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Forum nameOkay Sports
Topic subjectCOLLEGE FOOTBALL Offseason continued
Topic URLhttp://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=8&topic_id=2819080
2819080, COLLEGE FOOTBALL Offseason continued
Posted by guru0509, Wed Jul-29-26 05:17 PM

Bryce Underwood year 2

Arch Mannings final year

is Julian Sayin gonna put it all together


which players are gonna go first round?


this looks like a deep QB class, is your NFL's franchise star qb for the next decade among them?


Brutal schedules for all the top contenders ...last year alot of teams didnt get tested until late, now we hit the season in the frying pan...

2819081, bama has yet to say who qb1 will be.
Posted by tariqhu, Thu Jul-30-26 12:15 PM
I think it's Mack, but there's definitely pressure to put Keelon in as the starter.

Mack is good and has been with Debeor and Grubb longer, but Keelon seems special. qb shouldn't be an issue with either one. I'm guessing whomever doesn't get the nod will leave.

next up, wide receiver. not worried about this group. I'm expecting big things from Coleman-Willimans and getting those drops fixed. got a new coach there, which should be helpful.

where we need improvements are the OL and running back. the OL has been trash for the past few years. they're basically starting over with different personnel and body types. smaller, more athletic seems to be the move to fit the coaching schemes. they've also changed the OL coach.

if we fix that, the backs are talented and diverse enough to get some real yards. and the qb shouldn't have to run for his life and have to be the savior like Ty was last year.

defense was decent last year and should be improved this time around. got mix of experience and talent.

lessgo!!

2819083, Bamas schedule brutal too, UGA, UT and LSU back to back to ba
Posted by guru0509, Tue Aug-04-26 05:18 PM
>I think it's Mack, but there's definitely pressure to put
>Keelon in as the starter.
>
>Mack is good and has been with Debeor and Grubb longer, but
>Keelon seems special. qb shouldn't be an issue with either
>one. I'm guessing whomever doesn't get the nod will leave.
>
>next up, wide receiver. not worried about this group. I'm
>expecting big things from Coleman-Willimans and getting those
>drops fixed. got a new coach there, which should be helpful.
>
>where we need improvements are the OL and running back. the OL
>has been trash for the past few years. they're basically
>starting over with different personnel and body types.
>smaller, more athletic seems to be the move to fit the
>coaching schemes. they've also changed the OL coach.
>
>if we fix that, the backs are talented and diverse enough to
>get some real yards. and the qb shouldn't have to run for his
>life and have to be the savior like Ty was last year.
>
>defense was decent last year and should be improved this time
>around. got mix of experience and talent.
>
>lessgo!!
>
>
2819087, no pity for DeBoer.
Posted by PROMO, Thu Aug-06-26 09:38 AM
fuck him and that whole program.

it's not even hate at this point for how he left UW.

it's fuck you for chasing, when it was all right here for you.

dude probably gonna be fired after this season. just dumb.
2819088, none of these coaches get any pity lol
Posted by tariqhu, Thu Aug-06-26 03:20 PM
this is an unfortunately part of the game where coaches get on the next train smoking.

I'm glad we got him.
2819089, it could get ugly fast.
Posted by tariqhu, Thu Aug-06-26 03:27 PM
they need to win those first 5 games convincingly before heading into that part of the schedule.
2819084, was listening to some national analysts today
Posted by 3xKrazy, Wed Aug-05-26 04:19 PM

>is Julian Sayin gonna put it all together

talking about how osu should play TSC instead of sayin lol. not like anyone has actually seen the kid play. and sayin has a pretty good foundation to build on coming off his first season as a RS frosh.

he didn't light the world on fire against Indiana and the U but those were two exceptional defenses and the OL was getting destroyed. writing him off is pretty silly at this point.


>Brutal schedules for all the top contenders

schedule is absolutely crazy this year. undefeated regular season is always the goal but that's a tall order this year.
2819085, lol
Posted by 3xKrazy, Wed Aug-05-26 04:19 PM
>Bryce Underwood year 2
2819086, I'm buying up all the Lincoln Kienholz stock
Posted by 3xKrazy, Wed Aug-05-26 04:24 PM
I've seen him throw zero passes of consequence but he at least looked competent last year while he did it. And he's a very legit athlete. Big mistake last year not using him at the goal line.

