Premise: A ballerina competes against a rival dancer who may or may not be another version of herself.

Can I just tell you why none of my review matters? Can I just tell you why my review is absolutely pointless?

Because in this movie, Natalie Portman and Mila Kunis have sex.


http://scriptshadow.blogspot.com/2009/08/black-swan.html

o00o

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"Black Swan will star drool-worthy starlets" = trying too hard.

"Starring: X and Y" does the job. (Pics say the rest, if necessary)

I'm not spoiling the movie for myself, but the plot seems interesting.


edit:

OR! "Pic" + "Pic" + Lesbian Sex (+ Ecstacy tablet pic) + "Twilight Zone Logo" = "(Possible) Win"

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It just seems like the whole atmosphere and premise is based off of Persona a little bit.
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Anybody else see that??

But yeah, I hope they smut out w/ their tits out & don't get nominated for any awards (I'm j/k about this part btw).

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wha-wha-what?! what movie is this?!

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0465375/

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m,

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i remember this movie sucked but this scene was the by far best part.

yes

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I mean lets get down to the real nitty gritty here.

o00o

It would be corny to me.

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I think it was Analyse or som'n like that

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Mar-A-Lago delenda est

hahahahah this comment was so on point i busted out laughing at my desk

http://trailers.apple.com/trailers/fox_searchlight/blackswan/

>http://trailers.apple.com/trailers/fox_searchlight/blackswan/

you know, ballerinas and crap. then towards the end i was like "WHAT THE FUCK?!?" that took a serious turn towards crazytown.

also, natalie and mila look pretty smokin'

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Situation Podemy love

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Since D.A. paid for the rights for a remake just for the bathtub scene in Requiem.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anlHmGA-Bvs

(RIP Satoshi Kon)

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Honeycutt at Hollywood Reporter:

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/hr/film-reviews/black-swan-film-review-1004112184.story

Peter Deburge for Variety: http://www.variety.com/review/VE1117943400.html?categoryid=31&cs=1

Mike Goodridge for Screen:
http://www.screendaily.com/reviews/latest-reviews/-black-swan/5017589.article

Guy Lodge for In Contention:
http://gceae.th8.us/

Tom McCarthy for Deep Focus:

http://blogs.indiewire.com/toddmccarthy/archives/review_black_swan/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed


David Gritten for the Telegraph:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/film/filmreviews/7975546/Venice-Film-Festival-2010-Black-Swan-review.html

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I keep getting the run around when I try to do a search on the net. Is Nina(Portman) really Lily (Kunis)? Is she seeing a doppleganger of herself which is the darker side or does she actually transform into a creature? None of the hints make any sense.....

On The Lookout 4:
some new music. WTF is going on this year?

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Very interesting character study. I actually thought it was pretty cool but it wasn't anything you haven't seen before...

I mean, I won't spoil anything but I'll just say that because it's Aronofsky, there are certain things you can expect: a damaged protagonist who may or may not be going crazy and has some sort of objects or liquids oozing from their orifices as a result... you can also expect to see a lot of sharp objects, peeling skin, blood, some drinking and drug use, and lots of crying, all set to a pulsating and screeching Clint Mansell score.

Like I said, Amidala put it down as Nina in what surely will be an Oscar nominated performance. Only thing is I found it hard to *really* care about her situation, which I guess I can chalk up to my being highly ignorant about the competitive nature of dance theater, or perhaps just a simple misreading on the mental state of Nina... I just didn't understand why she was tripping over the fact that Lilly (Mila Kunis, who was okay, nothing special) was in the troupe and whatnot...

OH SHIT WAIT A MINUTE I JUST THOUGHT ABOUT SOMETHING THAT I CAN'T REALLY TALK ABOUT UNTIL OTHERS SEE THE MOVIE. DAMN THAT SHIT JUST HIT ME. DUH I'M SLOW...

Anyway, moving on, I thought Vincent Cassel brought the right amount of attractive and pretentious sleaze into his role as the director... I mean, I *guess* ladies find him attractive? I personally would have cast a more attractive actor in the role, for some reason...

