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Subject: "Herm and ASU about to be in some shit" Previous topic | Next topic
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Wed Jun-16-21 07:57 PM

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52. "Herm and ASU about to be in some shit"
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Too bad. I had fully bought in to what Herm was building at ASU and thought they were primed to make the jump this year and win the PAC south.

But ya, miss me with the auto playoff bid for this JV conference...

Yahoo Sports
Sources: NCAA investigating Arizona State football after dossier alleged glut of recruiting violations
Pete Thamel

Earlier this month, an anonymous person sent a dossier of dozens of pages to the Arizona State athletic department. It included screenshots, receipts, pictures and emails related to numerous potential violations within Arizona State’s football program, according to sources.

The NCAA enforcement staff is in possession of those documents, sources told Yahoo Sports. Among the enforcement staff members working on the case is Vic DeNardi, an assistant director of enforcement. And the arrival of those documents to Arizona State compliance chief Steve Webb has ASU officials conducting internal interviews. (The NCAA declined comment.)

Arizona State vice president for media relations Katie Paquet confirmed the NCAA investigation to Yahoo Sports, which was first reported by The Athletic. She declined further comment on specific allegations.

The documentation includes specific evidence of multiple examples of high school prospects taking illicit on-campus recruiting trips to the Arizona State campus. Those came during the pandemic-inspired dead period that ended June 1. For more than a year prior, NCAA rules explicitly banned players from visiting on campus because of COVID-19. The dossier, according to sources, lays out pieces of both the players' trips to campus and how those trips were paid for.

Sources said members of the football program deliberately, blatantly and consistently broke rules related to hosting players during the dead period, including coach Herm Edwards meeting with recruits. A source added that the evidence included pictures of the visits, including Edwards with a recruit who ended up enrolling at ASU. “It’s clear whoever provided it had a ton of access and knowledge of the football program,” a source told Yahoo Sports. “The stuff in there wouldn’t be provided by anyone outside the football program.”

When asked specifically about meeting with recruits and parents during the dead period in a text message, Edwards told Yahoo: “No comment thanks.”

At a time when the application of NCAA rules by the enforcement staff has been fickle, the prospect of ASU committing run-of-the-mill recruiting violations is trumped by the brazen nature of hosting dozens of kids on campus during the pandemic.

Yahoo Sports interviewed more than a dozen current or former ASU staff members this week. Multiple sources indicated that at least 30 players visited campus over a span of months, a practice so common coaches referenced “official visit weekends” in staff meetings, coaches bumped into recruits and families in a back stairwell and a routine developed of facility tours being given around 9 p.m. or 10 p.m. at night.

On one weekend in October, there were so many high school kids visiting that a staff member parked a 12-person van in the staff parking lot to tour around recruits. The visits spanned months, sources said, including some in October, the weekend of the UCLA game in December and through the spring game, which one source said “was like an official visit weekend.”

“It wasn’t a secret,” said a staff member with direct knowledge of the visits. “As far as knowing everyone who came into that office, the number is too big and the names are too many. They would bring in parents, their moms and dads and friends. They’d get a facility tour like they were on an official visit. They’d show you the weight room and training room. They’d show you everything.”

In perhaps the most extreme example of how normalized the illicit recruiting had become, one Bay Area prospect — who enrolled at a rival Pac-12 school — worked out with a position coach at a local park. The video of that workout was shot on a cell phone camera and then evaluated in an offensive staff meeting of more than a dozen coaches. Not only was the workout and visit against the rules, but the staffers evaluated the illegal workout on the illegal visit as if it were a recruit's high school game tape. The staff now must hope that same recruit and others like him don't detail their visits to the NCAA, which has leverage over the players' eligibility.

“The confusing part is why you’d put your career on a 17-year-old senior,” said one source.

The notion of a school repeatedly breaking rules about official visits was offensive to college officials, as it resonates as both a distinct competitive advantage and foolish to attempt to execute during a pandemic.

