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Subject: "The Risks - Know Them - Avoid Them" Previous topic | Next topic
MEAT
Member since Feb 08th 2008
22275 posts
Tue May-19-20 03:05 PM

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83. "The Risks - Know Them - Avoid Them"
In response to In response to 68


  

          

https://www.erinbromage.com/post/the-risks-know-them-avoid-them

It seems many people are breathing some relief, and I’m not sure why. An epidemic curve has a relatively predictable upslope and once the peak is reached, the back slope can also be predicted. We have robust data from the outbreaks in China and Italy, that shows the backside of the mortality curve declines slowly, with deaths persisting for months. Assuming we have just crested in deaths at 70k, it is possible that we lose another 70,000 people over the next 6 weeks as we come off that peak. That's what's going to happen with a lockdown.



As states reopen, and we give the virus more fuel, all bets are off. I understand the reasons for reopening the economy, but I've said before, if you don't solve the biology, the economy won't recover.



There are very few states that have demonstrated a sustained decline in numbers of new infections. Indeed, as of May 3rd the majority are still increasing and reopening. As a simple example of the USA trend, when you take out the data from New York and just look at the rest of the USA, daily case numbers are increasing. Bottom line: the only reason the total USA new case numbers look flat right now is because the New York City epidemic was so large and now it is being contained.


So throughout most of the country we are going to add fuel to the viral fire by reopening. It's going to happen if I like it or not, so my goal here is to try to guide you away from situations of high risk.

Where are people getting sick?

We know most people get infected in their own home. A household member contracts the virus in the community and brings it into the house where sustained contact between household members leads to infection.



But where are people contracting the infection in the community? I regularly hear people worrying about grocery stores, bike rides, inconsiderate runners who are not wearing masks.... are these places of concern? Well, not really. Let me explain.



In order to get infected you need to get exposed to an infectious dose of the virus; based on infectious dose studies with other coronaviruses, it appears that only small doses may be needed for infection to take hold. Some experts estimate that as few as 1000 SARS-CoV2 infectious viral particles are all that will be needed (ref 1, ref 2). Please note, this still needs to be determined experimentally, but we can use that number to demonstrate how infection can occur. Infection could occur, through 1000 infectious viral particles you receive in one breath or from one eye-rub, or 100 viral particles inhaled with each breath over 10 breaths, or 10 viral particles with 100 breaths. Each of these situations can lead to an infection.

How much Virus is released into the environment?



A Bathroom: Bathrooms have a lot of high touch surfaces, door handles, faucets, stall doors. So fomite transfer risk in this environment can be high. We still do not know whether a person releases infectious material in feces or just fragmented virus, but we do know that toilet flushing does aerosolize many droplets. Treat public bathrooms with extra caution (surface and air), until we know more about the risk.



A Cough: A single cough releases about 3,000 droplets and droplets travels at 50 miles per hour. Most droplets are large, and fall quickly (gravity), but many do stay in the air and can travel across a room in a few seconds.


A Sneeze: A single sneeze releases about 30,000 droplets, with droplets traveling at up to 200 miles per hour. Most droplets are small and travel great distances (easily across a room).


If a person is infected, the droplets in a single cough or sneeze may contain as many as 200,000,000 (two hundred million) virus particles which can all be dispersed into the environment around them.



A breath: A single breath releases 50 - 5000 droplets. Most of these droplets are low velocity and fall to the ground quickly. There are even fewer droplets released through nose-breathing. Importantly, due to the lack of exhalation force with a breath, viral particles from the lower respiratory areas are not expelled.



Unlike sneezing and coughing which release huge amounts of viral material, the respiratory droplets released from breathing only contain low levels of virus. We don't have a number for SARS-CoV2 yet, but we can use influenza as a guide. Studies have shown that a person infected with influenza can releases up to 33 infectious viral particles per minute. But I'm going to use 20 to keep the math simple.

