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Subject: "Talib Kweli: Beautiful Struggle" This topic is locked.
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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
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Mon Dec-22-03 11:32 AM

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"Talib Kweli: Beautiful Struggle"


          

thesis: Talib Kweli will have the best OkayArtist rap release of 2004.

support: nothing really.

call it a hunch or a retarded whim, it's a prediction.

not wanting to throw around the easily battered term "classic", let's just resolve to say that Kweli has been a part of some damn good music: Reflection Eternal, Black Star, Quality.

thesis: Talib Kweli is one of the ten best MCs making music today.

call it an overestimation or foolish praise, it's a feeling.

sometimes the dude does get a little to Dennis Miller-ish with the similes, but like Quest has said, he has the unique ability to spit memorable lines at a greater ratio than most rappers. he clearly has some quotables in his cannon.

thesis: Talib Kweli is at his best when produced by DJ Hi-Tek.

well, i could enter the evidence of Respiration and Reflection Eternal as Exhibit A. this is not to say that Quality was somehow a bad record (not at all), just not up to par with the superior beats that the Brooklyn-Cincinnati collaboration had inspired in years prior. the album seemed to be missing some consistent texture on top of consistent . . . quality. someone once had the idea that Talib's latter was better than his former. to refute this claim the guy was pointed in the direction of Reflection Eternal tracks 1-20.

how will Talib Kweli will have the best OkayArtist rap release of 2004?

the lyrics seem to be guaranteed. every track will not be flawless, but each should represent a higher level of lyricism than most.

featuring? "if skills sold, truth be told, i'd probably be lyrically Talib Kweli." the Get By remix(es) arrived, some more than surface connections with the R-O-C have sprung up, and the rumor mill has even been cornered. does this mean he's gonna turn his album into the Internet message board-A&R wet dream? R.E. had Xzbit, Rah Digga, Kool G Rap, Mos Def, De La Soul. Quality had Cocoa Brovaz, Mos Def, Black Thought, Pharoahe Monch. next up?

i don't wanna come off as this guy more concerned with beats than words, but damn an ass if it doesn't have the matching hips. the focus has to balance each other, both maintaining an equal relationship working each for each, making all elements stronger. that's what Hi-Tek did. that's what some producers failed to accomplish on the last album.

when i think of Talib Kweli and listen to him i feel nothing but sincerity and honesty. i doubt he'll let labels (record or otherwise) convict and jeopardize that integrity he's been working with this many years.

if i can suggest (see: hope for) guest appearances: Michelle Ndegeocello, Q-Tip, Saul Williams, Kayne West, Mos Def, J-Live, Aceyalone, Esthero (all culled from the Reflection Eternal "thank you" liner notes)

i wouldn't mind some lesser known producers to get some shine, but if anyone can call up Kayne, Pete Rock, Premier, 88 Keys, Diamond D, The Beatnuts, please do so. oh, and i heard this cat named Hi-Tek is kinda nice.

after the disappointment following Phrenology and confusion settling after Electric Circus, 2002 held Quality on top those three. The Tipping Point and B.E. tentatively have 2004 release dates, but again i look for Kweli to serve up the best OkayArtist rap release of the year.

and a new BlackStar album wouldn't be so bad either.

(Rawkus, stop dicking around with my music.)

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
This would be nice...
Dec 22nd 2003
1
it's not the time of the arrival that matters
Dec 22nd 2003
11
LOL
Dec 22nd 2003
2
2002 breakdown
Dec 22nd 2003
4
      Lyrics 6.5 my ass!
Dec 22nd 2003
5
      RE: Co Sign
Dec 22nd 2003
6
      If Kweli is on some RE type shit again then...
Dec 23rd 2003
18
      not the point of the post, people
Dec 22nd 2003
8
      RE: 2002 breakdown
Dec 22nd 2003
7
           Reflection Eternal
Dec 22nd 2003
9
I
Dec 22nd 2003
3
i don't play the guitar, i play my cadence-
Dec 22nd 2003
10
footnote-
Dec 22nd 2003
12
It's Impossible To Say
Dec 22nd 2003
13
      2004 looks nice
Dec 22nd 2003
14
      RE: It's Impossible To Say
Dec 23rd 2003
15
      RE: It's Impossible To Say
Dec 23rd 2003
31
disagree but...
Dec 23rd 2003
16
RE: disagree but...
Dec 23rd 2003
24
interesting
Dec 23rd 2003
17
Beautiful Struggle: Undercover
Dec 23rd 2003
25
RE: interesting
Dec 23rd 2003
40
RE: Talib Kweli: Beautiful Struggle
Dec 23rd 2003
19
RE: Talib Kweli: Beautiful Struggle
Dec 23rd 2003
20
just to get a rep
Dec 23rd 2003
26
RE: Talib Kweli: Beautiful Struggle
Dec 23rd 2003
21
why can't we be friends?
Dec 23rd 2003
22
Esthero...
Dec 23rd 2003
23
Tao of Now
Dec 23rd 2003
27
RE: Talib Kweli: Beautiful Struggle
Dec 23rd 2003
28
bias?
Dec 23rd 2003
29
Quality was not the best of the 3 - It was the worst
Dec 23rd 2003
30
RE: Quality was not the best of the 3
Dec 23rd 2003
32
RE: Quality was not the best of the 3
Dec 24th 2003
42
Rawkus track?
Dec 24th 2003
43
      RE: Rawkus track?
Dec 24th 2003
44
      RE: Rawkus track?
Dec 25th 2003
45
           correction
Dec 25th 2003
46
RE: Quality was not the best of the 3
Dec 31st 2003
55
hmmm
Dec 23rd 2003
34
      RE: hmmm
Dec 25th 2003
47
           RE: hmmm
Dec 26th 2003
48
                just to add
Dec 27th 2003
49
                     RE: just to add
Dec 27th 2003
50
RE: Talib Kweli: Beautiful Struggle
Dec 23rd 2003
33
please write to my fan club
Dec 23rd 2003
35
Wow, look in your mailbox for your "news update" prize
Dec 23rd 2003
36
this post will remain in the minds of my foes
Dec 23rd 2003
38
i'd just like to add my praise here...
Dec 23rd 2003
37
*bows*
Dec 23rd 2003
39
      RE: *bows*
Dec 23rd 2003
41
           Talib Kweli presents brr dum dum dum
Jan 03rd 2004
60
RE: Talib Kweli: Beautiful Struggle
Dec 29th 2003
51
RE: Talib Kweli: Beautiful Struggle
Dec 30th 2003
52
pretty much
Dec 31st 2003
53
Kweli as a RocA Fella?
Dec 31st 2003
54
RE: Kweli as a RocA Fella?
Dec 31st 2003
56
      RE: Kweli as a RocA Fella?
Jan 01st 2004
57
      just because it's on some message boards
Jan 02nd 2004
59
      RE: Kweli as a RocA Fella?
Jan 01st 2004
58
           ^
Jan 08th 2004
61
This post is a master piece... Well expressed!
Jan 08th 2004
62
Hi-Tek!
Jan 13th 2004
63

