I am a proud alum of the University of South Carolina - where 80-85% of the population was white while the remaining 20-15% was "non-white" and not necessarily Black.

During my collegiate education, I had the pleasure of attending Claflin College (HBCU) my Junior year.

Suffice to say: I feel like I've seen the best and the worst that these varying types of colleges can offer. And I feel like I can speak honestly on both.

So, tell me, are Unity, Ukaa and myself the only ones who have ever noticed the divide between Black students attending these schools? I have been a victim (Azzz if? ) of conversation that went like......"Yall think yall better than us"......... "You went to USC - University of Spoiled Children"...... AND ON THE FLIP SIDE: "I'd never date a boy from Benedict" (South Carolina HBCU)

CAN WE BE HONEST about our feelings and thoughts here?

What are some of the things TRUE/UNTRUE, FOUNDED/UNFOUNDED, RIGHT/WRONG things that you think about the different schools and the people that attend them?

What have your experiences been?

AND THEN....
Let's work them out so that we can know that we should be proud of each others educational accomplishments no matter where received. This is an issue that I feel there should be no division on. Education is Education.

ADD ON OR MOVE ON!

Live from the Shoe Sto'
I,I, I Can't Wait!

Live from the Shoe Sto, the Mall and NOW the courtroom


I, I, I Can't Wait?
U've waited long enuff!

I'm at The University of Missouri (4% Black) and Lincoln University(The OTHER one) is a 1/2 hour away. Relations between the black students at each school is.....warped I guess.

I say that because for the most part The LBC(Black student union at my school) only looks to LU for parties. The student body is only interested in LU for their parties,in particular Homecoming. Never, it seems will the LBC go down there to here Khalid Muhammad speak or anybody else for that matter. But let Scarface or Busta come down there for a show.......

Focusing on my school now, there is a class division amongst the LBC. I'm down for upward mobility, but I'm not trying to lose my identity and heritage just to gain some. Those who come from East St Louis never want to admit that they do because a lot of the times people from St Louis will ridicule them for it. So what ends up happening is that they say the are from some other town east of the river like Alton or Collinsville. Same goes for people from SouthEastern Missouri (The Boot Heel). It is the backwater area, but there shouldn't be any serious ridiculing about the folks from there. Yet many transfer after a while because they know that they shouldn't have to take such a beating.

I don't even want to start on about "letters". Nor do I need to go into detail about thinking outside the lines and applying shit from the classroom to everyday life. Not too many students at my school do this. They go to class, the dininghall and parties. Rarely does anybody get hyped about things going on in the community surrounding the school, nor are they involved.

Sorry for the vent, but that's what I ahve gone through/noticed about my school. Changing it would require a miracle. I got two more years left so time is in the recipe to start something


____________________________________________
Marinate on that!!!!!!!!!!!


Ju-LIE QUOTATION for the Week************************


"It's spelled D-O-O-K. Not the other way"
-----Lia

________________________________________
Grump
http://twitter.com/Gator_Bell

Thanks for responding Mister.

>I say that because for the
>most part The LBC(Black student
>union at my school) only
>looks to LU for parties.
>The student body is only
>interested in LU for their
>parties,in particular Homecoming. Never, it
>seems will the LBC go
>down there to here Khalid
>Muhammad speak or anybody else
>for that matter. But let
>Scarface or Busta come down
>there for a show.......
I've seen that too. What I saw was that the Black students from USC would flock to Orangeburg for South Carolina State's homecoming (the Black activity du'jour) but couldn't speak to you when you got back to campus (USC).

But let me ask you a question: Is there an established link between your schools? Does anybody make an effort to extend invitations to activities? Could YOU personally be about trying to make some linkage? Get a group together and go to some of the activities.....Get in touch with their Student Organization and offer to pass out flyers, bring a delegation, etc.... n/m?


>Focusing on my school now, there
>is a class division amongst
>the LBC. I'm down for
>upward mobility, but I'm not
>trying to lose my identity
>and heritage just to gain
>some.
Explain, please. I don't want to misunderstand you.

Those who come from
>East St Louis never want
>to admit that they do
>because a lot of the
>times people from St Louis
>will ridicule them for it.
>So what ends up happening
>is that they say the
>are from some other town
>east of the river like
>Alton or Collinsville. Same goes
>for people from SouthEastern Missouri
>(The Boot Heel). It is
>the backwater area, but there
>shouldn't be any serious ridiculing
>about the folks from there.
>Yet many transfer after a
>while because they know that
>they shouldn't have to take
>such a beating.
So this ridicule is based on sectionalism within the state as opposed to schools? Help.

Live from the Shoe Sto'
NuShooz

I,I, I Can't Wait!

Live from the Shoe Sto, the Mall and NOW the courtroom


I, I, I Can't Wait?
U've waited long enuff!

>I've seen that too. What I
>saw was that the Black
>students from USC would flock
>to Orangeburg for South Carolina
>State's homecoming (the Black activity
>du'jour) but couldn't speak to
>you when you got back
>to campus (USC).

YUP HAPPENS HERE TO, BUT NOT PREVALENT.
>
>But let me ask you a
>question: Is there an
>established link between your schools?
> Does anybody make an
>effort to extend invitations to
>activities? Could YOU personally
>be about trying to make
>some linkage? Get a
>group together and go to
>some of the activities.....Get in
>touch with their Student Organization
>and offer to pass out
>flyers, bring a delegation, etc....
>n/m?

ACTUALLLY, it was an alumnus of Lincoln University who desegregated MIZZOU by suing for admission into the Law School. Gaines vs Bd of Regents of the University of Missouri. As far as I know invitations are extended, but are never taken seriously. Those that do come a far and few between.
>
>
>>Focusing on my school now, there
>>is a class division amongst
>>the LBC. I'm down for
>>upward mobility, but I'm not
>>trying to lose my identity
>>and heritage just to gain
>>some.

OREOS, SELLOUTS, ETC.....

>Those who come from
>>East St Louis never want
>>to admit that they do
>>because a lot of the
>>times people from St Louis
>>will ridicule them for it.
>>So what ends up happening
>>is that they say the
>>are from some other town
>>east of the river like
>>Alton or Collinsville. Same goes
>>for people from SouthEastern Missouri
>>(The Boot Heel). It is
>>the backwater area, but there
>>shouldn't be any serious ridiculing
>>about the folks from there.
>>Yet many transfer after a
>>while because they know that
>>they shouldn't have to take
>>such a beating.