Barbara Hershey was very good as the overprotective mom, but her performance alongside Amidala made me want to know more about their situation: why was she so protective of Nina, what were the circumstances that led to the way they co-exist? I didn't need a prologue, but some kind of backstory would have helped. I felt cheated that we didn't see more of their dynamic, and I know, it's Nina's story, not really about Nina and her mom... at least it's not on the surface...

Also, I'm still trying to understand why Winona Ryder was in this piece... I mean, I get why she's there, I guess I would have liked to have seen more of her...

On the tech side, the movie looked great and was well-cut... I don't recall hearing any Radiohead or Thom Yorke, but the soundtrack credits showed about 5 Chemical Brothers songs, so there you go...


Okay, I DO have to give away one big SPOILER:


Y'all dudez ready?





Are you sure?






Like, really, really sure?





Okay, here it is: Amidala and Mila DO NOT GET NAKED. At all. No boobs, no asses, nothing. All you get is that kiss y'all are currently going apeshit over, which is followed by some shots of Mila simulating cunnilingus on Amidala. That's it. So don't go in expecting to see scissor action, or dildos, or anything else that you might see in a porno. This ain't really about that.


Oh, and the person who mentioned Persona, Mulholland Drive, and the other one which I forgot? You're spot on. Except not really. Can't really explain more than that at this time.

Overall, it was cool, certainly not as engaging as The Wrestler but it still has an equally-effective and hype-worthy performance from Natalie Portman...

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>Anyway, moving on, I thought Vincent Cassel brought the right amount of attractive and pretentious sleaze into his role as the director... I mean, I *guess* ladies find him attractive? I personally would have cast a more attractive actor in the role, for some reason...