Looking forward to seeing what he can do in Brohm's system and a weak conference.
2819169, ^^^^^
Posted by 3xKrazy, Sun Sep-06-26 11:28 PM
bounced back with a really nice second half. he's a gamer.

not using him short distance/goal line packages last year was absolute coaching malpractice
2819094, side effect of the NIL era
Posted by 3xKrazy, Wed Aug-12-26 09:04 AM
I don't get too hyped up about quotables but this was displeasing to read...


In an interview with NBC Sports’ John Fanta that Fanta posted to X on Monday, Underwood was asked what makes Michigan’s rivalry game with Ohio State different than any other game he’s played in. His answer: It’s not actually different at all.

“It's just another game with guys in a different color,” Underwood said. “That's how I see it.”
2819097, maybe it's not so bad to view it that way?
Posted by tariqhu, Wed Aug-12-26 04:18 PM
according to Caleb Downs, that's how Saban view the Auburn game.
2819098, I didn't catch the exact quote from Downs about that
Posted by 3xKrazy, Thu Aug-13-26 09:41 PM
>according to Caleb Downs, that's how Saban view the Auburn
>game.

to me it seemed more about Day and osu coaches just being far too uptight about the game

regardless, underwood doesn't exactly have the pedigree of saban to be casual about anything
2819101, here's a clip.
Posted by tariqhu, Mon Aug-17-26 06:15 PM
https://youtube.com/shorts/rnK-9kdtl4w?si=YqUtEzfJFyalPEAl

I'll admit, I didn't watch the whole interview. he may have added more context.

>>according to Caleb Downs, that's how Saban view the Auburn
>>game.
>
>to me it seemed more about Day and osu coaches just being far
>too uptight about the game

makes sense

>
>regardless, underwood doesn't exactly have the pedigree of
>saban to be casual about anything

there's that
2819102, Fantasy CFB anyone? Yahoo is running a pretty good setup..nm
Posted by guru0509, Mon Aug-17-26 11:08 PM
>
>Bryce Underwood year 2
>
>Arch Mannings final year
>
>is Julian Sayin gonna put it all together
>
>
>which players are gonna go first round?
>
>
>this looks like a deep QB class, is your NFL's franchise star
>qb for the next decade among them?
>
>
>Brutal schedules for all the top contenders ...last year alot
>of teams didnt get tested until late, now we hit the season in
>the frying pan...
>
>
2819110, Keelon is qb1 for bama.
Posted by tariqhu, Sat Aug-22-26 09:00 PM
this should be good.

I would be fine if they'd gone with Mack, but Keelon would've probably left. they couldn't risk losing him and possibly sending a message to other qb recruits that they may have to wait longer to see the field. patience isn't a thing anymore.
2819113, degeneracy has taken a plurality of my hype level
Posted by cgonz00cc, Sat Aug-29-26 07:22 PM
40% gambling
35% a coach and program to be proud of at Tech
25% new era at Michigan with a coach i admire

I blame the ongoing legal circus that has managed to turn the NCAA babyface
2819114, that being said, schedule predictions
Posted by cgonz00cc, Sat Aug-29-26 08:34 PM

Thursday, Sep 3
Colorado
8:00pm ET | ESPN

Colorado run D is not ready for Hosley and Haynes - W

Saturday, Sep 12
20Tennessee
7:00pm ET | ESPN

im glad this is week 2. true FR QB for the Vols, Key does it again against a ranked team - W

Saturday, Sep 19
Mercer
12:00pm ET | ACCN

W

Saturday, Sep 26
atStanford
10:30pm ET | ESPN

W

Saturday, Oct 10
Duke
Time TBA ET | TV TBA

W

Saturday, Oct 17
atVirginia Tech
Time TBA ET | TV TBA

i dont have a good feeling about this, even though James & Co dont inspire fear - L

Saturday, Oct 24
Boston College (HC)
Time TBA ET | TV TBA

W

Saturday, Oct 31
atPitt
Time TBA ET | TV TBA

revenge W

Saturday, Nov 7
24Louisville
Time TBA ET | TV TBA

the one ill be mad about all spring and summer - L

Saturday, Nov 14
atClemson
Time TBA ET | TV TBA

this team is not good - W

Saturday, Nov 21
Wake Forest
Time TBA ET | TV TBA

W

Saturday, Nov 28
at3Georgia
3:30-8:00pm ET | TV TBA

all of our wins since the 20th century have come in Athens, but this wont be one of them - L