Southbound
Member since Sep 30th 2003
2169 posts
Mon Dec-22-03 12:08 PM

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1. "This would be nice..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

I just picked up Reflection Eternal after much hype. I finally felt it was time to delve in to T.K.'s stuff. It has not left my cd player yet. As you mention tracks 1-20 are the ish. I can't wait to pick up his previous albums and look forward to this new one.

SB

"we missed a lot of church so the music is our confessional"
BB

------------------------------

Proud Member of The Young Curmudgeons

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Mon Dec-22-03 01:32 PM

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11. "it's not the time of the arrival that matters"
In response to Reply # 1


          

>I just picked up Reflection Eternal after much hype. I
>finally felt it was time to delve in to T.K.'s stuff. It has
>not left my cd player yet.

but that you arrived . . .the train of thought.

the record has yet to disappoint after many-a repeated listens.

try to at least dl most of the earlier Reflection Eternal stuff back in Rawkus' glory, and definitely acquaint yourself with Black Star if you haven't already .

  

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te_pakeha
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2545 posts
Mon Dec-22-03 12:10 PM

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2. "LOL"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

If Kweli wants "Best OKAYartist of the year" then he can't release against the Roots. Common too for that matter.

Quality was a good album, Electric Circus was great but Phrenology started off brilliant and gets better with every listen. I'm prediciting the Tipping Point will dothe same.

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Mon Dec-22-03 12:17 PM

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4. "2002 breakdown"
In response to Reply # 2
Mon Dec-22-03 12:18 PM

          

>If Kweli wants "Best OKAYartist of the year" then he can't
>release against the Roots. Common too for that matter.

i know, it goes against my greater conscience too.

>Quality was a good album, Electric Circus was great but
>Phrenology started off brilliant and gets better with every
>listen.

Quality-Beat .5 Lyric
Electric Circus-Beats:8.5 Lyrics: 6.5
Phrenology-Beats: 7.5 Lyrics: 8.5 (points taken off for missing Malik B)

averaging total numbers is how i could point Quality the 2002 crown.

also, just on innate feeling alone, Phrenology did not have what i had come to expect from the group (Roots for dummies.) too many moments of mediocrity with greatness merely sprinkled in. Quality delivered more in the opposite direction of that equation.

  

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misteranonymity
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1111 posts
Mon Dec-22-03 12:26 PM

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5. "Lyrics 6.5 my ass!"
In response to Reply # 4


  

          

If the musical aesthetic of EC felt overwhelming at times, Com's lyrics held it down fiercely.

"Just because we're well-spoken and intelligent doesn't mean we're not human."
--?uestlove, justifying why the Roots have a stripper pole in their studio

  

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G_Smooth
Member since Oct 07th 2003
4109 posts
Mon Dec-22-03 12:31 PM

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6. "RE: Co Sign"
In response to Reply # 5


          

Electric Circus was all Lyrics....The Beats were so so....too much rock ish

  

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Lardlad95
Member since Jul 31st 2002
66339 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 06:00 AM

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18. "If Kweli is on some RE type shit again then..."
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

no one touches him on lyrics


So Said the Pro-Black Prophet:

You are righteous, but a God fearing Devil.Saved by grace, but lost by humanity

The history of all hitherto existing society(2) is the history of class struggles-Karl Marx


"Man is born free but is everywhere in chains"-Jean Jacques Rousseau

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Mon Dec-22-03 01:12 PM

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8. "not the point of the post, people"
In response to Reply # 5


