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5th
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32 posts
Mon Jul-09-01 02:53 AM

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"Is Hip Hop for Africa??? for Africans"


          

All the posting about ppl "not wanting to be black" or labeled African American & not wanting it got me thinking maybe 'melanated-American' would be easier for Speakeasy to handle. On that path we'd soon have 'melanatedly-challenged' as a disability category too. Stupid Fool!

I have to take a strong stand on that because it's an issue that bugs me repeatedly. So much effort is spent on these boards discussing racial matters -permanent things which will never change. What we should be discussing is WAYS of effecting CHANGE in peoples attitudes towards race & race relations.

America is not a home for black people. That has been proven time & again. Wont Americans accept it??? There will never be no reparations to a Black man. There have been official apologies and compensation to former wartime enemies (over tactics used in warfare, atrocious as they were it was still war.) Does war have rules? are there rules when you choose to kill someone? There have been compensatory payments to Jews and their families after the holocaust. Damn, America even went as far as helping them establish a homeland in the middle of Arabia (sic) hence the middle east continues to bubble to this day. But not to the black man. Even after a govt promise of 40 acres and mule. Even after watching communities disintergrate. Kids shooting each other on the streets. Police shooting black men on the streets. what more do you need to tell you that aint your home, homeboy.

It's also too late to move anywhere else. Ya'll would'nt want to anyway. Those who would will have a tough time adjusting to the ways of life, the lack of taken-for-granted ammenities, poor infrastructure and general poverty that affects the continent (I'm talking of the region South of the Sahara cuz we all know Libya, Morocco & Egypt are now in the Middle East)

And through all that, Most Afric...sorry, melanated americans look down on Africans too. Cuz we dont speak the same english. We're darker with thicker lips, dont dress the same way or have the same values as Americans. Unless Black America also creates a nation for yourselves -as the Jews did, and populate it with your selves so you wont have to be the only black person in a waiting room or walk in fear of being pelted with a beer bottle from a passing car, then thou shalt always be oppressed.

Sometimes i think it's blacks & not jews that are the chosen people in scripture. Maybe the jews (who kept those damn records anyway) altered something. Why u ask? Cuz look around you!! Which peoples are the most opressed wherever they may be? Hell, were even opressed with poverty & underdevelopment at home. What causes that i wonder? Do i hear free-&-equal-trade being discussed at G8 conventions? nooo, never. But where do they get all those diamonds & gold from? And how come since colonialism those places are politically unstable to this day. Ever heard of the Mobutu-CIA connection? Ever wonder why?
Nigeria (oil producing nation by the way) the number of different leaders its had in the past 10 years compared to the number of elections is a joke.

Most of these problems are our own. The greed and lack of vision our leaders display. And the difficulties of uniting. Look everywhere else and you find united nations. America is a unity of states. Europe has also caught on and is desperately trying to unite. There are different economic communities world-wide including in Africa that dont really work but serve as a beginning for stronger unity. East Africa attempted to unite very early in the game but disintergrated after 10 years (in 1977) I wont go into the reasons here. The few visionaries we had were either assasinated (Kwame Nkrumah) had their legs pulled from under them by economic conditions including forced liberalization (J. Nyerere), or got frustrated and joined the mainstream of globally powerless African leaders (Chiluba, Mugabe etc.) Now it all about greed, see the mess that followed Kabila Sr.'s death.

I am African, born & raised, strong, intelligent & proud of who i am period. The people and ways of life i represent show through my everyday actions and in the way i relate to everyone, including white people. There's nothing wrong with embracing some elements of European and even Asian culture because there is essentially much to learn from other cultures. It's how civilizations emerged in the first place, by trading and learning from each other. Besides music, what else has the world learned from Africa? They choose to ignore lessons in love that Africans seem to be so good at (both in the way we relate with each other -who else calls you brother/sister, regardless of where you're from?) I wont elaborate on the other. (See i do have a sense of humour, bad as it is).

This has been long, but my aim was to use OKplayer to stimulate fruitfull discussion on matters that affect Africans as well. There seem to be so many of you so well informed. Lets learn from each other as well as the rest of the world.

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
My badd
Jul 09th 2001
1
RE: Is Hip Hop for Africa??? for Africans
Jul 09th 2001
2
Support appreciated:
Jul 09th 2001
3
      RE: Support appreciated:
Jul 10th 2001
11
           one thing i agree completely with yall on
Jul 10th 2001
13
                True..
Jul 10th 2001
21
No
Jul 09th 2001
4
What??
Jul 09th 2001
6
RE: What??
Jul 10th 2001
7
      RE: What??
Jul 10th 2001
8
           RE: What??
Jul 11th 2001
25
                Nuff of that too!!
Jul 11th 2001
26
                     RE: Nuff of that too!!
Jul 11th 2001
27
no, no, no.......
Jul 10th 2001
23
new zealand?
Jul 11th 2001
31
      ahhh... actually, yes you do.
Jul 11th 2001
50
True but,
Jul 11th 2001
51
      I agree.
Jul 12th 2001
54
           that is true
Jul 12th 2001
55
                as a european
Jul 12th 2001
56
                     damn it
Jul 13th 2001
67
                          yeah bro....
Jul 16th 2001
75
RE: Is Hip Hop for Africa??? for Africans
Dyskotek
Jul 09th 2001
5
...
Jul 10th 2001
9
      Africans dont like African Americans....
Dyskotek
Jul 10th 2001
10
           depends
Jul 10th 2001
12
           RE: depends
Jul 10th 2001
16
           saw this a lot @ school
Jul 11th 2001
34
           What's there to like about
Jul 10th 2001
14
                tryna start sumthin?
Jul 10th 2001
15
                on 2nd thought
Jul 10th 2001
18
                     I
Jul 10th 2001
19
                          this man
Jul 10th 2001
20
                               What?!
Jul 10th 2001
22
                                    RE: What?!
Jul 11th 2001
24
                                         oh yeh
Jul 11th 2001
41
                here we go
Jul 10th 2001
17
                ...then hear this:
Jul 11th 2001
28
                     thing is
Jul 11th 2001
42
                     ...
Jul 11th 2001
47
                          If you noticed
Jul 12th 2001
60
                     I AM dealing with Americans
Jul 12th 2001
57
                          you make some sense here
Jul 12th 2001
63
                               my 2 cents worth
Jul 12th 2001
64
                               I know about the tension
Jul 12th 2001
65
                                    hahahhahahaa
utamaroho
Jul 12th 2001
66
                                    RE: I know about the tension
Jul 13th 2001
69
                                         OK
Jul 14th 2001
71
                                              understood n/m
Jul 16th 2001
72
                RE: What's there to like about
Jul 11th 2001
29
                Solarus and Rhulah....
Dyskotek
Jul 11th 2001
44
                     Especially for you
Jul 12th 2001
59
                RE: What's there to like about
Jul 11th 2001
30
                Excuse me for being a little dumb...
Jul 11th 2001
33
                     RE: Excuse me for being a little dumb...
chandra
Jul 11th 2001
37
                RE: What's there to like about
Jul 11th 2001
38
                     that's very true
Jul 11th 2001
43
check this site:
Jul 11th 2001
32
RE: check this site:
Jul 11th 2001
35
RE: Is Hip Hop for Africa??? for Africans
chandra
Jul 11th 2001
36
No
Jul 11th 2001
39
      RE: No
Jul 11th 2001
40
      it's not basketball
Jul 11th 2001
46
           i am sorry
Jul 11th 2001
48
                Um
Jul 13th 2001
70
      Africans aren't black folks?
Jul 13th 2001
68
RE: Is Hip Hop for Africa??? for Africans
jboogiebrown
Jul 11th 2001
45
Solarus is not even real
Jul 11th 2001
49
Naw
Jul 11th 2001
52
RE: Naw
Dyskotek
Jul 12th 2001
53
As "real" as they come
Jul 12th 2001
58
      okay but
Jul 12th 2001
61
      Listen to the Ancestors...
utamaroho
Jul 12th 2001
62
hip hop is
Jul 16th 2001
73
RE: hip hop is
Jul 16th 2001
74

5th
Charter member
32 posts
Mon Jul-09-01 02:55 AM

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1. "My badd"
In response to Reply # 0


          

on the title, it should've been 'For Africans', oh well too late

  

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Federisco
Charter member
5002 posts
Mon Jul-09-01 04:27 AM

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2. "RE: Is Hip Hop for Africa??? for Africans"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I am glad someone posted at least abit positive about this. Since im a 17 year old white european (norway, a small unaware rich country)i try to learn about the world. And okayplayers has taught me much, about africa, african americans, hiphop, that not just my dad reads Tao and Zen, much more..

My mother says you should know as many sides to a case as you can before you tell your opinion. And i'm proud to see common doing the same as my father: studying Tao, Zen, the bible!

(Seing common live last friday was an experience for life! It hit me in the heart to see him there with a che guevarra t-shirt making the crowd (most white, some black, some latino) go "people unite" and freestyling about how hiphop builds and unites. A black boy and a white boy in front of me grabbed their hands and raisted it into the air, with common doing the same! Picture that..)

The title for this thread was "is hiphop for africa????". American hiphop? nah, bullshit. 99% is either too underground (talking about the endless struggle) or too overground (talking about the endless fields of cash and babes).

But common.. talib... mos def... the roots... Their music can reach much further out than the majority. Since common could touch the people of norway (both black and white, as if it should matter), i believe he can touch the people of africa. Senegal, Tanzania, South Africa.. Because he is global, his music is. Even just seeing DJ Dummy scratch like a dummy and then seeing common bring a girl to the stage to have her sing The light with him, i believe it will work on all continents. His message was "unite", forget about differences, and just get down to hiphop. From common's viewpoint he brings global music, just like bob marley is global.

His music can appeal to a chineese girl, a tanzanian boy, my norwegian father, a breaker from chile and an australian hiphop head.

I hope common acts the way he did in norway when he gets home to chicago/ny, that his unite-message just isnt for us. Norway has never had the slavery, africans that lives in norway are pretty african (not adopted kids, which is different), the latinos latino. In USA you have a difficult situation.

(An african man who stood in front of me reminded me of how you seem to be -from what i read in this thread- (a compliment). First he acted very intelligent (almost too much) and looked strange at those who freaked out 'too much'. He didnt smile but stood still with his hands folded and enjoyed common with closed eyes. Eventually he started clapping. In the end, thou, he danced like all others.. wild! He even smiled It took a while thou. That is a certain african type... But he did enjoy common.)

>They choose to ignore
>lessons in love that Africans
>seem to be so good
>at (both in the way
>we relate with each other
>-who else calls you brother/sister,
>regardless of where you're from?)

Yes.. true, but not all. You forgot that your africa has different types in different places. Different people. Some people are dead serious, never smile. Some always smiling. There is the people who dont take marriage seriously, and those who do. Those who smoke tobacco and just live life, and those who respect the traditions of islam. Those who want to join the western world and those who hate it and want to follow their traditions.

But.. yep, africa is known as the continent of smiles, no? It is partly wrong, since it is so variated. There will never be a true continent of smiles, a country perhaps, but a continent?

You can say the continent of life..! i get along with that one..

>This has been long, but my
>aim was to use OKplayer
>to stimulate fruitfull discussion on
>matters that affect Africans as
>well. There seem to be
>so many of you so
>well informed. Lets learn from
>each other as well as
>the rest of the world.

