For those who aren't familiar, read 1 Samuel 13 and take it up to 2 Samuel 1, so that basically you are introduced to two Biblical figures, Jonathan, a warrior and the son of Saul, and David, who would become the most famous king of Israel and the earliest ancestor of Jesus.

Basically, in the text, by chapter 18, David and Jonathan bond themselves together before God. The nature of that bond is up for debate, but basically Jonathan seriously has David's back during this whole book. Unusually enough, David turns down marriage to a woman not once, not twice, but three times during the course of this book. But he and Jonathan stay close until David goes off to do some serious fighting.

In 2 Samuel 1, David finds out that Saul and Jonathan have been killed by the Philistines, and he offers this elegy for Jonathan (2 Samuel 1:26):

"I grieve for you, Jonathan my brother;
you were very dear to me.
Your love for me was wonderful,
more wonderful than that of women."

Now, please don't respond unless you have read the whole thing. But my question for y'all is, how do you interpret this? Do you put a possibly .... David in the same category with 700 wives Solomon? Or do you just say that David being .... is not a valid interpretation of the relationship between him and Jonathan?

Let's talk about it.

<<<No that's not me.

"i love gay porn
those men suck a dick like it's the fountain of youth
it makes me want some" © EurekaFish

me and my best friend used to say, we'll never let a ni**a come between us...and I ain't gay.

let us pray

~~~~~~

They do. I've heard a number of messages about the friendship of Jonathan and David.

Don't remember it at all. How did they describe the friendship/what was the purpose of the sermon? I think it's an interesting text is all. Open for discussion.

<<<No that's not me.

"i love gay porn
those men suck a dick like it's the fountain of youth
it makes me want some" © EurekaFish

I remember it being described as a great friendship. Something that every man needs, a Male friend who has his back no matter what. That their love for one another was great testament to true friendship.

david was one of the greatest prophets, for all things holy , do not disgrace his legacy with this bullshit.
Jesus Christ quoted david dawg.
in some countries ppl will kill u for saying some shit like this

~~~~~~

Ain't no need to get all angry, man, a good debate over Scriptures shouldn't bother you.

<<<No that's not me.

"i love gay porn
those men suck a dick like it's the fountain of youth
it makes me want some" © EurekaFish

to suit ur lifestyle which is in DIRECT OPPOSITION to Gods will.
i was just talking to a girl from antigua and she was telling how her cuzins back home hunt down gays and kill them, and i thought she was a lil extreme, cause she totally supported it, but sometimes yall be saying some wild shit and it make ppl wanna do something man

~~~~~~

is okay with God?

shy is your sig directed only to Black men????/

but i dont try to rationalize my actions as normal
matter fact i openly admit my lifestyle is wrong
and that is the PRIMARY reason why i STOPPED going to church, cause i know i'm living wrong and i'm not a fucking crazy hypocrite

~~~~~~

Don't expect to see me there with you, though.

You have inspired me to forever turn my back on the human race. Congratulations.

God is a gracious and mercyful God, he wouldnt torture his children for eternity. Jesus decribes "hell" as hades, which is a sleep like state where u know nothing , feel nothing, are nothing. u simply return to earth never to be resurrected. read the bible fam. the devil is the one that will be chained up in fire

~~~~~~

U WERE RAISED A JW LOL!!!

FLUD_OF_IP<===elder's son

<----Me :Courtesy of Deluge

http://brownskinlaydee.blogspot.com/

but nice to you.

Okay, then.

And while it's on my mind, a number the laws in Leviticus are the words and rules of MAN, not God (including that one that adorns your sig, as well as laws about not mixing dairy and meat, wearing blended clothing, making regular sacrifices, and other laws listed in that same section of Leviticus that people just seem to conviently ignore.)

After all, why would God make a law that commanded you to kill someone, if one of the Ten Commandments was "thou shalt not kill?" Isn't that contradictory?

Yeshua boiled down everything we needd to follow to get to heaven to one word: LOVE. Love and respect go hand in hand. But it takes respect to get respect.

u crazy
i'm convinced

~~~~~~

IRONY

ﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲ

"...Regarr-Less to da facKK ... " (c) Fantasia Burrino

"...No Man Is Your Friend / No Man is Your Enemy ... Every Man is Your Teacher..."

