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Subject: "Reagan is dead? RIP." This topic is locked.
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FireBrand
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145739 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 08:33 AM

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"Reagan is dead? RIP."


  

          

wow.

holla.

Avatar? ...yup 'nother one.



___________________________

"Niggaz got it bad." --



"I'm not feeling it" --

"Afrika is our center of gravity, our cultural and spiritual mother and father, our beating heart, no matter where we live on the face of this earth." -- Baba John Henrik Clarke.

www.ayaed.com

"Slaves got options...cowards aint got shit." --PS
"Once upon a time, little need existed for making the distinction between a nigga and a black—at least not in this country, the place where niggas were invented" -- Donnell A

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
oh my bad...he has. (edit)
Jun 05th 2004
1
he's dead now..
Jun 05th 2004
2
I honestly don't have a hate or a like for his policy
Jun 05th 2004
3
RE: I honestly don't have a hate or a like for his poli
Jun 07th 2004
63
R.I.P.
Jun 05th 2004
4
And in other news...
Jun 05th 2004
31
      he ......
Jun 05th 2004
37
oh yeah?!
Jun 05th 2004
5
I'm so Sad.........................NOT
Jun 05th 2004
6
Let's all breath deep, and...
Jun 05th 2004
7
you guys are so sad.
Jun 05th 2004
8
We say the same about you, sheep.
Jun 05th 2004
14
Why? No disprespect was intended...
Jun 05th 2004
15
      because...
Jun 05th 2004
22
      Oh PLEASE!
Jun 05th 2004
28
           *yawns*
Jun 05th 2004
30
           Sorry about the tangent.
Jun 05th 2004
32
           The war on Drugs...
Jun 06th 2004
52
                Yeah.....
Jun 07th 2004
62
                     RE: Yeah.....
Jun 08th 2004
73
                          RE: Yeah.....
Jun 08th 2004
74
      RE: Why? No disprespect was intended...
Jun 05th 2004
25
I was actually wondering if they pulled his plug
Jun 05th 2004
9
RE: Let's all breath deep, and...
Jun 05th 2004
13
MY GOODNESS.
Jun 05th 2004
29
      The fuck are you talking about?
Jun 05th 2004
33
           RE: The fuck are you talking about?
Jun 07th 2004
55
The Cubs won and Reagan's dead, who wants lunch?
Jun 05th 2004
10
haha............I'm down for lunch
Jun 05th 2004
11
Can we get falafel? I LIKE falafel.
Jun 05th 2004
17
ronald reagan memorial fund
Jun 05th 2004
12
Will it pay back the $3 trillion debt he created?
Jun 05th 2004
18
      RE: Will it pay back the $3 trillion debt he created?
Jun 05th 2004
27
I feel bad for his family.
Jun 05th 2004
16
RE: I feel bad for his family.
Jun 05th 2004
36
      RE: I feel bad for his family.
Jun 05th 2004
38
           Reagan support some of the most
Jun 05th 2004
40
           Word, Reagan was just sleazy...
Jun 06th 2004
51
           RE: I feel bad for his family.
Jun 07th 2004
64
Man.
Jun 05th 2004
19
Oh, Bush'll be there alright...
Jun 05th 2004
20
      It's RIGHT by my work and my homie's house.
Jun 05th 2004
21
           Feh. Next time you think of 'respect' & Reagan...
Jun 05th 2004
23
                Well...Regan IS dead...
Jun 05th 2004
26
question
Jun 05th 2004
24
he was a damn good actor.
Jun 05th 2004
34
In the White House, maybe.
Jun 05th 2004
35
Bonzo murdered him on his own Shit!
Jun 05th 2004
44
POP THE CHAMPAGNE!
Jun 05th 2004
39
I was thinkin the same thing
Jun 07th 2004
56
Slap me some skins kid!!
Jun 07th 2004
57
      Oh Yeah!!!!
Jun 07th 2004
58
RE: POP THE CHAMPAGNE!
Jun 07th 2004
65
fuck ronald
Jun 05th 2004
41
RE: fuck ronald...co-sign.
Jun 05th 2004
49
When single femal parents become "welfare queens".
Jun 05th 2004
42
A patheitc liar.
Jun 05th 2004
43
The only liar is you.
Jun 09th 2004
81
      RE: The only liar is you.
Jun 11th 2004
83
      Read & comprehend better.
Jun 11th 2004
84
      The lies of Sexpertise.
Jun 11th 2004
87
           *LOL* aiight...so lemme get this straight.
Jun 11th 2004
88
                You are a stone cold dumbass.
Jun 12th 2004
90
                You're really funny, Ho.
Jun 12th 2004
93
                     RE: You're really funny, Thomas.
Jun 13th 2004
94
                          Citation of sources.
Jun 13th 2004
96
                          Who was funding the airport?
Jun 13th 2004
99
                          An assessment of medical student's status.
Jun 13th 2004
100
                          RE: An assessment of medical student's status.
Jun 14th 2004
106
                          RE: An assessment of medical student's status.
Jun 14th 2004
108
                          Reagan's numerous & false claims for invasion.
Jun 13th 2004
101
                          Grenada, a Soviet satallite? LOL!!!
Jun 13th 2004
102
                          Reagan censors the media.
Jun 13th 2004
103
                               RE: Reagan censors the media.
Jun 13th 2004
105
                               RE: Reagan censors the media.
Jun 14th 2004
107
                RE: *LOL* aiight...so lemme get this straight.
Jun 12th 2004
92
Just another dead trend from the 80s...
Jun 05th 2004
45
RE: Just another dead trend from the 80s...
Jun 12th 2004
91
ok....any one up for dancing on his grave? ............
Jun 05th 2004
46
Moonwalks
Jun 06th 2004
53
LOL!
Jun 13th 2004
95
Fuck Ronald Reagan.
Jun 05th 2004
47
RE: Fuck Ronald Reagan.
Jun 08th 2004
70
You do realize, folks
Jun 05th 2004
48
Don't forget
Jun 07th 2004
61
if theres a hell
Jun 05th 2004
50
Can't find it in my heart to lament.....
Jun 07th 2004
54
I wish I would....
Jun 08th 2004
75
      i was tellin my mom that the other day
Jun 08th 2004
76
RE: Reagan is dead? RIP.
Jun 07th 2004
59
HE LIVED TO BE 93 BY DRINKING VIRGIN BLOOD!!!!
Jun 07th 2004
60
Were cruel?
Jun 07th 2004
66
Exactly.
Jun 13th 2004
97
RE: Reagan is dead? RIP.
Jun 07th 2004
67
RE: I understand all of that...
Jun 08th 2004
71
Um, Ford isn't dead.
Jun 08th 2004
72
Get over it.
Jun 13th 2004
104
In 1980
Jun 07th 2004
68
OMGosh!!!
Jun 09th 2004
77
Wow,
Jun 11th 2004
82
that's like me in 1991
Jun 11th 2004
86
Funny...
Jun 08th 2004
69
fired the air traffic controllers...
Jun 09th 2004
78
Critics Question Reagan Legacy........
Jun 09th 2004
79
RE: Reagan is dead? RIP.
Jun 09th 2004
80
Well stated.
Jun 13th 2004
98
excellent article
Jun 11th 2004
85
TEAR DOWN THESE WALLS OF OPPRESSION..........
Jun 11th 2004
89

Expertise
Charter member
37848 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 08:37 AM

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1. "oh my bad...he has. (edit)"
In response to Reply # 0
Sat Jun-05-04 08:42 AM

  

          

But they are expecting it to be sometime between now and Wednesday.
__________________________
"Some say that by fighting the terrorists abroad since September the 11th, we only stir up a hornets' nest. But the terrorists who struck that day were stirred up already.

If America were not fighting terrorists in Iraq and Afghanistan and elsewhere, what would these thousands of killers do? Suddenly begin leading productive lives of service and charity? Would the terrorists who beheaded an American on camera just be quiet, peaceful citizens, if America had not liberated Iraq?

We're dealing here with killers who have made the death of Americans the calling of their lives, and America has made a decision about these terrorists. Instead of waiting for them to strike again in our midst, we will take the fight to the enemy."

- President George Walker Bush, June 2nd, 2004.

_________________________
http://expertise.blogdrive.com
http://twitter.com/KMBReferee
http://www.ask.fm/KMBReferee

  

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My_SP1200_Broken_Again
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56891 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 08:42 AM

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2. "he's dead now.."
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

.

< Live Mixshow - Thurs 10PM/EST >
https://twitch.tv/djchiefone

----Mixtape Archives-----
https://soundcloud.com/djchiefone

  

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FireBrand
Charter member
145739 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 08:43 AM

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3. "I honestly don't have a hate or a like for his policy"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

As much as I hated him- I liked him. (as far as policy goes)

eh...I guess that's how I am with all the presidents...cept for JR.


Avatar? ...yup 'nother one.



___________________________

"Niggaz got it bad." --



"I'm not feeling it" --

"Afrika is our center of gravity, our cultural and spiritual mother and father, our beating heart, no matter where we live on the face of this earth." -- Baba John Henrik Clarke.

www.ayaed.com

"Slaves got options...cowards aint got shit." --PS
"Once upon a time, little need existed for making the distinction between a nigga and a black—at least not in this country, the place where niggas were invented" -- Donnell A

  

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RaAmen
Charter member
482 posts
Mon Jun-07-04 10:08 AM

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63. "RE: I honestly don't have a hate or a like for his poli"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

What? Either I'm not understanding what your saying/mean or I'm suprised at your response......




My Rotate Solidify:

1. RBG: Revolutionary but Gangsta
-Dead Prez

2. Immortal Technique-Revolutionary Vol. 2.

3. The Tipping Point
-The Roots

4. Beautiful Struggle
-Talib Kweli


The history of contact between the white and black

  

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Monique
Charter member
2511 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 08:51 AM

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4. "R.I.P."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

condolances for the family.
A friend and I have been waiting on the final call.


***********************************************************
NELLY: I'm Humble In Life Taking Nothing For Granted

AFRICA: www.bbcnews.com

THE BROKER: John Grisham

  

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Battousai
Charter member
4386 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:47 AM

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31. "And in other news..."
In response to Reply # 4


          

Ireland beat the Netherlands in an international friendly 1-0, with Robbie Keanse scoring the winning goal for Ireland.

--

Your San Francisco Giants: 4.26.2005 - 8.15.2005.

  

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Monique
Charter member
2511 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 10:36 AM

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37. "he ......"
In response to Reply # 31


  

          


>Ireland beat the Netherlands in an international friendly
>1-0, with Robbie Keanse scoring the winning goal for
>Ireland.

HE GONNA DOMINATE THE NEWS, WON"T BE NO OTHER NEWS TIL...???

***********************************************************
NELLY: I'm Humble In Life Taking Nothing For Granted

AFRICA: www.bbcnews.com

THE BROKER: John Grisham

  

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Delete me
Member since Aug 27th 2002
8611 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 08:51 AM

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5. "oh yeah?!"
In response to Reply # 0
Sat Jun-05-04 08:52 AM

          

...

  

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G_Smooth
Member since Oct 07th 2003
4109 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 08:58 AM

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6. "I'm so Sad.........................NOT"
In response to Reply # 0


          

n/m.

  

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dhalgren718
Member since Jun 20th 2002
16992 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:01 AM

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7. "Let's all breath deep, and..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

... watch Bush's approval ratings start climbing. Was talking to some dude on Kerry's campaign staff about this theory.

http://50yearsfromnow.blogspot.com
MONGO IS A RACIST PIECE OF SHIT.

  

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Expertise
Charter member
37848 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:04 AM

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8. "you guys are so sad."
In response to Reply # 7


  

          

__________________________
"Some say that by fighting the terrorists abroad since September the 11th, we only stir up a hornets' nest. But the terrorists who struck that day were stirred up already.

If America were not fighting terrorists in Iraq and Afghanistan and elsewhere, what would these thousands of killers do? Suddenly begin leading productive lives of service and charity? Would the terrorists who beheaded an American on camera just be quiet, peaceful citizens, if America had not liberated Iraq?

We're dealing here with killers who have made the death of Americans the calling of their lives, and America has made a decision about these terrorists. Instead of waiting for them to strike again in our midst, we will take the fight to the enemy."

- President George Walker Bush, June 2nd, 2004.

_________________________
http://expertise.blogdrive.com
http://twitter.com/KMBReferee
http://www.ask.fm/KMBReferee

  

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Ryan M
Member since Oct 21st 2002
42444 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:14 AM

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14. "We say the same about you, sheep."
In response to Reply # 8


  

          


------------------------------

17x NBA Champions

  

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dhalgren718
Member since Jun 20th 2002
16992 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:15 AM

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15. "Why? No disprespect was intended..."
In response to Reply # 8


  

          

Although I'm STILL trying to figure out what the fuck the 'Reagan Legacy' was exactly...

But that's a whole 'nother thread.

Why is this observation sad?

http://50yearsfromnow.blogspot.com
MONGO IS A RACIST PIECE OF SHIT.

  

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Expertise
Charter member
37848 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:26 AM

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22. "because..."
In response to Reply # 15


  

          

A former president is dead, and all you guys can think of is how it will help or hurt your candidate.

Like I said, it's quite sad.
__________________________
"Some say that by fighting the terrorists abroad since September the 11th, we only stir up a hornets' nest. But the terrorists who struck that day were stirred up already.

If America were not fighting terrorists in Iraq and Afghanistan and elsewhere, what would these thousands of killers do? Suddenly begin leading productive lives of service and charity? Would the terrorists who beheaded an American on camera just be quiet, peaceful citizens, if America had not liberated Iraq?

We're dealing here with killers who have made the death of Americans the calling of their lives, and America has made a decision about these terrorists. Instead of waiting for them to strike again in our midst, we will take the fight to the enemy."

- President George Walker Bush, June 2nd, 2004.