“It’s a disrespectful thing to do,” Stanford coach David Shaw told Yahoo Sports. “That doesn’t sound overly harsh. But for me being a lifer in this profession and a coach’s kid, I believe in respecting our profession and respecting the other people in the profession. Doing things that you’re not supposed to do just to gain an advantage, I take offense to that.”

Added Notre Dame athletic director Jack Swarbrick: “If there was ever a time when everyone following the same rules was critical, it’s now during a pandemic and during a time of such national scrutiny on college athletics.”

'There's too many disgruntled people'

The arrival of the dossier at Arizona State football became the subject of intense intrigue this week, as it underscored the schism that has divided — and could potentially disrupt — the tenure of fourth-year coach Herm Edwards. While Edwards operates as a mostly hands-off CEO, associate head coach Antonio Pierce has accumulated much of the power in the ASU program thanks to his recruiting reach. His rise to power has been enabled by deputy athletic director Jean Boyd, who oversees football.

With Pierce’s power has also come division, as coaches have lost jobs, recruiting staff have felt pressure to blindly follow Pierce’s aggressive tactics and multiple sources said that those who insisted on avoiding recruiting gray areas were ostracized. That left a running joke on group texts and in phone calls this week about the mystery of who collected and documented all the receipts, emails and screenshots.

“There’s too many disgruntled people,” said one source. “There’s too many people that have been through that program that are frustrated. It could be any one of 10 people.”

Multiple sources indicated that there were numerous staff members — one estimated a half-dozen — “keeping receipts” on illicit recruiting activity. One said that Pierce fostered an “in or out” culture within the program, which created mistrust and fear as he accumulated power and convinced Edwards to bring in recruiting-focused coaches like defensive backs coach Chris Hawkins and receivers coach Prentice Gill. Neither had on-field experience at a Power Five school. They replaced veteran coaches who Pierce didn’t think recruited well enough.

As a distinct “camp” formed around Pierce and those loyal to him, coaches and staffers began collecting evidence as protection for their own jobs. And that’s why it remains a mystery as to who accumulated and sent the dossier, which one source estimated was more than three dozen pages.

“I don’t know who sent it, that’s what stuns me,” said another source. “I don’t know. When you don’t care , and so many people are seeing and knowing what’s going on… When you’re above the law and thumb your nose to it, it’s karma. You reap what you sow.”

How intense are the hard feelings toward ASU?

As social media rumblings of Arizona State’s issues arose this week, two prominent former ASU coaches trolled their former program on Twitter. Kevin Mawae, the NFL Hall of Fame offensive lineman who was passed over for ASU’s offensive line job, put out a bible verse that hinted that ASU’s compliance comeuppance was coming. “For all that is secret will eventually be brought into the open, and everything that is concealed will be brought to light and made known to all.” (He’s since deleted the tweet.)

Dave Christensen, the former Wyoming head coach who retired from ASU in 2020, responded with three emojis — one thinking, one wide-eyed and another with praying hands. (Both declined comment when reached by Yahoo Sports.)

Multiple former staff members told Yahoo Sports they’d be happy to speak to the NCAA, an unusual stance in a football culture that frowns on anyone speaking to the NCAA. It speaks to how divided the staff at ASU became.

“People are crossing their fingers, hoping they can talk to the NCAA,” one former staffer said. “There’s not going to be a lot of holding back — video guys, trainers, equipment guys. You’re going to find people very willing to talk. It’s because (Pierce and his followers) were not nice to the people who are good people. Some people were on board. Some weren’t. If you weren’t on board, you got blackballed.”

Multiple former staffers said that the dozens of recruits who came on campus during the dead period should be easy to track by going through the ASU football building and the surrounding area’s security cameras.

It wasn’t uncommon for Edwards and multiple coaches to host recruits in his office. As the amount of illicit activity rose, tensions simmered in the office. Coaches said that hosting recruits would have been too common to get security officials to agree to shut the cameras off every time a recruit came into the building during a dead period.