I like that, and i try to do that as well. I hope i wont give the only to reply to this thread. Africans, americans.. i'm sure many has more than me to say.

peace


Here goes my first sig common's been on my mind since my first okp concert. Cee-lo as well, thanks to this:

"You gon surely find there's no positivity without negativity
But one side you gonna have to choose
Any chance to speak I refuse to misuse
So how can you call yourself God when you let a worldly possession
become an obsession and the way you write your rhymes and
Can't follow your lesson
If a seed's sown, you make sure it's known, you make sure it's grown
If you God, then save your own, don't mentally enslave your own
If you God, then save your own, don't mentally enslave your own
If you God, then save your own, don't mentally enslave your own" g.o.d.

░▒▓█▌♥▐█▓▒░

proud okayphotographer: http://www.okayplayer.com/okayphotographers/

"Most of our assumptions have outlived their uselessness." Marshall McLuhan

  

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5th
Charter member
32 posts
Mon Jul-09-01 06:34 AM

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3. "Support appreciated:"
In response to Reply # 2


          

There may be only two responses for now (compared to threads on religion & love which prompt more discussion), but I'm glad someone felt a similar vibe from Common.

No doubt there are'nt that many hip-hoppers in Helsinki compared with the likes of Germany etc, but he still manages to perform this far north. 4 the luv. I was at his Helsinki performance spreading luv in my own way. When i entered the joint Grand Agent was rocking the crowd (do i hear about to blow up??) A couple of straight faced europeans were standing in pretty much the same way your African aquaintance was. I put them at ease by sharing a drink (coke) with them cuz we were all hot & thirsty & common had'nt even hit the stage. What followed can only be experienced, not explained. I ended up on stage (making a fool of myself with whack rhymes) but for a moment i felt what it was like to be in his shoes.

Anyway, of late i've been having a hard time enjoying overground hip-hop cuz of its shallowness. I know music is meant to entertain, but where I'm from, music hides a message within the entertainment it provides. Tanzanian Taarab (poetic music) is laced with hidden meanings and part of the enjoyment of it lies in deciphering what the artist is trying to convey beyond the obvious lyrics.

Yes, Common - talib - mos - roots, transcend race and location to reach global earholes with vibes we can all relate to. I sit in anticipation of Black Thought's masterpiece. Ive waited a lifetime for it (his lyrics were the first to touch my soul when roots dropped 'what they do')



looking for a sig? aaight:
"Songs relevant to the times like the psalms read in the bible" -Talib Chikwii, naa lemme try it again, Kwali, still aint got right; it's pronounced kw-eh-li. In Swahili it means truth.

  

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Federisco
Charter member
5002 posts
Tue Jul-10-01 08:09 AM

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11. "RE: Support appreciated:"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

I hope to bring the thread back up again.. my excuse? to give a reply

>No doubt there are'nt that many
>hip-hoppers in Helsinki compared with
>the likes of Germany etc,
>but he still manages to
>perform this far north. 4
>the luv. I was at
>his Helsinki performance spreading luv
>in my own way.

hehehe.. i am glad he came to finland as well. I thought hiphop had a pretty big hiphop scene, a friend even let me hear a finnish song. Glad it wasnt just you and maowey(?!)

>When
>i entered the joint Grand
>Agent was rocking the crowd
>(do i hear about to
>blow up??) A couple of
>straight faced europeans were standing
>in pretty much the same
>way your African aquaintance was.

mmhh, it is a certain type of personality. Who is grand agent really? I stood next to his wife who videotaped him, so i guess it must have been one of his first big tours He was good thou

>I put them at ease
>by sharing a drink (coke)
>with them cuz we were
>all hot & thirsty &
>common had'nt even hit the
>stage. What followed can only
>be experienced, not explained.

Yes, true.. like a bomb is the closest. Common left a very solid impression, he was even more than i thought he would be. More common than what i imagined from the cd's, his message even clearer!

>I ended up on stage (making
>a fool of myself with
>whack rhymes) but for a
>moment i felt what it
>was like to be in
>his shoes.


Heheheh, almost like my brother.. just that my brother said no. I'm glad for you you got up there thou, must have been an experience.

>Anyway, of late i've been having
>a hard time enjoying overground
>hip-hop cuz of its shallowness.

You are not alone feeling that. Not only american, but even more norwegian (perhaps finnish as well). They become a parody of themselves, a parody of hiphop! That is a shame, when they still sell good..

But i feel that common follows the chineese philosophy of "following the golden middle route".. i have also heard about what they call norway's new hiphop prince, salvador. From what i have heard he saying he is closer to okayartists than to certain others, he even went to say he believes hiphop is dead with just few exceptions.

>I know music is meant
>to entertain, but where I'm
>from, music hides a message
>within the entertainment it provides.
>Tanzanian Taarab (poetic music) is
>laced with hidden meanings and
>part of the enjoyment of
>it lies in deciphering what
>the artist is trying to
>convey beyond the obvious lyrics.

That reminded me, i used to think music was supposed to hide a message. I am sure i have known one music style which had that, perhaps my father's Bob Dylland and Lehonard Cohen. But that thought must have disappeared deep inside my head, because now very little western music is so. Commercial hiphop as well.. the message is being misused so much we start ignoring the message and instead talk about how the flow or beat is

The day i hear hiphop with influences from a different new music culture, i will listen close to it! (Most western styles have been used before.. classic, jazz, soul, reggae, blues, country. Different has to be good, it cant hurt trying.) Heard bisso na bisso? French-Congo, the use of qua-qua and.. very special!.. It would never hurt to try to bring in something as Tanzanian Taarab. Ehm.. from what i know... the little you told me (poetic music with hidden meaning). But an inner voice tells me it should take it a step further, i would listen close to it if someone would use it.

peace

░▒▓█▌♥▐█▓▒░

proud okayphotographer: http://www.okayplayer.com/okayphotographers/

"Most of our assumptions have outlived their uselessness." Marshall McLuhan

  

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guerilla_love
Charter member
8273 posts
Tue Jul-10-01 09:01 AM

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13. "one thing i agree completely with yall on"
In response to Reply # 11


          

the power and potential of the okayplayer musicians


i don't think we give them enuf credit for the influence they have



==**peace**==

"baby,
I'd draw yuh bath
like Picasso..

pick you,
like fruit
off yuh family tree. &
eatcha' honeydew ass,
wet"

-Giovanni, rhythmic poet extraordinaire

i believe in education and empowerment through art. i believe that movements happen when ideas are set to music. bodies and people come together through dance and movement, eyes awaken in the face of a good movie, and whatever ya gotta say is useless unless you can use these tools to reach right into people

"The logic of divide and rule is still valid today." Capleton

DomePoem Poets; Vibe Nation; One ppl under the spoken word

.....

"Who need fossil fuel when the sun ain't goin' nowhere"
- Amiri Baraka

http://www.okayplayer.com/guidelines

BUY MY BOOK- only $6! Inbox me for details

  

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Federisco
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5002 posts
Tue Jul-10-01 12:41 PM

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21. "True.."
In response to Reply # 13


  

          

But it isnt easy.. reminds me of how we stood there waiting for common to tell him how much the show meant. That it was dope.. i even planned to phone up a fellow okp in scotland and then ask if common would talk to her.

He never showed up thou (of course, i guess). It is difficult getting your message through to them, except for showing up where they perform. Well.... i know that the next any okayartist happens to be near where i am, i be there.

░▒▓█▌♥▐█▓▒░

proud okayphotographer: http://www.okayplayer.com/okayphotographers/

"Most of our assumptions have outlived their uselessness." Marshall McLuhan

  

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k_orr
Charter member
80197 posts
Mon Jul-09-01 06:37 AM

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4. "No"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Hip Hop is American.

k. orr

http://breddanansi.tumblr.com/

  

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5th
Charter member
32 posts
Mon Jul-09-01 11:55 PM

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6. "What??"
In response to Reply # 4


          

IS u serious with that comment, or on some satirical sh!t where it's not needed?

  

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mayowa
Member since Jun 26th 2002
434 posts
Tue Jul-10-01 12:31 AM

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7. "RE: What??"
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

5th,

you are right, you did make a fool of yourself

Anyhow, I feel you on the stuff about "African-Americans" looking down on us. Remember last year, after the Common show, when Common's road manager called someone names? Don't know if you remember that so let me recap - some guy (from Africa, Ethiopia I believe) was asking Common's roadie for a t-shirt with Com's logo on it. True, the guy went about it the wrong way - telling the roadie we should be getting shirts for free and stuff - but what followed was totally uncalled for. Common's roadie called the guy "cheap African mother-fucker!", with an emphasis on African! I'll never forget that, especially since it was right after my first OKP concert. Really hurt.

Just wanted to add my $ 0.02.

Signature starts here:

"No no Mayowa,
keep your rhymes simple,
you know me,
I like a girl with an ass that's nimble"...E-dub (c)2001

"I am in the wilderness, you're the music in the man's car next to me"...Sade - Lover's Rock, Lovers Rock

-----I'm feeling this!--------------

Mediocrity is self inflicted and genius is self bestowed...Walter Russell

"Some patients mistakenly believe that their loneliness is a product of another person's absence"...a psychology book I don't know the name of

  

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mE__again
Charter member
5843 posts
Tue Jul-10-01 12:59 AM

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8. "RE: What??"
In response to Reply # 7


  

          

>Anyhow, I feel you on the
>stuff about "African-Americans" looking down
>on us. Remember last year,
>after the Common show, when
>Common's road manager called someone
>names? Don't know if you
>remember that so let me
>recap - some guy (from
>Africa, Ethiopia I believe) was
>asking Common's roadie for a
>t-shirt with Com's logo on
>it. True, the guy went
>about it the wrong way
>- telling the roadie we
>should be getting shirts for
>free and stuff - but
>what followed was totally uncalled
>for. Common's roadie called the
>guy "cheap African mother-fucker!", with
>an emphasis on African! I'll
>never forget that, especially since
>it was right after my
>first OKP concert. Really hurt.
>
is this the best example you can use? for all you know the guy might have been joking or just a plain asshole. and surely dosent speak on behalf of the whole african american community.


---------------------------
"...okay player here we go..." - 8 ball

---------------------------
mE__again AKA mE_again AKA mE AKA joe1192

mE__again appears courtesy of joe1192 productions

  

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mayowa
Member since Jun 26th 2002
434 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 01:01 AM

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25. "RE: What??"
In response to Reply # 8


  

          

Mofo (me_again),

I know beef when I see it! There was beef there, simple. And he's not the only one I've seen shit like this from. But c'mon, who we kidding? I know many people back home that think "African-Americans" have taken the worst of American and now personify that. I'm sure you know such people too.

I go on an individual basis and try not to generalize, but I've seen enough beef between the two camps to know that there is beef. Period. There's beef between Nigerians and Jamaicans in England, between West-Africans and Somalians in Finland. Why is it so hard for you to accept that what happened with Com's manager was beef`?

And what's up with you and E bout this Badu thing? Can't we do la and hang out at the same time? Tanja isn't even going to the bloody concert!! You mofos need to chill...

Signature starts here:

"No no Mayowa,
keep your rhymes simple,
you know me,
I like a girl with an ass that's nimble"...E-dub (c)2001

"I am in the wilderness, you're the music in the man's car next to me"...Sade - Lover's Rock, Lovers Rock

-----I'm feeling this!--------------

Mediocrity is self inflicted and genius is self bestowed...Walter Russell

"Some patients mistakenly believe that their loneliness is a product of another person's absence"...a psychology book I don't know the name of

  

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5th
Charter member
32 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 01:27 AM

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26. "Nuff of that too!!"
In response to Reply # 25


          

No need to get personal. It has no relation to the here & now.