_________________________
http://expertise.blogdrive.com
http://twitter.com/KMBReferee
http://www.ask.fm/KMBReferee

  

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dhalgren718
Member since Jun 20th 2002
16992 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:31 AM

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28. "Oh PLEASE!"
In response to Reply # 22


  

          

If Clinton died tomorrow, you fucking berserkers would be holding pagan bonfires to celebrate his passing! I imagine Newt Gingrich wearing a viking helmet, bare-chested, dancing around the firelight with rest of his late-20th Century cohorts, while Bush sniggers like a drunken frat boy from the shadows...

Let's not mince words. I wasn't trying to be disrespectful before. I AM being disrespectful of your boy's legacy NOW: He didn't need Alzheimer's to be a half-wit - the Iran-Contra affair pretty much made him one from the gitgo. Or am I the only one who remembers him saying he had NO RECOLLECTION of the actions of his own White House staff while motherfuckers were making arms deals out the fucking basement?

http://50yearsfromnow.blogspot.com
MONGO IS A RACIST PIECE OF SHIT.

  

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Expertise
Charter member
37848 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:43 AM

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30. "*yawns*"
In response to Reply # 28


  

          

You were just waiting to go on a tangent, weren't you?

Read my statement again. I never even mentioned his legacy. I just mentioned how you guys just jumped into trying to look at his death from a political standpoint.

And for the record, I would not gloat over Clinton's death, nor would do I have responsibility over others who do it.
__________________________
"Some say that by fighting the terrorists abroad since September the 11th, we only stir up a hornets' nest. But the terrorists who struck that day were stirred up already.

If America were not fighting terrorists in Iraq and Afghanistan and elsewhere, what would these thousands of killers do? Suddenly begin leading productive lives of service and charity? Would the terrorists who beheaded an American on camera just be quiet, peaceful citizens, if America had not liberated Iraq?

We're dealing here with killers who have made the death of Americans the calling of their lives, and America has made a decision about these terrorists. Instead of waiting for them to strike again in our midst, we will take the fight to the enemy."

- President George Walker Bush, June 2nd, 2004.

_________________________
http://expertise.blogdrive.com
http://twitter.com/KMBReferee
http://www.ask.fm/KMBReferee

  

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dhalgren718
Member since Jun 20th 2002
16992 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:48 AM

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32. "Sorry about the tangent."
In response to Reply # 30


  

          

I started a separate thread for that. Unintended. I rant from time to time when the meds don't work.

http://50yearsfromnow.blogspot.com
MONGO IS A RACIST PIECE OF SHIT.

  

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insanejake
Member since Feb 18th 2003
4885 posts
Sun Jun-06-04 11:57 PM

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52. "The war on Drugs..."
In response to Reply # 28


  

          

If Reagan had never been president, then Latin America, especially columbia, would not be as fucked up as it is today. Jamaica would not be knee deep in the filthy drug (cocaine), and most of the people (black and white) that are in prison all over the world today, would not be in there...

"This isnt an argument, you are just contradicting everything Im saying"

"No Im not"
******************
"Dont open your mind too much or your brain will fall out"

******************************

Its 2005, where's my hoverboard and jetpack?

  

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RaAmen
Charter member
482 posts
Mon Jun-07-04 09:57 AM

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62. "Yeah....."
In response to Reply # 52


  

          

There would be probably another new drug aimed at a specific community of color to fund an overthrow of a sovereign government somewere around the world. This government would probably be minding it's own business also....Or maybe it would be nationalizing whatever resource that the trans multi-national American companies are there gobbling up and keeping the people poor........Fuck is wrong with you?




My Rotate Solidify:

1. RBG: Revolutionary but Gangsta
-Dead Prez

2. Immortal Technique-Revolutionary Vol. 2.

3. The Tipping Point
-The Roots

4. Beautiful Struggle
-Talib Kweli


The history of contact between the white and black

  

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spiiiit
Member since Mar 11th 2004
66 posts
Tue Jun-08-04 05:37 AM

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73. "RE: Yeah....."
In response to Reply # 62


  

          

For those of us who lived (and paid attention) during the Reagan years, life was interesting. What would that wacky, happy guy say or do next? Would he embarrass the country by falling asleep at an international summit? Would he show us some more pie charts while increasing the national debt? Would he allow junk bond kings to destroy entire communities while downsizing fever ruined countless lives?

All this and more. Every day was a new experience, a new challenge to see just how much the American public would take. Of course, the answer (as provided by his next two successors) is: just about anything. Not to pick on the ol' Gipper, but the clips below are a matter of public record. Take a walk down memory lane and remind yourself of why future historians will look back on the Reagan Error and say: "Where was the rest of him?"

11/20/80
President-elect Reagan arrives at the White House to receive a job briefing from President Carter, who later reveals that Reagan asked few questions and took no notes, asking instead for a copy of Carter's presentation

1/21/81
At his first Cabinet meeting, President Reagan is asked if he intends to issue an expected Executive Order on cost-cutting. He shrugs. Then, noticing Budget Director David Stockman nodding emphatically, he adds, "I have a smiling fellow at the end of the table who tells me we do." (see 11/10/81) Richard Allen, on his first day as National Security Adviser, receives $1,000 and a pair of Seiko watches from Japanese journalists as a tip for arranging an interview with Nancy Reagan. (see 11/13/81)
2/2/81
At his hearing to become Undersecretary of State, Reagan associate William Clark answers no to all of the following: "Are you familiar with the struggles within the British Labour Party?" "Do you know which European nations don't want U.S. nuclear weapons on their soil?" "Can you name the prime minister of South Africa?" "Can you name the prime minister of Zimbabwe?" All of the above questions were being addressed in the daily news at the time. Despite his lack of knowledge in current events, he is confirmed.

2/5/81
James Watt is asked at a Congressional hearing if he agrees that natural resources must be preserved for future generations. "Yes" he says, then adds "I do not know how many future generations we can count on before the Lord returns." (see 12/14/81)

2/18/81
President Reagan warns a joint session of Congress that the national debt is approaching $1 trillion. "A trillion dollars," he explains, "would be a stack of $1,000 bills 67 miles high." (see 10/23/81)

3/18/81
The Gallup Poll: Reagan Approval Rating Trails Earlier Presidents - The Washington Post

5/11/81
Ed Meese, White House counselor with Cabinet rank, calls the American Civil Liberties Union a "criminals' lobby."

5/21/81
White House Seeks Eased Bribery Act. Says 1977 Law Inhibits Business Abroad By U.S. Corporations - The New York Times The U.S. casts one of only three votes against a World Health Organization ethics code preventing the sale of American infant formulas to Third World countries, where their use with contaminated water has killed thousands of babies.

6/16/81
At his third press conference, President Reagan responds to the following:
· The Israeli attack on Iraq - "I can't answer that"
· Israels' refusal to sign the Nuclear Non-proliferation Treaty - "Well, I haven't given very much thought to that particular question there"
· Pakistan's refusal to sign the treaty - "I won't answer the last part of that question"
· Israeli threats against Lebanon - "Well, this is going to be one, I'm afraid, that I can't answer now"
· The tactics of political action committees - "I don't really know how to answer that."
When faced with skepticism about his administration's grasp of foreign affairs, the President declares "I'm satisfied that we do have a foreign policy."

6/29/81
"I regard voting as the most sacred right of free men and women" - President Reagan, although he refuses to commit to supporting an extension of the Voting Rights Act.

6/30/81
"We love your adherence to democratic principle, and to the democratic processes." - George Bush, toasting newly re-inaugurated President Ferdinand Marcos, whose fondness for democracy is less celebrated by those who know him better.











Ronald Reagan had alot to do with the break


me~> You are considered a fool until you open up your mouth and remove all doubt

Bruce Lee~> Truth is living and therefore, changing

Fred Hampton Sr.~> You can kill a revolutionary, but you can't kill the revolution

Bruce Lee~> Don't think.....feel

me~> Wise people talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something

Chairman Mao~> We are the advocates of the abolition of war; we do not want war; but war can only be abolished through war; and in order to get rid of the gun, it is necessary to pick up the gun."

Chairman Mao~> In the near future a colossal event will occur where the masses of people will rise up like a mighty storm and a hurrican, sweeping all evil gentry and corrupt officials into their graves

Chairman Mao~> Where there is struggle, there is sacrifice, and death is a common occurence.

African Proverb~> How easy it is to defeat people who do not kindle fire for themselves.

African proverb~> If you educate a man you educate an individual, but if you educate a woman you educate a family (nation)

7/23/81
"Heck, no. I'm going to leave this to you experts. I'm not going to get involved in details." President Reagan declining Treasury Secretary Donald Regan's invitation to join the negotiation session at which his tax-cut bill is being shaped.

8/6/81
White House Seeks To Loosen Standards Under Clean Air Act - The Washington Post

9/15/81
President Reagan says he is "as committed today as on the first day I took office to balancing the budget." (see 10/23/81)

10/19/81
California state senator John Schmitz tells a TV interviewer that if Reagan's policies fail, "the best we could probably hope for is a military coup or something like that." He explains that he is talking about "a good military coup, not a bad military coup."

10/23/81
The national debt hits $1 trillion.

11/10/81
Atlantic Monthly publishes William Greider's article "The Education of David Stockman", in which the Budget Director: · Admits "None of us really understands what's going on with all these numbers" · Acknowledges that supply-side economics "was always a Trojan horse to bring down the top rate" · Says of the Reagan tax bill "Do you realize the greed that came to the forefront? The hogs were really feeding." President Reagan is unaware of the article until brought to his attention at his fifth press conference by Leslie Stahl.

11/13/81
The Justice Department begins investigating a $1,000 payment given to National Security Adviser Richard Allen for arranging an interview with Nancy Reagan. "I didn't accept it, I received it," says Allen. "It would have been an embarrassment" to the Japanese to have returned the money. Asked if Allen will stay on the job, President Reagan says, "On the basis of what I know, yes." Nancy Reagan is said to be furious that she has been dragged into the story. (see 1/4/82)

11/23/81
President Reagan vetoes a stopgap spending bill, thus forcing the federal government - for the first time in history - to temporarily shut down. Says House Speaker Tip O'Neill, "He knows less about the budget than any president in my lifetime. He can't even carry on a conversation about the budget. It's an absolute and utter disgrace."

11/27/81
In an interview with Barbara Walters, President Reagan describes his academic record: "I never knew anything above Cs."

11/30/81
President Reagan tells a $2,500 per ticket GOP fund-raiser in Cincinnati about a letter from a blind supporter. "He wrote in Braille," the President says, "to tell me that if cutting his pension would help get this country back on its feet, he'd like to have me cut his pension." The identity of this generous fellow is never revealed.

12/14/81
"Mr. Reagan has the White House, I have Arlington." - James Watt justifying his decision to hold two private cocktail parties at Arlington Cemetery's Lee Mansion at the taxpayer's expense.

12/17/81
When asked at his sixth press conference if he agrees with his Justice Department's efforts to overturn the Webber ruling, which allows unions and management to enter into voluntary affirmative action agreements, President Reagan says he "can't bring to mind as to what it pertains to and what it calls for." When a reporter explains it to him, he says he supports the decision. White House aides later say he thinks it should be overturned.

12/20/81
Reagan Officials Seek To Ease Rules On Nursing Homes. Proposals Include Repeal Of Regulations On Sanitation, Safety And Contagion - The New York Times

12/22/81
President Reagan claims, during a PBS interview, that New Deal proponents actually "espoused" fascism. Roosevelt biographer Arthur M. Schlesinger, Jr., calls this "a gross distortion of history." (see 12/23/81)
12/23/81
Asked to comment on his wife's higher-than-usual disapproval rating, President Reagan says, "I just heard earlier today - and maybe Larry can tell me if this is true - I just heard that some poll or something has revealed that she's the most popular woman in the world." White House spokesman Larry Speakes says he has seen no such poll. (see 2/24/82)


for all inquiring minds...this Reagan administration was just about as bad as the Bush administration....







me~> You are considered a fool until you open up your mouth and remove all doubt

Bruce Lee~> Truth is living and therefore, changing

Fred Hampton Sr.~> You can kill a revolutionary, but you can't kill the revolution

Bruce Lee~> Don't think...

  

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spiiiit
Member since Mar 11th 2004
66 posts
Tue Jun-08-04 05:42 AM

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74. "RE: Yeah....."
In response to Reply # 73


  

          

cont.

7/23/81
"Heck, no. I'm going to leave this to you experts. I'm not going to get involved in details." President Reagan declining Treasury Secretary Donald Regan's invitation to join the negotiation session at which his tax-cut bill is being shaped.

8/6/81
White House Seeks To Loosen Standards Under Clean Air Act - The Washington Post

9/15/81
President Reagan says he is "as committed today as on the first day I took office to balancing the budget." (see 10/23/81)

10/19/81
California state senator John Schmitz tells a TV interviewer that if Reagan's policies fail, "the best we could probably hope for is a military coup or something like that." He explains that he is talking about "a good military coup, not a bad military coup."

10/23/81
The national debt hits $1 trillion.

11/10/81
Atlantic Monthly publishes William Greider's article "The Education of David Stockman", in which the Budget Director: · Admits "None of us really understands what's going on with all these numbers" · Acknowledges that supply-side economics "was always a Trojan horse to bring down the top rate" · Says of the Reagan tax bill "Do you realize the greed that came to the forefront? The hogs were really feeding." President Reagan is unaware of the article until brought to his attention at his fifth press conference by Leslie Stahl.

11/13/81
The Justice Department begins investigating a $1,000 payment given to National Security Adviser Richard Allen for arranging an interview with Nancy Reagan. "I didn't accept it, I received it," says Allen. "It would have been an embarrassment" to the Japanese to have returned the money. Asked if Allen will stay on the job, President Reagan says, "On the basis of what I know, yes." Nancy Reagan is said to be furious that she has been dragged into the story. (see 1/4/82)

11/23/81
President Reagan vetoes a stopgap spending bill, thus forcing the federal government - for the first time in history - to temporarily shut down. Says House Speaker Tip O'Neill, "He knows less about the budget than any president in my lifetime. He can't even carry on a conversation about the budget. It's an absolute and utter disgrace."

11/27/81
In an interview with Barbara Walters, President Reagan describes his academic record: "I never knew anything above Cs."