          

let's focus now . . .plus-"lady, that smoke is bothering me"

  

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te_pakeha
Charter member
2545 posts
Mon Dec-22-03 12:41 PM

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7. "RE: 2002 breakdown"
In response to Reply # 4


  

          


>Quality-Beat .5 Lyric
>Electric Circus-Beats:8.5 Lyrics: 6.5
>Phrenology-Beats: 7.5 Lyrics: 8.5 (points taken off for
>missing Malik B)
>

See I'd rate it

Quality: Beats 7 Lyrics 8
Electric Circus: Beats 8.5 Lyrics 7.5
Phrenology: Beats 9 Lyrics 8

You can't take marks off for Malik B not being there, you gotta judge albums on their own merits. Phrenology didn't sound like TFA, but so what? TFA didn't much sound like IH nor did IH sound much like DYWM.

Kweli IMO, and it is just IMO, sounds heaps better with a partner in crime on the mic. Maybe it's the greatness of Blackstar that casts a shadow upon him, but while I like Reflection Eternal and Quality quite a lot, they're not great albums, emanig albums that have a good shot at standing the test of time.

But it's all just opinion eh?

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Mon Dec-22-03 01:22 PM

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9. "Reflection Eternal"
In response to Reply # 7


          

>Kweli IMO, and it is just IMO, sounds heaps better with a
>partner in crime on the mic.

perhaps, but i think he works to a greater extent solo w/out Mos than BT does without the occasional appearance of Malik B.

i think the biggest collaboration abscence wasn't missing Mos Def, but lacking Hi-Tek beats.

>Maybe it's the greatness of
>Blackstar that casts a shadow upon him, but while I like
>Reflection Eternal and Quality quite a lot, they're not
>great albums, emanig albums that have a good shot at
>standing the test of time.

i could see how you could differ with me over Quality (i'm generally in the minority when it comes to thinking of the album), but i can't imagine Reflection Eternal in any other light but "great."

>But it's all just opinion eh?

of course . . . (unless Quest says it, then it's fact)

  

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Gjerky_dude
Member since Sep 11th 2003
2518 posts
Mon Dec-22-03 12:12 PM

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3. "I"
In response to Reply # 0


          

just want the nigga to diversify his cadence and get some heat from hitek and even j-zone and have some fun wit his rhymes!




DAMN RIGHT I'M AN ASSHOLE YOU PUSSIES AINT EVEN HALF AS TIGHT (Qwel)





http://profiles.myspace.com/users/5917005
add me to your list im friendless!!



"my uprock is written I'm like the blue collar that punched the clock i'm never quittin!" AN-ION

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Mon Dec-22-03 01:28 PM

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10. "i don't play the guitar, i play my cadence-"
In response to Reply # 3


          

>just want the nigga to diversify his cadence and get some
>heat from hitek and even j-zone and have some fun wit his
>rhymes!

very true. he generally has this standard as-many-words-per-line-possible flow that doesn't always benefit the beat or song in whole.

some J-Zone production would be very nice.

also, since Kweli did Raw Shit with Dilla, who also produced some stuff on Quality, i'd expect a return visit from Jay Dee. this i wouldn't mind, though his tracks have let me down just a little compared to past efforts.

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Mon Dec-22-03 01:36 PM

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12. "footnote-"
In response to Reply # 0


          

if Pharoahe Monch stops effing around and duplicates the glory of Agent Orange in 04, then my idea might be (further) flawed.

  

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0NE L0VE
Member since Oct 21st 2003
7368 posts
Mon Dec-22-03 02:00 PM

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13. "It's Impossible To Say"
In response to Reply # 12


  

          

Com's album (w/ Kanye production) is gonna be crazy.

Despite what many people think, IMO Phrenology was much the second best album of 2002 (Lost Tapes was first).

Quality was solid. Just had the misfortune of following Black Star and Reflection Eternal albums.

_____________________________
"If you had any idea who I was, or what I've done in the past, you'd know that i'm not bluffing."
-Jack fukking Bauer


www.vondarrien.wordpress.com
http://twitter.com/Vondarrien

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Mon Dec-22-03 03:36 PM

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14. "2004 looks nice"
In response to Reply # 13


          

>Com's album (w/ Kanye production) is gonna be crazy.

i wonder how many songs dude is doing for him. i figure we'll still get a large percentage of Dilla-?uestlove production (not that i'm mad at that.) and bring back No I.D.

>Quality was solid. Just had the misfortune of following
>Black Star and Reflection Eternal albums.

definitely some daunting work to trail. i think it was more a cause of beats than lyrics that were lacking.

  

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GROOVEPHI
Charter member
10630 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 03:20 AM

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15. "RE: It's Impossible To Say"
In response to Reply # 13


  

          

>Com's album (w/ Kanye production) is gonna be crazy.
>
>Despite what many people think, IMO Phrenology was much the
>second best album of 2002 (Lost Tapes was first).

lost tapes was a hot album. definitely in my top 5. i cant remember everything that dropped in 02, but quality, EC, phrenology were good. i was a bit disappointed in phrenology, and it took me a few listens to believe in EC..quality is definitely a sleeper album tho.
>
>Quality was solid. Just had the misfortune of following
>Black Star and Reflection Eternal albums.