YEAH, more so on my campus because alot of areas in the state have their own university so it seems(Truman State, NW MO State, SW Mo St, etc). But those that do the ridiculing are from the urban centers of Kansas City and St Louis. They come across as the high n mighty of the student populace.




____________________________________________
Marinate on that!!!!!!!!!!!


Ju-LIE QUOTATION for the Week************************


"It's spelled D-O-O-K. Not the other way"
-----Lia

________________________________________
Grump
http://twitter.com/Gator_Bell

>
>>I've seen that too. What I
>>saw was that the Black
>>students from USC would flock
>>to Orangeburg for South Carolina
>>State's homecoming (the Black activity
>>du'jour) but couldn't speak to
>>you when you got back
>>to campus (USC).
>
>YUP HAPPENS HERE TO, BUT NOT
>PREVALENT.
But this ish needs to stop. Adjusting to college is already hard enough without you (people in general) feeling like they ain got nobody that looks like them that got they back. n/m? And this type of division is fertilized by other mentalities that hold us (Black people) down. But if we are supposedly in an environment that supposedly teaches us educational & social skills,then college should be the place that WE make strides to fill those gaps of mistrust and "yall think yall better than us" mentality.

>ACTUALLLY, it was an alumnus of Lincoln University who desegregated MIZZOU by suing for admission into the Law School.
Is Regent's still in existence there? It may be a coincidence but there is an extremely "conservative" Law School-supposedly Christian-in Virginia called Regents.

As far
>as I know invitations are extended, but are ever taken seriously. Those that do come a far and few between.
Man, Mistah, that's were you come in. "Fixing" shit gotta start somewhere. Why not with you?


>
>OREOS, SELLOUTS, ETC.....
This is a hard and obvious battle that looms within almost every Black person that attends a Lily White College.....Assimilation? Association?
My take is this: I walked away from the Unviersity of South Carolina with EVERYTHING that they had to offer and that includes CULTURAL AWARENESS along with a greater sense of the STRUGGLE that exists for people of color. And I did it all and never FORGOT who I was and whose I was. You see, those SELLOUTS & OREOS that you speak of never really had an ideao of WHO THEY WERE. So when in Rome do as the Romans do. Being Black at a white school either tears you down-socially-or builds you up.

>>Those who come from East St Louis never want
>>>to admit that they do because a lot of the
>>>times people from St Louis will ridicule them for it. So what ends up happening
That sounds like the North Carolina/South Carolina thing that happens here. We (all people) some sectionalizing folk. Aiight?

>They come across as the high n mighty of the student populace.
That's the type of ish that I'm talking about. WHY? Black folk can't afford this. We should be proud and happy for each other in our educational endeavers and HOLD EACH OTHER UP!

Live from the Shoe Sto'
NuShooz

I,I, I Can't Wait!

Live from the Shoe Sto, the Mall and NOW the courtroom


I, I, I Can't Wait?
U've waited long enuff!

>I have been a victim (Azzz if?
>
>) of conversation that went
>like......"Yall think yall better than
>us"......... "You went to USC
>- University of Spoiled Children"......
>AND ON THE FLIP SIDE:
> "I'd never date a
>boy from Benedict" (South Carolina
>HBCU)

i have gotten a lot on the other side of this: comments indicating that i am not really "down" because i DID NOT attend a HBCU. First of all, as Nushooz said, EDUCATION IS EDUCATION and i'm tryin' to get mine. The point of attending College/University is (hopefully) to expand your knowledge base--both academically and experientially--and to get that little piece of paper that allows you to advance to the next stage of the game. Having some fun, making life-long friends and creating a path for yourself etc. are also part of this experience. Attending a HBCU is a wonderful thing if that's what you feel you need. The same goes for women attending all women's schools. If that's what will help you succeed, then more power to ya.

i am going to grad school at Harvard this fall. i am not going there because of the racial composition of the school, or because of its gender balance (or lack thereof), but because after graduating, when i show someone that piece of paper that says HARVARD on it i will be have doors opened to me that i did not even know existed previously. i would appreciate not being judged as being "less black" or whatever, because i'm at a school which represents the epitomy of white, male, upper-class dominant society. Instead of ridiculing me, congratulate me and ask if i need any support surviving in a potentially hostile environment!

Division of any kind only gives us less of what we need.





"You are the revolution,.....don't wait to see it on the 6 o'clock news. Bear witness to yourself."
--Wise_7

"theres' so much tension and hate in the world that the act of love to your neighbor is trully revolutionary...it's all about thinking differently than the mainstream concerns of now. "
--mayhem

"SO POWERFUL IS THE LIGHT OF UNITY THAT IT CAN ILLUMINATE THE WHOLE EARTH."
--Baha'u'llah

---
http://beantownbrown.blogspot.com/
http://www.itsjusthair.com/
http://twitter.com/indigginus
http://bahai.us/

the black/white school debate always intrigues me. i attended the university of iowa for both my undergrad. and grad. studies however i attended summer school at howard univ. and i have visited numerous HBCU's.
a. most hbcu's were founded by white folks.
b. i was a speech pathology/audiology major as an undergrad. i didn't have many options at hbcu's for this field.
c. money, i went where the money was. white schools offered me loot so i went.
d. b/c my mother and upbringing had instilled in me Black heritage and love for self and my people, i didn't need to go to a hbcu to find myself, i already knew who i was.
e. resources, iowa was a big ten school and one of the top research institutions in this country. therefore, the resources were vast and many of the opportunities i had to travel/study abroad i would not have had at a hbcu.
f. with all i've said in mind that doesn't mean that i have anything against hbcu's. i love the pride and sincerity that most hbcu alums have.
g. i am not better than anyone that went to a hbcu its all based upon personal decision. though i don't regret going to iowa, getting a degree from that school was more than a piece of paper. the mental anguish that many of us experienced was fucked up. many of the Black students and faculty suffer from depression and leave iowa all jacked up mentally. i am a stronger person b/c i went to iowa however my dislike of white folks is so strong b/c of that environment. an outlet was 3-4 hours away so we didn't escape often.
k. you eat, breathe, sleep, and study white folks day in and day out. your home is your haven. i was the only Black person in my undergrad. major and it wasn't easy at all.
So Black school vs. White school both has cons both has pros!!!!!!