Remember the formula: Successful Infection = Exposure to Virus x Time



If a person coughs or sneezes, those 200,000,000 viral particles go everywhere. Some virus hangs in the air, some falls into surfaces, most falls to the ground. So if you are face-to-face with a person, having a conversation, and that person sneezes or coughs straight at you, it's pretty easy to see how it is possible to inhale 1,000 virus particles and become infected.



But even if that cough or sneeze was not directed at you, some infected droplets--the smallest of small--can hang in the air for a few minutes, filling every corner of a modest sized room with infectious viral particles. All you have to do is enter that room within a few minutes of the cough/sneeze and take a few breaths and you have potentially received enough virus to establish an infection.


But with general breathing, 20 viral particles minute into the environment, even if every virus ended up in your lungs (which is very unlikely), you would need 1000 viral particles divided by 20 per minute = 50 minutes.



Speaking increases the release of respiratory droplets about 10 fold; ~200 virus particles per minute. Again, assuming every virus is inhaled, it would take ~5 minutes of speaking face-to-face to receive the required dose.

The exposure to virus x time formula is the basis of contact tracing. Anyone you spend greater than 10 minutes with in a face-to-face situation is potentially infected. Anyone who shares a space with you (say an office) for an extended period is potentially infected.

This is also why it is critical for people who are symptomatic to stay home. Your sneezes and your coughs expel so much virus that you can infect a whole room of people.

What is the role of asymptomatic people in spreading the virus?

Symptomatic people are not the only way the virus is shed. We know that at least 44% of all infections--and the majority of community-acquired transmissions--occur from people without any symptoms (asymptomatic or pre-symptomatic people). You can be shedding the virus into the environment for up to 5 days before symptoms begin.


Infectious people come in all ages, and they all shed different amounts of virus. The figure below shows that no matter your age (x-axis), you can have a little bit of virus or a lot of virus (y-axis). (ref)



The amount of virus released from an infected person changes over the course of infection and it is also different from person-to-person. Viral load generally builds up to the point where the person becomes symptomatic. So just prior to symptoms showing, you are releasing the most virus into the environment. Interestingly, the data shows that just 20% of infected people are responsible for 99% of viral load that could potentially be released into the environment (ref)


So now let’s get to the crux of it. Where are the personal dangers from reopening?



When you think of outbreak clusters, what are the big ones that come to mind? Most people would say cruise ships. But you would be wrong. Ship outbreaks, while concerning, don’t land in the top 50 outbreaks to date.



Ignoring the terrible outbreaks in nursing homes, we find that the biggest outbreaks are in prisons, religious ceremonies, and workplaces, such as meat packing facilities and call centers. Any environment that is enclosed, with poor air circulation and high density of people, spells trouble.



Some of the biggest super-spreading events are:

Meat packing: In meat processing plants, densely packed workers must communicate to one another amidst the deafening drum of industrial machinery and a cold-room virus-preserving environment. There are now outbreaks in 115 facilities across 23 states, 5000+ workers infected, with 20 dead. (ref)

Weddings, funerals, birthdays: 10% of early spreading events

Business networking: Face-to-face business networking like the Biogen Conference in Boston in late February.


As we move back to work, or go to a restaurant, let’s look at what can happen in those environments.



Restaurants: Some really great shoe-leather epidemiology demonstrated clearly the effect of a single asymptomatic carrier in a restaurant environment (see below). The infected person (A1) sat at a table and had dinner with 9 friends. Dinner took about 1 to 1.5 hours. During this meal, the asymptomatic carrier released low-levels of virus into the air from their breathing. Airflow (from the restaurant's various airflow vents) was from right to left. Approximately 50% of the people at the infected person's table became sick over the next 7 days. 75% of the people on the adjacent downwind table became infected. And even 2 of the 7 people on the upwind table were infected (believed to happen by turbulent airflow). No one at tables E or F became infected, they were out of the main airflow from the air conditioner on the right to the exhaust fan on the left of the room. (Ref)