but mainly the whole movie had me flinching
but yes he definitely did not help
you can be attractively sleazy
but unattratcively sleazy...i dunno i needed an attractive sleazeball for that role i suppose
~~~~
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~~~~
You cannot hate people for their own good.

It's pretty phenomenal. Believe the hype about Portman's performance. I liked it more than The Wrestler but don't think many others will think the same.

I seen it at the Chicago International Film Festival about a month ago.

I enjoyed it quite a bit, but the CGI ruined some key scenes...including one with Winona Ryder's character.

And Natalie Portman will not only get an Oscar nomination, but she will win it for best actress. At this point in the movie season, it's well deserved.

>I liked it more than The Wrestler but don't
>think many others will think the same.

Same here, I thought it was a visceral piece of filmmaking with some terrific acting, directing and editing. I really liked that the movie alternated between different genres without really committing to one. Truly astounding performance by Portman, the best yet this year (although Swank comes close in Conviction IMO)

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I enjoyed it. Nina was seeing some weird shit. Not much more that needs to be said that hasn't been already.

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Catfights? Check.
Bitchy controlling moms? Check.
Lesbian sex? Check.
Dream sequences? Check.
Fabulous costumes? Check.
Big time dance numbers? Check.

It's done with a straight face, but it's sooooo silly and over-the-top, lol. Only Portman's terrific performance keeps the film grounded.

This is the type of film that I feel will be a midnight movie cult classic, a film embraced by the gay community, or both. My audience laughed a lot and oohed at the bitchiness audibly... and I saw it at the super-hoity-toity arthouse theater, lol.

It's enjoyable enough and entertaining... but don't go in expecting anything deep or even that trippy. It's mostly just campy melodrama with a bunch of dream sequences, all kept from becoming too laughable because of how damn good Portman is at doing all of this with a straight face.

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*this shit is either going to be some dark ass drama or some campy shit that will ONLY be saved by whoever stars in this movie*

everyone I know who's seen this (its not out in my neck of the woods but will be in a week or so) has been RAVING about the movie..

I love Darren's work...he seemingly has a knack for doing movies about damaged protagonists who may or may NOT be going crazy...

and the Mulholland Drive (a movie I loved but a grip of folks hated up in here..then again, I loves me some David Lynch so my freak flag is *ALREADY* flying like crazy in 50 mph winds and shit) comparisons are being made...but you are right, Black Swan isn't like that at all...

sidenote: damn, isn't it time for David Lynch to come back out with some weird, identity swapping, psychosexual opus? I mean, really he should

I can't wait to see this...and it would be kinda cool if psychosexual dramas and thrillers started coming out more...

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I really think he came into his own with this one.

campy, lol. comparing it to showgirls is offensive to the film.

i think a lot of people are mistaking laughing at scenes out of shocked discomfort rather than it being funny because its bad.

yet to see true grit or the fighter, but this top 5 of the year for me

>campy, lol. comparing it to showgirls is offensive to the
>film.

Actually, the plot mirrors very closely with Showgirls up until the end.

>i think a lot of people are mistaking laughing at scenes out
>of shocked discomfort rather than it being funny because its
>bad.

There's a difference between bad and campy. But it is without question trashy entertainment-- my audience was laughing at Natalie dissing Winona and Mila, going "oooooh!" That's not out of discomfort-- that's because catfights between dancers are funny. They'd also laugh when the lights go out and Natalie starting seeing things, and shit would scare her with the stereotypical musical sting.

>yet to see true grit or the fighter, but this top 5 of the
>year for me

Not for me. Although Portman's Black Swan performance is easily near the top.

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when i think of campy/campiness i think of sumthing corny and in bad taste due mostly to bad acting and/or a bad script.

>Actually, the plot mirrors very closely with Showgirls up
>until the end.

O_o can you send me the copy of Show Girls you have, cause the one I watched was about a young woman who went to Las Vegas for dance fame and ended up consumed by sex and drugs. Where as Black Swan was about a young artist so dedicated to her craft and coddled by her mother, she is socially inept and suffers from pyschological disorders

>There's a difference between bad and campy. But it is without
>question trashy entertainment-- my audience was laughing at
>Natalie dissing Winona and Mila, going "oooooh!" That's not
>out of discomfort-- that's because catfights between dancers
>are funny. They'd also laugh when the lights go out and
>Natalie starting seeing things, and shit would scare her with
