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Subject: "biological race is not real" This topic is locked.
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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Wed Oct-15-03 05:51 PM

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"biological race is not real"


          

it is a social construction skewing reality.

cultural anthropology teacher said so.

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
RE: biological race is not real
Oct 15th 2003
1
what school?
Oct 15th 2003
2
RE: what school?
Oct 15th 2003
4
Not exactly true (to play Devil's advocate)
Oct 17th 2003
24
      careful now
Oct 19th 2003
30
      That's not what he's saying
Oct 28th 2003
40
      RE: Not exactly true (to play Devil's advocate)
Oct 28th 2003
48
RE: biological race is not real
Oct 15th 2003
3
RE: biological race is not real
Oct 16th 2003
8
RE: biological race is not real
Oct 16th 2003
11
RE: biological race is not real
Oct 20th 2003
31
RE: biological race is not real
Oct 16th 2003
12
      RE: biological race is not real
Oct 20th 2003
32
currently a sociology major
Oct 16th 2003
9
half-truths
Oct 15th 2003
5
we are out of late passes
Oct 15th 2003
6
Weird
Oct 16th 2003
7
To play devil's advocate ...
Oct 16th 2003
10
RE: To play devil's advocate ...
Oct 16th 2003
13
      Yeah,
Oct 16th 2003
15
           RE: Yeah,
Oct 16th 2003
16
                check this out. . .
Oct 16th 2003
20
                Interesting
Oct 29th 2003
51
                Race can be traced in DNA, quite easily ...
Oct 17th 2003
22
RE: Race = Phenotype
Oct 16th 2003
14
RE: Race = Phenotype
Oct 16th 2003
17
      Are you the poet?
Oct 28th 2003
44
Thats what JEWS want you to believe
Oct 16th 2003
18
What is with your fixation with Jews?
Oct 16th 2003
19
      They control the media
Oct 17th 2003
23
           You're Right
Oct 19th 2003
25
                thats funny.......
Oct 19th 2003
29
                     RE: thats funny.......
Oct 20th 2003
36
                          Thats what i been tryna tell these cats!
Oct 23rd 2003
37
RE: biological race is not real
Oct 17th 2003
21
A better way to state your propostion is...
Oct 19th 2003
26
Because race is biological
Oct 19th 2003
27
It is not "race specific."
Oct 20th 2003
33
well...
Oct 20th 2003
34
pbs says so too!
Oct 19th 2003
28
agreed but
Oct 28th 2003
42
Although it's so obvious, a lot of people dont know thi
Oct 20th 2003
35
RE: biological race is not real
Oct 27th 2003
38
For the simple reason that
Oct 28th 2003
39
subspecies and genetic drift:
Oct 28th 2003
41
RE: subspecies and genetic drift:
Oct 28th 2003
43
this just in
Oct 28th 2003
45
To some this conversation up
Oct 28th 2003
46
RE: To some this conversation up
Oct 28th 2003
50
RE: biological race is not real
Oct 28th 2003
47
RE: biological race is not real
Oct 28th 2003
49

sugababy
Member since Mar 19th 2003
17500 posts
Wed Oct-15-03 06:11 PM

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1. "RE: biological race is not real"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

thats what i learned too

--
www.twitter.com/rosaliiinda

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Wed Oct-15-03 06:44 PM

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2. "what school?"
In response to Reply # 1


          

>thats what i learned too

  

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sugababy
Member since Mar 19th 2003
17500 posts
Wed Oct-15-03 07:13 PM

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4. "RE: what school?"
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

university of texas at austin

--
www.twitter.com/rosaliiinda

  

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MrMick
Charter member
1539 posts
Fri Oct-17-03 08:49 AM

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24. "Not exactly true (to play Devil's advocate)"
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

The human species may actually now be multiple, extremely closley related, but different species.

Think about it. A species of birds lives on a land mass that is broken into islands, and eventually form different colorations, beak styles/lengths, and other physical uniquenesses based on environment. Scientists will look at this and say that the species has then divided based on these externally induced changes.