  

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theScholar3000
Member since Nov 27th 2003
32156 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 11:59 AM

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31. "RE: It's Impossible To Say"
In response to Reply # 13


  

          

>Despite what many people think, IMO Phrenology was much the
>second best album of 2002 (Lost Tapes was first).

LMAO, how the hell you figure the lost tapes to the best album of 02'

The Fix outshined that one, okay...player
*****-*-***** - *****-*****

Why did you run off secretly and deceive me? Why didn't you tell me, so I could send you away with joy and singing to the music?

The fool says in his heart,
"There is no God."

The revolution will not be televised/it will be waged and revised/by the principalities/to remove all falicies/so the truth can and will be known/have you now been shown? - the5philosopher

When you hear of wars and revolutions, do not be frightened. These things must happen first, but the end will not come right away.

Come, I'll tear up all my poems
for just a little piece
of you...

  

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phenompyrus
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9367 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 05:01 AM

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16. "disagree but..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

i dont doubt that talib's new album will be fire. but 'the tipping point' is gonna be the okayplayer album next year. i never understood why ppl hated so much on 'phrenology' and 'electric circus'. they were both good albums, even if they made the artist come off a little different. and i wouldnt say that 'quality' was as good as the reflection eternal and black star albums. also, it sounds that common's new one is gonna be a throwback pleasure. but in the end, no matter what happens, the roots, common, and talib are all going to have great albums this year.

http://twitter.com/phenompyrus

Get Out the Room
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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 07:33 AM

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24. "RE: disagree but..."
In response to Reply # 16


          

>i dont doubt that talib's new album will be fire.

that was my my goal with the post, to shine some light with that focus. any criticism i had was meant to be secondary.

>but 'the
>tipping point' is gonna be the okayplayer album next year.

i guess it's just easier for me to run with the underdog.

>never understood why ppl hated so much on 'phrenology' and
>'electric circus'. they were both good albums, even if they
>made the artist come off a little different.

personal preference is the only "excuse"

>and i wouldnt
>say that 'quality' was as good as the reflection eternal and
>black star albums.

didn't mean to imply that.

>but in the end, no matter
>what happens, the roots, common, and talib are all going to
>have great albums this year.

and let's hope people outside of message boards and rock magazines agree this time.

  

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ralph_s invisible man
Member since Jul 30th 2003
714 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 05:48 AM

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17. "interesting"
In response to Reply # 0
Tue Dec-23-03 05:52 AM

  

          

i think he definitely has much in his favor for this new release. I feel that of the OKP 'trinity,' his is the album that is the least discussed, as compared to com and the roots, but this leaves him at a vantage point. i still believe that phrenology was better than quality in terms of production, b/c despite the 'over-produced' sound of the songs, they were still coherent and flowed together, while quality suffered from a disfigured set of beats, albeit good. Lyrically, kweli was flawless, perhaps half a pt over black thought. But kweli does sound better to me with Mos, kinda of like watching NY Undercover without Malik Yoba's Partner, y' know?

I think of the three, though, kweli still has perhaps the most fire in his heart, and has the greates potential for the future. His lyrics are great, perhaps his cadence should be developed more, like com, i dunno. BUT, in terms of musical selection, this is what gets me excited. We kinda know where the roots are going, we kinda know where com is going, but KWELI IS THE WILD CARD. Cause he keeps to himself it seems, you dont see him in a lot of mags and such, or photo shoots. He keeps us in the dark, and I like that ("they always said he was the quiet type, who'da known that he was frontin?"). I still have a fantasy album of a collabo with him and Earth, Wind, And Fire, dude, that would be so fucking ill

com still my #1 mc, though

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 07:44 AM

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25. "Beautiful Struggle: Undercover"
In response to Reply # 17


          

>i think he definitely has much in his favor for this new
>release. I feel that of the OKP 'trinity,' his is the album
>that is the least discussed, as compared to com and the
>roots, but this leaves him at a vantage point.

yeah, definitely. 2002 his was least discussed as well, and in that way it kinda snuck up on the people. silent but deadly.

>Lyrically, kweli was flawless, perhaps half a pt over
>black thought. But kweli does sound better to me with Mos,
>kinda of like watching NY Undercover without Malik Yoba's
>Partner, y' know?

Ha

interesting way of looking at it. greatness makes all better, so any time Mos wants to get on a track with Kweli (still begging for that BlackStar) i'll be happy.

i guess it's like the crime still gets solved but something is missing on the way to the courthouse.

>I think of the three, though, kweli still has perhaps the
>most fire in his heart, and has the greates potential for
>the future.

yeah, man has heart and integrity without letting himself get corrupted by labels, popularity, an Atlanta songstress, or otherwise.

>BUT, in terms of
>musical selection, this is what gets me excited. We kinda
>know where the roots are going, we kinda know where com is
>going, but KWELI IS THE WILD CARD. Cause he keeps to himself
>it seems, you dont see him in a lot of mags and such, or
>photo shoots. He keeps us in the dark, and I like that
>("they always said he was the quiet type, who'da known that
>he was frontin?").

exactly. he's the underdog, that unknown runner in the race who kinda grabs your attention on the outside lane to come from little (hype) to a larger pay off.