Nappiness is next to Godliness!!!
"To thy ownself be true"
Ms. Nappiness

---------------
Veronica-Precious
'Moon'

Check out my publishing company
UnSilenced Woman Press
www.unsilencedwomanpress.com


AquaMoon
Aqua Beats and Moon Verses: Volume I
http://www.spokenexistence.com/aqua_moon.html

responses.

However, the debate is not about what you get at either school as much as it's about the prejudices that exists in our own community regarding attendance.

Have you noticed the divide that exists when students talk about the other? Students at HBCU's have preconceived notions about Students that go to White schools and vice versa.

n/m?

Live from the Shoe Sto'
NuShooz

I,I, I Can't Wait!

Live from the Shoe Sto, the Mall and NOW the courtroom


I, I, I Can't Wait?
U've waited long enuff!

i realized that i went off on my own little tangent after i posted. my bad.......
yeah, there are prejudices and i've experienced them and i have even given them. i remember when my girl first went to tsu and she told me she was taken typing 101, i was like what kind of high school ish is that, typing you must be kidding me. on the other hand i have been accused of thinking i'm betta b/c i went to a white school or that i've sold my soul to the devil b/c i went to a white school. also, i know first hand some black school horror stories where they have over and double booked your room and instead of it being a double it is a quad or you're jsut ass out of a room. that's not fun. prejudices also come with the pride that many hbcu attendees have for their school so they don't want to belittle hbcu's so they attack white school/Black students instead. i think i addressed the post this time if i didn't hell, i am sorry. i will just be silent.

Nappiness is next to Godliness!!!
"To thy ownself be true"
Ms. Nappiness

---------------
Veronica-Precious
'Moon'

Check out my publishing company
UnSilenced Woman Press
www.unsilencedwomanpress.com


AquaMoon
Aqua Beats and Moon Verses: Volume I
http://www.spokenexistence.com/aqua_moon.html

>i realized that i went off
>on my own little tangent
>after i posted. my bad.......
It's OK. It happens.

>yeah, there are prejudices and i've experienced them and i have even given them. i
>remember when my girl first went to tsu and she
>told me she was taken typing 101, i was like
>what kind of high school ish is that, typing you
>must be kidding me.
Thanks for your honesty. But what I've come up with is that some of our HBCU's take students that wouldn't get in by WHITE college standards. I think the philosophy at most HBCU's is that IF you WANNA GO, you should be ALLOWED to go regardless of what your SAT or Grade Point Average is. EVERY student (particulary Black) deserves a chance. So although they might teach Typing 101 (who knows? Did your girl know how to type before she went there? Probably not. Will she need typing in the real world? Probably so) what they give is a CHANCE to anyone who wants it.

on the other hand i
>have been accused of thinking i'm betta b/c i went to a white school or that i've sold my soul
>to the devil b/c i went to a white school.
Us Lily White School Grads have certainly heard more than our share of this BS. But when I left my mothers house to go to the school where they honor Strom Thurmond, my mother was PROUD and I was too. Cuz you see we both knew that I wasn't going to take my education and do with it what Strom Thurmond did with his. That's the difference. AND if you sleeping in the devil's camp, I think that makes you a prime candidate to help in his demise - when YOU COME OUT.


>also, i know first hand some black school horror stories where they have over and double booked your room and instead of it being a double it is a quad or you're jsut ass out of a room. that's not fun.
I've seen that too. Didn't stay on campus when I attended Claflin(HBCU). I knew right away I wasn't going to survive there. Particulary not after staying on campus at USC. But their lack of space could be contributed to their desire to give EVERYONE an opportunity.


prejudices also come with
>the pride that many hbcu attendees have for their school so they don't want to belittle hbcu's so they attack white school/Black students instead.
Hey, that's valid too. But we gotta let ALL people know that (1) You need to be proud of me and my education regardless of where I attained it - cuz now I'm an educated soilder for the cause of us all. (2) How come I gotta decrease so you can increase? It aint got to happen like that.

>i think i addressed the post this time if i
>didn't hell, i am sorry. i will just be silent.
You? Silent? Pleez!
You got it! Thanks

Live from the Shoe Sto'
NuShooz
I,I, I Can't Wait!

Live from the Shoe Sto, the Mall and NOW the courtroom


I, I, I Can't Wait?
U've waited long enuff!

the entrance standards well i don't agree with that one nushooz. i know that with many white state institutions it ain't that hard to get into. and sometimes it's harder to get into hbcu's than into white schools. let's not forget there is this thing called quotas so white schools have mastered recruitment of minority students but they could give a careless about retention. as long as they have the initial numbers for funding purposes they don't give a shit about us.
Nappiness is next to Godliness!!!
"To thy ownself be true"
Ms. Nappiness

---------------
Veronica-Precious
'Moon'

Check out my publishing company
UnSilenced Woman Press
www.unsilencedwomanpress.com


AquaMoon
Aqua Beats and Moon Verses: Volume I
http://www.spokenexistence.com/aqua_moon.html

Such is the case with my institution. Many a kids have the opportunity to attend Summer Brifge programs where they take Math and English courses (6 hours altogether) that need to be passed so that they can be full time students by the Fall semester. CLEP, AP, and other special high school programs where students are allowed to take college courses while still in high school are other ways of getting in.

For example. The University of Missouri System (Columbia, St. Louis, Kansas City, and Rolla Campuses) allows credits from any of those four campuses to pass through without doubt to any of the other 3. The only schools that have high school-collegiate programs are at these campuses. So, instead of coming in as a FRESHMAN, alot of student come in as TRANSFERS.


____________________________________________
Marinate on that!!!!!!!!!!!


Ju-LIE QUOTATION for the Week************************


"It's spelled D-O-O-K. Not the other way"
-----Lia

________________________________________
Grump
http://twitter.com/Gator_Bell

I know for a fact of some HBCU's that set themselves out there as institutions that don't use the customary way of evaluating their students for admissions.

Live
Nu
I,I, I Can't Wait!

Live from the Shoe Sto, the Mall and NOW the courtroom


I, I, I Can't Wait?
U've waited long enuff!

>i have gotten a lot on
>the other side of this:
> comments indicating that i
>am not really "down" because
>i DID NOT attend a
>HBCU.
I've gotten that too. I've even considered doing grad work at a HBCU. But every time I do, those things that seem indeginous to HBCU's rear their ugly heads and then I go: hell no! .....The unwarranted hoops you gotta jump through, the mis-organization, too much one-on-one with the students.....THESE are the things I want to talk about. They MAY NOT be indeginous to all Black schools but they have certainly been prevalent where I have been.