11/30/81
President Reagan tells a $2,500 per ticket GOP fund-raiser in Cincinnati about a letter from a blind supporter. "He wrote in Braille," the President says, "to tell me that if cutting his pension would help get this country back on its feet, he'd like to have me cut his pension." The identity of this generous fellow is never revealed.

12/14/81
"Mr. Reagan has the White House, I have Arlington." - James Watt justifying his decision to hold two private cocktail parties at Arlington Cemetery's Lee Mansion at the taxpayer's expense.

12/17/81
When asked at his sixth press conference if he agrees with his Justice Department's efforts to overturn the Webber ruling, which allows unions and management to enter into voluntary affirmative action agreements, President Reagan says he "can't bring to mind as to what it pertains to and what it calls for." When a reporter explains it to him, he says he supports the decision. White House aides later say he thinks it should be overturned.

12/20/81
Reagan Officials Seek To Ease Rules On Nursing Homes. Proposals Include Repeal Of Regulations On Sanitation, Safety And Contagion - The New York Times

12/22/81
President Reagan claims, during a PBS interview, that New Deal proponents actually "espoused" fascism. Roosevelt biographer Arthur M. Schlesinger, Jr., calls this "a gross distortion of history." (see 12/23/81)

12/23/81
Asked to comment on his wife's higher-than-usual disapproval rating, President Reagan says, "I just heard earlier today - and maybe Larry can tell me if this is true - I just heard that some poll or something has revealed that she's the most popular woman in the world." White House spokesman Larry Speakes says he has seen no such poll. (see 2/24/82)




me~> You are considered a fool until you open up your mouth and remove all doubt

Bruce Lee~> Truth is living and therefore, changing

Fred Hampton Sr.~> You can kill a revolutionary, but you can't kill the revolution

Bruce Lee~> Don't think.....feel

me~> Wise people talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something

Chairman Mao~> We are the advocates of the abolition of war; we do not want war; but war can only be abolished through war; and in order to get rid of the gun, it is necessary to pick up the gun."

Chairman Mao~> In the near future a colossal event will occur where the masses of people will rise up like a mighty storm and a hurrican, sweeping all evil gentry and corrupt officials into their graves

Chairman Mao~> Where there is struggle, there is sacrifice, and death is a common occurence.

African Proverb~> How easy it is to defeat people who do not kindle fire for themselves.

African proverb~> If you educate a man you educate an individual, but if you educate a woman you educate a family (nation)





me~> You are considered a fool until you open up your mouth and remove all doubt

Bruce Lee~> Truth is living and therefore, changing

Fred Hampton Sr.~> You can kill a revolutionary, but you can't kill the revolution

Bruce Lee~> Don't think...

  

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Soulthinker
Member since Oct 26th 2002
11 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:28 AM

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25. "RE: Why? No disprespect was intended..."
In response to Reply # 15


          

Because he has dissed the Black-Americans during his eight years in office.

  

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FireBrand
Charter member
145739 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:06 AM

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9. "I was actually wondering if they pulled his plug"
In response to Reply # 7


  

          

after the chilly Italian acceptance, then I thought, nah- that is fucking crazying Dom. don't go there. but it still lurks in the back of my mind.



Avatar? ...yup 'nother one.



___________________________

"Niggaz got it bad." --



"I'm not feeling it" --

"Afrika is our center of gravity, our cultural and spiritual mother and father, our beating heart, no matter where we live on the face of this earth." -- Baba John Henrik Clarke.

www.ayaed.com

"Slaves got options...cowards aint got shit." --PS
"Once upon a time, little need existed for making the distinction between a nigga and a black—at least not in this country, the place where niggas were invented" -- Donnell A

  

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Monique
Charter member
2511 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:13 AM

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13. "RE: Let's all breath deep, and..."
In response to Reply # 7


  

          

^^^^^

***********************************************************
NELLY: I'm Humble In Life Taking Nothing For Granted

AFRICA: www.bbcnews.com

THE BROKER: John Grisham

  

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Mars Nova
Member since Dec 29th 2003
1672 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:38 AM

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29. "MY GOODNESS."
In response to Reply # 7


  

          

Well, aren't WE being the champions of independent thought today!

-------------------------
: She's Vulnavia. I'm the Abominable Dr. Phibes.


  

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dhalgren718
Member since Jun 20th 2002
16992 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:49 AM

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33. "The fuck are you talking about?"
In response to Reply # 29


  

          

And who the fuck are you?

And why are you wearing my shoes?

http://50yearsfromnow.blogspot.com
MONGO IS A RACIST PIECE OF SHIT.

  

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kid
Member since Jul 10th 2002
4436 posts
Mon Jun-07-04 08:53 AM

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55. "RE: The fuck are you talking about?"
In response to Reply # 33


  

          

>And why are you wearing my shoes?

This one had me rollin down the hallway.

***********************************
StLOKp's�: DawgEatah, Dstl1, hyde, Colonel Sanders, MisterGrump, Afrotec, Instant_Vintage, ThaTruth, Soul1908, SefConscious, Baldheadslik, YngblkprinceMD, 314confidential, rdiggity, Kid

Honorable mention:auragin_boi

  

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LiquidDope
Charter member
25123 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:07 AM

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10. "The Cubs won and Reagan's dead, who wants lunch?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I'm buyin'.

  

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G_Smooth
Member since Oct 07th 2003
4109 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:08 AM

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11. "haha............I'm down for lunch"
In response to Reply # 10


          

n/m.

  

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dhalgren718
Member since Jun 20th 2002
16992 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:15 AM

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17. "Can we get falafel? I LIKE falafel."
In response to Reply # 10


  

          

n/m

http://50yearsfromnow.blogspot.com
MONGO IS A RACIST PIECE OF SHIT.

  

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urwrong
Member since Aug 10th 2003
216 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:09 AM

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12. "ronald reagan memorial fund"
In response to Reply # 0


          

proceeds benefiting...(you fill in the blank)

  

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dhalgren718
Member since Jun 20th 2002
16992 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:16 AM

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18. "Will it pay back the $3 trillion debt he created?"
In response to Reply # 12


  

          

Or just go towards more hookers for Billu Graham?

http://50yearsfromnow.blogspot.com
MONGO IS A RACIST PIECE OF SHIT.

  

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Soulthinker
Member since Oct 26th 2002
11 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:30 AM

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27. "RE: Will it pay back the $3 trillion debt he created?"
In response to Reply # 18


          

No,Reagan jacked the Blacks long ago and will not get the cash back.

  

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Ryan M
Member since Oct 21st 2002
42444 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:15 AM

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16. "I feel bad for his family."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Watching the guy deteriorate must have been terrible.

My condolences to his kids and extended fam.

Not a fan of the guy whatsoever, but he IS a person.

------------------------------

17x NBA Champions

  

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HoChiGrimm
Charter member
6247 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 10:34 AM

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36. "RE: I feel bad for his family."
In response to Reply # 16


  

          

>Not a fan of the guy whatsoever, but he IS a person.

So were Hitler, Stalin, and Pol Pot.



----------------------------------------------------------

The Rand (Paul or Ayn) philosophy, putting private property rights at
the same level of human rights, equates the status of things with the
status of human beings. If property is considered equal

  

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Oakley
Charter member
7810 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 10:41 AM

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38. "RE: I feel bad for his family."
In response to Reply # 36


  

          

are you comparing Reagan to Hitler, Stalin, and Pol Pot? just curious.

___________________________________
"WASP of the year: even if he isn�t a WASP, Oakley. Sailing? Check. In a yacht club? Check. Used the term �summer� as a verb instead of a noun? You betcha!" -thejerseytornado

  

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HoChiGrimm
Charter member
6247 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 11:18 AM

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40. "Reagan support some of the most"
In response to Reply # 38


  

          

brutal dictatorships the
people of Latin America
have ever known. Regimes
which led to the death
and disappearance of tens
of thousands innocent civ-
illians.

Like Hilter, Reagan did not
directly participate in the
murder of innocent people,
rather he provided financial
aid to brutal henchman who
carried out orders he gave
to the CIA.

----------------------------------------------------------

The Rand (Paul or Ayn) philosophy, putting private property rights at
the same level of human rights, equates the status of things with the
status of human beings. If property is considered equal

  

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Pinko_Panther
Member since Dec 11th 2002
11808 posts
Sun Jun-06-04 11:40 AM

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51. "Word, Reagan was just sleazy..."
In response to Reply # 40


  

          

Here's a puke of a human being who, during the Iran/Iraq war was arming both sides. Openly, he was sending all sorts of weapons to Iraq and covertly, he was selling weapons to Iran, the declared enemy of the time! Now, if that wasn't sleazy on its own, this tyrant of Hussein proportions, was taking the money he received from his secretive weapons sales to Iran and using those funds to build up counter revolutionary contra forces in Nicaragua. These contras reeked horrible terrors on the Nicaraguan population in the name of putting down the very popularly supported Sandinista regime. In fact, the World Court declared the US guilty of terrorism in Nicaragua. Upon this declared guilt, the US responded by increasing their military support for the contras and the death toll in Nicaragua doubled. Reagan was no different than a Stalin or a Pol Pot in his foreign game. May he rot with the rest of the maggots six feet under.

********************************************
"If you think you're too small to make a difference, try sleeping in a closed room with a mosquito."

  

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RaAmen
Charter member
482 posts
Mon Jun-07-04 10:10 AM

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64. "RE: I feel bad for his family."
In response to Reply # 38


  

          

He's arguably responsible for many more deaths than Hitler......




My Rotate Solidify:

1. RBG: Revolutionary but Gangsta
-Dead Prez

2. Immortal Technique-Revolutionary Vol. 2.

3. The Tipping Point
-The Roots

4. Beautiful Struggle
-Talib Kweli


The history of contact between the white and black

  

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Ryan M
Member since Oct 21st 2002
42444 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:18 AM

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19. "Man."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I just realized.

Things are gonna get real...conservative 'round here. I live in Simi Valley, CA where his library is. They're having the burial there. I wonder if Bush is gonna be here.

------------------------------

17x NBA Champions

  

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dhalgren718
Member since Jun 20th 2002
16992 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:22 AM

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20. "Oh, Bush'll be there alright..."
In response to Reply # 19


  

          

Probably trying to rub Reagan's embalmed foot for mojo.

"Come on, incumbency and public buildings - COME ON! Do I have to like... lick him or something to get some of his luck to rub off? I mean, he looks kind of dry. I need everything I can to get this White House thing for another 4 years, but he looks like dried up Republican jerky. I dunno. Oh Hell, let me just... oh, gross! He tastes worse than the dried remains of Hitler! And Hitler tasted BAD...."

http://50yearsfromnow.blogspot.com
MONGO IS A RACIST PIECE OF SHIT.

  

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Ryan M
Member since Oct 21st 2002
42444 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:25 AM

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21. "It's RIGHT by my work and my homie's house."
In response to Reply # 20


  

          

Any other time I'd be down to heckle and protest, but I'm more respectful than that.

------------------------------

17x NBA Champions

  

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dhalgren718
Member since Jun 20th 2002
16992 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:28 AM

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23. "Feh. Next time you think of 'respect' & Reagan..."
In response to Reply # 21


  

          

Consider how he basically criminalized poverty with his draconian tax policies, drug laws, and international economic policy; THEN slashed public assistance!

Now THAT'S respect!

http://50yearsfromnow.blogspot.com
MONGO IS A RACIST PIECE OF SHIT.

  

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Ryan M
Member since Oct 21st 2002
42444 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:30 AM

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26. "Well...Regan IS dead..."
In response to Reply # 23


  

          

It's not him I'd be disrespecting.

It's his family and friends.

Though, the friends are the ones I'm against.

But you know - everyone deserves a good, uninterrupted funeral.

I'll just be damned if this isn't a pickle.

------------------------------

17x NBA Champions

  

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urwrong
Member since Aug 10th 2003
216 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 09:28 AM

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24. "question"
In response to Reply # 0


          

what is the life expectancy for an average person diagnosed with alzheimers?

93 seems high, not be a bitch, but if dude wasnt the republican icon, whos illness changed the partys classification of an embryo and all that great stuff...?

  

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suave_bro
Member since Nov 19th 2002
9433 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 10:04 AM

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34. "he was a damn good actor."
In response to Reply # 0
Sat Jun-05-04 10:04 AM

          


  

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dhalgren718
Member since Jun 20th 2002
16992 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 10:09 AM

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35. "In the White House, maybe."
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

But his movies make Tom Arnold look like mufuckin' DeNiro.

http://50yearsfromnow.blogspot.com
MONGO IS A RACIST PIECE OF SHIT.

  

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Adwhizz
Member since Nov 12th 2003
40575 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 11:32 AM

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44. "Bonzo murdered him on his own Shit!"
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

That chimp acted circles around him.

R.I.P. Loud But Wrong Guy
Dec 29th 2009 - Dec 17th 2017

  

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Pinko_Panther
Member since Dec 11th 2002
11808 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 10:59 AM

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39. "POP THE CHAMPAGNE!"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

He's about to eat maggots! You know, I would be really entertained if the buried him in sexually provactive positions with Nixon. Oh, and the great irony is tha Castro is still alive baby!!! YEAH BABY!!!

********************************************
"If you think you're too small to make a difference, try sleeping in a closed room with a mosquito."

  

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kid
Member since Jul 10th 2002
4436 posts
Mon Jun-07-04 09:01 AM

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56. "I was thinkin the same thing"
In response to Reply # 39


  

          

>Oh, and the great irony is tha Castro
>is still alive baby!!! YEAH BABY!!!

***********************************
StLOKp's�: DawgEatah, Dstl1, hyde, Colonel Sanders, MisterGrump, Afrotec, Instant_Vintage, ThaTruth, Soul1908, SefConscious, Baldheadslik, YngblkprinceMD, 314confidential, rdiggity, Kid

Honorable mention:auragin_boi

  

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Pinko_Panther
Member since Dec 11th 2002
11808 posts
Mon Jun-07-04 09:07 AM

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57. "Slap me some skins kid!!"
In response to Reply # 56


  

          

nm

********************************************
"If you think you're too small to make a difference, try sleeping in a closed room with a mosquito."

