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Subject: "So who still thinks "Music is Free"? *Swipe*" This topic is locked.
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disco dj
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Sun Nov-07-10 01:53 PM

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"So who still thinks "Music is Free"? *Swipe*"


  

          

keep on thinkin' that...


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/40030700/ns/technology_and_science-security/?GT1=43001

MINNEAPOLIS — A Minnesota woman ordered to pay a recording industry trade group $1.5 million for illegally sharing music online doesn't plan to pay those damages as her attorneys continue to argue the amount is unconstitutional, she said Thursday.

A federal jury found Wednesday that Jammie Thomas-Rasset, of Brainerd, must pay $62,500 per song — for a total of $1.5 million — for illegally violating copyrights on 24 songs. This was the third jury to consider damages in her case, and each has found that she must pay — though different amounts.

And after each time, the single mother of four has said she can't pay.

"I can't afford to pay any amount. It's not a matter of won't, it's a matter of 'I can't,'" Thomas-Rasset said Thursday. "Any amount that I pay to them is money that I could use to feed my children. Any amount that I pay to them is money I could use to clothe my kids, and pay my mortgage so my kids have a place to sleep."

The Recording Industry Association of America has said it found Thomas-Rasset shared more than 1,700 songs on the file-sharing site Kazaa, but it sued over 24 of them. RIAA spokeswoman Cara Duckworth said the association made several attempts to settle with Thomas-Rasset, at first for $5,000, but Thomas-Rasset refused.

Duckworth said the RIAA was thankful the jury recognized the severity of Thomas-Rasset's misconduct.

"Three juries have now spoken and each has sent a strong message that she needs to accept responsibility for her actions," Duckworth said. "I'd say, enough is enough."


Under federal law, the recording companies are entitled to $750 to $30,000 per infringement but the law allows the jury to raise that to as much as $150,000 per track if it finds the infringements were willful.

The vast majority of people targeted by music industry lawsuits have settled for about $3,500 each. The recording industry has said it stopped filing such lawsuits and is instead working with Internet service providers to go after the worst offenders.

Thomas-Rasset, 33, was the first person to go to trial. In 2007, jurors decided she willfully violated the copyrights on all 24 songs, and she was ordered to pay $9,250 per song, or $222,000.

But Chief U.S. District Judge Michael Davis ordered a new trial, deciding he had erred in giving jury instructions. The case went back to court. Last year, another jury also found that Thomas-Rasset willfully violated the copyrights and ordered her to pay $1.92 million in damages, or $80,000 per song.

Davis called that figure "monstrous and shocking" and reduced the penalty to about $54,000. The RIAA rejected the reduced penalty for legal reasons. But the industry group said it would settle for $25,000, with the money going to a charity for struggling musicians.

Thomas-Rasset refused, setting up another trial to deal just with the issue of damages.

Her attorney, Kiwi Camara, said he has 30 days to submit arguments that the statutes allowing for such hefty damages in these cases are unconstitutional. He said even the minimum amount for damages is not reasonably related to the actual harm caused to the recording industry.

He said in Thomas-Rasset's case, the minimum damage amount would be $18,000, but the actual damages are $24 — the amount Thomas-Rasset would have paid if she bought each song for $1 off iTunes.

Camara said he'll take the argument to the appeals court if necessary.

Thomas-Rasset has maintained her innocence from the start, saying she never used Kazaa. She said Thursday that the law allowing for such disproportionate damages needs to be changed, and she's willing to keep fighting.

"It's not a fair law," she said. "In my eyes, it's legalized extortion."

When a reporter pointed out that three juries of her peers had decided that she should pay well above the minimum, she said there's "no rhyme or reason to the numbers" but she respects jurors for doing their jobs.


She said she's not going to worry about damages until the case is finalized and appeals are finished. Even then, she said, she'd probably file for bankruptcy and write off the damages, rather than pay herself.