>the stereotypical musical sting.

yup, i was at the archlight and people were laughing at the same scences ur describing. when dont crowds react to certain things. i think it was a mixture of both. i'm, still wondering what is trashy, silly or over-the-top. please name scenes. where is the big dance number, pleae dont tell me its the final scene you're talking about. where is the over the top costume? what the ONE of the male lead

>Not for me. Although Portman's Black Swan performance is
>easily near the top.

honestly the negative criticisms I'm hearing about the film seem to have a lot to do with some aversive sexism and inability to deal with Arnofosky not handing people a defined idea of what occurred with Nina.

i dont mind if you thought there were weaknesses, i just disagree

>when i think of campy/campiness i think of sumthing corny and
>in bad taste due mostly to bad acting and/or a bad script.

Campy films usually involve fabulous costumes, catfighting, and cheap pleasures. This film has all three-- even if you liked the film, shots of girls' writhing asses, lesbian sex, and jump-scares are CHEAP thrills, lol.

>>Actually, the plot mirrors very closely with Showgirls up
>>until the end.
>
>O_o can you send me the copy of Show Girls you have, cause the
>one I watched was about a young woman who went to Las Vegas
>for dance fame and ended up consumed by sex and drugs. Where
>as Black Swan was about a young artist so dedicated to her
>craft and coddled by her mother, she is socially inept and
>suffers from pyschological disorders

There's absolutely a huge aspect you're totally ignoring: the girl wants to move up in a dance company and be taken more seriously, and she overthrows the established older no-longer-hot commodity to become the star, thus earning the rancor of the older star and the other girls, making her a new target for predators.

That holds very strong for both.

In my review, I said it combines Showgirls, All About Eve, and Mommie Dearest. So it's not just Showgirls.

>>There's a difference between bad and campy. But it is
>without
>>question trashy entertainment-- my audience was laughing at
>>Natalie dissing Winona and Mila, going "oooooh!" That's not
>>out of discomfort-- that's because catfights between dancers
>>are funny. They'd also laugh when the lights go out and
>>Natalie starting seeing things, and shit would scare her
>with
>>the stereotypical musical sting.
>
>yup, i was at the archlight and people were laughing at the
>same scences ur describing. when dont crowds react to certain
>things. i think it was a mixture of both. i'm, still wondering
>what is trashy, silly or over-the-top. please name scenes.

The scenes where the drugged-up daughter is screaming at her mom and breaking her fingers is silly and over-the-top. The masturbation scene, focusing on Portman's writhing ass until she turns and sees the jump-scare of her mom, is trashy and silly.

>where is the big dance number, pleae dont tell me its the
>final scene you're talking about.

There are multiple. The end and the beginning. Not to mention the countless rehearsals. Why can't I name the final scene? Doesn't it include a big dance scene with gorgeous costumes?

where is the over the top
>costume? what the ONE of the male lead

I never said over-the-top costumes, though now that you mention it, the main man's costume (the "Evil Swan Man") is very silly.

>>Not for me. Although Portman's Black Swan performance is
>>easily near the top.
>
>honestly the negative criticisms I'm hearing about the film
>seem to have a lot to do with some aversive sexism and
>inability to deal with Arnofosky not handing people a defined
>idea of what occurred with Nina.

Well, I think the reviews people are calling "sexist" are fine critiques, because most of them note the similarities between the controlling Thomas physically demanding Nina to the controlling Aronofsky physically demanding Natalie. People call those reviews sexist because it assumes that Natalie isn't responsible for her performance-- why can't she be the one who chose to let Aronofsky be a demanding director? why can't she "need" a controlling taskmaster director to get her best performance out of her? Countless other actors are exactly the same, male and female alike.

>i dont mind if you thought there were weaknesses, i just
>disagree

I mean, I actually didn't think the film was weak. I thought it was entertaining and it will deservedly become a big cult classic that plays midnight screenings for years to come. I just think it was too silly and campy to be on my list of Best Films of the Year.

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>Campy films usually involve fabulous costumes, catfighting,
>and cheap pleasures. This film has all three-- even if you
>liked the film, shots of girls' writhing asses, lesbian sex,
>and jump-scares are CHEAP thrills, lol.

jump-scares? the scene with lilly and nina was underwhelming as shit. niggas who got turned on by that should watch porn or get some fuckin pussy. i found nina's early masterbation scene before the dun dun dun more erotic. and if those are "cheap" thrills our "film eye" is just trained differently

>>>Actually, the plot mirrors very closely with Showgirls up
>>>until the end.
There's absolutely a huge aspect you're totally ignoring: the
>girl wants to move up in a dance company and be taken more