Sig:
"U Got beef? lets discuss it" -Talib (was it?)

  

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mayowa
Member since Jun 26th 2002
434 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 01:36 AM

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27. "RE: Nuff of that too!!"
In response to Reply # 26


  

          

I don't have beef, 5th, just didn't like the way me_again came off like I was exagerating (I know I mis-spelt that!) stuff.

No beef, no beef...Chino XL

Signature starts here:

"No no Mayowa,
keep your rhymes simple,
you know me,
I like a girl with an ass that's nimble"...E-dub (c)2001

"Survival tactics means bursting gats to prove you hard,
your firearms are too short to box with God,
without faith all of that is illusionary,
raise my son no vindication of manhood necessary"...Talib Kweli & Mos Def - Thieves in the night, Black Star Album

-----I'm feeling this!--------------

Mediocrity is self inflicted and genius is self bestowed...Walter Russell

"Some patients mistakenly believe that their loneliness is a product of another person's absence"...a psychology book I don't know the name of

  

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tohunga
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32612 posts
Tue Jul-10-01 01:26 PM

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23. "no, no, no......."
In response to Reply # 4


  

          

hip-hop was born in America...

but it is no longer American.

K_orr, if you try and spin that line of shit again, i'm gonna have to send King Kapisi round to your house to set you straight.

http://www.kingkapisi.co.nz

_________________________
http://www.paulwalsh.co.nz
art.design.comics.blog.etc

  

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k_orr
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Wed Jul-11-01 03:49 AM

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31. "new zealand?"
In response to Reply # 23


  

          


I need not say anything.

k. orr

http://breddanansi.tumblr.com/

  

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tohunga
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32612 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 01:56 PM

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50. "ahhh... actually, yes you do."
In response to Reply # 31


  

          

have you been here?
have you seen any Maori hip-hop acts?
Samoan?
Niuean?
Have you seen DJ Raw play? (oh, you might have seen him at the WORLD FINALS of the ITF...)

What about DJ P-Money, DJ Sir-vere, or SubMariner, or Goosh, or Kerb?

or any of our MCs? Te Kupu, King Kapisi, Che Fu, Imon Star, Viso, Mana, Rizla, GnD, 5th Floor, Paolo?

So you gonna say all these guys aren't hip-hop? Because of nothing more than WHERE THEY LIVE?

That is the most fucked up, narrow-minded viewpoint I ever seen on this website.

Why don't you just go sing 'stars and stripes', stick your dick in an apple pie, and tighten your blindfold a little more?


Whaia te maramatanga
Me te aroha e nga iwi
Kia ka tapatahi
Kia kotahi ra
Tatou tatou e

seek after knowledge
and fellowship all people
think as one
act as one
all of us

-"Tutira mai nga iwi"

_________________________
http://www.paulwalsh.co.nz
art.design.comics.blog.etc

  

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TheSauce
Charter member
1721 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 05:44 PM

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51. "True but,"
In response to Reply # 4


          

it's now gone global.

Same shit happened happened before.

Traditional African music combined with new Western instruments like drum kits, guitars, etc. This produced new styles of music (Blues & Jazz among others). These styles along with the instruments then made their way back to Africa, which in turn affected and changed African music.

It's the basics of cultural exchange: in any exchange both sides are affected.

Now an artform created out of a combination of traditional African elements and African descendents experiences in North America has branched out into the world and affected all cultures that have come into contact with it.

Hip-hop will always be American, but it's affects are global.

Just thought I'd throw that in there . . .

Giving you true Calcio since 1986

  

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k_orr
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Thu Jul-12-01 04:41 AM

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54. "I agree."
In response to Reply # 51


  

          


wholeheartedly. It's gotten away from it's origin and is now practiced like fencing or calculus all over the world.

k. orr

http://breddanansi.tumblr.com/

  

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Federisco
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Thu Jul-12-01 05:12 AM

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55. "that is true"
In response to Reply # 54


  

          

in good and bad, hiphop has spread. But i ignore those who misuse it and instead look up to those who manage to stay close to the roots of hiphop (but still make their music come from where they stand). Most internationals either pretend to be an american rapper (rap in english and all) or they just bring it parts of hiphop into their music and call it hiphop. To make it more popular (misusing it).

I can understand it is a big camel to swallow..! hmm i understand it's more difficult for those who grew up to the music to accept it.

But you mustnt forget the world today is 'smaller' than it was. A up and coming norwegian rapper grew up listening to hiphop tapes, because his friends' big sister's boyfriend lived in the states in the early 80s and brought home tapes. Many grew up to hiphop like you did (i suppose you did), and i am sure he respects hiphop just as much as you do.

He said thou that he thinks today 90% of those who call themself hiphoppers/heads do it to give themselves an identity, only 10% would be there for the hiphop if it wasnt as big as it is today.

One day the western *hiphop phenomenon* will slowly decrease, then those who truly are for hiphop will stay left. International hiphop, that is....

░▒▓█▌♥▐█▓▒░

proud okayphotographer: http://www.okayplayer.com/okayphotographers/

"Most of our assumptions have outlived their uselessness." Marshall McLuhan

  

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k_orr
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Thu Jul-12-01 07:19 AM

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56. "as a european"
In response to Reply # 55


  

          

>in good and bad, hiphop has
>spread. But i ignore those
>who misuse it and instead
>look up to those who
>manage to stay close to
>the roots of hiphop (but
>still make their music come
>from where they stand).

How the hell would you know what the roots of hip hop are?
Are you from the South Bronx? did you grow up black in an american ghetto?

You can study, you can have empathy, but you just don't know.

The under current of hip hop has little to do with what is recorded on wax. It's like Egyptian Pottery showing kmt's, ethiop's and greeks.

peace
k. orr

http://breddanansi.tumblr.com/

  

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Federisco
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Fri Jul-13-01 06:32 AM

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67. "damn it"
In response to Reply # 56


  

          

>>manage to stay close to
>>the roots of hiphop (but
>>still make their music come
>>from where they stand).
>
>How the hell would you know
>what the roots of hip
>hop are?
>Are you from the South Bronx?
> did you grow up
>black in an american ghetto?

I said "stay close to", you cant expect someone on a different continent to BE the roots of hiphop! That was a lame attempt of you at getting an excuse for wanting hiphop to stay within USA.

I haven't even tried to (and i won't) put e.g. french hiphop in the same category as american hiphop, because i know there are big difference. What is it you don't like with hiphop outside the states?

nah i didnt grow up in no ghetto, thats why i dont walk around in them hiphop clothes, got dat slang, do dat freestylin ish and whatmore..

Eff your attitude, it is narrowminded and full of bad feelings against anything other than TRUE, REAL, AMERICAN hiphop it seems like.

Is it just europe or all continents you got something against? Have you heard french rap, rap from senegal, seen a b-boy from chile or even tried to listen to your fellow okp tohunga and the maori hiphop acts he can get you?

>The under current of hip hop
>has little to do with
>what is recorded on wax.
> It's like Egyptian Pottery
>showing kmt's, ethiop's and greeks.

Sorry, i'd answer that if i understand but my english isn't that up to date. under current?

>
>peace
>k. orr

hrmpf...
peace

░▒▓█▌♥▐█▓▒░

proud okayphotographer: http://www.okayplayer.com/okayphotographers/

"Most of our assumptions have outlived their uselessness." Marshall McLuhan

  

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tohunga
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Mon Jul-16-01 02:21 PM

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75. "yeah bro...."
In response to Reply # 67


  

          

what he said.....

how the fuck can k.orr post shit like this and then post "Who's the best Canadian MC" over in the lesson?
bitch-ass.

We gotta get a gang of all the MC's, DJ's, b-boys, b-girls and graff artists who live EVERYWHERE ELSE that is not the United States of Unconsciousness, form a million-strong posse, and take turns beating k.orr's bloated head with turntables and mic cords.


We respect the architecture, like Bahamadia says. We know that hip-hop started in America (albeit started by Kool Herc, a --Jamaican--). Now, the hip-hop that's being made all over the world- Europe, South America, Japan, Mongolia, wherever- can easily stand up against the US hip-hop crews.....

I think DJ Krush makes some of the best beats around. So does BlackThought.

The new Skitz album- from the UK- blows ANY U.S. hip-hop made in the last year OUT OF THE FUCKING WATER. Buy it. Try and prove me wrong.

King Kapisi is ill. Fact.

Alliance Ethnik were good enough for Common and Rahzel to work with. Wu-Tang collaborated with I AM, as did De La Soul. But... they're both French....

Hell, Shabaam Sahdeeq recorded a track with new zealand producer DLT.

These people recognize that hip-hop is universal....
k.orr, time for you to wake up.

Whaia te maramatanga
Me te aroha e nga iwi
Kia ka tapatahi
Kia kotahi ra
Tatou tatou e

seek after knowledge
and fellowship all people
think as one
act as one
all of us

-"Tutira mai nga iwi"

_________________________
http://www.paulwalsh.co.nz
art.design.comics.blog.etc

  

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Dyskotek

Mon Jul-09-01 07:28 AM

  
5. "RE: Is Hip Hop for Africa??? for Africans"
In response to Reply # 0


          

>All the posting about ppl "not
>wanting to be black" or
>labeled African American & not
>wanting it got me thinking
>maybe 'melanated-American' would be easier
>for Speakeasy to handle. On
>that path we'd soon have
>'melanatedly-challenged' as a disability category
>too. Stupid Fool!
>
>I have to take a strong
>stand on that because it's
>an issue that bugs me
>repeatedly. So much effort is
>spent on these boards discussing
>racial matters -permanent things which
>will never change. What we
>should be discussing is WAYS
>of effecting CHANGE in peoples
>attitudes towards race & race
>relations.
>
>America is not a home for
>black people. That has been
>proven time & again. Wont
>Americans accept it??? There will
>never be no reparations to
>a Black man. There have
>been official apologies and compensation
>to former wartime enemies (over
>tactics used in warfare, atrocious
>as they were it was
>still war.) Does war have
>rules? are there rules when
>you choose to kill someone?
>There have been compensatory payments
>to Jews and their families
>after the holocaust. Damn, America
>even went as far as
>helping them establish a homeland
>in the middle of Arabia
>(sic) hence the middle east
>continues to bubble to this
>day. But not to the
>black man. Even after a
>govt promise of 40 acres
>and mule. Even after watching
>communities disintergrate. Kids shooting each
>other on the streets. Police
>shooting black men on the
>streets. what more do you
>need to tell you that
>aint your home, homeboy.

Then where is my home? I'm not wanted here in America, but i know Africans that cant stand African-Americans. So where is a black man to go?

>
>It's also too late to move
>anywhere else. Ya'll would'nt want
>to anyway. Those who would
>will have a tough time
>adjusting to the ways of
>life, the lack of taken-for-granted
>ammenities, poor infrastructure and general
>poverty that affects the continent
>(I'm talking of the region
>South of the Sahara cuz
>we all know Libya, Morocco
>& Egypt are now in
>the Middle East)
>
>And through all that, Most Afric...sorry,
>melanated americans look down on
>Africans too. Cuz we dont
>speak the same english. We're
>darker with thicker lips, dont
>dress the same way or
>have the same values as
>Americans.


How do you know what we look down upon? I see Africans as my long removed cousin. You are refering to ignorant African Americans that refer to straight hair as "good hair" and light eyes as "pretty eyes". Thats not the sentiment of every black person in America.