"....I have come to the conclusion that my addictions are just habits... I don't Crave power anymore, I just want it because I always had it." -- Brerr Redding

ﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼ

>david was one of the greatest prophets

didn't know that david was a prophet.

thought was just an anointed King

Do you read?! He was a king. The prophet of his times was Nathan. The writers of the text do more disgrace to David's legacy than any slander ever could. Ease up and read chief...

<-----Ill Windmill!-------



***The universe is balanced with good and evil...Your next act will tip the scales***

what are they supposed to say about it?


★☆★☆★-☆-★☆★☆★ - ★☆★☆★-☆-★☆★☆★ - ★☆★☆★


OKP Anti-Fanclub Fanclub™: The fanclubs haven't gotten carried away...but they need to be
*****-*-***** - *****-*-***** - *****-*-*****

¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤
usually i don't do this but uuu... keep the S!G going
*****-*-***** - *****-*-***** - *****-*-******
I'm the man you think you are.... If you want to know what I'll do, figure out what you'll do. I'll do the same thing--only more of it. - Malcolm X

"it's better to have fought for redemption than to just sit silently sulking over the past" theScholar3000

When you hear of wars and revolutions, do not be frightened. These things must happen first, but the end will not come right away.

... is everywhere. It is all around us. Even now in this very message board ...

Come, I'll tear up all my poems
for just a little piece
of you...

And all you had to do was cut and paste? That's goofy. Did you read the whole passage? I asked folks to read the whole passage b4 commenting.

<<<No that's not me.

"i love gay porn
those men suck a dick like it's the fountain of youth
it makes me want some" © EurekaFish

the love of a brother... just like you would love your own brother, mother, father more than your woman...

★☆★☆★-☆-★☆★☆★ - ★☆★☆★-☆-★☆★☆★ - ★☆★☆★


OKP Anti-Fanclub Fanclub™: The fanclubs haven't gotten carried away...but they need to be
*****-*-***** - *****-*-***** - *****-*-*****

¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤
usually i don't do this but uuu... keep the S!G going
*****-*-***** - *****-*-***** - *****-*-******
I'm the man you think you are.... If you want to know what I'll do, figure out what you'll do. I'll do the same thing--only more of it. - Malcolm X

"it's better to have fought for redemption than to just sit silently sulking over the past" theScholar3000

When you hear of wars and revolutions, do not be frightened. These things must happen first, but the end will not come right away.

... is everywhere. It is all around us. Even now in this very message board ...

Come, I'll tear up all my poems
for just a little piece
of you...

if you had you'd have come across the section where D & J are in a field together all night and fall into an embrace and a kiss.

i don't spend time like that w/my family members. i dunno about you.

fuck you.

niggas loved him more then they loved theyself. wasnt no gay shit. niggas was just down to die for him, simple as that.
gay ppl try to twist shit to adjust to they twisted logic

~~~~~~

At least read the text before you come with knee-jerk reactions.

<<<No that's not me.

"i love gay porn
those men suck a dick like it's the fountain of youth
it makes me want some" © EurekaFish

relax

~~~~~~

Or maybe not.

<<<No that's not me.

"i love gay porn
those men suck a dick like it's the fountain of youth
it makes me want some" © EurekaFish

But for the sake of being neighborly, yes, I am. And I think a lot of us have not read half of the things in the Bible. For example, Elisha called a she-bear to kill 40 kids who mocked him for being bald. Who knows that?

Now I have a question, did you read the passage before you started replying?

<<<No that's not me.

"i love gay porn
those men suck a dick like it's the fountain of youth
it makes me want some" © EurekaFish

response.

>But for the sake of being neighborly, yes, I am. And I think
>a lot of us have not read half of the things in the Bible.
>For example, Elisha called a she-bear to kill 40 kids who
>mocked him for being bald. Who knows that?
>

Wild Story....

>But for the sake of being neighborly, yes, I am. And I think
>a lot of us have not read half of the things in the Bible.
>For example, Elisha called a she-bear to kill 40 kids who
>mocked him for being bald. Who knows that?
2 she-bears. Read 2 Kings 2:24, partna...

"It shows you there that white folks have a subtlety about them. What do we want? We want our reparations right? We want that mule and 40 acres right? They gave us our mule in Eddie Murphy, a talking mule. They said “here niggas, here's a talking mule, no

but they only consider them to be great friends...there really isn't anything that says that it was more than that, but people read whatever they want into the scripture since it doesn't give full details...

but as far as loving your friend more than a woman, i can understand that, esp when you haven't met the right woman yet. your boy is there throughout everything *pause* when women might have did u wrong.
if you've ever lost a best friend you'd understand...