Isn't it the same in humans? Didn't people in Europe gradually develop lighter skin tones based on environment? If you accept that we all started out from one race, most likely on the African continent (which I'm not inclined to dispute), then mustn't you also accept that the species split out of necessity as it expanded geographically?

This does not mean that we are not all humans, because we all have the same consciousness that makes us such. But the physical differences do exist.

PS-Although I don't agree entirely with someone like Jonathan Sacks' cultural and moral relativism, I do support his point about embracing the differences in others, as opposed to believing in or trying to enforce sameness throughout humanity.

--

"Old? Gay? Like decks?"
-The Janitor

  

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tohunga
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Sun Oct-19-03 10:54 PM

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30. "careful now"
In response to Reply # 24


  

          

the closest 'species' to humanity is chimpanzees.... don't confuse 'race' with 'species', or it'll fuck up yr whole argument from the start!

And yes, skin tone and physical characteristics altered due to environs. But the differences are pretty minute on a scientific scale.

_________________________
http://www.paulwalsh.co.nz
art.design.comics.blog.etc

  

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mara
Member since Sep 21st 2002
2058 posts
Tue Oct-28-03 03:53 AM

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40. "That's not what he's saying"
In response to Reply # 24


  

          

He's saying is no biological anything that determines race. It's defined by society and this is true. What you've stated is fact but that's not what he's talking about.

*I'm hella hella sexy*

  

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Nopayne
Member since Jan 03rd 2003
52486 posts
Tue Oct-28-03 11:02 AM

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48. "RE: Not exactly true (to play Devil's advocate)"
In response to Reply # 24


  

          

Nope. You may be able to argue that we're different sub-species, but not different species. It takes tens or hundreds of thousands of years for new species to develop. Different groups of humans were not separated long enough for this to happen.
===========================================
-Me

---
Love,
Nopayne

  

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d_lyte_1
Member since Aug 02nd 2003
9 posts
Wed Oct-15-03 07:00 PM

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3. "RE: biological race is not real"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

very cool that you're taking cultural anthro. that was one of my faves. pay attention to gender issues as well as race issues. hopefully your professor is comprehensive.

race is a political tool. simply put, it is a divisive tool. race is based on physical characteristics such as skin color, facial features, and hair texture. racial identification is not specific to our culture, and exists in most, if not all, "industrialized" societies. issues of colonialism play into favoring "white" skin color. mexicans experience racism within their culture, favoring "Spanish" light skin. indonesians experience racism, favoring the lighter skin of their colonizers.

ethnicity & culture (i'm sure you'll learn), are more concrete. they are based in traditions & practices passed down through generations. things like religion & marriage play important roles in the transmission of culture.

i'm not sure what your major is, but anthro, sociology, & psychology all delve more deeply into subjects like this. i'm a soc major/psych minor, & have taken classes in all of these disciplines regarding race.

keep an open mind. be willing to hear things you probably won't understand at first or will be offended by. learn from things that seem offensive.

you seem like a bright guy, & i enjoy your posts. good luck in your education.

http://Members.BlackPlanet.com/trupeachatl99/

  

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insanejake
Member since Feb 18th 2003
4885 posts
Thu Oct-16-03 01:55 AM

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8. "RE: biological race is not real"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

ethnicity & culture (i'm sure you'll learn), are more concrete.

As a Social Anthropology graduate, I would have to disagree. Ethnicity and culture (like race) are largely invented. Traditions are also invented, and whilst religion and marriage are important, politics and economics play as great a role in cultural evolution.

There is my two cents...

"This isnt an argument, you are just contradicting everything Im saying"

"No Im not"
******************
"Dont open your mind too much or your brain will fall out"

******************************

Its 2005, where's my hoverboard and jetpack?