First of all,
>as Nushooz said, EDUCATION IS EDUCATION and i'm tryin' to get mine. The point of attending college/University is (hopefully) to expand your knowledge base--both academically and experientially-
YES!
>
>i am going to grad school at Harvard this fall.
>i am not going there because of the racial composition of the school, or because
>of its gender balance (or lack thereof), but because after graduating, when i show someone
>that piece of paper that says HARVARD on it i
>will be have doors opened to me that i did
>not even know existed previously. i would appreciate not being judged as being "less
>black" or whatever, because i'm at a school which represents the epitomy of white, male,
>upper-class dominant society. Instead
>of ridiculing me, congratulate me and ask if i need any support surviving in a potentially hostile environment!
First of all CONGRATUALATIONS! I, myself hope to be getting an acceptance letter for Grad School anyday now. And I'm glad to know that we have such a caliber of individual here at OKP. The versatility and reach of some of these kats here astound me. This is truly a melting pot - even though most of us like the same music.
BUT ANYWAY.....you should BE CONGRATULATED and supported. And I hope that you will continue to be the kind of brother that never forget where he came from - Harvard education and all. I beleive that that's where you can show HOW BLACK YOU ARE. Because some of those same faces that hamper the process at these HBCU's have been people that looked like me! dig?
I beleive that there are a lot of things that these HBCU's could do differently to attract students. And one of the things is bridging the gap as best they can between the good things that they offer versus what you CAN get at a white school.

Live from the Shoe Sto'
NuShooz

I,I, I Can't Wait!

Live from the Shoe Sto, the Mall and NOW the courtroom


I, I, I Can't Wait?
U've waited long enuff!

>I've gotten that too. I've
>even considered doing grad work
>at a HBCU. But
>every time I do, those
>things that seem indeginous to
>HBCU's rear their ugly heads
>and then I go:
>hell no! .....The unwarranted hoops
>you gotta jump through, the
>mis-organization, too much one-on-one with
>the students.....THESE are the things
>I want to talk about.
> They MAY NOT be
>indeginous to all Black schools
>but they have certainly been
>prevalent where I have been.

word. i thought about transferring schools as an undergrad to an HBCU, but realized that if i was going to transfer anywhere, the reason should be that it would benefit my long-term goals and not my short-term desire to experience a Black environment.


>First of all CONGRATUALATIONS!

Thank you so much!


>I, myself hope to be getting
>an acceptance letter for Grad
>School anyday now.

Good luck with this. i'll keep you on the prayer list!

And
>I'm glad to know that
>we have such a caliber
>of individual here at OKP.
> The versatility and reach
>of some of these kats
>here astound me. This
>is truly a melting pot
>- even though most of
>us like the same music.
>
>BUT ANYWAY.....you should BE CONGRATULATED and
>supported. And I hope
>that you will continue to
>be the kind of brother

umm, sistah, but that's okay. it's hard to tell online...

teehee.

>that never forget where he
>came from - Harvard education
>and all. I beleive
>that that's where you can
>show HOW BLACK YOU ARE.
> Because some of those
>same faces that hamper the
>process at these HBCU's have
>been people that looked like
>me! dig?
>I beleive that there are a
>lot of things that these
>HBCU's could do differently to
>attract students. And one
>of the things is bridging
>the gap as best they
>can between the good things
>that they offer versus what
>you CAN get at a
>white school.

i feel you on this. what i really want though, is for people to see how HUMAN i am, and not how Black or not-Black-enough i am. i want people to see me and say, now there's a sister who rose above what many expected of her, a sister who is the first in her family to attend Harvard although generations of her ancestors have lived in the neighboring communities for decades, a sister who is trying to remain true to herself--a revolutionary peacmaker of the illest kind. i want people to see my skin color as only ONE component of who i am. i do not deny my beautiful heritage, i embrace it, but i do not allow it to define who i am.

i think in this discussion about the division between folks at HBCUs and folks at predominantly white institutions, we need to remember that we are talking about PEOPLE first and foremost. We are talking about young people trying to beat the odds, get an education and follow whatever path they choose in life. At least this is what i need to keep in mind. Thinking of this helps me to remember that it doesn't matter where you go to school as long as you are successful, supported and happy.

But i digress. i think i had some things on my mind that i didn't know were there really. thanks for listening. back to the main discussion. do more folks have experiences with this divide?

CAN WE THINK OF SOLUTIONS???

My first suggestion is to have more contact between Black Student Organizations at predominantly white schools and students at HBCUs. This could come in the form of the magazine (that started this conversation), a website or email list, whatever...

Other ideas?




"You are the revolution,.....don't wait to see it on the 6 o'clock news. Bear witness to yourself."
--Wise_7

"theres' so much tension and hate in the world that the act of love to your neighbor is trully revolutionary...it's all about thinking differently than the mainstream concerns of now. "
--mayhem

"SO POWERFUL IS THE LIGHT OF UNITY THAT IT CAN ILLUMINATE THE WHOLE EARTH."
--Baha'u'llah

---
http://beantownbrown.blogspot.com/
http://www.itsjusthair.com/
http://twitter.com/indigginus
http://bahai.us/

for the gender bender....
Thank you for your prayers.....

HUMAN? No Doubt!!!! Over the years I have made a conscious effort to not let color/race be the first word I use when describing people. We need to teach ourselves and our children that. Your color is not the definition of you. Now I will not deny that there are some things that are definitley indeginous to Black folk but there are a whole lot of adjectives that we can use to describe HUMANS. However, I digress. This is another post.

But your solution is right on time. And I don't say that just because I've already suggested it to Mister G ^up top. But it's a good thing to do. Perhaps we can make a plea to all currently "colleged" OKP's to make such a gesture. And if one of them is in a town near us "arrived" folks, we can help them out. I'd be willing to go to Orangeburg and help out Wise 7 if he chooses to build a bridge between Claflin and the University of SC. hell, I went to both schools. I could really be useful.

How bout that?

Live from the Shoe Sto'
NuShooz
I,I, I Can't Wait!