Duckworth said if the case is appealed, the RIAA is ready to defend the constitutionality of the verdict. She said the issue is still important, even after all this time.

"People forget about all of the individuals who work really hard to make music for a living," she said. "These people are negatively impacted whenever music is stolen and distributed to millions of people."

In another high-profile case in Boston, a federal judge this summer reduced from $675,000 to $67,500 the amount of damages a Boston University graduate student was ordered to pay. In that case, Joel Tenenbaum of Providence admitted downloading songs between 1999 and 2007. The case is currently under appeal.

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So who still thinks "Music is Free"? *Swipe* [View all] , disco dj, Sun Nov-07-10 01:53 PM
 
Subject Author Message Date ID
well, contrary to your post title, people *do* think music is free
Nov 07th 2010
1
we've had this discussion Ad Nauseum. it's not free.
Nov 07th 2010
2
well, you're basically arguing semantics
Nov 07th 2010
10
      So basically you're argument that it's free because somebody else
Nov 07th 2010
13
      see post 16
Nov 07th 2010
17
      no. i'm not.
Nov 07th 2010
15
           RE: no. i'm not.
Nov 07th 2010
16
           philosophically, this is huge
Nov 07th 2010
38
           The pants were free if you didn't pay for them
Nov 07th 2010
20
           You going into the store to take the pants
Nov 07th 2010
21
                THERE IS NO ANALOGY
Nov 07th 2010
34
           You can't own no 1's & 0's!!!
Nov 07th 2010
33
           ain't no lock on the door playa
Nov 08th 2010
77
my question is
Nov 07th 2010
3
i know you weren't asking me, but here's my thoughts...
Nov 07th 2010
4
I see it
Nov 07th 2010
5
'Cuz it's stolen goods...
Nov 07th 2010
8
      The bootleg CD on the block is not stolen goods n/m
Nov 07th 2010
35
           Of course to the people buying bootlegs it ain't "stolen"...
Nov 07th 2010
44
                Perhaps the bootlegger is the label head's cousin n/m
Nov 07th 2010
50
                     lol. Then perhaps the label head needs to be investigated...
Nov 07th 2010
64
                          or cooks
Nov 07th 2010
69
I don't understand this...
Nov 07th 2010
11
      RE: I don't understand this...
Nov 07th 2010
14
           Yup...
Nov 07th 2010
18
                *cough* http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=5&topic_...
Nov 07th 2010
37
                     But there's a difference between being forced...
Nov 07th 2010
62
we all know music aint free, however...
Nov 07th 2010
6
^^ sense & sensibility ^^
Nov 07th 2010
7
RE: we all know music aint free, however...
Nov 07th 2010
9
I agree in principle....BUT.
Nov 07th 2010
12
I agree w/punishment, but to clarify...
Nov 07th 2010
22
If you have ONE hi-speed dub cassette in your crib... n/m
Nov 07th 2010
31
that was ONE of my points...
Nov 07th 2010
52
I'm saying.....
Nov 08th 2010
76
that was a good answer
Nov 08th 2010
83
RE: we all know music aint free, however...
Nov 10th 2010
107
Who still thinks the laws about this are bullshit?
Nov 07th 2010
19
RE: So who still thinks "Music is Free"? *Swipe*
Nov 07th 2010
23
semantics.
Nov 07th 2010
24
RE: semantics.
Nov 07th 2010
25
      does it matter, though?
Nov 07th 2010
27
           Yes it matters.
Nov 07th 2010
28
           Don't let me find a VHS tape with a Super Bowl on it n/m
Nov 07th 2010
32
I think the sharer is the guilty one.
Nov 07th 2010
26
      From the little research I've done...
Nov 07th 2010
29
Nov 07th 2010
30
Nov 07th 2010
36
i think the price comes from the amount of people who got it.