  

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d_lyte_1
Member since Aug 02nd 2003
9 posts
Thu Oct-16-03 05:23 AM

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11. "RE: biological race is not real"
In response to Reply # 8


  

          

I respect your opinion and would agree. By concrete, I simply meant that it is something based on more than physical features, and is more easily defined. what is "black" in our culture may not be the same in a culture that doesn't hold to the "one-drop" rule. we can, however, look at food, customs, clothing, and other tangible items as being culturally distinct. I included religion and marriage as examples, but would wholeheartedly agree that politics & economics play large roles in almost every aspect of our lives.

peace


btw, i am interested to know that there is a graduate program for "social anthropology". what school? it seems that anthro is inherently social, so what is the distinction? i'm considering grad school, so all new topics are of interest to me.

http://Members.BlackPlanet.com/trupeachatl99/

  

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insanejake
Member since Feb 18th 2003
4885 posts
Mon Oct-20-03 02:45 AM

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31. "RE: biological race is not real"
In response to Reply # 11


  

          

Social Anthropology is UK cultural Anthropology.

As for blackness, well I reckon the Australian Aborigines are black, but their culture is wildly different from say, UK black culture, which itself is different from Masaai culture, which is different from Mbuti culture etc etc.

Black as term was invented by white people to describe the African 'other'.

Obviously, Black people appropriated this and used it as a tool of solidarity and some would say resistance against the dominant culture.

So from this we can see that Black is an invented term (by both white and black people), and I predict notions of blackness becoming increasingly fluid as people become more culturally accepting of others (which I believe is happening due to the homogeneity caused by US fueled globalisation...).

Not sure if I understood your point fully though, so I might just have spewed off some thoughts on a random issue...

"This isnt an argument, you are just contradicting everything Im saying"

"No Im not"
******************
"Dont open your mind too much or your brain will fall out"

******************************

Its 2005, where's my hoverboard and jetpack?

  

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Federisco
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5002 posts
Thu Oct-16-03 11:48 AM

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12. "RE: biological race is not real"
In response to Reply # 8
Thu Oct-16-03 11:53 AM

  

          

Since ive just started on my studies in ethnology (an academic field at least in my country, which is the studies of cultures and identity), i have to reply too.. i got interested in what you wrote.

In what way are traditions largely invented? How is culture invented like race was invented? Aren't all concepts invented, but they all reflect/describe the reality in some way. Some better than others.

So how shall one view the diversity of humanity?
What i like about using ethnicity as a guidance to viewing the world's diversity is because then I am norwegian rather than White, and my friend is a somali rather than Black. That way it can counter the stereotypes, stigmatization(sp) and prejudice attached to highly generalized categorizations. Instead it encourages the understanding of someone's identity ("he is somali") to a greater extent than what's the case with more generalized groups ("he is black").

Perhaps it wont transcend so easily, what i am saying and the way i see it, since norwegian culture doesn't have the use of black/white as you do in usa. (because of your history)

░▒▓█▌¹♥▐█▓▒░

proud okayphotographer: http://www.okayplayer.com/okayphotographers/

"Most of our assumptions have outlived their uselessness." — Marshall McLuhan

  

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insanejake
Member since Feb 18th 2003
4885 posts
Mon Oct-20-03 02:54 AM

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32. "RE: biological race is not real"
In response to Reply # 12


  

          


In what way are traditions largely invented? How is culture invented like race was invented? Aren't all concepts invented, but they all reflect/describe the reality in some way. Some better than others.

I would agree that apart from empirical concepts such as pain, hunger and thirst, most concepts are invented.

So how shall one view the diversity of humanity?
What i like about using ethnicity as a guidance to viewing the world's diversity is because then I am norwegian rather than White, and my friend is a somali rather than Black.

This is exactly my point. Blackness as a tool is not very useful for understanding Black cultures where there are no White people. See my above post.

Instead it encourages the understanding of someone's identity ("he is somali") to a greater extent than what's the case with more generalized groups ("he is black").

Sure, but there arent many Africans in the US (this is where I get shot down I think) most people are descendants from slaves, bought over by white people. Here Black assumes a different significance, as it has a whole set of economic, historical cultural and political meanings that it would lack in a country full of black people (eg Somalia). Even in those countries I would still say black was a valid term when discussing relations between white Africans and Black Africans, for similar reasons as it is valid to discuss Black Americans.

Perhaps it wont transcend so easily, what i am saying and the way i see it, since norwegian culture doesn't have the use of black/white as you do in usa. (because of your history)

I suspect that Norway has its fair share of racists (correct me if I am wrong). Anyway, any Black people in Norway have only arrived there relatively recently (again, correct me if I am not right), meaning that the effects of the battles of blacks to fight for recognition in other countries had already spread to the socially accepting climate of Norway (see the last two brackets).