  

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kid
Member since Jul 10th 2002
4436 posts
Mon Jun-07-04 09:13 AM

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58. "Oh Yeah!!!!"
In response to Reply # 57


  

          


***********************************
StLOKp's�: DawgEatah, Dstl1, hyde, Colonel Sanders, MisterGrump, Afrotec, Instant_Vintage, ThaTruth, Soul1908, SefConscious, Baldheadslik, YngblkprinceMD, 314confidential, rdiggity, Kid

Honorable mention:auragin_boi

  

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RaAmen
Charter member
482 posts
Mon Jun-07-04 10:13 AM

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65. "RE: POP THE CHAMPAGNE!"
In response to Reply # 39


  

          

Haha.....You ill sun......




My Rotate Solidify:

1. RBG: Revolutionary but Gangsta
-Dead Prez

2. Immortal Technique-Revolutionary Vol. 2.

3. The Tipping Point
-The Roots

4. Beautiful Struggle
-Talib Kweli


The history of contact between the white and black

  

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marcus3x
Member since Dec 07th 2003
2815 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 11:22 AM

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41. "fuck ronald"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

this niggah been dead for years

they injected some shit into his ass to fuck up his memory

-----------------------------
Support and listen to www.libradio.com

Marcus3x's leading candidates for 2004 Idiot of the Year

1. Pat Tillman - former nfl player leaves family and a multi-million dollar contract to fight for Bush's lies only to end

  

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Airbreed
Charter member
29392 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 03:22 PM

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49. "RE: fuck ronald...co-sign."
In response to Reply # 41
Sat Jun-05-04 03:23 PM

  

          

>this niggah been dead for years
>
>they injected some shit into his ass to fuck up his memory

too bad it wasn't hot bleach. he would have died alot sooner and spared us the annual rhetorical tributes.

good riddance.

so long cracka.

  

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HoChiGrimm
Charter member
6247 posts
Sat Jun-05-04 11:29 AM

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42. "When single femal parents become "welfare queens"."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Reagan cited a Chicago "Welfare Queen" who had ripped off $150,000 from the government, using 80 aliases, 30 addresses, a dozen social security cards, and four fictional dead husbands. The country was outraged; Reagan dutifully promised to roll back welfare; and ever since, the "Welfare Queen" driving her "Welfare Cadillac" has become permanently lodged in American political folklore.

Unfortunately, like most great conservative anecdotes, it wasn't really true. The media searched for this welfare cheat in the hopes of interviewing her, and discovered that she didn't even exist.

----------------------------------------------------------

The Rand (Paul or Ayn) philosophy, putting private property rights at
the same level of human rights, equates the status of things with the
status of human beings. If property is considered equal

  

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HoChiGrimm
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Sat Jun-05-04 11:31 AM

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43. "A patheitc liar."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

False Claims Led to Attacks on Grenada, Iraq
by Sheryl McCarthy

Twenty years ago this past Saturday, 1,900 United States marines and paratroopers invaded the tiny Carribbean island of Grenada.
President Ronald Reagan claimed that the unrest following the recent overthrow and murder of Grenada's socialist Prime Minister Maurice Bishop had put the lives of more than 500 American medical students there at risk.

He said he was also concerned about the growing Communist influence in Grenada and suspected that an airport being constructed there would be used as a staging area for Cuban and Soviet troops. The invasion was "forced on us by events that have no precedent in the eastern Carribbean," Reagan said, so the United States "had no choice but to act strongly and decisively."

Grenada's tiny army was crushed overnight, almost 100 people were killed and the United States installed a provisional government. But the reasons the Reagan administration gave for invading Grenada turned out to be dubious. The medical students, it turns out, were never in any danger. The presumed plans for the airport and reports about an alleged stash of weapons were grossly exaggerated. Even the administration's claim that it was invited to invade Grenada by the concerned leaders of some neighboring Carribbean countries turned out to be dicey at best. But these were the days of the Cold War, when U.S. officials were driven by paranoia that Grenada would turn Communist and that the rest of the Caribbean would follow.

"The United States was looking for a pretext to get rid of Bishop and his regime, to move the whole thing out," said Don Rojas, the general manager of WBAI-Pacifica Radio and Bishop's press secretary at the time of the coup. "The coup was just a great opportunity to invade and overthrow the government in its entirely." Moreoever, "fabrications were used."

The claims that the airport was being constructed as a Soviet and Cuban military base and was therefore a threat to U.S. security "was totally false," Rojas says. Nor were there any weapons of significance, other than some small arms and a couple of armored cars. "There were no jet planes, no tanks or anything like that."

Twenty years later, the comparison with Iraq is striking. The hype about Saddam Hussein's still-missing weapons of mass destruction. The supposedly imminent threat he posed to the United States. And the Bush administration's repeated efforts to link Hussein to the Sept. 11 attacks, just as Reagan linked the building of an airport to a pending takeover by the Communists. All of these claims have been proved false.

The invasion of Grenada outraged the international community. "It is very clear that in today's world the United States has decided that might is right, that nobody has the right to decide its own destiny when the United States decides that it is the wrong destiny," Grenada's ambassador to the United Nations at the time, Ian Jacobs, said. Granted, there's no comparison between the brutal regime of Saddam Hussein and the left-leaning tendencies of Maurice Bishop. But Iraq, like Grenada, was a case of a big country telling a small country what it could and could not do.

Rojas, a native Grenadian who was a schoolmate of Maurice Bishop as a boy, recalled that Bishop was loved by the Grenadians and admired throughout the Caribbean. He had overthrown a corrupt dictator who'd been supported by the United States because he was fervently anti-Communist. During Bishop's four years in office he greatly improved living and economic conditions in Grenada, promoted self-determination for Grenada's people after years of British domination and was preparing to hold democratic elections.

After the coup Grenada might well have resolved its internal struggles in its own way, had it not been for the big foot of the United States.

Depending on whom you talk to, Grenada has either thrived as a result of the U.S. invasion or has sadly failed to reach its potential in the last 20 years. The point is that the invasion of Grenada, like U.S. interventions in Vietnam, Nicaragua and Iraq, remind us that when we mess around in the affairs of other countries, not in pursuit of their interests but our own, we set into motion all kinds of forces, the impact of which may not be known for years to come.


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The Rand (Paul or Ayn) philosophy, putting private property rights at
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status of human beings. If property is considered equal

  

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Expertise
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81. "The only liar is you."
In response to Reply # 43


  

          

This column is a complete lie.

WBAI/Pacifica should at least try to hide their lies when engaging in revisionist history.

First of all, saying the medical students were not in danger after a coup that killed over 100 people, resulted in the assassination of the former leader (that prime minister tag is self-imposed, there were no democratic elections on that island) Bishop, and there was a curfew on the entire island is ridiculous. There were demonstrations everywhere and the place was in virtual chaos during the coup.

That kills Rojas's statement, because by the time U.S. forces moved in, Bishop was dead - not killed by U.S. troops, but by the same men who helped him oust the former leader in the first place.

There was no doubt that Castro wanted to make Grenada a Cuban satellite. That's probably why the communists arrested and eventually killed Bishop, and why U.S. forces killed almost 60 Cubans, wounded 25, and hundreds more were returned to Havana.

Those weren't simply contractors. Nor was it paranoia when U.S. forces found not simple small arms, but rocket launchers, patrol boats, antiaircraft guns, and howitzers; enough to arm over 10,000 people. There were also Soviets in Grenada as well. So trying to pretend this was a little innocent country that wasn't doing a thing and wasn't under communist influence was an absolute lie.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/reagan/peopleevents/pande07.html
http://www.acig.org/artman/publish/printer_159.shtml
__________________________
R.I.P. Ronald Wilson Reagan
February 6, 1911 - June 5, 2004

"General Secretary Gorbachev, if you seek peace, if you seek prosperity for the Soviet Union and Eastern Europe, if you seek liberalization: Come here to this gate! Mr. Gorbachev, open this gate! Mr. Gorbachev, TEAR DOWN THIS WALL!" - Brandenburg Gate, June 12. 1987

"From time to time, we have been tempted to believe that society has become too complex to be managed by self-rule, that government by an elite group is superior to government for, by, and of the people. But if no one among us is capable of governing himself, then who among us has the capacity to govern someone else? All of us together, in and out of government, must bear the burden. The solutions we seek must be equitable, with no one group singled out to pay a higher price." - Inaguration Speech, January 20, 1981.

"Yet this year we have to work even harder at summoning the vigor to tell the American people the truth and the vigor to ask their help, to remind them that what they do this November will decide whether the days of high taxes and higher spending, the days of economic stagnation and skyrocketing inflation, the days of national malaise and international humiliation, the days of "blame America first" and "inordinate fear of communism" will all come roaring back at us once again." - Forward For Freedom, 1986.

"What I am describing now is a plan and a hope for the long term -- the march of freedom and democracy which will leave Marxism-Leninism on the ash heap of history as it has left other tyrannies which stifle the freedom and muzzle the self-expression of the people." - Evil Empire Speech, June 8, 1982

_________________________
http://expertise.blogdrive.com
http://twitter.com/KMBReferee
http://www.ask.fm/KMBReferee

  

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HoChiGrimm
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Fri Jun-11-04 02:21 AM

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83. "RE: The only liar is you."
In response to Reply # 81


  

          

>First of all, saying the medical students were not in danger
>after a coup that killed over 100 people, resulted in the
>assassination of the former leader (that prime minister tag
>is self-imposed, there were no democratic elections on that
>island) Bishop, and there was a curfew on the entire island
>is ridiculous. There were demonstrations everywhere and the
>place was in virtual chaos during the coup.

Once again, you're full of
smelly, vile bullshit. It's
well-understood by serious
historians and political
analyists that those medical
students were NEVER in danger.
This claim is confirmed by
historian Joseph Conlin (1990).

And yes, there were demonstrations
across the island, KNUCKLEHEAD, but
why? Because people were enraged by
the murder of Bishop by a Stalinsit
faction lead by Bernard Coard. At
no time did any of the protesters
threaten the lives of the U.S. med.
students.

>Those weren't simply contractors. Nor was it paranoia when
>U.S. forces found not simple small arms, but rocket
>launchers, patrol boats, antiaircraft guns, and howitzers;
>enough to arm over 10,000 people. There were also Soviets
>in Grenada as well. So trying to pretend this was a little
>innocent country that wasn't doing a thing and wasn't under
>communist influence was an absolute lie.

Again, more revisionist history.
That airport was never used by
Soviets or Cubans for military
purposes and this fact has long
been established -- even by cred-
ible conervative analysts.

Reagan lied and you took the bait.
'

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The Rand (Paul or Ayn) philosophy, putting private property rights at
the same level of human rights, equates the status of things with the
status of human beings. If property is considered equal

  

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HoChiGrimm
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Fri Jun-11-04 02:26 AM

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84. "Read & comprehend better."
In response to Reply # 81


  

          

>That kills Rojas's statement, because by the time U.S.
>forces moved in, Bishop was dead - not killed by U.S.
>troops, but by the same men who helped him oust the former
>leader in the first place.

Rojas never asserted U.S. forces
killed Bishop, nor did he imply
that: "The coup was just a great
opportunity to invade and overthrow
the government in its entirely."

What he means by overthrow the gov-
nment "ENTIRELY" is ridding the is-
land of any remnants of the Bishop
leadership.

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The Rand (Paul or Ayn) philosophy, putting private property rights at
the same level of human rights, equates the status of things with the
status of human beings. If property is considered equal

  

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HoChiGrimm
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Fri Jun-11-04 10:27 AM

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87. "The lies of Sexpertise."
In response to Reply # 81


  

          

>There was no doubt that Castro wanted to make Grenada a
>Cuban satellite. That's probably why the communists
>arrested and eventually killed Bishop, and why U.S. forces
>killed almost 60 Cubans, wounded 25, and hundreds more were
>returned to Havana.
>
>Those weren't simply contractors.

http://www.unf.edu/~rkephart/Writings/Grenada-Iraq.html

"At the time, I was a graduate student doing doctoral research on Carriacou. The Marines reached Carriacou on Nov. 1, after spending a week on the main island of Grenada. When they found out that I was a US citizen, the first question they asked me was about the location of the “battalion of North Korean soldiers.” Now, Carriacou is a twelve-square-mile island inhabited by several thousand people, nearly all of African descent, living in a society where everyone knows everything that’s going on. The idea of a battalion of Koreans hiding there was simply ludicrous. As we see now with Iraq, strange ideas about the “enemy” are nothing new."

"Reagan claimed that a new airport with a runway capable of handling jet planes could only be intended for military use. In fact, Grenadians had been working for a new airport for years, because the old one was dangerously close to the mountains and could handle only smaller prop planes (meaning that Grenadians going abroad or tourists flying into Grenada nearly always had expensive layovers in Barbados or Trinidad). The Reagan administration was also upset by the Cuban presence, even though the Cuban “force” consisted mostly of teachers, doctors, and middle-aged construction workers helping build the new airport (of the 784 Cubans on the island, about 40 were members of the Cuban armed forces)."


Ronald Kephart is an associate professor of sociology, anthropology, and criminal justice at the University of North Florida.







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Expertise
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Fri Jun-11-04 12:14 PM

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88. "*LOL* aiight...so lemme get this straight."
In response to Reply # 87


  

          

And I'mma use YOUR own words here:

There is Cuban military in Grenada. Hundreds of Cubans are "working" in Grenada. There had been a coup by Coard (a "stalinist", as if that made any difference). There are warehouses found with weapons to arm thousands of people....

But the Soviets nor Castro were involved with Grenada. Get the fuck outta here.

And the funny shit is, you want to blame the U.S. for the overthrow of the government...and to get rid of Bishop's supporters! *LMAO*

Think genius, if it was simply about getting rid of Bishop WHY did Reagan send troops there in the first place? Hell; his own MEN killed him, and they would have killed anyone that stood up to them in favor of Bishop. And if they were Stalinists, then that means they weren't in cahoots with the U.S. neither. In fact, they would have been behind your boy Castro, who coincidentally had soldiers and officials on the island.