Live from the Shoe Sto, the Mall and NOW the courtroom


I, I, I Can't Wait?
U've waited long enuff!

man i swear i was just thinkin about this,
anyway I'm from detroit and go to school in west michigan(western michigan about hour and a half from Chi) I started here in 97(soph year)there are three colleges in this town. KVCC9community college, Kalamazoo College a very racist private college and WMU. in the fall of 98 a black man's room was torched at Kalamazoo College because he read a poem about being recgnized,not as the black man on campus, but just as a man.
Low-key i didn't even know i was black students on that campus(that's how racist the shit is) but best believe when we heard about how the administration hadn't replaced his shit three weeks after the fact we marched 200(hey that's considered a GOOD turnout) over there to support.
The thing here is like that SCHOOLDAZE bullshit, we releggedly(allegedly) think we tha shit cuz we go to school, let the locals tell it.
So this year, after my 1 year hiatus, i am starting ablack Causus(the West Michigan Black-Light Commission) to unite the community, and the black students on all three campuses.
Our first meeting is a Lemon Squeezer, where all the organizations involved coemto gether and ask questions, get mad, and crush all stereo types. It'll be ugly but hey....the sun will shine come Mornin'


http://www.deadprez.com
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I know more about what freedom isn't , than what it is...ASSATTA
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
reverse psychology got'em scared to say when shit is WACK/the fear of being called a hater imagine that/we aint havin that/reachin past the star status that you grabbin at/my battle rap flash yo ass back to yo nat-tu-ral habitat....TALIB KWELI

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Donuts Are Forever
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
http://twitter.com/MyNameIsJamma

:)
That Kalamozoo College thing is scary as f*c. I'm glad you showed up for the cause though. Power concedes nothing without demand (F. Douglas)

>Low-key i didn't even know i was black students on that campus(that's how racist the shit
>is)
See, this is one of the main reasons that we should unite at STUDENT regardless of what school we attend. There are wars raging on every side. And we can't let something like this stop us from being in the fight.
GLAD YALL SHOWED!

>The thing here is like that
>SCHOOLDAZE bullshit, we releggedly(allegedly) think we tha shit cuz we go to school, let the
>locals tell it.
Ossie Davis wrote in the play Purlie Victorious that "college ain so much where you been, as how you TALK when you get back"

>So this year, after my 1
>year hiatus, i am starting
>ablack Causus(the West Michigan Black-Light
>Commission) to unite the community,
>and the black students on
>all three campuses.
>Our first meeting is a Lemon
>Squeezer, where all the organizations
>involved coemto gether and ask
>questions, get mad, and crush
>all stereo types. It'll be
>ugly but hey....the sun will
>shine come Mornin'
Yes, SOLUTIONS! Weeping may endure for a night, but joy comes in the morning! Work it! We will NOT be divided on all sides - when there are people willing to do some WORK and not just offer lip service - telling us that the real problems is this, did you analyze this, did you do that, did you wear your orange drawz, all bull shit things to slow down real work. If there's ANYTHING I can do, LET ME KNOW! I WILL SUPPORT YOU!

Live from the Shoe Sto'
NuShooz
I,I, I Can't Wait!

Live from the Shoe Sto, the Mall and NOW the courtroom


I, I, I Can't Wait?
U've waited long enuff!

>If there's ANYTHING I can
>do, LET ME KNOW!
>I WILL SUPPORT YOU!
WELL I Need help building the platform to take to administration to get it implemented as a campus organization
Problem: I want members of the community to join as well, we have a black president here now, but he's thinking about leaving so how can i present this to this predomniately white college that what i want to do is basically for the eventual upliftign of the city as a whole??

>I,I, I Can't Wait! Me either: where are you at anyway??

http://www.deadprez.com
So I'm at Street Corner Music(mom and Pop store outside of Detroit)

Me: hey what happened to ya'll HIP-HOP section??It used to be like four times bigger?!?!?!

Guy behind counter putting in Slum Village: What happened to the section??? No what happened to the ARTIST.......
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I know more about what freedom isn't , than what it is...ASSATTA
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
reverse psychology got'em scared to say when shit is WACK/the fear of being called a hater imagine that/we aint havin that/reachin past the star status that you grabbin at/my battle rap flash yo ass back to yo nat-tu-ral habitat....TALIB KWELI

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Donuts Are Forever
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
http://twitter.com/MyNameIsJamma

with both feet.

I'm in Charlotte, North Kack...but thanks to the internet and long distance, we can pull this thing off.

I am a proposal writing phool!

Hit me at: nushooz@blackplanet.com

Live from the Shoe Sto'
NuShooz
I,I, I Can't Wait!

Live from the Shoe Sto, the Mall and NOW the courtroom


I, I, I Can't Wait?
U've waited long enuff!

>I am a proud alum of
>the University of South Carolina
>- where 80-85% of the
>population was white while the
>remaining 20-15% was "non-white" and
>not necessarily Black.
>

....i attend clemson univ. (in clemson, sc).......where a good 90 percent is white......and GOD willing, i will graduate shortly, but i won't be a proud alum.......i could really care less if i get that stupid piece of paper.......access to more money, and sometimes more problems, is not of great concern to me.....but that's another post......kinda......

>During my collegiate education, I had
>the pleasure of attending Claflin
>College (HBCU) my Junior year.
>

.....i am considering grad school at a hbcu.....to get a new experience.......hopefully......maybe.....

>
>Suffice to say: I feel
>like I've seen the best
>and the worst that these
>varying types of colleges can
>offer. And I feel
>like I can speak honestly
>on both.
>
>So, tell me, are Unity, Ukaa
>and myself the only ones
>who have ever noticed the
>divide between Black students attending
>these schools? I have
>been a victim (Azzz if?
>
>) of conversation that went
>like......"Yall think yall better than
>us"......... "You went to USC
>- University of Spoiled Children"......
>AND ON THE FLIP SIDE:
> "I'd never date a
>boy from Benedict" (South Carolina
>HBCU)
>
>CAN WE BE HONEST about our
>feelings and thoughts here?
>

....EVERY time.....

>What are some of the things
>TRUE/UNTRUE, FOUNDED/UNFOUNDED, RIGHT/WRONG things that
>you think about the different
>schools and the people that
>attend them?
>
>What have your experiences been?
>

.....pretty much what has been said already......plus a little more.....but nothing that should surprise anyone......like unity said......they are people......and whatever is experienced in college goes on outside of it.....to some extent......