"This isnt an argument, you are just contradicting everything Im saying"

"No Im not"
******************
"Dont open your mind too much or your brain will fall out"

******************************

Its 2005, where's my hoverboard and jetpack?

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Thu Oct-16-03 03:37 AM

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9. "currently a sociology major"
In response to Reply # 3


          

>i'm not sure what your major is, but anthro, sociology, &
>psychology all delve more deeply into subjects like this.
>i'm a soc major/psych minor, & have taken classes in all of
>these disciplines regarding race.

but i'm getting the paperwork today to change to poli sci.

>you seem like a bright guy, & i enjoy your posts. good luck
>in your education.

why thank you. i am *flattered*

  

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moreandmorelove
Member since Jul 26th 2002
793 posts
Wed Oct-15-03 07:50 PM

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5. "half-truths"
In response to Reply # 0


          

biological race is not real. old news. it is a social construct. older news. it is based on skewed perception. false news. it is divisive. more false news.



  

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Allah
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47754 posts
Wed Oct-15-03 08:19 PM

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6. "we are out of late passes"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

.

_______________________
"Arm Leg Leg Arm Hate." c/o desus
_______________________
Divine Ruler
http://www.facebook.com/divineruler
__gigs__
__stuff__

  

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TheSauce
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Thu Oct-16-03 12:04 AM

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7. "Weird"
In response to Reply # 0


          

My prof just went over that (knew it already) yesterday in MY anthro class on Colonialism.

  

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keithdawg
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5593 posts
Thu Oct-16-03 04:09 AM

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10. "To play devil's advocate ..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I'm not disagreeing with you, but can you answer these questions? I'd simply like you to elucidate further. It seems to me like destroying the notion of 'race' is simply a game of semantics.

What word would we use to categorize the physical differences between different peoples?

Is the DNA of a black man not distinctly different than the DNA of an Eskimo?

Different facial, hair, muscle, skin and copious other qualities are different amongst different races. If race doesn’t account for this what does? Are we different breeds (like a Chocolate Lab as apposed to a Golden Retriever)?

"You fasten all the triggers,
For the others to fire,
Then you sit back and watch,
As the death count gets higher"-Bob Dylan

"Maybe you'll be president,
But know right from wrong,
Or in the flood,
You'll build an Ark,
And sail us to the moon"-Thom Yorke

"I'm in heaven trying to figure out which stack they're going to stuff us atheists into,
When Peter and his monkey laugh and i laugh with them,
I'm not sure what at,
They point and say we'll keep you in the back polishing halos, baking manna and gas"-Modest Mouse

Do yourself a favor,
Be your own savior.

Daniel Johnston

  

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Federisco
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5002 posts
Thu Oct-16-03 11:59 AM

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13. "RE: To play devil's advocate ..."
In response to Reply # 10
Thu Oct-16-03 12:00 PM

  

          

other than that it's been discovered that our DNA probably matches someone from a completely different continent better than it does your neighbur - DNA is more about different "types", and what was used to classify "Race" is only cosmetic differences..
other than that, see ethnology, post #12.

or someone's nationality. but then i see the difficulties for you in USA, though. then you can resort to using your cultural belonging. at worst, your subcultural belonging, such as african american.

life aint in black and white

░▒▓█▌¹♥▐█▓▒░

proud okayphotographer: http://www.okayplayer.com/okayphotographers/

"Most of our assumptions have outlived their uselessness." — Marshall McLuhan

  

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keithdawg
Charter member
5593 posts
Thu Oct-16-03 12:25 PM

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15. "Yeah,"
In response to Reply # 13


  

          

Of course there's a lot of ugly cultural occurences and ramifications that come along with race ... but, are you denying that DNA does not play a role in the color of a human's skin, the shape of the eyes, height, weight, etc?