Workplaces: Another great example is the outbreak in a call center (see below). A single infected employee came to work on the 11th floor of a building. That floor had 216 employees. Over the period of a week, 94 of those people became infected (43.5%: the blue chairs). 92 of those 94 people became sick (only 2 remained asymptomatic). Notice how one side of the office is primarily infected, while there are very few people infected on the other side. While exact number of people infected by respiratory droplets / respiratory exposure versus fomite transmission (door handles, shared water coolers, elevator buttons etc.) is unknown. It serves to highlight that being in an enclosed space, sharing the same air for a prolonged period increases your chances of exposure and infection. Another 3 people on other floors of the building were infected, but the authors were not able to trace the infection to the primary cluster on the 11th floor. Interestingly, even though there were considerable interaction between workers on different floors of the building in elevators and the lobby, the outbreak was mostly limited to a single floor (ref). This highlights the importance of exposure and time in the spreading of SARS-CoV2.

Choir: The community choir in Washington State. Even though people were aware of the virus and took steps to minimize transfer; e.g. they avoided the usual handshakes and hugs hello, people also brought their own music to avoid sharing, and socially distanced themselves during practice. They even went to the lengths to tell choir members prior to practice that anyone experiencing symptoms should stay home. A single asymptomatic carrier infected most of the people in attendance. The choir sang for 2 1/2 hours, inside an enclosed rehearsal hall which was roughly the size of a volleyball court.


Singing, to a greater degree than talking, aerosolizes respiratory droplets extraordinarily well. Deep-breathing while singing facilitated those respiratory droplets getting deep into the lungs. Two and half hours of exposure ensured that people were exposed to enough virus over a long enough period of time for infection to take place. Over a period of 4 days, 45 of the 60 choir members developed symptoms, 2 died. The youngest infected was 31, but they averaged 67 years old. (corrected link)


Indoor sports: While this may be uniquely Canadian, a super spreading event occurred during a curling event in Canada. A curling event with 72 attendees became another hotspot for transmission. Curling brings contestants and teammates in close contact in a cool indoor environment, with heavy breathing for an extended period. This tournament resulted in 24 of the 72 people becoming infected. (ref)



Birthday parties / funerals: Just to see how simple infection-chains can be, this is a real story from Chicago. The name is fake. Bob was infected but didn't know. Bob shared a takeout meal, served from common serving dishes, with 2 family members. The dinner lasted 3 hours. The next day, Bob attended a funeral, hugging family members and others in attendance to express condolences. Within 4 days, both family members who shared the meal are sick. A third family member, who hugged Bob at the funeral became sick. But Bob wasn't done. Bob attended a birthday party with 9 other people. They hugged and shared food at the 3 hour party. Seven of those people became ill. Over the next few days Bob became sick, he was hospitalized, ventilated, and died.



But Bob's legacy lived on. Three of the people Bob infected at the birthday went to church, where they sang, passed the tithing dish etc. Members of that church became sick. In all, Bob was directly responsible for infecting 16 people between the ages of 5 and 86. Three of those 16 died.



The spread of the virus within the household and back out into the community through funerals, birthdays, and church gatherings is believed to be responsible for the broader transmission of COVID-19 in Chicago. (ref)

Sobering right?


Commonality of outbreaks



The reason to highlight these different outbreaks is to show you the commonality of outbreaks of COVID-19. All these infection events were indoors, with people closely-spaced, with lots of talking, singing, or yelling. The main sources for infection are home, workplace, public transport, social gatherings, and restaurants. This accounts for 90% of all transmission events. In contrast, outbreaks spread from shopping appear to be responsible for a small percentage of traced infections. (Ref)



Importantly, of the countries performing contact tracing properly, only a single outbreak has been reported from an outdoor environment (less than 0.3% of traced infections). (ref)


So back to the original thought of my post.

Indoor spaces, with limited air exchange or recycled air and lots of people, are concerning from a transmission standpoint. We know that 60 people in a volleyball court-sized room (choir) results in massive infections. Same situation with the restaurant and the call center. Social distancing guidelines don't hold in indoor spaces where you spend a lot of time, as people on the opposite side of the room were infected.