>AND THEN....
>Let's work them out so that
>we can know that we
>should be proud of each
>others educational accomplishments no matter
>where received. This is
>an issue that I feel
>there should be no division
>on. Education is Education.
>

i think this issue, like many posted, is WAAAY more serious when one steps back to look at the bigger picture......like in an earlier post by beyond, describing this realization........to me, it is obvious that people (in general.....not black, white, etc...) MUST be divided for such a small percentage of the population to control the rest........give every one a different category to fit in, let them fight about certain differences (that should be celebrated), and dick the hell out 'em all the while......laughing......
TRUE knowledge of self uproots such frivolous thoughts from a correctly (natural) thinking mind.......one, then, overstands what is truly valuable.......and takes concrete steps for what NEEDS to be done........personal sacrifices for the greater good included.....

.....some cats speak of their third eye.....but still only see the physical world that is presented to them.......

.....my solution to this and many interrated problems is meditation, i.e. sincere "LISTENING" to GOD......for GOD has already equipped us with the myriad tools with which to happily live......i am a civil engr. major....but every thing i have been "taught".....i already knew.....they just defined it for me.....i have always been a civil engr....and much more.....some cats allow themselves to be defined, and thus limited, by others.......

.....true, education is education......if we were truly being educated.......think about what we learn.....TOO much of it is propaganda.....at arguably every level of life......ever hear of the mis-education of the negro???....same principle apply to everyone......but beyond a book......have you ever REALLY thought about what is going on??? we are all fed fallacious HIStory and information in general.....across the board....."black" HIStory is not just for blacks.....it is a part of the legacy of the world........so affirming that life originated in afrika is not "afrocentric"......it's the truth...

....they (the workers of iniquity) know that we can defeat them.....and they will let you talk about solutions 'cause they honestly don't believe you will actually do ANY thing......

.....so my solution to such "problems" is not mind blowing, radical or revolutionary.....it's simple.......predicated on natural law.......sometimes one looks for the "great miracle".......when every respiration is that and more..........aahh, the dignity of simplicity.....

".....one's life is the best sermon......" NO ONE can change another person....and if folks really believed that tomorrow isn't promised......their life would manifest that........i strive to live a righteous life, which is actually easier (more natural) compared to the alternatives.......it cannot be stressed enough that "....you ARE the revolution....."

.....let go.....and let GOD......honestly.....

"....LIVE the now for the promise of the infinite"mos def

.......are you truly ALIVE?......
>
>ADD ON OR MOVE ON!
>

....hopefully i added......now i'll move on.....

>Live from the Shoe Sto'
>I,I, I Can't Wait!

......peace&blessings.........ukaa......a small axe.......

UKKA, it has taken me two days to respond to you. Some of the things that you say, distrub me. So, I wanna be as "RIGHT-eous" as I can in responding.....

>....i attend clemson univ. (in clemson,
>sc).......
South Carolina grad....Not going to hold that against you.


>i will graduate shortly, but i won't be a proud
You should be - particulary if the "road has been ruff" Man, coming out of some of these white schools ain always no bed of white lillies. There are some people that are going to challenge your very presence in those Ivy halls, your right to even be there. So, be proud. Be VERY proud, Tiger!

>.....i am considering grad school at
>a hbcu.....to get a new
>experience.......hopefully......maybe.....
Maybe this post will help you choose one that's right for you. And by the way, my manager is a Clemson University Civil Engineer.

>.....pretty much what has been said
>already......plus a little more.....but nothing
>that should surprise anyone......like unity
>said......they are people......and whatever is
>experienced in college goes on
>outside of it.....to some extent......
College is supposed to prepare you for that. Do you feel that your Clemson University education is doing that for you?

>i think this issue, like many posted, is WAAAY more serious when one steps back to look at the bigger picture......it is obvious that people
>(in general.....not black, white, etc...)
>MUST be divided for such a small percentage of the population to control the rest........give
>every one a different category to fit in, let them fight about certain differences (that
>should be celebrated)
There's no arguing that. But what I seek to do (with every post) is to bridge some of those gaps. We have got to start somewhere. If you look at the situation as insurmontable and the gap being un-bridge-able, then what is going to happen? NOTHING! So, you're right. But WE - you and me - as educated, responsible, people have got to take up this fight somewhere. Let people know that in order for you to INCREASE, I don't have to DECREASE. You went to school?!? I went to school?!? Hip - hip horay! - instead of "sell out" "oreo" "degenerate" "DUMMY"
DIVISION amongst us is one of the reasons that slavery was successful THEN AND NOW!

>TRUE knowledge of self uproots such frivolous thoughts from a correctly (natural) thinking mind.......one, then, overstands what is truly valuable.......and takes concrete steps for what NEEDS to be done........personal sacrifices for
>the greater good included.....
TAKE UP THE FIGHT SOMEWHERE!

>.....some cats speak of their third eye.....but still only see the physical world that is presented to them.......

>.....my solution to this and many interrated problems is meditation, i.e. sincere "LISTENING" to GOD......for GOD has already equipped us with
>the myriad tools with which to happily live......
God equips us for war as well. Remember Joshua?

>....they (the workers of iniquity) know
>that we can defeat them.....and
>they will let you talk
>about solutions 'cause they honestly
>don't believe you will actually
>do ANY thing......
MY POINT. So, let's put our collegiate prejudices on the table sort them out and move on.


"...you
>ARE the revolution....."

>.....let go.....and let GOD......honestly.....
If I AM THE REVOLUTION, then I CAN'T let go. See, Brah, I'm a Christian as well. But my Christianity does not beleive in not MOVING on what GOD gives you. So many people say "Let Go and Let God" That means, you let go of the reins and let God have them. He will lead you. But if he leads you to a battle, YOU GOT TO FIGHT!

ukka, do you have any interaction with Black folk from HBCU's? Would you consider forging a partnership with a HBCU near Clemson?
How are you going to make your decison about where you will do your grad work - Black school? White school?

Live from the Shoe Sto'
NuShooz
I,I, I Can't Wait!

Live from the Shoe Sto, the Mall and NOW the courtroom


I, I, I Can't Wait?
U've waited long enuff!

(ukaa)
>UKKA, it has taken me two
>days to respond to you.

....i noticed that......i was waiting for a reply....then i had to return to school......and now i am replying......i was going to anyway.....'cause of something about orange draws.....which could have been taken as a personal jab, but was funny as hell when i read none the less.......this is definitely a better (more progressive) approach.......i am glad you waited......

> Some of the things
>that you say, distrub me.
> So, I wanna be
>as "RIGHT-eous" as I can
>in responding.....
>
>>....i attend clemson univ. (in clemson,
>>sc).......
>South Carolina grad....Not going to hold
>that against you.

