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>>nas's style generally doesn't rely on punchlines, wordplay,
>>politics, so i think it's safe to assume he puts a lot of
>>thought into the words and images themselves
>
>I think so too, but you also run the risk of reading into
>something that isn't there. Like the "soap and water" line,
>you could see it as:
>
>1.Nas likes to practice good hygiene.
>2.Nas is referencing a sneaker / street habit.
>3.Nas is introducing a metaphor for the cleansing of himself
>and Hip-Hop.
>
>1 is an oversimplification; 3 reads too much into the line; 2
>explains it well.
>
>I mean, I've spent the last ten months dedicating a blog to
>Nas' lyrics, and while I certainly think he hits on themes /
>extended metaphors that go beyond surface level readings (The
>Rise and Fall is the best example), I don't know how cryptic
>or overly-involved his writing process is.
IMO it's like chess
every move/choice has almost infinite repurcussions (though you can really only think a few moves ahead)
so you can't analyse one move in isolation, the significance is how it links up with other moves
your analysis can't be 'wrong', unless you say 'this is what the plan is' but a later move contradicts that
so what you have is analysis, and at some point you may cross the line between decoding the artist's thoughts and being provoked into thoughts of your own... but that's ok
in the example at hand, no.2 isn't really an explanation because only newcomers wouldn't realize that. no.3 isn't necessarily wrong - other evidence might corroborate it - but even if it's ultimately contradicted, it's right to SEARCH for a deeper significance. I mean whis isn't a line in passing, this the last line on the whole album!
>
>Pound Magazine has a current article where Nas says he finds
>himself spending increasingly less and less time on the
>writing process. So I think he makes references that you have
>to get and connects those along in a cinematic like-fashion
>(We Major, Black Republican), but I also don't know if it's
>*that* much of a maze.
>
>>if you don't look hard, you'll probably miss something. for
>>instance, i was telling people Who Killed It is actually an
>>excellent track, and it would be a good idea to re-listen
>and
>>try to find any more subtleties or allegorical meanings in
>>there... in an inbox, dafriquan pointed out that he blends
>in
>>classic hiphop titles ('walk this way i'll tell you a
>>children's story' etc), which i myself hand't even noticed
>>yet, even though he signposted it with the 'that's the
>reason
>>eric b is not president' line. if you think about it, that
>>line is a bit strange... if you don't think about it any
>more,
>>you'll miss the whole concept and just think nas is prone to
>>writing strange lines
>
>"I Know You Got Soul, you're trying to hide it
>How'd you Kill A Man out in Cypress
>One-Eyed Charlie, he only hangs with the Criminal Minded
>Said you guys did it Doggystyle, is he lying?
>She says, Walk This Way, I'll tell you a Children's Story
>We hit the bodega, got a few forties
>We jumped in my ride, we drove, and she cried
>Twisted Off The Cap there and opened her mouth wide
>Swallowed It, whole bottle's half empty
>Drinks like a fish, now she's past tipsy
>The truth came out as we got to her Suave House
>Chopped 'N Screwed her mouth and sat me on the couch"
>
>I was actually surprised how well Nas worked in all those
>references, since, as you say, wordplay really isn't his
>thing. And I do think you need to get the references to get
>the concept to get the song; however, at the same time, I've
>seen people pull apart the pieces even further, e.g. "she's
>got me in the scope" = "Interscope was responsible for the
>commercialization / murder of the music"; "Two-Face Al" =
>2pac; etc.
>
>What's the expression, "analysis to the point of paralysis"?
>
actually, i like that
isn't the line 'well whadaya know, the whole time she had me in 'er scope'
and, like, people might be surprised to know that Interscope, or Universal Music Group at least, own/control Aftermath AND Death Row AND Def Jam AND Rocafella
as for 2Pac, Two Face Al, that was the first thing i was trying to work out when i replayed the track. the whole story's an allegory so what do the other characters represent?