Seriously Ho, who are you trying to fool here? You're sitting here trying to diminish the threat on the island, trying to diminish Castro's influence on the island, trying to diminish what the airport was used for, diminish the amount of weapons on the tiny island, diminish the requests for assistance by other Carribbean nations in restoring control on the island, and trying to paint a picture that everything was alright and peaceful except for the little fact that the former despot had been assassinated and there were a couple of demonstrations. Get outta here with that bullshit.
__________________________
R.I.P. Ronald Wilson Reagan
February 6, 1911 - June 5, 2004

"General Secretary Gorbachev, if you seek peace, if you seek prosperity for the Soviet Union and Eastern Europe, if you seek liberalization: Come here to this gate! Mr. Gorbachev, open this gate! Mr. Gorbachev, TEAR DOWN THIS WALL!" - Brandenburg Gate, June 12. 1987

"From time to time, we have been tempted to believe that society has become too complex to be managed by self-rule, that government by an elite group is superior to government for, by, and of the people. But if no one among us is capable of governing himself, then who among us has the capacity to govern someone else? All of us together, in and out of government, must bear the burden. The solutions we seek must be equitable, with no one group singled out to pay a higher price." - Inaguration Speech, January 20, 1981.

"Yet this year we have to work even harder at summoning the vigor to tell the American people the truth and the vigor to ask their help, to remind them that what they do this November will decide whether the days of high taxes and higher spending, the days of economic stagnation and skyrocketing inflation, the days of national malaise and international humiliation, the days of "blame America first" and "inordinate fear of communism" will all come roaring back at us once again." - Forward For Freedom, 1986.

"What I am describing now is a plan and a hope for the long term -- the march of freedom and democracy which will leave Marxism-Leninism on the ash heap of history as it has left other tyrannies which stifle the freedom and muzzle the self-expression of the people." - Evil Empire Speech, June 8, 1982

_________________________
http://expertise.blogdrive.com
http://twitter.com/KMBReferee
http://www.ask.fm/KMBReferee

  

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HoChiGrimm
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Sat Jun-12-04 08:57 AM

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90. "You are a stone cold dumbass."
In response to Reply # 88


  

          

>But the Soviets nor Castro were involved with Grenada. Get
>the fuck outta here.

As I already stated, of the
784 Cubans on the island, about
40 were members of the Cuban armed
forces. The remaining consisted mostly
of teachers, doctors, and middle-aged
construction workers helping build the
new airport.

SOURCE: Ronald Kephart, associate professor
of sociology, anthropology, and criminal
justice at the University of North Florida.

>And the funny shit is, you want to blame the U.S. for the
>overthrow of the government...and to get rid of Bishop's
>supporters! *LMAO*

I stated that Reagan's ultimate
goal was to undermine the Bishop
regime and in fact, he had been
working to achieve this objective.

The invasion of Grenada had been
planned by the Reagan administra-
tion as far back as 1981. In fact,
there were mock invasion, military
exercises on the island of Viequas
off of the island of Puerto Rico.
Viequas happens to be similar in
topography to Grenada. This had been
in the works, so to speak, for at
least two years before October of 1983.

The Reagan administration had been
conducting a very organized and con-
certed campaign of political, economic,
diplomatic destabilization of the Bishop
government, the revolutionary government
of Prime Minister Maurice Bishop, from
the time Reagan came into office.

THIS IS A WELL UNDERSTOOD FACT.

SOURCE: http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=04/06/10/1425246

You haven't offered a shred of evidence
which justifies the invasion of the island,
nor can you.

The fact is, there could have been 100,000
Cuban solders on the island and you still
wouldn't be able to justify this illegal
invasion.

1) There has never been any evidence
which suggests the airport was going to be
used for military purposes. Period.

2) There has never been any evidence
which suggests that those medical
students were in danger.

3) There was no justifiable reason to
illegally invade Grenada.

4) For someone who claims to cherish
libertarian ideals, you sure don't
mind government intervention so long
as it's carried out by one of your
so-called "conservative" butt buddies.


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status of human beings. If property is considered equal

  

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Expertise
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93. "You're really funny, Ho."
In response to Reply # 90


  

          

So we're supposed to think that Castro sent all these professionals, laborers, construction workers, weapons, and soldiers there, yet he had NO interest in the island?

Who do you REALLY think you're fooling?

- over 700 Cubans are there of all fascets.

- Weapon caches, of Soviet design, were stashed by the thousands.

- They are constructing an airport.

- Radio Grenada was reported to be espousing communist rhetoric and was hostile to towards the U.S.

- There were Soviets and Eastern Europeans found on the island.

- Bishop and Castro did meet and extend trade relations amongst the two countries.

Yet, Castro has no interest in turning Grenada into a Marxist nation, despite investing so many resources into the country.

Right.

I mean, what is there to prove? All you've really done is answered the questions for me, yet denied every intention of Castro to make Grenada a communist satellite.

Even you said if there was 100,000 Cuban soldiers on that island that I couldn't justify military action in Grenada. The simple fact is that you know as well as I do that Castro and Bishop's regime were doing all it could to establish strong relations.

so let's take these points one by one:

>1) There has never been any evidence
>which suggests the airport was going to be
>used for military purposes. Period.

The regime was partially funded and supported by Castro and had already received weapons and equipment. Castro had invested a considerable amount of resources into that country, and over 700 Cubans were on the island when U.S. Forces invaded.

>2) There has never been any evidence
>which suggests that those medical
>students were in danger.

Bishop and his supporters within the regime was assassinated in a coup that killed over 100 people. There was a curfew placed on that island where if anyone came out of their homes they would be shot.

The danger was placed on not just the students, but the whole island. And it was evident once U.S. Forces invaded, as most of the island were thankful that they were finally there to restore order and safety.

And, of course, there are still statements made by students themselves:

“I was in my first year of medical school, and there was a coup going on in Grenada,” said Shapiro, now a surgeon in Las Vegas. “As students, we were pretty immune to the whole thing at first, but then these rebels grabbed the prime minister and his cabinet and executed them.

“We found out what was going on that afternoon, when they declared martial law and said that anyone caught outside of their homes would be shot on sight,” Shapiro said. “The U.S. government kept trying to negotiate our release, but there was no way to get us off the island, because the rebels wouldn’t give permission for any military planes to come in and get us.”

http://www2.acc.af.mil/accnews/jul01/01229.html

There were also reports of students falling on their knees and kissing the tarmac once the plane had landed in Charleston.

>3) There was no justifiable reason to
>illegally invade Grenada.

This I already stated above. You killed the whole premise of this by the "100,000 Cuban soldiers" statement. Castro could set up 10,000 missles on that island and you'd still think the U.S. shouldn't do anything and have nothing to worry about, which of course, you're full of shit.

The fact is that the United States had a vested interest in stopping the spread of communism within Latin and South America, as well as the Caribbean, and it was done in that regard. Whether or not you think it was "illegal" is irrelevant, especially since Castro or any other communist ever abided by "international law".

>4) For someone who claims to cherish
>libertarian ideals, you sure don't
>mind government intervention so long
>as it's carried out by one of your
>so-called "conservative" butt buddies.

I don't mind action taken against communist governments. That's all there is to it.

And it's funny that you try to deride the United States for actions that the Soviets and Castro were doing for decades: the funding of armies and rebel groups designed to overthrow governments, movement of troops in Central and South America as well as in Africa, supplies of weapons and equipment to Marxist governments that have led to the deaths of hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of people...so don't even try it. You and Fidel Castro are full of shit, and as for Castro, has been for decades.
__________________________
R.I.P. Ronald Wilson Reagan
February 6, 1911 - June 5, 2004

"General Secretary Gorbachev, if you seek peace, if you seek prosperity for the Soviet Union and Eastern Europe, if you seek liberalization: Come here to this gate! Mr. Gorbachev, open this gate! Mr. Gorbachev, TEAR DOWN THIS WALL!" - Brandenburg Gate, June 12. 1987

"From time to time, we have been tempted to believe that society has become too complex to be managed by self-rule, that government by an elite group is superior to government for, by, and of the people. But if no one among us is capable of governing himself, then who among us has the capacity to govern someone else? All of us together, in and out of government, must bear the burden. The solutions we seek must be equitable, with no one group singled out to pay a higher price." - Inaguration Speech, January 20, 1981.

"Yet this year we have to work even harder at summoning the vigor to tell the American people the truth and the vigor to ask their help, to remind them that what they do this November will decide whether the days of high taxes and higher spending, the days of economic stagnation and skyrocketing inflation, the days of national malaise and international humiliation, the days of "blame America first" and "inordinate fear of communism" will all come roaring back at us once again." - Forward For Freedom, 1986.

"What I am describing now is a plan and a hope for the long term -- the march of freedom and democracy which will leave Marxism-Leninism on the ash heap of history as it has left other tyrannies which stifle the freedom and muzzle the self-expression of the people." - Evil Empire Speech, June 8, 1982

_________________________
http://expertise.blogdrive.com
http://twitter.com/KMBReferee
http://www.ask.fm/KMBReferee

  

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HoChiGrimm
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Sun Jun-13-04 02:00 PM

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94. "RE: You're really funny, Thomas."
In response to Reply # 93


  

          

>- over 700 Cubans are there of all fascets.

Yes there were and again, it
was determined that only 40
were military personel. Hardly
a reason to use illegal military
force against an island that prod-
uces nutmeg.

>- Weapon caches, of Soviet design, were stashed by the
>thousands.

Firt of all, the numbers
were exagerated, as I pointed
out using a valid source. With
that said, Bishop had made sev-
eral attempts to establish good
relations with the U.S. and
even advocated free enterprise,
to no avail

Governments have a right to est-
ablish relations with any nation
they choose, Grenada is no excep-
tion. Hell, Reagan did it with
some of the most brutal regimes
known to humanity.

Morerover, you have still failed
to establish proof for an invasion
of the island, so let's continue.

>- They are constructing an airport.

Yes they were, Thomas, what's your
point? Actually tourists were freq-
uently taken to the construction
site at the airport-a widely publi-
cized symbol of Grenadian pride.
US students from St. George's Med-
ical school jogged by Cuban and
Grenadian construction workers each
day on the airstrip. The main finan-
cial support for the airport came not
from the U.S.S.R. nor from Cuba, but
from Margaret Thatcher's Britain.

>- Radio Grenada was reported to be espousing communist
>rhetoric and was hostile to towards the U.S.

>- There were Soviets and Eastern Europeans found on the
>island.

You really are a moron with a low
IQ. What the hell are you trying to
say. Because Soviets and Eastern
Europeans were "FOUND" (yeah, I'm
sure), this was a reason to break
international law. Fuck outta here,
especially from someone who claims
to admire libartarian ideals. LOL!

>- Bishop and Castro did meet and extend trade relations
>amongst the two countries.

Well, duh! He also established trade
with a number of non-Eastern block
countries. Bahahahahahaaa! You're
laughable. Still no proof offered
for an invasion of another nation.

>Yet, Castro has no interest in turning Grenada into a
>Marxist nation, despite investing so many resources into the
>country.

Son (gotta call you that cause you're
obviously young and naive), Cuba --
since you're unaware -- has invested
"resources" in a plethora the Developing
Nations which anyone with a modicum of
common sence would realize were not ripe
for a "Marxist" revoltuion. They just
invested "resources" in Haiti and I don't
see any Leninist guerillas roaming about
in Port-au-Prince.

Again, what are some logical reasons for a
U.S. invasion? NONE.

>I mean, what is there to prove?

You keep dwelling on a point that
I never raised, one dealing with
Castro. I simply asked you to
provide an ample reason for an
invasion condemned by your girl
Thatcher herself and you've offered
nothing. Absolutely nothing.

>The simple fact is that you know as well as I do that Castro
>and Bishop's regime were doing all it could to establish
>strong relations.

And that, young man, is a moot
point simply because every moron
from Timbuktu to Kalamazoo knew
that Bishop and Castro had an
affinity for one another (NO HOMO).
Castro even referred to Bishop as
being like a son to him.

This is what you want me to admit???

I clearly stated to you that Cubans
were working on the island, and the
NJM was developing a relationship
with Cuba. Stop dancing around the
issue at hand.

>The regime was partially funded and supported by Castro and
>had already received weapons and equipment. Castro had
>invested a considerable amount of resources into that
>country, and over 700 Cubans were on the island when U.S.
>Forces invaded.

Duh! You're shittin me, right?

This is something I refuse to
disagree with simply because
I previously pointed this out.
Ha!

And props to you for underscoring
the fact that Castro "PARTIALLY"
funded the airport because in
actually, Britian was providing
most of the funds -- WITH THATCHER'S
approval.

>Bishop and his supporters within the regime was assassinated
>in a coup that killed over 100 people. There was a curfew
>placed on that island where if anyone came out of their
>homes they would be shot.

You need to read and comprehend
better because it is well understood
even by your boys on the right that
the students were never in danger
and the government went out of it's
way to ensure their saftey.

Now, does this mean the students weren't
fearing for their lives? I would venture
to say that some were, which explain
thie "kissing the ground" incident. Oh,
and I knew you try and use that to prove
some moot point. You're too preditable.

There's a qualitative difference between
actually being in danger and perceiving
as though you are in danger.

Further, the link you posted doesn't work.
Nice try.

In a nutshell, you've offered as much
proof for an invasion as Reagan did
and like Reagan, you're waffling. Do
you believe the invasion was justified
because of the med. students, or the
airport construction, or a Cuban/Soviet
presence?

WHICH RATIONALE IS IT, WENDEL?








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HoChiGrimm
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96. "Citation of sources."
In response to Reply # 94


  

          

http://www.pipeline.com/~rgibson/grenada17ZMAG.htm

Though the medical students were radioing out that they were in no danger, US rangers "saved" them, after U.S. jets bombed a mental hospital.

SOURCE: "The Last Prisoners of the Cold War Are Black" by Rich Gibsonhttp:

//www.commondreams.org/scriptfiles/views03/1027-06.htm

"The medical students, it turns out, were never in any danger.