>com still my #1 mc, though

to each his own. Pharoahe is still mine, but i'm very pessimistic about an 04 release.

  

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anamoly
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34 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 07:45 PM

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40. "RE: interesting"
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

cosign: com # 1 MC.

  

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gsol
Member since Dec 22nd 2003
9 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 06:44 AM

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19. "RE: Talib Kweli: Beautiful Struggle"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Big ups to Kweli... I relate th=o this nigga because he writes what I feel at times

Shouts to USAF Denver, ATL, Tallahassee!!!

For whom do we aspire to relfect our own peoples death? For who's entertainment shall we sing our agony? In what hopes, that the destroyers aspiring to extinguish us will suffer remorse at the sight of their own fantastic success? The last imbecile to

  

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Mr_Blackwell
Member since Dec 03rd 2003
5 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 07:24 AM

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20. "RE: Talib Kweli: Beautiful Struggle"
In response to Reply # 0


          

I would have to agree with damn near everything that you spit, but as an okayplayer fan you must admit that phernology was not a let down and if you have listened to electric circus more than 3 times you will realize that the album is pure emotion with hard beats. Would you rather listen to music that falls in line with the mass produced "bubble-gum" or something that takes a different approach. Now i admit that it is not quite the same common, but as a revolutionary rapper he is just extending his love of music and showing the versatility he has. What's wrong with that? A hip-hop fan should appreciate that over settling for something less and watered-down!!

And yes......a Blackstar album would be nice and is long overdue!!!

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 07:55 AM

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26. "just to get a rep"
In response to Reply # 20


          

>I would have to agree with damn near everything that you
>spit

uh oh, i didn't know i had a reputation to uphold.

>but as an okayplayer fan you must admit that
>phernology was not a let down and if you have listened to
>electric circus more than 3 times you will realize that the
>album is pure emotion with hard beats.

Phrenology-IMO (only what it is) was a let down. it was Roots for dummies. it was as if they tried to do a million things without delving in too deep on each venture. the sequencing was a let down and the number of tracks on this album that i skip is more than any other Roots album. that being said, lyricism is largely on point and there are a couple moments of greatness (however surrounded by mediocrity.)

Electric Circus-IMO (only what it is) was a weird experience. i revisited for the first time in a couple of months last nite. maybe 6.5 for lyrics was a little harsh (7.5 more like it) but i was very disappointed from what i thought was missing in that department compared to previous albums by Common. the beats are hit and miss. there is some stuff that is simply incredible, and other stuff that while it may not be bad may not be for me (New Wave / The Hustle / Come Close / I Got a Right Ta.) when it's good it's great, but when it settles back down it sinks and shows some holes.

>Would you rather
>listen to music that falls in line with the mass produced
>"bubble-gum" or something that takes a different approach.
>Now i admit that it is not quite the same common, but as a
>revolutionary rapper he is just extending his love of music
>and showing the versatility he has. What's wrong with that?

nothing, but quality is still quality, whether you're effing with some simple boom-bap or a song with Stereolab on the hook.

i'm not trying to suggest i like Electric Circus less than a Cash Money record (or something in that same vein.) plus, i was judging dude in comparison to what i had come to know, LWFC for example.

  

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BarTek
Member since Nov 10th 2002
51250 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 07:28 AM

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21. "RE: Talib Kweli: Beautiful Struggle"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

you are mistaken. plus, this is rather embarassing. peace.

let's play ping pong ■

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 07:30 AM

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22. "why can't we be friends?"
In response to Reply # 21


          

opinions are like assholes

  

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Knowledge Born
Member since Aug 21st 2002
351 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 07:32 AM

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23. "Esthero..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

definitely needs to get on that thing...she's got the most hypnotic voice...I would prefer her over Vinia Mojica (I know I mispelled that really badly...sue me)

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
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Tue Dec-23-03 07:57 AM

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27. "Tao of Now"
In response to Reply # 23


          

>definitely needs to get on that thing...she's got the most
>hypnotic voice...

he on that song off of Saul Williams LP is incredible to me.

  

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KweliRulezHipHop
Member since Aug 21st 2003
16 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 08:55 AM

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28. "RE: Talib Kweli: Beautiful Struggle"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

i agree wit everythin yu sed

ayo my silent moments, loud as tha crack of thunder

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 10:48 AM

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29. "bias?"
In response to Reply # 28


          

a little

  

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mellow
Charter member
1905 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 11:16 AM

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30. "Quality was not the best of the 3 - It was the worst"
In response to Reply # 0


          

Just my opinion,

But quality was a weak album. Very inconsistent in feel as well the tracks and some of the lyrics were very bland.

Reflection Eternal was an excellent release, I agree with you whole-heartedly, but quality was weak from my standpoint.

  

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theScholar3000
Member since Nov 27th 2003
32156 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 12:13 PM

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32. "RE: Quality was not the best of the 3"
In response to Reply # 30


  

          

Quality was just that, a quality album. It however was not the

best out of his three. (reflection eternal #1, I keep track 20

on repeat)The Beautiful Struggle got a brother anxiously

anticipating the release though, just the name gives you a

sense of what kweli is coming with this next time around.

That's what more artist should do, make their album names more

relevant to the subject matter. Kweli is lightyears ahead of

any emcee in the game, and gets my vote for best emcee.