"You fasten all the triggers,
For the others to fire,
Then you sit back and watch,
As the death count gets higher"-Bob Dylan

"Maybe you'll be president,
But know right from wrong,
Or in the flood,
You'll build an Ark,
And sail us to the moon"-Thom Yorke

"I'm in heaven trying to figure out which stack they're going to stuff us atheists into,
When Peter and his monkey laugh and i laugh with them,
I'm not sure what at,
They point and say we'll keep you in the back polishing halos, baking manna and gas"-Modest Mouse

Do yourself a favor,
Be your own savior.

Daniel Johnston

  

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Federisco
Charter member
5002 posts
Thu Oct-16-03 01:59 PM

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16. "RE: Yeah,"
In response to Reply # 15
Thu Oct-16-03 02:04 PM

  

          

nah, DNA contains the colour of your skin, eyes, hair, etc.. yeah. but there are different DNA "types", and these types cross any category of race. if i remember right, race cannot be traced in the DNA. at least not so easily. and what is much easier to trace is the DNA type, which like i said crosses the races.

if i wasnt so tired, i'd look for an article i read, about a documentary that is showing science's answer to human diversity and differences. i think it is called "man out of africa" or "adam out of africa". in it, one of the strongest points of the scientists was that what has been called "race" is only cosmetic differences, caused by the climates that different groups of humanity have faced.

we're human beings nonetheless. dogs vary extremely in sizes and composition.. but our differences (aside from cultural) are minor and cosmetic, on the surface.

other parts of the documentary is about how humans migrated out of africa, and to what areas, and then add constant mixing, and how that has lead up to today.

░▒▓█▌¹♥▐█▓▒░

proud okayphotographer: http://www.okayplayer.com/okayphotographers/

"Most of our assumptions have outlived their uselessness." — Marshall McLuhan

  

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okayhomo
Member since Jun 02nd 2002
543 posts
Thu Oct-16-03 07:02 PM

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20. "check this out. . ."
In response to Reply # 16


          

<http://www.alternet.org/story.html?StoryID=16917>

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
PEEP GAME:
http://www.reddirt.biz
http://sugartruck.tripod.com


"I am not wrong: wrong is not my name/ My name is my own my own my own/ and I can't tell you who the hell set things up like this/ but I can tell you that from now on my resistance/ my simple and daily and nightly self-determination/ may very well cost you your life"
-June Jordan, "Poem About My Rights"

"Exploitation of all and everything is the fundamental tenet of Capitalism, and exploitation of women is the fundamental tenet of Patriarchy, both of which are the foundation and driving ethos of this country, so Niggers are simply reflecting that in their words and actions. The real problem is that in many cases, you have all these Pro-Capitalist Niggers running around promoting the wonders of Capitalism, and Pro-Patriarchal Bitches telling us that Patriarchy is good, and without something to counter this madness, our children buy into that bullshit. . ."
-Art McGee

Re-member: James, Lorainne, Essex, Audre, Joe, June, Marlon, Assotto. . .

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
PEEP GAME:
http://www.reddirt.biz
http://sugartruck.tripod.com


"I am not wrong: wrong is not my name/ My name is my own my own my own/ and I can't tell you who the hell set things up like this/ but I can tell you that

  

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7Shy
Member since Dec 03rd 2002
10407 posts
Wed Oct-29-03 08:38 AM

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51. "Interesting"
In response to Reply # 20


          

.

  

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keithdawg
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5593 posts
Fri Oct-17-03 04:52 AM

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22. "Race can be traced in DNA, quite easily ..."
In response to Reply # 16


  

          

For example, take note of the Kobe Bryant pre-trial, where it was stated openly that the jizz in the alleged victim's panties was that of a white male.

"You fasten all the triggers,
For the others to fire,
Then you sit back and watch,
As the death count gets higher"-Bob Dylan

"Maybe you'll be president,
But know right from wrong,
Or in the flood,
You'll build an Ark,
And sail us to the moon"-Thom Yorke

"I'm in heaven trying to figure out which stack they're going to stuff us atheists into,
When Peter and his monkey laugh and i laugh with them,
I'm not sure what at,
They point and say we'll keep you in the back polishing halos, baking manna and gas"-Modest Mouse

Do yourself a favor,
Be your own savior.