>seriously, and she overthrows the established older
>no-longer-hot commodity to become the star, thus earning the
>rancor of the older star and the other girls, making her a new
>target for predators.

that didn't happen in Black Swan. nina was constantly defending the older dancers right to still be a star. even Lilly was constantly being friendly to Nina and the other dancers. once she became the it girl is when a few of the other girls become jeolous and envious. it was Thomas who made the decision to change his "muse". Black Swan showed us an artist so obsessed with her craft she became delusional. Nina's goal was to become the star of the show, but not in the same vein as in showgirls

>The scenes where the drugged-up daughter is screaming at her
>mom and breaking her fingers is silly and over-the-top. The
>masturbation scene, focusing on Portman's writhing ass until
>she turns and sees the jump-scare of her mom, is trashy and
>silly.

yeah fam we saw different movies. the scene of mother and daughter's ultimate unraveling made complete sense. at that point there hadn't been a real fracture or break in the arch of the story. her mother had such a psychological and social hold of nina, it would only make sense that the break would be violent, hence not over the top. and yeah the masterbation scene was weird not trashy in my opinion. it just illuminated the horrid relationship they really had

>There are multiple. The end and the beginning. Not to mention
>the countless rehearsals. Why can't I name the final scene?
>Doesn't it include a big dance scene with gorgeous costumes?

lol, when i think og BIG dance numbers i think of all the shit i had to endure with my ex and her love for shit like chicago, rent, mulan rouge... those are Big dance numbers. the dancing/dances in Black Swan were just aesthetic elements of the film

> where is the over the top
>>costume? what the ONE of the male lead
>
>I never said over-the-top costumes, though now that you
>mention it, the main man's costume (the "Evil Swan Man") is
>very silly.

okay, it was

>>>Not for me. Although Portman's Black Swan performance is
>>>easily near the top.
>>
>>honestly the negative criticisms I'm hearing about the film
>>seem to have a lot to do with some aversive sexism and
>>inability to deal with Arnofosky not handing people a
>defined
>>idea of what occurred with Nina.
>
>Well, I think the reviews people are calling "sexist" are fine
>critiques, because most of them note the similarities between
>the controlling Thomas physically demanding Nina to the
>controlling Aronofsky physically demanding Natalie. People
>call those reviews sexist because it assumes that Natalie
>isn't responsible for her performance-- why can't she be the
>one who chose to let Aronofsky be a demanding director? why
>can't she "need" a controlling taskmaster director to get her
>best performance out of her? Countless other actors are
>exactly the same, male and female alike.

nah son, i'm saying the way our male gaze is trained and how some men are reviewing the film is sexist, not the material of the film. this movie is essentially the wrestler with female characters, yet shit like campy, over the top, and silly are being thrown around because men percieve it to be just women being women and Aronofsky exploiting that trope, when in actuality its a great psychological melo-drama about a female artist. either way, thanks for engaging the conversation. respect

>I mean, I actually didn't think the film was weak. I thought
>it was entertaining and it will deservedly become a big cult
>classic that plays midnight screenings for years to come. I
>just think it was too silly and campy to be on my list of Best
>Films of the Year.

The Wrestler didn't have jump scares or the same detachment from reality that Black Swan had. That's what made me think it was campy and silly. If the movie had been about ballerinas and their commitment to the art without all of the hallucinations, I probably would have loved it a lot more (but then, it might have required some better dialogue in my opinion). I have no problem with movies about women or feminine things. One of the best movies I've seen all year was Winter's Bone, a MUCH tighter and more suspenseful film than Black Swan, and it's all about women and female identity in a male-dominated society.

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is what made me love the film. too much of modern cinema is straight forward. ive known and know of men and women who in THEIR minds must conflate their imaginations and reality as Nina did. The cutting/scratching and obsessive compulsive behavior Nina expressed, always seems to be the result of this paranoia and confusion.

i understand where you're coming from in terms of the sexism statement i made, but sometimes, like the race and class issues that are so imbeded in us, i think they play a role in how we percieve things without us acknowleding it. i was speaking for myself as well.

psst!

Go Smack yourself and then apologize to your hand for looking stupid - Case_One

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how did i miss this
the signs were all there
i would have enjoyed it waay more
and yes def a cult classic from that angle
~~~~
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~~~~
You cannot hate people for their own good.