Pitt and Clemson are the games that make this a reload season or a rebuild season. i like our chances in both but they could absolutely go the other way. ill say an expectation defying (and resetting) 9-3
with a bowl loss again killing the dream of a 10 win season


~~~~~~

Michigan

Saturday, Sep 5
Western Michigan
7:30pm ET | NBC/Peacock

W

Saturday, Sep 12
10 Oklahoma
12:00pm ET | FOX

W - Im absolutely sure that Michigan's offense is going to be a lot better. I dont feel that way about Oklahoma's. this is when it will be apparent that Michigan has 2 very good coordinators.

Saturday, Sep 19
UTEP
3:30pm ET | BTN

W

Saturday, Sep 26
22Iowa
Time TBA ET | TV TBA

*W/L

Saturday, Oct 3
atMinnesota
Time TBA ET | TV TBA

*W/L

*They'll lose one of these

Saturday, Oct 17
18Penn State (HC)
Time TBA ET | TV TBA

W - This coaching staff isnt losing to Iowa St talent with Michigan talent

Saturday, Oct 24
6Indiana
Time TBA ET | TV TBA

W - Take this as my belief that IU will be down in the second tier in general, and not the 6th best team in the country. They are going to miss the 4 AAs sourced from JMU, and i expect Michigan to improve over the course of the season.

Saturday, Oct 31
atRutgers
Time TBA ET | TV TBA

W

Saturday, Nov 7
Michigan State
Time TBA ET | TV TBA

W

Saturday, Nov 14
at2Oregon
Time TBA ET | TV TBA

L - Oregon is the team to beat imo, and Michigan doesnt win games like this on the West Coast anyways

Saturday, Nov 21
UCLA
Time TBA ET | TV TBA

W - this would absolutely be an L on the road

Saturday, Nov 28
at1Ohio State
12:00pm ET | FOX

L - Michigan has the offensive front to shorten the game, and the secondary to keep it contained, but not the experience to win the 4th qtr.

9-3 and this team WILL win their bowl game, because they are all sophomores or younger on offense and in the defensive front 7, and are coming back regardless for a serious run in 2027.
2819115, if GT run game is half as good as last year this should be an easy W
Posted by 3xKrazy, Tue Sep-01-26 04:22 PM
>Thursday, Sep 3
>Colorado
>8:00pm ET | ESPN
>
>Colorado run D is not ready for Hosley and Haynes - W

I dunno if that twitter video that colorado posted was some sort of next level subterfuge but that was a major yikes

but this game has a little bit of a UNC/TCU vibe to it in that why the fuck would anyone bet on colorado and then life doesn't go as planned

I will certainly defer to your expertise on GT but their O/U is at 6.5 and you got them at 9 so we might be working with a little bit of fan bias here lol
2819117, comes down to Pitt/Clemson/Tennessee
Posted by cgonz00cc, Wed Sep-02-26 10:48 AM
as of a week ago we were dogs in all the lookahead lines for those

those lines are gone now but i legitimately believe we'll beat Tennessee at home, and a likely scenario is a Pitt/Clemson split

could lose all 3 and theres the under. i really dont believe thats going to happen. Godsey has been saying the things about Alberto that seem like more than preseason coach hype, and they seem like a perfect match, but it may not click.

theres also a world where we lose all three and pull it together to get over the hump against UGA and hit 7.

there is bias for sure, but part of that is truly believing in what Key is building, and the comfort associated with knowing the OL will always be good. when you can start with that at the base, thats a solid foundation for success.

i dont bet team wins because thats a long time for an even money bet to be in the oven, but assuming a loss in each swing game seems unrealistic.
2819129, same. i generally avoid futures bets and i hate tying up my $ for months
Posted by 3xKrazy, Thu Sep-03-26 09:51 AM
>i dont bet team wins because thats a long time for an even
>money bet to be in the oven, but assuming a loss in each swing
>game seems unrealistic.

save for rare situation such as my Sayin 20:1 heisman bet last year where I took the L of a lifetime by not hedging with Mendoza before the conf champ game.

season win totals aren't always even money though. back in the day i used to play a few if i found an obvious weakness and was getting significant plus money. problem is nowadays with all the roster movement craziness its pretty hard to know what the fuck is going on before the season starts and how teams will look. so i dont even bother looking at season totals.