Daniel Johnston

  

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blueology3
Member since Jun 17th 2002
515 posts
Thu Oct-16-03 12:08 PM

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14. "RE: Race = Phenotype"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Race is not as social as racism because groups are different regardless. Someone of the same culture can be of a different race. Culture is very important but I refuse to kick race out the door when race put people in positions of have and have nots.

"We are not stunted in spirit, we are not europeans, we are not Christians that we should invent fables a child would laugh at and harden our eyes to preach them daylight and deep night as truth. We are not Arabs, we are not Muslims to fabricate a desert

  

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mariposanegra
Member since Aug 22nd 2003
1074 posts
Thu Oct-16-03 05:00 PM

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17. "RE: Race = Phenotype"
In response to Reply # 14


          

Race is not biological and is a social construct. Ok. But the point is that people don't treat it that way. Because of that the color line remains.

_________________________________________

Obama Answer Center: http://answercenter.barackobama.com

  

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Brooklynbeef
Member since May 30th 2002
4649 posts
Tue Oct-28-03 09:53 AM

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44. "Are you the poet?"
In response to Reply # 17


  

          


--

"Forget Black History Month, how about live an African History Life"-Ansley Burrows

  

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IvyLeagueNegro
Member since Jul 20th 2003
1902 posts
Thu Oct-16-03 05:27 PM

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18. "Thats what JEWS want you to believe"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

The Jewish liberal media will do anything to fool the public and remain in control of nearly EVERY fortune 500 company and EVERY TV station. I suggest you learn more about the Jewish agenda before making such foolish claims!!!!!!!!!!!!

****SIG!******
DO DA DAMN THING NUKKA! http://www.freephotoiPods.com/?r=13236380

  

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HoChiGrimm
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19. "What is with your fixation with Jews?"
In response to Reply # 18


  

          

*shrugs and scratches head*

----------------------------------------------------------

The Rand (Paul or Ayn) philosophy, putting private property rights at
the same level of human rights, equates the status of things with the
status of human beings. If property is considered equal

  

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IvyLeagueNegro
Member since Jul 20th 2003
1902 posts
Fri Oct-17-03 07:43 AM

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23. "They control the media"
In response to Reply # 19


  

          

n/m

****SIG!******
DO DA DAMN THING NUKKA! http://www.freephotoiPods.com/?r=13236380

  

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TheSauce
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25. "You're Right"
In response to Reply # 23


          

I haven't even started journalism yet and I've already been offered a job as anchor on a national newscast.

  

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IvyLeagueNegro
Member since Jul 20th 2003
1902 posts
Sun Oct-19-03 07:24 PM

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29. "thats funny......."
In response to Reply # 25
Sun Oct-19-03 07:24 PM

  

          

cuz i just posted this randomly after visiting stormfront.net. I guess that site is alright after all.

****SIG!******
DO DA DAMN THING NUKKA! http://www.freephotoiPods.com/?r=13236380

  

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TheSauce
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36. "RE: thats funny......."
In response to Reply # 29


          

>cuz i just posted this randomly after visiting
>stormfront.net. I guess that site is alright after all.

Fuck Yeah, I'm the devil and you're sub-human. Those crackers know their shit.

  

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IvyLeagueNegro
Member since Jul 20th 2003
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Thu Oct-23-03 01:08 PM

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37. "Thats what i been tryna tell these cats!"
In response to Reply # 36


  

          

White power! Im sick and tired of the way cats respond when i rock my swastika chain and KKK hood. If u aint down with the movement, then dont hate, thats what I always say!
Oh well, I guess ima always be the only black man reppin Tha Front. Maybe you can be the only Jew reppin them too.

****SIG!******
DO DA DAMN THING NUKKA! http://www.freephotoiPods.com/?r=13236380

  

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WarriorPoet415
Member since Sep 30th 2003
17777 posts
Fri Oct-17-03 02:56 AM

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21. "RE: biological race is not real"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

This is old news, but here is a website that might give you and all readers of this thread more information.

http://www.pbs.org/race/000_General/000_00-Home.htm

Using Phenotype has long been a way for those with power to keep the power amongst themselves and their descendants.