Who can touch Talib Kweli on the mic?


*****-*-***** - *****-*****

Why did you run off secretly and deceive me? Why didn't you tell me, so I could send you away with joy and singing to the music?

The fool says in his heart,
"There is no God."

The revolution will not be televised/it will be waged and revised/by the principalities/to remove all falicies/so the truth can and will be known/have you now been shown? - the5philosopher

When you hear of wars and revolutions, do not be frightened. These things must happen first, but the end will not come right away.

Come, I'll tear up all my poems
for just a little piece
of you...

  

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Pete Philly
Member since Dec 15th 2003
164 posts
Wed Dec-24-03 03:04 AM

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42. "RE: Quality was not the best of the 3"
In response to Reply # 32


          

I think Quality was just Talibs attempt to break through the surface of the underground, and if that was it's goal, then it did just fine. I mean the only rawkus track that got enough airplay was the one featuring nate dog, right? So I bet it got Talib thinking... But I know that all Talib fans would choose Reflection eternal over Quality in a heartbeat, I know I would...

www.petephilly.com

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Wed Dec-24-03 08:28 AM

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43. "Rawkus track?"
In response to Reply # 42


          

>I think Quality was just Talibs attempt to break through the
>surface of the underground, and if that was it's goal, then
>it did just fine. I mean the only rawkus track that got
>enough airplay was the one featuring nate dog, right? So I
>bet it got Talib thinking...

you mean that Mos Def/Pharoahe Monche/Nate Dogg song? Oh No?

Quality was still on Rawkus. Kweli's only airplay song though was The Blast off of Reflection Eternal.

i think Quality was the "no Hi-Tek" album (for whatever reason) and that's where the difference (weakness) shows up.

  

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_JP
Member since Jan 29th 2003
2433 posts
Wed Dec-24-03 10:54 PM

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44. "RE: Rawkus track?"
In response to Reply # 43
Wed Dec-24-03 10:54 PM

  

          

>Quality was still on Rawkus. Kweli's only airplay song
>though was The Blast off of Reflection Eternal.

"Get By" got A LOT of airplay . . . for a Rawkus song.

<------- The most important release of 2006, coming on July 23.
UPDATE: It's a boy!!!!!!

  

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theScholar3000
Member since Nov 27th 2003
32156 posts
Thu Dec-25-03 12:52 PM

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45. "RE: Rawkus track?"
In response to Reply # 43
Thu Dec-25-03 12:53 PM

  

          

>Quality was still on Rawkus. Kweli's only airplay song
>though was The Blast off of Reflection Eternal.

Don't forget that "Get By" and "Waiting for the DJ" got alot of airplay, but when I think about it the average cat that listens to crossover music probably wouldn't recognize any of these songs.

>i think Quality was the "no Hi-Tek" album (for whatever
>reason) and that's where the difference (weakness) shows up.

I feel where you coming from, but Kweli is nice on the mic. plain and simple I believe that brother could make your head nod to an accopella(MSSM) track that's how nice he is with the flow. but that's just my opinion.
*****-*-***** - *****-*****

Why did you run off secretly and deceive me? Why didn't you tell me, so I could send you away with joy and singing to the music?

The fool says in his heart,
"There is no God."

The revolution will not be televised/it will be waged and revised/by the principalities/to remove all falicies/so the truth can and will be known/have you now been shown? - the5philosopher

When you hear of wars and revolutions, do not be frightened. These things must happen first, but the end will not come right away.

Come, I'll tear up all my poems
for just a little piece
of you...

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Thu Dec-25-03 07:42 PM

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46. "correction"
In response to Reply # 45


          

>>Quality was still on Rawkus. Kweli's only airplay song
>>though was The Blast off of Reflection Eternal.
>
>Don't forget that "Get By" and "Waiting for the DJ" got alot
>of airplay, but when I think about it the average cat that
>listens to crossover music probably wouldn't recognize any
>of these songs.

i think i meant "Kweli's first airplay song . . ."

yeah, my sister even knows "Get By"

  

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Substantial
Member since Dec 29th 2003
22 posts
Wed Dec-31-03 09:49 AM

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55. "RE: Quality was not the best of the 3"
In response to Reply # 32
Wed Dec-31-03 09:52 AM

  

          

"Who can touch Talib Kweli on the mic?"

Ok well... where should I start? But first keep in mind that I'm a huge Talib fan. But!!! As sick as he is as a lyricist, he lacks a lot of finess. He often sounds like he's readin off the paper. Even with his lyrics as sick as they are he often has filler lines where he over uses "like" he's been doing that for years.

Now for my list.

-Andre "Ice Cold" 3000 (Yall know like I know that most of these emcees were lucky he was singing over most of his songs instead of spitting)

-Wordsworth (If you haven't heard more of his stuff you need to. Peep a Joint called "Apartments". And he sunned damn near everybody on the "Twice in a lifetime" song off the Blackstar album. When my man was in college he wrote his term papers as rhymes. How sick is that? My man rarely drops a filler."

-Pharaoh Monch (need I even explain that one. Like them or not but the source even gave my man 5th illest verse in hip-hop history for something he spit in 1993. And we all know he's only gotten better.

