think. they're numbered on the spine, so that makes it easier.


donny

random list of links:

the genius of the late comedian bill hicks: http://www.sacredcow.com/videos/media_hicks_standup.html

'direct your own custom made porno video': http://www.privatelabelporn.com/

the art of beating the fuck out of someone: http://furiousg.com/videos/

don jawns website 'more fun than pissing blood': http://www.geocities.com/wormswilleatyou/

  

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Don_Jawnson
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Thu Oct-11-01 02:21 PM

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7. "that should be brianwood.com"
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

donny

random list of links:

the genius of the late comedian bill hicks: http://www.sacredcow.com/videos/media_hicks_standup.html

'direct your own custom made porno video': http://www.privatelabelporn.com/

the art of beating the fuck out of someone: http://furiousg.com/videos/

don jawns website 'more fun than pissing blood': http://www.geocities.com/wormswilleatyou/

  

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knicksrule

Fri Oct-12-01 07:59 AM

  
9. "RE: Alan Moore's "Watchmen""
In response to Reply # 0


          

i just bought the graphic novel a month ago...AMAZING. everyone im telling everyone i come in contact with to read it.
i used to read comics when i was in grade school, mostly marvel.
im trying to get back into it but not with monthly books, strictly graphic novels. u save a lot of money and ur guaranteed a great story. just recently i picked up:

the dark knight returns
transmetropolitan (the first book)


"im down to earth, at times i feel closer to mars." - common

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Tue Oct-16-01 03:20 PM

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11. "Reading frank miller and alan moore..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


Remind me how the eighties were really dark times. I don't know of any of ther authors who capture the pessimism of the decade caused by the fear of Nuclear war, a Recession, Ronald Reagan, the Emergence of Crack Cocaine, and one of the highest periods of Crime in America History.


*****

"Rap's a funny business, really. People will pay to experience as "entertainment" what in real life they'd run a mile from: bug-eyed sociopaths threatening cruel and unusual deaths, nouveau riche bores bragging about their income and expensive possessions . . . And let's not forget the underground: paranoid poets who've never met a conspiracy theory they didn't embrace, autodidact crackpots who've glimpsed the secret of the cosmos in a cloud of weedsmoke—the sort of I-be-the-prophet spiel you can get for free if you hang out on the subway long enough." - The Village Voice

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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Jason_A
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3376 posts
Tue Oct-16-01 07:49 PM

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12. "I notice that too"
In response to Reply # 11


  

          

it's funny, cuz I was born in 82, and I didn't really know about reagonomics or anything until the past couple years...a boy just wanted to play with his he-man and transformers figures, lol. But damn, a lot of shit was going down in the 80's...I mean, the cold war seems so distant to me, but we aren't really that far removed from it.

------------
Respect the cock...and tame the cunt! Tame it!

http://jdawg2.freeservers.com - you know you wanna go there

---------------------
AIM: jdawgtheaggie



Atheism - a non-prophet organization

  

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AFKAP_of_Darkness
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Wed Oct-17-01 02:01 AM

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13. "RE: Alan Moore's "Watchmen""
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

this is
>probably the best book I've
>ever read.
>

i was gonna say the same thing... this is the best science fiction novel i ever read.

_____________________

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The man who thinks at 50 the same way he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life - Muhammed Ali

  

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knicksrule

Wed Oct-17-01 01:21 PM

  
14. "v for vendetta?"
In response to Reply # 0


          

i just copped v for vendetta, another alan moore book, it looks intresting.
anyone else read it?

  

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MrMajor
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Wed Oct-17-01 02:31 PM

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15. "Alan Moore..."
In response to Reply # 14


          

Is the best writer in comics... period. The man is a genius. Watchmen is the best graphic novel/mini series ever, nothing comes close not even DKR.

  

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Don_Jawnson
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2917 posts
Wed Oct-17-01 05:00 PM

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16. "RE: Alan Moore..."
In response to Reply # 15


  

          

what about 'from hell'?

donny

random list of links:

the genius of the late comedian bill hicks: http://www.sacredcow.com/videos/media_hicks_standup.html

exploding whale! read the story and download the video: http://www.perp.com/whale/index.html

the art of beating the fuck out of someone: http://furiousg.com/videos/

don jawns website 'more fun than having a sharp stick up ya dick. um...or vagina.': http://www.geocities.com/wormswilleatyou/

  

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Mosaic
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16409 posts
Thu Oct-25-01 05:09 PM

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17. "great Alan Moore article:"
In response to Reply # 0


          

courtesy of the Onion --

http://www.theonionavclub.com/avclub3738/avfeature_3738.html

-----
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PolarbearToenails
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Thu Oct-25-01 07:02 PM

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18. "Also note the web-only bonus Qs n/m"
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

--
Jesse Thorn / Host
The Sound of Young America
Thursdays 8-9 AM KZSC 88.1 Santa Cruz
http://www.splangy.com

"This album is by far the greatest piece of writing, arranging, producing, and sequencing genius I've ever encountered. Anyone who has heard the first two Swamp Dogg albums will possibly say impossible, but after listening to this one will make the cross-over to incredible. The only album that may possibly compare with this one is the one that I'm contemplating doing the late future. Everything that is neccessary to make an album I have; Ego, talent, originality, humor, and I am dynamic, articulate, defiant, altruistic, considerate, warm, wonderful, & humble... I have also been a Grammy nominee for the past two years. I'm also a Cancer (July 12) and twenty nine years in the world. What you've just read is my trip, and if you can't tolerate it, that's your trip."
-- Swamp Dogg, from the liner notes to his album, "Cuffed, Collared, & Tagged"

-
Bullseye with Jesse Thorn
A public radio show about things that are awesome.
http://www.maximumfun.org
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REDeye
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Fri Oct-26-01 05:01 AM

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19. "coming to the big screen"
In response to Reply # 0


          

http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20011026/en/film-watchmen_1.html

Friday October 26 3:53 AM ET

Universal puts ``X-Men'' scribe on ``Watch''

By Michael Fleming

NEW YORK (Variety) - David Hayter, who has become one of Hollywood's preeminent writers of macho superhero fare -- beginning with his sole screen credit on ``X-Men,'' has signed a seven-figure deal at Universal to adapt DC Comics' ``The Watchmen,'' with an eye toward directing the film.

The comic series was originally published in 12 parts in 1986, and became a cult favorite that was eventually re-released in graphic novel form.

The story begins in the 1950s, when a seemingly ordinary guy puts on a mask and superhero costume and starts kicking criminal tail. He's joined by others who take on the same pursuit, until a law is passed that forces them to hang up their capes. The film's storyline begins with the mysterious murder of a couple of the former crimefighters.

``Just the way we tried to make the characters in 'X-Men' real and show that their superpowers were a curse as much as a gift, 'The Watchmen' has a very high and intense level of character development,'' Hayter said. ``The series deconstructed the superhero mystique and took a literate look at the comic book genre. It goes way beyond the standard hero and villain stuff and has the makings of a richly developed mystery.''

Hayter is now working with director Bryan Singer in finalizing the ``X-Men'' sequel script at Fox, and has since written on such Universal franchise fare as ``The Hulk,'' ``The Scorpion King'' and ``The Chronicles of Riddick,'' the latter of which is the ``Pitch Black'' sequel.

Hayter's also in the homestretch on a pilot script for ``Lost in Oz,'' a primetime WB series based on the series of novels by L. Frank Baum, remembered for penning books that became the basis for ``The Wizard of Oz.''

Reuters/Variety REUTERS

RED
"Oooh! A fresh batch of America Balls!" © Homer

RED
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