The principle is viral exposure over an extended period of time. In all these cases, people were exposed to the virus in the air for a prolonged period (hours). Even if they were 50 feet away (choir or call center), even a low dose of the virus in the air reaching them, over a sustained period, was enough to cause infection and in some cases, death.



Social distancing rules are really to protect you with brief exposures or outdoor exposures. In these situations there is not enough time to achieve the infectious viral load when you are standing 6 feet apart or where wind and the infinite outdoor space for viral dilution reduces viral load. The effects of sunlight, heat, and humidity on viral survival, all serve to minimize the risk to everyone when outside.


When assessing the risk of infection (via respiration) at the grocery store or mall, you need to consider the volume of the air space (very large), the number of people (restricted), how long people are spending in the store (workers - all day; customers - an hour). Taken together, for a person shopping: the low density, high air volume of the store, along with the restricted time you spend in the store, means that the opportunity to receive an infectious dose is low. But, for the store worker, the extended time they spend in the store provides a greater opportunity to receive the infectious dose and therefore the job becomes more risky.


Basically, as the work closures are loosened, and we start to venture out more, possibly even resuming in-office activities, you need to look at your environment and make judgments. How many people are here, how much airflow is there around me, and how long will I be in this environment. If you are in an open floorplan office, you really need to critically assess the risk (volume, people, and airflow). If you are in a job that requires face-to-face talking or even worse, yelling, you need to assess the risk.

If you are sitting in a well ventilated space, with few people, the risk is low.



If I am outside, and I walk past someone, remember it is “dose and time” needed for infection. You would have to be in their airstream for 5+ minutes for a chance of infection. While joggers may be releasing more virus due to deep breathing, remember the exposure time is also less due to their speed. Please do maintain physical distance, but the risk of infection in these scenarios are low. Here is a great article in Vox that discusses the low risk of running and cycling in detail.

While I have focused on respiratory exposure here, please don't forget surfaces. Those infected respiratory droplets land somewhere. Wash your hands often and stop touching your face!

As we are allowed to move around our communities more freely and be in contact with more people in more places more regularly, the risks to ourselves and our family are significant. Even if you are gung-ho for reopening and resuming business as usual, do your part and wear a mask to reduce what you release into the environment. It will help everyone, including your own business.

------
“There is no fate that cannot be surmounted by scorn.” -Albert Camus

  

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Re-opening America (Wave 1) - post your experiences [View all] , handle, Wed May-13-20 09:53 AM
 