"SOURCE: Published on Monday, October 27, 2003 by the Long Island (NY) Newsday

"False Claims Led to Attacks on Grenada",
Iraq by Sheryl McCarthy

http://www.unf.edu/~rkephart/Writings/Grenada-Iraq.html

"At the time, I was a graduate student doing doctoral research on Carriacou. The Marines reached Carriacou on Nov. 1, after spending a week on the main island of Grenada. When they found out that I was a US citizen, the first question they asked me was about the location of the “battalion of North Korean soldiers.” Now, Carriacou is a twelve-square-mile island inhabited by several thousand people, nearly all of African descent, living in a society where everyone knows everything that’s going on. The idea of a battalion of Koreans hiding there was simply ludicrous. As we see now with Iraq, strange ideas about the “enemy” are nothing new."

SOURCE: Ronald Kephart, associate professor of sociology, anthropology, and criminal justice at the University of North Florida.


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The Rand (Paul or Ayn) philosophy, putting private property rights at
the same level of human rights, equates the status of things with the
status of human beings. If property is considered equal

  

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HoChiGrimm
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Sun Jun-13-04 02:43 PM

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99. "Who was funding the airport?"
In response to Reply # 94


  

          

http://www.zmag.org/zmag/articles/Shalominterven.html

"The Cubans, of course, were playing a prominent role in the construction of the airport, but so was the British firm Plessey, and even an American dredging company was taking part.(118) Presumably there would have been greater Western participation in the project if the U.S. had not gone to such great lengths to dissuade other nations from becoming involved."(119)

SOURCE: "PROTECTING AMERICANS ABROAD: PRETEXT FOR INTERVENTION"
STEPHEN R. SHALOM: Imperial Alibis (Boston: South End Press, 1993).

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The Rand (Paul or Ayn) philosophy, putting private property rights at
the same level of human rights, equates the status of things with the
status of human beings. If property is considered equal

  

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HoChiGrimm
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100. "An assessment of medical student's status."
In response to Reply # 94


  

          

http://www.zmag.org/zmag/articles/Shalominterven.html

Right after Bishop was killed, General Hudson Austin, head of the armed forces, announced the formation of a Revolutionary Military Command (RMC) and declared a round-the-clock, shoot-on- sight 96 hour curfew. U.S. officials subsequently claimed that the draconian curfew endangered U.S. citizens, and that Americans could not leave the island. Neither of these claims was true.

SOURCE: "PROTECTING AMERICANS ABROAD: PRETEXT FOR INTERVENTION"
STEPHEN R. SHALOM: Imperial Alibis (Boston: South End Press, 1993).

In later Congressional testimony, Deputy Secretary Dam acknowledged that he was unaware of anyone -- American or Grenadian -- shot pursuant to the curfew.<120> There is no evidence of any action taken or threatened against any foreign citizen during this period.<121> Reagan administration officials announced on October 27 that they had found evidence that the Grenadian government, together with Cuban advisers, was planning to take American hostages,<122> but this claim was retracted a short while later.<123> (Of course, this didn't stop noted legal scholars like John Norton Moore -- writing after the retraction -- from citing the false claim.<124>) Not only was there no such plan, but both Grenadian authorities and Cuban officials in Havana gave explicit assurances that U.S. citizens were safe. U.S. officials did not bother to disclose these assurances publicly. When they later came to light, the White House explained that the pledges were not trusted.<125>The Grenadian government was particularly solicitous of the welfare of the medical students, whose presence on the island was crucial to the country's economy.<126> Austin himself visited the vice-chancellor of the medical school to assure him that there was no danger to the students and to offer any assistance to help the school cope with the curfew; water was specially provided and school officials were given passes to go out despite the curfew.<127> Students who went outside during the curfew reported that they were not stopped or threatened.<128>For the country as a whole, the curfew was temporarily lifted on the third day to give people chance to buy food.<129> The government provided the medical students with vehicles and escorts to get from one campus to the other.<130>The medical school took a poll of its students and only ten percent wanted to leave Grenada.<131> On the evening of Sunday, October 23, 500 parents of the medical students met in New York City to discuss the situation. Many had been in touch with their children. They sent a telegram to President Reagan urging him not to "take any precipitous actions at this time."<132>

Late Sunday night a radio broadcast from outside Grenada announced that an invasion of the island was imminent. This caused many of the students to get worried -- as well it might, for, more than anything else, it was an invasion that would put them at risk -- and now perhaps half of them wanted to leave.<136> Fear of invasion, however, is hardly a rationale for an invasion, particularly because there was no obstacle to orderly evacuation if it were desired.British and Canadian diplomats present on the island did not believe an invasion was necessary to protect their nationals.<137> Administrators of the medical school supported this assessment,<138> though one of them, vice-chancellor Geoffrey Bourne, later changed his view on the basis of some rather peculiar reasoning, and who knows what pressure. According to Bourne, Austin had mistakenly thought that all the U.S. students were being taken out of the country and came to him very upset; Bourne explained to him that this was not the intention, but concluded from this that there were grave doubts whether they could have gotten out.<139> The Grenadian government sent a diplomatic note to the United States that Sunday night and broadcast the text over Radio Free Grenada. It condemned any planned invasion and offered to hold talks to ensure good relations. "We reiterate that the lives, well-being and property of every American and other foreign citizens residing in Grenada are fully protected and guaranteed by our government." However, the note went on, "any American or foreign citizen in our country who desires to leave Grenada for whatever reasons can fully do so using the normal procedures through our airports on commercial aircraft. As far as we are concerned, these aircraft can be regular flights or chartered flights and we will facilitate them in every way we can."<140>


















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HoChiGrimm
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Mon Jun-14-04 06:17 AM

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106. "RE: An assessment of medical student's status."
In response to Reply # 100


  

          

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:rUr6NXr0-coJ:coat.ncf.ca/our_magazine/links/issue50/files/50_24-25.pdf+grenada+medical+students+never+in+danger&hl=en&ie=UTF-8

The threat to U.S. medical students was
a total fabraction. Even Carson quotes
a medical school official: "Our safety
was never in danger. We were used
as an excuse for this government to
invade... They needed a reason... and
we were it." Most students insisted they
were not... in any danger before the U.S.
invasion; only afaterwards."

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The Rand (Paul or Ayn) philosophy, putting private property rights at
the same level of human rights, equates the status of things with the
status of human beings. If property is considered equal

  

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HoChiGrimm
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Mon Jun-14-04 03:50 PM

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108. "RE: An assessment of medical student's status."
In response to Reply # 100


  

          

http://perc.ca/PEN/2003-03/s-sanders.html

"When Grenada's popular revolutionary government leaders were killed under suspicious circumstances in a coup, the US claimed that they needed an invasion to protect US medical students, even though they were not in any danger. The US had previously conducted a practice invasion of Grenada that included the use of this pretext."

SOURCE: "Unravelling the Web of Pretexts for War" by Richard Sanders: Peace and Environment News (March 2003)

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The Rand (Paul or Ayn) philosophy, putting private property rights at
the same level of human rights, equates the status of things with the
status of human beings. If property is considered equal

  

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HoChiGrimm
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101. "Reagan's numerous & false claims for invasion."
In response to Reply # 94


  

          

http://www.zmag.org/zmag/articles/Shalominterven.html

One claim advanced was that the intervention had been requested and authorized by the Organization of Eastern Caribbean States as a measure of collective security. This claim, however, was a transparent fig-leaf. While most OECS members did support the invasion, they in fact had no legal authority to authorize force.

Another U.S. claim was that the invasion had in fact been invited by the government of Grenada in the person of Paul Scoon, the Governor-General. Scoon, according to the U.S., secretly transmitted a request for intervention that the U.S. could not reveal until after the invasion out of concern for his well- being. But Scoon's position was entirely a ceremonial one: according to People's Law Number 3 of March 1979, the Governor- General "shall perform such functions as the People's Revolutionary Government may from time to time advise."<159> A report from the British House of Commons (recall that the Governor-General is supposed to be the representative of the British Queen) stated that "the timing and nature" of Scoon's request "remain shrouded in some mystery, and it is evidently the intention of the parties directly involved that the mystery should not be dispelled."<160> The British magazine _The_ _Economist_ (which supported the invasion) was more direct: the "Scoon request was almost certainly a fabrication concocted between the OECS and Washington to calm the post-invasion diplomatic storm."<161> Later, Scoon told the BBC that what he had asked for "was not an invasion but help from outside."<162> And he also informed reporters that he had not been aware of the possible involvement of U.S. forces until they landed in his front garden.<163>

With the pre-invasion danger to the students not credible and the legal arguments unconvincing, the White House resorted to its old standby: U.S. troops got to Grenada "just in time," Reagan declared, to prevent a Cuban take-over.<164> This claim was preposterous on its face -- Cuba had been outraged at the killing of Bishop.<165>

SOURCE: "PROTECTING AMERICANS ABROAD: PRETEXT FOR INTERVENTION"
STEPHEN R. SHALOM: Imperial Alibis (Boston: South End Press, 1993).









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status of human beings. If property is considered equal

  

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HoChiGrimm
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102. "Grenada, a Soviet satallite? LOL!!!"
In response to Reply # 94


  

          

http://www.zmag.org/zmag/articles/Shalominterven.html

When U.S. forces captured some 25,000 documents in Grenada detailing such things as weapons deals with the Soviet Union and North Korea, the administration proclaimed that its case had been proven. But the documents<166> -- in the words of one right-wing study -- "provide no conclusive evidence that Grenada had become a depot of Soviet arms for future use in the region, nor were there any Soviet or Cuban military bases or facilities at the time of the U.S./OECS intervention aside from the controversial airport, which also had clear-cut civilian purposes."<167> Moreover, the documents "do not provide evidence" that the New Jewel Movement "intended to allow Grenada to be used as a military or political base for the Cubans or Soviets to expand their influence in the region."<168>

SOURCE: "PROTECTING AMERICANS ABROAD: PRETEXT FOR INTERVENTION"
STEPHEN R. SHALOM: Imperial Alibis (Boston: South End Press, 1993).

----------------------------------------------------------

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status of human beings. If property is considered equal

  

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HoChiGrimm
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103. "Reagan censors the media."
In response to Reply # 94


  

          

The invasion of Grenada (popular among most Grenadian people sickened by the long collapse of the NJM) was complete in a week. It was, however, denounced as illegal by the U.N. Security Council, by Margaret Thatcher and the British government, and by a myriad of US congress_people.

The international press, including US reporters, was cordoned off from Grenada during the invasion. US ships intercepted reporters who rented boats trying to get to the island, arresting them and detaining them until after the invasion was complete.

SOURCE: Patrick Sloyan, a senior reporter for Newsday, is investigating the media and the military.


The invasion of Grenada (popular among most Grenadian people sickened by the long collapse of the NJM) was complete in a week. It was, however, denounced as illegal by the U.N. Security Council, by Margaret Thatcher and the British government, and by a myriad of US congress_people.

The international press, including US reporters, was cordoned off from Grenada during the invasion. US ships intercepted reporters who rented boats trying to get to the island, arresting them and detaining them until after the invasion was complete.

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The Rand (Paul or Ayn) philosophy, putting private property rights at
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status of human beings. If property is considered equal

  

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HoChiGrimm
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105. "RE: Reagan censors the media."
In response to Reply # 103


  

          

http://www.rcfp.org/news/mag/25-4/cov-blamegre.html

Even though State Department officials notified Cuba, the Soviet Union and Western European Allies about the invasion several hours before it happened, they left the nation's press corps in the cold until President Reagan announced the invasion at 9 a.m. that same day. Even then, they restricted reporters to Barbados for another 48 hours.

Armed forces scuttled attempts by reporters to access the island by boat or small plane.

On Oct. 27, officials offered a small press pool a limited tour of the island. But then they grounded the media plane so reporters couldn't file their stories until after Reagan gave a speech on the invasion. On Oct. 30, reporters finally enjoyed unlimited access to Grenada but had to resort to footage and eyewitness accounts from military sources.

By then, the invasion already had been deemed a qualified success, despite later reports that the military had to use tourist maps during the attack and nearly bungled a rescue of medical students because they didn't know the island's university had two campuses.


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status of human beings. If property is considered equal

  

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HoChiGrimm
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107. "RE: Reagan censors the media."
In response to Reply # 103


  

          

http://xroads.virginia.edu/~MA03/holmgren/papers/media.html

Reagan and his administration controlled the early pictures and information of the 1983 invasion of Grenada. They isolated 300 war reporters on the island of Barbados, 155 miles away from the action, spoon-feeding them the news that the administration saw fit for the public (McCain, 23). Although the television and media executives protested, this policy was adopted six years later in the invasion of Panama.

SOURCE: Is No News, Good News?: Media and the Gulf War
by Chuck Holmgren (25 May 1997).


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HoChiGrimm
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Sat Jun-12-04 10:35 AM

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92. "RE: *LOL* aiight...so lemme get this straight."
In response to Reply # 88


  

          

>But the Soviets nor Castro were involved with Grenada. Get
>the fuck outta here.

As I stated earlier, the majority
of Cubans in Grenada at that time
were civilians. There were about 40
member of Cuban military personnel
there.

If you believe otherwise then prove
it.

>Think genius, if it was simply about getting rid of Bishop
>WHY did Reagan send troops there in the first place?

The invasion of Grenada had been
planned by the Reagan administra-
tion as far back as 1981. In fact,
there were mock invasion, military
exercises on the island of Viequas
off of the island of Puerto Rico.
Viequas happens to be similar in
topography to Grenada.

This had been in the works, so to
speak, for at least two years before
October of 1983.

The Reagan administration had been
conducting a very organized and con-
certed campaign of political, economic,
diplomatic destabilization of the Bishop
government, the revolutionary government
of Prime Minister Maurice Bishop, from
the time Reagan came into office. DUH!

>his own MEN killed him, and they would have killed anyone
>that stood up to them in favor of Bishop. And if they were
>Stalinists, then that means they weren't in cahoots with the
>U.S. neither.