....i actually haven't graduated quite yet....

>>i will graduate shortly, but i won't be a proud
>You should be - particulary if
>the "road has been ruff"

....."ruff" is relative 'cause "...every man think his burden is the heaviest"bob......"ruff" is this so-called life THEY dictate for me......

> Man, coming out of
>some of these white schools
>ain always no bed of
>white lillies. There are
>some people that are going
>to challenge your very presence
>in those Ivy halls, your
>right to even be there.

...you are correct.....those ppl exist here and make SURE their existence is known.....i feel i am only here b/c clemson gets money from the govn't.....even though a "black" person that attends clemson HAS to be somewhat intelligent (by their definition) to be accepted.....

> So, be proud.
>Be VERY proud, Tiger!

i am very proud to be iron like a lion, but these (clemson) tigers can kiss my ass....

>>.....i am considering grad school at
>>a hbcu.....to get a new
>>experience.......hopefully......maybe.....
>Maybe this post will help you
>choose one that's right for
>you.

...so far this post, like many posts here, are very informative nad helpful.....

And by the
>way, my manager is a
>Clemson University Civil Engineer.
>>.....pretty much what has been said
>>already......plus a little more.....but nothing
>>that should surprise anyone......like unity
>>said......they are people......and whatever is
>>experienced in college goes on
>>outside of it.....to some extent......
>College is supposed to prepare you
>for that. Do you
>feel that your Clemson University
>education is doing that for
>you?

....if you "that" refers to what goes on outside of college, then no i don't think clemson is doing that me......i am doing it for self.....

>>i think this issue, like many posted, is WAAAY more serious when one steps back to look at the bigger picture......it is obvious that people
>>(in general.....not black, white, etc...)
>>MUST be divided for such a small percentage of the population to control the rest........give
>>every one a different category to fit in, let them fight about certain differences (that
>>should be celebrated)
>There's no arguing that. But
>what I seek to do
>(with every post) is to
>bridge some of those gaps.

....me too....

> We have got to
>start somewhere.

If you
>look at the situation as
>insurmontable and the gap being
>un-bridge-able,

....i do not view the situation as such.....it is a big task, but "...we know we shall win/we are confident/in the victory/of good over evil...."HIM

then what is going
>to happen? NOTHING!
>So, you're right. But
>WE - you and me
>- as educated, responsible, people
>have got to take up
>this fight somewhere. Let
>people know that in order
>for you to INCREASE, I
>don't have to DECREASE.
>You went to school?!?
>I went to school?!?
>Hip - hip horay! -
>instead of "sell out"
>"oreo" "degenerate" "DUMMY"
>DIVISION amongst us is one of
>the reasons that slavery was
>successful THEN AND NOW!

...i agree.....but even if i wasn't "educated" by these "schools", i would, like many others, still be fighting b/c i feel it is is my duty.....

>>TRUE knowledge of self uproots such frivolous thoughts from a correctly (natural) thinking mind.......one, then, overstands what is truly valuable.......and takes concrete steps for what NEEDS to be done........personal sacrifices for
>>the greater good included.....
>TAKE UP THE FIGHT SOMEWHERE!

....i have.....

>>.....some cats speak of their third eye.....but still only see the physical world that is presented to them.......
>
>>.....my solution to this and many interrated problems is meditation, i.e. sincere "LISTENING" to GOD......for GOD has already equipped us with
>>the myriad tools with which to happily live......
>God equips us for war as
>well. Remember Joshua?

....that....is my point exactly.....i knew you overstood.....

>>....they (the workers of iniquity) know
>>that we can defeat them.....and
>>they will let you talk
>>about solutions 'cause they honestly
>>don't believe you will actually
>>do ANY thing......
>MY POINT. So, let's put
>our collegiate prejudices on the
>table sort them out and
>move on.

....personally, i don't have collegiate prejudices.....i have a real problem, not with the structure of the schools, but what they "teach" (propagandize).....what did usc (as an institution to which you pay money) really teach you? (serious question).....clemson didn't teach me shit 'bout self....they just train me how to work.....not think independently.....at least not outside of the classroom....when it could possibly challenge the status quo.....that came from personal introspection that would have occurred even if i didn't attend this "school".......i am of the ppl and for the ppl, so i identify with the ppl.....and don't deem it mandatory to have a formal education in this system......part of my motivation to teach is that I LOVE TO LEARN.......the truth......anything else is discarded.......and they are surely not teaching the truth in this system.....

"...build your penitentiary/we build your school/brainwash education/to make us the fools..."bob

>
>"...you
>>ARE the revolution....."
>
>>.....let go.....and let GOD......honestly.....
>If I AM THE REVOLUTION, then
>I CAN'T let go.

....to me, being the revolution means, with knowledge of self, i do not have to wait for someone to agree with me or join me to fight.....i must fight b/c i know that it is the right thing to do.....

>See, Brah, I'm a Christian
>as well. But my
>Christianity does not beleive in
>not MOVING on what GOD
>gives you.

.....i agree totally.....

So many
>people say "Let Go and
>Let God" That means,
>you let go of the
>reins and let God have
>them. He will lead
>you. But if he
>leads you to a battle,
>YOU GOT TO FIGHT!

.....in fact, we are at war (with spiritual wickedness in high and low places).....and i DEFINITELY gotta fight....the time is NOW......for real....your words sound like me talking to others

>ukka, do you have any interaction
>with Black folk from HBCU's?

....yes.....through my frat (pbs--also at usc) as well as my fam......but, with k.o.s. i don't have to personally know someone from a certain school to avoid gross generalizations......that is just plain ignorant......

> Would you consider forging
>a partnership with a HBCU
>near Clemson?

....yes....that is why i am too excited about this new endeavor with wise_7....

>How are you going to make
>your decison about where you
>will do your grad work
>- Black school? White
>school?

....this is a more difficult question b/c i am presently in civil engr......but recognizing our present situation, i feel i MUST work for change....and the best way for change, in my humble opinion, is the kids......so i plan to go to grad school teach elementary kids and start a school......but not in the confines of this present system.......i want to pool with other "conscious" cats and build our own school with our own ideaology......something that my fam helped do in d.c. with the ujamaa shule.....

>
>Live from the Shoe Sto'
>NuShooz
>I,I, I Can't Wait!