Unless Black America also
>creates a nation for yourselves
>-as the Jews did, and
>populate it with your selves
>so you wont have to
>be the only black person
>in a waiting room or
>walk in fear of being
>pelted with a beer bottle
>from a passing car, then
>thou shalt always be oppressed.


You know, black people think that its the white people against us. When the real problem is human nature. You just said it yourself, that African Americans look down on Africans. If we had our own nation then it would be African Americans oppressing
native Africans. Or if it was'nt that, then it would be light skinned people oppressing dark people, or tall people oppressing short people. The bottomline is that it is human nature to oppress, destroy and conqure. This is not a trait singular to just white people (although they have shown an apptitude for it).
>
>
>Sometimes i think it's blacks &
>not jews that are the
>chosen people in scripture. Maybe
>the jews (who kept those
>damn records anyway) altered something.
>Why u ask? Cuz look
>around you!! Which peoples are
>the most opressed wherever they
>may be? Hell, were even
>opressed with poverty & underdevelopment
>at home. What causes that
>i wonder? Do i hear
>free-&-equal-trade being discussed at G8
>conventions? nooo, never. But where
>do they get all those
>diamonds & gold from? And
>how come since colonialism those
>places are politically unstable to
>this day. Ever heard of
>the Mobutu-CIA connection? Ever wonder
>why?
>Nigeria (oil producing nation by the
>way) the number of different
>leaders its had in the
>past 10 years compared to
>the number of elections is
>a joke.
>
>Most of these problems are our
>own. The greed and lack
>of vision our leaders display.
>And the difficulties of uniting.
>Look everywhere else and you
>find united nations. America is
>a unity of states. Europe
>has also caught on and
>is desperately trying to unite.
>There are different economic communities
>world-wide including in Africa that
>dont really work but serve
>as a beginning for stronger
>unity. East Africa attempted to
>unite very early in the
>game but disintergrated after 10
>years (in 1977) I wont
>go into the reasons here.
>The few visionaries we had
>were either assasinated (Kwame Nkrumah)
>had their legs pulled from
>under them by economic conditions
>including forced liberalization (J. Nyerere),
>or got frustrated and joined
>the mainstream of globally powerless
>African leaders (Chiluba, Mugabe etc.)
>Now it all about greed,
>see the mess that followed
>Kabila Sr.'s death.

I agree with you on these points.

>
>I am African, born & raised,
>strong, intelligent & proud of
>who i am period. The
>people and ways of life
>i represent show through my
>everyday actions and in the
>way i relate to everyone,
>including white people. There's nothing
>wrong with embracing some elements
>of European and even Asian
>culture because there is essentially
>much to learn from other
>cultures. It's how civilizations emerged
>in the first place, by
>trading and learning from each
>other. Besides music, what else
>has the world learned from
>Africa? They choose to ignore
>lessons in love that Africans
>seem to be so good
>at (both in the way
>we relate with each other
>-who else calls you brother/sister,
>regardless of where you're from?)
>I wont elaborate on the
>other. (See i do have
>a sense of humour, bad
>as it is).

Yes, it is.....

>
>This has been long, but my
>aim was to use OKplayer
>to stimulate fruitfull discussion on
>matters that affect Africans as
>well. There seem to be
>so many of you so
>well informed. Lets learn from
>each other as well as
>the rest of the world.

You make some valid points, but for all practical purposes, you are looking at it from that vantage point of an outsider raised in a different culture with different values. Tru nuf, me and you are related but our paths have branched and taken us two opposite paths. Hence, how can i say to you what an African should do, and vice versa.

get at me....



>



  

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5th
Charter member
32 posts
Tue Jul-10-01 01:05 AM

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9. "..."
In response to Reply # 5


          

"How do you know what we look down upon? I see Africans as my long removed cousin....Thats not the sentiment of every black person in America."

-True, and my generalization was unfair on those who do consider and TREAT Africans as distant cousins (without putting them at a distance). Unfortunately there are more of the ignorant type than there are of you. Still, i stand corrected.

"The bottomline is that it is human nature to oppress, destroy and conquer."

-I agree with that to limited extent. I firmly believe it applies to certain historically (and still doing it now) antagonistic societies prepared to crush another peoples for their own advancement. I'm tempted to say Africans dont have it within our nature to "oppress, destroy and conquer" other races, but perhaps it's because the opportunity has passed and we cant do that anymore. Who knows how Africa would be now if Cecil, Karl, Livingstone and those blasted Christians had been strung up on baobab trees and left to the elements.

Again you are also right when you say i see it from a different angle. I feel that not being an american or having lived in America is a blessing in disguise. I did'nt mention other societies & places i've spent time in, and i wont, but I am well rounded. My primary concern is empowering Africa. Achieving that needs the support of Black people everywhere. Everything from academics to politicians, entertainers and even the religious.


Sig:
"The poor boy changes clothes and puts on after-shave, to compensate for his ordinary shoes" -Paul Simon; Diamonds on the soles of her shoes.

  

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Dyskotek

Tue Jul-10-01 01:24 AM

  
10. "Africans dont like African Americans...."
In response to Reply # 9


          

I dont know if this is a prevailing sentiment, but, i get the impression that Africans dont like African Americans. How do Africans feel about African Americans? I was dating this Nigerian
woman at my school (which has alot of Nigerians) and i caught a WHOLE lot of flak from the men, because i wasnt African. When i talk to (some) Africans i get distain and aloofness....
just wondering....

  

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guerilla_love
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8273 posts
Tue Jul-10-01 08:59 AM

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12. "depends"
In response to Reply # 10


          

on the african and teh african american

completely

i know where you're getting this from, cuz i've seen a lot of animosity

but the animosity is not even nearly universal and has the most to do with the ignorance of the individuals involved (e.g. my husband's old roomate, who is ethiopian, and believes he is "not black" and doesn't like black people. he thinks this way because he has a glorified vision of his amhara tribe. he also doesn't speak english but would be happy to marry a white american girl.)


==**peace**==

"baby,
I'd draw yuh bath
like Picasso..

pick you,
like fruit
off yuh family tree. &
eatcha' honeydew ass,
wet"

-Giovanni, rhythmic poet extraordinaire

i believe in education and empowerment through art. i believe that movements happen when ideas are set to music. bodies and people come together through dance and movement, eyes awaken in the face of a good movie, and whatever ya gotta say is useless unless you can use these tools to reach right into people

"The logic of divide and rule is still valid today." Capleton

DomePoem Poets; Vibe Nation; One ppl under the spoken word

.....

"Who need fossil fuel when the sun ain't goin' nowhere"
- Amiri Baraka

http://www.okayplayer.com/guidelines

BUY MY BOOK- only $6! Inbox me for details

  

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Federisco
Charter member
5002 posts
Tue Jul-10-01 09:58 AM

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16. "RE: depends"
In response to Reply # 12


  

          


>(e.g. my husband's old roomate,
>who is ethiopian, and believes
>he is "not black" and
>doesn't like black people. he
>thinks this way because he
>has a glorified vision of
>his amhara tribe. he also
>doesn't speak english but would
>be happy to marry a
>white american girl.)

i liked that
yes, i can agree it isn't very correct. But it goes prove something about us humans. In Roots (i read the book now), Kunta in the beginning wanted to kill the blacks just as much as the whites. He learned quick that they (blacks borned in america as slaves) could love toubou (white man) even more than white man loved himself. And before he was put on the slave ship, Kunta very often thought much about the differences even between his village and the village of the fulani people not far away.

░▒▓█▌♥▐█▓▒░

proud okayphotographer: http://www.okayplayer.com/okayphotographers/

"Most of our assumptions have outlived their uselessness." Marshall McLuhan

  

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LexM
Charter member
28342 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 04:49 AM

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34. "saw this a lot @ school"
In response to Reply # 12


  

          

>(e.g. my husband's old roomate,
>who is ethiopian, and believes
>he is "not black" and
>doesn't like black people. he
>thinks this way because he
>has a glorified vision of
>his amhara tribe. he also
>doesn't speak english but would
>be happy to marry a
>white american girl.)

except there were more West Africans there than eastern ones...

but then there were others who had a pan-African/Diasporan philosophy, like, we're ALL in the same boat (especially in America), so we need to all get together.

so I agree...it largely depends on the African & the Black American


~~~SPITFIRE: AUGUST 23, 2001~~~
HipHop. Old school style. In Full Effect. Want Info? Email: carameldom@hotmail.com

"to get inside this head of mine/would take a monkey wrench/and a lot of wine" ~~Res

~~~~
http://omidele.blogspot.com/
http://rahareiki.tumblr.com/
http://seatofbliss.blogspot.com/

  

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Solarus
Charter member
3604 posts
Tue Jul-10-01 09:08 AM

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14. "What's there to like about"
In response to Reply # 10


  

          

African Americans? Next time I here one of you colored cry this sentiment...

But anyway, African Americans collectively are the richest group of Africans in the world. And look at you. Look at your neighborhoods. Look at your ATTITUDES!!! Why should ANY Afrakan from anywhere respect African Americans?

I'm listening...


PEace
Solarus

***Words of Wisdom***

"Every time you rise from your sleeping state, you have been reincarnated. Every time you recover from a bad experience, you have been reincarnated. Every time you have been given a new lease on life, you have been reincarnated. Every time you breath in and out, take in the fresh breath of life and feel the divine intelligence flowing in and around you, you have been reincarnated."- Mfundishi Bakari

On "love":

"I am in love everyday, whether I am with someone or not. Why? All love is based on a search for spirit. For me love is timeless, transcendent, peaceful, freeing, soul-based, unifying, and enhanced evolution. This is the basis of my activism."- Nettrice, the embodiment of Oshun

"Since we all make up the rules as we go along, love can mean many different things to many different people. But, for me love is a total commitment to understanding that is not limited to just people but is open to the totality of life. As long as we approach love from a fear based mentality and perceive it through veils of guardedness and anxiety, it will always be restricted by our fears."- Mfundishi Bakari

____________________________
"the real pyramids were built with such precision that you can't slide a piece of paper between two 4,000 lb stones, and have shafts perfectly aligned so that you can see a tiny aperture through dozens of these mammoth blocks

  

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guerilla_love
Charter member
8273 posts
Tue Jul-10-01 09:24 AM

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15. "tryna start sumthin?"
In response to Reply # 14


          

i'll be back

==**peace**==

"baby,
I'd draw yuh bath
like Picasso..

pick you,
like fruit
off yuh family tree. &
eatcha' honeydew ass,
wet"

-Giovanni, rhythmic poet extraordinaire

i believe in education and empowerment through art. i believe that movements happen when ideas are set to music. bodies and people come together through dance and movement, eyes awaken in the face of a good movie, and whatever ya gotta say is useless unless you can use these tools to reach right into people

"The logic of divide and rule is still valid today." Capleton

DomePoem Poets; Vibe Nation; One ppl under the spoken word

.....

"Who need fossil fuel when the sun ain't goin' nowhere"
- Amiri Baraka

http://www.okayplayer.com/guidelines

BUY MY BOOK- only $6! Inbox me for details

  

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guerilla_love
Charter member
8273 posts
Tue Jul-10-01 10:25 AM

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18. "on 2nd thought"
In response to Reply # 15


          

i'll leave this open for people who learn best from the bootcamp approach


==**peace**==

"baby,
I'd draw yuh bath
like Picasso..

pick you,
like fruit
off yuh family tree. &
eatcha' honeydew ass,
wet"

-Giovanni, rhythmic poet extraordinaire

i believe in education and empowerment through art. i believe that movements happen when ideas are set to music. bodies and people come together through dance and movement, eyes awaken in the face of a good movie, and whatever ya gotta say is useless unless you can use these tools to reach right into people

"The logic of divide and rule is still valid today." Capleton

DomePoem Poets; Vibe Nation; One ppl under the spoken word

.....

