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Subject: "He tortured people. Literally, torture." Previous topic | Next topic
Walleye
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Tue Oct-17-17 01:40 PM

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12. "He tortured people. Literally, torture."
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http://theweek.com/articles/555720/how-george-w-bush-dick-cheney-brought-torture-america

How George W. Bush and Dick Cheney brought torture to America
May 19, 2015

Ryan Cooper

Tonight, Frontline will air a documentary called Secrets, Politics, and Torture, directed by Michael Kirk, about how President George W. Bush and Vice President Dick Cheney institutionalized torture in American politics and government.

Three major developments explored in detail by Kirk drive home the extent to which Bush and Cheney worked to ingrain torture in the American state.

The first was the crushing ideological pressure to torture that came from the top of the Bush administration. The most striking example of this came directly after 9/11, when al Qaeda operative Abu Zubaydah was captured. Since the CIA had zero personnel with experience in interrogation, the FBI was initially brought in. Ali Soufan, a highly experienced interrogator and Muslim who speaks fluent Arabic, took charge of the questioning. He deployed the traditional police model, which focuses on building rapport and a criminal case. Almost immediately, Zubaydah gave up Khalid Sheik Mohammad as a member of al Qaeda.

Despite that quick success, word came down from Washington: Use violence. A man named James Mitchell convinced the Bush brass that he had a better way. The CIA eventually paid his company — co-founded with another psychologist, Bruce Jessen — $81 million. The two had been psychologists in the Air Force, where they oversaw the mock interrogators in the SERE program, which trained Navy SEALs what to do in case they were captured or tortured by the enemy.

Mitchell did not speak Arabic. He had no experience whatsoever in Islamic extremism generally or al Qaeda in particular. And he had never even interrogated anyone. That is who replaced Soufan, who was without question one of the finest al Qaeda specialists in the entire country at the time. That is the level of competence the Bush administration was willing to flush down the toilet to validate its iron belief that non-violent interrogations (soft, weak, liberal) could never work, despite Soufan's proven success. They would have put an ice cream truck driver in charge of interrogations, so long as he had some crackpot scheme about freezing detainees half to death in soft serve.

It took a terrific fight with much of the professional bureaucracy — Soufan at one point considered arresting the CIA agents torturing Zubaydah — but torture eventually prevailed.

The second development occurred when the torture bill came due. The Abu Ghraib torture scandal was a colossal stain on Bush's legacy, and by late 2005 much of the administration had turned against the CIA program. Then-Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice led a push inside the administration to announce an official stop to the program. At a high-level meeting in the White House, everyone but Cheney agreed with Rice, and she seemed to have won. A speech was arranged.

But as happened so often in the Bush administration, Cheney went to Bush personally afterward, and convinced him that Rice was wrong. Rice went to the speech expecting Bush to disavow "enhanced interrogation," but instead he embraced it, and claimed it had produced valuable intelligence (it hadn't).

This is "one more example of the long shadow Cheney casts over the American government," Kirk said in an interview with The Week.

This was probably the key moment when the torture disease could have been expunged from the American government, but was instead left to take over the host. Once Bush, the leader of the Republican Party, embraced torture as affirmatively good policy, the rest of the conservative ideological apparatus swung into place behind him, and torture became a partisan matter. Instead of Jose Rodriguez (who destroyed the tapes of the CIA interrogations) being a criminal conspirator, he became a loyal conservative.

So when Barack Obama came to power, attempting to uphold previous norms would have required an unprecedented legal fight against practically the entire top echelon of the previous administration. It's understandable, though still inexcusable, that Obama has been utterly mealy-mouthed about torture, and that he declined to prosecute any torturers or their enablers. Trying to do so would have paralyzed his entire agenda.

Finally, unrepentant and unpunished CIA torturers, defensively looking to clear their names and reputations, inserted pro-torture agitprop into the Hollywood blockbuster Zero Dark Thirty. Acting on extensive CIA interviews, director Katherine Bigelow conveyed the strong impression that torture is what led to the killing of Osama bin Laden:

As a result, it's very likely America will torture again.

As with so many Frontline productions, Secrets, Politics, and Torture does not contain that much new information, but is instead a judicious and well-crafted summary of a long and complex story. When it comes to the CIA torture program, and the Senate report documenting it, this is as good a single source as you'll find.