...in closing.....again, i am glad we are exchanging thoughts in this positive manner.....i think my earlier message was misconstrued 'cause i feel that you a very powerful and motivated wombman.....i am very inspired by your posts....and pray we can work together in common unity for true liberation......uhuru.....

....your comments are graciously accepted.....

......peace&blessings.........ukaa......a small axe.......

Yeah..............and??

I read all the posts, and just to add my $.02, I'll just say this:

I went to Vassar as a "full need" student, meaning I was dirt poor and ain't seen no PAAAAAAARTS of gettin' paid, thus, a full scholarship.

I had no idea about Vassars reputation before I got there, I just knew that it was the school giving me the most money, so I went.

All of a sudden, my poor black ass is in the lap of luxury, on a campus where the roses cost $1 million dollars a year to keep up. Where the building plates are gold plated. Whrere the campus itself has been declared an historical landmark. Where my classmates had last names like Lehman-Loeb (As in Lehman AND Loeb, okay?), Bass (as in the shoe), King (as in Stephen's son), and Ronson (as in Mark)..........where there were more "legacy" kids whose great-great-great grandmother went to Vassar than there were folk like me whose great-grandmother couldn't even READ.

I could go on and on. To move this saga along, being in that environment made me more militant, more culturally aware, and more WELL ROUNDED than any other college experience I could've had. In four years:

I spent a semester in Kenya (for FREE!)

I spent three weeks in Jamaica in the name of "researching" my thesis topic (for FREE!)

My parents didn't have to worry about tuition money.

I also met and became friends with people who challenged me to defend my beliefs, and also people whom I wouldn've never met or had exchanges with otherwise.

As for becoming a "sellout", it's very hard to "sell out" at a small school like Vassar and not be called out about it, because there were so few black folks around that everybody knew EVERYBODY, so if you weren't tryin' to be down with the BSU (Black Student Union) SOMEbody was gonna at least ask you why.

For the most part, black folks at Vassar tried to forge a nice little community where, in the midst of paradise, we could enjoy a sense of "normalcy" about being black at an elite institution.

We had our fair share of "oreos" and "sellouts" but the rest of us were able to do some meaningful work at Vassar, while maintaining a healthy sense of self (mmmmkay we TRIED to maintain a healthy sense of self).

Unfortunatley, if you're NOT MIDDLE CLASS, attending an HBCU is a pipe dream, because they don't give scholarships (at least not in 1991 when I was applying), and they're unable to shell out the kind of $$ that a Vassar would to get a talented student.

I applied to Howard. got accepted, but no $$. And coming from the type of background that I came from, no scholarship, no college.

That's the reality.

I'm happy with my undergraduate experience though, because, while it was a cultural challenge, I emerged with cultural pride that I didn't possess in high school.

I came to Vassar thinking that I would DIE without a perm and left happy and nappy.

I came to Vassar never having been to Africa and left speaking Swahili.

I came to Vassar with NO networking skills. I left knowing people that I can call upon for LIFE if I ever need a hook-up.

I came to Vassar with no community organizing skills.

I left having produced a play that toured all the Poughkeepsie public schools, and also having worked for the Children's Defense Fund.

I came to Vassar with no idea how I could make an impact on the world. I left Vassar with an agenda and a B.A. with HONORS.

.......and you can't beat that with a bat (c) Black Sheep!

"Y'all don't believe fat meat greasy!!"-my mama

"Unhappy People Smell Like Chitlins"
-'Stress

Yes, you IS!

That the kind of stuff that I'm talking about in regards to my Lily White School education. I learned more by mistake - being in the right place at the right time - then I did on purpose at the HCBU. Not putting Claflin down - cuzz they gave me a chance when nobody else would.

But, Gem, what's your take on these HBCU's?
So you find yourself being labeled (of course before people meet you and/or meeting you on "paper" - cuz there no mistaking AFTER peeps spend time with you) NOT BLACK ENOUGH? OREO? SELL OUT?

And, how do students from HBCU's interact with you?

Have you noticed the DIVIDE?

Talk to me, my UPRIGHT SISTAH!

Live
Nu
I,I, I Can't Wait!

Live from the Shoe Sto, the Mall and NOW the courtroom


I, I, I Can't Wait?
U've waited long enuff!

Generally, people from HBCU's have been cool with me. There have been occasions when folk have misconceptions about black people at elite institutions (sorta like they EXPECT me to "think I'm better than......."), but like you said, once you get to know me, you GOTS to come up offa alla that, cuz I know who I am, Okkkkkkayyyyyy?

But seriously, I think that there is a "continental divide" between black folks who go to HBCU's and folk like me.......because the experiences tend to be different, and tend to equip you to handle very different situations/circumstances, it's very easy for us to play that "I'm better than you are" game, if you don't maintain some level of plain ole realness..........and I do admit, a whole heap of black folks who go to schools like Vassar, Yale, Brown, Columbia emerge from those institutions PARANOID!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

We have to be paranoid. There's no way to spend 4 years at an instituion like that and not have some level of paranoia AND some emotional scars. So, most times, it's not even that we THINK we're all that, we're just so used to people doubting our abilities that we have this "never again" attitude about feeling insecure.......

I hope I'm making sense........it's early.....



"Y'all don't believe fat meat greasy!!"-my mama

"Unhappy People Smell Like Chitlins"
-'Stress

Especially when you attend these institutions and get jerked out of an opportunity. That's when I got my paranoia, getting jerked over an assistantship!!!!!

I'm stiller bitter.


____________________________________________
Marinate on that!!!!!!!!!!!


Ju-LIE QUOTATION for the Week************************


"It's spelled D-O-O-K. Not the other way"
-----Lia

________________________________________
Grump
http://twitter.com/Gator_Bell

Mis-stah......(Shug Avery)
It was their lost!

It's Ok to be bitter for a minute - especially when YOU KNOW that your bitterness will not consume you.

Do you think that your "turn down" was racial?

Live
Nu
I,I, I Can't Wait!

Live from the Shoe Sto, the Mall and NOW the courtroom


I, I, I Can't Wait?
U've waited long enuff!

We were both qualified and put in the work to earn the respect of our "peers". However, more of his peers are in the field than mine.


____________________________________________
Marinate on that!!!!!!!!!!!


Ju-LIE QUOTATION for the Week************************


"It's spelled D-O-O-K. Not the other way"
-----Lia

________________________________________
Grump
http://twitter.com/Gator_Bell