i listen to all these podcasts where these guys are betting 50 different season win totals, conf champ futures, etc. and it's pretty nuts to me and seems like a guaranteed net loss. I feel like futures bets are for people who are trying to prove to themselves how smart they are.

but anyway i only brought up the season win total for GT to see how your optimism compared to a neutral 3rd party lol.
2819136, see: Umass
Posted by 3xKrazy, Thu Sep-03-26 07:14 PM
>problem is nowadays with
>all the roster movement craziness its pretty hard to know what
>the fuck is going on before the season starts and how teams
>will look.
2819137, see also: GT run game
Posted by 3xKrazy, Thu Sep-03-26 10:03 PM
2819145, in a real kick to the balls....
Posted by cgonz00cc, Fri Sep-04-26 03:28 PM
the only transfer involved with GTs run game is the one who looked like a Doak Walker finalist last year

our problems are homegrown...
2819116, this thread has marginally better attendance than a SC home game
Posted by 3xKrazy, Tue Sep-01-26 04:23 PM
will be interesting to see what that stadium looks like when osu comes to town
2819118, i saw something that est 5 figs worth of fans in the concourse
Posted by cgonz00cc, Wed Sep-02-26 10:53 AM
and i can relate to that. i dont remember GT ever kicking off at 330 in week 1 and i still spent large parts of those games in the shade.

but even if all those people were in their seats, they're still ~27,000 short of capacity.

im guessing it will look a LOT better friday night after a week of being shamed
2819125, LMAO. They turning this into the 2016 inauguration crowd size conspiracy
Posted by 3xKrazy, Thu Sep-03-26 08:55 AM
>and i can relate to that. i dont remember GT ever kicking
>off at 330 in week 1 and i still spent large parts of those
>games in the shade.

need sean spicer to come in gaslight the hell outta everyone

SC just needs to take the L on this and quietly go about their business...instead they got Riley up there talking about 'false narratives' lol

2819130, i dont remember where i saw that but it didnt come from USC
Posted by cgonz00cc, Thu Sep-03-26 01:53 PM
someone wrote they saw that with their own eyes

and yeah, Riley needs to chill bc even if all that was true, the stadium was still at less than 2/3 capacity

my own feelings on this are that im not surprised in the least. the weather is just the catalyst for people to consider being in the stands for a full ass hour of commercial breaks, for a noncompetitive pointless game. hard for me to throw rocks at USC fans when the entire sport seems to be TRYING to make it less painful to just watch at home. they havent done anything wrong by having a longer list of better things to do than ppl in Tuscaloosa.
2819132, both things can be true
Posted by 3xKrazy, Thu Sep-03-26 02:35 PM
attending cfb games can be an excruciating experience at times

and LA college football fans are horrible

> they
>havent done anything wrong by having a longer list of better
>things to do than ppl in Tuscaloosa.

watching that sc game made me think of this alongside one of my most epic battles on this wonderful site

my stance remains the same as it did back then. the whole 'we have better stuff do in LA' argument is corny and stupid. and that's coming from someone who spent a good portion of my life living in LA.

and actually the argument back then was about spring games. which this was not. so let's just call it what it is.
2819119, Are you going to that game? i wanna go. Lets go lol
Posted by guru0509, Wed Sep-02-26 12:09 PM
>will be interesting to see what that stadium looks like when
>osu comes to town


we need revenge for that 35-3 dumpster fire
2819126, life responsibilities will prob keep me from going to any games this yr
Posted by 3xKrazy, Thu Sep-03-26 09:00 AM
unfortunately.

this would be the first home game against mich I've missed since 2008 and im not happy about it. though i think the oregon is probably a better game to go to this year. hopefully get a 330 start out of that one at least.

>>will be interesting to see what that stadium looks like
>when
>>osu comes to town
>
>
>we need revenge for that 35-3 dumpster fire

I hear ya. 2008 was the only game ive ever attended where i knew walking into the stadium/arena that my team was gonna get their doors blown the fuck off. was an absolutely miserable experience.