“The people who walked the straight and narrow were forced out,” said another former staffer. “The culture that had been festering there had been able to bloom full go. I’m not surprised to hear this.”

When Arizona State athletic director Ray Anderson, a former agent, hired his old client four years ago, the college football world greeted it with a collective skepticism. The experiment had gone OK so far, with ASU going 17-13 through three seasons. Some of ASU’s biggest wins came on the recruiting trail, as quarterback Jayden Daniels chose ASU over a host of bluebloods and the Sun Devils began casting a national net. That’s included recent commitments from New York, Florida, Philadelphia and Louisiana.

That expanded net, and the success in the Los Angeles area where Pierce coached high school, has raised eyebrows around the country.

That recruiting success will surely be viewed through a more skeptical prism in the wake of this NCAA investigation. Coaches view the notion of having recruits visit during a dead period of nearly a year-and-a-half as significant.

“In this specific case, it’s a definite advantage,” Shaw said. “When it’s the first place you see or the only place you see, sometimes the kids feel special. ...To me, that’s always the double-edged sword. This team cheated to get you. Now they’re telling you to follow the rule, they’re going to hold you to a high standard that you can’t meet yourself.”


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CFB and the 12 team playoff expansion [View all] , legsdiamond, Fri Jun-11-21 11:53 AM
Subject Author Message Date ID
Hate the idea but I'll watch it so lets get on w/ it
Jun 11th 2021
no shit. and this is the giant elephant in the room
Jun 11th 2021
      I agree with everything you said, especially the GQP that’s growing
Jun 11th 2021
           its definitely all about the occasional upset
Jun 11th 2021
I hate it. Bring back the BCS
Jun 11th 2021
its not the same model every other college division and high schools use
Jun 11th 2021
I would argue that CFB is approaching the MLB model more
Jun 11th 2021
MLB talent disparity
Jun 11th 2021
This, plus MLB disparity in money for conferences and teams
Jun 11th 2021
      Their def needs to be uniformity across the conferences
Jun 11th 2021
I dont know shit abt baseball, so I'll defer to you on that comparison
Jun 11th 2021
: )
Jun 22nd 2021
I feel like six teams is the perfect number
Jun 11th 2021
I think 8 would’ve worked. Power 5 and 3 at large
Jun 11th 2021
      exactly where I'm at
Jun 17th 2021
It's awful and cfb is headed in a really bad direction
Jun 11th 2021
CFB has been heading in a bad directions for decades now
Jun 11th 2021
that's why i specifically wrote 'for a lot of reasons'
Jun 11th 2021
      No doubt and I was just expressing my thoughts and issues
Jun 11th 2021
I think 16 is max.
Jun 11th 2021
      and why is 8 or 12 better than 4?
Jun 11th 2021
           I want to see any hot team that is undefeated or has one loss
Jun 11th 2021
                RE: I want to see any hot team that is undefeated or has one loss
Jun 11th 2021
                     I think you may also see teams resting players down the stretch
Jun 11th 2021
                     teams already rest players
Jun 13th 2021
                          RE: teams already rest players
Jun 13th 2021
                     people are tired of hearing experts and power 5 fans tell us
Jun 13th 2021
                          you speak for the people now?
Jun 13th 2021
                               lmao.. yeah, I am the people
Jun 13th 2021
                                    LOL. this is corporate greed. nobody gives a fuck abt you or me.
Jun 13th 2021
                                         also 'the people'
Jun 13th 2021
                                         their sport? is it your sport?
Jun 13th 2021
                                              who's on third?
Jun 13th 2021
                                         Well, I think we all know how much they care about the players
Jun 13th 2021
                                              again the point is flying over your head
Jun 13th 2021
                                                   no, I just disagree with you