Subject Author Message Date ID
I’m adjusting to the six feet thing...
May 13th 2020
1
I could write a novel
May 13th 2020
2
dumb
May 13th 2020
3
part of texas got exempt from opening up more, for a week at least
May 19th 2020
60
America will be back on lock soon
May 13th 2020
4
i think theye going to push the limits of icu beds and ventillators
May 13th 2020
5
Stands in this line. There's no cultural will for people to go back ins...
May 13th 2020
6
      Welp: "Despite 20,000+ COVID19 deaths, we find only ~5% of France infect...
May 13th 2020
32
           Welp: A Swedish study found that just 7.3 percent of Stockholmers develo...
May 20th 2020
98
I’ve accepted it...
May 13th 2020
9
All my jobs are in very inflexible institutions...
May 13th 2020
7
I'm near Atlanta.
May 13th 2020
8
my brother invited me over for mothers day
May 13th 2020
10
RE: I'm near Atlanta.
May 18th 2020
57
I'm waiting for results of the 1st reopening wave before I make my move
May 13th 2020
11
Charlotte, NC
May 13th 2020
12
my leasing office isn’t opening...
May 13th 2020
18
still doing the same...
May 13th 2020
13
Atlanta....these motherfuckers are crazy
May 13th 2020
14
I basically run in my neighborhood.
May 13th 2020
22
This is like closing your eyes and walking into the road
May 13th 2020
15
That's a pretty perfect metaphor
May 13th 2020
19
That's a bingo
May 13th 2020
21
In a PA red county (suburban Phila.)
May 13th 2020
16
Not much has changed in cali
May 13th 2020
17
RE: Not much has changed in cali
May 14th 2020
47
Things are very slowly opening back up in the Bay Area
May 13th 2020
20
LA doing relatively well but
May 13th 2020
23
I thought they announced lockdown is going on through August in LA?
May 13th 2020
24
people ran with the headline. The mayor has been trying to clarify
May 13th 2020
28
LA is not doing well. no real evidence of descent or even plateau of
May 13th 2020
25
trying to be hopeful, man. my grandma's in a nursing home here as we spe...
May 13th 2020
31
      I am not trying to be anything other than realistic.
May 13th 2020
42
It is? I heard the exact opposite.
May 13th 2020
27
      i suppose i'm thankful we're not NY
May 13th 2020
29
           Population of 10+ million in LA County
May 13th 2020
37
let me know how that shit goes.. they'll need to drag me out...
May 13th 2020
26
STL city and county start to "re-open" next week, the state of MO opened...
May 13th 2020
30
Been WFH since March. Will likely continue for most of the year
May 13th 2020
33
Roommate is flying tomorrow, I am worried for her.
May 13th 2020
34
RE: Roommate is flying tomorrow, I am worried for her.
May 13th 2020
36
Holy shit.
May 13th 2020
40
Why do you think that case is relevant here?
May 19th 2020
59
      You're a fucking idiot
May 19th 2020
61
      Ah cool. Nevermind then, panic away.
May 19th 2020
75
      Some indications planes
May 19th 2020
93
           This is a twitter thread, and not even an informative one it’s a quest...
May 19th 2020
94
      real quick....air has to flow before it's filtered.......
May 19th 2020
64
           Likelihood of dying seems to be so many contrarians baseline for
May 19th 2020
65
           Agreed 100%.
May 19th 2020
67
           I know that.
May 19th 2020
78
                I am in a high risk group.
May 19th 2020
79
                I understand, it's a shitty situation to be in.
May 19th 2020
82
                Understood..I just wanted to zero in on that one component because...
May 19th 2020
80
                Fair enough.
May 19th 2020
86
                I mean..never question a man's reasoning....Man Law # 2,341
May 19th 2020
88
                     I don't really subscribe to man law, it's bad for your health.
May 19th 2020
89
                          RE: I don't really subscribe to man law, it's bad for your health.
May 19th 2020
92
                asymptomatic spread is the biggest difference between covid-19 and
Jun 01st 2020
136
                Thanks for posting these links - great info
May 27th 2020
125
I would be worried about her being around family
May 13th 2020
38
Word.
May 13th 2020
41
      She white?
May 13th 2020
43
           Ha! Nope Black.
May 13th 2020
45
"Airplanes don’t make you sick. Really."
May 20th 2020
99
      That op-ed is bullshit.
May 21st 2020
102
In FL. I'm not changing anything about what I am doing
May 13th 2020
35
Your gov is a f'ing asshole
May 15th 2020
51
Florida COVID-19 Data Chief responsible for dashboard fired (swipe)
May 19th 2020
69
same
May 13th 2020
39
South Korea, Germany Covid cases shot back up after reopening
May 13th 2020
44
Philly - most folks masked the fuck up
May 14th 2020
46
Georgia and Florida cases decreasing. Good news
May 14th 2020
48
Florida numers are hard for me as a human being to trust
May 14th 2020
49
Why would it be getter better???
May 14th 2020
50
I don't believe anything reported by any state that supports 45's K.A. a...
May 15th 2020
52
I don’t believe any reports from red states
May 15th 2020
53
they're deliberately holding back results...
May 15th 2020
54
Well, the Georgia data turned out to be horseshit.
May 17th 2020
55
drove up the coast
May 18th 2020
56
WHY AREN'T THEY WEARING MASKS?
May 19th 2020
58
Word.
May 19th 2020
62
Honestly, we don't wear masks outside just to walk around the
May 19th 2020
63
      RE: Honestly, we don't wear masks outside just to walk around the
May 19th 2020
66
      Great read. Thanks for the link. Literally been in Zero of those scenari...
May 19th 2020
68
     