i hope you make it out there and have a great time.
2819127, .
Posted by 3xKrazy, Thu Sep-03-26 09:00 AM
.
2819149, I hear you regarding life responsibilities
Posted by guru0509, Sat Sep-05-26 11:22 AM
inbox?

I feel much better about this season than last knowing we have an OC who isnt one foot out the door like Hartline was (im not mad at him, we all have personal goals and he wants to cut his teeth so he can come back and be the lead guy here, but damn man ..that USF offer came at a horrendous time)

I also miss having an uptempo offense, with quick audibles etc.

Hopefully its a bit more dynamic this year, considering all the speed on the offensive side


>unfortunately.
>
>this would be the first home game against mich I've missed
>since 2008 and im not happy about it. though i think the
>oregon is probably a better game to go to this year. hopefully
>get a 330 start out of that one at least.
>
>>>will be interesting to see what that stadium looks like
>>when
>>>osu comes to town
>>

>
>i hope you make it out there and have a great time.

thanks man
2819163, can't be mad at hartline. be mad at Day,
Posted by 3xKrazy, Sat Sep-05-26 10:24 PM
Day knew hartline was gonna be a 1 year learn on the job OC and then would be gone for a HC gig. and it cost us a NC.

the good thing at least is that i think day now knows that he needs to hire professional coordinators from this point forward.



>I feel much better about this season than last knowing we have
>an OC who isnt one foot out the door like Hartline was (im not
>mad at him, we all have personal goals and he wants to cut his
>teeth so he can come back and be the lead guy here, but damn
>man ..that USF offer came at a horrendous time)
2819140, USC vs San Jose St or doing anything else in LA?
Posted by legsdiamond, Fri Sep-04-26 07:46 AM
I think I would pick anything else.

2819138, everything i said above goes in the garbage
Posted by cgonz00cc, Fri Sep-04-26 05:25 AM
we suck, both lines are terrible, and we arent going to a bowl game
2819139, Thought Prime would blow it with 37 seconds left
Posted by legsdiamond, Fri Sep-04-26 07:44 AM
I almost turned if off after GT blocked the FG and went up 13 to 7.

Entertaining game and it looks like Prime invested in the trenches.

Now if they could get this QB to settle down in the RZ they may have something.

or maybe GT just fell the fuck off, lol

2819144, Colorado isnt good
Posted by cgonz00cc, Fri Sep-04-26 03:18 PM
it took a whole trainload of unforced GT errors to add up to a 1 point Colorado win

we arent good either, because good teams dont do that, but yeah
2819146, I'm suprised that tech played so poorly.
Posted by tariqhu, Fri Sep-04-26 04:00 PM
both teams looked like AI slop.
2819147, apparently the OL was set from April to last week
Posted by cgonz00cc, Sat Sep-05-26 06:14 AM
and then last week it got shuffled around, including the C

hard to imagine how that could have been a positive change
2819148, Ohio State has THE toughest schedule in the country
Posted by guru0509, Sat Sep-05-26 11:09 AM

Im expecting a 1 loss season, I just hope its not to oregon at home, that would piss me the fuck off


Im going to the game on halloween night in LA, I hope its scary hours for the trojans


I can totally see a loss to Iowa in a slip up game in bad conditions maybe, but then again its Kirk Ferentz...


I thought about going to the game in Texas next week but fuck that state entirely. I hate that place and everything about it, and refuse to spend any money there.


Chris Henry Jr and Legend Bey will stamp their names in the history books as the next great Wrs

and another win over michigan,

but Idk if Julian Sayin has the toughness to take this team to a natty like Will Howard did, something about SoCal QBs is so untrustworthy to me...(ie Stroud)

I prefer my midwest salt of the earth lunchpail to work QBs who arent afraid to get the tough yards with their legs , theyre saying Sayin is bigger now, I hope I can see it on the field today

2819150, Man legend bey got fucking rocks in his head wtf
Posted by 3xKrazy, Sat Sep-05-26 12:53 PM
2819151, yooooooooooooooo that was some vintage #7 shit right there
Posted by 3xKrazy, Sat Sep-05-26 02:12 PM
we'll have to live with tomes of the mental mistakes lol
2819153, Curtis Samuel vibes
Posted by guru0509, Sat Sep-05-26 06:16 PM
>we'll have to live with tomes of the mental mistakes lol