"Who need fossil fuel when the sun ain't goin' nowhere"
- Amiri Baraka

http://www.okayplayer.com/guidelines

BUY MY BOOK- only $6! Inbox me for details

  

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Federisco
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5002 posts
Tue Jul-10-01 12:30 PM

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19. "I"
In response to Reply # 18


  

          

leave it to the others, i have said my part for now and hope to see other opinions when i come back tomorrow!

░▒▓█▌♥▐█▓▒░

proud okayphotographer: http://www.okayplayer.com/okayphotographers/

"Most of our assumptions have outlived their uselessness." Marshall McLuhan

  

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guerilla_love
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Tue Jul-10-01 12:32 PM

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20. "this man"
In response to Reply # 19


          

is not lookin for opinions

he's lookin to crack a whip at some scamperin bodies

he's lookin to make ppl stand taller

by eggin them on

cuz this man

has taken one too many martial arts courses in his day


==**peace**==

"baby,
I'd draw yuh bath
like Picasso..

pick you,
like fruit
off yuh family tree. &
eatcha' honeydew ass,
wet"

-Giovanni, rhythmic poet extraordinaire

i believe in education and empowerment through art. i believe that movements happen when ideas are set to music. bodies and people come together through dance and movement, eyes awaken in the face of a good movie, and whatever ya gotta say is useless unless you can use these tools to reach right into people

"The logic of divide and rule is still valid today." Capleton

DomePoem Poets; Vibe Nation; One ppl under the spoken word

.....

"Who need fossil fuel when the sun ain't goin' nowhere"
- Amiri Baraka

http://www.okayplayer.com/guidelines

BUY MY BOOK- only $6! Inbox me for details

  

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Federisco
Charter member
5002 posts
Tue Jul-10-01 12:48 PM

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22. "What?!"
In response to Reply # 20


  

          

Hehehehehhe

This woman

has been too long at the okayplayer board

has forgotten that sleep is important

for an okayplayer to think clear

and with her sharp tongue

disturbs a okayyoungoun(sp)s sleep!!!!

Really, i have a reason. I dont have more to say about it, unless you want me to pull in something i have read in Roots. The title of the thread says "....for Africans". Even if i think it is wrong to only want africans to answer, i give 5th some respect for now.. and me some good sleep

What did you mean with
"he's lookin to crack a whip at some scamperin bodies"
??

░▒▓█▌♥▐█▓▒░

proud okayphotographer: http://www.okayplayer.com/okayphotographers/

"Most of our assumptions have outlived their uselessness." Marshall McLuhan

  

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mE__again
Charter member
5843 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 12:37 AM

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24. "RE: What?!"
In response to Reply # 22


  

          

>The title of the thread
>says "....for Africans". Even if
>i think it is wrong
>to only want africans to
>answer, i give 5th some
>respect for now.. and me
>some good sleep
>
5th said he made a mistake in the title of the post. i think it was supposed to be: is hip hop for africans?

maybe its the sleep getting to u

>What did you mean with
>"he's lookin to crack a whip
>at some scamperin bodies"
>??
i guess this is meant for g_love

---------------------------
"...okay player here we go..." - 8 ball

---------------------------
mE__again AKA mE_again AKA mE AKA joe1192

mE__again appears courtesy of joe1192 productions

  

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guerilla_love
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Wed Jul-11-01 06:26 AM

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41. "oh yeh"
In response to Reply # 24


          

>>What did you mean with "he's lookin to crack a whip
>>at some scamperin bodies"
>>??
>i guess this is meant for g_love

we-ell, i mean that he wants to say sumthin like this, make people get angry and think about it, and make people come back willing to work harder to really improve their community instead of getting comfortable and resting on historical accomplishments


==**peace**==

"baby,
I'd draw yuh bath
like Picasso..

pick you,
like fruit
off yuh family tree. &
eatcha' honeydew ass,
wet"

-Giovanni, rhythmic poet extraordinaire

i believe in education and empowerment through art. i believe that movements happen when ideas are set to music. bodies and people come together through dance and movement, eyes awaken in the face of a good movie, and whatever ya gotta say is useless unless you can use these tools to reach right into people

"The logic of divide and rule is still valid today." Capleton

DomePoem Poets; Vibe Nation; One ppl under the spoken word

.....

"Who need fossil fuel when the sun ain't goin' nowhere"
- Amiri Baraka

http://www.okayplayer.com/guidelines

BUY MY BOOK- only $6! Inbox me for details

  

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mE__again
Charter member
5843 posts
Tue Jul-10-01 10:07 AM

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17. "here we go"
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

>African Americans? Next time I
>here one of you colored
>cry this sentiment...
>
>But anyway, African Americans collectively are
>the richest group of Africans
>in the world. And
>look at you. Look
>at your neighborhoods. Look at
>your ATTITUDES!!! Why should ANY
>Afrakan from anywhere respect African
>Americans?
>
>I'm listening...
>
>
>PEace
>Solarus
>


---------------------------
"...okay player here we go..." - 8 ball

---------------------------
mE__again AKA mE_again AKA mE AKA joe1192

mE__again appears courtesy of joe1192 productions

  

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5th
Charter member
32 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 01:45 AM

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28. "...then hear this:"
In response to Reply # 17


          

Solarus.

I've been reading OKP boards for a while, posting where i've felt my contribution could give a perspective that had not been mentioned by another. I thus seldom post. I've read several of your posts and they are often educative and good to read. I respect your opinions on a general level.

I am however pissed off at the attitude you enter into this discussion with. Take a step back and look at what you say in other posts. You're very good at analysing current situations vis-a-vis historical facts. U & Utamaroho hold that sector down, no doubt.

But what do you propagate? Do you offer feasible scenarios that are relevant to Africa? You guys are no doubt Africans, but I think you've lost touch with what it means to be an African. I call that "too-long-in-the-states" syndrome. You are concious -no doubt, wish to help the continent rise to its feet -no doubt, but how do you do it? By scaring intelligent minds away like you did above?

U'r not dealing with Americans on this post, so come correct & with respect. Leave that attitude on your mousepad and share some of that knowledge you've been directing the wrong way all year.

  

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guerilla_love
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Wed Jul-11-01 06:29 AM

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42. "thing is"
In response to Reply # 28


          

what works for some works for some

what works for others works for others

if his words are what some people need to hear, let him say them

that's the conclusion i'm coming to after seeing that some people really love to be treated harshly and really respond well to "stimulating insults"



==**peace**==

"baby,
I'd draw yuh bath
like Picasso..

pick you,
like fruit
off yuh family tree. &
eatcha' honeydew ass,
wet"

-Giovanni, rhythmic poet extraordinaire

i believe in education and empowerment through art. i believe that movements happen when ideas are set to music. bodies and people come together through dance and movement, eyes awaken in the face of a good movie, and whatever ya gotta say is useless unless you can use these tools to reach right into people

"The logic of divide and rule is still valid today." Capleton

DomePoem Poets; Vibe Nation; One ppl under the spoken word

.....

"Who need fossil fuel when the sun ain't goin' nowhere"
- Amiri Baraka

http://www.okayplayer.com/guidelines

BUY MY BOOK- only $6! Inbox me for details

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                            
5th
Charter member
32 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 09:15 AM

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47. "..."
In response to Reply # 42


          

Unfortunately, I dont.

Are you trying to say that some people respond better when treated harshly. Look at your comment as well.

Do not post to support someone just because they regularly come with good arguments. And especially not after they've posted crap. I respect you too guerilla_love, but have you noticed Solarus remained silent to the above post. & its not because he's has'nt seen it.

  

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Solarus
Charter member
3604 posts
Thu Jul-12-01 08:29 AM

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60. "If you noticed"
In response to Reply # 47


  

          

HTP

I have not really posted on ANY threads in depth recently except the "God is IMMANENT" one. I'm trying to finish it and it is taking up most of my time. Any other posts, that I comment on are just simple comments that I want to make. I made the previous comment about African Americans simply because that statement is not only negative but false and counterproductive. I wanted to those who feel that way to express WHY they feel that way and HOW anyone could feel that way about African Americans?

That is a statement that I constantly here reiterated by African Americans and thus they negate FAMILY.

Although it was not specific to your initial post, it is still important nonetheless. African Americans who believe that are usually less motivated to REconnect with their FAMILY, heritage and FUTURE, thus becoming another PROBLEM.

PEace
Solarus

***Words of Wisdom***

"Every time you rise from your sleeping state, you have been reincarnated. Every time you recover from a bad experience, you have been reincarnated. Every time you have been given a new lease on life, you have been reincarnated. Every time you breath in and out, take in the fresh breath of life and feel the divine intelligence flowing in and around you, you have been reincarnated."- Mfundishi Bakari

On "love":

"I am in love everyday, whether I am with someone or not. Why? All love is based on a search for spirit. For me love is timeless, transcendent, peaceful, freeing, soul-based, unifying, and enhanced evolution. This is the basis of my activism."- Nettrice, the embodiment of Oshun

"Since we all make up the rules as we go along, love can mean many different things to many different people. But, for me love is a total commitment to understanding that is not limited to just people but is open to the totality of life. As long as we approach love from a fear based mentality and perceive it through veils of guardedness and anxiety, it will always be restricted by our fears."- Mfundishi Bakari

____________________________
"the real pyramids were built with such precision that you can't slide a piece of paper between two 4,000 lb stones, and have shafts perfectly aligned so that you can see a tiny aperture through dozens of these mammoth blocks

  

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Solarus
Charter member
3604 posts
Thu Jul-12-01 08:02 AM

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57. "I AM dealing with Americans"
In response to Reply # 28


  

          

HTP

My purpose for making that post was to deal with a dentrimental idea that African AMERICANS proclaim (cry) consistently:

"Africans dont like African Americans...."

Why would you say this?

Does a few disparaging comments made by SOME continental Africans make that statement true?

Why wouldn't African like African americans?

The latter question alone causes several open wounds to be expose but also for them to heal.

Then one has to consider the African who dislikes African Americans. More often than not, the African who seriously has a disdain for African Americans usually does so because of jealously. Jealously because African Americans don't readily see how they can enjoy the "comforts" (traps in IMO) that Western/American culture has offer, and deep down they (the Africans in question) want what African Americans possess.

Often African Americans don't realize how UN-African, continental Africans are. Continental Africans in the States are often the children diplomats, World Bank employees, other well-to-do families of the higher classes and/or the product of a highly Western-indoctrinating and African-negating education. So one must then question the African who would negatively comment on the African American.

There are serious problems on both sides of the Atlantic. We have serious and complex family issues to resolve. However, crying "Africans don't like African Americans," is NOT going to help matters AT ALL.

For all of those wondering am I "real," I'm as real as they come. And next time, look at the question and try to answer it to the best of your ability, instead of just making unrelated comments. The purpose of using the word "colored" was to catch your attention, insure comments would be made, and to awaken your emotions as emotions often breakdown any barriers that might hinder one from being TOTALLY HONEST about how they feel.

