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Subject: "I'll tell you what the problem with R&B is" Previous topic | Next topic
OldPro
Member since Dec 10th 2002
34401 posts
Wed Feb-15-12 11:27 AM

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"I'll tell you what the problem with R&B is"
Wed Feb-15-12 11:30 AM by OldPro

  

          

I've been thinking about addressing this for a while now and since this is my farewell week I guess it's now or never

The problem..... our best singers have shitty writers and producers.

Think about some of the greats and who they worked with

MJ - Q, Rod Temperton, Teddy Riley
Luther - Marcus Miller
Whitney - Kashif, Narada, Babyface, etc
Jeffery Osborne - George Duke
Diana Ross - Nile Rodgers, Ashford & Simpson
Teena Marie - Rick
Deniece Williams - Maurice White, Ray Parker Jr, George Duke

Now look at the best voices out there today and who they are working with... are you really surprised R&B has become a second class genre? We have some great voices out there today that just don't have the material to hit that next level. It's almost like the better the singer the more pedestrian the material. The genre has been pigeon holed... you're either making records for the top 40 set or urban contemporary/quiet storm crowd.

Most of the time we get the bad/mediocre singers on the stuff that actually bumps & sleepy time music from those that can actually blow. About the only two real "sangers" I can think of right now that have mixed it up are Beyonce & Mariah... two of the most successful acts going. Well R Kelly too but he's a self contained act. But we've just fallen into this trap where if you have a great voice you're expected to be a great writer too... or be able to elevate mediocre material to classic level. It just don't work that way 99% of the time.

So the next time you say R&B today sucks.... look a little deeper at who's actually making the music.

_________________________________
Reunion Radio Podcasts
Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

  

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I'll tell you what the problem with R&B is [View all] , OldPro, Wed Feb-15-12 11:27 AM
 