Thanks for your input. All I'm saying is, the text is remarkable. But you are right, every guy should have that type of ride-or-die companion. It just seems to me like they had a very deep friendship, perhaps "more than friends", but what does "more than friends" mean outside our narrow cultural context, anyway?

<<<No that's not me.

"i love gay porn
those men suck a dick like it's the fountain of youth
it makes me want some" © EurekaFish

finally some good debate in GD...you should post this activist as well.

*waits for the fireworks*

i'll say this though about the initial question...preachers are scared to touch scriptures that's not dictated by their denomination. so that makes me wonder...how can you claim to be a doer of "god's word" and you knitpick which parts you gonna preach about.

peace.

---------
<= "Tomorrow" Romare Bearden

and his writings about 'Gatekeepers' in Dagara culture. There is no purpose in continuing to try and justify your orientation to a group of people you know have been conditioned to be intolerant. That is counterproductive to your own mental health and esteem. Furthermore you are quoting from a book that also contains the leviticus verses that SPM has in his sig, so it will all come down to subjectivity. In other words you will not win that battle- and is it a battle that needs to be fought? Anyway, do a google on Malidoma Patrice Some and go to a bookstore and find the book by his ex-wife Sonbonfu Some. It's called 'The Spirit of Intimacy'.

Good luck.

------------------
One Hundred.

an intelligent and informed reply.

thank you, castro.

peace.

---------
<= "Tomorrow" Romare Bearden

it's intelligent. i have to give credit where it is due.

95% of the replies have been of little or no substance and an attack on the poster...that's not the type of debate i was looking for.

peace.

---------
<= "Tomorrow" Romare Bearden

but you should assume that just went over her head. for your own sanity

plain and simply stated, this is a reaching attempt by homosexuals to biblically justify their behavior...

two dudes can't be friends?

i'm not going to be belligerent about it, but i disagree.

Or are people just gonna come into this post with pre-conceived notions?

Man, why I even ask that question, I know the damn answer.

<<<No that's not me.

"i love gay porn
those men suck a dick like it's the fountain of youth
it makes me want some" © EurekaFish

------------------
One Hundred.

you posted it like noones heard of jonathon...like preachers avoid him or something...

DID U READ IT?
lmao

~~~~~~

How the hell you gon' turn down not one, not two, but THREE women? They were lovers. Period. Point blank, that's it, and get over it.

I love the King James Version for its simplicity. People complain about not understanding the old english, but it's really all there if you understand what the words mean. And if you take some time and learn about the customs of the time and biblical euphemisms for sex, it all becomes clear.

Pastors come with standard with anti gay rhetoric. So they won't touch Johnathan and David except to say that they were "good friends". Even if a pastor believes they were lovers, he's not going to preach that for fear of angering his congregation.

People need to remember that the Bible is an historical tome. Things mentioned in the Bible actually happened, these were REAL people being talked about, and the same shit we go through today, they went through back then. There's creeping in the Bible, putting hits out on people in the Bible, kidnapping, rape and drug use, even. Men been falling in love with other men since time began, so naturally the Bible will mention it. And really, it's OK! That black people have got to be the most gay bashing folks on the planet (in word and in deed) really upsets me.

And SPM? Homophobia is so 80s, dude. That's just not too bright of you, and it disappoints me that you would think the way you do. Grow up--free your mind, and your ass will follow. What does it serve you to hold onto this outdated mode of thinking?

______________________________________

amazin they ungrateful after all The Game I gave away

http://i30.tinypic.com/e9x4xi.jpg

some the nicest ppl i know are gay. they still are confused and living in opposition to God. simple as that. and i aint the only one that feels this way. i dont know ANYONE off these boards that supports gay marriage,etc

cept for the gay ppl i know

~~~~~~

to paraphrase Chris Rock, gay people deserve to be just as miserable as everyone else! But seriously, ALL of those people lining up to get married in Massachusetts last week had been together for a seriously long time. One couple had been together 49 years. Some straight marriages don't last 49 WEEKS, and here's this country, that's been on the wrong side of every civil/human rights issue FOREVER, trynna tell these people that they have no legal rights to each other? Gimme a break.

And who are you to be speaking for what God's will is? How do you know who's living in opposition to God's will and who's not? Does God inbox you every morning with a list of people She wants you to talk shit to?