Umm, stupid-ass, I never once
claimed that the Coard Stalinist
faction was in collusion with the
U.S.. In the eyes of Reagan it did
not matter if there was a schism
within the New Jewel Movement. All
that mattered to Reagan was that
there would be a regime suberviant
to U.S. interests, which is why a
provincial government was "created"
by the U.S. subsequent to the inva-
sion.

>Seriously Ho, who are you trying to fool here? You're
>sitting here trying to diminish the threat on the island,
>trying to diminish Castro's influence on the island, trying
>to diminish what the airport was used for, diminish the
>amount of weapons on the tiny island,

And you have failed to prove that
the airport was being used by Soviets
or that there was a need for an illegal
invasion that was condemned by Thatcher
herself.

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Pinko_Panther
Member since Dec 11th 2002
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Sat Jun-05-04 12:23 PM

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45. "Just another dead trend from the 80s..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

While much of the 80s seems to be coming in and out of style it is nice to see this icon dead for good.

********************************************
"If you think you're too small to make a difference, try sleeping in a closed room with a mosquito."

  

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Pinko_Panther
Member since Dec 11th 2002
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Sat Jun-12-04 10:22 AM

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91. "RE: Just another dead trend from the 80s..."
In response to Reply # 45


  

          

I found it funny...sheesh...

********************************************
"If you think you're too small to make a difference, try sleeping in a closed room with a mosquito."

  

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Zorasmoon
Member since Aug 30th 2002
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Sat Jun-05-04 12:56 PM

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46. "ok....any one up for dancing on his grave? ............"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

coldblooded!!





http://www.youtube.com/user/kimmayluv

  

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insanejake
Member since Feb 18th 2003
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Sun Jun-06-04 11:58 PM

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53. "Moonwalks"
In response to Reply # 46


  

          

Up and down it. Ill go and do a jig on Nixons afterwards...

"This isnt an argument, you are just contradicting everything Im saying"

"No Im not"
******************
"Dont open your mind too much or your brain will fall out"

******************************

Its 2005, where's my hoverboard and jetpack?

  

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HoChiGrimm
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95. "LOL!"
In response to Reply # 46


  

          

.

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tha8thjewel
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47. "Fuck Ronald Reagan."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Besides which, he's been brain-dead for 15 years.


"Alphas are that good high...stick witcha, you can't shake that shit...like heroin. You'll always be addicted."
--OKP novembersgift

  

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kinetic94761180
Member since Jul 05th 2002
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Tue Jun-08-04 04:36 AM

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70. "RE: Fuck Ronald Reagan."
In response to Reply # 47


  

          

-word.

_____________
if racism is a cancer, black thought is the answer.

Rjcc is code for "bitch-ass troll"

DROkayplayerâ„¢

  

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dhalgren718
Member since Jun 20th 2002
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Sat Jun-05-04 02:22 PM

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48. "You do realize, folks"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

That they will try to re-name Washington after him, now.

I mean, Reagan single-handedly overthrew the USSR, branded those pesky queers as plague-carriers (remember GRIDS? Gay Realted Immune Deficiency Syndrome? Yeah, what they used to call AIDS), and won the War on Drugs! He also dealt with those naughty Negroes and Messicans with his really effective domestic policy, international free trade, and immigration laws! And let's not forget those Commie Pinko Laborniks, who don't know how to shut up and appreciate their lower-than-minimum-wage employment in back-breaking industries like construction, agriculture, and home care!

Ah, Reagan... you brought Jesus back from the dead AND balanced the national budget. My hat off to you, sir! Reagan, D.C., here I come!

>shoots self in face<

http://50yearsfromnow.blogspot.com
MONGO IS A RACIST PIECE OF SHIT.

  

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kid
Member since Jul 10th 2002
4436 posts
Mon Jun-07-04 09:34 AM

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61. "Don't forget"
In response to Reply # 48


  

          

he cleaned up the rootinist tootinist rough an rootinist wildest city this side of the Rio Grande, by golly

***********************************
StLOKp's�: DawgEatah, Dstl1, hyde, Colonel Sanders, MisterGrump, Afrotec, Instant_Vintage, ThaTruth, Soul1908, SefConscious, Baldheadslik, YngblkprinceMD, 314confidential, rdiggity, Kid

Honorable mention:auragin_boi

  

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thembi
Member since Feb 05th 2003
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Sat Jun-05-04 07:11 PM

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50. "if theres a hell"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

......

the world is a toll-free toilet-george clinton

  

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Corey_Atherley
Member since Jan 31st 2003
1509 posts
Mon Jun-07-04 07:25 AM

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54. "Can't find it in my heart to lament....."
In response to Reply # 50
Mon Jun-07-04 07:28 AM

  

          

I feel like I should've known more about Reagan, but sadly I didn't because I was only a toddler during his time. But for all I've been taught about him was a bunch of negative stuff..for example, he didn't do jack shit to help out Black communities..(ie..crack epidemic, AIDS, and gang violence). Of course, there was the WAR ON DRUGS policy..but what did that lead to? Obviously, the war on drugs is still going on, if it hasn't already taken a turn for the worse. I'm saddened I've never gotten to know who Regan was as a person from all the negative propaganda about him. He was like another Nixon.

This is just what I've been taught.

  

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spiiiit
Member since Mar 11th 2004
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Tue Jun-08-04 05:46 AM

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75. "I wish I would...."
In response to Reply # 50


  

          

shed a tear for the
3 "6's"
Ronald
Wilson
Reagan



me~> You are considered a fool until you open up your mouth and remove all doubt

Bruce Lee~> Truth is living and therefore, changing

Fred Hampton Sr.~> You can kill a revolutionary, but you can't kill the revolution

Bruce Lee~> Don't think.....feel

me~> Wise people talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something

Chairman Mao~> We are the advocates of the abolition of war; we do not want war; but war can only be abolished through war; and in order to get rid of the gun, it is necessary to pick up the gun."

Chairman Mao~> In the near future a colossal event will occur where the masses of people will rise up like a mighty storm and a hurrican, sweeping all evil gentry and corrupt officials into their graves

Chairman Mao~> Where there is struggle, there is sacrifice, and death is a common occurence.

African Proverb~> How easy it is to defeat people who do not kindle fire for themselves.

African proverb~> If you educate a man you educate an individual, but if you educate a woman you educate a family (nation)





me~> You are considered a fool until you open up your mouth and remove all doubt

Bruce Lee~> Truth is living and therefore, changing

Fred Hampton Sr.~> You can kill a revolutionary, but you can't kill the revolution

Bruce Lee~> Don't think...

  

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thembi
Member since Feb 05th 2003
9009 posts
Tue Jun-08-04 06:24 AM

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76. "i was tellin my mom that the other day"
In response to Reply # 75


  

          

about the 666 lmao

the world is a toll-free toilet-george clinton

  

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ChiBrownSkinLady
Member since Nov 14th 2002
30211 posts
Mon Jun-07-04 09:23 AM

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59. "RE: Reagan is dead? RIP."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Man, you guys are cruel... I mean, Reagan obviously wasn't the salt of the earth by any stretch, but every life has some sort of positive impact-- be it showing others the way not to be or doing something good that immediately helps others. So let's try to show just a smidge of respect. Not like I liked him that much-- dude tried to make ketchup a food group to further malnourish kids everywhere-- but talking about dancing on his grave? That's a bit harsh.

But I am with the overall sentiment here. And I was rediculously annoyed to see that he was all over the TV coverage this morning. I mean, he was 93. Most Americans, healthy or not, don't live to be nearly that old (though my great-grandmother just turned 97 yesterday!). So to me, it's just not that newsworthy. Yes, the passing of a former president should be acknowledged, but I don't remember there being this much of a fuss about Nixon or Ford. And the thing that really kills me is that because the services won't be until Friday, we'll be forced to hear this for the next few days while other real stories will be buried as "in other news..." This is why I have grown to hate the newsmedia industry as a whole.

I'm going to the National Hip Hop Political Convention. Are you? Check it out: www.hiphopconvention.org/schedule/

You MUST read this book: How To Get Stupid White Men Out of Office http://www.indyvoter.org/article.php?list=type&type=4

Rock The Vote Chicago: http://www.xanga.com/home.aspx?user=rtvchicago

"...We shall have to do more than vote; we shall have to create leaders who embody virtues we can respect, who have moral and ethical principles we can applaud with enthusiasm." - Martin Luther King, Jr.

"At exactly which point do you start to realize that life without knowledge is death in disguise?" - Black Star

"You know the motto: Stay fluid even in staccato" - Mos Def

__________________________

Just tryna do the best that I can with what it is I have...

  

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dhalgren718
Member since Jun 20th 2002
16992 posts
Mon Jun-07-04 09:25 AM

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60. "HE LIVED TO BE 93 BY DRINKING VIRGIN BLOOD!!!!"
In response to Reply # 59


  

          

IT'S TRUE!!! SAME THING WITH STROM THURMOND!!! THINK ABOUT IT!!!

http://50yearsfromnow.blogspot.com
MONGO IS A RACIST PIECE OF SHIT.

  

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RaAmen
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Mon Jun-07-04 10:18 AM

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66. "Were cruel?"
In response to Reply # 59


  

          

How many Latin American children and families did that bitch destroy? I have compassion for life, so I feel sorrow for his family. But in all due honesty, he probably deserves to burn in hell..........Fuck his presidency.




My Rotate Solidify:

1. RBG: Revolutionary but Gangsta
-Dead Prez

2. Immortal Technique-Revolutionary Vol. 2.

3. The Tipping Point
-The Roots

4. Beautiful Struggle
-Talib Kweli


The history of contact between the white and black

  

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HoChiGrimm
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Sun Jun-13-04 02:04 PM

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97. "Exactly."
In response to Reply # 66


  

          

.

----------------------------------------------------------

The Rand (Paul or Ayn) philosophy, putting private property rights at
the same level of human rights, equates the status of things with the
status of human beings. If property is considered equal

  

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Constant Resistance
Member since Mar 12th 2004
55 posts
Mon Jun-07-04 11:50 AM

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67. "RE: Reagan is dead? RIP."
In response to Reply # 59


          

>So let's try to show just a smidge of respect.

The dead deserve respect and ketchup is a vegetable... Why show any respect for someone who has so little respect for even the most basic of values--like not victimizing kids for having poor, disabled, addicted, or even just lousy no-good parents?

How about all those crack babies and AIDS victims? You think his war on drugs was anything more than a song and dance to increase the power of the already powerful and the wealth of the already wealthy?

You think for a second Herr Reagan wouldn't dance across your grave for a buck?

-If you're not part of the revolution, you're part of the problem

  

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ChiBrownSkinLady
Member since Nov 14th 2002
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Tue Jun-08-04 04:42 AM

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71. "RE: I understand all of that..."
In response to Reply # 67


  

          

BUT all I'm saying is that a life is a life. Reagan's life was no more or less valuable than any of the other lives he helped to destroy. You can talk about how shitty they were in their lifetime, sure. Not everyone deserves to be canonized as the best thing since sliced bread. But celebrating someone's death is fucked up.

I'm going to the National Hip Hop Political Convention. Are you? Check it out: www.hiphopconvention.org/schedule/

You MUST read this book: How To Get Stupid White Men Out of Office http://www.indyvoter.org/article.php?list=type&type=4

Rock The Vote Chicago: http://www.xanga.com/home.aspx?user=rtvchicago

"...We shall have to do more than vote; we shall have to create leaders who embody virtues we can respect, who have moral and ethical principles we can applaud with enthusiasm." - Martin Luther King, Jr.

"At exactly which point do you start to realize that life without knowledge is death in disguise?" - Black Star

"You know the motto: Stay fluid even in staccato" - Mos Def

__________________________

Just tryna do the best that I can with what it is I have...

  

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Expertise
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Tue Jun-08-04 04:55 AM

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72. "Um, Ford isn't dead."
In response to Reply # 59


  

          

__________________________
R.I.P. Ronald Wilson Reagan
February 6, 1911 - June 5, 2004

"General Secretary Gorbachev, if you seek peace, if you seek prosperity for the Soviet Union and Eastern Europe, if you seek liberalization: Come here to this gate! Mr. Gorbachev, open this gate! Mr. Gorbachev, TEAR DOWN THIS WALL!" - Brandenburg Gate, June 12. 1987

"From time to time, we have been tempted to believe that society has become too complex to be managed by self-rule, that government by an elite group is superior to government for, by, and of the people. But if no one among us is capable of governing himself, then who among us has the capacity to govern someone else? All of us together, in and out of government, must bear the burden. The solutions we seek must be equitable, with no one group singled out to pay a higher price." - Inaguration Speech, January 20, 1981.

"Yet this year we have to work even harder at summoning the vigor to tell the American people the truth and the vigor to ask their help, to remind them that what they do this November will decide whether the days of high taxes and higher spending, the days of economic stagnation and skyrocketing inflation, the days of national malaise and international humiliation, the days of "blame America first" and "inordinate fear of communism" will all come roaring back at us once again." - Forward For Freedom, 1986.

"What I am describing now is a plan and a hope for the long term -- the march of freedom and democracy which will leave Marxism-Leninism on the ash heap of history as it has left other tyrannies which stifle the freedom and muzzle the self-expression of the people." - Evil Empire Speech, June 8, 1982

_________________________
http://expertise.blogdrive.com
http://twitter.com/KMBReferee
http://www.ask.fm/KMBReferee

  

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HoChiGrimm
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Sun Jun-13-04 03:10 PM

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104. "Get over it."
In response to Reply # 59


  

          

He was a war criminal.

----------------------------------------------------------

The Rand (Paul or Ayn) philosophy, putting private property rights at
the same level of human rights, equates the status of things with the
status of human beings. If property is considered equal

  

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Soletaker
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Mon Jun-07-04 12:06 PM

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68. "In 1980"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Before he took office and Jimmy Carter was giving his last address, I remembered I cried. I had to be like either 5 or 6 years old. I didn't really know why I was sad to see Carter go at the time. Maybe I knew what was to come. It was really weird now I sit down and look back.
Anyway my response when my boy told me on Saturday,

Hey, Like Sam Cooke said...
We're Having A Party!!!!