______________________________

"Walleye, a lot of things are going to go wrong in your life that technically aren't your fault. Always remember that this doesn't make you any less of an idiot"

--Walleye's Dad

  

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I actually miss Dubya [View all] , j., Tue Oct-17-17 12:34 PM
 
Subject Author Message Date ID
Nah, Trump just skews the perspective on everything
Oct 17th 2017
1
some Einstein's theory of relativity ish. felt.
Oct 17th 2017
2
Did you read this story about him too?
Oct 17th 2017
3
We didn't say he the worst - we said he was FUCKING AWFUL
Oct 17th 2017
4
Maybe we should stop using "we" for this convo.
Oct 17th 2017
10
no we were right.
Oct 17th 2017
5
Politics aside, Bush was a decent human being
Oct 17th 2017
6
      i agree with all of this
Oct 17th 2017
8
      maybe.
Oct 17th 2017
11
      Yup
Oct 17th 2017
15
      No he isn't.
Oct 18th 2017
53
      I agree with none of this
Oct 18th 2017
55
he's done a whole lot of good in Africa
Oct 17th 2017
7
FOH
Oct 17th 2017
9
Just because Drumph is one of the worst human beings ever...
Oct 17th 2017
13
okay, yeah. i can't agree W is a decent human being.
Oct 17th 2017
16
Picture if Obama took over after Trump destroyed the country instead of ...
Oct 17th 2017
18
      sho nuff.
Oct 17th 2017
27
Yeah but, this is kind of funny....
Oct 17th 2017
17
      rocketman and pocahontus is funny too
Oct 17th 2017
21
He just makes me more terrified of this dipshit
Oct 17th 2017
14
I'd take a moron over pure evil
Oct 17th 2017
19
      unfortunately he's not *just* a moron
Oct 17th 2017
22
Nope.
Oct 17th 2017
20
https://retentionscience.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/Confused-Baby-Me...
Oct 17th 2017
23
nope. but he did give us 3 great moments...
Oct 17th 2017
24
aw man if only desus & mero were around for the shoe incident.
Oct 17th 2017
26
      on the hush tho
Oct 17th 2017
31
           I was impressed by those dodging skills.
Oct 17th 2017
33
           I was impressed by how cool he was while dodging the shoes
Oct 17th 2017
34
                add those feelings too
Oct 17th 2017
35
           that's why i was so incensed by it.
Oct 17th 2017
38
                It was literally, if a black man can do it, then anyone must be able
Oct 17th 2017
40
                     it feels that way.
Oct 17th 2017
41
                     that's EXACTLY what it is/was...
Oct 18th 2017
54
He lied us into unwinnable wars (so his friends would get $$$)
Oct 17th 2017
25
dont forget gutting of section 5 preclearance from the voting rights act...
Oct 17th 2017
42
This just made me remember a dream I had last night
Oct 17th 2017
28
Saw this yesterday after Trump's "BHO, Bush never called families" lie
Oct 17th 2017
29
He looked and acted like a normal, respectable president
Oct 17th 2017
30
better as a painter than as a president
Oct 17th 2017
32
This is naive as fuck & grown ups need to stop.
Oct 17th 2017
36
YUP
Oct 18th 2017
51
Shit, Id take President Cheney
Oct 17th 2017
37
you need a nap.
Oct 17th 2017
39
      HE EVEN LOOKS PRESIDENTIAL
Oct 17th 2017
43
           Lol!!
Oct 17th 2017
44
His father was a the invisible hand of the crack era.
Oct 17th 2017
45
people dont talk enough about how republicans outright stole the office.
Oct 17th 2017
46
^^^^^and this
Oct 18th 2017
52
WTH ?
Oct 17th 2017
47
Tell that to those who had as much to lose during W
Oct 17th 2017
48
zero sympathy for the victims of his foreign policy huh
Oct 18th 2017
49
Dubya was a terrible president and a sociopath
Oct 18th 2017
50
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/oct/20/george-w-bush-dona...
Oct 23rd 2017
56
another reason i know alex jones is a fraud
Oct 23rd 2017
57
the only difference i believe is that Bush grew up in the politics
Oct 23rd 2017
58
nah, b, go fuck yourself
Oct 23rd 2017
59
RE: I actually miss Dubya
Oct 23rd 2017
60

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