Jun 13th 2021
                                                        shit man this is your direct quote
Jun 13th 2021
                                                             why should I watch another sport
Jun 14th 2021
                                                                  jesus. arent YOU the one complaining about the existing model?
Jun 14th 2021
                                                                       You told me to stop watching
Jun 17th 2021
                                                                            no. I told you to watch other sports to enjoy their model.
Jun 17th 2021
spreading the money around
Jun 11th 2021
I had higher hopes. this seems lame.
Jun 11th 2021
I think you'll see more top level talent sit out
Jun 11th 2021
Not a fan. Keep it at 4 or 8 at max. No need to saturate the CFP.
Jun 12th 2021
I also thought the 6 team model made sense
Jun 12th 2021
On the actual expansion, 12 teams makes no sense at all
Jun 12th 2021
RE: On the actual expansion, 12 teams makes no sense at all
Jun 12th 2021
its not based on conferences tho
Jun 13th 2021
who gives a shit if your draft stock is solidified?
Jun 13th 2021
they can barely find a 4th worthy team most years.
Jun 13th 2021
my off the top list of bigger issues plaguing cfb
Jun 12th 2021
with so many issues why do you watch it?
Jun 14th 2021
      you interpret things in strange ways and it's kinda exhausting
Jun 14th 2021
           translation: you don’t agree with me and its exhausting…
Jun 17th 2021
                translation: you're illogical and annoying
Jun 17th 2021
                     Cincinnati lost 42-0 to OSU the PRIOR year? whooa nelly!!
Jun 18th 2021
                          right who cares about what happened in the last full season of cfb
Jun 18th 2021
                               what happened in 2019 had no bearing on the 2020 season.
Jun 18th 2021
                                    RE: what happened in 2019 had no bearing on the 2020 season.
Jun 18th 2021
                                         bowl games with no stakes involved huh?
Jun 22nd 2021
                                              RE: bowl games with no stakes involved huh?
Jun 22nd 2021
RIP College Football
Jun 13th 2021
Let’s see what the NCAA actually does here
Jun 16th 2021
      NCAA doesn’t wanna get involved in sexual assault
Jun 17th 2021
           I agree on all of this and on a side note, you see this
Jun 17th 2021
                i think it was the ASU thing
Jun 18th 2021
eventually, a UCF or Boise type is gonna go to an SEC West school...
Jun 17th 2021
I think this could do wonders for college football
Jun 17th 2021
there we go he's finally got a backer
Jun 17th 2021
NFL development and competing for NC's are different things entirely
Jun 18th 2021
Bingo.. but I don’t think its really about recruiting or NFL talent
Jun 18th 2021
Very dumb. And Very predictable once the box was opened
Jun 22nd 2021
Not that anyone cares but Orgeron named in LSU sexual assault lawsuit
Jun 26th 2021
Not that anyone with the NCAA or LSU cares but Orgeron named in LSU sexu...
Jun 26th 2021
Nah it's everyone. Do cfb fans care? Does ESPN care?
Jun 26th 2021
feelgood 2019 all the way gone
Jun 26th 2021
UNC players not in favor of proposed 12-team College Football Playoff
Jul 08th 2021
UNC will never have to worry about playing 16 or 17 games
Jul 08th 2021
      wow doesn't this response undermine your entire argument? LOLLLLLLL
Jul 08th 2021
           If you lived in NC you would understand
Jul 09th 2021
#1 2021 recruit JT Tuimoloau picks OSU
Jul 08th 2021
Rose Bowl trying to hold onto that old ass 2PM kick off time
Jul 20th 2021
Rose bowl has been holding cfb hostage for the longest
Jul 20th 2021
Dabo and Clemson players not in favor of 12 team playoff format
Jul 20th 2021
Big 12 president says College Football Playoff expansion on ‘life supp...
Aug 27th 2021
why would they vote against it now?
Aug 27th 2021
      because college football is ran by GOP assholes
Aug 27th 2021
      I can see why the Hateful 8 would vote no, it’s all about leverage
Aug 27th 2021
      because theyve miraculously converted to pro-autobid
Aug 27th 2021

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