some of it is over the top but that doesn't automatically equate to campy.

___________________

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Perfectly structured, Portman delivers the best performance since Day-Lewis in There Will Be Blood and Aronofsky comes into his own and quite possibly makes his masterpiece. Visceral to say the least. Dug the Cronenberg/Polanski-esque elements, too.

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it came on as soon as I entered the theater and it amazed me more than Black Swan. I'm dying for fox searchlight to place an HD trailer online. I'd watch that three times a day.

unlike almost any trailer i've ever seen, hype for them to release the proper trailer online

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hasta la victoria siempre

cant wait for this

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I had a similar experience as Longo described on this week's AFOP. Saw it opening day (for those of us who are not ivory tower coastal elites but instead live in The Real America) in an art house theater and people were cracking up at a lot of the campier scenes (my personal fave, and this is not really a spoiler, was early in the flick when Nat P was in her room doing that thing and the camera DUN DUN DUNs over to her mother.) It may be a dark psycho-thriller, but this movie has laughs galore.

Portman and Hirshey were both excellent (Portman's a shoe in for an Oscar nom,) really there wasn't a bad performance and as corny as it kinda felt, the score really did bring that ending home.

Not as good as The Wrestler or Requiem, but definitely better than The Fountain.


**SPOILER QUESTION**





Maybe it's because they all kinda looked alike, but was Nina supposed to be fighting Lilly in the dressing room? Because to me it looked like she was fighting the evil/mirror version of herself she started seeing towards the end. Maybe I need to think on this more, I literally just got home from it.

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>**SPOILER QUESTION**
>
>
>
>
>
>Maybe it's because they all kinda looked alike, but was Nina
>supposed to be fighting Lilly in the dressing room? Because to
>me it looked like she was fighting the evil/mirror version of
>herself she started seeing towards the end. Maybe I need to
>think on this more, I literally just got home from it.

Aronofsky splices between shots of her fighting Lilly at the start of the fight to her mirror image and then back to Lilly to see the end "result" of the fight, if that makes sense. Of course, it's not Lilly. And really, there are so many dream sequences that it's hard to keep reality straight.

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like when Nina was jilling off and she see's her mother's in the room...that was was intended moment of levity.

i'm really not understanding a lot of the criticism of the movie as being campy or over-the-top. it's INTENDED to be that way.

the main character is having a mental breakdown...she's literally going crazy and seeing the world through a cracked lens.

were y'all fucked up by the rave reviews - maybe expecting a stone-faced drama? this is an unapologeticly over-the-top psychological horror movie. sounds like a lot of people were bringing preconceived baggage into their viewings.

>i'm really not understanding a lot of the criticism of the
>movie as being campy or over-the-top. it's INTENDED to be
>that way.

i thought "black swan" was a great movie -- however, the greatness stems in no small part to its being completely out of control. it would be campy if the performances and the visuals weren't so excellent, but as a movie-watcher who has seen many, many campy films, you can't help but see things in this movie that reflect camp. and it's straight-up over-the-top. that's not a criticism, that's what it is. it works wonderfully, but it's anything but an act of subtle filmmaking.

Go Smack yourself and then apologize to your hand for looking stupid - Case_One

http://i54.tinypic.com/nxros2.jpg

..and certainly deserving of the oscar nomination

as annoyingly timid and naive as her character could be at times in this film, she never lost my attention.

she really became nina

in a role that required quite a bit of reach (esp the short-stints/scenes without dialogue), she absolutely shines.

the film overall was entertainin'. the dance/stage scenes will prob'ly earn an oscar nod (for costume/wardrobe). i'm still upset with kunis for such a bland performance in "the book of eli" but she gives a solid supporting role in this

*SLIGHT SPOILER*







the sex scene btwn portman & kunis played more like suspense than sensual, but that shit was still sexy...




*los angeles lakers: 2010 nba champions*

-the dynasty continues-



..and miles to go before i sleep...

The director who has a gritty new take on Swan Lake who is physically demanding of his star and grinds her down to her most emotionally vulnerable state?

This doesn't really just talk about Black Swan. You could say The Wrestler and Requiem for a Dream do this and also obsess with physical discomfort and wrung-out emotional states.

I saw one or two critics write about it, but they used it as a reason to hate the movie... I also saw a couple of critics write about how critics that note this obvious parallel are misogynistic, which to me makes zero sense as well.

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critics be trying to hard sumtimes. that bobble head hipster at the village voice wrote one of the stupidest things ive read in a while. LaSalle of SF Times was descent in his not really liking the film and the GOATS (Ebert's) review came of confusing as well. Travers has been the only one with an on point review in my opinion

as for ur cassell-aronofsky idea. i dont know about that

>critics be trying to hard sumtimes.

>as for ur cassell-aronofsky idea. i dont know about that

Well, three of his last four films have been about people in relentless pursuit of a goal who punish their bodies to receive it. Aronofsky-as-taskmaster is certainly very within the realm of reality, so the parallel isn't terribly hard to draw.

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