           Yes, that’s the article Backbone & I are discussing above
May 19th 2020
84
      Also, the kids part...that's another issue I have with the reporting....
May 19th 2020
71
      Here's another good article that speaks to exercising w/o mask...
May 19th 2020
77
      Yeah. I’m the same way. We don’t wear them while walking the hood
May 19th 2020
73
      I stopped wearing gloves weeks ago. I just don't touch shit. Here's why
May 19th 2020
76
           Fuck that.. I’m wearing gloves. Lol
May 19th 2020
85
           I DO keep a stash in the whip though lol.....
May 19th 2020
87
                Mine stay in the car and it’s the only time I use them
May 19th 2020
90
           I am not big on gloves because I can sanitize my hands every 5 minutes o...
May 19th 2020
91
                True, but I’m also not using them frequently
May 20th 2020
97
      I don't wear a mask walking in the neighborhood but I live in a spacious...
May 19th 2020
74
I am not looking forward to Memorial Day
May 19th 2020
70
I was looking forward to no Rolling Thunder this year...and THEN...
May 19th 2020
72
      I drive around Lincoln Park every day going home
May 19th 2020
81
           I'm in Hillcrest SE
May 22nd 2020
105
Most people really dont care.....
May 20th 2020
95
I think people believe the virus is more wide spread than it is
May 20th 2020
96
      THIS...i'm hearing a TON of "Oh, I probably had it already...."
May 21st 2020
100
CDC and States are Misreporting Test Data by Conflating Two Tests (Swipe...
May 21st 2020
101
DC is gonna begin reopening on Friday. I ain't ready!
May 21st 2020
103
Me on 4/27 as people started to open up
May 21st 2020
104
Georgia been open for about a month. What's hannenin'?
May 26th 2020
106
On the rise
May 26th 2020
Masks, social distancing, lower population density.
May 26th 2020
109
NYC is where most people flew into from overseas
May 26th 2020
113
The virus moves at a constant speed
May 26th 2020
118
why didn't Baltimore get hit like Detroit did?
May 26th 2020
122
i changed my mind. we're not going back on lockdown
May 26th 2020
107
with all of the Memorial Day activities especially at beach/water spots....
May 26th 2020
108
As long as the gatherings are outside, a spike in cases is unlikely
May 26th 2020
110
      Naw it isn't as cut and dry as "if you're outside you are safe"...
May 26th 2020
111
      Which is why I didn't write that.
May 27th 2020
124
      the national review though?
May 26th 2020
119
           Not familiar with it, tbh.
May 27th 2020
123
                that's how they get you.
May 27th 2020
126
                     Thanks for the heads up.
May 27th 2020
129
They say no new deaths for 1st time since March in DC...
May 26th 2020
112
I don't doubt the number, but it's not relevant.
May 26th 2020
115
      Word.
May 26th 2020
116
went to a kohls to do an amazon return
May 26th 2020
114
Had to go to Home Depot twice over the weekend for home repair
May 26th 2020
117
      im debating going to target to return a water pitcher with filter
May 26th 2020
121
           Return that sh*t
May 27th 2020
127
                i think i will
May 27th 2020
131
                     i did
Jun 02nd 2020
137
Los Angeles County (maybe we could start one reply for various cities)
May 26th 2020
120
Charlotte - I go back June 10th
May 27th 2020
128
RE: Re-opening America (Wave 1) - post your experiences
May 27th 2020
130
suspected/confirmed cases at work
May 29th 2020
132
I don't know, BUT
May 29th 2020
133
yeah that's the crazy I part I think because of HIPAA laws they can't...
May 29th 2020
134
update
Jun 01st 2020
135
Yes. 4 times going on 5. I'm responsible for reporting .....
Jun 02nd 2020
138
update pt 2
Jun 02nd 2020
139
My family is trying to get me to come to PA for my Dads Bday
Jun 02nd 2020
140
Don't know. Riding this out at least until daycares open again at full c...
Jun 03rd 2020
141

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