Why go on? But regardless I will be copping or stealing Talib's new project whatever comes first. Should be hot. But the OKP artist album I'm anticipating the most is Common. Just to hear what he does with a Kanye track.

PEace...

Stay in Peace
Substantial

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 12:37 PM

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34. "hmmm"
In response to Reply # 30


          

>Just my opinion,

understood. not like i came with facts either.

>But quality was a weak album. Very inconsistent in feel as
>well the tracks and some of the lyrics were very bland.

i think of the three it was the most lyrically consistent release. maybe i was a little too generous regarding beats, as there were some slipups.

>Reflection Eternal was an excellent release, I agree with
>you whole-heartedly, but quality was weak from my
>standpoint.

yeah, Quality was weak in comparison to Reflection Eternal, i still though can't see it as weak in general.

  

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haj20
Member since Nov 21st 2002
16194 posts
Thu Dec-25-03 11:28 PM

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47. "RE: hmmm"
In response to Reply # 34


          

>i think of the three it was the most lyrically consistent
>release. maybe i was a little too generous regarding beats,
>as there were some slipups.

>yeah, Quality was weak in comparison to Reflection Eternal,
>i still though can't see it as weak in general.


i agree with you, of the three Quality was the best, it wasnt the best with the beats but lyrically it wasnt weak at all, i think the lyrics make up for the not so great music..i dont understand how people can say Quality wasnt good, did they actually listen to it?

_________________________

  

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_JP
Member since Jan 29th 2003
2433 posts
Fri Dec-26-03 12:07 AM

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48. "RE: hmmm"
In response to Reply # 47


  

          

well, I agree that Quality was good, but Phren was better. I would rank them 1) Phren, 2) Quality, 3) EC.

<------- The most important release of 2006, coming on July 23.
UPDATE: It's a boy!!!!!!

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Sat Dec-27-03 10:21 AM

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49. "just to add"
In response to Reply # 48


          

>well, I agree that Quality was good, but Phren was better.
>I would rank them 1) Phren, 2) Quality, 3) EC.

Phrenology doesn't sound like a complete album to me, but rather just a collection of songs ranging from mediocre to good. Quality, for whatever faults one wants to pin on it, sounds like a complete album, intro to ending. Start to finish it's solid, and since the beats slipped a little, this can all largerly be attributed to the skills of one Talib Kweli.

Phrenology does have the better album cover.

  

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_JP
Member since Jan 29th 2003
2433 posts
Sat Dec-27-03 02:12 PM

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50. "RE: just to add"
In response to Reply # 49


  

          

Well, I put it like this: I skip more songs when I listen to Quality then when I listen to Phren.

<------- The most important release of 2006, coming on July 23.
UPDATE: It's a boy!!!!!!

  

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BarTek
Member since Nov 10th 2002
51250 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 12:19 PM

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33. "RE: Talib Kweli: Beautiful Struggle"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

"when i think of Talib Kweli and listen to him i feel nothing but sincerity and honesty. i doubt he'll let labels (record or otherwise) convict and jeopardize that integrity he's been working with this many years."

lol

whatever. and quality was not quality. it was wack.

let's play ping pong ■

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 02:25 PM

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35. "please write to my fan club"
In response to Reply # 33


          

if you're gonna be this dedicated of a follower.

>whatever. and quality was not quality. it was wack.

care to share some more of your glorious insights in full? i'm always looking for "fresh opinions."

  

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DawgEatah
Charter member
49225 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 02:59 PM

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36. "Wow, look in your mailbox for your "news update" prize"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Just playin. I hope your right. Kweli is a Top 10 emcee and I hope he gives us what we've been waiting for (i mean aside from another Blackstar album).

Have a Happy Holiday, rick.

*peace*



A Invasion!

"i weave a web so intricately that the english dictionary lacks an adjective to fit me" ~brother ali


=


OG OKP.
I don't come around as often but I check in now & then.

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 07:19 PM

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38. "this post will remain in the minds of my foes"
In response to Reply # 36


          

forever in infamy (c) ~Pharoahe

>Kweli is a Top 10 emcee
>and I hope he gives us what we've been waiting for (i mean
>aside from another Blackstar album).

definitely top 10. no gimmicks, just heart, man is a writer in the truest (and corniest) sense. and i better get my muthafuckin BlackStar album next year.

>Have a Happy Holiday, rick.

you as well

  

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fuji__
Member since Apr 05th 2003
99 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 05:01 PM

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37. "i'd just like to add my praise here..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

... this is possibly the most on point statement i have EVER read on these boards, and ive been reading them for many years longer than ive been contributing to them. Talib Kweli is without an ounce our quarter-pound of doubt, in the top5 greatest mcs of our current time. And the criteria is simple, all Ceremonies require a keen social awareness, fluidity, fun, happiness, dissatisfaction and a dope playlist. Talib is mos-definately a master of such events in the rawest sense of the word. I second your production requests Rick and eagerly await the new record in hope that it will combine the rawness and streetsensabilites of Blackstar, the conscience and flow of Train of thought, and the fun and bounce of Quality. Peace to Talib this christmas. im out like busta douglas, peace.