______________________________________

amazin they ungrateful after all The Game I gave away

http://i30.tinypic.com/e9x4xi.jpg

and there is no reason why gays should get married
homosexuality imo is just a sexual arrangement.
and u must draw the line somewhere, whats next? kids marrying adults?

~~~~~~

for centuries. only since this whole "statutory rape" shit came along did age *really* become a factor.

like you aint know them old ass men was marrying them 12 year old girls. and thats almost in every culture. soon as the girl get her first period.......

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
No person is your friend who demands your silence, or denies your right to grow. -- Alice Walker ..Humanist of the year 1997



"Heidi Fleiss of OKP" -eclipsedini

"Debbie Downer of OKP" - buildingblock

"if all the chinese foods got in a fight sesame chicken would probably win. those seeds are lethal. I can see eggrolls putting up a fight, but they normally run solo. Sesame chicken is known to stick together." --okp AfroTec

http://www.youtube.com/user/kimmayluv

now..

__________
Power 2 da People

__________
Peace~

http://www.savefreemanbeach.com/

witty.

LMAO.

---------
<= "Tomorrow" Romare Bearden

Maybe not sexual love, but certainly romantic love.

I never found it necessary to declare my love for someone who was just my "best friend" to God. Twice.

to assume that david and jonathan were lovers would take a whole lot of assuming. the beauty of the bible is that you could make a passage lean any way you want but in the end, you gotta really get with God to get the real understanding.

so, lets just assume that they were lovers. does this now mean that just because they did something that it is right? I say no because if we are going to take this part of the bible and use it then we must also use the rest of the bible including the passages that specificaly say that we aren't supposed to engage in homosexual acts. now, for the sake of this argument, lets assume that they did have a sexual relationship. we all have done things (and some are doing things) that are outside of gods will but we can be forgiven. I mean, no one arrives at perfect salvation as soon as they are saved so maybe david did indulge in a sexual act with jonathan but they did not continue it. as a matter of fact david never even indulged in another act after that one! so I say all of that to say this: even if david did have a sexual relationship with jonathan, it by no means justifies a sexual relationship between a man and a man.

<-- this week's "brother I want to get to know better"
kiko ellsworth

dookie love
come gimmie gimmie gimmie that dookie love
come gimmie gimmie gimmie that dookie love
when you see me in v.i.p. with niggas around me
man they gimmie that dookie love....

<-- this week's "brother I want to get to know better"
brian j white

changing the game up like karamo

No one posted this passage looking for "justification", least of all from the parade of morons in GD. The point is to get people thinking outside the box and, as I said previously, realizing that a lot of us don't even KNOW what was written in the Bible. As for the interpretation, you're right, I probably DO need to pray on it. But the point of departure between me and you is that you conflate lust and love. If anything, the passage should be clear in highlighting that TWO MEN CAN LOVE EACH OTHER, regardless of whether they had sex or not. This isn't a post on whether Jonathan and David were lovers, necessarily; it's about what the boundaries of friendship and comradeship really are.

peace

<<<No that's not me.

"i love gay porn
those men suck a dick like it's the fountain of youth
it makes me want some" © EurekaFish

I too belive that men can love one another. as a matter of fact, God tells us that we must do so in order to enter heaven. all I am saying is that it must be made clear that when we add sex to the love of 2 men, it perverts it into something sinful. but as to your point, yes I do believe that men can love, and love hard even.

<-- this week's "brother I want to get to know better"
kiko ellsworth

dookie love
come gimmie gimmie gimmie that dookie love
come gimmie gimmie gimmie that dookie love
when you see me in v.i.p. with niggas around me
man they gimmie that dookie love....

<-- this week's "brother I want to get to know better"
brian j white

changing the game up like karamo

...No one likes to talk about the Apostle Paul's un-named "thorn in the flesh" that he besought the Lord 3 times to take away from him. God's reply: "My grace is sufficient". Paul, mind you was very single his entire life. WHAT ELSE...would be so tormenting as thorn in his flesh that he couldn't handle or manage but was too ashamed to name ?

ﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲ

"...Regarr-Less to da facKK ... " (c) Fantasia Burrino

"...No Man Is Your Friend / No Man is Your Enemy ... Every Man is Your Teacher..."

"....I have come to the conclusion that my addictions are just habits... I don't Crave power anymore, I just want it because I always had it." -- Brerr Redding

ﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼ

because when I was at the point of killing myself because I couldn't get rid of this problem, God gave me that exact scripture and let me know that it is not about getting rid of the desire but about deciding against indulging in it.

<-- this week's "brother I want to get to know better"
kiko ellsworth

dookie love
come gimmie gimmie gimmie that dookie love
come gimmie gimmie gimmie that dookie love
when you see me in v.i.p. with niggas around me
man they gimmie that dookie love....

<-- this week's "brother I want to get to know better"
brian j white

changing the game up like karamo

Homosexual preachers is som'n new that didn't start till Donnie McClurkin came out the closet or until the Catholic priests started gettin caught. . Get over it. It's been around ever since there've BEEN preachers or priests. EVEN in the Bible. They're just not called out as such.

ﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲ

"...Regarr-Less to da facKK ... " (c) Fantasia Burrino

"...No Man Is Your Friend / No Man is Your Enemy ... Every Man is Your Teacher..."

"....I have come to the conclusion that my addictions are just habits... I don't Crave power anymore, I just want it because I always had it." -- Brerr Redding

ﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼ

>Homosexual preachers is som'n new that didn't start till
>Donnie McClurkin came out the closet or until the Catholic
>priests started gettin caught.

Wait. Donnie McClurkin is gay????

really?

I did read that he was raped when he was a boy, but i had no idea. Guess im late.

<-- this week's "brother I want to get to know better"
kiko ellsworth

dookie love
come gimmie gimmie gimmie that dookie love
come gimmie gimmie gimmie that dookie love
when you see me in v.i.p. with niggas around me
man they gimmie that dookie love....

<-- this week's "brother I want to get to know better"
brian j white

changing the game up like karamo

Read his book. He points to the fact that he was molested as a child. Which, admittedly is a very traumatizing ordeal ... but at some point the confusion turns to decision and decision turns to lifestyle etc. You can't blame it on the past your ENTIRE life.

ﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲ

"...Regarr-Less to da facKK ... " (c) Fantasia Burrino

"...No Man Is Your Friend / No Man is Your Enemy ... Every Man is Your Teacher..."

"....I have come to the conclusion that my addictions are just habits... I don't Crave power anymore, I just want it because I always had it." -- Brerr Redding

ﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼ

I am not under the illusion that I will ever be a roaring heterosexual. I just have to make a conscious effort not to act on my desire(a desire that will still be there) to sleep with a man.

<-- this week's "brother I want to get to know better"
kiko ellsworth

dookie love
come gimmie gimmie gimmie that dookie love
come gimmie gimmie gimmie that dookie love
when you see me in v.i.p. with niggas around me
man they gimmie that dookie love....

<-- this week's "brother I want to get to know better"
brian j white

changing the game up like karamo

ﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲ

"...Regarr-Less to da facKK ... " (c) Fantasia Burrino

"...No Man Is Your Friend / No Man is Your Enemy ... Every Man is Your Teacher..."

"....I have come to the conclusion that my addictions are just habits... I don't Crave power anymore, I just want it because I always had it." -- Brerr Redding

ﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼ

seen.

I just did a little reading on Donnie...he is now trying to purge young homosexual boys of their sinful ways or whatever. I remember that when i read of his abuse, my heart was so heavy. I believe I shed a tear. I mean..what a horrific thing to go thru. I can understand how he must have struggled to deal with that thruout his life.

I'm not sure if I'm qualified to say whether the abuse and his subsequent feelings of desire toward other men are linked, but yes I think it does smell like bullshit. The church has been very inconsistent about the 'values' it teaches and it has always struck me as suspect, how there is such an emphasis on the 'abomination' and less emphasis on other forms of 'sexual immorality' like adultery. Furthermore, there is too little emphasis on the Old Testament in general, because if you check that out, there are MANY MANY things in there that'll make ya go 'hmmm' (gang rape, incest etc).

And to the original poster, this is a very interesting extract indeed and i will study it further then comment. Peace to you

not God that places such an emphasis on this. I mean, it is really just a sin of lust not unlike other sins of lust. the church is what made me belive, when I was younger, that i was bound for hell unless I could get rid of my feelings. the shit almost killed me.

<-- this week's "brother I want to get to know better"
kiko ellsworth

dookie love
come gimmie gimmie gimmie that dookie love