Finally, I am "black" born to Afrakans from the West Indies who settled in Panama and I was born and raised most of my life in the United States. From my West Indian parentage I can understand any misgivings Africans may have to African American. However upon meeting any continental African, they will most likely assume that I am "African American" but I have NEVER been treated disrespected by FAMILY. Maybe you should check your own ATTITUDES before EVER proclaiming "Africans don't like African Americans."

PEace
Solarus

***Words of Wisdom***

"Every time you rise from your sleeping state, you have been reincarnated. Every time you recover from a bad experience, you have been reincarnated. Every time you have been given a new lease on life, you have been reincarnated. Every time you breath in and out, take in the fresh breath of life and feel the divine intelligence flowing in and around you, you have been reincarnated."- Mfundishi Bakari

On "love":

"I am in love everyday, whether I am with someone or not. Why? All love is based on a search for spirit. For me love is timeless, transcendent, peaceful, freeing, soul-based, unifying, and enhanced evolution. This is the basis of my activism."- Nettrice, the embodiment of Oshun

"Since we all make up the rules as we go along, love can mean many different things to many different people. But, for me love is a total commitment to understanding that is not limited to just people but is open to the totality of life. As long as we approach love from a fear based mentality and perceive it through veils of guardedness and anxiety, it will always be restricted by our fears."- Mfundishi Bakari

____________________________
"the real pyramids were built with such precision that you can't slide a piece of paper between two 4,000 lb stones, and have shafts perfectly aligned so that you can see a tiny aperture through dozens of these mammoth blocks

  

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dafriquan
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24695 posts
Thu Jul-12-01 11:18 AM

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63. "you make some sense here"
In response to Reply # 57


  

          

it always surprises me how intelligent people can make ignorant comments...anyway as a child of west indian parents, i'm surprised you don't know about the tension between west indians and african americans. if you know about the way some west indians view african americans and why they do it, you will better understand the african vs african-american dynamic. it is not based on jealousy, it is based on ignorance. most other non-american blacks thing that african americans are lazy mofos who paint a bad picture of them.
because non-american blacks can come in and succed in the face of racism and all that other shit.(there's actually an article in the economist called "black like me" that contrasts the success rates of different black groups in america) non-american blacks tend to forget that psychologically they are not coming from the same place as african-americans. they are not living in the land of their oppressors. also a good number of west indians and africans who immigrate to america, come from the middle class in their respective countries. so even if they don't have the money, they have the attitude which they impart on their children.
as for the reasons why af-americans don't like other black groups, i'm not really sure...maybe someone can help me on this
SIGNATURE STARTS YONDER
"I'm not looking...forward to seeing
him"- Snoop on Suge's release.
understatement of the year
**************************
NE LOVE/ LOVE
(THE HICE IS URS)
**************************
The emoticon as 'O' symbol is a
registered trademark of dafriquan.
No biting without written permission.
*************************

RIP JDILLA
THE ILLEST THAT EVER DID IT

  

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guerilla_love
Charter member
8273 posts
Thu Jul-12-01 11:27 AM

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64. "my 2 cents worth"
In response to Reply # 63


          

for what it's worth, my impression of african and west indian animosity toward african americans is that it stems from ignorance more than anything

african americans exist in a real everyday sense only in practice. in media, in stereotypes, in every other way they're a misrepresented group and often judged on the basis of those misrepresentations.

the animosity usually stems from people who are socially isolated from black americans.


==**peace**==

"baby,
I'd draw yuh bath
like Picasso..

pick you,
like fruit
off yuh family tree. &
eatcha' honeydew ass,
wet"

-Giovanni, rhythmic poet extraordinaire

i believe in education and empowerment through art. i believe that movements happen when ideas are set to music. bodies and people come together through dance and movement, eyes awaken in the face of a good movie, and whatever ya gotta say is useless unless you can use these tools to reach right into people

"The logic of divide and rule is still valid today." Capleton

DomePoem Poets; Vibe Nation; One ppl under the spoken word

.....

"Who need fossil fuel when the sun ain't goin' nowhere"
- Amiri Baraka

http://www.okayplayer.com/guidelines

BUY MY BOOK- only $6! Inbox me for details

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                                
Solarus
Charter member
3604 posts
Thu Jul-12-01 11:44 AM

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65. "I know about the tension"
In response to Reply # 63


  

          

However it only becomes a problem if you let it. And the problem isn't just ignorance or jealously. There are a myriad of issues involved. My grandfather, "Dese damn African American, dey bad i tell you, dey don't rispek one anudda! Dey bad. Bad, bad!"

But the tension is no more great than the tension that African Americans have for themselves, West Indians have for themselves or Africans have for themselves. Within each of these GENERAL groups of Afrakans you find even more groups with issues with one another.

That's why believing this statement "Africans don't like African Americans," is detrimental. It is untrue as a universal statement and at BEST it is focusing on the negative and not the positive. Thus it is a pitiful and useless statement only hindering the Afrakan healing process.

As for this:
"it always surprises me how intelligent people can make ignorant comments."
Assuming you are talking about my first response. my purpose for making the statement was reached.(ignorant statements call for ignorant responses.) But I'm curious as why you think it was "ignorant?" Is it because I used the word "colored?" I thought it added a nice touch, especially since an AFRICAN AMERICAN friend of mine said, "Don't call be African American, African, Black or nigger. Just call me colored."

Hey I thought it was funny.




PEace
Solarus

***Words of Wisdom***

"Every time you rise from your sleeping state, you have been reincarnated. Every time you recover from a bad experience, you have been reincarnated. Every time you have been given a new lease on life, you have been reincarnated. Every time you breath in and out, take in the fresh breath of life and feel the divine intelligence flowing in and around you, you have been reincarnated."- Mfundishi Bakari

On "love":

"I am in love everyday, whether I am with someone or not. Why? All love is based on a search for spirit. For me love is timeless, transcendent, peaceful, freeing, soul-based, unifying, and enhanced evolution. This is the basis of my activism."- Nettrice, the embodiment of Oshun

"Since we all make up the rules as we go along, love can mean many different things to many different people. But, for me love is a total commitment to understanding that is not limited to just people but is open to the totality of life. As long as we approach love from a fear based mentality and perceive it through veils of guardedness and anxiety, it will always be restricted by our fears."- Mfundishi Bakari

____________________________
"the real pyramids were built with such precision that you can't slide a piece of paper between two 4,000 lb stones, and have shafts perfectly aligned so that you can see a tiny aperture through dozens of these mammoth blocks

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                                    
utamaroho

Thu Jul-12-01 11:52 AM

  
66. "hahahhahahaa"
In response to Reply # 65


          

>>My grandfather, "Dese damn African American, dey bad i tell you, dey don't rispek one anudda! Dey bad. Bad, bad!"


  

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dafriquan
Charter member
24695 posts
Fri Jul-13-01 09:14 AM

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69. "RE: I know about the tension"
In response to Reply # 65


  

          


>But the tension is no more
>great than the tension that
>African Americans have for themselves,
>West Indians have for themselves
>or Africans have for themselves.
> Within each of these
>GENERAL groups of Afrakans you
>find even more groups with
>issues with one another.
Good point here. I'll use it next time I have to argue
>That's why believing this statement "Africans
>don't like African Americans," is
>detrimental. It is untrue
>as a universal statement and
>at BEST it is focusing
>on the negative and not
>the positive. Thus it
>is a pitiful and useless
>statement only hindering the Afrakan
>healing process.
I'm actually on your side here. I believe black people who constantly play up this African Americans don't like Africans or Africans don't like African Americans or West Indians don't like Af-Americans, are no better than the black people who infiltrated the Black Panthers on behalf of the CIA/FBI. What could their aim possibly be? If you say something long enough, it might eventually become true. And that is not a universal truth so why are they trying to make it.
Personally as an African, I try to put my older relatives in check anytime they say something negative about Af-Americans or West Indians. You'd be surprised how easy it is to convince people when you persuade them with logical arguments and facts.
I think that's what each of us should be doing to alleviate that tension instead of fueling it.
>As for this:
>"it always surprises me how intelligent
>people can make ignorant comments."
>
>Assuming you are talking about my
>first response. my purpose for
>making the statement was reached.(ignorant
>statements call for ignorant responses.)
>But I'm curious as why
>you think it was
>"ignorant?"
"But anyway, African Americans collectively are the richest group of Africans in the world. And look at you. Look at your neighborhoods. Look at your ATTITUDES!!! Why should ANY Afrakan from anywhere respect African Americans?"
That last rhetoric question ticked me off. And the first one undermines the fact that they are the poorest group in America. Something that needs to be chamged.

>
>Hey I thought it was funny.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>PEace
>Solarus
>
>***Words of Wisdom***
>
>"Every time you rise from your
>sleeping state, you have been
>reincarnated. Every time you recover
>from a bad experience, you
>have been reincarnated. Every time
>you have been given a
>new lease on life, you
>have been reincarnated. Every time
>you breath in and out,
>take in the fresh breath
>of life and feel the
>divine intelligence flowing in and
>around you, you have been
>reincarnated."- Mfundishi Bakari
>
>On "love":
>
>"I am in love everyday, whether
>I am with someone or
>not. Why? All love is
>based on a search for
>spirit. For me love is
>timeless, transcendent, peaceful, freeing, soul-based,
>unifying, and enhanced evolution. This
>is the basis of my
>activism."- Nettrice, the embodiment of
>Oshun
>
>"Since we all make up the
>rules as we go along,
>love can mean many different
>things to many different people.
>But, for me love is
>a total commitment to understanding
>that is not limited to
>just people but is open
>to the totality of life.
>As long as we approach
>love from a fear based
>mentality and perceive it through
>veils of guardedness and anxiety,
>it will always be restricted
>by our fears."- Mfundishi Bakari
>


SIGNATURE STARTS YONDER
"I'm not looking...forward to seeing
him"- Snoop on Suge's release.
understatement of the year
**************************
NE LOVE/ LOVE
(THE HICE IS URS)
**************************
The emoticon as 'O' symbol is a
registered trademark of dafriquan.
No biting without written permission.
*************************

RIP JDILLA
THE ILLEST THAT EVER DID IT

  

Printer-friendly copy | Top

                                        
Solarus
Charter member
3604 posts
Sat Jul-14-01 04:30 AM

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71. "OK"
In response to Reply # 69


  

          

HTP

""But anyway, African Americans collectively are the richest group of Africans in the world. And look at you. Look at your neighborhoods. Look at your ATTITUDES!!! Why should ANY Afrakan from anywhere respect African Americans?"
That last rhetoric question ticked me off. And the first one undermines the fact that they are the poorest group in America. Something that needs to be chamged."

It was part of the attitude I was assuming. Every now and then I will make statements that can be challenged to see if the person that I'm responding too can argue the their point intelligently and poignantly. Dyskotek made several "ignorant" statements throughout his post and when he said, "Africans don't like Americans," I was "inspired" to challenge him. I was assuming the role of an continental African/West Indian (who would say that they don't like African Americans) in order make Dyskotek think critically about his ideas/comments.

The word "richest" wasn't so much "ignorant" as it was "misleading" for the very reason that you pointed out. However the fact remains is that collectively African Americans have more "spending power" than any other group of Afrikans in the world. However within the system of capitalism, technically, "spending power" does not define what "rich" is. Being "rich" is define by one's "wealth" and/or "assets" something that African Americans are severely lacking.