-1ooooshadowS-

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 07:22 PM

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39. "*bows*"
In response to Reply # 37


          

>... this is possibly the most on point statement i have EVER
>read on these boards, and ive been reading them for many
>years longer than ive been contributing to them.

thanks much

>Talib Kweli
>is without an ounce our quarter-pound of doubt, in the top5
>greatest mcs of our current time. And the criteria is
>simple, all Ceremonies require a keen social awareness,
>fluidity, fun, happiness, dissatisfaction and a dope
>playlist. Talib is mos-definately a master of such events in
>the rawest sense of the word. I second your production
>requests Rick and eagerly await the new record in hope that
>it will combine the rawness and streetsensabilites of
>Blackstar, the conscience and flow of Train of thought, and
>the fun and bounce of Quality.

where do i cosign? hell yeah on all points. especially on your "keen social awareness" comment. if there was a rapper that i would want to represent hiphop in a political or just generally social forum, it'd be Kweli. honesty.

  

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_JP
Member since Jan 29th 2003
2433 posts
Tue Dec-23-03 09:59 PM

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41. "RE: *bows*"
In response to Reply # 39


  

          

>if there was a rapper
>that i would want to represent hiphop in a political or just
>generally social forum, it'd be Kweli. honesty.

You mean it wouldn't be Lil Jon and Manny Fresh?

<------- The most important release of 2006, coming on July 23.
UPDATE: It's a boy!!!!!!

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Sat Jan-03-04 08:24 PM

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60. "Talib Kweli presents brr dum dum dum"
In response to Reply # 41


          

>You mean it wouldn't be Lil Jon and Manny Fresh?

i just imagined Kweli over a Lil Jon beat. . .interesting.

  

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Why
Member since Oct 21st 2003
898 posts
Mon Dec-29-03 01:20 PM

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51. "RE: Talib Kweli: Beautiful Struggle"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

He'll do the damn thing no doubt.

1) Quality, 2) Phren, 13592) EC.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>>But the people highest up got the lowest self esteem

<<The prettiest people do the ugliest things (c)

  

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jay510
Member since Dec 30th 2003
74 posts
Tue Dec-30-03 06:06 PM

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52. "RE: Talib Kweli: Beautiful Struggle"
In response to Reply # 0
Tue Dec-30-03 06:08 PM

  

          

. sorry for the ramblings, just thought i'd share.

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Wed Dec-31-03 08:38 AM

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53. "pretty much"
In response to Reply # 52


          

>personally, everything kweli and the
>roots have put out is tight. quality and phrenology
>included. personal faves are reflection, of course, and
>illadelph halflife. i know theyre 04 releases will not
>disappoint (... me at least). sorry for the ramblings, just
>thought i'd share.

  

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neehiii
Member since Dec 14th 2002
1109 posts
Wed Dec-31-03 08:48 AM

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54. "Kweli as a RocA Fella?"
In response to Reply # 0


          

I've heard - on Rawkus's site - there's the possibility (which isn't much, really) that Kweli may go to the ROC in 04'.

Seems as if Rawkus is closing shop?

Give me the word, if ya know.

..........................................

Just sayin

Mentally universal.
Physically eternal.
The beautifull part of this?
WE are.

.

Happiness is a DECISION one
makes.

  

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Skripchure
Member since Dec 31st 2003
3 posts
Wed Dec-31-03 07:41 PM

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56. "RE: Kweli as a RocA Fella?"
In response to Reply # 54


          

That'd be crazy....

I can't picture anything like that happening....but Kanye and Talib collabo's like crazy....

  

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neehiii
Member since Dec 14th 2002
1109 posts
Thu Jan-01-04 10:44 PM

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57. "RE: Kweli as a RocA Fella?"
In response to Reply # 56


          

well, apparenty it's on the boards...

..........................................

Just sayin

Mentally universal.
Physically eternal.
The beautifull part of this?
WE are.

.

Happiness is a DECISION one
makes.

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Fri Jan-02-04 07:24 AM

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59. "just because it's on some message boards"
In response to Reply # 57


          

doesn't make it true.

i think he wouldn't necessarily fit in with the rest of the crew at R-O-C, but it could be a mutually beneficial venture (though he would gain more.)

  

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neehiii
Member since Dec 14th 2002
1109 posts
Thu Jan-01-04 10:46 PM

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58. "RE: Kweli as a RocA Fella?"
In response to Reply # 56


          

+, Kweli would become the gap that is left by what's his name. In a new interesting way?

..........................................

Just sayin

Mentally universal.
Physically eternal.
The beautifull part of this?
WE are.

.

Happiness is a DECISION one
makes.

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Thu Jan-08-04 01:20 PM

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61. "^"
In response to Reply # 58


          

>+, Kweli would become the gap that is left by what's his
>name. In a new interesting way?

  

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Ocsis
Member since Jul 02nd 2003
313 posts
Thu Jan-08-04 02:30 PM

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62. "This post is a master piece... Well expressed!"
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...

It is ... what it is

  

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ricky_BUTLER
Member since Jul 06th 2003
16899 posts
Tue Jan-13-04 08:44 AM

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63. "Hi-Tek!"
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spitkicker.com:

Kweli has been working in on his new Lp titled 'Beautiful Struggle'. So far the album has cameos from Common, Killer Mike, Faith, and Mary J. Blige. He has production from Hi-Tek, Kanye West, and others. It sounds like he's on his way to another great album.

  

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