******************************

"To Each His Reach"
-George Clinton


______________________________________________________________________________

"To Each His Reach"

but.....

Fuck aliens.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Sun Oct-19-03 03:33 PM

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26. "A better way to state your propostion is..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

there is no biological basis for race.
Answer this question for me though?
If there is no biological basis for race, then how come certain heriditary diseases, like sickle cell, are race specific?

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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MrMick
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27. "Because race is biological"
In response to Reply # 26


  

          

Or rather, evolutionary. Race is the result of natural selectiuon based on the necessities of survival in different parts of the world. Biological differences go beyond skin tone, too. Why do pygmies live in heavily forested areas? Why do mountain people have such large chests/lungs? It's all biology.

--

"Old? Gay? Like decks?"
-The Janitor

  

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HoChiGrimm
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33. "It is not "race specific.""
In response to Reply # 26


  

          

Sickle cell is a disease that
affects people of all different
racial and ethnic backgrounds,
including African, Arabian, Israeli,
Greek, Italian, Hispanic, Turkish,
and Pakistani. Although unlikely,
it is entirely possible for a blond-
haired, blue-eyed child of Northern
European extraction to have sickle
cell disease.

----------------------------------------------------------

The Rand (Paul or Ayn) philosophy, putting private property rights at
the same level of human rights, equates the status of things with the
status of human beings. If property is considered equal

  

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Harmonia
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Mon Oct-20-03 04:11 PM

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34. "well..."
In response to Reply # 26


  

          

Sickle-cell anemia is a biological defense against malaria. Sickle-cell anemia affects those from regions with high malaria infection. It is not race bound, but regional and therefore the descedants of the people from malaria regions carry on the genes.

***************************************

www.twitter.com/MsKianga
http://nativebeadwork.blogspot.com/
'I can't stand Tim McCarver. He has a penchant for making blindingly obvious statements in a self-congratulatory tone' Kyle Lohse

  

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ororo_munroe
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28. "pbs says so too!"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://www.pbs.org/race/000_General/000_00-Home.htm

the truth of the matter is phenotypical differences are real. what they represent through the rubric of "race" as we know it...THAT's the illusion.

______________________________
for a minute there, i lost myself.

  

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emil
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Tue Oct-28-03 04:40 AM

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42. "agreed but"
In response to Reply # 28


          

the argument is semantics, and i was taught phenotype is synonymous with race, as most 'scientists' identify it anyway. socially, there may be differences. my background is in biology and not really sociology so i look at it a little differently.

  

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Harmonia
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35. "Although it's so obvious, a lot of people dont know thi"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I'm not gonna befuddle you with "late-passes". Congrats on taking a cultural anthro class and let me suggest that you follow that up with a biological/phsyical anthropology class. You'll learn a lot more about the physical anatomy and evolution of humans. The race issue is also dealt with in that field. Considering that we share 99% of our DNA with Chimps, as homo-sapiens we are so much alike, but focus on physical differences and try to classify them into "races".

***************************************

www.twitter.com/MsKianga
http://nativebeadwork.blogspot.com/
'I can't stand Tim McCarver. He has a penchant for making blindingly obvious statements in a self-congratulatory tone' Kyle Lohse

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71344 posts
Mon Oct-27-03 05:55 PM

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38. "RE: biological race is not real"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

yeah of course its not real, blacks, mexicans, etc are all thoroughly and disparately amalgamated yet all are viewed the same. most "races" are and on top of that many people are of more than one racial category. "social construction" is the term for it, but I gotta say, like most things, there is a problem, there is a term, but there aint no solution coming from the left

where there is a solution coming from, and a shitty one at that, is the right. i feel bad for asking, but did prop 54 pass in Cali? Ive been outta state for this whole recall fiasco. But thats what they propose, fine, no real race, no desire for racial categories and disparate practice, preference, etc, then lets not even acknowledge race'

this is not the way to go, because the social constructs ARE real and are important and they would like nothing more than to find a new one way to ignore them. When you see changes coming from the establishment, you know they are being made only to keep things the same, thus the cliche "the more things change the more they stay the same." Its not because of some innate human behavior or any bullshit like that, its by design

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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Jaymz
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Tue Oct-28-03 12:16 AM

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39. "For the simple reason that"
In response to Reply # 0
Tue Oct-28-03 12:16 AM

          

there are no "lines" separating one "race" from another. Who's to say "OK, *here's* the line - one shade lighter than this is latino, one shade darker than this is black..."?