PEace
Solarus

***Words of Wisdom***

"Every time you rise from your sleeping state, you have been reincarnated. Every time you recover from a bad experience, you have been reincarnated. Every time you have been given a new lease on life, you have been reincarnated. Every time you breath in and out, take in the fresh breath of life and feel the divine intelligence flowing in and around you, you have been reincarnated."- Mfundishi Bakari

On "love":

"I am in love everyday, whether I am with someone or not. Why? All love is based on a search for spirit. For me love is timeless, transcendent, peaceful, freeing, soul-based, unifying, and enhanced evolution. This is the basis of my activism."- Nettrice, the embodiment of Oshun

"Since we all make up the rules as we go along, love can mean many different things to many different people. But, for me love is a total commitment to understanding that is not limited to just people but is open to the totality of life. As long as we approach love from a fear based mentality and perceive it through veils of guardedness and anxiety, it will always be restricted by our fears."- Mfundishi Bakari

____________________________
"the real pyramids were built with such precision that you can't slide a piece of paper between two 4,000 lb stones, and have shafts perfectly aligned so that you can see a tiny aperture through dozens of these mammoth blocks

  

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dafriquan
Charter member
24695 posts
Mon Jul-16-01 05:02 AM

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72. "understood n/m"
In response to Reply # 71


  

          

SIGNATURE STARTS YONDER
"I'm not looking...forward to seeing
him"- Snoop on Suge's release.
understatement of the year
**************************
NE LOVE/ LOVE
(THE HICE IS URS)
**************************
The emoticon as 'O' symbol is a
registered trademark of dafriquan.
No biting without written permission.
*************************

RIP JDILLA
THE ILLEST THAT EVER DID IT

  

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rhulah
Charter member
4409 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 02:02 AM

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29. "RE: What's there to like about"
In response to Reply # 14


          

>African Americans? Next time I
>here one of you colored
>cry this sentiment...
>
>But anyway, African Americans collectively are
>the richest group of Africans
>in the world. And
>look at you. Look
>at your neighborhoods. Look at
>your ATTITUDES!!! Why should ANY
>Afrakan from anywhere respect African
>Americans?
>
>I'm listening...
>
>
>PEace
>Solarus
>
>***Words of Wisdom***
>
>"Every time you rise from your
>sleeping state, you have been
>reincarnated. Every time you recover
>from a bad experience, you
>have been reincarnated. Every time
>you have been given a
>new lease on life, you
>have been reincarnated. Every time
>you breath in and out,
>take in the fresh breath
>of life and feel the
>divine intelligence flowing in and
>around you, you have been
>reincarnated."- Mfundishi Bakari
>
>On "love":
>
>"I am in love everyday, whether
>I am with someone or
>not. Why? All love is
>based on a search for
>spirit. For me love is
>timeless, transcendent, peaceful, freeing, soul-based,
>unifying, and enhanced evolution. This
>is the basis of my
>activism."- Nettrice, the embodiment of
>Oshun
>
>"Since we all make up the
>rules as we go along,
>love can mean many different
>things to many different people.
>But, for me love is
>a total commitment to understanding
>that is not limited to
>just people but is open
>to the totality of life.
>As long as we approach
>love from a fear based
>mentality and perceive it through
>veils of guardedness and anxiety,
>it will always be restricted
>by our fears."- Mfundishi Bakari
>





Solarus.....that's precisely what I'm talking about!!

Why should any human being on this small planet, "RESPECT" Afrikan Americans.

You don't educate your own children.
You don't create or control your own wealth.
You don't control your own schools.
You don't grow you own foods.
You don't control or create your own institutions.
You don't have control over politics.
You don't know your original languages.
You don't or haven't even begun (some of us have)to write our own history.
You don't produce goods and services(in masses)for the benefit of all Afrikan/blacks(just mankind period).
You don't your own clothes(FUBU isn't stiched together in Queens, NY)
You don't even control the "beauty products" black people use daily to hide their "natural beauty". I got "statistics" on this.


Fuck it!! You don't even control your own THINKING!! Don't use the Creator as an excuse(well, God speaks through me!!), so that gives you a sign to act and say "FOOLISH" things.


Negroes don't deserve RESPECT.



Black people, wake the FUCK up!

  

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Dyskotek

Wed Jul-11-01 07:18 AM

  
44. "Solarus and Rhulah...."
In response to Reply # 29


          





>>African Americans? Next time I


>>here one of you colored

First of all check you effin mouth. Watch what you call me.

>>cry this sentiment...
>>
>>But anyway, African Americans collectively are
>>the richest group of Africans
>>in the world.

Rich compared to what?!?!? Do you mean we dont live in shanty towns?

And
>>look at you. Look
>>at your neighborhoods. Look at
>>your ATTITUDES!!! Why should ANY
>>Afrakan from anywhere respect African
>>Americans?

African Americans like any people are a product of their enviornment. Black people were given crappy jobs, sub standard education, and a crack epidemic and told to compete with the rest of the world. This is not to say that African Americans CANT succed, cause thousands do. Only recently has steps been made to rectify the state of blacks in America. We were given a loaded deck, and invited to play with card sharks....c'mon now...
>>
>>I'm listening...
>>
>>
>>PEace
>
>
>
>
>Solarus.....that's precisely what I'm talking about!!
>
>
>Why should any human being on
>this small planet, "RESPECT" Afrikan
>Americans.
>
>You don't educate your own children.
>
>You don't create or control your
>own wealth.
>You don't control your own schools.
>
>You don't grow you own foods.
>
>You don't control or create your
>own institutions.
>You don't have control over politics.
>
>You don't know your original languages.
>
>You don't or haven't even begun
>(some of us have)to write
>our own history.
>You don't produce goods and services(in
>masses)for the benefit of all
>Afrikan/blacks(just mankind period).
>You don't your own clothes(FUBU isn't
>stiched together in Queens, NY)
>
>You don't even control the "beauty
>products" black people use daily
>to hide their "natural beauty".
>I got "statistics" on this.
>
>
>
>Fuck it!! You don't even control
>your own THINKING!! Don't use
>the Creator as an excuse(well,
>God speaks through me!!), so
>that gives you a sign
>to act and say "FOOLISH"
>things.
>
>
>Negroes don't deserve RESPECT.
>
>
>
>Black people, wake the FUCK up!


Read my reply above.


You know what, i cant respect either one of you (i mean that from the bottom of my heart), coming to these boards with such ignorant and uneducated statments. Both of you need to study African American history much closer before you insult me like that again. X(....
>



  

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Solarus
Charter member
3604 posts
Thu Jul-12-01 08:09 AM

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59. "Especially for you"
In response to Reply # 44


  

          

See here:
http://www.okayplayer.com/dcforum/DCForumID1/3300.html#57

sidenote: it's interesting that you find using "colored" disrespected but "nigga" not...

____________________________
"the real pyramids were built with such precision that you can't slide a piece of paper between two 4,000 lb stones, and have shafts perfectly aligned so that you can see a tiny aperture through dozens of these mammoth blocks

  

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rhulah
Charter member
4409 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 02:06 AM

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30. "RE: What's there to like about"
In response to Reply # 14


          

>African Americans? Next time I
>here one of you colored
>cry this sentiment...
>
>But anyway, African Americans collectively are
>the richest group of Africans
>in the world. And
>look at you. Look
>at your neighborhoods. Look at
>your ATTITUDES!!! Why should ANY
>Afrakan from anywhere respect African
>Americans?
>
>I'm listening...
>
>
>PEace
>Solarus
>
>***Words of Wisdom***
>
>"Every time you rise from your
>sleeping state, you have been
>reincarnated. Every time you recover
>from a bad experience, you
>have been reincarnated. Every time
>you have been given a
>new lease on life, you
>have been reincarnated. Every time
>you breath in and out,
>take in the fresh breath
>of life and feel the
>divine intelligence flowing in and
>around you, you have been
>reincarnated."- Mfundishi Bakari
>
>On "love":
>
>"I am in love everyday, whether
>I am with someone or
>not. Why? All love is
>based on a search for
>spirit. For me love is
>timeless, transcendent, peaceful, freeing, soul-based,
>unifying, and enhanced evolution. This
>is the basis of my
>activism."- Nettrice, the embodiment of
>Oshun
>
>"Since we all make up the
>rules as we go along,
>love can mean many different
>things to many different people.
>But, for me love is
>a total commitment to understanding
>that is not limited to
>just people but is open
>to the totality of life.
>As long as we approach
>love from a fear based
>mentality and perceive it through
>veils of guardedness and anxiety,
>it will always be restricted
>by our fears."- Mfundishi Bakari
>












What the fuck!!!

GARVEY saw it!
NKRUMAH saw it!
PATRICE LUMUMBA saw it!
CARLOS COOKS saw it!
NYERE saw it!
ELIJAH MUHAMMAD saw it!
KWAMW TURE' saw it!



Why can't ya'll negroes see it??????

  

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5th
Charter member
32 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 04:21 AM

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33. "Excuse me for being a little dumb..."
In response to Reply # 30


          

...but what exactly are YOU saying?

Emotion is a great motivator to saying things like WTF this and Fuck that et al. At the end of the day, what are you saying to the board-readers with your post rhulah? Great views on what African Americans are'nt doing and dont have. Have you stopped to consider WHY the situation is so.

Do that first. Look up earlier threads & see WHY African Americans are so disadvantaged. Apart from that, we're not discussing who respects who/why.

Does anyone have opinions on what Africa/Africans/African leaders/African Americans can do to HELP THEMSELVES??

I'm of a strong opinion that if Africa is to ever provide for it's people the kind of infrastructure, social & health services, education, overall development, it has to do many things at different levels.

Among them (& in no particular order):

-Set correct priorities on how govt budgets are allocated. Emphasis should be placed on education. Not just to build more schools, but to staff them well & keep teachers teaching. More higher learning institutions with world-class academia. Only through teaching recurrent generations can a level of active conciousness develop within the population. Our people are still sleeping on this global economy!

-Stimulate an entrepreneurial spirit among the people. Entrepreneurs create jobs, not governments. Governments merely facilitate this phenomenon by creating an environment that supports entrepreneurial efforts. Not all will succeed but those who do will probably succeed through utilizing the strengths of the country in question, thus developing it. It may be minerals, cheap labour & manufacturing (as was the case with most of Asia), education leading to specialization in a particular sector (as is the case with India and some Eastern european states in the software programming industry) etc etc.

-Unity and a shared vision among African states. Strength lies in numbers.

-Control of the continents resources and wealth. Directing the income from these resources back into the continent. Not into Swiss bank accounts & fleets of Mercedes Benzes to pacify govt officials. Implementing this point alone will enable everything else to be realized.

-Stop govt. reliance on foreign aid.

If this is OkayActivist, then the question in our minds should be "What can you and I do?"

For starters, actively support efforts to cut 3rd world debt. Their success will create the opportunity Africa needs to achieve all the above.

I'm sure there are many more ppl with opinions on this. Let consctuctive discussion resume.



:The foundation is set. Time to bring in the brick layers. -Kam

  

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chandra

Wed Jul-11-01 05:43 AM

  
37. "RE: Excuse me for being a little dumb..."
In response to Reply # 33


          

I agree with you 5th. It's pass time for us to stop pointing the finger at one and other, and make some changes within our own selves. Life is toooooo short for all this squabbling.





pixel pushers for life!!!!