2819162, curtis was great
Posted by 3xKrazy, Sat Sep-05-26 10:14 PM
but he didn't have THAT level of physical ability that i saw with just that one play. bey is different.

just needs to get his head screwed on straight.
2819152, CLEMSON V LSU is going to be entertaining
Posted by guru0509, Sat Sep-05-26 06:04 PM


I cant stand either coach but I think i dislike Lane Kiffin even more


South Carolina Death valley vs Baton Rouge death valley


i wonder which stadium gets louder at night, they both look electric
2819154, Bryce Underwood is TERRIBLE
Posted by Sofian_Hadi, Sat Sep-05-26 09:34 PM
He'll be benched by week three
2819155, Underwood is horrible omg
Posted by BrooklynWHAT, Sat Sep-05-26 09:36 PM
2819157, 12.5 miiiiiiiiillion dollars
Posted by Sofian_Hadi, Sat Sep-05-26 09:50 PM
2819156, Bryce Underwood is buns.
Posted by PROMO, Sat Sep-05-26 09:50 PM
Yikes.
2819158, Investigate the refs.
Posted by PROMO, Sat Sep-05-26 09:55 PM
2819159, On what planet was there one second left. Complete bullshit
Posted by Sofian_Hadi, Sat Sep-05-26 10:00 PM
2819160, it's just cartoon level cheating at this point
Posted by 3xKrazy, Sat Sep-05-26 10:12 PM
fuck everything about this vile, overrated, cornball program.

will get absolutely demolished next week vs OU and will be on pace for another miserable season.
2819161, thats the most robbed shit ive seen in a minute
Posted by BrooklynWHAT, Sat Sep-05-26 10:12 PM
2819165, they went to replay, i saw it, and immediately changed channel
Posted by cgonz00cc, Sun Sep-06-26 07:01 AM
one look convinced me the game was over
2819164, also missed a blatant facemask and running into the punter penalty
Posted by 3xKrazy, Sat Sep-05-26 10:59 PM
2819166, B1G got some 'splainin to do.
Posted by Kira, Sun Sep-06-26 01:00 PM
WM got robbed.

Bryce needs four possibly five full years of starts before entertaining the thought of entering the nfl draft.
2819167, lost in the clock nonsense and underwood's ineptitude
Posted by 3xKrazy, Sun Sep-06-26 02:45 PM
is that whittingham looks 110% checked out. that was a horribly coached game (throwing out routes at your own 20 with that qb and 20 sec left in the half?)

I'm not going to even say that it's a bad culture fit. It just looks like he doesn't give a fuck and only took the job for some extra retirement money.
2819177, i dont think it was that
Posted by cgonz00cc, Thu Sep-10-26 07:10 PM
ive seen that look on the faces of countless Lions coaches throughout the my lifetime

it eventually broke Bobby Ross, who verbalized that look in an interview before he was out the door:

"That was terrible what we did out there today! We shot ourselves in that last drive! We get two holding penalties, a motion penalty — you think I coach that stuff? I don’t coach that stuff! I work on that stuff! I spend time on that stuff!"

its no better for the prospect of me enjoying this season, but hes not talking like someone who doesnt care.

he also said post game that particular play "made no sense", which is basically Mormon for "hes a fucking idiot for calling that", which, he was.

like i said, this is most likely a distinction without a difference, because this is clearly not going to be an enjoyable season either way.
2819168, was confused about all the preseason ND love
Posted by 3xKrazy, Sun Sep-06-26 08:19 PM
and I'm even more confused now. look pretty similar to every other version of ND and miami should beat them rather easily.
2819170, Fickell has torpedo'd that program straight into the dumpster
Posted by guru0509, Mon Sep-07-26 07:30 AM
>and I'm even more confused now. look pretty similar to every
>other version of ND and miami should beat them rather easily.
>


they had a formula, it worked for them, he completely ditched the formula and cannot recruit a QB to save his life

I cant think of a time in my life when Wisconsin ever had a good qb aside from the Russell Wilson season
2819171, I think there are programs that simply can't succeed in the NIL era
Posted by 3xKrazy, Mon Sep-07-26 08:00 AM
as they have in the past.

wisconsin is prob one of them.

they always had a dominant OL, usually a bunch of mean ass white boys from the state of Wisconsin. now it's a bunch of transfers from all over the country. it's just a different time.

wisconsin qb's have always sucked...it was all about their OL and elite running backs.