come gimmie gimmie gimmie that dookie love
when you see me in v.i.p. with niggas around me
man they gimmie that dookie love....

<-- this week's "brother I want to get to know better"
brian j white

changing the game up like karamo

>not God that places such an emphasis on this. I mean, it is
>really just a sin of lust not unlike other sins of lust. the
>church is what made me belive, when I was younger, that i
>was bound for hell unless I could get rid of my feelings.
>the shit almost killed me.

I'm really sorry that you experienced such a level of inner-conflict. Its not a matter of whether I, personally, condone homosexuality of not. But I do think that a little compassion and understanding is needed...(from the church and also on a personal level). Maybe that would help us to get to The Truth and help us to understand God's will.

And realize that sin is sin. There are no "levels" or "degrees" of it. It all stinks in God's nostrils and invokes his anger. From lying to Gossip to fornication ... and the list goes on. They are all on a level plane. Let's not even discuss the number of fat evangelists who proclaim fire & brimstone upon the heads of everyone else but never condemn their ownselves (or fall under conviction) for GLUTTONY. That one's on the list TOO.

ﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲ

"...Regarr-Less to da facKK ... " (c) Fantasia Burrino

"...No Man Is Your Friend / No Man is Your Enemy ... Every Man is Your Teacher..."

"....I have come to the conclusion that my addictions are just habits... I don't Crave power anymore, I just want it because I always had it." -- Brerr Redding

ﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼ

>And realize that sin is sin. There are no "levels" or
>"degrees" of it. It all stinks in God's nostrils and invokes
>his anger. From lying to Gossip to fornication ... and the
>list goes on. They are all on a level plane. Let's not even
>discuss the number of fat evangelists who proclaim fire &
>brimstone upon the heads of everyone else but never condemn
>their ownselves (or fall under conviction) for GLUTTONY.
>That one's on the list TOO.

Well....ionno about that. Sexual perversion...say, incest, is clearly more abhorrent than, say, eating shellfish. dont u think?

but to God, sin is sin.

<-- this week's "brother I want to get to know better"
kiko ellsworth

dookie love
come gimmie gimmie gimmie that dookie love
come gimmie gimmie gimmie that dookie love
when you see me in v.i.p. with niggas around me
man they gimmie that dookie love....

<-- this week's "brother I want to get to know better"
brian j white

changing the game up like karamo

God hates ALL sin. While one sin may "seem" worse in our eyes (mainly because of the extent of moral depravity one has to go to in order to cross that inner line of constraint) ... in God's eyes...there is one general sin behind ALL sins... disobedience. For this reason it doesn't get "categorized"....it all goes under "I tole ya'll nyggas not to do NONE of this...and you do it anyway.

ﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲ

"...Regarr-Less to da facKK ... " (c) Fantasia Burrino

"...No Man Is Your Friend / No Man is Your Enemy ... Every Man is Your Teacher..."

"....I have come to the conclusion that my addictions are just habits... I don't Crave power anymore, I just want it because I always had it." -- Brerr Redding

ﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼﯼﺉﺕﷲﭏפֿכֿﭺﭼ

<-- this week's "brother I want to get to know better"
kiko ellsworth

dookie love
come gimmie gimmie gimmie that dookie love
come gimmie gimmie gimmie that dookie love
when you see me in v.i.p. with niggas around me
man they gimmie that dookie love....

<-- this week's "brother I want to get to know better"
brian j white

changing the game up like karamo

>God hates ALL sin. While one sin may "seem" worse in our
>eyes (mainly because of the extent of moral depravity one
>has to go to in order to cross that inner line of
>constraint) ... in God's eyes...there is one general sin
>behind ALL sins... disobedience. For this reason it doesn't
>get "categorized"....it all goes under "I tole ya'll nyggas
>not to do NONE of this...and you do it anyway.

I feel you. its just...eating a seafood salad...VS. a lifetime of homosexual activity...

since under the new covenent, we can eat whatever we want as long as we bless it first.

<-- this week's "brother I want to get to know better"
kiko ellsworth

dookie love
come gimmie gimmie gimmie that dookie love
come gimmie gimmie gimmie that dookie love
when you see me in v.i.p. with niggas around me
man they gimmie that dookie love....

<-- this week's "brother I want to get to know better"
brian j white

changing the game up like karamo

>since under the new covenent, we can eat whatever we want as
>long as we bless it first.

Thats a matter of opinion, since Jesus 'did not come to do away with the law' and that train of thought is also part of the problem of Christians picking and choosing what they follow, according to their own personal needs.