Nov 07th 2010
42
I've had engineering/production gigs with acts -
Nov 07th 2010
39
^^dry snitching^^^
Nov 07th 2010
43
      not even
Nov 07th 2010
51
           i'm just givin' you shit, man. It's all jokes...
Nov 07th 2010
55
           Logic is an amazing example
Nov 07th 2010
57
                also, it definitely boosted the sales of macs substantially
Nov 07th 2010
67
where are you getting this from?
Nov 07th 2010
41
      "Projected Illegal Downloads" is on spreadsheets fam
Nov 07th 2010
47
today's musicians shouldn't waste their time complaining about piracy
Nov 07th 2010
40
this reply was just dumb....
Nov 07th 2010
45
since you're so smart
Nov 07th 2010
49
      It is dumb. I don't think it even needs any explanation.
Nov 07th 2010
53
      dumb for who ?
Nov 07th 2010
56
           it is easy to explain but why bother?
Nov 07th 2010
59
      funny you should ask....
Nov 07th 2010
54
           just cause i'm in a contrarian mood
Nov 07th 2010
58
           You really believe this hippie b.s.?
Nov 07th 2010
60
                People think I'm joking when I say I'm an art evangelist
Nov 07th 2010
61
                     Funny thing is that I am also an art evangelist.
Nov 07th 2010
63
                          $ can be a reason to _make_ art but not to *make* art
Nov 07th 2010
70
           no industry
Nov 07th 2010
66
you're an idiot.
Nov 07th 2010
74
      tu mado ?
Nov 08th 2010
79
and who punishes the labels that leak their own shit?
Nov 07th 2010
46
They would never do that n/m
Nov 07th 2010
48
conflict of interest
Nov 08th 2010
81
what ppl never mention is how money makes music
Nov 07th 2010
65
interesting, but i completely disagree
Nov 07th 2010
68
      music will exist, but only as a bunch of amateurs
Nov 07th 2010
71
           whatever dude
Nov 08th 2010
80
                Yeah and what's the average age of those dudes
Nov 08th 2010
87
                     I agree
Nov 08th 2010
88
This Is The Part That Seems So Wrong & Infamous About The Situation
Nov 07th 2010
72
technology fucked the record industry
Nov 07th 2010
73
This poast seems a bit out of touch famb.
Nov 07th 2010
75
Leaving out moral judgements and personal biases.......
Nov 08th 2010
78
^^^^^
Nov 08th 2010
84
Im pretty sure this person is being sued for sharing music not dling
Nov 08th 2010
82
Re-examine "money".
Nov 08th 2010
85
it's not my problem/i don't care/it is free.
Nov 08th 2010
86
I can dig that, BUT.
Nov 08th 2010
91
      this is capitalism.
Nov 09th 2010
94
is it freely available? is there means of obtaining it free?
Nov 08th 2010
89
Half-agree.
Nov 09th 2010
93
Music is not free
Nov 08th 2010
90
*applause*
Nov 08th 2010
92
ahh, the moral/paying-for-music-makes-me-feel-good argument
Nov 09th 2010
99
      i wasn't really looking at it from paying to not worry about ...
Nov 09th 2010
100
           Don't mind them, dude... I know exactly what you're talking about.
Nov 10th 2010
101
           doesn't happen w/me b/c i listen to it all the same way.
Nov 10th 2010
103
                but you don't have a different 'feeling' or attachment to the music...
Nov 10th 2010
104
                     not at all.
Nov 10th 2010
105
           i get you
Nov 10th 2010
102
she needs to file bankruptcy like last weekend!
Nov 09th 2010
95
You guys should start using PEERBLOCK.
Nov 09th 2010
96
1) read more Mike Masnick
Nov 09th 2010
97
Does this happen to people who use mediafire, megaupload etc.
Nov 09th 2010
98
RE: So who still thinks "Music is Free"? *Swipe*
Nov 10th 2010
106
"Cost" and "(Intrinsic) Value" are two different things.
Nov 15th 2010
108

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