Fuck Regan.


--------

Mixcloud - www.mixcloud.com/Soultaker/

  

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MME
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Wed Jun-09-04 09:46 AM

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77. "OMGosh!!!"
In response to Reply # 68


  

          

I cried TOO when Carter left office, and I was the SAME AGE!! that's weird.

____________________________

FUCK DONALD TRUMP

  

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Soletaker
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Fri Jun-11-04 02:05 AM

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82. "Wow,"
In response to Reply # 77


  

          

I guess we both saw what was coming.

--------

Mixcloud - www.mixcloud.com/Soultaker/

  

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LexM
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Fri Jun-11-04 05:43 AM

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86. "that's like me in 1991"
In response to Reply # 68


  

          

at 13 years old knowing the gulf war was bullshit.

it would serve us well to pay attention to children's reactions to such things.

~~~~
http://omidele.blogspot.com/
http://rahareiki.tumblr.com/
http://seatofbliss.blogspot.com/

  

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Canela74
Member since Feb 24th 2004
471 posts
Tue Jun-08-04 02:54 AM

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69. "Funny..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

When I was watching CNN on Sunday and saw the coverage I was like, "didn't he die already like 2 years ago????!"

>>>"Oil? Who said anything about oil? You cooking, bitch?" - Dave Chapelle as "Black Bush"

>>>"I ain't scared of no Al- Qaeda. I'm scared of Al- Kracker!" - Chris Rock

>>>"Ain’t no disrespect, but the average person don’t wanna hear lyrics no more. They just wanna shake their ass. So if you wanna play dumb, I can play dumb, too. I ‘m not gonna bust my brain, actin’ like I gotta write a Malcolm X dart, because right now, the people are simpleminded. A wise man can play the part of a fool, but a fool can’t play the part of a wise man." - Ghostface

"Arrest the President" (c) Intelligent Hoodlum a/k/a Tragedy Khadafi
Read My Blog! http://canelanyc.blogspot.com/
myspace.com/canela_nyc (sigh)

  

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rogue_scholar
Member since Feb 14th 2003
7647 posts
Wed Jun-09-04 10:22 AM

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78. "fired the air traffic controllers..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

and now has the airport named after him...

wtf

**************
rS

--Any belief worth having must survive doubt--

----------------
rs

  

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Monique
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Wed Jun-09-04 10:59 AM

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79. "Critics Question Reagan Legacy........"
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Jun-09-04 11:01 AM

  

          

http://news.bbc.co.uk?2?hi/americas/3788229.stm

COUNT DOWN POST FRIDAY---??Fallout??.

i guess one thing for sure we are living under his legacy in whatever way.
someone said some republicans are concerned with some of the extremes being used.

HMM,BUT,Worse. Alledged Evidence During Hearings, But No ONe Falls Down.
Except The Little People.

***********************************************************
NELLY: I'm Humble In Life Taking Nothing For Granted

AFRICA: www.bbcnews.com

THE BROKER: John Grisham

  

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eldealo
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10109 posts
Wed Jun-09-04 11:24 AM

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80. "RE: Reagan is dead? RIP."
In response to Reply # 0


          

for iran contra alone....fuck r.i.p.

he can b.i.a.

Looking for music? Check out....

Yerba Buena....
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00008V5T9/qid%3D1049121392/sr%3D2-1/ref%3D%0Asr%5F2%5F1/103-8648523-1647849
http://www.yerbabuenamusic.com

Romeo Blue
http://cdbaby.com/cd/romeoblue
http://www.romeoblue.com

KLT - KLT Presents....Butch
http://cdbaby.com/cd/klt
http://www.kltrocks.com/

-------------------------------------------
INFIN8 Photography
http://www.instagram.com/infin8photo
http://www.facebook.com/INFIN8Photography

  

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HoChiGrimm
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Sun Jun-13-04 02:38 PM

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98. "Well stated."
In response to Reply # 80


  

          

.

----------------------------------------------------------

The Rand (Paul or Ayn) philosophy, putting private property rights at
the same level of human rights, equates the status of things with the
status of human beings. If property is considered equal

  

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LexM
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28342 posts
Fri Jun-11-04 05:36 AM

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85. "excellent article"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

may god have mercy on his soul. for his sake, i hope he was a puppet.
~~~~~~~~

http://blackcommentator.com/94/94_wise_reagan.html

Reagan, Race and Remembrance: Reflections on the American Divide
by Tim Wise

If one needs any more evidence that whites and people of color live in two totally different places, politically and psychically, one need only look at the visual evidence provided by the death of Ronald Reagan.

More to the point, all one needs to know about this man and his Presidency can be gleaned by looking even haphazardly at the racial and ethnic makeup of the crowds flocking to his ranch, or his library to pay tribute. So too will it be apparent from the assemblage lining the streets of DC for his funeral procession, or gathering in the Capitol Rotunda to pay respects to their departed hero.

They are, and will be – in case you missed it or are waiting for the safest prediction in the history of prognostication – white. Far whiter, one should point out, than the nation over which Reagan presided, and even more so than the nation into whose soil he will be deposited within a matter of days.

While persons of color make up approximately 30 percent of the population of the United States, the Reagan faithful look like another country altogether. As they gathered in Simi Valley – home of the 40th President’s library, as well as the jury that thought nothing of the police beating of Rodney King – one wonders if they noticed the incongruity between themselves and the rest of the state in which they live: a state called California, where people like them are slightly less than half the population now.

Doubtful. Most of them, after all, are quite used to never seeing black and brown folks, since the vast majority of whites live in communities with virtually no people of color around them.

That the mourners wouldn’t notice the overwhelming monochromy of their throng is no surprise. But it has been more than a little interesting that no intrepid reporter - or at least someone pretending to be such a creature – has thought to ask the obvious question about the racial makeup of those losing sleep over the death of Ronald Reagan, versus those who frankly aren’t.

After all, there are really only two possible interpretations of the sanguine reaction by people of color to Reagan’s death: namely, either black and brown folks are poster children for insensitivity, or perhaps they know something that white folks don’t, or would rather ignore.

The former of these is not likely – after all, millions of black folks actually forgave George Wallace for God’s sake when he did a partial mea culpa for his racist past before his death – but the latter is as certain as rain in Seattle.

What white folks ignore, but what most black folks can never forget, is how Reagan opposed the Civil Rights Act at the time of its passage, calling it an unwarranted intrusion on the rights of businesses, and never repudiated his former stand.

Or that as Governor of California, Reagan dismissed the struggle for fair and open housing, by saying that blacks were just “making trouble” and had no intention of moving into mostly white neighborhoods.

Perhaps they have a hard time forgetting that of all the places Reagan could have begun his campaign for the Presidency in 1980, he had to choose Philadelphia, Mississippi: a town famous only for the 1964 murder of three civil rights workers. And perhaps they recall that the focus of his speech that day was “state’s rights,” a longstanding white code for rolling back civil rights gains and longing for the days of segregation.

Maybe they have burned in their memories the way Reagan attacked welfare programs with stories of “strapping young bucks” buying T-Bone steaks, while hardworking taxpayers could only afford hamburger, or how Reagan fabricated a story about a “welfare queen” from Chicago with 80 names, 30 addresses, and 12 Social Security cards, receiving over $150,000 in tax-free income. That Reagan picked Chicago as the site of this entirely fictional woman, and not some mostly white rural area where there were plenty of welfare recipients too, was hardly lost on African Americans.

Perhaps black folks and other people of color remember the words of former Reagan Education Secretary Terrell Bell, who noted in his memoir how racial slurs were common among the “Great Communicator’s” White House staffers, including common references to Martin Lucifer Coon, and “sand niggers.”

Perhaps they recall that Reagan supported tax exemptions for schools that discriminated openly against blacks.

Perhaps they recall how his Administration cut funds for community health centers by 18 percent, denying three-quarters-of-a-million people access to services; how they cut federal housing assistance by two-thirds, resulting in the loss of about 200,000 affordable units for renters in urban areas.

Or how Reagan opposed sanctions against the racist South African regime, and even denied that apartheid, under which system blacks could not vote, was racist, noting that its policies were “more tribal than racial.”

And it isn’t surprising that few if any Salvadorans or Guatemalans who came to the U.S. in the 1980s, fleeing from violence in their countries, were to be seen placing flowers outside Reagan’s library either.

After all, the former were forced to seek refuge here precisely because Reagan was so intent on funneling money and arms to the murderous death-squad governments who were responsible for killing so many of their countrymen and women; and the latter no doubt recall how Reagan brushed off the genocidal policies of Guatemalan dictator Rios Montt – whose scorched earth tactics, especially against the nation’s indigenous resulted in at least 70,000 deaths – by saying he was getting a “bum rap” on human rights, and was instead a man of “great personal commitment,” who was dedicated to “social justice.”

That whites would view much of this as irrelevant, even whining or sour grapes on the part of communities of color, is only proof positive that for many if not most such folks, the opinions of, and even the humanity of black and brown persons with whom they share a nation is of secondary importance to the fact that Reagan - as many have been gushing these past few days – “made them feel good again.”

But how can healthy people feel good about a leader who does and says the kinds of things mentioned above? Obviously the answer is by denying that racism matters, or that its victims count for anything. Even more cynically, it is no doubt true that for many of them, it was precisely Reagan’s policy of hostility to people of color that made them feel good in the first place. By 1980, most whites were already tiring of civil rights and were looking for someone who would take their minds off such troubling concepts as racism, and instead implore them to “greatness,” however defined, and “pride,” however defined, and flag waving.

Whites have long been more enamored of style than substance, of fiction than fact, of fantasy than reality. It’s why we have clung so tenaciously to the utterly preposterous version of our national history peddled by textbooks for so long; and it’s why we get so angry when anyone tries to offer a correction.

It’s why we choose to believe the lie about the U.S. being a shining city on a hill, rather than a potentially great but thoroughly flawed place built on the ruins and graves of Native peoples, built by the labor of enslaved Africans, enlarged by theft and murder and an absolute disregard for non-European lives.

As Randall Robinson points out in his recent book, Quitting America, when such subjects are broached, the operative response from much of the white tribe is little more than, “Oh, that.”

Yes white man, that. That exactly. That thing we were raised to gloss over, to speak of in hushed tones, as if by our diminished volume or failure to audibilize it, it will go away; that perhaps they will forget about it, and instead join with us in praise of our country, since that is most definitely how so many of us envision it.

White people, especially those who are upper-middle class and above, have no reason on Earth to be aware of the truth, let alone to dwell on it. The truth is, after all, so messy, so littered with the bodies of dead Nicaraguans, and dead Haitians murdered by Duvalier while Reagan stood by him; so soiled by his support for Saddam Hussein. Better to ignore all that, and to go mushy before the pictures of Reagan in his cowboy hat, to remember a President who, for all of his murderous policies abroad and contempt for millions at home, at least never got a blow job in the Oval Office.

This is the twisted psychosis of growing up privileged, as a member of the dominant group: a group that must view their nation as fair and just, as a place struck off by the literal hand of God, as a place where “average” guys like Ronald Reagan can become “great leaders.” As a place where an “aw shucks” smile, and a profound lack of knowledge about the details of public policy – or even the names of foreign leaders – is not only not cause for embarrassment, but yet another good reason to vote for someone; where refusing to read up on important policy details prior to a key international meeting so one can watch The Sound of Music on TV, is seen as endearing rather than cause for a recall.

This is why we get people like George W. Bush, for those who haven’t figured it out yet. Oh sure, vote fraud and a pliant Supreme Court help, but were it not for the love affair white Americans have with mediocrity posing as leadership, things never could have gotten this far.

It’s why a bona fide moron like Tom DeLay can brag about not having a passport (because, after all, why would anyone want to travel abroad and leave “Amur’ca,” even for a day) and not be seen as the epitome of a blithering idiot, and why he could probably be elected again and again in thousands of white dominated congressional districts in this country, and not merely in Texas.

Having to grapple with the real world is stressful, and people with relative power and privilege never know how to deal with stress very well. As such, they long for and applaud easy answers for the stress that occasionally manages to intrude upon their lives: so they blame people of color for high taxes, failing schools, crime, drugs, and jobs they didn’t get; they blame terrorism on “evil,” and the notion that they hate our freedoms: a belief one can only have if one really thinks one lives in a free country in the first place.

In other words, delusion is both the fuel that propels people like Ronald Reagan forward in political life, and then makes a rational assessment of his legacy impossible upon his death.

I think this is why so many white people remember him fondly, and are truly crestfallen at the thought of his physical obsolescence: simply put, much of white America needs Ronald Reagan; a father figure to tell them everything is going to be O.K.; a kindly old Wizard of Oz, to assure them that image and reality are one, even when the more cerebral parts of our beings tend towards an opposite conclusion.

With Reagan gone, maintaining the illusion becomes more difficult.

But knowing white folks – I am after all one of them, and have been surrounded by them all of my life – I have little doubt that where there’s a will to remain in la-la land, we will surely find a way.

Reagan has been released from the lie, finally, and may his soul find peace among the millions of dearly departed victims of his policies around the world.

Meanwhile, the rest of us must pull back the curtain on all phony heroes, Reagan among them, lest we create many millions more.




~~~~
http://omidele.blogspot.com/
http://rahareiki.tumblr.com/
http://seatofbliss.blogspot.com/

  

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Monique
Charter member
2511 posts
Fri Jun-11-04 12:17 PM

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89. "TEAR DOWN THESE WALLS OF OPPRESSION.........."
In response to Reply # 0
Fri Jun-11-04 12:22 PM

  

          

AND SUPPRESSION GLOBAL PRESIDENTS--PRIME MINISTERS--KINGS--QUEENS...

TO HONOR THE LEGACY OF ONE YOU HOLD SO DEAR.

SEE the eyes of the intensity with which i speak-OPENING PAGE>>>
GO THERE>>>www.dangelosangels.com . MISS NO PAGES SHOULD YOU VISIT.

***********************************************************
NELLY: I'm Humble In Life Taking Nothing For Granted

AFRICA: www.bbcnews.com

THE BROKER: John Grisham

  

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