Think of a box that has no sides, no top and no bottom... it's not really a box, is it?

-----
Get over yourself.

  

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emil
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Tue Oct-28-03 04:25 AM

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41. "subspecies and genetic drift:"
In response to Reply # 0


          

we're different.

really read your book(s), don't just listen to your professor.

  

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watdefok
Member since Jun 27th 2002
1443 posts
Tue Oct-28-03 08:17 AM

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43. "RE: subspecies and genetic drift:"
In response to Reply # 41


          

We're genetically way too similar to be considered subspecies. Besides, there is no obvious division. It all kind of blurs together, because people have been in contact with eachother and we've only existed for a short period. Most people would be mutts if you take this race thing back a while.

There certainly are differences, but the way we currently classify race is nonsense.
http://www.pbs.org/race/000_General/000_00-Home.htm

  

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Iltigo
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Tue Oct-28-03 09:58 AM

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45. "this just in"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

water IS in fact..WET!

news at 11

SHMEA?!

just let your soooooulglooooooow

________________________________________
It's A Boy and his name is MILES KHALIL YOUNG

  

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Brooklynbeef
Member since May 30th 2002
4649 posts
Tue Oct-28-03 10:02 AM

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46. "To some this conversation up"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

With all due respect, so what white folks finally admit race is not a biological construct.

That's just like a Cherokee knocking on a white man's door explaining that the land the white man occupies belongs to his great great great great grandmothers and fathers. Now mind you, he has the historical documentation to prove it. Knowing this and indulging in the benefits this land provided do you think the white man is going to off and give up his land to cure the injustice of the Cherokee? Especially when history proves otherwise.

"Forget Black History Month, how about live an African History Life"-Ansley Burrows

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71344 posts
Tue Oct-28-03 11:56 AM

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50. "RE: To some this conversation up"
In response to Reply # 46


  

          

yeah i agree with what youre saying here, even though the myths may be falling in rhetoric, their systemic effects persist and people wont do shit about it

thats the problem with social and justice studies in my opinion, too much problem identification and no action whatsoever. i think thoughtful ambiguity is great, but it doesnt mean inaction is the only course of action, it means fuck with solutions, be patient but stay flexible. sounds simple, but seems impossible

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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OshunsChile
Member since Oct 28th 2003
33 posts
Tue Oct-28-03 10:37 AM

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47. "RE: biological race is not real"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Evolution is the way of life on Earth and evolution/life thrives on diversity. If there were no diversity in humans, we humans as a whole would become extinct because if all of us, all 600 million of us tried to live the same way...meaning ate the same foods, used the same plants, animals, and other natural resources to build our homes, make our clothes et c...we would be extinct in less than 50yrs because we would use up all of those particular resources...therefore different types of humans require different things to survive and are biologically equipped to live in different areas. For example, most people of West Afrikan decent are lactose intolerant so would not thrive in a cattle herding culture and most Europeans red blood cells are not equipped to deal with malaria, making them less likely to survive in a tropical climate.So while race as a Eurocentric way of defining an inferior "other" is a fallacy, the diversity of the human family, is real an ordained by the Universe and the Creatress/tor. Humans are not the same scientifically and that is a GOOD thing.

~~~My spirit is too ancient to understand the separation of soul & gender...My love is too delicate to have thrown back in my face...Ntozake Shange~~~

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71344 posts
Tue Oct-28-03 11:53 AM

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49. "RE: biological race is not real"
In response to Reply # 47


  

          

yeah there are differences but they are not monolithic and most of the research and "conclusive" findings have some dangerous underpinnings. most groups and people are so mixed that its difficult to tell exactly where they fall in the genetic spectrum though there are similarities based upon genetic history/evolution.


And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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