>>besides, part of having a poetic gift seems to be that your
>>work can generate different interpretations, like it just
>>crosses a certain threshold of depth. also with Nas's subtle
>>brand of multisyllable rhymes, you think 'was that
>>alliteration/assonance deliberate, or is it just a natural
>>product of the language?' and then you realize Nas knows how
>>to capitalize on the language's natural features like that,
>>avoids being restricted to those angular rhyme patterns
>
>Ultimately, I think this should be the point.
>
>I'm trying to remember the quote Lupe had about his lyrics
>sometimes being left intentionally open for interpretation,
>like a good jazz melody, i.e. you lay it down, but it's up to
>the listener's mind to decide "what it means." (I butchered
>the paraphrase, but you can get the basic idea.)
>
well i like the jazz melody comparison cause it shows that there's great skill involved in crafting something that can work like that. i'm not sure exactly how writers arrive at this skill... i suspect they are able to sense what images have the most resonance with people, or like a chess player knowing what move will keep his options open
>>yeah i know that...
>>but he stops on that note, and then starts talking about
>>hiphop being dead, or if you say that it's dead then you
>>killed it, essentially accusing himself, which he's already
>>admitted in interviews. why go from recollecting childhood
>to
>>talking about the current state of hiphop.
>
>Well, I think those last two ideas are certainly connected:
>the essence of Hip-Hop, as represented by the shoe laces, that
>Nas knew so well in his youth is missing from the current
>state of Hip-Hop. He's reminiscing, he's nostalgic, he's
>mourning it. As Foneticcus was saying, that seems to be his
>natural tendency.
>
>This portion from Can't Forget About explains that much:
>
>"I don't wanna keep bringing up the greater times
>But I'm a dreamer, nostalgic with the state of mind
>The past the past, enough of it, aight then
>But nothing gives me chills like Douglas and Tyson
>Or Mike when his talk was live
>Or when he first did the moonwalk on Motown 25"
>
>A.I know it might seem repetitive to keep dwelling on the
>past;
>B.But I gotta remember the past, that's just me doing me.
>C.Seriously, I really do know y'all are tired about hearing me
>reminisce.
>D.Still, shit, that affects me like no other, so here are some
>more memories . . .
>
well in the nat king cole song he IS being nostalgic
but that's just that song
you said 'nostalgic' and Fonneticus said 'fetishizing the past'
as if that explains it
i gotta disagree
what he does on tracks like Hope is not nostalgia or fetishizing, it's what writers do, period. they draw from their well of experience. just like any other writer i'm going to think why he chose that image over the endless other possibilities, i'm not just going to think 'oh, Nas is being nostalgic again' and leave it there just cause it's hiphop
i mean maybe it's nothing as mystic as a 'cleansing metaphor' (maybe it is... jury's still out on the melody that follows)
maybe it's what you or fonneticus was saying about the fashion, style of hiphop inspriing him, but that too would merit looking deeper into. like is this sense of style the essence of hiphop?
maybe it's linked to the 'black ice' metaphor earlier in the verse
or another connotation entirely
>>it's not like
>>he's saying 'in an unforseen attack, the CIA killed hiphop
>in
>>1997'
>
>As I wrote earlier, I especially liked how he wasn't so
>blatant about it, because 1) that allows people to draw their
>own conclusions 2) it's a little pretentious to suggest it can
>be summed up so easily.
>
>Even on a track called Who Killed It, there's not a clear
>culprit really, nor is a specific time or cause of death
>given. "It" simply vanishes.
i just think stuff aint always obvious. like that post up there somewhere where you interpret Who Killed It, you need to put some thought in to reach that conclusion. you can't just say 'oh there's some sort of extended metaphor going on' and leave it there --------------------
Why do you choose to mimic these wack MCs?
Why do you choose to listen to R&B?
"There are obviously many things which we do not understand, and may never be able to." Leela
*puts emceeing in a box*
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