  

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sistasoul
Charter member
876 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 05:45 AM

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38. "RE: What's there to like about"
In response to Reply # 14


  

          



Let me start by saying that I am not necessarily writing this post in defense of African Americans, I am merely writing it to expose another facet of the argument. I think its unfair to say that Africans shouldn't and have no logical reason to have "respect" for African Americans. First of all, that is the problem. We, blacks in the diaspora, need to stop inventing reasons to not like or disagree with one another. To put it plain and simple, we are all AFricans. We all came, at some point, from the continent, regardless of where we may live now. Yes, our cultures our different, and yes our beliefs may not match, but we share a bond that is much stronger than that. It pains me to see the disdain and apparent disgust which Africans show towards Africans in America. I agree, that as a group, we are the richest Africans living in the world. I believe someone said something to the effect of "look at your neighborhoods, look at your attitude..." and another person said "you can't even educate your own children, you don't have control over your politics, you don't create your own institutions, etc, etc." Well these facts may be true. No, fuck it, they are true. I do believe that to say Africans in America have lost their initiative, and become blinded by the society in which they live is unquestionable. To say that we have lost sight of the principles which our ancestors lived by would not be far from the truth. But look deeper than that. What is the reason? Did we just one day decide to be greedy, and selfish, and materialistic? I think not. We have become products of this American society. A societies whose goal, since they brought us here, was to strip away any link we had to our homeland. Our religion, spirituality, rituals, ancestry, everything was taken away. So it is only logical that our way of thinking would be vastly different from those Africans actually living in Africa. The fault cannot be totally placed on African Americans, but cannot be totally placed on American society.

What I'm trying to say is, that regardless of what differences we have, we are all connected. I know people from Nigeria, and other West African countries that hold more disdain for African Americans than they do for Europeans. I don't mean to sound preachy, but these separations and divisions are making it impossible for us to ever unite. Maybe Africans don't want to unite with AFricans in the diaspora, but I do. And many African Americans do. If we were to unite, the force of our bond would be strong enough to break through even the strongest oppressors iron hand. But we can't do that if we keep breaking each other down. Feel me?



~Peace







"I'm an African, never was an African American..."- Dead Prez

~~~~~~welcome to my sig~~~~~~~

"Perilous to us all are the devices of an art deeper than we possess ourselves."- Gandalf, 'The Two Towers'

"...the doper that I get the more I'm feeling broke as shit..."- Dre 3000

  

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guerilla_love
Charter member
8273 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 06:32 AM

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43. "that's very true"
In response to Reply # 38


          

the reason why i didn't say that was because i believe that his comments were directed at african americans



==**peace**==

"baby,
I'd draw yuh bath
like Picasso..

pick you,
like fruit
off yuh family tree. &
eatcha' honeydew ass,
wet"

-Giovanni, rhythmic poet extraordinaire

i believe in education and empowerment through art. i believe that movements happen when ideas are set to music. bodies and people come together through dance and movement, eyes awaken in the face of a good movie, and whatever ya gotta say is useless unless you can use these tools to reach right into people

"The logic of divide and rule is still valid today." Capleton

DomePoem Poets; Vibe Nation; One ppl under the spoken word

.....

"Who need fossil fuel when the sun ain't goin' nowhere"
- Amiri Baraka

http://www.okayplayer.com/guidelines

BUY MY BOOK- only $6! Inbox me for details

  

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LexM
Charter member
28342 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 04:10 AM

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32. "check this site:"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

http://www.africanhiphop.com

some good shit on there.




~~~SPITFIRE: AUGUST 23, 2001~~~
HipHop. Old school style. In Full Effect. Want Info? Email: carameldom@hotmail.com

"to get inside this head of mine/would take a monkey wrench/and a lot of wine" ~~Res

~~~~
http://omidele.blogspot.com/
http://rahareiki.tumblr.com/
http://seatofbliss.blogspot.com/

  

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Federisco
Charter member
5002 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 05:13 AM

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35. "RE: check this site:"
In response to Reply # 32


  

          

Oh what a site.. thank you!
check this site: http://www.africanhiphop.com/

░▒▓█▌♥▐█▓▒░

proud okayphotographer: http://www.okayplayer.com/okayphotographers/

"Most of our assumptions have outlived their uselessness." Marshall McLuhan

  

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chandra

Wed Jul-11-01 05:22 AM

  
36. "RE: Is Hip Hop for Africa??? for Africans"
In response to Reply # 0


          

IS Hip Hop for Africans?

  

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k_orr
Charter member
80197 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 06:08 AM

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39. "No"
In response to Reply # 36


  

          

it's for black folks. If it reaches others, fine. But it wasn't made with them in mind, nor do they have the cultural experience of living in the states to draw from.

k. orr

http://breddanansi.tumblr.com/

  

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Federisco
Charter member
5002 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 06:16 AM

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40. "RE: No"
In response to Reply # 39


  

          

No, an mc outside usa (be it taiwan, swaziland or holland) cant use what the mcs you find in usa use. If they do, they are faking. But they use what they themselves can relate to.. can't you see the big picture??!

Hiphop is global.. grafitti artists are all over south africa, little boys in chile becomes b-boys, hiphop is used to fight any cause you can imagine..!!

░▒▓█▌♥▐█▓▒░

proud okayphotographer: http://www.okayplayer.com/okayphotographers/

"Most of our assumptions have outlived their uselessness." Marshall McLuhan

  

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k_orr
Charter member
80197 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 07:53 AM

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46. "it's not basketball"
In response to Reply # 40


  

          

it's cultural expression. But you ain't hearing me.

peace
k. orr

http://breddanansi.tumblr.com/

  

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Federisco
Charter member
5002 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 09:49 AM

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48. "i am sorry"
In response to Reply # 46


  

          

I don't think i understood what you meant, still dont totally. Hiphop was started by blacks, is mostly for blacks, and i am very glad you said you don't mind others enjoy it. But do you say those not black can't make hiphop?

It's become the voice of those who can't voice their opinions, at least international hiphop. But i start to feel that your hiphop is one thing (from the roots, common, mos def to ice cube, tupac, nwa), but international hiphop is different. More underground and not representing a specific group (in usa it represent blacks, even if far from all blacks like it).

I try to respect hiphop as much as possible.. heck, i only listened to Mos Def's "Black on both sides" once... i was afraid to become too wannabee (many dream they want to be black, so that they can "suffer like the gangsters do". i understand you dont want that). I am almost too paranoid, on the common concert i went to he had the crowd go "we be dat.... afrodeziac".. i started wondering if i should sing along, isnt afrodeziac something very black?.. i sang, but not loud! and it confused me.

(still havent made up my mind if i should or should not.)

░▒▓█▌♥▐█▓▒░

proud okayphotographer: http://www.okayplayer.com/okayphotographers/

"Most of our assumptions have outlived their uselessness." Marshall McLuhan

  

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earthsista
Charter member
4408 posts
Fri Jul-13-01 10:33 AM

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70. "Um"
In response to Reply # 48


          

>>
>(still havent made up my mind
>if i should or should
>not.)

Just be who you ar it's the easiest thing to do


~sig~
When ppl show you who they are- BELIEVE them. ~Maya Angelou

  

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nahymsa
Charter member
1734 posts
Fri Jul-13-01 07:34 AM

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68. "Africans aren't black folks?"
In response to Reply # 39


          

Some would beg to differ.



C'mon how you gonna diss the ?uestion like that, of course he wasn't a Fat Boy. Now previous to Roots life, Quest did appear on television. He played Shirley on "What's Happenin?" - fxsnyc 6/19/01

  

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jboogiebrown

Wed Jul-11-01 07:28 AM

  
45. "RE: Is Hip Hop for Africa??? for Africans"
In response to Reply # 0


          

all i can say is, "right on brother." question; what's the Mobutu-CIA connection? I heard that term a long time ago, but back then i was 'blissfully ignorant'. Bomb me sun.....

  

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dafriquan
Charter member
24695 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 12:27 PM

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49. "Solarus is not even real"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

notice how he disappears from the rest of the post...it's just some dude waiting to start something...lol...probably not even black.
SIGNATURE STARTS YONDER
"I'm not looking...forward to seeing
him"- Snoop on Suge's release.
understatement of the year
**************************
NE LOVE/ LOVE
(THE HICE IS URS)
**************************
The emoticon as 'O' symbol is a
registered trademark of dafriquan.
No biting without written permission.
*************************

RIP JDILLA
THE ILLEST THAT EVER DID IT

  

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TheSauce
Charter member
1721 posts
Wed Jul-11-01 05:46 PM

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52. "Naw"
In response to Reply # 49


          

he's real mane. He's utamahoro (sp? too lazy to look it up) brother or some shit & he's posted some good ish before.

Just thought I'd throw that in there . . .

Giving you true Calcio since 1986

  

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Dyskotek

Thu Jul-12-01 02:15 AM

  
53. "RE: Naw"
In response to Reply # 52


          

>he's real mane. He's utamahoro (sp?
>too lazy to look it
>up) brother or some shit
>& he's posted some good
>ish before.

He showed his ass this time....

  

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Solarus
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3604 posts
Thu Jul-12-01 08:05 AM

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58. "As "real" as they come"
In response to Reply # 49


  

          

See here:

http://www.okayplayer.com/dcforum/DCForumID1/3300.html#57

____________________________
"the real pyramids were built with such precision that you can't slide a piece of paper between two 4,000 lb stones, and have shafts perfectly aligned so that you can see a tiny aperture through dozens of these mammoth blocks

  

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dafriquan
Charter member
24695 posts
Thu Jul-12-01 10:48 AM

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61. "okay but"
In response to Reply # 58


  

          

that was pretty ignorant for "real" poster to say. that's the kind i would expect from people who post under fake names(instead of their established okpname) or don't plan on being around okayplayer for long.
cut down on the ignorance. personally i wouldn't post something that i would hesitate to say in public...or maybe you're just all round ignorant?

SIGNATURE STARTS YONDER
"I'm not looking...forward to seeing
him"- Snoop on Suge's release.
understatement of the year
**************************
NE LOVE/ LOVE
(THE HICE IS URS)
**************************
The emoticon as 'O' symbol is a
registered trademark of dafriquan.
No biting without written permission.
*************************

RIP JDILLA
THE ILLEST THAT EVER DID IT

  

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utamaroho

Thu Jul-12-01 10:58 AM

  
62. "Listen to the Ancestors..."
In response to Reply # 58


          

...and don't waste your time with this cat. let go.

from Ptah Hotep (3500 BCE KMT):

If you encounter a disputant in action
Who is an equal to you, your peer,
You will cause your excellence to surpass him by SILENCE,
when he is speaking wrongly.

Great is the discussion among the Hearers,
Your name is good in the estimation of the Great Ones.

HERE'S THE HIEROGLYPHS FOR IT:
http://members.aol.com/mwhealton/pthp4.gif



  

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UrbanCowgRRL
Charter member
8764 posts
Mon Jul-16-01 08:15 AM

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73. "hip hop is"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

the number one export of america

hip hop culture

they're making millions off black youth culture

and how is this helping black youths that created hip hop?

exactly.

Much love,
Kyle

"how bout i take your hip hop self and stick my hip hop foot, up your hip hop ass" ~ one man army freestyle in Detroit


go vote for me, cause i'm extreme and deserve to be on TV..
http://bluetorch.tv/host/voteforme.asp?id=41472

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much love,
Kyle

Detroit..Let's GO!!! May 12th Dilla Walk for Lupus...Belle Isle...

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Even a Dollar can HELP..


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Federisco
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Mon Jul-16-01 10:23 AM

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74. "RE: hip hop is"
In response to Reply # 73


  

          

I get a feeling that most commercial rappers pretend they are the #1 export article of usa, to make them seem bigger. Entertainment is the #1 export article, and hiphop is a big part of it.

Is Seinfield hiphop!? nah..

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