Subject Author Message Date ID
*pause for my agenda*
Feb 15th 2012
1
How funny this is post #1
Feb 15th 2012
3
it's my agenda. lol
Feb 15th 2012
5
      I credit Rod almost as much as I do Q
Feb 15th 2012
14
           *throws hands in the air*
Feb 15th 2012
15
           you're describing how 'clear' and 'slick' the "thriller" album sounds.
Feb 15th 2012
25
                i do not understand the origin of the Cult of Temperton
Feb 15th 2012
26
                Are you serious? His legacy is incredible.
Feb 15th 2012
35
                sure, but his importance in MJ's material is overstated.
Feb 15th 2012
40
                     No I think your throwing the baby and the bathwater out....
Feb 15th 2012
48
                          this isn't the post to argue this.
Feb 15th 2012
51
                I do, but not as it relates to Michael Jackson
Feb 15th 2012
36
                     i gave up trying long ago.
Feb 15th 2012
42
                          As I said i don't wan to get bogged down on this but
Feb 15th 2012
47
                               it's all good.
Feb 15th 2012
53
                Right I'm talking about the sound
Feb 15th 2012
34
                     as does
Feb 15th 2012
38
correct
Feb 15th 2012
4
Can we have an honest and objective discussion about this?
Feb 15th 2012
2
IT'S OVER!!! SOUL, R&B, HIP-HOP, ALL THINGS OF THE PAST!!
Feb 15th 2012
13
      ^^^
Feb 15th 2012
16
      ...done by bedroom ''composers'' fumbling around on their laptops...
Feb 15th 2012
19
      there's a feedback loop between bedroomers and those with other means
Feb 15th 2012
23
           Ha!!!
Feb 15th 2012
28
      yeah.
Feb 15th 2012
31
what happened between that era and now?
Feb 15th 2012
6
I see we're on the same track
Feb 15th 2012
8
it's also telling that a lot of the better artists out there
Feb 15th 2012
11
      I've always been drawn to self contained acts for this very reason
Feb 15th 2012
17
The Hip-Hop ethos infected R&B.
Feb 15th 2012
12
      I think it's because it's not easy to pull off
Feb 15th 2012
20
Full Disclosure
Feb 15th 2012
7
I've been arguing this for years, though.
Feb 15th 2012
9
last line - dead.
Feb 15th 2012
22
Yeah I've said this about neo-soul too
Feb 15th 2012
24
yeah, your neosoul post deeply affected my thinking
Feb 15th 2012
29
      Damn you brought it wit this -
Feb 15th 2012
33
      The thing about those 90s joints...
Feb 15th 2012
37
           Excellent point - I blame Jermaine Dupree haha.
Feb 15th 2012
41
           Don't even get me started wth that dude
Feb 15th 2012
55
                hahahaha... dead. EXACTLY. EXACTLY.
Feb 15th 2012
65
           in the '80s that would have meant
Feb 15th 2012
45
                The Prince "clones" were doomed from the start
Feb 15th 2012
59
                     true
Feb 15th 2012
64
                          I like a few things from Survivin' in the 80's
Feb 15th 2012
67
                               Yeah... I was just kind of shocked @ the abrupt change
Feb 15th 2012
69
I don't think good songwriting (tm) would change a thing...
Feb 15th 2012
43
      lost in the sauce...
Feb 15th 2012
56
      They want good songs.... they just may not know it
Feb 15th 2012
58
      i think this is it. people just want crap.
Feb 16th 2012
83
           That could be true, but one thing I have noticed since the 90s
Feb 16th 2012
84
           isnt that just people wanting to appear superior
Feb 16th 2012
85
                hmm... that's an interesting way of looking at it.
Feb 16th 2012
86
                     i def think that with youtube etc
Feb 16th 2012
88
           I think (relative) sophistication is just a ''gimmick'' too though...
Feb 16th 2012
87
I agree, most of the A-list guys these days would be C-list
Feb 15th 2012
10
Wait - farewell? I blame Pop music.
Feb 15th 2012
18
Yeah man I have to step away
Feb 15th 2012
30
      Aw man. Damn, I'm gonna miss your posts and insight bro.
Feb 15th 2012
32
i agree with everything you wrote.*
Feb 15th 2012
21
agree wholeheartedly - re: the importance of songwriting (my rant)
Feb 15th 2012
27
yeah... we need some better marriages between
Feb 15th 2012
39
Good singers used to make fun music too
Feb 15th 2012
44
THAT SONG SUCKED ASS!!!!
Feb 15th 2012
46
      I'm not ashamed to say I like the song too
Feb 15th 2012
49
      incidentally thoughts on this "Green Light"
Feb 17th 2012
98
      :(
Feb 15th 2012
52
           This is exactly why "serious" acts are afraid to let their hair down lik...
Feb 15th 2012
57
           This isn't about choice of direction it's about the actual song
Feb 15th 2012
60
           But see you're showing what the real problem is
Feb 15th 2012
62
                Truth. Raw truth.
Feb 15th 2012
66
                I didn't put my stick in this thread you did, OG post
Feb 15th 2012
71
                     First off all pop isn't created equal
Feb 15th 2012
73
                          you're missing my point
Feb 15th 2012
74
                               Really man you off in left field somewhere
Feb 15th 2012
75
                                    Green Light is the mad note. i love that song
Feb 15th 2012
78
                                    bbbut lemme finish first
Feb 15th 2012
79
                                         I can say this about 100s of classic songs
Feb 16th 2012
90
                                              Mostly by my own doing
Feb 16th 2012
91
           RE: This is exactly why "serious" acts are afraid to let their hair down...
Feb 15th 2012
61
                i liked it too
Feb 16th 2012
82
           yup...it definitely does NOT suck ass lol
Feb 15th 2012
63
well its simple the industry and R&B went more toward
Feb 15th 2012
50
I think the producer is every bit as important as the song writer
Feb 15th 2012
54
      well then that hurts your argument because it is the writer
Feb 15th 2012
80
I agree about the writing but I also say that...
Feb 15th 2012
68
"and they don't have any joy in their voices" (c) my mom.
Feb 15th 2012
70
      Man this is more than a mouthful - I concur in every way.
Feb 15th 2012
72
i think its just too pop
Feb 15th 2012
76
edit
Feb 15th 2012
77
if you got a Brenda Russell or a Leon Ware composing
Feb 15th 2012
81
the problem is URBAN RADIO!
Feb 16th 2012
89
agree..
Feb 16th 2012
92
funnily enough, the new usher song is almost a modern classic
Feb 17th 2012
93
Usher is an empty vessel
Feb 17th 2012
94
      lol
Feb 17th 2012
95
      Amen OP Amen. He's been a gimmick his whole career but
Feb 17th 2012
97
      Usher has talent and yet it never went to match the hype
Feb 17th 2012
99
yes and NO
Feb 17th 2012
96
I don't dislike all mainstream R&B now
Feb 17th 2012
100
Chris Rock nailed it on "Champagne" back in '97
Feb 17th 2012
101
Wow and I thought it had to do with these soulless fucks like Dr. Luke
Feb 17th 2012
102

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